Men and Suicide

Before I launch in here today I need to confess that this post has been in my drafts folder for a while now. As most of my readers are aware I’ve known two personal friends who’ve taken their own lives as a result of having their Blue Pill conditioned beliefs set them on a path to self destruction. One of the more important parts of my charter when I started writing was to reach the men who were at their wits’ end in figuring out how to deal with their personal, romantic or married lives that had until then been directed by what their Blue Pill acculturation and their understanding of intersexual dynamics were molded to be. Since I started and stopped and then restarted this topic again there have been a few recent developments in my perspective on men taking their own lives as a result of the Blue Pill’s influence on them.

All of this really began about two months ago while I was engaging in a debate (or what passes for debate) on Twitter with a very unsympathetic woman who thought she’d set me straight about why it is men choose to take their own lives at a far greater rate than women. As it stands today, men are statistically between 4 and 5 times more likely than women to kill themselves. For most Red Pill aware men this is a fairly well known stat and one that gets quoted often enough when women trot out their own stats about abuse or whatever issue they think it is that MRA are ‘confused’ about. They usually get owned when this sort of back and forth goes down, but I’m always drawn to the comparative issues women think are equitable to that of men losing their lives.

Men’s disposability is also nothing new to the manosphere. Sperm is cheap, eggs are scarce and men are expected to sacrifice their lives for the security and betterment of women even in the most patriarchal of prior social orders. It’s always interesting to me that issues of mandatory male conscription into the military (potential death) and the unignorable high male suicide rates are something women still won’t accept as being a pretty raw deal for men. Women’s innate solipsism will still compel women to find some “yeah, but;…” rationalization for men’s disposability. Whenever I bring something like this up the reflexive presumption is that I’m bemoaning men’s victim status for being disposable. However, it’s impossible to discuss male disposability without such a connotation. My issues isn’t one of seeking some equitable disposability for women, but rather it’s drawing attention to the way women react and rationalize away their own part in that disposability.

True Powerlessness

I covered a lot of this in Chivalry vs. Altruism, so I won’t belabor that here, but I will point out the inherent power imbalance in this disposability. I’ve stated in the past that true power is not the control we can exert over the lives of others, but rather the extent to which we have control over the direction of our own lives. When we discuss issues of power between men and women the real, ultimate, loss of that control is in the context of our deaths.

There is no greater powerlessness for men than a lack of control over our own disposability.

Again, this isn’t some cry of victimhood for men – I happen to believe there’s an evolved component in the male psychological firmware that actually predisposes us to sacrificing ourselves in lieu of the security of our women and children. That’s not so much altruism as it is an inborn subroutine for protecting women that triggers in life-threatening situations. When a mass shooter opens fire indiscriminately at a crowd of people it is the men, not the women, who instinctively put their bodies between that gun and women or children, even the one’s they don’t personally know.

In the bigger scope of things, men will always be more disposable than women, and on some level of consciousness women’s hindbrains instinctively understand this. As such, women’s conscious process must find ways to reconcile this understanding in order for them to move on from men’s sacrifices. Sometimes this can manifest in the War Brides phenomenon, but I would argue that in today’s social learning environment of mass media, instant gratification of women’ solipsism and feminine-primary social order, this reconciliation takes some even uglier turns. Today, women have become very efficient in consoling each other’s solipsistic rationalizing of men’s sacrifices. In this environment of default female victimization and presumed oppression even men’s ultimate sacrifice, men’s ultimate powerlessness in their own deaths, cannot ever be consciously or unconsciously acknowledged in a state of fempowerment.

While I had this debate it occurred to me that even men’s suicides could never be attributed to anything less than their own ‘male egos’ by women, thus making them victims of their conditioning into “toxic” masculinity. Essentially, women were arguing that men would put a noose around their necks because they were socially conditioned to do so. Their suicide rate was attributable to their self-pity and inability to be ‘real men’ as some nebulous toxic masculinity had predefined for them. I thought this was kind of ironic when you compare this reasoning to the narrative shift away from ‘toxic’ masculinity to masculinity itself is toxic. This is really a stupid argument when you consider that it’s just another social convention used to absolve women of the guilt associated with men’s sacrifices. Men are hardwired for self sacrifice, but likewise women had need to evolved psychological adaptations to help them clear the red from their life’s ledger in this respect.

So, in the end, it helps if women can fall back on social conventions that put the associated guilt of men’s sacrifices back on the men themselves. Chivalry and traditional masculinity are fine when they serve the Feminine Imperative, but if a man actually gets killed or kills himself as part of that, well, that’s on him then. And this is what I was beginning with in this debate; there will always be a desire for absolution of women’s guilt or complicity in the deaths of men. I should also add that in terms of war and men being drafted women regularly default to the same asinine presumption that if women were running the world that there would be no wars. I won’t dignify that with any deeper analysis than to say that this too is one more (feeble) way of looking for absolution in the sacrifices men make to facilitate women’s reality.

Suicide Solution

That still left the question, why do men take their own lives in such alarmingly high numbers compared to women? I had to do a bit of research on this, but the demographics for male suicide today show some patterns. 7 in 10 suicides are men (majority white) between the ages of 45 and 65. As expected from gynocentric media, the primary reason always cited is men’s so called stubbornness in seeking out psychiatric help before they attempt suicide – again absolving women’s influence of any complicity – but ignoring what would motivate men, and this demographic in particular, to suicide. Again, there’s no attempt to understand the underlying reasons for male suicide, only a stereotypically easy ‘male-stupid’ answer to absolve women’s complicity in it.

There’s a lot to consider and be sensitive of when it comes to male suicide, but I’m going to speculate about a few reasons here coming from a Red Pill perspective. At no other time in western history has there ever been a generation of more purposeless men. From an evolved psychological perspective, men need a function. We are innate idealists. We look outward at the world and like to imagine what could be possible. I believe there is also an innate part of our evolved mental firmware that predisposes us to problem solving and improvisation, and much of that comes as an adaptation to women’s own innate need for men who can display cues of competency.

In Competency I made the case for women’s attraction to men displaying signals of competency, confidence, mastery and creative intelligence as a selected-for survival adaptation. In short, our competency in life, whether stemming from physical prowess, social dominance or creative intelligence is integrally linked with our reproductive success as well as overall life success.

However, at no other time in history has men’s competency been so devalued and so debased; other than perhaps in terms of physical prowess and accommodating the short term (Alpha Fucks) breeding imperatives of women. At no other time in (western) history has the equity in what a man can provide or create or solve been so implicitly unnecessary or superfluous to women. When we consider the rates of college enrollment and graduation of women compared to that of men, when we consider the practical problems that men used to solve, our utility has never been less needed – or at least that’s the zeitgeist of today.

We read about how men need to accept this new social reality – that our need for purpose and function is no longer needed or as valued – and we need to change our headspace about it as if it were something men might simply turn off. This is the result of equalist beliefs that anything gender-specific is something learned rather than the innate firmware we were born with. But we cannot simply change our minds about needing a function. We evolved to be problem solvers, women talk, men do, but now we are expected to accept that men are obsolete.

Loss of Utility

In Relational Equity I made a case for men investing too much of their egos into what intrinsic (and extrinsic) value they believe their respective women ought to appreciate about themselves. Under the old books, old social contract this equity may have had some conditional value to women, but as a buffer against Hypergamy today there is very little a man might consider value-added equity (unless it’s exceedingly rare or exceedingly valued) as a hedge against Hypergamy. Before any defeatist critics tell me how not all women are like that, yes, I get it, there are a lot of variables to consider here, but the equation and the reality doesn’t change – relational equity, overall, is no insurance against Hypergamy. It is also no insurance against women’s security and providership needs being met by resources that come from outside that relationship. I’m not considering this because I’m trying to depress any man, but it is vitally necessary to consider when we look at reasons why 45-65 year old men are predisposed to higher rates of suicide and higher rates of alcoholism and opioid abuse.

I would argue that a major contributing factor to high male suicide rates finds its origins in men’s need for purpose, function and accomplishment during this phase of life. Every day I read an article about how men my own age are dropping out of social discourse. I mentioned a Boston Globe article about just this phenomenon in Male Control. In some respects I can understand that despite the unprecedented connectivity we enjoy today men really don’t seek out bonds with other men. This is primarily due to the fact that men need a common purpose in order to form these bonds. Again, this is just how we’re wired. Women intentionally schedule time to simply interact with their same-sex friends just for the sake of communicating and enjoying the act of communicating. Men need function or a common purpose to come together. We need an activity or a problem to solve and then we communicate and form bonds.

Women talk, men do. This is a well studied fact; our brains and, by extension, social networks largely center on purpose and function. Now, lets presume that in spite of having literally all the information in the world at our finger tips we remove all need for the utility that men are wired to provide to not just women, but the larger scope of Society. We get a generation of men on the outside looking in. Only the most creative, resourceful and motivated of men can really utilize, much less master, all that this information has to offer him. And even a portion of those men can really see past the antipathy of their supposed obsolescence to do something truly meaningful or masterful. As the saying goes, most men live lives of quiet desperation, but in the modern era these men are demonstrably useless. And I mean that in a functional sense; once a Beta man has been wrung of his utility to women, he ceases to be able to convince his hindbrain that he can build, improvise or solve things.

Once a man is stripped of his usefulness, once it’s made clear that all of the equity he believed would support his relationship has been erased after so long, men will still resort to practical, deductive solutions. That solution may be suicide when weighed with the prospect of having to rebuild himself in a new context; and even if he did would he just be building a new ‘him’ based on his old belief set?

When my brother in-law committed suicide it seemed to me at the time to be the most logical end he would come to. He was a man very steeped in Blue Pill ideals, but he was also a man who prided himself on what he could do – and if he didn’t know how to do something he was always a fast learner. He literally built his life, and expectations of a future life, around the relational equity he believed defined him as a man. He was very invested in the old books, old social contract that rooted a man’s attractiveness and quality in what it was he could do. What he built for himself and his wife defined his identity.

All of that 20+ years of building equity and an identity based on it was erased for him in the space of about six months. But it was more than the 20 years he’d been saving, building, solving and refining, it was a perceived future he believed would be lived out for the rest of his life that got erased.

To me, at that time, his suicide made absolutely perfect sense from a male-deductive logic perspective. What didn’t make sense was all of the endless rationalizations I heard from his family, friends, his kids, his Ex (my now widowed sister in-law) about why they thought he went through with it when it was plain for anyone who wanted to confront the truth to see. A lot of these rationales were almost verbatim the same that the article I linked used. “If only men would reach out when they have suicidal thoughts”, any and every rationale that might absolve his Ex of the guilt, and still more that were meant to console her (he must’ve been mental ill) though in the end she really didn’t need it.

My brother in-law made a practical decision not an emotional one, and while I wouldn’t presume to say that a guy’s emotional state isn’t very influential in his suicide, how he comes to the decision is very much attributable to men’s deductive nature. He showed no outward signs of emotional distress. In fact, right up to his hanging himself he was in very good spirits and seemingly accepting of the fact that the wife he lived his life for was going to be leaving him soon. He was very matter of fact in a way that men are when they’ve resolved something for themselves. When a guy seems to be taking things in stride we don’t want to create a problem where we see none.

When we look in this context at the high rate of male suicide in this age demographic we begin to see how men come to this decision. Everything they’ve built up to 45-65 years of age is now debased, devalued or simply erased. All of the value and equity they’ve committed their lives to – doing the right thing according to their Blue Pill conditioning – is as if it never mattered. So they’re confronted with a choice, rebuild themselves (hopefully in a new Red Pill aware paradigm), reconstruct a new life and tough it out, or, simply, pragmatically erase themselves.

Personally, I’ve had at least two occasions where I’ve been confronted with rebuilding myself. It’s a tough prospect, make no mistake, especially when you’re Red Pill aware and understand the reality behind having to rebuild a life from scratch after so much investment in plans and projects you truly believed in when you made them. My father had to confront this rebuilding too at around 55 years of age, but rather than rebuild or kill himself I watched him slowly decay into a man I never knew could exist as my dad.

Zeroed Out

I apologize if this topic is a bit of a downer, but I think it ought to be part of any Red Pill aware man’s understanding that at many points in our lives we will be confronted with the prospects of having to rebuild ourselves. Failure, rejection and disappointment will happen for you, that’s just part of a man’s life, and it’s easy to rattle off platitudes about how many times you get back up being the measure of a man. But what I’m saying is there will be times when total reconstruction of your life will be a necessity.

You will be zeroed out at some point, and how you handle this is a much different situation than any temporary setback. This zeroing out is made all the more difficult when you confront the fact that what you believed to be so valuable, the equity you were told was what others would measure you by, was all part of your Blue Pill conditioning. At that point you need to understand that there is most definitely a hope for a better remake of yourself based on truths that were learned in the hardest way.

To end this I’m going to quote the comment of a man I met when I spoke at the 21 Convention in September. I won’t use his name, but after we talked he confessed that he was the commenter here. He’d made the trip to the convention to meet me face to face, to thank me for my work and gave me permission to use his example in a post. I won’t quote it entirely, but you can read the whole thing here. His situation is an example of, and inspiration for, everything I’ve illuminated in this essay

After a long marriage I divorced the mother of my children. A couple of years later, after some casual dating, I met a woman I would come to describe as my soulmate. I got married young – but this time, with all my infinite wisdom gained over the years – I was finally wise enough to pick a woman I was super compatible with.

We were together for a few years and even lived together. Things started out great and it was mostly smooth sailing until we moved in together – at which time I slowly allowed myself to be betaized in a slow motion, excruciating painful way.

About a month after breaking up with her I fully planned to commit suicide. I wrote a long letter explaining my rationalization and took other affirmative steps towards going through with it. About a week after I wrote the note – with D(eath) Day fast approaching – I took a break from getting my affairs in order to surf the net. I stumbled upon an Ask Reddit thread that was bad mouthing various subreddits. Some feminazi or male feminist mentioned the Red Pill subreddit as an example of a subreddit filled with craziness, and I decided to check what all of the fuss was about. Now

I’m not a religious man, but I will never rule out divine intervention. The timing of finding TRP – by complete coincidence no less – couldn’t have been more fortuitous. I stayed up all night reading the side bar – Rollo’s essays having the deepest effect on me – and everything…just…clicked….Talk about connecting the dots! Wow! It was very much like a come to Jesus moment. It was like divinity revealed secret knowledge to me just when I needed it the most – knowledge that gave me hope and very well may have saved my life. This all went down not really that long ago in actual time – but from where I metaphorically stand now it seems like an eternity.

Stay strong my friends, you can rebuild yourself even in the face of being zeroed out.

Published by Rollo Tomassi

Author of The Rational Male and The Rational Male, Preventive Medicine

666 comments on “Men and Suicide

  1. Mark
    December 2, 2017 at 4:54 pm

    Do not identify.
    Do not consider.
    Do not tell lies.
    Do not express negative emotions.

    For the meaning of all that read The Fourth Way by Ouspensky. He was a student of Gurdjieff.

  2. @Blaximus

    Amen to that. Wise words. I’ve screen shotted your comment and I’m going to send it to a few game aware friends of mine who don’t have the patience to read RM.

    I fully understand where Westray is coming from. Even with the golden advice on here regarding maintaining a marriage, given how most modern societies are today, is marriage still really worth the risk? And I think the answer to that is family; if children and a good family is something you desire then it probably is, if it isn’t, then maybe it’s not worth putting yourself in the line of fire, even if you have got Captain America’s vibranium shield and an in depth knowledge of how to use it.

  3. In the current climate, under existing circumstances, marriage is not advisable for the average dude.

    Pretty much for the same reasons as 50,000 mile auto tuneups shouldn’t be attempted by the average man. Tools and knowledge required or else a running auto will be reduced to a non running one.

  4. @ Mark


    The word of the day is: Perspective.

    Who says a Man’s best days are ever behind him, or that he’s ever ‘ lost out ‘? Ask yourself where this is coming from?

    Watch that inner dialog my friend. Pay attention to what you’re feeding your brain. Nothing is ever really over until dirt is being thrown on a casket, and we are all headed to that eventuality. So what’s to stop us from making the most of our time?

    Short version of a story ( I don’t remember if I’ve shared this before or not…. Memory isn’t as exact as it used to be, not because I’m old, but because I’m not exercising my brain as I should.. Lol ).

    I knew a girl once, beautiful girl that was pretty troubled. I saw her one day while I was driving down the street. She was crying hysterically and looked horridly disheveled. I pulled over and got out of the car and approached her asking what was wrong. She couldn’t even speak for crying, so I justbgrabbed her and squeezed her as tight as I could for as long as I could.

    Skip, skip, skip…

    Eventually she told me that she was so depressed that she didn’t want to live. She had spent the morning on a nearby bridge trying to gather up the nerve. I was floored.

    Skip, skip…

    I put her in my car and drove her first to McDonald’s for some coffee, then to a large shopping center parking lot where we just talked for hours. She got everything out. But she still didn’t want to live.

    So I made a deal with her. I told her that she should die and I’d help her. She didn’t even react to that statement, so I expounded – ” let’s kill this version of you, and let’s make a better, stronger version “. Why not???

    She didn’t have anymore of those thoughts…. That I know of.

    Now, men are much different than women. A guy would’ve jumped under her same circumstances we finish the job more often.

    This is why it’s absolutely crucial that we use our rationality to examine what messages we are taking in, because they effect us much more than women Wrt suicide. We are not the same.

    Still, I would advise men that find themselves in that dark place, to metaphorically kill ” themselves “, the suffering self in between your ears. Liberate your mind by killing what you used to know and believe that has helped to lead you to where you are.

    There’s nothing to lose by doing this versus the alternative that is permanent. It’s worth a good shot.

    The pain and confusion and bewilderment can be very real indeed. It can also be banished and replaced with a different perspective and understanding. The first step is to begin to guard your brain from all of those negative thoughts and beliefs. Discern what’s real, true and Important. Give yourself 30 days minimum to try. You owe at least that much to yourself.

    Sometimes looking for answers to specific problems can be a maddening non starter. Kill that ” problem “. Give yourself priority over ” problems “. Change your perspective.

    Remember that ‘ happy ‘ is a choice that we have more control over than we know.

    And as far as ‘ satisfaction ‘ goes, if your doing it right, satisfaction is a temporary state anyway. Logic dictates that the same must be true re: dissatisfaction.

    Stay up.

  5. @Mark

    30 is not too late.

    Those “formative” experiences in high school and college aren’t the end all be all. If you talk to people who had “great” times in college, most of them are miserable now and fat and ugly.

    You ever follow up on the prom queens, the quarterbacks, the popular kids? Most of them have since reeeeaaallly let themselves go. Talk to other people, they’ll tell you the same. Divorced, saddled with alimony, or they have tons of little kids they have to take care of now…

    What fucks people over is they think the made it, then they just stop working. The don’t aspire to try or do anything new, to challenge themselves. They stagnate and rot.

    So who cares if you missed out on a few years here and there. Majority of people only have a few brief moments of fun, and then its the long boring grind of “must work 60 hours a week for house with white picket fence for my ungrateful wife who only gives me a handjob once a month” lol. And they just work and conform and don’t get to be their real selves ever until they drop dead. No fun.

    They had a few years of fun in their teens, then the rest of their life is shit.

    You could still have most of your 30’s, and all of your 40’s and 50’s having a blast, doing things on your own terms. That’s way longer than most people get, even the ones that were partying and banging left and right in high school — sure some of them end up with an awesome rest of their life, but most of them don’t turn out quite as well as you think.

    30 is not too late.

    Put in the work, it will take a long time. Most likely years. Its hard as fuck to come back from where you are…but thing is, everything else is easy by comparison.

    I had a very slight improvement in my health a few weeks ago, only lasted a few days, but it was fucking amazing. I got out exercising, was running around, shit was awesome. And I was still sick as fuck! So I can’t even imagine what it would be like to feel normal. It’d be like life on easy mode.

    Thats the advantage you have. If you can get back to normal, you’ve been through so much more shit than most people have, and the everyday shit people complain about will be nothing.

    But its going to take a lot of work and just ENDURING to get there.

    Not easy, not easy at all.

    But I think its worth a shot.

    Be glad you aren’t a woman though…they are the ones that really get fucked by missing out.
    They really can’t make things happen when they get older…and they have a very narrow window to have their fun.

    Dunno if it was here that I first saw Jessica Simpson’s before and after pics were posted, but man, holy shit.




    As a dude, you can work out, challenge your self and develop better game skills, and make more money, etc. etc. You can become a high smv man at almost any age short of 110 lol.

    Women though, once they fuck up their bodies, they are fucked forever.

    You still got plenty of time to work things out and get to where you enjoy life.

    30 is not too late.

  6. Guys that put Jessica Simpson on a pedestal are probably a bit shocked. Lol.


    Don’t ever pedestalize them.

    What someone else is doing or not doing has no bearing on your mission.

    .. Something like that.

  7. PlaydontPay: “Talk about clown game! How long do you think you can maintain the emotional rollercoaster?”

    Mersonia: “That’s actually a really good question. How long can anyone really keep it up. How long can game which girls will grow accustomed too stand and if you are in a marriage is it upheld by desire or just the fact that the female has invested(lol idk if thats good word (I think become accustomed to being part of your life is better) so much in it that she just decides its better to stay.

    I’d really like someone with game and that is married to awnser that… queue ( blax sentybear.. shit even SJF (Not you ASD don’t respond plz)(And i’m not trolling at all I’d like a deadpan serious answer)

    Blaximus is hitting it out of the park in my estimation. If you are not Babe Ruth, you shouldn’t be calling the direction and the field into which you are going to hit a home run prior to hitting that said home run.

    You learn, you study, you act, you get mentors, you have desire to achieve what you want to achive. You strengthen yourself, you have courage going into the unknown and capricious wilderness that is life as a masculine male (a masculine male, not a feminized male), you develop mastery step by step. You get along with other males and have honor among other males.

    I heard that Rollo had a graph of SMV that graphed getting more valuable over time for males and peaking out if that male decided to get better (non automatic merit), vs. females had a value based on their well known attributes (automatic merit, and then the decline). What is the value of that graph? A feminine male lost boy with no vision for his passion and his pursuits and drops out of his burden of performance. Which graph do you thing his life and SMV tracks? The Female peaking at 23 or the Male peaking at late thirties?

    I call bullshit on Westray’s comments in the context of not self improving as an enlightened male that can and should be acting in his own self interests. We all know in the red pill community that legal marriage is a raw deal nowadays. It is what it is. You have ultimate choice to not get married. Has nothing to do with a man’s being able to sustain an LTR if so desired. Hell you don’t have to do anything you you don’t desire. But you should have a desire for some plan. And execute whatever plan you desire.

    So don’t be Babe Ruth unless you are. Don’t seek a completion in life. Build your legacy as a masculine male.

    As to the question of how you sustain a LTR. First you set that as a goal of your own. Don’t do it if you have no desire for it. It is OK to have no desire for it, whether you you are incompetent or competent. You can have either, but it still is a decision and a commitment. Don’t try to trip Blaximus up on his vetting statements. If you are not attractive enough or competent enough or don’t have enough confidence to advance your cause, then fucking work on it. If you get good enough, you will have confidence if you put in the work and have had success. (confidence comes from doing stuff and doing it well and then it’s an upward spiral).

    So back to Mersonia’s questions about sustainability. Yes LTR’s are sustainable. Because it takes two to tango. It’s not just on the vetted girl to perform. It’s on the male to get better, to adapt, to get better to adapt, to learn to mold the girl, to mold yourself into someone that is attractive and generates desire and not unattractive. Relationship game is and ongoing process of learning and growing. It’s best when the man owns his part of the relationship 100% (no excuses) and the woman owns her part of the relationship near as possible to 100% (but you as a man should not hold your breath in her getting to that 100%. You’ll die doing that) in following her man’s vision (it helps if she retains her beauty by any means necessary, has sexual open-ness, trust’s your direction, supports your vision, is intelligent and has healthy radiance–all of which is recursive and can be induced.)

    You can’t decide ahead of time what is going to happen in the future in your inter-sexual relationships. You have inner desire, you have inner intention, and then you have outer intention (you want to do something) and then you have outer action. You do stuff. It helps that you have competence and confidence (things you can create over time). Then you choose the things that present themselves to you in real time. You do have to choose things minute to minute, hour by hour, and month and years, ETC. You choose things that present themselves to you. You do that as wisely as you can. Even if that means: It seemed to be the right thing to do at the time!

    And if things go bad you pick up and move on. Telegraphing what’s going to happen is a fools game. Telegraphing your future is a Mind Trick that fools you into thinking that you accomplished something when you really didn’t. And it makes you try less hard going forward. Your brain was rewarded for your dream, but you didn’t accomplish it yet.

    Once again, a lot of how you accomplish a long term relationship or marriage was contained in the video he did with Donovan Sharpe. In which he explains how to sustain desire.

    Keep in mind all of my comments are still on board with The Red Pill brand of Rollo, and Blax advising that marriage is not advisable in today’s climate. I’m not advocating for marriage or LTR’s at all. I’m commenting on what it takes.


    Good comments in this thread. The thing that brought more healthiness and happiness to my LTR were definitely Red Pill awareness and Game. Those things can sustain any type of inter-sexual relationship any man wants. To deny RP awareness and Game is a fools game. Those two things are a springboard to growth.

    I don’t know why the fuck someone would think that if a man get’s married or enters in to an LTR he would think he was complete then, can rest and all is settled. Unless he doesn’t read Rollo or decides for some capricious reason that Game (natural or learned) is entirely un-necessary.

    It’s best to Deeply Convert the girl and never let up on the Blaximus or Rollo gas pedal. The second best is to recover and dig your self out of a Beta hole. Best not to go beta in the first place. Blax went beta with first wife, recovered and never wanted to repeat that mistake with wife2. I went beta with my first wife and recovered. Rollo told his great story in the Donovan Sharpe interview. Watch it and learn.

    Do not seek a completion in life or relationships.

    Which includes suicidal ideations.

    All things are possible. If you don’t know how to obtain something: Ask for help. Have desire. Learn. Get a mentor. And then make some good choices. If things don’t work out, start over. Most great men have failed a lot. And then they told themselves: never going to do that again.

    “How long can Clown Game be sustained” is a Strawman argument. Easy to take down, because it is not actually a thing. A man drives the emotional roller coaster by taking control of the wheel in a confident, congruent, dynamic (not sitting on your ass) and authentic manner. Move forward and die when you are done.

    Read all of this link, not just my quoted text:

    When should you die?

    Should you live fast and die young, or should you eke out every tiny bit of life you can?

    Neither, either, both. The question is flawed.

    The better question is why do you live? What do you live for? What is your purpose, your mission?

    You should die when you are done.

    You should live until you have accomplished your mission or when your continued existence can no longer serve your mission. You should not allow yourself to die before then and you should not try to prolong your life beyond this point.

    You do not deny death, you do not affirm life. You affirm your mission and realize death is simply when you cease to struggle in this mortal world.

    Live to struggle for your mission, struggle to live for as long as you are able to advance your mission. Then allow yourself to die. Don’t drag it out, don’t fight it; go to the grave knowing you gave your all for what mattered to you.

    That is when you should die, when you can rest peacefully knowing you have done everything you could and there is nothing more to do.

    Die when you are done.

  8. The overrepresentation of white men among suicide statistics is fascinating. I don’t buy the idea that white men are killing themselves in droves because political correctness dictates they are evil privileged racists and they can’t bear their collective guilt. They can’t possibly be that dumb. It absolutely makes sense that white men have an evolved thirst for problem solving, building, and work which when unfulfilled leads to self-destructive behavior. This innate industriousness explains the drastic differences in the types of societies that white and non-Asian minorities build.

    It is also very interesting that African Americans, who are drastically worse-off by almost any western metric of success, would have such low suicide rates. Of any group they would appear to have the strongest rational justification for a hopeless and self-destructive outlook and yet they almost never resort to suicide. I can’t imagine how the egalitarian crowd rationalizes this salient contradiction.

  9. @Blaximus

    “…. Lol, Jesus I butchered the fuck out of that story.”

    Which brings up the topic of fucking up and getting butt-hurt about it. Or moving on.

    Hell I even wonder if I was in my right mind when I just quoted FreeNortherner blog on his Die When You Are Done essay. Seems like any suicidal guy would say: “OK, I’m done. Can’t complete my mission. So I’ll abort”.

    I have no reference experiences in suicide. But I know to advise against it. It’s not worth the lack of future promise in my book. But what do I know.

    One always chooses. Whether taking a chance, choosing wisely with wisdom, or having enough wisdom to say that it seemed the right thing to do at the time.

    As a random Rian Stone comment on MRP once was said:

    We are swapping notes. A man is allowed to fail, to fuck up. Guarantee will all will at some point. So long as that man eventually owns it, sheds the ego, gets back up and gets to work, that’s the point of all this.

    Smack him upside the head, dust him off, and back to work
    So long as you’re in the fight, and willing to effort, fuck up, learn from it, and move on.

    And then there’s Teddy’s Man in the Arena Speech:

    In his book Transforming Depression, Jungian analyst, David Rosen, MD studied ten people who jumped off the Golden Gate Bridge and survived. “Although the ten had widely divergent views of religion before attempting suicide, they all admitted to feelings of spiritual transcendence after they had leaped.”

    David goes on to say, “What I learned from the Bridge-jump survivors has become an integral part of my own healing journey and of the healing journeys I lead my patients to undertake: People can overcome depression and suicidal impulses through egocide.”

    What needs to die is a part of the ego ideal. It would be an attitude, a naivety, or an attachment to an idea that is no longer useful.

    To kill off the whole body and mind is naive. For example, “I am drowning in despair and shame. I cannot admit this to anyone. No one can help me with this kind of pain. Everyone will be better off if I was dead”. The feelings are real but the interpretation of the feelings needs revision. That is the “healing journey” David is referring too. The old interpretation needs to be shed so something new can replace it.

    This person is feeling deep pain but the ideas are very naive. No one can help? How do you know everyone will be better off? Have you asked them? These painful feelings need to be felt and understood in a different way and the old way will naturally have to die off in David’s term, “egocide”.

    Perhaps the manosphere was invented for some reason:

    “Yes, it is important to go through the hurt, anger and loss of our past. This helps to clarify the parts or pieces of ourselves that got “depressed”, so they can gradually be brought back. We can say they are parts of our soul that got broken off, displaced. So much of this can be healed, just by telling our stories. It is not complaining or whining about the past if you really tell the whole story. This takes people who will listen in a way that is not dismissive or will not say, “get over it”. The most important part is opening your emotional pain, by first writing, then sharing it with people who can hear you. Make sure it is with people who can hear you, otherwise it repeats the cycle of rejection. I have never met a worthless, or unlovable person, but I have met many people who are sad and confused.”

    Guys, give Red Pill and Game a probabilistic chance because it has been shown to work. And don’t merely try it. Do it.

  10. The Last X Man

    “I’ve never been in a “serious” relationship, so my own experience is limited”


    “if a man settles down with a woman I can’t really see how he won’t be automatically less desirable”

    Using dog logic, yes. Cats are not dogs.

    “he is no longer the thing she wanted but couldn’t entirely have”

    You think Fleezer’s wife thinks she “has” him entirely?

    “the uncertainty of her becoming a permanent recipient of his valued attention is lost.”

    Not at all. You can be lying next to someone and be a million miles a way.

    You ever things like “i never know what your thinking”, “what’s going on in there”, “you’re always so distant”, “i don’t k ow what it means when you look like that” etc etc.

    What do all those things have in common?

    “Once it becomes constant or something she is sure will always have access to, one way or another, then that desire reduces. ”

    You can probably figure out the answer to your question from this…

  11. “I call bullshit on Westray’s comments in the context of not self improving as an enlightened male that can and should be acting in his own self interests.”

    I wasn’t talking about self-improvement at all. Go do your deadlifts in the garage and read Deida all you want. Won’t change the fact that when the girl goes batshit (half do) she can have you jailed on a whim and nearly painless self inflicted arm scratch.


    I get all that you’re saying. The internalization, vetting etc. but I still think you’re simply bringing it back to your own success and not staying on topic. But you give good advice along the way so it’s valuable to hear it anyhow. It’s good to hear the contribution. That said, who gives a shit about LTR’s if so much is called for? To continue your car metaphor; What if it took 25 years of high level mechanics schooling just to get an AMC Hornet to turn over? Not worth it. That’s how I feel about learning game to maintain an LTR with a western Anglo bint. No that’s not me backing down from the burden of performance or not having the nutsack to self improve. It’s just me saying “Who gives a shit about LTRs with third rate Western Anglos?” They’re simply not good enough for me, straight up. When you throw in the fact that the burden of performance is nearly constant and eternal (because value can’t be stored for later withdrawal when needed) I’d rather just eat tit in asia and get back to working on my own projects. The fact that failing at game no longer simply results in heartache. Now the stakes are possible jail time, lost jobs, tarnished hiring prospects, and lifelong financial ruin. You’re saying, “Hey man. It can be done.” Yeah, we know, but who gives a shit anymore? Once again, would you risk your whole life’s financial prospects to own a Hornet that takes two decades to learn how to tune up and then requires daily, nay, hourly, nay, minutely tuneups? Not me. There’s nearly free Mercedes Benzes in some other places that require no upkeep. And you just keep getting a brand new Benz whenever you have the whim.

  12. To continue your car metaphor; What if it took 25 years of high level mechanics schooling just to get an AMC Hornet to turn over? Not worth it. That’s how I feel about learning game to maintain an LTR with a western Anglo bint.

    Does it really take 25 years to develop unconscious competence? I don’t think so.

    When you throw in the fact that the burden of performance is nearly constant and eternal

    Kind of like breathing is nearly constant and for as long as you live…it’s such an effort to breathe…fuck that shit…

    …the point is that once you develop unconscious competence at game so that you can get in state quickly and easily…more like you live in state most of the time…it’s no more effort than breathing to run game on a LTR…I’ll post a FR about tonight…

  13. I slowly allowed myself to be betaized in a slow motion, excruciating painful way.

    This is why you NEVER allow them to move in – you have them come for the night, then go home. And never let one monopolize your time – always have several that you can call upon. That way when one gets upset for whatever reason, you bail and move on to the next one while the first gets her shit together. A man with options when it comes to women, is one that never needs to worry about not having a warm place to relax in. The biggest problem is keeping the number of women you have to a manageable number – I usually go with three, but for various reasons I have four at the moment – I usually like to have the weekend to myself, and a day between seeing any one of them – so while four is doable, it isn’t ideal.

    But it’s better than the alternative of having fewer than three – you always want a reserve… The well prepared man, is the one that keeps an eye on what HE needs. Let the women find what they need for themselves. They will either accept what you offer (that is almost always what they will do to stay with you) or they will bail, and as long as you have spares, that works. Keep a “string of pearls” that you can call upon as needed, and you’ll find your life is MUCH easier.

    Of course, you can do it the way that works best for you – I’m just saying what I found works for me. I know a guy that has a woman for every night of the week – to me that would be exhausting – but he’s younger than I am, and I like to have time to do what I like. So your mileage will vary. But always keep your options open, and have a fall back position.

  14. I don’t trust your writing as of late any longer, Mr Rollo Tomassi. I have started to ask myself whether or not your writings somehow is being coopted by feminine interests.

    Take this post for example. You set out all fine and well, seemingly readying yourself to argue against the notion of males being obsolete as claimed by feminists.

    But then you don’t. After having merely presented the idea of masculinity being redundant on a societal level, you just leave it at that and you skip to continuing your discussion on an individual level. Where indeed you suddenly full out accept male obsolescence as if it were fact, only you rebrand the man to being ‘zeroed’. Thereby ‘coincidentally’ the notion of male obsolescence all of a sudden us stated as a fact. In a deceptive and roundabout manner.

    This way of presenting an argument is extraordinarily feminine. It’s switch and bait. It’s deceptive. It carries a hidden agenda instead if plain speak.

  15. The most painful thing about this post is the fact that ONLY THE MEN GIVE A FUCK, YET THEY ARE NOT THE ONES WE ARE DYING FOR!

    Indiana, thanks for being there for your dad.

  16. @SJF
    Great comment on what it takes to manage an LTR, if one decides to enter one.

    I can’t argue with your breakdown at all. What you, Blax and SJF have been asserting is what’s needed to maintain an LTR. In all honesty, it’s not knowledge I wasn’t aware of, it’s just that the horror stories I hear damn near everyday, and read on here sometimes, have made me cynical regarding relationships despite the tools a man may have when entering one, so I had come to the conclusion that no matter who were you were entering an LTR must be an an automatic L(oss) of some sort,but if I really look at it that’s not always the case and it can be otherwise.

    I had a “longterm” fuck buddy for two years a few years back when I was just entering my 20s. Many of the techniques people are mentioning here I applied during that period, and it was easygoing until I ended it. Seeing as that wasn’t a serious relationship in comparison to what the men I know and what men on here have been in, I never looked at that experience as being successful because of the tools I was using but rather because we weren’t “serious”. On reflection, it may have been so easygoing because of the knowledge I applied, rather than due to me viewing her as a fuck buddy.

  17. @ mersonia

    Listen boy I do get it, trust me on that. I’ve been here and on illimitable men for 4 years now.

    I don’t practice PUA techniques or run clown game or try to keep a pedestalised piece of pussy around by taking her little brain on emotional road trips, that’s her fucking job.

    Looks/physique matter
    Lifestyle matters
    Power matters
    Alpha attitude matters

    So you crack on pandering to these little girls emotional whims to get some short term pussy until they figure out your just an actor, a facsimile of an alpha.

    Meanwhile I’ll be over here being a Man and enjoying women for what they are a form of entertainment.

    She is attracted by your lifestyle and maybe also your looks and physicality, but is loyal to neither. She needs your Alpha leadership but she will only be loyal to your power.

    Now run along little boy I’m done schooling you for the day.

  18. Mersonia

    “That’s actually a really good question. How long can anyone really keep it up. How long can game which girls will grow accustomed too stand and if you are in a marriage is it upheld by desire or just the fact that the female has invested(lol idk if thats good word (I think become accustomed to being part of your life is better) so much in it that she just decides its better to stay.”

    Interesting question.

    Part one.

    “How long can game which girls will grow accustomed too stand”

    Well she is programmed to follow. So a large part of this is are leading. If you are leading you have momentum and she is pulled in your orbit. If she isn’t following, you aren’t leading.

    If you’ve plateaued, well plateaus are dangerous because they trigger hypergamous instincts to affirm her enviornment. Doesnt matter where the plateau is, bottom or top.

    I’ve come to the conclusion that hypergamy is more a reflex than a drive. It is more a response to specific stimulus than a constant need. The difference betweel Patellar Reflex and hunger for example.

    If you are doing enough, just enough of leading, of having frame, of emotional engagement, mpoo etc. Via displays of the Alpha Triad traits and hewing to the Platinum Rule – the reflix is not triggered.

    Part two.

    “Is it upheld by desire or investment”

    I don’t think desire is conscious to the degree we as men would relate to. Because we are not programmed as followers, but as leaders, we can’t grasp the pleasure she gets from just having to follow. We have to look at things like “gains” and “opportunity costs” and “switching costs” etc. To try and grasp why “she” is staying with “him”. It’s really much simpler. She is simple. She is a baby maker. She is programmed to follow and adapt to leading.

    When we as men get away from these truths, that’s when the hypergamous reflex is tripped.

  19. Playdontpay

    “Looks/physique matter
    Lifestyle matters
    Power matters
    Alpha attitude matters”

    But they matter because they evoke emotion and feeling. Don’t overlook that when thinking about emotional engagement and emotional leading.

    To a woman the only Truth is emotion. How she processes her emotions keeps the hypergamous reflex in check or not.

  20. Zeroed our just happens, it’s random. Based on your choices sure, but in a world of disposable men it is just random. So be ready for it. Women will zero you in a moment, I don’t care how into you they were are. So be ready. I Ben zeroed it has to happen to know what it means. She comes home and says she met someone else. The guy who fucking painted your house. Zeroed. You give and give and no one gives a shit. You work somewhere twenty years and you lose it in a day. You don’t see it coming and you can’t really adapt and no one cares and it must have – MUST HAVE – been your fault. Knowing it is there, is random, like a trap door is what gets you through. My motto has always been if you can’t leave you can’t stay. I got four men friends who didn’t get through. Four suicides. I miss each of them. Thanks Rollo.

  21. I would have titled this great post Zeroed Out, because while it initially touches on suicidal thoughts and actions it then goes way beyond.

    There is one especially dangerous moment when many men face the Zero Hour — it’s called retirement. So much of what you are or were may be gone in an instant. The most deadly serious thing my usually jolly grandfather ever said to me was “Don’t ever retire.” (The second most serious thing was “Don’t ever get old” — but what’s the alternative?)

    If you’re heading toward that stage do some serious planning in advance and not just about the finances that everyone focuses on.

  22. @ palma

    Menopause. YIKES!!!!!! lol.

    According to my wife’s gyno, she is pre menopausal. I can’t really tell any difference as of yet, but I made myself aware of what will be happening to her physically, hormonally and emotionally, so I won’t be caught flat footed believing that she’s gone batshit crazy.

    Having watched a few women go into menopause already ( my mom was the first I’d gotten to observe first hand, up close ), the severity of symptoms can vary greatly.

    Whatever happens though, I am ready for it as I understand it ( symptoms) will be temporary. Massive hormonal shifts are no joke, for men or women. Lol.

    To your other point, I’ve been through a divorce already as well. But compared to much of what I’ve read in the manosphere, mine was atypical. I don’t think I view/see/understand women the same as most men. I don’t think I ever have, once I’d had my heart dug out of my chest with a rusty spoon by my first love at a very young age. Even she taught me some valuable lessons that remain with me to this day, and she holds the distinction as being the only woman I’ve dealt with that I would not piss on if she was on fire.

    She motivated me from my early teens to figure out how I could still be close to and be intimate and trust a woman on my terms and to my benefit. After a while just getting pussy was not sufficient. I wanted everything a woman was capable of giving, and then I wanted

    So as delusional as I may sound, I approached both marriages the same way ( went beta in the first and ruined a good thing- self inflicted mortal wound …lol ). In fact, I approach all relationships with women with the goal of pulling the best/most out of them. While amassing a triple digit N count, there have only been a few that were just unreachable and a waste of time.

    Again, I truly believe that a man must build himself and his mind and his life consistently and don’t ” change ” because of a woman. Take her with you on your journey, and if she balks…NEXT

    I can still think of an even dozen of things I still would like to do with my wife. She has no idea. The thought that being with a woman Has to stifle a man is foreign, married or not. This summer I took my old lady hiking around grandfather mountain in north Carolina. It wasn’t planned or anything, it’s just something I’d been thinking about doing because I spend so mush time sitting at my desk and commuting to work. A hike sounded like a great idea. It was something for me, but I included my partner in crime ( I’ve trained her to be that ), and she had a blast. Picking up frogs and giant beetles, lol, and a butterfly even hitched a ride on her shoulder for an hour. She was like a kid.

    After 3 hours of hiking ( which I’d started to question my choice of trail… Damn ), she said she was starving, so I took her to a little barbeque joint and I could swear she had an orgasm eating barbeque chicken.

    Year 19.

    You don’t have to roll over and die in a relationship. Hell, don’t roll over and die without one. This kinda ties into the OP a little bit about a man’s concept of usefulness and purpose.

  23. @ sentient

    Agree, and if I have the 4 areas I outlined handled her emotions will mostly take care of themselves with minimal input from me.

    Build it and they will come.

  24. I am right in the middle of that demographic you mentioned. My own personal experience isn’t as important as one fact of Men in this age group – all started their careers before Personal Computers, Mobile/Smart Phones, Social Media (or even the explosion of “media” at all – cable TV was in its infancy).

    Many of us “grew up” in an age when it was still possible to have a “career” that spanned your entire professional/income earning years with one single company. So the path of (1) Get a college degree, (2) go to work for a Fortune 500 company (3) Get Married (4) have kids and raise a family and (5) retire comfortably – based upon both your own savings and the Pension provided by that great company – those were ultimate goals many of our parents had for us.

    How quickly – in less than three decades – that world has been completely lost (as a goal).

    Today? It’s questionable a college degree makes any real difference (from an investment/payoff standpoint). Anyone that is even casually aware of TRP knows Marriage or even a LTR lasting beyond a decade is very, very tough – and it will be Men paying for the dissolution of that relationship. Career? Is there a lifer type job out there anymore? Retirement? What is that.

    When you take all those changes and add them together. It doesn’t surprise me about the suicide rate for Men in my age group. We were not “brought up” for a world of “resets”. We were conditioned from an early age to plan our path, and then move down it. Most of my peers, even if unhappy in their lives, can’t see “resetting” as solution. IN that case, if resetting is not the solution, there are only three paths left (1) double down on the current situation (2) take your foot off the accelerator and ease into “retirement” and hope for the best or (3) end it all, especially if you are lucky enough to have that really big corporate life insurance policy (example – when I was working for one of the F50 companies in my past – I could have gotten as much as $1.5M depending on the circumstances of my death).

    It becomes a real solution – especially if your mindset is “taking care of my family” – to take Option #3. The ironic aspect of the third option – it becomes a problem to solve, something not encountered previously, and I’m sure for some Men, it may be something they haven’t experienced in a while.

  25. Some really good stuff here. I don’t have much time as I’m knee deep in work. Got up at the crack of dawn to start working today and took a 30 minute break to read TRM. I’ve been non-existent here for the past six weeks or so after a series of minor unfortunate events that I had to attend to.

    First, @IndianaJones, thanks for sharing. Hang in there man. Come back and keep us updated if it helps. @Blax, shit, man….YOU ARE FUCKING SPOT ON BROTHER!

    You learn, you study, you act, you get mentors, you have desire to achieve what you want to achive. You strengthen yourself, you have courage going into the unknown and capricious wilderness that is life as a masculine male (a masculine male, not a feminized male), you develop mastery step by step. You get along with other males and have honor among other males.

    Always appreciate the reminders.

    Suicide….I can’t go into it now, but in short, I do see how some men fall into dark places and get stuck. It doesn’t take much, especially if you have no good mentor(s), mental point of origin, agency and are blue pill as all fuck. About a month ago I fell into a funk. It didn’t last long, but during that two week period I was more worried about my job than ever before. I couldn’t exercise and life seemed like shit.

    Got in a minor car accident and my knoggin’ kissed the steering wheel. The result was a concussion, and while minor, my ability to think analytically was fucked. My job requires a great deal of logical work and I ended up pooching the primary program I run for our group of companies. This operation had been a cash cow and a year ago I was the golden child bringing in a nice revenue stream.

    I had to take a week off work because of the concussion and when I returned I realized several things were fucked with my program. I had made some mistakes the day of the accident and for the life of me didn’t realize it until a month later. Meanwhile revenue plummeted and my boss and others were like WTF. I simply could not figure out what had gone wrong. I couldn’t remember jack shit about several key components. My logs and notes made no sense. I felt dumb, forgetful and a space case for weeks. Couldn’t work out as the doc said wait until the knoggin’ is healed.

    I walked around feeling like a failure and couldn’t shake it. At times I even felt a bit of downer humiliation and grief. Suicide was never a thought, it wasn’t that bad. BUT…..after reading Rollo and others here I can see how a guy who doesn’t have a good foundation can go downhill fast. My relationship with the GF has been solid and so luckily I had no issues with her. I empathize with guys who are in a funk. You think and feel like there is no light at the end of the tunnel. It’s all darkness and failure. Nobody to support you, you can’t muster the energy to get out of bed etc…

    It wasn’t luck, but I got shit turned around.

    My thinking started clearing up and I found a peer in my industry who happened to need some extra cash and I hired him immediately to help me fix my work fuckup. At first I felt a fool explaining what happened. He ripped me to shreds (nicely) for some things I had done that were fundamentally wrong. I bore back into work like a determined motherfucker to right the ship. Sure, I’m loyal to the company, but it wasn’t that that drove me. It was a determination to fix what was broken. To prove to myself I could handle this and make my program successful once again. I dug into like a beast and began working 80 hours a week, and still doing a side project for a local non-profit. About two weeks ago the fixes showed promise. My head clear and critical thinking skills returning.

    I’ve been getting up at 5:30 regularly without an alarm clock now for the past month. My drive to get done what I needed to do drove me to plow through every obstacle. Had I been a lesser man I could have walked away or just settled for a half-assed solution. Had I not had the Red Pill as a foundation for keeping my MPO and remembering I can AGENCY WHENEVER I WANT OR NEED IT….I might have floundered and got fired. From there it would have spiraled quickly down. But it didn’t. I crushed it and now my program is looking to beat last December’s record revenue.

    I’m far behind in my non-profit work so I’m at my office right now so I can have large screens and crank out some design and photography work. It’s sunny and gorgeous outside. My yard beckons….but I need to stay focused until my deadline has passed.

    What does all this mean and why am I sharing it? Because there might be a guy out there reading this that feels like he is fucked. Maybe he lost his job, is in the middle of a divorce, or he got hurt and can’t work. The list is endless of what can go wrong. Just remember….when shit hits the fan TRM is a place to help you find your mental point of origin. Think of it as a lighthouse to help you see danger and how to avoid it. It’s a hot kitchen and not a safe space, but when guys like Blax, Rollo, SJF and others write what they do that shit is golden. Don’t fucking pull the trigger. Offing yourself is NOT a solution. Reboot and do it for yourself. Don’t go blackpill, read up on read and vent, grieve, cry, or whatever it takes.

    Failure is an opportunity to succeed. I was shitting bricks a month ago. Today jumped out of bed before sunrise and charged ahead. A new day to find success. Another day I’m breathing and feel alive and kicking.

    Peace out brothers. Rock on!

  26. @Sentient @play

    But they matter because they evoke emotion and feeling. Don’t overlook that when thinking about emotional engagement and emotional leading.
    To a woman the only Truth is emotion. How she processes her emotions keeps the hypergamous reflex in check or not.

    True. But play and other men don’t need to understand women unless those men make a misstep. We all have our ups and downs. So there may come a time when understanding women is helpful even for men like play. Can I hear an “amen” from Blax and Ton?

  27. @ ASD

    True, men don’t need to understand women, but I encourage men to try to understand them none the less.

    From a biological and even religious standpoint, women are here for me. All women. Even the fat ones, lol. And 90% of them are hardwired to respond to me as a man, in a mostly positive manner. They can’t help it. It’s reflexive as a cough or laughter

    So understanding them works only to your benefit. Otherwise they can appear as a shitload of aliens living among us.

  28. “Listen boy I do get it, trust me on that. I’ve been here and on illimitable men for 4 years now.”

    Shit there’s probably not any hope for you then lol. lol You’ve been on illimitable men and you still don’t get this shit lmao. Just because you get a boner for looks doesn’t mean girls do

  29. Game in itself will not prevent being zeroed, the idea that a man must never plateau is an impossibility as well…In the end you will look back at all the time you spent trying to please women and chasing pussy as being a colossal waste of resources. The other gorilla in the room is menopause, a bat shit crazy switch all women flip just when you think you can slow down a bit and enjoy the fruits of your labors. Your life will become hell and you’ll wish she did run off with the guy who painted your house.

    My advice to any young man is to make your own life your mission, make your pile of FU money as quick as you can, travel, expand your life mentally, physically and spiritually. if you must marry hide resources well before hand and never reveal them to anyone. In the event of a divorce you can start again and will not be left sitting in a moldy basement apartment or sleeping in your car.

    For older men, post 45 who have been divorced, forget about women, take a month for every year you were married and go Monk Mode ( EG. 24 years of marriage= 24 months of Monk Mode) Attend to regaining your own financial, physical, mental and spiritual health, volunteer in your community and build new relationships that get you out and about. For me the physical activity was the initial life saver, I took up cycling, rode at least ten miles a day and went back to the gym, it’s about the only way one can burn off the “fight or flight” stress that wears you down, floods your life with depression and can kill you.

    I kept a journal of my trip through all this and reading it now I often wonder who that poor bastard was. I’m certainly not that guy now, I’ve pared my life down to doing what pleases me and live simply. Women come and go in my life, but at almost 63 I find most of them to be a pain in the ass, Spinning plates? who needs three times the aggravation? If there’s is one thing I’ve learned it’s whoever cares the least that has the most power, nothing lasts forever and always be prepared to walk away….

  30. Well…. That’s one way to look at it I guess.😀

    But, there’s no ” batshit crazy ” switch being flipped. If it appears that way, it only means you don’t understand what’s going on and become frustrated. Frustration isn’t good.

    And yeah, if you live in her frame ( ie you look forward to slowing down and are thrown by her disapproval… Wtf????) Then she will do what you’ve empowered her to do.

    Simple and basic.

    No man should ever feel he must duck and hide shit from a woman in his life. If this is the case, you have chosen poorly and failed in leadership.

    There! That’s better.

  31. Re: working.

    I’ve been at my current job going on 22 years in 2018. Every one of those 22 years, I’ve understood that my employment could be terminated at any time. Why? Basically because my name wasn’t on the sign above the entrance.

    And I realized this long before coming to work for my current employer.

    If I got let go, at 56, tomorrow, would I be bummed or saddened? Yes to the extent that I’m only 2 years into my 5 year plan of maximizing my retirement funding. But after 30 years in this field, I’m good to go because I realized that dependency on ” others ” , even in employment is a dangerous thing. I’ve been ready for long-term job loss for over 15 years. Reaction to the nature of this beast.

    Nobody owes a man a damn thing. Truth.

    It still sucks though, when that’s demonstrated.

    Hustle, hustle, hustle. Stagnation is to be avoided.

    A few months ago a guy I know offered me a thousand bucks cash to help him paint a car, as he’d fallen behind in work and was desperately trying to catch up. Honesty, I would have done it for half that amount because it only entailed about 3 hours work on my part, but cash is king.

    A couple of days later, he had the same offer. The following week yet again, same offer.

    A similar situation came up with another guy I know that had a large contract to restore and refinish the massive oak floors in a historic mansion in our city. He just couldn’t get the necessary manpower to complete the job on schedule, so I assisted him for the better part of a week in my spare time. 2,500 bucks in cash for less than 10 hours of work. And the floors look absolutely amazing.

    A landscaper has asked me if I wanted to earn some cash, but I just don’t have the time.

    Stagnation. Is. Bad.

    Our tendency to place all of our eggs in one basket, a basket that we don’t even own, is going to be a risky proposition.

    There’s more than one Red Pill.

  32. Me: When you throw in the fact that the burden of performance is nearly constant and eternal

    ASDgamer: Kind of like breathing is nearly constant and for as long as you live…it’s such an effort to breathe…fuck that shit…

    That’s such a lackluster analogy on your part. ‘Breathing’ compared to navigating the SMP in a world of obesity, violently gynocentric laws, full-on sexist divorce courts, social media smv inflation, unleashed solipsism, 50 years of cultural misandry, legislated hypergamy, VAWA etc all for a ‘reward’ that is dwarfed by the risk involved to get it, if it even qualifies as a ‘reward’ in any way at all anymore, which is dubious.

  33. @ mersonia

    Your right obviously girls absolutely don’t get tingles for good looking men ( fitness/ health marker) or men who can physically dominate other males, Alphas generally look like Alphas after all.

    Yea it’s all about game and taking them on that emotional rollercoaster while working your crappy 9-5 until they figure out you’re a fraud.

    I get a boner for looks, they get tingles for a man with a lifestyle they want to step into and who can protect them, lead them and make their friends jelous, they are heard animals after all.

    Tell me exactly what is it that I “don’t get lol” ?

  34. Blaximus, yes there is a switch and it’s hormonal and very well documented. How it effects individual women varies, I’ve watched my mother go through it, my sister, my x and wives of numerous friends who spend most of their time trying to placate this woman they no longer recognize or hide out in the man cave and hope it all blows over before divorce rears its ugly head. Go read some women’s menopause forums for a real eye opener, watch how they go at onset of Peri from being concerned about their change in behavior effecting their marriage to the point a year in they can’t stand to even be in the same room with their husband and are revolted by his touch…. Yeah, it’s real and nobody wants to talk about it.

  35. Placate??

    Oh my, no.

    I’ve witnessed menopause myself ( and will again soon ). Hormonal, yes. I don’t need go read menopause ” forums ” to understand it. Don’t care for the worst case scenarios.

    You’re actually making my case for understanding vs frustrated attempts at placating. Never placate a woman.

  36. @Westray

    Most of your issues are only fears, not real problems. Men with understanding can easily avoid misandrist social and legal shit without even training a woman if their game is unconsciously competent. The biggest hangup is going to be social media–dealing with that requires training a girl. Social media unleashes solipsism on steroids, so a woman’s social media use needs to be restricted and regulated and that requires training a woman and that a woman be accountable to her man for her use of social media…her social media accounts must be open to her man.

    LTRs are a big risk and something to be avoided if you don’t want kids. There’s no need to have kids. But if you don’t want to be zeroed out evolutionarily speaking, you will want kids; that is best accomplished via marriage. We had a discussion about this on the blog some time back and the general consensus is that marriage is best for kids and divorce is terrible for kids, as is single-mommyhood.

  37. Blaximus, I think you are getting my point wrong, I’m describing what I’ve seen, not what I agree with, husbands doubling down trying to please their menopausal wives in a last ditch effort to try and turn the Titanic around. It might delay the inevitable, but the end remains the same for most. Dread and game won’t work either on a wife who in her own mind six months ago has already left the relationship and planned her exit strategy, even if it did the prize is not worth having.

  38. Why do men suicide more than women? In a TRM context the answer is simple — women tend to dismiss any situation as not their fault. Men take more responsibility.

    Much is made of some stat that women ATTEMPT more suicides than men, but with more failures. Again, the TRM-based answer would be Men Do, Women Talk. A failed attempt is a form of communication, not action.

  39. “Lighten up the cross, it’s a lonnnng journey,” singer Annette Peacock advises in a nice moment on an old Bill Bruford album.

    Of course there are terrible situations and clinical conditions that lead to suicidal thoughts, but sometimes it’s just self-blame and negative thoughts — like, “I can’t go on without X,” or “I let X down, I didn’t measure up.” It’s one thing to set goals and strive for improvement, but don’t give other people (especally women and especially menopausal nutjobs!) veto-power over your agenda and your sense of self-worth.

    Rest cheerfully assured that even those closest to you — ESPECIALLY those closest to you — hate you on some level or at least are deeply disappointed. The question is, do YOU like you?

  40. Oh, and as Columbo would say, “just one more thing.” Ozzy Osbourne turns 69 today. If he somehow hasn’t done himself in as yet, there’s hope for us all.

    It sounds so old-fashioned, but find something to laugh at, even if it’s yourself. Or as Dorothy Parker put it,

    Guns aren’t lawful
    Nooses give
    Gas smells awful
    You might as well live

  41. cheupez, Quit on women for the Monk Mode period, not indefinitely… That said, women 45 and over are a rapidly depreciating asset. The ones I was interested in when I first became single six years ago in that age range have not weathered very well , most of them are still single post divorce five to 8 years on. Women age very quickly once menopause kicks in..

  42. @Rollo

    This is one of your greatest essays ever, thanks man!!!

    “My father had to confront this rebuilding too at around 55 years of age, but rather than rebuild or kill himself I watched him slowly decay into a man I never knew could exist as my dad.”

    My dad is in the same situation that your dad was, after he turned 60 he has been decaying more and more each year. I don´t really know what to do or how can I help him, he is too old to be red pilled (he´s 67) and he is very ego invested in his blue pill/old books idealism. It is very sad to me to see him diying from inside. Any suggestions?

  43. Yeah, The Wall that women hit in their 30s is legendary here but wait until you see The Pavement they hit around 60 — from about 12 stories up. I’ve been attracted to plenty of women in their 50s but it’s like hitting a rapidly moving and diminishing target

  44. @ Ronin

    ” Blaximus, I think you are getting my point wrong, I’m describing what I’ve seen, not what I agree with, husbands doubling down trying to please their menopausal wives in a last ditch effort to try and turn the Titanic around. It might delay the inevitable, but the end remains the same for most. Dread and game won’t work either on a wife who in her own mind six months ago has already left the relationship and planned her exit strategy, even if it did the prize is not worth having.”

    Ronin, your probably right that I’m getting your point wrong.

    Most of what you’re describing above, sounds like Blue Pilled hubbies doing shit ass backwards and paying the price for that.


    ” Dread and game won’t work either on a wife who in her own mind six months ago has already left the relationship and planned her exit strategy ”

    Lol, a man would have to be pretty clueless.

    I have empathy and great compassion for my fellow men, but I’m not that cat who will go along with cursing all teh awful wimminz for following their biology ( and men being ignorant of it ).

    Men had better get geometrically smarter about this shit, as I’m tiring of hearing how ” women aren’t worth it “, when they are the one’s who chose these very same women. Did you or did you not understand what the hell you were doing? If the answer is ” not “, guess who’s ” fault ” that is?


  45. palmasailor, Yeah I know, I think that’s why in some cultures a man of means would have more than one wife. When the old one was no longer attractive enough or interested, she was promoted out of the bedroom for a younger one.. My current lady is past menopause and still has a strong sex drive, she also told me her menopause was very mild compared to most of her friends and most of them are “Past Sex”. Whether there is any correlation between the severity of the bat shit crazy and sex drive after menopause I don’t know.. Up until her I’d never slept with anyone over 45, I generally have no attraction to women of that age.

  46. While I’m talking about this, I have a question for everyone –

    In YOUR real life experience, have you seen a very large number of women 30 and over slamming into walls?

    I hear this refrain constantly in the manosphere, and I get suspicious now that a bunch of men just repeat this by rote.

    I personally have witnessed some chicks crash into ” the Wall “, but this isn’t true for the majority that I know. But evidently it’s wide spread enough where manospherians are adopting it as an absolute gospel truth.

    30? Done.


    So fellas, what’s your personal EXPERIENCE with chicks crashing into the wall at 30 and older?

  47. Off topic

    About Prince Harry´s engagement I think that the worst thing is not the confirmation of Harry being Beta but the message that women are getting:

    “You are free to find yourself during your 20´s (aka ride the CC), marry beta bucks after hitting the Wall at 30, divorse him and explore new options (aka correct the soul mate mistake) and you still can land prince charming at 40 even if you are an objectively average woman”

    I am sure this will feed even more unrealistic fantasies among women and divorce rape rates will increase.

  48. Blaximus, it’s the old story, women marry hoping to change a man, men hope their wife doesn’t change, both end up disappointed . All you need to know about women is to have a cat in the house, They are temperamental, demanding of attention, finicky and you have to deal with their shit everyday..

  49. palmasailor, The batshit crazy has always been there, but there used to be brakes on female behavior because of limited options. Hell prior to the late 1960’s, even a women’s peers would reel her back in if she was after someone who was “Not good husband material”. , the threat of single motherhood with no support was also ever present. Now there are few restrictions on women and certainly no social shaming or restraints.

  50. ” All you need to know about women is to have a cat in the house….”

    My cat sits and rolls over on command.


  51. Blax
    I’m generally attracted to older women so I don’t really see the physical aspects of hitting The Wall.

    What I definitely have seen is the pretty quick turnaround at that age from AF to BB in their choice of men —
    something I never quite put my finger on until reading TRM. And what I have heard is biological time clocks loudly ticking (I wisely dodged one very attractive time bomb who wanted to breed with me).

    So it’s behavior more than looks, maybe from the sense that a whole new cohort of younger women is breathing down their necks for male attention, and that reproductively speaking it’s the bottom of the eighth and the Sandman is warming up for the ninth.

  52. Mr Roboto
    Where to start — has your dad been screened for any possible chemical imbalance, nutrient deficiency, early Alzheimer’s onset, chronic pain and so on? Is he physically limited or able to walk, exercise, shop, socialize? Is he alone a lot or are there friends and family nearby?

  53. palmasailor, yes we are in a new territory as men post 50-60, a whole different thing for us than guys under 45. I have to admit I was amazed by female interest in me when I got zeroed at 56, some of them just under 30. I was too shell shocked at the time to recognize what was going on,, but then I’d not even kissed another women since I met my X Circa 1987. .Short of a few fitness model competitors I’ve met in the gym, the number I see over 50 that I find attractive are very few in number and even those without the make up and hair dye are i imagine pretty scary in the morning.

  54. Blaximus, I inherited my daughter’s cat, otherwise wouldn’t have one in the house. I had the dog train him, when he pisses me off I sick the dog on him,

  55. @Blax

    I think that you misunderstand what is meant by “hitting the Wall.” I think that it refers to women being past child-bearing age (eggs dead) and entering menopause with a loss of femininity and youth and some beauty. At what precise age women hit the Wall depends on the individual woman’s fertility. That’s my understanding. Maybe others think differently.

  56. palmasailor, true enough, but most can find a safe berth with some thirsty guy it they really had to. The thirst is mighty with some guys, I meet just such as guy a couple of weeks ago, he’s on his second marriage and was going on about what a catch his current wife is… then I met her, an obese midget of a women whose every order he follows without question.

    There are a lot of articles out there by women bemoaning becoming “Invisible at 50”, some of them when you check out their early articles from years gone are full of complaining about the “Male Gaze” and “Cat calling”

  57. ASD
    I understood The Wall to mean early to mid 30s — the time when their SMV curve is starting to drop pretty sharply. Some of them are starting to lose their looks as well but even if they look sharp there are (largely negative) behavioral changes.

  58. Westray,

    I’ve heard your zero sum definition of Alpha before.

    IMO, it’s a matter of perspective.

    I’m a father of many children, many boys, red-pilled. That’s force multiplication. 1+1=??

    Is that power? Fully grown successful adults emotionally bonded, working for my well being, as well as theirs? My family tree is right side up. It is possible, you know…

    Life’s not a win-lose fixed pie. When my wife wins, I don’t lose.

    Women require our RP stewardship.

    Let’s stick to the RP script give it to them.

  59. With my kids I’ve discussed a attempted/successful suicides known to our family over the last 20 years. All men 16-25.

    All born from a perceived lack of options. Men from successful, albeit BP families. Athletic, popular guys…who felt that wasnt enough, who they were becoming was failure.

    One father painfully admitted this: “As religious as I am, it never prepared me for this.”

    Society requires an all in approach to maintaining the power structure as is. Men propel it, women are manipulated to ensure men stay dutifully in it. All aspects focus not on human well being but limiting their options, benefitting the state.

    Re: The above father-friend is correct. Today’s church didn’t prepare him…by design.

  60. On a lighter note, we do have purpose:

    Was out with wife and sister, at the bar. Pretty lady, 30’s slim shoulders exposed. She’s trying to unlodge the ketchup. You know, smacking the backside.

    “Nice shoulders…pause…but you’re doing it wrong.” I take the bottle and ask her “Where do you want it?” and slap the front side…viola! Ketchup deluge.

    “See ladies? Men are awesome, ain’t we? We pour your ketchup, install your toilets. What would you do without us?BTW, only the first one’s free.”

    That got a laugh from the guys nearby.

  61. Generally, I lurk but I wanted to jump in just to say thank you again, Rollo. You truly are doing the Lord’s work here, whether you believe it or not. Keep saving lives.

  62. “Toxic masculinity” is welcome at Shotgun Willies in Glendale, Colorado. It’s not irony, it’s sincere.

    The woman who put it up is not apologetic.

    “I didn’t put that up because of marketing,” Dunafon said in an interview. “I put it up because I’ve been watching what’s going on in our country as far as men are concerned and it’s infuriating.

    “I have a son, I have four grandsons, and I feel sorry for my grandsons because they’re all teenagers and I’m afraid for them. I’m wondering if they’re gonna have to make girls sign a contract before they can even go on a date.”

  63. As I have said there is a hole in the manosphere as a lot of commmentators haven’t been Round the total loop.

    Mrs. Gamer is postmenopausal and she still wants sex. I have data points. Do you have a postmenopausal wife?

    So marriage is not for the long haul? 30+ years and counting…

  64. I know there’s a lot of media mention about the “opioid crisis,” but do you hear much reported about male suicides? It seems to me the media is more fixated on teen suicides — maybe because this might be more of a girl-related thing.

  65. My wife only has a handful of eggs left.

    She’s peri-menopausal.

    Which means she is surprised when a new period comes.

    Which did two weeks ago.

    It was awful. But tolerable. But that depends on who you ask.

    It was long, nearly a week.

    A week later she texted me from the bedroom as I was dealing with the subcomms the prior week: ” Drunk or coming to bed?” So I went up and she fucked me.

    Later she figured she was ovulating then and explained to me that when a woman is ovulating that that is the time she most wants to fuck.

    I exclaimed: “Really?”

    A couple months ago I was with my red pill guy buddy and an old fuckbuddy of his. She’s really a firebrand. But annoying and not a good fit for an INTJ. Totally needy. She talks of hundreds of Plenty of Fish prospects with no fits for her. Lots of dates, no hooks in sight. She certainly looks very fuckable.

    She explained that post-menopausally she had to warm up to the idea of sex. In other words, if the guy was good they will get up for it. She told a story of a guy that really warmed her up and she took off with him a while ago. He was “patient” with her lack of desire. Until she warmed up. And then she really liked it. Then she gets rolling if she is in to it and he is good. If not, no interest. She hasn’t found something that has turned her on since. But holds out hope.

    Additionally, I have related that a post-menopausal drug rep that has called on me for 20 plus years has related that her girlfriends told her, if the guy is Alpha: the sex doesn’t wane in a post menopausal world. So move towards Alpha. And be Good. In Bed.

  66. Self surgery and dealing with…
    Staying in the present… This post hits close to home for me… The thing’s that brought me into the this community have been extreme moment’s of human experience without collaboration. Everything in life is a process or a spiral. Today i was thinking about the amount of time i have devoted in saving anything that was meant for its own transformation. In a lot of way’s that is what the process and purpose of this community is for me. It’s a way to re build yourself for yourself while enjoying your ability to be a human. The amazing thing’s that make me happy are not hard to come by. Mostly the ability to express anything about myself without being attacked with violence or sexual manipulation.
    I am building this into reality. Challenge everything i ever viewed heard and experienced and remixing the pain and isolation into a chorus of laughter and gratitude.

    About to rest and meant to continue this with more history and change… I hope everything from everyone is heard and exchanged into something beautiful.

    If your not doing the family alpha’s December challenge i highly recommend it.

  67. So, Rugby

    This space is a collaboration.

    “Everything is a process or a spiral”

    Which is your reference experience and vague.

    You’ve been here long enough to know what the order of business is.

    What are are you’re sticking points and what can we help you to move on with the business of being a masculine male?

    It seems that via your sport you have vicarious strength, courage, mastery and honor among men in the sport of Rugby.

    What the hell are you doing in the realm of sport-fucking women?

    Sorry to be so crude in the asking. But if I were your your uncle, I would do so much.

    Leave your past behind. Pursue a new path forward. Don’t have any such thing as a Madonna/Whore mentality. That thin is a made up thing by the FI so you don’t get laid.

    Get laid.

    Stop living in the past. You’ve been in the manosphere long enough to let bygones be bygones. Your past is not prologue. It doesn’t matter. Don’t be stuck. Move on without apologies.

    Your family is only a figment (a thing that someone believes to be real but that exists only in their imagination).

    You guys, including Westray with the Madonna/Whore complexes. Please stop with that.

    Every time a negative thought comes down in your mind. Stop it. Just stop it. And think what would Blaximus do at the check out line? And just go with the flow of that.

    Stop being retarded in the flow of Red Pill and Game thought.

    Just act on that. Don’t prethink. Move. Act. Do. Outward intention and Outward Action.

    Choose among the fucking things that present themselves to you in life. Don’t fucking wait till you sit around and think yourself into a conundrum of non doing.

    Choose. And act.

  68. “I stayed up all night reading the side bar – Rollo’s essays having the deepest effect on me – and everything…just…clicked”

    Rollo you are saving lives!

  69. Can’t help but notice that the OMGs often sound as unicorny as the NAWALT crowd.

    Yes, perhaps not ALL marriages are like that, yet, for all intents and purposes it seems NAMALT is quite similar to the cri de couer of NAWALT.

    The bottom line seems to be one of Frame and all the other things here. One must enter knowing what is absolutely vital to prevent the natural betaization that so often comes with cohabitating, marriage, and children.

    One must vet BOTH/ALL ways, you/her and the surrounding family/community systems.

    And be vigilant.

  70. @Kieth

    The canary in the coal mine is there to test the atmosphere, when it dies GTFO now. I was thinking this canary looks to healthy for todays climate, bad air.

  71. I remember being a typical teenager where you go through the rewiring phase and the world makes no sense, and you hate your parents, and you feel trapped in a house with siblings and no privacy, and you don’t know what you want to do with your life, and your pimple-faced-self is down in the dumps. I remember being amazed at how while I felt I was a fighter with the “fight or die” mentality, I simultaneously had suicidal thoughts. I heard a random comment that helped me through it though – “You can’t fall off the floor.”

    Feel like you’re at the bottom and can’t get any worse? Good, cause you can’t fall any further, but yet there you are still breathing.

    Also, if you happen to see people die a violent death right in front of you, you feel a bit more thankful to be alive.

  72. @SJF

    The natural alpha experience is far different, he is less likely to project as he has always been the screen for others projecting. The runners high can become a great escape, the sense of peace is overwhelming and much welcomed. He will always be judged by his potential and manipulated by the games other weaker people have adopted to their own ends and agendas. It is one thing to have them build you up to your full potential, quite another to be constantly boxed into a safe, controllable space because weaker men and women feel threatened.

    The constant battle of the natural is to free his mind from the constant outside pressures from every direction in today’s society. A good solid understanding of ” red pill” intersexual dynamics, the social dynamics of game and an understanding of his own proccess is essential.

    The projecting that the natural alpha does, thinking others are as fearless and strong is detrimental to his well being in that he is unaware of the threat of the scared and weaker men and women present to his very lively hood.

    When he fully realizes his position for what it is, and learns compassion for the scared little ones then he can realize his full potential.

  73. @boulderhead

    Yes, we are each of us biased by our own experience. The naturals often struggle as coaches. Here they have all this mastery, yet work mightily to convey it. Or don’t bother and let others try to figure out how they did it.

  74. Excellent advice being given here.

    In the past I would have linked adulthood with sex, but now I think it has to do with realizing how utterly meaningless life is. Once that sinks in, Blax’ advice about adopting a radically self-centered MPO is no doubt the best bet.

    Consumerism gets a bad rap but if you can abstain from maxing out your cards it is as good a motivation as anything else.

    I was ultra greedy as a kid and very happy, now there is almost nothing I really would like to buy and far more miserable, so that’s that. I kinda envy those folks exited at the prospect of a new car or a new house…

  75. *excited


    I never went through that ‘teenage phase’ of rebellion and self-doubt, and I wonder if I should have. I have always had a great relationship with my parents and it is only now when approaching 30 that being at home feels a bit trapping (and it is mostly due to the difficulty in getting laid while living like that, otherwise I would be pretty happy). I am a single kid and that probably matters in this.

  76. @ boulderhead I don’t think a man is a coal mine. It’s like they using a bird to depict life inside a man. Like it’s delicate or vulnerable. The resaon you put a bird in a cage is to keep it safe. I don’t know maybe Rollo try to say take care of your core self with this art. That maybe your mental health is just as important as physical health. It’s great timing on this the holiday season is hard on divorced fathers and lack of daylight and lethargy of cold winter can be depressing as hell. Movement is life. idleness and stagnation feed on themselves

  77. @Markos

    Take for instance a HS football coach, seeing a natural alpha, the alpha becomes his mark. The coach will approach, open, create comfort and close the deal. Coach has his agenda, building a winning team. The alpha is being played, he may enjoy the attention but he will have to give up his MPO for the team. This becomes a full time job.

    Now alphas make great coaches, it takes years to grow through the experience of being coached into the position of coaching. A total paradigm shift.

    The naturals friends growing up also recognize his potential, the coaching dynamics are similar.

  78. @ Oscar

    “Consumerism gets a bad rap but if you can abstain from maxing out your cards it is as good a motivation as anything else.”

    There are much better options. Stuff, sex, knowledge are just that. They might be buffers for powerlessness elsewhere. It’s not you.

    Blax said it clearly above. Watch your internal dialogue.

  79. @Keith

    It is Rollos artwork. The world is a stage and everyone is a critic, art is open to interpretation.

    My interpretation is, using the canary in the coalmine analogy, the mans heart is the canary when it dies, if he doesn’t get moving into better space he will soon die.

    Seeing the dead canary and staying at work in the coal mine is a form of suicide.

  80. I am a single kid

    I’m sorry for you. You missed out on a lot of life experiences with siblings which help with learning social lessons. You have a lot of work to do.

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