Are Men Adapting to the New Sexual Marketplace?

I revisited the topic of Men Going Their Own Way (MGTOW) last Saturday on Rule Zero. I don’t like rehashing old debates I’ve learned will ultimately go nowhere. You simply wont reach most people who don’t want to be reached. Once they’ve had some experiential lessons in life, reinforced it with the tribalistic need to affirm the beliefs derived from that experience and then invest their egos in them it becomes kind of pointless. I’m not saying just give up on people, far from it, but do understand what you’re up against. This is why I say unplugging men from the Matrix is dirty work, and a lot like triage. Know what’s worth expending energy for.

Most men, and nearly all women, don’t form a belief set based on multiple, independently funded, peer reviewed studies or statistical analyses. We go with experience first and then modify it from there.

I did a bit of preparation for this talk. My schedule last Saturday only permitted me an hour so I wanted to be succinct and throw out at least something new to the conversation. There’s a lot of tribalism in the Manosphere today and it’s no surprise that MGTOW as a tribe in growing – but likely not for the reasons most MGTOW would be willing to admit. MGTOW is becoming atomized and commercialized in the same manner as I predicted the Red Pill would (and has) last year.

What that means is MGTOW is rapidly becoming the same commercial vehicle for grifters that the Red Pill was just a year and a half ago. Life Coaches, Relationship Experts, Fitness Gurus, even Christian men’s ministry pastors are all looking online to find out ‘where have all the men gone?’ When men were found in the Red Pill this is where the grifters would coalesce. Thus, you had every ‘brand-of-me’ self-improvement hack calling himself “red pill”. A few of them still do. A few of them read verbatim from my book(s) and plagiarize it as their own. But more now I see these same grifters referring to themselves as MGTOW without realizing (or even caring) what it really means to men.

MGTOW is the new ‘brand’ that lifestyle ‘coaches’ are adding to their twitter profiles and YouTube channel About pages. They see the potential for growth by association. Even if they get owned in their comments and feeds, adding the tag MGTOW will draw clicks. A few of these ‘coaches’ had a familiarity with the tribe and decided to finally commit in the hopes that it would boost views, others are former ‘power-of-positivity‘ life-coaches who slide into MGTOW because the definition of what makes a man “go his own way” is so loose now that it can align with virtually anything the guy had written about before his new affiliation.

It’s a real short step from “Make yourself your Mental Point of Origin” to “Make yourself #1 in your life” and then to “Go your own way.” I’ve had at least four “dating experts” (one female) claim Mental Point of Origin was their own idea in their subscriber emails as recently as August. Grifters used the Red Pill and are now using MGTOW to legitimize their brands today. In 2015 the MRAs decided to appropriate the Red Pill as their own brand to name a feminist’s “journey of self-discovery” movie The Red Pill. This appropriation is continuing with MGTOW now.

As I said on the Red Man Group back in May, the Red Pill is going to have a real PR problem in the coming year. Everything I predicted in my State of the Manosphere address a year ago has come to pass and I predict it will only intensify in the 2020 election cycle. The Gender War needs a convenient, easy-to-hate villain to point to in order to reinforce the Future is Female narrative.

Very soon MGTOW will have the same PR problem. And once the next Eliot Rodger or Alex Minasian incident occurs you’ll see these grifters scatter from MGTOW like roaches when the lights come on. When there are dead women on the sidewalk somewhere, and the MSM is using terms like ‘MGTOW’, ‘Incel’ and ‘radicalization’ that is when all the ‘tribes’ of the Manosphere will throw each other under the bus. That’s when you’ll know who was ‘playing MGTOW’ for likes.

Adaptation

One thing this re-debate of MGTOW has made me reconsider is whether men are adapting to the new realities of the sexual marketplace or just looking to make their necessities a virtue. At its simplest MGTOW is men refusing to make women the measure of their lives, and then molding their lives to their own plan. This pairs nicely with virtually every pet ideology and ‘positivity’ grift in the ‘sphere today. Even Tradcons will agree with MGTOW if it means “Be the best man you can be“. It agrees with Mental Point of Origin. It agrees with Roissy – “You shall make your mission, not your woman, your priority.” It agrees with “Women should only ever be a complement to a man’s life, never the focus of it.

If that was all there was to MGTOW it would simply be Red Pill. What “MGTOW” life-coach grifters don’t realize is that MGOTW is a derivative of the Red Pill. I’ve always argued that once a guy becomes Red Pill aware he cannot help but live in some different fashion. Even the guys who go into complete denial can’t unsee the truths of intersexual dynamics. It’s what you actually do with that new awareness that sets apart Red Pill praxeology from MGTOW in practice. There’s more to MGTOW than just refusing to make women the measure of a man’s life – it’s also deciding what actually is deference to women. And that’s where it becomes highly subjective.

In my last post I outlined how women were upset there weren’t enough ‘eligible‘ men to marry in the current (westernized) sexual marketplace (SMP) today. Of course the two most common responses were either:

  • Women are the victims of the SMP they created. Women’s solipsistic, socially enabled entitlements to an ‘economically attractive’ man (a man who exceeds her own productivity by 58%) only proves the point that women’s social media bloated egos have made them unrealistic tyrants. Now their beliefs and actions have come home to roost.
  • This is proof-positive that MGTOW is working! Finally women are waking up to the realities of their beliefs and actions. If enough guys abandon the SMP altogether then women will be forced to come back to reality and choose men based on other criteria than ‘economic attractiveness’.

One point I struggled to make on last week’s show was that I wondered if MGTOW believed that, from an evolved perspective, men and women are better together than they are apart. Unfortunately, I didn’t have time to pursue that question in depth; do MGTOW largely believe that, if social circumstances were different, men and women evolved to be complements to the other and the best social outcome would be for the sexes to be together rather than segregated?

For the last 60 years feminism has effectively driven a wedge between men and women. The Gender War of today exists because of a systematic segregation between men and women (don’t @me with the cultural marxism/’evil juice’ shit for the moment). Honestly, I’m sick of reading about how negative it is to merely point out the realities of this ‘gender cold war’ by Success Porn grifters, but is not MGTOW an adaptation to this segregation? Is not MGTOW an exacerbation of this segregation. When I read mantras like ‘Dogs, Dudes and Dolls’ it sounds an awful lot like ‘Cats, Girlfriends and Vibrators’.

Is MGTOW an adaptation to the conditions in a sexual marketplace that was (and still is) contrived by feminism/gynocentrism?

The following quote is from a long time commenter and friend Deti. This was from a larger discussion that began here if you want to get some context. Sorry guys, I just don’t have the space to repost the whole thread, but I don’t want this to get lost. Hopefully, it will inspire further discussion in this post’s comments:

I read Novaseeker as saying in his comments on this post, that women have adapted within this particular milieu. In other words, women noted the changes and have adapted to them. It helps that the changes were geared to them and prepared with them in mind. But women have adapted, and men have not.

About 100 years ago, it was all geared toward men and the sexual and marriage marketplaces were prepared with men in mind. They were prepared to advantage men and disadvantage women. Women responded to and lived within that milieu in a number of ways.

Using soft power, manipulation, deceit, subterfuge, behind the scenes machinations. Most women were more or less OK with marrying an OK guy, having OK sex, and living an OK life.

Of course, sometimes women cheated on the downlow. Sometimes women cuckolded husbands. I mean real actual traditional definition of cuckolding, which is a married woman getting pregnant by an Alpha and passing the child(ren) off as the Beta Husband’s. There’s no way to know how often that happened, but it wasn’t really rare – Maybe anywhere from 5 to 20% of children then weren’t fathered by their bio-moms’ husbands. In rare cases, not marrying and becoming spinsters, living as bohemians or as “favorite cousins” or “favorite aunts” with male relatives, working as teachers or seamstresses or some other job, and being live in nanny/maid. In rare cases, divorcing and living off family money or a husband’s alimony money. Living as widows and not remarrying.

The point is that women learned how to adapt. There are a lot of reasons for that, but they did adapt.

The main responses men have used today to adapt to changing circumstances have been:

  1. Game/PUA/Seduction – Use the changes to men’s advantage and go for easy sex and the bachelor lifestyle.
  2. MRA – Fighting the changes to advocate for either equalizing the laws or rolling them back to a return to Marriage 1.0 and pre-sexual revolution status.
  3. MGTOW – Check out of the new system, refuse to support or participate in it, and eschew relationships with women to varying degrees.

About, oh, 20 years in, I think we can safely say that option 2) is dead in the water and has been for some time. About the only real reforms here are that divorce and family laws are slowly, very, very slowly, moving toward 50/50 residential custody and away from alimony (except in the case of longer term marriages with breadwinner spouse/dependent nonemployed wife). Unless you have been married more than 20 years and support a housewife, you probably will not be paying alimony except for temporarily. Thats about the entire sum and substance of how “equal” it’s going to get between men and women.

That leaves 1) Game; and (3) MGTOW.

It’s hard to tell what will come out of this. I think we can say:

• Marriage 1.0 is dead and we are never going back to it for at least 2 more generations. If you think you’re going to have a “traditional marriage” where you don’t have to do much to maintain it or you can let up on your attractiveness levels, think again. Because that is not going to happen. If you’re going to marry a woman, you need to improve your attractiveness, marry a woman who is not financially dependent on you, and cultivate your own life separate and apart from her. You need a contingency plan in the event the marriage goes south. And with all that, you need to consider whether you want to risk bringing kids into the mix. You absolutely need a prenuptial agreement, even if it gets judicially torn up or modified later.

The bottom line is, people are still marrying, it’s just that it’s all being pushed out later and later, and people are staying single longer and spending less time married. Many women are meeting the men they eventually marry in their early to mid 20s, and then marrying in their late 20s and early 30s. That’s a paradigm that’s increasing in frequency; this idea of long term dating and engagements lasting 2 to 5 years while both the man and woman establish their careers.

If you want long term relationships you should consider marriage alternatives like living together, or being exclusive while living apart. You absolutely must avoid at all costs these polyamory/polygyny situations, and open marriages. You absolutely must avoid women who want to continue AF’ing it even after they marry. That must be an absolute no go, not an option, ever.

• Men have to improve and increase their sexual attractiveness to create, maintain, and sustain relationships with women. You can’t let up here. That’s IF you want relationships with women.

• More and more men will go pure MGTOW and will severely minimize if not eliminate their relationships with women. For a growing number of men, this option is going to be the best one, because (a) they did the work and still couldn’t attract women; or (b) they don’t want to do the work and it’s easier to stay as is than to try.

For most men, avoiding women entirely, except for paying hookers, is a no go. The thirst is that strong. The male sex drive is that potent. Most men want to have some contact with women, even if it’s just random hookups now and again. And the only way to do that is to make yourself as sexually attractive as possible. That just is so. Women are the ones who pick sex partners, and they have no problem with sharing attractive men with other women. So if you want sex partners, you have to make yourself sexually attractive. And you have to know male and female sexual nature, so that you know what you’re getting into, you know what you’re seeing, you know what women are doing, and you know what women really mean when they talk.

For men, improving one’s own attractiveness increases one’s power in the market. It increases his ability to control some of the selection process. It gives him an abundance mentality. It gives him the power to walk away from situations that disadvantage him. It gives him the ability to tell women “no” and to reject women who cannot or will not give him what he wants and needs.

On the other hand, going your own way can also increase your power in the market. It maximizes your control over your own life. It sharply reduces your responsibilities to others, and increases your opportunities. It frees up your resources to expend the way you want. Sharp reductions in responsibility means a sharp reduction in the needed resources for day to day living, meaning you can work less and increase your leisure time.

I think that more and more men will go pure MGTOW, which is essentially “make the best of a tough situation, be single, and don’t have a family. At least that’s better than getting divorce raped and it’s less work than going to the gym, getting in shape, and eating clean. This way I can eat what I want and work 30 hours a week, and live by myself in my apartment”. It’s kind of similar to women 100 years ago, where the path of least resistance was for Bertha BigGirl, Martha Dumptruck, and Plain Jane to “find a decent, OK man to support me, and probably have at least 3 of his kids. At least it’s better than living with Mom until she dies, and then having to live with my brother and his wife, and taking care of their kids.” And similar to the spinster, the MGTOW will be low status, or at least perceived as low status. But for the spinster and the MGTOW, their lifestyles will be at least better than whatever else they could have gotten.

Guys, Nova is absolutely correct in that men by and large are not adapting.

I think that what’s going on is that many men are saying “want to stay the same, don’t want to do a lot of work, but I still want women to be attracted to me and to be able to date a lot and eventually get married and have a family like (a) mom and dad had when I was growing up; or (b) like I didn’t get to have growing up.” Well, you can’t have that, at least not without working for it. If you want something you’re going to have to work for it. If you want women and sex, you’re going to have to make yourself attractive to women. And the way you’re going to do that, the only way to do that, is to stand out. And the way you stand out is by improving every area of your life – your job, your body, your finances, your lifestyle, your hobbies, your social acumen, and everything else that involves you going through your life.

The funny thing is that when a man stops caring so much about it, forgets about women, and sets about improving his life, he starts attracting women.

That’s the current state of things, I think.

I don’t disagree that we’re presently at a turning point in intersexual relations. After the advent of unilaterally female controlled birth control and the Sexual Revolution that followed the upheaval in how men and women come together and relate was inevitable. Now that we’re 50 odd years past that point we’re figuring out how reproduction, love, marriage, and something as simple as boy-meets-girl is going to look for future generations. The internet and a social media acculturation on a global scale has seen to it that it will likely never look like it did under the old social contract. There’s a theory that post-agrarian societies experienced a similar shift in intersexual dynamics in our ancestral past. Socially enforced monogamy was the obvious intersexual shift.

Right now we’re seeing a similar shift in intersexual relations. Is it simply better for men and women to live segregated lives? I don’t believe so, but it seems like a larger cultural narrative believes it’s time for both men and women to go their own ways. Until one side concedes, fuck any notion of evolved complementarity is the narrative I guess.

I do disagree with Deti in that I think men are adapting. They always have. It’s that the adaptation is counter to what we might hope is the natural order between men and women.

Published by Rollo Tomassi

Author of The Rational Male and The Rational Male, Preventive Medicine

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File under : Open Hypergamy, Sisterhood Uber Alles, women Heroes, Drumbeat, Media Propaganda, Creating a Narrative https://www.aspentimes.com/entertainment/review-adrienne-brodeurs-wild-game/ Adrienne Brodeur’s memoir begins with her mother, Malabar, waking the 14-year-old Adrienne in the middle of the night to tell her that she had just kissed her husband’s best friend. In the first flush of romantic excitement, Malabar takes her daughter into this confidence as if she was a peer and not a child hardly prepared to handle, let alone be party to, a parent’s infidelity. Poor Adrienne had enough to sort out in her own life. It was only that same day… Read more »

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Walawala
Which ad executive in their right mind thought THIS was a good idea? <i/i>

The “creative” who came up with it is surely a radical feminist, likely lesbian. Saying “no” to her would be thoughtcrime.

Gillette lost money…but P&G may still not care.

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SJF – Yes, the market is always changing, but I don’t think you at least some on here realize how much has changed. The pace of change in most industries is significantly faster today than it has ever been by an enormous factor and the dating market is no exception. An invention in 1500 would last hundreds of years. One in 1950 would last 1 or 2 generations. Today, 3-7 years. Read Disrupt: Think the Unthinkable to Spark Transformation in Your Business by Luke Williams for more information (not related to dating but still applies) Yes, if a 23 year… Read more »

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Blaximus
Men aren’t supposed to be women,

In your opinion…others disagree, and would chastise you for being insufficiently woke. Just for a start.

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A 35-50 year old man with money, in good shape, well dressed and a LOT of worldly experience will clean up like crazy.

If your “worldly experience” is devoid of sexual relationships with a number of women, you are apt to fail.
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_Collier_Township_shooting

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“An invention in 1500 would last hundreds of years. One in 1950 would last 1 or 2 generations. Today, 3-7 years.”

I don’t think that integrated circuits and telecommunications satellites are going anywhere soon. Don’t mistake product for invention.

I also think you might be underestimating the pace of change circa 1500 with the rediscovery of the classical world, the discovery of the new world, the discovery of the universe and the invention of the limited liability company.

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Sentient
Open Hypergamy, Sisterhood Uber Alles, women Heroes, Drumbeat, Media Propaganda, Creating a Narrative

All of that “off the leash”. It’s the female “monster from the Id” turned loose just a little more. Should easily sell as well as 50 Shades and Eat, Pray, Love did.

What’s the best musical background for that review?

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Sentient – “If your “worldly experience” is devoid of sexual relationships with a number of women, you are apt to fail.” If you do the things I said, you will have sexual relationships, increasing exponentially as your career/networth/confidence grows. Worst case scenario, you can just get a sugar baby or hire a hooker if it is that important to you – both massively cheaper than a wife with less stress and less risk. The emotional relationship side of what you need as a male is better served by your male friends and family. I think its important to stay in… Read more »

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Magus Once again, I don’t disagree with your recommendations for most young guys. I did what you recommend and I’m very glad I did. On the changing dynamic/landscape. You can keep discussing that all you want. It doesn’t change things much. In my profession, medical care, the landscape changed horribly from the seventies till the 2000’s. So much so that physician satisfaction with their job plummeted like a lead balloon every ten years. From like the high 80% to the low 20%’s. What is one to do about that? Whine and cry? Or find your niche where you are happy,… Read more »

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” . . . if a 23 year old guy gets buff as hell (2 hrs in the gym every day or at least most days) . . .”

15 minutes once a week at home, with little if any additional equipment required, plus some lifestyle changes, much of which doesn’t take up any time at all. The “health and fitness” industry is pushing product. They want you to buy as much of it as possible. This is not in your interest.

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“I also think you might be underestimating the pace of change circa 1500 with the rediscovery of the classical world, the discovery of the new world, the discovery of the universe and the invention of the limited liability company.”

See Nassim Taleb’s Lindy Effect in Antifragile: Things That Gain From Disorder

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lindy_effect

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kfg
The “health and fitness” industry is pushing product.

+1

Gyms rent access to machines and weights. It is very profitable if no one ever uses them; zero maintenance, for a start. Renting weights vs. buying them is not a really difficult economic problem.

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What is one to do about that? Whine and cry? Or find your niche where you are happy, healthy and successful. This is analogous to the intersexual dynamics reality. This is absolutely right. The general situation may suck, and it does pretty much suck, but it’s relevance to any individual man is simply contextual. It provides the context in which he must plan his approach and execute his plan. It doesn’t matter that most will not be able to do this — why should that matter to you? What matters to you is that you are able to do it,… Read more »

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Yeah, if one commits to trying to keep up with the winds of changing commercial society life is going to be unnecessarily hard/harsh. That goes for 20 year olds as well as 60 year olds equally.

Take what’s useful and disregard bullshit, and he smart enough to know the difference.

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These ‘Magus” types never like to address Sodini… “The perpetrator was 48-year-old Scott Township resident George Sodini (September 30, 1960 – August 4, 2009), a systems analyst at the law firm of K&L Gates. On a website registered in his name, Sodini chronicled over a nine-month period his rejections by women and his severe sexual frustration. “Who knows why? I am not ugly or too weird. No sex since July 1990 either (I was 29),” he writes. “Last time I slept all night with a girlfriend it was 1982. Girls and women don’t even give me a second look ANYWHERE.”… Read more »

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Blax: “Yeah, if one commits to trying to keep up with the winds of changing commercial society life is going to be unnecessarily hard/harsh. That goes for 20 year olds as well as 60 year olds equally. Take what’s useful and disregard bullshit, and he smart enough to know the difference.” I was just driving to work and Bob Seger’s Against the Wind was nice to listen to. “Let the cowboys ride (against the wind). And Bob Seger was troubled by the lyric “Wish I didn’t know now what I didn’t know then…” He thought it was grammatically incorrect because… Read more »

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Pertinent to the op, way back in the early 90’s Robert Bly wrote Iron John. Some nuggets in that book: one that stood out was men being IRON and women being COPPER.

Men suffer when they become like copper: malleable, conductive, taking on other forms too readily.

So, Blax is spot on as ever when he says look beyond all that, for yourself as a man.

Yet, walawala points out correctly, too, that the copper-women are taking on the shape of ever more strange and chaotic things.

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Magus comment of having other “high value” men in their social circle is not for nothing. And I would say it is essential to the masculine in real life. This need/desire/virtuous circle has not changed over time. Male spaces… Our annual October get together of 30 guys was an awesome peak experience. Normally there is one female bartender hostess for food. She flaked. And that made it even better than normal. (This is the party that had me get my ass in gear six years ago when annually one of the guys showed up to say his wife divorced him… Read more »

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SJF – it is absolutely not a trope. There are only 24 hours in a day and 8 of them will be eaten up by sleep and for the average person 10 of them will eaten up by 8 hour work day + lunch and commute (and hitting on women at work is nuts in this environment). The high achiever in their careers will likely work 1-2 more hours a day than that. That leaves exactly 4-6 hours a day (except 2 days a week) for EVERYTHING else including investing in your person and career growth outside of work, making… Read more »

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Forgot to include this comment for the exclusive invitees:

“Had a great time as always! This was my second invite! Nice to hang out with people who have the same drive! –Paul”

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Hypergamy doesn’t care if you saved her life after killing a terrorist in a mountain in Asia.
I was watching the documentary called The Dawn Wall, which is about one of the greatest climbers in the world Tommy Caldwell.
In this, there is the fact that he killed a terrorist after being days as prisoners, he, his girlfriend (ex-wife), and other friend.
So, after 7 years of marriage, she left him for another guy.
Hypergamy doesn’t care about shit.

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“Yet, walawala points out correctly, too, that the copper-women are taking on the shape of ever more strange and chaotic things.”

It doesn’t matter.

What women do/say doesn’t matter.

It should only matter to them and the rest of the herd.

Don’t join the herd.

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“Nearly every lifetime girl seeking “alpha” I know that’s slayed hundred+ notch count is broke as hell and even the ones that aren’t are significantly behind in their careers and retirement levels vs their friendset when they were in grade school or college”

….

Lol.

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“after 7 years of marriage, she left him for another guy”
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Can’t imagine why

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Magus SJF – it is absolutely not a trope. There are only 24 hours in a day and 8 of them will be eaten up by sleep and for the average person 10 of them will eaten up by 8 hour work day + lunch and commute (and hitting on women at work is nuts in this environment). The high achiever in their careers will likely work 1-2 more hours a day than that. That leaves exactly 4-6 hours a day (except 2 days a week) for EVERYTHING else including investing in your person and career growth outside of work,… Read more »

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“Hypergamy doesn’t care about shit.”

Actually hypergamy does care, it cares a great deal. It cares enough to take risk, to take action, to do… It just doesn’t care about the same stuff you care about.

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“Hypergamy doesn’t care if you saved her life after killing a terrorist in a mountain in Asia.
I was watching the documentary called The Dawn Wall, which is about one of the greatest climbers in the world Tommy Caldwell.
In this, there is the fact that he killed a terrorist after being days as prisoners, he, his girlfriend (ex-wife), and other friend.
So, after 7 years of marriage, she left him for another guy.
Hypergamy doesn’t care about shit.”

True.

A feature, not a bug.

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Sentient

“You think that “that” is limited to 16K guys? Or 16M guys? Of the 160M guys, how many aren’t satisfied with their sex life or relations with women?”

+100

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“after 7 years of marriage, she left him for another guy”

Hypergamy?

No. It is better explained by David M. Buss’ The Mate Switching Hypothesis. Otherwise known as finding a different mate.

Both Caldwell and Rodden(ex-wife) found other mates and had children by those new mates.

They weren’t one and only soulmates.

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Dawn Wall guy married someone far hotter and very into his shit who birthed him two kids shortly after.

Blaximus
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as it should be…..

theasdgamer
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“Half of men never face true adversity”

No True Scottish Diversity

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Trigger warning: reflection on autism “A lot of the adversity is self imposed.” (I enjoy your posts–even more if they have a lot of downvotes. You sound like an academic, but are actually far from it.) And some adversity is imposed by others (e.g., FI-imposed mental programs), but men have the capability of overcoming the adversity. If you’re autistic, you didn’t choose to be that way and it’s definitely a different kind of adversity. On the plus side, if you’re autistic, your body may be in better shape when you’re older than non-autists. And there was an interesting article that… Read more »

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“15 minutes once a week at home”

Pretend you are in federal prison and can only do bodyweight exercises…

…pushups, situps (raise feet if you need more weight), crunches, good mornings with half a bed (or dumbbells), leg lifts, single leg squats in a door frame, etc….

…you can put up a bar and do pullups, which you can’t do in a federal prison…

…you can exercise your lats with dumbbells…

…military press with dumbbells…

…of course, if you travel a lot like I do, you may have to rent weights.

single leg squats in a door frame won’t exercise your upper body like deadlifts will…

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“You can’t become a gym rat or spend hours approaching women and still execute WELL on the other things.”

for an educated t10 motherfucker this and that lol

hypertrophy is not the answer to hypergamy

it’s not pumped up water filled muscles, body fat percentage and the “right” shirt

it’s the will to go to the garage and deadlift heavy when it’s 10 below outside

most guys will never know their limits

because they are afraid to break themselves

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oh yeah, I forgot about this here…

“Blaximus That ad is totally on topic which if you take a moment to stop spamming us with your teenage reminiscences you’ll note is “Are Men Adapting to the New Sexual Marketplace?””

Lol.

Past, is prologue. ” teenage years ” are formative for the future.

Don’t hate, motivate.

theasdgamer
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“because they are afraid to break themselves”

…reminds me of the time where I was benching a measly 70 pounds as a 14 year old weighing maybe 110 lbs….a kid was “spotting” for me who turned out to be crazy and he started pushing down on the weights as I was lifting. I was able to lift the weight and defeat his pressure…that was some serious adversity…lol…he could have killed me…he got sent home from boarding school shortly after that…

adversity…diversity…perversity…

aqualinespirit
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aqualinespirit
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Hi, I am a 29 year old eastern european living in the UK. I am an engineer and make some good money, lift 3-4 times a week, do occasianally some mma in the evenings, ok dressed, but 5ft6 and balding :(. And guess what I can’t get pussy to save my life :D. I am thinking of taking the black pill. Just don’t see a way out of this, i bang hookers eveery now and then, cuz my T leves are a bit higher than avg and think about sex all the frickin time :D. I think black pill guys… Read more »

redlight
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redlight
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@aqualinespirit

If you spend very little of your free time interacting with women in social settings you get no free pussy. Likewise if you go out to clubs, pubs, and shows but you rarely interact same results. If your idea of interacting with a woman is to walk up and say hi, then fail.

Blaximus
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Blaximus
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Redlight, +100 Aqua Being an engineer, doing mma, making money etc. Those things are for you and a majority of women that aren’t golddigging won’t be wowed by any of this if you can’t spark attraction and interest. If your nose isn’t on the back of your head, there’s always a shot. You might consider spending as much time developing your personality and social skills as you did becoming an engineer and learning mma. All are equally important. I have a brother in law that start balding in his 40’s, and after his hairline went to the middle of his… Read more »

wahoo Mcdaniels
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@aqualinespirit “I am a 29 year old eastern european living in the UK.” Sounds like racist self discrimination. “I am an engineer and make some good money,” ^= I am serious and spend to much time wrapped around the axle. “lift 3-4 times a week, do occasianally some mma in the evenings,” Good, if you are doing these things for yourself. ” ok dressed,” ^= conformatist,needs to learn to peacock. “but 5ft6 and balding :(.” At least you aren’t cute; Short fat and bowlegged. Ive seen worse genetics that stepped up to the plate with charisma and charm on demand… Read more »

TT
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TT
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@aqualinespirit It is also hard to pinpoint what victory is, and victories are, isn’t it? You want to be more valued and better liked by females; but if that had happened consistently more than it has, perhaps you would have sunk in love for one of them — she would, initially, have partly reciprocated it, to then proceed to turn her back on you — and you would have gone mad, or killed her and/or yourself, and so on. We can hardly ever know what, in our walk of life, is a win or a loss. Perhaps if no female… Read more »

Blaximus
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Blaximus
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😑

Blaximus
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Blaximus
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… Yeah, give up mma because somebody might break your neck one day. It’s hard to know exactly what the future holds and whatnot.

wahoo Mcdaniels
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TT is one of the most articulate chatbots to frequent this space. HT to the programer!

Sentient
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Sentient
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Cats are not dogs

walawala
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walawala
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@aqualinespirit And guess what I can’t get pussy to save my life :D. I am thinking of taking the black pill. Just don’t see a way out of this There are two ways out of this: give up, go black pill, hate women, hate yourself and rationalize the whole thing as your life sucks. The second way is to start learning game both inner and outer game. Read the Mystery Method, start opening women. The reason Mystery wrote this was to put some sort of structure around meeting women. The routines, the various openers etc were designed especially for guys… Read more »

theasdgamer
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“… Yeah, give up mma because somebody might break your neck one day.”

…and don’t drive to work because you might die in a wreck…

…and don’t take a train because it might derail…

…and don’t walk because you might get hit by a vehicle…

…just stay in your flat and starve…

/sarcasm off

theasdgamer
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aqualine, if you want a diagnosis from other men, post your experiences in Field Reports

Wildside
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Wildside
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@Aqua. Stay on this forum and listen to the men and what they have to say. They are all good men. If you become Black Pill you will become an Incel because you want women but feel like you can’t meet them. That is a limiting mindset. Your height is not the limiter. Stay away from that road. A subject I do know about is Prossies/Escorts. My advice, stop wasting your money on them. These kind of women drain your masculine energy as well as your wallet. I was visiting them, at times twice a week. I got into the… Read more »

theasdgamer
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@Simon ” Most of the MGTOW I know are great and highly succesful men who made a superbly rational choice about the women of today – they are not worth ANY kind of effort or investment in terms of time, money, mental or emotional energy.” …and their MGTOW genes aren’t worth ANY kind of effort or investment in terms of time, money, mental or emotional energy–that’s what they themselves say by not reproducing…such men are voting that their genes are shit…selling themselves short…really fucking stupid…but hey, if you wanna win the Darwin Award, more power to ya… (of course, some… Read more »

Yollo Comanche
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Yollo Comanche
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@asdgamer

I wonder who the non-patriots are that keep downvoting your comments?

theasdgamer
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@Yollo

Probably a bunch of liberal soyboys.

theasdgamer
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And the issue really isn’t about patriotism, but biology. People who fear overpopulation are liberal because the overpopulation scare is part of the liberal narrative.

kfg
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kfg
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In the words of Inigo Montoya, “You might want to look that word up.”

Blaximus
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Blaximus
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hoo-boy…..

theasdgamer
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In the words of Mayor Shinn, “You watch your phraseology!”

Are you wanting me define ‘is’? lol

moonbasemgtow
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The future is up for grabs but I disagree with your prediction. MGTOW was already demonetized after the CNN interview and the 2nd wave adpocalypse on YouTube. There’s no money left. That’s why YogiOabs and Alexander Grace left MGTOW and rebranded as “Red Pill”. Also, Incel is a more popular search term than MGTOW, and Incels are creating “The Black Pill”. Because of Big John, the face of MGTOW to the MSM is just bitter divorced men. Full response on my blog here: https://moonbasemgtow.com/2019/10/15/why-big-john-saved-mgtow-rollo-tomassi-response/

theasdgamer
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kfg, you should probably look at some critiques of the Club of Rome’s “Limits to Growth.” We were supposed to run out of oil long ago because of overpopulation. E.g., By the 1970s, overpopulation hysteria came fully back into vogue. Stanford University biologist Paul Ehrlich published The Population Bomb in 1968, which opened with the lines, “The battle to feed all of humanity is over. In the 1970s hundreds of millions of people will starve to death in spite of any crash programs embarked upon now.” Shortly thereafter, in 1972, the Club of Rome issued a report called The Limits… Read more »

Blaximus
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Blaximus
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oh jeeez

kfg
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kfg
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“Environmentalists are liberals, in case you have forgotten.”

Some of these words aren’t just team names. They have actual meaning.

“Who is pushing the carbon tax?”

Wanna be aristocrat authoritarians. To the point where the only thing they hate worse than a fascist (whatever that is) is a liberal.

theasdgamer
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Lol, MGTOW looks to be as relevant as the old Shakers. Gone in fifty years and forgotten.

theasdgamer
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“Some of these words aren’t just team names. They have actual meaning.”

Lol, try to come up with an actual argument.

kfg
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kfg
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” . . . try to come up with an actual argument.”

In the words of Marion, madam librarian, “You’ll find it in Paine and Voltaire.”

theasdgamer
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“Language is my whore, my mistress, my wife, my pen-friend, my check-out girl. Language is a complimentary moist lemon-scented cleansing square or handy freshen-up wipette. Language is the breath of God, the dew on a fresh apple”

“There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, than are dreamt in your philosophy.”

“A rose, by any other name…”

“Politics makes strange bedfellows.”

Shakespeare anticipated Voltaire quite a lot.

I’m still waiting for you to hit the ball over the net.

SJF
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SJF
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“And the issue really isn’t about patriotism, but biology. People who fear overpopulation are liberal because the overpopulation scare is part of the liberal narrative.” @ASD I like your statements for the individual man. And humans were successful as a species by being good at overpopulating. Because of their large brains and adaptation over adversity. Which they did big time. But to suggest that over population is a goal is quite a miss-step. The proper goal is to have your tribe populate. Your tribe starts at two people and goes up-ward. And not to infinity. It goes to the Dunbar’s… Read more »

Anonymous Reader
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Anonymous Reader
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SJF
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SJF
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So, @Moonbasemgtow, Who are you and what is your story? Why are you here? Tell us what narrative you are selling? And WTF? is this: However, there are still scraps to be had, and that comprises of people like Rollo Tomassi and others that brand themselves as “Red Pill”. However, as their audience continues to shrink, they are opting to lash out at peripheral groups, like MGTOW. Rollo’s latest hot take claims that MGTOW has been infiltrated by grifters, and their growth will only lead them to becoming a target by the mainstream media in the next escalation of the… Read more »

SJF
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SJF
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I timed out editing, so: I mentioned upstream I was listening to Bob Seger’s Against the Wind on the radio driving to work around noon on Monday. Well, I’ll be darned. I drove to work this AM before 9:00 and guess what, it was playing again. Go Figure. A narrative of facing Adversity and dealing with it. Otherwise known as adapting. Which is fine for you MGTOW’s. Go ahead and adapt that way. But don’t talk down the Red Pill guys that find plunging into the feminine as a way as adapting to the New World Disorder. The greatest thing… Read more »

rugby11
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rugby11
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I don’t mind how hard life gets or whatever happens to me. All i have is my adaptions with time and perseverance, My grandfather would be 100 today if he didn’t die 8 yrs ago. i’m part of a scared legacy beyond the trauma of itself. I will get better and the process is more than stressful but that won’t mean i give up.
Just a place for re composure than a new charge out in the dance floor of life and relationships.

rugby11
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rugby11
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Cancún foam canon party A documentary about today’s young adult hookup culture and the stories in pop-culture that influence it. Liberated: The New Sexual Revolution is a documentary about today’s young adult hookup culture. The film follows the journey of college students during their Spring Break revelries, offering an insightful look into their attitudes and behaviors regarding sex. It is an honest and raw depiction of this casual sex environment where sexual violation has become normal. Liberated widens the view of today’s hookup culture by examining the role of pop-culture in shaping conceptions of gender and sexuality that underlie this… Read more »

Wildside
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Wildside
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@rugby11. Very eloquent. This is why this community is so good and why I stay here. It adds positive value and guidance for men who want to be part of life and like women to compliment their lives. MGTOW is a fad. A sales pitch. A cash in. I watched a video by Coach Greg Adams who was not best pleased that Rich Cooper had called MGTOWS ‘Doll fuckers’. Adams states that he is the real deal as he is not trying to sell anything and just deals in the truth. ALL the MGTOW and PUA coaches, charging 1000s, who… Read more »

redlight
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redlight
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I drop into a great restaurant and order the combo plate. It arrives, and is delicious as usual, when an older guy sits himself down and starts talking. He says he is the owner, and the restaurant business is going the way he said it would go, getting highly competitive. He says some other places have copied the best of his menu items. He goes on that Beyond Meat is the big thing right now, and some are selling the sizzle more than the Beyond Meat. Some dude walks by and says actually Vegan is the way, nobody wants anything… Read more »

theasdgamer
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“ASD seems to be advocating rabbit-like breeding.”

lol, no

theasdgamer
Guest

“Interesting fact, children’s brains between the age of 2 and 7 are unable to conceptualise an object existing unless it is in the line of sight. This can be demonstrated with ‘peek-a-boo’ games with babies and younger children.” Tested this–definitely not true. Babies can point to boxes containing crackers and will say “cracker”. And with peekaboo games they learn to anticipate. From what I can tell, MGTOWs just eschew LTRs and are Ok with sex and no kids. As I’ve said before, this behavior is biologically irrelevant–like the Shakers. If someone ought to feel ashamed, then shaming is appropriate, assuming… Read more »

wahoo Mcdaniels
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“Since the food was terrific, but the ambience was awful, how much a tip should I leave?”

The server gets the tip,if the setting was neat and clean and the service was prompt and courteous 20% is gratuitous.

Blaximus
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Blaximus
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” Shame ” is an outdated concept that no longer exists.

Blaximus
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Blaximus
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theasdgamer
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“” Shame ” is an outdated concept that no longer exists.”

just like women no longer exist if you pretend that you can’t see them

I tell ya, MGTOWs are such lolcows.

Incubus_Rising
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Incubus_Rising
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So Pat Campbell also addresses Anthony “Retard” Johnson as “Mr.President”.

https://www.1170kfaq.com/story/41185211/visionary-21-convention-founder-anthony-dream-johnson-becomes-first-president-of-the-manosphere

Rollo, you are a good thinker and writer, but an absolute shit judge of character.

Blaximus
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Blaximus
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” The problem I am having right now is that many factions of the media and the Manosphere are confusing and conflating the concept of a ‘red pill’ mindset with that of a ‘black pill’ mindset. When a man is truly red pill, he tends to evaluate women’s behavior in a manner that is realistic, objective, and fair and balanced. Conversely, when a man adopts what is known as a ‘black pill’ mindset, his attitude toward women tends to be more representative of negativity toward women, bitterness toward women, antagonism toward women, and in some cases, even blatant misogyny and… Read more »

Blaximus
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Blaximus
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Lol.

Church.

wahoo Mcdaniels
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To be perfectly Frank, the news should read 31 yo florida con artist sees opening to jack the slang term for an online male space and file it as his own llc trade name in an attempt to increase revenue for his failing conventions.

Should we rename our free space? Do we need a president?

theasdgamer
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“A narrative of facing Adversity and dealing with it. Otherwise known as adapting.”

adapting, lol…cutting off your own balls and hiding your head in the sand…adapting, lol

SJF, sometimes you are too funny

Wildside
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Wildside
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@Asd. My apologies, got the ages mixed up there. It’s much younger than 2 – 7. Up to 8 months a baby has not developed ‘object permanence’. They are unable to understand an object exists if it is not visible.

2 – 7 is preoperational. Kids logic is flawed and they don’t understand cause and effect. Hide and seek games can come down to “If I can’t see you, you can’t see me”

SJF
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SJF
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“adapting, lol…cutting off your own balls and hiding your head in the sand…adapting, lol” It doesn’t have to be. It is a tool to persevere. Epictetus, Marcus Aurelius and Seneca used adaptation/change in the sense of changing one’s emotions. Not hiding ones head in the sand but holding it high with a healthy masculine, mindset. Avoiding a feminine demeanor. Adaptation can be a process of Reduction. Sloughing off emotional fears. Facing Resistance and moving through it in a Flow State. Fear (irrational expectation of something bad or harmful) vs. Caution or discretion (rational aversion of truly harmful things). “Once you… Read more »

TTisabitupset
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TTisabitupset
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Her gift, if she is a good woman, is to test you with her darkest moods, over and over and over, until your consciousness is unperturbed by feminine challenge, and you are able to pervade her with your love, just as you are here to pervade the world. In response to your fearless consciousness, she will drench your world in love and light.” -David Deida, The Way of the Superior Man You wouldn’t expect anything lesser than that, from someone selling to “men” how to be “superior” specimens. Take what is tragedy, embrace it, and call it nice fine and… Read more »

Sentient
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Sentient
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“Adversity plays an important role in relationships… 👉 It’s going through those challenging times together that you get to REALLY know your partner and see what your relationship is made of! Don’t shy away from it… It‘s what adds DEPTH & COMMITMENT. ”

— George Bruno

Bruno at it again…

Wut wait a sec {squints]}… J U L I E N….?

https://www.instagram.com/p/B3kiGcCnvRL/

Blaximus
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Blaximus
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“She is a biological machine that will tear to shreds your mind and nervous system (and, why not? your physical health too) if you think anything about love can be between you and her.” After…. “” The problem I am having right now is that many factions of the media and the Manosphere are confusing and conflating the concept of a ‘red pill’ mindset with that of a ‘black pill’ mindset. When a man is truly red pill, he tends to evaluate women’s behavior in a manner that is realistic, objective, and fair and balanced. Conversely, when a man adopts… Read more »

Blaximus
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Blaximus
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“Currie expressed that initially, the Manosphere was more so about helping men improve their level of romantic success with women, but over the last five plus years, the Manosphere has slowly began to become more associated with a ‘men vs. women’ narrative with many bloggers and podcasters repeatedly discussing their hatred of modern-day feminism and their profound disdains toward the overall concept of romance, monogamy, and marriage.”

fleezer
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fleezer
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“Wut wait a sec {squints]}… J U L I E N….?”

he’s just trolling….

no way bride approves photo with fucking power lines in the background

no way that guy got married

but if he did can somebody send her the video of him bitching out on cnbc

will dry her used pussy right up

SJF
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SJF
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PSA:

WahooMcDaniels is correct. TT is a Bot. A machine.

In case you want to debate with her.

Sentient
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Sentient
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fleezer
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fleezer
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“Registry and all…”

your secretary could make those pages in an hour….

and she would have made sure to shop the pics like a real photographer

isn’t this his business model now…. married soulmate crap…..gotta have a “wife” to do that lol

raised seal marriage license or it didn’t happen

Yollo Comanche
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Yollo Comanche
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Maybe the problem is Red Pills think people should only adapt to whatever they feel comfortable with.

Here’s crazy crackers getting tired of obnoxiously pale pin-cushions writing bullshit about them.

Here’s a sane MGTOW thinking about how he will continue to spread his message. This name is Think before you Sleep.

Here’s nerds standing up to communism;

This might not be adaptation yet. But it’s an encouraging start.

Blaximus
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Blaximus
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People are doomed.

We’re too stupid to survive.

Blaximus
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Blaximus
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Correction: Culture is making people too stupid to survive.

Blaximus
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Blaximus
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Yollo

I agree with about 70% of what this guy says –

I’m just not sold on the hype that this is fully the fault of any Frankfurt School or anything other than good old fashioned capitalist money making. Yeah, it got started with ideals ( that sucked ass ), but it’s spread by hyper-connected corporations, and they have ONE ideal – CASH.

One thing I do agree with that this guys said, Social Media plays a huge part in the devolution.

” There is NO counter-culture “….

Amen.

Blaximus
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Blaximus
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Once the “old guys ” ( lol ) who have seen life before this catastrophe are gone, the devolution will accelerate. forward to 3:30 https://youtu.be/bRCwe7J_4YE?t=210 Years ago Asd and I were going back and forth as he accused me of supporting Black Lives Matter. I’ve never seen a BLM march or protest, because they can’t get a good toe hold where I live. Yet, this imaginary group saturated social media as if they were a massive movement or something. Even Asd drank the BLM kool aide ( because it stokes bad feelz …. as designed ). it’s kinda like Anthony… Read more »

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