Little Big Head

One of the dichotomies I consistently see in the manosphere is the differences in how men approach the importance (or feigned unimportance) of sex. I got a bit sidetracked in last week’s essay. I was planing on writing about this phenomenon when I saw the need to explore how it impacted a larger social narrative. So, let’s consider this essay an addendum to The New Polyandry.

How men publicly and privately prioritize sex is always something that leads to a judgement call about that particular man, how he lives his life, and what it says about his integrity. If you openly make sex a “big deal” in your life, or you acknowledge its importance in intersexual relationships, you open yourself up to men’s Beta Game virtue signaling. The presumption is that if you were a real Alpha sex is just something you should have mastery over. If sex is at all important to a man, and he expresses this, that guy runs the risk of being seen as “obsessed with sex“, a “pussy beggar” or in someway less of a man for allowing sex to control his decisions.

Why is this the perception?

Two weeks ago I had a lively debate with the producer of Pat Campbell’s morning show. While we did have other topics to hit on that morning, she and I dug in and talked about how “sex is the glue that holds relationships together.” You can listen to the full segment here if you like.

As I mentioned last week, the notion that men need sex is nothing I haven’t covered in the past. In You Need Sex I made a case for the importance of sex and how it was, until recently, something that constituted part of a man’s life experience. Now it seems that being a sexless virgin at age 40 should be considered an accomplishment by certain factions in the manosphere: 

One very common dismissal of Red Pill awareness I read from Blue Pill men is this feigned, blasé indifference to sex.

For the most part this false-indifference is really a conditioned, response couched in Beta Game. The idea is for the Blue Pill guy to promote the public perception that he’s above his sexual impulses in the hopes that any girl within earshot (or reading his comments online) will recognize his uniqueness in not letting his cock do his thinking for him. From a male deductive logic standpoint it makes sense to the feminized male – women have all told him how off-put they are with guys who only think about sex, so he’ll identify with the women he’d like to get with and “not be like other guys.”

“All that Red Pill, PUA shit is for guy’s who obsess over sex. They only go to the lengths they do to get laid and never see the bigger picture. You don’t need sex you know? You wont die from not getting laid.”

[…]Thats the Beta Game behind the “you don’t need sex” Buffer, but there’s more to this rationale than that. Technically the Beta reasoning is correct; physically, you’re not going to die if you don’t get laid. You could probably masturbate to relieve yourself or live a sexless existence due to a physical disability and live a productive life as satisfying as you can manage it. If you don’t know what you’re missing or if a sexual substitute does the job, what’s the difference, right? The line of reasoning is that if it isn’t food, water or oxygen it isn’t really a necessity for existence.

You’re All Obsessed!

Self-righteous Blue Pill men always look to make their necessities into virtues. It also helps the men who fall on the 80% side of the Hypergamous Pareto curve to convince themselves and others that their sexual strategy – one that follows enforced monogamy – is the moral one; or the logical, common sense one absent the moral context. If you cannot get laid yourself, at least you can make getting laid into an ‘obsession‘ for the 20% of men who can. By doing so you encourage the 20% of men, who women desire to fuck, to police themselves and women by adopting your own, self-superior, one-woman-per-man sexual strategy.

Pretty much every MRA I’ve listened to, most Traditional Conservatives and a few MGTOWs, like to qualify men who can get laid as being in some way obsessed with getting laid. We’re told how morally superior they themselves are for essentially thinking with the big head instead of the little one, thus confirming their own part in a monogamous sexual strategy. As I mentioned in the last essay, a majority of men tend to fall on one side of the Strategic Pluralism Theory with respect to their sexual strategy.

Low SMV (sexual market value) men are basically forced to invest in one woman at a time if they are to successfully reproduce. This is the basis of a socio-sexual order founded on enforced monogamy. The larger pool of men benefit reproductively if the majority of men can be relied upon to follow the dictates of socially accepted, socially enforced, form of monogamy.

In the past this emphasis also had a culling effect on the worst aspects of women’s Hypergamous tendencies. If all men – including the 20% who could enjoy many women – agreed to play by the old social contract and adopted monogamy as their sexual strategy (in spite of being able to reproduce outside it) then more men would have the opportunity to reproduce. Furthermore, women’s Hypergamy would also be forced to accept lower SMV men’s monogamous strategy as a buffer to worst aspects of their own.

In the past, religious and social mores used to act as a buffer against Hypergamy, but the compromise for women was that they could expect to have the Beta Bucks provisioning aspects of their Hypergamy more or less provided for by the majority of men who adopted this strategy. In an evolutionary sense, protection and provisioning are already an integral part of the male mental firmware. But all of that went out the window after the Sexual Revolution, unilaterally female-controlled hormonal birth control and the socio-sexual/socioeconomic landscape that sprang from the Fempowerment narrative.

Today there is a radical imbalance between the old social contract upon which enforced monogamy was a key element and the new social contract dictated by a gynocratic social order that places women’s sexual strategy well above that of men’s. So it’s small wonder that men would revert back to 80% of low SMV men insisting on, and shaming, the 20% of high SMV men comply with a sexual strategy that women readily confirm isn’t in their best interests. 

On the male side of the strategic equation a majority of low SMV men cannot afford to have Alpha men playing by the rules of polygyny.

That polygyny is really a form of female-directed polyandry (see last week’s essay), but to the 20% of men who enjoy the benefits of falling on the enthusiastic consent side of Hypergamy it just makes sense to go with it. As such, low SMV men are compelled to find ways of discouraging these Alphas from following their r selected sexual strategy. They realize women will want, and pursue, Alphas. And in a polyandrous socio-sexual order based on the Alpha Fucks side of Hypergamy low SMV men drew the shortest straw.

Intrasexual Combat

When Beta men shame women for wanting to fuck Alpha men it has the effect of making those Beta men seem more insecure. In a feminine-primary social order one of the highest crimes is to attempt to challenge Hypergamy in any way. Even in a religious context, to challenge Hypergamy is to be guilty of repressing women’s sexuality. Today, just this impression is conflated with ‘toxic’ masculinity.

In truth, it would never occur to most low SMV men to shame women for their sexual strategy because they know that in doing so they reduce their own chances of reproduction. Women simply deem them ‘losers’ in the SMP (sexual marketplace). They become scolds, or worse, they become men who are “insecure in their masculinity” because they confirm their low SMV status in doing so. In today’s socio-sexual environment men policing women’s Hypergamy is a lost cause.

The solution then becomes an effort to disqualify the Alpha men they compete with by changing the rules that “real men” are supposed to play by. If you can’t win the Game, change the rules to better fit your strengths.

The ‘Real Man®‘ becomes the guy who exclusively invests himself in one ‘Quality Woman‘ – just like they do.

The apex of masculinity becomes whatever definition best aligns with what they believe they represent.

The’Real Man®‘ is the guy who best fulfills a woman’s, often duplicitous, sexual/life strategy by adopting the K mating strategy of socially/religiously enforced monogamy – just like they do. Oh, and the Quality Woman becomes whatever woman whose necessity compels her to agree with and adopt that strategy (Epiphany Phase).

The Real Man®‘ is the guy who plays by the old social contract rules of enforced monogamy, so more Betas might have a better shot at reproduction. True ‘Manhood‘ becomes a title Betas now feel qualified to bestow on other men; just as women also do with men who help complete their Hypergamous life-strategies. 

Trads vs. The Playboy Lifestyle

In order for Beta men to effect this reigning in of the Alpha men women want to tame and breed with, the high SMV man must be demonized and disqualified from the SMP for following his sexual/biological imperatives. The most common way to do this is by conflating his strategy with a degenerate hedonism. he must be made to seem as if he’s not in control of his sexual nature. So the effort becomes one of building an archetype around the ‘Playah‘ – A man who would be a bad long term bet for women’s Hypergamy because he lacks self-control. For this straw man character his little head does the thinking for the big head making him unreliable as a prospect for parental investment.

If enforced monogamy defines the accepted SMP, and women are presumed to be coequal, co-rational participants in it the ‘Playah’ needs to be cast as the outsider. The latent message is the same intrasexual combat method women use with ‘slut shaming‘; the ‘Playah‘ is a bad bet for long term security even if he is the guy women want to fuck.

However, that Playboy is a cruel reminder to low SMV men that they’ll never be able to fully exercise their own masculine imperative – unlimited access to unlimited sexuality. The closest the majority of men will ever get to this is online porn; which of course is why it’s so popular. There is a reason why 68% of Christian men watch porn. They understand that it’s the only viable substitute for their sexual imperative that they’re likely to experience in this lifetime.

While MRAs and MGTOW tend to reserve a special hate for ‘Playahs‘, it’s the Trad-Con mindset that is the most vocal against the Playboy lifestyle. There’s an overarching need amongst Trads to confirm their ego-investment in locking themselves into  enforced monogamy. 

There’s two complications to this:

First, Trad men (and women) tend to superimpose their religious and social belief set on their own sexual strategy. It’s a sin if they don’t accept monogamy as the standard. Today, this belief is a vestige of the old buffers that used to guard against either sex getting too far into their primal sexual impulses and strategies. It’s much easier to impose your sexual strategy on other men, effectively policing their strategy, if it’s ‘God’s Will’ that everyone behave according to that old social contract. I should add that this is the primary reason most Trad men suffer the worst from having their belief in the old set of books destroyed by Red Pill truths. It is galling for men who’ve invested their whole lives in the old social contract to have it vividly disproved by ‘Playahs’ (and women’s behaviors that confirm it) who understand the new social contract well enough to make it work for them.

Second, there’s the self-fulfilling idea that a man who opts for the traditional monogamous lifestyle is in some way more progressive or evolved, or life-satisfied than the ‘Playah‘ with the option to enjoy his non-exclusive sexual strategy. These are the guys who play up the ‘sour grapes’ Law of Power:

Law 36 – Disdain the things you cannot have

If there is something you want but cannot have, show contempt for it. The less interest you reveal, the more superior you seem.

MRAs and Trads alike don’t like being reminded that sex has always been an integral part of a healthy life experience for the majority of men who’ve ever lived on this planet. However, to them, sex is almost always a reward for desired behavior that they believe women expect of them. For most of them sex is always transactional so they never live out any frame of reference of having sex with a woman in a validational sense. It’s likely that they will never experience sex in any other context than the transactional. This is simply one of the visceral realities of a Darwinian sexual marketplace. As such, this pretext colors all of their understanding about what is, or should be accepted as, a legitimate sexual strategy – which unsurprisingly is his enforced monogamy strategy.

“Meaningful” Sex

The low SMV majority have many contrivances to corral uncooperative Alphas to adopt their sexual strategy. However, there’s also an involved necessity to convince themselves that their Blue Pill conditioning is the best sexual strategy that would benefit everyone if we’d all just see the validity of it as they do. To effect this they apply a subjective “meaningfulness” to their enforced monogamy (K selection) and “meaninglessness” to pursuing men’s biological imperatives (r selection) or the Alpha sexual strategy.

As a result, low SMV men tend to deemphasize the importance of sex in life. I asked this in the introduction; why is there a perception that a man who enjoys many women is somehow having sex that is less ‘meaningful’ than a man whose sex live is dependent on his relationship with one woman – or, a man who is ostensibly celibate?

The tactic involved here is the control over what constitutes meaning in sex. Low SMV men need this control to direct a meta-Frame that foments their sexual strategy; sex is only valid if it’s ‘meaningful’ in a way that aligns with an enforced monogamy sexual strategy. Thus, they can disqualify high-SMV men by delegitimizing his sexual experience. The higher the notch count, the less meaningful the sexual experience – and the likelier he can be seeen as “obsessed‘ with (meaningless) sex.

“Meaning” is deliberately ambiguous to better salve the egos of low SMV men, but meaning only aligns with what better promotes the enforced monogamy strategy. This strategy conflict actually serves Hypergamy in the long run as well. Women will endorse the importance of meaningful sex since it helps to convince the r selected Alphas that they should (eventually) shift to K selected commitment and parental investment with them. To the Beta moralist, any sex that doesn’t implicitly lead to marriage, children and the formation of families it’s always ‘meaningless’.

For the less moralistic low SMV man the idea that sex is something easily had, something inherently cheap, serves in devaluing Alpha men’s sexual experience. A popular idea among MRAs is that meaningless sex is something any guy can realistically achieve in a random club on a Friday night. This also serves to debase the value of learning Game; something MRAs never seem to have any facility with. By unrealistically cheapening the process of Game the same ‘meaninglessness’ imperative is created.

If any guy can find a worthless club slut with minimal effort then the low SMV man can raise his value by appearing to have higher standards than to lower himself to doing so. See how that works? This is a variation of the ‘sour grapes’ strategy I mentioned earlier. The Alpha who can easily get women becomes common. And by enjoying what Beta men believe should be a common sexual experience that man is reducing himself to his baser instincts. They say he’s “obsessed with pussy” or a “pussy beggar” because he’s applied himself to learning, in the most marginal way, how to have sex on his terms. And if he plays by a rule set that doesn’t align with the “correct” rules all his efforts become “meaningless”.

I should add here that MRAs and some Trad-Con men also like to foment the idea that because they eschew all that easily-had “meaningless” sex that Alpha men and Low Quality women are engaging it frees him up to pursue more esoteric, philosophical and creatively productive pursuits. Again, this helps to boost their esteem while presenting the appearance of uniqueness in spite of the fact that few of them ever have anything concrete to show for it. Along these lines they also love to imply that famous celibate men of antiquity were somehow more accomplished because they had the forbearance of mind to understand sex was a hindrance. When no one believes you aren’t making your necessity a virtue it’s sometimes necessary to paint men more famous than you with the same false-virtues.

The common refrain is that they’ve reached some Nirvana state of higher purpose or that they’ve evolved above the common need for sex. They shame the Alpha’s intelligence by claiming they allow their sexual nature to dictate to their rational nature. This too is a sexual quality signaling (or they believe it should be). They hope that their coequal, co-rational, Quality women will respond to it because they presume they’re using the same enforced monogamy rule book. Most Beta moralists are egalitarian blank-slate equalists. If they are evolved above their sexuality, then evolved, rational women should be too – but only if they are quality.

Published by Rollo Tomassi

Author of The Rational Male and The Rational Male, Preventive Medicine

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Pinelero
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Pinelero

What playbook is the average woman going with then in 2019 USA? She has her naturally RP hypergamous instinct, but that has to be enacted within the social morays of her local environment.

Blaximus
Guest
Blaximus

Willpower??? Based on….what exactly? Even when 30 years younger and single, it wouldn’t take ” willpower ” to not bang a Monica Bellucci. WIillpower??? If I wanted to bang, I’d bang, but she doesn’t have some kind of irresistible super power. Hence, she’s just a girl. That’s how I see her. That’s how I see 80% of them. Lol, some of the hottest chicks I’ve ever had sex with were the worst sex partners ever. And I let them know this most times. Because guys get dazed by their looks, and only want to put dick in ( masturbating with… Read more »

kfg
Guest
kfg

The extended family in the absence of strong paternalism. The historical basis for The Game of Thrones was medium-strong patriarchal. Women could wield direct power of their own, but only on the rare occurrence of lacking any male relatives. I don’t know how it’s handled in TGoT, I haven’t paid much attention to either the books or the show. The absence of patriarchy does not imply matriarchy; the dominant men are simply not the husbands/fathers. Without certain paternity male dominance falls to other men who are of certain blood relation. The male offspring of women. Brothers and maternal uncles. Family,… Read more »

rugby11
Guest

Exposure to cannabis alters the genetic profile of sperm
Whether genetic changes can be reversed or are passed on to children is still unknown
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2018/12/181219075846.htm

Boris (@Protagoris7788)
Guest

Same as it ever was. People no longer marry their second and third cousins, except in the Arab world and sub-Saharan Africa. The Catholic Church banned consanguineous marriage in the 12th century. It survived in places but it gradually died out. If it was literally “the same as it ever was” then our intelligence would be the same as it ever was. The black guy who impregnates a bunch of girls he can’t support was never part of my nation. Even most white guys aren’t part of my nation. Not everyone is Amish. if it were dysgenic we would not… Read more »

theasdgamer
Guest

Nah. I know she’s married. Just don’t care (might end up getting me killed one day tho lol).

Sure could. But you can enjoy your memories as your life blood oozes out of your chest and your back arches at the end.

If my wife hoodwinked some guy into banging her, I wouldn’t hold it against him. But someone like you, J, would just disappear one night. There wouldn’t be any screams because of the gag. If you haven’t guessed, I can be a monster. I don’t always run from a fight.

Student
Guest
Student

@kfg

“The absence of patriarchy does not imply matriarchy; the dominant men are simply not the husbands/fathers. Without certain paternity male dominance falls to other men who are of certain blood relation. The male offspring of women. Brothers and maternal uncles.”

Yeah its not like single mothers are pointing their children towards Justin Bieber and other such freaks. Yeah a single mother is really likely to have been brought up by dominant males and not wuss bags.

theasdgamer
Guest

Do children have agency because they can be trained?

Irrelevant. Men and women have mature judgment centers in their brains. Nowadays, it’s about at 22 for women and 24 for men. Being on your own can accelerate the maturation is my guess.

Boris (@Protagoris7788)
Guest

He’s talking about the extended family brah.

The government is the village.

Blaximus
Guest
Blaximus

The current generation doesn’t really believe in consequence. Too many weak fuckers that can be walked all over by other men. It’s like extremes – guys that become mass murderers because ” lpissed “, or guys that just shrug and cry and complain. Lots or younger guys don’t get it. It’s how they are socialized. Fuckin around with a.man’s wife is a great way to get got. There was a dude a long time ago that kept pushing up on my wife, and one day he made the miscalculation of doing it in front of my face. He didn’t die… Read more »

Blaximus
Guest
Blaximus

It wasn’t about her.

j
Guest
j

@blax

if I was presented with the opportunity to bang some dude’s “Monica Bellucci” (circa 2000), without anybody ever finding out about it (didn’t reveal my name, where I live, what my job is, etc.,), I’d do it. No question. Hey, maybe her sex game turns out to be shit. Aight well, I won’t bang her again lol. but. She IS a very attractive woman. She wanna bang, even tho she got a ring on her finger, I ain’t saying no.

Ain’t yo “thing”?

Cool.

We different. And that’s cool too.

j
Guest
j

“one day he made the miscalculation of doing it in front of my face”.

shhhhiiiiiit.

R.I.P.

lol

kfg
Guest
kfg

“All organisms that exist evolved.” And continue to do so. That’s what makes dysgenic evolution an issue in the first place. However, I note that we evolved advantageously from proto-simian ancestors. “The Catholic Church banned consanguineous marriage in the 12th century.” The time of the Crusades. And of course before it was banned, it was not banned, so it happened up until that point. So the Church and its civilization thrived and grew while it was done. “People no longer marry their second and third cousins . . .” People no longer know who their third cousins are and marry… Read more »

Student
Guest
Student

@kfg

Could you make your point clearer

@J

ignoratio elenchi. Just saying

kfg
Guest
kfg

“Men and women have mature judgment centers in their brains.”

https://infogalactic.com/info/Lawrence_Kohlberg%27s_stages_of_moral_development

Anonymous Reader
Guest
Anonymous Reader

Could you make your point clearer

The details were left as an exercise for the Student.

kfg
Guest
kfg

@ASD:

Note that the feminist theory of moral development does not refute the claim that men have a more justice based conception than does that of women.

They merely refute that that matters and have posited a caring model of morality.

So you are, ironically enough, at odds with feminism in claiming that women have the same sort of moral agency.

Student
Guest
Student

@Anonymous Reader

“‘Could you make your point clearer’

The details were left as an exercise for the Student.”

I’ll take that as a no then

Student
Guest
Student

@kfg
“Men and women have mature judgment centers in their brains.”

https://infogalactic.com/info/Lawrence_Kohlberg%27s_stages_of_moral_development

Your using 1950s psychology theory!

kfg
Guest
kfg

@Student:

When I was an undergrad I had a physics professor who liked to give us test questions he didn’t know the answer to. I thank him for it, because it turns out that figuring out the answers to questions that the professor doesn’t know is what grad students are for.

theasdgamer
Guest

@ student

“Better to keep quiet and be thought a fool than to open one’s mouth and remove all doubt.”

From 2010:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2892678/

theasdgamer
Guest

@ASD: Note that the feminist theory of moral development does not refute the claim that men have a more justice based conception than does that of women. They merely refute that that matters and have posited a caring model of morality. So you are, ironically enough, at odds with feminism in claiming that women have the same sort of moral agency. Why should I care? Agency merely implies ethical choices, which both sexes have since we don’t have external compulsions. Women can make ethical choices just like men can. Women have a cortex, even if their emotion centers are more… Read more »

Student
Guest
Student

@Kfg I’m a grad student so does that mean you don’t know the answer?

@asd

Your link is based on cognitive science theory.

As opposed to the 50s Kohlberg theory that bases all moral judgements around the value of justice.

Also cognitive science theory itself is built on shakey foundations

XXX
Guest
XXX

Blaximus, I think it would have served your alpha guy status it it was your wife who told the guy hitting on her to piss off loudly, and in no uncertain terms. You should not have done a thing, only smirked as she laid into him (in a bad way). Isn’t the manosphere always banging about how mate guarding is beta ? Sure, defend your territory if push came to shove, but I think most alpha men would ditch women who do not respect them enough to fend off the attentions of other men vigorously.

kfg
Guest
kfg

” . . . we don’t have external compulsions.”

Hunting, fighting and inseminating.

Gathering, gestating and child rearing up to weaning.

External compulsions – that are different, and yield different psychologies and moralities, because they must, or we wouldn’t be here. Plug the parameters of equality into an RTS game and watch your civilization collapse and die.

Are you really here to tell us that men and women are the same except for a few bits of irrelevant plumbing?

kfg
Guest
kfg

” . . . does that mean you don’t know the answer?”

No. It means that I am affording you the respect and opportunity to show that you can think.

Student
Guest
Student

@kfg “Are you really here to tell us that men and women are the same except for a few bits of irrelevant plumbing?”

I think women are more different than you can imagine.

I attacked this claim only:

“The absence of patriarchy does not imply matriarchy”

And quoted it to make that fact clear

kfg
Guest
kfg

“I attacked this claim only: “The absence of patriarchy does not imply matriarchy””

Do you know what the terms mean?

Adam S
Guest
Adam S

Long time lurker, first time poster. I agree with you about the importance of sex, but think you’re exaggerating a bit about the difference between alpha and beta strategies. Humans are a very k selected species and as a result we have strong parental urges. Although men don’t get the baby rabies in the same way as women, lots of men who can laid still want to have a family and invest in their kids. The ideal male reproductive strategy is to have a family who you provide for AND sexual variety on the side. This is what powerful men… Read more »

Student
Guest
Student

@kfg
“I attacked this claim only: “The absence of patriarchy does not imply matriarchy””

Do you know what the terms mean?”

Well kfg now you mention it, anthropologists haven’t used these terms for many decades because they were found to be nonsensical and of no use. So I could attack your claim from that direction if you like?

The point I was making contra your claim is that when children lack fathers they’re upbringing is not sufficiently substituted by male relatives. See my reasons above.

kfg
Guest
kfg

“The ideal male reproductive strategy is to have a family . . .”

Family does not imply nuclear family.

” . . . banging other girls didn’t stop a man from loving his wife . . .”

Historically wives did not expect to be loved. Ancient Greeks thought marriage was the cure for the mental illness of love. Marriages were arranged, for practical function.

That is why Victoria and Albert are held to be remarkable.

Student
Guest
Student

“Family does not imply nuclear family.”

Saying it doesn’t make it true and you haven’t addressed my objections above.

Good bye

kfg
Guest
kfg

” . . . anthropologists haven’t used these terms for many decades . . .”

In the absence of further evidence, I’ll take that as a “no,” but it’s good to know that there’s nothing to smash and that . . . the absence of patriarchy does not imply matriarchy.

” . . . when children lack fathers . . .”

I haven’t seen my father since I was 18 months old, but I’m pretty damned sure I had one.

Student
Guest
Student

@Adam S

What you say is true if the purpose of life is to cultivate sex. Doesn’t hold true if man is a rational animal AND his purpose in life is to cultivate rationality.

“Women have historically have been okay with this because”

Women are ok with it because it eats away at mans rationality and women are jealous of man abilities.

In my opinion anyway

theasdgamer
Guest

Are you really here to tell us that men and women are the same except for a few bits of irrelevant plumbing?

No, women and men are wired differently. However, despite the wiring differences, both men and women have judgment centers. Proper training will turn a feral boy/girl into a civilized man/woman.

Student
Guest
Student

@kfg

“I haven’t seen my father since I was 18 months old, but I’m pretty damned sure I had one.”

I didn’t say that you didn’t have a father.

I say that if you don’t see him in your childhood then you don’t have an optimal upbringing.

kfg
Guest
kfg

” . . . despite the wiring differences, both men and women have judgment centers . . .”

. . . which are wired differently. See the preparations for the final battle in Eaters of the Dead/The 13th Warrior.

“Proper training will turn a feral boy/girl into a civilized man/woman.”

Actual work with actual feral children suggests otherwise.

kfg
Guest
kfg

“I didn’t say that you didn’t have a father.”

That is correct, you addressed the generic issue. I am merely an instantiation.

“I say that if you don’t see him in your childhood then you don’t have an optimal upbringing.”

You are making the assumption that the absence of a father in the nuclear family model is the absence of being raised by men filling the same role. There are children who don’t even know that their father is absent.

Or perhaps you are merely making the bald assertion.

Student
Guest
Student

@kfg
“Or perhaps you are merely making the bald assertion.”

Gave reasons above. You haven’t addressed them

Dionysus
Guest
Dionysus

As has been stated, if all men tomorrow instantly became the ‘alphas’ of today the only thing that would happen is the women would become even more discerning as to who is in the top 20%. There is no real endgame here, just a losing propostion all around with enormous opportunity costs and a breakdown of society. It’s the ‘Snitch-Snitch’ equilibrium in the Prisoners Dillema – meaning not optimal. This is the crux of the connundrum when it comes to the creation of a functional society. The optimum civilizaiton-building strategy is the supression of sexual desire from the get go.… Read more »

kfg
Guest
kfg

“Gave reasons above.”

I have reread the thread and found no reasoning or reasons. Only the hammering of your a priori axiom.

So, ummmmmmmmmmmmm, OK?

boulderhead
Guest

“I didn’t say that you didn’t have a father. I say that if you don’t see him in your childhood then you don’t have an optimal upbringing.” Odds are on average this statement may be true,but considering that most men fall on the curves either side of average then the statement must be false. As in 80% of statistics are fabricated from partial evidence on the cuff of the spur in a moment. Calling a single moms father a wuss may ignore the fact that his SIL hit his daughter and summarily disappeared into the old out house hole during… Read more »

boulderhead
Guest

My favorite is the BMI,an above average man at 5’10 may weigh 230lbs with an 18″ neck 50″ chest and 36″ waist and 3% fat.
At the same time a below average man could be the same height and weight with 30% fat .

But they are both considered obese according to the BMI.Where is the curve?

What they are really bitching about is where are the good men? They are all tired.

SJF
Guest

@Dionysus You are mixing up the fact there is a Top Down approach and a Bottoms up approach to Red Pill. The former implies there are forces beyond your control. A Stoic would not let that bother him. You cannot control what you cannot control. The latter implies a man has control over his own way of thinking and doing. He can self improve. He can make his life better. He can decide how he thinks about his own realm and his control over his reality. It is implied in your statements you are not in an LTR. (As often… Read more »

alf
Guest

Hey Rollo I would like to put your SMV graph on the cover of my upcoming e-book (amongst other memes). Is that OK with you.

Blaximus
Guest
Blaximus

XXX

Clarification: wifey had rebuffed the guy numerous times. It was very different when he walked up ( knowing who I was ) and ignored me like I wasn’t even there, and hit on her 3 feet away.

That’s something completely different. I didn’t thrash him for hitting on my wife, I broke his ass for that level of blatant disrespect. It’s like a dude walking up and taking your beer/drink out of your hand while not acknowledging you at all.

He was trying to send me a message. Message received and replied to.

theasdgamer
Guest

As has been stated, if all men tomorrow instantly became the ‘alphas’ of today the only thing that would happen is the women would become even more discerning as to who is in the top 20%.

Lol, this is silly. The key thing is to learn your moves in the mating dance. The game isn’t about who dances “best.” Woman can’t discern that clearly. Most men dance very clumsily. It doesn’t take that much to dance without being clumsy.

theasdgamer
Guest

Blax, the drink thing hits home with me. Last night, a young girl was being very friendly to me, even putting her hand around my waist during a line dance–I’ve danced with her before, but she comes to the bar very infrequently. Anyway, I asked a guy who was chatting with her if I could leave my drink on the ledge near him and I went and did the line dance and the girl was friendly. When I came back, my drink was gone. I was pissed and abandoned the group and the girl, who was still throwing IOIs at… Read more »

joesantus
Guest

Reminds me to mention a counterpoint I sometimes drop on women who scorn, “You don’t die from not having sex.” “As a woman, you won’t die from not having social connection nor contact with your girlfriends, children, and family, either — but you live without any for six months, then report back how you’re faring.” As a sidenote…my wife (we’re first-marriage, 39-years-married…atheists…six now-all-adult kids,…mutually non-sexually-exclusive except a deliberate hiatus until all the kids had become adults) has been telling other women for decades, “Any woman who marries or long-term-commits to a guy, but doesn’t do all she’s able to meet… Read more »

Playdontpay
Guest
Playdontpay

Is there ever going to be a comment section where adsgamer doesn’t interject his dancing?

It’s as predictable as it is boring and it’s been done to death, give it a rest FFS.

ex-cartoonist
Guest

Why does this bother me? I get that there are Men Who Get Laid and Men Who Don’t. And I get Rollo’s point that Men Who Don’t try and shame the Men Who Do (a) out of a ‘sour grapes’ resentment, (b) as a sexual strategy to present themselves as ‘not like other men’, and (c) as an attempt to reframe the conversation so that ‘Alpha behaviour = shameful’, thus promoting themselves as ‘better men’. And that this is not the reality–that alpha men are not necessarily shameful. Fair point. I agree. However, as a low SMV guy, it seems… Read more »

Orson
Guest
Orson

@ex-cartoonist The manosphere is very fragmented and decentralised for you to feel like you are excluded. The various factions constantly pull knives on eachother which I find very entertaining to be honest. The black pill/Lookism crowd talks shit about red pillers for being old timers that cope with holding frame and lifting weights. They also call “MGTOW” Men sent their own way..lol. The Red Man Group and PUAs call MGTOWs incels in disguise or belittles incels for not trying hard enough …”just lift bro”. MGTOWs hate the PUAs and call them pussy beggars. TFL crowd call MGTOWs as true forced… Read more »

ex-cartoonist
Guest

@Orson Thanks for your comment. I laughed when I read your breakdown of ‘the Factions’. So true! I’m not sure I would use the word ‘excluded’, but I do wonder whether I’m welcome here. On the one hand, I love the idea of participating in a discussion which is, in essence, a search for the truth. My experiences with women have been marked by such extremes of joy and misery (mostly misery) that I really didn’t know what the hell was going on and Rollo’s blog explains so much and makes so much sense. I’m deeply grateful to the man.… Read more »

palmasailor
Guest
palmasailor

@ex cartoonist

So far no one has really had their knives out that I’ve seen

You’re just revelling in your own victim hood

If you got your attitude together most in here would pile in to help you make positive changes

Your negative mindset isn’t washing

No one wants to know.

ex-cartoonist
Guest

And there we have it.

I rest my case…

palmasailor
Guest
palmasailor

“And there we have it.”

Ok

Come up with something positive you are going to do and then see what happens

But that would be a burden of performance huh?

Yeah i know – easier to just feel sorry for yourself as a victim

Poor me..

Orson
Guest
Orson

“But if, as one commenter said, this is only a site for men who want to get laid (“If you’re not interested, what are you doing here?”)”

Getting laid is important part of the male experience so it’s also about that.
Still this is the best place to learn about inter-gender dynamics and there is a lot of gold in the posts and the comments. You don’t have to agree with everything and if someone challenges you in the comment section does not mean that you “don’t belong”.

palmasailor
Guest
palmasailor

@orson

He could belong and is welcome but it’s a male space and tribe. Members need to add value or they get metaphorically kicked out

Cartoonist

Go out to a high end hotel bar tonight on your own sit at the bar and talk to the barman and talk to any women within 6 feet of you

Something innocuous

You’ll fail miserably attempt one unless you’re super lucky

Post a field report tomorrow and see who piles in to try to help you improve..

Or don’t

It’s up to you.

Orson
Guest
Orson

@ex-cartoonist “partly to hear other experiences and partly to figure out what works for me.” If you don’t know about the red pill and other’s men experiences you feel like there is something uniquely wrong with you when shit hits the fan. When my 6 years old LTR ended I was all alone because I made the mistake to ostracise myself from male friends and the social circle and only socialise with the girlfriend. I started dating immediately after she dumped me and ghosted me. Just one week after that, I dated a girl that was hotter than her and… Read more »

scribblerg
Guest
scribblerg

Great post. This is the kind of clear truth men – alphas and betas and everyone else – need to internalize. Rollo provides us with a map, how one traverses the terrain is up to each man to come to terms with himself. But somehow, Rollo didn’t quite go the distance on the beta mindset wrt hating guys who fuck lots of women. Their insipid rationales (i’m low, or immoral, or obsessed or mean – all on display in this comment thread already) are merely buffers for their egos. They have to hate us or else they will only be… Read more »

Blaximus
Guest
Blaximus

You can’t keep a woman around.

They keep themselves around.

When you start ” figuring “, you’re on the road to fucking up over the long term. That figuring shifts the frame to her.

Sentient
Guest
Sentient

Blax

HoF quote

“You can’t keep a woman around.

They keep themselves around.”

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6475023/California-wildfire-evacuee-returns-home-dog-waiting-rubble-torched-house.html

Once more with feeling “cats are not dogs”

scribblerg
Guest
scribblerg

Fyi, I have a nuclear blast waiting in moderation cuz of two links, you pussies had better brace yourselves. @Orson and The Wheeler – Men choke down the Red Pill for the pussy, then calmly transform their beings and lives when they get that they’ve denied themselves their very essence via gynocentric social conditioning. The hardest part for me was seeing my complicity and how I liked whining. I needed my good excuses for not shouldering the Burden of Performance. @Wheelie – Read Rollo’s books. You seem quite smart and evolved, I don’t think you will need so much time… Read more »

theasdgamer
Guest

@play

See, there’s this thing called a scroll wheel…

Sentient
Guest
Sentient

Cartoonist

“Sure, I would love to bang hot women, but since they don’t want to bang me, I feel I would be wiser to focus my energies and time on pursuits I CAN succeed at. ”

I’d like to fly, but wishing won’t make that happen.

What have you been doing to bang any women, let alone hot ones?

Sentient
Guest
Sentient

Blax

Concur with your beat down. Now tell the story…. Blow by blow.

Sentient
Guest
Sentient

On the topic of sex with married women… Sex is really no big deal to women, to a degree we will never fully understand as men. They are hit on constantly, if largely ineptly or half heartedly. But every single one of those little IOIs they receive they can fan in to a fire with a subtle response. They know this. A little side action to a married woman is not a big deal. Easily rationalized away, it “just happen ed”, or tucked away as a fantasy… Guilt free just like that chocolate they ate while dieting… And from what… Read more »

Onder Hassan
Guest
Onder Hassan

The problem with this theory Rollo is that as valid as it is that Alphas are able to have sex with as many women as they want and serve their sexual needs. It simply isn’t healthy in terms of your biological function to experience that much sexual gratification. We simply weren’t built that way and is more harmful than good. Case in point is the idea of stimulation. Almost everyone experiences the eventual dopamine flatline to porn, which commonly spawns into more taboo types of porn in order to get the dopamine hit required to feel excited. This is no… Read more »

Student
Guest
Student

@Onder Hassan

Exactly.

Sugar is good. But being addicted to sweeties and chocolate is not.

Christians have one way of regulating intake others have their own.

But a lot of red pill don’t see a problem. They are like drunks and crack addicts who never realise how much it stunts their growth because they never manage to get out of that drunken state.

scribblerg
Guest
scribblerg

@Onder – Throughout much of humanity’s time on Earth, high power/value men have taken many men. When it was legit to do so, and when not. This is not as new a phenomena as you seem to want to think, nor was monogamy enforced very well. In terms of reproductivity, it’s clear many lower value men don’t get to pass on their genetics. so the clustering around high value males is clear over human history. You talk about what’s good for “harmonious society”, says who? When was this great “harmony” you speak of? So all quality of genetics get the… Read more »

Sentient
Guest
Sentient

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=slCyRchz2YQ

If you are looking for a Christmas movie… Which covers hypergamy, fidelity, sexuality and Illuminati…

Blaximus
Guest
Blaximus

Sentient Yeah man, I was that dog story in one of the morning news shows. Outstanding. Re: guys trying to figure out how to keep a woman around, 😂 that sounds like some kind of hostage situation. You can’t expend brain power in that stuff. My wife is out right now desperately trying to wrap up Christmas shopping, and I have a work project to work on, so I’ll be tethered to my laptop for the bulk of the day. Wifey has been blowing up my phone with texts since she left – ” do you want me to bring… Read more »

theasdgamer
Guest

Nope. I don’t grasp why a man would try to ” figure out ” how to keep a woman around.

I don’t grasp why a man would try to “figure out” how to drive a car. No accidents in decades and one moving violation (when I was severely sleep deprived).

You don’t even get why your statement is so retarded.

Someone who has unconscious competence doesn’t understand why people can be incompetent. It’s just so easy….

theasdgamer
Guest

Almost everyone experiences the eventual dopamine flatline to porn

Except when they don’t…like me, cuz I don’t do porn. I have other addictions.

theasdgamer
Guest

It simply isn’t healthy in terms of your biological function to experience that much sexual gratification.

…sounds like something a woman would say when there are no hot guys around…this is standard FI programming and is backed up by NO scientific studies

Blaximus
Guest
Blaximus

Women and care are different things.

My statement is not retarded, a man shouldn’t ” figure out ” how to keep a woman around. Women stay because they want and are compelled to do so. Men aren’t women, so all that figuring will most likely be an FI based form of blue pilled capitulation.

First a man understands who and what he is, then he needs to understand the opposite sex. You don’t get them and then start figuring.

theasdgamer
Guest

First a man understands who and what he is, then he needs to understand the opposite sex. You don’t get them and then start figuring.

In an ideal situation, sure. Unfortunately, many men have to figure it out AFTER they are married. I remind you of your first marriage.

theasdgamer
Guest

Blax, my son in law is in a marriage and doing a shitty job of leading…Daughter Gamer moved out a month ago because of his constant attacks on her…she has started a new job with lots of hours as well as the baby, being sleep deprived for months on end and lots of stress at work as well as with the SIL…she cannot function at work if SIL is in the house…he follows her from room to room, ranting and yelling at her…he has not listened in the past to my lessons, characterizing them to Daughter Gamer as “sexual escapades”… Read more »

Orson
Guest
Orson

@scribblerg “Women want to stop having to fuck betas. They’d rather work their whole lives and die lonely deaths for just some time on alpha dick in their lives.” That’s the path to asexuality for women and the inverted female version of “Meaningful” sex that Rollo talks about in this essay. Female sexual strategy is completely lame and unnecessary in the modern world we live in. Her reserving her ovaries for alpha seed serves no purpose whatsoever if the seed ends up in the trash bin. Many western countries are dying out because of their infantile entitlements. Majority of women… Read more »

boulderhead
Guest

@Studebaker.

“Christians have one way of regulating intake others have their own.”

The majority of Christians use porn to regulate their intake,they need to take the red pill.

Sentient
Guest
Sentient

Blax Yup I hear you… Of late, as my radiant sexual vibe has amplified… Wife has taken to grabbing me throughout the day and planting a kiss… and acting very jealous when I am out… sending a bunch of texts “hey! When you coming home ;)” “Be careful out there” “stay out of trouble” etc… My WK buddy gets furious when I show these to him… ASD Well your “trained” daughter is just some isolation away from banging some random dude… I’m in on the pool. Red Flags – it’s what’s for Christmas… [PS – women with recent babies are… Read more »

Student
Guest
Student

@boulderhead

“The majority of Christians use porn to regulate their intake,they need to take the red pill.”

Just because they identify as Christian doesn’t make it so. And even if they did that figure is lower than average among men. I wonder how tight their survey methodology was etc….

Yawn.

kfg
Guest
kfg

“Just because they identify as Christian doesn’t make it so.”

Primus: How old are you?
Secundus: 50
Primus: Dude, you look awful, like you’re 70.
Secundus: Actually, I’ve lived for 90 years, but I spent 40 of them in Delaware and don’t count them.

theasdgamer
Guest

ASD

Well your “trained” daughter is just some isolation away from banging some random dude… I’m in on the pool. Red Flags – it’s what’s for Christmas…

Lol, I’ll take that bet. A fool and his money…

Sentient
Guest
Sentient

Well you are a fool ASD . so… Get ready.

Red Flags

Separated
Husband is a bitch… So she has no guilt.
Post baby self esteem issues.
Stressed
Works out of home, so has child support. Easy to isolate.
Momma doesn’t like SIL… Sisterhood Uber Alles activated!!!
FIL has Daddy Goggles on…

What kind of odds you giving?

Sentient
Guest
Sentient

Oh and 8. Fear of “what is going to happen to baby?”… Monkey branch….

Sentient
Guest
Sentient

Let me know when the GNO’s start…

“Sure dear, your dad and I will watch the baby tonight. You seem so stressed, go have some fun with your girlfriends…”

Sentient
Guest
Sentient

Blax back to your HoF quote… ” You can’t keep a woman around. They keep themselves around.” The subtle mental shift, so easy, yet so hard. Reminds of the story of a HoF cornerback… He was a big stud out of college, got on his NFL team, ballin out… One day an older corner pulled him aside and asked him about his “mentality”, how he approached the game. The younger guy said “easy man…. don’t GET BEAT!”… lol Older timer shook his head, “that’s why you won’t be great”. Youngster was taken aback ‘huh”… Old guy “think about this… the… Read more »

theasdgamer
Guest

Sentient, you should feel confident about 5 to 1 odds, so let’s do 500/100.

Daddy Goggles, lol

kfg
Guest
kfg

“Daddy Goggles”

An order of magnitude stronger than husband goggles.

Sentient
Guest
Sentient

Well there we have it… ASD had no confidence in his “training” BS… So at least we wont have to hear about that nonsense any longer. If he had any integrity that is.

Sentient
Guest
Sentient

Of course those playing along at home will note that with the selection and parental ratification of SIL the “training” was seriously deficient to begin with.

Beds made will be layed in…

theasdgamer
Guest

Of course those playing along at home will note that with the selection and parental ratification of SIL the “training” was seriously deficient to begin with. Lol, the training that I did on Daughter Gamer was seriously deficient. I was very Blue Pill when she was growing up. However, I knew that SIL was a basket case going in to the marriage. He was a flight attendant and told DG that he had never kissed a girl. Not bad looking, though, and he could carry on a convo. I still got a beautiful granddaughter out of the deal, so I’m… Read more »

Sentient
Guest
Sentient

ASD

Briefly because I don’t enjoy hurting kittens…

A male flight attendant that never kissed a girl? We have a word for that: gay.

On training be insufficient… Well your admonitions and citing the Bard left out the fact that all your hope in this is wannabeeism or just straight KJ…

So we can dispense with this henceforth.

Grandkids? That’s your Trump card?

I have five kids, all in school ATM. I’ve no doubt there will be 10 to 20 grandkids down the line.

theasdgamer
Guest

Beds made will be layed in…

Yep. My goal of grandkids achieved despite the pathetic cards I was holding. Now I’m gaming SIL and he’s coming to me, along with his mother and father. Daughter Gamer is an alpha widow to me, despite my blue pill past. (Nonsexual, of course, to prevent the pervasive pervs. I alliterate all over myself.) So SIL has to listen to me because he doesn’t want a divorce.

theasdgamer
Guest

A male flight attendant that never kissed a girl? We have a word for that: gay. Indeed, but strangely enough, he was interviewed on national tv about his anti-gay stand. He’s not effeminate and he’s tall and fair complexioned. Swiss-German and very devout. Mennonite background. Doesn’t drink. He was a flight attendant on military charters. Burned up a shed when he was a boy, so he shows some masculine traits. But very blue pill in a churchian sense. His dad told him, “true love waits.” I recognize some of my former blue pill aggressiveness in him, so I empathize somewhat… Read more »

Student
Guest
Student

@ASD

Don’t Mennonites reject military service?

boulderhead
Guest

@Studley

“Just because they identify as Christian doesn’t make it so. And even if they did that figure is lower than average among men. I wonder how tight their survey methodology was etc….”

I was surprised that 68% of men that identify as christians were honest enough to admit it.

As for myself brother I’m Christian and have never told a lie or masturbated.

Student
Guest
Student

@boulderhead

I was referring to the protestants and other such disqualifications

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