Hypergamy Knows Best

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One of the most basic Red Pill principles I’ve stressed since I began writing is the importance of Frame. The dynamic of Frame stretches into many aspects of a man’s life, but in a strictly intergender sense this applies to men establishing a positive dominance in their relationships with women. In a dating context of non-exclusivity (plate spinning) this means, as a man, you have a solid reality into which that woman wants to be included in. Holding Frame is not about force, or coercion, it’s about attraction and desire and a genuine want on the part of a woman to be considered for inclusion into that man’s reality.

Being allowed into a man’s dominant, confident Frame should be a compliment to that woman’s self-perception. It should be a prize she seeks.

This is a pretty basic principle when you think about it. The main reason women overwhelmingly prefer men older than themselves (statistically 5-7 years difference) is because of the psychological impression that men older than a woman’s age should be more established in his understanding of the world, his career, his direction in life and his mastery over himself and his conditions. From an Alpha Fucks perspective, the ambience of mastery makes an older man preferable, while a Beta Bucks older man represents the prospect of dependable provisioning.

In our contemporary sexual marketplace I think this perception – which used to hold true in a social climate based on the old set of books – is an increasing source of disappointment for women as they move from their post-college party years into the more stressful Epiphany Phase.

And once again we also see evidence of yet another conflict between egalitarianism vs. complementarity. Because all things should be equalized, equalism espouses that this age preference should make no difference in attraction, yet the influence of this natural complementary attraction becomes a source of internal conflict.

Women’s self-perception of personal worth becomes wrapped up in a tight egotistical package that’s tells her men – the men she’s convinced she deserves – should be attracted to and aroused by her based on whatever nebulous personal conviction she has, fat-acceptance approved ideas of what men should be hot for, and he ought to be ready to settle into a coequal parental ‘partnership’ when she’s finally ready to do the right thing.

It’s an interesting paradox. On one hand she’s expects a Hypergamously better than equitable pairing with a self-made man who will magically appreciate her for her self-perceptions of her own personal worth, but also to be, as Sheryl Sandberg puts it, “someone who wants an equal partner. Someone who thinks women should be smart, opinionated and ambitious. Someone who values fairness and expects or, even better, wants to do his share in the home.” In other words, an exceptional, high SMV man, with a self-earned world and Frame she wants to partake of; but also one who will be so smitten by her intrinsic qualities (the qualities she hopes will compensate for her physical and personal deficits) that he will compromise the very Frame that made him worthy of her intimacy, and then reduce himself to an equality that lessens him to her.

The Red Pill Father – Frame

The reason I’m going into this is because of a basic tenet of Frame: The Frame you set in the beginning of your relationship will set the tone for the future of that relationship. That isn’t to say men don’t devolve from a strong Alpha frame to a passive Beta one, but the Frame you enter into a relationship with will be the mental impression that woman retains as it develops. Your establishment and maintenance of a strong control of Frame is not just imperative to a healthy relationship and interaction with a woman, but it’s also vital to the health of any family environment and the upbringing of any children that result from it.

At the Man In Demand conference I was asked about my thoughts on the influence family plays in conditioning boys/men to accept a Beta role in life. Mainly the question was about a mother’s dominant influence on her children’s upbringing and how an unconventional shift in intersexual hierarchies predisposes her to imprinting her Hypergamous insecurities onto her children. It gave me a lot to think about.

A common thread I’ve occasionally found with newly Red Pill aware men is the debilitating influence their domineering mothers and Beta supplicating fathers played in forming their distorted perception of masculinity. I made an attempt to address this influence in the Intersexual Hierarchies posts, however, I intended those essays to provide an outline of particular hierarchical models, not really to cover the individual health or malaise of any of them.

From Frame:

The default pedestalization of women that men are prone to is a direct result of accepting that a woman’s frame is the only frame. It’s kind of hard for most ‘plugged in’ men to grasp that they can and should exert frame control in order to establish a healthy future relationship. This is hardly a surprise considering that every facet of their social understanding about gender frame has always defaulted to the feminine for the better part of their lifetimes. Whether that was conditioned into them by popular media or seeing it played out by their beta fathers, for most men in western culture, the feminine reality IS the normalized frame work. In order to establish a healthy male-frame, the first step is to rid themselves of the preconception that women control frame by default. They don’t, and honestly, they don’t want to.

Post LTR Frame
In most contemporary marriages and LTR arrangements, women tend to be the de facto authority. Men seek their wive’s “permission” to attempt even the most mundane activities they’d do without an afterthought while single. I have married friends tell me how ‘fortunate’ they are to be married to such an understanding wife that she’d “allow” him to watch hockey on their guest bedroom TV,…occasionally.

These are just a couple of gratuitous examples of men who entered into marriage with the frame firmly in control of their wives. They live in her reality, because anything can become normal. What these men failed to realize is that frame, like power, abhors a vacuum.  In the absence of the frame security a woman naturally seeks from a masculine male, this security need forces her to provide that security for herself. Thus we have the commonality of cuckold and submissive men in westernized culture, while women do the bills, earn the money, make the decisions, authorize their husband’s actions and deliver punishments. The woman is seeking the security that the man she pair-bonded with cannot or will not provide.

It is vital to the health of any LTR that a man establish his frame as the basis of their living together before any formal commitment is recognized.

The primary problem men encounter with regard to their marriages is that the dominant, positively masculine Frame they should have established while single (and benefitting from competition anxiety) decays to a Beta mindset and the man abdicates authority and deference to his wife’s feminine primary Frame. This is presuming that dominant Frame ever existed while he was dating his wife. Most men experience this decay in three ways:

  • A decline to his wife’s Frame via his relinquishing an authority he isn’t comfortable embracing.
  • An initial belief in a misguided egalitarian ideal that redefines masculinity has him surrender Frame
  • He was so pre-whipped by a lifetime of Blue Pill Beta conditioning he already expects to live within a woman’s Frame

Of these, the last is the most direct result of an upbringing within a feminine-primary Frame. I think one of the most vital realizations a Red Pill man has to consider is how Red Pill truths and his awareness of them influences the meta-dynamic of raising and instructing subsequent generations.

As I’ve intoned in many a post, Hypergamy is both pragmatic and rooted in a survival-level doubt about its optimization. When a woman’s insecurity about her life-determining Hypergamous decisions are concretely answered by the positively, conventionally, masculine Man who is both her pair-bonded husband and the father of her children, that doubt is allayed and a gender-complementary environment for raising children proceeds from that security.

In a positively masculine dominant Frame, where that woman’s desire is primarily focused on her man, (and where that man’s SMV exceeds his wife’s by at least a factor of 1) this establishes at least a tenable condition of quieting a woman’s Hypergamous doubt about the man she’s consolidated monogamy and parental investment with.

In a condition where that husband is unable or unwilling (thanks to egalitarian beliefs) to establish his dominant Frame this leaves a woman’s Hypergamous doubt as the determinant of the health of the overall family. That doubt and the insecurities that extend from Hypergamous selection set the tone for educating any children that result from it.

In the last post I made the case that deliberately single, primarily female, parents arrogantly assume they can teach a child both masculine and feminine aspects equally well. In the case where a wife/mother assumes the headship of family authority, both she and the Frame abdicating father/husband reverse this conventional gender modeling for their children.

That woman’s dominant Frame becomes the reality not just her husband must enter, but also their children, and also their family relatives. That feminine dominant Frame is one that is predicated on the insecurities inherent in women’s Hypergamous doubts.

Is he really the best she can do?”

Play Don’t Pay had an observation from the last post:

I think this “putting the kids first” phenomenon is very simple to explain. She DOESN’T WANT TO FUCK YOU!
She is using the kids as a shield, a barrier to deflect your UNWANTED BETA SEXUAL ADVANCES.
It is generally accepted that women are only interested in the top 20% of men, and if you are talking about as marriage partners I would agree with this.

However if you are talking about as SEX partners that they are genuinely hot for I would estimate this percentage to be north of 5% add in the frame required to maintain her SEXUAL interest in a marriage / LTR and your probably closer to 1-2%.
It’s really that simple! the women that are with these top tier men, the top 1-2% don’t need to be told to put them before the kids, they do it because he IS more important to her than her kids, because if he leaves she will never be able to replace him with another top tier man now she has his kids in tow.

Top tier men don’t raise other mens children and she knows this instinctively.
If you think you can mitigate this by being top 20% and reading a few articles on frame and dread game then I think you will be disappointed.

Sure you can improve your relationship but your probably not going to be able to command the visceral raw desire that women have for the top tier men that makes the do this shit naturally under their own violation.

“Is he really the best she can do?”

In a feminine-primary Frame, that question defines every aspect of that family’s life and development together. It’s important for Red Pill aware men to really meditate on that huge truth. If you do not set, and maintain, a dominant masculine Frame, if you do not accept you role in a conventional complementary relationship, that woman will feel the need to assume the responsibility for her own, and her children’s, security. Women’s psychological firmware predispose them to this on a visceral, limbic, species-survival level.

I’ve met with countless men making a Red Pill transition in life who’ve related stories about the burdening influence of their domineering mothers and Beta supplicating fathers leading to them being brought up to repeat that Blue Pill cycle. I’ve also counseled guys who were raised by their single mothers who had nothing but spite and resentment for the Alpha Asshole father who left her. They too took it upon themselves to be men who sacrifice their masculinity for equalism in order to never be like Dad the asshole. I’ve met with the guys whose mothers had divorced their dutiful fathers to bang their bad boy tingle generating boyfriends (whom they equally despised) and they too were molded by their mother’s Hypergamous decisions.

And this is what I’m trying to emphasize here; in all of these upbringing conditions it is the mother’s Hypergamous doubt that is the key motivating influence on her children. That lack of a father with a positive, strong, dominant Frame puts his children at risk of an upbringing based on that mother’s Hypergamous self-questioning doubt. Add to this the modern feminine-primary social order that encourages women’s utter blamelessness in acting upon this Hypergamous doubt and you can see how the cycle of creating weak, gender confused men and vapid entitled women perpetuates itself.

Finally, to the guys who are psychologically stuck on the shitty conditions they had to endure because of this cycle, to the men who are still dealing with how mommy fucked them up or daddy was a Beta; the best thing you can do is recognize the cycle I’ve illustrated for you here. That’s the first step. The Red Pill is great at getting you laid, but it’s much more powerful than that; it gives you the insight to see the influences that led to where you find yourself today.

Once you’ve recognized the Red Pill truths behind your Blue Pill conditioning, then it’s time to realign yourself, and recreate yourself in defiance to them. The longer you wallow in the self-pitiful condition that your mother’s Hypergamy and your father’s passive Beta-ness embedded in you, the longer you allow that Blue Pill  schema to define who you are.

Published by Rollo Tomassi

Author of The Rational Male and The Rational Male, Preventive Medicine

464 comments on “Hypergamy Knows Best

  1. “I’m guessing you don’t spend much time around the hipster set?”

    Nope. I didn’t even know there was a name for this “look”.
    Appears very much like a guy in drag to me.

  2. insanitybytes22

    October 3rd, 2015 at 4:54 pm

    This isn’t an answer to my question(s). So once more: Where did he specifically do this…in which post did this labelling occur?

  3. Insanitybytes, “Uh, yes you did. Your language,your attitude, your labeling, your relentless rage, all speak to the fact that you perceive women as dangerous, as a threat. The enemy.”

    Coming from the mouth who said:
    1, let him stink in the attic. (after killing him)
    2,using him as a combos to my flowers.

    Not one man in here EVER said these words about women.
    I bet you, you would do that to your God if he stops serving you.
    What a deranged woman you are.
    Ps,
    I still like you.

  4. Tomassi, I am not the least bit threatened by men finding their own worth and value. I think that is quite awesome, and yes attractive, too.

    However, your attempts to hide behind only being “descriptive rather than prescriptive” is a bit like handing out the recipe for explosives and then saying, “meh, what people do now is not my problem. I was only arming them and describing the enemy.”

    1. Go and have a look at the Alexa demographic stats for the blogs of Athol Kay, Mark Manson or Evan Mark Katz. Notice the pattern?

      All have grossly overrepresented female readership. Men don’t read these purple pill blogs much less follow along with their marketeer and those who do don’t stick around long. Why? Because they’re looking for answers, not more pandering to a never ending stream of how better to fulfill women’s insecurities.

      IB, this’ll be the last comment I make towards your fearful, self-righteous, concern trolling so read carefully. Thank whatever God it is you think listens to you that I don’t play patsy to women’s oblivious insecurities and try to cater whatever message I have to pacify men to be better Beta slaves for them.

      Red Pill men are the Men women really want. They are the men who Just Get It.

      They are men who know better than to bother with an endless tail chasing trying to appease whatever changing prerequisites women have at their various stages of tenuous maturity.

      They are men who wont waste your time or their own when it comes to intersexual relations.

      They are men who will raise up a new generation in, or exemplify for, a Red Pill awareness.

      They are men who see the Feminine Centric social order all around them and understand its all-encompassing influence.

      They are men who will accurately discern if a woman is worth more than a perfunctory fuck or if she’s amenable to earning his respect.

      These are the men women want and deserve, and I help to open their eyes every week.

  5. “So now you back track and attempt to distinquish that there is a “caring kind” of hypergamy?”

    Hell yes, Bitch, I’ll backtrack 27 years and allow my wife to choose me all over again. That’s the good, caring type of hypergamy.

  6. “Hate to you is a freed slave. Love to you is a mindful Beta. In the 13 years I’ve been writing I have rarely met a man I’d say ‘hated’ women. But I have had women accuse men of misogyny for merely disagreeing with them.”

    Gold.

  7. ” . . . a bit like handing out the recipe for explosives . . . ”

    You can buy them off the shelf, without ID, at any filling station, hardware store or supermarket.

    But maybe that’s a secret that only men above the age of 6 know.

  8. Tomassi: Smell that? You smell that?

    IBitch: What?

    Tomassi: Freedom From Constraint, son. Nothing else in the world smells like that.
    [kneels]

    Tomassi: I love the smell of Freedom in the morning. You know, one time we had a blog commented on, for 4 years. When it was all over, I logged on. We didn’t find one of ’em, not one stinkin’ bitch comment. The smell, you know that freedom smell, the whole blog. Smelled like
    [sniffing, pondering]

    Tomassi: Victory. Someday this war’s gonna end…
    [suddenly walks off]

  9. Someone should tell IB that those sandwiches wont make themselves, neither will the dinner, not to mention everything else…she’s outlived whatever quasi-usefulness she had.

    Begone rodent!

  10. insanitybytes22

    October 3rd, 2015 at 4:54 pm

    ““Where did he specifically do this…in which post did this labelling occur?”
    Women as the enemy? It’s in every single post and reinforced by the comments here.”

    If it’s “in every single post” it shouldn’t be too hard to give an example, should it?

  11. Engaging with that insane cunt is simply not worthwhile, guys. Don’t let her take another thread down the shitter.

  12. Oh, damn. I just realized that by wearing a green shirt today, my actions say women are the enemy.

    Hey! My shirt is green, too. What th’….?

  13. Whoever is butthurt about the police responding to domestic violence calls doesn’t deserve to live in a first world country. I wish he was born where police don’t care until you get killed (that’s still most part of the world), and had to go to sleep while listening to children’s screams from the room of the next door drunk. I don’t even believe his story it was only for telling his daughter to clean – all parents do it but almost nobody gets cops called on them, if there’s no actual yelling, cursing, throwing things and other threatening behavior involved. To call protection of the weak ‘evil government oppression’ is just like SJW calling another normal thing ‘evil patriarchy oppression’.

  14. @ Sun – Equating economic/political systems with intersexual dynamics as an argument to undermine my POV is intellectually vapid. Do better…

    My point, once again, is that a woman truly “getting” male reality might be moved to be a bit more generous with the power she has and actually lay some pussy on the poor bastards like Moonface – who is never going to be an alpha.

    I don’t know how much clearer I can make it:

    Not all men can be high value – axiomatically.

    Some men will always be desolate but all are programmed to crave pussy.

    Red Pill chicks claim they “get it” – if so, demonstrate it via actions, not blathering on blogs.

    What the fuck does socialism have to do with any of that? For some reason this argument bothers you and I’m not sure why. Tell me, what do you think the reaction of an actual “Red Pill woman” should be to her awakening and the knowledge of male reality? I’m not saying beta blue pill low value guys who never get any love are going to be transformed by it, I’m noting how most Red Pill woman are simply talking a good game but don’t actually change any of their sexual behavior. Hence, what the fuck good are they?

    Me, I’ve gotten more ass than any ten of you motherfuckers here – I don’t need or want sympathy sex. But as I made incredibly clear already, not all men are able to be alphas or leaders and as such will likely never get “desire” dominant sex. It’s a pretty basic reality. Life is a competition and as such there will always be winners and losers.

    But I have sympathy for guys like Moonface and I also get that “the strong must protect the weak”. I’m trying to get some poor incel/beta/low value aspergers suffering punk some ass here. Maybe one of the women who lurk here will suck the dick of such a guy tonight – that would be my victory. If I was a chick, I’d at least thrown him a handjob and let him play with my titties. That poor bastard deserves a taste of joy and the bliss female touch and sexual release can give a man, even if it’s shortlived.

  15. “Women are the enemy”. Hmm, the 26 yr old lost girl I personally coach and fuck sometimes just started her own business. She sent me an email on Thursday, here’s what it said.

    “. I keep saying,” its not If Dad, its When.” and then a small smile comes across his face and I can see how proud he is of my thought processes and that he made this little mind of mine. 🙂

    It feels so amazing to have a plan Glenn. I feel like I’m not so lost anymore.

    Gahhhh! I’m excited about this… very excited.”

    She’s been a fuckup her whole life. After 15 months of thrashing it out with her and never giving up on her – went 8 months without fucking her – she’s finally pulled her head out of her ass and started making something of herself. She’s on her own path of self-improvement. She’s won back the respect of her Dad – due to my influence on her. What, IBCuntBitchFucktard – is she my enemy?

    Here’s what you don’t get, you nasty slag. Women get no credit with me just for being women anymore. I take people as they come. This woman, N., has potential and some inner spark, and I decided to take on nurturing that ember into something. I decided to help her as a human being, even when she had a boyfriend and decided to not fuck me anymore. I kept at it.

    As I told her, “I take your life more seriously than you do” at one point. I’ll stand for people who are worth it.

    But you, IB? I wouldn’t piss on you if you were on fire. The notion that what you say matters to me at all is laughable. I zip by loser, loudmouth cunts like you everyday and just keep on keeping on in my life. A new friend’s wife just told her husband that “I love Glenn”. Another woman I just me, in a friendly way, spontaneously just hugged me on Friday because of my energy and how good our conversation made her feel. I get along great with many women – but when they pull the shit you have? I let them have it with both barrels without a second thought or regret.

    Tell me, how many woman’s lives have you affected the way I did this young woman’s? She’s not the only one I’ve helped either – 2 others are sober from opiates today because of me, in their words, not mine. They told me it was because of me.

    What have you got, you shitbag? Some blog where you preen about your pseudo-intellectual drivel and pointless, self-serving analysis?

    I shit out a turd more consequential than you this morning. Fuck off now, you ignorant, nasty, bilious harpy.

  16. “To call protection of the weak ‘evil government oppression’ is just like SJW calling another normal thing ‘evil patriarchy oppression’.”

    Any limits on that “protection”? The evil isn’t in government exactly but rather in the strong abdicating their responsibilities and outsourcing things like “protecting the weak” to corrupt institutions.

    Carried to its extreme we allow the gov complete power to protect the weak from everything. Ultimately that protection is a misguided effort to protect people from themselves. So let’s ban guns, and other weapons entirely, and allow any criticism of a parent to result in a CPS investigation. While we’re at it let’s create a system that protects the feelings of the weak, and protect the weak from the consequences of their actions. Let’s criminalize, and punish strength because the weak lack it. Let’s make everyone equal by codes enforced by violence. Don’t forget the weak often have inferior material circumstances so let’s also “spread the wealth around” because it protects the weak from their own weakness. Ultimately the protection offered is an agreed upon lie that the weak are strong, and the strong are weak.

  17. Well Tomassi, even though scribblerg is attempting to vomit obscenities and hatred all over me, I did compel him to rather defensively protest that he does indeed love women, which speaks well to your post, “Are we Our Sister’s Keeper?”

    Yes, yes you are because mens very sense of worth and value comes from how you perceive yourself in women’s eyes, whether or not you deem yourselves worthy and useful to her. That sucks, I empathize there and I truly believe it is women’s job to show men that they do have worth and value in our eyes. That is our part of the biological equation. Unfortunately we can’t do it if you are not your sister’s keeper.

    Also a bit amusing, but I see even scribblerg responds right on cue to a well orchestrated poo test, with rather predictable results.

  18. …because mens very sense of worth and value comes from how you perceive yourself in women’s eyes, whether or not you deem yourselves worthy and useful to her.

    No, dearie. You’re projecting your own female insecurities onto men yet again.

    Men want women, but do not need them. Women need men, period. All your rather vicious empty-headed banging here is clearly intended to get men to qualify themselves to you, and by proxy to all women.

    It’s way too late around here for that game to work. And there’s no way anyone with a mean streak such as you have displayed will ever qualify to any of us.

    Nobody here likes or respects you. We just point and laugh at the object lesson you provide of female solipsism, entitlement and aging bitterness.

    Ta ta, dearie. I know you’ll be back for more. You can’t help yourself, the fried ice is calling your name…

  19. Go and have a look at the Alexa demographic stats for the blogs of Athol Kay, Mark Manson or Evan Mark Katz. Notice the pattern?

    All have grossly overrepresented female readership.

    Did not know that, but at lease in the case of Athol it makes perfect sense ever since he gave his wife some power over comments. The last time I tried to wade through a comment stream it was all about teh wimmenz. Not as bad as $usan Wal$h’s blog became, but heading in that direction.

    Men don’t read these purple pill blogs much less follow along with their marketeer and those who do don’t stick around long. Why? Because they’re looking for answers, not more pandering to a never ending stream of how better to fulfill women’s insecurities.

    Men solve problems. Women talk about problems. The other month I was listening to a 30-something woman talk, and in a moment of candor she said something like “I have 200 things to worry about and my husband says that like 197 of them are of my own making”. I had to agree with her husband.

    Zed once proposed that Spearhead should be a male only zone. It didn’t fly with Welmer, but in fact thanks to various commenters it was male only de facto, if not dejure. Most women can’t take the heat of male discourse, and very few can engage in sustained logical argumentation. We see that here. And we see mighty few women who follow a logical argument to the end. Most of them just aren’t built for it.

  20. liz
    Nope. I didn’t even know there was a name for this “look”.
    Appears very much like a guy in drag to me.

    I see some number of manjaws on millennial women…

  21. @insanitybytes22

    “However, your attempts to hide behind only being “descriptive rather than prescriptive” is a bit like handing out the recipe for explosives and then saying, “meh, what people do now is not my problem. I was only arming them and describing the enemy.”

    It’s so obvious you have absolutely no intention of reaching the merits of what Rollo or anyone else here has written, Keep fishing for victim points amongst men who you insult with ad hominems who don’t care about your games or your pill consumption.Tell yourself you’re a winner when a funeral home is primed to make money off of your upcoming failure.

    “I can’t tell
    How’s this shit not your fault?
    Bitch, you’re barbaric
    Get off of this earth
    Switching command
    Just because I can
    I like to see you wear it
    Why can’t I stare?
    Switching command
    Just because I can
    And if I let my guard down
    Who knows what then?
    Once again
    Just because I can
    Just because I can”

  22. @Insanitybytes ,
    Deep inside, how do you feel about having to personalities?
    There is no red pill women or blue pill women, there are Insanitybytes.
    Women know exactly how to suck and swallow, whether she’s red or blue or pink.
    Don’t bring Glenn as an example, he is as deranged as you.(sorry Glenn).

  23. Insanitybytes
    “Yes, yes you are because mens very sense of worth and value comes from how you perceive yourself in women’s eyes, whether or not you deem yourselves worthy and useful to her. That sucks, I empathize there and I truly believe it is women’s job to show men that they do have worth and value in our eyes. That is our part of the biological equation.”

    PUSSY UBER ALLES.
    Sieg hail!
    Pussy, pussy.

    Fixed it for you.

  24. @scribblerg

    Equating economic/political systems with intersexual dynamics as an argument to undermine my POV is intellectually vapid. Do better…

    And you’re intellectually lazy. The fact that Rollo (and many smart guys) equate the two by calling it a sexual market place makes plenty of sense. Ignored everything else after that. Insulting me won’t make me listen. You do better.

    Don’t think you just get to bully and I’ll listen. It don’t work that way with me. You know that by now.

  25. @scribblerg

    And for the record the reason I don’t care about any further argument with you on the matter is as follows:

    Do women currently do what you suggest? No.
    Will women ever do what you suggest? Hell no.
    Will women ever even do the small thing I suggest and bring their expectations in line with reality? Not without losing a good portion of the male population.
    Will women, even “Red Pill” women stop fucking hollow Alphas? A couple million years of evolutionary momentum says no.

    The entire suggestion and debate is just pissing in the wind. You and I both know it. There’s no point in even raising the subject with women of any stripe. Don’t waste anymore time on it, because I’m not going to.

  26. @Sun Wukong

    I agree with you. I think Scribblerg’s point was roughly in line with yours – his comments are mostly intended to show the absurdity of women calling themselves ‘red pill’ – when they would never even contemplate doing what he suggests. He’s contrasting that reality with the compassion red pill men see incels clearly warrant.

    He’s playing fast and loose with your arguments to make that point. So I’m not faulting you for defending against that shit 😉

    Not trying to be the Official Scribblerg Interpreter here, I’m just more attentive to subcommunications lately…

  27. @kfg, M Simon

    Thank you for your responses to me re: continuing pain.

    kfg: ‘” . . . am I holding back on something?”
    Yes.
    “And the pain changes subtley over time, finding new objects. ”
    This is transference, an avoidance behaviour. What you are holding back on is the original object(s).”

    Kinda what I’m afraid of. I’ve done everything I currently know to find the source. I’m running out of ideas. Maybe it’s not something you can force yourself into….I could tell stories about my life. But not now. Suffice it to say the most obvious sources of pain could well come from before I could form clear memories. I’m not sure how to access that.

    M Simon: “Healing can’t begin until you remove yourself from the source of pain. That is always the first step. The beatings must stop.”

    Heh. Still see the old one-itis frequently at work. It hurts less now – almost not at all most of the time. The constant IV drip of pain was killing me. Now, it’s mostly the consistent deprivation of sexual contact that continues pain. I’m working on it but I’ve made my life busy lately. Mostly in good ways.

    These are different ideas for me to watch. Above all, I’m trying to understand what is going on and how it gets fixed, if it does. I want to know. And if possible, I want to be able to teach to others who need to understand. This world has enough difficulty as it is without such pain.

    Any input is welcome.

  28. “liz
    I see some number of manjaws on millennial women…”

    That’s true.
    I don’t see the jaw in the photo, but she’s a strange looking one.
    I’d say
    Caitlyn Jenner is to Bruce Jenner as
    Donald McDonald is to this chick above.

  29. I have known a few female incels. Yes, I know, they can get it if they go down to a bar and offer it up, but these ones weren’t willing to do that, and they weren’t attractive women and knew it. The bar is a lot lower for women, true, but I have seen women come across with that level of desperation.

    To be honest, I wasn’t attracted to them. Some things are attractive or not attractive across genders. Being an asshole is probably beneficial to a woman as well, especially if she’s content attracting and manipulating weak men.

    I was in the incel, celibate, whatever situation (I was not really seeking it out very much) and I don’t know that a freebie would have helped all that much. It would probably only help if the guy has built himself up enough that he can eventually get it for real. Then it might be a bit of a booster shot.

    Like MSimon, I did know one generous, experienced woman. Wasn’t involved with her, but she did help my development. There are a few out there of both genders. Not a lot.

  30. “Poo test” – lol, oh, really, I’ve changed my mind Rollo, don’t ban her. She’s just too rich. As though I’m qualifying for her, wow. I’m just making clear to men here and others that I don’t hate women at all. I do speak straight to them, and don’t tolerate shit from them – but those who I choose to bring into my dominant frame are showered with love and support and protection and wisdom and provisioning (in very small doses, i’d rather cook a meal for a woman than take her to a restaurant).

    But given the sliver one gets of me here on this forum and my balls to the walls approach, one might get the idea that I’m down on women or have a difficult time with them. So I wanted to make clear with facts in my real life what goes on with women just by citing three instances from just Thurs and Friday this past week to provide a glimpse of who I am in the world. I have fully integrated my leadership and wisdom into my frame now and people run at me these days to be in my world. It’s just amazing and is all due to the Red Pill in the sense that it was the last step in me really stepping up to and owning my true power.

    Interestingly, IB claims I’m making an “attempt” to vomit obscenities at her – no, I succeeded you stupid, vapid quim. It’s not really hard to “attempt”, one just says “Your are a cunt, IB” and voila, the task is done.

    Carefully examine her rhetoric guys. She’s currently in a repair phase socially, trying to re-brand herself after Rollo exposed her for the fraud she is. But even now her irrationality and self-serving nature must peek through. She can’t even string a rational sequence of words or thoughts together.

    One of the impolite truths we don’t discuss much here or anywhere in society is how stupid many women are, and how far they over-estimate their own intelligence. After 50+ years of “you go gurl” and “girl power” and FI generated memes about equality and women’s superiority (notice how crazy that is “we’re equal, but better than you too!” – just more idiocy), cunts like IB actually believe they are smart.

    IB probably has a slightly above average IQ, yet I’m sure she believes she’s brilliant. Fyi, I know I’m brilliant – intelligence tests have shown it for my entire life and people regularly tell me I am. I don’t care about that, but what comes along with being in the top .3% of of the human population in abstract reasoning and verbal abilities is being able to easily assess other’s intelligence. In fact I have to often dumb down my ideas to my audience. One of the “oh shit” moments of my Red Pill journey is when I looked at how intelligence distributes itself among women versus men – there are many, many more brilliant men than women. It’s like 8:1 men vs. women at the brilliant level. Lol, this alone explained so much about the world to me.

    Never do I have to dumb myself down so as much as when I’m speaking to women. It’s weird, many women have succeeded in seeming bright, and I guess this is no surprise as women focus so much on the social and emotional that they become experts as “signalling” rather than substance. In my field of technology I’ve always “kept up” and as women have entered the business many have mastered the art of seeming smart. I can’t tell you how many times I’ve “deep dived” into a tech subject with them, thinking they know what I know and realized after 30 seconds that they don’t know shit – AND DON’T CARE TO KNOW. For example, I just read a great book called The Phoenix Project about DevOps and I tried to talk to a female colleague about it and her eyes glazed over.

    IB is no different. Shallow, barely intelligible, incoherent, inconsistent but full of brio and self-confidence. Just wait till something actually needs to be built or fixed are something hard needs to get done in the world, she’ll be on the sidelines watching men – but still thinking she’s my equal. IB is not my equal, she’s like a child, yet the world tells me I should treat her like my equal. Not anymore, bitch.

  31. @Rollo – Your last comment to IB was a tour de force. No shock about those other blogs, I was nauseated just glancing at Athol Kay’s…

  32. Did not know that, but at lease in the case of Athol it makes perfect sense ever since he gave his wife some power over comments. The last time I tried to wade through a comment stream it was all about teh wimmenz. Not as bad as $usan Wal$h’s blog became, but heading in that direction.

    MMSL is not “heading in that direction”, it has been a purple pile of gynocentric shit from the beginning, just like HUS. Kay specifically stated numerous times that he deletes comments that advocate Red Pill thought or oppose Marriage 2.0. He’s just another opportunist who wanted to cash in on the growing popularity of Red Pill thought by repackaging it as useless rubbish for female consumption.

  33. @Anonymous – Spot on commmentary above, every word. This in particular “Men want women, but do not need them. Women need men, period. All your rather vicious empty-headed banging here is clearly intended to get men to qualify themselves to you, and by proxy to all women.”

    But don’t get carried away. A woman can only get a man to qualify for her if the man cares about her opinion. Putting a cunt in her place is not “qualifying”. This is also a forum where tens of thousands of men lurk, as do many women and there is value to explicating on IB’s nonsense as we are limited to commenting. IRL, I would smirk and simply avoid IB and get on with more important things. But here it’s valuable to analyze her as an exemplar of cuntishness. She’s like the prototype of a covert cunt so it’s instructive to take her apart.

    My “diagnosis” of her is different from Rollo’s. I think she has covert narcissistic personality disorder. Such women overtly attempt to seem sweet and nice publicly but then when it really comes down to serious dealings, they want to chop you up and stuff your smelly corpse in an attic. Men should learn from IB here. The games she plays are common today and can be very difficult for men to traverse successfully if they don’t see through her.

  34. Zed once proposed that Spearhead should be a male only zone. It didn’t fly with Welmer

    Ah, Welmer. He really revealed himself to be a fucking wanker before he deleted his lame-ass website. In his last posts he was shitting all over MRAs and MGTOWs and predicted that they’ll side with rabid feminists in the culture war against blameless tradcons. Wtf? He was completely eviscerated by some family court, and yet decided to start cohabiting with another broad and sired yet another child. What kind of idiot do you have to be to do something like that? He’s a typical victim of the feminist matriarchy, a man that has his life destroyed, and the only way his mind can deal with that is by seeking refuge in delusions.

  35. @Sun – Say’s you. Amazing how you know the future and how women will react. IRL, I can get women to do things you never think they would. I’m doing an experiment here to see if that svengali like/hypnotic effect can be transmitted to RP chicks via a blog. If just one of them gives a sympathy hand job to someone like MoonFace, my work here is worthwhile. Women can be manipulated into having sex in many, many ways and this is really just an experiment.

    “Will women, even “Red Pill” women stop fucking hollow Alphas?” – Who says they are “hollow”, you? This smacks of alpha-hating “why do girls always fuck the assholes when I’m such a good guy”. Most guys you think are “hollow alphas” probably have a shitload more on the ball than you know. Watch out for this kind of thinking, it’s a Blue Pill trap. Just to shove it right down your throat, why do you think so many young chicks today love big, black, thug cock? Cuz those guys really know how to act like men and have tapped into an anti-social vibe which signals their dominance and focus on their sexual nature and their rejection of anodyne, mainstream, Blue Pill white society. He may live on his grandmother’s house, but he’s got something you don’t – real IDGAF and an ability to be very masculine and sexual in a way that many white guys can’t/won’t. Ditto for bikers and other outlaws you and I would call lowlifes. Don’t kid yourself, your conformity with societies strangling norms is not compensated for by buying a fast motorcycle – been their, done that with dry pussy on the back seat. I had a good friend in NYC who was a tall, fit black man with musical talent – but couldn’t hold a job and mooched off of women constantly. I remember him getting thrown out of one woman’s apt he was living in because he was getting a blowjob from another chick on her couch, in her living room when she came home. Is he a “hollow alpha”? Perhaps you don’t really understand alpha and how women see value?

    But in the end, what’s more interesting to me is your investment in my commentary. I’m not asking you to blow anyone, why do you care so much? This has really hooked you and I suggest you figure out why.

    I’ll continue to talk about it as much as I want, fyi. ZFG about your POV on the matter. My main point, as Forge gets, is to haul supposed RP chicks on the carpet for their hypocrisy. “Learning implies a permanent change in behavior” – RP men know this. As far as I can tell, RP chicks are so in order to encourage more alpha to improve their ability to skim off the cream. Which of course doesn’t earn any “respect” from me at all.

  36. Whenever I read online calls for more male self-improvement, I’m reminded that Roosh is advocating the same thing, yet at the same time he writes one detailed article after another describing how such attempts at self-improvement are bound to have more and more diminishing returns in a world that is less and less suited for sane men. Funny guy, he is.

  37. This is serious shit going on (with all this feminism, etc.).
    It’s a global scale social engineering.
    It’s more than “global shit test”.
    Women are puppets here (tools only, useful idiots) – at early stage they benefit from it (“Matrix” protects them by law & media), but later they will be equal to men (read: equally enslaved).
    Goal is to make the ultimate beta male society – because it will not be able to perform any revolution!
    So elites/royals will continue to rule this planet.
    These “master-race” psychopaths will do anything to keep their positions.
    To be successful (to fight human nature), beta-conditioning of males must start early (so System is bullying kids at school for “staring” at girls, etc.), it’s obvious.

  38. @Forge – Suggestion:

    Try releasing all attachment and resistance to your emotional states. Imagine yourself as a cup of tea. Your emotions/thoughts are the tea and you are the cup. Cultivate the ability to be “the listener” so you have thoughts and feelings, instead of being them. Analyzing trauma an pain are important as one must be aware of what’s going on with themselves in order to deal with it, but the solution is always the same.

    The most brilliant bit of wisdom imparted to me when i was a practicing Buddhist was by an amazing master, an older Vietnamese monk. I would got to sit with my sangha on Sunday’s and after the meditation we’d have a dharma talk. The interchange follows:

    Western Buddhist who’s entire approach to meditating and Buddhism was about medicating his pain and looking better than other westerners he thought were defective (a very common archetype in the western Buddhist community): “Master, what should I do when I become angry or sad?”

    Master: “Invite your anger in for a cup of tea and sit with it. It will eventually leave on it’s own.”

    I did so much therapy to deal with the traumas and abuse I suffered as a child (serious physical, emotional and sexual abuse, death of my mom when I was 11, divorce of my dad and stepmom and abandonment by my Dad just to give guys here who don’t know my background the highlights) and while the self-awareness part of that was very useful, I believe much of the analysis of it fed my suffering and angst.

    While I made some progress, after CPTSD destroyed me after my rock climbing fall 12 years ago, I found normal therapy (which I had already done 14 years of, on and off throughout my life) was useless. Some idiotic therapist tried Cognitive Behavioral Therapy with me (nothing new, it was invented in the ’70s and I was first exposed to it in 1981 as “Rational, Emotive Psychotherapy) which only made me more miserable. The worst thing to do with someone dealing with trauma is to get them more in their head and more into “trying” to be calmer or happier. CBT is good for someone without real psychological pathology, who is perhaps trying to get over a loss or setbacks but is otherwise well adjusted. But for people with real problems? It’s garbage. The real reason it’s popular now is two-fold. First, most of psychology and therapy is an abject failure. Second, it’s cheap. It’s also been packaged as “Solution Oriented Brief Therapy” – which basically means insurance companies can cap paying for therapy sessions after 8-10 of them. Lol – the entire field is largely a joke.

    My relief finally came from the following:

    1. Accessing what law enforcement and the military have learned about dealing with trauma, as follows:
    – Develop emotional resilience. Do some googling on how to do this along with the term trauma/ptsd and you’ll see volumes on it.
    – Develop an attitude of “pragmatic optimism”.
    – Attempt things like re-visualization of traumas, where you bring them up and then re-shape them in your mind. I turned a vicious attack by a babysitter and her brother into a pillow fight with feathers flying everywhere and dancing to music in my mind. This rewires neural pathways and reduces/eliminates the charge trauma has for folks who haven’t transcended it.
    – You can also try EMDR (rapid eye movement) and other modalities. These also work at the neurological level, not the psychological level

    2. I discovered The Sedona Method Release Technique – This is a way to bring up all emotions that swirl inside of us and release them. It’s simple yet incredibly powerful. This is the single most powerful part of my recovery from CPTSD, by far. Google them, buy their course (audio stuff) and do the exercises. You will have amazing results within 30 days and you will no longer have out of control emotional states if you do the work. Sadly, almost nobody I recommend this to actually takes the recommendation and does the entire 30 day course. A little peek into what is amazing about it? Detaching from positive emotional states is even more freeing and energizing than releasing negative ones.

    I go into all of this here not only for you, of course. Many men suffer from childhood trauma. In my family system, only the boys got beaten. Men suffer the majority of child abuse, yet women run around as though they have cornered the market on abuse – again, their solipsistic nature makes me puke on this count. Male suffering from this crap is an epidemic in our society, yet the first thing we do is stigmatize men who express their sadness or rage. You are either a pussy or an “aggressive” man who is “scary” or “violent” (they now use the world violent to include making women feel badly, lol – the U.N. has actually formalized this in its policies as an example).

    I hope this is of some value to men here who are suffering from trauma and emotional turmoil. I had already done a lot of this work when my world exploded to due my daughter, which brought me to the Red Pill. The Red Pill had me accept myself at a much more profound level and I used the above tools to deepen my recovery and healing as once I put myself as my own point of mental origin, I gobbled up the approach and techniques whereas in the past I often found myself backsliding and resistant to doing that which helped me even when I knew what was good for me. Now? The idea of not doing what serves me and heals me seems absurd. What could be more important? I also shucked the shame I felt at “being broken”. I always felt inferior due to this and also felt angry about it. That shit is all in my rearview now.

    I’m off now to enjoy this Sunday. Hope you guys do too.

  39. Many men suffer from childhood trauma. In my family system, only the boys got beaten. Men suffer the majority of child abuse, yet women run around as though they have cornered the market on abuse – again, their solipsistic nature makes me puke on this count.

    It’s also a fairly convenient distraction from the fact that child abuse is often either committed, or indirectly facilitated, by women.

  40. Folks,

    Another amazing thread. I have a busy weekend so I was unable to read all the responses but I wanted to respond to the people who gave me some input.

    First, I appreciate it to all.

    Two, in order of Appearance:

    @kobayashii1681,

    ”Who looks outside, dreams; who looks inside, awakes.” – Carl Jung

    Introspection…this and perseverance. Take time…it’s a journey. I think introspection is innate to men, but like the alphaness, it is socialised out of us, just in case one day we’re like “tha fuck?!….I’m outta here!” and realise that the game is rigged.

    This makes sense on a couple of levels. A couple of years ago, I had, not sure how to put it, but perhaps an awakening is a good way to put it. I’ve written about it before, and I am still grappling with what exactly happened.

    It wasn’t Red Pill knowledge coming to me…that come before. It was, well honestly, it was like I realized I HAD been sleeping and suddenly I had woken up. Maybe it was the Red Pill really catching up to me, but it like my programming was interrupted and I looked at my life and went, “what the hell?”

    It wasn’t like I was not dissatisfied and frustrated before, but…it was like I first truly sensed what my potential had been, what it still was, and maybe I WAS finally aware of things that previously had just passed under my nose. It was a first glimpse at my own real agency is one way I might put it…that I actually had a choice in this life.

    I am not describing it well, but further down I think I figured out something.

    @wacokid

    Nice. Keep that up. Argue as little as possible and try not to get mad or show that you are mad. My wife asks me why we never go out to dinner? I just tell her we never ended the evening with sex, that is why. I also tell her that if we are not having regular sex I am not going to listen to her boring ass stories…The more you push back, the better you will feel and the easier things will get with her. My wife is responding with much better sex and she does not question everything I say or do now.

    Couple of similar micro examples.

    One, my wife was always harping on the money I spent to buy food at work, yet my wife does not cook very often and while she shops, she does not do it religiously. She kept mentioning how expensive it is to buy takeout compared to making stuff at home, and she’s right.

    It took me a while to realize that if she was SO concerned with it, though, she would be fucking cooking and preparing my meals a whole lot more. She was not working or working part time during a lot of this harping. Sometimes she would make stuff for me, sometimes not.

    Bottom line, I finally said, “fuck it! I need to eat…”

    I started buying whatever I wanted at work and ignored her.

    What did she do?

    She started preparing more meals for me, and while I still buy shit at work often, she has not brought it up in months.

    Two, as I mentioned, I began to realize that while my wife downplayed my needs sexually, she had no qualms with monopolizing my time with HER needs by talking my ears either on the phone or after I got home. Or with asking me to do the Honeydoo list, or spend time with her family, etc.

    In essence, she was being mindlessly selfish about her needs, and I told her so.

    Now, I understand bringing it up directly was bad because it is negotiating desire, but at that point I felt I needed to make the point explicit and get it through her solipsism shields. Like a lot of women, they really have no idea what the male sex drive is really like and are self-centered.

    Also, quit with the “tempting” excuse for not losing weight. I did the same thing, got in shape and now have all the divorced ladies in the neighborhood talking to me and actually touching me on my evening walks. And for you guys rolling your eyes on someone getting touched, try being married for 30 years…

    Yes, I see the folly in that. Residual Blue Pill Betaness? It has to be focused on what MY goal is and where I want to be. I will deal with the results when they emerge. I was making an excuse not to try.

    And in regards to touch…

    Really can relate. Just this week, had a women I consider very attractive (not only for looks, but because she acts like a women in the best sense) work closely with me. We are friendly, and I always sensed she found me attractive, but more than once she made a point of touching me in a very familiar and warm way and sat very close, skirted, crossed legs pointed right at me.

    Grrr, baby!

    No, it was not anything major, but the way she touched me was warmer than my spouse has managed in a long while. It gave me a very pleasant feeling that had little to do with lust.

    Now, I now am fully aware that part of that may be a manipulation on her part (i.e., can you make an effort for me, pretty please?), but I think a lot of women are unable and/or unaware of the simple power of that, or if they are, they use it very selfishly.

    If she is being primarily manipulative and not expressing some genuine affection or attraction, then she at least fakes it very goddamn well, which is more than one can say for a lot of women, especially those in LTR’s.

    Keep posting your progress

    UPDATE:

    My wife and I actually had few hours to ourselves in the morning for a change. She came back from a meeting, and initiated, which I was not expecting. I was frankly expecting another day without sex.

    She not only initiated, but she also was a lot more playful and surprised the hell out with trying to sex things up a little bit.

    She played lingerie model, and for the FIRST fucking time wore high heels while doing so. What a FUCKING difference!

    My wife is not young, but she is an attractive women, particularly with a shape what puts many women even younger to shame. Problem is, she does not play that shit up. I have told her numerous times she has a great shape and could rock a bikini, especially compared to the warthogs that do so nowadays.

    NOPE. Never does.

    Now, in front of me, I see in a outfit I picked out, what a fine piece of ass she really is. She actually made an effort to be sexual. What a concept!

    So, something must be working.

    I suppose it did not hurt that a friend of hers commented recently on how much slimmer I look.

    @SJF,

    Your wife has needs too. One is for you to be the man she wants to fuck.
    You need to make yourself better. Whether it takes 6 months, 18 months or
    24 months (a month for every year of marriage is the median).
    She needs to babble/talk and you need to listen. You have to at least pretend/show/fake or indeed be genuine in showing you care and you have to not get distracted by her lack of grounding in what she needs to do. She didn’t sign up for a guy she doesn’t want to fuck and doesn’t want to listen to her hamster babble.

    Yes, she has needs, but so do I, and quite frankly, she’s been getting hers met a lot more for over a decade.

    I make her come, ALWAYS, and I listen to her babble, and make a great wage with awesome benefits and am in any number of ways helpful and supportive.

    When I have brought up my sexual needs, she argues that we are just fine.

    But listen in the future after you gain her admiration and respect, you keep frame and your own point of mental origin. first things first, but don’t be an incomplete masculine man.

    I understand about making sure to be well-rounded and the whole package, but I have put my needs aside for so long, I need to yank the wheel hard the other direction just to straighten it out.

    I appreciate the links and I will look at them because someone else mentioned his basic stuff might be useful even if he went Purple pill, but I have to say I already tried the Athol stuff; even bought his book, MMSL.

    I related it here before that I reading through it, really even studying it, when I fucking realized couldn’t do it. Not improving myself, but feeling like I was being forced to jump through just to get better access to my wife’s love, affection and yes pussy, and I was like, What the FUCK!?”

    All my life I have been catering to everyone else’s needs, thinking that I would receive reciprocation, particularly from women, to be bitterly disappointed. That was what I woke up from, from this script of being a good robot doing X to receive Y, and then ended up with a Null value.

    I can’t do it anymore.

    Real desire on a woman’s part never comes from rational, reasonable explanations of why she should desire you, it comes from your demonstrations and your example.

    This is what I an doing, but I am doing it by making clear that I can and will live my life without her quite happily if she does not up her game. And I fucking meant it. I can go either way, but I want to be happy and satisfied.

    SHE HAS TO UP HER GAME.

    I am upping mine, and I will consider all bids that I receive as it were.

    I am NOT openly declaring it to her, of course, but I am bit by bit showing her that I could live a life apart from her if I needed to, and I don’t mean after I am too old to appreciate it.

    It’s her move.

    If a man is deficient, he needs to make himself better at being a man.

    Yes, but a woman who is deficient needs to make herself a better woman, or a man gets himself a better woman. Unfortunately, most women do not get that same pressure, because they are insulated from the consequences.

    Mine is receiving the pressure. Slowly, moderately, but she is getting it, and she will continue to get it.

    I get the Burden of Performance for men, but women have a Burden as well, call it what you will. If I put in the time and effort, and it does not get the results I want, then I WILL GET THE RESULTS I WANT, however I need to do it.

    Now, please don’t take my tone to be one of irritation with you. I appreciate the perspective, and I have no doubt you are wiser that I in the Red Pill.

    But I have spent years moderating myself and trying to nice guy my way into getting what I want, I am done with that. I have a whole lot of repression from trying to play roles and I am done with it. I am tired of jumping through hoops for anyone.

    I am not going to turn into a selfish prick or asshole, but I am, I need to, train myself to demand certain things out of my life.

    @Forge the Sky

    Your journey will look different. Just try shit. Don’t be stupid. But also don’t be safe.

    That is a whole lot of wisdom there in a small package. And I really think that is what I am trying to do. I am not trying to blow shit up, but I am trying to expand myself in ways that will suit me well, and hopefully, ultimately, my relationship.

    I have shit to work out, and it IS my shit. I fully realize that now, and I have tried this or that to help, whether reading RP or therapy or whatever. Nothing is a panacea, but bit by bit I have been making progress. It is that inward lookingness that kobayashii mentions above.

    Well, I’m not an expert (adolescent skill set) but I think the following are big parts of it:

    1) Narcissim/disconnect from reality – the adolescent hasn’t had time to have many real accomplishments or make themself into a full person. So they buffer that lack by imagining the world is such that they have more control over it than they do, or that they are the sort of person who has more mastery than they, in fact, possess. They will be very defensive if either of these conceptions are challenged. Getting past this entails paying attention to how the world functions, and how you actually act. It takes a few sharp raps to the ego.

    Buh-Bingo!

    In my case, I developed a great imagination because that was the way I survived the day to day horseshit, whether great or small. Problem was, I was relying on fantasy to replace actual accomplishments and experiences.

    Not just sexual fantasy, but any sort of accomplishment, goal, mind you. I had created my own internal VR world in which to do those things that I was too lazy or afraid to do or try. That was part of what I went through, when I had my awakening I think. It was like I unplugged myself from my own Matrix as it were.

    2) Lack of mastery – you lack some basic skills needed for good interactions to proceed as they should – how to be hospitable, how to comfort the grieving, how to make small talk, how to have good eye contact, how to propose plans, how to change venues, how to turn down a request politely, etc, etc, etc. These skills are accumulated gradually with experience in diverse social situations.

    I actually have great overall social skills in general the sense I have literal problem interacting with people. I am not a shy dweeb, in fact I am downright gregarious.

    Where I was deficient was in turning people down, taking the lead, and with dealing with women I was attracted to. In the latter case, it was the “skills needed for interactions to proceed as they should” where I lacked, particularly in understanding women were sexual creatures too, and what follows that knowledge.

    There is different stuff wrapped up in that, including religious guilt, etc, but a big part was feeling that I was responsible for protecting women from my and their sexual impulses. I guess that in and of itself is an adolescent mind set, not seeing adult women as adult women.

    Also, and this ties into ‘turning people down’, I was loathe get involved with a woman, sexually or otherwise, for fear of having to reject them at some point.

    Yes, in a lot of ways I set myself up for failure.

    3) Overt manipulation/explication – the adolescent hasn’t learned how to get what they want from a person or circumstance by taking actions that make the other person want (or at least feel compelled) to do what they want, or to alter circumstances so that they are favorable. They ask others and the world explicitly for what they want – or at least unsubtlely, as with emotional tantrums. As though they were a child asking their parent for a cookie.

    Yep, but I was not a tantrum guy.

    An alternative part of this same dynamic is ‘silent bargaining’ where you don’t ask or act to get what you want directly, but assume by certain actions that you will get that because in your mind the other person will just KNOW what you are after.

    When they don’t (and why would they? They have no fucking idea what’s in your head), you are disappointed and resentful but you DON’T show it, and just stuff those feelings way, way down where they won’t get in anyone’s way, including you. Or so you think.

    4) Reactivity – this is the most important factor wrt women. You react to the things other people do to you, to the way they think of you, to their manipulations…

    Yes, but in my case a big part of this was worrying or thinking a lot about what people think about you without really knowing. I was reacting what I THOUGHT they might be thinking, without real even evidence of it.

    I ran out of time, but this last one I might have to dwell on a bit more.

  41. Hey Seraph.

    That is a wonderful summary of where you are at and how you are feeling.

    Reminds me of Forge the Sky’s comment in the past: “I’ve found that, in general, RP and game feel more like the awakening of buried impulses than the addition of foreign behaviors.”

    I don’t take your tone as irritation at all. We’re on the same side. I agree entirely that your wife has to step up her game. Give her time. It takes time. Don’t resent her for that.

    You said: “Yes, but a woman who is deficient needs to make herself a better woman, or a man gets himself a better woman.

    I get the Burden of Performance for men, but women have a Burden as well, call it what you will. If I put in the time and effort, and it does not get the results I want, then I WILL GET THE RESULTS I WANT, however I need to do it.”

    I entirely agree.

    Rollo started out the original post with:

    “One of the most basic Red Pill principles I’ve stressed since I began writing is the importance of Frame. The dynamic of Frame stretches into many aspects of a man’s life, but in a strictly intergender sense this applies to men establishing a positive dominance in their relationships with women. In a dating context of non-exclusivity (plate spinning) this means, as a man, you have a solid reality into which that woman wants to be included in. Holding Frame is not about force, or coercion, it’s about attraction and desire and a genuine want on the part of a woman to be considered for inclusion into that man’s reality.

    Being allowed into a man’s dominant, confident Frame should be a compliment to that woman’s self-perception. It should be a prize she seeks.

    The problem is for men that Frame is not power.

    If your wife can’t come around to your frame in which you are the best you can be, then she doesn’t deserve you.

    It sounds like you are working on self improvement well and your wife needs to come together.

    If I may offer some advice. I’m not advocating for your wife. I’m advocating for you. Also I’m not a proponent of purple pill. But a few things from the MAP (Mindful Attraction Plan) include the fact that your wife and you have to concentrate on “green light” things, stop the “red light” things and work on the yellow light things. She needs to stop harping on your weakness, whatever they may be. She needs to go with you and give you back positive things like having sex more. The Mindful Attraction Plan was a stripped down plan to address what you are going through without the gay Star Wars shit and the limited captain and first officer thing (which puts the cart before the horse) that MMSL was.

    On thing I brought up last winter and was somewhat pilloried for by Scribbler when he was in a bad mood was using the MBTI (Meyers-Briggs) personality inventory to actually read (in an objective outlay) what exactly your strengths and weaknesses in your personality are (and the same for your wife’s). You should maximize your strengths and she should admire and respect you for them. You should minimize your weaknesses and she shouldn’t go for that jugular vein as much as she does, nor harp on them. Other women you meet at work and in your social life don’t need to know your weakness.

    And vice versa. Use your wife’s strengths for positive energy and don’t let her weaknesses steal your energy. Your wife will change, but her weaknesses will for the most part remain. She’s a grown woman. So with her weaknesses, that leaves you with the need to adapt. Don’t harp on her weaknesses. It is self defeating. She will resent you for it and it will cancel out all of the admiration for your strengths.

    Play with her and play with her. Go with her strengths. Use Roissy’s Ninth commandment of Poon. Go with her flow and let her roam. Even if you resent having to play to her because she is not reciprocating. Get positive energy from her feminine if possible.

    You can’t let other people, esp. your wife steal your energy. See Law #10 of the 48 Laws of Power.

    A somewhat simplistic book on this stealing of energy concept is Toru Sato’s “The Ever-Transcending Spirit: The Psychology of Human Relationships, Consciousness, and Development” It is basic stuff that pales in comparison to Red Pill Awareness, but it is pretty much right in line with what you are dealing with: Your wife is stealing your energy. She needs to give you energy.

  42. SJF –

    Regarding Myers/Briggs:

    Future ex-wife and I were in a pre-marriage class at my church. Part of it was a compatibility test. Test results come back and we are far apart. Right in front of me she just rips it up and says we’re going to ignore it!

    How reassuring. I had next to no ability to cope with something like that at the time. I’ve internalized some things since, but some of the spontaneous stuff is still not in my wheelhouse.

    I did not have good frame, but nothing I’ve learned so far has moved me to think I could make that marriage work, battling her frame.

  43. I had an employee that needed some help 10 months ago. She was a key employee and I didn’t want to lose her. I tried to get her to take a Meyers Briggs personality so I and the other employees could help her perceived problems with another two key employees. She was on the verge of quitting. I figured we would play to her strengths and not push her weakness buttons (she refused on the advice of her clinical psychologist son–he of course said MBTI are for shit). Turns out she has lots to hide and I diagnosed BPD traits. She had too much to lose in regards to ego-investment by taking the test. She was faking being better emotionally stable and task oriented than she really was. She is still with me and doing a fine job (shes been my employee for 15 years).

    Meyers Briggs is just a tool. I haven’t thought about for a while, but it had utility for me last year. It has its internal defects including the fact that most people are on a bell curve (instead of polar) in their personality attributes.

    More important is to actually address and be able to deal with personality strengths and weaknesses in an LTR. Yours and hers. You can have all the Frame in the world but still not get admiration and respect and then most of all desire from a woman. They don’t call Game an Art for nothing. Intersexual relationships should be complementary and if partners are opposite or polar in personalities it is not necessarily bad. But neither partner can keep contempt for the other’s traits and that includes their personality weaknesses.

    A key variable in a LTR is the quality of the partner. Some partners won’t make it out of triage in a defective relationship.

    Sorry for my positivism, can-do mindset, and idealism. That’s just who I am.

  44. SJF, I’m surprised a BPD refused a Meyers-Briggs, since it doesn’t take much to game that test, and BPD’s are nothing if not cunning.

  45. She’s not that bright. BPD’s can be skillful and have mastery over their domain. She’s not one of them. But she’s very functional as a receptionist.

    One more note is that Seraph and Striver allude to red pill advanced skillsets. I think there is more importance on Game (including married man game which is harder than single man game–you’re basically stuck with the partner until you are not) than on Red Pill “awareness”. I just happen to be very highly motivated to elevate my game and am a good learner and can adapt well. I’m “stuck” with a good one

    Rollo is wise to not write prescriptions because they are admittedly infinite in variety.

    And Seraph, sometimes a man just has to go into overt mode on rare occasions. Sometimes a woman needs to be told NO!. And guess what? She will respect you for that. Stay true to your ideals.

    1. Have a look at the sites of all the Purple Pill authors I listed. Add Tucker Max or even Aunt Giggles to that list.

      Every one of them offers a paid consultation fee or monthly plan for their ‘coaching’ or advice. This is their prescription – catering their message to accommodate their clientele because the perpetuation of that revenue is something they’ve become dependent upon.

      TRM will always be unsweetened, unbleached Red Pill truths as hashed out in the crucible of an open forum of men (and women). I don’t rely on TRP for my livelihood. I don’t depend on book sales or consultation fees or (lack of) payments from personal appearances. I only care about Red Pill truths in the most objective capacity I’m capable of.

      I only know what’s worked for me and for the men who’ve related their gratitude for my presenting TRP to them. I don’t write prescriptions; I want men to write their own. I’m not interested in creating better men; I’m interested in men recreating themselves as better men.

  46. @scribblerg

    Sometimes you’re just a really angry guy whose hubris leads him in to fights not worth having. This is one of those times.

    I summed up my disagreement using my position as an example, yes. Do you honestly think though that I’m getting emotional over what you’re saying simply because I did that? I’d say the emotional one is the one that’s fastest to resort to anger and name calling, and for that person you need only look in a mirror.

    Learn to chill a bit, bro.

  47. “I only know what’s worked for me and for the men who’ve related their gratitude for my presenting TRP to them. I don’t write prescriptions; I want men to write their own. I’m not interested in creating better men; I’m interested in men recreating themselves as better men.”

    Yes, but a great deal of what you write is actually about women. So the focus becomes “women are this negative thing, feel free to treat them accordingly”. It’s like the secular version of Dalrock with his relentless parade of crafty harlots and child murderers.
    [coming from a woman who pardons women’s abortions for the sisterhood]

    Men and women exist in complete symbiosis. [they should, they do not now]You cannot knock one gender down in an attempt to elevate the other.

  48. @ Sun & scribblerg

    Learn to chill a bit, bro.

    Which was my point to scribbler from the beginning… I used the sentence:

    Go easy on the ladies.

    And a 52 year old man who fancies himself alpha lost his shit. Nice frame hold there scribber, great example for the guys. I like how you implied power over women and physical threat on the internet without directly implying it, as if that’s never been tried before.

    Go back and read my original reply to you, and see how you literally lost any sense of cohesive thought from one sentence I posted in an internet message board. Just one sentence. The rest of it you probably either agreed with or at least didn’t have any problem with. Every comment I posted to you since then was conciliatory and explanatory, but you continued to act like a jackass AMOG, circle-jerking anyone who peripherally agreed with you.

    I honestly think you’re a bad example of alpha, you don’t engage the brain before the hands to keyboard, and then you find it necessary to tear down those who do.

  49. Sorry, Rollo, but I just left a comment that probably went to moderation for a single link to an Ian Ironwood’s article and clarifies what the red pill actually is. Also clarifies why what IB just said is categorically wrong. I would appreciate if you would check and release it from moderation. Thanks.

  50. @Seraph: Exactly.

    I think most men especially if you’re raised in a traditional family without too much TV in your former years…it’s always this nagging feeling you get, or that confidence you carry as a young boy when you unknowingly use amused-mastery on other young girls, aunties or your mom even….but from the 80s and being fed a plethora of rom-coms, soaps, women’s literature, aggressive socialisation, you always try to snap back to this ‘kafkaesque reality’…but, the red pill is innate, it’s always there….
    For me it was the relationships me & my boy were in…we had completely supplicated…and we had our spirit and energy sucked out….at some point, I just took stock and said “Fuck this shit! I’m not ‘avin it!”

    I started to reinstore my sense of self and value, and have not had a conventional relationship since then (2012)…stumbled upon TRM & TRP around 1 year and a half ago…the rest is history…. Now it’s just sharpening my instincts….always being aware of frame, prioritising my MPO and always learning and introspecting…relationships with women now must serve my needs first…
    I’ve become lean, walk with reinforced confidence, appreciate and love being a man infinitely more, and, have no fucking apologies to make for that….now apart from my achieving my personal RP, economic and business goals, I’m intent to double /triple my N count next year and every year, or sooner, not in a hurry though…until I find some women who will be worthy to carry my children.

    By the way, to those who haven’t, you should read “The Manipulated Man”…I finished it quick, and man, Esther Vilar uses some very strong language and may come off as insulting to our other halves…but it gave me inspiration as a man strictly speaking. ‘Predatory Female’ is not bad either….

  51. @Insanitybytes,
    As you know, some brothers here had some “misunderstanding” regarding “mercy fuck”, I would like to have your say about it, I mean, how does Mr. bytes feels about it?
    As you said before, you believe in “mercy fuck”.

    My second question is;
    As you know of your “pussy is power” don’t you think Mr. Bytes needs to find a younger pussy that is worth serving instead of serving your old pussy?
    Don’t you see why you hate the “red pill “?

  52. @takingthepiss;

    “Yes, but a great deal of what you write is actually about women. So the focus becomes “women are this negative thing, feel free to treat them accordingly”.

    No.
    It’s about how men should be/act in relation to how women have become and society has changed.
    Secondly, Rollo’s never said women are negative…However, what he and we advocate for is knowing how women ARE and acting accordingly.

    “Men and women exist in complete symbiosis. You cannot knock one gender down in an attempt to elevate the other.”

    No, they do not, and haven’t in while…though, they should! The red pill and TRM are about restoring that balance, and reclaiming the male perspective…

    We love women…but we must love them as they are, without compromising our perspective, and/or masculinity for short term and/or no gains. Its what women NEED!

  53. IB. 10/3 @10:59 “…mens very sense of worth and value comes from how you perceive yourself in women’s eyes, whether or not you deem yourselves worthy and useful to her…”

    IB. 10/4 @9:33. “Men and women exist in complete symbiosis. You cannot knock one gender down in an attempt to elevate the other.”

    IB. You are roundly derided here and blame it on RP anger. Can you not open your heart and see how offensive the contradiction in you two quotes above is to men?

  54. I see Insanity is till here… sigh…

    It’s interesting the number of females (Insanity being a good example) that desperately wish to put the Genie back in the bottle. To have their little beta boys never grow up and stay nice and sweet – and compliant. In the post feminist mind they have equated Red Pill awareness with a woman’s exile to the kitchen making sandwiches.

    And to be fair I personally believe that is to the betterment of mankind. Man should be conquering and a Woman in the kitchen making said sandwiches. So I sympathize with the outright panic Insanity/Sisterhood exhibit when men talk of Red Pill concepts openly. It truly must be odd to be in a Feminist inspired society where “Being Right” always leans female centric and then see that there is dissent from pesky male agendas. It’s so LOGICAL that women are the superior gender who should reap all of modern societies blessings… right?

    I personally am DONE with middle roads or third ways… It’s time to place emphasis on ME and Male progress. To hell with all these coddled western women. I can fly three hours and find a beautiful teenager who will raise my kids and stay in the kitchen. And be happy she is not squatting out her kids on a dirt floor like her sisters.

    Why should I put up with the Insanity women any more? Enough is Enough brothers don’t bother talking to Insanity anymore. She has no options but to keep the Matrix from letting men see the world as it really is. Our options are limitless and should be exercised regularly.

  55. “Men and women exist in complete symbiosis. ”

    You and “your” mitochondria live in complete symbiosis, but they use you as a machine to feed them, leaving you to live off their excrement.

  56. Keyser Soze, I think your language is vulgar and obscene and your attempts to insult my husband are not appreciated. You should be so blessed as to be Mr. Bytes, he is a good man and much loved.

    Tomassi, to call me a menopausal fraud and to accuse me of being a woman who pardons abortions for the sisterhood is how a small minded man tries to disqualify and discredit a woman he actually fears. Men should not fear women, that is downright pathetic.

  57. @SJF,

    A somewhat simplistic book on this stealing of energy concept is Toru Sato’s “The Ever-Transcending Spirit: The Psychology of Human Relationships, Consciousness, and Development” It is basic stuff that pales in comparison to Red Pill Awareness, but it is pretty much right in line with what you are dealing with: Your wife is stealing your energy. She needs to give you energy.

    You remind me of one of the earlier arguments/discussions with my wife when she was giving me a hard time about activities which did not include/benefit her. Of course, she was not as direct as that as you can imagine.

    Anyway, I described it to her as a need to recharge my batteries in order to get the energy to do all the other shit.

    I told her that I, that guys in general, need to recharge doing shit that interests them, and whether or not women could understand it, it was irrelevant.

    Nowadays, I describe it as male energy, and she seems to be getting it. She watched Man on Wire the other day, and it finally struck her how men are driven to do all sort of crazy, adventurous, daring, wacky, interesting things as part of being men.

    Little steps.

    I really appreciate all your insights.

  58. Thanks Seraph.

    Realize that 1. She needs to not suck energy out of you and 2.You will get your manly energy on your own and for yourself. Two separate issues.

    In regards to #1 if she persists, you will disallow it. In regards to #2 you have the means to accomplish this.

  59. Insanitybytes, ” Mr. Bytes, he is a good man and much loved.”

    I’m sorry Insanitybytes, but I wasn’t attacking Mr bytes, in fact I feel sorry for him to be married to your trickery and manipulation of him.
    When you say he is a good man and much loved, it means two things :
    1, he is not sexy to you (I really hope he finds a younger women to fuck him as a tingle not because he’s a good nice guy ) .
    2, The “good man and much loved” , I last read something like that , was in the obituary section.
    And you say :” Men should not fear women, that is downright pathetic.”

    How can I not fear you when you advocate for the “attic doctrine”?

    If you are so confident of your beliefs, why do you moderate your blog?

  60. Well anyway I think my post earlier might not make it, but it is along the line of what Kobayashii posted in response to IB in regards to what the red pill is actually about. She just doesn’t get it.

    So here is a few excerpts from a post that Ian Ironwood made when he rebutted Susan Walsh’s drivel about the same shit IB is wining whining about.

    It doesn’t fit in Rollo’s new post so I will cut and paste it from my earlier post that either went into moderation for a link to the original or got lost in the WordPress ozone layer.

    All this is Ian Ironwoods words. He said it better than I can.

    Wednesday, June 4, 2014 (at the Red Pill Room blog)
    Aunt Giggles Doesn’t Get It: The Red Pill Is The Toolbox


    “”The Red Pill doesn’t blame women for the “defects innate to the female sex”, it accepts them and teaches strategies of how to counter them. If those strategies are ineffective, then either you’re using the wrong strategy and you change it, or you’re courting the wrong woman and you change her. Not “change her” in the sense of making her who you want her to be . . . but “change her” in the sense of dumping her ass and moving on.

    Thanks to the destructive nature of feminism on femininity in the West, there are actually huge numbers of women who are miserable and unhappy with their lives and eager for any chance at a stable relationship. They write to me constantly, wondering where they can find a Red Pill man. Pursuing an unfulfilling relationship is not part of the Red Pill. Pursuing quality women is. The Red Pill teaches men that women are fungible, and if one doesn’t work out, well, there are a hundred others out there waiting in the wings. You just have to have the fortitude, skills and sense of personal responsibility to pursue them. Or, at highest form, you become the type of man who becomes pursued by them.”

    “The Red Pill, as I’ve stated frequently in the past, isn’t an ideology, as she claims. Ideology is a set of beliefs. The Red Pill isn’t. Its a praxeology, or method of doing things to achieve a particular goal. That’s an important distinction.

    The Red Pill is a collection of skills and methods – call it a tool box, to stay in masculine parlance – designed to help men (and some brave women) live happier, more fulfilling lives. It isn’t dependent upon an ideology. It’s dependent upon observable truths and reality-based results.

    The goals shift from man to man, depending upon just what a particular man decides he wants out of life, but the central focus is to make men better men . . . for themselves. Not to fit in better with society or make women happy. Forty years of feminism has advocated for the things that allegedly make women happy (and largely failed). That’s what happens when you depend upon an ideology to live your life by: the real world comes along and challenges your ideology with, y’know, reality, and when it doesn’t work out most often you find the world at fault, not the belief.”

    “The Red Pill toolbox is replete with resources, but she focuses narrowly on the PUA side of the equation. In doing so she blatantly ignores the larger picture and issues involved. Sure, many men come to the Red Pill searching for a way to get laid – because that’s a seriously important male issue. But the focus of the Red Pill has always been masculine self improvement. Problem is, Aunt Giggles wants to dictate to men just how they should improve themselves. Not so that they will be happier in their lives . . . but so they can become more useful to women.

    Giggles focuses on the idea that Red Pill men are frustrated by the tendency of women to focus on the top 10-20% of “quality men” (who have suspiciously Alpha-like qualities). She sees the Red Pill as a failed ideology of trickery and disappointment.

    The Red Pill lets guys off the hook. If they can’t get a woman, it’s due to the defects innate to the female sex. For many, the strategy of passing blame is more psychically rewarding than the strategy of taking responsibility.

    This is where she’s wrong. The Red Pill does not let guys “off the hook”, in part because yes, Virginia, there are a lot of batshitcrazy/attention-whoring/frivorce-happy/hypergamous/outrageously-entitled females out there (count the number of “selfies” on any given young woman’s FB page for details), but also in part because the Red Pill does not “blame” women for anything. While it may blame feminism (itself a disturbing and increasingly misandrous ideology), in its purest form it accepts women for what they are and what they have become . . . and arms a Red Pill man with the tools to deal with them.

    The true Red Pill man does not blame women for what they have become. He merely recognizes the paucity of quality women in our society, and if he is inclined toward developing a long-term relationship, he becomes knowledgeable about how to recognize and pursue them. Or, conversely, if he has decided that a LTR is not in his best personal interest, he uses those tools to pursue women for short term sexual liaisons. There are even Red Pill men who decide that any interpersonal relationship with a woman is not in their interest. They do not measure their masculinity in belt notches. Neither do I.

    But that last line is where she really screws up. Because at the top of the Red Pill toolbox, the very first thing you take out, is personal responsibility. And one of the first things you discard from your own scarred heart is the idea of blaming someone else – man or woman, men or women – for your troubles. If you aren’t willing to take responsibility for your actions, you aren’t taking the Red Pill. Pure and simple.

    The Red Pill doesn’t blame women for the “defects innate to the female sex”, it accepts them and teaches strategies of how to counter them. If those strategies are ineffective, then either you’re using the wrong strategy and you change it, or you’re courting the wrong woman and you change her. Not “change her” in the sense of making her who you want her to be . . . but “change her” in the sense of dumping her ass and moving on. ”

  61. Sorry to confuse you, but the following paragraph above was Susan Walsh’s quote but the formatting was lost in my cut and paste:

    “The Red Pill lets guys off the hook. If they can’t get a woman, it’s due to the defects innate to the female sex. For many, the strategy of passing blame is more psychically rewarding than the strategy of taking responsibility.”

  62. “For many, the strategy of passing blame is more psychically rewarding than the strategy of taking responsibility.”

    She really nailed it there, because that is more than obvious in multiple threads. Men have always found it to be more psychically rewarding to blame women than to take responsibility for themselves.

    Regardless of what your red pill tries to teach, it doesn’t translate well because so many of you are trapped in relentless hatred, anger, and fear towards women. You constantly seek to disqualify, discredit, and demean us, which you apparently find more psychically rewarding than actually taking responsibility for your own selves.

  63. You obviously didn’t read or can’t understand why Susan Walsh is fabricating that bit about red pill praxeology with feminist ideology.

    You are ascribing your emotions to what you think is Red Pill. You are dead wrong.

    Do you need someone to sound this out for you? Or interpret the straightforward rebuttal? Stop wining mewling and GTFO:

    “This is where she’s wrong. The Red Pill does not let guys “off the hook”, in part because yes, Virginia, there are a lot of batshitcrazy/attention-whoring/frivorce-happy/hypergamous/outrageously-entitled females out there (count the number of “selfies” on any given young woman’s FB page for details), but also in part because the Red Pill does not “blame” women for anything. While it may blame feminism (itself a disturbing and increasingly misandrous ideology), in its purest form it accepts women for what they are and what they have become . . . and arms a Red Pill man with the tools to deal with them.

    The true Red Pill man does not blame women for what they have become. He merely recognizes the paucity of quality women in our society, and if he is inclined toward developing a long-term relationship, he becomes knowledgeable about how to recognize and pursue them. Or, conversely, if he has decided that a LTR is not in his best personal interest, he uses those tools to pursue women for short term sexual liaisons. There are even Red Pill men who decide that any interpersonal relationship with a woman is not in their interest. They do not measure their masculinity in belt notches. Neither do I.

    But that last line is where she really screws up. Because at the top of the Red Pill toolbox, the very first thing you take out, is personal responsibility. And one of the first things you discard from your own scarred heart is the idea of blaming someone else – man or woman, men or women – for your troubles. If you aren’t willing to take responsibility for your actions, you aren’t taking the Red Pill. Pure and simple.

    The Red Pill doesn’t blame women for the “defects innate to the female sex”, it accepts them and teaches strategies of how to counter them. If those strategies are ineffective, then either you’re using the wrong strategy and you change it, or you’re courting the wrong woman and you change her. Not “change her” in the sense of making her who you want her to be . . . but “change her” in the sense of dumping her ass and moving on. ”

  64. “You constantly seek to disqualify, discredit, and demean us, which you apparently find more psychically rewarding than actually taking responsibility for your own selves.”

    Holy inversion, Batman!

  65. Bites
    Men have always found it to be more psychically rewarding to blame women than to take responsibility for themselves.

    Regardless of what your red pill tries to teach, it doesn’t translate well because so many of you are trapped in relentless hatred, anger, and fear towards women. You constantly seek to disqualify, discredit, and demean us, which you apparently find more psychically rewarding than actually taking responsibility for your own selves.

    Dearie, you simply have to come up with something better than this boring old projection. I mean, really, you’ve tried it off and on for some time now, and all that happens is more men see how pathetic you are, like some badly dressed bag-lady standing on a grate shrieking to passersby about The Patriarchy! The Patriarchy!

    We don’t care what you screech. We don’t care what you emote. We do know you do not and can not think. And again, the projection simply is just not working. Here, let me fix your latest, er, effort:

    Women have always found it to be more psychically rewarding to blame men than to take responsibility for themselves.

    Regardless of what your feminism tries to teach, it doesn’t translate well because so many of you are trapped in relentless hatred, anger, and fear towards men. You constantly seek to disqualify, discredit, and demean us, which you apparently find more psychically rewarding than actually taking responsibility for your own selves.

    Dearie, every single man here and more than a few honest women know that my fix contains a lot of truth, unlike your tedious lies.

    You’re getting more desperate, honey. I knew you’d be back for more from me and the other men. Because even through the cold medium of text, you know we are men and We Don’t Care. Because we don’t care, you yearn for us more.

    Yes, Bites, you love us and wish for us to … discipline … you.

    The fried ice, it calls to you, it calls to you…

  66. I wonder if Frank Zappa had some tiresome old 2nd wave feminist like Bites in mind when he wrote this little tune?

  67. @Sun – Toughen up buttercup, your argument was shit. Deal with it or don’t. Also your commentary about “hollow alpha” was juvenile. Own your shit or don’t, your choice. But I’m not angry at you, I’m trying to sort out your fucked up thinking. Take it or leave it, but it’s not about me. You got very hooked about me taking the line I took – which had nothing to do with you. You don’t ever have to blow anyone you don’t want to, okay?

    @Jeremy – Your comment was drivel. Do better. Tell me, do you hear me telling you how to speak to other commenters here? I take on your arguments and rationale, you cast personal apsersions and tell me how to behave. Get a grip on yourself.

    As for the alpha comment, it’s clear, you are jealous of me. I get it, I’ve been dealing with guys like you my whole life who can’t compete so they whip dung at me. And I’m 53, not 52. Look 40, btw. But that’s besides the point. I don’t have a thing to prove to you and get almost nothing out of your facile commentary. And your white knighting bullshit is intolerable to me “take it easy on the ladies”, like I said, just who in the fuck do you think you are white knighting like a gaping, glistening mangina here?

    For the record, this is the only website I spend any time on in the manosphere. This where I talk Red Pill. I don’t spend time on or comment on any other sites. This is where I talk about this stuff. I spend all my energy on my life in the real world, and come here to review and think etc. I take this site and the commentary seriously so when I get the kind of bullshit back that I’ve been getting from both of you i deal with it.

    Notice that the two of you have devolved to criticizing style points now and didn’t deal with the many substantive points I made in response to both of you. Me? I make very clear my rationale and POV. I’m happy to defend it, but stop whining, the both of you.

  68. In the Greek myths, there was no doubt who was in charge. It was Zeus who spins plates like mad, playing the dread game on his wife Hera. Competition made Hera mad with protective desire enough that she would bath every day to restore her virginity in the special waters. He did what he want to do but didn’t tell Hera, preferring to let her make the guessing. There was no question which frame was in control.

  69. “I get it, I’ve been dealing with guys like you my whole life who can’t compete so they whip dung at me. And I’m 53, not 52. Look 40, btw. “

    That must be it. They can’t compete ’cause you’re super likeable.

    Re red pill women and pity fucks with men they aren’t attracted to because “guys would do it if they were gay”. I’ll just ask (and don’t worry, I’m not sticking around for the answer from you, but instead of howling at the moon and insulting men here you can insult me, you’re welcome)…

    if attraction isn’t a player what does it matter if you’re gay or not? You don’t have to be gay to hum nuts and suck cock put on some Folies Bergère (or frenchy whatever) makeup and you can’t look much different from that “mommy” in the picture above. Probably better! Imagine all the happiness you can provide. Lead by example.

  70. “Women have always found it to be more psychically rewarding to blame men than to take responsibility for themselves. Regardless of what your feminism tries to teach, it doesn’t translate well because so many of you are trapped in relentless hatred, anger, and fear towards men..”

    These things are true, I don’t dispute that at all. That is the fallacy of feminism and what makes their ideology so weak.

    For many however, your red pill “praxeology,” is simply the ideologies of feminism with the genders reversed.

  71. “As for the alpha comment, it’s clear, you are jealous of me. I get it, I’ve been dealing with guys like you my whole life who can’t compete so they whip dung at me. And I’m 53, not 52. Look 40,”

    You go gurrrrl.

    Ps,
    True natural aren’t obsessed about looking younger unless you’re a woman.

  72. @scribbler:

    You’re picking fights you gain nothing from and you fail shit tests. Stay grounded, stay sharp, brother. Reconnecting with your natural Alpha spirit is good and important. But it’s not that uncommon to have an alpha side which was never appreciated enough or lost on the way.

  73. “I said, just who in the fuck do you think you are white knighting like a gaping, glistening mangina here?”

    Insanitybytes ¿
    I need your help here, he’s calling me a white night and a mangina, what do you think? Am I?

    Ps,
    Catch 24?

  74. “I need your help here, he’s calling me a white night and a mangina, what do you think? Am I?”

    No, I think in the name of all that is decent and good about men, “take it easy on the ladies” is something that needs to be said around here once in awhile. That is a reflection on your own selves, your own honor, and how you define yourselves as men. Those hate filled words scribblerg speaks over others, he is actually speaking over himself. That is how it works and it reveals an emotional investment that is not rooted in confidence, but rather in fear.

    I could say anything I wanted to a truly dominant man and he would either be amused, entertained, and engage….or walk away and completely ignore me. Confident men do not engage and proceed to call women names because they feel threatened by the mere words of a woman.

    So no,nothing white knighting about it, it’s actually calling a man out for his obvious frame failure.

  75. insanitybytes22
    October 5th, 2015 at 10:00 am

    “These things are true, I don’t dispute that at all. That is the fallacy of feminism and what makes their ideology so weak.”

    Agreed

    “For many however, your red pill “praxeology,” is simply the ideologies of feminism with the genders reversed.”

    That is a simple non sequitur. That statement means nothing without context. Now either you can make it your context (frame) or I can make it my context (frame).

    A non sequitur is a conversational and literary device, often used for comedic purposes. (It is something said that, because of its apparent lack of meaning relative to what preceded it, seems absurd to the point of being humorous or confusing.This use of the term is distinct from the non sequitur in logic, where it is a fallacy.)

    Intersexual relationships actually have something at stake.

    #01 – We Are At War. (Princilple number one from Principles of Game, the Beige Phillip Show)

    “Nothing you want to do gets in the way of your relationship, it is innately part of who you are and why the bitch fell in love with you in the first place. We are at war. You’re in situations when you think you’re in a relationship but you’re not in a relationship, you’re in battle. If you give in you’ll never get what you lost back, it’s very hard to get what you’ve lost back if you’re not a “master pimp” red pill aware masculine male with game.”

    This does not take away from a man being kind, respectful and loving of his partner. (I know. I’m there and do that)

    But a man doesn’t need to lie down and take feminism like a pussy and lose his self respect (and her’s in the process), congruence as a male (who’s hindbrain and cognitive and physical skills evolved over a million years) and masculinity.

    You may not label yourself as a feminist because you hate women, but you are no doubt a raging “Equalist” non-complementarian. You don’t appear feminine and you are misandric. Although you do argue like a woman. All emotion and no logic.


    Taking down your neighbor won’t take you any higher
    I burned my own damn finger pokin’ someone else’s fire
    I’ve never gotten taller makin’ someone else feel small
    If you ain’t got nothin’ nice to say don’t say nothin’ at all

    Just hoe your own row and raise your own babies
    Smoke your own smoke and grow your own daisies
    Mend your own fences and own your own crazy
    Mind your own biscuits and life will be gravy
    Mind your own biscuits and life will be gravy

    Nobody’s perfect, we’ve all lost and we’ve all lied
    Most of us have cheated, the rest of us have tried
    The holiest of holies even slip from time to time
    We’ve all got dirty laundry hangin’ on the line

    So hoe your own row and raise your own babies
    Smoke your own smoke and grow your own daisies
    Mend your own fences and own your own crazy
    Mind your own biscuits and life will be gravy
    Mind your own biscuits and life will be gravy

    Pourin’ salt in my sugar won’t make yours any sweeter
    Pissin’ in my yard ain’t gonna make yours any greener
    And I wouldn’t know about the rocks in your shoes
    So I’ll just do me and honey you can just do you (so hoe)

    So hoe your own row and raise your own babies
    Smoke your own smoke and grow your own daisies
    Mend your own fences and own your own crazy
    Mind your own biscuits and life will be gravy
    Mind your own biscuits and life will be gravy

    Kacey Musgraves – Biscuits Lyrics

  76. “I could say anything I wanted to a truly dominant man and he would either be amused, entertained, and engage….or walk away and completely ignore me. Confident men do not engage and proceed to call women names because they feel threatened by the mere words of a woman.

    So no,nothing white knighting about it, it’s actually calling a man out for his obvious frame failure.”

    That’s a dull shiv.

    Any idiot knows that men wouldn’t be here if they weren’t working on their masculine self improvement, whatever form that takes. Myself humbly included.

  77. Thank you Insanitybytes for your position.
    That was very brave of you.

    I have a question for you regarding the ” mercy fuck”.
    Do you think it is a Christian believe?
    I mean , when all religions order wives to fuck their husbands regardless of “their mood and the headache stuff ” .
    Don’t you think Glenn might be speaking from a deeply held religious beliefs?

    Another question for you! Do I go to hell if women ask me to have anal sex with them (sorry for my vulgar language).

  78. “This does not take away from a man being kind, respectful and loving of his partner. (I know. I’m there and do that)”

    Yes, I believe you. And I believe Tomassi likely perceives the red pill in that same light. The problem is you are perceiving it through your own eyes and only seeing the positive.

    Dominance in the hands of broken men, outside of any cultural/moral restraints, is not a good thing. That is the same problem within feminism. They too are being “descriptive,” here is a bad man, now ALL men must be regulated and controlled. The personal becomes political and the entire nature of reality is now defined by a couple of people’s wounding.

  79. “I have a question for you regarding the ” mercy fuck”.
    Do you think it is a Christian believe?”

    I really do not like the vulgar language, but I truly do not believe it is my job to police the language of men.

    As to “mercy sex,” that is not “pity” at play in the context of marriage, that is simply giving a husband what he is due, even when you may not be 100% enthusiastic about it. Those words were said in another context, in the context of wives refusing sex because they just didn’t “feel like it.” Women can get resentful, controlling, punitive, about sex within marriage. It can quickly become abuse, the with holding of affection for the purpose of manipulation.

    I’ve yet to meet a man that complained because a wife sometimes put his sexual needs before her own, but what would I know.

  80. “Dominance in the hands of broken men, outside of any cultural/moral restraints, is not a good thing.”

    I can understand why you fear the emotions of “broken men” or “hateful speech out of fear”, but note these things only matter for your emotional solipsism. You resent those feelings because they don’t fit into your need of inner congruency. For the men though, while they may have those feelings indeed, these emotions matter far less, if at all. And that’s why they aren’t really a danger to anything other then your “feel good”.

  81. Tomassi, I’m going to do something I rarely do and apologize for pricking your pride when you tried to post on my blog about how I was a bipolar, menopausal, fraud. You pissed me off, I lost my temper, and I’m sorry.

    You’re right, I should have been more gracious and appreciative of the fact that you were willing to entertain me at all. Unlike you, I however receive a great deal of hate mail, opposition, and abuse, and so I filter some comments. I don’t particularly appreciate being called mentally ll or as some do, threatened with assorted violent endings.

  82. What a thread. Had to comment.

    1)I think scribblerg is partially right and pity sex would help. Definitely help short-term. Maybe even long term, if it gives the guy a confidence boost long enough to get laid himself. It might stop him from suicide or killing other people. I think most likely it won’t solve all his problems, but it’s a net positive.

    2)However, most women are not gonna do it. Not regular women, not Red Pill women. Mostly because women don’t have sex with men they aren’t attracted to it. For Red Pill women, there is even more reason not to do it. Red Pill for women is the same as Red Pill for men – recognize reality, remember that men and women are different and want different things, and take that into account when you plan your life. For women, that means getting a good captain – a man who is both committed and attractive,and can lead. To get there, a woman must not sleep around, don’t waste time on men who won’t be good captains; she must make herself as hot as possible, and also be as good wife material as possible.

    3)Women probably won’t hand out charity sex, but prostitutes will have it for money. Why is this not seen as a more viable option? I always wonder why neither Elliot Roger nor George Sodini resorted to going to a whore. They had money. Were they too far gone?. Perhaps, just like suicidal people need to hear that there are ways out, men like this need to hear that there is always prostitution.

  83. “The problem is you are perceiving it through your own eyes and only seeing the positive.”

    I’m an idealistic, positive mother-fucker. So sue me 🙂

    “Dominance in the hands of broken men, outside of any cultural/moral restraints, is not a good thing. “

    Damn. That’s a thing I can agree on. If……those broken men abuse their evolutionary call to dominance that women were evolutionarily designed to need and submit to for their own good (and the good of the children, don’t forget the children). I didn’t agree on that a year ago. But I mentored/taught a cute little mid twenties Syrian chick last year that was smart and intuitive. And Hot!. I came to realize the women in the Middle East have it bad that way. But that is not the way the red pill defines dominance–not intrinsically evil, that is……… And you are merely using that as a straw man argument.

    “That is the same problem within feminism. They too are being “descriptive,” here is a bad man, now ALL men must be regulated and controlled. The personal becomes political and the entire nature of reality is now defined by a couple of people’s wounding.”

    It’s not a couple people men. It’s a whole lotta men that are wounded out there on the feminist dominated battlefield.

    And I’m on the men’s team. You’re on the woman’s team. You Ma’am are the opposition. Get that straight.

  84. @Sun

    “Do women currently do what you suggest? No.
    Will women ever do what you suggest? Hell no.
    Will women ever even do the small thing I suggest and bring their expectations in line with reality? Not without losing a good portion of the male population.
    Will women, even “Red Pill” women stop fucking hollow Alphas? A couple million years of evolutionary momentum says no.”

    An easy truth in all this is what Rollo has said from the beginning about a man’s sexual strategy and a woman’s sexual strategy being intentionally at odds with one another. It has to be that way. Like you pointed out, it’s a sexual *market place* where bargaining for the best deal (from both sides) occurs.

    Women giving away their sexual favors for free only makes them deemed as a low value woman. Very very very low value depending on how high her N count gets as she continually wastes her sexual market value by giving it away for free.

    Red pill women are NOT like red pill men. They have a counter strategy (get it, Glenn? Counter!). Their strategy is to protect their sexual status value, make themselves HIGH value women.

    High value women do not give incels blowjobs for free … or beta… or omegas… etc.

    It’s been against the sexual strategy of the feminine since the beginning of time to operate that way. That’s why there are prostitutes, and even they demand actual payment (ie. no one gives a free lunch oops… blowjob).

  85. “I came to realize the women in the Middle East have it bad that way. But that is not the way the red pill defines dominance–not intrinsically evil, that is……… And you are merely using that as a straw man argument”

    Actually it’s not a straw man at all. I am genuinely curious how men would address that? I know what the Fems are doing, I know what the UN is doing, but how would you deal with it? Because like it or not, there are some rotten men out there who do bad things. To say, “oh well, not my problem, I’m just being prescriptive, not descriptive” is not a satisfactory answer.

  86. “Are you going to use your new name on your blog too?”

    Keyser, I’m shocked to see she found out how to change her name back. Although she did come back a little humbled by “Tomassi”. I see she used a lower case “I” in her name.

    “To say, “oh well, not my problem”, is not a satisfactory answer.”

    Is too.

  87. @Insanitybytes ,
    I LOVE you. You make me laugh (thank you).
    It is so entertaining talking to you, I really mean it. You play cat and mouse, you are a little girl.
    I really hope Rollo doesn’t block you.
    Ps,
    All women are Insanitybytes, and we should enjoy them like we enjoy talking to little girls.

  88. “All women are Insanitybytes, and we should enjoy them like we enjoy talking to little girls.”

    Actually Keyser Soze, that is the most sensible thing I’ve heard you say yet. Is that not the nature of women and should you not enjoy us?

    And yes, I do appreciate Tomassi not banning me. He is braver than many others, they all quickly descended into hysterics and banned me.

  89. @dragon,
    The brave woman who gives “pity/mercy fuck” (if you find that woman) to an incel, is the same woman who will be on the incel’s list when she stops fu**ing him and he goes ,”a little funny in the head “, Dimitri.

  90. Insanitybytes “Actually Keyser Soze, that is the most sensible thing I’ve heard you say yet. Is that not the nature of women and should you not enjoy us?”.

    You know Insanity, I pity men who treat women as :
    A, equal.
    B, adult.
    All of you women should be treated like little girls.
    Just read Nataliya’s comment, or Dragon ‘s monthly photo change. re read your own comments and the fast name change.

  91. @scribblerg

    Your comment was drivel.

    Not surprising that someone who didn’t read my first one skimmed the meaning in all of my comments.

    Tell me, do you hear me telling you how to speak to other commenters here? I take on your arguments and rationale, you cast personal apsersions and tell me how to behave. Get a grip on yourself.

    LOL, you’re like a 3rd grader, well if that’s the level of your discourse I guess it’s a great complement to Rollo’s writing that you’re able to understand it. For a recap, here’s scribbler from four days ago:

    scribblerg
    October 1st, 2015 at 10:21 pm

    @Jeremy – Don’t tell me to “Go easy on the ladies”, it smacks of white knighting. I’ll say whatever the fuck I want to them and if you don’t like it, too fucking bad.

    Ah, there’s that one sentence and Scribbler lost his shit. Does it get worse?

    scribblerg
    October 1st, 2015 at 10:24 pm

    @ Jeremy – Your analysis is also highly speculative and ignores the dynamics of female sexual selection. THEY CHOOSE UP. This actually means some guys aren’t going to get laid, no matter how they are raised. If you don’t understand this, you don’t understand anything about human intersexual dynamics.

    The game is not “fair”. It’s slanted against men – women choose and men compete for that choice. I’m sure the lecture makes you feel good though…

    Oh, yep, 3 minutes later it got worse. I guess you had to finish the beer you were on, that’s fair. This comment was little more than a logical fallacy, a red herring, as I never said anything in opposition to hypergamy. Does it get worse?

    scribblerg
    October 2nd, 2015 at 8:43 am

    @ Jeremy – You know, I used to like your commentary but over time I’ve realized you just like arguing. It’s very boring. As for your reply to me, of course there are other factors to why some men don’t reproduce but that doesn’t obviate my point – which makes your comment a distinction without much difference. As well, I did not suggest getting angry about it was the correct approach.

    Keep lecturing though, it seems to give you great satisfaction.

    Yep, 3rd grade material. “I used to like you, but now I don’t.” Apparently everyone can question everyone here, but if anyone dares question Scribbler, somehow the muscles come out, and he has to go AMOG on them.

    You’re literally demonstrating repeatedly your own incapacity to put your own curiosity before your ego, and anyone with half a brain on this board can see right through it.

    How dare I question the great and powerful scribbler?!?!?
    I guess I’ll go back to reading and questioning Rollo, since he has the understanding that his arguments are strengthened by such things, unlike some habitual AMOGs in the comment section.

    BTW, I wish you well on the women front, I suppose physical intimidation does go a long way, otherwise someone wouldn’t have gotten as far as you have.

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