Sex is the glue that holds relationships together.
“Taking things slow” is covert communication for “I have other irons in the fire, and you’re not the first best option.”
This is the law of diminishing returns; at what point is the yield out-valued by the effort needed to produce it? If you allow yourself to be put into a holding pattern with a “take it slow” woman you will ALWAYS expend more effort than the reward yield, if for no other reason than that you are ignoring other, potentially better, opportunities in exchange for your attention and effort.
The “take it slow” methodology capitalizes on a guy’s insecurity in that it automatically places him into a constant position of qualifying himself to the woman at the risk of his reputation. In other words, if he doesn’t take it slow (i.e forces the issue, pleads his case too emphatically) OR he ejects altogether, he risks becoming who she, conveniently, “fears he really is”, a Player only interested in getting in her panties. It’s a self-fulfilling social convention that protects a woman’s ego no matter what the outcome. However the converse of this is that he wastes his own resources (time, opportunity, attention, money) indefinitely while trying to negotiate terms for what he thinks is her genuine desire. Ultimately, assuming there is one, the reward (which initially is always sex) will never out-value the cost of the investment.
In most instances, a guy getting this response is one of multiple options she’s entertaining at the time and will conveniently be dismissed if a higher value guy becomes viable for her (i.e. the hot guy in Cancun). In a way this “take it slow” contrivance is a similar, but more manipulative version of the LJBF rejection. In the TIS method there is an implied presumption that a guy “may” qualify for her intimacy IF he can prove himself to be patient and match her set of prerequisites. There is no presumption in an LJBF and the guy simply takes it upon himself that he can qualify if he can only plead his case well enough.
the SEX might not be worth the wait, but the relationship might.
Beware of this rationale, sex is the glue that holds an LTR together. Sex is an integral part of an LTR and if it is established from the outset that a woman’s sexuality is a conditional reward for desired behavior from a man rather than a mutual experience based on mutually passionate desire, this LTR becomes fundamentally compromised. It is her frame, her world, that the waiting guy is entering from the very inception of what later may turn into an LTR. His first act of that LTR is capitulating to her terms for sex.
You can dress this up in esoteric reasonings as to how, later, she’ll appreciate him more for respecting her wishes to move slowly, but it doesn’t negate the fact that the Alpha traits women find the most attractive, and the most sexually arousing, have nothing to do with patience and everything to do with impulsivity. Women want to be pushed for sex. Women constantly complain that they need to feel sexy to want to have sex, and so long as it’s ‘the right guy’, nothing makes them feel sexier than knowing he’s hot for her to the point that he’s acting on impulse. The token resistance might seem cute or it’s used as some ASD ego preserving buffer, but it’s really a another way women prolong that feeling sexy dynamic which can be more rewarding than sex itself.
The nature of the Alpha guy that women crave pushes him to have sex, not wait for it. In fact that sexual insistence is a prime indicator that a woman is dealing with an Alpha. The man who’d agree to ‘taking it slow’ telegraphs Beta to her. Sexual impulsivity is an Alpha indicator that translates into a Man who insists on getting what he wants in other aspects of life – which benefits HER and her future offspring’s long term provisioning. In the long term, women want Men who other men want to be and other women want to bang. The man agreeing to the patience and effort needed to “take it slow” is indicating that he’s not accustomed to insisting on, and getting what he wants. If he can sublimate his most powerful biological imperative to get sex, what else is he willing to sublimate?
Sex is the deal breaker, but in my pointing it out I run the risk of coming across as “shallow” or “superficial.” It’s important, but it shouldn’t be that important, right?
Wrong. It is THAT important. Sex is the glue that holds relationships together.
If you encountered a woman who fit every ideal you ever had for a relationship – best friend, loving, 100% loyal, excellent mother, came from a great family, perfect HB 10, healthy both mentally and physically, emotionally available, intellectually stimulating, shared all your beliefs – who loved you unconditionally and wanted to marry you, but with one caveat; he/she would NEVER have sex with you under any circumstances, would you marry this person? You could have children together through insemination and they would always be platonically affectionate with you; knowing full well before you did, and pledging to be completely faithful yourself, would you spend the rest of your life in a completely sexless marriage with an otherwise ideal person?
Remember this sexless state doesn’t come after having had sex before (due to an injury or disability), it’s a pre-condition for the relationship. That’s the underlying message of “taking it slow” – all the benefits and emotional perks of a relationship with no expectation of sex. It’s like men having a fuck buddy, all the sex he wants with no expectation of emotional investment.
This is how important sex is. People tend to think of love as coming in different varieties and colors – platonic, fraternal, familial, erotic, agape, etc. All of this is nonsense. Love is love, it’s how it’s expressed that’s different. I love my Mom, my brother, my best friend and my daughter, but I only fuck my wife – that’s what makes us husband and wife, not brother and sister. Sex can be an expression of love or it can be an act of recreation, but it is always a prerequisite for an intersexual relationship. It’s time we all stopped deemphasizing the importance of sex and accept it for what it is. Every time we think we’re taking some moral high-road by saying it’s superficial or shallow to place such importance on sex, we only do a disservice to ourselves and our lovers. We’re only screwing ourselves by thinking that we’re in some way above sexuality in some lame self-delusion that in stating so will make us more desirable and set us apart from the rest of the herd (who are also claiming to be above sex anyway). It IS that important, so start giving it the respect it deserves. You do yourself no favors by desexualizing yourself.
Rollo, Question for which is OT from this post, but really hoping to get your thoughts. I have been in a a monogamous LTR for close to 6 years. Overall, I think I have done an effective job of maintaining the right frame, and going back to your last post, subcommunicating I am a guy with options. All that said, the last few months she seems to be ramping up the verbal shit tests. There is a playful undertone to it, but to me it is starting to cross the line from fun to seeming like it is trying to… Read more »
Great post. Women love my rapist eyes.
TIS is a totally manipulative tactic. A TIS woman will always use sex to manipulate men. Just walk away. Let that plate drop, brother.
Another nice elaborate post.
Here for the theory, Roissy’s for the practice.
So the question becomes, should a guy ever wait for sex? I almost never wait for sex. The one time I have waited for sex in this past year, the girl let me into her apartment on the same night I met her but wouldn’t do more than let me pull her dress a quarter-down. Then on our first date she wouldn’t let me take off her pants. Then, 3 days later (after the weekend was over), she called me up and wanted to hang. Banged her good and saw her for a few more weeks. What the fuck was… Read more »
Taking it slow isn’t always a manipulative tactic. If you haven’t been racking up the number count, then there’s the sexual bonding issue to deal with. I have to admit, this is my main issue in being gun shy about taking things fast.
You men are so dumb. “Taking it slow” is a way for a woman to assess a man’s character. Is patience and fortitude not a virtue? In a way, a man being able to “wait” demonstrates how much he cares for his Woman in that he is willing to put her needs before his. Her needs being a loving commitment preferably through marriage. Do you not know that a truly feminine woman bonds herself to the man in the act of lovemaking? A woman can’t be careless about who she gives her body to. For the discerning woman, the only… Read more »
You sound like a troll.
Is a man supposed to give everything to a woman, and get nothing in return? That makes no sense.
Not men per se, just beta men. Meanwhile, alphas get the good stuff up front with no investment required on their part.
Unfortunately, the kind of women that respond appropriately (in the storybook way) to a show of unconditional love are very rare in this world. Most will only see it as weakness and be repulsed or else they’ll see it as an opportunity to use the man. Plus, a relationship is meant to be give and take, as equals. Even if the man endures the TIS path and a relationship is started, well, because it starts off on such an unequal footing, where the man gives everything while expecting nothing in return, that sets the tone for the relationship and that… Read more »
our first gal qaeda infiltration. you’ve made it to the big leagues, rollo.
unconditional love? no such thing. even our little troll here knows this, as evidenced by its statement ‘the only way to separate the wheat from the chaff is to see how unconditional the man’s love is‘
‘how’ unconditional? it’s either unconditional, or it isn’t; there are no levels.
just press the trigger and detonate your vest, girl. your beta will love you even more unconditionally.
There is no one that will love you without expecting anything. Not even your parents.
Rollo, I agree that sex is a fundamental and VERY vital part of a LTR relationship, I do not deny this. But I find it essentialist and slightly cynical to make the claim on an absolute level that when a woman wants to take things slow, she is being consciously manipulative. The same way a man’s first priority is sexual intimacy, a woman’s first priority is often emotional intimacy. As much as a man wants to feel sexually secure, a woman also wants to feel emotionally secure. Do either inclination take precedence over the other one? A substantive number of… Read more »
I’ve read elsewhere that when a girl is looking for a LTR, she will consciously do an effort to take it slow. So if you’re presenting yourself as relationship material, then she might want you to take it easy. She won’t want to be seen as a slut. But I think as men we have to learn to plow through this, because, well, sex is important. And we can take it slow for the sake of getting to know if each other -if we so wish- but it can’t be that it’s always her who decides when (and even where)… Read more »
If you’re spinning plates, this isn’t an issue worth analysing. She can take it as slow as she wants while you’re getting it from other girls.
Exactly. As long as you’re not spending money on her and you’re still looking into other options, she can take it as slowly as she wants.
“A wise woman never yields by appointment. It should always be an unforeseen happiness.”
“Women sometimes forgive a man who presses an opportunity, but never a man who misses one.”
“A woman never forgets her sex. She would rather talk with a man than an angel, any day.”
“If men knew all that women think, they’d be twenty times more daring.”
Ha ha I love the last one.
Part of unplugging is realizing just how sexual all women are.
This is the biggest load of shit I have read in a while. It would be funny if males didn’t seem toconsider it the bible. A single sexual woman’s perspective: the two hottest sexiest relationships I have had is with males who I would consider alpha as in they exuded magnetism and people looked up to them not that they were dominant or treated me as less then equal. They wanted to take it slow. We didn’t. Have sex for a month to a month and a half. But everything was a tease and I found I really liked them… Read more »
“Take it slow, but don’t. It wasn’t worth it but it is.”
So sayeth the Alpha Widow.
Loveiseasy touched on a few points I didn’t and said it with much more diplomacy. Points. Oh and I apologize for ranting inconsiderately for minimizing your opinions… the cynicism and the objectification here is appalling and to be truthful offensive
[Women would rather be objectified than idealized.]
Rollo other then this post I haven’t read your articles. But the implied meaning of alpha widow in the context of this article is negative. Since you know nothing about me it is more revealing about you then me. I have found not only in my personal experience but borrowing from my friends as well general observation that you often get as much or as little as you expect. My frustration is that you are passing this expectation on to other males and the divide grows wider. If you wish to be hostile and lonely that’s your choice but don’t… Read more »
TWISI, if a woman tells me she wants to take it slow, her ass is dropped. She might as well be giving me a LJBF! LTIS and LJBF are both rejections!
Seriously?? You are going to bash a woman for being selective about who she has sex with and when? Do you not get the whole point of loving yourself as woman and being of quality, is that men of a lower caliber will always bail, that’s how a woman weeds out the junk..and I can tell from these posts it’s a strategy that works!:)
Caroline apparently is too dense to understand that “weeding out the junk” works both directions. Also, she doesnt seem to understand the double standard between Cancun guy and beta provider guy. She unknowingly affirms this articles truth one thousand times over.
If you guys dump a chick cuz she won’t put out on the 1st date or on YOUR terms and timeline then you are NOT relationship material and that’s why you’re here whining and pulling each other’s dicks for a little comfort.
You want women to accept you while acting macho and talking about ‘dumping her ass.’ Dude that chick and her friends are laughing at your childish bullying antics.
Oh btw if you think your opinions here are valid how about you run them past your sister or mother? See what they think of your macho desperate posturing.
Wow. This is a very sad post to me. No wonder so many women are giving up on men. I hope this is not representative of the mindset of most men, because some of us keep courageously pressing on in the hopes that there are men out there who actually love women, not just vaginas.
For my part, taking it slow has a rationale. I want to find out if we enjoy each other and are good for each other outside the bedroom. Sex skews the data, causing us to think those good feelings are going to be present in all aspects of the relationship. Good sex can only make up for an otherwise inharmonious relationship for so long before the cracks in the relationship start breaking into the sexual arena, as well. Since women give so much of ourselves in sex, some of us have decided not to let anyone into the holy of… Read more »
A better way to relate: http://www.reuniting.info/node/7970
It’s hilarious to hear (read) women talking about how ‘taking it slow’ represents getting to know them inside and out. You never listen to a woman, you only watch her actions. Women are only going to tow this line after they are coming off of the carousel (close to the wall). They’ve ridden the carousel through the better parts of their lives and now they come along giving men this ‘holy advice’ on how we should just love and accept them (the way they are, any way they are, inside and outside, etc…). It’s bullshit, gentlemen. A woman hot for… Read more »
Interesting post and replies. I would have to agree on the following things: 1. Sex is important in a relationship. Very. 2. Taking things slow… To me, really does mean, I want to check out my other options. Heck, why not? Men do it all the time. 3. A man told me he wanted Take things slowly… And he was more religious than I. I think he was more of that Beta guy… But also respecting me. However, soon after we met, work was more important and excuses were made for holiday functions. Funny how things are great, he wants… Read more »
“It IS that important, so start giving it the respect it deserves. You do yourself no favors by desexualizing yourself.”
I need to internalized that.
This advice is a crock.
Seems to have been written by an impatient, white, insecure, possibly masochistic male who needs to do some soul-searching and even more importantly – ego-shedding.
Author: see above.
Author: get off your high horse and get on that sh*t.^^^^
promise you it’s great advice IF you DESIRE a beautiful, healthy, self-respecting woman of humility.
To all the patient, self-respecting, kind men out there – dont believe a word of this.
Don’t believe a word of this article, that is. And maybe we have been shamed because we gave it up before getting to know someone better, but that doesnt mean some of us women werent young and naive once. And douped by men who only put a ring on it to “win” the virginity. Believe it or not, a large population of young women out there still value virginity and sex. Losing virginity is a different experience for every person and it definitely entails a much different stereotypical status post-sex for men versus for woman. Men cant fathom what it’s… Read more »
What if u known her for years but never gone for it..and had two kids with another girl.. then 7 years later you r single ,she is single with one kid. But she’s been single for a year and half and I 6 mouths but.I tell the feeling I always had for her. And she tells me let’s take it slow and see where it ends
Women give it up quick to the Alphas.
Then make the betas wait, and shame them for being shallow.
[…] got to account for a Blue Pill / Beta guy’s lack of social intelligence to understand that taking it slow should be something he knows already. And still, how can we presume this slow and steady […]
@ Khristine: do you realize, that your words as a woman are actually confirming the very statement in the post? It illustrates perfect all the things Rollo says about female nature. I have seen it before, women stating one thing, doing another, rationalizing the whole with a valid excuse. Arguing without arguments, attacking a person’s character instead the argument itself… (recommended reading: https://patch.com/washington/universityplace/the-ten-commandments-of-rational-debate Point #1.) I am so glad to see the things in the post clear now and I admit as I read the words “It is THAT important” I was struck by the fact how true it is… Read more »
2 years… 20 years… 200 years later, it is the TROOF!
[…] While we did have other topics to hit on that morning, she and I dug in and talked about how “sex is the glue that holds relationships together.” You can listen to the full segment here if you […]
It’s funny though.. that think called double standard. See cuz if you are a man and you tell a woman you want to take it slow.. she will now change her opinion from “The hot guy at the bar who I want to fuck” to now accusing him if he’s gay or if he’s married just because he said he wants to wait. I’ve rejected one too many girls these past two years.. and it wasn’t because I didn’t wanna get laid.. because I’ve slept with others.. but it seems like lately it’s slim pickens out there! Where have the… Read more »
Lemme tell you guys, there is a chick after the third date, she told me that she wanted to take things slow/she needs space/the ex is coming back. Mind you, I was the guy with the sniper mentality/oneitis. Something was wrong/felt wrong but my friends were telling me to tell her it’s okay and all that shit. Some told me to walk away, but the ego has a funny way of wanting to believe what you want, which you want to believe she still wants you. But I was like okay, “me I am here for you, reach out if… Read more »