The Nature of Power

From Truth to Power:

Real Power is the degree to which a person has control over their own circumstances. Real Power is the degree to which we control the directions of our lives.

Are women attracted to Power? Yes. Why? Because a man who has it is in control of his own circumstances (to the best of his ability). People need to be reminded of this because we tend to think of power as some tyrannical dominance over others. Sometimes power is exercised as such, but that’s not what defines real power.

There exist a set of Beta men who hold this idea because it fits into their self-loathing binary understanding of intersexual dynamics. On my Incels post comment thread there’s a conversation with a 25year old guy who considers himself an Incel and his self-awareness is one that he’s hopeless to be anything else. He believes he has no power and therefore nothing a woman would ever want from a man. As he persists in this belief he’s not wrong.

I’m proud of my commentariat for giving this guy some kind of hope and inspiration, but according to the Black Pilled set all they’re doing is setting him up for failure and disappointment. Because if he attempts to empower himself he’d just be making himself a more efficient pussy-beggar and or/setting himself up for more failure. The game is rigged so stop playing it, right? And even if he had the kind of access to women he wished for ‘the juice isn’t worth the squeeze’ is the circular logic, and he’d only be a failure from within a success – or something like that.

The old saying goes, ‘Everything is about sex, except sex; sex is about power’. But what is ‘power‘? The degree to which a person has control over circumstances that would otherwise govern their lives. But power is always measured by how it fits into a particular context, so in this instance that power is a control over sexual experience, gratification and ultimately reproduction. And really, this is the basis of how Hypergamy has become the socialized, prime-directive that is gynocentrism. What is the latent purpose of a feminine-primary social order? Empowering women to unilaterally control their reproductive circumstances and then as much of their own lives as follows that imperative.

Power is one aspect of attraction (sometimes arousal) for women. I would also say, by this definition, that power is an aspect of a man being Alpha, but it isn’t the only aspect. I can point to a lot of men who have no real power, influence, affluence or even social proof who nonetheless pull women and have women pull him because they have a look that fit a woman’s sexual ideal and/or had an Alpha mindset. I have been that guy.

Power is not a prerequisite for being Alpha, but the appearance of, the potential for, power certainly is. Remember, women are hardwired to seek out competency in men as part of their innate need for security in all its forms. This is why I make the distinction between power being ‘attractive’ to a woman (in the long term Beta Need side of Hypergamy) and not always an element in arousal – though when paired with an arousing man power is intoxicating for women sexually.

The appearance of, or potential for, real power in a man represents competency in his capacity to control the circumstances that would dictate the terms of his life. If a woman is to ultimately pair monogamously with a man, his access to power will ultimately dictate the terms of her life while paired with that man. So it follows that power would be a selected-for aspected of female attraction.

This is probably pretty remedial. “Duh, chicks dig power Rollo.”

Power is a part of that Alpha ideal, but the question to ask is why is power attractive to a woman? This is where militant MGTOWs and Black Pill nihilists show their colors. Most will say it’s because they want control or some parasitic association with a powerful man to further their own ends. In essence it’s about a need to control their circumstances by using a male proxy to exercise their own self-serving plans. It’s all very melodramatic until you pick apart the latent purposes of female power.

From an evolutionary perspective, what these guys think is “power” is really just social dominance, preselection and a good physique. That’s why they’re obsessed with the “Chad” archetype that bullied them in high school. That guy seems “powerful” and made a lasting impression on them because he effortlessly got women and reminds them of what they’re not. Whether or not the guy is genuinely ‘powerful’ in the sense that he’s in control of his own destiny is irrelevant – he has the appearance of what these guys think power should look like and he’s rewarded with pussy for it.

So, what to do? Do the same shit feminists do; change the game and try to convince everyone that they are the real deal and the world that they figured out (really constructed) on their own is the ‘real’ game everyone ought to be playing. Unless you’re Thundercock the Barbarian, which you never are, all you’re doing is trying to be like him, which amounts to you accruing ‘power’, (however they define it) no matter how self-interested you think you are, with the sole purpose of giving it away to a woman – which she will use to more completely own you, because, that’s “just how women are.”

Feminists do the same thing from their own base of interest. They cannot compete for Darwinistic reproductive success with women whose SMV outclasses their own.

Solution: Change the game to suit their lesser capacity to compete; embrace fat-positivity, shame men for their innate sexual choices and expressions, disqualify hot women by disempowering and stigmatizing their strengths. Ban Grid Girls, cheerleaders on TV and remove the swimsuits from Miss America.

All of these are adaptive strategies for increasing reproductive success. The problem is nature confounds these efforts over and over again. The idea is to change the rules of the game; to literally control the reality and context in which it’s played in order to make the ones changing it the superior players. Rather than find the cheat codes to play the existing game in ‘God Mode’ the idea is to just rewrite the game to suit their skills.

Ostensibly, the cover story of feminism has always been about some effort to achieve an idealized state of equality between men and women. This has never been the actual case, but even if we were to presume that this equality was tenable it still requires the players to ignore their strengths and weaknesses in playing the existing game and pretend that a new game, based on contrived rules, is now the true game. The problem is they can never get everyone to participate in the new game. The fact remains that we evolved to compete in a naturalistic game and most people instinctively get this reality even when they espouse a belief in the new game.

Beautiful women will aspire to a feminist-contrived norm, but on a root level of consciousness they understand that their beauty and sexuality puts them above their less beautiful sisters. This again is a form of power. It provides them a control advantage over their life circumstances and their hindbrains wont allow any pretense of a level playing field stop them from exercising it.

End Games

The same principle applies to the ends of MGTOW. I’m not even sure what the consensus is as to what an idealized outcome between the genders might be for a MGTOW mindset. Every time I’ve tried to parse out what happens when enough men go MGTOW that society shifts I’m usually met with some equalist future where women ‘come to their senses’ and take responsibility for their own actions. That and crypto currencies seem to be what the future MGTOW utopia looks like.

I’m not being flippant here. I’m genuinely curious as to what the end state of a MGTOW society ought to look like. Feminists seem to think that egalitarian equalism and gender neutrality, and a world where men and women are coequal agents is a future that’s possible. I’ve read the comparisons of feminism with Marxism and it’s not too far off with regard to their stated future hopes. I don’t buy any of it of course. It’s been proven over and over that feminism is a supremacism movement, but I’m interested in what the hopes are for the the cover story of feminism.

I wonder the same about MGTOW. Both MGTOW and feminism are ultimately interested in power – in the respect that power is the control over the individual circumstances that govern our lives. MGTOW make it very clear that dealing with women is an unacceptable risk (by order of degrees) and that until such time as the risks diminish to an acceptable tolerance they’ll simply ‘go their own way’ and avoid potentially dangerous entanglements with women. Sounds perfectly logical in a male deductive logic way, but what does the intended goal-state look like for MGTOW?

I’ve yet to get a clear consensus on this. Most of it seems to be awaiting an expected societal collapse whereafter women ‘come to their senses’ and somehow realize they really need men and voluntarily relinquish the power they hold today in favor of treating men more fairly. I’m doubtful of how realistic this is, but perhaps I’m mistaken in this being the perceived end game. Women of course would see this as being an abdication of their own interests – a surrender of feminism so to speak, but what does an acceptable ‘truce’ between men and women look like to feminists as well as MGTOWs?

I ask these questions because it seems to me that both movements depend on an adversarial state existing between the sexes. What would the inter-gender landscape need to look like for MGTOWs to deal with women or compete with other men? What would that landscape need to look like for feminism to dissolve and relinquish the abusive power it’s established over the lives of men?

Published by Rollo Tomassi

Author of The Rational Male and The Rational Male, Preventive Medicine

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theasdgamer
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Blax, don’t blame him…he was dropped on his head as a baby.

theasdgamer
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Imo, one of the fastest ways to accrue ” power ” is to not do what everybody else is doing . Or at a minimum, do it differently.

When I dance, I dance to the beat of the music, which is different than all the other guys. When I go out and don’t dance, I circulate and chat up various people and mess with strangers and make them feel important. Which is different than all the other guys.

frank632
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https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=-Z49ixqSFAE&t=946s

Maybe you should watch some of FaceandLMS videos. MGTOW, for many men is a cope. It should be MSTOW, mrn sent their own way. Let’s face it, many of those men are physically unappealing and aren’t neurotypical to boot. And game helps most if you are a decently looking and built guy who may need improvement in the area of social skills and/or confidence.

But no amount of game will have a 5’3 balding, potbellied, 44 year old Indian slaying barely legal college cuties. He can only make up for that with lots of money.

theasdgamer
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But no amount of game will have a 5’3 balding, potbellied, 44 year old Indian slaying barely legal college cuties. Would you believe that a 65 y.o. obese Jewish troll was banging models? Henry Kissinger. Sure, he was rich, but more than that, he had awesome social skills as well as power. And Game to boot. Without Game and social skills, no amount of money will help. A mid-20s hottie I didn’t know was bumping her butt against mine last Fri. night. I tried to get her to stop using swats (without turning to look at her), but that failed,… Read more »

theasdgamer
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Oh, I have shit for money, lol. Social Security and an IRA. But I don’t resemble a whale in any shape, manner, or form.

NB

A whale is a rich guy who spends a lot of money.

guest
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I’ll start by saying I’ve been reading you for years and you’ve made a difference in my life. Thank you. The end game is death just as it always has been. MGTOW walkouts, used up post Wall feminist hags, bitter aging high notch count redpilled guys like Roosh and Delicious Tacos and myself, the young men you’re telling not to get married, we’ll all end up the same. We’re going to die without reproducing and be replaced by those who do. Whoever they may be. In the meantime I don’t blame the losers for dropping out. I’ve had everything going… Read more »

Face
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Face
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Farmers market? That’s like taking a class in pottery at the junior college with post wall middle age white women. Thats some low level game. Might as well stay home and tazer your junk and post the vid to youtube for shits and giggle.

SjR
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Hahaha! “Farmer’s Market day game” huh? An untested venue for me… Hell, I even grow my own produce.. 😁 I’ll have to check this out! I just flirted with and for months now have been banging the hottie who cut my hair. I know that each man has his own strengths and battles to win, but this game shit isn’t as impossible as many make it out to be. I was truly concerned when I got divorced 2 years ago.. Do I still have game (I was never a ‘Chad’ even in my prime), where am I going to meet… Read more »

Sophos
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My prediction is that as more and more men go MGTOW, the amount of men going MGTOW from an earlier age will increase in proportion. This will mean more men that are not financially raped by the divorce courts and more men that will not have to spend money on raising kids. With the extra money and time that the MGTOW lifestyle will free up, a proportion of women will adapt by “selling their time and sex” to men in an openly stated manner. We are already seeing it with Sugar Daddy type websites. I expect that these sort of… Read more »

Yollo Comanche
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rugby11
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palmasailor
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palmasailor
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The following is in no particular order. In my opinion TRP is a subset of MGTOW, not the other way round. By definition if you’re not buying into the societal narrative then you’re going your own way so you’re MGTOW. So we’re all MGTOW – But we define what that means for us, not anyone else. The only thing we have in common is that we refuse to comply with the societal expectations that don’t suit us. Non compliance of the plow horse on the sort of scale we are reaching is dangerous so they want to shut it down.… Read more »

EhIntellect
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The farmer’s market is urban. There’s music venues and lots of food, alcohol, beer tents.

The time of day draws the after office crowd and the suburban girls from well, 14 to 50. The women dress to impress. The nearby bars offer drinking deals and certain bars along the venu cater to certain crowds. One in particular caters to 40+ singles. The street is where the younger set game.

Assume what you will, Fact.

“Tazer your junk…”

Your inexperience is showing. Everyone here knows you haven’t done anything worthwhile but please do go on commenting. Not trolling you…just an observation.

O.B.I.T.
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@Face
Well you’re right, there’s a lot of 50-something granola chicks, but at least they’re usually slender — on that diet of wheatgrass and kale, you know. And I don’t mind when women with nice hair let it go all silver. Just don’t get into politics with ’em!

If you know how to cook and you look like you know what you’re doing with odd ingredients — at a veggie stand or especially at a fish market — reasonably shit-together middle-age women will chat you up. At my age there is no such thing as a bad IOI

rugby11
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A5Al7cELoLg “But in the years after my book came out, I had to watch a rival theory gain ground-namely, that sex flushes damaging mutations from the genome by remixing genes to expose bad ones. For much of the last two decades, the two theories have battled it out in the pages of journals, mainly in the form of rival mathematical models, on the whole demonstrating little but that models can support anything if you put the right assumptions in. Now, however, I am confident that the Red Queen holds the battlefield. She has vanquished her rivals largely because of a… Read more »

kfg
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“Farmers market? That’s like taking a class in pottery at the junior college with post wall middle age white women.”

Maybe you’re shopping on the wrong side of the counter.

Sentient
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Farmer’s markets, art fairs, street fairs of any stripe… All bomb game opportunities. Better than clubs imo because the girls have their guard down and a good open carries more impact with less distraction.

Remember they are not reeeeaaaaalllly going out to by hydroponic lettuce .;)

frank632
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@theasdgamer You said: Would you believe that a 65 y.o. obese Jewish troll was banging models? Henry Kissinger. Sure, he was rich, but more than that, he had awesome social skills as well as power. And Game to boot. Without Game and social skills, no amount of money will help. Me: His game and social skills were icing on top of the already, very tasty money cake. How many average 65 year old retirees do you see banging models over 40 years younger than them? No doubt that some 65 year old men could at one time, but that time… Read more »

foxguy148
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Farmer’s Markets around here are pretty good, each time I go it’s a sea of leggings and tight clothing from mostly healthy looking women, pretty good place to pick up I would say. As for the original post, we currently have open hypergamy I would say, it’s interesting the effect on the younger guys in the office, I got two guys on my team who openly worship this married Indian 4(if that), had an older game aware friend who also was going down this road with this broad. There is a third young guy who is trying to game her… Read more »

theasdgamer
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Remember they are not reeeeaaaaalllly going out to by hydroponic lettuce .;) Girls are sexually opportunistic…it’s their default program…doesn’t mean their libido is on, tho. If they get a whiff of alpha, their libido will kick in, possibly without them even being aware of it. So girls herd together to buy hydroponic lettuce and get groomed (comforted/validated) by other girls–that’s what they’re thinking–they don’t even think about their sexually opportunistic strategy…they don’t need to think about it…it’s always on for them…alpha tingles => girl’s libido kicks in => sex just happens…girls don’t need to consciously “get it”… ASD happens if… Read more »

DisgruntledEarthling
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Wow, the comments on this article are outstanding. Particularly the newer commenters who may or may not have been lurking for years. The MGTOW angle has hit a particularly sensitive point among us who have been either burnt in the past by divorce or who have decided for various reasons not to engage. @palmasailor July 19, 2018 at 4:16 am was a good attempt at describing the issue (brains melting and regrown). The regrowth could be towards a MGTOW direction or a RP/Game/Improvement direction. As we are all unique and our brain biochemistry differ in so many ways, I feel… Read more »

walawala
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Interesting experiment that demonstrates frame and “power”. After basically getting told I was being pushed out of my job I immediately got advice and started my own company. My first outreach to a few friends was “They screwed me over”…which I realized made me appear weak and out of conrol. I immediately changed that to “I’m starting my own thing…reaching out to line up some projects and seeing if you’d be interested”. Wow…the difference was huge. By demonstrating “power” over my own destiny vs reacting to a bad situation I realized that the being fucked over part…was all in my… Read more »

Wiz
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Wiz
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Any Jordan Peterson Fans out here?

https://longreads.com/2018/07/12/petersons-complaint

DisgruntledEarthling
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@walawala
You are an inspiration. Your progress and will-power has been amazing.

palmasailor
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palmasailor
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@DisgruntledEarthling

How do you control the costs on the SB thing.

I’m in the same age group as you.

theasdgamer
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I have to admit, I don’t believe you. No problem. The honesty is refreshing. Because the more something departs from what I reasonably know to be true about the real world …thanks for playing…seriously…great opportunity for analysis… …what you know?…or what you have seen (sort of)?… …when I have fun and am enjoying myself, I naturally work a room…getting in girls’ grills for a couple of secs, singing to them, moving on…rinse and repeat… …I chat up various people (both men and women) and make them laugh…they give me nonverbal validation which is easily seen if you are watching… …girls… Read more »

Vektor
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There is no MGTOW utopia. MGTOW is concerned with the self and immediate family/friends, not civilization.

It is focused inward. Feminism is focused outward – controlling everyone else’s behavior. Like an invasive weed. Eventually totalitarian.

theasdgamer
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Sugar babies…why not just call them whores?

SMH

DisgruntledEarthling
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@palmasailor Don’t want to turn this into an SB/SD discussion board out of respect for TRM, but here’s a short summary. Contrary to most SD who seem to want to give it away, I’m a cheap bastard. My goal is proximity which is what the initial costs get me. I’ve never been rejected with a ‘you’re too old’ from SBs, which goes to prove to me that age is rarely an issue out in the wild. Her rep is the issue. Also, I look more like 42 rather than 59. So I’ll pay 200$ per meet. With my long term… Read more »

O.B.I.T.
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@walawala
Great example. At some point I’m assuming you not only reframed what you were telling other people but also what you were telling yourself. 90 percent of the game is 50 percent mental, as Yogi would say. So I’m struck by commenters like MarcoP who seem to have some positives to build on but still sound so down.

I am generally pretty passive but when my business took a big hit due to 9/11 I sat down and found something fun I could add to the mix. It took months and months to establish but paid off for years.

Not Born This Morning
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Not Born This Morning
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I still think the most significant influence is birth control and abortion. Both absolve women (and men) of the responsibilities and challenges of reproduction so they can enjoy the feel good without those responsibilities and challenges The power these reproductive interrupters provide is squarely placed in the female hand. Like I have written before, it is similar to insect control. Any chemical or hormone or homocidal practice that is designed to interrupt the reproductive life cycle of a species will also drastically change the social dynamic of that species.

DisgruntledEarthling
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Sugar babies…why not just call them whores
They are whores. But there’s different degrees of whoring. If you can understand that then there’s no point of further discussion and you can just scroll past my post, as I do most of your dancing monkey nonsense.

Fact
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If you work in restaurant business or foodie and you hit the farmers market because that’s what you already like to do, then do that for your own reasons. But otherwise sounds like beta game advice. You don’t want to be the one who is asking her if she wants to go antiquing on the weekend while she’s shopping for cock online in era of open hypergamy.

foxguy148
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Sugar baby dynamic is interesting, but at the end of the day it’s still whoring :). The mental gymnastics are mainly for the SB, so she can think of herself as not a whore, I would say it’s still a sub optimal setup for the man, as you are still handing out material resources directly. You want to get to the point where you hand out as little resources as possibles and that’s your default setting, a goal to strive towards is to have the woman bring you prizes, I’ve done it before when younger, didn’t give a shit either… Read more »

Not Born This Morning
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I’m lonely but not for that shit. Damned if you do damned if you don’t. Can’t live with them, can’t live without them. Those are all reactions to conditions formed by others. Form your own conditions. Recognize opportunities and capitalize on them. Women are not to be “respected”, worshiped or acquiesced to. They are to be used! Be the user not the used. No one can be the master of another unless they are first the master of themself. Use their expectations and yearnings to your advantage. Think. Every bribe works both ways. Every blackmail works both ways. All such… Read more »

palmasailor
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palmasailor
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@Disgruntled

Looks like a bargain to me. I have a number of plates but because I’m not exclusive I’m constantly gaming new women and it’s probably costing more than that.

Downside is I’m not sure you’d get desire sex in the same way I do with the plates but I’m losing interest in the game to be honest.

Straightforward transaction has its advantages.

kfg
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“Only the most top tier of men that age can bang women in their 20s. For the most part. I’m sure exceptions exist.” If only someone would observe these exceptional men, make note of what it is that makes them exceptional and relay that information to other men so that they had the opportunity to emulate them. What a world that would be. ” . . . a 44 year old, 5’3 potbellied and balding Indian . . .” Could get leaner, shave his head and put a ruby in his ear. Then learn game, because the former are only… Read more »

Sentient
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“I still think the most significant influence is ”

Voting rights…

“This is the pivotal moment when you realize that abundance is a mentality, frame is your decision and power flows from that.”

Dilly Dilly!!!

Frank – hypergamy doesn’t care what you believe…

“If you work in restaurant business or foodie and you hit the farmers market because that’s what you already like to do, then do that for your own reasons.”

Your own reason could be you like being around high concentrations of fuckable women, dipshit.

Sentient
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Kfg

“If only someone would observe these exceptional men, make note of what it is that makes them exceptional and relay that information to other men so that they had the opportunity to emulate them.”

Preach!!!

mersonia
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mersonia
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All this talk about nothing 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥

theasdgamer
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Women are not to be “respected”, worshiped or acquiesced to.

+1

They are to be used! Be the user not the used.

Kind of harsh, don’t you think? If a girl passes your vetting, why not treat her like a vassal? Vassals who behave decently are treated decently.

theasdgamer
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mersonia, have you reproduced yet? Otherwise, you’re just milking the bull.

theasdgamer
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Ok, let’s have a poll. Who thinks I’m making shit up/exaggerating about my experiences going out and who thinks I’m on the level? This isn’t just for me…Rollo ought to get a post out of this. And if you could explain why you take the position you do, that would be an added bonus.

O.B.I.T.
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Hundreds of women milling around aimlessly out in the sunshine is a good thing. But try to vet for dog lovers, not cat ladies.

4-H fair coming up next weekend. Be there — aloha!

O.B.I.T.
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@asd
A little exaggeration can be a feature, not a bug. Coincidentally enough here’s a brand-new paper in The Journal of Social and Personal Relationships:

“This research explores the possibility that exaggerating in order to entertain the listener while sharing previous experiences can increase interpersonal closeness in new relationships. It is hypothesized that adding exaggerations will increase the quality of the story, which will lead to increased interpersonal closeness, and that even listeners who are provided with the actual facts will show this effect.”

rugby11
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Culum Struan
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@frank632 – this subject has beat absolutely to death by the regulars on this blog, so we’re all pretty tired of discussing it because there’s not much new to say (if you’re really interested check out the blog comments in summer/fall 2016 – especially the posts with 1000+ comments)… Sentient and kfg are trying to put you on the right track. In short: looks DO matter, but they don’t matter *as much* as you think, and their *function* isn’t what you think (this is what kfg is trying to say when he says they are “attractors”, not “catchers”). Other things… Read more »

marelius
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@ASD – I can’t resist the invitation. I do think you are exaggerating/embellishing your circumstances, although probably not outright lying. I also think you imagine thoughts are occurring in the mind of your “object girl” that almost assuredly are NOT occurring. You are doing all of this because you have no inherent ability to calibrate your observations of behavior in social settings. You are well aware of that, and have been for many, many years, thus your “handle”. You have learned that you can substitute feedback from other guys as a proxy for the social skills you lack, so you… Read more »

Culum Struan
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@theasdgamer – you asked, so: No, I don’t think you’re making stuff up. You’re obviously a fun, social guy who goes out and interacts with people a lot and I have no doubt you’re describing your interactions truthfully to the best of your recollection. I think people like dancing with you and hanging with you and you probably have good energy and vibes and you probably get some genuine attraction and IOIs. The problem is you don’t understand Game anywhere near as well as you think you do, and you use a lot of Game jargon without understanding what it… Read more »

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“Any Jordan Peterson Fans out here? No. https://longreads.com/2018/07/12/petersons-complaint Laurie Penny, self described: ‘Nasty, British and short.’ Writer, journalist, social justice bard. Latest book: ‘Bitch Doctrine’ That article makes my (eye)balls hurt. Wasted time….. “Prolific feminist writer Laurie Penny is mad as hell in her new collection, Bitch Doctrine . . . Expect essays on how the Trump administration is f—ing with us, how marginalized people are in danger in our current political climate, or how the inequality of women is never-ending. But what’s to relish most is Penny’s distinct voice and snarky takes that have made her previous works–including six… Read more »

Culum Struan
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LOL. Marelius got in before me, saying some pretty similar stuff.

kfg
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“Bitch Doctrine is a powerful and fiercely funny series of articles laying out a radical vision of a kinder world.”

So Penny is planning on taking herself out of it?

Anonymous Reader
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DisgruntledEarthling Which is why I choose the SB route. Nothing (to me at least) beats a 19-20yo tight body and youthful energy. If I had more proximity to that age group I wouldn’t go the SB route, but to me it’s a reasonable compromise if I control the costs as I do. Not gonna be good for you in the longer run. The dopamine hits that your brain gets from renting these girls is sorta like what really anxious or depressed people get from their meds. Longer term you would be better off tapering down on the SugarBabies. Because be… Read more »

Incubus_Rising
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@ASD: I don’t think you are lying or exaggerating about your experiences. But I am curious to know if you can GAME women outside of dance venue you frequent. I understand you are a regular and most people know you there. Talking about Indian guys, a few months ago I saw an Indian guy (true to the sterotype) at a club. He was alone, drunk and was dancing (making weird movements) in the middle of the club as if nobody was watching. Everybody had their eyes on him as he was just nuts blissfully unaware of where he was or… Read more »

Orson
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As others have noted there is no end goal for MGTOW’s. As MGTOW is the man who stops making pussy his mental point of origin after swallowing all the red pill knowledge about female nature. Women “coming to their senses” is a delusion when you have hordes of pathetic males nurturing their solipsism and facilitating their infantile romanticism. If it was possible for all men to swallow the red pill in one instant and change their needy ways towards women then yes. Women would then be forced to adapt to this new reality! Quite unlikely to see this happen. On… Read more »

kfg
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” . . . the history of humanity . . .”

. . . is babies, all the way up.

Anonymous Reader
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DisgruntledEarthling I could probably achieve the same results without the SB thing if I had proximity and wasn’t social retarded like I am. My fear of cold-approach is great and it’s something I’ve had since I was a child, be it cold-engaging people of either sex. That is a problem. There is a solution: approach more. Culum did 400 approaches, did you read his report? Yeah, your fear of cold approach is long standing, so the neural pathways are stronger / the “trenches” are deeper, but they still can be modified. Brain plasticity is real. I know it seems all… Read more »

SJF
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“So Penny is planning on taking herself out of it?”

Not hardly.

Because of…

“…the kind of magical thinking that some women, in the name of empowerment, have adopted as an antidote to self-doubt. Confidence is one thing. An absolute absence of rigor and self-inquiry is, of course, another.”

https://www.wired.com/story/elizabeth-holmes-downfall-has-been-explained-deeplyby-men/

mersonia
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mgtow = loser

Orson
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kfg ==> “In vitro fertilisation”

SJF
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Disgruntled Earthling

If you were my red pill buddy in real life, I’d say that it sounds pretty legit to me (and efficient, to boot).

I’ve seen it work in real life for someone that was very socially savvy, didn’t have the proximity/quantity of targets and was too busy MGTOWing. It worked great. And he wasn’t celibate with non SB’s either, plates were spun. And the cost was (relatively) ridiculously low for the services taken.

If I were you, I’d definitely take advantage of that. It’s called disposable income for a reason, despite it’s often vastly more inexpensive than relationship game.

DAVID
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Get money. Spin plates. Praise Rollo.

SJB
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Laurie Penny’s article = “So he’s saying . . .”

Pretty funny.

Anonymous Reader
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kfg “It’s babies all the way up”.

TFR says “nope”.

Culum Struan
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1. Everything Anonymous Reader said is spot on. 2. The issue *for me* with sugar babies wasn’t the money or the price. It’s that paying them feels like cheating (btw, it is possible – way, way harder, but possible – to have desire sex with a chick you’re paying) and it rarely results in true desire sex. If it works for you and the “cost per orgasm” metric that some of the guys on that Blackdragon link works for you then great. But I never wanted to feel like I was paying. And that is true no matter how good… Read more »

Steve Canyon
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It’s tough to categorize the whole MGTOW phenomenon as the motivations are far to broad to lend themselves to one standard category. For me, it was a transitory phase. To borrow a biblical reference, it was the equivalent of a 40 days in the desert Jesus spent affirming the foundation of his beliefs. My phase, well, it was an understanding that what I was doing wasn’t working, and not knowing exactly how to get to a point where things were working. Sometimes, you just need to strip away everything out of your life that’s causing problems so you can focus… Read more »

theasdgamer
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I don’t think you are lying or exaggerating about your experiences. But I am curious to know if you can GAME women outside of dance venue you frequent. I understand you are a regular and most people know you there. I wrote a FR from last Fri. night about this very thing. The experiences that I referenced in my reply to frank were from a non-dance venue. He was just a harmless drunk guy, and the girls were just “playing with him”. Even though I’m not drunk, girls may just “play with me”, too. The game is in the nonverbal… Read more »

marelius
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People keep referring to the YaReally Archives. Can someone give me a link? I can’t seem to find them in a single collection as people have mentioned.

Culum Struan
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@Marelius

I don’t want to link because the blog software seems to be a bit funny about links today. But if you literally google that phrase, it’s like the third hit (the first two are Reddit discussions about the Archive which have more google juice).

There are also a couple of huge PDF files floating around which contain most of the content from the Archive (but they are not fully up to date with all his posts through to the end of 2016 – it’s only the web archive that is fully up to date)

SJF
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Person A: “No Scotsman puts sugar on his porridge.” Person B: “But my uncle Angus is a Scotsman and he puts sugar on his porridge.” Person A: “Ah yes, but no true Scotsman puts sugar on his porridge.” No true Scotsman or appeal to purity is an informal fallacy in which one attempts to protect a universal generalization from counterexamples by changing the definition in an ad hoc fashion to exclude the counterexample. Rather than denying the counterexample or rejecting the original claim, this fallacy modifies the subject of the assertion to exclude the specific case or others like it… Read more »

theasdgamer
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Incubus, I see and dance with girls who have no interest in me beyond dancing (if even that). So, I’m not under the misapprehension that all girls like me. I don’t know too many girls who only want to chat. Usually, if they want to chat, they want a romance. How do I know? Because they are lit up. There are girls who were lit up at one time and won’t even say hello now (and I’ve done nothing overtly to offend them). They gave up because I didn’t show interest and move things along. Loading...

DisgruntledEarthling
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Downside is I’m not sure you’d get desire sex in the same way I do with the plates Two points: First – I’ve also bedded women from pof, okcupid, and bumble. Non of which were young and tight and non of which gave me anything close to desire sex as my current SB. Second – my goal is more a long term relationship rather than banging a different woman every week. I’ve been with the same SB for about 1.5 years down – she was 19 ans now she’s 21. She’ll study (biochem) until 2 AM, come to bed, wake… Read more »

Palmasailor
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@Steve Canyon

I reckon you’re about 45

Palmasailor
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@DisgrintledEarthling

Yes i reckon you can program their heads to get desire sex

I’ll give it a go!

DisgruntledEarthling
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Then your skill set is good enough. You are using SB’s as a buffer. Doesn’t help that I grew up with a large stuttering problem which has mostly disappeared, but the damage has been done. That doesn’t matter anymore. Your neuro-plastic brain has rewired. Whoever it was that had a stutter? He’s not around now. You are not him, and he is not you. Banish that ghost! Your neuro-plastic brain has rewired That process was started a good 20 years ago. I’ve given presentations at Apple HQ to the OS group about what my company was going at low-level loading… Read more »

DisgruntledEarthling
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Yes i reckon you can program their heads to get desire sex

At the risk of being creepy, 19yo girls are very, very malleable. They can be receptive to many thing since all is new to them (well, most of them. I stay away from the obvious total sluts). I’ve introduced my current to bondage, toys, semi-public sex. She eats it up. 40yo’s are like: these are my demands…

And they’re fresh and curious about the world although that varies with the girl.

Not Born This Morning
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“They are to be used! Be the user not the used. Kind of harsh, don’t you think? If a girl passes your vetting, why not treat her like a vassal? Vassals who behave decently are treated decently.” Word modification control = perception control = manipulation The question of harshness is up to individual actions and the individual perception of what the word “use” refers to. This provides an opportunity to explain word usage, specifically how word usage is modified to control frame. This example is best related starting with a question. Why does the word “use” or “used” immediately solicit… Read more »

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19yo girls are very, very malleable. They can be receptive to many thing since all is new to them . . . . I’ve introduced my current to bondage, toys, semi-public sex. She eats it up.

Heartily co-sign.

Not Born This Morning
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Are you in control of yourself if words someone else writes are conflated in your mind with meanings that the writer did not intend… and conflated with meanings Webster’s dictionary does not include. Who or what is in control of what you think? You see, the modification of word meanings, just by subtle indirect conflation is used by manipulators, frame thieves really, in order to subvert established language and communication to usurp power. Don’t fooled by this phenomena. It’s the oldest and most commonly employed strategy. You can be its’ victim or you can ignore it or you can apply… Read more »

DisgruntledEarthling
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Oh, just thought I’d mentioned I had a vasectomy yesterday. Cool procedure. Lightweight. On vacation until next week but I got bored today so went out to shoot pool for a couple of hours.
I know some consider getting sniped a relinquishment of manhood, but I’ve had too many false alarms recently. And I do like it raw.

SjR
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I took a look on the seeking arrangements site today.. It looks like an attractive RP man could clean up well there without having to spare any ‘sugar’ lol…
The SMV is on clear display too.. Anyone who thinks these girls don’t understand that at least on a hind-brain level are kidding themselves..

rugby11
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Went to a fundraiser to pull in this girl named kelly
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=t8rfMh6xbFc&feature=youtu.be
Made me think of much fun approaching is.

Playdontpay
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Regarding the sb/sd dynamic for me it’s desire sex or nothing, after experiencing genuine desire sex on a regular basis I don’t see how anything less would be acceptable. Seeing my girls genuine desire to fuck me is a turn on feed back loop for me, I doubt I could stay hard and “perform “ without it st my age ( 50) that’s part of why staying in good physical shape is so important to me. If I continue to look after myself I don’t see why I won’t still be able to fuck still attractive 40 somethings well into… Read more »

Sun Wukong
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The majority of MGTOW are undesirable men to begin with. Their self-sorting out of the pool is exactly what women–feminist or otherwise–want them to do. They will have absolutely zero impact on the social fabric ultimately. Now if feminists manage to continue to accrue power toward the end of making it illegal for Alphas to turn down women they’re not attracted to (which they ultimately will be forced to do to achieve their apparent goal state), you might see some serious shit. Put another way: the current “soft control” of men only legally and socially excludes undesirable men from the… Read more »

Palmasailor
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@Culum & Anonymous

I reckon I can get the sugar baby thing going without paying using the successful older man mentor thing but I’ve been distracted with my business recently plus I had a few weeks away sailing.

The boys here who are critical about paying for it need to get a couple of divorces under their belt and divide back the settlement to get a cost per lay.

That should wake them up.

Mine after my first marriage 22 years ago was about £800. Haven’t done the math on the second one as I don’t feel like confronting it.

palmasailor
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@Sun Wukong ‘The eventual “hard control” of directly forcing desirable men to engage with women they have no interest in will be… interesting’ Well you just wouldn’t get the boner. You’d need chemical intervention. It would just be rape. But of course that would be fine this way round. With all that said I do actually see it happening. But firstly via societal shaming which is already happening and only later by legislation. For some time the girl that did my hair quizzed me on my dating / sex life and was completely any utterly astonished if I ever said… Read more »

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@OBIT and disgruntled earthling

Thanks. This has been tough but I’m getting great advice from former colleagues many of who are ready to work with me…two weeks ago I was depressed. Now I’ve got a number of prospects demanding My schedule and availabilities.

I found out some unsavoury things about some of my colleagues that were not obvious.

A lot of this re enforces my reframe. Yes you have to believe it for it to be authentic to those you’re trying to influence.

Culum Struan
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NOTE: I am not critical of paying for sugar babies. I’m only saying it’s not right *for me* because I don’t enjoy it. The reason I don’t enjoy it isn’t because I’m paying (after all, I’m paying for drinks etc anyway, it’s only a question of degree to pay more), it’s because in my experience it makes it *much* harder to a) get desire sex b) accurately read the girl and understand her motivations and subcomms (ie, you’re always wondering if she’s doing something because she wants to or because she hopes to get cash out of you) Since I’m… Read more »

Incubus_Rising
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“The majority of MGTOW are undesirable men to begin with.”

True, in the absence of “Enforced Monogamy” (as defined by JBP) there will always be 80% of men that will be considered “undesirable”. Sure, there will be men who will move in and out of the 80/20 depending on the self improvement and effort they put in, but 80% will always be “undesirable”. That is how Hypergamy works.

Incubus_Rising
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@ASD:

Thanks for the reply. I have nothing further to add.

rugby11
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Sun wukong Great to read you again. I don’t think you can really control the 20%. They find a way to make life work for them. To Live and know that Desired Sex is something they have available to them. I’m noticing exceptions to everything as i go out and observe. In a more hopeful manor i think anyone in the 80 percent can more into the 20% with effort and Growth. But you have to have a serious red pill motivated reason to do so. Otherwise It falls apart in confronted with reality in the culture and climate we… Read more »

Blaximus
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80%.

Damn, that’s so harsh that I have to question the idea. 80% is the overwhelming bulk of men. The majority of American culture has a lot of oddly regimented and stubborn peculiarities, but does it really render 80% of men across the spectrum as the ” bottom ” wrt sexual dynamics?

marelius
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@NBTM

Word modification control = perception control = manipulation

This equation is what put JBP in the spotlight during his protests of the gender pronoun debacle of 2016 in Ontario. He refuses to comply with a law that is intentionally designed to assert word modification control with a specific end goal in mind. Even though he is clearly BP, he knows that the FI/Post Modernists are behind this and therefore JBP and TRP/TRM share a common enemy. The enemy of my enemy is my friend.

marelius
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@Blax I too question the viability of the assumption that 80% of men are excluded from the SMP. I think that a lot of statistics get mixed up and that number is the result. For example, the study that concluded through genetic research that “…4,000 to 8,000 years after humanity invented agriculture,…for every 17 women who were reproducing…only one man did the same… In more recent history, as a global average, about four or five women reproduced for every one man.” So the more recent stats for reproduction are 4:1 or 5:1 female to male ratios, or 20-25% of the… Read more »

SJF
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“80%. Damn, that’s so harsh that I have to question the idea. 80% is the overwhelming bulk of men. The majority of American culture has a lot of oddly regimented and stubborn peculiarities, but does it really render 80% of men across the spectrum as the ” bottom ” wrt sexual dynamics?” There is obviously a Bell Curve Distribution there. Change it to: the bottom 80% are less desirable than the top 20%. The bottom 20% of the 100% are certainly going to have less SMV merit than the rest. The guy at 79% is not as fucked as the… Read more »

Blaximus
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Marelius Yup. That’s why I emphasized culture as a possible cohort/culprit. I read certain widely accepted memes, but they don’t line up with what I observe no matter where I go. I currently know or deal with about 50+/- men on a consistent basis over many years, and out of that number there are only 1 or 2 outliers that seem incapable of relating to women sexually. I’m trying to figure out why it is in the sphere the odds appear to be so heavily skewed against the man, and ” the culture ” aspect ( at least in the… Read more »

Blaximus
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Sjf

Think about all of the men you know who have ” mates ” ( that aren’t whales of hb5’s ):over decades.

What is it that would render a bulk of men ” less attractive “?

*sniff* I smell piping hot buffers.

Incubus_Rising
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A lot of men get to breed and have sex, but it does not mean that women find them desirable, or that such men as receiving “desire sex” from their women.

We are not talking about which men get to breed, we are talking about which men women find desirable, or rather “undesirable”.

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