Open Cuckoldry


During the Q&A section of the Man in Demand talk I gave back in September I was asked about where I believed the social dynamic of Open Hypergamy would lead. In specific the idea was proposed, and I agree, that the logical next step for a social order founded on feminine Hypergamy and one that prioritizes the female sexual strategy as preeminent would lead to a state of openly accepted cuckoldry.

Although I can’t say it’s an accepted social dynamic as yet, there are many social indicators that are revealing this push towards a normalized cuckoldry. I’ll explore these for a bit in this essay, but for now these indicators are about a move away from conventional monogamy in the hopes that a ‘soft cuckoldry’ might be a precursor to instituting a more accepted open cuckoldry.

I think it’s also important to keep in mind a couple of primary principles about this shift. First is the fact that, initially, an openly accepted state of feminine-controlled cuckoldry will never be called ‘cuckoldry’ proper. If we use the example of a socially accepted (if not celebrated) open Hypergamy as a model, open cuckoldry will be sold as a more logical, more humane sexual strategy for men and women in light of divorce statistics, romantic boredom and other sexual studies that indicate men and women weren’t evolved for monogamous commitment.

The second is that open cuckoldry is the extension of a unilaterally feminine controlled Hypergamy. That is to say that as Hypergamy becomes more normalized as a social imperative that sexual strategy will extend to optimizing Hypergamy across genders. If that optimization is taken to its logical end it will require men not just to adopt cuckoldry as a norm, but to socially reward them for advocating it among their own sex.

Cuckoldry By Any Other Name

As I said, it wont be called ‘cuckoldry’; the connotations are negative, so a redefining will be made in order to make the practice more socially palatable. The Feminine Imperative wont recruit the very men it needs to perpetuate cuckoldry as their own sexual strategy if the term is derogatory. Thus we’ll get euphemisms for alternative lifestyles, ‘open marriages’ or a “Designer Relationship“:

We live in an era when everything is customizable. Relationships are no exception. Some people will continue to practice their grandparents’ form of monogamy, and others, probably the majority, will be serially exclusive and pair-bonded. Still others will explore some form of non-monogamous expression that encompasses one or more of the facets we’ve discussed or may flow in and out of being exclusive based on what the relationship requires. (We’ve done this ourselves.) Having the ability to customize a relationship means having the freedom to respond to life’s vicissitudes.

The first time I came across the concept of ‘soft polygamy’ I was in a behavioral psychology class exploring the practices of modern marriage and contrasting them with the long term sexual behaviors of men and women. As you might imagine the context of the study focused entirely on the ‘bad behaviors’ of men who essentially transitioned from serial monogamy to serial marriage. The idea was that in the process of moving from one LTR to another men were establishing a soft form of polygamy.

In a social respect, men have far more to lose from serial marriages than do women. The financial liabilities of divorce are well known to the manosphere, but so are the emotional and familial accountabilities. So from a strictly male perspective, serial LTRs are a dicey prospect, but from a female perspective, in a feminine-primary social order, institutionalized Hypergamy and the soft polygamy that results from the Sandbergian sexual strategy, soft cuckoldry becomes pragmatic in optimizing Hypergamy for women.

At this point we should consider the Heartiste maxim about feminism again:

The feminist goal is removing all constraints on female sexuality while maximally restricting male sexuality

Institutionalized cuckoldry is the logical means to restricting male sexuality, but we have to consider what function that restriction serves for women. From an Alpha Fucks / Beta Bucks perspective the plan is simple; restrict that sexuality as women find need for a particular man’s service.

Diamonds and Rust

While I’m reluctant to prognosticate, my guess is that future generations of men will be conditioned to accept their role in this cuckoldry as part of their socialization. The above Forevermark diamond advertisement is one illustration of this. Open Hypergamy and its acceptance has already made its popular debut in mainstream media and advertising, and likewise open cuckoldry is just now finding a social foothold.

It takes the Red Pill Lens to appreciate the efforts as they’re being made by a large society. The Forevermark ad is intended to be funny or cute, but it belies a deeper, more poignant truth about Alpha Widows, Hypergamy and the long term sexual strategy Plan and roles women expect men to play in it.

I was made aware of this ad being circulated from a reader on Twitter and at first thought it was a reworked joke. It is however legit and billboards with this campaign are up in major cities. Without the benefit of a Red Pill Lens I can see how most men would laugh it off or women might giggle sardonically about it, but the the fact remains that a clever copywriter is aware of the sexual dynamics that make it funny.

I pulled the following quote from Deti on one of Dalrock’s more recent post:

“I think what we will continue to see is growing disengagement.”

Yeah, this has been discussed here and elsewhere in the almost 5 years I’ve been around here.

I think that what will happen is that things will continue sliding in the same direction they’re going now, until a critical mass is reached. I don’t know what that critical mass is, what will trigger it, or when it will be reached.

We live in a mostly free society with a hybrid of capitalism and socialism. We have maximum freedom and autonomy right now, with both sexes being free to pursue pretty much whatever they want, however they want to. That is the prime characteristic driving the current circumstance — that, and up to now, there’s been enough money taxed, borrowed and stolen to pay for it.

A growing number of men are not getting as much sex as they want. A growing number of women aren’t getting commitments in the form they want — when they want or from the men they want.

So things are going to keep sliding that way. More and more men will walk away and direct what energies they have left elsewhere — into work, or beer/bros/Xbox/porn, or travel/leisure. (Oddly enough, this might make many of them more attractive to women, since they’re spending less time directing their attentions to women.) More and more men will earn just enough to support themselves, since they don’t plan on marriage, and fatherhood is out of the question. They will lack the skills to improve their lives. They will not get nearly as much sex as they want, but they will learn to live with it — mostly through porn, the occasional hookup, and the even more occasional prostitute. The price of prostitutes will skyrocket as demand increases; and a few more women will go into high-end call girl work to earn side money.

More and more women will direct their attentions into their work, travel/leisure, and having children without men. (This will definitely make more of them less attractive to men except as on again, off again sex partners.) They will not get the commitments from men they want, but they will learn to live with it. They will complain about it with increasing volume and shrillness, but they’ll learn to live with it.

Until something happens to cause the tides to turn. Again – don’t know what, or when, or how. But something will happen to cause a hard reset. And it will be exquisitely painful for everyone. I don’t want it to happen, nor do I relish it. It’s not something to desire or look forward to because of the pain it will bring. But I do think it will happen. I don’t think it will happen in my lifetime or my kids’ lifetimes. We could easily slide like this for another 50 to 100 years.

I think one consequence of this separation of the genders will include a socially normalized institution of cuckoldry. To take hold it will need to be termed something different, but in effect the process of women conceiving with one man and then expecting another man to parentally invest himself in that child will be a casual expectation of women. With so many men effectively (if not intentionally) going their own way, the idea that any man wouldn’t be expected to serve as a surrogate parent will become commonplace.

Genders divided by feminism or feminine social primacy will need a ‘customized’ form of cuckoldry that allows for the Alpha Fucks side of Hypergamy to be reconciled with the Beta Bucks side by enlisting different men for either purpose.

The Pink Pill

I want to end here with an essay I read recently on the fallout of the new female form of Viagra:

In an infamous cartoon in The New Yorker in 2001, one woman confides to a friend over drinks: ‘I was on hormone replacement for two years before I realized what I really needed was Steve replacement.’ Medicine has been reluctant to engage the question of just how much monogamy and long-term togetherness affect sexual function and desire, and the ‘Steve’ problem remains an issue that is tacitly acknowledged and yet under-discussed. To return to Julie’s growing pile of self-help titles, the books all promise to return, revive, restore without really getting down to the brass tacks of why desire extinguished in the first place. As Julie notes, the honeymoon grinds to an end, but the issues leading there are complex. In short supply is attention to the way mind and body react to social structures such as popular media, faith and marriage.

To develop drugs to boost libido is like ‘giving antibiotics to pigs because of the shit they’re standing in’

The American psychologist Christopher Ryan argues that the institution of modern marriage – meaning an exclusive couple bound by romantic love – is antithetical to long-term excitement. Ryan is best known for Sex at Dawn (2010), a book authored with his wife Cacilda Jethá, that makes the case that sexual monogamy is deeply at odds with human nature. He is among a growing number of researchers suggesting that the rift between women’s purportedly limitless sexual potential and their dulled actuality might owe to the circumstances of intimacy. Accordingly, the conjugal bed is not only the scene of dwindling desire, but its fundamental cause. The elements that strengthen love – reciprocity, closeness, emotional security – can be the very things that smother lust. While love angles toward intimacy, desire flourishes across a distance.

The entire article is very insightful if not a bit depressing, but with the Red Pill Lens we can begin to understand the latent purpose behind the message. I’ve gone on record about the pushback against clearing the pink pill for use as being a direct threat to women’s control of their own Hypergamy. The concern, ostensibly, is that a libido stimulating drug might be used to induce a woman into having sex that her otherwise sober sense would prevent; effectively it could be a ‘rape’ drug.

What’s finally being addressed in this article however is what I’ve been saying since I was aware of the drug’s trials – a chemical that induces libido in women removes an element of their control in sexual selection and compromises Hypergamy. I’m not entirely sure the author was aware of the points she was revealing in this, but she succinctly makes the case for both institutionalized cuckoldry (or certainly a ‘customized’ soft polygamy for women) and advocates for women maintaining control of their Hypergamy unclouded by a drug that would remove that control by chemically inducing them into sex that isn’t of their own choosing.

The ‘cure’ to women’s low libido is holistic, not biological. Women’s sexual deficiencies are presumed not to be the result of a ‘broken’ biology, but rather a lack of proper motivation. I should point out that all of this validates all the points I was making about Dread in marriage last month on Biblical Gender Roles – maintaining a condition of proper motivation (i.e. Dread), the holistic cure, is exactly what even femosphere authors are tacitly advocating.

The elements that strengthen love – reciprocity, closeness, emotional security – can be the very things that smother lust.

Yet now, even when a pharmaceutical solution to the lust problem is made available the ‘cure’ is rejected. Why? Because on a root, limbic level women’s hindbrains know that Hypergamy cannot be optimized with a drug that removes Hypergamous choice. The real solution has never changed and women are now put into a position of having to openly acknowledge that for all of the pretense of “mismatched libidos” or “sex just declines after marriage” social conventions, men’s cuckoldry is the real plan for Hypergamy.

When presented with a pill that will make them sexual, when given a cure to their low sex drives with the men who’ve made lifetime commitments to them, women will still refuse to take it. Hypergamous doubt can’t be quelled with a pill.

Published by Rollo Tomassi

Author of The Rational Male and The Rational Male, Preventive Medicine

942 comments on “Open Cuckoldry

  1. Listen, open cuck happens because to hang the fucker from the nearest tree is now looked down upon.

  2. “It’s not something to desire or look forward to . . .”

    . . . but while you may not be interested in war, war is already very interested in you. If you desire peace, prepare for war.

  3. Hey – the forevermark ad is really funny for another reason …”hey guys buy the diamond so you can be the forever mark! cuckman”

  4. I sense this whole man/woman thing is changing so fast that we are going to zoom right through the cuck period, into the era of the individual, marked by something akin to what we were talking about some weeks ago with respect to what the male imperative would look like, – unlimited access with no consequences, orgy-style, induced by some sort of new psychic technologies, the seeds of which are already probably in the pipeline, given the techno-wave that is about to crash upon us all.

    I think the future spells the unfettering of the psychic apparatuses that binds our personal agency. The future is enhanced personal agency, and that is going to mean alot more diversity of human expression of all kinds including sexual.

    At some point women will begin to equate reputation ans status with real personal expression (and not just the cheap facsimile of this, as the current shitlib camp campaigns for). Men already have a lead over women with respect to equating reputation and status with real personal expression (but women will catch up).

    The future is going to be much wilder than any of us can even imagine, and I think it is coming surprisingly soon.

  5. But it’s a choice to be cucked. I was banging a girl in my rotation who started banging another dude. She knew i was banging other girls. But the minute i learned she was….she’s nexted. A plate is a plate…but it’s the idea of having something flaunted at me that was the immediate turn off…. i never flaunted other girls in front of the plates. if they ask i reframe…but the idea of “open cuckholdery” is an acceptance on a guy’s part of something that for me is unacceptable.

  6. Why does an open relationship favour women and not men? It’s only cuckoldry if you don’t approve of it. If you agree to an open relationship for both of you, then it seems like an equal footing.

    1. Why does an open relationship favour women and not men? It’s only cuckoldry if you don’t approve of it. If you agree to an open relationship for both of you, then it seems like an equal footing.

      Because there is no margin for error on a man’s part. I’ll be delving into this in the next essay on cuckoldry, but for now bear in mind that an ‘open’ relationship only serves a woman’s sexual imperative.

      Ask yourself this, why would a man persist in an ‘open’ relationship? What unique advantages does he get in this arrangement that he couldn’t by simply staying single, practicing Game and spinning plates?

      Then ask yourself what unique benefits does a woman receive from the same ‘polyamorous’ arrangement?

      When you’re contemplating this, try to divorce yourself from the emotional investments and focus on cold hard evolved Hypergamy and how it would function for either sex in that arrangement.

  7. I am black and open cuck is as normal as it gets in the black community because a large amount of black females have kids in their early teens and will very rarely make it to their mid-20s being slightly attractive without getting knocked up at least once. To date seriously in some pockets of the black community is to raise another mans child, I know multiple friends and family members in this situation now.


    “Apparently there is a new law going into effect in NY at the start of 2016 which caps alimony-eligible earnings at $175,000/year. This means that if you are a guy that makes near or below this amount it’s the same old same old divorce rape for you. Nothing is changed. If she runs off with her co-worker or her high school boyfriend you will be paying her alimony and keeping her in the middle-class lifestyle that she is accustomed to for a very very long time. Usually until both of you are past your romantic prime.

    But lo and behold, if you are a man who earns far in excess of $175,000 as many on Wall Street and also elite professional types do then you get off Scott free. Consider a run of the mill partner at a NYC law firm (i.e. “Big Law”). Let’s say this middle of the pack partner makes $1.5M/yr. Small fry compared to Wall Street hedge fund managers but still decent income. He still has to pay alimony on the first $175K/yr a certain % of which is given to cupcake depending on the mood of the judge and the rest he keeps. The best part is that the remaining $1,325,000/yr will now be entirely alimony-free and completely his.

    Now consider the true 1%’ers making high 7 figures and above, practically their entire income is alimony-free. These guys can now Alpha Fuck their way until the cows come home, even after disasterous marriages, as long as they retain their earnings power. It is only lower and middle class males that stay in the purgatory of BB failure trying to survive on scraps of monthly income left behind after their divorce judgement.”

    A widespread law like this would create a situation where women are more hesitant to marry rich guys for the money because they’ll view themselves as getting “less” than what they “deserve” if they bail on him.

    But more importantly it makes marriage less of a hazard to rich Beta Bucks and Alpha rich CEO “want to start a family someday” men…incentive for them to start marrying these 30+yo single women? That rich dude is never going to marry a “good enough” 35yo when he can pay millions in alimony…but if the risk is minimized then hey, maybe it’s worth it.

    But of course it’s not a law like “alimony will cap at X% of your earnings” because the “lesser men” who are dirt to society and women’s Hypergamy still gotta pay everything while they work 3 jobs and live out of their car.

    Cuckoldry and acceptance (and praise) of open Hypergamy is definitely being mass-promoted. And the next gen of guys is more and more cool with it, like these guys are fine with being just another orbiter chode to the girl who’s resources she uses while she’s off fucking her fuckbois because the guys are so fucking thirsty because the girls don’t want them because they’re FI-brainwashed into being unappealing.

    …which all works out GREAT for us older guys. These girls can have their BB on the side and I can provide the AF. There’ll be even LESS need for me to have ANY Provider qualities if this does go widescale. Hell, I’ve been in situs where the BBs are funding what the girl and I do. Could see a big increase in that along with acceptance of it from the BBs themselves.

    But I mean, that’s a step up from promoting pedophilia which is the other push inexplicably picking up steam:

    (could part of the pedo push be because a bunch of 30+yo single women are going to need to maximize the range of men they can socially-acceptably get preggers by and child support from? Spinster teacher fucking the high school jock etc)

    Dat social programming. Fuckin scary. 10 years ago no one even used the world “cuckold”, now it’s all over the place and the stigma of swingers into the cuckold thing etc is lowering, and the prevalence of cuckold porn has increased dramatically.

    The key to avoiding being cuckolded is understanding how to trigger Hypergamy and understanding the red pill to avoid being the BB…but what happens when you brainwash a generation of men to make them feel ashamed for even glancing at red pill information, fill the media and entertainment with content that promotes and normalizes the cuckold open BB/AF concept, and dump a bunch of porn on them that helps them develop a taste for it (or uncovers a fetish they wouldn’t have realized they had if they hadn’t been exposed to it) in their early developing years?

    …society is gonna get a lot weirder before it gets better lol

    1. Talking about the next generation praising their cuckoldry. Watch this video by an Austrailian Band called “5 seconds of summer” the song is called,”She’s kinda hot”

      It’s all about letting pretty girls walk all over you.

  9. Monique Mulder observed this trend in the Mpimbwe tribe in Tanzania.

    Basically the fall in comparative economic output of men (relative to women) causes women to seek economic optimisation via multiple partnering. Interestingly economically autonomous women optimised non economic markers (alpha fucks?).

    Seems like YaReally is an example of an early adopter of this trend, sexual status signalling is trumping economic status signalling.

    Mulder observed the side effects as increased listlessness among men, more downtime and even lower economic output, while the women actually experienced more work and less downtime.

    Simply put, cuckholded men have no incentive to maximise work output, ala Dalrock’s signalling incentive scenario.

  10. “We could easily slide like this for another 50 to 100 years.” Barring major catastrophe which would send existing relationships scrambling for tightened security to the “familiar” and less risky, my guess is the slide will go on about that long.

    Even a correction based on a major event, having not organically “hit bottom” in totality, would eventually pick up back where it left off until that critical mass is achieved.

    With the last half of my life upon me, this is what I’m planning on.. more slide. It’s the best contingency plan basis I foresee.

  11. @Johnycomelately
    “Seems like YaReally is an example of an early adopter of this trend, sexual status signalling is trumping economic status signalling.”

    Yup. I’m just going by what I’m seeing out there, anyone can see the trends if they’re infield. Girls aren’t impressed by money anymore, they either have their own money or/and have government money/support to take care of them or/and have an unlimited list of orbiters who will happily fight over who gets to fund them without even requiring sex and fully accepting the BB cuckold role if they need it. That’s the reality of hot <25yo girls today.

    The 25+yo's might feel a little guilty about it, like because they're from a slightly different time…but the <25yos almost view it like "that's what these guys are FOR". That's actually how I AMOG a girl's orbiters, like I TELL her to flirt with them and don't care if they buy them stuff etc "because that's what those guys are for". Because why would they view those guys as anything else? Why WOULDN'T they accept all these free things, they've been told since childhood that they're special for having tits and these guys are insignificant nothings to them anyway (not that they treat them bad on purpose out of some malicious intent but like, you're probably not concerned about the ants scurrying around on the sidewalk below you even if you aren't maliciously trying to crush them).

    What happens in economics in general when there's an abundance of something? It's value goes down and people start using other more unique features to define that thing's value.

    Most guys reading this will accept this. We all know that's how a market in general works.

    So when women's Provider needs are more than adequetely, what happens?

    The ability to Provide becomes less valuable and women start looking at other unique features to define value. Like Lover features. Because Lovers are rare now, since guys are all neutered by the FI conditioning they've had…even guys who DO get these girls VERY OFTEN end up being needy/clingy instead of remaining aloof and cool and end up turning the girl off.

    Most guys reading this will accept this.

    But watch what happens when I keep extrapolating this consistent logic into an area that guys have heavily invested beliefs in lol:

    What do HB9's and 10's social circles look like? Specifically the guys? A bunch of hot tall jacked rich good-looking dudes, because normal guys don't feel entitled to even approach the girl and those guys are the "most likely" to display alpha traits (and probably would if they weren't being brainwashed by the FI into often having chode tendencies and blue pill thinking under all the money and looks) so they're the safest bet to hang out with because logically they're more likely to display alpha traits than the quiet shy ugly nerd circle playing World of Warcraft…and they're also the most likely to have high-value alpha friends so basically they're the ones the hottest girls will hang around.

    But what did we just say about economics? That smokin hot girl already has all the Provider shit she needs, so she's looking for a Lover. But she's so surrounded by looks and money that they don't have value anymore…her entire social circle is pretty, but 99% of it is blue pill chodes (maybe not in business etc but in seducing women) in pretty packaging. If she wanted to just get laid by a hot guy she could literally snap her fingers and have a gangbang with 10 tall rich jacked guys. But she doesn't, and, very often, she'll be completely uninterested sexually in them or even turned off by them and just use them as orbiters and validation etc, because they don't turn her on.

    The HB6 who has one tall hot jacked rich guy in her social circle, ya she jumps his fucking bones. But the 10 has an over-abundance of that already, and most of those guys are just nice good dudes under it and aren't badass alpha assholes who tease and neg and understand game…a lot of them are guys who passively rely on a girl showing interest in them, or happening to be the guy around the girl at the end of the night when the party dies down, or worse in rich circles trying to bribe the girls with drugs and booze and just plowing them in that compromised state.

    So what happens when a normal looking guy walks over to a circle of tall jacked rich dudes that are with the 10 and just stands beside them and doesn't do anything? He's completely invisible.

    But what happens if that normal looking guy chats one of the dudes up and befriends him, gets group approval, teases her, ignores her to befriend the men and demonstrate social savviness and leadership of men etc, negs her when she tries to find out who he is and then gets up in her space to game her creating huge emotional impact with and giving her a rollercoaster of emotions that these other guys she's so bored with don't give her?

    Well now you're demonstrating a unique feature that makes you stand out from the over-saturated market.

    But no one will listen to THIS part…they'll still look at a hot girl with hot guys and think "there's no way she'd go for me" and not approach that set.

    "Mulder observed the side effects as increased listlessness among men, more downtime and even lower economic output,"

    MGTOW and Grasseaters on the "no fucks given about women" side and TRP'ers on the "women are fun but also I don't want to be workhorse for the system" other side are all already heading down this path so this is playing out.

    "while the women actually experienced more work and less downtime."

    Sounds about right. I actually think part of why the webcam and Instagram/orbiter stuff has picked up so much steam is because girls are starting to realize "I don't LIKE working, and my aunt/mom/friends/etc are all miserable working…that feminism stuff was cool but like, I don't want to work 80 hours a week to be a CEO I just want to not have to worry about rent and have fun". So they see stuff like webcamming or building huge armies of orbiters on Instagram who buy them shit and hand them money as a MUCH more appealing option. Like I think this is the start of the push-back and the beginning sparks of the YaReally Reversion Theory:

    I think it'll get worse (a LOT worse) before it gets better, but I think it's going to get better, espeically as more of these old hag's write their complaining blog posts about how men won't marry them and girls read the comment sections and see how many men don't want to get married because women aren't offering anything anymore and they start looking for the edge over their competition (because girls LOVE to compete with other girls, there are entire consumer industries and pickup tactics based around that).

    I say men should learn game and focus on their own shit and enjoy playing the field and building their value and just stall for time till this generation of girls become the warning sign for the girls growing up right now, because I think what girls will be offering in 10+ years will be MUCH better than what's being offered now and they'll be looking for older men who aren't FI-brainwashed cuckold BB chodes like their peers will be. So here I sit, chilling poolside watching it all fall down, sipping a drink with a smile as I waiting for the good stuff to bounce back up and sort itself from the garbage which is when, if I decide I want to settle down, I would do it. Right now? Not a chance. And I think men choosing to settle right now are crazy and should wait it out for a bit…especially if they're <35yo. A guy settling down in his 20s right now in 2015 is a fucking madman.

  12. @walawala : I conduct myself the same. Plates but no acceptance of being cucked. Just this weekend, a new plate I’ve been seeing about 5 weeks had a small Bday celebration at a dive bar I attended. We got rather drunk, and I watched (and told her I was) how she acted as each level of drunkenness leveling up.

    Mindful of my surroundings, and years of “reading a room” experience from playing in bands kicked in, and I noticed this one dude strangely lingering in the shadows non-chalantly at first, then increasingly pervasive the more drunk my plate and I got. Check. I’m onto something. My theory; These two used to fuck, she clued him into fact she’d be partying there despite her stating wanting to “be exclusive” with me recently, for which I responded;”We’ll see how things go.”

    He comes up next to me and the first thing I say is;”So you know Erica?” He says he’s her neighbor from 2 houses down. Hmm. So Erica comes over “acting” surprised he’s there, yada yada. Erica walks off I look the guy straight in the face in a disarming brotherhood tone and say;”Hey, just be honest with me.. you two used to bang huh?” Long pause, short bewildered look.. and he says No. Check.

    Basically she had both her back up, and at least one guy knowing what was up, not expecting the other guy (me) to pick the lock of her surrounding herself with fuckables. A grill the dude for more info and he says;”Let’s just say, she’s not the type of girl you want to have any standing relationship with, she’s fun, I’ll just leave it at that.”

    One thing I definitely won’t tolerate is any women trying the exclusive talk with me, only to front load her evening with ex-fuck(s) surrounding us in the waiting, no less a dude right down the road whose surly a regular booty call when I’m not there. He can have her. Upon dropping her off at home, I told her she can take a flying fuck, while she said something so evil it nearly takes the cake. My dad died from ALS in 2007. She says this precisely;”Oh yea asshole? Well you know that gene you likely carry from your dad’s ALS? Well I hope you die the same agonizing way he did.” These hoes are God damned ruthless.

  13. @Dave

    “If you agree to an open relationship for both of you, then it seems like an equal footing.”

    Yeah, no. For your average blue pill chump to get laid, he has to work his ass off on self improvement and swallow the red pill I concept if not in name. For the average chick to do the same, she has to just stop saying “No”.

    Not equal in the least.

  14. GRock Girls are basically interchangeable. One plate is off banging another dude so I just next her. No drama no notice just no more…another plate is on my case about wanting an exclusive relationship…my reaction again is to just not respond. That girl didn’t even wish me a happy birthday. My first case is similar to yours. The ironic thing..girls hate that you may flaunt other women but suddenly get nasty when you tell them off about their acting out. I didn’t and won’t tell my plate why im no longer on the grid for her. What’s the use? Better to move forward and restock the shelves.

  15. My first reaction was that the Forevermark ad represented some clever manosphere humor.

    But, holy crap, it’s real. We’re literally moments away from seriously open hypergamy.

  16. @Mr C
    That was a good fucking talk thanks for linking it. From the talk:

    “If in the past we divorced because we were UNHAPPY…today we divorce because we could be happIER.”

    THIS x10000. This is the new mentality in 2015, espeically in women with the Eat Pray Love push. This is why marrying in 2015 is just retarded. Again it was different in the past, because of a ton of factors, but this is how it is in the modern era and guys need to understand and accept that.

    “I tell my clients if they could bring to their relationships 1/10th of the boldness, the imagination and the verve they bring to their affairs they probably would not need to see me.”

    As I explain in my pLTR and “Why monogamy is broken in 2015” post here:

    Monogamy/marriage actively remove the things that make the relationship feel exciting and like a rollercoaster of emotions and actively handicap the guy’s ability to be bold, imaginative, challenging, aloof, punishing, rewarding and having it mean something (VS the beta who just rewards her endlessly till it loses meaning), fighting (it can be GOOD to pick a fight now and then or let her pick one so she gets her need for a range of emotions filled with some drama) etc etc

    So those girls, who don’t hate their man and even love him and love what they have with him, go out to the bar and look for assholes like me because their man has voluntarily signed up for a situation where the stuff that keeps her excited and interested (and him, this all applies with the genders flipped if she lets herself go and he loses interest but men have more desire for variety whereas Hypergamy is more about the one top dog that provides her the best value so the temptations are a bit different).

    And she may have no intention of cheating, but she’s still inherently CRAVING that stuff that her man has voluntarily chosen to not be able to provide for her, and those are the things that a guy like me just naturally radiates because I’m single so I’m naturally the bold imaginative aloof hard to get punishing rewarding rollercoaster ride of emotions that she’s craving. And if she can’t find me, often she’ll just blow her own relationship up causing drama etc because her man isn’t providing that range of emotions, even if the emotions he IS providing her are all happy ones people don’t WANT to just be happy all the time…that’s why we pay money to go be scared and repulsed and sad etc watching horror movies and thrillers. We want the eventual happy ending, but we want to go on the rollercoaster to get to it.

    That’s why I always boil it down to “if that guy was doing his job providing her what she needs, she wouldn’t come find it from assholes at the bar”. If that guy had been running a pLTR which lets him KEEP all those things that make him attractive and exciting and high-value and gives her a range of emotions, she would get that stuff from him.

    pLTR is the future. Unless technology dies out and we go back to the dark ages, there’s no going back to how shit was when monogamous marriage worked. From this point on women will ALWAYS have access to thousands of orbiters on her little validation device in her pocket and that number of orbiters will just go up not down.

    She also describes some of the good things that come out of affairs/infidelity. I could list a bunch more benefits to it too, that I see from the inside perspective. That’s why I sleep easy at night…the system is already broken, it’s not working anymore…I say burn it down and create a new system that actually works in this current culture.

    @walawala @GRock
    I don’t mind if girls have other guys. It’s not cuckolding for me because all I’m offering is sex on my personal schedule. If I’m like, out of town for a month I don’t expect her to not fuck anyone and I’m not going to cut her off if she does. As long as she’s keeping our plans and not flaking on me and she’s not coming over without showering up, she’s free to do what she wants because I don’t want to date her. If she fucks around too much or unsafely or starts to treat me with less respect than I expect, then ya she gets a freezeout/Next. But I just assume that hot girls have a few other guys on the go.

    “So Erica comes over “acting” surprised he’s there”

    lol I’ve met girls who purposely invite all their orbiters and exes out to the same bar to watch them fight over her. It’s win/win for her, she gets drama and gets to watch guys fighting over her and no one actually blames HER or says to her “fuck this you’re not worth it I’m out” and walks away, they all fight over her and she goes home with whoever the best one is that night.

    “Basically she had both her back up, and at least one guy knowing what was up, not expecting the other guy (me) to pick the lock of her surrounding herself with fuckables.”

    This is why you never go to the venue she wants you to go to for a Day2 etc. Girls won’t pick a venue where they don’t know anyone and have no value and things are nice and easy for you. She’ll pick a venue where she has other guys and orbiters and shit incase you suck. I NEVER let girls dictate where we meet up. Even if I’m at a bar a block away from the bar they’re at and they’re BEGGING to fuck tonight, I’ll make her meet me at a venue between us so she has to leave her environment because I KNOW that if I go there she’s going to have a handful of guys she’s met that night that I have to diffuse and disarm to get her out of there and I’m going to have to try to get her attention which lowers my value etc.

    If you DO end up in that situation the two best options are either 1) be so aggressively up in her grill and/or AMOG’ing the other guys with just sheer unstifled value (not tooling them, but being cooler than them and assuming you’re fucking her that night, treating it like you’re married to her and sweeping in to rescue her from the chode-fest she doesn’t want, lots of strong internal belief shit) so that the othe guys fuck off because they can’t compete. Or 2) if you’re not feeling that badass that night, just start opening and flirting with other girls and ignoring her…she’ll come find you when she sees other girls want you and that you won’t chase her and that she might lose you lol

    I don’t get attached enough to care if they do stuff like that. I expect it. Like I can tell when a girl boyfriend’s up because she’ll go from texting me pages of shit daily to suddenly a week of silence and one word replies. I don’t get pissed off at them because I have and can get other girls, if anything that guy she’s seeing is saving me from having to deal with her giving me the Ultimatum wanting me to be her boyfriend lol Sometimes I call them out and make fun of them “awww sounds like true love to me <3 <3 lol" but I'll usually throw in an "in all seriousness tho, good luck babe I hope it works out. but keep my number incase it doesn't ;)" lol The vast majority of the time I'll get a txt in a few weeks/months because surprise surprise it didn't work out once the New Relationship Energy phase wore off and she got to know him and got to see all his chodey behavior or just naturally got bored being in an LTR because LTRs are usually inherently boring and because I'm not texting her my value never goes down, she assumes I'm off fucking a harem of hotties and being fun and adventurous etc while she watches her guy watching youtube in his boxers with no social life.

  17. Re. the quote from Deti, the paragraph that begins, “A growing number of men are not getting as much sex as they want…” and the paragraph after that are both spot on. More and more men are going to see this as a battle they cant’ win. As such, they will make do with distracting themselves somehow with both productive and unproductive pursuits, and they will become increasingly resigned to the occasional lay, be it a hookup or a paid encounter.

    But I disagree with the part of Deti’s quote where he says this may take 50 or 100 years to materialize. Show of hands here…how many of you predicted, say, 15 years ago that a male celebrity would be applauded for “courage” in transforming himself (herself?) into a “woman” named Kaitlyn? Me neither. The hypergamy brick wall is going to be hit a hell of a lot earlier than any 50 years from now.

  18. I’ve decided to get in touch with my feminine side.
    I’ve decided to love opportunisticly, I’ve decided to embrace Hypergamy as my mating strategy and solipsism as my mental point of origin.
    I will ruthlessly upgrade my plates at every opportunity without thought for anyone’s needs but my own.
    Having discovered that females bring so little to the table in terms of love, support and being a team I have accepted that I stand alone and accept that my happiness is solely my responsibility.

    I have no choice but to take this path, this games going down like it or not, not taking part (mgtow) is not an option for me as I like the pussy too much.
    I now view Females as purely for entertainment purposes so if they want my time they have to be hot and they have to perform as they offer little else, and if they can do that with some feminity then I’ll let them stay a while until I get the opportunity to upgrade.

    I have swallowed the red pill and dealt with it’s bitterness, it’s taken just under two years to reach this point.
    I love the company of sexy feminine women, I’ve learned to love the game, now it’s time to play.
    Are you ready “Ladies” ?

  19. @GRock: Damn man. Wishing you die from the same degenerative disease that your dad died of? Evil is the right word. Damn.

  20. Funny but I just listened to the bonobo monkey section in “The Way of Men”, and the parallels are right on.

  21. Very interesting and I see signs of this all the time in my limited circle of acquaintances.

    I predict that whatever happens:

    1. men will be held to be at fault.
    2. marriages of limited duration will be instituted.

    We already have limited marriages where the State determine that because two people have lived together for a short while they are de facto married and other state institutions such as requiring marriage for five years to be eligible for citizenship to mail order brides (who then promptly upgrade – if they can).

  22. YaReally is bang on about the BB provider strategy being over abundant and lacking in Value.

    My ex-gf recently moved onto another dude because I pushed her away in terms of commitment. Yet because my verbal game was always on point with her, she always kept coming back.

    Even now, she’s still unsatisfied with the new guy despite having better provider attributes than I have (Owns a few successful business, has his own place etc.)

    Not surprisingly, I pushed her further to him by eventually breaking and telling her how I truly felt about her and wanting her back. I simply couldn’t compete on that level, so she didn’t come back.

    I know now that the only way to get her back is to genuinely move on, wish her well in her new relationship with the new beta and start gaming new and diverting my attention.

    The best defence is verbal game. Competing at the BB level will always be harder than simply going out and learning some techniques to improve your attractiveness.

    Many guys in the community don’t seem to get this and still think pumping weights, dressing in tailored suits and having a big bank balance is what will make all the difference. You’re simply making things a lot harder for yourselves than it actually needs to be.

  23. You guys would be surprised at how many women I grew up with that are married now, who have private messaged me on social media and were pretty much direct about what they wanted.

    It’s stunning to be truthful. I live an exiting life, travel, in decent shape, and their husbands are blobs. Some were or are close friends that I holler at when I visit home. Hypergamy doesn’t care. They’re like feral cats in heat.

  24. I helped. I wear multiple horns. I stayed because the children were young and managed, I think, to blunt the rampaging vagina a bit.

    Now everyone has reached legal adulthood. I’m still here and it sucks; somebody said something like “you can’t fix what you behaved yourself into.” The counter-pressure to a change in behavior is incredible.

    Never let yourself be in a position where tolerating being cuckolded is a better option.

  25. @Andy
    “YaReally is bang on about the BB provider strategy being over abundant and lacking in Value.”

    The best way I can describe it is that guys focused on lifting, money, suits, cars, etc are putting a lot of time and effort into areas that women no longer value. It’s like investing in stocks for VHS when DVDs have been released and are catching on like wildfire…there was a point where VHS was king and those stocks were worth investing in, but shit changes and you have to adapt your strategy.

    This wasn’t the case in the past, that these things weren’t valuable, but society has changed in even the last 10 years. 2015 is a different beast and in this beast women have an overabundance of those attributes available to them so they’ve lost a lot of their value.

    Now those things CAN be useful in that like, being in decent shape shows you take care of your body and will be able to fuck her good. But there’s no reason to worry about getting jacked, it’s irrelevant. An HB10’s social circles will already have 10 other guys bigger and more jacked and more rich than you.

    I liken it to a buddy I went to Vegas with. We knew we’d be hitting pool parties so he got himself SUPER jacked. He was in retarded shape, killer body, made the rest of us look like fat walruses and beanpoles and he was super proud of it. We strolled into a pool party with him getting cocky about how he was going to get so much attention…soon as we walk in like 80% of the guys there are bigger and more jacked than him lol (’cause it’s Vegas). Dude’s state/confidence TANKED and he spent the day just drinking and looking defeated because all his hard work was a waste. My fat ass had a great time because I knew going in that my value is in expressing my personality, not competing on looks/money/etc lol

    Like I get that in the old days looks and money probably DID matter, girls were looking for BB/Provider qualities and shit. But shit has changed. An HB10 is surrounded by those things and has her own money and just doesn’t NEED that stuff from men anymore. That’s WHY they call all these guys “fuckbois” now. They have a dozen jacked good-looking chode orbiters chasing them, all they want from their fuckboi is a guy who fucks their minds and bodies to give them that full range of emotions like they imagine James Deen and Christian Grey would.

    Cause what those guys around her AREN’T offering her is emotional impact and making her feel ALIVE. That’s what they’re craving right now. And you can provide that by just going out and learning to talk to women and flirt, tease, push/pull, give her the full range of emotions, escalate, fuck, etc.

    Hell why are girls all obsessed with Netflix binging? Because TV and movies are designed to give them the full range of emotions that the guys in their life aren’t giving them.

    Now if there’s no one providing that emotional impact shit then ya, she’ll pick one of those guys around her because in the absence of steak, a McDonald’s hamburger looks pretty good compared to a convenience store plastic-wrapped burger or starving…and that DOES happen a lot, because normal guys eject themselves out of the running of even attempting to get with girls like that because they just assume “she should be with that guy, I read a study from harvard once where people marry within 2 points of their looks range” and they don’t even TRY let alone practice getting GOOD at getting those girls, so that rich tall jacked chode doesn’t have any competition and the girl doesn’t want to starve.

    …then everyone wonders why the bored rich housewife fucks the poolboy, or why that chick fucked Dan Blizerian when she was already dating a dude who bought her a Tesla to match his Tesla. It’s not because she totalled up their assets and logically compared them or because Dan has 3″ larger biceps, it’s because Dan offers the emotional impact that her boyfriend doesn’t and that’s what she’s looking for.

    This is why I say guys should just focus on game now. Those other things might have been worth focusing on even up to like, 2005, before social media, Instagram, Tinder, smartphones, etc. But now? Don’t waste your time. Those things are going to go even LOWER in value because it’s not like girls are going to just suddenly not have access to orbiters or the government or all drop out of university and need someone to take care of them anytime soon.

    Invest your time in maxing out your Lover attributes which are the things a guy like RSDJulien is teaching for how to game the <25yo hotties in 2015 and fill that need they're looking for a guy to fill.

    Now if you want to settle and have kids, you'll need some Provider shit but 1) seriously reconsider doing that for another 10 years minimum, because right now you're walking into a shitshow culture that's working against you succeeding at that, wait for it to settle down a bit and see where it goes before you decide to take that plunge (like counting cards in blackjack and betting high when you know the deck is better), 2) expect that she'll leave around the 7-10 year mark like don't settle thinking "this will last forever", always accept that it could end at any minute and prepare yourself and your life accordingly so that you don't get too burned, and 3) maintain Hypergamy, learn everything you can about how it works and how to maintain it because giving her ALL the shit she needs (and if you legally tie yourself to her or make it so you can't just walk away at any point you'll have to consciously find ways to still create dread in her mind) is going to help keep her from E-Mailing benfromtexas etc

  26. @YaReally

    You’re spot on mate. I look at things in terms of a pyramid in that Game is the foundation. Have that strengthened and along the way, focus on the other things that most other people think is the only thing that gets the girls.

    In fact, I purposely avoid telling girls how much money I make and go out of my way to wear normal clothes and drive a shit car, because I want to make sure that this person likes me for me and not because of the things external to me that can be replaced at any time,

    Most average guys fall for that strategy and don’t seem to realise that they’re essentially shooting themselves in the foot.

    Learned charisma never weakens and will only get stronger and stronger over time. The bonus of having the other things in place is that when she doesn’t eventually see it accidentally, it’s all pretty much icing on the cake and there’s no way she can leave you. You’ll have everything a girl could possibly want.

  27. “If you agree to an open relationship for both of you, then it seems like an equal footing.”

    Yes, it would seem that way, if you have the impression that men and women are equal. I know this may be a hard idea to internalize given the social gestalt of the last 50 years or so, but men and women are not equal and without transhumanist intervention never will be, because they cannot be.

    And with transhumanist intervention they will cease to be human and all bets are off.

  28. Dave

    December 7th, 2015 at 2:40 am
    “Why does an open relationship favour women and not men? It’s only cuckoldry if you don’t approve of it. If you agree to an open relationship for both of you, then it seems like an equal footing”

    Incorrect. A cuck is a man whose wife has intercourse with anyone other than himself. With or without his knowledge and/or consent. Your approval doesn’t uncuck you, if anything it solidifies it.

    Some even use the term for the partners of non-wives; LTR’s or plates.

  29. “maintain Hypergamy, learn everything you can about how it works and how to maintain it because giving her ALL the shit she needs (and if you legally tie yourself to her or make it so you can’t just walk away at any point you’ll have to consciously find ways to still create dread in her mind)”

    New to married RP, but this is spot-on! I have inadvertently dreaded SO, and it works… In my BP days, I would have felt bad and apologized and professed eternal love…etc. Now, I recognize her reactions to something simple like her questioning why I want my going out clothes washed sooner than later, and I just AA and laugh it off. She gets a really hot looking smirk and look in her eye.

  30. Honestly I was a bit skeptical when I started reading this, that open cuckoldry is “a thing” or going to be “a thing”, but I see what you’re saying, especially with the way that essay on the pink pill ends.

    And actually, yes. There is absolutely an ever-strengthening push for men to become more comfortable raising other men’s babies. My husband and I dealt with this recently because we were talking about whether our next child would be adopted or biologically born.

    We don’t have any sons yet, and my husband’s feeling is that while he could see himself adopting, he really wants a biological son and to try everything we can to conceive a son biologically first. In talking about this with other traditional families, the reaction was like, oh yeah, of course, that’s natural and normal for men. In talking about this with feminists/single ladies, it was like “WHAT HOW DARE HE!”

    There was absolutely an element of shaming and I can see how that is an example of very early stages of introducing open cuckoldry.

  31. YaReally writes: “Hell why are girls all obsessed with Netflix binging? Because TV and movies are designed to give them the full range of emotions that the guys in their life aren’t giving them.”

    This is the true. My wife, daughter, and now granddaughter, are all engaged with (to?) their iPads – streaming tingles. I seem to remember encountering description of that slack-jawed consumption in Fahrenheit 451. Eerie.

  32. With the invention of male birth control, is it still cuckoldry if no children are involved? It simple becomes fornication over time.

  33. Open cuckoldry has been around for a bit; there is no legal ramification against adultery. That is, there are no ramifications for the woman: let a man call her an adulterous whore and see how quickly he is falsely accused.

  34. When you say most men aren’t getting the amount of sex they want, okay, but throughout history most men didn’t get the amount of money they wanted, lifespan they wanted, etc. Cuckoldry coming from the cuckoo bird who lays eggs in another’s next, I really don’t think this is cuckoldry since no children

  35. The One: I’d say it comes down to intention: if a wife intends to have a penis, other than her husband’s, in her vagina, it is cuckoldry.

    I.e. we cannot separate copulation from reproduction. Intending to copulate is intending to reproduce.

  36. @SJB

    As a Catholic I agree that copulation shouldn’t be separate from reproduction. However if before one copulated, they reach into the wallet, open the condom package and then put it on the penis, it’s impossible to say “intention to copulate is intending to reproduce”. Rather they have an intention to fulfill their lusts, which is adultery.

  37. @The One: “I really don’t think this is cuckoldry since no children”

    I really don’t think this is a marriage. Looking at its actual terms, it appears to be nothing more nor less, in all its particulars, than a contract of indenture.

    @SJB: “I.e. we cannot separate copulation from reproduction. Intending to copulate is intending to reproduce.”

    It’s babies all the way down.

  38. The One: I do understand what you have written but would disagree; a man does not put on a condom for any reason other than to prevent insemination of a female. The act of sheathing is subsequent to the intention to copulate and the knowledge that copulation is a reproductive act.

  39. ” . . . they have an intention to fulfill their lusts, which is adultery.”

    And in order to do so must inherently assume the risks of reproduction, no matter their intention. You’d almost think that the lust was designed to fulfil and enforce the function of reproduction no matter the self-conscious intent of the act.

  40. @kfg: Very excellent – “Babies all the way down.” There was a character in a Joyce novel, don’t remember the character or the novel, who mused about everyone’s umbilicus attaching to mother, to mother, to mother all the way back to Eve. Babies all the way down.

  41. WRT the ad, I am glad I am a sailor, that sailor.

    Ester Perel,
    yes a good talk(s), I had seen them before and it certainly touched on many RP concepts, specifically that to create that sexual urgency you need to break the monotony of secure monogamy and create some excitement and danger.

    @Rollo has ruined pop culture for me now. I have been renovating a bathroom at home and listening to Virgin radio while I work as a form of stick to keep beating me forward with its 90 minute ever repeating play list. I now listen to every song’s lyrics with my RP lenses firmly in place.

    From Justin Beiber, “what do you mean”. E.g. your body says yes but your words say no, it’s the Anti slut defence, last minute resistance song.

    To, anything by Taylor Swift, Wildest dreams, be my Alpha and widow me, just please God don’t forget about me later on in life, I’ll bang you now and it’ll be hot just please don’t forget me. (He must have been a sailor)

    Adele, Hello, lyrics a la, Yes I dumped you and tortured you before but now I am older and past the wall I have regretted what I did, won’t you please come back to me beta boy, what do you mean you don’t care any more? what do you mean by Righteous Agent of Alpha retribution? Oh please just answer the phone won’t you?. (In the first week 3 million post wall lonely women with boxed wine downloaded that track and cried to it while scrolling FB and Tinder)

    Then to add a personal anecdote to heap on the pile of data we all know about. Friday afternoon I end up in a downtown bar after an industry lunch with lots of gabbing etc going on. I meet a nice woman, attractive, 36 years old. We chat for a while I ask her, “How she fits in this world”, I was alluding to the conference we were at and what kind of job she held, builder, designer, admin etc? But she launched into, “I don’t know, I want to be a mother but I am commitment-phobic, I’ve been with a man for a while but I am just not sure about it.”

    I did not immediately steer her back to my original question I just played out the thread. She knew she was post wall for all intents and purposes, she was attractive and could score but her eggs were frying on the sidewalk before me and she was in this haze of regret and desire all tangled up.

    I suggested life was not being fair to her, in an open ended kind of way and sure enough she said, “no it’s me, I don’t know…….” I interjected, “He’s a nice guy and makes you feel comfortable but he’s just not the one you want to father your children?”

    She shot me the little laser stare as if to say, “But you haven’t even met him, how could you know that?”.

    She had a deep look of concern for a moment while I said it then broke into a very engaging smile, she then proceeded to kino me. We chatted a little more but then the guy I was with crashed it, she got flustered and made tracks out of there.

    I cannot help but think that if I had worked some YaReally game on her I could have been cucking her poor live in boyfriend. It just seemed too easy given her visceral and immediate reaction.

    I tell you these RP goggles are like frickin x-ray vision, only problem is you can’t NOT see this shit all around you.

    Adultry = stepping out on your defined partner.

    Cuckoldry = being duped into raising offspring that are not of your seed.

    Open cuckoldry = being told if you want any companionship of the female sort you will get along with raising the offspring of another man’s seed and you’ll probably have to accept her occasional or regular stepping out for good measure so suck it up butter cup because all you got is BB and no Alpha tingles.

    Societal side effects may include legal banning of DNA and paternity tests, vitriolic shaming of Beta men who question their choice in market terms, lionization of emotionally intelligent Alpha’s, the option for mother’s to designate which man will be burdened with child support obligations (BB this means you, Alpha I’ll see you next GNO, winky face). More shaming of hi IQ Beta men for not being equalist enough to accept “progressive” parenting models and so on. See CH for all the details as they evolve.

    1. I suggested life was not being fair to her, in an open ended kind of way and sure enough she said, “no it’s me, I don’t know…….” I interjected, “He’s a nice guy and makes you feel comfortable but he’s just not the one you want to father your children?”
      She shot me the little laser stare as if to say, “But you haven’t even met him, how could you know that?”.

      Almost verbatim the conversation I had with the bartender in Vegas back in September.

  42. I can’t help but think this Open Hypergamy / Open Cuck is nothing more than the modern equivalent of a conquering army impregnating the women and leaving the offspring to be raised by the conquered cucks.

    Rollo I think you should read this –

    The guys central thesis is that our real enemy is not the people doing the bad things to us. But more the idiots that keep telling us that “they are not so bad”, “It’s good to have an alpha horn dog around” 5th column types that delude us into thinking that bad is good.

    We are getting past the time where we can keep allowing people to call things in fanciful PC terms. We have a recruiting crisis in our military our cuck political leaders’ answer was to allow women in combat roles.

    the decline may be faster than we think

  43. @LeeLee: Men don’t want to raise another man’s obligation even if it is openly known as such through adoption. If you speak to men who father adapted kids, then they may just tell you in an unguarded moment that they just don’t love them the same as their other biological children.

  44. Rollo, I’m surprised that in your articles about the future of hypergamy you don’t mention the imminent clash of western feminism and Islamic culture. The French author Michel Houellebecq makes the case in his novels that it will never be possible for feminists to ideologically oppose Islamic culture, despite its treatment of women, because feminism reflexively sides with the underdog against institutionalized power. I don’t think he’s right. I think we’ll see Eurpoean women embrace muslim polygamy and the polyandry of western open hypergamy without acknowledging a conflict. What this means for women’s rights legally is up for grabs. Strange times ahead.

  45. Had a big fight last night with wife. Her and our daughter come home after a day of doing their thing while my son and I did our thing.

    Great day of relaxed bonding and peace and quiet. The second they get home, my daughter starts teasing my son through the open window; she didn’t even wait until she got in the freaking house.

    My son’s a good kid, and my daughter teases relentlessly. I’ve had to teach him how to win the teasing game, but even for me that shit gets old.

    Then my wife starts complaining (again from the porch; she didn’t even wait to get into the door) about some pet shit on the porch. I was having none of it. I told her don’t start up right as you get in. Ask me how my days was, give me a hug, and then ask if I can clean up the shit and then I’ll simply do so. Then I ask her if the dishes were clean because I was about to empty the damn thing and she starts with that “married lady” tone of annoyance and contempt about whether I hit the stop button our not and would thus know the answer.

    Long story short, shit snowballed with her and I bringing up past stuff then her trying to purposefully get me mad about certain things. You could hear the contempt and joy in her voice as she did so. I said that’s it, give me the fuckin’ debit card again.

    I’ve implemented a rule. No sex, no debit card. Disrespect me in any way, no debit card. Have fun figuring out how to fill up her gas tank without me and with the little money she makes.

    Shit worked in the past and I was nutting about 5 times a week, so I gave it back to her recently. So she obviously got a bit too head strong, but you should have seen how bent out of shape she got with getting the card pulled again. She didn’t even say a word to me this morning, even though she needs the card to get her car fixed.

    My daughter wrote me up a slip like they do at school for being bad. I asked her why she didn’t give mommy a slip. She said mommy didn’t do anything wrong. HYPERGAMY IN TRAINING!

    Some shit you just can’t fix.

  46. @stuttie

    Good catch with that bachelorette article, just read it.

    This just confirms that Rollo is spot on about the fact that open cuckoldry is becoming mainstream now. For the series to have a sense of legitimacy, the Bachelorette’s whole premise is that a group of men are competing with each other for the top of the line female. It’s implied by the very structure of the show that the woman in question is supposed to be the prize, head and shoulders above other women…and they want us to buy that a single mom fits that description and is the cream of the crop now? Ridiculous, it’s insulting to our intelligence. Any one of those contestants could easily go out and find a childless woman and start their OWN family, but the FI wants them all on national TV grovelling for the affection of single mommy AND her child from another guy’s penis. If that isn’t an agenda being shoved right down your throat…

    The article is also very cringeworthy, talking about how hard the guy was trying to kiss the ass of a tantrum throwing 2 year old. Speaks volumes about what the future holds for this guy. What he should have been doing was noticing the giant red flags. This woman is a single mommy AND shitty parent to boot, run for the hills! Who does he think is gonna be dealing with all the future tantrums? For those here that have kids, It’s frustrating enough when your own child is acting up, let alone someone else’s. The majority of men have difficutly finding the patience to deal with constant bad behaviour from other people’s children, and the statistics on the high rates of step-parent on stepchild abuse sadly reflect this. It’s a shame but a relief at the same time that this site is one of the only places I can say the truth that many men think when they read stuff like this. The hard truth that no matter how much you love the woman in question, her child from another man is always going to be a fact of reality that is just tolerated in order to be with her, it is never something that is preferred. Not that the man cannot develop a relationship or bond with the child, and have some genuinely fun times and experiences with him/her, but the fact remains that there are absolutely zero relationship benefits or positives to the fact that she has another man’s kid, and it will utlimately mostly be a hindrance and stressor on a relationship. Every guy in that situation, if presented with a hypothetical choice and answering honestly, would opt to take the woman WITHOUT the child and/or replace that child with their own.

    Any guy answering differently is lying to himself.

  47. @SJF, after learning red pill, I’ve adjusted accordingly, but sometimes you just can’t jump start a dead battery, no matter how much charge you throw on it. At this point, I just want a wet hole to drain the backup ,and some common respect. If I don’t get it, she don’t get it.

  48. Great article.

    The key to rolling this out to men will be to play on men’s egos and desire to not be seen as unmanly. While it may seem like a long-shot, given that the epithet “cuckold” has, since its inception, been one of the worst insults that could be flung at a man in terms of undermining his own sense, and reputation, of manliness, the way it will be done here is by, as you suggest, rebranding cuckolding as something else, and then pressuring men to engage in it by the same means that have been used in related contexts to great effect in recent decades.

    Namely, men will be told, through various kinds of cultural messaging, that they are fearful, insecure, and therefore unmanly, if they have any problems with this — in pretty much exactly the same way men have been messaged culturally about caring about a woman’s N count as part of vetting her for marriage. The same basic argument will be rolled out — i.e., a man who is really secure, knows who he is, isn’t fearful, and is strong, will have no issue with open cuckolding, because he’s strong. It’s only a weak, insecure pussy of a man who has issues with this, and he should just man up, leave his insecurities behind, and get with the program. It basically turns the kinds of natural insecurities that are in a man for a reason (a good biological alarm) against him thoroughly by portraying him as emasculating himself by listening to his biological alarms — it sets the man against himself, and men against other men directly, and that is why it is such a brilliant cultural messaging approach.

    No doubt this will happen, because it’s already started. The future is cuck or be cucked, but either way, don’t bitch about being a cuck, because that just means you’re a pussy.

  49. ” I’m surprised that in your articles about the future of hypergamy you don’t mention the imminent clash of western feminism and Islamic culture.”

    It’s not Rollo’s thing, but I alluded to it in my first comment. Or, if it isn’t Islam, it will be China looking to give its overpopulation of young men with no hope of marriage something to do. Or those flooding out of Latin America.

    The thing is that it isn’t wise to assume that the slope we are on in the US will continue on as it is. We are fairly insular compared to much of the rest of the world, but we do not live in a closed system.

    The world will belong to the strong. There is no other way.

    Under the previous article Andy has said that he feels like he is standing at ground zero, but this is what ground zero looks like:

    1. Lets just say I do recognize a distinct parallel between the French women who gave it up to Nazi occupiers and what’s currently happening with their ‘migrant’ crisis.

      But as I’ve stated countless times, Hypergamy is pragmatic. All you’re seeing is the same survival-evolved War Brides dynamic I’ve been writing about for 10 years now:

      two books by John Costello; ‘Virtue Under Fire’ and ‘Love, Sex, and War’ in which all too much of the above female psychology manifested itself;

      “Of the 5.3 million British infants delivered between 1939 and 1945, over a third were illegitimate – and this wartime phenomenon was not confined to any one section of society. The babies that were born out-of-wedlock belonged to every age group of mother, concluded one social researcher:

      Some were adolescent girls who had drifted away from homes which offered neither guidance nor warmth and security. Still others were women with husbands on war service, who had been unable to bear the loneliness of separation. There were decent and serious, superficial and flighty, irresponsible and incorrigible girls among them. There were some who had formed serious attachments and hoped to marry. There were others who had a single lapse, often under the influence of drink. There were, too, the ‘good-time girls’ who thrived on the presence of well-paid servicemen from overseas, and semi-prostitutes with little moral restraint. But for the war many of these girls, whatever their type, would never have had illegitimate children. (pp. 276-277)”

      Remember that Hypergamy is rooted in survival-level doubt. Women who chose to breed with, and form convenient emotional connections with, a conquering force were selected-for and lived to pass on their DNA.

      The trick of course is having the prescience to side (breed with) with the winning force, and that’s where Hypergamous doubt can be debilitating for women. Hypergamy doesn’t care about nationalism, patriotism or even long term fidelity to the men who might fail in defending a woman from that invading force.

      In terms of a woman’s genetic interests, all of those are handicaps.

  50. Something to explore further:

    So let’s agree this is the modern SMP: empowered cam girls and trust-funded party dolls hanging around the good-looking, monied chodes. The chodes don’t have Game so they hang around and wait for Mz. Camgirl or her HB5 friend to sex-positively approach them. Chad the Chiseled Chode could be accidentally arousing by looking perpetually bored, which is mistaken for Tingles Value. The doodz who don’t porn, cam-girl or pay a pro may try speed-date services like It’s Just Lunch where virtually all the available candidates are divorced be-sprogged ex-carouselers. (I read too many inflight magazines). It occurs to me that this is where LTR matchmaking in UMC America will happen for Wall super-colliders.

    But I wonder about the large number of “average” young women who for whatever reason are not in the SMV vanguard. Most are not HB7+. They are not forward or assertive. It must be a fair percentage. They may be brought up to think they are all “special” but they are not and will not be a prize, notwithstanding the bleating of SJW’s that Beachballs are the new HB10.

    I know not to extract too much from the sets of data presented here and in the Biomechanics thread. My point being: the Time article’s survey data may be flawed, but it seems to me there is a story there to be teased out. Simply put: not every high school and college girl is carousel-worthy, or carousel-ready. I don’t buy Time’s thesis that a lot of them are virgins, but they are not packing the clubs and frat parties either; we would be seeing that. At best they may get swept into the current occasionally, being lucky or good enough to get those one or two ONS’s or short-term coupling.
    In the current overheated market, it seems to me these women will be as big losers as the BB chodes. These women won’t be asked out on dates; dating as we knew it is over. According to college consent classes, male approaches are sex assaults. We know what the men will do/are doing. The cry of pontificators demanding that the chodes Man Up and Marry A Baby Momma might be tried on for size, but ultimately will be ignored more and more. What social initiative takes its place?

    Would that social construct look something like @Novaseeker’s idea that “supplication is strength” so marry that Baby Momma and/or HB5? Will Sadie Hawkins Day become a legislative mandate? Will the corollary to “all male approaches are assault” be that “women’s approaches to men to be the BB provider must be obeyed”? (Example: the draft University of Michigan SJW student manual labeling “withholding of affection” a thought crime, since withdrawn – for now).

  51. “All you’re seeing is the same survival-evolved War Brides dynamic I’ve been writing about for 10 years now . . .”

    Correct, which is why ground zero is currently in Sweden, although it may soon move back to its more traditional locations in France and Austria.

  52. I think YaReally is on to something in the sense of how rapidly it’s all evolving. I did more research on the cam thing and also was aware of guys just giving shit to women, but I put that i small minority, like it was exceptional. Cuz it was, just 5 years ago. I had a frame and understanding of sex workers that isn’t even that old, but it’s now obsolete. I realize this is in part due to the narrow window for women who do sex work – 18-25 – they turn over every 7 years. And the new generation is quite different.

    This pace of change is unprecedented. It presents a huge challenge even for solidly Red Pill guys. Just consider the comments he’s making about the HB9/10 chicks, he’s so right. They are surrounded by jacked, highly attractive men. Hell, many beta chodes have gotten the message and now get jacked. I’m in a college town and I rarely see chubby young guys at all, easily more than 75% are in good shape or better. Economics dictates that abundance drives down price.

    Remember the arguments we were having about the importance of looks to women – it’s not that this is wrong, it’s that it’s out of date. Being consciously sexually attractive as a man isn’t nearly as rare as it once was, men have figured that out as women have acted on it more. I grew up in a world where such men were considered unmasculine and women reacted strongly almost to an anti-sexy, earthy vibe and men who dressed up were considered prisses.

    Also, SJB’s “streaming tingles” comment captures neatly how ubiquitous online connections to entertainment and men and whatever means they can to get that buzz constantly are. Wonder why women’s faces are constantly in their phones? They are trying to get that next tingle. How can an actual living, real man compete with that alternative nonstop?

    The larger problem for non RP men is that they are being lied to about all of this. They are being encouraged to groom themselves to be good providers and nice and respectful and to treat women like equals when that is a formula for disaster for men.

    What I think is missing from this analysis is how men can evolve more completely as social creatures and how we can participate in social institutions and structures that meet our other needs. Being the head of a family wasn’t mostly about having a wife who fucked your brains out, it was also in large part a way to gain status in society. It was a way to play a role in life that was bigger than just being about oneself. It was something to stretch towards, to strive for and to achieve. It was a social game worth playing – of course not any more. It also required moral, upright men who were highly invested in the society which supported all this. Now? Such a guy is insulted and denigrated and devalued all day long by the larger culture.

    Just look at Newlyaloof’s FR (of sorts). The aggressiveness of women in asserting their prerogatives while in marriage is getting more and more overwhelming for men. While of course, SJF is correct to point him in the direction of not taking the bait, etc, it’s also true that women for the most part are running amok in every social setting they are in an accelerating fashion.

    Am I really supposed to be satisfied with just pleasing myself? I don’t find myself as motivated to strive as when I believed I was carrying my family and a chunk of the world on my shoulders. I don’t find it nearly as noble and gratifying. I don’t see myself in the same way. Sure, there may be no other good choices but it leaves me with a much less rich life.

    I re-read Jack Donovan on “the gang” and I’m wondering if this is perhaps the only road forward for men to have more meaningful, rich lives? Should more of us seriously consider forming stronger male enclaves and institutions and social structures that give us that higher sense of purpose? I think so. I think to just settle for tricking women into fucking us is not enough for me. Sure, I need to get off and like sex but I had a taste of what it was like to play the bigger game (before it mawled me) and there was something incredibly rich about it, it was totally absorbing and engaging in a way gaming chicks for sex just isn’t.

    And I’ve also been luckier than most men. I was out watching the Pats game with a buddy last night and saw and spoke to three solo men at the bar, just aching for social connection. Their desolation was written all over their faces. It’s so sad how many men are utterly destroyed by this world and how many live lives of utter suffering and grief, plodding along alone without any solace or much connection to anything meaningful.

  53. Field Report

    tl;dr Girl looking to hit the Wall advertises for a dad for her baby on a hike.

    I was on a hike and overheard an early-to-mid 30s HB6 UMC single woman talking about how she is planning to get pregnant soon because of her reduction in egg supply. She also gave her phone no. to the group leader whose gf was watching.

    She was thinking, “I’m gonna interest these men in sex,” and the men were thinking, “She’s looking for child support for some else’s child. No thanks.”

    That made for some awkwardness on the hike.

    Women are getting the message and some are getting desperate.

  54. “Although I can’t say it’s an accepted social dynamic as yet”

    It already is in rural areas where men outnumber women. I remember gaming an HB at a table next to mine, and wondered why it was everyone else at the table was suddenly quiet. The girl asked me for a dance and ,wondering WTF was going on, I asked her how everyone knew each other.

    “Oh were celebrating my wedding anniversary. That’s my husband, the quiet one over here”. She gestures to a slouching Beta sitting next to her.

    Did she get shamed for talking to another dude on her anniversary? Heck no.

    Eden isn’t burning, men .Its burnt. This recent battle of the sexes is over and we lost .If the shoe was on the other foot and a man did that with his wife, he’d be carried out of the bar and beaten ” Way Of The Gun” style by rioting patrons.

  55. The overabundance of rich, jacked chodes diminishing the value of being jacked and being provider-ready wealthy in the SMP reminds me of the old Gilbert & Sullivan refrain:

    “If everybody’s Somebody,
    Then no one’s anybody!”

    Another reminder – in my single BP days, I would have been one of those tromped-on loners watching the Pats game at the bar.

  56. I agree that this is where we are headed: a re-worded cuckoldry and the propaganda will be delivered by the media and state schools (read female teachers).
    Anyone seeing 4+ children families? Pretty rare eh? Not when I was a boy. My best friend was the last of 8 and I was the second of 4.
    We are destroying our (western civilization’) ability to go to war and win. Hiring mercenaries wont work: ask the Romans. Theirs turned on them and destroyed their civilization.
    We are headed to the dustbin of history.
    Useful idiots, like pinker, can babble about how the world is a kinder,gentler place. Bullshit. A civilizations’ ability to survive is directly proportional to its citizens producing sons ready to fight and die: usually for resources or turf or both.
    The world is the street. In the street you keep what you have through deterence (being a mean mofo) and, on occasion, brutal violence (avoid doing so in front of witnesses). When you want something, you take it. Never explain, never complain.

  57. Lol to this post Rollo!

    I feel sorry for future slubs. However, it might come around just as sexbots get cheaper and better.

    They are making sexbots for women, however for purely sexual pleasure as women need the tingles, something I do not think a sexbot will give in the near future.

  58. As usual, a great post and no doubt there will be a lot of interesting discussion points here. it’s amazing to see how much the notion of cuckoldry being rebranding as a positive is already afoot. Where marketing goes, personal lives follow. And in speaking of that header image, I really thought it was a joke at first. If it’s getting that blatant out there, no wonder why men everywhere are deciding that the hidden costs of marriage just aren’t worth it.

    I was recently describes as “detached” and I took it as a compliment. A bit of detachment gives you the objectivity a man needs to assess the situation, and to determine if it’s worth investing in.

    When you have skills, vision, drive, creativity and a pair of shoes, you’ll be able to walk away and start again from scratch.

  59. @theasdgamer

    My view of sex is very eastern. Sex is capable of reproduction outside of the physical realm, i.e ideas, etc. IMO the discrepency between male and female sex drive is intentional as the excess energy should be put into the pursuit of loftier ideals

  60. Another great article Rollo. At the risk of sounding cliche, you are a treasure to read and I look forward to every article. You are again ahead of the curve, great write up. For example, look at that new (albeit disgusting) Kia Sorrento commercial. The chubby hubby beta in the passenger seat, acting weak as he questions his “alpha” wife where they are going (who coincidentally has short hair and angry demeanor), is dismissed by her. Ultimately, she is the one making the decision where they will park. And in the end she mutters to herself, “Who wears the pants? Yep, I wear the pants”. Is it funny/clever? Not as much as it is sad. The marketing people at Kia play to that dynamic, women smart/in charge, men weak and dumb. But which relates more to the masses? The beta hubby or the masculine man? Sadly, we know the answer.

    Keep up the good work men, swallowing the Red Pill is a blessing and a curse, but I’m thankful every single day for it…

    1. For example, look at that new (albeit disgusting) Kia Sorrento commercial.

      I know the one, I can’t escape it when I’m watching football. Cunty, bobbed haired snarky wife is the perfect example of a stereotypic hyena.

      When I’ve seen this come on at a sports bar thing I’m doing I look to see the physical reactions of people around me and it’s always a look of disgust.

      Whether that’s disgust for the husband or the bitch is hard to tell, probably both.

  61. @Bob – You are so right about Pinker. What’s saddest is the science that he’s misusing is actually pretty interesting about what motivates us etc. But in the end, he’s just another Blue Pilling chode flacking for SJW madness.

    Your reference to Rome is also spot on. I’m reading a tome on the decline and fall of Rome (Gibbon, The Decline and Fall of Rome, 200 years old and the style is so much more rich than much non-fiction today, which is interesting in and of itself). One of the things that becomes so clear is how important national leadership is to culture. The Antonines valued virtue and venerated classical learning and sought to elevate the people, but then Comitus comes along, with his bloodlust and craven weakness, and boom, the character of Rome changes.

    We are led by fools who don’t believe in the values which gave rise to our greatness. I also have great interest in our nations founding and founders and when reading their actual words and writing, I’m often astounded by their erudition and brilliance, and intellectual rigor of these men. There is a great book on the founding of the U.S., A Struggle for Power by Theodore Draper, and he uses mostly the correspondence and other published works of our founders and other stakeholders here and in Britain at the time to tell the story. These men were geniuses, with towering intellects. They were engaged in elevating man himself and knew it and took it all quite very seriously. As an aside to the rabid leftists here – Draper’s work is a “materialist history” of the founding, and is meant to be a support to Marxist analyses of the U.S.. Hmmm, imagine that, me reading a leftist’s intellectual work? How could that be if I’m some knuckle-dragging conservative jacking off to Rush Limbaugh?

    Compare just the language of men such as Benjamin Franklin or George Mason to the inane, barely coherent babblings of Barack Obama or Hillary Clinton. Their rhetoric is cheap and appeals to our basest instincts. It lacks all subtlety and rarely elevates or edifies the listener. Just listen to Obama’s speech last night, you could have skipped it and missed nothing. With such leaders, it’s no wonder we are headed down the crapper at an alarming rate. And this flows downhill into the culture, it’s unavoidable. Sigh. Really, fucking sigh…

  62. @Scribble, “While of course, SJF is correct to point him in the direction of not taking the bait…”

    With some women, this isn’t bait. This is flat-out unappreciative, selfish behavior on autopilot. It’s in their programming. I’ve told her I’ve changed and won’t take any shit from friends, family, or coworkers, no matter how minor. Bitch has fucked up credit, only makes about 15k on her own and sometimes acts like her shit doesn’t stink, even though she’s quickly approaching menopause. Like that Terminator line, “You can’t reason with them … they absolutely will not stop until you are dead (or miserable).”

  63. @The One:

    “My view of sex is very eastern. Sex is capable of reproduction outside of the physical realm, i.e ideas, etc. IMO the discrepency between male and female sex drive is intentional as the excess energy should be put into the pursuit of loftier ideals”

    Are you talking about that kundalini stuff about redirecting the orgiastic output into your spine, so you don’t actually spill seed?

    If so I would like to hear about that – i.e. – tried that, can’t do it, not enough self discipline or something – it seems like I can’t get a away from a great need for release at least several times a week (sometimes topping out at 20/week, but at that level then I am really just abusing myself, but still do that sometimes – fuck!).

    It seems to me if I could get better control of this I could get more shit done.

    If you got advice I wouldn’t mind hearing it.

    If this is too personal, or I am being too weird, then just feel free to ignore.


  64. “Unless technology dies out and we go back to the dark ages, there’s no going back to how shit was when monogamous marriage worked.”

    “Eden isn’t burning, men .Its burnt.”

    I tend to agree. The Moms in my neighborhood… You can just see it in their eyes. Borderline desperate. They’ve had a taste of true desire and attraction and now it’s gone. They invite me over for the kids to play to test their husbands. Dudes get home from work with me there… and they fail. Every time… It just says so much about the marriage… Kind of sad really. Thing is, maintaining tingles with these chicks is not something a normal guy can pull off. Marriage is just plain FUCKED. I just don’t see a way back to the old days.

    “Under the previous article Andy has said that he feels like he is standing at ground zero, but this is what ground zero looks like:”

    Yeah… We have this air of invulnerability, like “oh “war” that was in the past. There’s no way we could ever have another world war” The reality is we’re still the same human beings. We’re basically the first generation that hasn’t been conscripted for a huge war. My grandfather’s father? WWI, my grandfather? WWII, my Father’s generation? Vietnam. Me? TBD.

  65. @Wild Man – Not too personal for me, but the entire “eastern sexuality” thing is horseshit. I say this as one who was a devout Buddhist for 7 years, who was part of an “eastern” sangha and actually meditated until I disappeared (a parlor trick easily replicated with non spiritual trancendental meditation to produce a certain brain state). It was shortly after this experience – a “spiritual experience” that many Buddhists work a lifetime for – that I became an atheist. I definitely saw “truth”, lol…

    Here’s an article on sex in Buddhist monasteries in Bhutan.

    There is no escaping desire.

  66. We live in a market based system and sexuality is just another thing traded on the market now. Like all markets, it is prone to speculative bubbles.

    I guess I see some of the wisdom in a PUA approach because it’s almost an impossible play for a man to become a respected patriarch. Like walking a tightrope for your entire life. Yes, everyone is just doing what comes naturally. That is the problem. Natural eventually leaves in the jungle, in grass huts. Men have always striven to overcome nature and sometimes that means instinct repression. When men have to do anyway, can’t let the feral rapey guys run about. Women’s repression has been removed.

    But the PUAs basically have conceded that all of their plates will eventually walk. Don’t try to keep them, just replace. And they all will. It’s hard for a man to get sex, but even if he can, boytoy-short term is just a much easier play than LTR.

    I mean, I’m doing better. Had a marathon session in bed with a woman the day after I scored multiple makeouts at a Christmas party. But neither of those will ever last. So I need to keep playing as long as I have value. But I don’t see easy LTR out there for men any more. Women’s hypergamy is just insatiable.

    Even with the marathon session with the one, I guess from her reaction I can see why women do what they do. Those emotions must be so powerful for them, I’d do what they do too. Men aren’t the same, and have had their feral side socialized down for a long time now.

  67. @newlyaloof

    To be honest, the first couple times it happened I just assumed that dude wasn’t going to be coming home. Like that’s kind of disrespectful to have another dude at your house. Then I started to realize what was going on…

    If it happened to me I would probably be a bit surprised, but I would know how to pass that test with flying colors. Regardless. Marriage = Fucked!

  68. LOL I thought you made up that ad in the picture, but nope. I found a similar one “…Pilot, Ballplayer and Movie star…” on their website.

  69. @kfg

    That picture is from Albania, it is often used whenever people talk about the “evil” patriarchy. Taken out of context, it certainly looks like that.

    That picture was probably taken from mountainous regions of Albania, where people still use an old code of conduct. I’ve posted about it before:

    In those regions it is usually women that work the lands or in this case gather firewood. The reason for it is that man are the ones who are to carry life threatening activities. In this case the man is her bodyguard.
    According to that code of conduct women have almost no legal responsibility in the public sphere. Even if she commits a crime or a felony, it is men of the family who has to pay. Also, in case of murder, one way to pay for it was to kill the murderer. If he wasn’t to be found then men of his family were the target. Never women or children. The region was plagued by wars, family feuds, and harsh climatic conditions.

    While women’s day to day life was strenuous, it was never endangered. Considering all this, picking up some firewood is a good deal.

  70. YaReally
    Now if you want to settle and have kids, you’ll need some Provider shit but 1) seriously reconsider doing that for another 10 years minimum, because right now you’re walking into a shitshow culture that’s working against you succeeding at that, wait for it to settle down a bit and see where it goes before you decide to take that plunge (like counting cards in blackjack and betting high when you know the deck is better), 2) expect that she’ll leave around the 7-10 year mark like don’t settle thinking “this will last forever”, always accept that it could end at any minute and prepare yourself and your life accordingly so that you don’t get too burned, and 3) maintain Hypergamy, learn everything you can about how it works and how to maintain it because giving her ALL the shit she needs (and if you legally tie yourself to her or make it so you can’t just walk away at any point you’ll have to consciously find ways to still create dread in her mind) is going to help keep her from E-Mailing benfromtexas etc

    This. Even men in LTR’s / marriages must have the ZFG / “plenty” mindset. That includes men in the conservative religious environments, where historically one could rely on the rest of the women to keep a woman in line. Not any more, a man needs to understand hypergamy and deal with it in order to keep her from going EPL, even in the most religous of marriages.

    IN other words: every man needs to understand female psychology, and in the modern world that means Game.

    Beyond that, it’s no accident I’ve been quoting Musashi Myamoto from time to time, because the warrior “it is what it is” mindset is indispensible. She gets the 7 year itch and leaves? Outcome independence must be the rule. A man gets Betaized? He’s got to get out of that mindset, restore frame – whether the Betaization was for 5 minutes or 5 weeks or 5 years, when he becomes self aware enough to realize his frame is all wrong the only solution is to change / restore it. No moaning about woulda-coulda-shoulda, just fix the frame. Just fix it. Or as the girlies wish, Just get it.

  71. @Fred Flange, wickdaver

    “. Chad the Chiseled Chode could be accidentally arousing by looking perpetually bored, which is mistaken for Tingles Value. ”

    Yeah. Competing against these guys is easier than you think, though. I’ve only met one of these types in my entire life experience of going out and coming up through the VIP club scene who is a bona fide Chad with good game.

    And yeah, he’s an unstoppable force. Game + those things makes a huge difference.

    But, most ‘Chads’ come off like….kids who decided to take their Dad’s supercharged V-8 Mustang or whatever around the block. It looks cool at first, but then it’s easy to see that you have an inexperienced or scared driver behind the wheel.

    Like, if you have a good body, use it to project a larger than life aura of physical superiority. Mike Tyson is the best example of this. He had an extreme physique, but…his confidence was insane.

    #3 is the best (just kneel to me right now). So, he had an external attribute, but he combined it with extreme frame control (I’m going to eat your children! It doesn’t count unless HE’S DEAD! I’ll kill you)….i.e. experienced driver.

    Mike Tyson was tiny for a heavyweight: only 5’10 and 220 (which is a ton of mass for that height, but it’s pretty light for heavyweights and it’s definitely very short for heavyweights)….but he scared the shit out of a lot of taller, bigger guys. To THIS day Mike Tyson is talked about like he could EASILY beat people he CLEARLY COULD NOT BEAT (Wladimir Klitschko), because of that ferocious aura he put out. No one even thinks Wladimir Klitschko is that interesting, despite the fact that on paper and objectively he’s probably the greatest KO artist in heavyweight boxing history (ya, no rly!). And we all know why. No surprise too….Mike Tyson slept with a lot of women in his day.

    So against the typical Chad…an attitude like Mike Tyson’s (weak physique) will have the same effect. You have to go out to see it…some shrimpy guy puffing out his chest and intimidating this ripped, buff Chad.

    If you say ‘but Scray, I don’t want to put out that kind of vibe,’ that’s understandable….then lol, you don’t really need the physique. If you’re not using it to establish that frame, it’s not that useful. If you can’t see yourself building an alpha SUPREME CONFIDENCE persona around an external trait…then don’t develop it.

    Donald Trump is another example. He has money, but like…he projects the same kind of otherworldly confidence in that domain as Tyson does in his.

    True naturals have that one thing in common: a delusional self-concept.

  72. LeeLee
    There was absolutely an element of shaming and I can see how that is an example of very early stages of introducing open cuckoldry.

    This can be seen in many churches, where it’s become a status symbol to adopt children of a very different skin color, then flaunt it before others. Sure, it’s couched in all sorts of altruistic ways, but it’s more than a little cucky looking.

  73. @Andy, “If it happened to me I would probably be a bit surprised, but I would know how to pass that test with flying colors.” Do tell!

    Regardless, a mini voice recorder hidden some place in your house will let you know all you need to know about the trustworthiness of your special flower. Any beta doubting the red pill will doubt no more once you hear how they talk when you are not around. You may even catch the beginnings of a budding relationship that you can address before any boundary is breached. If you do and ask them about it, they will flat-out lie to your face numerous times. When you state specifics of what you know, THEN they admit, but think you’re ridiculous for thinking badly about their intentions.

  74. You might see as part of the rebranding is more talk of women being more complex, men being simpler. You’ll hear more of women needing lots of time to figure out what they want.
    And I think you’ll see even more attempts at control over male spaces as a reaction to more men pulling away. If women find it harder and harder to get access or attention from men, even beta men, they’ll seek to get more control over any areas that have the alphas that they desire. More control and influence over the NFL and NBA.
    I expect more “it takes a village…”. It may even be used to say that since men have been so instrumental to building and maintaining societies, that it’s their responsibility as part of maintaining societies, to be willing to take care of kids that aren’t theirs.
    As more women have kids without being married or even being involved with a man, there will be even more obesity. Bout the only time that women seek to get in shape or maintain being in shape, is when they break up with somebody.
    Less charm, more tackiness from women as strong, says what’s on her mind, empowered.
    You may see more women getting into being high priced call girls. I think it will be more likely more websites like Bid Date, or whatever it’s called. But it won’t be much different than being a call girl. But if there is more involvement in call girl jobs, I wonder if there will be a crackdown on the lower tier prostitution as an attempt to deny access to the less desirable non rich Johns. If it does happen, it will probably be precluded by more talk of sex trafficking being an epidemic or how most of the regular streetwalkers are being forced to do it.
    What ever happens, or where ever things go, before anything big happens, look for the propaganda. I was watching a show that was talking about what makes people, who were before friends, neighbors, turn on each other and commit heinous crimes against each other. They were using the Bosnian war as the example. And they talked about how the use of propaganda was so effective. Even some of the craziest things that were said were effective. And it made me thing how effective a propaganda campaign can be.
    Throughout history, some of the worst things that have happened have been greatly influenced and kicked off by a propaganda campaign. Tell people enough things, many will believe it. Just like the wage myth, and the 1 in 5 myth we have now.

  75. @scribblerg

    “I say this as one who was a devout Buddhist for 7 years, who was part of an “eastern” sangha and actually meditated until I disappeared (a parlor trick easily replicated with non spiritual trancendental meditation to produce a certain brain state)”

    That is fascinating. Disappearing. Would you mind elucidating?

    Hey – while we are on the subject of eastern theology, this idea of guru-game is very fascinating to me. Some of the earth-mother type ladies eat this shit up. Man is the redpill truths about hypergamy ever hyper-apparent with these women. They just gush for their guru. That type of gushing is just so weird it freaks me out and I don’t want any of that directed my way. It is like staring into the existentially endless black-hole of narcissism. Scary.

    Anyway there is a documentary film by a guy by the name of Vikram Gandhi titled “Kumare” (2011), that is easy to get on the internet and still may be on netflix (Canadian version anyway), that is about guru-game. Fascinating film, showing this guru-game stuff big-time, and sort of has an uplifting ending as well. Worth viewing IMO.

  76. @Liz: is the advice of determining the gender of the baby related with having sex very close to ovulation (I think for males) and a few days away from ovulation (I think for females)? I remember reading that on average Y spermatozoa are faster and that X spermatozoa last longer.

  77. “Do tell!”

    I’d just act like it was perfectly normal, and happily greet the dude. As opposed to avoiding eye contact and pretending like I’m not there and hoping I just quietly go away (which is what has happened)

    “Regardless, a mini voice recorder hidden some place in your house will let you know all you need to know about the trustworthiness of your special flower.”

    I’m not fucking these women (I never will although I don’t think it would be hard). I’m just shooting the shit while the kids play. Obviously it’s probably jarring to come home to ME at your house. I have done my best to befriend the dude and diffuse the situation, but ya know, I’m working on my own game and dread and shit too… Six months ago I wouldn’t even talk to these girls.

  78. “@Liz: is the advice of determining the gender of the baby related with having sex very close to ovulation (I think for males) and a few days away from ovulation (I think for females)? I remember reading that on average Y spermatozoa are faster and that X spermatozoa last longer.”

    Yes, IAS…I can’t remember exactly (we passed our copy of the book to others, so I can’t look it up), but that is how I remember it. The Ys are fast and have short lifespans, the Xs linger longer and are slower. So sex right during ovulation increases one’s chances of a boy. There were other tips as well, which I can’t remember, but that was the gist of it. 🙂

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