The Best Of The Rational Male – Year 5

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Well another year has come and gone. I generally view the end of August as my year marker for The Rational Male. I didn’t add a page for year 4 since I’m not sure I want to clutter up the top of my blog layout with links pages, but I may yet combine the best of years 4 and 5 into one page.

A lot has happened in this span, I began the Red Pill Monthly talks with Niko Chosky. I still think I sound like a nasally teenager when I hear my voice, but the feedback has been nothing short of amazing on these so I believe we’ll continue with them for the foreseeable future.

Right after my year 4 best-of I did my first liv appearance in Vegas with Christian, Goldmund and Tanner Guzy at The Man in Demand Conference. I’ve discussed doing another one with Christian McQueen and we’re looking into venues for 2017. This was just an overwhelming experience to meet up with my readers in person, do the talk and have dinner at Sinatra’s. This was the first time for me to do an on premise event and I’d be lying if I said I wasn’t a nervous wreck the night before, but every guy in attendance just impressed me to no end and the whole thing was something I’ll remember for the rest of my life.

I went through the process of having the audio mastered (courtesy of Sam Botta) to make it available via DigiRAMP for anyone to get a hold of now too.

Probably the biggest TRM news of 2016 was the release of the audio book of The Rational Male. It was a long time coming, but I think well worth the wait. I’ve come to believe that a book needs a time to mature into what its overall reception will be. The Rational Male book continues to sell very well and my focus has always been on emphasizing the printed book above all else since I feel that medium is the best to spark discussions and pass along to men who need it at the right time. That said, Sam Botta convinced me that men listen to books more than they read them so I thought the time was right and he’d just gotten back in the saddle so to speak after his debilitation in a hit & run car incident.

The book has exceeded any expectation I ever had for it and I still receive emails and tweets about how it’s changed men’s lives in the best possible way. The Rational Male, Preventive Medicine is also doing far better than I’d hoped if not eclipsing the first book. Sam and I are now in the process of doing the audio for TRMPM and I expect it will go live in early 2017.

The blog traffic continues to grow too.

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As most readers know, I do very little self-promotion for TRM and I only advertise the book on the TRP reddit forum and posting occasional Amazon reviews on Twitter. I always want the the message of this blog and my work to be relayed by the men who read and contribute to it. I’m a believer in the bottom up plan for improving men’s lives and ultimately the social order we find ourselves. I’m glad to see men passing on what they learn here. I’m happy to be able to focus on my ideas and have men spread the word for me.

I’ve done art direction and brand management for over two decades now. It’s what I do for a living so it wouldn’t be a stretch for me to convert TRM into a similar commercial success, but that’s never been my goal. From the outset I wanted to just do what I do and talk about the ideas I’ve come to or the dots I’ve connected. That isn’t to say I don’t appreciate making a little money from it, but I’ll never compromise my message to sell more books or start a Patreon site.

I’ve had guys tell me I should quit my day job and write full time, but I’ve never really needed to be an author for my livelihood. I do quite well for myself and not being beholden to being an official author allows me the freedom to do what I do without the concern of having to write ‘for’ anyone. I know there are guys whose schtick is to treat their writing like a product and they tell you to write for what your audience wants to read, but I think this inherently compromises the authenticity of the real message.

My goal isn’t to sell books, it’s to genuinely change men’s lives for the better with the tools and truths I present in my work. The Rational Male isn’t a ‘product’ for salesmen to sell, it’s a collection of ideas that, really, we’re all responsible for authorship of. Ideas are a hard thing to suppress, and they last far longer than the men who conceived them.

Honestly, when I started this blog back in 2011 I never imagined it would grow into what it’s become today. I have some plans now to do a site redesign. I’ve never really focused on the look of the blog, I just poured myself into its content, but I think after 5 years I’ll freshen the look up soon. I’m also in the middle of the first round of edits for my third book, the working title being The Rational Male, The Red Pill. That may change, but the primary focus will be on defining what the Red Pill is from an intersexual dynamics perspective. As a matter of policy I generally refrain from being too prescriptive for individual men to apply their Red Pill awareness, but in the new book I’ll break this rule and provide some generally applicable ways to live in a Red Pill paradigm.

Red Pill parenting and family interactions in a feminine-primary social order will feature prominently. Yes, it will include selections from the blog again, but with each I’ve added what I believe are general solutions to Red Pill problems, plus more new content.

Well, that’s it. I continue to be humbled by the response and reception of The Rational Male and I want to extend my true gratitude for everyone’s input, participation, reading my ideas and helping me do what I do – even the critics and detractors make me a better Red Pill author. So here’s what I thought represents the best posts from year 5.

Let me know what your favorites were in the comments and let me know how TRM has helped you as well.

 

With much gratitude,

Rollo Tomassi

 

The Rational Male Audio Book

Interviews

Red Pill Monthly

The Red Pill Monthly

The Red Pill Monthly

A Man in Demand Radio – Talk 3

The Red Pill Monthly – Frame

The Feminine Imperative

Solipsism I

Solipsism II

Damaged Goods

Good Girls, Bad Girls

Mansplaining

Sugar Babies

Losing My Religion

Parenting

The Red Pill Parent

Hypergamy Knows Best

Red Pill Parenting – Part I

Red Pill Parenting – Part II

Neofemininity

Red Pill / Game

Christian Dread

Ovulation & Dread

The Purple Pill

Don’t Hate the Beta

The Red Pill Balance

The Pareto Principle

The Cardinal Rule of Sexual Strategies

Positive Masculinity

Tribes

Hypergamy

Open Cuckoldry

Open Relationships

Evolving Hypergamy

Plan B

Late Life Hypergamy

Social

Storytelling

Empathy 2016

The War Brides of Europe

The Warrior Princess

Gamer Girls

Fempowerment

Ghosts in the Machine

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Published by Rollo Tomassi

Author of The Rational Male and The Rational Male, Preventive Medicine

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scribblerg
scribblerg
5 years ago

@SJF – Seeing humanity as a single organism is still in Wilson’s message and it’s a very interesting analytical frame. In The Social Conquest of Earth, he’s up to something much more momentous in a way. He’s essentially taking on “kin selection theory” (Dawkins selfish gene stuff) and blows it away. He’s literally displaced an entire body of thought about how and why humans form groups, and how they behave in them. It’s breathtaking, and I think you’d really enjoy it. Nice break from the manospherian stuff if you are interested. Culture is decisive when it comes to group selection,… Read more »

YaReally
YaReally
5 years ago

@Blaximus To elaborate further: 1) we know that you can’t negotiate desire, so a legal contract and/or monogamy in exchange for her love is nonsense 2) we know statistically and anecdotally that a legal contract and/or monogamy will not prevent a woman from bailing/cheating 3) we know that the ability to leave her helps keep the man attractive 4) we know that the man staying attractive helps keep her attracted long-term 5) we know that women who fear their men leaving and/or feel jealousy (aka dread game), are more likely to bring their A-game to the relationship and desire him… Read more »

Blaximus
Blaximus
5 years ago

@ yareally ” The benefits you get from going outside VS barricading yourself in your home are so numerous it would be hard to even decide where to begin listing them.” But the risk is death. That’s pretty significant. And the whole ” nobody giving 1 shit ” unless the media shows up thing. Lol. “What benefits does a man get from monogamy/marriage that he can’t get in a pLTR or without a legal contract? No one answers this when I ask it but I’m seriously asking lol The only benefit is not having to risk losing her or having… Read more »

stuffinbox
5 years ago

If you can stay single till you are 60yo statisticaly you will be outnumbered by women,dick will be a premium.
Feature that I may buy stock in ky jelly.

Blaximus
Blaximus
5 years ago

@ YaReally … you working my brain man. 1) we know that you can’t negotiate desire, so a legal contract and/or monogamy in exchange for her love is nonsense Agree.It is a fool’s errend to think that getting married has ANYTHING to do with desire. I never believed anything else. 2) we know statistically and anecdotally that a legal contract and/or monogamy will not prevent a woman from bailing/cheating Agree. I never thought that ” marriage ” was to prevent cheating. Marriage does not absolve a man from being a masculine man. 3) we know that the ability to leave… Read more »

Blaximus
Blaximus
5 years ago

@ stuff

” If you can stay single till you are 60yo statisticaly you will be outnumbered by women,dick will be a premium.
Feature that I may buy stock in ky jelly.”

Lol

” Good ” dick is at a premium right now. Always is. Lmao.

Get. Sex. Game. Up.

stuffinbox
5 years ago

@Blax

Lol

” Good ” dick is at a premium right now. Always is. Lmao.

Get. Sex. Game. Up.”

Still married mono LTR.Still getting it,just got a lapdance in the middle of writing this,go figure.

Next million dollar idea;Red Pill nursing homes,all the nurses wear hooters outfits hb 8 or better,no discrimination ofcourse.

There often comes a time in the aging PUA’s game plan when women are just too messy,and the pua turns mysoginist.Seen it happen to two of my good wingmen.

SJF
SJF
5 years ago

@ScribblerG I see what your description of of Wilson’s group selection is and it seems that Harari explains why group selection has taken over in humans and why top down globalism puts the truth to Wilson’s asertion that group selection is more prominent now, whereas kin selection was the norm for humans in smaller groups (tribes) of 75 to 100 people rather than the collective of 7 billion at the global level. It was Sebastian Junger who recommended Sapiens by Harari after I read Junger’s book Tribes. Junger described the small tribe concept among the early circa 1700 North American… Read more »

YaReally
YaReally
5 years ago

@Blaximus “Holding frame sounds strange. Frame is developed and integral. If you have to wrestle with it and hold it like a strong dog at the end of a leash pulling you, then something is wrong. With you. Lol.” A significant number of men are pressured to agree to marriage out of a fear of losing their girl if they don’t agree to it. The pressure her, her family, her friends, his family, his friends, society, etc put on him is testing whether he can hold his frame against it being tested. He’s not wrestling with his own frame, he’s… Read more »

hank holiday
hank holiday
5 years ago

@yareally @culum @hadb @forge @pua about fucking time first instadate first kino Did a hour and half deal. Full FR later. Chick said randomly while we were walking “Is that guy your friend?’ it was just some dude out in the street. So I was like “wait, what?” and she said “oh, well you know everyone everywhere we go, so I just figured he was one of your friends too.” lol great first date. lol. that was literally my first date and kino ever (did hold hands, and arm over shoulder holding her close) did lots of time bridge, gotta… Read more »

YaReally
YaReally
5 years ago

@Blaximus I just want to quote myself here to make sure it’s clear that I’m not attacking you or your marriage or any of you old guys and your marriages: “It’s not, but what benefit is there to the man to even ROLL those dice? Any benefit at all. Not “if he doesn’t see a benefit then don’t roll them”, I’m asking ANYTHING you can give, so we can look at it and figure out if that benefit can be obtained through a less risky way.” What I’m doing is saying: look, we have a store that’s GREATLY over-charging for… Read more »

YaReally
YaReally
5 years ago

@hank
WHY DIDN’T YOU JUST FUCK HER IN AN ALLEYWAY YOU PUSSY?!?!!

lol jk congrats dude! Props for putting in all the hard work to get to the point where a girl thinks you know everyone and is wanting your number. I can vividly remember my first successes, that shit sticks with you. Good luck with the Day2, looking forward to the FR! You earned it dude

kfg
kfg
5 years ago

“just keep her pregnant”

If a married man wants a vasectomy, his wife has to sign off on it. She can also “sign off” on putting pinholes in all of his condoms.

If a married woman wants the pill, the morning after pill, her tubes tied, an abortion – her body, her choice.

It isn’t the man who keeps her pregnant.

YaReally
YaReally
5 years ago

@Blaximus “Make sense? I’m not picking on you, I’m just asking you about that bag of potato chips so that we can make a better store for men so they don’t have to risk getting punched in the face to get that juice.” Just to add to that because I really want to make it clear that I’m not just trying to be an annoying asshole lol What we need from you old guys who married is what benefits you guys got from it, so that we can help guys find other ways to get those benefits in a lower-risk… Read more »

Blaximus
Blaximus
5 years ago

@ YaReally Oh my damn. I dunno if my reasons for getting married are relevant to other guys. 1) it is true that I was socially conditioned towards marriage.( by family, not society..) True 100%. But I was also guided in what ” married ” meant, and inherent risks involved. Failure to heed the lessons led to the dissolution of marriage #1. that’s a field test for your ass right there. Lol. 2) The benefit to me was in having a wife, her taking my name, and the understanding that the marriage meant that 99% of the silly, dumb shit… Read more »

kfg
kfg
5 years ago

” . . . they abdicate the power of manhood . . .”

The power of manhood illustrated:

Her: Honey, let’s get married.
Him: No.

stuffinbox
5 years ago

“We can’t see ANY benefit to legal marriage or monogamy that they can’t still get from a non-legal non-agreeing-to-monogamy arrangement, so we need you guys knee-deep in that shit to tell us what benefit you get, or Andy gets, or Big Al will get, or hank and his new girlfriend (lol) will get, etc Because to US, legal marriage is 100% dead.” Tough call. When I die I know she will get my assets,to use as she sees fit to further her survival and the survival of our children.This is one of the legal aspects of licensed marriage. So my… Read more »

kfg
kfg
5 years ago

“This is one of the legal aspects of licensed marriage.” It is also one of the legal aspects of a Last Will and Testament. Real property deeds can be drawn up with a survivor clause. Joint bank accounts default to the survivor, but can also be formed as Payable On Death to a designee. A legal Health Proxy gives all the medical proxy rights of a spouse. A Power of Attorney can give rights to act in your behalf from limited to picking up the mail, to doing everything as if they were you save for altering your will. ”… Read more »

stuffinbox
5 years ago

I suppose you guy s could just skip the legal marriage part and just write a will,leaving all of your valuable assets to your significant other or whatever you decide to call her.

Does sort of make marriage seem redundant.

SJF
SJF
5 years ago

I would cosign what Blaximus just said. But point out that YaReally is arguing with a false premise about marriage. You can’t ask why Blax and Andy did it and then equate that Big Al should do it today while stating that Marriage and monogamy is 100% dead in your realm. Social pressure is social pressure. A girl who is not married is just shacking up and is more inclined to not be with Blaximus, SJF or Andy and do something stupid with her vagina or with her children. She truly has no “legal” obligation and she will meet every… Read more »

stuffinbox
5 years ago

“And, contrariwise, love has nothing to do with marriage.”

Love has more to do with marriage,going in than it does in the middle or going out the other end.

A word that has only been defined by poets,and explained by psychiatrists.

Ever notice how cupid rhymes with stupid?

kfg
kfg
5 years ago

“Does sort of make marriage seem redundant.” The case is not that good. Once upon a time, circa 200 years ago, marriage conferred certain responsibilities and corollary rights to a spouse. It no longer does so. Marriage is dead, not just because of a social climate that includes feminism and smart phones, but because it no longer exists. The proper noun has been kept as subterfuge, but it has been replaced by the legal system with Civil Union. A civil union that confers unprecedented responsibilities on a man (including the possibility of fiscal responsibilities that are designed to be literally… Read more »

kfg
kfg
5 years ago

“She truly has no “legal” obligation . . .”

Within the Anglosphere, enumerate the obligations conferred on women by state recognized marriage.

” . . . as the mother of your children for 21 years (fuck the 40 year nonsense) . . .”

I can get annoyed by Ya Really’s reductio ad absurdum strawmen, but in this case I will note that there is no state sanctioned 21 year marriage contract. Till divorce do you part, and divorce is divorce.

SJF
SJF
5 years ago

“Because you are 100% PUA which has been described as 80% risk avoidance (not fucking up your chances with her wanting to fuck you).” I screwed up this sentence. It should have been a separate paragraph and should have referred to YaReally in regards to way too much risk avoidance going on/being recommended here. Not living on your edge is buffering higher possible rewards. I’m not talking about strictly marriage and monogamy in risk avoidance. I’m talking LTR. (LTR with or without monogamy, LTR with or without marriage). But holy shit, maybe we should reduce the argument to starting with… Read more »

kfg
kfg
5 years ago
SJF
SJF
5 years ago

Damn KFG, I guess I left a hanging curve ball of wrong terminology. That Rollo essay was actually using the term “Quality Woman” to connote something that I was not actually denoting. He was speaking in terms about what an AFC should not connote in a madonna/whore context. Not what I was implying (and I beat my one-itis with a stick last year and she stayed down). I was actually trying to denote a valuable woman to me. I was meaning a feminine woman that can actually give a man energy, raise his children great, have a great feminine personality,… Read more »

YaReally
YaReally
5 years ago

@Blaximus “2) The benefit to me was in having a wife, her taking my name, and the understanding that the marriage meant that 99% of the silly, dumb shit stopped. ” Married ” is different than ” dating “.” Ok finally lol Now let’s take this apart step by step. “The benefit to me was in having a wife” lol we can throw this out because “the benefit to me in having a wife is having a wife” is circular logic just like “the benefit of being a feminist is being a feminist” “her taking my name” I actually don’t… Read more »

YaReally
YaReally
5 years ago

“If Hypergamy, which we all accept, dictates whether she stays attracted and strays or not, which we all accept, and, as Sentient says, being “DPA” will keep her attracted to you, then there are the exact same odds of her staying with you or not staying with you whether you’re legally married or not because it’s based on Hypergamy/DPA instead of the legal contract.” Sorry, to clarify I meant “there are the exact same BASELINE odds”, like, not taking cultural pressures/influences and dread etc into consideration…just looking purely at you two being in an empty room together legally or not… Read more »

YaReally
YaReally
5 years ago

Basically do you wanna see more guys and future generations of men (as statistics are showing is increasing) ending up like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rxu5wXkaViQ&t=13s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YW-HGLlKYEU&t=17s ’cause those are the current paths…enter contracts with insane risks and lose access to your kids and end up in deadbedrooms etc etc (for no benefit that anyone can actually seem to name when I ask what the benefit to the legal contract is)…or just MGTOW/PUA/etc forever and refuse to settle and have kids. Those are the options right now. And those are the ones that don’t contribute to the astronomical male suicide rate. Personally I’d… Read more »

Softek
Softek
5 years ago

@ YaReally I pretty much agree with everything you’re saying. What is real? Hypergamy. Masculinity. Food. Clothing. Shelter. Things that are biologically innate from birth, and things that are biologically required for our sustenance after birth. We can call the interaction between Hypergamy and Masculinity an LTR, or marriage, or whatever. That’s all a hallucination. Tower of Babel. ‘A rose by any other name would smell as sweet.’ All it is, really, is Hypergamy interacting with Masculinity. This can get complex on its own, but adding labels just adds to the confusion. And then we end up with a society… Read more »

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
5 years ago

kfg It isn’t the man who keeps her pregnant. Well…yes and no. My 30-something friend with the wife and multiple kids goes to the same church as his parents, his sister and brother-in-law and maybe a cousin. Her social life revolves around children and his family and church stuff. Not Cosmo and being bored and putting in hours on social media. She’s more likely to have Pinterest than Tumblr as online connectivity. It wouldn’t surprise me if they share one email account. So he’s clearly been keeping her preggers, but a lot of factors are keeping her faithful. There are… Read more »

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
5 years ago

Blaximus “2) The benefit to me was in having a wife, her taking my name, and the understanding that the marriage meant that 99% of the silly, dumb shit stopped. ” Married ” is different than ” dating “.” Anecdote: I know multiple Millennial women who married right around 30 who are not, not, not, taking their husband’s name. There’s always a reason, of course. But looking at them with The Glasses on, I do believe I spy someone preserving her options. Not All Millennials Are Like That, of course. But it appears the day of the hyphenated name, the… Read more »

Driver
Driver
5 years ago

Nice work. I’ve been coming here since 2013 and it’s a definite plus to any man’s life. The content of RM plus all of the other men out there sharing stories in the comments section (the round table) is a winner.

Kaminsky
Kaminsky
5 years ago

Yeah. The victory cry of a 64 year old maintaining his frame over his 62 year old is not exactly some hugely incentivizing image for the never-marrieds.

redlight
redlight
5 years ago

“Yeah. The victory cry of a 64 year old maintaining his frame over his 62 year old is not exactly some hugely incentivizing image for the never-marrieds.” It’s not just that, a guy with a 50+ wife (and not banging much younger on the side) is not playing in the same league. He’s going “I hit a 20mph fastball today, look at me, look at me!” A 50+ woman knows she is turning into the invisible woman. Nobody flirts with her. Much of fashion is “too young” for her. 50 shades of grey are her roots. Tits fought gravity and… Read more »

anon
anon
5 years ago

Ode to the tut tutting masses at Blue Pill reddit. Wow, were you right about that place. Dare speak anything intelligent and comments are edited so there’s not context (or simply deleted so the whole string of responses disappears). But they got a few like so they just might have a chance!!

DisgruntledEarthling
DisgruntledEarthling
5 years ago

@yareally “How would Andy’s long-term arrangement with his wife be any worse if he didn’t have a piece of paper signed that legally risks everything based on her staying happy for 40+ years? He could do literally everything else that he’s doing now, even down to choosing to be monogamous day to day with her, but without a noose around his neck, and would probably be MORE attractive to her for it because she knows he can leave (and she’d probably be more inclined to keep herself hot and pleasant for him so he doesn’t leave, VS the wife who… Read more »

Andy
Andy
5 years ago

“But my brother is sounding the alarm. Mind you, he’s not having any immediate issues at all. Just ” thoughts “. He is voraciously reading everything he can about why marriage is suicide, but his is not. Andy and myself, we are in a very similar position. Do we sound the same?” @Blax Just to clear things up, I am fine. My marriage is fine. When I’m talking about this marriage stuff I’m saying that my situation is not ideal. It would be EASIER to take care of this relationship if I wasn’t married. Maybe because you’re a natural or… Read more »

DisgruntledEarthling
DisgruntledEarthling
5 years ago

@yalreally “Part of why it works your brain is because your attachment to marriage is socially conditioned.” And again, my buddy yareally has the uncanny ability of cutting thru the BS and fluff of daily talk. I agree 100% with this statement and this is tightly related to Rollo’s previous article on religion and it’s ability to draw numerous commenters out of the woodwork spouting biblical nonsense. Being raised as an atheist I am convinced that Men’s attraction to marriage derives from the same pool of BS. That contract idea is obsolete in today’s world. It is a remnant from… Read more »

Blaximus
Blaximus
5 years ago

Lol. * Fakes gnashing teeth * If you don’t…… aw, never mind. Marriage is dead. Monogamy is dead. Women, the FI and confusion reign supreme. Men must create an alternate universe to compete with the FI. This old guy doesn’t think a man needs to compete with women/a woman, but I’m old and out of touch. IMO,. If a woman won’t take a man’s last name, and a man accepts this, he will get what’s coming to him. So all men should have harems, because all men are capable of doing this, even if they lack the ability to get… Read more »

stuffinbox
5 years ago

@Yareally This non legal ltr that you are proposing is nothing new in this society. It has been done and is being done all the time. The question is have you found this woman that you are ready to trade in your rock and roll lifestyle for,in terms of a longer term commitment.Is this what you are even looking for. Are your survival skills good enough in todays shifting environment” and don’t kid yourself it has always been shifting “to meet her needs when she does get pregnant,is your frame strong enough to provide the comfort that she will need… Read more »

Roused
Roused
5 years ago

Yareally: “Personally I’d rather have Tyler’s kids (brought up eating healthy, meditating, reading and learning etc as he programs them to be super-beings lol) befriending my future theoretical kids and running/influencing society than kids coming out of some deadbedroom miserable home full of cheating and jealousy and negativity eventually ending with a single mom raising them with random shitty male influences passing through each weekend and a dad that’s breaking his back working 3 jobs living out of his car. lol” It was all roses and rainbows until you got to “shitty male influences passing through each weekend.” You will… Read more »

Andy
Andy
5 years ago

“I lose track in all of the negativity.”

Blax, you’re the one attaching negative connotations to reality. I know that men here can and will find a way to make it work. That is what we are DOING. Sheesh.

kfg
kfg
5 years ago

“I dunno. I lose track in all of the negativity.” If you decline to play Russian Roulette with a revolver whose chambers are fully populated, it is not because you are being negative, it is because you realize that you are not being invited to play Russian Roulette, you are being invited to commit suicide. The con is on. Perhaps you are being tested to find out just how much of an idiot you really are. ” . . . after two kids . . .” Relevant factor. ” . . . but my ex was lazy about her schedule… Read more »

Sun Wukong
Sun Wukong
5 years ago

@stuffinbox Are you willing to trade your sense of importance,for another? Old Set of Books. I’m what matters, not her. Are you ready to start giving out red pill ltr advice? Refusing to give up the only leverage you have as a man (“I’ll leave you for younger and hotter if you don’t cut this shit out”) is pretty Red Pill LTR advice in my view. Marriage is by definition the surrender of that option. If society will not have your back in marriage, instead openly telling you it will actively work against you if you get married, then you… Read more »

kfg
kfg
5 years ago

“Marriage is by definition the surrender of that option.”

And the measure of a man’s social strength is his available options. Keep as many as you can without negatively impacting your mission.

“Humans did it that way for a lot longer than they’ve done it the way you’re suggesting.”

And all other animals have always done it that way.

Bears do not even pair bond, and yet there are bears.

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
5 years ago

Some anon Ode to the tut tutting masses at Blue Pill reddit. Wow, were you right about that place. Dare speak anything intelligent and comments are edited so there’s not context (or simply deleted so the whole string of responses disappears). This is one of Rollo’s strengths, he doesn’t play “combox police”. Other sites, usually run by women or feminist men, do as noted above – not just one posting, but a whole string of comments may be vaporized, or sometimes just an entire posting. Five years now, and sometimes I’ve just scrolled past entire walls of text but nowhere… Read more »

IAS
IAS
5 years ago

@YaReally, Andy and Blaximus (related to the legal marriage discussion). There are a few slim advantages for the legal marriage. One is that is a convenient legal wrapper (not just in case of death, which has been mentioned). It is widely recognized in different countries for stuff like tax benefits, sometimes higher salaries directly (for some specific jobs), automatic recognition of offspring (which can obviously backfire if you are cucked), and in case of death for inheritance etc. Some of these can be obtained through specific arrangements, but I doubt all of them can, and the legal marriage automatically does… Read more »

kaminsky
kaminsky
5 years ago

Roused, Thanks for reminding us of the possible downsides of children. Most people never factor that in. Especially with all the glowing depictions of wunderkinds on facebook, we forget the disaster scenarios, but they are common. About 3/4 of my friends have daughters who don’t sleep under the same roof as them. (I’m not trying to pedestalize them over sons, btw, wouldn’t get far around here with that, heh) But that’s where my mind goes—I imagine having a daughter when kids are the subject. You run a solid 50 or 80% chance of bringing a daughter into the world who… Read more »

stuffinbox
5 years ago

@Sun

” Humans did it that way for a lot longer than they’ve done it the way you’re suggesting.”

I am not suggesting anything,except that Sun wukong stop reading between the lines.

Either you are ready for a ltr or you are not.However you tie the knot is totally up to you.

But you can’t deny that the male ego needs to be looked up to,and if you already have this respect,then why trade it for an unknown situ.

On the other hand never trade your self respect,for the feigned respect of another.See https://youtu.be/q9EJ0qXNJGgsocial conventions.

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
5 years ago

Blaximus IMO,. If a woman won’t take a man’s last name, and a man accepts this, he will get what’s coming to him. Quite likely. But these young men have no counterargument. They’ve been raised from the start to defer to women. Their schooling in K-12 and then in uni taught them to defer to women. Yeah, that’s not the way it was when you grew up, but you’re not a 32 year old man marrying a 29.999 year old woman, right? Nobody ever taught them anything different. So they don’t know what they don’t know (tautology, right?). Obviously they… Read more »

Sun Wukong
Sun Wukong
5 years ago

@Blax Negativity and pragmatism are often mixed up by people bully on a particular subject that others simply aren’t excited about. If I felt like: – I could even interest a woman I dig in committing (because even if marriage were fair, she’s being told 30 is the new 20, don’t settle down you’ll miss everything, oh wow look at the 100 more dudes that just made offers to me on Tinder/OKC/POF/Facebook) – I lived in a society where men were actually still respected instead of actively denigrated and pathologized (Homer Simpson and toxic masculinity) – marriage law was actually… Read more »

kaminsky
kaminsky
5 years ago

@Stuffinbox, “But you can’t deny that the male ego needs to be looked up to” “Part of the masculine person is needing to be needed” —–Wooah, man. Those are just the glamorous ways of saying that men are here to serve. You really gave yourself away there. You need to read Rollo’s stuff if you’re going to play around in the comments. You are way behind. That (blue-pill slathered) prescript is the weak point that has been exploited. Lose that need ‘to be looked up to’ and life can open up to you in a big way. I doubt you… Read more »

Blaximus
Blaximus
5 years ago

I speak of negativity because it is what I am reading. I am fully aware of how society is fucked up. For me, this HAS ALWAYS been so from birth. Society has been an odd thing where people gyrate and look for the next ridiculous hoop to invent. Letting yourself think any kind of way about who you are and. what you can do or think will usually wind up negatively, if your only guide is ” what does society dictate for/ about me?”. ASK ME HOW I KNOW THIS AS FACT FROM 50+ YEARS OF EXPERIENCE. For me, a… Read more »

sfer
sfer
5 years ago

Scandinavian countries have a variety non-marriage living together situations: https://www.government.nl/topics/family-law/contents/marriage-registered-partnership-and-cohabitation-agreements This leads to a lot out of wedlock babies. It isn’t clear that scandinavian men avoid the problems of marriage by using these arrangements. Committed relationships w/ kids have issues and changing the names used doesn’t fix them. I generally back yareally against the “golfing is great” married dudes. On the issue of how best to have kids though, I don’t think his ideas are field tested. I don’t think they can be field tested. Paul Janka got married. He has reasonable things to say about it (he certainly did… Read more »

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
5 years ago

When I wrote that provider game is dead, I immediately reflected that the man I know with multiple children is the sole provider for his family. So in his case, provider game is not dead. However, his immediate family is wrapped in mulitple layers of fairly traditional cultural structures – extended family nearby, a church that provides a lot of social outlets, and so forth. Something called “marriage” will continue. For a lot of people it will look more and more like a pLTR, for the UMC and UC and religious people it will probably look like marriage 1.0 with… Read more »

stuffinbox
5 years ago

@Kaminsky “Part of the masculine person is needing to be needed” —–Wooah, man. Those are just the glamorous ways of saying that men are here to serve. You really gave yourself away there. You need to read Rollo’s stuff if you’re going to play around in the comments. You are way behind. That (blue-pill slathered) prescript is the weak point that has been exploited. Lose that need ‘to be looked up to’ and life can open up to you in a big way. I doubt you care though. Then are you suggesting that Rollo doesn’t get this need to be… Read more »

Softek
Softek
5 years ago

+1 to YaReally’s comment about social media. Women are keeping all their options open at all times. Older guys aren’t out of touch with technology, per se; they just don’t have the reference of EXCLUSIVELY dating/Gaming/having LTR’s with women that are fully immersed in this technology, because it came onto the scene long after their time. And it is a game changer. Can any self-respecting man knowingly restrict his options in 2016 and beyond, with the knowledge that any woman he restricts his options for will never, ever reciprocate? That she will, in fact, keep her options wide open? I’ve… Read more »

othergrain
othergrain
5 years ago

Just to be pedantic… “Be Alpha is not actionable, like Be Attractive is not actionable or Just Get It is not actionable…” I’d argue that wtr women, these three are just different names for the same thing. “Dynamic – a bias for action, initiation, invention. These are male life giving and sustaining traits. A man siting on his ass ain’t bringing in mastadon meat or discovering how to make fire or exploring and conquering new territories or defending existing ones. Male dynamism is the corollary to female reproduction and nurturing.” I spend all day in the country creating torture devices… Read more »

kfg
kfg
5 years ago
kaminsky
kaminsky
5 years ago

@stuffinbox,

Pretty incoherent stuff there, frankly. ‘Paying rent’….what?

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
5 years ago

sfer Scandinavian countries have a variety non-marriage living together situations: The Nordics have been the leading edge of the feminist wedge for a bunch of years. They are basically trying to serve the FI while preserving an advanced society. It does not seem to be working out the way it was intended, perhaps because the whole blank slate, “men and women are the same” premise is false. This leads to a lot out of wedlock babies. It isn’t clear that scandinavian men avoid the problems of marriage by using these arrangements. They probably don’t. The issue of “out of wedlock”… Read more »

stuffinbox
5 years ago

@kaminsky

There is no shame in being born into a world as a man,where your best chance at survival is having your mind programed to do figuressit in a cubicle all day after day,or being covered in crude oil in the hot sun,maybe busted knuckles and a bad back,or having to learn to fight and do it….

There may be some shame in never getting off your ass and trying.

kfg
kfg
5 years ago

“Layer enough paper . . .” . . . and you may get enough actual practice, through happenstance, to improve. The issue is a psychological, pedagogical and even biological one. If you spend half an hour day sitting down and faking being a guitar player, you may well become something of a guitar player, but it will take a lot of time and you will never be a good one. If you sit down and practice* guitar for half an hour a day, you can hardly help but become pretty decent. The first thing a man should learn is how… Read more »

Softek
Softek
5 years ago

Now for the flipside: @ Blax In one sense, “the juice ain’t worth the squeeze” because the deck is so severely stacked against men these days, compared to the past. And we could talk about that all day. In another sense, becoming a guy like Rollo has ALWAYS been supremely difficult, and WILL ALWAYS be supremely difficult, and nothing has changed in that aspect since the dawn of humanity. A man’s best insurance today (as it always has been) is skyrocketing his SMV to the absolute pinnacle of his potential. And Rollo’s very clearly said a number of times that… Read more »

kaminsky
kaminsky
5 years ago

Well….thanks for the front row seat inside your head to share in your ruminations. I’m honored by that. No shit.

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
5 years ago

kfg
“Humans did it that way for a lot longer than they’ve done it the way you’re suggesting.”

And all other animals have always done it that way.

Bears do not even pair bond, and yet there are bears.

There’s still pygmies and bushmen in Africa living in hunter-gatherer tribes, maybe in grass huts, too.
So?

Mosuo

A rare tribe that exists only one place on the planet, kind of similar to the Bonobo’s who only exist in one tiny part of the jungle. The upper 1% doesn’t live that way.
So?

Softek
Softek
5 years ago

@ kfg Being a guitarist myself, that example is very clear. *How* you practice is critical, as you pointed out. You can practice guitar 30 minutes a day, but if you practice poor technique/improper fingering, you will get better at poor technique and improper fingering. A lot of songs I learned, since I’m self-taught, took me a while to get the proper fingering for. This includes what fingers to use for fingerpicking, and in what combinations and succession, or what fingers to use for chord voicings depending on the progression. You might know how to play a D minor in… Read more »

kfg
kfg
5 years ago

” A rare tribe that exists only one place on the planet, kind of similar to the Bonobo’s who only exist in one tiny part of the jungle. The upper 1% doesn’t live that way. So?”

So I identified the model. You’ll find something similar in Detroit. Didn’t say I found it desirable.

“There’s still pygmies and bushmen in Africa living in hunter-gatherer tribes, maybe in grass huts, too. So?”

So babies will be made. Mankind will live on. Only civilization will go extinct.

Sun Wukong
Sun Wukong
5 years ago

@Blax I speak of negativity because it is what I am reading. I am fully aware of how society is fucked up. For me, this HAS ALWAYS been so from birth. See this is where I disagree and probably why I don’t see negativity where you do. Not in terms of “society is fucked up”. It simply is what it is. I can’t change society so there’s simply no point in viewing it that way. I can only make changes to myself to gain benefits from how things are or screw myself out of benefits by not making any changes… Read more »

having a bad day
having a bad day
5 years ago

@Andy I have no reason to doubt you. I’ll have a better perspective on it in 2 or 3 years. I wonder what @HABD thinks about babies with hot 2016 girls. Bat signal. lol. i’ll be right with you… just gotta zip up…lol props on putting in the work… i’ve been skimming along on this whole thing on 2016 girls and haven’t really had time to wedge into the discussion…and i still don’t… lol… but i understand all sides… and there really ARE more than 2…lol… I understand exactly what YaReally is saying about social media, etc (having experienced that… Read more »

SJF
SJF
5 years ago

So here is a thought experiment. Say theoretically that Sentient, Blax, rollo and I have 23 year old daughters (at some point in their feminine career) over the next 5 years. These daughters were raised well with lots of provisioning, but were not spoiled. They were brought up in a culture that was pretty much all married at some point. They were intelligent and self aware and they can carry on great conversations both individually with anyone or in large social groups. The parents, now old married guys and moms raised them well in the upper middle class. Say these… Read more »

theasdgamer
5 years ago

@Softek

If you’re not going to fuck other women, at least sexually escalate to the point where there’s a constant air of slight sexual tension with them.

Gamer Maxim: Flirt early, flirt often.

kfg
kfg
5 years ago

“Do the parents say, sure no problem it’s a new world disorder and marriage is broken anyway, you don’t need to get married to raise my grandchildren?”

Yes. And explain to them why and how.

theasdgamer
5 years ago

@HABD

plus there’s the whole ‘no STDs to worry about’ thing in play

With the current bear market in genital warts (i.e., the supply of warts is HUGE), then that pushes men towards STD risk-management.

plus there’s the whole ‘no STDs to worry about’ thing in play…lol. but mostly those things are all available with pLTRs in your favor

I don’t see the argument for this…I see lots of girls with multiple partners, some of whom are likely alphas -> how are you gonna get girls to be exclusive to you? Are you gonna ALWAYS use condoms?

SJF
SJF
5 years ago

To clarify KFG, do you advise red pill parents to advise their daughter’s not to marry at all if they are intent on marrying a man?

The point of the thought exercise is partly to point out that there is always social conditioning on the daughter’s to have certain expectations. Even though the young men always have the priviledge to NEXT if pressed to marry.

I can understand clearly if the parents are only explaining why and how to sons.

kfg
kfg
5 years ago

” Are you gonna ALWAYS use condoms?”

If, like Blaximus, you don’t want kids; yes. And always supply your own. And dispose of them carefully afterwards.

kfg
kfg
5 years ago

“KFG, do you advise red pill parents to advise their daughter’s not to marry at all if they are intent on marrying a man?” Not if you want them to have every advantage in life, but you will do so to the disadvantage of men. The scenario you put forward was that the women had already made their selection, but the men decline marriage. The women will then have to decide whether they want the man or the marriage more. To complicate the issue, consider the possibility that the men, in declining marriage, support the idea that the selection was… Read more »

kfg
kfg
5 years ago

“If a woman will not assume your surname she will never accept your authority as a man.” Right. And getting back to a bit of earlier stuff, that goes for an unlicensed marriage as well. A woman changing her surname is no big legal deal. In most Anglo places all she has to do is make the proper notifications that her name has been changed, just as if the marriage had been licensed. A women is expected to change her surname at least once. It’s SOP. So long as there is no intent to defraud there will be no illegality… Read more »

Sun Wukong
Sun Wukong
5 years ago

@SJF The majority of chicks I’ve met who babble about marriage don’t really want a marriage. They want a wedding. They’ve never given a thought to what a successful marriage would actually take, probably because society already has them covered. As to your situation though, in your theory it’s the definition of a Mexican Stand-off. First one to blink loses. Society’s incentives are set up for short term only on both sides, so nobody has a smart move that the other side will accept. The male is stupid to take a marriage, and the woman is stupid to not insist… Read more »

Sun Wukong
Sun Wukong
5 years ago

@Rollo

Women who insist on retaining their surname or hyphenating it after marriage should be an unconditional and automatic NEXT. No marriage, no ring, just NEXT.

Even as a Beta I instinctively grasped this. Behind every woman with a hyphenated last name is a dude that fucked up hard.

BTW, what exactly is the “Sun Wukong asterisk” in your context?

hank holiday
hank holiday
5 years ago

@yareally @othergrain @forge @culum @habd @pua heres my FR At mall. One girl early on, but still a bit sluggish. Had to jump into this chick, so not quite there yet. Let her pass. Okay, a lot of my other stuff here is truncated. There is a LOT of riffing I do on the piercing girl — stalker girl that is kind of hard to convey here (and remember lol). But basically I go over like how I know crazy girls, or I will tease the girl that maybe SHE is a stalker and SHE is crazy and maybe I… Read more »

kfg
kfg
5 years ago

“She gets weirded out . . . “I’m not drunk.”” When gaming across cultures this is the advantage in knowing something of the other culture. It prevents unintentional miscalibration. Like the Asian girl who works in the Asian mall store. You thought you were asking her to try on a jacket. She thought you were telling her she looked like a prepubescent girl, so she should dress like one. I some respects it’s actually easier to game across a language barrier, because you have to do it down at “bare metal” where language (subcoms) is more universal. “I just told… Read more »

kfg
kfg
5 years ago

” . . . she tosses him softball shit tests to make him feel like he’s in frame control.”

This is so easy for them, and they are so skilled at it, that they can do it in their sleep – literally.

Andy
Andy
5 years ago

” and agree with him 99 44/100%…lol… but he’s really forced to forego that 66/100% bc of the dynamics in play in this discussion…”

@habd

Check your math! 😛

“So babies will be made. Mankind will live on. Only civilization will go extinct.”

THIS, imo, is negative. In the long run at least.

Blaximus
Blaximus
5 years ago

@ Sun ” See this is where I disagree and probably why I don’t see negativity where you do. Not in terms of “society is fucked up”. It simply is what it is. I can’t change society so there’s simply no point in viewing it that way. I can only make changes to myself to gain benefits from how things are or screw myself out of benefits by not making any changes or making poorly chosen changes.” From my perspective, society has always been pretty fucked up, but my experience has been on a different level. Society to me, has… Read more »

kfg
kfg
5 years ago

@Andy:

There quite a number of aspects of civilization that I’m rather fond of myself.

Blaximus
Blaximus
5 years ago

@ Rollo ” Women who insist on retaining their surname or hyphenating it after marriage should be an unconditional and automatic NEXT. No marriage, no ring, just NEXT. Women insist on retaining their surname for one reason, they recognize their husband-to-be as Beta and seek to maintain a frame they already understand they have. If a woman will not assume your surname she will never accept your authority as a man.” See, this to me is a given. The fact that a man would even question ” what about the women that won’t take your name..” is very odd to… Read more »

Blaximus
Blaximus
5 years ago

@ HABD Lol. Great to see you commenting. You were missed. ” mostly i push men to not even consider legal marriage, and i advocate a pLTR in the man’s favor (like YaR talks about) even IF that man ‘doesn’t get any on the side’… like Blaximus’ situ… bc then it’s his CHOICE… just bc you’re ‘monogamous’, IF you can spin up some pussy at the local mall in a couple of minutes, you really aren’t…lol… (just like those girls with the social media/orbiters…) at least in the sense that we are talking about with most guys… but those guys… Read more »

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
5 years ago

Women who insist on retaining their surname or hyphenating it after marriage should be an unconditional and automatic NEXT. No marriage, no ring, just NEXT. Agreed and that’s part of vetting. No way a man should get very far down the road without setting out clear boundaries, that’s one of them. But try telling a thirsty, Blue Pilled, Beta that. At the age of 32 he finally, finally has a girl (29.9999) who will settle, er, settle down with him. He doesn’t want to spook this unicorn. So he agrees. At least that’s what it looks like to me IRL.… Read more »

Andy
Andy
5 years ago

“No. I’m attaching negative connotations to negativity.”

“A constant hue and cry of ” … and there’s nothing that can be done about problem X. It is unsolvable ” ”

@Blax

Is anyone actually saying that? That’s not what I’m thinking. That’s not the vibe I’m getting from anyone here except maybe kfg. We can’t all live in a fantasy world where failure isn’t even a possibility. lol.

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
5 years ago

One potential game changer : STD’s that cannot be cured. http://tmzhiphop.com/common-stds-becoming-resistant-to-treatments-here-is-why-you-should-be-afraid/ Girls riding the carousel are pretty much bound to pick something up, and for years it just meant an embarrasing doctor’s visit. Gonorrhea has some pretty ugly effects, and it’s in the lead to becoming totally immune to antibiotics. If this happens, it will probably take about 20 years for social mores to catch up, but if the majority of a cohort of 20-somethings finds out 10 years later they can’t have children due to reproductive system damage thanks to carousel riding, then something will have to give. Even… Read more »

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
5 years ago

Blaximus
That’s why it rankles me to hear that men just can’t do anything about anything,

Who is saying that? Please point to some poster and his words. Thanks.

Blaximus
Blaximus
5 years ago

@ Andy

” Is anyone actually saying that? That’s not what I’m thinking. That’s not the vibe I’m getting from anyone here except maybe kfg. We can’t all live in a fantasy world where failure isn’t even a possibility. lol.”

That is the vibe that I get, and it’s fairly consistent. The ” unsolvable ” issues.

Even when you say _ ” We can’t all live in a fantasy world where failure isn’t even a possibility.” ( I know you’re mostly joking ), it’s not a fantasy world, and men should never actually be afraid to fail.

kfg
kfg
5 years ago

” . . . even the sacrosanct, inerrant, UMC works this way – girls ride the cock carousel . . .”

And not just the cock carousel. It is for the UMC, at places like Harvard, Yale, Vasser, et all, for which the acronym LUG was coined.

Lesbian Until Graduation.

Been there. Seen that.

Sun Wukong
Sun Wukong
5 years ago

@Blax

I think the vast majority of “SOCIETY HAS GOTTEN SO FUCKED UP!” reactions come from angry disillusionment of Blue Pill views. As I always say: anger is simply the product of the distance between your mental model of reality and actual reality. The closer you can make the two, the less surprised and angry you’ll be. And seeing as you can’t change reality…

Then again, the neo-PC movement really has managed to fuck things up:

newlyaloof
5 years ago

@Rollo, congrats and thanks for all the help you’ve given me.
Appreciate it man.

P.S. But, that about page needs to change in year 6. Quite frankly, it sucks because it doesn’t quickly and easily explain what your site will provide readers. If I were to send somebody to your site, and they read your about page, they’d be scratching their head in confusion.

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
5 years ago

LUG It’s more difficult to catch STD’s that way, and impossible to get preggers, so they got that going for them. Even then they may well be carousel watchers, although that’s less likely to lead to Alpha widows. Frankly, I find the notion of any UMC woman marrying before the age of 29.999 to be rather risible. How can she make partner at the law firm? How can she get tenure in the women’s studies department? Career first, marriage later on, when she’s “ready”. Besides, how can she ride enough cocks in her 20’s if she gets married half way… Read more »

Blaximus
Blaximus
5 years ago

@ Anon ” Who is saying that? Please point to some poster and his words. Thanks.” It is a constant refrain over a dozen posts when the subject of marriage or monogamy arises. Of course I paraphrase, but the ideas are the same, and I normally reject them. If yaReally states something like ” all women have a million orbiters and tons of social media and she will cheat on you because she has all of this temptation and you can’t ” Alpha ” your way out of it, so we need to find ways to get around it and… Read more »

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