The Goddess Movement

Six years ago I wrote a post outlining what the PUA community referred to then as “Chick Crack“. It was a pretty straight forward post that I delved into just to explain why playing to women’s propensity to believe in the spiritual – or what women would consider spiritual – is an effective technique in Game. I always thought it was funny how accurate this presumption about women was when I came across it.

Of all the strippers I’d ‘dated’ in the past every one subscribed to some form of non-mainstream spiritualism. This girl Angie I used to bang kept Tarot cards in her pink lady’s devotional Bible, another professed to be a psychic; in fact the only people I’ve ever known who self-seriously wanted me to believe they were in fact psychic were all women.

[…] For the stripper set this seems to be par for the course, but I wish I could say this chick-crack phenomenon was limited to just women who had some vacuous spiritual/emotional hole in their lives to fill. No, all women (yes I said all) are predisposed to the intrigue that metaphysical imaginings sparks in them. If it smacks of secret, covert knowledge, privy only to a chosen few, then you’ve got an attentive listener in a woman. UFOs, palm reading (always a classic), psychic premonition, ‘gifts of prophecy’, really anything that hints at knowledge beyond the ordinary is fair game. Chick Crack is not just limited to off-brand spiritualisms either, you’ll find that far more women than men will develop (conveniently) an affinity for, and are more invested in, religion than men.

In the wake of the Anthony Bourdain “suicide“, and the scramble to absolve Asia Argento of any complicity in his decision to hang himself, I came across this post about Asia’s penchant for Witchcraft. Apparently Wicca is somewhat more than a hobby for her. As you look at these pictures it’s important to remember that this is a 42 year old woman (and her friends) who sincerely believes in this stuff.

In Chick Crack I also made reference as to why I believe women’s being predisposed to beliefs in the supernatural is a desire for secret power from an innate position of female powerlessness.

Feminine Mythology

Women’s natural pull towards the mysterious and metaphysical has its roots in the sex’s historical characterizations. In keeping with the very useful associations of women’s unknowability and feminine mystique, it’s perhaps unsurprising that we find most mythologized representations of women and femininity cast as brooding, fickle, rapacious and often as a temptress, possessing secret knowledge that foolish men (the mere mortals) are neither capable of, nor encouraged to understand. Sometimes childlike, often conveniently eroticized, women are literally cast as forces of nature – whether sexualized nymphs or tempestuous witches, each characterization relies on women possessing some form of secret or forbidden connection to the metaphysical. Even the commanding presence of Joan of Arc, while leading the armies of France, had a connection to something otherworldly. By their very nature, feminine mythology, by default, presumes women are more in tune with the nature of reality, while surpassing the ignorance of brutish men.

Women revel in their mythology. Since covert forms of communication are the preferred language of women, their affinity for secret information is a natural fit. Ever wonder why gossip seems to be uniquely endemic to women? Look no further than women’s innate impulse to acquire secret knowledge. Take away the Vampires and Werewolves – the metaphysical component – from the Twilight series and what you’re left with is a relatively bland romance novel. Add the otherworldly and you have a runaway hit popular with every female age demographic, from tweens to octogenarians.

In women’s evolutionary past, concealment meant everything. Confusing a man as to the true genetic heritage of his children was often a matter of life or death. Pursuing pluralistic sexual strategies depends upon creating a characterization of women as legitimately unknowable, thus the feminine mystique is instituted. Ergo, the sociological PR campaign over the course of millennia has been to perpetuate the mystery of woman.

From an evolutionary perspective it makes sense that physically weaker tribal women would seek some sort of mastery over the men in their lives who could punish or kill them and their offspring at will. As I’ve covered in many essays, women are biologically and psychologically more attuned to deeper communication and the emotive states of other people. Women have a far greater capacity to understand subcommunications and subcommunicate themselves among their own sex. This is borne out by multiple brain scan studies and research on the architecture of men and women’s brains.

To the blunt, overt, relatively nuance-less interpretive processes of men this subcommunication can be both frustrating and mysterious. It’s the mysterious part that women learned to reinforce and exploit in their dealings with men long ago. This is where we get the idea of the seductress or the ‘keeper of mysterious secrets’ archetype (witch, midwife, nature goddess) for women. It’s less important that women would actually be more in tune with the supernatural, but rather it’s more important that they believe it’s a general truth about all women. Men might be skeptical, or they may buy into that mystique, revere it and encourage other men to believe something similar. Usually how a man adopts or rejects that archetype is determined by his own self-understanding and his Game according to it and his sexual market value.

There are a lot of derivative character archetypes that stem from the basic ‘mysterious woman’ root. That might be anything from a healer, nurturer, mother type rooted in what used to be the mystery of women’s life-giving capacity, to the force of nature sorceress, to the eroticized sexual seductress (nymph, siren) or even the high-priestess of the holy temple of prostitution (an ancient brothel madame). Over the course of history, since our hunter-gatherer beginnings, this means to influence and power for women has coalesced into what we popularly imagine about women’s mysterious nature. Only today we call it a ‘woman’s intuition’ and we make appeals to fortune and fate when a guy get’s “lucky” and a woman favors him with her sexuality. It’s all socialized solutions to evolutionary problems, but if we add an element of ‘magic’ to the equation it makes explaining failures and appreciating successes that much easier.

Today, the belief in this nature is still very much reinforced in society. Thus, we get women subscribing to what amounts to a collective pathology – they are encouraged to believe in their ‘magical’ sensitivities to spirits and forces beyond the sensitivities of (ostensibly) “powerful” men. To fight the mythological Patriarchy women rely on a mythological tool. In Chick Crack I made mention of a stripper I used to have as a friend-with-benefits who was very attuned to the “spirit world”. As such the whole gamut of the supernatural was free game for her to use. She’d read my Tarot cards, my palm, throw in some eastern mysticism and wash it all down with a read through her pink ladies’ devotional Bible. Granted, ‘Angie‘ was an extreme case, but all women are in someway, or say they are in someway, privy to metaphysical understandings which men are not. And today we read and listen to male leaders in mainstream religions adopt and parrot back this “women are closer to God than men” mantra which is directly linked to the ‘spiritual women’ mystique.

The old trope of a Woman’s Intuition is an example of this belief in something beyond the ken of men. And this is also an important aspect of boys’ Blue Pill conditioning – girls/women possess some unearthly connection to God or something supernatural which further cements the idea that they should to defer authority to girls and women if they want to “please God the Goddess”. You might think this hard to believe in our age of technology, but only the context of the supernatural has shifted. Even the most objectively rational boys and men strongly believe in the ‘soul mate myth despite atheism or agnosticism. This belief of the faithless is directly related to the unknowability of the female. Even modern atheists have a tendency to fall prey to the “someone for everyone” religion when it comes to connecting with the opposite sex.

It’s my belief that this presumption of a greater sensitivity to the supernatural is an aspect of women’s evolved mental firmware. Regardless of how false it may be, a woman with the disposition to encourage men to believe that she has some otherworldly connection despite the world or circumstances around them, one that would lead men to venerate her in the long term, would’ve been a powerful social adaptation in ensuring her and her children’s security. No doubt women readers will trot out the reflexive “Well men have been shamans and soothsayers and the patriarchal leaders of churches too”, and this is true, but those men lacked the female elemental advantage in their believability. Even their own belief sets encompassed the ‘spiritual woman’ tropes for better or worse. The wise old wizard is definitely an archetype, but that wizard lacks the feminine mystique and the sexual components only women possess in exercising that power.

Modern Witchcraft

Today we see a distinct falling away from the old order of acknowledging the supernatural. Less and less people subscribe to religion in its conventional sense. The Millennial generation wants nothing to do with “organized religion”, yet they still seek the structure to life it used to provide. So instead we hear the compromise about being “spiritual, but not religious” as if accepting the possibility of the metaphysical is something expected, but the taint of the “religious” is left for older generations. Even in what passes for contemporary religion the influence of the Feminine Imperative is ever-present. The spiritual, the metaphysical, the religious, all are still useful tools for women to consolidate power with. As men abdicate more authority to the feminine, as they themselves are the products of a continuous social feminization, we see a wholesale handover of the spiritual to the direction of women. The male leadership of mainstream religions is itself compromised with the imperatives and priorities of women who are already presumed to be “more in tune with God or the supernatural”. As such they exercise the Feminine Imperative and assimilate women’s stake on the spiritual by being proxy agents for women’s authority.

Today I was linked a story about how Episcopalians have begun to Remove the Man from their religion. Apparently this marks the beginning of rewriting the doctrine of this religion by erasing all masculine pronouns for God. Of course I expect the predictable retorts that Episcopalians aren’t real Christians, but theirs is just one of the more glaring examples of how the feminization of religion progresses. The latent purpose is a wholesale removal of anything conventionally masculine from religion, and/or placing the feminine as the primary connection with the supernatural. Whether it’s mainstream religion or psychic reading, a woman is at the center of that mysticism. If you want a perspective into the things to come for a female-led mega-religion look no further than the teaching of Rev. Shannon Johnson Kershner (dual surname noted). God is not male is the clarion call of the priestesses (and their male ‘ally’ priests) of this new religion.

Why should we view God as female? Well, it’s so that little girls can become pastors, with Kershner saying, ““I wanted to make sure that little girls knew that God could call them to be pastors, too.”

For the MeToo / Time’s Up generation God is female, the supernatural is more aligned with the feminine. I’ve made this observation before (before the #MeToo moral panic arrived) but there’s been a growing push on the part of men to relinquish any spiritual authority from a masculine perspective for decades now. The largely secular impetus of the MeToo movement is now finding its way into a religious environment that has been primed and ready for it (largely due to its acquiescing, complicit, and thoroughly Blue Pill male leadership) for a long time. MeToo was a natural fit for a feminine-primary church that needed its push to consolidate power even in the most patriarchal of religions. MeToo has given women license to finally be overt in their design on religion and spirituality – not unlike Open Hypergamy has been embraced in the mainstream.

In celebration of this conversion of religion to feminine-primacy we get the feminist Beyoncé “worship” services in formerly traditional cathedrals. Millennials may be falling away from the old church, but they fill the new church to overflow-capacity when ‘god’ is female.

The take home message for this essay is this; womankind has been intimately aware of the complicity of men in granting them a default connection to the supernatural. While we may not profess a formal belief in such, men are eager to accommodate female power in this arena – especially if in doing so it endears women to the men who play along with it. Professing a belief in the supernatural is simply good Game. The early PUAs picked up on this and used it to their advantage. However, this abdication of moral authority – an authority founded in masculine pretenses – goes far beyond getting your palm read by an earthy stripper you want to bang. This compromising of moral authority to the feminine by men is just the next phase in conceding all social and political authority to the Feminine Imperative. If God or a ‘higher power’ is the foundation of moral authority, and women are universally presumed to be more in touch with that higher power, the next step is to cede that authority to the sex that has a more direct line to that power.

What prompted me to consider writing this essay was a link I was sent in response to the story about Asia Argento’s involvement in modern day Wicca. I listened to a bit of a podcast by Vox Day recently in which he was asked his thoughts about modern paganism. He said, and I paraphrase, “Paganism today is just kids LARPing to the idea of old world religions. They’re role playing something akin to Dungeons and Dragons with no real belief.” I thought this was interesting in light of the article I was sent on Neo-Paganism and the Feminist Spirituality Movement:

However, some women were not willing to identify themselves as “witches”, and there arose a form of Goddess worship without any of the trappings of witchcraft. As Nevill Drury explains, “Although some Goddess-worshippers continued to refer to themselves as witches, others abandoned the term altogether, preferring to regard their neopagan practice as a universal feminist religion, drawing on mythologies from many different ancient cultures.” This has been called “Goddess worship” and the “Goddess movement”. These terms are frequently used interchangeably with, but should be distinguished from, “feminist spirituality”, which includes the Goddess movement, but also feminist Christianity, feminist Judaism, etc.

[…]

The principal beliefs of the Goddess movement are that the Goddess is a radically immanent deity and she can be experienced directly. The Earth is seen as the body of the Goddess and women are understood to connect to the Goddess through their experience of their own bodies, as well as the “body” of the earth. Goddess feminists also believe that the Goddess is constantly changing, manifest in the changing of the seasons and the human life-cycle, and perpetually self-renewed.

The Goddess movement offers women a new self-image and facilitates women finding their own innate goodness and natural divinity. It enables women to redeem and revalue the “feminine principle” and offers them positive images and symbols of female empowerment.

It may seem easy to dismiss the influence of the feminine on what is re-evolving into a new feminine-world order of spirituality, but I think it would be foolish dismiss the influences of the Feminine Imperative – the Goddess Movement – that is manifesting itself incrementally in the power vacuum left by the abdication of masculine moral authority to the feminine. We read that Millennials may not be “as religious” as previous generations, but that doesn’t mean they don’t seek out ‘spiritual, but not religious’ metaphysical connections. They seek direction, and connection in religion, but they seek it in the secular, gynocentric terms they’ve been conditioned to believe they should define themselves by. A similar parallel exists on the masculine side too. One of the reasons for Jordan Peterson’s popularity is his ‘ministering’ to a generation of “lost boys” seeking direction in life. He is every bit one of the Lords of the New Church in the same way that the Goddess Movement speaks to another demographic of lost souls who seek absolution in the “divine feminine” – also a term Peterson is fond of.

Published by Rollo Tomassi

Author of The Rational Male and The Rational Male, Preventive Medicine

561 comments on “The Goddess Movement

  1. I invited the police in

    First mistake. Never, ever, ever invite an agent of the gov. inside your home. Not police, not social workers, not BATF, not DEA, not police looking for donations for their charity., not ICE.

    It depends on how one defines ” thugs “.

    I usually mean someone who makes their living by illegal activities which includes using threats and force. That doesn’t include cops, although I see cops as coercive and not interested in my well-being. I wouldn’t have recognized the thugs, but the cops would have and once one pointed out a thug to me.

  2. ” I wouldn’t have recognized the thugs, but the cops would have and once one pointed out a thug to me.”

    Lol, cool. Because, you know, cops always know and are never wrong about such things.

  3. @SJF

    Jordan Peterson took a deal he cannot get out of.

    I’ve had those opportunities, but have let all time limits pass on such deals as they’d control my entire life and all content of my life, voice and work. JBP accepted a deal that controls all of his content, and that’s destroying males and masculinity!

    Jordan B. Peterson is being used to cause the male suicide rate to exponentially increase!

    Jordan B. Peterson is going to eventually be made the NEGATIVE example of all things red pill, and this is NOT good.

    If males do not absorb the works of Rollo Tomassi The Rational Male or Ivan Throne The Dark Triad Man
    Ivan Throne BEFORE they find the wimp Jordan Peterson, the destruction of males and masculinity will be catastrophic.

  4. @sam

    With all due respect, please explain.

    “Jordan B. Peterson is being used to cause the male suicide rate to exponentially increase!”

  5. ” 38 special revolver? who makes safeties on those? I thought the safety on a revolver was between the ears?”

    Lol. I took as a joke. But I did shake my head ” yes “.

  6. “JBP accepted a deal that controls all of his content, and that’s destroying males and masculinity!

    So you are saying…

    On what basis.

    Do you even read Jordan Peterson? He addresses thoughts individually, he’s not stuck in one paradigm.

    Past the fanboi throwaway insults for those that get ideas from him, young men thinking that all the stuff they have heard from Mainstream Media, Feminine Imperatives and all the rest of the bullshit they are faced with?

    Where are all these retarded young men that can’t discriminate shit from shinola?

    I guess I live in Unicornlandia where we don’t grow our boys dumb as shit.

    “Jordan B. Peterson is being used to cause the male suicide rate to exponentially increase!

    Who was involved?
    What happened?
    Where did it take place?
    When did it take place?
    Why did that happen?

    Jordan Peterson was a depressive intellectual with an over 150 IQ. He blew his stack in academia, said fuck it. Went into YouTube land. Generated $1 Million in revenue from his 2017/2018 exploits and now he’s going to lead young men to their death. Got it. Sold out to kill young boys with his self absorbed intellectual exploits.

    Jordan Peterson was never Red Pill, despite a small amount of his psychological realizations of hypergamy and such. He’s blue pill.

    He’s part of the fucking manosphere. What the fuck? The manosphere is guys getting together and talking about shit in a male only space. Venn Fucking Diagram associated with Red Pill.

    HE’S NOT A NEGATIVE EXAMPLE OF RED PILL BECAUSE HE DOESN’T SPEAK FOR OR CLAIM TO BE RED PILL.

    He’s just a guy swapping notes. Thirsty people never heard such shit before. Go fucking figure….

    I’m not going to lock my son’s buddies in the basement out of fear he might indoctrinate them, because they aren’t clinically retarded enough to be that influenced to not be able discriminate among ideas.

    What the fuck is going on here? It’s not the shit show you want to make it out to be. Geez. Same as it ever was, except for The Advantages of Now in the Manosphere. New technology. Don’t let the enemy be us.

    I’m at a loss for why JBP is dangerous to a normal young man. Really. But I’m solipsistic. I don’t have reference examples of young men around me that aren’t on the ball. My son, and those other young guys I associated with.

    So maybe you can fill in the blanks guys. What exactly beyond the blue pill, moderate, intellectual bias, with him making bank and being lauded by indoctrinated fanbois is he actually doing harm with? He’s filling a fucking void. Maybe you should just fill that void for your son and his buddies on your on in your Red Pill bottoms up approach.

  7. “Jordan Peterson isn’t an alias.

    It matters”

    Antifragile:Things That Gain From Disorder?

    Skin in the Game: Hidden Asymmetries in Real Life?

    Fooled by Randomness: The Hidden Role of Chance in Life and in the Markets? (is a book by Nassim Nicholas Taleb that deals with the fallibility of human knowledge.)

    The Black Swan: The Impact of the Highly Improbable? (is a book by the essayist, scholar, philosopher, and statistician Nassim Nicholas Taleb, released April 17, 2007 by Random House. The book focuses on the extreme impact of certain kinds of rare and unpredictable events (outliers) and humans’ tendency to find simplistic explanations for these events retrospectively. This theory has since become known as the black swan theory.)

    Welcome to the Monkey House.

  8. There’s a problem. Do you see it?

    Roused
    Perhaps a small problem. I really don’t see it in the real world.

    Ok. So what’s your point?

    I know a young man or two and none of them idolize JP.

    Well, since “some” and “all” mean the same thing…

    Please provide some data on this idolatry going on.

    Please show me where I used the word “idolatry” in reference to Peterson first.

    I do see now, and have in the last several years how boys have been indoctrinated by TV, ESPN (Disney) movies, video games, teachers, sisters and their mothers.

    You must have missed the last 3 or more years of my comments saying pretty much the same thing. Including the reply to you up the thread where I pointed out the K – 12 system’s damage done to young men. Maybe you could read more carefully in the future?

    IMO each of those things have a larger impact than JP.

    Ok. So what?
    You just want to argue about people, or do you have some ideas to discuss?

    What’s your goal in this comment thread? Seriously, is there a point beyond defending Jordy ?

  9. Blaximus and his quality time with the NJ po-lice reminds me of a couple of things.

    First, back in the 90’s I was following a hearing on CSPAN, and there was this keg-shaped copchick dressed up in an outlandish costume, testifying that US Federal gun law was woefully anemic. I wondered what she was playing at, was she pretending to be an East German STASI secret agent or something else? Turned out she was an oaf-ishul Noo Jersey State Po-Lice SpokesPerson. She just happened to look like something from a police state…pure coincidence. Nothing more.

    The second thing was when an escapee from Illinois once asked me what kind of permit he needed to buy some ammo for his .357 here in nowhere. I laughed at him and said that a permit with Andrew Jackson’s picture on it would do just fine for starters, but he might need a Hamilton also. If he wanted to stock up more, take a permit with U.S. Grant’s picture. No “Firerams Owner ID” nonsense around here.

    Last time shots were fired around here it was one of my stupider neighbors trying to whack a skunk in the dark by flashlight. He missed. Fortunately.

  10. Blaximus
    (Loaded .38 on car seat in VA.)
    Then he handed me my papers back and asked me if I was certain that the safety was on.

    Probably a joke. But maybe not. Many cops know zip about firearms other than what they are issued. This can cause problems.

    A friend of mine was stopped by a cop once for speeding in an open carry state, and Officer Friendly decided to disarm him because of “officer safety”. My friend was carrying an M1911A1 in Condition One, and Officer Friendly didn’t understand anything about it, so he waved the muzzle all over the place trying to decock it, including at oncoming traffic and even my friends legs, then torso. It was annoying to all concerned. First, perfessional law enforcers don’t like to look ignorant about guns. Second, Army vets with multiple tours as NATO advisors to the Baltics and combat tours to the Sandbox don’t like having guns pointed at their body parts.

    Eventually the pistol was placed on the hood of the vehicle, the ticket was issued, and no harm done. Lesson: don’t expect Officer Friendly to have a clue about anything other than his issue Glock / Sig.

    Now shall I discuss the Webley .38 revolver, that came with a safety catch? Or the popularity of .38 Super in the 1930’s? Nah. Too nerdy.

  11. “They idolize “Jordy””

    Yes, I must have missed many of your comments in the last three years. Oops.

  12. “Seriously, is there a point beyond defending Jordy ?”

    The point is over your head.

    No one is defending Jordy. And he is laughing all the way to to the bank as a depressed nihilistic intellectual.

    Some of us, including Roused have young men offspring. None of which are too stupid to not have a thought. Who are not acolytes of Jordy. Who are dancing under the gunfire at their feet. Who seek freedom from constraint.

    Which will come from developing talent. Mastery. Which comes from inspiration. From an ignition source. Where the fuck does that come from. Some young men don’t need Red Pill Helicoptering lecturing. No right minded father imposes things on his well developed son. Some sons don’t need it because they are doing just fine, thank you. Some associates are helped by
    “uncle” advice. Because it is not de rigeur to be lectured to by the father for a number a reasons. Jordy fills that void. Blue Pill or not.

    Some of us are cited as keyboard jockeying. A false indictment. Some others are keyboard jockeying without skin in the game.

    Jordy’s forte is intellectually debating the point of trying to make young men, old men, women make order out of chaos that is the current milieu of life as we know it. I had a patient recently that had a son in law that had Jordy’s book up north on vacation. He was like Meh on it. She picked it up and started reading it. Her impression was: Good Shit.

    Don’t judge a book by it’s cover. None of you guys saying “Seriously, is there a point beyond defending Jordy ? ” or say ” Can’t you take a swipe at Jordy and twitter and have fucking Fanbois not pour out of the woodwork to defent him?” have young men in hand you are raising to get ideas, to talk to other men, to develop talent, to have mastery, to fuck women good, to be self interested, to go forth and have Real Power.

    Tools in the Toolbox of Red Pill. Tools are inert objects. Interesting, leading thoughts are tools.

    Do you even listen to or read Jordy? Whithout a bilious, jaded thought? Without young men in your purview? Without actually going directly to Jordy? Without listening to “reviews” or criticisms on Twitter, or here, or in Mainstream Media.

    In order for Red Pill to have legitimacy, it can’t have retarded retread, secondary thoughts. Judge content. Not Groupthink.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Groupthink

    Groupthink can be either good or bad depending on the retards or actualized masculine men that are using it to advance their agenda.

  13. “Because it is not de rigeur to be lectured to by the father for a number a reasons.”

    One big reason is this: lectures create a superior-inferior environment. Young men at around 13 y.o. must display competence in some regard and the confidence to know they can and will learn the rest…by themselves if the must, taking risks, success through some failures and not avoiding the hard times. Lectures create risk avoidence layers of playing not to lose. Picture yourself in a employee sex harrassment lecture. IMO, same thing.

    Secondly, it’s hard enough to step out of Dad’s shadow. “Kill the idols” if you will. Mentors, uncles help.

  14. Hard job, being a professional lecturer, because eventually one runs out of pithy, interesting things to say, and because this is now the means of earning, sometimes the subjects become ever more controversial – if one doesn’t pace himself.

    Rocket into notoriety, plunge into obscurity.

  15. Rocket into notoriety, plunge into obscurity.

    Exactly. There will either be an event that decapitates him (some kind of scandal) or he will slowly slide into oblivion as the eye of attention moves on.

    I’ll give Peterson this much: he’s good at making hay while the sun is shining, based on what he is taking in on his Patreon. And that’s no small thing for him at all really, having lived the financial life of an academic for the rest of his years.

    But his blue pill nature is devastating for young men, really. Half truths are often more harmful than lies, because they are kind of “truthy” while still containing much untruth, whereas outright lies are simply lies through and through. Peterson’s pablum about “cleaning up your room” is harmless in itself, but ensconcing it in what is essentially a blue pill view of women and male/female relationships is simply poison for young men, and made all the more potent by the truthiness of some of what he says, otherwise. Peterson is helping to mislead a large number of young men when it comes to women, while many of these young guys think that they are learning “reality” when it comes to women because Peterson actually acknowledges sex differences and other obvious things like that. Can some of them discern? Sure, but when the truthy stuff is mixed in with patent untruths, the risk of harm remains quite high — I can’t, and don’t, endorse his use by my son (19) because of precisely this issue. Again, it isn’t because everything Peterson says is wrong, but rather because what he says is a mixture of obvious truth and then outright falsehood. It’s simply a risky mix, and therefore I can’t endorse it.

  16. Some of us are cited as keyboard jockeying. A false indictment. Some others are keyboard jockeying without skin in the game.

    which leads to…

    taking risks

    indubitably, including rearing kids…”rear” as in “seat of the pants”…which some ysfoms are skeered to do….don’t wanna take risks…yet these same cats say that they believe in evolution…yet, according to evolutionary principles, if you’re not passing on your genes, you’re irrelevant…so these numbskulls are just kj-ing about evolution…

    Rocket into notoriety, plunge into obscurity.

    Yep, it’s all about the endgame. One of the 48 Laws is about that…

  17. Half truths are often more harmful than lies

    The same accusation could be leveled against Dalrock. I came to the manosphere via his site, but I moved past anger and found Rollo. However, lots of boys still linger at Dal’s wallowing in anger and self-pity when they ought to move on to self-improvement.

    I’m grateful to Dalrock for giving me a taste of the RP, even if it was only half a dose of the medicine that I needed to take.

  18. @nova – And that’s no small thing for him at all really, having lived the financial life of an academic for the rest of his years.

    Tenured professors make a pretty good salary, and usually have a light or non-existent workload in the summers. A quick google shows his current salary at $164,706.24, likely with a 60-80% pension for life after he retires. While this is not the same as the > $1M he is reportedly bringing in on patreon, it is still nothing to sneeze at. While I’m sure its true that he is intentionally capitalizing his notoriety, I doubt he set out with that in mind at first.

    Also, my take on the 12 rules is that it is proscriptive advice for how any given man should act in the context of the world as JBP sees it. I do not see where he has “ensconced that in…a blue pill view”. Take a look at the rules. Even though he may see the world through his BP lense, these rules apply equally to any RP aware man. In fact, a key tenet of RP awareness – acting out of enlightened self-interest – requires that one follow at least rules 2,4 and 7, if not others as well.

    1 Stand up straight with your shoulders back
    2 Treat yourself like someone you are responsible for helping
    3 Make friends with people who want the best for you
    4 Compare yourself to who you were yesterday, not to who someone else is today
    5 Do not let your children do anything that makes you dislike them
    6 Set your house in perfect order before you criticize the world
    7 Pursue what is meaningful (not what is expedient)
    8 Tell the truth – or, at least, don’t lie
    9 Assume that the person you are listening to might know something you don’t
    10 Be precise in your speech
    11 Do not bother children when they are skateboarding
    12 Pet a cat when you encounter one on the street

    While it is true that he is clearly BP WRT his views of intersexual dynamics, the opinions he espouses on that issue – most notably the concept of “enforced marriage” as good for society – are at a society-wide level and are really anthropological in nature. While his BP perspective clearly colors his view of the world, I have not seen specific advice from him at the individual level that a given man should accept the FI old book rules.

  19. https://www.tripadvisor.co.nz/LocationPhotoDirectLink-g31582-d1122563-i261363930-Rowdy_Beaver_Restaurant_Tavern-Eureka_Springs_Arkansas.html

    Ha ha ha ha ha….Soooo Funny. Oh its just so funny to insult, belittle, denigrate, and cage the poor bastard who earned the money the bitch wastes as she goes on her shopping spree of compulsive consumption of frivolous materialistic crap. What an annoyance if her husband is present while she wastes the family income on her gluttony of idiocy! He must be “babysat” and aestheticized with alcohol into a stupor lest he threaten to mitigate her obnoxious waste of family income which he mostly earned while she compulsively grabs valueless trinkets!

    Eurika Springs is a shopping schmorgasborg of mostly worthless shit, much of it quite expensive.

    Imagine the extreme outrage about “misogamy” and “sexism” if a similar sign advertising wife day care were posted at any establishment mostly visited by men. How about a wife day care facility next to a brothel. Now wouldn’t that be nice!

    So, here we have the typical western female. She is prescribed birth control pills at the time she begins menstruating or before. This is done so she can fuck whoever whenever she wants with impunity and not get pregnant. She is given impunity from responsibility. Don’t ever ask her about her sexual history, it is a crime. If she forgets to take the pill or isn’t prescribed, then she has the legal entitlement to commit fetal homicide with impunity, without consultation from the father, her parents, or his. First they renamed fetal homicide and started calling it “abortion”. It is not abortion. Abortion applies to something like a mission, like a mission to the moon. You abort a mission. You do mot “abort” a person. You do not “abort” a fetus. You murder a fetus. The word abortion is intentionally misapplied to conflate fetal homicide with something objectified and impersonal. In their view, the fetus is an object, an undesirable object, so they want everyone to refer to it as such, lest someone sense the truth and complain. They play word games to psychologically shift context in order to distort everyone’s perception of reality. In reality the act is in fact fetal homicide. Lets refer to it as what it is.

    I am not a religious person and this comment post has nothing to do with religion. Although, I am well aware of the fact that there are those who would love to claim the opposite in order to conflate the issue with superstition. Again, this would be and is a shift in context to again distort reality. The fact is, women have total control over fetal homicide. The female alone decides whether the fetus survives or not. This is power. This is an imbalance of power compared to conditions that existed before the pill and safe fetal homicide was almost universally available.

    Now they claim its about the woman’s body, that she should have the right to do with her body as she pleases regardless of anyone else’s concern. People began to sense that “abortion” is really fetal homicide, so they are now re-couching it as “women’s health”. Again this is an intentional misdirection, a distortion of the truth, another twisted conflation and it is based on a lie. It is not just her body that is involved. Half the DNA of a fetus is the fathers. Some of it is his parents, some of it is her parents. There are several individuals DNA literally physiologically involved, not just hers. The debate concerning fetal homicide is not about “women’s health” or moral issues. It is all about women’s entitlement to avoid responsibility for motherhood. It is about avoiding consequences that would require her to make sacrifices. It is about babies and children being too great an inconvenience to women who want to expend their energy pretending that they can be the same as a man. Babies get in the way of pretending to be a man. The existence of an infant blatantly displays the reality of natural femininity. Male, the gender she attempts to emulate, cannot become pregnant and give birth to an infant. Infants and children also get in the way of materialistic compulsive gluttony!

    This is all about power. It has little to do with “women’s health’ or “morals”. She is literally entitled by law and social mores to impunity from reproductive responsibility. So, why should we expect anything different from her? Doesn’t it make perfect sense that she would endorse such signage in the link above and all the behavior and mentality the FI dishes out given the fact that she has total control over the reproductive process with total freedom to postpone or murder it?

  20. Roused
    “They idolize “Jordy””

    Yes. To idolize a sports figure is not to actually worship him as a god, so “idolatry” is not necessarily the same word. However, trawl through some of the reddit threads if you have the time, and you can find men who clearly idolize Peterson. He’s a polarizing figure because he’s stating things that were common truths less than 25 years ago.

    Yes, I must have missed many of your comments in the last three years.

    You certainly missed this one.

    https://therationalmale.com/2018/07/07/the-goddess-movement/comment-page-2/#comment-
    257409

    If you want to talk about ideas, and JBP in the context of ideas, get back to me.

  21. Equal rights you say?

    Ha! Ok…

    Women have the legal right to commit fetal homicide and murder any fetus that may inconvenience them in the future.

    Fair enough! Men should have the legal right to murder any woman that may inconvenience them in the future!!

  22. Last week I wound up with some people at a night spot where the entertainment was a singer with an amped acoustic guitar & some electronics backing him. He sang John Denver for he boomers, the Bangles for Gen-X (never heard a man sing “Vacation Holiday” before) and then “Just shut up and dance” by Walk the Moon, a tune from 2014.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shut_Up_and_Dance_(Walk_the_Moon_song)

    All the girls at the bar and the standing tables began to move around, some pogoed, all of them sang with the chorus. It was the biggest hit with the single girls in an hour.

    That tune is a full up dose of the blue pill in music. Lyrics here:
    https://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/walkthemoon/shutupanddance.html

    “Bound to get together” is classic Soul Mate plus Oneitis that young men get fed.

    Chorus:

    She took my arm,
    I don’t know how it happened.
    We took the floor and she said,

    “Oh, don’t you dare look back.
    Just keep your eyes on me.”
    I said, “You’re holding back,”
    She said, “Shut up and dance with me!”
    This woman is my destiny
    She said, “Ooh-ooh-hoo,
    Shut up and dance with me.”

    This is another piece of the popular culture that we all swim in. Boomers who listen to their old Rolling Stones LP’s all day may not be aware of what the younger men are soaking in, or what the chick crack looks like now. Well, here’s a dose. I won’t post the videos because I’m not sure they’d come through, but I found several on YouTube.

    From the PickUp angle, that song was a perfect setup for the kind of palmreading game Tiberius described up thread.

  23. “From the PickUp angle, that song was a perfect setup for the kind of palmreading game Tiberius described up thread.”

    And it’s a fun enough little pop song to sing and only takes a few minutes to learn. Outside my usual folk/blues type stuff, but I’ll throw it in if I sense it’s the right sort of crowd.

    I’ve Told Ev’ry Little Star is another good one. I turn into a mini game show event, challenging the audience to guess what movie I’ve just watched. If a girl gets it (and it’s always a girl) it turns into an “OMG! You like that movie? I LOVE that one,” moment.

  24. Boomers who listen to their old Rolling Stones LP


    I’ll never be your beast of burden
    My back is broad but it’s a hurting
    All I want is for you to make love to me
    I’ll never be your beast of burden
    I’ve walked for miles my feet are hurting
    All I want is you to make love to me

    Am I hard enough
    Am I rough enough
    Am I rich enough
    I’m not too blind to see

    http://www.songfacts.com/detail.php?lyrics=592

  25. @SJF, I added the comparison of JBP into the mix at the end not as a ‘dig’ so much as an illustration of a parallel in the hunger for a direction in life that both he and the Goddess Movement cater to.

    If you look at his audience which consists mostly of “lost boys” – rudderless young men looking for direction and purpose in life (not ‘meaning’ as the woo woo spiritualism would have it) – you see a demographic of young men who flock to his intellectualism like a religion. JBP himself has stated in the past that he want to start his own church.

    Similarly, The Goddess Movement appeals to young women raised on the Fempowerment narrative who want a similar connection when all the promises that feminism and a feminine-primary social order fail them. They need a new religion that confirms and edifies their belief in their own entitlements. Thus, if those women are uncomfortable in the Goddess Movement in a Neo-Paganist flavor assimilating old school religions (Christianity being the easiest target) and rejiggering them to fit their comfort level serves the same purpose.

    This is why Jordanetics is appealing to men: it (seemingly) satisfies a rational aspect of men’s nature, but also panders to their innate idealism – a looking outward at what is possible. As such, it becomes a religion-that’s-not-relgion to give them direction.

    The Goddess Movement is appealing for women because: it reinforces their perspective that all their gender-appointed entitlements are justified from a woo woo spirituality perspective; and old school or new school religion will serve as well as the other. This movement plays to the innate, evolved, desire for covert power and panders to a core belief that women are ‘divine vessels’ of life that men can never be.

    Both, again, seemingly give either sex a direction they lack but crave.

  26. I’m not going to rehash the myriad reasons why I think JBP is reinforcing Blue Pill narratives. I’ve already made that post and recorded that video:

    https://therationalmale.com/2018/02/12/no-prescriptions/

    I’m with Nova (once again) on this; there will come and event, something that trips him up which will not be some clever re-editing of something he says that will prove beyond all doubt that he’s a guy who happened into a demographic of young men with whom his message resonates. He’s a walking contradiction at this point, but he treads so carefully that his adherents can make up his rationales for him should he fuck anything up publicly.

    But at some stage he’ll overextend himself. He really already has but none of his fanbois want to admit it yet. What Sam Botta was saying upthread is that he’s taking in so much money today that he’s hired his own publicity company whose sole purpose it is to extend his popularity run for as long as possible. If you look at his ‘image’ just a year ago, he doesn’t even look like the same guy. Now he’s pulling a world tour, selling a best seller book and wearing designer suits.

    But I’m Rollo Tomassi and I’m not allowed to bring any of this shit up because, jealousy. Sorry, but the shit is right in front of us. JBP is the ‘savior’ the right was desperate to find and he’s very focused on maintaining this image. This guy was a clinically depressed college professor from Canada whose only outreach up to a year ago was YouTube videos he shot in his home office by the light of his computer monitor. Now he’s ‘playing’ sold out arenas just to hear him contemplate life. What do you suppose this does to a guy like this? His biggest fear is saying something ‘wrong’ and I understand why, because it’ll mean the ride’s over for him.

    As I mentioned above, my aside about JBP in the OP was just that, an aside. But look at how quickly I get jumped on for even dropping his name. So yeah, I’m going to be critical of Peterson whenever I feel it’s warranted. Remember how much shit I got for calling Roosh to the carpet for his throwing TRP under the bus? “Don’t punch right man.” “He’s still doing the right thing for men, man.” “You’re just jealous he’s more successful than you.” Where’s all of that shit now?

    If you get something out of JBP, great, more power to you. I listen to him talking to Joe Rogan recently – on a rare occasion he and Dave Rubin weren’t on tour somewhere – and Joe actually nailed his ass a couple of times. But what I found really interesting was that he was using my definition and my vernacular when he was discussing Hypergamy with Joe. JBP has either been reading my work or his handlers have been. Peterson knows who I am.

  27. “Unfortunately he’s blinded by his own ego investment in some areas and this is a problem.”

    My take is that he’s not so blind as he may appear, that he is at least somewhat aware that what he feels and what he knows are not aligned, but what he knows has been unable to change what he feels. You can see it in some of his old classroom videos when he talks about experimental and study results that he knows are good results, but make him feel squicky.

    And not just in intersexual dynamics either, but in all the ways a “progressive” from Toronto would feel squicky about reality.

    For instance the way he approaches the idea that smart people are just plain smart and stupid people are just plain stupid as “frightening.”

  28. You want mainstream fame like Peterson, Cernovich, Roosh, and Julien Blanc while pretending you don’t care cause that’s “alpha”. Face it, Molyneux refusing the air his interview with you and Joe Rogan not reaching to do a podcast with you

    None of those guys have anything to offer me. Just repackaged Blue Pill shit. Rollo still comes the closest to the Red Pill.

  29. My take is that he’s not so blind as he may appear, that he is at least somewhat aware that what he feels and what he knows are not aligned,

    “My take is that he’s not so blind as he may appear, that he is at least somewhat aware that what makes money and what he knows are not aligned,”

    fify

  30. Very fair and balance reply Rollo. Thanks for focusing in on why the idolatry is dangerous. If the lost boys get drunk/intoxicated on the idea of JBP being their savior/messiah for their predicament, they are no better than silly girls. Men can and should compartmentalize ideas/ goals/ aspirations. That’s what makes them masculine focused.

    As always, I refined a few thoughts I had while discussing the ideas. Without discussing personal details and personal details, one thing I have come to realize by refining the discussion is that intersexual agency on the part of the male matters. IOW if any of the principle males are getting laid and have the propensity to get laid, that makes all the difference. IOW, incels, and even MRP men who have deadish bedrooms are at the greatest risk of inappropriate worship of Blue Pill ideas , because those ideas can merely be a buffer. No matter what the subject matter.
    I come to realize in my solipsism, I still live in that insular world where young men are at less risk because they do have agency and certain ones are getting laid.

    Rollo: “So yeah, I’m going to be critical of Peterson whenever I feel it’s warranted. Remember how much shit I got for calling Roosh to the carpet for his throwing TRP under the bus?”

    Understood.

    “I listened to him talking to Joe Rogan recently – on a rare occasion he and Dave Rubin weren’t on tour somewhere – and Joe actually nailed his ass a couple of times. But what I found really interesting was that he was using my definition and my vernacular when he was discussing Hypergamy with Joe.”

    I listened to the same (most recent) Joe Rogan interview while working out. Accepting and being Red Pill already makes all the difference. I don’t see Joe “nailing his ass a couple of times”, but challenging him. And Peterson’s use of hypergamy was a nice touch.

    While Peterson may be a Blue Pill agent of the Trad Con milleu (and full disclosure: so am I of the Trad Con milleu, but committed to Red Pill. And it is working great for me and my children…), Peterson is not an Agent of The Matrix. As such there is value there for men.

    Palmasailor: “He was a contradiction very early on but he was digging down hard in some directions to avoid inevitable conclusions.”

    I agree.

    “Unfortunately he’s blinded by his own ego investment in some areas and this is a problem.

    I’m concerned for him, but more importantly I’m concerned for the movement as a whole if he unravels badly. It would give the FI an excuse to say : “yup, we knew he was a wrong’un – take the trash out honey”

    We don’t need that.”

    I don’t agree. Ideas are just ideas and life for males is comprised of walking through minefields. There is Antifragility in exposure to how life is, not how it ought to be.

    Peterson is not going to run out of ideas. He’s been collecting and playing with ideas for 35 years and expressing them in university classrooms.

    He’s become undepressed this year (he claims because of diet).

    As far as “We Don’t Need That.” I now get the danger to The Red Pill Brand. It is real. The same danger that Roosh posed to The Red Pill Brand three years ago with his changing lanes into NeoMasculinity. So I get the Danger. It’s just that some of us live at ground level in a bottoms up approach and don’t see that danger to ours sons and his and our young buddies. And that is not contradictory even if it is paradoxical (seemingly contradictory).

    P.S. I wrote something out earlier, but refrained from posting it, and sent it to my buddies. And I’ll have to leave some of it out (personal stuff about my son and buddies.), which degrades the comment somewhat. So if it seems disjointed, that’s because it is.

    This is a fragment:

    I understand the dangers of Blue Pill Jordan Peterson for young men. Especially young men that aren’t getting laid and don’t have much sexual experience with women. The whole Blue Pill Feminized Matrix is hell on teaching young men shit. Especially if they watch Entertainment News and television.

    I have to separate my solipsism from what is out there in the field for other father’s and young men. To whit: A a mature male, I can easily compartmentalize facets of life. I see how other people including women and feminized men cannot do that. I recognize this trait in patients when I prescribe three independent prescriptions for a patient. Each having a separate compartmentalized function. Analogous to the trades building a house. The plumber, electrician and the HVAC guy are performing different functions.

    And I’ve always been in the top ten percent of being able to learn, philosophize, intellectualize and work with ideas. So compartmentalizing Jordan Peterson’s stuff into boxes is easy for me. Not so for others…..

    ……So I have seen a lot of great stuff from Peterson lately in regards to how life is a shit show if you let it be. Chaotic if you let it be. He gives tools in the toolbox to deal with masculine issues penetrating a chaotic world. His latest interviews with Russell Brand (on Addiction) and his latest with Joe Rogan on hypergamy are fantastic. I can compartmentalize that stuff. So can Matt (although he doesn’t read or listen to Peterson, or even need Red Pill right now, and he’s not blue pill) and so can Mario (I discuss things with Mario on an uncle basis.)

    So there is that. The danger of JBP is out there like rocks in the ocean under stormy conditions trying to move in and out of ports of meaning. But knowledge, ideas and sparks of Ignition are important for young men and there are very few other manosphere venues to pursue. There aren’t a million other men out there that can say shit better than Peterson. And Peterson is not going to run out of ideas, because he is always formulating more.

    Peterson says that post-modernists can’t just take an original work that can stand on it’s own intellectually with ideas and turn it in to a self designated agenda. Because it stands on it’s own. In other words, you can’t have post-modernists take Anna Karenina by Tolstoy, or The Brother’s Karamozov by Doestovsky and twist it so much for modern culturally appropriation. You can interpret it now, you can’t erase the base writing.

    Peterson started to formulate thoughts and ideas in 1985 and worked and worked them, based on works by many classic philosophers and psychiatrists.

    And then I cut and pasted the Wikipedia on his 1999 book Maps of Meaning. Mainly to point out that he won’t run out of material based on what he drew on for many decades of teaching.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maps_of_Meaning

  31. ” I don’t agree. Ideas are just ideas and life for males is comprised of walking through minefields…”

    Kinda mostly disagree.

    For many young males, Life is a matter of Life and Death, and Ideas Matter Immensely.
    It’s not only about a mental exercise for shits and giggles, and accuracy matters.

  32. @ASD:

    The second he said “no” to “gender pronouns” he painted a target on himself. So far he has survived, but even his tenure won’t protect him forever. He started out just protecting himself, developing a revenue stream that would be there when he gets the academic ax.

    Then he got a grand plan, to develop a brand new, Internet centered, university system. That is going to take a lot of money and make him a university president type, rather than an academic. There’s a lot of kissing asses to raise funds in that.

    Now, because of the adulation he’s receiving he risks falling into the Tony Robbins mold instead.

  33. I see Sentient’s guy, Vito Schnabel, is now with the bitch that fucked over Johnny and Elon:

    Do you actually know any of those people? Why do you care?

  34. @KFG

    “My take is that he’s not so blind as he may appear, that he is at least somewhat aware that what he feels and what he knows are not aligned, but what he knows has been unable to change what he feels. You can see it in some of his old classroom videos when he talks about experimental and study results that he knows are good results, but make him feel squicky.”

    Hell Yes!

    And that goes to the matter of his Blue Pill Idealism too. You can see him dancing around in old videos of him discussing “Shadow Self” and Dark Sides and sublimating impulses. Although he does a fascinating job when he discusses it in regards to Nazi Prison Camps.

    That goes to Red Pill Enlightened Self-Interest (which can be characterized by heart and soul alignment with cognitive brain and action)

    Which goes to Sentient’s Platinum Rule, in which what you want is what is in your heart. And your brain finds a way to bring that to you. In the most efficient Game way possible: Analogous to going to the grocery store and getting a rib-eye steak. You walk in, pick one and have what your heart wants. (No intellectual debate).

    It’s been a while now since my buddies and I digested Reality Transurfing (in which Unity of Heart and Mind plays a huge roll) as a tactical toolbox of Red Pill implementation. And we use that gut check all the time. I even used it texting to my buddy from the gym today: “I think you are doing fine, I think your heart is aligned with your brain.”

    Unity of Heart and Mind (Not something that Depressed People have): In this state the feelings of the heart and the thoughts of the mind are as one. For example, on the upside: when a person is filled with joyful inspiration the heart “sings” and the mind “rubs its hands in glee”. In this state a person is capable of being highly creative. On the downside: It can also be the case that the heart and mind find agreement in emotions such as anxiety, fear and non-acceptance. This is when our worst expectations are realized. Finally, when common sense insists on one thing and the heart resists there is discord between the heart and mind. (adapted from Reality Transurfing)

  35. asd

    ” Do you actually know any of those people? Why do you care?”

    Awww c’mon, you know Johnny and Elon dontcha?

  36. @ PalmaSailor“Also ref his ideas, aren’t they more or less the same things he’s been preaching in the classroom for decades which I admit he has probably refined over time?

    Yes, most definitely. Gone over and over and over. Lots and lots of Ideas. Lots and lots of archetypal sources.

    @Blax

    “For many young males, Life is a matter of Life and Death, and Ideas Matter Immensely.
    It’s not only about a mental exercise for shits and giggles, and accuracy matters.”

    Depends on your frame of reference. I understand that you are out there mentoring a boatload of young men.

    I’m all about mental exercise. And I never did it for shits and giggles. And that made all the difference. Peterson isn’t out for shits and giggles, he used to be a nihilistic depressive. All he’s ever done academically and lecture wise has been to be accurate. (That’s actually why his Blue Pill-ism is dangerous)

    My deal is that my boys (son, future son in law, and a cohort of young men that are close) are not as at risk as your boys. Umm, Sorry? It goes to frame of reference.

    I’m not trying to be sarcastic or non-empathetic. It’s how I am.

  37. …. just girls.

    Not magicians or sorcerers or goddesses. Not really.

    Being ” a man ” is quite enough, as long as you understand who you’re dealing with. What’s their nature? What are they capable of by degree, and can you suss out the signs?

    Pussy blindness is a handicap, as I’ve tried to convey 1,000 times. I’m sure Vito thinks Amber is a high HB hottie ( that shit is mostly objective no matter how much guys try to quantify it. That’s why They Fall ).

  38. Being DPA alone isn’t enough…being a PUA isn’t enough…even being a Red Pill aware man is not enough (see: mgtow no Fap virgins)

    iow, knowledge + action => wisdom & understanding

    That’s one reason I like Ecclesiastes…Solomon tried a lot of things…

    Girls & their feelz….Mrs. Gamer is all excited about the new granddaughter…who lives many hours away atm…talks about Granddaughter Gamer a lot…looks at baby pics a lot…talks with Daughter Gamer every night…feelz….I was a Bad Person ™ because I told Mrs. Gamer that we had to leave Daughter Gamer’s house before Mrs. Gamer wanted to leave…deprived her of baby feelz, lol…she recovered after a few days…

    …Mrs. Gamer’s B.O.B. stopped functioning…I changed the battery…still wasn’t working….Mrs. Gamer lengthened the spring…contact!…I was proud of her for figuring it out…I meant to try that, but I wasn’t DPA enough about it….why did Mrs. Gamer care about B.O.B. and try to fix it? Feelz.

  39. My deal is that my boys (son, future son in law, and a cohort of young men that are close) are not as at risk as your boys. Umm, Sorry? It goes to frame of reference

    Understood.

  40. I’m not trying to be sarcastic or non-empathetic. It’s how I am.

    I wouldn’t even have said, “Um, sorry?” If I actually knew them, I’d care. It’s how I am. Now there’s me being sarcastic. lol

  41. @J

    These guys, going after that Amber chick, whatever they get is mostly what they deserve in a sense.

    A sane man should leave her to her own devices. There are some chicks that are too far gone to do anything with, and one’s fame or notoriety or smarts will never change any of that.

    But…. hawt…. Lol.

    Famous…..

    Games for kids. Fuck that, go to Disney. Their fantasy won’t take your shit and bust your Corazon, and you can pretend all you want until you reach your car in the parking lot.

  42. wrt Grandbaby Gamer, I’m not about the feelz. I care how she turns out, tho. If there’s something I know to do that will help her, I’ll do it. But, if that happens, it won’t be for a few years.

  43. ” . . . you need to come from a position where you can get it if you want it and the decision is voluntary.”

    This.

  44. kfg
    And it’s a fun enough little pop song to sing and only takes a few minutes to learn. Outside my usual folk/blues type stuff, but I’ll throw it in if I sense it’s the right sort of crowd.

    “Right sort of crowd” would be any crowd with 20-something or early 30’s girls far as I can tell.

    I’ve Told Ev’ry Little Star is another good one. I turn into a mini game show event, challenging the audience to guess what movie I’ve just watched. If a girl gets it (and it’s always a girl) it turns into an “OMG! You like that movie? I LOVE that one,” moment.

    Lot of fans of Tippi Hedren up there? Or just the girls?

  45. palmasailor
    Also ref his ideas, aren’t they more or less the same things he’s been preaching in the classroom for decades which I admit he has probably refined over time?

    It’s the ideas that used to be taught by fathers, uncles, older brothers, cousins, scoutmasters, horse wranglers, forest rangers, sports coaches, ROTC instructors, shop teachers…etc. As I said before, the fact that this is attention getting just shows how far the Female Imperative has shoved the window of discourse. “Stand up straight” – PE class in 7th grade…plus my father…plus other men…plus my mother, too. Geeze. Should not be a great big revelation to a man of 20 years!

  46. kfg
    Then he got a grand plan, to develop a brand new, Internet centered, university system. That is going to take a lot of money and make him a university president type, rather than an academic. There’s a lot of kissing asses to raise funds in that.

    Paging Bill Gates. Paging Bill Gates…

  47. ““Right sort of crowd” would be any crowd with 20-something or early 30’s girls far as I can tell.”

    I play mostly private college town coffeehouses. They draw from the high schools as well because it’s someplace they can go without getting carded. Of course they also draw whatever 60s burnout cases are floating about.

    “Lot of fans of Tippi Hedren up there?”

    Like I said, it’s always a girl. They’re Naomi Watts fans.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h2XnBsLP9lE

    That’s Melissa George singing. She also plays the Hooker With a Heart of Gold/Murder Victim in Dark City. I’m a Jennifer Connolly fan.

  48. “It’s the ideas that used to be taught by fathers, uncles, older brothers, cousins, scoutmasters, horse wranglers, forest rangers, sports coaches, ROTC instructors, shop teachers…etc.”

    For a number of reasons (which I could explain with too much verbiage), I haven’t seen any of those around in my my boys’ (son, future son in law, and a cohort of young men that are close) realm. Hence: a void that you-know-who might be attractive as filling. (and my son did have one high school coach that was horribly, awfully Blue Pill…)

    And as far as being a father, I took the non-helicopter route with my son (because that’s what my father did, and I thank him for doing so. I loved how that worked/turned out.) and it worked well for him despite some road crashes. Another reason I did that is contained in retrospect in EhIntellects comment upstream @July 11, 2018 at 5:40 am.
    Another reason is:
    http://deida.info/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/BK00906-interior-pages-3.pdf
    (And Rollo has some great red pill fathering perspective in his third book, mainly by acta, non verba).

  49. @kfg

    The girl in the picture is Vanessa Hudgens, not Mila Kunis. Sorry to be pedantic, just Mila Kunis is one of my favorite actresses.

    And to add, girls can lift and lift, and they won’t bulk up like men. They will get super lean, and have nice muscle curves, but not big arms or quads like men will. Lack of testosterone, what can you do…

  50. “The girl in the picture is Vanessa Hudgens, not Mila Kunis.”

    Yeah. Got my signals crossed somehow, because I’ve used the Hudgens example before without the error. She’s even tinier than Kunis.

    “Sorry to be pedantic . . .”

    Not at all. It’s called accuracy. I’m in favor of it. Thank you.

  51. “Lack of testosterone, what can you do…”

    Well, if you’re an athlete, you can take “steps” to keep your test levels near the legal limit.

    Under the current transgender rules the 70s East German women would have had to compete as men.

  52. I realized something last night…girls live in feelz, so you train them using praise. Boys should be different. Train boys using their own sense of accomplishment. You don’t want boys to train boys to respond to praise because that just makes them weak.

    Also, with boys, you might want to make a task tougher than normal to make them tougher and smarter. More confident. Put obstacles in their way. Yell at them. Don’t try to be their friend. Drill sergeant approach. (not that I was ever in the military)

    This wisdom was also in The Dosadi Experiment by Frank Herbert.

    I don’t have boys to train other than son in law.

  53. “I’ve seen this again and again.”

    Yeah, so have I. It’s what’s to be expected when you start doing too many reps with the weight of a cheese danish.

  54. “Not at all. It’s called accuracy. I’m in favor of it. Thank you.”

    Interesting thing about That what with all the buffers that AFC’s, incels or Blue Pill aficionados use vs. Red Pill Awareness.

    It’s recursive to that concept of Unity of Heart/Soul and the Mind.

    From Rollo’s 5 Stages of Unplugging it has to do with that Anger Phase (or take your pick of Denial, Bargaining or Depression), when they wake up to what their mind was cock-blocking from their soul. Their former lies being exposed (by awareness of how things really are) for what they are by a Red Pill approach.

    Truth. Radical Honesty. (e.g.,Admitting your unattractive features, or the baseness of female instincts, per se, in Game.)

    Same thing from Jordan Peterson-Beta Male Persona and The Shadow. The practical approach to developing your Shadow Self is radical honesty. A genuine moral effort (in the definitional sense of being honest about what is in your soul, not definitionally holding high principles for proper conduct) is a substitute for psychotherapy.

    The Truth is Out There….Accessible by The Red Pill.

  55. I worked as a receptionist in a hospital when I was a teen. The dietician’s office was next door and the clients would sit in my waiting area. I saw the effects of the no fat, all carb diet. Dietician would talk about calories and the importance of eliminating all fat. I noticed the patients over time didn’t seem to lose weight so the dietician asserted they must be “cheating”. They also got really ornery. I was only 17, but it was pretty clear to me whatever they were doing wasn’t working. Some things work brilliantly for men’s bodies….not the same for women’s bodies over time.

  56. Eliminating fat has been incorrect since its inception.

    Wanna lose weight and improve your hormonal profile, eat butter/fats and cut carbs/sugars drastically, even eliminating them completely from time to time.

    For good measure, don’t eat grains/breads either.

    The food pyramid we grew up with will make you sick over time.

  57. The two most medically underserved: the mentally ill and obese, for different reasons.

    Mental illness isnt profitable to celebrate. Obesity is.

  58. “Like Communism.”

    “Communism would work amazingly well if it wasn’t for human nature”. (h/t to BlackLabelLogic)

  59. “Eliminating fat has been incorrect since its inception.
    Wanna lose weight and improve your hormonal profile, eat butter/fats and cut carbs/sugars drastically, even eliminating them completely from time to time.”

    Agreed. Because it works. But cutting all fat and eating all carbs also works, as long as calories are minimal (I’ve done it). Just not longterm. In general (there might be outliers but when I look for a gauge on decisions I try to still to observation of longterm trends).

  60. Careful, carbs promote inflammation, depending on the source, in organs and in the circulatory system.

    This is one of the reasons cholesterol/fat will have a tendency to collect in these places. Absent higher carb intake, organs and arteries remain much clearer.

    Certain carbs act as sandpaper almost.

  61. Thanks Blax, I haven’t done that in a long, long time.
    Last time was after our youngest was born….just ate one thing for about six weeks (oatmeal or rice for instance). Not suggesting anyone else try it. The contrary, I don’t think anyone should…. but it worked like a champ. I figured if a POW could survive on only rice every day for years, I could do it for six weeks.

  62. @AR
    I’m just two degrees of separation from Tippi Hedren but not getting the answer to this trivia question. Please help.

  63. Girl trains to be thin and shapely, gets thin and shapely.
    Girl stops training to be thin and shapely and starts training to eat lasagna, gets fat.

    Ergo, training to be thin and shapely makes you fat.

    “Not suggesting anyone else try it. The contrary, I don’t think anyone should….”

    Eggs. If you eat only eggs you’ll be fine (but I advise throwing in a few ounces of liver once a week). And due to the packaging you only have to weigh and calculate calories once. After that you just count eggs. Which due to the packaging is super easy, you just count cartons. 3 cartons of large eggs, 2000 calories. Knock off a half carton, you’re running a safe and sustainable deficit.

    Also, you have to be wary of ending up skinnier, but proportionately fatter. You lose weight, but you lose proportionately more muscle than fat, so your body fat percentage actually goes up as you lose (plus there’s a bit of bone mass loss as well). When you gain weight again, you gain proportionately more fat than muscle. A few cycles of that and you end up a skinny blob of fat. If you then say “this sucks,” and just start eating, you end up a fat blob of fat (with osteoporosis).

    Gee, I wonder if there’s a way to stimulate retention of muscle and bone while running a caloric deficit so you lose mostly fat.

    “Certain carbs act as sandpaper almost.”

    Metabolizing carbs is a corrosive process, like rust. But the biggest issue is that it cross links proteins, essentially tanning your living tissue. Cross linked proteins resist breaking down for the normal protein cycling, so they accumulate over time.

    You gradually develop leathery skin and arteries.

  64. “For good measure, don’t eat grains/breads either.”

    The hamburger has developed a notorious reputation, and not without justification, but please note that the hamburger is a sandwich.

    And as long as I’m here I’ll note that wheat is the most “problematic” of grains, rice the least.
    Soy is the most problematic legume, lentils the least.

    So if you’re going to eat a grain and legume diet no matter what anybody says, eat Indian food. Rice and lentils.

  65. I found one distinct and significant usage of “divine feminine” by Peterson in one of his writings…

    For better for worse, that idea reaches its apogee in Christianity. The divine individual is masculine because the feminine is not individual: The divine feminine is, instead, mother and child.

    https://jordanbpeterson.com/philosophy/new-years-letter/

    Protestants are gonna have problems with JP’s theology; since JP leans heavily on theology for his weltanschauung, especially concerning the relations of men and women, he will diminish his market. Of course, ignorant young men who are merely ‘tribal’ protestants probably won’t even pick up on that.

  66. @Palma However, to do that you need to come from a position where you can get it if you want it and the decision is voluntary.

    Isn’t this a result of shifting mindset from scarcity thinking to abundance thinking? If pussy is abundant, then there is no sacrifice to choosing to abstain at any point in time. You can merely choose to partake at the next moment.

    Monk mode may be useful to facilitate introspection and aid in arriving at a frame of abundance. However, there is no need for a prolonged “mode” once you have mastered this concept.

    For me, once the glaring and obvious truth of TRP became known to me, it was an instant revelation. From that moment forward, I knew the truth, and it was up to me and me alone to recover and re-orient myself to that truth. Monk mode would have only served to defer the inevitable at that point.

    …Out of the door and down on the street, all alone.

  67. “Monk mode may be useful to facilitate introspection and aid in arriving at a frame of abundance. However, there is no need for a prolonged “mode” once you have mastered this concept.”

    @marelius, Agreed.

    Monk Mode for Monk Mode’s sake is a buffer. And as you stated, maybe even a failure to internalize an abundance mindset.

    Absolutely. get your shit straight, but at some point you must test your mettle.

    How solid is your Frame? How centered is your MPoO? What is your metric? Only one way to find out.

  68. Seraph

    You read like an intelligent man and your point about JBP’s interpretation of the divine feminine isn’t lost on me.

    BUT what you are missing is JBP is blue pill when it comes to gender dynamics,it’s socialy conditioned into him. His battle with PC speech at the campus level is what kicked off his current fame.

    What he is battling with is the byproduct of what Rollo is battling ,capisch?

    When we see JBP fight against blue pill ideals( blank slate equalism,egalitarianism,defering to the feminine,ect,) at the root cause and stop playing with the side effects then this is the difference bettween antibiotics and aspirin if you get my drift.

    Do these boys need to clean their room? Yes . Is this the most important thing they need to learn? no.
    All this psycho babble is predictable,I can tell what JBP is going to say before he says it almost like I agree,still it is prescriptive of a larger root problem and the treatment DOESN”T cure the root condition .So there you have it.

    Rollo on the other hand isn’t prescribing anything,rather pointing out some root causes of DIS-EASE if you will.This I find much more helpful while at the same time it is blue pill heresy and a hanging offense to voice publicly in some circles ,god damn it saves mens lives for fucking real.

    So some inexperienced PHD is headed for hell,some bachelaureate has the answer that can help him and ner the twain shall meet.

  69. “Sometimes called witches due to their secretive nature and misunderstood powers, the Bene Gesserit are loyal only to themselves. However, to attain their goals and avoid outside interference, they often screen themselves with the illusion of being loyal to other groups or individuals.”

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bene_Gesserit

    It’s fiction, for those who have not read the Dune books.

    Then this from the Art of War:

    “If you know the enemy and know yourself, you need not fear the result of a hundred battles. If you know yourself but not the enemy, for every victory gained you will also suffer a defeat. If you know neither the enemy nor yourself, you will succumb in every battle.”

    Being fearful of women and the FI is not necessary. Being informed is absolutely necessary. The last several comments on Peterson and religion are good reminders that war requires getting our hands dirty. It is not always black and white. It’s no wonder the huge gains made by the “FI” are so deeply embedded in our society and culture. Those pushing that don’t care about which side is perfectly correct or whose “truth” has the most integrity.

    Open palms extended will have a better chance of building alliances and creating change.

  70. I guess I can be put in the JPB ‘fanboi’ category since I get a hell of a lot of value from his lectures. @Rollo, one thing you and Peterson have in common is that you both have unusually high Value/Bullshit ratios. Like, >90%. For that, I respect you both immensely.

    I agree with the criticism that JPB is blue pill and a tradcon, but I take issue with the suggestions that he’s fond of the phrase ‘divine feminine’. It’s just not true in a literal way nor is true that JBP spends a disproportionate amount of time pedastalizing the idea of the feminine in a metaphorical sense.

    He is not a good emissary of TRP, but he really never claimed to be. He’s forging a unique path with intellect and empiricism on one side and spirituality and charisma and literature on the other. In my mind, that’s what makes him so freakin’ effective at communicating his ideas.

    Listen, if anyone takes issue with what he says, then engage with the ideas rather than his personal eccentricities.

  71. The JBP criticism is interesting, I’ve been away from reading this blog for some months, it looks like he is still making quite a big impact here, as he should be.

    The latest 3 hour JBP session with Joe Rogan is very interesting, his best interview to date. He connects a lot of concepts together, some that were being talked about by libertarian authors such as Robert Ringer as far back as the 70s and 80s in some of the recent books I have read. JBP is highly intelligent and is extremely good at tying in cultural/social economic/envy issues etc and how they are factors in our modern predicaments. I agree that if someone only listens to JBP or JBP like individuals, he is in danger of being a “better beta” but even if so they still improved themselves, even without the intersexual knowledge.

    The criticism of the financial angle on JBP by some commenters is also unwarranted, it’s clear the manosphere/red pill is ripe for financial exploitation and while Rollo himself appears not cashing in massively, there are certain other Rollo allies such as the 21 convention that are clearly cashing in on the movement or hope to do so, nothing wrong with that but let’s be honest here, people want to cash in on this movement and are positioning themselves to do so, so criticism of JBP and him cashing is unwarranted, he should do so as he is clearly providing value to people and people are rewarding him for it.

    1. I’m done with JBP. Clearly I’m not allowed to have an opinion on the man else it’s professional jealousy and since it’s all cool to cash in on other men’s lives I’ll just keep doing what I do.

      This shit just proves my suspicions about a few commenters here, but I guess we’ll have to wait and see.

  72. I agree with the criticism that JPB is blue pill and a tradcon, but I take issue with the suggestions that he’s fond of the phrase ‘divine feminine’. It’s just not true in a literal way

    I bet this author scrolls past my comments.

  73. I’m done with JBP. Clearly I’m not allowed to have an opinion on the man else it’s professional jealousy…

    You’d be wise to listen to yourself there.
    Unfortunately unless you chose to pay the man a compliment, and leapfrog off of one of his ideas, and thereby attract some of his fans, all else will appear to be petty jealousy. And the more you protest it isn’t jealousy, the more it will seem it is. I have told Dalrock, that I think it would be better to try to work with and red pill educate JP than to make an unnecessary rival of him. I’m not saying that it will work, but it should be tried. Sorry you are in this frustrating circumstance. I understand your frustration. Unfortunately it would seem that you’re personally best off not mentioning JP in your writing, unless you’re paying him a respect, on a shared point, and then you will come across as seemingly above any petty personal rivalry.

    I’m your fanboi too! And honestly I don’t know that much about JP, other than he seems to help some lost and hopeless folks, by showing them some respect, sympathetic understanding, and some hope, and there seem to be a lot of “lostboys” who are hungry for somebody to inspire them without disrespecting their plight, patronizing, or even demonizing them. The opportunity is that there are many millions of those lostboys out there, and “children are the future”. So if somebody can lure JP’s fanbois with respect, understanding and a positive plan, like he has, millions of lostboys can also become their fans. And I know you’re smart enough to make your ideas appealing to the youth. You just have to show you understand their condition and reach out to ally yourself with them while respecting who they are and what they can become. JP seems to be mentoring on a grand scale, and he is respectful enough of his audience, that they actually crave his mentoring instead of finding it condescending. He has, metaphorically speaking, built a pretty good mouse trap, or at least the bait smells good to the young men thronging after him. He has become a pied piper, and sadly respect is a blessed tune those lost boys haven’t much heard before. I tell the men at Dalrock’s blog; society will never respect men, until we can show respect for each other, modeling the behavior for them. Everybody wants respect. Few seem wise enough to give it out generously.

    Thanks for the excellent blog, and your great thought resources.

  74. May as well face the facts,the pareto principal applies here,many are called few are chosen. Only 20% or fewer are going to make it to entrepreneur level the rest are followers,when the “man ” they are following stops leading they will find someone else to follow.

    What is even rarer is to find a mentor that can teach the level of personal responsibility to reach self sufficiency.

    Odd, does it seem that the young men today are more apt to follow a feminine man? Or is it just me?

  75. Re: cashing in.

    Over the last 35-40 years or so, society – more specifically men in general – have become adherents of the ” anything for money, however you can get it ” style. It’s been hugely disappointing to witness, and I think the only way it will ever end is when particular generations did off and successive generations fine that other dudes left dick for them to earn.

    Honor is mostly a dead concept. Hook or crook is more admirable. A further with of our degradation.

    I give no true shits about jbp cashing in as things like this become a normalized part of ” helping people “, like evangelicals driving 300,000 dollar cars, living in mu multimillion dollar mansions and flying around in private jets. Men admire these things while not seeing the bigger picture.

    And yes, if you point it out you will be labelled a jealous hater. I’ve been called that so much that I should have it on business cards.

    It doesn’t matter as much what other people do as it is now you perceive it and react to it. Most people wouldn’t praise a successful drug dealer, even though he too did whatever it took to earn, but almost anything else if fair game ( see financial crisis circa 2008….).

    Men are responsible for setting a ” tone ” , but have abdicated their responsibilities in favors of a ” get mine ” mentality.

    So a majority will never ever recognize what a part of what jbp is doing as problematic. That currency is an elevator in out delusional society.

    Mo’ money.

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