The Princess Experience

‘Fallen Princesses’ –  photographer Dina Goldstein

504 comments

  1. “Honey you can be a princess and grow up to be just like me!” “Queen Of Whales!” “Disney will show you how to start, and then you can graduate to teeny sitcoms, and then soaps and Dr. Oz and Oprah, and Dr. Philoshit and The E channel and the food channel and…. …..and Disney and Nabisco and Mickey D’s and General Mills and…. will all get rich off your imbecilic idiocy as you blubber inflate your fat ass into horrendous hideous oblivion just like me your proud mommy!!!!!!

  2. How much would looks/money matter if boys were given that experience every day from birth so they viewed themselves as having as much value as a hot girl has, instead of being told they don’t deserve a princess and teaching them to compare themselves to other men and put women on a pedestal and view other men as having higher value than themselves? 😉

  3. I’m a sexist, but I just added a short story to my website where a “princess” actually uses ingenuity to save her own useless ass …. Check it out …. the June 22 top posting. Scroll down my website header page if you can’t see it. Then click.

    http://www.sorcerygod.wordpress.com

    I think the best thing about being a princess is that it comes pre-assembled and pre-attached with an adoring crowd of white knights and beta orbiters — whose adoring looks and urges to please and assist make any day a pleasure for the young lady about town.

    Whether it’s a move to a new apartment, or a job she just HAS to have (retail), or an alpha boy who might give her the orgasm she craves, the princess speaks to the solipsistic mind inside every chick. Even the 60-year-old woman wants to be the princess, always.

    *SPLAT*

    The sound of princess hitting The Wall, abruptly.

  4. Yareally
    “How much would looks/money matter if boys were given that experience every day from birth so they viewed themselves as having as much value as a hot girl has, instead of being told they don’t deserve a princess and teaching them to compare themselves to other men and put women on a pedestal and view other men as having higher value than themselves?”
    That’s wonderfully though provoking.

  5. 27 years ago I felt so much like a king i named the third princess in native tongue and raised her as one now she is a single mommy raising her princess.Interesting like a man that is robbed of his royalty or just in waiting to inherit.
    Much better to go out and get it on your own.
    Tough fantasy to break,even tougher to live up to.

  6. The “Unhappy Marriage” shows Princess in a decent middle class home with four children with a decent looking, fit husband.

    A healthy, pretty woman standing in a modest home with four children depicts the “tragic fate” of a “fallen princess”?

    W.

    T.

    F?

    Fifty years ago such was the model of happiness, domestic bliss, the American Dream. Today it’s degradation on the same level as cancer.

    W.T.F?

  7. LoL.

    The start of the Black Flag book by Shark:

    Chapter The First: Internal Game THE MATRIX

    “Why do my eyes hurt?” “You’ve never used them before”

    The Matrix is omnipresent. It is ubiquitous, it is all-­‐encompassing, it is all-­‐seeing, it is all-­‐ knowing. From billboards to magazines to TV shows to high school clubs to advertisements to movies to father-­‐son conversations to novels to fairy tales to news paper articles to proverbs to jokes; it is literally fucking everywhere.

    It starts with Disney movies.

    From a young age all men are exposed to a stream-­‐line of normalization that teaches them that all girls are princesses and all women are led to believe that they are entitled to their own fairy tales. By their pre-­‐teen years, boys have been thoroughly conditioned to believe that all women need to be placed on pedestals, that insecurities are a parasitic yet beneficial aspect of relationships, and that one day, it will be honorable for them to willingly sacrifice their minds to a media-­‐fueled pop sensation soul-­‐mate mythology whose sole function is to systemically sterilize them and all of their kin. Other girls give them shitty advice, leading them to think that girls actually like desperate behavior and that the appropriate way to win a woman’s heart involves a prostrating desire for exclusivity, a willingness to spend a suicidal amount of money on flowers, and an over-­‐protective standard of commitment. The few men who are able to escape the jaws of a greater feminized imperative adopt a perverted form of masculinity, becoming the famously labeled “jerks” of society, extroverting their insecurities in the form of cocky, arrogant, or obnoxious behavior. Afraid of commitment and themselves, they are the future janitors of our race. Of the saved souls, only a few become real “men” -­‐ and even they have trouble articulating their leadership into useful forms. From video games to materialism, the hyper-­‐addictive personality embodied by contemporary society successfully transfigures them into a corrupted version of themselves. Nice guys are praised for their willingness to bend over and take it up the ass. Jerks are demonized for jizzing on other people’s faces. “Real” men waste all their time playing video games, masturbating, and engaging in other useless activities. In short, men are taught to be pussies and no one realizes that they’re being lied to until it’s too late.

    The ending isn’t from a Disney movie.

    The symptoms of a decaying post-­‐modern society leak out in the form of divorce rates and psycho-­‐social pathologies. Approach anxiety seizes its victims by the throat and turns good natured men into lifeless herbs who innocuously orbit the dark corners of clubs and bars. Jealousy etches itself into the foundation of every relationship as men opt for lackluster Page 4 of 139 attempts at controlling their emotions. The defiant subculture of game turns into a tool used to oppress women rather than liberate men -­‐ it’s original purpose. Husbands and boyfriends world-­‐wide contemplate suicide or murder everyday because they can’t stand the idea of “the one” leaving them to get raw-­‐dogged by fresh cock in some dark alleyway. Girls who refuse to acknowledge the true, biologically determined, nature of men are left in the dark and fed acreages of shit in their own abusive or pathetically isolated half-­‐relationships. The swath of supplicatory comments offered as tribute to them on facebook via decadent bitchboys galvanizes even the most repulsive of marsh monsters to join the league of extraordinary cunts – an exclusive priori dedicated to burning an embroidery of feminism unto their world.

    The sexual market is merciless in its judgment. Men begin to seek solace in World of Warcraft and porn magazines. The mass production of lube makes it possible to find comfort in jerking off to lesbian literature while avoiding the horrifying experience of being rejected by a real girl. Social skills, like common sense, become a rare commodity. The purifying acid wash of reality begins to settle in as the painful dissolution of humanity begins its tragic descent to chaos. This is the degenerated acropolis of “refined” culture you begin your journey for self-­‐improvement in.

    @Andy

    Wow. Thanks, man for that youtube link to to Julian’s Ten Game LiveStream. I was traveling today and listened to the first two in the truck on the way to do some serious farming. Good stuff.

    @YaReally

    Julian really is terribly lucid in these new videos. Who would have thought? Him and Tyler have matured into some fine young speakers.

    Pua Game leads to skills that spill over into being a man vs. a boy. And then you move on. Us old guys did it the old-fashioned way. We got skills and life experiences and then backed into red pill and Game.

    What do you think about his video #2 in the series? I have some thoughts about balance in masculine life vs. addiction to game. But don’t have time to compose a more fleshed out comment. Game first be balanced second. PUA Game is a stepping stone. To a future life moving beyond that.

    Julian advocating for balance: Less than full alpha, ok for some beta ( a little vulnerability along the lines of in order to be in love with a girl and go with the flow, it is not alpha fucks all the time. Not full on alpha which tends to be unstable in relationship game. Even poly LTR’s).

    Julian has done it all. Seems he is settling for a girl or two or three based on his concise ruminations on answers posed to him.

    What are your thoughts? Ten years from now, for you? (I’m not goading you. I love you, man and want the best for you.) :

  8. This is one of the inevitable and bad consequences of having brexited from Monarchy. Only in a Republic, where everyone is a nobody, is everyone, at least the women and the Trannies, a Princess – Princess of Wails.

  9. I had to laugh when I saw the shot in the bar. I ran out and took the shot on the bottom because I used to get torqued there back in the day.

    Can’t say I recognize her though….

  10. and the FI keeps crushing it:

    Eli Hurst is 12 years old. Girls have just started to enter his thinking in a new way, and he’s “vulnerable,” says his father, Darrell Hurst.

    Still, Eli’s views are sturdily progressive, despite the misogyny seeping into the U.S. presidential campaign and corners of Canadian campuses. “Treat girls with respect,” he says.

    Darrell recently sat down with Eli to make good on a pledge to talk about consent, a promise he put forward as part of the #20MinutesOfAction4Change campaign.

    It’s more than a hashtag. Turning a now notorious courtroom quote on its head, the online campaign asks dads to sit down with their sons for 20 minutes and to counter misogynist attitudes, wafting everywhere from Donald Trump rallies to college chants.

    “It makes me nervous. It makes me scared,” Darrell said.

    https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/2016/06/23/fathers-turn-the-talk-into-dialogue-on-respectful-relationships.html

  11. I was lucky enough to experience the “Prince” experience for twenty years, courtesy of the U.S. Marine Corps. It included spending part of one training day – – coincidentally, my birthday, going through the CS gas chamber “experience,” among many other wonderful (and some awful) memories. Although I’m nearly 60 now, and well past The Wall, those memories and my accomplishments will live with me until the end, and I wouldn’t trade them for anything in the world.

    What post-Wall princess can say the same?

  12. #20MinutesOfAction4Change

    Father: Son, I’m nervous, I’m scared. You are vulnerable. I want to talk to you about what it means to be a man.

    Son: Can I go play my game?

    Father: No, listen to me. I know you know to treat girls with respect, but what I have to tell now is about consent.

    Son: Cool, can I go play my game?

    Father: No hold on. Now you need her consent. Go that? And this applies to everything. If you want to do something, you need her consent. Okay?

    Son: Sure.

    Father: Wait, that’s more. If a woman wants to be part of your group, you need to consent to that, always.

    Son: Sure

    Father: If you to make something, you need the consent of women. Anything you make, they have to consent to.

    Son: Sure

    Father: Even if you become rich, and want your name on a building, you got to have the consent of women. Without consent you are nothing.

    Son: Sure

    Father: And your primary focus of life, should be getting the consent of women. You should study it for years, spend much of your free time on it. You have to learn how to get the consent of women.

    Son: Sure

    Father: And how your character as a man will be judged, that will be on how enthusiastic that consent is.

    Son: Sure

    Father: Now your dad is a little less nervous and scared, go play your game.

  13. I had a “princess” experience myself yesterday when a drunk gay dude hit on me 3 times, lol. Called me “honey” and stuff like that. I ignored him and the normally cold waitress warmed up to me a bit. Will gay men hitting on straight men trigger Preselection in women?

  14. Saw this comment somewhere, a while back:

    “She told me to treat her like a princess… So I married her off to a total stranger to strengthen our alliance with Prussia.”

  15. @Asd
    Funny stuff!
    If she can relate to the guy it may even trigger mate guarding,we used to go to Dennys after the bars closed,the gay fellas would hit on me and the wife would give them dirty looks.She knows I don’t roll that way,it still triggered a defense.

  16. “A healthy, pretty woman standing in a modest home with four children depicts the “tragic fate” of a “fallen princess”? Fifty years ago such was the model of happiness, domestic bliss, the American Dream. Today it’s degradation on the same level as cancer. W.T.F?”

    It’s the exact same feminist tripe the (((Dina Goldsteins))) of the world have been shilling for the past 50+ years.

    Credit where it’s due for the “Pocahontas Cat Lady” pic, though. I lolzed pretty hard at that one.

  17. @stuff

    The gay dude invaded my space briefly and I just ignored him other than a brief look. He was wearing a dress and had long hair, lol. I was slightly amused. I could have engaged him and asked him if he liked receiving golden showers and if he licked dirty assholes, lol.

    Messing with him would have been a DHV. Ignoring him without feeling threatened was also a DHV, but less so. Still, he was drunk, so there was risk if I had engaged him.

    Mrs. Gamer found my story highly amusing.

  18. “I was lucky enough to experience the “Prince” experience for twenty years, courtesy of the U.S. Marine Corps.”

    Exactly.

    From The Black Flag:

    “Studies concur; men who are competitive are more alpha than their vagina bequeathed brethren.

    If you’re young, you have time to pick up a sport. If you’re older, your career is the way to go. Become uncannily good at anything you do – approach it with an untapped competitive potential – and your flaccid personality will follow in suit. It is no coincidence that men who stand out in their respective fields generally display Alpha characteristics.”

    What will happen if boys are given the full Princess Treatment? They’ll become princesses, which will fuck them up even worse than it does the girls.

    Boys are not princesses. Boys are not girls. Boys do best and will develop the greatest self-esteem not when they are coddled, but when they are given the opportunities and guidance to overcome difficulties and hard times by their own actions.

    “She told me to treat her like a princess… So I married her off to a total stranger to strengthen our alliance with Prussia.”

    That’s exactly what I was talking about in my comment above. If a woman asks you to treat her like a princess – Do It!

    What is the life of a princess?

    “Your Highness, you are a princess, you CANNOT do that.”
    “Your Highness, you are a princess, you MUST do that.”

    It’s easy for a girl to look at the cage and only see the gilding, but there is no life so constrained as that of a princess. Give it to her good and hard.

    “I meant a Disney princess,” I hear her cry.

    Fine. Mia from The Princess Diaries. Now, where were we?

  19. @asd

    If you and I were having a beer together and the guy hit in you,yes asking him if a tossed salad tastes like shat would have given us some laughs.
    But as it was not a boys night
    ,being judgmental in front of the babes not so much of a dhv,rather the opposite,live and let live higher dhv,judgmental lower dhv.imo

  20. @Yareally
    Thanks for the advice. I was wondering what you thought of Krauser’s Daygame Mastery – he wanted a fair review so there’s no problem you being critical if you wish.

  21. I had to study it to get it.

    All of these pics are of “Fallen Princesses.”

    Woman with kids and husband watching TV- Fallen.

    Woman sitting on a pile of books implying she has read them= Fallen.

    Woman getting botox- Definitely Fallen.

    Woman is little fat riding hood= Fallen

    Pocohontos Cat Lady= Fallen.

    OK, I get it now.

  22. @stuff

    I figured that girls would see that flirting with a gay dude showed massive confidence and security. Maybe I don’t understand how girls would see that.

  23. @stuff

    I think flirting with a gay fella would disqualify a man as gay.

    Depends on how you carry it off, I think. If you are very indirect and subtle and don’t act effeminate, but show a lot of amused mastery, I think it would work.

  24. At Vox Day’s they are arguing over when was the last Disney movie that was a) good and b) at least boy-tolerant, if not about a boy protagonist. Most agreed that was probably The Lion King. Though a couple noticed that Zootopia had some nuance, in that the heroine would not trust the fox, and so the fax acted just like he assumed the distrust, and called her on her prejudice.

    They deliberately left out discussing Pixar, a studio which swings all over the place (i.e., no mention of Wall-E, definitely a boy robot, or Finding Nemo).

    But here are a couple good, if older kid movies for boys:

    Time Bandits – the young boy is the hero, he is smarter than everyone except the Supreme Being (literally). The movie is rather a sausage fest, in a “Ripping Yarns” kind of way, except the characters are all buffoons, and inserting a Pretty Strong Woman would get in the way. The one major fenale role is Katherine Helmond, who is very good as the giant’s bossy wife. A Monty Python product.

    Yellow Submarine – super-psychedelic and hippie-ish, yes. A couple references to cigar and cigarette smoking. But damn if it doesn’t hold up well – and it’s definitely a Bechdel test epic fail.

    Though I confess I rather like the fallen princess photo displays – they are a bit upsetting, and therefore get a thumbs-up from cynical ol’ me.

  25. @Not Born This Morning: ““Honey you can be a princess and grow up to be just like me!” “Queen Of Whales!” “Disney will show you how to start, and then you can graduate to teeny sitcoms, and then soaps and Dr. Oz and Oprah, and Dr. Philoshit and The E channel and the food channel and…. …..and Disney and Nabisco and Mickey D’s and General Mills and…. will all get rich off your imbecilic idiocy as you blubber inflate your fat ass into horrendous hideous oblivion just like me your proud mommy!!!!!!”

    And don’t forget: VOTE FOR HILLARY. JUST PULL THE F*CKING LEVER AND VOTE FOR HILLARY INTO PERPETUITY

  26. Time Bandits was a Terry Gilliam movie, not Monty Python; Handmade Films, not Disney.

    Yellow Submarine was United Artists- King Features, not Disney.

    If we’re just talking older movies that are good for boys, there are piles of them. A lot of them are crap movies, but good for boys anyway, and boys will love them. Before they totally princessified Disney made a lot of these as live action (the discussion at Vox Popoli is just about animated movies).

    Iron Will comes to mind of the more recent.

    I’ll go with The Jungle Book as the last good Disney animated feature.

  27. Yes I’m talking good movies for boys, I was not looking for Disney. Time Bandits was directed by Terry Gilliam, written by Michael Palin and Terry Jones, Palin and John Cleese appear in it – all Pythons.

    Yes there are lots more good movies for boys, those are just two which popped into my head.

  28. @redlight That Toronto Star article made my balls crawl up inside my pelvis for fear of being lopped off. Yikesters. I like your take on it.

    Mr. SJW Dud had me at “I’m nervous and scared.” Do tell. I bet he is, the likely fucked up result of his parenting makes ME nervous and scared.

    We MAH-dern parents fuck ourselves raw with a Crazy Straw getting all worried up in this DoublePlusGoodThink. The Paper or the Website say we must drop everything and have various “talks” on this week’s parenting fetishes to the bewilderment and boredom of our sprogs.

    What ever happened to the idea of just teaching good manners, and developing the good sense not to make personal remarks? Somehow that’s too hard??

  29. @kfg: The Jungle Book hit perfectly the seductiveness of the feminine. The male resistance is humorously couched in Baloo’s words; I think few Mowglis escape when the seductiveness turns into the FI.

  30. The RePatriarchy

    Episode 23

    Took the boy 13 on a tournament weekend… Lacrosse is quite excellent for developing young male minds and bodies…

    We roll into a beach bar… Sweet little 7 strides up to take an order… I say “Beer here and the boy is not eating.” she says “why” i say “because we just robbed a bank and his nerves are still a little shot.. You know it was the first time for him”.

    She breaks out laughing and plays along.. “Oh yeah.. I remember my first time” switch to some game, a little laser… “Of course… The first time… It’s all about the nerves. But it gets better with experiance right?” and now some blush and giggling from her…. She is highly attentive. Lots of eyes from her as she gous around the room.

    We finish up she comes to see if we want anything else… Some more banter… “We are doing another tomorrow you in?”… She is laughing and nodding “totally!” she asks… “Whats your name” i hold my hand out, she takes in and i pull her in closer, still holding it. “Whats yours” still holding it. “Matilda” still holding it “well matiltida im sentient and this is Kid Biscuit” still holding it… “Nice to meet you” … Release. “Not sure if we can trust you just yet, but i’ll let you know”… She “ok! Come back tomorrow”. We split. He’s like. “Dad tou are funny”. We walk back to our hotel, a car full of girls gives a shout out the window… “Get used to it son.”

    Of course it will help him immensly that he has 3 older and a younger sister…. He knows now girls are silly, annoying, and will do whatever he asks them to do… Birth order for the win.

    Counteract Disney Princesses by raising strong sons….

  31. “I think few Mowglis escape when the seductiveness turns into the FI.”

    It lures men to civilization. It happened to Tarzan as well.

  32. The “Unhappy Marriage” shows Princess in a decent middle class home with four children with a decent looking, fit husband.

    A healthy, pretty woman standing in a modest home with four children depicts the “tragic fate” of a “fallen princess”?

    Nothing wrong with it, but it isn’t “being a Princess”, which means castles, servants, wealth, etc.

    Main Street ain’t Buckingham Palace.

  33. @Gunnar von Cowtown

    “It’s the exact same feminist tripe the (((Dina Goldsteins))) of the world have been shilling for the past 50+ years.”

    They play adult working until they realize work is not glamourous and their ovaries begin to scream like Alx Rose. Then like predators they find a competitive hubby-worker-provider, settle into a McMansion in the burbs, and excrete a couple of womb rats.

    Once the womb rats reach two or five, they take up easy usually part time work or never return to work. But the notion housewifery is drudgery never leaves them and they use it to leverage domestic work from their worker-providers under the fraud that they “gave up their careers” or are “stuck at home,” which is, absurdly, what they angled for.

  34. @Rollo – I love that you just posted the pix and the vid. It didn’t need a long disquisition, yet it’s such a powerful point. Where are men/boys being treated like “princes” or “kings”? The entire idea would make Michelle Obama track you down and claw your fucking eyes out (if ya didn’t see Gavin McGuiness’s treatment of her hateful Father’s Day commentary, ya should head over to YouTube and check it out).

    @ Ya – This. “How much would looks/money matter if boys were given that experience every day from birth so they viewed themselves as having as much value as a hot girl has, instead of being told they don’t deserve a princess and teaching them to compare themselves to other men and put women on a pedestal and view other men as having higher value than themselves? ”

    I’m so clear on my own social conditioning now and how saturated I am to the bone with it. For me, gaming has largely become about asserting my value to myself primarily, and noticing how automatic making women the prize is for me – and shucking that shit. Retraining myself.

    Mini FR: The HB8 I met at the business function is following the same pattern as my HB9 woodland girl. HB8 is very smart and well educated politically (in the poli sci/philosophy) and not a standard SJW type. So I’ve engaged her intellectually over messaging, with overt sexualization and teasing woven in. Cracking on her being smart for a blonde, but not even a real blonde, telling her about my other friend girl and how she likes to lay together and read books with to each other under the moonlight.

    She went quiet for a couple of days and i began to get that thirsty, weird feeling but laughed at it and moved along. Sure enough, she came back today, mentioning that I called the other woman “friendgirl” and then invited me out to meet her at a networking event tonight. Flirtier than ever.

    I’m figuring out how to demonstrate huge high value intellectually to a subset of young women who appreciate it, while also being dominant and sexual. I engage in well calibrated debate and the gentle push/pull of rhetoric. That’s my game, and ya know what? I think it’s working like a charm. Using my strengths – writing, intellect and rhetoric, while demonstrating social dominance. She met me at an event that I run, where I have high status. She interacted with me seeking my coaching and advice. Perfect.

    I was nervous about how sexual and flirty I was being but didn’t get weak, and now bam, she’s all giggly and cute. So the club may not be my thing, but the game is exactly the same. What I realize is that I have to be in an environment where I project high value and that’s hardest for me “in the club” where I’m the 53yo guy with a gut, lol. But in the professional context or my musical context I’m seen much differently. Even at the cafe where I know the owner (he owns 9 of them) and he seeks my advice etc, I’m seen as having high status. Now I have see myself as high value in the club, but I also think externals matter more there. Ot maybe it’s that I don’t have as much time to do so, or as many ways to do so in the club. Whatever, I’m making progress in how I see myself, and also in seeing myself honestly.

    And hey, I’ll fuck the princesses too, he he…

    @KFG – “Become uncannily good at anything you do – approach it with an untapped competitive potential – and your flaccid personality will follow in suit. It is no coincidence that men who stand out in their respective fields generally display Alpha characteristics.” – from Black Flag, very nice.

    Good luck out there.

  35. The defining takeaway from the pictures is that being shackled with one man and domestic life is BOOORING.

    The defining characteristics of a princess is that she has many suitors, many social engagements with sexy high status men, is served hand and foot, is the centre of attention, doesn’t have to work and is sought after and desired.

    It’s Hyperagamy writ large, after all if she gets married she would become a queen and I’ve yet to see a story tale valorising being a queen.

    The more you peel the onion the more it looks like the female isn’t naturally monogamous.

  36. https://therationalmale.com/2015/03/31/wives-lovers/

    The character that is a wife is now socially and popularly expected to move into a sexless, passionless and unexciting condition by being married today. All Epiphany Phase rationalizations aside, marriage is viewed as the end of the party. Being a wife is boring by comparison.

    I explored this in detail in Beta Fucks and As Good As It Gets, but what I find ironic in light of Dalrock’s assertions about romance-primary intergender dynamics is that the very pretense of that romantic “true love” context that supposedly legitimizes sex is killed within the confines of marriage. In fact, women expect and anticipate that the sexual desire they find so important in that romantic context will necessarily die once they become a ‘wife’.

    The pretext of being a ‘wife’ is a socially excusable expectation of progressively losing sexual affinity for the man she’s agrees to marry, so what woman wants to be a wife? Women become wives due to the necessities an ever-decreasing capacity to maintain being a lover requires of them.

  37. “Main Street ain’t Buckingham Palace.”

    It’s closer than you think, especially for women. I read an article recently that pointed out how our current, modern lives are basically more wealthy, comfortable, healthy, pleasurable and abundant than Rockefeller’s was, just due to overall advances.

    If Black Americans were their own country, they would be the 12th wealthiest nation in the world (similar fact). Most American whining is because they compare their life to the upper class instead of to other countries or history.

    They ‘struggle’ of middle class America, even lower class America is overplayed. Big houses, patios, yards, clean air, abundant forests, mountains etc. It’s all awesome. Compare to a brain surgeon in Shanghai who lives in a leveled box in a cloud of shit and noise.

    Now if you want to talk about the lack of free time/overwork/tax burden for the middle-class/upper middle-class male, that brings up some different issues.

    But for a woman to lament her carpeted, two-story palace (yes palace) in a clean environment etc….it makes me sick. Just more bullshit from the pedestalized ones.

  38. I don’t really get it. Why is this even here? It’s good art, and powerful social commentary.

    As for the complaints about the unhappy marriage one… It’s very clear that Prince Charming is at the back totally not giving a single fuck about the kids or the wife. Now, sometimes that’s okay. My bf often acts like a Prince while I do everything. But that’s not always the case. Meanwhile, this artist is clearly trying to say that this is ALWAYS the case and she’s in an unhappy marriage with a man who doesn’t care.

  39. @SJF
    No interest in LTRs. Pretty much all of the things that LTRs come with outside of what you get from FBs, are things that I don’t enjoy.

    I don’t like going to a girl’s family dinners, I don’t like hanging with her friends (since most of the time they’re not people I would hang out with, they’re people she grew up with or went to school with etc and are of massively varying quality), I don’t like seeing her dressed like shit with no makeup gassy after eating greasy takeout dinner, I don’t like worrying about whether her skipping the gym this week is going to be a thing that I have to run a whole dread game production to make sure she gets back to the gym, I don’t like having to babysit her and listen to her first world problems that are ultimately pretty insignificant, I don’t like the drama of fights and passive-aggressive shit and having to run around doing dread game because she’s trying to use sex as a weapon, I don’t like having to remember her birthday or care that she’s hanging out with some co-worker who keeps posting on her Facebook wall, I don’t like having to plan road trips or vacations around her wants and needs, I don’t like having to factor someone else into my major life decisions like moving or career changes, I don’t like having to answer questions like “where are you going?” or “where were you?” or “why are you going to do that?”, I don’t like vegetating on a couch watching Netflix like a lazy sloth all night (I have career shit to work on right now, and I’d rather post here or do my own thing), I don’t like needlessly spending money on silly shit to go do things that I don’t really want to do so she doesn’t get sad or bored, I don’t like, I don’t like having to time anything in my schedule around someone else (like when I’m going to eat, when I work, when I play, etc), I don’t like having to pretend I’m not sick/tired/depressed when I am, I don’t like hanging out with other couples playing board games and eating cheese, I don’t like hanging out with other girl’s lame depressing given-up-on-life passionless purposeless Blue Pill boyfriends while our girlfriends gab about whatever and think we’ll get along because we’re both guys when the guy comes off as just a zombie waiting to die to me, and on and on and on.

    Most of that same stuff applies to kids lol There’s nothing appealing about having kids to me at this stage in my life.

    Like I get that some guys are cool with that stuff, or want it, or enjoy it, or don’t mind it, or hate it but don’t mind compromising on it, and I know some of it can be dealt with from a red pill frame like laying down the law and not caring about her crying or giving drama or social pressure bla bla but I just don’t WANT to deal with any of that. All the parts of relationships that I LIKE are the same parts I can get from having a harem of FBs lol

    And there might be a point in my late-40s where I decide I want to pass on my genes enough that I want a kid and am willing to put up with some of that stuff to be able to do it and just pick the best girl out of the group I’m seeing at the time with the expectation that it’ll probably fall apart in 10-ish years (and I’ll have protected my assets/custody/etc from day one).

    But right now I’m VERY happy being a single bachelor, ESPECIALLY as I’m getting my career/finances/health/etc handled. All I see in my future is a long life of endless beautiful girls, good close buddies who are all on their own purposes and striving to reach their potential (mastermind group type shit), and infinite adventure. In my mid-40s I’ll probably gravitate toward more of a social circle focused game instead of hitting up the bars for ease of access to new girls, but I can’t see myself settling down anytime soon. 10 years bare minimum.

    This is just my own personal wiring and what I’ve learned about myself from being in LTRs and pLTRs and having FBs etc, and not a recommendation for anyone but myself. Maybe Julien likes the stability of having a girlfriend, especially when he’s travelling the world from city to city every few days and dealing with crazy chaos infield, maybe he just likes some of that LTR shit I listed, who knows, doesn’t matter to me lol I’m just doing what makes me happiest day to day and I’m always open to my desires/wants/needs evolving over time.

  40. @Emily

    I don’t really get it. Why is this even here? It’s good art, and powerful social commentary.

    he’s at the lake, he’s male it in (that was rationally intended).

    As for the complaints about the NBA draft, sorry, unhappy marriage one… It’s very clear that Prince Charming is at the back totally not giving a zero fucks about the kids or the wife. Now, sometimes that’s perfect. My roommate often acts out like a Prince while I do everything. But that’s not always the case, just 99.9%. Meanwhile back at the raunch, this art tist is clearly trying to say that this is ALWAYS the case and she’s in an unhappy long term relationship with a boyfriebd who doesn’t care about Emily.

    fuck, this is scary (you there?). First E says fuck, and then she runs a rational augment on is. WTF?

    E, it’s a puzzle, move them around until they all fit

  41. @yareally

    (E don’t read this, you will become a lez)

    Here’s what men I hang out do. They attend weddings, funerals, baptisms, dinner parties, cottage parties, beach parties, backyard BBQs, church and school social events, community events, beer with the bros, soccer practices with moms in yoga pants.

    They go boating, what Rollo calls sledding, off-roading, fishing, hunting, motorcycling, racing, bicycling, running, playing in a band.

    They build decks, cabins, cottages, renos, cut down trees, put in roads

    They don’t take shit from anyone

    They teach men to be men, which you and Rollo do

    They do what they do, and the pussy goes to them and stays attached to them

    Besides teaching, what men stuff do you do?

  42. Serious question, do you do these things because you ‘get pussy’ or because you actually enjoy them? I see so many guys on TRP trying to be what they aren’t just to get women chasing them. Well, if that makes them stop playing video games that’s a good thing, but to be attractive you have to be genuine and if you are only going hunting because ‘look at me! Look how MANLY I am OMG’ then naa, you won’t seem attractive, just a try hard.

    But yeah, if you actually don’t do any of these activities, if you have real hobbies that women don’t find attractive (like… say, programming) then why would you rewire yourself to do more ‘manly’ things? What defines a man in the first place? And is it really worth it doing things you don’t find interesting just so you can ‘get pussy’?

    I don’t know… that’s just the vibe I get here sometimes from some members.

  43. Emily,

    I’m assuming you’re commenting about the photo with Prince Charming in the chair while Snow White takes care of the kids (FI translation; “Does everything”)

    Your FI lens sees a husband worthy of criticism for not hopping around and doing what he should for the woman’s moment to moment happiness.

    The MI lens (what the hell is that?) sees a huge house with nice furniture, healthy kids, a TV, a nice fireplace, abundant food, a dog and all kinds of comfort for her, provided by his work. After so much work all week to provide a palace for her, he wants to rest and have a drink.

    You see the man as a p.o.s. We see him as a guy who set aside his own imperatives (running a dive shop in Indonesia and having access to a lifetime of 19 year old tail) to bust his ass to provide .001 percentile living conditions for his wife who only bitches about it and thinks it’s bullshit that she has to spend a few hours a day managing the house.

  44. Kaminsky,

    Thank you for explaining your pov.

    First of all, unless you are rich I doubt anyone has access to a lifetime of 19 year old tail, but moving on…

    I think you are reading too much into it, and making far too many assumptions. I don’t find anything wrong with the picture, and that’s not because I’m part of the FI or whatever. I want to be a SAHM, live in a nice house and have 3 beautiful sons.

    But the question here is what did the artist intend for you to see? She wanted to show an unhappy marriage. Now, you could fill all the details not there by saying ‘oh, the man is just resting after a long day of work and the woman is unhappy because she’s an entitled princess.’ But how do you know ANY of that information? You don’t. The husband could be a slob who stays at home all day and maybe the woman works AND takes care of her kids. Who knows? The point is, the princess is unhappy. That’s all. You guys are reading wayyyy too much into this.

  45. I don’t know what the artist intended. The best artists produce ambiguous work, don’t you think?

    “But how do you know ANY of that information? You don’t.”

    That’s silly. My interpretation is my interpretation. That’s what I know. How do you know the man in the chair isn’t Snow White’s transgendered sister who just got back from a satanic ritual in Pocatello, Idaho and then was cloned and the clone is in the chair right now and the actual sister is out on her new jetsurf?

    “You don’t.”

    Also, we’re supposed to read things into it. It’s art.

    My favorite part of your post is this;

    “The point is, the princess is unhappy. That’s all.”

    FI gavel right there.

  46. @N1
    “Thanks for the advice. I was wondering what you thought of Krauser’s Daygame Mastery – he wanted a fair review so there’s no problem you being critical if you wish.”

    He sent me Daygame Overkill (the video product), not the Daygame Mastery book. I’d like to do an in-depth breakdown of his actual infield footage at some point to show where I think he could tighten stuff up (more for his benefit than anything else, ’cause I like to see guys improve and I don’t think he’s anywhere near his ACTUAL potential skill level yet) but the general review would be:

    The content is solid, I have no problems with what he’s teaching. My only real issue is that it’s limited…most of it would get decimated in a nightclub (to which the reply from Krauser would probably be that nightclub girls are all trash anyway lol), and doesn’t train you to REALLY deal with real obstacles (AMOGs, turning around rejections/difficult sets, dealing with groups, dealing with clever/sharp/feisty girls, dealing with cockblocks, etc). Honestly the ESL conversations ruin it the most for me…on a friendly tourist girl, slowly trying to communicate “YOU…..LOOK LIKE…….A CUTE…..LITTLE……BUNNY. (do hand motions of bunny ears) You know, like, a BUNNY? A small, fluffy (hand motions of a small animal) bunny…that hops….along the ground?” while the girl gives a puzzled look and only starts to understand you’re talking about whatever a bunny is in her native language 3/4 of the way through that conversation, like, that’s a LOT easier than engaging girls who speak English that would shit-test or walk away or tool a guy doing that. Not that he would speak that slow to them if they understand him, obviously…but Krauser will tell a girl she looks like a cute bunny hopping along and the ESL girls will half-understand what he’s saying and get the jist that it’s a compliment and say thankyou and then politely seek rapport or stand there receptively waiting for him to say something else, whereas most of the English speaking chicks I know would be like “uhh ok? That’s weird lol” or “oh thanks, well I’m heading to wherever bye!” and shit-test him or just not actively seek rapport or help the conversation along or ask questions or anything because what he’s saying doesn’t really make any kind of an impact or demonstrate any real value…like there’s nowhere near enough value demonstrated for them to give a shit and try to find out who he is or want to guess where he’s from or care if he guesses where they’re from etc, VS a girl who’s run into a mysterious stranger who speaks another language on a day where she’s just walking around bored with nothing to do in a tourist area.

    Think of it as the difference between trying to engage a New Yorker who’s running late to work VS engaging some laid back country person with nothing to do that day who’s just out for a lazy stroll. If you can engage that New Yorker, you can engage the stroller. But being able to engage that stroller isn’t going to help you engage that New Yorker…to engage them you need to make some IMPACT so THEY want to stay.

    These girls having shitty English helps make them act extra friendly because they feel insecure that they don’t understand what he’s saying (here’s this friendly stranger who’s clearly trying to be friendly and I have no idea what he’s saying, I hope he doesn’t think I’m a bitch)…which is great, if you’re in an area with a bunch of ESL chicks. But if you’re gaming in a general English-speaking city in North America and gaming around other guys or mixed sets etc (basically anything that isn’t lone 1 or 2 girl set approaches), this stuff will get steamrolled HARD. I can’t imagine any of the girls I know even entertaining these interactions…he tends not to really get shit-tested in his sets because the girls are friendly so I have no idea if he can really overcome any kind of resistance or if he’d just classify them as “No” girls if they aren’t friendly right away. Like in terms of how friendly/receptive the girls are, his “Maybe” girls are my “green lights all the way, she LOVES you” girls, like they’re giving ZERO real resistance from my perspective, they’re just not actively HELPING things move along which I’d never expect in the first place. To me any girl that isn’t actively walking away ending the conversation is a “Yes” girl or can be turned into a “Yes” girl with proper game lol A “Maybe” girl would be a girl actively putting up big resistance and trying to end the conversation. A “No” girl would be a girl telling me to fuck off and literally walking away. But in traditional PUA we learned to deal with resistance and turn difficult sets around, not just deal with receptive sets…like we learn to FORCE them to pay attention and see our value to turn the set around lol

    It’s kind of like having a manual for how to drive on a straight stretch of road. It’s good, if you’re just driving on straight stretches of road. But it doesn’t really prepare you for how to drive on swerving roads with hills and people crossing the street in front of you. He sticks to areas of the world where he can drive on straight stretches of road, so it works out great for him, and he encourages others to find those same places…but personally I prefer a guy learn how to handle all sorts of driving conditions ’cause it’s rare, especially in North America, and especially in our nightlife etc, to find endless straight stretches of road like that.

    Some of the concepts themselves are just PUA stuff repackaged but I legitimately don’t think Krauser realizes it, like he seems like he’s genuinely come up with the stuff himself, which he very well might have (like I’m not saying there’s necessarily malicious intent) since the way we all figured this stuff out was hitting the field a ton and when you hit the field enough you all come to the same general conclusions about what works…but there’s a lot of little labels he gives things where I can go “this is just this concept from Mystery Method renamed, or combined with this early RSD concept”. And they’re not bad concepts or anything, so I have no real problem with that. Like I don’t care if you call it “being in state” like RSD, or call it “god mode” like Simple Pickup, or “flow state” or whatever else someone comes up with…as long as you understand the concept itself and can use it infield to succeed.

    As for Krauser’s game itself, the infield in the product is a million times better than what I’ve seen posted on YouTube. I have no idea why he doesn’t post this stuff on YouTube instead of the shitty old sets he has up there. To his credit he even makes fun of his old footage at the start of this product, like he understands now how asexual and squirrelly his old vibe was, VS the masculine sexual grounded energy he’s working on developing now. His breakdown of his sets is solid and worth the watch, he points out a lot of subtle calibration stuff he’s doing that most people wouldn’t notice. If I was him, I would take one of these infield vids where he breaks it down, and post THAT online (the breakdown included), to represent himself and his brand. His actual sets are a lot better than the footage he has on YouTube.

    That said:

    1) the ESL thing…it’s REALLY hard to give proper credit to a sarge when 80% of the conversation is going over the girl’s head and confusion and just flustered attempts to describe things the way you’d engage a 4 year old. This stuff would get eaten alive in a North American nightclub. I know, I know, subcomms are more important than words…but I think a guy doing this on chicks who speak English natively will find himself running into a lot more shit-tests and feisty comebacks (not necessarily malicious, but just the girls WANTING a good engaging interaction) and girls trying to qualify him etc, whereas these girls tend to just go right into seeking rapport or being receptive to rapport and part of that is because they feel insecure about not understanding what this friendly stranger is trying to say to them about how they look like a clever little minx or whatever.

    Personally I’d like to see some infield of him running on game with girls who’s first language is English and regularly speak it…that’s not me talking shit, like “oh YA? I’d like to see this shit stand up to a REAL challenge pffft!!” That’s me, legitimately as a guy who enjoys pickup and seeing people push their boundaries and field test stuff, just curious how it does. Me taking his stuff infield wouldn’t really give a good read of how it holds up because inevitably my personality and all my training is going to come through as I go way off-script and just do what I’m used to. I’d love to see him take a trip to any major city here and give his game a go just to see how it holds up.

    2) he’s got more sexuality in his sets now, which is a big improvement. And he’s got good calibration. And the girls are cute. No qualms with any of that. Like, what he’s doing works well for the specific scenario he games in.

    3) but there are things he could tighten up, he misses windows that he could jump through and sparks of attraction that he could fan into way hotter flames…it’s alright when things are running in slow-motion (because of the ESL that slows the conversation down massively) with a friendly receptive girl. But missing those windows with North American girls would end in rejection/flaking. It’s not about speed (because the comeback would probably be “this is the art of seduction like a bear playing with a bunny I’m not in a rush like those dumb PUAs that just hump a girl’s leg immediately, I take my time and bat the bunny around because I know I have her” bla bla), I’m talking more about IMPACT. Like the number closes might work out there, and that’s cool, it sounds like the phone culture is different from here…but the numbers would pretty much all be flakes in North America lol Because he’s just not making enough impact…it’s still just a nice pleasant interaction but now with some sexuality in it. That would be alright for an instadate in North America, but for a number-close here I don’t think it’s enough especially in 2016.

    Like here’s Krauser infield where he pulls and you can watch him boning at the end lol:

    And it’s awesome that he pulled the chick. Massive props. Especially from daygame. But a lot of the stuff he says has more impact to the girls there because of the ESL situation, with the nervousness/awkwardness of not understanding what he’s saying as he slowly describes something “it’s like have you ever been to the circus right? And you know you get the clowns…like the comedy. The comedy, with the red nose, right? The white face with the red nose, and they have these big stilts (motion describing stilts)?” To an English speaking girl that would be like a 2-second “you look like you work at a circus” ok now what? Like the ESL lets him draw the conversation out muuuuuch longer (which is more opportunity to use laser eye-contact and demonstrate subcomms and build tension and let her get insecure that she isn’t understanding/explaining things properly etc) and this girl is pretty much instantly receptive, zero resistance and filling in the conversation immediately).

    But stuff like “before I came here people said to me, they said Ukranian girls, you really like high heels. Heels. Heels. These! (point) They said they really like it. I thought okay, maybe this is a stereotype you see………and also. Long hair. People told me Ukranian girls: very long hair. And heels.” Like holy shit, I’m crawling at the wall with boredom just typing this out. This is just NOT a conversation you’d have with a chick who speaks solid English. But this girl will giggle along with it as she tries to understand what he’s saying (which is a mini rollercoaster of emotions in itself) and feels minor insecurity not understanding him (and feeling insecure that she isn’t expressing herself properly in English, like not knowing if she’s sounding dumb etc) and compensates by being friendly etc.

    It works, because this stuff has enough emotional impact when you factor in all the ESL stuff and he’s got decent subcomms in set. But over here, these are conversations you’d have with a retarded 4 year old. A girl who speaks English nice and fluid and fast and can verbally joust with him, it’s never going to sound like this lol To relate it to Mystery Method, his default conversation with these girls tends to hit A1-A3 because of all the little dynamics going on, so he can just go right into C1. But a girl who isn’t instantly receptive isn’t going to want C1 and I don’t think he has a lot of A1-A3 skill because he just writes those girls off as “No” girls instead of learning to turn it around (because they aren’t worth his time, why not go find friendly girls etc etc which is valid but if you’re teaching other guys they should be aware that they aren’t getting a full skillset).

    It’s not that he CAN’T have more interesting conversations, who knows, maybe he CAN handle shit-tests and bring more interesting conversation to the table and handle girls who aren’t as receptive, but I don’t think he HAS to out there and I haven’t really seen it in his infield footage. Like how about some infield gaming local London girls even, since he’s from London. Where they grasp the language solid and how that changes the dynamics (less flustered nervousness on their part).

    My reason for stressing “in North America” over and over is just that if a guy in North America is buying his product with the intention of learning how to game HERE, I really think it’s going to underprepare him for a lot of situations and dynamics we have to deal with here…it might be good for literally PURELY daygame (as per its title, so I can’t fault it for that, but even then I think it needs tighter number closes to not get flaked on here), but guys tend to study pickup stuff hoping to apply it to a wide variety of situations and I just don’t see this preparing guys for more than lone wolf one on one daygame which is great if you live in a city where you have access to a huge flow of hot girls wandering around solo and bored where they can go on instadates because they’re not headed anywhere, but that isn’t as common over here…some guy wanting to learn game in I don’t know, Denver, there’s no influx of hot girls travelling to some tourist area of Denver to just mill about all day lol And the bigger tourist cities like New York, Vegas, etc tend to be faster-paced than all these euro clips I see where people just lazily stroll around. I’d rather guys learn a more versatile system where they can apply it to nightlife, daygame, mixed sets, deal with obstacles, etc

    Like if you can do nightgame, daygame is no problem, but the opposite isn’t true…being good at daygame doesn’t really make you good at nightgame where the chaos, obstacles, difficulty, shit-tests, bitch-shields, etc is ramped up.

    I mean here’s another infield clip:

    In this one the girl isn’t immediately receptive like the other girls which I’d imagine gets her classified as a “No” girl by his system, but I don’t think she was a “No” girl at all. She just didn’t blow open like a lot of the super friendly girls he goes for, and when she wasn’t immediately receptive he didn’t really know what to do and you can hear him go into “selling himself” mode. Subconsciously it’s like when the girl is receptive, he can talk about himself and where he’s from and what he does etc and he comes from a place of building a connection with the girl, but when she’s NOT receptive he self-doubts and then tries the same thing but it falls flat because he doesn’t have enough value to her for her to care where he’s from or what he thinks about her or what he does etc and he starts to fall into her frame where he’s saying stuff trying to get her to open up and seek a positive reaction from her (outcome dependence, seeking validation) and she won’t budge because it’s a spiral and I don’t think he knows how to get around it. Notice he goes into way more self-depreciation than he does in his other sets (because he’s doubting himself, because she’s not reacting super positive).

    But it’s not that that girl’s really a “No” girl or bitchy…he’s just not really equipped to break through her shield and MAKE her interested in him. Most of his game is building rapport/comfort-based which really only works on the receptive girls (classic generic guy game is to seek rapport “Hey there, so uhhh do you come here often? Cool do you like it here? Cool where are you from? Cool what do you do?” etc where A1-A3 are skipped over, but without hitting A2 she doesn’t CARE about having comfort/rapport with you). To open this chick up he needs to make some impact, disqualify her, hit her emotionally and shake her out of her frame so that she WANTS rapport/comfort.

    Like scray or myself or Julien would plow through this chick’s frame and get her emotionally reacting but he keeps defaulting to his trying to build rapport game which works great on the friendly girls. The thing is, he DOES get little teeny tiny spikes here and there when he says something semi-offensive, she finally giggles…but then he lets the foot off the gas pedal and goes back to his rapport comfort zone. These are those windows I’m talking about, where he should floor that pedal the second her temp goes up and blast that shit through the roof. If he spent a year pounding nightclubs he would probably be able to plow through this minor resistance (not even resistance, just not playing along immediately cooperative). A lot of these “No” girls would be “Yes” girls.

    I think the biggest thing for Krauser’s personal skillset is that he still comes off like he views himself as a scrappy underdog under the surface bravado, which doesn’t make sense to me because I know guys hate on him not actually looking like Jason Statham and it’s easy to pick on a guy’s looks, but to me based on my field experience and guys I’ve seen tear it up with girls and shit, Krauser looks just fine and I would fully expect him to do well and be getting attraction in set…I don’t see him as having anything to compensate for or have any self-doubt about regardless of the girl’s reactions, compared to guys I’ve sarged with in the past who have actual looks/height/etc disadvantages. But part of not taking those windows and not making more of an emotional impact and falling into the frame of trying to sell yourself or self-depreciating too hard usually comes from a guy not thinking he can get away with it and playing it safe or not feeling like they can turn it around.

    Basically I think he can go more sexual and make way stronger impact (not dancing monkey high-energy crazy stuff, but just solid emotional impact on the girl) than he’s doing now and I think he’s going to discover that over time when he fully internally views himself as “sexy” to his core (which he’s closer to now compared to his old infield) VS right now where it seems like he’s just saying he believes it but still gives off self-doubt scrappy underdog vibes in his subcomms. I’d like to see him do pickup without the peacocking gear (get him out of his comfort zone and away from crutches because I don’t think he actually needs any of that stuff, and to help internalize that he has worth/attractiveness to women by default) and see him run game in North America to pressure-test it on girls that can verbally test and qualify him which would toughen his skillset up.

    I’d say as long as you understand the limitations of what he’s teaching, then it’s a good product. But I can’t tell if he understands it has limitations, or if he just rules everything his system doesn’t prepare guys for as “not worth the hassle”, “”No” girls”, “bitchy/low-value girls”, “venues/situations/locations that are beneath him”, etc Like his system doesn’t teach guys how to deal with AMOGs or jealous orbiters or cockblocks, but I don’t know if he KNOWS that and just doesn’t care because he doesn’t put himself in situations where he HAS to deal with those things and would recommend guys don’t put themselves in that situation either…but the reality is, in North America, you’re probably going to be hitting on girls in situations where you’re going to have to deal with AMOGs and jealous orbiters and cockblocks so I don’t think this product will equip a guy with a wide array of skills and they should be aware of that in advance, and other products teach most of what Krauser is teaching in his product so for North American guys I’d say check it out if you want (the infield breakdowns are worth a watch) but expect to have to supplement your learning/skillset with other products (especially stuff that focuses on A1-A3).

    This mini-review is all jumbled and jumping around (moreso than usual, with a 13yo schoolgirl’s equivalent abuse of the word “like”) because I have some legitimate criticisms of the product but don’t want to come off like I’m talking shit ’cause I don’t have any hate for the guy. All I care about is the game and guys reaching their potential skill level lol

    If anyone wants to they can shoot this mini-review Krauser’s way lol

  47. Ya Really,

    Dark take on LTR’s but I have to agree. The older I get, the less comfortable I get flinging an entire afternoon off into the dumpster at a picnic outing (with someone I already know inside and out), community BBQs or a long dinner with half-acquaintances etc. Time gets tight and a weekend given over to drinks, broccoli and carrot snacks followed by barbecued chicken and a bunch of facebook-come-to-life self-marketing style chatter is just HOURS that I could have spent reading, working on my projects and really learning. If a guy can really find a girl who respects that and doesn’t expect the guy to be her social side-piece, then that’s great.

    Some guys, like surgeons, lawyers might have a job that is;

    –their job (obv.)
    –their passion
    –their legacy/calling

    But if you don’t have that trifecta then the pressure to work on other things or self-improve in your off time really starts to build. Chattering about deck-building at a church BBQ for six hours while mildly buzzed or watching pee-wee soccer all weekend would just kill me at this age. Someone could call me out and say, “Sounds like you were slow to grow up and get your shit in gear,” and I would say, “Yup. You nailed it,” but I’d still rather spend my weekend on my own projects than tooling around in facebook-come-to-life land, killing hours by the truckload.

  48. @redlight
    “Here’s what men I hang out do.”

    I’m sure your bros are super cool. But like I said in my post, this is just how I’m wired and in my experience most guys in relationships in their mid-30s are lifeless zombies or Blue Pill chodes with negative depressing attitudes.

    I’m sure you guys enjoy your super-manly hobbies but I just find most of the stuff you wrote to be boring or just not something I’m interested in. No interest in attending soccer practices or hunting or playing in a band or building things or cutting down trees etc lol And I can hit up weddings, parties, BBQs, etc single. And bring a hot young fuckbuddy.

    “They do what they do, and the pussy goes to them and stays attached to them”

    lol well shit, what is anyone doing wasting their time learning PUA? We should be climbing mountains and hunting deer waiting for the pussy to roll in instead!

    “Besides teaching, what men stuff do you do?”

    Whatever we want, whenever we want lol Most of the guys I choose to hang out with regularly want to go chase poon together. Sarging is a bonding experience…in the time you aren’t engaged with girls and helping eachother break through personal barriers and mental hurdles and celebrating eachother’s success and helping eachother through failure and having crazy adventures like waking up on the other side of the city somewhere with who knows what people what who knows what walk of life, or sending your buddy off into the night with that girl you helped cockblock 7 guys to get him into that cab with her etc, there’s tons of time to talk about life, love, career, health, the future, the past, personal problems, family stuff, self-improvement, goals, dreams, etc etc

    I mean, I have buddies who DO love to do all that other shit like hanging out in a backyard crushing beers BBQing or going on a camping/hunting trip or whatever, but I opt out of joining them because that stuff isn’t fun to me and they know that and don’t care because we bond through chasing girls.

    But the key is that these are all red pill guys that I hang with, and they’re guys I personally select when I run across them and choose to hang out with them. They’re not just, Bob my co-worker who sat beside me for 3 years and he doesn’t really approve of how much I hit the bars and his wife won’t let him go to the rippers with us, or Jim, my girlfriend’s brother that I have to hang out with and be nice to and guilt trips me for not going camping with him and I have to make more of an effort or my girl will give me drama and why won’t you take him out with you to meet your friends he needs a girlfriend bla bla

    Like, infield I’ll socialize with anyone and everyone so in my personal time I’m VERY selective about the people I choose to hang out with. I choose guys who are on the same path as me and who are heavily dosed in red pill and have good postive upbeat value-giving attitudes and we encourage eachother to work on ourselves. I’m making an effort to start getting in shape this year and my buddies will txt me asking if I did my lifting or what my time was for some exercise shit and send me vids/info on diet/exercise, and I’ll ask them how their work stuff is going or shoot them motivational quotes etc because we all want eachother to slay it at life.

    I just can’t relate to the Blue Pill guy who’s girlfriend nags him all day while he sits on the couch chugging beers watching sports and wants to argue about politics while our girls yap away in the kitchen over a bottle of wine. My skin crawls just thinking about that shit lol

    If I was dating a girl and she DID just by sheer magic fluke somehow HAPPEN to have a brother and friends who were all super red pill badasses striving to achieve their full potential in life with positive upbeat mindsets, ya sure, I’d love to befriend them.

    But the VAST majority of girls pick their friends through “they were around for a long period of time so now we’re just friends even though they’re kind of fucked up” and are people that I would never choose to spend large amounts of time with. But in an LTR, you pretty much have to.

    @kaminsky
    “Dark take on LTR’s but I have to agree.”

    I’m not trying to be cynical. I’m just calling it as I see it. My experience with LTRs and seeing my buddies in LTRs is that LTRs tend to pretty much neuter a guy and all the GOOD parts of the LTR are things I get from my fuckbuddies lol

    “The older I get, the less comfortable I get flinging an entire afternoon off into the dumpster at a picnic outing (with someone I already know inside and out), community BBQs or a long dinner with half-acquaintances etc. Time gets tight and a weekend given over to drinks, broccoli and carrot snacks followed by barbecued chicken and a bunch of facebook-come-to-life self-marketing style chatter is just HOURS that I could have spent reading, working on my projects and really learning.”

    This. Like, man, there is SO MUCH ELSE I could be doing with those hours that I’m forced to talk to a girl’s dad about politics and play xbox with her little brother while we wait for her mom to cook us dinner and ask me boring questions about myself and expect me to ask questions to them that I don’t care about at all and then hear all about thier trip to visit their cousins zzzzz lol

    Some guys are down for that stuff, but that shit is torture to me. Life is short and I have a lot of goals I want to accomplish, especially as I make up for the time I spent hyperfocused on pickup (which I don’t regret at all, it’s a lot easier to work an 18 hour day when you can call a smokin hottie over for a fuck-break halfway through to de-stress lol). When people ask me if I watched the latest Game of Thrones or what I thought about Breaking Bad it’s like sorry I have no idea, I’m busy doing other shit, I don’t sit around watching Netflix.

    I’m not even really judging them, even though it probably sounds like I am, it’s just that’s not the life for me and I can’t really relate to that lifestyle and the people I develop close friendships with are the people who are like me and get what I’m saying and don’t get butthurt and cry all needy that I don’t want to go on a fishing trip with them. They know when they’re doing something I’m interested in I’ll 100% in be in for THAT trip with them and we’ll have a blast.

    “If a guy can really find a girl who respects that and doesn’t expect the guy to be her social side-piece, then that’s great.”

    I can’t even count the amount of wasted time I lost in the few LTRs I’ve tried. Just that blur of day to day unproductive nothingness. And just having to babysit and maintain their feels and keep in touch and hang out so they feel like they’re not being neglected and shit. I come from a hyperfocus mindset of “if I’m doing this, I might be just doing this for a week and exclude everything else in my life to get this shit done”. Which other guys with goals and passions understand and respect, because they’re doing the same thing.

    My one buddy had a super depressed clingy needy guy from school who he took out for beers once (to cheer him up ’cause he got dumped so my buddy was just being nice to him taking him out) literally txting him a few months later “I feel like you don’t even care about our friendship man” because my buddy was ignoring his weepy emo txts about bullshit non-problems while he was focusing on studying for some important exams. Like what the fuck? What GUY texts that to another GUY?? lol The funniest part is I WARNED him “don’t take this guy out for drinks trust me man” ’cause I can smell the “value-taking” type guys a mile away but he didn’t listen to me lol

    But girls, man, they want you to be a success but they don’t wanna see the work that goes into achieving that success especially if that work gets in the way of spending time with them…then it’s drama city. “Why can’t you work a week of 18 hour days and then also txt me for 2 hours because I’m sitting at home on my day off and then also come hang out and listen to me yap about trivial problems, aren’t I important to you??” I don’t want to have to explain WHY I’m working late tonight or WHY I’m crashing at the office or WHY I need to go for a beer with my buddy (who can relate to burden of performance discussion and shit) after a stressful week instead of a beer with her (listening to her yap about how Becky at work was SUCH a bitch and life is sooooo hard because their dad paid for their sister’s flight to Cuba but not theirs etc).

    With fuckbuddies I can come and go as I please and do what I need to do to achieve my goals. The whole “a woman will support you and prop you up and help you up when you’re down” thing is Hollywood fluff. The reality is they’ll do that as long as it’s convenient for them, but if you struggle for TOO long and can’t micromanage their feels while you’re putting in the level of work necessary to achieve big goals, it’s drama city that I don’t wanna deal with lol

    “Chattering about deck-building at a church BBQ for six hours while mildly buzzed or watching pee-wee soccer all weekend would just kill me at this age.”

    God yes lol Like, there’s nothing I’d rather do less than that. I would hang with my close buddies for 6 hours, sure, but that would be a fun productive 6 hours to me because we’d be discussing or doing shit that’s relevant to my life. VS 6 hours of pretending I give a shit about whatever this church BBQ guy who wants to be my new best friend because he’s so fucking lonely in his LTR, wants to talk about.

    Now when I’m sarging, THAT’S my “hey, I have time to kill, tell me all about yourself random stranger!” time where I take an interest in whatever random people are around me. But in my general day to day I have shit I want to do lol Even my friends know if they wanna catch up with me, come over for a beer on a Saturday night because I’m probably not going to come on your camping trip or come over on a Tuesday evening to play xbox.

    This posting I do here is, as I’ve said before, beneficial to me in that it helps me sort out my thoughts and solidify my mindsets and makes me better able to teach my friends when I’m out and helps balance out my non-pickup related career stuff. That’s why I do these huge fucking posts, so I can just brain dump a bunch of pickup shit out and then get back to work where I don’t think about pickup at all (aside from girls txting me but I try to just leave my phone turned off when I work because girls wanna YAP all fuckin day lol) until my next break where I load TRM and brain dump some more pickup stuff.

    “Someone could call me out and say, “Sounds like you were slow to grow up and get your shit in gear,” and I would say, “Yup. You nailed it,” but I’d still rather spend my weekend on my own projects than tooling around in facebook-come-to-life land, killing hours by the truckload.”

    This. I hyperfocused on pickup and achieved a shitload of goals in it, and have MORE pickup goals to achieve still. And now I’m playing catch-up on my career and health. Sorry if that means I can’t watch Netflix tonight and if I’m GOING to watch Netflix I’d rather watch it with a brand new hottie who’s vag I haven’t seen before who shows up dolled up to impress me and fucks me halfway through the movie, instead of the girl I’ve fucked a hundred times who’s not wearing makeup and changed into her “comfies” after work and wants to binge-watch the newest Lena Dunham show while she complains about trivial shit lol

    But hey, maybe I just need a unicorn like all the guys that will chime in replying to this saying their girl is special and doesn’t do any of these things and has amazing social circles and is so supportive bla bla and then tell me to quit criticizing their life (I’M NOT TALKING ABOUT YOU IN THIS POST SJF lol) and feel sorry for me and condescend about how one day I’ll understand the fulfilling zen of watching little league soccer.

    But I don’t care, ’cause 1) like I say I’m just talking about me and my experiences and my preferences for my own personal life, and 2) I have work to do now lol

    …okay, maybe I’m a LITTLE cynical. lol

  49. Your interpretation is your interpretation yes, but you can’t insist that this is all part of an FI conspiracy just because you are interpretative a work of art with an anti-feminist bias. If you want to conduct a deeper analysis of it, approach it neutrally.

  50. @YaReally – I read a lot of Krauser’s stuff upto about 2013/14 (until I just got turned off by his general negative vibe – no complaints about his skills) and while I’ve not seen any of his latest products, I’m sure I remember him talking about how he actually finds it a lot easier to game native English speakers for all the reasons you say – he can bring in all his wordplay and verbal skills etc. I think he even has a few native-English-speaker FRs on his blog, but the vast majority are Eastern European (either in EE itself or in London).

  51. @Emily – But wait, “standpoint” theory, a common foundation of “analysis” taught in every gender studies curriculum, tells us that Kaminsky’s POV is ineluctably colored by his lived experiences and the social conditioning he’s subjected to. His POV is ad true and valid as any other as there is no actual “neutral” position possible. And that, in fact, there are many truths available with none being any more valid than another.

    Or are you claiming that this foundation of feminist theory is incorrect?

  52. Well, it is incorrect, but that’s besides the point.

    The point is, Kaminsky (and many others here, I guess) see that picture and interpret it as a perfectly lovely family. Okay, I’m fine with that.

    However, he then follows up by insisting that the author (and others) view that picture as an ‘unhappy marriage’ because of feminist indoctrination.

    That’s wrong. Thing is, other people don’t see the same thing you guys do. We don’t look at that and think ‘hey, this guy worked hard all day and is now relaxing at home with his wife whos looking after the children, what an unhappy marriage!’ if that’s what we thought ad verbum, THAT would be feminist indoctrination.

    But what people actually see is a husband who seems like he’s in his own world, giving zero fucks about his wife who is clearly struggling with the kids at that particular moment. I don’t think that’s a result of FI, it’s a perfectly reasonable way to interpret that scene.

  53. I wasn’t talking about the artist who made that photo. I was talking about you. Your take on it was pure FI. I wanted to share the MI of the same photo. I said nothing about the “FI conspiracy.” There’s no conspiracy. The FI dominates everything. You are oozing FI with every single one of your posts and you don’t even know it. Like how a fish doesn’t know it’s wet.

    And how unfair of you to say that my take has an “anti-feminist bias.” My take is my take. There was no ‘anti-feminism’ just because my take was different than yours. My take was from an MI lens. That’s what I shared.

  54. @Emily – Also, I love this attitude many women, including FLOTUS Michelle who castigated men to do more with their children and around the house on Father’s Day, seem to be re-embracing today. The idea that men don’t do childcare and aren’t involved in parenting. Men have always been deeply involved in parenting, and the guys I know in marriages where both parents work run their tails off for their kids. Some drop them off at school, others are coaching their kid’s teams etc., many cook, clean and do primary childcare a lot of the time.

    99.99% of what? The studies that were done years ago showing men not pulling “their fair share” of housework didn’t consider all the things men did. Getting insurance, repairing the car, dealing with the bank, unplugging the toilet or figuring out why a lamp doesn’t work. Esther Villar notes this in her famous face off with that horrible German feminist decades back.

    The other thing about housework that never gets mentioned is the difference between many men’s and women’s standards. I know women who vacuum several times a week and cannot stand to have a dish sit in the sink or for the bed to go unmade. I am neither sloppy nor a neat freak, but I get by as a single man in an 1100 sq ft, 1 bdrm home with about 2-3 hours of housework a week. If a woman was around who wanted things neater, by all means have at it. But don’t dare tell me I’m not pulling my weight because I didn’t make the bed. I don’t give a shit if the bed is made – that’s just me. Also, I might be content with a simple dinner whereas a woman turns it into a production. Me? Grill some protein, saute some veggies and I’m done. And if the saute pan sits in the sink until I cook again the next evening? No biggie.

    This is really just an FI informed top level complaint women assert as a truth in their ongoing campaign to promote their victimization. It really serves to assert females as oppressed, a crucial ground level belief for the SJW-Prog-Marxist victim hierarchy. The reason the victimology of women is being presented louder than ever, despite the obvious liberation of women and the vast privileges they enjoy, is that if they aren’t oppressed and aren’t victims, the entire epistemology/pedagogy of feminism and much of Social Justice theory falls apart. If “justice equals fairness” and women aren’t being treated unfairly but merely making different choices, then the entire enterprise of feminism goes out the window.

    As for a neutral analysis of the picture as “social commentary”, let’s do it.

    – Why are there 4 babies of roughly the same age in the pic? In reality, in a 4 child family, there would never be 4 infants scrabbling around. They would be spaced out, with 1 infant likely. This serves to increase the portrayal of how careless and unengaged the man is, as he’s not paying attention to 4 helpless babies but in reality no man has a family that looks like that.

    – Why is the man portrayed as watching sports? Why is this selected? Of course, it’s another trope. Men sit around watching sports and do nothing most of the time. Why instead isn’t it a picture of a housewife watching Oprah or some other daytime show while her kids crawl around the floor, ignored? Is this not just as common?

    This is agitprop, not just “neutral” social commentary. It’s not just a portrayal of an individual woman’s unhappiness but rather a social commentary on the unjust state of the nature of gender relations, men and the family. The larger context is that this portrayal of the family is a crucial aspect of Marxist, Progressive and Feminist politico-social ideals, and must be seen emerging from, and supportive of, those ideologies. Also, it’s not art in the classic sense. It’s shit, art must reach an aesthetic threshold which results from real mastery/skill/talent/craftsmanship and this piece of crap is lazy in its aesthetics. Cropped together garbage that only has value on a socio-political basis, not aesthetically.

    Compare it to say the graffiti art of Banksy, which is surely socio-political, and in a way that I find absurd and even offensive, but it’s also aesthetically valid as art on its own, stripped of the political-social context. I have a book of Banky’s work on my coffee table – even as I find his politics loathsome. True art can be appreciated aesthetically primarily, with the socio-political context secondary and in the background.

    Vox just did a vid interview with Stefan Molyneux in which they talked extensively about how the domination of SJW ideals and the primacy of them in the culture is destroying mainstream novels and other writing. By making the ideology/politics primary and aesthetics suffer, we get brutish, ugly, unsubtle art which only appeals to those who have “personalized the political” in a very peculiar way. David Sedaris is a great example of this, his work being so tedious and repetitive and more like a psychological therapeutic catharsis than anything someone without SJW-Prog-Marxist sensibilities would enjoy. I was told he was so great so I made myself read two of his utterly unforgettable books and was like, really? This is it? Compare him to say Philip Roth (Vox hates him), and while I don’t care for such darkness and pathos being presented nonstop, his writing is undeniably beautiful to read. Or Nabakov. I hated Lolita as a story as it’s so overdone and drawn out and an example of bathos, but in the end, Nabakov’s use of language is so brilliant that you end up tolerating the shitty story. Jerzy Kosinski was much the same – if you haven’t read The Painted Bird, well, you must. It’s so dark but so brilliant as a piece of art, and even though it’s dripping with social commentary, the story is amazing and even if you don’t agree with him, he’s a pleasure to read.

    So, for me, the larger “context” here, sweetie, is that this supposed piece of art is a milestone on road of our devolution and debasement as a society. A reminder of how absurdly low our culture and society has become. It’s an ugly piece of trash that can only be shoved in our faces as art in a highly politicized and fractured society.

    Have a nice day.

  55. @YaReally

    Thanks for the reply. What comes over in my interpretation of your response is not what lifestyle is best, it is that a man has to have a core mission. Yours is written loud and clear with no doubt as to your convictions. Keep with your convictions and keep following them. If they change, then follow that path.

    That is what important.

    With all the discussions previously about neuroplasticity and the knowledge of evo-psychology, a man can pretty much mold any kind of lifestyle he wants as long as he pursues an adventuous, passionate and dynamic path.

    I had a scary experience yesterday (scary for single men, not necessary for me, just insight/re-inforcement of all Rollo has ever written ). I caught up on the flow of guys being eliminated on the Bachelorette. I had caught a few glimpses in the past because of the fact that my wife and daughter are obsessed with it and wanted to see if they could actually get any guidance from it on how women should relate to men in a 2016 Disney Princess world and all.

    (My daughter is 24 and has been dating a guy that my wife and I think highly of. And and that is like riding a rollercoaster. But not one that has extreme highs or extreme lows and she has a stable framework from UMC (upper middle class) to work with.)

    On the show so far, about 17 men have been eliminated out of say 26. The Bachelorette herself seems to have nothing to offer any of the guys except her beauty (which is marginal at best) and her emotions. Plus show provided venues to frolick in. I see no with, intelligence, added value for the men, no self insight, no real ability to read the men and a history of poor choices.

    There was a super polar matchup in Alpha vs. Beta male–Chad (masculine roided out and unable to control his narcissism and rage vs. Evan, a girly man with female emotive quaking in his boots and beta a fuck).

    One guy that got booted said as he left “Dammit, if this thing were decided on looks alone, then I would still be in it.

    And the tabloid backstories of all the principle characters are scarily pathetic. No virtue in the female, lack of managing circumstances and the outcome of their lives on the part of the males.

    It really is a dynamic expose of the tragicomedy of contemporary sexual relations.

    I would not recommend the time investment in watching the shit, but the 2016 dynamics of what Rollo has been talking about (Disney Princess) and what YaReally has been talking about ( self-validated young women) are all there on display.

    Back to the lifestyle thing. I thought that that Julian’s second video was remarkably good for talking about balance in life.

    I think it is OK for polar extremes, but they come with a price. Chad and Evan paid the price in having their goal shot down because of their extremes.

    Lifestyle will exist on a bell curve and it’s not always so bad in the middle.

    What redlight describes June 23rd @11:26 is not so bad. That is also my experience.

    The moderate life can still be adventurous as hell. I’m not advocating it, just pointing out some perspective. (You won’t find me, Rollo or Blax being nihilistic, we have a lot of adventure, it is just different, but no less extreme or gratifying. And we are not really self-supressing ourselves in our self-disciplined ways. Secondly we have opened ourselves up to be vulnerable at times and it was a benefit to ourselves not a tragedy)

    Free Northerner was speaking about something else but referred to moderation. I’ve referred to his Die When You are Done essay before:

    http://freenortherner.com/2012/09/06/die-when-youre-done/

    Now, the arguments of both Roosh and Danger &Play both centered around health. Do you suffer now by denying yourself foods you enjoy, undergoing painful workouts, and starving yourself? Or do you live in the moment, and die when you die.

    For this we will go to my favourite book of the Bible for wisdom:

    In this meaningless life of mine I have seen both of these:

    the righteous perishing in their righteousness, and the wicked living long in their wickedness.

    Do not be overrighteous, neither be overwise—why destroy yourself?

    Do not be overwicked, and do not be a fool—why die before your time?

    It is good to grasp the one and not let go of the other.

    Whoever fears God The man who is on point with his convictions will avoid all extremes.
    (Ecclesiastes 7:15-18)

    Regardless of whether you are a Christian or not, the advice here applies to everything, avoid all extremes.

    “Moderation in all things, including moderation.” – Petronius

    Be moderate: take care of your health, but only insofar as you need to. Worshiping your health is no better than living a life of gluttony and sloth.

    The point is not to deny yourself, not to suffer. Suffering is extreme and unnecessary. The point is not gluttony, that’s just leads to future suffering.

    Both of those are unnecessary, counter-productive extremes.

    And there is a big difference in what F. Roger Devlin calls the PUA lifestyle “riding the tiger” and the back to civilization lifestyle that Redlight alludes to. Neighther is “right”. It depends on the man. The trick is to know your mission and master it. And think about balance and vulnerability like Julian spoke of in his second video.

    This was a good podcast I listened to on my cell phone the other day while driving:

    F. Roger Devlin joins Richard to discuss his new book, Sexual Utopia in Power, and the tragicomedy of contemporary sexual relations.

    http://www.radixjournal.com/podcast/2015/9/23/the-rakes-progress

  56. Ya Really,

    Yeah, it’s not ‘dark’ at all, actually, just very real. Amazing follow up post. It’s cool knowing that I’m not the only one and thanks for sharing those thoughts. It makes me feel less guilty about how bored I get with those situations, lol. I don’t know if it’s so much boredom though or just a sense of “Here I go again, wasting another 8 hour block of my life.” Give me 30 hour days and I would be more open to that stuff but time is tight. I have a mellow teaching job overseas though. So I’m not exactly a hyper-stressed ER doctor who really just needs to chill on someone’s deck on Sunday afternoons. I totally get that kind of lifestyle too.

  57. The prince charming and princess pic – what I read from it is prince charming (watching the sport of king’s – polo, on the telly) now has his own little kingdom but is not overjoyed with the results nevertheless, and princess now has fulfilled her baby-fest dreams but is not overjoyed with the results nevertheless. Makes you want to ask yourself – why?

    So perhaps the “art” is that there is an implied challenge to the beholder, to speculate upon that.

    My speculation might be – well their dreams didn’t turn out too sweet for anybody perhaps (except for the babies! – they be here now – there is something to be said for that!), because maybe their interests are not sufficiently aligned, maybe because they didn’t sufficiently understand each other to truly respect each other – why would that be? Social conditioning? Does the social conditioning aid in eroding self-respect?

    Somebody else is probably going to speculate something entirely differently as to the why the “art” implied ambivalence. Scrib for instance seeing it a agitprop, pandering to (or perhaps even subliminally coercing – al la Bernays) certain politico-social ideals. And Scrib maybe entirely more accurate than I am, interpretation-wise, …… but that is the interesting thing about this “artpiece”. There is even an ambivalence implied, by way of presentation (of form), about the implied ambivalence of the content.

    Anyways – this “artpiece” reminds me of what Ingmar Bergman’s lense (or even Stanley Kubrick’s), implies (however I agree with Scrib that the aesthetic of these guys is on an entirely different level).

  58. @SJF
    “(My daughter is 24 and has been dating a guy that my wife and I think highly of. And and that is like riding a rollercoaster. But not one that has extreme highs or extreme lows and she has a stable framework from UMC (upper middle class) to work with.)

    On the show so far, about 17 men have been eliminated out of say 26. The Bachelorette herself seems to have nothing to offer any of the guys except her beauty (which is marginal at best) and her emotions. Plus show provided venues to frolick in. I see no with, intelligence, added value for the men, no self insight, no real ability to read the men and a history of poor choices.”

    lol it’s funny because we’re all sitting here talking about FI conditioning, but like, stop and visualize the scene: you’re with your wife and 24yo daughter who has a guy and it seems like hey, ya, it’d be good if they work out…and yet you’re all sitting around the boob tube where she’s consuming a show that’s LITERALLY implanting in her brain the celebrity status and social attention and value and rewards and fame that come with being a girl around her age (not sure how old the Bachelorette is) DISCARDING 17 high-value men (I assume they’re all good-looking, rich, etc) for completely trivial/shallow/retarded reasons, while she flits around with no self insight, no real value, a history of poor choices etc and in the end, despite all her poor choices and TOSSING AWAY 17 HIGH-VALUE DUDES, she’s STILL going to end up with some rich good-looking neurosurgeon Prince Charming, the Hypergamous best option of the group.

    And then down the road if your daughter ditches her guy to go Eat Pray Love, fully expecting to have no problems getting another quality guy, it’ll come as a huge surprise like “but why wouldn’t she stick with him??” Women are being fed this kind of shitty programming from childhood these days and yet people are SHOCKED that they’ll bail on decent dudes to go ride the cock carousel. Why WOULDN’T they when they’re being fed all this shitty programming that normalizes and rewards that behavior and tells them “don’t worry, you can throw away 17 high-quality options and you’ll still have another 5 high-quality options left and they’re all better than those first 17 anyway!”

    Like you’re looking “to see if they could actually get any guidance from it on how women should relate to men in a 2016 Disney Princess world and all”…well THERE’S the guidance they’re subconsciously taking away from it lol

    Meanwhile a dude watches the show and takes the message “even if you’re a super good-looking tall jacked rich lawyer/doctor/whatever, you still have to compete for this woman who has nothing going for her, and you’re probably going to get rejected like the other 17 guys who society will now make fun of and call losers…and you aren’t even HALF as accomplished as THOSE guys are.” and then we wonder why that guy doesn’t feel like he deserves to approach some silly HB9 in a bar and feel entitled to her and tell him looks/money matter and keep him in the rat race instead of teaching him to look at why she’s picking one jacked dude over another (hint: subcomms/game) and teaching him how to exploit THAT and ditch his shitty internals and insecurities.

    @kaminsky
    “It makes me feel less guilty about how bored I get with those situations, lol.”

    I felt that way for years, like what’s wrong with me everyone else seems to be into this shit and I made an effort to try to enjoy it, but it’s just not me. It goes against all sorts of gut instincts I have. And at some point while doing pickup which is already going against social norms, you learn that most of the people who are critiquing your life aren’t even happy themselves and aren’t successful by your own personal value system anyway, so you go “fuck it, okay then I guess I’ll just be the outsider and do my thing.” and just accept and embrace yourself. I fully embrace who I am and don’t apologize for it. No one’s gonna be standing around my death bed high-fiving me for wasting a weekend watching Netflix or talking to some dude I’m obligated to hang out with because my girlfriend is friends with his girlfriend. It’s just going to be me looking back at memories of my life.

    I can VIVIDLY remember my first two approaches, that were successful number closes, and turned into lays on the Day2s. I can remember everything about them from what I said, to what the girls looked like, to every key moment of the interaction and escalation, and little memories of our interaction that made me laugh or feel good because they were the first time I had done those things with girls in my life. I can remember SO many little adventures and key moments where my mind was blown infield or I overcame some success barrier or limiting belief or hurdle or went on some wild adventure or met some girl or had some interaction that clicked more puzzle pieces together in my head or took over nightclubs on solo nights out and remembering that feeling of feeling like a god on those killer nights etc

    But my first ex of 2 years? I can barely remember her face anymore (which surprised me) and most of that 2 years is just a hazy blur of hours and hours of watching movies and eating out and just doing mundane things. She was a sweet girl, but the whole LTR thing was just a dialtone in terms of excitement for me.

    I remember waiting for her to get ready, we were going to go out to some special event thing, and it was objectively a pretty big deal. But I was sitting there thinking “I’m HAPPY…but I’m not ECSTATIC, like when I’m getting ready for a night out sarging” Like my happiest moments in LTRs have paled in comparison to my happiest moments sarging.

    Same with another ex, just a blur of time spent together. Even though we did some little adventure things like vacations/trips and roadtrips and shit, none of it ever really compared to the high of a good night out sarging.

    Kind of like how an adrenaline junkie who skydives on the weekend would find it stifling to have to work a desk job and give up skydiving. A lot of people would find that desk job fun and exciting, but that skydiving guy would be clawing at the walls looking out the window at that big beautiful sky wishing he was up in a plane again.

    And again this isn’t a judgement, you don’t have to explain to me how watching soccer practice gives you a skydiving high, I’m not saying sarging is the end all be all for everyone. But for me, I love it and have never found a hobby that comes close to the emotional rollercoaster sarging puts me on. The highest highs and the lowest lows and I love it for that. Makes me feel alive the way skydiving or hitting the gym or cheering a kid on at soccer practice does for other guys. That’s just me.

    “So I’m not exactly a hyper-stressed ER doctor who really just needs to chill on someone’s deck on Sunday afternoons. I totally get that kind of lifestyle too.”

    I’m not even a Type A go-getter personality. I’m a HUGE slacker. But that’s WHY I have to push myself to stay focused. I can’t have a girl telling me to come “lay down” with her. “Just come lay down for a bit with me, I miss you :(” Because I’ll DO it, and then I won’t get back UP lol Whereas my close buddies push me to stay on track and help hold me accountable, they don’t interrupt my work day and expect me to have a 2 hour text conversation about insignificant shit just because they’re bored and then get butthurt that I can’t come for dinner with them later.

    When my financial situation is fully handled and my career is where I want it to be, I’ll slack off a bunch and spend days lazing in a sunbeam giving zero fucks. But right now I have goals to achieve and anything that distracts from them is cut. If a girl can understand that, cool, and my fuckbuddies do because we aren’t “serious” so they know they aren’t my top priority. But actual girlfriends give me hassle and can’t relate to the burden of performance thing because they can coast along at their cushy office job where no one will fire them for using Facebook all day and if they get fired some orbiter chode will come along to save them…plenty of guys who look just like me around the homeless shelters, but you’ll never see an HB8 there lol

    Like I say, all of the parts of LTRs that I ACTUALLY enjoy, are things I can get from fuckbuddies. But that’s just me, and not a judgement call on anyone else. I know guys who are perfectly happy just sitting around a fire with a 6-pack and some friends/family and that’s totally cool with me as long as that’s what they enjoy doing.

  59. “Does the social conditioning aid in eroding self-respect?”

    That’s all part of the plan. At least Emily knows to have babies early and often. But she should make sure she chooses wisely and treats kindly.

    As F. Roger Devlin explains in that podcast, women gaining multiple undergraduate degrees and masculine accomplishments to display to the world and a prospective mate, ends up in women turning into cat ladies after their window of fertility degrades. (Men would just more likely desire an 18 year old waitress to have babies with, if they wanted babies). The tragedy of high quality women degrading their value.

    Feminism and SJW’s benefit when more women are lonely frustrated and middle aged. These women all become feminists.

    Feminism survives on failure of women. The more women mess up their lives then the better it is for the cause of Feminism. “You go girl” and mess up your lives, the better it is for the cause.

    The Patriachy was a social construct to advance “society” The Patriarchy had men locking down women earlier and advancing stability and productivity of men. F. Roger Devlin advocates for re-establishment of European based communities (like Redlight, SJF, et. al already had in place decades ago and it does work if a guy is on his Game). Late age nihilists take advantage of the new-found chaos in the degradation that is the last 50 years and ingratiate themselves with bar sluts. (I’m not talking about you, YaReally…Lol….I’m not advocating for something or some way, just point out the way things are.)

    The best way to make a woman unhappy is to give her anything she asks for and reign in her hypergamy. A woman is best satisfied by an alpha man that is just outside of her grasp (ref: romance porn)(And note this can be achieved in a community setting in 2016, you just have to know what you are doing). If she can’t have that situation, she will dominate a beta male and have children, then shut down desire sex.

  60. Correction: The best way to make a woman unhappy is to give her anything she asks for and not reign in her hypergamy.

  61. @YaReally

    “Like you’re looking “to see if they could actually get any guidance from it on how women should relate to men in a 2016 Disney Princess world and all”…well THERE’S the guidance they’re subconsciously taking away from it lol”

    Agree 100% with everything you said. I got that same message in the show. That is why I typed that out about the Bachelorette: Precisely because is backs up what Rollo and you are saying.

    The women actually just get it too. The Bachelorette understands intuitively why she rejected Chad the alpha and Evan the beta. Too much risk in the former and too much beta in the latter. My wife and daughter understand it too, innately. By watching the tragicomedy. In the end, the Bachelorette is going to choose with Hypergamy, but her choice is going to be a compromise. It always is. Red pill straight up.

    I just get it. The guidance is there clear as day for me, because of my manosphere help over the last three years. (That’s what the manosphere was invented for, and I’m taking advantage of it.)

    I understand it and I know how the playing field is for my daughter. Nothing will surprise me. My daughter has better chances than most (Relative Risk of Eat, Pray Love rather than Absolute Risk) to achieve her goals and happiness. Because of my wife and I our eyes open, goal directed balanced life–an old school European, community based approach that is working well.

    I also just get it for my son. He has better chances than most men for Real Power and control over his circumstances. The guys in the show don’t win because of their fuckups. Game is about not fucking up, not maximizing every chance. Low downside, high upside. The guys on the show are real fuck-ups. The guy that wins is the one that fucks up the least. Mostly all about Attrition.

    I also get it for me and my wife. We’re strivers and we get things done well. We even have sex once in a while.

    I worked through some great dream scenarios last night in my REM sleep. Really vivid dreams. They were wickedly bizarre. LOL good ones.

    But I can process that stuff, be happy, be on point with my mission and move on well. (I’m in a good place, not struggling and having fun.)

    Carry on YaReally, I’m listening and am shaped by your great contributions (well 98% of them….).

  62. There are commercials going on now about a movie coming out called “Bad Moms”. It will have the cliched home life driving a woman crazy scenes. But essentially it seems it will be empowering for a woman to basically be incompetent while a man in that role would be just incompetent.

  63. SJF – I read that F. Roger Devlin essay “Sexual Utopia In Power”. yesterday evening, and yeah – his take is one way to frame things (as you have partially outlined in your comment here), but still ….. something just doesn’t sit quite right with me wrt his analysis.

    He seems to de-emphasize this “mutual respect based on respect for the other’s self-agency” thing (without actually denigrating it in the essay – but I haven’t read any of his other stuff yet, so I don’t know why he as chosen to de-emphasize that).

    I’m still thinking about all this stuff ….. like a thought that comes to mind – well…… what would happen if men and women started to emphasize this “mutual respect based on respect for the other’s self-agency” thing? Wouldn’t that tend to mitigate for the erosion of self-respect that is currently occurring by way of the social conditioning?

  64. Bachelorette is one of the worst shows on, however, I too watched some of it analytically and I think it should be noted that she kept Chad around for a long time and didn’t get rid of him until the other men started telling on him.
    Virtuous motivations perhaps. But my opinion is probably colored by if it were me, if she chooses Chad, then she gets what you wishes for. But I think they just couldn’t stand that she liked him. Nice guy syndrome.

  65. @YaReally

    Not disagreeing, just trying to amplify the dynamic:

    “Kind of like how an adrenaline junkie who skydives on the weekend would find it stifling to have to work a desk job and give up skydiving.”

    Not kind of like, exactly like. That is why all that previous talk about how the brain handles Dopamine in the limbic system. Hence the need for balance to avoid addiction in the long run.

    Whenever I get bored or addicted to one thing, I dial up my nine other dopamine inputs. Music, good parenting, fucking my wife, hobbies, good guy friend relationships, chainsaw work, plowing and planting farm fields, weight-lifing. Balance in dopamine. Not seeking the ultimate high over and over because that ultimate high ultimately fails to give you the high. That is just how the brain works. It is normal.

    “She was a sweet girl, but the whole LTR thing was just a dialtone in terms of excitement for me.”

    It’s not about it being an LTR per se, it is what you are doing with that LTR.

    If it is not aligning with your goals, it is not getting you anywhere. It is wasting time.

    You pursue your mission. But tell guys to have a mission. And pursue it.

    “But right now I have goals to achieve and anything that distracts from them is cut.”

    Exactly. Focusing on your mission and mastering it. That is the thing to do.

    With the caveat that a man’s way is never hoping for a completion in life.

    “I know guys who are perfectly happy just sitting around a fire with a 6-pack and some friends/family and that’s totally cool with me as long as that’s what they enjoy doing.”

    It is not the chilling with the six pack or the BBQ outing that is the goal.

    I know guys that aren’t just chilling at the fire, they are actually accomplishing something tribal, with a goal in mind. They are doing this:

    Rollo: “That tribe must exist for a passionate reason other than the express idea that it exists to be about men meeting up. Every sub-tribe I belong to, every collective interest I share with other men, even the instantly forming ones that arise from an immediate common need or function, all exist apart from “being” about men coming together.Worldwide “tribe” day failed much for the same reasons an organization like the Good Men Project fails – they are publicized as a gathering of men just “being” men.

  66. @emily

    “Serious question, do you do these things because you ‘get pussy’ or because you actually enjoy them? I see so many guys on TRP trying to be what they aren’t just to get women chasing them.”

    They do it because they enjoy it. My friends who have Harleys didn’t buy them to get pussy. My friends who have boats don’t expect pussy to jump into the boat. Then this type of thing occurs, which nobody can figure out:

    McLachlan met her hockey-player boyfriend at a charity event held at her home.

    “I saw those big blue eyes, and I’m like, ‘Oh my goodness, you’re yummy,’” she gushes. “He was so kind and so sweet. We had a great conversation, then he started talking about fishing and I asked him to take me fishing and that was that, apparently.”

    So for some reason the pussy wants to jump on the boat and go fishing. There is no way he thought that fishing was a way to get pussy. I strongly suspect that she no longer goes fishing with him, that it was a bait n’ switch, do something the guy likes until you got him in the net.

    http://www.vancouversun.com/touch/story.html?id=10322915

    Now there may be guys who go “I’ll buy a Harley, and take it to the yacht club and sit on the deck drinking cosmos until pussy jumps aboard”, but for some reason that nobody can figure out, women are able to determine they are betas even though they own a Harley, so a few years later he has to sell the Harley and boat as part of the divorce rape.

  67. Rollo had a post about marriage or could have been what it means to stay in a marriage, but it started off as it’s mostly about the times that you spend with each other doing things like sitting across from each other eating oatmeal for breakfast. It’s just mostly regular stuff. The Snow White picture is about the fairy tell that’s sold.
    Yeah, every thing is exciting in the beginning. But you’ll mostly have days you’re eating oatmeal together. You still in love on those days? That’s all the Snow White photo is about.
    But who’s the girl in the bar? Is that Cinderella

  68. @Water Cannon Boy

    Chad was the the ultimate alpha male Chad. Don’t deny women their ultimate alpha male fantasies. Don’t deny your wife being desirous of the of the 6’3″ chiseled guy at the country club party at the bar at 11:00. Just have .001% better game.

    She wanted Chad bad. But Chad fucked up because he was incongruent and The Bachelortte had to be told overtly that he was lying to her in being sweet to her and being an asshole to every other male behind her back. Violent and punching doors and AMOGing every single other male behind her back. He was a dick and she found out via great effort to relay this info by the other guys.

    He transgressed Law #18 (Isolation is Dangerous) and the guys all emloyed Law #33 (Discover Each Man’s Thumbscrew) in a big way. He had no chance that way.

    She was pissed that she had to send him home, but her evolutionary detector told her she couldn’t have him. For safety.

  69. Correction: The best way to make a woman unhappy is to give her anything she asks for and not reign rein in her hypergamy.

    FIFY.

    “Rein” vs. “Reign” and “Lose” vs. “Loose” are common errors.

  70. “Serious question, do you do these things because you ‘get pussy’ or because you actually enjoy them? I see so many guys on TRP trying to be what they aren’t just to get women chasing them.”

    Because no one in the ‘sphere has ever addressed this issue,…
    https://therationalmale.com/2013/07/18/crisis-of-motive/

    No, this is what your orbiters on TBP tell you they think they see and you believe because it feeds your ego. Even a cursory skimming through any of my posts or any of YaReally’s comments will put the lie to your Blue Pill friends’ assertions.

    This imagery (arranged and shot by a woman) scare you because you see yourself in them.

  71. This imagery (arranged and shot by a woman) scare you because you see yourself in them.

    Examine each image. Not one of them contains fried ice…oh, noes!

  72. “I’m still thinking about all this stuff ….. like a thought that comes to mind – well…… what would happen if men and women started to emphasize this “mutual respect based on respect for the other’s self-agency” thing?

    Wouldn’t that tend to mitigate for the erosion of self-respect that is currently occurring by way of the social conditioning?”

    No.

    Because Hope is not a Strategy.

    It is not the “Way of Men” or “The Rational Male”.

    Have your even even read those books, bro?

  73. @Rollo

    “The pretext of being a ‘wife’ is a socially excusable expectation of progressively losing sexual affinity for the man she’s agrees to marry, so what woman wants to be a wife? Women become wives due to the necessities an ever-decreasing capacity to maintain being a lover requires of them.”

    Once her womb rats are extruded, many wives will begin to de-sex themselves. They will at first gain a little weight and then cut hair distorting it to resemble a war helmet or a mushroom cap. Scientists have found a strong correlation between the appearance of helmet-hair and the strange disappearance of blowjobs.

    This is a helmet-hair style donned by a very aggressive and domineering wife subspecies.

  74. “I’m still thinking about all this stuff ….. like a thought that comes to mind – well…… what would happen if men and women started to emphasize this “mutual respect based on respect for the other’s self-agency” thing?

    What if fried ice could really be on a menu?

  75. The Person Formerly Known As Wild Person:
    SJF – I read that F. Roger Devlin essay “Sexual Utopia In Power”. yesterday evening, and yeah – his take is one way to frame things (as you have partially outlined in your comment here), but still ….. something just doesn’t sit quite right with me wrt his analysis.

    You never post anything even remotely like a Field Report. That means you never test your model of male / female relations in the real world.

    You are still living almost entirely inside your own head. How’s that working out?

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