Late Life Hypergamy

Commenter YaReally dropped an interesting set of videos in last week’s comment thread and I thought I’d riff on them for a bit today. I’m not familiar with Loose Women (the TV show anyway), but from what I gather, it’s on par with The View or any similar mid-day women’s talk show. I don’t make a habit of watching shows dedicated to entertaining women’s need for indignation, but I regularly have readers email or tweet me segments asking for my take on certain aspects of them or how they relate to Red Pill awareness.

It should come as no shock to my readers that shows of this formula are a social manifestation of women’s base natures. Every conversation takes on a sense of seriousness and gravity, but the tone and the presumptuousness that drives these conversations are rooted in women’s solipsism. All iterations of this show are presented from a perspective that assumes a pre-understood feminine primacy. It’s also no coincidence that the rise in popularity of women’s talk shows has paralleled the comfort women have in embracing Hypergamy openly.

Whenever I get a link to something the women on The View discuss it’s almost always a confirmation of some Red Pill principle I’ve covered previously, and in this instance Loose Women doesn’t disappoint. Saira Khan (I apologize for my lack of knowing who she is or why I should care to) related to the panel of women – and the expectedly disproportionate female audience – that at 46 years of age and two children (only one by her husband) she has entered some commonly acknowledged phase where she finds herself lacking all libido for her husband.

I decided to write a full post on these clips because Saira amply demonstrates every facet of the latter phases of maturity I outlined in Preventive Medicine. She begins her self-serving apologetics by prequalifying her previously “fantastic sex life in her younger years” and moves on to her bewilderment over her lack of arousal for her glaringly Beta husband. We’ll get to him later, but she’s a textbook example of a woman in what I termed the Alpha Reinterest phase from Preventive Medicine. Granted, at 46 Saira is experiencing this “stage” a bit later than most women, but we have to consider the difficulty she had in having and adjusting to children later in life – all undoubtedly postponed by her obvious fempowerment mentality and careerism.

I love you, but I’m not in love with you

It’s likely most men in the Red Pill sphere have experienced and discussed this very common trope. Saira is quick to apply a version of this standard self-excusing social convention. She “loves her husband” and “he’s a great man”, but lately(?) she simply has no desire to fuck him. I’m highlighting this because it’s an important part of the psychology and the self-excusing rationales that revolve around the less-than-optimal outcome of women’s dualistic (AF/BB) sexual strategy.

It may serve readers better to review the Preventive Medicine series of posts, but the short version is this: Once a woman has settled on a man for her post-SMV peak life plans, and the routine and regimen of a life less exciting than her Party Years begins to reveal the nature of a (usually Beta) man she settled on, that’s when the subconscious sexual revulsion of him begins. The feral nature of

Hypergamy begins to inform her subconscious understanding of her situation – the man she settled for will never compare to the idealized sexuality of the men she’s been with prior to him. Alpha-qualifying shit tests (fitness tests) naturally follow, but Saira herself describes her sexual revulsion for Steve as a sense of “panic” at the thought of him expecting her to be genuinely sexual with him.

As such, there becomes a psycho-social imperative need to blunt and/or forgive these feelings for the “lack of libido” women experience for their Beta husbands. Thus, we get the now clichéd tropes about how “it’s not you, it’s me” or “I love you, but I’m not in love with you.” Both of which amount to the same message – I love you, but I have no desire to fuck you. You’re a great guy and a swell husband, but my pussy only gets wet for Alpha.

Saira exemplifies this in her assessment of her husband (Steve), but more so, she illustrates the disconnection she knows is necessary to insulate her ego from knowing exactly what’s “wrong” with her. The problem with her lack of libido becomes separated from the source, Steve. So she says it’s not him, she just doesn’t want to do it.

She qualifies herself as someone loveable (she still cuddles and gets comfort from Steve), but this lovable ‘good person’ doesn’t want her lack of arousal to be something to disqualify her from feeling good about herself.

Solution: make sex separate and ancillary to her relationship with her husband.

For women in this phase, sex is equated with a chore. It’s a chore because it’s not something she has a desire to do, but still feels obligated to do. Steve walks through the door at 6 and her subconscious understands that the expectation of her is that she should be aroused by this Beta man she’s trapped into living with for the rest of her life. Hypergamy informs her subconscious and the manifestation is to find ways to avoid sex with a man her Hypergamous sense acknowledges is a suboptimal sexual pairing. Her conscious, emotive, female mind understands that she should want to fuck him, but it wars with her hindbrain that is repulsed by just the imagining of it.

In order to contend with the internal conflict created by Hypergamy, and a woman’s settling on a poor consolidation of it, social conventions had to be created to make separating sexual arousal (Alpha Fucks) from women’s personal worth (Beta Bucks investment) and the attending bad feelings it causes for them.

Ironically, this show’s original premise was based on the question of whether sex was even a “must” on a couple’s wedding night. This is a prime example of separating desireless sex from women’s sense of personal worth. I wrote about this in Separating Values. If sex is ancillary or only an occasional bonus, it ceases to be a deal-breaking factor in marriage for women when they don’t have a desire to fuck their Beta husbands.

Conflating Values

One of the major problems women have, and more than even some red pill men have, is the conflation of sexual market value with their intrinsic personal value as a human being.

It needs to be emphasized that while personal value is influential in sexual market value, SMV is distinct from your value as a human being. I’m stressing this because, in the age Disney Princess empowerment, this conflation of the two has become a go-to social convention; and not just for women.

What Korth suffers from is presuming her personal value is her sexual market value.

It’s disruptive to her self-perceptions and ego-investments when that presumption is challenged by a man who doesn’t want to fuck her for reasons based on the intrinsic value she believes she’s entitled to by virtue of maturity and imaginings of self-sufficiency. Just as women aren’t aroused by men’s own self-concepts of virtuousness and aspirations of higher purpose, men aren’t aroused by whatever ephemeral self-perceptions a woman may have.

In Khan’s case, she (and the many women in the audience who nod in agreement with her) must devalue sex as an article or an object rather than accept that it’s something she wants to engage in, just not with Steve.

There are many other social conventions that aid women in avoiding sex with Beta husbands. An even more common convention is the popularly accepted idioms that “sex just naturally declines after marriage” or “men and women often have mismatched libidos.” Both of these have filtered into our popular consciousness, but they serve the same latent purpose – excusing a lack of desire caused by women interpreting their husband’s lack of Alpha sub-communications. Wives don’t get tingles from Beta husbands, thus, they need to find ways to offset the bad feelings for themselves first, and their husbands secondarily.

The trick in this is women not personalizing their lack of arousal with a husband’s self-worth – “it’s not you, it’s me” – and deferring to some naturally occurring biological or psychological event that can be conveniently attached to the mystique of women.

It’s not you, but it is you

Thus, the rationale morphs from “it’s not you, it’s me” into “it’s not you, it’s the time/circumstance/effort/need for help with the chores/phase of my mysterious woman-ness” that’s causing her lack of sexual desire.” She’s got a busy life, she’s got kids, and in her pursuit of perfection in these arenas, sex somehow falls by the wayside – or at least the kind of non-obligatory, hot, urgent sex she used to enjoy in her fantastic youth. It’s not you, it’s just life.

It’s not you, it’s wives ‘naturally’ lose interest in sex. It’s not you, it’s that she panics at the thought of you expecting her to be aroused by you.

If sex can be delimited to being all about the person then a lack of women’s arousal can’t be blamed on the mechanics of sex. So when men complain about a lack of sex from their wives or a lack of enthusiastic genuine desire, we get the response we hear from the panel of women on the show; a sarcastic shaming of men who raise the issue that their wives are frigid with them.

“Oh, how can men survive without sex?” or a sarcastic “No bloke can be in a relationship without sex” is a deemphasizing of the importance that the role of sex plays in a marriage and any intersexual relationship. Once again this is due to the separating of personal worth of a woman from the sexual mechanics of Hypergamy that prompt her to genuine arousal. The easiest solution is to cast men into the same sexual expectations as women; if women can forego sex then men ought to be able to “survive” without it too.

This normalized idea stems from the equalist perspective that men and women being equal should also share equal attitudes, prompts, and appetites for sex. This is a biological impossibility of course, but the conversation serves as a stark illustration of women expecting feminized men to identify with the feminine and prioritize that identification above any and all considerations about their experiences of being male.

Ultimately this is self-defeating for women because the nature of the Alpha guy that women crave pushes him to have sex, not to deny himself of it.

In fact, that sexual insistence is a prime indicator that a woman is dealing with an Alpha. The man agreeing to the patience and effort needed to “wait out” his wife’s frigidity is indicating that he’s not accustomed to insisting on, and getting what he wants. If he can sublimate his most powerful biological imperative – to get sex – what else is he willing to sublimate?

Sex is the glue that holds relationships together.

The ladies on the panel mock this idea for exactly the same reason Saira is tying herself in knots about not being hot for Steve. He needs sex, but he shouldn’t really need sex because it’s all about the person and not the mechanics. But it is exactly the mechanics of Hypergamy that are at the root of Saira’s need to solipsistically feel better about herself to the extent that she’ll publicly emasculate her husband on national TV.

As the show grinds on, all of the predictable rationales for wive’s self-consolations for a lack of sex get run down like a check list. Kids? Check. Career? Check. Never do they address that she’s a

Kids? Check. Career? Check. Never do they address that she’s a

Never do they address that she’s a 46-year-old woman raising small children or that her so overstressed condition is only one consequence of delaying what passes for motherhood to her for so long. I understand Saira and Steve struggled with infertility, but my guess is that this too was a physical result of the life choices she made and the difficulty of conceiving and carrying a child to term well after her fantastic sexual prime. I’m 48 and my daughter graduated high school this year so I can’t imagine facing parenthood in my mid/late 40s. This isn’t even an afterthought for the panel because it exposes the costs of the feminist-inspired careerism the show is triumphantly based upon.

Shit Tests and Marriage

As I mentioned earlier in this post, wives in this state will still shit test their husbands just as readily as any single woman. We are meant to believe, no we are expressly told, that Saira’s sexual revulsion is “normal” and it’s not Steve or his dedication that’s at issue. Yet during all of Saira’s journey of self-discovery about her lack of libido, she suggests that Steve go out and find a woman who will fuck him. At some stage in their great open communication, Saira gives Steve express permission to go out and bang another woman because she just can’t.

Naturally she couches this in the idea that she’s so devoted to him “as a person” that she just wants him to be happy, however, she is so repulsed by him, sex is a happiness she can’t find within herself to even feign for him. For all the shocked gasps from the women in the audience, what this amounts to is a very visceral shit test for Steve.

The purpose of the ‘dare’ for Saira is meant to determine whether Steve can still (if he ever) generate genuine sexual desire in other women. I’ve covered this dynamic in at least a dozen different posts – women want a man who other men want to be, and other women want to fuck. Steve’s steadfast devotion to his wife is anti-seductive and Saira, on some level of consciousness, knows this. If another woman found Steve attractive enough to bang it would generate Dread, social proof and confirm his preselection among other women. And as I’ve mentioned countless times, breakup sex (or near breakup sex) always trumps contrived, preplanned special occasion “date night” sex, which predictably is the suggestion that ends the second video.

And as I’ve mentioned countless times, breakup sex (or near breakup sex) always trumps contrived, preplanned special occasion “date night” sex, which predictably is the suggestion that ends the second video.

Steve, the dutiful Beta, is also predictably dumbfounded by her “suggestion”. He’s heartbroken from a feminized emotional perspective, but also because, like most Beta men, he’s heavily invested in the fallacy of Relational Equity. He’s observably sexually optionless so it’s a moot point, but if he were to muster up the balls and the Game to take her up on her oh so caring suggestion to fuck another woman, he risks losing the relationship equity he believes his rational, empowered wife should appreciate and factor into her attraction for him.

Thus, Steve comes up with rationalizations for why he didn’t take her up on her offer of permissive infidelity. He makes his necessity (really his optionlessness) a virtue and sticks to the standard Beta wait-it-out supportiveness he’s been conditioned for but is actually the source of his sexless marriage. He defaults to the “open communication” solves everything meme while ignoring the message that the medium of his wife’s sub-communication is telling him. Steve attributes everything (accurately) to his conditioning that most men, “typical blokes”, are Betas whose responsibility ought to be unconditional supportiveness when in fact they really have no other choice but to be so.

She doesn’t want to be ‘fixed’

One last thing occurred to me while I picked these clips apart. At the end, the panel of women defaults to the “it’s not you Steve, you’re a great guy, Saira’s just experiencing a normal frigidity that comes along for women in marriage.” I thought this was interesting because there’s a push to accept this frigidity as a normal phase women experience, but it still relies on the idea that sex and personal worth are two separate aspects of this problem.

If the root of this ‘normal’ problem is one about mechanics (it’s not Steve, it’s Saira’s physical/psychological malfunction) then I would expect there could be a mechanical solution to the problem. Even the fat brunette panelist suggest that all it takes is a better ‘effort’ on Saira’s part to get herself into the mood, but she even rejects this. Her problem isn’t a pharmaceutical one or a behavioral one, it’s a holistic one rooted in hardwired Hypergamy. So repulsive is the thought of fucking a Beta that Saira cannot psych herself up to do so.

I wondered if she would even consider taking the new “pink pill”, the female form of viagra, but I’ve read enough counter argument articles from women about it to know that women’s hardwired psychology prevents them from even chemically altering themselves to want to have sex with a man her Hypergamy cannot  accept. My guess is that even a cheeky holiday in the Maldives won’t be enough to convince Saira to want to fuck Steve.

However, this simple fact, that women will refuse to take the Spanish Fly to work themselves up and bypass their Hypergamy for their Beta husband’s happiness, destroys the convention that her frigidity is the result of her biomechanics. She doesn’t want a pill to fix her because she knows it’s a holistic problem.

Saira knows how to please Steve sexually, she simply doesn’t want to, and it’s because Steve is Steve.

 

756 comments

  1. @yareally

    Okay, but how would you NOT use BFD?

    I get in a longer convo if the “i have a bf” come up you can just blaze on with a different subject, but specifically for daygame how would you do that?

    Was thinking of that girl I met out at night who was giving me major IOIs in body language from just a 45 sec convo. Said I had to go and went for number, but she said she had a bf. But I could tell she either was lying or didn’t really like her bf.

    I feel like you’d need to do BFD at least a bit to get past that. Ask her questions about how long they’d been going out. If she hesitates you could just call her out for lying lol. But if she goes on about they’d been going out for 4 weeks or whatever, that’s when you just talk about how he seemed like a cool guy and hoped the best for them.

    I dunno, I just feel like “I have a BF” is a shit test most times, and dunno how you’d deal with that in a daygame type setting where you aren’t going to have much time to chat.

  2. @hank

    Was thinking of that girl I met out at night who was giving me major IOIs in body language from just a 45 sec convo. Said I had to go and went for number, but she said she had a bf.

    either you really had to go, and no time for BFD, or you didn’t have to go, in which case why are you leaving?

  3. Don’t be a “Steve”. At what dread level will she finally put out, if he even wants it?

  4. Got some duplicate lines in your post.

    The dare to go out and find another might be her preliminary guilt reduction for their soon to be divorce. If he takes it, she may get a rekindled desire, if she ever actually had it. I guess she’s trying to make
    him into somebody she’d been with before. So there’s the alimony from the divorce if the dare doesn’t work, and then she can do what that woman did, take a trip all over and agree to have sex with a lot of men and blog about it. She may see coming on the show as hedging her bets for a win/win. Or win/smaller win.
    I would like to see if there is a different dynamic between the kid she had with him, and the kid she already had.
    But husband needs to take a page from this guy playbook. These girls may end up being future Saira Khans. Also it’s just like that thing that somebody linked to a long time ago. Can’t remember what it was called. Princesses and Porn or something. Whatever it was called, it was pictures of girls they were giving fake porn movie auditions to.

    http://www.newser.com/story/226703/they-were-told-it-was-a-porn-audition-it-wasnt.html

    Off topic, but something I was wondering. Did you ever take that trip along the Appalachian Trail?

  5. It’s my observation that even “duty sex” isnt percieved to be the same activity as “real sex”.

    Not being married I’ve never had the former. But I’ve heard mocking tales thereof after having the latter with “unicorn” women (my plates currently are all married to other, dumber men) thoroughly fed up with pretending to like sex with their Betas.

    While “dead bedroom” isn’t an unheard of experience, women have no issues enduring and compartmentalizing lazy sex if it’s what it takes to keep Mr Beta happy enough to swipe his credit card one more time. Once the Betabux is throughly trapped , or she has what she wants out of him the sex spigot is closed for good.

  6. “I love you, but I’m not in love with you”

    Any man in Sairas’ husbands shoes should absolutely consider this statement a blessing because it provides him with the freedom to go out and fuck much hotter younger women. She does not desire him and therefore is providing him the release to express his sexuality free of her restraint should he choose to indulge.

  7. One think that struck me watching these clips… 3 of the 4 women have shorn their hair into the asexual matron bob… just the fat girl keeps it long…

    That is a major shit test right there… short hair on middle aged women. They want to take themselves out of the sexual market.

    Do yourself a favor… if you are in a LTR with a middle aged woman, mock and shame all of her friends who have done this… and ensure your woman keeps her hair like YOU like it.

    “is so and so sick? she have something? she looks like an old lady”

    “OMG… I almost didn’t recognize [name]… what did she do to her hair? she looks so old now”

    etc. etc.

    You get what you enforce.

  8. “Her problem isn’t a pharmaceutical one or a behavioral one, it’s a holistic one rooted in hardwired Hypergamy. So repulsive is the thought of fucking a Beta that Saira cannot psych herself up to do so.

    Saira knows how to please Steve sexually, she simply doesn’t want to, and it’s because Steve is Steve.”

    Excellent essay Rollo and thanks for the impetus YaReally.

    What my visceral feeling were about this in previous comments were only spelled out 4000X better by this OP. Hopefully Wild Man, the man won’t chime in with his be-nice- BullShit. Steve lost the fight fair and square. He was unattractive and not desirable. Don’t be unattractive and undesirable.

    Women don’t want douchey males via Briffaults law in their late 40’s when they have achieved hard won motherhood and then they need provisioning for them and their children. Sex is ancillarily a burden. With a douchey husband.

    Don’t be a Steve.

    He is a perfect example of how not to engineer a marriage or monogamy.

  9. In B4 a female reader responds with “A lot of women want more sex from their husbands, let me make this all about men by disingenuously pointing out that it happens to both sexes so women get a pass”.

    No precious, we’re not talking about ‘ooh ooh men do it too’ or NAWALT.

  10. “I love you, but I’m not in love with you”

    Any man in Sairas’ husbands shoes should absolutely consider this statement a blessing because it provides him with the freedom to go out and fuck much hotter younger women. She does not desire him and therefore is providing him the release to express his sexuality free of her restraint should he choose to indulge.

    The problem is that he does not have Agency. To fuck other women, let alone have agency for inciting desire in his wife.

    If you haven’t adequately Googled images and “news” stories about them, you can’t adequately get that she is +2 SMV (she’s no hottie like Padma Lakshmi who had the same fucking narrative as Saira) to him and that he is inept to that market (he’s a douche). All else flows down from that. She is the semi-precious bread-winner and a different heritage. Which is important because her heritage is matriarchal. She is his mom. Chose one: son or lover. He chose buddy/buddy non polarizing parent of the children, with Briffault’s law all the way down.

    Zero sexual desire on her part, with fake explanations of the dynamic without Rollos clear explication.

  11. @hank holiday
    Oldschool methods were a simple “that’s fine, you’ll have something to do when I’m not around” or “don’t tell ME your problems” quip. You can use sexual misinterpretation like “woah, we’re just getting coffee, where’s YOUR mind at? lol” and downplay it as if you’re just going on an asexual platonic meet-up for coffee. You can disqualify yourself seriously with something like “that’s fine, I’m already dating someone but I’m allowed to get coffee with a stranger that makes me laugh” or you can disqualify yourself with a silly thing like “that’s fine I’m married with 3 kids lol relax, it’s just coffee”. Or you can poke her independent side with “lol it’s just coffee, are you ALLOWED to have coffee with your male friends or are you going to get in trouble for DARING to talk to someone with a penis?” to try to flip the “independent woman” switch.

    The general pattern in all these methods is downplaying the date (and of course, don’t use the word date…just say “hanging out”) as something platonic to allow her ASD to settle down, she can tell herself a pretty little lie and you get her out again, even if it’s under platonic asexual pretenses, and then just run through your usual Day2 while DHVing, lasering, being sexual, etc and attract her and escalate to sex. If she meets up with you at all, she wants to fuck.

    None of that is technically Boyfriend Destroying though. BFD is more of an overall nuke and tends to take place in Comfort (though not always) and is more for when it’s a legitimate hurdle…like, you’ll probably want to brush up on BFD before you go on a Day2 with her incase she brings him up on it. Generally she’s just bringing it up so she can tell herself she was a good girl and did her duty, and you can just brush past it and treat her as if she’s single (and remember to pre-emptively steal her frame with stuff like “we shouldn’t be doing this” as you makeout etc).

    But of course then you get into the situation of “wait, she met up with me and I decided that meant their relationship wasn’t any good so it’s okay to seduce her, if she brought him up for real then that would mean their relationship was a good one I don’t want to ruin…but now she’s bringing him up, so is it actually a good relationship and she just had a moment and now I’m about to BFD a good relationship, or is it a shitty relationship and this is just ASD?” and that’s where you’ll learn about yourself. 🙂

    @Water Cannon Boy
    “I guess she’s trying to make him into somebody she’d been with before”

    It’s entirely possible that she’s trying to make him into the man he was when she was in the New Relationship Energy stage when they first started dating. Believe it or not Steve may have, at some point, not necessarily BEEN alpha, but by sheer fluke have happened to trigger her switches the right way (which is how most chodes manage to get laid, fumbling around in the dark but managing to flip all the light switches by fluke or over a long period of time).

    Like maybe Steve was a workaholic so he was naturally aloof and hard to contact with being busy at work all the time and maybe he had a social circle with girls in it that flirted with him etc etc but 10+ years later that’s all fallen by the wayside and now he’s in full chode mode.

    I’ve seen some pretty amazing Naturals turn into full out chodes in monogamous LTRs because they weren’t consciously taught red pill mindsets and game so they have a lot of leftover FI-programming like madonna/whore complexes and a desire to get married and treating the madonna like a princess not like those bar sluts (aka not like how he FIRST treated her before he decided she was a special madonna unicorn NAWALT), etc

    It’s one of the saddest things in the world to see lol

  12. I banging a few 20 something girls in my rotation.

    I was teasing one about her friendship with a funny younger goofball.

    She got serious momentarily and sort of froze up and said xxxis everyone’s friend but there’s nothing sexual about him.

    With me this same girl is trying to get me to take her on dates and when all we do otherwise is fuck. I prefer keeping it that way for now and she knows that.

    I’ve become quite ruthless in cutting women out of my life if they don’t bang or express overwhelming interest off the top.

    Women don’t like it. But they do this same thing all the time to guys. How many countless times have women often with BPD tendencies but not always be…just cut me off and act ice cold days after being all warm.

    Steve is Steve because he’s a people pleaser Johnny on the spot. Fixing a girl’s computer won’t make her want to fuck you.

    Cutting her off when she asks you to often does…

  13. @Hank,YaReally

    Ya, feel free to shit all over about what I’m about to say

    Hank, both here for the 40s number close and before for the NASA Mars landing planning, Ya is giving you technically perfect advice. But he is not addressing at all your internal state at that time. I suspect he highly relates to you as he was pre-PUA and believes technical is the way forward, that once you have that the rest will follow. I believe that it’s important to understand internal framework, hence my counterpoint of zfg/outcome independence watch movie/eat popcorn before, and here trying to determine state, as why the fuck you were leaving in the face of massive IOIs.

  14. If I were ever to get married again (not gonna happen) and my wife pulled this shit on me I wouldn’t say a word.
    The very next morning I’d just lie in bed and when she asked me why I’m not up getting ready for work I’d say “that’s just not who I am anymore”.
    I’d get up about 10 am have a lazy breakfast and then go to the gym then maybe take the mountain bike out for a spin.
    After all that excercise I would go to the bar and have a few drinks.
    Zero fucking chores would be done.
    I would repeat this until she changes her attitude, and if she didn’t get the message the marriage would be over.
    And with all that excercise I’d be in better shape to apply dread.
    If I lost my job , zero fucks given I’ll get another after the bitch has gone.
    Her actions have to have consequences I refuse to be a beta/atm machine.

  15. How does any guy with a European accent have trouble nailing a bitch for revenge sex? The whore he’s with will file that under hypergamous doubt any day of the week but what does baldy do here?

  16. Mixed marriages are not a good idea. Saira was marrying up when she married Steve, for clearly no white woman wanted Steve. Telling Steve to go fuck some other woman is what a woman says when she knows the likelihood of his successfully doing so is slim and in the unlikely chance that Steve started scoring with one or more hotties his arse would be dragged through the Divorce Courts. Would you agree to appear on this knitting-circle of a show like this to be mocked in public by your own wife unless you received enjoyment from your masochistic or sissy fantasy of public humiliation?

    Sex is best left to the young.

  17. @ opus “sex is best left to the young”

    You need to get your testosterone levels checked mate.
    I’m the same age as Rollo and sex is just like in my twenties if not teens.
    My T levels were 565 (normal for my age) but I lacked energy/focus and my sex drive was just ok.
    I was refused Trt as my levels were “normal” so I took the matter into my own hands.
    Now I keep my level around 1300/1400 and I have never felt better.
    I’m constantly up for it, refraction time is down to 15/20 min , orgasms are more intense and I can go 4/5 times in a night.
    In short sexually I’m 17 again!
    Best thing I ever did.

  18. Telling Steve to go fuck some other woman is what a woman says when she knows the likelihood of his successfully doing so is slim and in the unlikely chance that Steve started scoring with one or more hotties his arse would be dragged through the Divorce Courts.

    Yep. It’s the famous “open marriage” – your wife will only suggest it if she thinks you won’t be able to find another woman, whereas if she’s not a cow finding another man will be easy for her (she’s probably already flirting with someone at work).

  19. To be aware of the feminine hypergamic function at the age of 19 is credit i personally give to you Rollo. I’ve been reading your blog since March this year (along with Darlock Heartiste and Roosh V’s youtube). Ihave to say thank you so much for spoon feeding this 19 year old idiot the Red Pill. Hats off to you and keep crankin them out.

    Of course, thanks to all the commenters who frequent this blog, your feedback and knowledge is amazing

  20. Sucks being those guys,you can take a woman out of the cave but you can’t take the cave out of the woman.48 is too late.
    One thing i do is carry a condom at all times,just for a subcom.

    Going to spend the weekend with the boys at the welding shop,walking distance to the bars.I’ll be bach w/ hangover,new truck bed,who knows what else.

  21. >Every conversation takes on a sense of seriousness and gravity, but the tone and the presumptuousness that drives these conversations are rooted in women’s solipsism.

    This is a funny idea that I’ve never been able to put my finger on- the women on these shows have mastered the art of sounding smart.

    They can use the tone and cadence of gravitas, intelligence, and authority, so if you only listened to the sound and didn’t think about the words, you’d take their opinion very seriously. Whoopi Goldberg comes to mind here, as I think she’s the “intellectual authority,” or the final word, for the women, but once you listen to what she’s saying, it’s pure manipulative gibberish.

    Great example of Power Talk, though.

  22. In Britain during WW2 it was said – a common refrain, not that I was there then – that Americans were ‘overpaid, oversexed and over here’ – there’s gratitude for you! Playdontpay reminds me, as do a lot of articles and comments especially at Dalrock of this obsession Americans seem to have with sexual intercourse. Stoicism and a cup of tea tend to ease the problem of desire. I am glad that I no longer have the Testosterone that I had as a seventeen-year-old if only because my actions at that age were frequently criminal but when legal would now be considered as verging on the unacceptable. I wish Paydontplay luck in all his endeavours both sexual and otherwise.

  23. @ opus
    The libido thing is just one of the benefits and by the way I’m UK based.
    I have more energy, better focus, I’m sleeping like a baby and I’m killing it at the gym, I’m stronger now than ever.

    It also encourages an alpha mindset and strong frame. And I swear women can smell a high T male.

    I have also almost finished developing a side business, no way would I have had the energy to do that this time last year.

    You give up and stoically drink tea if you want to, me I’m too busy enjoying what life has to offer, younger women being part of that.
    Having the confidence that you can easily satisfy a chick half your age in the naughty room is awesome.

  24. “It’s the famous “open marriage” – your wife will only suggest it if she thinks you won’t be able to find another woman”

    agree.

    she should never be suggesting anything other than minor stuff like fun positions, places, etc.

    anything to do with bringing in a third party should always come from the man.

    the idea of me fucking other women without her makes my wife sick to her stomach while simultaneously making her pussy wet

    that’s dread

  25. Now here’s a simple script for a 40s number close that my friend with a four digit count used. I was there but I might as well been invisible.

    Note that during the lasar eye lock it must be as if you two are the only people on the planet. Here’s the script:

    – meet hot girl, lasar lock eyes for a full 10 seconds saying absolutely nothing (no hi, hello shit)
    – say the exact name of her perfume, and only that, while maintaining lasar lock
    – she will nod or say yes
    – say “that’s nice but I prefer xxxx, which has a touch more lavender”, where xxxx is a similar perfume with a touch more lavender
    – hold eye contact for two seconds, break, and ignore her

    wtf, epic fail I know, he didn’t ask for her number

    But some unknown reason, she gave him her number without him asking

    So simple script, try it out.

  26. Wow. Amazing videos. I’ve never seen it that blatant before.
    So, let’s coach Steve (if for not other reason than I’d like to hear how you guys would do it). Here would be my advice:
    Right now, you’re too far gone to respond effectively to her shit tests. Your SMV is low and, more importantly, your wife’s perception of your SMV is even lower. You need to improve your SMV ASAP before you can push back. This will take about 45 days (and about 90 for her to realize it). So, for the next 4 months you hit the gym every day, keep your diet clean, and dress/groom better. After about week 4, she will have noticed the changes and will be a little anxious and you can start “pushing back” lightly engage in light teasing and flirting with other women. After 45 days, the pushing back gets a little more firm, as does the teasing and flirting. At this point, start initiating sex. If she goes for it, fuck her brains out and make sure she enjoys it. If she doesn’t go for it, tease her playfully, walk away and engage in a manly hobby that doesn’t involve her. Also, after about 45 days, cut back on helping out with housework. At the 90-day point, your wife’s anxiety will peak. If she gives you a shit test you push back – hard. Start to initiate sex. If she doesn’t go for it, playfully say “ok” and go somewhere out of the house for the next 3 hours. When she asks where you went, say “out with friends” and nothing more specific. Keep this up for the next 30 days. If nothing improves, bail.

    What would you guys tell him to do?

  27. Sounds like she is entering or already in menopause. Most women loose their sex drive at this time of life.

  28. I particularly like the nearly immediate question and presumed response:

    “You haven’t gone off Him, really?”
    “Not at all!”
    “It’s just your sexual desire is gone.”

    The only clearer they could be would be to say: “Let’s not destroy the gravy train. Beta, you should stick around because ‘everything is the same.’ “

  29. ooh, ouch… Second video has this man being put in his place as just a “Regular Bloke” by a female personality on TV. It’s painful to watch him accept that hunched over like a slave.

  30. Very early on, she says “I feel like I had in my younger days a fantastic sexual life.” I can only imagine what this middling skank must’ve done for male approval…

    She’s hideous!

  31. I couldn’t help but laugh at the videos Rollo posted of the 40 something skank apparently losing her libido in her marriage. I’ve lost count how many times women i’ve seen her age go wet at the sight of seeing young guys dancing at my salsa club i attend regularly.

    I’ve already fucked 2 milfs from it already with a few more on the way i’m sure.

    Apart from this, it makes me feel grateful that I’m aware of it and can pinpoint exactly how husbands in a sexless marriage can turn things around. All he needs to do is start hitting the gym and changing his fashion.

    Everything from his voice tone and body language reeks of beta. More and more men like this need to be saved.

  32. “We are meant to believe, no we are expressly told, that Saira’s sexual revulsion is “normal” and it’s not Steve or his dedication that’s at issue”.

    That’s right. After at least 4 plus years of reading red pill thinking (from the 3 R’s and elsewhere) it does take awhile to internalize concepts and shit can most of the social conventions we were brought up in. Dread being one concept the other being the idea of continuous process improvement or running the male action plan—until you’re dead. It. Never. Stops.

  33. interesting their 7 year son is alpha for his age, and she doesn’t believe in mollycoddling:

  34. I refuse to watch this mind poison, but I can still speak knowledgeably about this situation, as I experienced this.

    I was a good beta. My ex-wife went to work in another country “only for one year”. Around the end of the third year of her working abroad, I had already been depressed for a couple of years. On one of my infrequent visits to her, she told me that she was “developing a crush” on another man, but that they hadn’t done anything – “not even hold hands!” I was pretty devastated, but figured she would be coming back home for good in just another month or two (her contract was supposed to expire, although there was a possibility she could extend it another year or two), so it would be alright and we would get back to “normal”.

    She came home a couple of months later, and when I tried to initiate sex, it was awkward and she was whining about this and that, and she made it a miserable experience that finally fizzled out without orgasm being achieved by either one of us. I tried again a few days later, and she started giving me a blowjob, and again, she was complaining about how I was holding her head, or whatever. So, again, no release achieved. I tried again a couple of days later, and she said to me, “I’m not interested in penetrative sex anymore. Let’s have Tantric sex instead”. I asked her, “What does Tantric sex mean for you?” Her explanation basically boiled down to a lot of hugging and kissing, and pretty much stopping at that. I told her that wasn’t acceptable to me. She repeated that she wasn’t interested in having sex anymore. I was about 43 and she was about 41.

    At some time in between there, I had asked her, “Are you planning to stay here, or are you going to go back?” She replied, “Of course I’m going to go back!”

    After she again insisted she only wanted to try “Tantric sex”, I asked her, “So, why are we even married anymore? We live in different countries, you are interested in another guy, and you don’t want to have sex with me anymore.” She replied, “I don’t know why we’re married”. So I told her, “OK, then we’re getting a divorce”. And we did, because I was determined not to put up with that shit any longer.

    Of course, during the divorce process, she tried to get me to change my mind and to get back together, and she also changed her mind about having sex with me. She asked me at some point, with puppy dog eyes, “Can you see yourself having sex with me again?” I stared her in the eyes and said “No”.

    I’m much happier than I’ve ever been. Not because everything is perfect, but because I finally threw off the old equalist idea of marriage, and learned to take charge of my relationships and get my own needs met.

    I understand poor Steve. And i do feel sorry for him. But he has to find or reclaim his balls on his own. If I were him, his sorry excuse for a wife would be out of the house and holding divorce papers tomorrow, and I’d be out looking for a cute thing about 25 years younger than her to bang.

  35. @ Rollo T

    It seems obvious by now that women are genetically hardwired to find only 10% of the male population (Alphas) sexually attractive. One of my biggest gripes with the manosphere is their insistence that every man can be an alpha. Just as it’s impossible for every man to be a millionaire (you need janitors) it’s impossible for all men to be alphas. I don’t think it’s even possible from an evolutionary perspective.

    Having said this, is there any reason for a man to be married anymore? As you said, the social conventions that reigned in female behaviour and made it compliant with monogamy have long been dismantled by feminism. Are betas who refuse to tow the line condemned to a life of isolation?

    Lastly, do you see any value in prostitution for married men trapped in sexless lives? Historically, the Greeks and the Romans enjoyed the company of courtesans for sexual thrill while their wives were there merely to produce offspring. The Arabs enjoyed concubines but reproduced with their wives. It seems like this notion that a wife must be a man’s friend and lover is a very recent one. I guess historically men realized that their wives were incapable of being attracted to them and thus they enjoyed sexual intimacy with other women. The wife was merely a heir incubator.

    Does this ancient formula apply even today?

  36. “My husband has never raised his voice, one time, ever…”

    She’s crying out for an alpha.

  37. is there any reason for a man to be married anymore?

    Children

    Are betas who refuse to tow the line condemned to a life of isolation?

    No. Steve is not isolated. He has his kids. He has his friends (lads in England). He has people that work for him and that he works with. If he refused to tow the line he could become less isolated.

    do you see any value in prostitution for married men trapped in sexless lives?

    the men are only trapped because they allow it. they could end celibacy with a little effort, paying for sex just being one of the options

    Historically, the Greeks and the Romans enjoyed the company of courtesans for sexual thrill while their wives were there merely to produce offspring. The Arabs enjoyed concubines but reproduced with their wives. It seems like this notion that a wife must be a man’s friend and lover is a very recent one. I guess historically men realized that their wives were incapable of being attracted to them and thus they enjoyed sexual intimacy with other women. The wife was merely a heir incubator.

    Does this ancient formula apply even today?

  38. @Playdontpay

    what do you mean by “taking the matter into my own hands”? Did you buy testosterone online and inject it yourself? And if so, how did you ensure that you were doing so safely and effectively?

  39. @ SJF and redlight

    I read Rollo’s post on services rendered a while back. My question was much broader in scope. I was contemplating the possibility of completely dismantling the current marriage paradigm in favour of the old Greco/Roman model. Notice that the Greco/Roman model does not try to change or regulate female behaviour in the way that Christianity does, but just gives men options to adapt to it.

    The G/R model understands that women will never be attracted to the majority of men, so why must men suffer on account of their wives’ frigidity? G/R men saw courtesans with their wives’ knowledge. But in order for this paradigm to work, men must educate their sons that wives are neither their friends nor their lovers. The wife is merely an heir incubator who is given provisioning for services rendered (producing and caring for the heir).

    I feel this model will produce healthier relations between the sexes.

  40. Rollo – this time, you didn’t do a bad job at all wrt this latest article. But there are important conceptual layers, that lie even deeper, beneath the conceptual framework you used here to analyze the Siara/Steve thing, and these deeper conceptual layers actually underpin the concepts you are using, and better inform around the issue of culpability.

    I have some things to do today, but if I had some assurances I wouldn’t be banned again (like you did wrt me near then end of the last thread), then I would be willing to take the time to write out my ideas.

    Do I have those assurances?

  41. @dota

    I feel this model will produce healthier relations between the sexes

    great, let us know when the male imperative is in ascendancy

  42. “One of my biggest gripes with the manosphere is their insistence that every man can be an alpha”

    uh… read Ya. all the “alpha” subcomms can be learned, and if need be, faked. just takes practice.

    “Just as it’s impossible for every man to be a millionaire ”

    lol. see zimabawe. paper “money” doesn’t mean shit. especially when it comes to attraction.

    “I guess historically men realized that their wives were incapable of being attracted to them and thus they enjoyed sexual intimacy with other women.”

    hypergamy usually ends with a “winner”. a woman can be, and often is, satiated by one “alpha” lover.

    not so with men. lots of men like variety, even when they are their wife’s “alpha”. a man can be the alpha for many women at the same time.

    partaking of variety is one way to keep a wife attracted. I am always enough for her. she is never enough for me.

  43. @The Wild Man

    Truly, you have a dizzying intellect.

    I suggest starting your own blog, on which you can flesh out fully those lofty concepts, and draw to you others of superior mentation.

  44. Playdontpay

    ” when she asked me why I’m not up getting ready for work I’d say “that’s just not who I am anymore”.”

    and then going “all in” on you [Platinum Rule]

    is the kind of electrical Alpha storm that will reverberate through every single relationship in your life.

  45. pulling out of the death spiral is hard. I tried to do it for my marriage but it didn’t really work. especially when there are kids involved the dude is at a disadvantage. my bet is that lots of marriages play out something like this.

    It is a hard situation to fake alpha your way out of because of the history involved and the 24 hour nature of the interactions. I think in general women don’t find the situation of marriage as being very erotic. something like 50% of married women in the 50s were considered to be “frigid”.

  46. I’ll admit, I had a slight secondary motive with this post to continue the marriage debate we got into in the last thread.

    I’ve written about this before, but it bears repeating, as a Man who’ll have been married for 20 years next month and who’s had what most guys would think of as a good example of a married relationship for all of it, I would never advocate for men to get married in our present social environment.

    The most common question I get is always “how can you write what you do and still be married?” And I’ll repeat it again, don’t get married. Socially, statistically, there is no upside to marriage for men in a western(ized) culture today.

    Men tend to view marriage from the old books perspective with old books expectations and old books rewards. Those simply do not exist for men today. Steve’s ROI expectations with Saira are based on a marriage institution that doesn’t exist. He expects relational equity will trump Saira’s hypergamy, but his ‘reward’ was not just a sexless marriage, but public national ridicule for his Beta mindset.

    I have a good marriage and there are many reasons I can list as to why it is so, but everything I could count as a positive is the result of having an internalized Red Pill awareness and putting it into practice for 20 years.

    Most men, most unmarried guys in their 20s and 30s, simply don’t have the desire or perseverance or initiative to care to learn how to put Red Pill awareness and an unvarnished, brutal understanding of women into practice with a wife or in order to start and maintain a marriage. And all of that is IF a man unplugs from the Matrix and internalizes the Red Pill in the first place.

    It’s a waste of time and makes no sense. There is no ‘marriage strike’ or boycott, it’s just simple deductive pragmatism for men to avoid a losing proposition. And when stories like Steve’s are repeated with the connectivity of instant communication for millions of men the simple solution becomes obvious

    Marriage sells, but who’s buying?

    It is entirely possible to have a Red Pill marriage, but men will simply never bother themselves with the effort to master what it takes to have one – and why should they? Until women collectively motivate themselves to provide more added value to men than what their sexual currency offers men will only see them as a utility. The zebra can’t change her stripes and sees no reason to for any man.

  47. @The Man, no. You’ve proven yourself to be a broken record every time I’ve pulled you from the black list and you are a confessed troll.

    That said, have at it.

  48. Rollo

    this ” but his ‘reward’ was not just a sexless marriage, but public national ridicule for his Beta mindset.”

    Is simply not true…

    The ridicule is now international… and heading inter-galactic…

  49. “One of my biggest gripes with the manosphere is their insistence that every man can be an alpha.”

    No, but EVERY man can become MORE Alpha.

    While Gender is most definitely “binary” the concept of “Alpha” is not. ANY man can become MORE Alpha. ANY man can get better with women. ANY man can revive the sex with his wife.

    That doesn’t mean ANY man can fuck 200 different girls and spin 8 plates at a time but ANY man can fuck dozens and spin a couple of plates.

  50. Is there anything more humiliating in life for a man? Seriously I can’t think of anything more humiliating then “my wife won’t fuck me.”

    Even in my blue pill days this would have been a deal breaker. May god have mercy on this dudes soul. Sweet Jesus!

  51. http://www.ericberne.com/games-people-play/now-ive-got-you-you-son-of-a-bitch-nigysob/

    Steve may be a submissive Beta, but he’s not stupid enough to fall for the Hall Pass Shit Test.

    In effect, the wife’s “Permission allowing him to have sex with other women” is an ultimatum, a variant of “Now I’ve Got You, You Son of a Bitch” game described by Eric Berne wherein one player (wife) challenges husband to seek sex elsewhere so she can justify her desire to blow-up the marriage if & when he follows through.

    Poor Beta Steve doesn’t realize that the NIGYSOB game initiated by his wife means that his marriage is already over, even though he’s still trying to save it by appeasement & knuckling under. His wife will just keep raising the ante (cucking him on TV & even in front of the children) until he cracks, then his wife will declare herself ‘The Blameless Victim’ entitled to cash, prizes & sympathy.

    More than anything, this video clip demonstrates that Marriage 2.0 has become a ‘damed if you do, damned if you don’t’ death-trap for most men.

    Sure, some men may be able to preserve their marriage if (1) they become an Alpha irresistible to women, (2) they use Dread Game on the wife by threatening to blow-up their marriage first or (3) they stumble upon a humble NAWALT, but those are the only options (besides submission, appeasement & knuckling under) for most men in marriage nowadays.

  52. Holy fuck. If Steve is emblematic of the state of Western Men (I believe he is) we are absolutely fucking doomed as a civilization. Islam will displace us before the end of the century if Western Men don’t find their balls. Unfortunately I just don’t know if there’s enough time….

  53. The feminine imperative has created in the majority of Western Men a weak, sad, pathetic, hollowed out character that will soon be swept into the dustbin of history. It’s amazing to see Western Civilization go out without as much as a whimper.

  54. “EVERY man can become MORE Alpha.”

    yes.

    every man can be zimbabwe in that he can create/print as many alpha subcomms/”dollars” as he wants.

    the only cost is time (which is arguably the most valuable thing a man has because he can’t get it back once it’s gone).

    a man can succeed where zimbabwe failed because though every man can print unlimited alpha subcomms, making them all subcomm “millionaires”, the sexual marketplace doesn’t react with the kind of hyperinflation that zimbabwe’s physical marketplace did because while women are a commodity and not infinite, they are not essential for life like calories, and consuming them does not physically destroy them.

    abundance mindset.

  55. To do it again….

    fuck marriage, what a PITA all the way down the line.
    I know that statistically it is suggested that married men live longer, earn more, all that shit. But frankly given the way the culture wars are going I am not sure I would want to be responsible for introducing a child into that now I am aware of what is happening and if you don’t want children why the fuck would you get married?

    At this point, I would far rather be sitting poolside or travelling the world living the life of an irresponsible sailor hopping from boat to boat and plate to plate.

  56. I feel no sympathy for Steve because no doubt he parrots and promotes the feminine imperative that will inevitably doom himself along with every other Western Man and our civilization. Weaklings like him deserve their frigid wives and dead blood lines.

  57. Rollo – why was I banned at the end of yesterdays’ thread? Because I am a troll? By troll do you mean?:

    “One who posts a deliberately provocative message to a newsgroup or message board with the intention of causing maximum disruption and argument”

    If that is the definition you prescribe to, I don’t see how that is bad thing, wrt your forum motto of “speak you mind”, as long as the word “maximum” is parsed, and with that word parsed, then yes, that definitely would apply to me, and rightfully so …… I think you do a fine job of revealing the hidden patterns in the social environment that men are subject to, but don’t go nearly far enough wrt the conclusions you draw from said patterns. So ….. half-truths are abundant here imo, and often half-truths are more obfuscatory and damaging to peoples’ lives, than nothing at all. Rollo – the line of reasoning the SJF entered into in the last thread, based on your half-truths, that led him to conclude, and share with the readership here, that under certain circumstances, adopting the level of self-loathing that would allow one to contemplate offing oneself, as a healthy way of looking a things, for a man, is very strong evidence that I am making a point very worthy of consideration. Of course any line of reasoning that leads to that conclusion (i.e – the conclusion that extremely high self-loathing is good) is flawed in some way because it is clear to nearly everyone that that conclusion is ludicrous.

    I need a better assurance, and if that’s not forthcoming, well then I will conclude this isn’t worth my time here, and I’ll go somewhere else, or perhaps go write my own book about how within our culture there is now arising, a new symmetry wrt flawed thinking based on half-truths, that mirrors the flaws of feminism theory, inclusive of my views wrt reconciling the underlying conceptual problems on both sides, and as such hopefully reconciling some of the social shite we are all now mucking around in (women and men both). Of course I will be using your material, by way of example, as some of my source material, because your conceptual framework is rather sophisticated compared to other redpill writers and so, one might as well go to where the best nuance resides wrt half-truths.

    Do I have your assurances that my point of view may be worthy of your consideration, and as such, a better level or respect wrt me should naturally be forthcoming from you, as to which it is obvious I have not enjoyed to date? That would mean actually thoughtfully engaging with me wrt your disagreements instead of pigeon-holing me as some categorically low-value entity (you’ve now made up quite a few of those wrt me) that you therefore unthinkingly assume you can then easily dismiss (which imo has constantly shown you up here as taking a very low-value approach by said junior-high-school level strategy). Do I have your assurances wrt more thoughtful engagement?

  58. “Ultimately this is self-defeating for women because the nature of the Alpha guy that women crave pushes him to have sex, not to deny himself of it.

    In fact, that sexual insistence is a prime indicator that a woman is dealing with an Alpha. The man agreeing to the patience and effort needed to “wait out” his wife’s frigidity is indicating that he’s not accustomed to insisting on, and getting what he wants. If he can sublimate his most powerful biological imperative – to get sex – what else is he willing to sublimate?”

    Been thinking a lot about this with myself.

  59. There is no ‘marriage strike’ or boycott, it’s just simple deductive pragmatism for men to avoid a losing proposition.

    In the Year 2050, the last Alpha men standing will be jailed for having protected sex with women, where the male solely chose to utilize the protection (whether through a pill, utilizing a prophylactic or via mechanical means) … thereby denying the woman of her right to choose to procreate.

    The charge will be RAPE.

    The rest of the particulars of marriage, provisioning, etc. will have been worked out long before… as early as the mid 2010’s the state had enforced the right to ensure paternal support despite no marriage and even no certainty of paternity and for confiscation of male assets via cohabitation.

    By 2025, men who did not respond favorably to any online solicitations on Universal FaceBook were heavily fined. By 2035 they would be publicly tortured for such offenses. By 2045, the Cuddle Laws were passed, requiring at least 45 minutes of cuddle time per day and compulsory complimentary greetings to all females.

    The ball really got rolling though in 2017…

    everything is proceeding right on track…

  60. In 2030 one woman would arise, stronger than all who came before her… one who trained in the FI arts since birth…

    She would be the one to start the Alpha farms… and sign the Beta Male Slavery Proclamation into World Law.

    An elderly Steven Hyde would watch on his Google hologram… and shed a single tear…

    of joy.

  61. Rollo – alright then – I think I like it better that way anyway! The sweet aroma of challenge is now in the air! As a fellow intellect, best you keep watching over your intellectual shoulder for me coming for you then! Your stuff doesn’t even come close to passing the sniff test , mainstream-wise. You gonna be crucified brother! Lotsa fun will ensue for all!

    As an aside – in the past I have noticed that you have virtue-signaled wrt fancying yourself as an intellect that helps save the lives of men and you got the emails to back it up apparently. For the sake of brevity all round, will you now publicly counsel SJF in that respect, given that he’s got that issue, and given you signal you got both the desire and the chops for that endeavor? Methinks you do have something to prove here, to the readership, and for SJF’s sake as well (after all he has drown said conclusions from what he has absorbed here I would guess), so …… lotsa challenges today (as such it’s truly glorious to have man’s life, eh?)

  62. @ Truman
    Yes I inject testosterone twice weekly mon and Thursday 150mg each time and take 12.5mg of exemestane every other day to prevent estrogen levels rising by aromatisation.
    This is a higher dose than TRT as the upper level of Trt is around 200mg/week.
    You can have blood tests done by a private lab ( male hormone panel) and also monitor your lipid profiles if you are worried about that.
    Injectable testosterone is not toxic to the liver like the oral version so is safer.

    I just asked a guy I know who is a doorman (bouncer) for his source, i preferred to go via recommendation than buy blind off the internet.
    Alternatively just ask around at your local gym.
    The normal range for testosterone is very wide sometimes 200-1200 with 300-1100 being the most common.
    It’s ridiculous that it’s not age related because if as a 35 year old man you are tested and return results at say 350 most doctors will say that your fine (within range) and refuse to help.
    350 would be about average for an 80 year old man, but computer says no.
    It seems that in the medical profession estrogen = good, testosterone = BAD!

    Can you imagine a woman asking for HRT and being refused? No me neither.
    Most doctors even some endocrinologists don’t know shit about testosterone.
    So if a doctor tells you you are fine with sub 400 T levels, find another one, or ask him what is normal for your age and wait for the confused look on his face. Shocking really!

  63. LOL@Sentient and the narration of the videos. Especially the Hillary Clinton bust.

    PS – Blackdragon’s blog has a good primer on TRT and what it involves etc. Worth reading. I’ve not done it myself (at 35 – last year – I had T levels of about 1250 so I figure I’m okay for now).

    PPS – Sentient, have started gym and weight training again and starting to feel benefits. Just need to incorporate some cardio or at least walking on the off days and I should be all set.

  64. @Laikastes

    Your story sounds familiar. Im not as far down the line as you are, and my wife didnt go abroad, but I may well end up in the same place. I found trp after getting married–actually *as a result of* getting married, trying to figure out why it wasnt working. I cant cut the cord right now bc of circumstances, but Im getting there, and I know that when I do, she will quickly change her attitude, behavior, and physique, or try to. And it will be too late.

    Like Saira, she plays the intimacy-over-sex card and avoids any introspection over *why* she feels so little desire. The bp /communicate/ refrain somehow never extends that far. . . . I do accept that she might not even realize why, but the outcome will be the same. No one, man or woman, gets to have it all.

    Spot-on post, Rollo. Tragic and damning to the FI how the men who give most get so little in return. Another essential reminder not to be one of those men.

  65. The meme here is not being taken to it’s proper conclusion.

    It’s not that Saira has no interest in fucking… if she’s not fucking Steve, she’s fucking somebody else.

    And the whole permissive infidelity ploy is just a pathetic attempt to alleviate her guilt and dissonance at not being the ethical & moral person she wants to believe she is.

  66. PPS – Sentient, have started gym and weight training again and starting to feel benefits. Just need to incorporate some cardio or at least walking on the off days and I should be all set.

    Culum… George says “Don’t you be fucking with me now”

  67. “As such, there becomes a psycho-social imperative need to blunt and/or forgive these feelings for the “lack of libido” women experience for their Beta husbands. *** – I love you, but I have no desire to fuck you. You’re a great guy and a swell husband, but my pussy only gets wet for Alpha.

    “Saira exemplifies this in her assessment of her husband (Steve), but more so, she illustrates the disconnection she knows is necessary to insulate her ego from knowing exactly what’s “wrong” with her. The problem with her lack of libido becomes separated from the source, Steve. So she says it’s not him, she just doesn’t want to do it.”

    This is really key here, and it’s key for men reading this to understand what’s truly going on here. The basic truth is that Saira isn’t sexually attracted to Steve, her husband of 11 years whom she married when she was 35. She wants to have sex. She is interested in having sex. It’s just that she is not interested in sex WITH STEVE.

    But she knows that telling him this will crush him. So she makes up an elaborate excuse that she isn’t really interested in sex at all.

    This is a common thing among respectable women in the middle class on up. They aren’t interested in fucking their husbands, so they pretend they aren’t interested in sex at all. They can’t get divorced because the social blowback will be too much to bear, they really don’t want to ruin their children, and they really do care about their husbands. So they lie.

    Another thing is that these women aren’t necessarily monsters. What’s happened is that they did what most women do (marry men they’re less sexually attracted to than the men they used to fuck as younger women but couldn’t get to commit), and now they’re trapped by circumstance, children, and far reaching obligations.

    Finally: this right here is why the emphasis is on increasing attraction. The solution isn’t to lambaste all older women for being hypergamous bitches. The solution for men is to increase their attraction, operate with necessary Dread, and if a relationship continues to yield less than satisfactory results, to walk away with as little ongoing financial obligation as possible.

  68. @Laikastes

    Similar story to yours, though not my own. Mid-30s power couple pursuing their careers on opposite sides of the country for two years. Rather than join the husband after, wife opts to renew her current contract for another year. When that term expires and she still refuses to join him (their original agreement), he files for divorce and moves on with his life, eventually remarrying. She begins seeing a guy from an ultra-rp country, goes off birth control, gets pregnant. Rp guy ghosts. Shes raising the kid as a single mom while dating a new, seemingly very bp guy. And shes from a good family, highly educated, appears very innocent, no mitigating trauma, yadda, yadda.

    You cant make this shit up. The ultimate value of any model is how well it predicts real-world behavior/phenomena, which is why rp will win the narrative war, even if publicly its couched in fem-friendly terms.

  69. “she suggests that Steve go out and find a woman who will fuck him. At some stage in their great open communication, Saira gives Steve express permission to go out and bang another woman because she just can’t.

    “Naturally she couches this in the idea that she’s so devoted to him “as a person” that she just wants him to be happy, however, she is so repulsed by him, sex is a happiness she can’t find within herself to even feign for him. For all the shocked gasps from the women in the audience, what this amounts to is a very visceral shit test for Steve.”

    The way this is phrased, the only way to “pass” that nuclear shit test is to divorce the wife, whether or not he has sex with another woman or not.

    A woman who says “maybe you should just go out and have sex with someone else” is really saying

    “This marriage is over. I don’t want to have sex with you and I probably never will. I don’t really care if you have sex with another woman. In fact, I very much doubt you will, because I think you’re a loser. I don’t think you’re able to get another woman to have sex with you. I don’t think you’ve got the stones to do it.”

    The only way to pass that test is to file for divorce. I suppose a man could “pass” the test by going ahead and having an affair. But in many cases that will shitcan the marriage, which is where it was headed anyway. Query whether the affair actually does anything to help the husband, other than perhaps showing his STBX he could actually get another woman to sleep with him. And to what end?

    Did you notice – one of the panelists on the show referred to her ex husband and how she told him to have sex with another woman, and he did. She said the words “he did” with all the requisite gravity and drama as well. Of course, his going ahead and having sex with another woman was probably the last nail in that marriage’s coffin.

    Before anyone lambastes me for moralizing, I’d point out that going ahead and sleeping with another woman for the sheer brinksmanship and one-upsmanship of it, just to prove he can do it to “pass” the test, probably does no one any favors, other than for the guy to get his rocks off for a night or three, and to rub his STBX’s nose in it.

  70. @Bart
    “The ultimate value of any model is how well it predicts real-world behavior/phenomena, which is why rp will win the narrative war, even if publicly its couched in fem-friendly terms.”

    This is a key point. RP is the only current predictive model that makes sense to me.
    I too was a ‘Steve’ but I walked out after 28 years. Not because of RP but because I had been fed up with minimal or no sex for the last 10 years and the kids were old enough.

    Did the okcupid thing, bumped into Manson’s models, then followed a link to Rollo’s blog from an okcupid forum post (of all places) and had the Aha! moment. It was brutal, and it still is. More (all) Steves should be rebelling.

  71. The medium is the message…
    “He’s an awesome guy…” bitch can’t fuck the dude…😧
    With red pill eyes we understand why this is….it’s not the guys fault….but it is…
    Added to that – she went public…
    The blue pill is poison.
    Fuck me…this new world, man!
    That dudes marriage is a trainwreck waiting to happen….
    So be it….

  72. “Men tend to view marriage from the old books perspective with old books expectations and old books rewards. Those simply do not exist for men today.”

    Rollo in ’96. still good for him in 2016.

    I did it in ’03. mine’s trained like a dog, to the point she’ll fetch a fucking ball if I throw it.

    so where is the cut off? what marks the end of marriage 1.0?

    certain statutes passed in certain states?

    social media explosion in ’07? the i phone in ’07? tinder in ’12

    earlier? bubble pops in ’99? american idol in ’02? student debt for life in ’05?

    or is it a gradual shift?

    who got married after me in ’03 who still has it good?

  73. “…she just wants him to be happy”
    It’s very sad when a man can be publicly undressed like that and still can’t see what the fuck is happening….
    And naturally this is the result of social engineering since the 60s…
    Too many men want to talk, instead of do…the pervasiveness of the FI is is directly proportional to how men have been raised over the last decades to be increasingly permissive…
    Of course solipsism is used to white wash the guilt, and abject fuck-nuttery that is occurring…more so, on a meta scale….

    It is a great time to be a man!!!

    Men in this day and age cannot thank Rollo enough….

  74. @ Rollo

    ” It’s interesting to read Wild Man switch from Elizabethan English to ghetto-speak in every comment. Does anyone actually talk like this IRL?”

    He he, hell no. It’s a recent thing with him in an attempt to ” fit in ” a little bit more. I noticed it too, because it is an odd change to make.

    It’s like when folks try to ” talk cool ” without really knowing what the fuck they’re saying wrt context.

    I have a new, Teflon coated scroll wheel for just such occasions.

  75. ” women want a man who other men want to be, and other women want to fuck. Steve’s steadfast devotion to his wife is anti-seductive and Saira, on some level of consciousness, knows this. If another woman found Steve attractive enough to bang it would generateDread, social proof and confirm his preselection among other women.”

    It really is what it is…cold.hard.facts!!!

    If this guy told her “let’s separate/divorce”, or had an affair with a younger woman/women, started looking after himself…she’d be back on that show wingeing about how “insensitive” he is…

    Men, on the whole, need to start making painful decisions and giving zero fucks…

  76. Hamster rationalizations. Hamster rationalizations everywhere.

    Women do this before and after commitment. Before commitment, it could be, “People that are in love with each other wouldn’t want to have sex with anyone else. If you have any interest in banging other girls that means that you’re not in love with me and you don’t care about me, and we can’t have any future together.”

    After commitment (i.e. after the man ‘realizes’ that the ‘right thing to do’ is for him to devote himself 100% to one woman even after the point that she stops having sex with him)..

    …it could be, “I love you, but I’m not in love with you. I’m just in a phase in my life where I have no libido. If you love me you’ll stick with me through this and help me work through it. Sex isn’t everything.”

    A little anecdote that comes to mind:

    Before I got off of FB, I just checked in on a 20 y/o I almost hooked up with a couple years ago. She’s married now. Her wall is full of propositions of love from this chode calling her “my beautiful lovely wife” and “I am the luckiest man on earth to have this lovely darling beautiful princess cupcake all to my own.”

    (this is the same girl that, at the time she was just dating him, was telling me shit like she wanted to be a stripper, was huge into girls and that he would never allow her to be with other girls and it made him feel very insecure…

    …sexted more than a few times with me, and would talk about how she wanted to be fucked, and how he was a nice guy but was afraid of being rough with her. So he never fucked her in a way that she really wanted to be fucked, and it was frustrating, but if she had to tell him to be rough it would be meaningless because he should’ve known to do that from the start…..like I did, lol. She even went so far as to literally tell me “omg, you get it” followed by more dirty messages)

    She also gloated on one post about how she hadn’t had sex with him yet (advertising to potential Alpha Fucks, most likely), and he was a “Real Man” for understanding that sex isn’t the most important thing in a relationship and he “had the balls” to “respect her” and “love her” and “put her first” and prioritize the relationship over something that “the media makes us think is so important.”

    Heavy emphasis on praising him for “Being a Man”….of course, the definition of “Man” in that context is defined by the Feminine Imperative, and has nothing to do with actual masculinity. Only how a person that happens to have balls and a dick can be used to secure a woman’s agenda, and the positive reinforcement of verbal praise to keep them doing it and believing that it’s in their best interest.

    An acquaintance of mine also recently got married. He has still never had sex. He refuses to fuck his wife for whatever reason. I think he’s afraid of doing it. Can’t really say. She’s already started talking about wanting to fuck other guys. She was talking about that even months before they got married because he kept saying he wanted to wait until marriage to have sex, but she was skeptical, and the longer the ‘relationship’ went on without sex she got more and more frustrated.

    Another acquaintance of mine was so lonely that he just got engaged after dating a girl for a few months. She isn’t good looking and is easily 5-6 points below his SMV, if you’re going by looks, and all he ever posts is things about how much he loves her. He even ordered matching hoodies that said something like “Engaged to the World’s Greatest Princess” and “Engaged to the World’s Greatest Prince” or something like that. Like holy shit, man.

    Also brings back another memory of a girl I used to know that ended up getting married. Christian girl. Classic “good girl.” Waited for sex.

    Makes you wonder why she felt the need to tell me, an old friend of hers where there used to be some sexual tension, why “having him in my mouth was the most amazing feeling I’ve ever had.”

    Like uh….okay? So what time do you want me to come over to film it, and when am I trading the camera with your new husband?

    I was so oblivious for most of my life I didn’t catch things like that. Or I innately did, but I was so invested in the Blue Pill I was like, oh, well, if a girl is in a relationship, or ESPECIALLY if she’s married, that means she can’t want anyone but her husband, derp.

  77. Fleezer

    “what marks the end of marriage 1.0?”

    1920 – The 19th amendment in the US. And now near universal women’s suffrage globally.

  78. One thing I realised in my red pill journey, reading Rollos glorious material, as well as CH, and now illimitablemen…is that men should be able to offer stability without being predictable…
    Only thing is guys in Steve’s case have to learn the hard way….
    In Swahili we have a saying…in fact most sayings in Swahili, rather proverbs, start with “Wahenga wanasema”, i.e. “The old men say…”
    The saying goes…”If your mother did not teach you, you will be taught by the world”…
    Most of us will arrive/have arrived at the red pill this way…

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