Good Girls, Bad Girls

goodbad

Culum Struan requoted a really great thought from an old commenter, AnonymousBosch, on Heartiste’s blog from about a year ago and I thought it might make for some good weekend discussions:


All I’m getting at is that every woman has an almost psychopathic longing to destroy any perception of being ‘the good girl’. It’s the most common complaint you’ll hear from women:

“It’s so hard being good.”

Women long to indulge their emotions enough to risk being swept away by them, and it’s this self-indulgence that makes them at risk of being self-destructive: they reach a point where they just want to tear everything down, including the Good Girl, and, most commonly, their beauty. An example is hacking off their hair when they have a breakup.

It’s in their songs, it’s in their literature, it’s in their movies. The social pressure to ‘behave’ drives them to distraction, even as they conform to it, meaning they’re internalizing this constant battle to be both good and bad: wanting the social approval, rewards and status for being good but desperately-craving social stigmatization to the degree of martyrdom for being bad.

Feminism, at it’s core, is basically: “Fuck you society, I won’t be the good girl you want me to be!”

This is why it’s beloved of ugly chicks who can’t sexually compete, and those with obvious Daddy Issues.

I see my role, as a man, is to recognize their capacity for depravity, both sexual and emotional, and to offer the dominance and guidance to reign them in. Women, even as they get outraged at the very notion, simply want a man they respect to tell them ‘No’, and offer them structure and guidance. One good way I’ve heard this described on here was “She is the ocean, and you are the rock, and the furies of her storms have no impact on you. You are unyielding.”

If you’re stoic, she gets to indulge her emotions with a safety net that stops her from self-destructing, and she will adore you for it. This is the masculine – feminine relationship. She gets to be weak, knowing you’re her rock. She doesn’t want to lash out at stone that crumbles, whilst simultaneously wanting strong shelter to hide against.

Sexual degradation is part of the risk, and you temper this by always being in control of the situation. Never let her think she’s leading: or her desperation to prove her devotion to you will take her into weird, disgusting places that destroy her.

If you’ve got your player on, I guarantee you will hear some variation of this: “I’d never do this with any other guy, but you make me want to do this and I’m not sure why.”

This is their sexuality out of control by their furious emotional desire to be owned by you – they are swept away – and this is where you need to reign them in with a strong hand and be ‘Daddy’. Otherwise she’ll get stupid notions in her head that by being sexually-outlandish, she’ll be the whore women believe all guys want their wives to be, not realizing that we don’t want to think of the mother of our children blowing dogs and wearing our shit, (unless that’s really your thing).

This is what destroys women and makes the light go out in their eyes: when they degrade themselves for a man they value highly-enough in the hopes of locking him down enough only to eventually disgust him.

Sometimes, the degradation is a sex thing, where she blurts out that she’d blow a horse for you.

Sometimes, it’s physical: she wants you to see her with running mascara and her hair hacked off so you can see how ‘wounded’ and ‘vulnerable’ you’ve made her.

Sometimes it’s emotional: stories of ‘being raped’ or being abused by Exes, designed to fire you up with masculine protective instinct, but instead make you see her as damaged goods. She thinks she is showing you how much she longs for you with these socially-transgressive displays – because Social Status is female currency and power – so deliberately lowering herself in a man’s eyes is the ultimate submission for her – but all she is doing is pushing you away.

During sex: always lead, always control, always structure what is happening. She wants to serve a strong man: show her how to so she doesn’t go off on self-destructive tangents. As McQueen used to say, don’t call her ‘a’ whore, call her ‘your’ whore. Your eyes are your strength here: if she’s sucking your dick, tell her to look at you, so she has nowhere to hide. Call her your ‘good girl’ as she does it.

Basically, structure a performance of faux-degradation and sexual submissiveness she can enact it that makes her feel she’s served a strong man, that stops her crossing into actual degradation, where it starts emotionally-messing her up and leaving scars.

That being said, Millennial Girls seem to possess a capacity for self-loathing and self-destruction I’ve never seen in previous generations.

So, take what is happening in this thread: the transfer of money for sexual degradation. It’s the same core process: she’s telling herself it’s about the money, but it’s about submission before the masculine: the trappings of supreme social and financial power. It’s about thinking she’s high value enough to be submitting to Princes and Kings, so the leap to being crapped on or blowing a dog to prove she is ‘a worthy consort’ is a small one for them.

Obviously, it makes no sense to us, but women seem to be clueless as to what behaviour actually makes them attractive, and not repulsive, to men.”


I think one of the reasons AnonymousBosch finds Millennial girls to be more debased is that these girls are the first generation to be counted among the sum result of a preceding 4 generations of feminist ideologies. Likewise, Millennial men are the products of that same 4-5 generations of emasculation, feminization and the deliberate obfuscation of what masculinity “really is” for them. This deserves some explanation.

I’ve gone into the timelines and the evolution of how Hypergamy has been released from social restraints, wholesale, on western society in my Adaptations series of posts, but it’s a good review to understand what AnonymousBosch is relating here; We keep returning to Hypergamy and its regulation as a basis for an expanded vision of social structure, but it’s important to remember the behavioral prompts that women’s biology predisposes them to in that respect. Since the time of the Sexual Revolution we’ve had a systematic conditioning for, and institutionalization of, a social order that prioritizes women’s Hypergamy as the predominant one.

Unilaterally female-controlled hormonal birth control was certainly a catalyst for this social shift, but it’s important to remember that for the past 4 generations women have been raised and acculturated in a social environment not only rooted in the fempowerment narrative, but also one that encourages the excesses of the ‘bad girl’ side of Hypergamy that AnonymousBosch describes here. And as I mention in that post, the social engineering that’s led to feminine-primacy (as well as erasing the inconvenient aspects of conventional masculinity) all centers on optimizing women’s Hypergamy.

So we experience 2-3 generations of women who are conflicted between what that Fempowerment narrative has taught them they should value and the conventional, evolved biological impulses that predispose them to appreciating, enjoying and submitting to sexy male dominance. Instead of being confused and agonizing over the traditional (old order) ‘Good Girl’ social restrictions that buffered the more damaging consequences of Hypergamy, now women agonize over the conflict between what Fempowerment has conditioned them to believe they should be attracted to in an “equal partner” (Beta Bucks) and their visceral sexual drive for ‘bad’ Alpha dominance in a man they want to lose themselves with.

They’ll still lay claim to the ‘Good Girl’ social convention when it suits their purpose (i.e. during the Epiphany Phase) to affirm their decisions to prioritize a need for long term security – or to excuse past Alpha Fucks sexual needs – but the primary conflict is still the same, an internal war between the contradicting aspects of her sexual strategies and how they influence her life’s decisions and different phases of her maturity.

In her SMV Peak years, “Fuck you society, I won’t be the good girl you want me to be!” is the message she adopts insofar as it serves her sexual strategy’s immediate interests. The conflict comes when she needs to temper this sentiment with a need to settle into a motherhood role and compromise it just enough to present the appearance of being a prudent choice for long term commitment.

I see my role, as a man, is to recognize their capacity for depravity, both sexual and emotional, and to offer the dominance and guidance to reign them in. Women, even as they get outraged at the very notion, simply want a man they respect to tell them ‘No’, and offer them structure and guidance. One good way I’ve heard this described on here was “She is the ocean, and you are the rock, and the furies of her storms have no impact on you. You are unyielding.”

When men first come to Red Pill awareness about the motivations of women’s sexual strategy it’s very easy to see their behaviors as being intentional or their after-the-fact rationalizations for them as being convenient and expedient in excusing them. There is a definite design to the psychological and social schema women will use to explain their actions, particularly when they’re anti-social, sexist and/or damaging to the men who bear the worst of them.

Not to say men should tolerate this, but it’s important for men to understand the underlying psychology and motivators for women’s behaviors. It would seem AnonymousBosch has embraced this understanding. Again, it’s easy to think you’ll just put your foot down and not tolerate women’s bad behaviors, but this ignores those same female-motivators, sacrifices a real understanding of them and attempts to replace learning to maneuver them with the misguided hope that women will be rational agents and change their behaviors because we say so.

Men of this mindset believe the same ‘equalist’ hope that women will cease to be the “most mature teenager in the house” because they rationally explained to them that they should ignore their base motivators (Hypergamy) and act reasonably. This doesn’t work for women, nor does it work for men when women attempt to convince men to adopt a feminist mindset based on exactly the same appeal to reason. The boner doesn’t lie, and neither does women’s sexually strategic behavior.

In an age of unfettered, socially and legally affirmed Hypergamy it’s counterproductive to expect any woman to self-police her own sexual strategies by appealing to her reason.

The good news, as outlined by AnonymousBosch, is that Red Pill awareness and internalized Game are the same buffering contingencies for Hypergamy as they’ve always been. The trick for men now is to reestablish and embrace a connection to the conventional masculinity that’s been systematically conditioned out of men for 2-3 generations. In fact, there’s no better evidence of this Blue Pill conditioning than the common sense of counterintuitive-ness of embracing a masculinity that puts a man into a position of exercising the dominance women need.

Published by Rollo Tomassi

Author of The Rational Male and The Rational Male, Preventive Medicine

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Sentient
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Yay…. Now we don’t have to look at that pointy prick all weekend…!

Andy
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Andy
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Good post… Love it.

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[…] Good Girls, Bad Girls […]

LeeLee
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Wow, I love everything about this. That picture, that comment! AnonymousBosch clearly gets it. I think women are so into the extreme, degrading stuff he talks about (which I’m just going to categorize as “humiliation”) now more than ever is that it’s a cheap, quick way to bond. Bonding does not come so naturally when you’re entering a relationship at a later age, after lots of casual sex, even just after a couple of relationships. I think we want to be hazed, actually. The point of hazing is bonding. To go to an extreme place and find each other there.… Read more »

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The book Datenomics ( and “too many women?” posits that the sex ratio controls men and women’s sexual behaviors. if there are a lot of men, then the men want ensure that that they can get a wife and become particularly interested in long term relationships. Even high quality men. The men also become interested in virginity et al. If there a lot of women, the men (especially high quality men) don’t want to get into long term relationships. Women tend to be more promiscuous. Apparently, oral sex was popularized in the 1920s (when the ratio was low due to… Read more »

Morpheus
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Agent P
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@rollo, your timing is always impeccable. Just last weekend I took wifey away for a few days in a tropical locale for the weekend to do some man things with a side of couple time free of offspring. Friday night entails what could be characterized as a peak social experience, great time with friends, lots of drinks. Get back to the hotel and invariably wife drives the whole show off the rails by going broad spectrum BSC powered by booze. It should have been wham bam thank you mamme, instead I end up leaving the hotel for the night saying… Read more »

Morpheus
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Rollo,

Off-topic, but this might provide some fodder for red-pill analysis. I see it as sort of a “beta game” on steroids…which is men doing their “fair share” of “emotional labor”. The very concept of “emotional labor” seems almost Onionesque but it may represent a further split into sexy guys for short-term sex, but “emotional laborers” for long-term partners.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B0UUYL6kaNeBTDBRbkJkeUtabEk/view?pref=2&pli=1

Morpheus
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The book Datenomics ( and “too many women?” posits that the sex ratio controls men and women’s sexual behaviors. if there are a lot of men, then the men want ensure that that they can get a wife and become particularly interested in long term relationships. Even high quality men. The men also become interested in virginity et al. Although there is some merit and validity to analyzing data when it comes to dating, mating, sexuality, etc. I think it is easy to run afoul and try to pin too much on carving and slicing data. I’m sure the sex… Read more »

YaReally
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I think it’s important that the thread that post is from is linked so guys understand that we’re not talking about a little dirty talk or hair pulling:

https://www.rooshvforum.com/thread-45437.html

Also be sure to see the sequels: My Secret Garden and Forbidden Flowers by Nancy Friday and watch some average everyday girls do fucked up shit on Chaturbate.

The truth can be uncomfortable, but guys need to really GET how deep the rabbit hole of female sexuality goes and that it’s not just some small % of crazy bitches lol

peregrinejohn
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Agent P, I know that situation all too well – and if I’d had the wit (and, yeah, the Pill) it would have gone much better… though even then I suspected the better way, doubts from beta training notwithstanding. It’s good to have an actual example of Situation Done Right, thanks.

peregrinejohn
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(Going to make an adage/mantra of the “telling the ocean to rest” thing. )

Morpheus
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Likewise, Millennial men are the products of that same 4-5 generations of emasculation, feminization and the deliberate obfuscation of what masculinity “really is” for them. This deserves some explanation. I may be overreaching here, but this is something that just dawned on me. I’ve been working out…lifting weights for 20+ years. I’ve noticed recently at my gym I just don’t see many guys younger than me (mid to late 20s, 30s) really hitting the weights…heck I see more guys who look like hipsters on the treadmill. It would be interesting to see what percentage of men are active weight trainers… Read more »

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This reminds me of something a close female friend always says which is to never take dating advice from women. She insists that most women not only do not know what they really what, but (as we all know), they usually want the opposite of what they say they want. She too insists that the desire for dominance is in the soul of nearly every woman whether she realizes it or not. And that there is the danger.

RichardP
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… attempts to replace learning to maneuver them with the misguided hope that women will be rational agents and change their behaviors … It is often stated (paraphrasing) that the thing which separates mankind from the rest of the animal kingdom is that he can become something more than his base impulses would have him be through the exercise of his will. It is further argued that this is what the process of education (formal schooling and social conditioning) is all about – learning to subjugate base impulses in order to accomplish something greater for the benefit of self and… Read more »

Ishamael
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@yareally

Never thought I’d see 120 Days of Sodom type fetishes in anything but a movie. Shoulda known better. One of the posts there recommended googling “dubai porta potties” … damn lol. Some fucked up shit out there.

RichardP
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kb9P8BLipqo
She’s Come Undone – The Guess Who

Speaks to the subject matter of this thread.

Pinelero
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This article explains why younger girls go for the tattoos and dyed hair and weird piercings. A lack of discipline and maybe a way to covertly advertise for a “bad-boy”, while trying to appease the feminist overseers with a pretense of equality or fem-powerment.

Morpheus
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Wow, I thought I had heard of everything, that is just unreal…couldn’t believe this line:

“I’ve had sex with their 14 year old boys to make them men, I’ve drank cups of c*m and have smeared my face with their sh*t. So to all you ladies that are going to bash me.

I’m 24 years old and have 1 million dollars liquid in my bank account. I’m now retired and can have normal sex with whomever I want.”

Yollo Comanche
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@LeeLee

“I think we want to be hazed,actually”

GAH!!!! The Male shit test!!! YAY!!!!!

Thank you LeeLee.

Craig
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@ Morpheus
Dude, you seriously haven’t heard of Dubai Porta Potties before? You live a very sheltered life, bro.

bo jangles
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Millenials are more debased because they’ve already seen everything on porntube and she thinks thats what everyone does. Add feminists telling them like the brave soul honey boo boo…I do what I want! And this is the danger of allowing hollywood to put their politics into movies. They are smearing pure bs fantasy and making people believe that is normal and correct(ie confess your love and not get friendzoned)

rugby11
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I found this (relates to degradation)
http://www.blogtalkradio.com/tmill/2011/01/09/duke-skywalker–saturday-night-rewinds
I am embracing my masculinity…

D. Horrenbrand
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Fantastic post.

rugby11
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@Morpheus
Just at gym today doing weight work

LeeLee
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@Rollo I’m gonna run to that song now

rugby11
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Interview with porn director starts at 30:50 an link…
I don’t think anyone even in the industry enjoys the work this guy creates.

Anonymous Reader
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Morpheus, Rollo: My gym / weight time is always off cycle to the rest of the world, so pretty much all I see are retirees. Some of them actually work, some just sit around playing with rubber band resistance stuff while they talk about Social Securlty. So I got no data from the gym. But most of the college aged men I am around are in pretty weedy shape. They don’t smoke for the most part, but quite a few of them clearly are not lifting anything heavier than a pint of beer. The more I learn about Crossfit the… Read more »

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It’s amazing that someone came across a good comment on CH’s blog, and not surprising that one had to go back in time to find it. Most of the comments that can be found there these days are barely above the level of YouTube quality.

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@Culum “That being said, Millennial Girls seem to possess a capacity for self-loathing and self-destruction I’ve never seen in previous generations.” nah. here is the SAME concept PUAs try to convey, applied to something else manosphere-dudes love jacking off about (violence/mayhem among/between men)….but now apply it to female sexuality https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d1U3MyX0pmE people can be programmed socially to do A WIDE RANGE OF THINGS you need to understand that your world and ideas were given to you from a young age, but it’s just a small slice of what’s out there. (btw i kno chicks who have done this type of shit… Read more »

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@This Comment Section Fuck. To think I actually might be wanting to fuck around with someone who is into this type of shit beneath the eye-liner. All I wanted was a fucking blowjob…… Turns out all the SS-tier women are at least THIS fucked in the head? What does that to them? It’s not just their gender, so what is it? The life of prestige? Of being someone that someone else wants to shit on? And what about their stupid lower B-rank harpy friends? They’re texting each-other on the finer points of timing a specific facial expression as the Chips… Read more »

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What in the ever living f$&@

http://youtu.be/wRCmVfkjn1A

Blaximus
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@ AR, et all re: Lifting…. * sigh * In my experience a troubling majority of young males are physically and mentally soft, and approach life with carefree silliness rivaling women. A co-worker of mine serves as a prime example… He never looks under the hood of any car he’s ever owned not even out of curiosity. He too considers ” working out ” to consist of a treadmill exclusively while practically boasting of ” not being very strong “. He dresses like a homeless man with a bushy unkept beard. He is incapable of assembling ANYTHING at all. Cannot… Read more »

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Rugby11

http://cinelando.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/Numero_Uno_Shirt.jpg

Pumping Iron is a RP must watch explication in alpha…

Sentient
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“He’s like a large 8 year old.”

LOL. Perfect description Blaximus

kfg
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“He never looks under the hood of any car he’s ever owned not even out of curiosity.” She-Who-Must-Not-Be-Named asked, “If your car broke down on the highway, would you blame the car, or the manufacturer.” The answer is, of course, neither. You would determine and blame the cause. It takes someone utterly clueless, and who wishes to remain so, to ask the question in that way. “He too considers ” working out ” to consist of a treadmill . . .” Treadmills exist for one and only one reason – to sell treadmills. That goes double if you actually run.… Read more »

Sentient
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Nicely done Agent P… been there many many times, BP times ended in acrimony, RP times ended in an accepting satisfaction.

Cats are not dogs.

Blaximus
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Btw, the comment quoted in the OP is pure gold. I stopped believing in the concept of The Good Girl 40 years ago. As I’ve said many times, anything I could have thought up sexually there were always a few chicks more than willing. Anything. I too think that millennials are different. The ones that I know/know of certainly are. Any chance an uninitiated man gets he should indeed jump down this rabbit hole and explore women’s depraved potential actualized or not. IMO, it makes a difference in how you will ultimately deal with them. Understand what they are fully… Read more »

Blaximus
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… Knew a chick that bred Rottweiler’s.

It worked better after she purchased a female though.

Blaximus
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Lol…I won’t do ” storytime ” this go round. Some shit should be forgotten.

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My wife had the opening day of her 18 hole women’s golf league yesterday. I got home from work earlier and started reading Franco’s Manual of Seduction after someone’s suggested on the married red pill re: the female stages of manipulation (more about that later). Anyway she had texted me back she was still at the club, so I was chilling before my anticipated dinner night out for our anniversary. She came back home later and was in tears. I ask her why and she wouldn’t open about it. She said it was no big deal, but she was very,… Read more »

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@ Blax re: modern men’s ineptitude I feel like I’m a part of a dying art. A lot of what I do in my trade is by eye and feel. You get good simply through experience and effort. They sell tools that are supposed to “help,” but they’re mostly marketing BS that pussyfoots around the truth: that there’s no substitute for experience. One guy was asking me how to do a certain job. I said the only real way to do it is by eye and by feel. He said he thought that was ‘tedious and inaccurate.’ I’ve seen guys… Read more »

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I was recently talking to a co worker about a young (early 20’s) woman we both work with. She was telling me how this girl likes to travel. Dubai being one of her favorite destinations. You know, for scenery and whatnot. Other places she’s been in the past year include Thailand, and Brazil. Pretty amazing to do all that traveling, and pay your bills at home, while making $25/hr. It’s funny, out of all of the people I know at work making that wage, none of them can afford to do that much traveling. When I started hearing some of… Read more »

cheupez
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My take: You will probably never know why she was really crying.

Water Cannon Boy
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So things like Amber Rose and her slutwalks are her actually asking to be rescued from them

Water Cannon Boy
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supposed to have ?

Culum Struan
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@Scray – I didn’t write that post, I just reposted it from the mega-thread on the Roosh forum because this particular post stood out to me. When you say you know “girls who’ve done this type of shit”, do you mean you know girls who’ve gone to Dubai to be shat on for $$$ and blown dogs (literally), or just your common/garden hot girl sugar baby who was sponsored by some rich guy in college and banged a few NFL/NBA stars on the party circuit? If the former I’d be really interested in hearing how you think those experiences affected… Read more »

caprizchka
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We just haven’t yet heard the right rhetorical secret pass phrase yet–/sarc grin

Kate Minter
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It is hard to be good. It’s not so hard to be a virgin for your husband when you’re young because you don’t know any different. But women at older ages or stages find it much more difficult. I found that the culture did not support celibacy. Without parents/friends to help me, I essentially locked myself away in my house for five years knowing I couldn’t be trusted. It was worth it.

theasdgamer
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@LeeLee

My concept of myself as a good submissive wife would be much more intricate and dark, and feelings based.

This is a very intriguing comment, but I need some word pictures to flesh it out.

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“ the social engineering that’s led to feminine-primacy” Great article!! I often wonder if we are not over thinking this. TRM is by far the best of the manosphere by but I really wonder if we are over intellectualizing gender relations in the US. I sometimes think it’s a simple matter of American women being the product of our society and American men who worship women, pedestalize them, spoil them, and turn them into these ugly little spoiled entitled brat (often fat) children. I think it all starts with American dads who spoil their little princesses (and take pride in… Read more »

Blaximus
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That’s the strange thing about having many close female friends. It’s great to be able to have straightforward, honest communication and relationships but lawd the things you will see and hear. Everyone has an inner Vader. There’s nothing wrong with that it’s normal. What’s referred to as ” base ” behavior or instincts are a normal part of your make up. It’s helpful to control the base aspect to stop it from having unpleasant and unintended consequences. It’s ridiculous to try to fully suppress or eliminate it. You might snap…lol. Embrace to gain full understanding.. Do not carry shame or… Read more »

hoellenhund2
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I may be overreaching here, but this is something that just dawned on me. I’ve been working out…lifting weights for 20+ years. I’ve noticed recently at my gym I just don’t see many guys younger than me (mid to late 20s, 30s) really hitting the weights…heck I see more guys who look like hipsters on the treadmill. It would be interesting to see what percentage of men are active weight trainers from say 1970 to present. I’d bet it ramped up with the mainstream popularity of Arnold and has actually declined over the last 10-15 years. I’d say it’s declining… Read more »

hoellenhund2
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He’s like a large 8 year old. But the frustrating thing about all of this is the way he smirks and rolls his eyes at any opinion contrary to living the weak ass life he has chosen. And with each passing year I encounter more of these ghost men. No drive to do shit. No interest in masculinity. A weak, flabby inept mumbling motherfucker. He has no interest in masculinity because he lacks innate masculinity, and nobody incentivizes him to develop and display masculine attributes. There was a time when even men like him were needed as farmers, soldiers, factory… Read more »

hoellenhund2
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Feminism, at it’s core, is basically: “Fuck you society, I won’t be the good girl you want me to be!”

Except that society doesn’t want her to be a good girl anymore. There was a time when it did, when it needed her to fulfill the role of a competent mother who raises 3-5 well-adjusted, psychologically healthy, productive children.

Artisanal Toad
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Functionally, the problem with defining hypergamy as an evolutionary development is that it eliminates any moral context to this. And, yet, there is in the back of most men’s minds a moral context into which this behavior is trying to be fit. While I applaud Rollo’s efforts and the incredible work he’s done to create a cohesive syntax to objectively identify and explain hypergamy, the one issue I have with it is the fundamental premiss. Hypergamy is not an evolved trait, it’s a curse. For thousands of years, the guys studying the Scriptures would look at Genesis 3:16 and not… Read more »

hoellenhund2
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I’m not going to disagree with YaReally’s argument, but I don’t think it’s a good idea to hold up “My Secret Garden” as great proof. From Wikipedia: My Secret Garden: Women’s Sexual Fantasies is a 1973 book compiled by Nancy Friday, who collected women’s fantasies through letters and taped and personal interviews. After including a female sexual fantasy in a novel she submitted for publishing, her editor objected, and Friday shelved the novel. Later, after other women began writing and talking about sex publicly, Friday began thinking about writing a book about female sexual fantasies, first collecting fantasies from her… Read more »

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@hoellenhund2

“The popularity of lifting is one natural male reaction to the emergence of the matriarchy, because the matriarchy rewards alpha roles while ignoring or even discouraging the beta provider role. When physical prowess and aggressiveness is the main male way to compete on a matriarchal sex market, lifting becomes popular.”

Comment of the year. Incredible insight.

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Blaximus “He too considers ” working out ” to consist of a treadmill . . .” Probably why the gyms have a whole bank of them. Maybe he’s stuck in that 1970’s “running is all you need” mindset. kfg Treadmills exist for one and only one reason – to sell treadmills. That goes double if you actually run. They fuck up your stride. Have never liked those things, to me they are weird even at walking pace. It is interesting to me how many people I know are stuck on some past piece of information – the USDA 1980’s food… Read more »

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Blaximus
“He is incapable of assembling ANYTHING at all.”

kfg
A generation that hasn’t made anything beyond a finger painting.

I wonder. Millennials like to brag on their technosavvy, but most of what I see people doing is swiping or dragging and dropping. Installing apps on a phone or a tablet is not really that hard.

Funny thing is, I’ve repaired or refurbished several machines of various sorts just by trawling the web – YouTube vids, special interest websites, etc. can teach a lot of things to a man who knows how to learn. As with lifting, ya gotta want to do it.

FopDespotic
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Rollo, You always say that you focus on the theory and concepts behind the Red Pill and Game, not on the actual practical application. Who would you recommend most in terms of reading up on that practical application? I’m recently out of an LTR that I had coming out of the very tail end of college, where previously I had very easy access to a large number of women. I used many of the concepts you teach here to great effect: the shy muslim girl I dated went from being terrified of wearing dresses around me to absolutely worshiping my… Read more »

Bromeo
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IlFIWHFGqJ4

life is 20% game and 80% being jacked

[An ideal physique triggers an emotional response]

mersonia
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@hoellenhund2 “I’m not going to disagree with YaReally’s argument, but I don’t think it’s a good idea to hold up “My Secret Garden” as great proof. From Wikipedia: My Secret Garden: Women’s Sexual Fantasies is a 1973 book compiled by Nancy Friday, who collected women’s fantasies through letters and taped and personal interviews. After including a female sexual fantasy in a novel she submitted for publishing, her editor objected, and Friday shelved the novel. Later, after other women began writing and talking about sex publicly, Friday began thinking about writing a book about female sexual fantasies, first collecting fantasies from… Read more »

benfromtexas
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Hey Rollo, that In The Moment song is awesome. Check out their song from the same album called “Whore.” It’s a good one too.

I’m a big hard rock fan, and I dated a girl into that band, and the lead singer has to be a major Alpha Widow, because just about all her lyrics are about it.

I agree. I can picture LeeLee getting rammed like Drago pounding Khaleesi and that song is in the background! 😂😂😂😂

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@artisanaltoad

It is only a “curse” in man-speak.

“Because regardless of which particular rationale one chooses, looking at the data it’s pretty much impossible to find the benefit to anyone- either long term or short term from an evolutionary perspective.”

That’s like saying that tumors, cysts, bubbles, and zits have feelings.

Pop.

In Madonna-speak it’s a blessing on women.

In whore-speak it’s a blessing on men.

Just don’t expect to actually build anything.

[youtube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5GL9JoH4Sws&w=560&h=315%5D

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Blaximus,

No 8 year old I ever knew (my young self included) was “scared shitless of ‘wilderness'” or “hated any kind of sport”.

Really, you are maligning all previous generations of 8-year-old here…

IAS
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Ouch Rollo, that is an extreme “Making up for missing out” case there, arguably on par with the reverse “Saving the best” cases which still make me cringe to think about. I want to believe that an N=1 wife (technicality, N=0 is a virgin, not a mom) is less likely to not want to feel like such a mom than someone who has already felt like “not a mom” before. I guess it depends on the particular woman if the curiosity (never having felt it) or the nostalgia (having felt it) would be a stronger pull to cheat. Also we… Read more »

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This, so much THIS! “The boner doesn’t lie, and neither does women’s sexually strategic behavior.” This is what I’m getting now, women’s intersexual/mating behavior is hypergamous and driven inside of them the way my boner is, lol. Sure, some of their post hoc justifications and even superficial behavior and speech is adaptive but the base impulses are almost autonomic. I also get that the reason for the super-slutty behavior is engaged in in the first place is that it’s a way of demonstrating sexual value to a man who THEY have qualified themselves to as a sexual object for the… Read more »

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@Rollo you’re simply not going to alter the fundamental realities of women’s natures by asking them to change their behaviors in a way that contradict an evolved impulse that’s literally responsible for the success of our species. We don’t need to agree on the metaphysics and what I was talking about has nothing to do with asking women to do anything. Women compete with each other, they always have and always will. There is no point in asking them to act in such a way that men might desire if they have no personal motivation to do so. We agree… Read more »

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So much goodness in the comments. Muh eyes are bulging. @AR The new ” tech savvy ” crowd crack me up. Most of the self professed techies I deal with are frighteningly one dimensional. You nailed it with the drag and drop. Lmao. ” Tech ” now has multiple meanings. There is Jet Propulsion Labs type tech, and fission/fusion type tech, and med/genetic tech…. Then there is this consumer friendly bastardization tech. It’s kinda like tech but with half the calories. Millenials except life lived at lesser levels. There is a thirst for the simple and easy. Understanding stays at… Read more »

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“When physical prowess and aggressiveness is the main male way to compete on a matriarchal sex market, lifting becomes popular.” in my experience lifting makes zero difference with women. sports athletic, skinny fat, beer fat, six pack cut, big – I managed to pull with all these body types. it is true when I’m big their hands tend to roam over my muscles more but it really makes no difference for the sex. if a guy is good in bed he’s good in bed no matter what. and I don’t think lifting is popular. I lift a few days a… Read more »

fleezer
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“Men do not have to ask women to do anything, they need only change *their* definition of commitment. The women can choose to accept or not. ”

agree with Toad big time. commitment meant monogamy for her. not for me. this turns her on

16 years later I get my cock sucked every day, insanely good passionate sex (4 times yesterday) and hot food every night. and I’m a scumbag

men with frame win

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@scray, yareally, habd, sentient, etc What should one keep in mind when a girl is feeling sorry for herself/expressing a desire for comfort? If it’s something silly, I don’t have a problem. But what if it is something that does kinda suck for her, and you can feel your beta shit goblin trying to put you in “comfort bitch” mode to sabotage any progress you’ve made? Examples and theory would both be appreciated. And what do you say to a plate when she says she can’t hang out because she has a bf now? I’ve said, “great, happy for you”,… Read more »

Sentient
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Fleezer – so married 16 years? Good for you.

Do you have any children with her?

Sentient
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betathrowaway

What is the context?

I.e. You aren’t going to a and a her Dad dying. You can give comfort from an alpha frame, what you need to do is understand her reason for wanting comfort and see if that is beta bait or not.

It’s OK to be human.

Sentient
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Toad You have observed repeatedly that the best sex a man will get is at the beginning of a relationship and this is tied to the commitment of the man. Once he’s committed, she’s no longer in competition with the other women because his commitment took that off the table. Observationally, that great sex was the result of her competition with other women. By the same token, the decline in the sex correlates perfectly with the decline in her competition for him. Part of her drive is to secure commitment, and she will keep up her efforts until she gets… Read more »

redlight
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If you do feel lifting is important, I recommend the David Spade Lifting program. Here is the ranking:

http://www.ranker.com/list/women-who-david-spade-has-dated/celebrityhookups

If you are gay or bi, then lifting is important, and if you evaluate the SVM of a guy based on how jacked he is, then you can guess what that means about you.

Switching to Rollo, evolution demands that Rollo has a lot of children, since he rates high on the traits evolution wants to pass along. I don’t understand why Rollo wants to fight evolution, in particular why he would spend time lifting instead of fucking multiple women.

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@Sentient,

Context here is that she got really sick at a bar, thinks she might have been roofied, but I’m not certain I agree.
Really mostly using it as a catalyst to ask you guys about a sticking point I often have taking the beta bait when they show vulnerability.

Sentient
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Betathrowaway

See context is important. Sick from a bar? Roofied lol… That is pure beta bait. Pffft.

Good time to make fun of her or just ignore…

kfg
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And if you don’t think lifting is important it might be because you think it’s about picking up chicks, instead of about this:

http://comps.canstockphoto.com/can-stock-photo_csp8740583.jpg

SJF
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@Sentient Baby with resting bitch face. @YaReally et. al. Hey, I got a throwback to PUA game and possibly Mystery Method game. I got a buddy that came to the conclusion that I would have recommended to him. And I have thought of this in regards to guys like Forge, Scribblerg, and Sun Wukong (where is Sun? hope you are doing OK and just busy with work or too busy fucking girls…) Can they use a girl for a wingman? Is it feasible, workable, valuable? Tips and tricks? Pitfalls? Like Forge the Sky’s coworker with a boyfriend (the Lebanese one?)… Read more »

Sentient
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LOL David Spade… He cracks me up. Quite a player. His list also illustrates the benefits of being an older guy, you have a wide range of women… Plenty of really good looking 30’s women, even some 40s, out there if you are in good places. And you dont have to be with them if you dont want. But if you are 50 and want to hit a hot 32 yo… You are in a way better place than a 21 yo guy… And it doesnt keep you from hitting a 20 yo girl… Good to be a guy! Loading...

Sentient
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Oh and on lifting… Please use moderation.

Going heavy for heavy’s sake is fucking up your back and knees and shoulders. I know a bunch of guys who are having surgeries now at 55…

Double knee replacement anyone?

redlight
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@sjf

Is hanging out with a desirable woman that you don’t judge as serial monogamy potential because she is otherwise invested and you are seeking gaming other women a legit tool in the tool box?

yes it is, but she is not a wingman

redlight
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Double knee replacement anyone?

kfg’s picture shows the result of lifting and old age

Sentient
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SJF

Idk… I read that baby’s face as “you serious bro? These are ALL mine… I suck on them whenever I want?!”

Never had a female wing, most of my game stuff is solo. But back in college it was always great to have a girl on your side helping out.

Would love it now.

SJF
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“…evolution demands that Rollo has a lot of children, since he rates high on the traits evolution wants to pass along.” Sweet ideological jeezus statement. Lol…you just made up your own little interpretation of how mother nature works. There is a difference about how things were set up to evolve and how they did evolve. Good luck on understanding the theory, science, facts and Darwinist interpretations over that. I doubt you get out and observe how Mother Nature really operates–yes get out in the woods and observe nature and wildlife. It is not as pretty as human society pretends to… Read more »

redlight
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@SJF

saying that Rollo rates high on the traits that evolution wants to pass along is not derogating him, it is quite the opposite

rugby11
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“you’re simply not going to alter the fundamental realities of women’s natures by asking them to change their behaviors in a way that contradict an evolved impulse that’s literally responsible for the success of our species.”
Rollo this has been the child’s inside me’s issue since learning about the red pill…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SYgWHwMm9Uo
Yeah this is painful please grow up and move on.

Morpheus
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If you do feel lifting is important, I recommend the David Spade Lifting program. Here is the ranking Logic 101 massive fail. Outliers/exceptions don’t prove the general rule. David Spade is a celebrity so he ranks high on social status, and for all I know he might be as charismatic as Casanova. The whole “lift or not” really ties back into the whole do looks matter to women? I just roll my eyes and shrug my shoulders. Sure, guys can improve along other dimensions to increase success with women because looks are not the magic bullet, and other things can… Read more »

redlight
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David Spade is a celebrity so he ranks high on social status

Note that in the celebrity status rankings, David Spade actually does not rank that high. Actresses do NOT want to be on the red carpet with David Spade.

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rugby, best part:
Being a porn star is what Sky wants. She makes good money, she doesn’t get bossed around by a suit, and she has time to attend college (majoring in women’s studies).

Majoring in women’s studies? Perfect.

Morpheus
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Oh and on lifting… Please use moderation.
Going heavy for heavy’s sake is fucking up your back and knees and shoulders. I know a bunch of guys who are having surgeries now at 55…

+1000, the key is good form and letting muscular tension do the work, not momentum and bouncing the weights. And just to be clear I don’t think the “jacked” look and by that I mean some ridiculous look like Rich Piana, but something more like the guy from Athlean

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DVK22UNLS-g

SJF
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“Is hanging out with a desirable woman that you don’t judge as serial monogamy potential because she is otherwise invested and you are seeking gaming other women a legit tool in the tool box? ” Ok. I totally said that wrong due to lack of writing skills. Hot babe. Number rating is strict and doesn’t do justice to the actual boner test. She is boner test turned up to 11. She would never not pass the boner test if you were in close proximity. Rephrase. She not going to bang my buddy (he know’s the score analytically). It is definitely… Read more »

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