Incels

Back in the summer of 2014 I wrote two essays outlining the minds of Incels. The first was The Severing and the second was Owed Sex. I wrote these essays in the wake of the Eliot Rodger shooting and the sudden emergence of the term ‘red pill’ into the popular lexicon. Eliot had a lot of manifesto style youtube videos as well as a fairly detailed written manifesto he published online just prior to his shooting. His frustration was palpable in these videos. Here was a kid who fit the profile of an AFC, an average frustrated chump. AFC is an old school PUA term used to describe average guys who were confused by intersexual dynamics, usually as a result of their life long Blue Pill conditioning. I used to unironically use AFC to describe a guy who I’d probably refer to as a Blue Pill Beta in my work today, but in light of the most recent “Incel attack” in Toronto last month I’m wondering if AFC isn’t a better descriptor for these guys.

I’m doing a bit of review here because I want to put the perspective on time in these incidents. Alek Minnasian, the Toronto truck driving killer, another AFC, reportedly idolized Eliot Rodger. In and of itself this is probably to be expected from a self-avowed Incel, but what motivates these guys. That’s what the mainstream media wants to know, right? And literally hundreds of bloggers and social pundits seem to all have an expert knowledge about the motives of Incels. Weeks after the Toronto killings there are people I’ve never read before who are convinced that they know all about these “losers”. For the most part, the mainstream media (and I include online pundits in this category now) want ‘crazy’. Even the guys who are ostensibly part of the manosphere know that crazy gets eyeballs on the screen, and nothing is crazier than a ‘killer Incell’.

Incels are the low hanging fruit for pretty much anyone on either side of the ideological spectrum. I can read any number of feminists wanting to link Incels to ‘red pill radicalization’ and how they are ‘gender terrorists’ (this is genuinely laughable considering the natures of most of these kids), to the Red Pill guys who want to carve out their own trad-con niche in the ‘sphere using Incles as a negative example to prove their version of whatever qualifies as masculinity. Lets face it, Incels are easy targets. They’re universally described as “the losers you used to know in high school who couldn’t get laid”. This makes them easy to dismiss most of the time, until one of them shoots up a university or mows down random women with a panel truck.

Incel is short for involuntary celibate, but there’s a lot more contributing to these guy’s condition than just an inability to get laid. Back in 2014 the term Incel wasn’t used to define Eliot Rodger. He was an Incel for sure, but very few people trying to analyze him made this connection. Again, they wanted crazy, and what’s better than crazy? More crazy. So all the efforts used to pick Eliot apart back then were really pointing to bigger motives, nefarious groups of ‘misogynists’ and more craziness.

Back then, Eliot belonged to an online forum called PUA Hate; literally a group formed by these guys’ collective dislike of the Pick Up Artist set that virtually all of them had once been hopeful would end their involuntary celibacy. For whatever reason the promised magic formula that would end their loneliness and sexlessness didn’t work for them. They were all understandably mad. Ironically, Rational Male articles I had written got link-backs to various posts on the forum and most of them were appreciative of them, however, that may’ve also been part of the problem. Fast forward four years and today the deleted PUA Hate forum is replaced by incel.me, another forum with a similar charter (and also one I get good link-backs to).

I think one of the most pressing problems in Red Pill awareness today is that awareness itself. Not every guy is ready to be unplugged. One of the inherent risks I take in writing what I do is presuming every man I make aware has the presence of mind to accept it and work it out for himself. If you look at the profiles of the past 6 school shooters, include Eliot Rodger and Alek Minassian, you find a lot of similarities. Most were the products of a fatherless home, most were diagnosed with autism or Asperger’s syndrome, and all of them were the ‘Forever Alone’ types triggered by the rejection of a girl. These young men are the product of a generation that has removed the man from their upbringing and taught them to emote before they think.

Today we’re just starting to acknowledge this generation of ‘lost boys‘; the young men who drift rudderless in life, are socially retarded to varying degrees and a demographic that is looking outside themselves for solutions to problems that are the result of the social order that created them. Is it any surprise we have such a rise in popularity of any speaker or organization that might be able provide them some direction?

Many of these guys are simply not ready to be made Red Pill aware. It is a risk to their egos, but also, it’s often a crushing disillusionment of the Blue Pill ideals they’d hoped would be a reality for them if they could just play the Blue Pill’s game correctly. For a lot of them it was their Blue Pill hopes that formed the basis of their existence. Now add the harsh truths of the Red Pill to a lost boy, one who is socially maladapted or has a genuine psychological disorder, and take that (misguided) ‘hope’ away from him. What does that kid do when the Red Pill shows him the reality of the game he’s involved in?

There is no ‘Black Pill’

I’ve heard Roosh and a few other commenters in the ‘sphere describe the “Black Pill” – the idea that the social order of the Blue Pill, the Feminine Imperative, or the ‘gynocracy’ if you like, is so rigged against men that they accept their role in it and give up on trying to make themselves or their circumstance better. What these guys are describing is what I’ve referred to in the past as the Abyss. This Abyss is the psychological / existential gulf a man needs to cross when he becomes Red Pill aware. He realizes that the person he carved himself out to be in a Blue Pill conditioned ideal was based on a the same falsehoods. This stage of unplugging has difficulties unique to men at various stages of their lives and according to the decisions they made for themselves throughout their lives in accordance with those Blue Pill ideals. It’s one thing for a young man of 25 to unplug and turn his life around in a Red Pill aware paradigm, but it’s quite another for a man of 70 to become aware and look back on his life, marriage(s), family dysfunction and the long term impact his blindness to the Blue Pill game he was a part of for so long.

There is a necessary state of nihilism, or at the very least a prolonged doubt, that occurs when men realize that they’re cut away from that Blue Pill conditioned life. This is why I compare it to mourning in The Five Stages of Unplugging, men are literally mourning the loss of their investments in that paradigm; they’re morning the loss of Killing the Beta they used to be.

Understand this, there is no Black Pill – there is only the Abyss of accepting the truth that comes with Red Pill awareness and a man’s capacity to make this awareness work in his best interests.

Incels, if nothing else, want to find ways to make this awareness work for them, but most are too damaged to deal with the realities that Red Pill awareness reveals to them. They’re not ready for the truth, but it’s unavoidable today.

A lot of femosphere critics want to lay the blame for Incels at the feet of the Red Pill. They think there’s some nefarious plot to radicalize young men to be killers in some misogyny fueled gender-jihad against women. This presumption also comes on the heels of the #MeToo / Future is Female movement so it fits in perfectly with the ‘resistance’ narrative. As I said, it’s easy to hate on Incels. They fit another profile too; that of the basement dwelling 30 year old who refuses to leave his parents house. For the Man Up crowd Incels are easy to AMOG, for the lathered up militant feminist they’re the perfect foil needed to legitimize their own ego investments in gender dystopia.

The truth of the matter is Incels have always been with us. They were the losers, the nerds (before they were told they were cool) and the guys who were Darwin’s dead ends. I knew dozens of them when I was growing up. I know many now, all of them building a life-theme around their life long confusion and misery of not figuring out women. I know a lot of married men today who are technically Incels in their marriages. We like to say they’re ‘unlucky’ in love or we’ll say “Don’t worry, you’re a great guy. Any girl would be lucky to have you. You’re just meeting the wrong kind of girls, just be yourself and it’ll happen for you.” Then we hope they don’t fixate on one of our girlfriend’s girlfriends and they go off to figure out how the real world works.

AFCs in 2018

So what’s different now? Well, to start, we have a generation of lost boys who’ve been acculturated to think that even asking a girl out is a form of sexual misconduct. The Village has raised boys as if they’re defective girls, devoid of any of the masculine discipline necessary to teach these young men how to cope with real rejection from a girl, how to deal with defeat or how to come back stronger as a result. As we’ve feminized these boys so to have we embedded the same feminine victimhood narrative that women rely on into their collective psyche. Except these boys are still beholden to the old social contract that women believe incumbent upon men. This puts these boy-men into a very precarious position: they are educated like defective girls and as such adopt the same frail sensibilities and are subject to the same entitlement narrative as most women are, but they are also male and therefore are expected to suck it up, take it on the chin and carry on. They are told to express their feelings and in the next moment are told to check their male privilege.

Most of the lost boys generation are not ready for the disillusionment that the Red Pill brings to them, but it’s not the manosphere that’s opening their eyes so much as they are having it thrust in front of them by a communication age steeped in the Feminine Imperative. Today, Red Pill truths are harder and harder to get away from as Open Hypergamy and all of the unflattering truths about the female nature are triumphantly lauded by women themselves. Every swipe left on Tinder is one more confirmation of exactly the harsh truths that push Incels to their limit.

Of every article I’ve read on Incels since the Toronto killings not one author has analyzed the problem correctly, but also none have any actionable idea about how to solve the problem of Incels snapping. There are no longer the same outlets that ‘losers’ had back in my day to channel that sexual frustration to more productive ends. Many a frustrated high school boy became his generation’s iconic artist or musician. I think it’s the height of irony that Mark Zuckerberg essentially created Facebook to stalk his ex girlfriend. There are no longer the creative ways to deal with the discontent that comes from sexual rejection. Some will say to me there are, it’s just these guys are too unmotivated to apply themselves. And while that may be true, there are much easier outlets that further stunt that boys development. Rather than redirecting that sexual angst to something creative, it’s much easier to lose themselves in online porn or immersive escapisms facilitated by this age’s technology.

Or they can seek out a forum of similarly disaffected young men and commiserate about the truth of a world that has no place for them. I read that Dr. Jordan Peterson suggested that a social order based on ‘enforced monogamy’ might be a cure for Incels. I get what he was trying to say, but it’s just one more flippant redirection away from the real causes of this rise in Incels. I can remember reading a post that Roissy had made about a knife wielding man in China who had gone to a day care center to specifically kill women and children. As horrifying as that is what had prompted the guy was the understanding that he’d essentially been selected out of the reproductive game because there was a huge imbalance in the ratio of men to women in China as a result of their one-child policy for so long. Roissy went on to suggest that as more and more men are disaffected by a feminine-primary social order, one that bases all its legislation and social doctrine on optimizing Hypergamy, the men disenfranchised by it will become either more violent (in their effort or angst to reproduce) or more suicidal – which we also see in men killing themselves at 5 times the rate of women.

Incels are the canary in the coal mine that is a gynocentric social order. They are what results when a society prioritizes and incentivizes Alpha Fucks (enthusiastic consent) while Beta Bucks is more or less assured by direct and indirect resource transfer to women. When 80%+ of men are evaluated as ‘unattractive’ to women fed on a steady diet of ego inflating social media, you get Incels. I made a case for this in Dangerous Times, but Incels are a byproduct of a feminine-primary form of polyandry. Incels are a result of shifting from a social contract based on marriage to one based on a sustained child support. The old social order was founded on giving a guy a decent shot at marriage and reproduction by way of being a good provider, this contract is gone today. When a woman’s primary incentive is no longer provisioning all that’s left is a socio-sexual contract based on the most available Alpha seed to meet a need that a woman cannot provide for herself.

As we move into the next decade I believe we will see even more narrowing of this socio-sexual contract. This is why some countries are legislating that anything less than an enduring enthusiastic consent for a woman is rape. This is an effort in insuring a woman is never again inconvenienced by having transactional sex for resources, nor should she be bothered by men who will know not to approach her. Incels are the natural expression of the frustration that comes from this truth becoming more and more blatant and accepted in society. Incels have it right; they more than any guy understand the brutal truths of a social order founded on mandating Alpha Fucks and Beta Bucks. Where they go wrong is in their way (or non way) of coping with that truth. They accept their Black Pill and never cross the Abyss to a better life because they don’t know how to evolve with it.

Published by Rollo Tomassi

Author of The Rational Male and The Rational Male, Preventive Medicine

593 comments on “Incels

  1. Very insightful. It’s true that incels growing in numbers is the end result of all the social trends we’ve seen since the 60’s and it’s reaching a tipping point. For those guys that are in the 80% that are left behind, it’s easy to see why the abyss has such a powerful hold. The real question is what will the future hold once the mass breaking point has been reached?

  2. @ Blax

    Yeah, i know i’ve been indulging my blue pill side which i totally need to annihilate out of my system if i am to truly grow into the man scribb, Sentient and others like yourself are. I am well aware of this. I’ve just about hit rock bottom and have whinged for the last time. Fuck it! Scribb’s last post has resonated very deeply with me. I’m sick of being a victim in this fucked up world, wishing it was something other that what it is, a dog eat dog world. It really is hard to spit that blue pill fucker out of one’s system, and let go of all the buffers one’s been clinging to his whole life. So, yeah, i’ll be hanging in there and reinventing myself, piece by piece. Keeping what is good and disgarding the rest.

    It’s helped me a lot being able to vent and be vulnerable in this space. I’m sincere in my goals and am a good man wanting to make a positive contribution whilst also getting what i want out of my remaining years on this wilting planet…

  3. “Incels are a result of shifting from a social contract based on marriage to one based on a sustained child support. The old social order was founded on giving a guy a decent shot at marriage and reproduction by way of being a good provider, this contract is gone today. When a woman’s primary incentive is no longer provisioning all that’s left is a socio-sexual contract based on the most available Alpha seed to meet a need that a woman cannot provide for herself.”
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oezKQEF0deY
    Behold RED is forced from being in blues… What happens when computers and men Morph to evolve a new state of being?
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ocT6m0yk0Vc
    “the most available Alpha seed to meet a need that a woman cannot provide for herself.”
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QFd4tUcSJsM
    Comfort from the pain of all that has come to pass.

  4. Hey Rollo:

    This is the best post I have read from you in a while. It was one of those “whoa” moments for me. If you think hard, you may remember me from about 5 years ago complaining that you didn’t post enough. It was during that time that a lot of your posts were blowing me away on a regular (if not daily) basis. In early 2013, I was reading your blog regularly and basically saved my marriage by doing something very conterintuitive to me when my wife was pregnant with our second child (walking out when she was S-testing me big time). Anyway, it’s been far from a smooth ride since then, but something I understand a lot better, and my boys have been able to grow up with their father, which is a huge blessing.

    Frankly, honestly, I have taken your site for granted in the last few years. I’ve been very focused on Vox’s site and CH (as well as Sailer ) because they deal with news and actionable current political issues. You deal with timeless gender relation issues, but you are the best at what you do. I still bare you a lot of goodwill, but realize I haven’t expressed it much. I bought your first book for my dad. I almost went to see you in Vegas a couple years back and will attend any conference of yours if I can (Vegas is easier than Florida). If you ever indicated that you needed a 5 (if not 6) figure cash infusion, I would definitely help out, though it seems things are going pretty well with you.

    I just say this by way of encouragement. You have significantly touched the lives of many, including me. I’m sure there are many men like me who do and would support you. So I hope you can further step out in public with the courage and conviction that you are doing the right thing (though no man comes to God, but by Christ, and really pray you can go there). Frankly, I wish and hope I could/can be like you later… when I can afford to put my face out in front of the public (I’ve got multiple ivy league degrees, and almost no one in my milieu comes out as “red pill”, though I have to think there are more than a few of us…)… but whatever I do, I owe you a great debt for teaching me all the basics, including more key concepts in this post. Keep doing what you do, but hope you can also use your knowledge and see the political winds as they blow.

  5. The core principal of the Black Pill is that only your appearance matters, specifically those core attributes of your appearance that can’t be changed – height, body frame and facial structure. A short, narrow shouldered guy with a poor chin line who lifts a lot will be derided as a “gymcel” who is still basically an unattractive loser. Personality is irrelevent, provided you aren’t a complete weirdo.

    Now Elliot Rogers was a very good looking guy. That he was regarded as a genuine Incel by Blackpillers shows that the bar for being an Alpha is very high, and it is binary. All or nothing. Either you are Chad, or you an ugly loser, and there is nothing in between.

  6. @scribblerg
    Fucking solid bro, yareally changed my shit up as well from a deep hole.

    @rollo
    Pimps roosh and like you said helped chase yareally out of here. Rollo writing is solid, but Ya writing gives dudes a blueprint to swallow that motherfucking redpill and accept women for who they are and enjoy them lol

  7. @Scribbs,

    I enjoy reading your posts. For whatever fucked up reasons your style resonates with me while it makes others bristle like nails on a chalkboard.

    I am not passing up the opportunity to take issue with this:

    “YaReally was chased out of here for calling bullshit.”

    LMFAO. Seriously? What kind of pussy gets chased off a virtual world blog? I learned a lot from Yareally as did others, but he could never shut the fuck up and argued/debated like a teenage girl. He was the champion at crushing the keyboard. So many threads turned into what appeared to be a bunch of girls in a high school locker room. If Ya was such a stud maybe he shouldn’t have grabbed the football and ran away with his tail between his legs.

    He (and others) are right about one thing. There is a shit ton of keyboard jockeying on TRM and sometimes it reads like boys arguing, not men doing.

  8. @biff
    Good thoughts, but to me the ideas Rollo raises are far more “actionable” than “current political issues,” which are largely space-filling media BS.

  9. I mean, it’s important to stay informed on what the FI is up to in culture and politics, but even as an admitted news junkie I see that it’s largely just that — junk. Noise. There was some article out yesterday about the public suffering from “news fatigue” and even as a journalist I think that’s a good thing right now.

  10. @ Roused

    I really wish that ya didn’t vanish because I do miss interacting with him and even reading his 2000 word replies to dudes here.

    But I’d started to suspect that it wasn’t solely his frustration here that caused him to disappear. That doesn’t make sense for a guy that constantly talked about helping ” the newbs ” the way that he did. Something else had to be going on.

    As far as being abrasive, lol, I don’t have a problem with people’s abrasiveness as long as they are right and correct and consistent. Otherwise it’s just empty, angry railing in service of attempting to make one feel better about their life…. Like some women do.

    At a certain age a man JUST realize that he is not his ” job ” or his ” car ” or his ” home ” or elevated by ” women fucked “. Yeah, these are all great things that have to be kept in proper perspective lest you happen to lose it all and get driven insane by that loss.

    Or worse.

    Life is a straight ( or crooked ) line and not a big repetitive circle.

  11. Keep in mind that from his own crazy screed it’s clear Roger Elliot was batting for the other team. He describes men in an admiring way that betrays a deep attraction, and doesn’t really mention the looks or attractiveness of women. The paradise he writes about was all men with a few women saved just for breeding more men. Yeah.

    He may have been in deep dark denial, and maybe snapped when his male roommates discovered his orientation. He murdered them first

  12. @ Fox

    Brother, I understand completely what you’re saying. Getting ” down ” occasionally is to be expected at particular ages, but it’s key not to stay in anger of sadness or any form of nihilism. The world can indeed be a tough place, but it’s also a beautiful place. Yin and yang.

    Personally, I don’t even have all the answers, and I won’t live long enough to attain them. What I do have is the answers that work for me and my life, and the mortal recognition that my time is finite. I don’t have time for slumps like I did at age 20.

    Sometimes people can’t realize why they need to let go of anger or frustration without having a near death experience or great tragedy. The concept of ” still breathing today ” doesn’t fully register.

    All I can offer ( that’s been field tested…lol) is that the world will be as you perceive it. The narratives you write inside your head will always come to fruition. Mind that inner voice.

  13. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=G-gQ3aAdhIo

    The real Elliot Rodgers…

    Creepy AF. Insect like in demeanour and yes lot’s of Teh Gay going on.

    Real incels are creepy weirdos. It’s the creep thing that women pick up on.

    Take our former resident incel Hank… Buried in his backstory was a self reported episode of as a child repeatedly holding a puppy under water in a bathtub. That kind of creepy weirdness undoubtedly came across in his subcomms. No matter how much game he learned.

    The run of the mil AFC “incel” is really just a gormless dude who will not bang the girls he is able to… The 3-5s… He creates a buffer by believing all women are available to him and not settling.

  14. O.B.I.T.
    “Life CAN be a big repetitive circle if you make the same mistakes over and over.”
    Well if you learn along the way what you have control over. That gives you meaning in the struggle.

    KAK
    “He may have been in deep dark denial, and maybe snapped when his male roommates discovered his orientation. He murdered them first”
    Reminds me of a lot of high school violence i am use to witnessing. Something that is repressed holds back a secret.

  15. Elliot’s view on entitlement is so hard to listen to… Holy hell… This is not a video to push your problems from. It’s as if it’s an echo chamber of social demand. Their is no respect on the process. This how horrible thing’s come about. Their is no build up and Game. Yes its part of unplugging but their is work beyond that. Violence is a language that if used from anger only makes the world amplify the wrong direction of the problem.
    Look at the contrast with the alpha chad
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C-gtdWBQph0
    Love and affection without play?

  16. “The paradise he writes about was all men with a few women saved just for breeding more men.”

    Which is just plain silly. They’re also for money and power.

  17. I do not position myself as the only “Real Man” here. But I will tell you this – giving Betas an excuse for marinating in their rage and resentments isn’t helpful for them – it matters not to me, the angrier these spergy pussies get, the more they fuck up out there in the real world, and the more chances I have to win against them. In business, with women – in anything.

    Look at the comments made back at me – does anyone here doubt I could debate ADS or Anon into the ground in a live debate on this topic? As for my past here, I’m giggling – it’s all public. All one need do is click on my name and you can see them all. I’m not hiding a thing about the rage period I went through. But if you keep with the thread, you’ll then see I went away for a long time. That I was deeply affected by YaReally, and Sentient. Just make sure you get the entire story. And I’m sharing with you guys how I moved from that useless, angry place – by being tough on myself. By demanding victory, from myself. I’m only sharing the path that worked for me, while others here piss themselves cuz they are invested in this site in bizarre, unproductive and unmasculine ways. Here’s me giving zero fucks about what you guys think. You have some other need to participate here other than getting your life reoriented to a Red Pill frame – have at it, just know that most of the guys who come here want what has happened to me to happen to them. Not to sit here blathering on for years and years about what geniuses they are.

    So, to the haters I say:
    https://giphy.com/embed/44Eq3Ab5LPYn6via GIPHY

    I’m writing this stuff for the guys here who wonder the following:

    – How do all these supposedly awesome Red Pill guys find the time to comment 20,30, 50 – 100 times per week while also living full lives?
    – What is the point of this exercise? To aggrandize our sense of victimhood? Is that good enough?
    – What to ACTUALLY do going forward?

    Rollo talks about “the Abyss”, ya, the Red Pill world is not comforting. Any Beta should be terrified and disappointed by these truths. In our current world, only high value men are having a good time. But I also know that any man can up his game and I won’t tolerate anything less. You can learn social dominance. You can learn to telegraph high value. You can learn to stop undermining yourself. But you won’t learn it by reading endless parsing and mental masturbation over Red Pill ideas.

    Your choice guys. Ask yourself this – who would you rather be? Me? Or Anon or Flange or some of the other whiners here? Or me. The question answers itself. I have to get back to building my empire now. And fucking young hotties. And making music that makes me melt. You guys can keep being the Red Pill experts, lol…

  18. @magyar

    Most of them aren’t as highly functioning as you are, and even a simple conversation is near impossible for them because their brain lacks the wiring necessary to automatically detect nonverbal cues.

    truth…but that can be learned…I did…you have to learn to focus on the cues and expect them to show up because you are very nearsighted and your window could close quickly…and somehow you have to be “in the moment” and having a good time…and if you are having a good time, the window will manage to stay open longer than it would for a neurotypical who isn’t having a lot of fun…which explain Owen Cook’s success (RSD Tyler). (Watch him rock in videos while he’s lecturing, lol.)

    I’ve solved the interruption problem…just mess with whoever is talking…teasing them nonverbally, joking with them, whatever, anywhere near a break and you can get the floor because alphas get to interrupt other people if they give comfort and do it in a fun way.

    Even for us spergs, we can do it.

  19. See, even ADS can learn social dominance. It’s not magic, and guess what? It’s not easy for “alphas” – it’s learned. Just like ADS is learning it. Alphas are not given their abilities, we develop them as an adaptive strategy to win in life. We just hone in the skills.

  20. Look at the comments made back at me – does anyone here doubt I could debate ADS or Anon into the ground

    Did you mean Blax and AR? Cuz I never debated you about your past. There were a lot of nimrods who enabled you during your anger/hamsterization phase and they threw shit at me right along with you when I told you that you needed to fix your shit and quit your psych-mumbo-jumbo rationalizing and get some internal game and frame. Like you said, it’s all in the old comments.

  21. @Scribbs

    1. Google “Mr rogers middle finger gif”
    2. Clink the first link
    3. Open Image in New Tab
    4. Copy and paste that URL here

  22. At the end of the day the quote below of Scribblerg is what sums it up:
    “by being tough on myself. By demanding victory, from myself.”

    This is the only real solution, to become better. I do have sympathy for these guys, the game is becoming harder everyday with women, it’s not that easy to make the transition to a game aware guy who is successful with women. Just to give you guys some insight , I was with a hiking group I hike with this week of middle aged people, one of my running buddies there is a mid 40’s millionaire, over 6ft on the skinny side, not fat, not really bad looking at all, during an interaction with a mid 40s divorced corporate woman who is on the carousel, it was clear she didn’t view him as man at all in a sexual manner. It really hit home for me, because I tease this woman occasionally, have received hugs from her out of nowhere and have generally been a dick to her and she responds favorably.

    It’s all game, yes the abyss is there , it must be embraced not run away from.

  23. “Copy and paste that URL here”

    URL HAS to end in .[image file extension] .png .gif . jpg .jpeg etc.

  24. foxguy

    it’s not that easy to make the transition to a game aware guy who is successful with women.

    well not true. flip the switch. that is the key. Flip the fucking switch.

    From that everything else flows, you just need to put in some time and effort. Flipping the switch is easy though.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oG-nnDlnWrA

    With women, my switch flipped at 19 when the long distance thing I was doing (for all of a month… lol), resolved to be the “Best Boyfriend Evaaa! ™ ended with her cheating.

    “ah ha!”…

  25. One’s ability to win shouldn’t rely upon someone else losing.

    Amirite or nah?

    That sounds counter-mental point of origin.

    Let’s dig into that without just allowing it to pass by as a fact.😂

  26. ” I’m getting too old for this shit ”

    Danny Glover – every lethal weapon movie ever.

  27. If you want to give your sons a leg up in their development – competition, navigating male spaces, hierarchies, self growth, attitude, brotherhood – get them into lacrosse or hockey. These sports have a cultural vibe of “insane overconfidence” to a far greater degree than other sports like football or basketball, and as less reliant on physical attributes for success (i.e. body type, height, weight etc.). Not far from these is competitive swimming, something about being in great shape and practically naked all the time and surrounded by similar girls.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3trL4fxN1ZQ

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mw3ZyuIAA8M

    https://jennifergilmore.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/gilmore_studios_high_school_swim_dive_team_CDM_corona_del_mar_high_school_orange_county_blog_011.jpg

  28. Incubus

    Voters have a right to recall. That’s part of a message I’m getting across to youth, that politicians and judiciary aren’t untouchable and to disgard the notion of ” there’s nothing I can do about it “.

    I didn’t read the full article, but what I remember about that particular case is that the guy raped/had sex with a drink chick behind a dumpster or something, and was found guilty but sentenced to 6 months of something crazy like that.

    The law provides penalties. There must be some kind of equal application of the law across the board, and judges or anyone else that bypasses sentences for other reasons should find themselves subject to a possible recall I’d that is what the rest of the population seems appropriate.

    Again, equal applied the law. Your family, money, where you live, or nothing else should cut you any kind of break over anyone else, or ” law ” doesn’t have meaning.

  29. Your family, money, where you live, or nothing else should cut you any kind of break over anyone else, or ” law ” doesn’t have meaning.

    Of course it has meaning, it serves the former. Vae Victus!

  30. Your family, money, where you live, or nothing else should cut you any kind of break over anyone else, or ” law ” doesn’t have meaning.

    Fucking idealism. If you have to go to court, make sure you win.

  31. Sentient

    Lol. No progressivism on my part. The idea of ” the more they lose, the more I win ” just rings foriegn to me as what others are doing should have no impact on what a man is doing for himself, and the development of his own abilities and talent.

    We are men, not vultures.

  32. Blaximus
    One’s ability to win shouldn’t rely upon someone else losing.

    That’s the difference between “win-win” and “zero-sum” thinking. Probably zero-sum is human nature. It sure seems to come naturally to kids on playgrounds. But a lot more can get done by men thinking in the “win-win” mode. Good salesmen run that way.

    Some men get stuck in zero-sum emoting, not even thinking. They have to elevate themselves in their own mind by trying to shove other men down, be the Only Real Man. It’s a manifestation of insecurity. Real world-class champions don’t need to do that. Their performance speaks for itself.

  33. Asd

    You’re reading what I’m saying as idealistic. In fact it’s anything but.

    If being an American means you have particular rights, then exercising them isn’t idealistic or else the whole nation is a lie.

    That’s what I’ve seen and figured out irl in almost 60 years outside of Disneyland.

    More.than.one.red.pill.

  34. AR

    And that zero-sum thinking hamstrings most men because they can’t actually develop a ” killer instinct “, so they are relegated to the sidelines of life hoping for table scraps.

    It’s not for everyone, and it makes society as a whole intolerable.

  35. “the Red Pill world is not comforting”

    only initially (like stepping into the super fast batting cage sans warm up – after a few swings you don’t want to be anywhere else)

    and then the blue/purple pill world is uncomfortable. sickening even.

    and then finally both are comforting

    keep going until you reach that place. i promise it exists and you will find it if you just keep going

    i think there might even be a place beyond the red pill world…

    Sentient’s platinum pill world?

    a heavy, grayish-white, highly malleable and ductile metallic element, resistant to most chemicals, practically unoxidizable except in the presence of bases, and fusible only at extremely high temperatures: used for making chemical and scientific apparatus

    you are the beaker and she is the volatile chemical mixture

    the reaction does not affect the beaker

  36. so they are relegated to the sidelines of life hoping for table scraps.

    See “former super powers”

  37. Blaximus
    And that zero-sum thinking hamstrings most men because they can’t actually develop a ” killer instinct “, so they are relegated to the sidelines of life hoping for table scraps.

    “Place and time”. The epic poem “Horatius at the Bridge” – zero sum, or not?

    A lacrosse team – each player is in zero-sum mode all the time towards everyone, including teammates? Or not?

    Place and time. Context matters.

    There was meth head who tried to stick up a convenience store here in flyover country a few weeks back – his game was definitely zero-sum. He got zeroed out. Permanently.

  38. Good salesmen run that way.

    Good salesmen who can’t close often enough are fired. Champions are only champions because they have beaten everyone else out.

    The lesson should be “develop a killer instinct” or suffer the result of not doing so.

  39. each player is in zero-sum mode all the time towards everyone, including teammates?

    Ever play a sport? There is the A line, the B line, the C line – the scrubs, the benchwarmers and hangers on. How do you get on the A line?

  40. fleezer on platinum

    you are the beaker and she is the volatile chemical mixture

    Nice. Succinct.

  41. @Blax:

    I agree with your point of view.

    However, my concern is that in the #metoo era, the Judges will be afraid to hand out fair sentences out fear of losing their job. It is not about the evidence anymore, only feelz. In this particular case, I agree that the sentence was laughable.

    This had me laughing for a good hour – “Turner’s father was also criticised for lamenting that his son was facing consequences for “20 minutes of action”.”

    It would have helped if Senior Turner had explained that to his son before he went of to college. This is how fathers fail at raising sons.

  42. Blax

    If you are a formerly live baby Zebra – lion or vulture… I mean at this point what difference does it make?

  43. Incubus

    Yeah, the dad won’t be getting Father of the Year anytime soon.

    Remember, the pendulum swings both ways wrt to #metoo fuckery. The scared judges can also be removed.

    Win-win.

    Know your rights –

    The Clash.
    ( Good listen )

  44. Incubus

    the Judges will be afraid to hand out fair sentences out fear of losing their job. It is not about the evidence anymore, only feelz.

    That judge had a long history of favoring probation and rehabilitation in sentencing over jail time. Image that in California, a lenient judge?

    It is only because of feelz that this is now an issue. feelz of the “appropriate” mob. Vae victus indeed…

    1. the Judges will be afraid to hand out fair sentences out fear of losing their job. It is not about the evidence anymore, only feelz.

      Read this and then go read the Emotional Process parts of my last series. This is the female-correct presumption of Emotional interpretation superseding all other interpretive processes on a macro/legislative social scale.

  45. Sentient
    Good salesmen who can’t close often enough are fired.

    Zero-sum salesmen screw over all their customers on every deal and even cheat their employers on mileage/travel; “I win, everyone else loses”.

    By your standards, are they good salesmen?

  46. Scribblerg using incels as foil to try to make himself look more alpha?

    Draw your own conclusions.

  47. Ever play a sport? There is the A line, the B line, the C line – the scrubs, the benchwarmers and hangers on. How do you get on the A line?

    Ever play a sport? When you are on the field, is it “me, me, me, I make every play” or are you part of a team with a mission?

  48. Zero-sum salesmen screw over all their customers on every deal and even cheat their employers on mileage/travel; “I win, everyone else loses”.

    Well i reject the hypothetical that they “screw over” customers on “every deal” and the fallacy that of course this also means they cheat on their mileage. Strained example.

    Warren Buffet underpays on all BH acquisitions… the BH discount… Are the sellers screwed over? Is he not being “fair”…

    For the sake of argument, if it’s push or shove – we eat or not – and they close. So be it. Bonus will be paid.

    http://31.media.tumblr.com/1b3ef463d006970608e6194b196eb33f/tumblr_n5gxkyQ8MR1qbvaudo7_250.gif

  49. For the last few hundred years, far more men have hunted lions than lions have hunted men. A lion has to actually touch you to cause harm…

    Given a choice between being a zebra, a vulture or a lion, I prefer to be a man.

  50. When you are on the field, is it “me, me, me, I make every play” or are you part of a team with a mission?

    watch Lebron when we get to Game 7 and they are down late…

  51. @AR:

    That would depend on the sport.

    In fencing it’s pretty much do or die, even if you are competing on a team.

    In bicycle road racing a dozen or more teams will be competing at the same time and ad hoc inter-team teams are often in play.

  52. Sentient
    Well i reject the hypothetical that they “screw over” customers on “every deal” and the fallacy that of course this also means they cheat on their mileage. Strained example.

    Then you don’t understand what “zero sum” means. There’s your problem.

  53. ” . . . far more men have hunted lions than lions have hunted men.”

    On the Serengeti if you want to see a lion you have to be careful not to wear anything that’s red.

    Because that’s a color commonly worn by men with pointy sticks.

  54. watch Lebron when we get to Game 7 and they are down late…

    So “Get the ball to the hot hand” and “that ballhog never passes” are the same thing to you?
    That’s funny stuff.

  55. Recognize that every life scenario doesn’t automatically default to ” push coming to shove “.

  56. @j

    Saw your field report to girlschase site. Never seen that one. Good stuff. Never heard of the “adapted missionary” either, but I’ll try it. One pic shows one of the dude’s lets on the outside of the girl’s body and another pic shows a dude with both legs inside the girls legs though.

  57. The key seems to be not the legs but that you support yourself on your elbows and forearms instead of your hands and wrists. (How did we ever survive without search engines?)

  58. @KL:

    Thanks for introducing me to Jennifer Lourie … what a gem !!

    Rollo couldn’t pay them enough to fulfill his predictions.

    I randomly picked this article from her site:

    http://www.aloneinthebackseat.com/2017/05/desperation-what-would-you-do.html

    And it is another shinning example of the unwritten law that ” Women break rules for the Alpha, but make rules for the Beta”.

    “Today, Red Pill truths are harder and harder to get away from as Open Hypergamy and all of the unflattering truths about the female nature are triumphantly lauded by women themselves. Every swipe left on Tinder is one more confirmation of exactly the harsh truths that push Incels to their limit.” – Rollo

    1. That blog is chock full of utterly delusional thinking from someone completely ignorant of SMV dynamics….she has one of the most prominent manjaws I think I’ve ever seen.

  59. “About a year before my band, The Mighty Mighty BossToneS, released the album Let’s Face It, I was at the funeral of a close friend’s brother. The depth of sadness that my friend and his family were experiencing on that day made me think about how we are, at times, measured by our ability to handle pain, sadness, tragedy and adversity. I came to the realization that my life at that point had been, for the most part, free of these sorts of life-altering challenges. I wondered (without wishing for them) if I had the inner strength to handle such things.”

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