Teaching Slaves to Read

Ehintellect had a very enlightening comment in last week’s thread. I’ve edited it for relevant content, but you can read the whole thing here. This touched on an essay topic I’ve been considering since my conversation with Ed Latimore and Mark Baxter:

[I] was at a home party a few years back. Highly successful surgeons, wives, husbands; quickly devolved into quarters, college games. 

My wife loves the parties as she gets compliments and conversation she’d otherwise not get. She’s not plugged into that crowd, and I assume doesn’t want to. In a way, that’s fortunate. There is tremendous value in my marriage, parenting. I’m astonished at the change.

Mrs. Eh’s shit tests continue, but are a whole different breed. Comfort, mostly, and usually because I don’t calibrate enough. Easily dealt with, I’m astonished at the dynamic. I was bar rail with wife, and my erstwhile suicidal, now RP, TRM acquaintance called asking me to celebrate his 2 (!) plate spinning / back at school / ”I know your trick, EhIntellect!” / ”Now I understand the true nature of women.” / “My life has never been better.” life. I was celebrating on the phone with him. Well, yeah, after the 5-10 minute chat, Mrs. Eh. wasn’t too pleased. She started to test about me treating her as a “whore” and my daughter shabbily.

Still upbeat, I kissed her forehead and whispered, “You’re no whore. You’re MY whore.” Well, that didn’t work as intended, she sulked, I got up and said let’s go. Nope she sat and I, dropping her jacket on my chair, wordlessly left out the back. The bar waitress walked her out by the arm 3 minutes later.

I’d have never been able to do that without you guys.

I had a karaoke night planned, for me, so kept on. In a way I “bounced” her to another venue, ran with her happily sprinting with me to the new pub. It’s like the dust up never happened, she was crazy sexual for the rest of the night. That’s what we’re to do right? Spike that test! I wanted to sing, and raised the roof that night. Did I reinforce bad behavior? IMO, no. The test is to be passed, my burden of performance, she holds me tighter, begs me for affection as never before. Sex is plentiful. More frame for me, no snark, much laughter.

Reader SJF comments next:

Your wife’s response to overhearing your conversation is normal operating procedure for women. I’ve been through this scenario and could shed some more light on it.

Sure it is a shit test. Sure it is a comfort test. Doesn’t matter. It’s not about passing a shit test. It’s about using it to your advantage. “You’re no whore. You’re MY whore” was an Agree and Amplify response to the test. Not the best way to accomplish your goals. Your goals here were to mentor your buddy. Not to game your wife–you already have that in hand 

What this situation calls for is to conduct your discussions with men in fight club in private.

What’s going on with your wife in this situation is and INDIGNATION of the SISTERHOOD scenario. (How fucking dare you help another man to implement his strategy to compromise the strategy of the Sisterhood? The Sisterhood’s Social Conventions and their Feminine Imperatives to implement their strategy are more important in a Feminine Supreme Society than you buddy gaining agency).

Your wife on behalf of her and your daughter is affronted by you giving him tactics. (She figures on your part this is you giving her and your daughter and indignity because you are giving this: insult, offend, mortify, provoke, pique, wound, hurt to the Sisterhood Strategy and Imperatives.) You are poking the mother of your children in the ribs with riposte. She protests. She figures it’s not fucking fair.

So this talking red pill to red pill with guys is best kept off the grid and out of sight and earshot.
Now keep in mind this is not abdicating frame any more than a Machiavellian strategist is embarrassed by his tactics being kept secret.

Tyler Durden in fight club would not agree about using overt, rather than covert discussions about blowing up the edifices (buildings, social conventions and imperatives) in society to achieve ends.

And finally Novaseeker adds this most salient comment:

“You should know this stuff, but you shouldn’t know this stuff, if it were up to the Sisterhood. You guys are taking away OUR POWER and I’m going to shit test you about that with some INDIGNATION.”

Yes, it’s because it violates the “Just Get It” principle. It’s fine if a man “just gets it”. It’s not fine if a man has to learn it in order to get it, because in the latter case there is a concern that he doesn’t actually really “get it”, because he isn’t a man who “just gets it”.

More fundamentally, they do not trust themselves to be able to tell the difference between a man who “just gets it” and man who has learned from other men how to “get it”, and they fundamentally do want to distinguish between the two types of men because that is a critical Alpha filter. What you’re doing is sabotaging their filter, which of course will be unwelcome, never mind that they will generally be just as satisfied with a man who learns to get it as they would with a man who just gets it, in practice (as long as the former guy maintains frame and so on properly). So, yes, don’t talk about fight club outside fight club and all that.

Women want a man who ‘just gets it’ but they despise a man who has to be told how to ‘get it’.

This is the first law of the Sisterhood, a man who must be told how to be a man, how to be dominant in his dealings with women, or fluidly, naturally be the Alpha who is in control of his environment(s) isn’t the man for her. If masculinity or the value of social dominance had to be explained to him, he had to make a conscious effort to act contrary to what his ‘true’ nature would otherwise be for women.

Hypergamy always seeks the better-than-deserved situation with men. In the past I’ve discussed how the nature of Hypergamy is such that it cannot wait for a man to realize his potential. Hypergamy looks for the ‘sure thing’. This is why women prefer the romantic attentions (at least as far as long term prospects go) of men who are 5 – 7 years or older than themselves. On a limbic level, women are aware that men’s accrual of sexual market value takes much longer than for women. Men who would be intimately acceptable are the men who are already made-men. There is no (or certainly less) uncertainty for her Hypergamous doubt to resolve for her when that man possesses SMP equity that time has made of him. This is also the root reason women are attracted to men who naturally, effortlessly, display higher value and Amused Mastery, as well as men for whom social proof is socially and organically confirmed for her.

Women’s sexual agency –their only true commodity value to men – is perishable. This then is the nature of women’s very intimate relationship with the Wall; they know on a hindbrain, limbic level and from a very early age that their sexual agency rises quickly and burns out fast. Their peak competitive years in the sexual marketplace (SMP) spans only 10-12 years at best before their younger sisters replace them in the SMP. They know that there will come a point that their capacity to compete in the SMP will diminish.

Every cosmetic ever created, every plastic surgery or implant devised (by men) every fashion trend or clothing style for women has been created with the express purpose of both making a woman appear younger than her actual age and/or to convince her that her sexual agency has an indefinite shelf life. Every social convention for women the Feminine Imperative has ever devised is rooted in the latent purpose of convincing women that their sexual market value ought to be based on some esoteric or intrinsic quality (rather than the biological and evolutionary reality) once they’ve moved past the age of being able to effectively compete intrasexually with their sisters.

They are conditioned to believe the fault in ‘unrealistic beauty standards’ is due to the horrific sexual objectification of men’s base (biological) natures and/or the social constructivist narrative that would have them believe it’s a nebulous ‘society’s’ fault that they are unable to consolidate their Hypergamy once the expiration date for their sexual market value has passed and their younger sisters outcompete them.

Id vs. Ego

On a subconscious level this is the internal conflict women fight within themselves. The desires of their Ids war with the dictates of what Hypergamy demands of them, knowing all the while that their capacity to consolidate on it is limited to a very short window in their lifetimes. Women’s Egos are then fed on the narrative of the Feminine Imperative that the worries of their Ids, and the crushing doubts that Hypergamy biologically wires into women, are unfounded and they have an almost indefinite timeframe in which to consolidate on the ‘perfect guy’ ; The guy who will satisfy both the Alpha Fucks sexual excitement of Hypergamy with the stable, comforting, dependable security the Beta Bucks side of Hypergamy needs for her long term security. A woman’s Id knows this is a lie, but her Ego is convinced she can wait out her Party Years at least to sample as many ‘bad boys, wrong boys, commitment-phobic boys’ as the Sheryl Sandberg plan for Hypergamy has convinced her Ego she has the time to work her way through.

A woman’s Id is having none of it, beyond enjoying the sexual pleasures of the Alpha men she prefers in her peak sexual market value (SMV) years. Hypergamy demands the complete package, the already-made man. The guy for whom she’s so certain will be the best of both worlds (despite the unbeliveability of it) that it quells her Hypergamous doubt. On a rudimentary level a woman’s Id knows she deserves a better-than-warranted situation with regard to her Hypergamy; it’s the only situation that will ever be truly satisfying to her. Only a man who rates 1-2 degrees above what she feels her own SMV merits (however unrealistic that’s become to her) will be the man she can truly submit herself to.

This is what her Id knows. On some level of consciousness it knows she is choosing a life in which she can either submit herself and entrust her life, body and soul to the long term security of a deserving man (one who rates a full to two steps above her own self-impression), or she will resign herself to her own ‘independence’ and self-reliance with respect to long term security in a life with a man who doesn’t “deserve her” and who she will never submit herself to.

There are many variables that interfere with a woman making this consolidation in her younger years, but the fact remains, the longer a woman delays consolidating on the guy she could comfortably submit herself to the less likely she is to actually do so; and the more likely she is to resign herself to insisting on her own Frame to supply the security she would otherwise get from a man she could’ve submitted herself to.

This is why we see a majority of older women – women who’ve cycled out of the SMP – falling back on the tropes of the Strong Independent Woman® narrative. The truth is they are unlikely to ever lockdown the prefect guy with whom they could comfortably submit to. This is also compounded by her Hypergamous doubt and long term security having to be self-provisioned for a longer and longer period of time. A never-married 40 year old woman will likely have been so necessitous in her own provisioning that she will never allow herself to submit to any man’s Frames for the remainder of her life.

All of this interpersonal back and forth revolves around women’s capacity to attract a suitable man while simultaneously filtering for men’s requisite qualities to satisfy the dual nature of Hypergamy. From an evolutionary perspective, women’s breeding potential cannot afford to be tricked or deceived into her consolidating on a less than optimal man. That’s the paradox of Hypergamy and the prime reason women seek pre-made man (or a man with such overwhelming potential it satisfies Hypergamy). So important is this filtering mechanism that it evolved to be a part of women’s neurological firmware – it’s baked in.

In a larger respect, this filtering is part of the prime directive amongst the collective social influence of the Sisterhood. Women want, and expect, a default, and completely honest, evaluation of a man’s intimate potential in satisfying Hypergamy from her peers as well as the larger social collective of women. Anything that confounds or deliberately confuses the veracity of this Hypergamous assessment about a guy is equitable with deliberately attempting to sabotage a woman’s life. Accurate evaluation of a man’s Hypergamous potential is the highest order for the Sisterhood.

Teaching Slaves to Read

In my interview with Ed Latimore we discussed exactly this dynamic and what Ed said was profound. I paraphrase him here, but the sentiment was, “Men learning Game, men teaching men about the intrinsic psychological and biological natures of women, men making other men Red Pill aware, is like teaching slaves to read in the time of slavery.”

Men becoming aware of the nature of women is a Threat; and that threat is primarily dangerous because it deliberately confounds women’s accurate assessment of a man’s true value in satisfying her Hypergamous doubt. Educating men about Game, about Red Pill awareness, must be prevented on both a personal level and a sociological level if women are to maintain a feminine-primary, feminine-correct and feminine-dominant social order. Thus, we encounter the social situations that Ehintellect and SJF describe in the above comments.

This reminds me of a story I read on the Red Pill Reddit forum about a guy who’s girlfriend discovered my book he’d been reading. She began picking through various sections and, expectedly, got really pissed off at the chapters on SMV (the chart in particular). They both discussed the parts she’d read and she admitted she wanted to read the whole thing, but from what they talked about she confessed that there wasn’t really anything she disagreed with. Her words were, “You men shouldn’t know this stuff!

It wasn’t that she was irritated by the truth in those sections of the book, but rather, her concern was that men might become aware of women’s sexual strategies as laid bare by the SMV sections and chart. Essentially, men teaching men to become Red Pill aware, to unplug them from the Matrix is anathema to women’s long term sexual strategy. Teaching men to Just Get It is a deliberate effort to bypass women’s subconscious and overt filtering processes to evaluate a man’s Hypergamous value.

Furthermore, Red Pill aware men represent an existential threat to women unilaterally making Hypergamous decisions for their lives – a unilateral power women have taken for granted since the unfettering of Hypergamy in the Sexual Revolution – and thus represent a threat to their making a less than optimal choice. Men becoming Red Pill aware, in effect, prioritizes men’s control over the Hypergamous process. That may be only by order of degree, and subjective to men’s real grasp of the Red Pill and their capacity to implement it, but the fear remains. Even a nominal control or increase in control of men over the Hypergamous process must be criminalized, marginalized or shamed to eliminate the threat that a man might convincingly misrepresent himself for a woman’s Hypergamous approval.

This is interesting in light of women’s hubris of embracing Open Hypergamy on a societal, cultural level. It’s not that men would be aware of women’s Hypergamous sexual strategies – this they triumphantly flaunt in very public ways – it’s that men would collude together to deliberately exploit that knowledge to wrest some marginal control over women’s sexual selection process.

Novaseeker’s assessment is correct, this convincing deception centers on men teaching men to passably appear to, if not actually, Just Get It. There’s a maxim in the manosphere that states women are not interested in how a man becomes a man. They are uninterested in the process of a man becoming anything, just that he is. If there is one thing Hypergamy demands to satisfy its inherent doubts is that men be genuine. How they became ‘genuine’ is irrelevant to women, just that they are genuine is enough. This is the conflict between women’s Ids and Egos – that a man might appear to be genuine in his quality is enough, yet not enough. 

324 comments

  1. Reposted from last thread-

    All women have 2 sides. All of them, even my mom. It’s a feature, not a bug.

    Side #1 is a loving, caring side. It’s often heavily maternal in nature, and when it’s focused on a man, it is highly desirous. Sex is just one component of the desire under these circumstances. The woman will have a strong desire to please in multiple ways, and she will go about the task of pleasing with a sense of happiness and purpose.

    The man will not need to instruct her in how to do this, yet the woman will be open to any instruction given her. She will see the instruction as a learning opportunity, and will use it to assist her in an ability to intuit how to please the man in the future.

    Side #2 is something very different. This side is the cold, uncaring and mean spirited side. When a woman has gone to this dark side, she will do unthinkable things, but these unthinkables are usually the things that her target/man will imagine as unthinkable in the first place. Under most circumstances, she can’t physically beat the hell out of you or seriously verbally threaten your safety, so in her weakness she will find other ways to hurt and destroy you. The woman that is best at this is the one who has been close enough to you long enough to figure out what will really fuck you up.

    When women choose side #2, it is ” justified ” as their only viable option since usually physicality is a non starter.

    If one spends enough time in the company of women that one is not sexually involved with, you will often hear these mental machinations discussed. Not long ago I heard a woman talking to her friends, and she was regaling about how she chastised her husband for his porn usage. She told the crowd of females that she yelled that her husband was a pervert and was sick and disgusting – all with a broad smile on her face. She explained that she’d use the behavior as yet another reason not to have sex with him, at the same time forbidding him access to any kind of release sexually. Then she announced that the man was a sexual dud in the sack anyway, and that he should ” Change his name to Santa, because he will only come once a year “.

    Both sides of this behavior are options for all women. The devil lies in the details.

    At this point in American society, the scales are weighed heavily in women’s favor with respect to side #2. Think back a few decades ago to a television show that featured a woman setting her husband’s bed on fire as he slept in it. The point is not whether the action was somehow ” justified “, but the tacit approval shouted from the rafters in praise of the show. Since then we have been deluged with countless movies and television shows about how a woman ” doesn’t have to take it anymore “.

    So if your wife won’t fuck you, well… it’s her body and her right. And if you ” force ” yourself on her in your marital bed in any manner, you may very well find a rape charge waiting in your future. And if you get angry and lose your temper at the bullshit going on in your home, be sure you only use flowery language and soft tones lest you get charged with being verbally abusive and find yourself at best, asked to leave your domicile by the officers of law enforcement, or at worst, charged with domestic abuse, where you will be escorted from said domicile by said officers, and have to stand tall before a magistrate.

    So here’s the Pop Quiz: Where is the disincentive for a woman exercising Side #2?

    Okay, that’s the downside. Now for some ( slightly ) better news.

    All woman have the ability to choose either side #1, or side #2, but most will fall somewhere in the middle, with a majority leaning more towards side #1 than side #2. It is society at large/ The FI that is training women to lean more towards the #2 side, but for many women this doesn’t truly sit right in their heads. Biology – it’s what’s for breakfast.

    Now as a man, understand the popular operating notion that all of this craziness is your fault . Somehow, some way, you have fucked up women. Lol. Hence, you cannot be trusted. You are a fake ( most likely ) and a charlatan that must be tested and tested and tested again. In your confusion at all of this fuckery, if you decide to just become agreeable and pliable, you will be hated and punished by whatever means a woman can use against you.

    There is nothing a woman can ask for from a man that will ultimately make her ” happy “. That shit is just white noise in the background. The beatings will continue until morale improves, and all that.

    So if a guy really wants an LTR or ( gasp!!!!) a marriage under these circumstances, what on earth shall he do?

    Rule 1: You are the only thing that matters.

    Rule 2: The only thing that matters is you.

    The long con that society is playing out right now puts 100% of the focus on the female/princess. Personally, I hope a giant sink hole swallows Disney World whole, but short of that happening, men have to take back their minds first.

    We often speak of Shit Tests here and elsewhere in the sphere. Men need to remember how to shit test women, for lack of a better descriptor. Constantly test her to make sure she is still aware of who’s boss. Hone your discerning abilities. One of the best ways to assist in honing your discerning capabilities, is to bang a lot of chicks with no commitment past a movie of a dinner. Refuse being ” wooed “. Fleezer laid out some golden stuff above. Heed that shit. Your job is to get extremely comfortable with pussy. Take away the magical mysticism from snatch, and you can think more clearly and as a byproduct, discern what the fuck is really going on around you. Always remember that your dick and your stomach might be used against you. Build up a tolerance. Never be overly appreciative. Ladle that stuff out sparingly.

    Our built in attraction to certain aspects of femininity betray us in most situations. Learn to keep looking past these things. What you will find happening is that there are zero HB10’s anymore. There will only be what you like. See Rule 1.

    It’s like climbing a mountain. First it’s a huge, gigantic and imposing obstacle. Then you summit it a few times, and it’s just a mountain. After a while you rebuild your appreciation for it from another perspective and instead of being imposing, it’s just a fucking awesome mountain. Full stop.

    Marriage is not something that is highly advisable in the current day and age. There will be some of us, maybe a shitload, that are just bound to head off in that direction. Think of it like this here, your marriage license requires 10 years of study and a minimum notch count of 20-30. You’ll need a few courses in evo-psych, finances and woodworking…. I like woodworking, so sue me. And you need to always, ALWAYS understand that awalt. It all goes back to Rule 1 & 2, you matter. Are you up to the task? Got the requisite skills? Read through enough disaster stories and cautionary tales and think you got The Right Stuff? Lol. Say your girls is 75% side 1, and 25% side 2. Do you know how to keep that side 2 nonsense in check? After notching 20-30 chicks you’ll have a good start, as long as you pay attention in class.

    And it’s mandatory that you pour a snifter of Brandy and down a big, fat red pill.

    Gentlemen the fucking lunatics are running the asylum. The good thing is that they are lunatics at the end of the day. Their numbers are scary and huge. Everywhere you look, you see some lunatic bullshit happening. But aside from all that sound and fury, they are still lunatics. Eventually their quest for MOAR!!! will start to burn itself out, as long as there’s something there to take it’s place. Something real. Something better. Our job tapping away in comment sections in the sphere is to encourage our fellow men to develop something better, something real. And the best part is that all of us came pre-loaded with the software installed from birth.

  2. “How they became ‘genuine’ is irrelevant to women, just that they are genuine is enough. This is the conflict between women’s Ids and Egos – that a man might appear to be genuine in his quality is enough, yet not enough.”

    This is why members of the Sisterhood continue to ply what is possibly the worst advice to give any blue-pilled AFC: “just be yourself”. (The FI thanks you for self-selecting yourself out of the running.)

  3. I regards to the last three paragraphs in the original essay, and Blax’s comment:

    “Our job…. is to encourage our fellow men to develop something better, something real.

    I’m struck with the thought and have to keep reminding other red pill buddies (who at some point get conflicted in their striving to change, and in their new-found enlightened self interest) is that collaborating on Red Pill awareness and Game (including masculine self-improvement) frequently leads to a paradox for men’s subsequent actions and an irony for women’s feelings (indignation) (at least in LTR Game, but I daresay PUA Game also) in that if we develop something better, and something real, Guess What? We are genuinely and authentically doing our girlfriends, wives and lovers a favor. They are in most respects much better off for us having swallowed the red pill and if far along in Mastery with confidence and competence, we are doing them a big favor. Assuming we actually do move toward Alpha and move toward masculine competence.

  4. Profound line about red pill theory being the equivalent of teaching the slaves to read.

    @Blaximus: with side #1 women are only capable of that special kind of unconditional love for their children. In the current era women consider husbands to be replaceable. I’ve dated single mothers who have told me that direct to my face while I was dating them. Its common beta male mistake to expect that kind of unconditional love that his mother gave him, to be provided to him by his wife.

  5. When this epiphany phase SIW,

    or she will resign herself to her own ‘independence’ and self-reliance with respect to long term security in a life with a man who doesn’t “deserve her” and who she will never submit herself to.

    resigns herself to this Steady Eddie from the previous post,

    Betas like to wave around the idea that eventually they win out because if they’re persistent the used up woman who’d have nothing to do with them prior will now start a family with him.

    yet another iteration of the saddest story ever told ensues, and we can take bets on how many years until self-destruction.

    One could take the view that it’s just bad luck for him (and her I suppose), and fall back on the old saw – “life is tough, but it’s tougher if you’re stupid” usually seen on John Wayne posters. But I find myself hoping for a better life for Normal Beta Joe. I want him to snap out of it. I want him, and all of them to get their dose of the Red Pill; and “passably appear to, if not actually, Just Get It.

    Why do I care? Certainly I was Beta Man, I’m not even cured yet; but I married a young woman and accidentally sidestepped epiphany stage drama, although not many other kinds of drama. I can’t explain exactly why I care about these unknown men but I do. I feel like being a mentor and a cheerleader for the younger men in all this, inasmuch as I’m able.

    Why does Rollo, or any number of commenters care about these people’s problems; as some obviously do? Why does Blax want to “encourage our fellow men to develop something better, something real.”? What is the motivation for men that do not actually know one another to want to give a helping hand, to teach the slaves to read?

  6. @ Lost Patrol

    Very germane to the original post about teaching other men red pill and your comments about having an inbred desire to mentor, Robert Greene covered the aspects of getting a proper mentor in Mastery. If a Mentor is properly motivated he has a desire to be a mentor. Especially if he raised children to the age of 21 or so. Raising children who develop desire for mastery and develop agency and sovereignty over aspects of their life is very rewarding for a father. Being a mentor and caring about other red pill men is a surrogate good feeling for that. It reminds them of that feeling all over again.

    Having a mentor is very efficient way of developing Mastery in a shorter period of time (time is the most valuable asset for a man). Developing mastery in the shadow of a mentor is fun. Mentors also can be flattered by their mentees, as is witnessed all the time in Rollo’s twitter feed. He’s humble about his help, but undeniably is gratified by guys who read him and improve their masculine strategy.

    From Robert Greene’s book Mastery (Part III, ABSORB THE MASTER’S POWER: THE MENTOR DYNAMIC):

    What makes the mentor-protégé dynamic so intense and so productive is the emotional quality of the relationship. By nature, mentors feel emotionally invested in your education. This can be for several reasons: perhaps they like you, or see in you a younger version of themselves, and can relive their own youth through you; perhaps they recognize in you a special talent that will give them pleasure to cultivate; perhaps you have something important to offer them, mostly your youthful energy and willingness to work hard. Being useful to them can build a powerful emotional connection to you over time. On your part, you also feel emotionally drawn to them—admiration for their achievements, a desire to model yourself after them, and so on. Mentors find this immensely flattering.

    So that is just a bit of comment on why perhaps mentors feel satisfaction in caring about other men who want to swallow the red pill and have desire to pursue that awareness and the temerity to Game well going forward. The mentees would do well to see the value in pursuing guys like Blaximus as a mentor in real life. Those guys are out there in real life, but (because time is their most valuable asset) they are not always easily approachable because they are super busy in living their life well. So it takes getting in their good graces which I mention last in the link at the end of this comment.

    More from that from Robert Greene:

    The reason you require a mentor is simple: Life is short; you have only so much time and so much energy to expend. Your most creative years are generally in your late twenties and on into your forties. You can learn what you need through books, your own practice, and occasional advice from others, but the process is hit-and-miss. The information in books is not tailored to your circumstances and individuality; it tends to be somewhat abstract. When you are young and have less experience of the world, this abstract knowledge is hard to put into practice. You can learn from your experiences, but it can often take years to fully understand the meaning of what has happened. It is always possible to practice on your own, but you will not receive enough focused feedback. You can often gain a self-directed apprenticeship in many fields, but this could take ten years, maybe more.

    Mentors do not give you a shortcut, but they streamline the process. They invariably had their own great mentors, giving them a richer and deeper knowledge of their field. Their ensuing years of experience taught them invaluable lessons and strategies for learning. Their knowledge and experience become yours; they can direct you away from unnecessary side paths or errors. They observe you at work and provide real-time feedback, making your practice more time efficient. Their advice is tailored to your circumstances and your needs. Working closely with them, you absorb the essence of their creative spirit, which you can now adapt in your own way. What took you ten years on your own could have been done in five with proper direction.

    There is more to this than just time saved. When we learn something in a concentrated manner it has added value. We experience fewer distractions. What we learn is internalized more deeply because of the intensity of our focus and practice. Our own ideas and development flourish more naturally in this shortened time frame. Having an efficient apprenticeship, we can make the most of our youthful energy and our creative potential.

    I had adapted some ideas for newbies to red pill in how to get a mentor IRL (Robert Greene also elaborates on the method of that in Mastery) from some Julien RSD SHIFT notes back in January 20, 2016 at 10:42 am:

    https://therationalmale.com/2016/01/18/a-teachable-moment/comment-page-3/#comment-136711

  7. The fundamental issue here is power. Shit tests are nothing more than games of bluff. The current social battle is a real one. Women’s real advantage stems from birth control, legalization of abortion and criminalization of masculine biology. But, it is still all nothing but bluff. Every ternate of the FI is wielded with a dare. A rational man can objectively play his cards and manipulate the women in his life, manage them, using their own nature to control them. This is far easier to do than the average joe perceives because average joes mind is distracted by his delusional appreciation for her sexual beauty and his fear of social shame. Furthermore, and of most significant importance, average Joe doesn’t know that every woman’s primary desire is to be dominated, protected, bred, and provided for by a man she cannot compete with, she cannot bluff. Experience and the ability to remain objective…detached dispels the delusion of sexual beauty. Remaining unemotional and recognizing that dares and bluffs are nothing more than what they are enables him to dispel the fear.

  8. @Rugby

    In regards to your Family Alpha Day #22 link:

    I could go on and on, but the point is proven here; people are probably not meeting the new standard you’ve set and you’re overlooking it.

    By giving your time and attention to an individual, free of charge, you are saying that you are a man who has no value.

    By not enforcing consequences and boundaries you are saying that their performance is acceptable.

    If there is something wrong in your life, you need to fucking address it; conflict aversion is weak.

    Failure to do so is weak and completely unacceptable.

    Choose to follow the path of the man inside you, choose to directly confront the issue and draw a boundary which you will defend.

    This deals with Assertiveness Training 101. This is why a red pill man reads and employs what Manuel Smith wrote about in When I Say No I Feel Guilty.

    Assertiveness techniques are valuable.

  9. These resonated like two power E chord in my brain:

    “Red Pill aware men represent an existential threat to women unilaterally making Hypergamous decisions for their lives – a unilateral power women have taken for granted since the unfettering of Hypergamy in the Sexual Revolution – and thus represent a threat to their making a less than optimal choice.”

    and

    “….the fear remains. Even a nominal control or increase in control of men over the Hypergamous process must be criminalized, marginalized or shamed to eliminate the threat that a man might convincingly misrepresent himself for a woman’s Hypergamous approval.”

    Initially the “female consumer” had a nice and tidy checklist, official seals of approval, and one another to maximize total quality control and be in the optimal position to easily inspect, filter, identity, validate and then select the “genuine” article from the “counterfeit” one.

    Then one day these consumers noticed a gradual, but significant change. There seems to be a lot more genuine articles available on the market. Or wait….no, I mean, the market is displaying an unusual number of knock offs and counterfeits……Yeah, that’s what it is.
    But wait….um, hey, are they REALLY counterfeits? Oh fffffffuuuuuuuuhhhh!!!!..Houston, the Feminine Imperative may have a problem.

    It’s one thing for the slaves to learn how to read.
    It’s yet another when the slaves decide to act, and revolt against their masters.
    But what on earth does one do once the slaves become free and slaves no more?

    It is indeed remarkable how the knowledge must be surpressed somehow, and the application and use must be criminalized.

  10. Powerful. That girl had a point. Men should not know this shit. I remember reading fleezer comment in the last post and he was waxing sentimental about how this stuff has spoilt it for him. Now that the empress has no clothes he can’t bear to look. It was better when he believed in Love. Heheheee…

    May be men should not get it. Any woman can depend on that (in the literal sense). A man getting it is interesting but useless. A colourful but not edible bird. A dull fat chicken, but edible. That we can keep. Fat and dull, but useful. Society needs that more than anything. Has always done. This trail, when pursued to end, is leading to damnation for mankind.

  11. Blaximus
    “Side #2 is something very different. This side is the cold, uncaring and mean spirited side. When a woman has gone to this dark side, she will do unthinkable things, but these unthinkables are usually the things that her target/man will imagine as unthinkable in the first place. Under most circumstances, she can’t physically beat the hell out of you or seriously verbally threaten your safety, so in her weakness she will find other ways to hurt and destroy you. The woman that is best at this is the one who has been close enough to you long enough to figure out what will really fuck you up.”

    This is something ive come to respect in how harsh it can be and in many ways will always be from every female in a mans life. One of my problems is being a romantic partner to my family as in stepping into my farther’s role. Knowing how to heal as a grown man is hard without a place such as this to find respite from the brutality of many human truths on not just biology but
    culture… Culture controls the dialogue and when pain comes up that flips it on its head it will destroy the sender with laws and new religions.

    constrainedlocus
    “It is indeed remarkable how the knowledge must be surpressed somehow, and the application and use must be criminalized.”

    I grew up with this and its part of the rage i have to my upbringing. It was blatantly being attacked for having any emotional expression. While being shamed with a good amount of guilt and anxiety all while the moral whores of god where preaching about the sanctity of marriage while destroying a son they coundn’t biologically respect because they are WOMEN. Not an exception to a god from the heavens. Creating a state of human terror to not be emotionally available while being cold in return to any human experience that is raw and real.

  12. Been having some stark realizations lately about how fucked this all is.

    The “teaching slaves how to read” thing just further illustrated the starkness of this to me.

    Gaslighting of Men = Feminine Imperative

    The objective has been to systematically dismantle men’s self-perception as men. To deconstruct and reorganize it into something that fits the Feminine Imperative. It’s basically a brainwashing experiment and the effects can be seen far and wide.

    Dystopian futures aren’t just fiction. The only scary part about the Red Pill is when you realize that you’ve been fucked with your whole life and not knowing who you are or what to do when you’re waking up from the bad dream.

  13. This also plays out in the lame “be a man” chorus that feminists and angry women spout out when a guy walks away from a needless fight…as though engaging in a pointless aeguementbwith her is the Manly thing to do…

    But when you say “be more feminine” they freak out and call you mysoginist….

    This ridiculous chick logic compels men to keep a strong frame.

    I made a New Years resolution to kill the beta….it’s a lot harder than I thoughtt especially after getting baited into needless confrontations with shaming language like that.

  14. Softek
    “Dystopian futures aren’t just fiction. The only scary part about the Red Pill is when you realize that you’ve been fucked with your whole life and not knowing who you are or what to do when you’re waking up from the bad dream.”

  15. Rollo
    If there is one thing Hypergamy demands to satisfy its inherent doubts is that men be genuine. How they became ‘genuine’ is irrelevant to women, just that they are appear genuine is enough.

    FIFY.

    Fake sincerity and that’s good enough.

  16. walawala
    I made a New Years resolution to kill the beta….it’s a lot harder than I thoughtt especially after getting baited into needless confrontations with shaming language like that.

    “Bait” is what is placed in a trap. You know how to recognize bait. You know how to avoid it, deflect it, reject it, etc. Stay in frame around bait and it has no effect.

  17. This ridiculous chick logic compels men to keep a strong frame.

    I made a New Years resolution to kill the beta….it’s a lot harder than I thoughtt especially after getting baited into needless confrontations with shaming language like that.

    Lol, just playing in my earbuds, trying to sleep after my three consult stints and a biopsy on a skeptical patient with pyoderma gangrenosum I had to distract from The Pain necessary from my lidocaine with stingy epinephrine. :

    Positively 4th Street
    Bob Dylan, Nobel Laureate:

    You’ve got a lotta nerve to say you are my friend
    When I was down you just stood there grinnin’
    You’ve got a lotta nerve to say you got a helping hand to lend
    You just want to be on the side that’s winnin’
    You say I let you down, ya know its not like that
    If you’re so hurt, why then don’t you show it?
    You say you’ve lost your faith, but that’s not where its at
    You have no faith to lose, and ya know it
    I know the reason, that you talked behind my back
    I used to be among the crowd you’re in with
    Do you take me for such a fool, to think I’d make contact
    With the one who tries to hide what he don’t know to begin with?
    You see me on the street, you always act surprised
    You say “how are you?”, “good luck”, but ya don’t mean it
    When you know as well as me, you’d rather see me paralyzed
    Why don’t you just come out once and scream it
    No, I do not feel that good when I see the heartbreaks you embrace
    If I was a master thief perhaps I’d rob them
    And tho I know you’re dissatisfied with your position and your place
    Don’t you understand, its not my problem?
    I wish that for just one time you could stand inside my shoes
    And just for that one moment I could be you
    Yes, I wish that for just one time you could stand inside my shoes
    You’d know what a drag it is to see you


  18. Revolution
    The Beatles
    You say you want a revolution
    Well, you know
    We all want to change the world
    You tell me that it’s evolution
    Well, you know
    We all want to change the world
    But when you talk about destruction
    Don’t you know that you can count me out
    Don’t you know it’s gonna be
    All right, all right, all right
    You say you got a real solution
    Well, you know
    We’d all love to see the plan
    You ask me for a contribution
    Well, you know
    We’re doing what we can
    But if you want money for people with minds that hate
    All I can tell is brother you have to wait
    Don’t you know it’s gonna be
    All right, all right, all right
    You say you’ll change the constitution
    Well, you know
    We all want to change your head
    You tell…

  19. “They are conditioned to believe the fault in ‘unrealistic beauty standards’ is due to the horrific sexual objectification of men’s base (biological) natures and/or the social constructivist narrative that would have them believe it’s a nebulous ‘society’s’ fault that they are unable to consolidate their Hypergamy once the expiration date for their sexual market value has passed and their younger sisters outcompete them.”

    This is also a huge disservice to women.

    Women are developing mental disorders based on these beliefs. Instead of being able to accept the natural aging process and the decline in SMV that follows, they’re conditioned to see aging and decline in SMV as UNNATURAL, with men (and their horrific sexual objectification of women) and the media (run by sexually depraved men who objectify women) to blame.

    I can’t even count the amount of times I’ve heard women talk about their extreme body image issues and then immediately blame men for being ‘disgusting pigs’ and ‘sexually objectifying women.’ And how they wouldn’t have any body image issues if men weren’t so disgusting and depraved and weren’t peddling unnatural photoshopped images of women in magazines and if there wasn’t so much pornography everywhere.

    They’re completely blind to the fact that men are programmed to fuck, and pornography is a supply for a biological demand.

    It’s as if these women really BELIEVE that pornography CREATED MEN’S SEX DRIVE. Like….lol?

    So pornography is why men are horny all the time. Pornography is why men are attracted to young, hot women. Not because it has anything to do with biology or anything. It’s the MEDIA that created these unnatural, sick desires in men.

    What fucking universe are we living in….

    Which of course leads to even more vehement shaming of men for having sexual desire for young, attractive women. To the point where they will basically accuse you of being a disgusting sociopathic subhuman for it.

    For having desires that conflict with their Hypergamy.

    The problem is that instead of being able to cope with the natural aging process and drop in SMV, they’re conditioned and encouraged to PROJECT and BLAME a natural, biological process on external things — especially men.

    The neuroses this can create is astounding.

    Similar to Blue Pill men looking for the women of their dreams. They’re being sold the same snake oil.

    Both are looking for the fountain of youth. Acknowledging the reality of the SMP is probably as painful for women as acknowledging TRP is for men.

    Blaming biological processes on society/media/men fits nicely into women’s innate solipsism and tendency to project.

    Men don’t have that innate solipsism, and even then, it’s STILL very hard for men to swallow TRP. So for women to acknowledge their own SMV degrading as a natural process….not very likely.

    And as in that other article Rollo linked to, even when women ARE aware of their declining SMV, there are 1,000,000 more women ready to jump on board and blame the guy for being a disgusting pig.

  20. This is pairing up well with Dalrock’s ongoing mining into the vein of Courtly Love, which was not a thing in ancient Greece or Rome, but appears to be an invention in high middle ages France. Sir Galahad? He wasn’t in any of the English Arthurian legends. All that M’Lady stuff? An invention of French upper crust females.

    Either way, whether it’s showing churchgoing men that the FI’s influence on their church doesn’t come from any part of the Bible, or showing other men that AWALT, it’s counter culturual.

  21. @ Rollo

    There’s a maxim in the manosphere that states women are not interested in how a man becomes a man. They are uninterested in the process of a man becoming anything, just that he is.

    —————————-
    It’s all a Game

    I completely agree with the quote. It has always confused me why Game works. In the Red Pill community we say the in field results speak more than volumes of psych studies about true nature of women. And as the Sisterhood continues it’s disinformation campaign against Red Pill concepts it’s more confusing than ever.

    It’s almost as if there is the desperate agenda to NOT have women’s weakness for the appearance of Alpha traits be exposed. Ever. Young 18-25 year old women in the west are deep programmed to say “money doesn’t matter”. But then watch movies, TV, media where a man’s wealth is displayed. And then those same young women make appreciative cooing sounds about how hot the wealthy man is.

    My take is that women the world over depend almost entirely on subjective, emotional and irrational fitness criteria for mating (frame winning, shit tests etc). The more intelligent women know they are weak and this irrational method can be used against them. These intelligent women become Alpha Widows or the like when their irrational wiring is used against them.

    But instead of giving up on the subjective irrational “frame” based criteria. These born again virgin Alpha Widow types just tighten the goal posts of her subjective irrational mate fitness detector.

    Many a beta orbiter has lamented to me “why doesn’t she (Alpha Widow) just appreciate ME being me (beta)?”.

    Now I’m beginning to realize She (the Alpha Widows of the world) NEVER WILL appreciate the Beta. At best the Post-Wall Alpha Widows will TOLERATE a Beta in her life because despite all the mental logical messages the Alpha Widow sends. The Beta did NOT WIN the irrational “Frame” based mate fitness game. (winning game = “just get it”)

    And after seeing this drama play out with dumb women and smart women. I’m thinking that women may be incapable of changing their hardwired irrational male fitness test. All she can do is rationally suppress it for a time until eventually leaving the Beta (in Frivorce). “He was never much of a man” = he never won the woman’s frame game.

    I would equate this to a woman’s mate selection mental wiring being a moving set of goal posts. At 15,20,25,30 etc there is a closing down of her subjective tolerances on what she finds acceptable and “just get it Alpha”.

    Every Alpha cad or every successful man winning her game yields an ever tighter tolerance on winning her affection. It’s a progression from Easy mode to Hard mode in gamer speak. (which gives great insight into the subjective valuation of a woman’s Virginity the world over)

    It’s as if her mental mate selection wiring is working against the rational realization of her physical beauty’s ability to land such a mate. I would say that this is nature’s way of encouraging higher mating fitness Alpha males to seek out younger partners.

    In other parts of the world that have mostly been left untouched by western Feminist BS. There is a universal thinking that NO man of means would consider marrying a woman who is over 25. To my young western mind this always reeked of misogyny. To my now more mature thinking. I get it. Why would a man with manifest options EVER consider a woman who’s internal mate selection wiring has been tuned to Alpha Widow b!tch mode?

  22. Blaximus
    All women have 2 sides. All of them, even my mom. It’s a feature, not a bug.

    Can confirm. Used to be women were taught men have at least 2 sides also.

  23. Ang Amer
    And after seeing this drama play out with dumb women and smart women. I’m thinking that women may be incapable of changing their hardwired irrational male fitness test. All she can do is rationally suppress it for a time until eventually leaving the Beta (in Frivorce). “He was never much of a man” = he never won the woman’s frame game.

    She can suppress it if she’s not an Alpha widow, as you note. She can suppress it if there’s no other option: stay married to the beta or suffer very badly with no ca$h & prizes waiting for her after divorce.

    In other words, it can be suppressed for her by outside social pressure.

    I would equate this to a woman’s mate selection mental wiring being a moving set of goal posts. At 15,20,25,30 etc there is a closing down of her subjective tolerances on what she finds acceptable and “just get it Alpha”.

    Every Alpha cad or every successful man winning her game yields an ever tighter tolerance on winning her affection. It’s a progression from Easy mode to Hard mode in gamer speak. (which gives great insight into the subjective valuation of a woman’s Virginity the world over)

    One of the few useful things Social Pathologist ever did was analyze the GSS data in terms of divorce risk crossed with reported # of sexual partners. The first 3 make a big difference in divorce risk for women, after that it slowly levels off. Very slowly.

    It’s as if her mental mate selection wiring is working against the rational realization of her physical beauty’s ability to land such a mate. I would say that this is nature’s way of encouraging higher mating fitness Alpha males to seek out younger partners.

    It’s the FI run amok, with no real limits placed on it except a woman’s social circle. This is why it really, really matters in an LTR / marriage exactly who the li’l woman is socializing with both in real life and in media.

    Western monogamy is not natural. Neither is industrial civilization. The two artifices complement each other. It would be nice to keep industrial civilization going…

  24. How do you measure success?
    By the results.
    “I discovered the red pill and now I feel like shit and nothing matters to me! But that’s keepin’ it real, bro!”
    Isn’t success.
    Nor is it “real”.
    Humans aren’t capable of seeing reality.
    Human all build their own illusions.
    We aren’t actually living in a (crappy) Keanu Reeve’s motion picture.
    If you’ve chosen one that makes you miserable, you might want to choose again (unless you define “success” as misery…in which case, misery makes you happy, which is an odd choice but if so you should stop bitching about how success makes you miserable.

  25. @ blaximus

    Regarding the second side of women that allows them to do things that are “unthinkable” .
    That just doesn’t exist for me anymore after 4 years of red pill I literally expect them to be capable of anything if it suits her wants/needs.

    Here is a true example for you all, this would have shocked me back in the day but not now.

    I worked as a freelance lighting electrician on film and tv projects (still do occasionally).

    About 3-4 years ago we were filming in HMP Leeds a very old prison that had closed a few years earlier.
    The building was still open for public visitors and had a small skeleton security crew of whom most were ex prison guards.
    Some sections of the prison were kept locked for safety reasons and it was often necessary to have security accompany myself to unlock areas we needed to access to place lighting equipment etc.

    On one such occasion an ex guard I had become quite friendly with was taking me into the old tower and telling me some of the history of the building and how about many years earlier many people had been thrown to their deaths from the roof area of the tower and that their remains were still buried in the ground below to this day. The prison dates back to 1847 and was also used as an execution site in its early years, many hangings took place there.

    On the way back down from the tower roof we passed a locked room with a cell type door and I asked the guard if we could use it as an equipment dump for an upcoming scene on the floor below.

    The gaurd said ” there’s an interesting story about that room” he proceeds to tell me that it used to be used as a teaching room for some of the better behaved convicts ( it was a category B prison) and although named Leeds prison it’s located in the small West Yorkshire town if Gloucester.

    The middle aged schoolteacher wife of the local GP (doctor) who ran the towns local practice used to come to the prison one day a wed to give lessons to groups of around 12 trusted convicts at a time.

    During his patrols around this part of the prison the guard noticed that recently the teacher “lady” had started to lock the door of the “classroom” from the inside during some of the lessons.

    This was unusual and against safety protocol but she was a trusted member of the local community and the local doctors wife so he let it slide for a while.

    However he noticed that this door locking had now started to occur on every occasion that she was teaching, so he brought it to the attention of the warden. It was decided that the guard would wait until the next occasion she was teaching and open the door during the lesson and explain the safety protocol to the teacher.

    Next lesson time the guard obtained the duplicate keys and quietly opened the door during the “lesson”.
    As he opened the door he saw that several tables had been pushed together, the schoolteacher was naked on her back one inmate was fucking her missionary while another was receiving oral and the majority of the rest of the convicts were stood around watching/ masturbating while waiting their turn!

    Shocking! right? from the 40 something respected schoolteacher wife of the local doctor!

    That’s not the half of it, after her suspension the investigation revealed more serious activity by this “lady” had been occurring!

    During the last few months of many of the convicts sentences they are allowed home leave for a couple of days a week to see family and try to arrange employment or do work placements.

    Turns out that during these home leave periods schoolteacher lady had been booking hotel rooms out of town and holding drug fuelled gang bangs with her favourite convicts, she had supplied the alcohol and they had procured the cocaine!

    I asked if she was attractive he replied that she was a little overweight not ugly but not pretty and just looked like a middle aged mother “she didn’t look the type”

    He said it was decided to try to keep it quiet, not to protect the lady but because it was an embarrassment to the prison management as it had happened under their watch. I asked him if the doctor ever found out and he said he didn’t know if he was aware or not but that it was a small town and people talk.

    He only told me this as the prison was then closed and this had happened a few years earlier.

    Few people would have believed that this seemingly respectable married little mouse of a middle aged woman would be capable of such depravity but they don’t know the truth about Hypergamy and AWALT like we do here.

    Just picturing this doctor being proud of his wife for helping educate the local convicts so they have better employment prospects on release while she returns home covered in/full of their cum for him to jus/ eat/use as lube would have made me angry back in the day, now i just think women are capable of anything given the right circumstances/opportunities.

    There are no unicorns, there are no good girls, they will do anything for the right man/men
    And I guess most convicts are alpha/high T personality types so she was just getting something that wasn’t available at home and once she started she couldn’t stop.

    Remember she’s not yours it’s just your turn. Also remember this could never happen to you because your woman is different!

    Sleep tight, sweet dreams.

  26. Great post Mr Rollo,
    Im a first time commenter, learned about trp a couple months ago, bought both Rollos books. Its been eye opening and its essential knowledge for a young man in todays world.

    I’ve noticed that Rollo likes to bash Carl Jung a little, I find the critique unjust.

    I used to be a huge beta, an excuse for myself to the point of it being neurotic, was raised by my mother to become basicly a girl. Studying jungian psychology in my early 20s is what saved me. It taught me to study my dreams, and your dreams will tell you the truths you are hiding from yourself.
    He teaches that every man has an “anima” an inner female character, which is very true. It is one aspect of the whole character of a man, it represents the emotional part of his unconscious personality. This is only problematic if the anima is a negative influence, which it was for me.
    The females I encountered in my dreams were young and shy, generally reacting negatively towards me, being easily frightened. What it was showing me was my own emotional character.
    I had dreams where my mother would make sexual advances towards me, showing me the negative side of the dominating mother complex.
    Like wise Jung teaches to embrace your shadow. I used to have many dreams where I was being attacked by different dark masculine characters, in different ways. Those were neglected masculine aspects of my personality, the sides that were not appreciated by the feminine imperative and had been denied their natural expression. When a part of a persons nature is denied expression, it will turn into neurotic insecureties.
    However it is not a problem that can be “solved” like that, making it counscious is only the beginning. You dont “solve” the problem, you grow out of it, and it takes time and effort.
    But the human psyche wants balance, and will try to address energetic imbalances through dreams.
    So while “embracing your female side” sounds very gay, Jung didnt intent it in that way, its more about knowing yourself and balance.

    For the guys who are beta to neurotic levels, you cant just teach them “game” like that, succes will require a total spiritual transformation.

    Im also surprised that no one seems to talk about race in here.

  27. Re: Softek’s “Gaslighting of Men = Feminine Imperative”

    But how can they get away with the gaslighting? Trump is being PUBLICLY gaslighted right now over being subjected to electronic surveillance, for which “wiretapping” is an accepted euphemism. The left, on the one hand, is going crazy about leaked transcripts – which had to be the result of elint (electronic intel) while claiming that there was no surveillance. And most people are convinced Trump is crazy – when the plain facts are supportive of his POV (which Nunes confirmed yesterday). I’m not trying to drag us into politics, rather this is just such a largeish example of what men and people on the right in our society experience all the time now. Not just about sexual issues. Gaslighting can only happen when you don’t have control of the framing/narrative, but when your enemies/opponents do.

    Let’s try to go deeper than ‘just so stories’ about women having 2 sides…

    Deeper…Societies are stable when they reach an equilibrium state between competing forces. This happens on many levels. Here, we focus on male-female intersexual dynamics, both collectively and interpersonally. The pre-modern and modern world’s pretty much had the same setup for men-women relationships. This is what equilibriums looks like – competing forces that balance each other off. Male and female sexual agency was constrained and directed under these social orders. Don’t get confused by the fact that some men and women always were transgressive, what matters is what the norm was. The norm stayed the same.

    But slowly, the power balance changed. Upthread mention is made of Dalrock’s exploration of courtly love – this is not news, the subject was well treated by an original MGTOW, Peter something or the other at Gynocentrism.. Here’s the link. https://gynocentrism.com/2016/04/15/romantic-chivalry/

    And why does this occur, and particularly in France? The vast wealth and formality of the aristocracy in France was only surpassed by their libidinousness. By allowing sexuality to run amok, this axiomatically gives women power as they “choose”. The more sexuality becomes central and embraced by a society, the more power women will have as they select mates and men compete for that selection.

    But even then, courtly love reinforced many of the pre-modern and modern traditions. Chivarly ties valor and gentlemanly behavior to SMV, formally. The culture of “court” is the mechanism for supporting all this. And the lower classes, over time, ape the standards of “ladies” and “gentlemen” as a way of allocating SMV. So nothing goes too haywire. Most importantly, the stability of it and its outputs reinforce its value over hundreds of generations. Societies that embraced this social order thrived and surpassed others (like Islam, for example).

    The fundamental organizing unit of family was supported by all this, not destroyed. Traditional masculinity and femininity were reinforced by these systems. Romantic love emerges, as women gain more and more power in royal aristocratic circles and make larger and larger demands of men. The Renaissance and the Enlightenment(s) were the products of societies stable enough to produce enough excess wealth to fund intellectual endeavor on a large scale.

    None of the cultural or social disorder of today here existed before the 19th century. Hmmmmmmmmm – what could have happened in the 19th century? Ah, yes, the classical liberal experiment which had previously focused solely on individual liberty was hijacked by maniacal French and other European “philosophers”. Who in the fuck were these philosophers anyway?

    In a “free” society, we still needed leaders and an aristocracy, surprisingly. So the intellectual elite became our new overlords. Of course, most of what they posited was not as trenchant or important as we have been told. Much of Marx or Bentham’s emissions were not really about how one can “run” society, rather, they were competing for the cash and prizes on offer for being an intellectual in society. It was a new ladder up that previously had only been the province of clerics and perhaps a few courtiers.

    We now live under the tyranny of intellectuals. They are largely left of center due to how socialism developed in the 19th and 20th centuries. You see, they had to invent another school of thought as the classics of Rome and Greece had already said what there was to say about democracy, republican govt, human nature, the truth of politics etc. They could only succeed by creating a new edifice of reason and study.

    The edifice is best described as Progressive, Post-Modern Marxism. It is reflexively anti-status quo, as Marxism at it’s core is simply a materialistic analysis of social order. Whether you see power as being wielded economically or socially/culturally, Marxist reduces all social order to oppressor-victim dyads. And then the politics of the Left (today’s politics are a result of the New Left) became all about dealing with power. It’s essentially a reductionist lens, but a powerful one in that it hands the intellectual moral superiority for decrying the oppression.

    The feminine imperative was growing in the 18th and 19th centuries, as always, as women are always pressing for more prerogatives in the social order covertly. The classical liberal ideas of liberty are hijacked by the radical egalitarians of Europe. And guess what?In the early 19th century, the French philosopher Fourier coins the terms “feminist” and “socialist”.

    Society and intellectuals became infested with insane ideas about equality and “justice”. This provides an opening for women to grasp more power, and by doing so they become allies of the socialist, the leftist, the Prog-Marxist. Vast institutional power is accrued as modern, wealthy societies spray intellectuals with vast responsibility and wealth. It’s not too much of a stretch today to say that our new aristocracy is comprised self-anointed intellectuals. And they gain power by catering to women, so they continue to do so.

    But there is a systemic problem. And it’s why we are all here. The system is not in equilibrium. It may be seeking equilibrium, but it can also easily come apart. It’s unstable. The simple fact that Western reproduction rates are not increasing our numbers, but are in fact decreasing is an inescapable biological truth. We are failing as a society. The social order has been undermined due to our politics embracing intellectuals and their ideas about social order with the express mission of destroying traditional culture to make way for the ill defined Utopian world leftist intellectuals promise to deliver. And they have little real resistance. Look in Europe and the U.S. now – traditional peoples are pressing a weak resistance to this destruction. But it’s far too little too late.

    The Left is correct. We are merely “backlash”. Roadkill on their journey to totalitarian Utopia. They believe they have won the culture wars and we are merely like say southern rebels after the end of the Civil War who continued to fight. We are a nuisance, but we can be handled. Just look at the glee in the press and Prog-Marxist hacks as they breathlessly push the limits further and further, giddy with their power. Check out some of the “deep state” types on Twitter who revel in their power to undermine Trump. People who just 6 months ago were law and order types – nope, the mask is being dropped now. They never cared about justice, they cared about power. That’s why the select a Hillary – it’s not accidental. She’s a sop to stupid women who are mostly easy to manipulate, sure. But most of all, she’s purely about power and showed throughout her life she would do whatever it takes to win. She was the perfect avatar for who they actually are…While Trump was anything but, he was a “Black Swan”.

    Fyi, this analysis is why I spend less and less time here. The macro-level picture is incomplete. Rollo does great work on intersexual dynamics, but unless you see how it is being driven and affected by larger social/political forces, you will miss a lot of the “why”.

    This is why I laugh at the small minority of conservatives who think they can wall themselves off and build their own Christian enclaves. That is to give up on winning the political and institutional battle. The desire to do this is a symptom of defeat, not a milestone on your path to victory. It’s a strategy of comfortable retreat. Personally, sure that may be a great way to live a better life. But in terms of our larger society? You are taking yourself out of the game. Conservatives have been doing this for a while already, while the left ran the field institutionally.

    Radical egalitarianism is how the Prog-Marxists put food on the table. Feminism is merely one aspect of it. And hey, the Prog-Marxists long ago identified the family as the social unit most destructive to their ideas about equality and justice, so they of course promoted it. But the end state isn’t female “equality” – its about giving the institutions they control power and removing power from traditional corners of society. If you don’t understand how the family has been a target for he left for a while, go read Engels essay on the family from like 1870 something. The same critiques can be heard by radfems today.

    In the end, their obsession with collectivism means that individuals don’t matter either. We are interchangeable to them. If we don’t reproduce, they’ll go get some desperate peasants from the third world who are amazed to have power 24/7. They are easy to control and impress. And remember, what our new intellectual aristocracy need most of all is to be worshipped.

    Last. Of course, this intellectual edifice is itself affected by women’s newfound powers. It’s not a coincidence the social sciences are dominated by women (except for economics cuz yuck, it’s mathy) and emit ridiculous ideas. Nietzsche predicted that as women masculinized themselves and entered into public intellectual discourse that said discourse would be reduced to a hash of nonsense. Women are not up to the task of beneficial, generous leadership. Or intellectual leadership. The smartest of them are at best semi-smart, possessing little genius or unique ideas. Allan Bloom, in his penetrating work The Closing of the American Mind (read it in the ’80s, none of this is new folks, many of us have seen all this coming for a very long time) catalogues how the Prog-Marxist intellectual edifice is by nature a closed system. That it’s purpose is political change, not the pure pursuit of intellectual competition and exploration. So errors in reasoning don’t get corrected, and instead the primary incentive of social and political power is the motivation and the end. It’s very easy to see once you know this is what’s happening.

    So, you have to now ask yourself. How can such a society hold itself together? The only possible way forward is to replace the intellectuals…In every institution they control. It will take force.

    Everything else is just noise along the way. Men will increasingly find “game” mandatory to get laid in such a feminine dominant social order. Women’s strategies will be enabled more and more. Notice how the sexualization of girls begins so young – that’s about extending the window of peak SMV, start ’em early. That’s why the Mom’s are the one’s dressing their daughters up like little whores to begin with. Today, being a sexually attractive women is so powerful as women can use that social power in every walk of life because sexual interest trumps so much interpersonally. Do a little experiment, try treating a hot woman like she’s nobody in a social setting, lol. Watch how it grinds her gears…

    For me it’s mostly a spectator sport. As an older guy, I’m merely looking to where I can juke the system to make young pussy fall on my cock. I’ve given up playing along with the insanity, but I’m also near the end of my sexual journey. Sure, I’ll flirt and game, but I can feel my sexual attractiveness waning by the day these days. It’s just a fact of getting old – will be 55 this year. Don’t get me wrong, I’m still playing my game, but my advice or approach is not a path to success for anyone. I’m merely living out the best path I can in the wreckage of a not so well lived life in a collapsing social order.

    Young guys? I have no idea other than this. It’s going to get worse and worse and worse. Only full scale revolution and the cleansing of Prog-Marxists and their intellectual heroes from our institutions and positions of power is a sufficient response. How many of you are up for that? Everything else, including this site and community, are merely re-arranging the deck chairs on the Titanic. Our destruction is certain. Kid yourself at your own cost. Sure, arrange your personal affairs to your advantage, always, but don’t kid yourself. Your personal change is meaningless in the grand scheme of things.

    For every Red Pill man we create, there are thousands of SJWs being produced by society.Each day we fall further behind. The Left knows that they merely need to wait out the dying out of my generation, and then they win.

    This is why men and anyone on the right politically can be gaslighted – because we don’t control the social order. Notice it doesn’t happen to leftists and women. Expect more of it.

    “Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats.”

    ― H.L. Mencken, Prejudices: First Series

  28. Powerful post, Rollo. Recently read both your books and am frequenting your blog a lot lately. Keep being the threat to the FI you are, and please keep writing on. We are listening, learning, and applying.

  29. @ scribblerg

    Fuck all that are you still banging that 19 year old hb9?

    Sounds like you need TRT it will give you another 10 years at least!

    Try it it will change your life.

  30. A demographic break down of who voted for Trump, and who voted for Hillary.
    I’m of the opinion that social media is going to reach a point of critical mass where people are just so overloaded by expectation (in Asia some companies even cater toward the aspiring professionals who want/need to look popular…they’ll bring “friends” over to pose and improve your Facebook posts) it will be dump en masse.
    But that’s just me.
    I do know some high school boys who were forced by social pressure (including the mothers) into “prom-posals” so their girlfriends could post on Facebook. Well….lo and behold they don’t ever want an LTR again.
    Millennials seem more RP than the old generation to me.

  31. Fleezer

    part of me wishes I could go back and unlearn all this shit and just go at it like I used to, from the gut. I’ve got more control of my game than ever, but that took away all the romance for me. I liked the idea of “getting lucky”. now it’s just applying the formula, adjusting for variables and pushing to close. I don’t feel lucky anymore. I feel fucking sick.

    I’ve felt the same way at times. It is worse within the day to day of an LTR… constantly barraged with inputs… HABD how have you felt?

    Then the voice that I had heard from heaven spoke to me once more: “Go, take the scroll that lies open in the hand of the angel who is standing on the sea and on the land.”

    9So I went to the angel and asked him to give me the little scroll. He said to me, “Take it and eat it. It will turn your stomach sour, but ‘in your mouth it will be as sweet as honey.’a ” 10I took the little scroll from the angel’s hand and ate it. It tasted as sweet as honey in my mouth, but when I had eaten it, my stomach turned sour.

  32. Lol, prog Marxist yet again.

    1 trick pony. Play is right. Get some T and shock therapy.

    And lift a weight or something instead of being so comfortable iin your massive angry bitch behavior.

    55? Lol. I’m 56. Will you ever get your shit wired tight?

    Fucking sky is falling / woe is me / I’m so smart bullshit is tired. Give it a fucking rest.

  33. Ha you youngsters! I’m 58. Started Cialis though. MDs here in Canada think T is poison or something.

  34. Blax is right about making improvements until you can’t any more.

    Scrib is right that the prog Marxists have a lock on national culture and politics…but you CAN affect its impact in your social circle by pushing back against the national culture among your friends…and create your own culture for your social circle to enjoy.

    I’m older than you other old farts.

  35. Scribbler Comeonnnn..

    This is the destiny of the human race since the harnessing of fire,we don’t need so many words and labels to describe it.

    Somebody always is stronger,got there first,has a bigger gun or bomb,just learn to walk through the fire without getting burnt and in the meantime enjoy the warmth and watch the show.

    Power shmower,these blue pill psudointelectuals all believing in their own brand of lies,LOL they are barely smart enough to read,fucking stupid bastards are their own worst enemies.

  36. @ disgruntled

    They are right T is toxic to the femenine imperative! Bitches love it tho, they can smell it, best cologne money can buy! It must be hard for them to be so conflicted.

  37. Great topic.

    Days ago my oldest states at dinner:

    Him: “Dad, my teacher is about to take 4 days of class to show us a SJW-leftist panoply video. She’s made it clear the Pope Francis believes in it too and if we don’t accept its premises, we’re not Christians. This crap has been going on all semester. If I walk out, will you stand by me?”

    Me: “I’ll stand by you, but not as you might think. The fight you pick is yours to win. You deal with the fallout at school. You’re up to that. You may even like stirring up waters. Some things are worth fighting for, right? This home is your sanctuary, though. You won’t get any heat here.”

    Fast forward to the previous comment thread re: “not talking fight club” “just getting it” (thank you Nova and SJF). I take it seriously, in spite of my devil-may-care attitude. Thus I institute a new DL RP policy yesterday. Let’s be tactful here. FFS, EhIntellect, stop being purposely stupid. Aye-aye.

    In my woodworking shop yesterday, my son enters with Mrs. Eh. Son explains he walked out of class with the termagant belittling the back of his head, he’s not willing to debate, talk it out (!). He sat it out alone in the chapel, just chilling. (Me: Good plan son. No one ever goes there.) He’s ecstatic, as only he can be, a swimming duck.

    Him: Dad remember X girl? The first girl I ever number closed way last summer?

    Me: Oh yeah. She not only LJBF, but “I have a BF” too.

    Him: Yeah. She hasn’t talked to me since that text last summer. She, out of the blue, approached me today and started mining me for information: Why I left, what I did in class, where I went. I told her “Pay me 5 bucks and I’ll tell you all. She left. I’m glad I did it.”

    IMO clearly beta-bait. She’s calibrating his fitness. I’m about to mention it…wait…let’s keep that on the DL til later, right? Mrs. Eh was patting him on the back and showering praise. Why stop the good vibe? Patience.

    Kids all around, Mrs. Eh picking up, chores, she fixed me a drink. Happiness. I decide to broach the beta bait conversation, discuss Chateau’s common beta bait post, but opt to email my boy. I write him RP isn’t a toad slime, easing the fetid FI swamp-swimming. It’s stepping out of the filth, if possible, as he just did.

    He’s only three feet away. Email? Really, you fucking pussy EhIntellect! I admit I’m ashamed of my rank hypocrisy, weakness. I hadn’t been that indecisive since flailing last year. How am I to demonstrate MPO, mastery of fatherhood if I can’t, won’t convey my ideas openly, and auto-subjugate to the FI? Alphas not explicating, only demonstrating? My boys, family deserve more than an almost-Dad.

    When did this become part of the patriarchy equation? I’d rather suffer the venom of Mrs. Eh’s indignancy, let her auto-whipsaw, and be her rock to emotionally crash upon, she wants this too. She has stated so in word and deed, and apologized for her little pout. She’s thanking me daily for all this, and esp. exposing her to the perverse paralyzing-guilt church themes. She’s upset she wasted so many years hating herself, fearing social disapproval for loving me openly, the hobbling humility as holiness, saving her natural femininity because of sanctimonious fiction. Serving two masters was futile, burying her talents. The irony is thick now and she wants to make up for lost time.

    I’m relatively new to TRM. Perhaps, I’m missing the subtle technical expertise of running a smooth RP household, raising ZFG boys. I’m good at helping people, if only under my own roof.

    Glad I posted that moment. It was the only test I’d had in weeks of her tanguera dancing around me.

    For me, this was never about the sex. This is why I comment. High-fives!

    @Lost Patrol, ASDgamer

    “I feel like being a mentor and a cheerleader for the younger men in all this, inasmuch as I’m able.

    Cosign. Powerful stuff.

    I read the new OP this morning, Then listened to this on the treadmill a few times. Yeah, I get a little sentimental…

    And when you call
    And need me near
    Say it when you go
    Brother I’m right here
    And on those days
    When the sky begins to fall
    You’re the blood of my blood
    We can get through it all

    It’s my Friday, Mrs. Eh’s birthday weekend, if she doesn’t get “too much birthday” fussy I’m giving her my presence, taking her out for karaoke again. She has been a good girl. This is truly a charmed life I lead. Thank you all.

    Go Team RP!

    Tactful me, almost, as my son explained his day…

  38. Never have tried TRT or ED drugs…One thing I have noticed is the tombstone eyes and the macho atitude of women is a dick wilter.

    Seems to me testosterone is key,as it causes women to act more feminine,and this in itself seems to bring on more testosterone?

    ED drugs on the other hand,would seem to make a guy hard at the wrong time and thereby reward her macho actions with undeserved hard dick?

  39. ED drugs on the other hand,would seem to make a guy hard at the wrong time and thereby reward her macho actions with undeserved hard dick?

    No, ED drugs work by blocking whatever is released that enlarges blood vessels in order to empty the penis out. It still has to get full the old-fashion way – arousal.

    In the case of the current girl I’m banging (19yo black Coed HB8?+) it’s probably overkill. She’s young, funny, eager, and sexy. There’s a SD/SB thing going on but at my age I don’t give a shit anymore. It’s a reasonable arrangement.

    My Urologist basically laughed at me when I requested T (I’m at 650 what ever units…I do everything I can find to keep it high without TRT). Told me he’s a professional and treats sick people. So much just wanted to punch him in the face. That’s the T talking.

  40. Yes familiar with the vasodialators and the indicators and contras.
    Still seems like if it doesn’t come natural for her I don’t want her and thats it,personaly.

    SD/SB thing?

  41. Im also surprised that no one seems to talk about race in here.

    Everything in here is about race. The Human Race.

  42. @ Lost Patrol

    Only a true racist would say that…and don’t take my word for it:

    https://answersingenesis.org/blogs/ken-ham/2015/12/04/phrase-only-one-race-considered-microaggression/

    “The list includes statements that you shouldn’t say, such as, “I don’t believe in race,” or “There’s only one race, the human race.” Apparently refusing to acknowledge so-called “race” is offensive because it denies the individual “races” of people.”

  43. @ disgruntled.

    Same here in the UK my T was around 560 @49 I drink too much and that lowers T. I have to self medicate and now I keep my levels around 1100-1200 basically the top end levels of a healthy, fit 21 year old.

    Only negative is it sometimes lowers your standards as to what you will fuck. I can live with that!

  44. “My Urologist . . . Told me he’s a professional and treats sick people.”

    Sounds suspiciously like the practice of medicine. I thought we were all about “Healthcare” these days. Did I miss a memo?

    “Apparently refusing to acknowledge so-called “race” is offensive because it denies the individual “races” of people.”

    War is peace, Brother.

  45. @Scrib

    Hi big bro. This reeks of conspiracy theory;

    We are interchangeable to them. If we don’t reproduce, they’ll go get some desperate peasants from the third world who are amazed to have power 24/7. They are easy to control and impress. And remember, what our new intellectual aristocracy need most of all is to be worshipped

    There is more to a population than head count. Peasants from the third world cannot maintain a first world infrastructure. Even the peasants from the first world cannot maintain it. I have heard of cities in the US that have become completely delapidated following radical shifts demography.

    Therefore the so called prog marxists are not heading anywhere if that is their game plan. Unless their game plan is to create a global third world.

  46. “Peasants from the third world cannot maintain a first world infrastructure.”

    They are not expected to. They are expected to destroy it and live on Carbon Credits.

  47. @EhIntellect

    Thanks for highlighting my latest transgression. One of my favorite hobbies is making “statements that you shouldn’t say”. Also, I’ve taken to looking for opportunities to launch “microaggressions” far and wide. It’s laughably easy to do, and in fact some of my best micros are fired off inadvertently. Negligent Discharge, as it were.

    Good stories on your oldest man-in-training. My oldest son has also decided to take the more difficult road, and does not sit still at his university for the “approved narrative” on anything. He resists, and tries to sway his indoctrinated friends over to the more war-like team. We had it much easier than they do. I’m proud of both of them.

  48. @kfg

    Hahahaaa.. wow. Carbon credits! That’s a new one. I like this place.

    But seriously, a dilapidated first world means a stone age third world. No more cash prizes for the FI. Collapse of the security and military establishment, replaced by militia, or gangs/other similar ragtag outfits? What is to be had by the women in such a setting?

  49. cheupez the trouble is you have already thought this through in 5 mins. more than the “intelectual elite” have in 50 years. The lack of respect for the men that make this modern world function is astounding,it may stem from the unrealistic atitude that workers are simple and uneducated,anyone could do that and so on.

    This is all good and fine till someone gets a blister,splinter,afraid of heights,don’t like to get dirty or breaks a sweat,then all bets are off.And we havn’t even begun to cover the technical side of things,I would bet good “money” ninety percent of them don’t know what the ASTM is and couldn’t pass an ASE or ACI test with all the books available.

  50. “And we haven’t even begun to cover the technical side of things…”

    from on offline mcclean article:

    “Mechanically challenged”

    “Remarkably, most of his Grade 11 students arrive not knowing which way to turn a screwdriver to tighten a screw. If he introduces a nut threaded counterclockwise, they have trouble conceptualizing the need to turn the screwdriver the opposite way. That’s because, he says, “They are texting non-stop; they don’t care about anything else. It’s like they’re possessed.””

    Parents excuse themselves from culpability here. They’ve swallowed the universal college degree meme, or blame lack of shop classes. This affords them not to learn the skill themselves, let alone teach it. The Angie’s List (God help us) category commercials reflect a hyperspecialization, lowering the bar of domesticated Beta masculinity.

    Worthless degrees.

  51. “Remarkably, most of his Grade 11 students arrive not knowing which way to turn a screwdriver to tighten a screw.”

    I’ve told this one before, but I’m sure if I’ve done it here:

    Guy across the street, 20ish, knocked on my door and asked if he could borrow a screwdriver.
    “Sure,” I said. “What kind and size?”

    “I don’t know. Come out and I’ll show you the screw so you can tell what I need.”

    The screw was a hex head bolt.

  52. @kfg

    Technically, the hex head bolt is a screw if it’s threaded. A screw doesn’t have to have a pointy end to be a screw. But the convention is to not call a bolt a “screw”.

    Growing up, I avoided skills because of physical development issues due to autism. I sucked at spatial reasoning as a result. I’ve recovered somewhat. I posted pics of a bar I built on my website recently.

    NB: I can go days without sending a text.

  53. “But the convention is to not call a bolt a “screw”.”

    Except where the convention is to call it a machine screw. And the convention is to not call a wrench (or hex socket, or nut driver) a screwdriver. Kid knew he needed a tool but didn’t have a clue what tools are called by convention or otherwise.

    And, to complete the story, the bolt wasn’t threaded. It was a pass through secured by a circlip to allow a part intended to be attached by a threaded bolt to a bracket adapting it to an unthreaded flange, the bolt serving as a shaft for the part to rotate around.

    So what he really needed was a hex wrench just to hold the bolt steady (and while nice, optional) and circlip pliers.

  54. So this is what it has come to – the 20 year old “kid knew he needed a tool”. The FI begins to cement its legacy.

  55. @Intellect

    Very pretty, did you tongue and groove the paneling yourself?

    Thanks. I didn’t think of tongue and groove. Nothing has moved much in 9 years, so I think that the result is acceptable.

  56. My 2 cents:

    My last house. First time homeowner lesbians move in next door. Super shy. I’m a skeeery man. They can’t even say hello standing next to me on the lot line. Anyhow, week two they come over to the lot line and stand, staring, and the, well, feminine one in front of the other. The butchier one is goofily hopping-peeking over the shoulder of her lover. I found it highly entertaining.

    They say they need a tool, want to exchange a shower head, need help and could I help?

    Me: Yeah! Happily! Now listen carefully, girls. Looong pause. Step one, wrap a rag around the old shower head. Step two: Get in your car, with about two hundred dollars and drive to the big box down the road, buy a shitload of tools and make sure there is a channel lock in the mix. C-h-a-n-n-e-l l-o-c-k. Step three, use the channel lock and remove the old shower head, not to mar it…..

    You get the point.

    Her Dad came over from then on.

  57. kfg

    The screw was a hex head bolt.

    Gave him a standard flat bladed screwdriver and a file, did you?

  58. EhIntellect
    They say they need a tool, want to exchange a shower head, need help and could I help?

    You could have asked them what they wanted in exchange for that shower head.

  59. I asked a blonde if she knew the difference between a nail, a bolt and a screw. Blank look, then said she’d never been bolted.
    Ba boom tish!
    (*groan*)

  60. Funny how women say they don’t need men. Until they do.
    My wife’s divorced friend asked me for help to move some furniture into her new house. I said I would send the missus over asap. No, she wanted me to come. I pointed out that she apparently had a boyfriend. Yes, he was there with her. What, can’t he handle it?
    I’m sick of my male privilege, always expected to help at any woman’s beckon call.

  61. @AR: “Gave him a standard flat bladed screwdriver and a file, did you?”

    It would have been interesting to see if he could have worked out the principle.
    I’m sure he also thinks he’s a cutting edge technologist, because he can post to Instagram from his smartphone.

    The word comes from the Greek; tekton* – one who is skilled at making things.

    *The word actually used to describe Jesus’s profession in the Bible. Not a carpenter as we think of it, but an all around designer and craftsman. More like the British meaning of “engineer.” Odysseus was also noted as an exceptional tekton.

  62. @ Lost Patrol

    Has your son incorporated/accepted RP? How did you approach it?

    I’ve been thinking how most effectively to introduce the subject to different people. It easiest when the subject is at their rope’s end. A colleague seems close, but I’m not sticking my neck out with him just yet. That’d be too easy as I know his wife well enough, oh yeah AWALT.

    Two other colleagues who’ve claimed the exact same desire to revive their dead bedrooms, quickly reversed course with the mildest of prompting. I think I said something like “You’re underestimating your skill set, your leverage, your potential.”

    After 10 minutes of sincere frustrated complaining/explaining about his wife’s dying libido, they panicky backtracked any need for help. “Oh, it’s not as bad as I said. I’m fine with it.” Show no weakness…

    I’m not pushy. In any successful cessation program, the subject must be independently willing.
    Some guys are easier prompted, RP friendly, but don’t know it yet. Guys are harder to manipulate, pride gets in the way.

    Rollo wrote about it before. Men’s massive sexual self-control to deny the natural urge vis-a-vis women is astonishing. Ironically, contrary to public belief, women are more sexually manipulable then men.

  63. @EhIntellect

    I would love to share some tactics here, but my then 22 year old son introduced me to RP. How’s that for a plot twist? I used to grumble about the endless anti-man, women are god message that permeates all of modern life; but I didn’t really know what was behind it. I was prepared to let the women become men and just leave me out of it. But of course as I know now, they categorically WILL NOT leave me out of it, or any of us. My son meanwhile had found the men’s sphere on his own, and having observed my position let his old pater in on the scene like a good lad. Bless him.

    Learning the RP truths happened for me as fast as I could read them. It’s easy to see yourself and your life in the TRM essays among others. You’ve done it, failed to do it, every woman you’ve ever known has acted like this, why wasn’t I told?, etc. You know the drill.

    I figured every man would want, and need to know this information; but I understood RP truth was a sort of thought crime that could lead to trouble for some if their employers, professors, religious leaders, and so forth found out about their interest in it. So I was careful in my specific targeting, but more general in dropping the occasional RP live grenade into a gathering to see reactions, which sometimes yielded more candidates.

    All that is to say HOWEVER, as many clairvoyants here predicted, men are not as enthusiastic for this knowledge as I took for granted. Progress is slow and there is even active resistance. Like you, I have some experience and some slicks when it comes to leading men. I’m a precision weapon, not a blunderbuss; but I have made little headway so far. My son reports similar difficulties with his age cohort of buddies, which surprised me even more.

    I know this has been discussed before, but my experience backs up your comments:
    It easiest when the subject is at their rope’s end.
    In any successful cessation program, the subject must be independently willing.

  64. This made me think of all the tweets I see from girls about hoping boys will one day have a daughter that has a boy treat her they way they treated a girl back in the day.
    The sisterhood’s protection network wouldn’t care to explain anything their sons are confused about what girls in their future would do out of their hypergamous nature.
    You really don’t hear it outwardly said from fathers who have sons.

  65. Keep posting Scrib beats the shit out of the boasters here that use this place as a mirror to inflate their egos.

  66. @EhIntellect
    March 23, 2017 at 9:24 am

    Fast forward to the previous comment thread re: “not talking fight club” “just getting it” (thank you Nova and SJF). I take it seriously, in spite of my devil-may-care attitude. Thus I institute a new DL RP policy yesterday. Let’s be tactful here. FFS, EhIntellect, stop being purposely stupid. Aye-aye.
    Kids all around, Mrs. Eh picking up, chores, she fixed me a drink. Happiness. I decide to broach the beta bait conversation, discuss Chateau’s common beta bait post, but opt to email my boy. I write him RP isn’t a toad slime, easing the fetid FI swamp-swimming. It’s stepping out of the filth, if possible, as he just did.

    He’s only three feet away. Email? Really, you fucking pussy EhIntellect! I admit I’m ashamed of my rank hypocrisy, weakness. I hadn’t been that indecisive since flailing last year. How am I to demonstrate MPO, mastery of fatherhood if I can’t, won’t convey my ideas openly, and auto-subjugate to the FI? Alphas not explicating, only demonstrating? My boys, family deserve more than an almost-Dad.

    When did this become part of the patriarchy equation? I’d rather suffer the venom of Mrs. Eh’s indignancy, let her auto-whipsaw, and be her rock to emotionally crash upon, she wants this too. She has stated so in word and deed, and apologized for her little pout. She’s thanking me daily for all this, and esp. exposing her to the perverse paralyzing-guilt church themes. She’s upset she wasted so many years hating herself, fearing social disapproval for loving me openly, the hobbling humility as holiness, saving her natural femininity because of sanctimonious fiction. Serving two masters was futile, burying her talents. The irony is thick now and she wants to make up for lost time.

    I’m relatively new to TRM. Perhaps, I’m missing the subtle technical expertise of running a smooth RP household, raising ZFG boys. I’m good at helping people, if only under my own roof.

    Careful there on the potentially slippery slope.

    It is vastly different to piss your wife off with the brief talk with your adult buddy in talking over red pill sexual strategy vs. being a red pill parent to your children in front of your wife.

    Those two things require different tacks in sailing. The former should be avoided for reasons explained in the OP, but the latter perhaps needs to have you leaning out to your edge as a red pill parent. Your son’s and daughter needs you to take the helm in being that red pill father that is confident in his parenting as a father with a complementary wife by your side.

    Some remedial reading in Rollo’s Red Pill Parenting series is perhaps in order, because there are tremendous nuances in this parenting issue.

    Go back and (re) read here the three part series:

    https://therationalmale.com/?s=red+pill+parenting

    That link has these three essays in reverse order. Lots of ground is covered and as always it is at times seemingly paradoxical, with very slight cognitive dissonance. But it is great perspective:

    THE RED PILL PARENT

    RED PILL PARENTING – PART I

    RED PILL PARENTING – PART II

    Bottom line is that you shouldn’t be apologetic about your red pill parenting. Or even having it be out in the open. It should be out in the open. (In contrast with helping your red pill buddies–adult males–get laid)

    Especially since your wife is buying into your value as a red pill husband and she is breaking out of the Hivemind Matrix. She is benefiting (and your children with benefit by her buying in to your red pill Frame) by you two developing a complementary parenting style. You the masculine father and her the feminine mother with a strong relationship will be better role models for your children to have a view of healthy long term relationships as they learn to have healthy relationships in the future.

    You appear to be doing everything right. Keep up the good work. You won’t get ultimate credit for it, but your wife and children are benefiting.

    As far as tips on red pill parenting for your sons, I’m afraid I don’t have many to give. I haven’t actually needed to give my son much remedial awareness and Game advice or adjust his red pill lenses because he has and is doing quite well on his own. He’s had a lot of reference experiences, doesn’t have needy tendencies, has success and charm with women, and hasn’t had any significant “ropes end” experiences. I’ve offered and introduced red pill thoughts, but he has declined in a way that he says he’s not interested or doesn’t need the help (cause he doesn’t much). He’s also not feminized or Blue Pilled, nor betatized. Obviously I’m there is he needs help.

  67. @LostPatrol
    Re: “ropes end… Willing”

    I’ve had less than a dozen such conversations. But short of a “…gonna end it all…” statement, who’s to say where another man’s rope ends? As I’m not a trained psyhrink, I’m certainly not a gauge. But I can recognize when someone is where I was.

    Guy next to you at the bar, maybe drinking like he can numb the pain… at least for the night. Mediocre girls happen by… You turn him into your impromptu wing…. They wander off & he goes darker. He’s angry and sad but mostly confused & you get his personalized flavor of the story most everyone here could tell. Maybe you relate with a parallel from your life. Regardless- not my job to fix… But I believe one has to extend a hand. Personally, all I do is open the door or plant a seed- pick your metaphor.

    I introduce TRM.com (I have literally written it on cocktail napkins more than once). I preface with three things: 1) a warning that you can’t “unread” it, but 2) it will change your life, and 3) what they choose to do with it is entirely on them.

  68. @Sentient

    Fleezer

    “part of me wishes I could go back and unlearn all this shit and just go at it like I used to, from the gut. I’ve got more control of my game than ever, but that took away all the romance for me. I liked the idea of “getting lucky”. now it’s just applying the formula, adjusting for variables and pushing to close. I don’t feel lucky anymore. I feel fucking sick.”

    I’ve felt the same way at times. It is worse within the day to day of an LTR… constantly barraged with inputs… HABD how have you felt?

    exactly the same… (except i don’t wish i could unlearn all this shit… bc i really was clueless…lol)

    the daily drip, drip of shit tests in ltr/marriage is the emotional equivalent of the chinese water torture…lol… but not kidding… it really does get old…

    but it’s better to KNOW and puke a couple times… than to keep getting slapped in the face every day and not know why your life sucks…

    bc after you puke it out, you can make some changes to your attitude/approach/MPoO… and focus on what you need to… which is to focus on YOU (just like Blaximus says…) with ‘girls’ (which includes wives…) only a small part of THAT… and i’m still working on making THAT change stick… with the FI’s knee on my neck and both hands on my shoulders…lol… but i’ll get there…

    good luck!

  69. “They are uninterested in the process of a man becoming anything, just that he is. If there is one thing Hypergamy demands to satisfy its inherent doubts is that men be genuine. How they became ‘genuine’ is irrelevant to women, just that they are genuine is enough. This is the conflict between women’s Ids and Egos – that a man might appear to be genuine in his quality is enough, yet not enough.”

    Authentic= not false or copied; genuine; real.

    Using the Dynamic, Passionate, Authentic model (about as subjective as any measure could be, but so is human communication, overall) the “learned” part my seem a little inauthentic. I know some folks might jump on that (and they’re right to) because most all human social engagement is learned behavior. People are mimics…that is how they learn.
    But, imagining a guy thinking over his every action with (“WWAAD?” what would an alpha do an “WWABD?”) kind of kills the mood.
    Men don’t experience this, obviously…most men love for their women do want to please them enough to study up on the matter, this would not kill the mood one iota.

  70. @fleezer, Sentient, Habd

    That discussion reminds me of different features of Identity. I can see Fleezer and Sentient falling in one camp and HABD and myself falling in a different camp. Neither is better, they are what they are. The first camp would be the artistic type. (A lot like my son’s ISFP type.) Pushing for Adventure, using “aesthetics, design and even their choices and actions to push the limits of social convention. ISFPs enjoy upsetting traditional expectations with experiments in beauty and behavior – chances are, they’ve expressed more than once the phrase “Don’t box me in!”

    The artist types live for “Happy Accidents” to occur in their pursuits. Cause those happen all the time for the competent artists and it is a dopamine laced thrill. Fleezer: “I’ve got more control of my game than ever, but that took away all the romance for me. I liked the idea of “getting lucky”. now it’s just applying the formula, adjusting for variables and pushing to close. I don’t feel lucky anymore. I feel fucking sick.”

    Feeling or thinking types on a “nature” scale determines how we make decisions and cope with emotions:

    People with the Feeling (F) trait follow their hearts and emotions and care little about hiding them. From their perspective, we should not be afraid to listen to our innermost feelings and share them with the world – these individuals tend to be compassionate, sensitive and highly emotional. They would rather cooperate than compete, although it would be a big mistake to see Feeling types as naïve or easily swayed – quite the contrary, they are likely to fight tooth and nail for what they believe in. For many Feeling types, their principles and ideals are much more important than, say, professional success. Or, to put it another way, this is a different kind of logic, one rooted in assessments of the feelings of others – a decision that makes everyone happier is just as valid as a decision that gets the job done fastest.

    –this and other quotes taken from 16Personalities.com

    The second camp are the scientists, (and yes those with autistic traits). They tend to be more purposeful about being in control. Fuck you Happy Accidents, I’ll control the outcome, but feel less worried about what that outcome really is. We take things as they come. More thinking than feeling. More thrilled about engineering the “design” of how we approach life to be just right.

    People with the Thinking (T) trait seek logic and rational arguments, relying on their head rather than their heart. They do their best to safeguard their emotions, shielding them from the outside world and making sure that they are not clearly visible. “Whatever happens, you must always keep a cool head” – this is the motto of Thinking types. However, this does not mean that these types are cold-blooded and indifferent. People with the Thinking trait are often just as emotional as those with the Feeling trait – but they tend to subdue and override their feelings with their rational logic.

    This also has a bit to do with the Assertive vs. Turbulent identities.

    Assertive vs. Turbulent identities (on a scale) show how confident we are in our abilities and decisions. In a way, it acts as an internal sensor, reacting to the input we get from the environment – for instance, success or failure, feedback from other people, pressure caused by unexpected events and so on.

    Assertive (-A) individuals are self-assured, even-tempered and resistant to stress. They refuse to worry too much and do not push themselves too hard when it comes to achieving goals. Similarly, they are unlikely to spend much time thinking about their past actions or choices – according to Assertive types, what’s done is done and there is little point in analyzing it. Not surprisingly, people with this trait report more satisfaction with their lives and they also feel more confident in their abilities to handle challenging and unexpected situations.

    In contrast, individuals with Turbulent (-T) identity are self-conscious and sensitive to stress. They experience a wide range of emotions and tend to be success-driven, perfectionistic and eager to improve. They are also more willing to change jobs if they feel stuck in their current one and to spend time thinking about the direction in which their life is going.

    However, while the Assertive variant may seem more positive on the surface, that is not always the case – for instance, Turbulent individuals perform better in certain roles as they push themselves to achieve superior results, while Assertive ones do not care about the outcome that much. Always feeling the need to do more, to have more, and to be more, Turbulent types often forget how exhausting that can be to both themselves and the people around them – but it is entirely possible that this desire to always push themselves just a little further helps many Turbulent types to achieve what they seek to achieve.

    Neither is better. Either can be used with Dynamic, Passionate and Authentic Mastery to achieve our goals with competence and competence. It’s OK for artistic types to feel that sick feeling from being boxed in because being boxed not their nature. (you’re going to be fine Fleezer….).

    Its OK for the scientific types to not sweat who they used to be (not feeling guilty or anxious about past faults. It was our own damn fault, we say, without damning ourselves. And who cares what are future outcomes are (able to be outcome independent) because with effort, intelligence and consideration, nothing is impossible.

    Go with your flow.

  71. I would love to share some tactics here, but my then 22 year old son introduced me to RP. How’s that for a plot twist?

    You might be surprised. When I was at the Man in Demand Conference in 2015 I had at least 3 father/son groups of guys who went to hear me speak. Beyond that I had other men tell me they were going to give the books to their sons or fathers too.

    It was very humbling and gave me hope for men that this would happen at all.

  72. “If you carried your thinking machine in your pants, you might have a basis for speaking about a man’s authenticity.”

    😉
    I can’t vouch for a man’s authenticity, only a woman’s interpretation of a man’s authenticity.
    (which is the matter at *cough* hand)

  73. @rugby – some feedback…. sometimes when I go watch your links, I have no idea what they have to do with the topic or comments, though I try

    if there is some connection, might have to spell it out for some of us slower folks

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