Alpha Widows

As today’s Purple Pill Manosphere tries to sort out what it wants to pick and pull from ideas the Red Pill has been debating for decades now it requires a lot of deliberate misdirection of the old concepts they struggle with. This is actually nothing new. If you look at any of the exchanges I had with Aunt Giggles (Susan Walsh ret.) or various notables from the golden years of this blog you’ll recognize the pattern – Distort the premises of the concepts that conflict with your ego-investments, straw man them, then offer some redefinition of what they ‘really’ mean.

One of these maligned concepts is the phenomenon of the Alpha Widow. I’ve written extensively on this idea for well over a decade now. I’m fairly certain I even coined the term back in my SoSuave days. Back then Alpha Widow was a designation we used to describe a woman’s tendency to become fixated on an Alpha lover she had in her Party Years and still pined for him into her 30s or 40s after marriage. We didn’t just pull the idea out of our asses back then. We came to it because of the overwhelming number of married or LTR men who reported that their wife or girlfriend were pining for old lovers they thought were “the one that got away” or they left them to pursue a new relationship with an old flame.

Back then it was just a useful reference, but it quickly became such a predictable and confirmable phenomenon I thought it deserved more investigation. I mentioned Alpha Widows in The Slut Paradox but it was around this time that Roissy (Heartise) had proposed a simple maxim: 5 Minutes of Alpha Trumps 5 years of Beta. That’s when I decided to look deeper in my own short essay Five Minutes of Alpha. With a Red Pill Lens I began to see this Alpha Widow narrative played out in popular culture. Katy Perry had a song out then called The One That Got Away and it accurately described everything that goes into making an Alpha Widow.

What is an Alpha Widow?

To understand the phenomenon of the Alpha Widow we must look at women’s evolved mating strategy – Hypergamy, a woman’s intrinsic desire to balance the best quality sexual/reproductive male with the best provisioning/parentally invested male. Since a woman’s mating strategy centers on quality in a long term partner(s) women tend to focus on ideals in men. The imperative drive for mate quality extends to both sides of women’s Hypergamous equation; the best genetic, sexual experience and the best long term security potential. Only women are Hypergamous, and Hypergamy never seeks its own level – it is always seeking a better-than-merited exchange in SMV compared to her own. For more information on this concept read False Equivalencies.

When a woman misses the opportunity to consolidate on a confirmed, high SMV (sexual market value) male that man becomes the new standard for what she believes she can attract as a potential mate.

“I’ve had an SMV 8 guy before so in the future no man below an 8 will be my optimal choice.”

Even if a woman’s perception of her own SMV isn’t realistic her Id wants what it believes it can get.

The setting of a mating strategy metric in men is largely a subconscious process for women, but, more often now, high-ego women do consciously acknowledge that one man does (or doesn’t) meet the SMV benchmark of a previous lover. As women have become more comfortable in embracing Open Hypergamy, amongst their girlfriends, on social media, they will readily debate this SMV metric of past boyfriends. The Alpha Widow dynamic is no secret among women. Usually this involves women bemoaning the lack of “eligible” men in their lives when their prime SMV years are behind them. Please note that eligible implies an entitlement to a man who would be an ideal.

This qualification process is a constant for women, and it’s a complement to mens’ Burden of Performance. Women’s Hypergamous filtering process evolved from an Existential Fear of pairing with any man beneath her own (self-perceived) SMV and risking her life on a bad reproductive bet.  The worst existential prospect for a woman is to have her mating strategy superseded and controlled by that of a suboptimal man. 

The flip side to this dynamic is that, evolutionarily speaking, a woman’s subconscious cannot afford to miss out on an optimal Hypergamous pairing. If a woman’s Existential Fear is to be forced to reproduce with a lesser man, the next fear is to lose or miss out out on the opportunity to consolidate on monogamy with a high SMV man. When I talk about how a woman will make rules for Betas, but break rules for Alphas this is the root of that principle. 

As such, a man who exceeds a woman’s SMV, and creates a benchmark of her ‘personal best’ ideal male to breed with and parentally invest with, makes a significant impact on her psyche; sometimes in the long term. When a woman has had this man – one for whom she has genuine, organic desire for – but she cannot consolidate on him (i.e. lock down in monogamy), this represents a critical loss of the ideal Hypergamous/Reproductive/Life strategy option. Mentally this is what a woman will strive in some way to recreate with subsequent men in her life – a return to that ideal state.

This then is the basis of the Alpha Widow:
A mental fixation on the man who made the most significant impact upon a woman as her Hypergamous ideal.

The Fantasy Ideal

Usually this male ideal is an actual man from her past with whom she had some sort of relationship with, but not always. Sometimes the fantasy of that ideal will make a mental impression and sometimes a brief, seemingly insignificant, encounter with an ideal man may be enough to imprint on her psyche. 

Five Minutes of Alpha Trumps Five Years of Beta.

Sometimes the smallest brush with an ‘alpha’ male is enough to trigger the ‘what if?’ possibilities of consolidating on a guy like that. This might be one-night sex, the one guy in the foam cannon party on spring break in her wilder college years, or even just a missed opportunity to fully develop a hoped-for connection at a social gathering. The ‘Missed Connections’ forum on Craig’s Lists are filled with these regrets. All that matters is that the guy, knowingly or not, instilled a sense of Hypergamous urgency that she just knew represented a prospect for consolidating on that ideal.

An Alpha Widow can also be ‘widowed’ from the fantasy of her ideal male. This is fairly common among women who marry early in their Party Years. Most feel like they missed out on having made a good Hypergamous choice (or had it made for them by circumstance or social pressures). That missed opportunity leads some women to be widowed from the fantasy of an Alpha who would have been a better choice. Thus, an ideal Alpha mental model is what she pines for. An interest in romance literature is usually exaggerated in this type of widow. The formulaic stories are a form of vicarious fulfillment of an unrealized Hypergamous ideal. I should also add, this this widow, when married, is a prime demographic audience for divorce porn fantasies.

In any of these instances what’s at issue is the fact that women’s mating strategy always moves them towards a “better-than-merited” SMV exchange and a psychological fixation on the man, or the type of man who best embodies it. It’s as if a woman’s Id is imprinted with the model of the optimal Hypergamous pairing (evolution-wise a life or death proposition) and believes that only in recreating it will that male again save her life. This is the source of that unconscious pining.

Social Enabling of the Alpha Ideal

In 2019 it has never been easier for a woman to explore her reproductive options with an ever-increasing pool of potential Alphas from which to be widowed from. Since the Sexual Revolution western cultures have done little else than facilitate women’s mating strategies. In terms of “sexual liberation” the goal has always been to ensure provisioning and support – the Beta Bucks side of Hypergamy – in order to give women the impression that they have an indefinite window of time in which to find their optimal Alpha man. We see this reflected in the age of first marriages getting older and older. And in the age of social media women take for granted that they can remain sexually viable if not indefinitely, then at least as long as a man would. This facility exacerbates the Alpha Widow effect.

Women will fixate on the “one that got away”, but today we have social conventions in place to pander to that predictable insecurity in women. In fact, there are numerous industries that now thrive on exactly this.

Ladies, will you ever find your soulmate? Our Life-Coaching, our 12 step plan, our positivity training, our magic personality test will help you find him today.

I should add here that the very concept of a soulmate began with women pining for their bygone ideal man. That ‘One’ is much easier to justify cheating with, or agonizing over, if you mix in the metaphysical to aid in rationalizing it. The popularity of Fifty Shades of Grey and Eat, Pray, Love also find their root in the Alpha Widow dynamic. Popular culture tells women they are entitled to that ideal soulmate; and the only way they can remain true to themselves, the only way to live their best lives (even the life they believe God meant for them), is to pursue the ‘ONE that got away.’

The Plan B mating strategy is another social convention that forgives women of the consequences of pursuing that Alpha ideal while concurrently holding on to her next best male option. And lastly, the ongoing normalization of a female-initiated Polyandry is also a social convention predicated on allowing women to hedge their Hypergamous bets with respect to finding that Hypergamous ideal mate.

Misconceptions

The following are a couple of the more common misconceptions critics like to presume is meant by “Alpha Widow”. For the most part these are attempts to straw man the phenomenon with no real interest in how anyone came to understanding the dynamic. 

Alpha Widows are the result of “players” who fiendishly used these poor impressionable women before they left them high & dry

Blue Pill conditioned White Knights in particular use this to build their own heroic narrative around women. Of course, not all women are victims of the Alpha they were widowed by. The first part of this misconception is the presumption that no woman would volunteer for her own widowing; the second is that an Alpha “Player” was implicit in his motives to thoroughly imprint himself upon her. The truth is that any seduction requires a willing participant (Art of Seduction, Greene) and in accordance with women’s mating strategy women will eagerly participate in their own seduction. These are Alpha Widows, not rape survivors. 

The misconception is that the woman being widowed was somehow traumatized by her former lover. The truth is that the more positive the experience was for her the more impactful the widowing is likely to be. If women didn’t think fondly of the “one that got away” she wouldn’t be an Alpha Widow in the first place. The emotional despair some women feel over that Alpha is usually the result of having missed pairing in the long term with a better prospective man than the lesser man she settled on by necessity. 

This is an easy misconception for most Blue Pill men to follow along with because often enough women will refer to their ‘asshole ex boyfriend(s)’ as the man (men) who was responsible for her being damaged. Women in their Epiphany Phase will usually incorporate into it some narrative of their having been used by the Bad Boy Jerk who came before the Nice Guy Beta they found it necessary to settle on. This damaged narrative then locks in with a woman wanting to “do things the right way this time”. Women will often use this narrative as a failsafe to excuse their hesitancy to be as sexually available to the Beta as she was with the Alpha she was widowed from. So, you get a Saving the Best situation for the Nice Guy in the relationship and he’s apt to believe her claims of being damaged by the asshole who had her before he did.

Self-righteous Beta men love this damaged by the Player narrative because it allows them constant opportunities to prove to his woman how positively different he is compared to the asshole Alpha she’s still covertly pining for.

• “Alpha Widows” are just men making shit up and thinking the worst of women because they’re bitter and burned.

Yes, it is entirely possible that despondent Incels may exaggerate the phenomenon of the Alpha Widow to rationalize their giving up on women. This still doesn’t invalidate phenomenon. This misconceptions is generally dropped by critics of the Red Pill who’d rather attack the source than have to address a concept that rattles their comfortable Blue Pill understanding of women. That said, I understand how it might be convenient to disqualify the concept based on the bitterness of the individual piecing together why his wife or girlfriend still seems to be having a relationship with her ex even if just in her head. Self-loathing Incels will then use this as an excuse to give up for the same reason they believe Hypergamy is this insurmountable obstacle to their connecting with juice they don’t want to bother squeezing for.

For the record, no, not all women turn into Alpha Widows. All women are Hypergamous, but buffers and learned self-control have historically been the checks and balances needed to protect against this Alpha Widow dynamic. The problem is that these buffers are popularly considered sexual repression of women today. Women simply wont police the worst aspects of their mating strategy and any interference, personal, political or social, that would prevent a woman from exercising her Hypergamous sexuality is viewed as misogynist, sexist repression.

Statistically women with more sexual partners have a higher incidence of divorce and find it more difficult to form healthy attachments in LTRs based on their partner count. Men do not appear to follow these stats or dynamics, why?

Because men and women have different evolved mating strategies and priorities. Men, it appears, have a much easier time compartmentalizing the sex act and separating it from the emotional aspect women apply to sex. Men’s obsession with pornography is a good illustration of this, but it is reflective of the differences in our evolved mating strategies developed in our ancestral past. Men found it necessary to breed quickly and then move out – ejaculate and evacuate.

However, in a social order where Hypergamy is unbuffered women have more access to more men and have more opportunities to be imprinted by Alpha men while in their peak fertility years than in any other era before. This abundance of reproductive opportunities, and a lack of any social stigma or moral reservations are putting women into a position where their Blue Pill husbands turn their denial into hate for the ‘Players’ who violated and ruined their ‘soulmate’ before he came into her life. They refuse to acknowledge that in most cases his girl eagerly chose to give herself to the man she told her husband was a ‘Player’ from her past.

Blue Pill married men have the hardest time accepting the idea that their wives may be Alpha Widows for a man that came before them. They struggle with the possibility their wives gave a part of themselves to a guy that they’ll never experience, so denial and anger becomes their ego’s protection.

They throw shade at the men who have the Game to seduce women (who enjoy the seduction as well) because they “ruin women for great guys like him”. Thus, they turn it into a moral issue for those men or a personality flaw because it absolves their wives of their modern mating choices.

– Illustration, Stefan Schmidtz

Published by Rollo Tomassi

Author of The Rational Male and The Rational Male, Preventive Medicine

440 comments on “Alpha Widows

  1. Blax, I was considering “r” vs. “K” modes of reproduction within the US context. The current ‘r’ mode is failing dramatically. I have no idea what your context was.

    I want to thrive, but even more, I want my seed to thrive. And part of thriving is biologically reproducing and maintaining your heritage, wisdom, work ethic, etc.

    I was in an irascible place yesterday and apologize for my snarky comment. I had a problem and fixed it with Game. People were trying to deny my daughter compensation and were trying to demean her and she wasn’t standing up for herself. I had a “Come to Jesus” talk with DG. DG realized that she was being a wuss and decided to fix that. Fixed. Today DG stood up for herself and demanded her pay and refused to do the bullshit. She will get her pay and is no longer being asked to do the bullshit. I’m a happy camper and so is she. Thriving.

    I want Grandbaby Gamer to have many more kids than I did and to teach them wisdom and train them to be wise. To have Game. To have Discernment. To have Prudence and Discretion. Wisdom leads to health, wealth, and happiness.

    Proverbs is nothing more than a primer and a man must develop his own wisdom beyond that without moving away from the basics.

  2. “Why women fuck ugly Uber Drivers even if the guy who rejected her just 30 minutes ago is Super Hawt.”

    Machts nichts. You are blinded by short term thinking. PIV <> reproduction. Only when PIV leads to fruit is there reproduction. If the fruit is a fruit, your line will end. Your seed must also propagate. Hence, you must instruct them. Teach them to not become cannon fodder like most of ‘r’ production and how to thrive.

    “Your Theory of Reproduction badly fails.”

    XD

  3. “Today DG stood up for herself and demanded her pay and refused to do the bullshit. ”

    Fighting for her pay? Is that what game is for? Turning her into the son you never had?

    You have an unnecessarily complicated home life to be that involved in your daughters career.

    Women function best within the interiority of humanity. Home, hearth, children and such. Feminine always and all ways.

    How is telling your girl that she’s a wuss going to help your legacy? Dime to dollars she doesn’t like herself much with a foot in both masculine and feminine world’s. It’s affecting her competence and confidence as a woman and you call that success.

    ASD can’t discern self-sabotage from thriving.

    And holy hell, now ASD puts the pressure of generation on a 1 year old.

  4. Its often repeated fallacy of manosphere that all the single moms out there are getting knocked up by the same top tier Alpha Males with superior genetics. Their bastard kid is just as likely to be product of beta male running clown game on them while they were drinking and had birth control fail.

  5. https://patstedman.com/2019/08/08/defense-of-rollo-tomassi/

    Note how he unironically links all of his prior obsessive blog posts about me in the beginning. 5 posts and a ‘podcast’ with Artful Man where they kvetch about me for 3 hours in 2 years. Lets just clear the air here, the guy is obsessed with me and my work. His OCD would be flattering except that I know that ADJ invited him to speak at the 21 Convention prior to his meltdown and it’s kind of creepy now.

    All of these guys are in for a penny on all this new agey shit. Do I need an E-Meter now to register my ‘vibrations’? Some crazy shit’s gonna happen in the next 2 months and all of this OCD shit will make sense.

  6. Fact

    Its often repeated fallacy of manosphere that all the single moms out there are getting knocked up by the same top tier Alpha Males with superior genetics.

    If this is often repeated, it should be easy for you to point to examples. Please do so.

  7. From red pill summit to pundit centerpiece along the bull-in-china-shop path. Post-election it will be a pivot to what?

  8. Hi guys, I am relatively new to all these, I only heard about Rational Male from my colleague at work cause I was talking about my girl problems. I haven’t gotten real far in the book but I was wondering if there was a way to get out of an IJBF friendship. She says she’s not looking to date right now, but says she’s in a situationship with with some guy. I tell myself oh the guy doesn’t like her back to feel better about myself. Says she won’t lead me on and she would be fine if I didn’t want to be friends anymore. I understand she has more power since clearly she doesn’t like me as much as I do. I need help, I want to know if there’s anything I could do to redeem myself, I really like her company so I’m torn cause I don’t want to let go.

  9. Novaseeker, I was looking for a review of The Anatomy of Female Power and stumbled upon your old blog. Do you still post your own stuff someplace? And what do you think of the past decade since you wrote that review? Seems on point to me.

    Hey Just Beers —

    I haven’t written my own blog in quite a few years now — no time to do it regularly, so I closed it down years ago.

    Chinweizu’s book is interesting, if a bit dated. I’d say that events of the last ten years have accelerated the changes in a way that I didn’t foresee in 2009 when I wrote that review. The biggest changes being the rise of the smartphone and dating apps/sugar/insta changing the landscape for average guys. For average guys without Game things were pretty bad in 2008-2009, but in 2019 they are much worse than they were then. I think Chinweizu’s overall analysis is still interesting and helpful but there are some curveballs that technology has thrown in the last ten years that have been very impactful on average guys with no Game (yesteryear’s AFCs).

  10. “I want to know if there’s anything I could do to redeem myself”

    Sure. Forget about her and go out and pick up some other woman you’ve never seen before. Then do it again.

  11. Kxnx
    I want to know if there’s anything I could do to redeem myself, I really like her company so I’m torn cause I don’t want to let go.

    First: Stop living inside your head. She’s LJBF’d you, don’t pretend otherwise.
    Second: She’s LJBF’d you, there is nothing to let go of beyond your own infatuation.
    Third: Do what kfg said to do.
    Fourth: take this to Field Reports.

    PS: There is no “soul mate” for you, there are many girls who you would get along with just fine. One-itis is bad stuff, don’t do it.

  12. DG has three offers of permanent employment, including one for over .5 million dollars/year

    but EI wants DG to “submit” to her unemployed, homeless, worthless husband and let her daughter starve

    lol @ EI and his ivory tower bullshit

  13. is my browser broken? Did Rollo delete the RMG post?

    If so… Good.

    Rollo no one really cares about ADJ and what happened as it relates to YOU. Sure he is a tool and a great subject for mockery but that’s it.

    Never mention him again. Let him keep pining for you. 1/3 of his feed is about you at any given time. Lol

    He will be gone completely in 2021.

  14. ASD

    “DG has three offers of permanent employment, including one for over .5 million dollars/year

    but EI wants DG to “submit” to her unemployed, homeless, worthless husband and let her daughter starve”

    Do you even Red Pill bro?

    What’s better for your grandkids you’ve been moaning about and thriving?

    Shekels? Or them growing up in a home where their mother follows their father’s leading?

    Stop undermining your own progeny.

  15. “Stop undermining your own progeny.”

    @ Sentient.

    Thank you.

    It’s not about sex. It’s not about a paycheck. It’s not about control. It’s not about ASD.

    Measure yourself with something outside yourself for once ASD and easy on the ivory tower stuff. I’m here with you for a reason. I bleed as you do.

  16. @ASD

    Jeff Epstein once said: “How is a man the better for it, if he gains the whole world at the expense of losing his own soul? For a man’s soul, what price can be high enough?”

    No wait, that was an old white dead guy….wait Epstein’s is now an old white dead guy too….wait that’s all voodoo churchianity FI fueled conspiracy!! That’s it!!

    DISREGARD.

    https://media0.giphy.com/media/9HQRIttS5C4Za/giphy.gif?cid=8fc3c8978792db035c6115bb752621963ce522793b36ab04&rid=giphy.gif

  17. Thanks Novaseeker, re: The Anatomy of Female Power. Regards to dating, and your take on the online scene, I couldn’t agree more. It’s been very good for me, but I imagine it is not good for most.

    Re: leaving a legacy, and having a successful life, I’m simply wondering what being a lifelong mentor/coach/teacher means. A colleague of mine has two daughters, yet no grandkids to speak of. Yet he really crushed it as a coach and teacher. When he retired, the room was packed and the stories were rich. Sounded almost like a eulogy even though he was standing right there.

    Despite his genetic line possibly ending, is this not a good life lived? He’s super content, by all measures as far as I can see…

  18. Yollo Comanche: “but resented the possibility that they might be responsible for engineering the worthlessness of their own children.

    And nobody is allowed to talk about it or else they end up admitting that they aren’t in control of their own lives. That is, they aren’t equipped to deal with being born to cowardly people. ”

    That hit me like a ton of bricks, luckily not for me, per se, but as a warning for what I don’t want for my own child. Thank you for that.

  19. Hi guys, I am relatively new to all these, I only heard about Rational Male from my colleague at work cause I was talking about my girl problems. I haven’t gotten real far in the book but I was wondering if there was a way to get out of an IJBF friendship. She says she’s not looking to date right now, but says she’s in a situationship with with some guy. I tell myself oh the guy doesn’t like her back to feel better about myself. Says she won’t lead me on and she would be fine if I didn’t want to be friends anymore. I understand she has more power since clearly she doesn’t like me as much as I do. I need help, I want to know if there’s anything I could do to redeem myself, I really like her company so I’m torn cause I don’t want to let go.

  20. “What’s better for your grandkids you’ve been moaning about and thriving?

    Shekels? Or them growing up in a home where their mother follows their father’s leading?”

    “What’s better for your grandkids you’ve been moaning about and thriving?

    Shekels? Or them dead?”

    fify

    Red Pill praxis always has to be adjusted to the particulars. Don’t you Red Pill bro?

    The Son In Law is very game resistant. He’s a self-righteous know-it-all churchian who won’t support his own daughter. I’ve done far more for the baby than her father has. I think that he bought her a bath toy once that cost him a buck max. No milk, formula, diapers, wipes, etc. from him. His parents have given her clothes and toys, but the SIL is a loser because he won’t support his own daughter.

    SIL is proudest that he stands for “truth” (as he alone sees it). He’s not ashamed that he doesn’t support his daughter. I’m not giving SIL any time or attention (or respect) until he does so. (That is dog training game.) “Anyone who will not take care of his own is worse than an unbeliever.”

    If the SIL were able to support his family, I might agree with you. Right now you are just being silly in ivory tower mode.

    Some people think that the man is always right. It ain’t necessarily so (especially if a man is Blue Pill). That’s the Red Pill, bro.

    If you can give helpful advice about my situation, down where the rubber meets the road, that would be appreciated. Otherwise, I’ll appreciate the intent but I won’t follow the advice and will explain why your advice fails for the other guys.

  21. “Shekels? Or them dead?” fify”

    Holy drama queen. ASD, consider this all in another possible less extreme way and you might relax and have better vision how to proceed. If you had a disinterested yet good friend-mentor-council how might he see this differently?

    You write as a man with few options.

    You have more options though to redeem them you must choose to accept them as extant. You can’t understand what you choose not to.

  22. @theasdgamer

    Red Pill praxis always has to be adjusted to the particulars. Don’t you Red Pill bro?

    i think you are missing some points…

    The Son In Law is very game resistant.

    FI/BP/social conditioning and ‘sperg special interest pattern grooving… do YOU maybe have any insight on this?…lol

    He’s a self-righteous know-it-all churchian who won’t support his own daughter.

    come on dude, @Rollo is writing a whole BOOK about the FI coopting the churchianity ‘male space’… but since that ‘churchianity’ value set includes ‘supporting’ (like a good beta provider) can’t you leverage that inconsistency into some action?… if not, why not?… hint – shaming won’t do sh*t… except groove existing patterns…

    I’ve done far more for the baby than her father has. I think that he bought her a bath toy once that cost him a buck max. No milk, formula, diapers, wipes, etc. from him. His parents have given her clothes and toys, but the SIL is a loser because he won’t support his own daughter.

    i can smell your shaming attitude through the computer screen… which is a great way to make him feel bad, but won’t change his behavior…

    how would THAT work out for YOU if somebody approached you wanting you to change your behavior?… and just shamed you for your current behavior?… cuz i gotta tell ya, as a fellow ‘sperg, (((I))) couldn’t even HEAR that sh*t (the possibility of change)… much less be open to consider it… much LESS have a game plan to get there…bc the ‘shaming’ (as well as the pattern grooving of ‘limited interests’) triggered the ‘bad feelz’ which overrode any idea that i could (or even deserved to) change… there was no path to daylight, only wallowing in ‘my mistakes’…

    that’s changed now… thanks to RP/TRM/etc… but i still remember it…

    SIL is proudest that he stands for “truth” (as he alone sees it). He’s not ashamed that he doesn’t support his daughter. I’m not giving SIL any time or attention (or respect) until he does so. (That is dog training game.) “Anyone who will not take care of his own is worse than an unbeliever.”

    how’s that FI workin’ out for ya?…lol

    that’s not dog training game… it’s FI shaming game… you can’t train a dog to do a positive action (fetch that money…lol) with negative reinforcement… using negative reinforcement (smack his nose with a newspaper/shaming/criticism/etc), you can only get the dog (SIL) to avoid that situ… and feel like sh*t…

    ‘modeling’ a dog’s (or SIL’s) behavior is only possible with hands-on POSITIVE interaction reinforcing the desired behavior… through step-by step shaping/modeling…

    you can’t do that without time/attention/respect… to the dog OR SIL…

    If you can give helpful advice about my situation, down where the rubber meets the road, that would be appreciated.

    how did the last advice about befriending him and helping him plot a path to daylight work out?… bc that’s the only real way to get what you say you want him to do…

    good luck!

  23. ASD, she’s not our daughter. We’re not going to make any special pleadings for her, nor against SIL.

    “If you can give helpful advice about my situation, down where the rubber meets the road, that would be appreciated.”

    Sure, SIL should fire up the van and get as far away from this shit show as he possibly can.

  24. @kfg

    “More generally, if you’re spending more than an hour traveling just to see a woman you’re probably doing it wrong.”

    More generally still, if she is into you she will accept (or suggest, if you are making her really wet from afar) that it’s she who is to do the travel to meet.

    “This is only part, and the least important part, of the story. What she is doing is fishing for a man to pay for her to come to his country. That is the sole point of a woman being on an international dating site. There are plenty of thirsty betas within walking distance of where she is right now, but she wants to get out of that place.”

    Depends on socio-economic class, country of origin, and what site/app she’s on.
    Take OKCupid (and USA-centric apps generally) and you have a lot of HB7+s, 8s and 9s even. They are looking for their David Beckham, or their sugar daddy.

    Others are online because while they are ungainly (to misshapen) they can’t resign to mate within their own SMV category.

    Others want to be paid, like honest women of course, not prostitutes!
    He should be hard-working, ambitious, generous, love me and my family.

    There is still a little % of semi-romantic dreamy girls specially in Asia, but the USA-originated Misandristic Indoctrination Program is succeeding in turning them into narcissistic exploit-o-machines like the rest.
    If you propagandize people showing them full-time that being humane, per se and with a man, is “weakness”, even the % who by their nature would have such inclinations will feel shame at them, and, if they aren’t, play the **** [insert your favourite name for the woman behaviour propagandized as cool].

  25. One day I’m going to have to look at this ” OkCupid ” and ” tinder ” shit. It’s mentioned so much that I’m getting curious.

    I think these things are super counterproductive for men, but for the entire time I’ve been reading in the sphere, they just keep coming up.

  26. Is bitch muscles having gama male personality melt down on twitter again? Who would pay thousand dollars to listen to that live?

  27. Not relevant to the topic but needing recommendations. Why should or shouldn’t you let your wife find out that you are reading the blog and The Rational Male books? Is an argument that her knowing you better and as a result feeling closer and more comfortable being intimate a reason to tell her about how you are reading them? Thanks, men.

  28. ” . . . her knowing you better and as a result feeling closer and more comfortable being intimate . . .”

    Houston? We have had a problem.

  29. ASD

    He’s a self-righteous know-it-all churchian who won’t support his own daughter.

    Hmmmm… How those rent checks going with Daughter #2? You buy her a new car lately?

    SIL is proudest that he stands for “truth” (as he alone sees it).

    So he has a strong MPoO? I see…

    He’s not ashamed that he doesn’t support his daughter. I’m not giving SIL any time or attention (or respect) until he does so. (That is dog training game.)

    Yeh. How are you at Wolf Training game? [Hint – it’s a trick question. You don’t train wolves]

    Anyone who will not take care of his own is worse than an unbeliever.”

    That would be a touching Hallmark card to send to DG2, along with the deed to her [in best Price is Right voice – “new house!!!!”]

    If the SIL were able to support his family, I might agree with you.

    Looks like he’s figured out a way to… have you?

    Some people think that the man is always right.

    He should always have the opportunity to prove that to his wife. “Right” might not mean “your way” or “shekels”…

    I won’t follow the advice

    We know…

    will explain why your advice fails for the other guys.

    Not seeing this…

  30. “will explain why your advice fails for the other guys.”

    Compare yourself to the badass youthful ZFG youngshagger killing it this week.

    See my man? Best compare yourself with something better than yourself and emulate that.

    Youngshagger chose to be different, acted and got results.

    You love your stasis, defend it until death and collateral damage lives all along the way.

  31. “Is an argument that her knowing you better and as a result feeling closer and more comfortable being intimate a reason to tell her about how you are reading them? “

    No. Not even close.

    She won’t like the new you. For a while. Until she does.

  32. @12pointbuck:

    Hint 1: Have you ever heard the saying, “familiarity breeds comfort and intimacy?”

    Yeah. Neither have I.

    Hint 2: Taken is not simply a Male Power Fantasy. It is equally a Female Security Fantasy.

  33. “Compare yourself to the badass youthful ZFG youngshagger killing it this week.”

    Good point. I have a grandchild who is thriving by all standards. ys is still a darwin award candidate.

    Sex feels so important because of the drive. There are no feels to lead to reproduction, hence the Pill and abortion.. Don’t be fooled/controlled by feelz.

  34. @Blaximus

    I can resume those apps/sites here saving you time:

    I am independant smart, confident, highly educated, love salsa dancing singing, most of all lov travelling.
    Have travelled to 19 countries and will be in #20 and #21 next Sept.
    Independint and strong

    You should make me laugh, fun, have ur shit together, confident but not arrogant, travel the world with me, respect women

    Don’t ever contact me if you are a Trump supporter, a redneck, or don’t respect women.

    [Their only worry is that you respect women… ;)…]

    The above is an average, and they look so cloned from each other that you doubt if the site admins are trolling men and those profiles are fake.

    1. @Blax. Christ on a bike, that’s about right. That is a snapshot of every woman on every dating site/app.

      More Red Flags than a Raiders game. Look at me being all American. Men of value want nothing to do with ‘independant’ women who have obviously been railed into triple digits.

  35. @12pointbuck

    The very fact you are here reading this site (and asking that question) indicates your wife isn’t the Female Unicorn (which may, or more likely may not, exist) whom you can share everything about yourself to without meeting a penalty and who will share everything about herself to you.

    Or doesn’t it? Ask yourself.

  36. 12pointbuck
    Not relevant to the topic but needing recommendations. Why should or shouldn’t you let your wife find out that you are reading the blog and The Rational Male books?

    What is the first rule of Fight Club?

  37. “I have a [matrilineal] grandchild . . .”

    You have a position, but it’s the weakest possible.

    And that places the principle burden of performance on you while forcing you into playing matrilineal game.

    What does SIL get out of playing your matrilineal game other than chafed shoulders and a compressed spine?

  38. Is an argument that her knowing you better and as a result feeling closer and more comfortable being intimate a reason to tell her about how you are reading them?

    “Shuttle Challenger, go with throttle up…”

  39. Fred Flange running a Russian botnet
    Miley Cyrus

    Permanent damage since Di$ney got a hold on her. Sorta like Judy Garland.

  40. @TT
    She has said that she doesn’t want it to be like having sex with a stranger. I even ran by the idea of me being a mystery to her and that’s when she said what she did about having sex with a stranger. She wasn’t lying when she said what she said about being close for intimacy, so perhaps she is the unicorn.

  41. 12pointbuckaroo

    “Why should or shouldn’t you let your wife find out that you are reading the blog and The Rational Male books?”

    If you want a thoughtful answer to your question in context, perhaps you should explain why you came to The Rational Male. Are you trying to solve a marital problem? Who (metaphorically) are you and where do you want to go? Where have you come from?

    Or do you want us to comment on universal riddles?

    “I even ran by the idea of me being a mystery to her and that’s when she said what she did about having sex with a stranger.”

    So you are asking permission to change yourself? Why?

    Does she have a lot of desire to fuck the person you are now? Without reservations?

    Who said you will be a mystery down the road, as opposed to self evidently having conviction and purpose? Right there in front of her, to not puzzle over.

    Are you happy with who you are and where you stand on your own two feet right now?

    What else is your wife like?

    What plans do you have for deer hunting this year?

    Why is your avatar name 12pointbuck?

  42. @12pointbuck: “She wasn’t lying when she said what she said . . .”

    No, she wasn’t. But she was speaking cat and you were hearing dog. What she was saying is that she doesn’t want to have sex with you like she has sex with strangers.

  43. Addendum:

    You aren’t in a good position. Read through the blog from the beginning. Do NOT talk about Fight Club, it will only make things worse, possibly irreparably. You’re going to need help and support. Go to the Field Reports section where there are people who will do their best to give you all you need.

  44. Women Are Not Liars

    “Keeping your word” is a masculine trait, in men or women. A person with a feminine essence may not keep her word, yet it is not exactly “lying.” In the feminine reality, words and facts take a second place to emotions and the shifting moods of relationship. When she says, “I hate you,” or “I’ll never move to Texas,” or “I don’t want to go to the movies,” it is often more a reflection of a transient feeling-wave than a well considered stance with respect to events and experience. On the other hand, the masculine means what it says. A man’s word is his honor. The feminine says what it feels. A woman’s word is her true expression in the moment. –David Greenberg

  45. 12pointbuck
    I even ran by the idea of me being a mystery to her a

    Do not “run by her” such ideas, that’s a form of negotiating desire.
    Learn to read her better than you do now, then decide what you want and do it. Calibrate to her reactions. Don’t expect her to tell you anything directly, learn to read her and you’ll see everything.

    She’s not a man with boobs. Stop treating her like one.

    PS: What is the first rule of Fight Club?

  46. ““I have a [matrilineal] grandchild . . .”

    You have a position, but it’s the weakest possible.”

    Explain how my position is weaker than that of someone having no offspring. I dares ya.

    Matrilineal? wtf? It takes two…the baby looks more like me than like her ma…ears…eye and skin color…hair is auburn like mine, although it looks blond in bright light…shape of the head…

    “And that places the principle burden of performance on you while forcing you into playing matrilineal game.”

    A man always has the burden of performance…you aren’t getting through to me about matrilineal game…daughter made 1700 smackers today, after taxes

    any of you all who don’t want your shekels–I’ll be happy to take them…(it’s so easy to expose bullshit)

    I love the baby and game all my women. The baby is very sharp and games very well herself. We are all on to her, of course, the little dickens…

    son in law doesn’t respect himself and threatens suicide to get attention…he’s basically a five year old…like so many young “men”…he blames daughter for all his problems…why he’s homeless…why he can’t hold a job…weak…loser…

    …hotel hostess tells me she doesn’t like sleeping with her husband…giggles…just because I gave her a little attention…

  47. “Explain how my position is weaker than that of someone having no offspring. I dares ya.”

    A person with no offspring doesn’t have a position.

    “Matrilineal? wtf?”

    A daughter of a daughter. All your legacy eggs are in one basket. It defines your position.

    “…you aren’t getting through to me . . .”

    I didn’t expect to.

    ” . . . daughter made 1700 smackers today, after taxes . . .

    It’s babies, all the way forward. She isn’t making any boy babies while she’s making smackers.

  48. “Explain how my position is weaker than that of someone having no offspring. I dares ya.

    Matrilineal? wtf? It takes two…the baby looks more like me than like her ma…ears…eye and skin color…hair is auburn like mine, although it looks blond in bright light…shape of the head…”

    Wait…

    What site did I stumble into?

  49. “ys is still a darwin award candidate.”

    OMG we are watching ASD implode. IRT.

    I’ve never seen anyone blow through the seed corn of life with such stupidity. Guys like ASD focus on the weakest most dependent characters in his life to claim authority. Hence ASD heaps all his praise and potential on a non-sentient infant and dismisses the sentients in his life as failures as they don’t do his will. He turns the insecurity dial to 11 and thinks he gets 5x as much RP result if he’d just leave it at 2.

    ASD refuses realizing his family members (or anyone) don’t want to be used as puppets or controlled as step-and-fetch-it ASD life-purpose-niggers (no offense). People want their own meaning and find it perplexing ASD, as a father cum slavemaster, would steal their meaning for himself.

    Hence the shit-show. The moment ASD can’t physically or mentally perform (which is sooner than he thinks) they’ll ignore him completely and at his perfunctory funeral give some pat eulogy about him being a good dad, roll their eyes and split the estate.

  50. Right now, I’m dealing with a young man ( 24 or so ) that’s become a father for the first time.

    He wants to not screw up his child’s life, but he’s uncertain of his ability to figure out what’s best to do amid all of the female advice and single mom gibberish all around him. He’s slowly melting down and it’s only been 2 months..

    What is a ” father “?

    The preceding 2 decades have furiously tried to strip ” father ” of meaning and authority. This only results in a flood of semi morons populating the landscape in the future, a society of dupes so to speak.

    Nobody has perfect kids or perfect child rearing skills initially, but it is a burden of performance for a man to assume full headship and authority over his family unit.

    Remember: your kids didn’t ask to be born, and they don’t ” owe ” you shit. It’s your responsibility to teach, instruct, and discipline. Love is ( or should be ) automatic. Respect from them is built via word matching action. They learn whether or not they can trust you and your words and actions.

    This is no different initially for sons or daughters.

    Shit happens in life that are beyond out control, and that’s a given, but I’m sorry, it your kids won’t take counsel and instruction seriously you’ve managed to fuck up along the way at being a ” father “. You have to grasp how to inform and instruct. It starts the day they exit the womb. That very day. No excuses.

    Society loves to exalt motherhood at the expense or fatherhood. What else is new? Focus. Your kids depend on it. Never give in and take a backseat of you will reap untold fuckery later in life when you attempt to exert authority. Your kids will be like ” pfftttt…. “.

    So I’m trying to help the new father as I can see the stress and worry in his eyes. I can also see women rushing in to fill a perceived vacuum. This will be an excellent starting point to help him, getting him to see that he will be shut out of he cannot display his authority and take ownership of his child at least, and his family at most.

    Lol, feelings are going to get hurt initially. Respect will grow. Takes time.

    So as a dad I will counsel and support him, and I’m calling on my entire social circle or dads to assist and aid. But even so, the work is all on him. For decades.

    He laughed when I asked him ” do you wish you’d have pulled out yet? “.

    As HABD would say … Lol..But not joking.

  51. “This only results in a flood of semi morons populating the landscape in the future, a society of dupes so to speak.”

    Commonly referred to as “social workers.”

  52. “Shit happens in life that are beyond out control, and that’s a given, but I’m sorry, it your kids won’t take counsel and instruction seriously you’ve managed to fuck up along the way at being a ” father “. You have to grasp how to inform and instruct. It starts the day they exit the womb. That very day. No excuses.”

    Earth to Blax. Most men stumble on to the Red Pill after we become fathers. We mostly start with a shit position and have to muddle through the best we can. But you are aiming your counsel at first-time fathers, so move along…

    kfg, my position is vulnerable, no doubt. But it’s certainly not untenable. The baby is female and beautiful and intelligent and vigorous and healthy. Fertility is high in grandparents and daughter. Mrs. Gamer and DG and I are all on board with focusing on the baby. And we don’t suck at doing what’s best for the baby.

    Daughter Gamer may yet bear more children.

    The grandfather is Red Pill even if the father isn’t. Daughter is INTJ and aware of hypergamy. And I’m continuing to instruct her and she is receptive.

    I could potentially eventually have a male descendant who has a lot of my characteristics.

    Some of you all need a lesson in genetics. Men have an X chromosome as well as a Y chromosome. Your offspring will have 1/2 of your genetic material. So, even if a man only has daughters, a good proportion of his genetic material continues. Obviously, the Y chromosome dies out from his line, but if his brother has sons, that chromosome will continue…

    If you fail to have daughters, your X chromosome will fail to continue.

    The Y chromosome, as I recall, doesn’t have a lot of genetic material. This bears on the importance of the loss of your Y chromosome to your passing on your genes, not to whether men are important or not.

  53. “Hence ASD heaps all his praise and potential on a non-sentient infant”

    Well, she might be as Sentient as you are. Admittedly, that’s a low bar. ta-dum

  54. “Mrs. Gamer and DG and I are all on board with focusing on the baby. And we don’t suck at doing what’s best for the baby.”

    This is that same baby with the broken skull right?

    “Daughter Gamer may yet bear more children.”

    Desperate words…

  55. Genetics lesson?

    Pray tell.

    Being a father isn’t predicated on being blue or red pill, although one is definitely optimal.

    Concentration sole!y on the offspring misses the point. You are to teach and instruct, regardless of how they look or how beautiful you think they are.

    No sympathy for that ” stumble into fatherhood ” shit. No excuses because the outcome is too important, more important than what a man thinks is his legacy of genetic line. What if you come from a long line of slacking assholes?

    Betterment.

    If you helicopter and baby a baby, you will effectively raise a full grown baby.

    As a grandparent, your job should have been completed a long time ago, and the fruits of your labor are supposed to bear out now. If my daughters pick arrogant and useless Assholes that won’t care for their offspring, who’s ” fault ” is that?

    It starts from the womb. Effort is mandatory, stumbling optional.

  56. “Daughter Gamer may yet bear more children.”

    “Darwin Award Candidate” YS is only 17 years old and may yet father dozens. Picking on school boys for not being grandfathers is not a good look.

  57. Blaximus
    I’m sorry, it your kids won’t take counsel and instruction seriously you’ve managed to fuck up along the way at being a ” father “.

    In most cases, but not all. Behavior is at least partly inherited, maybe 40% or more.
    Throwbacks happen. Have seen a couple. Some people have to learn the hard way, or the hardest way. It’s sad, but it happens.

  58. @Chaldeans…

    “The brainwashed fool knoweth not that he be brainwashed; he thinketh his insane worldview to be entirely “normal”; that is the very essence of an effective brainwash; for the subject to never once consider any alternative to his slavery; and to vigorously recoil at any attempt by outsiders to free him of the yoke that binds him.”

    Truer words have never been spoken. You definitely understand the thinking of men inured in a blue-pill mindset/worldview.

    “I guess the 900 people who kill themselves every week in America were just “seeking attention”.”

    No… the people who successfully committed suicide likely meant it. Now for the ATTEMPTED suicides… probably the majority were just looking for attention. Did you know that women attempt suicide 3x more than men?

    “a pebble tossed from a beach can become a tsunami on the other side of the world. She is that pebble; while the Universe waits for that tidal wave to crash on The Other Side of Eternity…”

    Probably not. The ripples will dissipate within a few meters 😉

  59. AR

    ” In most cases, but not all. Behavior is at least partly inherited, maybe 40% or more.
    Throwbacks happen. Have seen a couple. Some people have to learn the hard way, or the hardest way. It’s sad, but it happens.”

    I’ll take 40%. Sounds reasonable.

    O/T

    I’ve been trying to parse out the ” inheritability ” thing forever with IRL observances. My jury is hopelessly deadlocked.

    My grandfather ( maternal ) was a notorious alcoholic. He died a year before I was born. Many of his brothers were partial to massive quantities of alcohol as well. For a time, my mother was imbibing way too much.

    Yet her 7 brothers didn’t drink much more than anybody else.

    Buuttt…

    I had many cousins that had problems with alcohol.

    So genetic somehow? I can’t figure.

    For the most part, I don’t drink. I have gotten blitzed out of my skull, mostly in my teens, but it wasn’t a regular thing.

    What I do know, is that I’m acutely aware that there must be some kind of vulnerability to addiction/alcohol in my maternal relatives ( large native American gene pool ). I happen to believe that I harbor great potential for becoming a hopeless drunk.

    My dad was a tea tottler ( sp? )and non smoker. He cautioned that I could drink, but not become a crazed drunk. Control.

    So did I have a clash of genetics?

    Or is it fear of becoming like the alcoholic side of the fam? This is why I continue to question the behavioral aspect of genes and inheritance. It’s only a potential or propensity.

    40% is good.

  60. Blaximus
    I had many cousins that had problems with alcohol.

    So genetic somehow? I can’t figure.

    Both genetic and environment IMO. Biology of Desire talks about neuroplasticity, so there’s something making some people go back again and again to something. Sometimes. In my extended family there are people who handle their wine and beer and cocktail or two with no problems, and there are people who started drinking hard at 30 and never made it to 60.
    I’ve known people who were addicted to sugar. Yeah, addicted. When you lose a toe or two due to diabetic circulation failure and still keep on with the sweet stuff, that’s addiction. When the rest of the foot goes and still can’t quit? Serious stuff. Now, abstractly that’s really close to what alkies will do – get themselves badly messed up but be unable to quit, until they hit the rock bottom (if still alive).

    But what if this is just a form of obsessive-compulsive behavior? I saw Johnny play earlier this century and was amazed he was still alive at all.

    https://psmag.com/social-justice/kicking-methadone-johnny-winter-77162

    How many times have you looked at a family member and then a picture of some long gone uncle and said, “Whoa! That’s odd!” . Bone structure, eye color, hair color, jawline are all inherited in part. Behavior patterns can be as well.

    Throwbacks exist. Have seen some.

  61. “I’ve known people who were addicted to sugar. Yeah, addicted. When you lose a toe or two due to diabetic circulation failure and still keep on with the sweet stuff, that’s addiction. When the rest of the foot goes and still can’t quit? Serious stuff. Now, abstractly that’s really close to what alkies will do – get themselves badly messed up but be unable to quit, until they hit the rock bottom (if still alive).

    But what if this is just a form of obsessive-compulsive behavior? I saw Johnny play earlier this century and was amazed he was still alive at all.”

    I’m more partial to Edgar myself.

    But yes I agree. Lot’s of shit can be addictive, but the whole OCD thing is fascinating and I’d bet dollars to donuts that it is a component in the most hard core do-it-till-you-drop types.

    “How many times have you looked at a family member and then a picture of some long gone uncle and said, “Whoa! That’s odd!” . Bone structure, eye color, hair color, jawline are all inherited in part. Behavior patterns can be as well.

    Throwbacks exist. Have seen some.”

    The grandfather I mentioned? I look a whole lot like him. A lot of his grandkids look like him as well, even moreso than his own kids. It’s freaky.

    I used to ask family members ” what did he die of ” and the standard answer was ” he drank himself to death “, which didn’t satisfy me, so I got his death certificate and autopsy report ( as he’d died on the street ).

    Cause of death = Thrombosis. Autopsy found advanced cirrhosis of the liver ( surprise ). So much for the ” drank himself to death ” thing, but liver failure couldn’t have been too far off.

    All of my life and to this very day, older people in the county where my family is from can recognize me ( even if I don’t know them ) as being related to my deceased grandfather by looks. Sometimes, other assumptions come along with that recognition, lol. Whenever I’m down there, I make every effort not to die in the street.

    O/T again…

    Genes.

    There’s a guy I’d posted up here a few years back, because he is damn near my twin – even down to the bags under the eyes and copious forehead, lol. We’re the same age and all. But there’s a ” look ” that has made me so curious, I’m almost tempted to go into stalker mode to ask him about his family tree. I don’t know this guy at all, but we look the same, even growing the same kind of beard. And my family is gigantic and spread all up and down the eastern seaboard.

    But damn, there’s something odd going on here.

    http://epmgaa.media.clients.ellingtoncms.com/img/photos/2017/07/07/SavedImage_0529171627n_01-1_t750x550_MpcZUiw_t750x550.jpg

    I get that genes can make one more prone to certain disease and behavior, but I haven’t seen conclusive research. The research is a lot like research on drinking coffee – one day coffee is a cure all, the next it will kill you.

  62. ‘Daughter’ Bot banned.

    Those thing use different dynamic IPs for every post. Every one of them uses the same protocol.

    Funny how they seem to find my comment threads when the bullshit gets thick with my haterz on other platforms.

  63. Rollo

    Funny how they seem to find my comment threads when the bullshit gets thick with my haterz on other platforms.

    Totally a coincidence, I’m sure.

  64. @IRL

    It doesn’t surprise me. It hurts to have your social approval torn away from you……when you’re a fucking coward.

  65. @IRL (or indeed anyone else): what am I missing about that Grant Cardone video?

    I saw the whole thing – what’s wrong with it? He’s using his daughters to emphasize his message – they seem like cute kids. What’s wrong with teaching your daughters (as well as your sons) about the importance of persistence and not giving up, whatever your goals may be?

  66. Culum

    “What’s wrong with teaching your daughters (as well as your sons) about the importance of persistence and not giving up, whatever your goals may be?”

    I dont know this guy and didn’t watch the video. As a dad of four girls I say your framing is wrong, if it is leading to your girls becoming inferior men.

    See ASD Shekel Daughter…

  67. Sentient

    Cardone is a ” real estate ” mogul cum motivational speaker. I recently discovered him during a vladtv interview on YouTube, but his thing isn’t my thing.

    I didn’t get the point of the video. Grant brought his daughters onstage and had them speak about not giving up. Idk, I saw it as him showing that he teaches his own kids the same message he charges you to come hear.

    I am incapable of hating on most kids so I didn’t see the ” wrong “. Not what I’d do, but not ” wrong “.

  68. ” As a dad of four girls I say your framing is wrong, if it is leading to your girls becoming inferior men.

    See ASD Shekel Daughter…”

    Did you invent a time machine or something? Because your advice is about as useful as a poop sandwich.

    And you need to get some specs, because your read of Daughter Gamer is very unfocused.

    Here’s a clue…just because a woman works outside the home doesn’t mean that she’s trying to become a man. DG has many problems because she submitted to my dumbass son in law…those problems are diminishing as she pays her way out of them…son in law has the emotional constitution of a five year old, as well as Borderline Personality Disorder…he managed to hide all this, which BPD people often do…

    …the son in law will not make a good father “as is”…he needs lots of therapy for his emotional problems…

    …and now you’ll say that Daughter Gamer should have chosen better…well, duh…have you invented a time machine yet?

    …probably her best option from a Red Pill perspective is to make herself as attractive as possible, divorce the retard, and marry another doctor who is divorced (or someone comparable)…

  69. asdgamer – Here’s a clue…just because a woman works outside the home doesn’t mean that she’s trying to become a man.

    The current K-12 school system is so infected with the fem imperative that a high percentage of girls that go through it will assume they must follow the career path – pure societal programming – you want to know how deep it goes, let me tell you the only way my son could meet up with tech companies visiting the school was to go to the Women in Stem event and his female guidance counselor basically told him that – she actually said this is your only chance to meet them go to the Women in Stem event. Slam head into wall now.

  70. ASD

    “DG has many problems because she submitted to my dumbass son in law…”

    So when she was spending prime fertility years in undergrad and med school and being a virgin until 35 it was because of her submitting to him?

    K

    Time machine you say? 😂😂😂

  71. “…probably her best option from a Red Pill perspective is to make herself as attractive as possible, divorce the retard, and marry another doctor who is divorced (or someone comparable)…”

    All aboard the ASD time machine…

    It’s almost as if she could have dispensed with all the schooling… Been attractive and married that Doctor at 20???

  72. @Culum

    So I don’t have a daughter and have no experience in raising one. But something doesn’t sit right with me when I see dolled up 9yo and 7yo on stage. My son is in that age group and I see how his peers (boys and girls) think.

    You see girls sending “the right message” (not incorrect but not deeper than any Tony Robbins-esque).

    I see them getting an emotional boost from dressing up and being celebrities like their mom.

    https://pbcdn1.podbean.com/imglogo/dir-logo/259895/259895.jpg

    Fast forward 10 years? Then another 20?

  73. “So when she was spending prime fertility years in undergrad and med school and being a virgin until 35 it was because of her submitting to him?”

    I’ve already stipulated that I was a Blue Pill dumbass back then and didn’t rear my daughters properly.

    I see you’re still making those poop sandwiches.

  74. “It’s almost as if she could have dispensed with all the schooling… Been attractive and married that Doctor at 20???”

    More like a prospective medical student…which means he has to finish college, medical school, residency, and fellowship before he’s an attending vascular surgeon. Your average college student doesn’t have access to doctors and there aren’t many unmarried doctors who are prime candidates for marriage. And your average premed will aim for being a primary care physician, who typically earn about $200k.

  75. @ASD

    I feel you man and hate to break up your pity party. Whats the worst that can happen? Your SIL offs himself? You end up raising your grandchild? How is this your problem? Whose frame are you in with the wife? with the DG? Are you afraid you will fall into GD’s frame as well?

  76. ASD

    I was a Blue Pill dumbass back then and didn’t rear my daughters properly.

    So what’s your excuse now you are supposedly RP?

    “Your average college student doesn’t have access to doctors’

    The receptionists and medical billers w/o college degrees in doctor’s offices don’t have this problem.

    “and there aren’t many unmarried doctors who are prime candidates for marriage.”

    Based on track record you cannot identify what a “prime candidate” looks like…

    “And your average premed will aim for being a primary care physician, who typically earn about $200k.”

    It’s shekels all the way down… Says the guy who isn’t Blue Pill…

  77. “The Y chromosome, as I recall, doesn’t have a lot of genetic material.”

    ASD as egalitarian-equalism geneticist.

    Quality over quantity.

    Have all the daughters you want…never to pass on what makes you a man. It’s a timeless recognition of generation and inheritance if a guy cares about his nature enduring after death.

    All the masculinizing nature and downstream benefits is in the Y. Matters not if “it doesn’t have a lot of genetic material.”

  78. “Whose frame are you in with the wife? with the DG? Are you afraid you will fall into GD’s frame as well?”

    His portfolio is entirely invested in the FI with nothing but “could happens” as prospects. He’s pretty well bound to it.

  79. Remember: your kids didn’t ask to be born, and they don’t ” owe ” you shit. It’s your responsibility to teach, instruct, and discipline. Love is ( or should be ) automatic. Respect from them is built via word matching action. They learn whether or not they can trust you and your words and actions.

    Well said Blax. This is the winning formula. It can be difficult but that’s why we’re the men and women are not.

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