The Nature of the Game

I had a reader ask me some questions recently and in answering it gave me some food for thought.

Are we stuck in our Alpha fucks/Beta cucks categories? Should we attempt to blend the two categories into the ultimate hybrid?

Or is there nothing we can do, but attempt to use the information that you have (brilliantly) given us as a navigational tool to find our way through this world and godspeed to every fellow?

Before this I came across these Tweets from Rian Stone:

I think a lot of guys new to Red Pill awareness tend to apply qualifiers to the ideas of what is Alpha and what is Beta. In a similar respect a lot of plugged-in Blue Pill conditioned ‘Beta’ men like to make similar qualifications, but their understanding is rooted in what their conditioning has convinced them of. For the newly unplugged guy, Alpha is whatever he hadn’t been doing before with women that is now working for him once he flipped his own script. For the plugged in guy, whatever he’s been convinced of that women say they want is ‘Alpha’ to him – and usually that means whatever benefits a woman’s sexual strategy in terms of long term provisioning, parental investment and security. They just don’t realize their own utility to women in that game.

That said, I don’t disagree with Rian here. Over the course of fifteen years and three books I have made every effort to correct critics who insist that “all those Red Pill guys think Alpha men are Silverback Gorillas or Wolves.” Roissy once called this Etymology Hate:

5. Etymology Hate

Hater: Your definition of an alpha male is false. In the animal kingdom, the alpha male is leader of the pack, not a cad/badboy/jerk who pumps and dumps women.

Isn’t it just like a nerd to get hysterical over the appropriation of a narrow-sense scientific term to conveniently illustrate broader truths about men and women.

These “broader truths” are why I still use Alpha and Beta as descriptions for men and their mindsets. Critics and disingenuous haters like to think that even considering men or behavior sets as being Alpha or Beta is cause for dismissing whatever is being said. There’s a reason for this blanket disqualification which I’ll cover in a moment, but what they (willfully) misunderstand is that these classification are abstractions for bigger ideas. Alpha and Beta are placeholder terms necessary to consider more complex ideas in intersexual dynamics. For the most part, when I hear or read Blue Pill conditioned men mock the idea of Alpha men and insist that it’s a direct derivative of believing those ‘idiot Red Pill guys thinking they’re Alpha wolves or Silverback gorillas’ I know that I’m not dealing with a serious debate. More on this later.

Rian is also correct in his observation that both Red Pill aware men and critics alike tend to think of Alpha and Beta as specific archetypes of men. I’ve written almost a dozen essays about the nature of Alpha, but in each one I make an attempt to dispel the archetype of what an Alpha or a Beta man is. The Beta archetype is easy to agree on because almost no guy wants to be a “beta male”. As would be expected we tend to think of betas as the stereotypical ‘cuck’ or ‘soy boy’, or the Nümale with his fear grimace agape.

I should point out that even the guys who we would categorize as Betas don’t think they are. Very few Beta men look in the mirror and go “damn, I gotta Alpha up”. They believe that they are the vanguard of the new definition of Alpha; that they and women have evolved beyond the visceral realities of Hypergamy and Beta is the new Alpha. Recently there’s been a concerted social effort to redefine what is acceptable masculinity in the wake of the narrative shift that would have us accept that all masculinity is toxic.

For men there will always be a want to believe that whatever qualities make up their own personality and their own lifestyle is what should define what is “alpha”. From Alpha:

Guy’s like Corey [Worthington] infuriate men who have invested their self-worth in the accomplishments of what they think ought to be universally appreciated and rewarded. So when they’re confronted with a natural Alpha being undeservedly rewarded for brazenly acting out of accord with what they think the rules ought to be, they seethe with resentment. The natural response in the face of such an inconsistency is to redefine the term ‘Alpha’ to cater to themselves and their accomplishments as “real men” and exclude the perpetrator. The conflict then comes from seeing his new definition of Alpha not being rewarded or even appreciated as well as a natural Alpha attitude and the cycle continues. Your respect (or anyone else’s) for an Alpha has nothing to do with whether or not he possess an Alpha mindset. 3 failed marriages and 100+ lays has nothing to do with his having or not having an Alpha mindset.

In the same way that a Blue Pill conditioned “beta male” believes he best represents the new “alpha” definition, so to do a lot of Red Pill aware men who play the same game of applying their own traits to what should be considered or appreciated as “alpha”. Nowhere is this more apparent than in Trad-Con circles – an Alpha is a guy who takes care of his family and is respected as the head of the home. He takes care of his duties to family, God and country, etc., etc. Really all this is is another grab at affirmation of personal worth. Blue Pill “betas” believe exactly the same self-fulfilling thing from a different set of ideological beliefs.

In the process both the plugged-in and the unplugged create convenient archetypes for the opposite of the apex they want to believe they are and what they hope will be confirmed and rewarded. Usually these are binary caricatures: the Alpha ‘Chad’ is usually whatever image of the popular high school jock that used to be their nemesis fits, while the Beta ‘doormat’ is the George McFly character whose introversion and lack of social intelligence places him at the bottom of the dominance hierarchy. Either one of these guys can be seen in a positive or negative light depending on the perspective of who’s doing the viewing. To the Nümale, whatever that classic Beta does should be what’s appreciated as ‘alpha’ and to the Trad-Con an Alpha is the guy who dominates, but only insofar as he sticks to what they think is his ‘duty’.

Funny how both tend think the Alpha Playah, the self-important ‘Cad’ who women tingle for, who follows his own sexual strategy shouldn’t be considered ‘Alpha’ in spite of women consistently, predictably rewarding him with sex and genuine desire.  Rian nailed this part; Alpha makes her wet, Beta makes her secure. Our Instinctual interpretive process understands the visceral reasons why women get worked up for that physically ideal guy who also completes the fantasy of the Alpha Fucks side of Hypergamy. But our Emotional and Rational processes want to recreate a reality in which what we have is what women really want. So we try to persuade and convince women to act against their own Instinctual interpretive process with respect to what they should find sexy and genuinely desirable – us, just as we are. We want to change the Game to fit our capacity, our skill, our genetics, to excel in it.

Beta men don’t just hope that women will perceive their own redefinitions of ‘alpha’ as the accepted ideal, they build lives and systems of belief around convincing others and themselves that we’ve evolved past the visceral realities of what arouses women. Trad-Con men, even Red Pill aware men, do something similar – they hope that their own definition of what should constitute Alpha, and best describes themselves, will likewise supersede the natural evolved impulse of what a woman’s hindbrain perceives as an ideal Hypergamous opportunity.

Alpha Seed, Beta Need

T-rex doesn’t want to be fed; he wants to hunt. You can’t just suppress sixty-five million years of gut instinct. – Dr. Grant, Jurassic Park

Hypergamy wants what Hypergamy wants, but it’s also important to remember that Hypergamy has two sides; Alpha Seed and Beta Need. When we look at the dynamic of Ovulatory Shift we see this play out. In a woman’s proliferative phase of her menstrual cycle she is predisposed to seek out sexual opportunities with high SMV, masculinized, dominant (to the point of arrogance) men. In her luteal phase she seeks comfort, rapport, security and protection qualities in men. Alpha Seed, Beta Need. As Rian pointed out, we’ve made archetypes (and caricatures) of the type of guy who embodies these needs, but we do so to persuade a woman’s evolved Instinctive understanding of what they are. Women’s hindbrains want to hunt for Hypergamous opportunity, men’s rational (and emotional) process wants to ‘feed’ Hypergamy by redefining what that Instinct should want.

Where both Nümales, Trad-Cons and more than a few Red Pill aware men get it wrong is believing that the security Beta represents should also be what gets her wet. We live in a day and age where men are so feminized that 80%+ default to ‘beta’ behaviors and mindsets because they believe it’s what arouses women. I’ve also written many essays about how anxiety, urgency and (sexual) tension are necessary factors in the ‘enthusiastic’ sex women have with men they genuinely desire. When it comes to comforting a woman, rapport, honesty, emotional investment and security the Beta men of today have been acculturated to have it all in spades. Where they fall short is the Alpha capacity to generate tingles based on making women uncomfortable. One reason men have a tough time with Red Pill awareness is because it all seems so counterintuitive to everything they’ve ever been conditioned to believe about women and sex and how to initiate it.

If you read Roissy’s old categories of Beta to Alpha it follows a predictable pattern. The same applies to Vox Day’s socio-sexual hierarchies (Omega, Gamma, Sigma, Delta, Beta, Alpha, etc), but what we’re really defining in these ranking is a male dominance hierarchy as it applies to women’s sexual selection process – Alpha seed, Beta need – and according to any individual woman’s capacity to demand any particular rank of man.

To answer the first question I began with here, I don’t think the “categories” ever really end because dominance hierarchies are something innate to our world. So, rather than think we can change this, change the nature of reality as equalism attempts to, I think men ought to learn to play it better. The nature of the game doesn’t change. In fact, the equalist mindset that wants to change it ends up making those who accept it and play it well appear that much more exceptional. 

Why? Because the game doesn’t change and our hindbrains know this. So when we see a man who is a “good player” of the game we evolved to play, who became so in spite of all the foolish efforts to change the game to better fit those who don’t play it well, our instincts are attracted to that person that much more. In other words the guy who Just Gets It is even more attractive in a world that women’s hindbrains know is trying to convince her that he shouldn’t just get it. This is why even the most staunch, egalitarian equalist feminist of women still adore a conventionally masculine man who looks and plays the natural role of Alpha man well. They still want to bang him, they still want to submit to him in spite of their ego investments. And they’ll coyly, shamefully, but without any self-consciousness admit they love being loved, fucked, protected, secured, etc. by that guy.

As an adaptation to increase the likelihood of reproduction men and women seek to change the Game that we’ve been playing for 100,000 years now. Only in our age of “gender enlightenment” are we so deluded as to think that prioritizing our emotion or reason above the realities our evolved instinct is spelling out for us might be a way to get intimate and reproduce. Women want to change men’s evolved sexual natures – via social constructionism, feminism, feminine-primacy – in order to reproduce with men they would naturally never have a chance breeding or pairing with, and without any burden of their own performance or merit. They want to change the Game to suit their deficits in playing it the way it is.

Similarly, men seek to improve their own reproductive success by also redefining the terms of the Game to also breed and pair (mostly breed) with women that their own Burden of Performance would merit them. This is why transvaluation (vulnerability is strength, etc.) features so prominently in this mindset. It is an effort in achieving reproductive success and intimacy without excelling in a man’s performance burden. This is precisely why Blue Pill men insist on defining Alpha and Beta in as literal a sense as possible. By rejecting and mocking these terms it self-reinforces the misbelief that they, and ‘quality’ women, have evolved beyond the visceral aspects of Hypergamy. By denying the realities of Alpha and Beta aspects in men the belief is it sets them apart from any natural dominance hierarchy. They’re “above all that”, “women (at least the ‘quality’ ones) are rational agents too and above their own Hypergamous impulses” and “people are all unique individuals set apart from all that human nature stuff.” Each of these rationales is linked to a core misbelief in blank-slate equalism (I’ll address in another essay), but they are also representative of an effort to remove these men from a natural dominance hierarchy and place them into a new Game they believe women are also playing and in which they, by default, are at the highest degree by virtue of having progressed beyond the old Game.


Published by Rollo Tomassi

Author of The Rational Male and The Rational Male, Preventive Medicine

370 comments on “The Nature of the Game

  1. ” ya that’s what lumberjacks are paid to do. and it’s very likely I’ll ever have to fix an engine when self driving cars become mainstream lol”

    the future of men is done. My daughter said something similar to this to me not very long ago.

  2. @blax

    Predictable response lmao. I’ll only address this:

    “most people I know irl that aren’t female don’t give a rats ass about who’s banging who. I only ever see this kind of thing in the sphere”

    uhhhhh no duh. cause most people you know irl are blue pill betas. and they’re not the ones going around banging bitches. I see you must not hang around many playas…

  3. @blax

    “Standard of some sort?”

    because that gives other people seeking advice on relationships with girls (raised in this culture) authority. (I personally only listen to only a select few men on advice wrt women). Ignore anyone who doesn’t fit this criteria because what they have to say may be outdated dating advice.


  4. “My daughter said something similar to this to me not very long ago.”

    you’ve raised a very smart girl. Congrats

  5. Blax

    “the future of men is done.”

    There will always be a remnant…

    And lacrosse and hockey will do their parts by Zeus!

  6. How old were you j, when you first heard the word ” playa “?

    And where pray tell, did that word even come from son?

    Hint: RSD didn’t come up with. Neither did Ya. Or Mystery even.

  7. I’m not entirely sure where the connection between self-driving and self-repairing comes in.

  8. On Hardwick… Not read much on that link, early in it seemed that Dykstra (cray cray family) cheated on him during the relationship. So everything that follows is just more chumpery taking place. And his response – can you see James Woods responding differently?

    More beta Metoo angst.

  9. @Sentient

    you do realize I went to high school and college with big strong lax bros in Massachusetts (I played football (defensive end cause I know I’m gonna be asked) but that’s not as alpha as lax/hockey) not too long ago? majority of them were blue pill alphas lol

  10. You said upthread that most people are BP… 😋

    I hold out hope for you yet though J… This is just a phase you are going through atm.

    Maybe start with an oil change, see how that goes.

  11. j has most of his shit completely together, but sometimes he goes through a YaReally brain fart.

    I don’t hold it against him…. playa.

  12. @Anonymous Reader

    “I’m on travel and re-reading Biology of Desire on Kindle. It is striking how similar chemical addiction is to extreme depressive states, and thus to TFL / MGTOW. In all cases there’s a deep path dug in neuroplastic terms, and as with the 12-step approach the first thing to do is admit a problem exists, but the groupthink in TFL and MGTOW won’t let that happen.

    The executive part of the brain clearly is shut out of the loop, a person exists at the lowest level of time, maybe in the one-day cycle. That’s not a bad definition of despair, or black-pilling.:

    There is a lot of ancillary stuff to the way the brain works that is complementary to the Marc Lewis Neuroplasticity in climbing out of addictions and repeated behaviors.

    And yes Incel behaviors are in a rut repetitive. I don’t know much about MGTOW and TFL (WTF? with the TFL, I can’t comprehend that at all and it’s a new one to me.)

    Even PUA’s have repetitive ruts. Not that there’s anything wrong with that. Until something doesn’t pan out. And I certainly won’t leave out LTR betatized ruts at all.

    A couple points to mention.

    First dopamine is interesting. It always takes precedence over Seratonin, although treatment of deficient Serotoning is the cornerstone of anti-depressant therapy.

    (Before I forget, her is an aside to what I’m going to mention next: I remember lots of times in my life that I would tell myself that I wasn’t having pleasure at the current time, but paradoxially if felt a lot of happiness. I didn’t call it happiness, though, I called it satisfaction in who I was and what I had done, and where I planned to be.

    And I never can remember ever having any significant length of time being psychologically depressed. Pretty much never. And I think that’s because of how my brain was built by genetics ( I can see stoicism as far as the family tree reaches), parental upbringing, and my own self generated mastery. )

    That leads to the concept of Dopamine actually being an incentive to seek something, rather than be a pure pleasure reward. Shooting up heroin or sucking down alcohol doesn’t give pleasure over time as much as the desire to seek pleasure. There is a difference. The same dopamine can stimulate 9 other things to do to get pleasure. When one gets in a rut, they only rely on the solitary venue towards pleasure seeking, rather than the other 9. The other 9 are put on the back burner.

    Witness this explanation:

    So what does dopamine do?

    Dopamine plays a lot of roles in the brain. If you kill off the cells that produce dopamine, the animal is not motivated to go out and do things. It’ll still enjoy something — like the sucrose solution you squeeze directly into its mouth — because the pleasure systems are fine. But they won’t pursue it. If you perform an action and you get more dopamine, the consequence of that increased dopamine tends to be that you’re more likely to do that behavior again.

    There are sort of two camps for how this works. One camp thinks that dopamine is a “prediction error,” meaning that you expected something from the environment, and you got something better. And then you go, “Oh, I’m going to do that again, something better than expected happened!” It’s a reinforcement.

    The other camp says that dopamine is a motivational signal. It invigorates and energizes you toward a distinct goal. Dopamine is actually involved in motor disorders — like conditions that cause tremors — and that would be very consistent with the motivational aspect of dopamine. Dopamine could be important to juice you up to promote actions. And this is supported by people who take cocaine or amphetamines, which increase dopamine a lot. This motivates them to do things. Of course, later on, this can lead to the probability of repeating things and then lead to addiction and gambling and other negative behaviors.

    And that article was objecting to this article (which has some real cool diagrams of Dopamine/pleasure and Serotonin/happiness explanations):

    Secondly, and this is a go figure kind of thing. Over this last weekend (where I had plenty of Serotonin flowing and had happiness/super satisfaction–Heh, father’s day–, but actually little pleasure with Dopamine, because my wife was being cunty–but this too shall pass…) I saw one of the best dialogues about this topic.

    It included what you mentioned and also what EhIntellect mentioned in the Incel thread in regards to Jonas. To whit:

    Let’s admit your incel state is rather pathetic. Full stop. That’s a benefit as you’re not claiming your failures as virtues of necessity. Guys like to themselves all the time like that or they think their life is much worse than it is.

    Surprise surprise: It was and interview by Russell Brand of Jordan Peterson. Russel wrote a book about 12 step programs (As a former super addict that didn’t kill himself in the celebrity real at 27 years old).

    Phenomenal interview in regards to the topic you bring up. I had some in-between-time and listened to the whole thing including driving to the gym and spending 30 minutes on the treadmill because it was unbearably hot and muggy outdoors. (really)

    Starting @ the 14:00 mark, Russell and JBP address what you surmised and run down the field with it.

    The whole interview is very, very good. And very relevant to the Incel, Red Pill self-improvement, and moving forward with self improvement.

  13. @Blax, I just ‘upgraded’ to the WordPress Business plan. Got some new goodies incoming, but are you having trouble linking to YouTube?

  14. Yeah, but after a while I figured there must be some upgrade or something going on. Every time I pst a comment, I have to put muh credentials in. That clued me in. Progress must progress.

  15. I’m probably gonna do a blog theme overhaul soon. I need something that scales.

  16. Getting laid a lot isn’t reproductive advantage. As long as the woman frustrates conception she’s not all that interested in your sexual success, only her atm pleasure, not yours.

    No one is eulogized by their n count.

  17. it’s like a man tasting ice cream for the very first time and losing his shit, demanding to know why everyone he sees isn’t eating ice cream 24/7, because it’s so delicious.

    Then you add in other dudes telling the guy to never stop eating ice cream. Giving seminars and hot seats geared towards the pursuit and consumption of all kinds of ice cream….as long as it’s all gourmet ice cream from specific creameries.

    And under no circumstances can one eat vanilla, chocolate or strawberry because it’s lame as fuck.

  18. @ j

    “Fox’s biggest issue is his choice to live in a remote place with few women around and his scarcity mindset.”

    lol doesn’t matter where he chooses to live. If we were gaming in the same venue on a Saturday night, I would destroy him (no offense bro!!!)

    @ Sentient

    “Fox is a hobbled shell of his old self… That’d be a hollow victory.”

    Gentlemen, i do find it rather amusing that i have made such an impression on you, even whilst my mojo has eluded me for the past few months. However, no need to write me off just yet. The ole FoX can feel his sweet mojo seeping back into his psyche & with it the warm inner glow of confidence and congruence returns to take off from where he left off…

    I’ve recently been reflecting upon how well i’ve done in the past with the girls (yes, it does count, just like the number of games a sportsperson has played will always count), and remembering that women just dig me and have rewarded me with an abundance of desire sex over the last 20+ years. Too much information and opinion here has just clouded me away from my natural talents (F2F rather than text game) and field instincts. Out in the real world, when i get out there, women are constantly flirting with me. I’ve just gotta hit the close button a bit harder like i used to, that’s all. So with that mindset, i’m back in the game, and playing to win, once again…

    Oh, and j… don’t get too far ahead of yourself, my man. This is only cyber-space, after all…

  19. It’s not Boy Scouts where we all have to give a shit about earning our Sentient/SJF badge for chopping down a tree and fixing an engine.

    I was your age (once) and really pushed back hard at established traditions, values and the advice of older people. It was cool and hip, or so I thought. Lordy, if I had had an old geezer like Blax or SJF to give me tips I would saved myself a lot of bluepill heartache.

    The tree chopping thing stood out as I’ve had some surprisingly good experiences with swinging an axe. Not just to have a supply of firewood, but generating wet panties. Unfortunately over the past 14 years I’ve had to cut down all my Ash in the yard, over a dozen trees in all. I was provided with a lot of firewood for the wood burner in the living room. You don’t think stoking a good fire on a cold winter night also might assist in generating a few tingles?

    By sheer accident I discovered a few years back that my girlfriend became extremely aroused watching me split firewood with an axe. At first I thought she was bored and just being silly setting up a lawn chair to watch. As I proceeded she began taking pictures with her phone, then gushing about how horny she was getting. By the time I was done she was dripping and needing to be fucked badly. Later she sent photos to a few of her girlfriends. Turns out other chicks also dig this and they readily shared pictures of their men, or wood piles in the back yard with an axe in the photo. Now it’s a running joke as well as foreplay. I dug out an old Ash tree stump this weekend with an axe and shovel. Indeed, same results as before, although digging out stumps and roots doesn’t offer the fluid rhythm like splitting a cord and making a pretty stack.

    So who woulda thunk chopping firewood would generate tingles? My ex-wife was often impressed by shiny fast cars, motorcycles. Her fiance she made a baby with at age 40 ( all I can do is laugh about that shit ) is a skilled motorhead and can completely take apart a car engine, diagnose a problem and put it back together. It’s very impressive. My ex gets all hot and bothered over shit like that. What’s not to be impressed by shit like that?
    Different things turn on chicks in different ways. Don’t underestimate a little bit of competence.

    I have a lot of other success with my photography skills. You don’t have to believe me though, check out Goldmund’s body of work with photography and game. Shit is real.
    When photography was my primary career I was forced to learn social skills and a bit of light game in order to get the photos I was looking for. I had no idea what game even was back then, but I knew what got people relaxed in front of a camera. From there it was fun and games when girls started offering to take their clothes off. You might be surprised at the amount of ass that becomes available if you’re competent with a camera and have some game.

  20. @J

    This is the case,my wife has a pulse,is on social media,drives a vehicle,has a vagna,has orbiters,is a member of the “sisterhood uber alles” and hasn’t moved on for 37 years.

    The reason is my game was better than the other guys, a ring doesn’t plug any holes.

  21. “So who woulda thunk chopping firewood would generate tingles? ”

    I’ve said it a number of times before, I’ll say it again now, and will no doubt do so in the future:

    A man can best judge the looks of a woman when she’s asleep.

    A woman can best judge the looks of a man when he’s chopping wood.

  22. Fox,

    “I’ve recently been reflecting upon how well i’ve done in the past with the girls (yes, it does count, just like the number…”

    Beware friend. Only you care about your n-count. Women care in so far as you can dread them or use it as DHV, aka is it getting you laid. It’s a tool, not a laurel wreath.

    ‘Round here people pay to run marathons. They’re not running for the ability to marathon, they’re paying for the validation that comes with the formalities of the process. Nobody but them cares about their split times after a week or so.

    In the SMP, you’re only as good as you are atm.

  23. @ Eh

    Yes, i’m aware of all that. It is just to remind myself that i have had good game and not to get too down on myself. Sure, i have plenty of Red Pill improvement in me, but i’m no chump either. I have been pedastalizing pussy and coming from a place of scarcity and getting down on myself. But fuck that, i’m snapping out of my funk and getting my head right again. Watching someone successful like Bourdain destroy himself over a skank like AA has helped bring me back to reality. It’s a big wake up call to all men who haven’t swallowed the Red Pill, or have been struggling to keep it down…

  24. Love my gravitar! That’s how i’m rolling again, sans “solitary”, even though i currently still am…

  25. Roused

    You brought a tear to my eye talking about chopping wood.

    I used to spend summers with my grandparents in rural ( and I mean RURAL ) Virginia. My grandfather demanded it. It was like time traveling, as we lived in a 2 story lot cabin with no running water and wood stoves. The one in the kitchen was a massive beast yet beautiful at the same time.

    Every morning at sunrise my grandfather would chop wood before heading off to work. As a young boy, I couldn’t wait to get big enough to swing his axe.

    In my family, makes had particular rites of passage. The ” old guys ” oversaw the process. Looking back, it was basically a survival course spread out over a decade.

    We had to learn:

    Chopping wood

    Building fires

    Butchering livestock

    Planting gardens and trees

    House framing and roofing

    Well digging….by hand initially

    Hunting and trapping

    Hide tanning

    Horse riding, bareback and saddled.

    How to kill shit with huge hunting knives

    Handgun, shotgun and rifle.

    These were taught by a dozen men with a few hundred years of experience, so the learning curves wasn’t that steep at all. The biggest lesson learned was that men must ” do “.

    Out of all of the stuff women say, what I dig the most is when they look at me and ask “woah…who are you?????” .:lol. I’ve gotten laid by just sitting on my front porch playing oye como va with a tiny pignose amp.

    Living life fully will make you the prize, and you will know this without a doubt. It ain’t about them.

    Bring girls that are worthy and proven home…. They walk in, look around, and start trying to figure out what They are seeing. ” wait, did you paint these? ” yeah. ” are these all your guitars? ” yeah. ” sooo…you box? ” yeah. ” is that you driving that car? ” yeah. ” are those your old cars under those covers? ” yeah. ” you can build cars? “. Yeah. ” you actually cooked this? “. Yeah. Etc.

    And it’s been like that forever, right up till last weekend when a dozen high school grads were querying me.

    The past? Lol. Things have changed? Lol. Men have changed. Women are reactive to negative change. Do the math.

    It’s just a little sad when women gather around to watch me grilling, because they’ve not seen a man really work the fuck out of fire, flames and meat. ” you don’t get burned? “. No. ” omg, isn’t it too hot?? “. No. ” you want something cold to drink? “….why yes darlin’.

  26. My two cents about women and labor and who does what….

    I got myself in beta trouble by assuming all home maintenance duties. I’d let her paint a room.

    I, as a WK, thought it was my duty to do these things but at the end of the day, she really didn’t care about my skills. She’d compliment and fuck me dutifully, sure. Eventually I started equating, expecting appreciation of my skills and the betaization happened. She did too. It benefitted her, and other marriages fx that way, so why not?

    Only after I backed off the work, work, work did I realize the fix I was in. I was in a negotiated relationship. She didn’t like it, I didn’t either. The rest is history.

    Over the years, I lost sight how to put HER to work. After little kids grow, there’s really not much to do in the feminine world. It was up to me to keep her busy.

  27. @Blax

    It’s sweet how such simple things can bring great satisfaction.

    That is a pretty damn solid list of learning, impressive.

    Out of all those I did not get taught early the hunting, trapping, house framing and roofing would be valuable to learn, even at my age. I’m looking forward to some future hunting once I get the appropriate firearm. I’ve met a red pill guy IRL who has some expertise in that.

    I taught my son how to split firewood when he was big enough to swing the axe, around 11 if I recall right. He is a big boy. It was always fun to hear the shock and concern from coworkers when I shared with them my son could split firewood. Usually just the women acting overly protective and freaky….go figure.

    That list of skills would come in real handy like if/when shit hits the fan. Imagine having to butcher a hog or deer and not being able to run to Safeway or Meijer to quickly pickup a pre-wrapped package of ground beef? My dad had a huge garden plot with a lot of berries, herbs and veggies. My mom canned and we grew up leaning how to be self-sufficient with those sorts of things. It’s not like a badge of honor, nobody gives a shit really, but hell I was out working in fields with a hoe or picking berries on fruit farms when I was 12. My brothers and sisters as well. I chuckle when I hear kids talking in the present about how rough life is and there are no good jobs. It’s such a cliche, but that doesn’t mean it’s not a real thing. I surely am not writing this to try and convince J or any other young man they should adopt your skills list or do grungy jobs we did in our youth. You can lead a horse to water……whatevs.

    Competence is a thing, along with leadership and having control of your life. People (not just women/girls) notice this stuff. It’s just as important in the workplace as in the sexual marketplace dating world. The guys you work with that take the initiative and aren’t afraid to learn new things, processes, allow the scope of their job to change etc…. stand out from the guys that clock out at 5, complain their job sucks and that “it’s bullshit my boss just asked me to do X.” Shit translates to game and relationships outside of work.

    @Eh is spot on about the honeydo or rolodex list that wives so successfully lure their men into. It can quickly become a negotiated sex dynamic and we all know that shit is no good. You don’t have to be married either. My LTR used to drop hints all the time about this and that needed repair at her condo. I used to jump at stuff like that. Same goes for shoveling snow in her driveway etc….more often than not now I avoid that or suggest her 16-year-old son get off his ass and shovel the driveway. Young guys may not want to adopt any old guy shit, but wait until they are in an LTR and that honeydo list is whipped out. They won’t know it as it’s like smoking. Doesn’t hurt you too much at first, kind of enjoyable, and you get all that sex, BJs and back rubs. Years later it’s like coughing up a lung when the bedroom is dead and she is banging the gym trainer.

  28. Rollo you seem like a person who is pretty committed to logic, I appreciate that as I am similar. What do you use your emotions for, like do you see the purpose of emotions? Seems like anyone who’s too far down the emotional spectrum ends up behaving retarded. Women and betas are very, very emotional, and honestly every time I see the shit some of them do and then try to explain their own reasoning, I’m like holy mother of god how does this person make it in their day to day life without dying.

  29. Moving into nursing field. I am older 48. The females dominate this field and use passive aggressive manipulation, or female speak. I am being bullied with this non-confrontational shit and I need advice on how to counter this. Recently unplugged. What do you suggest?

  30. Any thoughts how personality traits (Big 6 or HEXACO) correlates with Alpha/Beta paradigm?
    I would argue that disagreeableness, low humility, low neuroticism correlates with Alpha.
    It is known fact that dark triad correlates with women sexual interest. So it is conservable that some personality traits are naturally more Alpha and some are more Beta.
    As theory goes personality traits is fixed by genetics as well as looks.
    Women does not explicitly rank men as HM 0 to 10, it may be due to fact that metrics is not one dimensional as HB 0-10 for men (genetics component only), but multi dimensional where Alpha personality is just one metrics axis along with handsomeness, wealth, social status and more, where total sum also changes depending of ovulary cycle shifts as it influences weight of indicators above in final composite perception of men SMV.
    It is important to understand that all metrics are just perceived and combined in same way as one perceives for example sound produced by tiger in the bush, combining frequency, loudness and direction of sound without aid of conscious thought to it, one just runs, not thinks.
    I would argue that Alpha potential in large part is caped by fixed personality traits. Add to this fixed genetic quality and you are set on SMV scale with limited room for wiggle.
    Further add to this innate male gynocentrism and you can see why all intellectual learning about red pill truths and Alpha behaviour patterns easily goes away for some men as soon as they find themselves in relationship.
    This would also explain why betas despise red pill and alpha behaviour – Law 36: Disdain things you cannot have.

  31. Johnny, you must make sure that you are respected and feared…”He whose displeasure is feared.”

    If you know who the instigators are, you could tell them something like, “I got fired from my last three jobs for beating up a woman who displeased me. But you all are so nice, I’d never do that here.” Don’t be so obvious when you say it, but leave them with the impression that you’ve beat up women before.

  32. “If you know who the instigators are, you could tell them something like, “I got fired from my last three jobs for beating up a woman who displeased me. But you all are so nice, I’d never do that here.” Don’t be so obvious when you say it, but leave them with the impression that you’ve beat up women before.”

    @Gamer, that is actually very shitty advise. At best, it’s equally passive-aggressive (female) behavior and, at worst, it’s overt intimidation which would get him fired and black-balled in the industry in a nano-second. HR departments will always ‘believe the woman’ and this would be playing right into their game.

    @Johnny, @palmasailor makes a good point about calling out malicious, bad behavior, but it’s likely that they’re threatened by your presence and are desperately trying to control the frame and/or push you into an emotional state to create opportunities for you to fuck up. Don’t fuck up.

    Why, in today’s climate, you would pick an industry which is controlled by women who are often bad actors is beyond me, but you do you, buddy.

    Until you realize that your new profession was maybe not a well thought out decision at this stage in your life, stoicism and ‘giving zero fucks’ about a herd of whinging cows will be your friend.

    If you are new on your journey to enlightenment, there will be A LOT of faking it until you develop a solid frame where the cackling of some angry old hens will be at most a source of amusement, but with diligence you will get there. Focus on you… your performance, your mastery, your goals, your mission, your passion. Live in your frame with you as your Mental Point of Origin… everything else is extraneous bullshit.

    Above all else… Keep reading, keep studying, keep practicing, keep doing.

  33. Johnny,

    Understand they are women and as such are in a generally crouched defensive posture though think men who work in female jobs are weak. If you relax and do a good job they’ll chill out. Do not use your workplace as a harem. It will backfire. Get a hot girlfriend and that’ll establish your DHV.

    Women smell fear and men in your field are beta or worse….so walk the line of quiet, direct, competent Alpha and they’ll look up to you.

    Yes, they like all women, will try to get you to pull a larger share of the work or expect your natural make confidence allows them push work on you.

    You’ll get your Alpha types there but they are quiet about fight club and you should be too. And for heavans sake don’t gossip in the lounges or rooms about others.

    Never, ever DEER, about anything to anyone. DEER: defend, explain, excuse, rationalize. You should be as factual as possible.

    Be direct, friendly, greet them…no need to be a prick…but remain ice cold if they step out of line.

  34. at worst, it’s overt intimidation

    Work on your reading skills…”Don’t be so obvious when you say it, but leave them with the impression that you’ve beat up women before.”

    It’s a covert message, not overt.

  35. @ ass

    If he shows his concern or avoidance in any way, that’ll telegraph weakness.

    Being chill is game.

  36. @Johnny Liebling: “What do you suggest?”

    Unlike back in the day when they were putting the squeeze on independent truckers leading to my cousin moving from trucking into nursing, there is a currently a trucker shortage.

  37. Work on your reading skills…”Don’t be so obvious when you say it, but leave them with the impression that you’ve beat up women before.”

    @Gamer, doesn’t matter if it’s covert or overt, that’s ‘creating a hostile work environment’ through intimidation and it will get you fired. Full stop. In today’s “Me too” environment, a woman on the receiving end of that message, regardless of how covert you are with your ‘impression’, will march straight up to HR and you will be gone. Women know they have the upper-hand and they are not afraid (in fact, they’re eager) to use that power.

    Just admit that your advise was ill-conceived and move on. Don’t make yourself look any more ridiculous.

  38. They have thesaying, “nurses eat their young” for a reason. It sucks to be a new nurse. Floor is worst, I recommend the ER there seem to be more men there and the mentality is better (no time for bullshit)

  39. Sorry ASD about the typo.

    it was funny 🙂


    doesn’t matter if it’s covert or overt

    lol, don’t be silly

    that’s ‘creating a hostile work environment’ through intimidation and it will get you fired.

    None of that shit matters if you have game…and if you don’t have game, you’re fucked anyway–Catch 22

    Women know they have the upper-hand and they are not afraid (in fact, they’re eager) to use that power.

    “Women know they have the upper-hand and they are not afraid (in fact, they’re eager) to use that power against men who lack inner game.”


    Gamer Maxim (new) “If you won’t enforce your boundaries, women will fuck you over because they despise weak men.”

    Ok, let’s get down to some serious tacks about Johnny’s situation…I was headed out the door and didn’t flesh out all the nitty gritty…

    First, see these covert manipulative games as shit tests, because that’s what they are (see, HABD, I did learn something from you). So, how do you enforce your boundaries against these shit tests? You pass them.

    Me to suspected passive-aggressive shit tester:

    “So, someone has been saying shit about me and it’s just so hilarious. I mean, at first I wanted to beat the shit out of whoever was doing it…and it can’t be you, because you’re just too nice…anyway, like I said, I wanted to put whoever was doing it in the hospital and file a lawsuit against them and take all their shit…anyway, that was all just in the heat of the moment and it passed and I’m just very chill now…whoever was doing it (and I’ll emphasize again that I’m sure it’s not you) is probably just sexually frustrated…not getting any….and needs some way to vent and I understand…but it’s kind of funny in a way and makes me laugh…” [your tone should convey that all of this is No Big Deal and you should be able to pull off Amused Mastery with your body language]

    This is probably something I’d say. I make sure I enforce my boundaries here, I’m chill, I’m “open” about my masculine anger and about my self-control and humor. I’m conveying “He who must not be displeased.”

    I’ve never even been slapped, although once a girl said that another girl might slap me for touching her a lot within five minutes like I did that girl. Of course, she invited me on a date, lol.

  40. @Gamer,

    Key phrase here is “inner game”. In that context, I don’t disagree, but this guy is new to red pill preaxeology and has none. What you are recommending is a level of self-esteem, confidence, mastery, abundance, and Frame that is way above his pay grade and will get him fired.

    Give him actionable advise that he can use now.

  41. Johnny

    Frame. Masculine frame.

    Being recently unplugged, you should have a handle on the nature of most women in different settings. Watch them operate like you were watching a national geographic program.

    Bullying only ever works if you chose to allow it to work. Same with any manipulation. Maintain your mpoo. You aren’t there to get entangled in the stuff of female nurses. You’re there to do your job as best you can, and go home.

    If you react at all, just do so with amusement. You don’t really have to ” set anyone straight ” or try to lay down the law……right away that is. Just let them know that you don’t get rattled and by action and demonstrations rather than by overt communication.

    In other words, you’re a duck and they are water.

    Oh yeah, and when your work day is done, make it a regular habit to let it all go. When your not at work, don’t allow work to be with you.sometimes this can be harder than it sounds, so in that case, leave the womanly nonsense behind every time.

    I don’t think it’s impossible to work around a lot of women as long as your mindset and frame are reinforced properly.

    Good luck.

  42. Chump, I take your point. It’s good for Johnny to know what he should eventually aim for. Probably outside of his ken where he is, but maybe a seed has been planted. And maybe for other lurkers as well.

    In other words, you’re a duck and they are water”

    An Anglo aphorism: “Like water off a duck’s back”

    Maintain your mpoo.

    Warren Beatty for 200 and “What is Shampoo?”

  43. Johnny’s feeling some heat as he’s awakened to his previous behavior and wants more frame in an eqialist-above-all workplace.

    He’s asserting himself more and others will take notice that he’s not playing nice. He doesn’t have to…but then he must accept the reaction.

    Women play equalist otj but not so much off. Work doesn’t have to be social dominance hour so keep out of the petty chick drama games and you’ll be a considered a balancing male Alpha counterweight.

    ASD, a physical response is overeacting to routine daily chick testiness . That talk is more appropriate for a construction site, not the ICU and would get you labeled as potentially violent.

    I’m not saying it won’t get noticed and youll have more frame but you’ll have to deal with administration fallout if it gets around and it will. Nurse ASD can’t hold his temper and fists even if he’s covert and vague. Plaisible deniability doesn’t apply to gossip.

    Anyways, who is Johnny to tell that to? Another female RN? Even if he went to admin about abusive chick bullying that be politely listened too then followed up on, then Johnny’s labeled a wuss.

    You know exactly that talk is just enough for the long knives to come out.

    This whole situation becomes micromanaged and overcomplicated though it’s fun talking about.

    99% of nurses work for a little money and mostly decent health care insurance and will work fearfully and cowed to maintain that. They want an uneventful shift and to go home without crying (again) about some little error they made or being complained about by some other battle-axe.


    Keep you head high, mouth shut, DO NOT get involved in cattiness, go home, have a brew, fuck your HB 10 gf and you’ll be fine.

    Sweating the small stuff (and it is small stuff) can stunt your RP growth and career.

  44. @EI

    Sure, Johnny can ignore the shit-testing, but that’s not gonna help him grow and he needs to practice and get some experience enforcing his boundaries. If he pushes back, there will be quite a few chicks who support him for showing some balls. Brings me to my experience where I enforced my boundaries as an example to Johnny.

    I was at a party in college and took a girl out from the party to make out. Long story, short, she was unhaaaappy afterwards and whined to her sorority who helped to fund and prepare for the party. Unexpectedly to her, the sorority supported…me. Our fraternity president’s girlfriend liked me and garnered a bunch of her sorority sisters to take my side. There were damn few of the complaining girl’s sisters on her side and only one guy from my fraternity on her side. She didn’t go to any more parties, lol. A major defeat for her.

    About the fraternity president’s gf–she had been flirting with me and testing me all semester and I had been flirting with her and passing her tests. I even once pushed her against the wall and went to kiss her and she turned her head away. That was me enforcing my boundaries because she lived next door and was just playing and trying to get me worked up. She respected that and that was one reason that she liked me. So, enforcing your boundaries will garner respect and help you gain social credibility.

    Here’s a general strategy anywhere you work. Make friends. Chat lots of people up. Flirt with women circumspectly and test their prudishness carefully (always using double entendres) and be ready to backpedal (“whoah! You took that the wrong way.) and even apologize if needed. AMOG the men at work and be someone they respect and like. Party with them a little.

    Then, if some broad complains about you to HR, you can get women to support your story and character.

    I’ve got a similar story about white-knights trying to cause me problems and the bouncers and a girl supported me and nothing bad happened to me. Be popular. Even a little.

    Enforce your boundaries with humor and charm and don’t give off nonverbal signals indicating that you are violent (at least where there are witnesses, lol).

    I can’t remember–does Rollo have a post about enforcing your boundaries?

  45. He’s not ready for confrontation. He’s rattled by shit testing. Yes, ASD, in time he’ll be there.

    Igoring is passive boundry enforcement. No one’s attacking his right to employment, just his right to feel invalidated.

    Johnny’s ATM getting rattled at pithy relavances. The battle is in his head. He’s seeing opportunity to improve but isn’t sure where he’s at and as he’s fresh to the job…he best play as you described: Cheerful, attractive, not unattractive guy.

    The rest will take care of itself.

  46. @ASD, Having game will only work in the workplace on the women who play at that game. From the sound of your advice, it doesn’t appear that you have spent the quality hours in the HR training programs that all of the employees of the fortune 500 have been subjected to for the last 35 years.

    There are women in the workplace who are ugly, bitter and mad at every guy they see – female incels – and they will do you in the moment they sniff that the game is afoot. Their anger and self-righteousness makes them hair-trigger prone to taking offense at the slightest provocation, and they have solid, repeatably observed evidence that HR will back them up EVERY TIME.

    Your advice is toxic even to a practiced RP guy, but it is fatal advice for a newbie or BP guy struggling with female competition in the market place. Ask me how I know.

    @Johnny, the collective majority advice is the most sound – do not engage, be excellent, be cheerful, leave work behind, work to earn money to fund your experiences, not to establish your worth in society.

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