When I was studying behavioral psychology there was a point when I came across this phenomenon called the Endowment Effect. A friend showed me this video recently and it reminded me of when I’d studied it.
It’s really fascinating how early our sense of ownership develops. There is a school of thought (one I happen to agree with) that this need for ownership is an innate part of out psychological firmware – it’s something we’re born with. We value things more highly once we believe we own something. It makes perfect sense that this would a selected-for part of our evolution. Individuals that possessed this Endowment Effect, theoretically, might have been more adaptable to their surroundings by having something on hand that would aid in their survival at the cost of a competitor. For early man this was likely to be physical tools, but this Endowment Effect would also extend to our progeny and long-term female partners – more on this later.
By extension, our belongings literally become a part of us. This is observable even on a neurological level. Furthermore, our belongings have an essence that becomes unique to us. In other words, we wont settle for (even exact) imitations of our stuff even when they are exact duplicates.
As you might expect from a TED video, the bias towards making this ownership dynamic one of being a bug, rather of a feature, of human development is evident. The new-agey narrative goes like this – if we’re ever to reach the utopian state of egalitarian equalism the Village would have us believe in, we need to somehow unlearn this innate Endowment Effect we evolved to hold. This anti-materialist sentiment is part of a larger socialist/collectivist message that seeks to disempower us by convincing us that this connection to our things is innately bad. Issues of socialism, communism, collectivism, capitalism, etc. are beyond the scope of this blog, but it’s important to consider the drive behind this ‘anti-materialism’ push and how it affects our sense of ownership in intersexual dynamics.
I think it’s interesting that we have a part of our psyches that evolved for ownership; a part of our nature that is decidedly unegalitarian.
If you’re ever read Dawkin’s book, The Selfish Gene, you kind of get a clearer picture of it. Selfish, self-concerned, organisms tend to survive better than overly altruistic or egalitarian ones. Now before you tell me, “On no Rollo, Bonobos are the peacenik, free loving hippy example of egalitarianism in the wild” have a read of The Naked Bonobo and you’ll understand how deliberately false that impression is. If anything Bonobos are far better examples of the more visceral side of Hypergamy in humans. Self-interest is the driver of a great many survival instincts and adaptations in all animals.
Getting back to humans here, combine that evolved, adaptive, selfishness with a hindbrain level, intrinsic sense for ownership – one in which we feel as if it has a direct connection to ourselves – and you can see what social constructivists and equalitarians are trying to undo in humans. If you watch today’s video you’ll better understand this deep connection we have with the things we, selfishly, consider our own. There is a neurological connection between our sense of self and our things.
I’ve mentioned the concept of ego-investment in our belief systems many times throughout my past essays. Briefly, ego-investment is phenomenon of being so intrinsically connected with our beliefs and ideologies that they become part of our personalities. So, to attack the belief is to, literally, attack the person. In a similar fashion the connections we apply to our things also become (to varying degrees) part of who we are. In essence we invest our egos into the things we consider ours – and the greater the effort, cost or the applied significance involved in getting those things the greater the injury is to the self when they are lost, destroyed, damaged or stolen.
In the video there is also a mention of how original items are more valued than an exact copy of those items. Again, this is part of the evolutionary side of humans investing their egos into those things. There is a limbic level need to know that these items are our things because only those things somehow contain the essence of us. Also in the video it’s postulated that the higher price of common items owned by celebrities we admire are a cost we’re willing to pay because we believe part of that celebrity’s essence is somehow contained in that item.
Why is it that we evolved to place such importance in knowing that some thing is ours, and only that thing is ours? Why do we, sometimes obsessively, need to imbue that thing with the essence of us? Why is this (apparently) part of our evolved mental firmware?
The Need to Know
I’m going to speculate here a bit. I think a strong argument can be made for men’s intrinsic need to verify his own paternity being linked to the Endowment Effect. In fact, I’d suggest that this ownership need can extend to not only a man’s children, but also to the women (even potential women) in his life. This isn’t to say women didn’t also evolve this sense – women display the Endowment Effect as much as men – but I’m going to approach this from the male side for the moment.
The video refers to this compulsive need to verify the authenticity of a thing as ‘magical thinking’, but is it really so magical? I think the writer and researcher would have us think this dynamic is silly because it’s ‘just a thing’ right? We shouldn’t place such a high degree of importance on a bicycle or an old guitar. That’s just vulgar materialism, right? Granted, some things, heirlooms maybe, can have sentimental value, but ultimately even those might well be replaceable too. It shouldn’t be so important to know something is magically your own.
Unless the thing that’s your own is your only shot at passing something of yourself into the future.
The butter knife that Elvis used to spread peanut butter on his peanut butter and banana sandwiches could be anything you can find at Walmart, but if his ‘essence‘ was in someway invested in that knife (and anyone cared to know about it) that part of Elvis might go on into perpetuity. That seems like childish magical thinking until you realize that the only part of the average person’s essence that might actually do this is their children. And until just recently, evolutionarily speaking, there wasn’t any completely dependable way to know if a man was 100% invested in his own ‘things’ – his progeny. His kids would carry on his essence, so in our evolved past it made sense to be obsessive-compulsive about the things that we’re one’s own.
As I stated, women also exhibit this effect as well, and I’d argue for much of the same reasons. Though, in none of the research related in this video was this Endowment Effect controlled for by sex – at least none that I’m aware of. Again, this is conjecture, but I would think that with the intrinsic certainty a woman has in knowing a child is her own, and the collectivist communal nature of women in hunter-gatherer society from which we developed, it might be that women place a higher ‘endowed’ value on different things than men do. I think this effect may be more pronounced in an era where women are almost unilaterally in control of Hypergamy.
I recently saw a video of a fertility doctor who had either used his own sperm to fertilize women’s eggs, or completely random samples to father about 40 children. The women, the children (mostly female) were absolutely aghast that he was their father or some donor who they would never know had contributed to half their DNA. The idea that the selection and control of Hypergamy was taken from them was worthy of the death penalty. Yet this is exactly the control we expect men to relinquish in this age. We will pat men on the back for abandoning their evolved instinct to ascertain paternity. We’ll tell a man he’s a hero for wifing up a single mother and “stepping up to be a father” to a child he didn’t sire and at the same time pretend that father’s are superfluous. We’ll change ‘Father’s Day’ to ‘Special Person’s Day’ and tell men they’re insecure in their masculinity for preferring a son or daughter of his own – but try to remove that control from a woman, try to tell her that Hypergamous choice wasn’t hers to make and it’s tantamount to rape.
“She was never yours, it was just your turn.”
I think it was my fellow Red Man Group friend Donovan Sharpe who coined this phrase. I might be wrong. I’ve read this around the usual Red Pill Reddit subs and other manosphere forums, but it wasn’t until last month (July) when I read yet one more story about a husband whose wife was leaving him and was in the process of Zeroing him out when he decided to kill her, their three kids and then himself. You can read the Twitter reaction to this here:
Five more casualties of the Feminine Imperative:https://t.co/2wx04PIbPG
— Rollo Tomassi (@RationalMale) July 11, 2018
Naturally women were appalled at the deaths of the wife and kids, as they should be. Pre-divorce women will prep months in advance for their new singleness. Often they’ll check out of the marriage and live without any real connection to their, usually Beta, Blue Pill conditioned, husband who languishes in this Blue Pill hell for the duration it takes his wife to establish a new mental persona and finds a way to exit the marriage. She’s already gone from the marriage, but the typical Blue Pill husband believes that he is the source of her discontent and resorts to anything he can to ‘keep things fresh’ or ‘rekindle the old flame’ that a feminine-primary popular culture tells him should be his responsibility. Unfortunately, this guy’s situation is typical of middle aged men today, and I honestly believe is the source that drives suicides and murder-suicides in this demographic. This man was going to be Zeroed Out and he knew it was coming.
That’s when I thought, ‘Was this guy’s turn with her just over?’ Was it as simple as that? If you read this couple’s story there wasn’t a history of him losing his mind. If anything Matthew Edwards was a pretty dedicated and invested father. No history of depression, suicidal tendencies or abuse; just another average frustrated chump who built a life for himself likely based on his Blue Pill conditioning.
But his turn was over and he likely believed the soul-mate myth. How was he supposed to live with out her?
The fem-stream media offers up their standard pablum – “Misogynistic society teaches men that they’re entitled to women’s bodies. Men need to be taught that they don’t own women.” or something similar that goes entirely against a man’s evolved Endowment Effect. What exactly does a man get to think is his own if not his family? When a woman finds out that her Hypergamous choice was made for her by a fertility clinic doctor rather than herself they’re out for blood – again, rightfully so. Then why are we surprised that men, particularly men in Matthew Edwards demographic, resort to murder and suicide when faced with losing everything they’ve invested themselves in.
Now this week we see another, almost identical, tragedy in Colorado this week.
I hate being right all the time.https://t.co/lparvfPOFI
— Rollo Tomassi (@RationalMale) August 16, 2018
And once again we have what looks like another guy being Zeroed out and another quadruple homicide. How man more of these murder-suicides (or just murders in this case) is it going to take before we collectively see the commonalities in all of them?
I had a conversation with several women in the wake of this latest tragedy and every one of them couldn’t wrap their head around why the guy would kill his kids? They could understand why he might kill his wife – the assumption being her unborn child was sired by guy who wasn’t him – but not his kids. I think this is interesting in the light of how men and women approach paternity/maternity and the Endowment Effect. The best answer I could come up with is that a man doesn’t want that part of him to go on into the future without him. The idea that his kids bear some of his essence and he would rather erase that essence entirely than live or kill himself with the knowledge that his children wouldn’t have him in their lives. Killing a wife might be the result of an uncontrolled rage, but killing your kids takes premeditation – there has to be some point to the act, some reasoning (corrupted as it may be) that made sense to him.
The Strategic Pluralism Theory is from a research study by Dr. Martie Haselton:
According to strategic pluralism theory (Gangestad & Simpson, 2000), men have evolved to pursue reproductive strategies that are contingent on their value on the mating market. More attractive men accrue reproductive benefits from spending more time seeking multiple mating partners and relatively less time investing in offspring. In contrast, the reproductive effort of less attractive men, who do not have the same mating opportunities, is better allocated to investing heavily in their mates and offspring and spending relatively less time seeking additional mates.
From a woman’s perspective, the ideal is to attract a partner who confers both long-term investment benefits and genetic benefits. Not all women, however, will be able to attract long-term investing mates who also display heritable fitness cues. Consequently, women face trade-offs in choosing mates because they may be forced to choose between males displaying fitness indicators or those who will assist in offspring care and be good long-term mates (Gangestad & Simpson, 2000).
The commonalities in every one of these murder-suicides is a Blue Pill conditioned, Beta husband who by all indications was playing by the First Set of Books. By all indications these men would fit into the second type of man mention in Strategic Pluralism Theory – they did everything right, they played by the rules, they did their best to invest themselves in their mates and offspring and likely believed they’d earned some Relational Equity from it. But then, their turn was over with their wives. For whatever reason they were faced with a complete loss, a Zeroing Out, of everything they believed they owned. The things they invested so much of their lives in, the things they worked so hard for, the things that retained his ‘essence’, the things they invested their egos in were all being taken away from them. When faced with such a reality men tend to look at only two options; remake and rebuild what they had in the knowledge that this too might be taken from them, or they can simply erase all themselves and all the ‘things’ they were attached too.
Prenatal Testosterone and the Earnings of Men and Women Anne C. Gielen, Jessica Holmes and Caitlin Myers “Testosterone, which induces sexual differentiation of the male fetus, is believed to transfer from males to their littermates in placental mammals. Among humans, individuals with a male twin have been found to exhibit greater masculinization of sexually dimorphic attributes relative to those with a female twin. We therefore regard twinning as a plausible natural experiment to test the link between prenatal exposure to testosterone and labor market earnings. For men, the results suggest positive returns to testosterone exposure. For women, however, the results… Read more »
Burden of performance https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4653185/figure/fig01/?report=objectonly “DISCUSSION Our experiment provides evidence for a novel gender→testosterone pathway and points to possible mechanisms and mediation via gender-stereotyped behavior. We showed that wielding power increases testosterone in women regardless of whether it is done in stereotypically masculine or feminine ways, supporting the stereotyped behavior hypothesis (H1) over the stereotyped performance hypothesis (H2) for how gender might modulate testosterone. Our research design was able to disentangle wielding power from masculinity using trained actors, providing an innovative new paradigm. By involving actors, we were able to maximize the strengths and rigor of a within-subjects design, whereby participants… Read more »
@rugby11,
Dude! I’m adding my name to the list asking you to please stop!
The vast majority of us are too busy living our lives, engaged with the world to read your endless ‘cut & pastes’. You may sincerely believe that it adds to the conversation but it more often does not and it’s become increasingly aggravating to just scroll past it.
Others have given you excellent advise and I will echo it… Get your ass in the arena, quit analyzing and start living.
Ownership https://academic.oup.com/beheco/article/25/4/685/257440 “Mating system and testosterone Arguably, the sample sizes for mating systems other than social monogamy were small (but not smaller than Ketterson et al. 2005, who came to different conclusions) and may prevent a definite answer, but the data did not even show the slightest trend. Even though the sample for nonmonogamous birds was limited, we wonder whether an absence of a relationship between male-to-female testosterone and mating system really is surprising. Previous studies have shown that peak testosterone concentrations of male birds do not vary with mating system (Wingfield et al. 1990;,Beletsky et al. 1995; Hirschenhauser et… Read more »
Online gamer goes postal at Madden competition in Florida. Probably topped himself.
https://www.news4jax.com/news/police-id-madden-19-tournament-shooter-as-gamer-david-katz
He looks somewhat feminine in the face. I’m assuming the gamers he shot / shot at awere all young men, but that might not be true.
Rugby, this new wall-of-text quoting someone else is not doing anyone any good.
Suppose you read two or three links, then summarize what you have learned in your own words? You can include the links after your summary.
Because it looks like you are stuck in fact-collection mode or maybe analysis-paralysis. Not doing you or anyone else any favors.
Rugby won’t listen …me and countless others have urged him to stop the spamming. He reacts like it’s a shit test. He will just amplify!
Baltimore Sun: Filings from Katz’s parents’ divorce, in 2005, widely discussed his emotional and social struggles, as well as his troubles in school. The documents note a hospitalization for psychiatric treatment. The guy was weirdly unsmiling even when being congratulated by an NFL player at a previous tournament win Expect “incel” to be tossed into the post-mortems, to the extent that he could be useful to either side in any debate. (He supposedly was anti-Trump for what that’s worth). I don’t see the story having any legs, except for a “gamer subculture” feature or two. Cliche alert: He and his… Read more »
kfg
Within the field of psychology, common sense confirmed to a percentage point:
Publications such as Nature could save a lot of money by replacing editors and “peer review” with a bright, shiny coin. Heads – science! Tails – not science.
The guy was weirdly unsmiling
His facial muscles show a strange “set” to them in the few pix I’ve seen, sorta kinda like the alleged Sandy Hook shooter. “Better living through chemistry”? Very likely.
palmasailor, Orson, Junkyard? Not at all went out dancing and was thinking about the topic of suicide fan my route back home. Look in both your experiences what are the moment’s that keep you from self destruction? The science of it was what i was attempting to get across. Not looking into making your any less stressful reading wise or to bother your sense’s but i find it interesting to see people in the world struggle along. Yet their is a stance of resilience. Is advanced and profound. Men who don’t let other’s get into them or passed their mental… Read more »
“Would you say that if i told you any of this on a boat?”
Rugby, you haven’t been saying any of that. You’ve been cut and pasting article copy, what others are saying.
Pretend we are on a boat and tell me about an article you have read and what you thought about it.
Then you can paste in the link to the article, and if you have “sold” it to us with your words, trust me, we will have a look at it.
“Pretend we are on a boat and tell me about an article you have read and what you thought about it.” Ok no article this is coming from my mind on my bike back from last evening. What if a women did what Rollo writes about? What if a women killed her whole family because she was being zeroed out? What would happen if a women decided to take the life of herself and her children the way Medea does by Euripides? What if are culture and violence was brought back to the point of having women choose who lives… Read more »
“What if a women killed her whole family because she was being zeroed out?” Men would be held to blame. Either that or PMS. For which men are probably to blame. Although my own great . . . great grandma found a man to take her in and give her protection. “Each time i push it i keep being cut off because i haven’t found a way to engage with someone without any of the trauma coming up.” You can only help the men who are ready to be helped – but you have to have your own shit together… Read more »
Rugby Alright what i learned from what was placed up above was that men having family’s become extensions of them self’s losing that in a social context can invoke rage loss and being zero’ed out to the max dosn’t motivate you to make the world a better place, for yourself or anyone else This is a start. Try using fewer words next time, that means you pick words more carefully. What if…. Rugby, women have been killing their children for millennia. Modern example: Andrea Yates murdered her 5 children. Feminists and their TradCon sock puppets blamed her husband first, her… Read more »
Man, you’d want to be paid for fucking this evil, misandrist skank. What in the hell was Bourdain thinking? Watching his shows now (i never watched them before his death) all i see is a sad, lost, very unhappy man. It’s all in the eyes, and how he can’t really smile. Being “in love” with trash like Argento would make even the biggest masochist miserable…
Good to see they’ve used a very unflattering pic of her in this article from Down Under as she begins to get her come-uppance…
https://www.theage.com.au/entertainment/tv-and-radio/asia-argento-axed-from-x-factor-20180828-p5005w.html
What in the hell was Bourdain thinking?
He wasn’t. He was emoting. Blue pill thirst is real.
Perhaps he believed (emoted) he’d found a quality woman to be his soulmate…
Good to see they’ve used a very unflattering pic of her in this article from Down Under as she begins to get her come-uppance…
That photo is straight up wicked witch of the west. Poor old Bourdain became the thirsty beta poster boy with that hookup. It’s all many of us will ever remember about him. A cautionary tale.
@blax and maybe @rollo
absolutely mind blowing
https://twitter.com/SeloSlav/status/1034219002929631232
J
Aaron macgruder called it
https://bit.ly/2LxRW5w
Homicidal women also can sometimes play the post-partum depression card
… And if post-partum won’t work, you can always try PTSD. Notice the Mel B teaser above that Asia Argento piece? Former Spice Girl going to rehab for PTSD —No, she didn’t serve in Iraq, it’s from her breakup with Stephen Belafonte
Here’s an interesting example of a still ok looking 38 y.o. Australian female politician who claims she was “slut-shamed” out of office. One of the accusations was that she did a Sharon Stone flash at a male staffer, which she naturally denies…
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-08-28/slut-shaming-forced-me-out-of-politics-emma-husar/10152266
Mel B
Always been a case
http://www.spicenews.com/localbak_pages/Our%202-year%20affair%20with%20Mel%20B/Our%202-year%20affair%20with%20Mel%20B.htm
@Silver FoX
We had the wonderful case of Nashville’s mayor resigning after discovery of her sordid affair with the head of her police security detail. They did the grand tour of Europe together on her “official business” and were also rockin’ a van at 6 AM at a local cemetery.
The cop’s wife asked for a divorce but the mayor’s hubby — a college professor — seemed to pathetically take it all in stride.
https://www.tennessean.com/story/news/2018/03/06/nashville-mayor-megan-barry-expected-resign-press-conference-tuesday-morning/398440002/
@EhIntellect
Eddie Murphy says: “The brightest part of my life is my kids”.
https://www.etonline.com/eddie-murphy-expecting-baby-no-10-108657
https://www.instagram.com/p/BOeCYh8DTlM/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link
@FoX
What in the hell was Bourdain thinking?
Hold that thought.
What turns men into a clingy mess?
Imagine a guy in an emotionally remote location (aka alone… in a crowd)… starved of female attention… for a prolonged time… with no perceived options… he meets a charming woman…
@Obit
You mentioned your in the biz, hit me up if you ever want to privately chat about the deadwood biz and RP
https://therationalmale.com/2015/11/06/always-default-to-game/#comment-126675
@Roused
The deadwood biz — I assume you mean newspapers rather than foul-mouthed TV westerns.
Traditional newspapers and magazines are more like dead meat now, so glad I got out in time.
Happily semi-retired while still serving some loyal long-time clients — mostly corporate women who simply can’t organize a coherent train of thought.
I comment on the media in a TRM context because the FI has largely hijacked the industry for its own purposes.
@ O,B,I,T,
I’m a long-time TRM reader and rare commenter, who is also in the Nashville area. Can we set up a time for coffee? How can we get connected?
Marko
That should be O.B.I.T., with periods.
@Marko
Sorry for the misunderstanding — I was replying to the Aussie guy FoX so when I said “we” I just meant this crazy female mayor we had here in the US! So I’m afraid our relationship will have to remain long-distance but I do appreciate the offer.
“I comment on the media in a TRM context because the FI has largely hijacked the industry for its own purposes.”
In so many ways….but has it really been hijacked? When you help the hijackers and welcome them aboard it sorta seems complicit.
@ OBIT
Thanks for the reply, OBIT.
Well worth a try.
This TRM site, virtual friendships, is of great value to me, and to so many others. Thanks, Rollo, and commentariat!
@Roused
Yeah, I was going to add that the guys there are generally very beta and they fell without a shot being fired.
Flies of a roger pt2
Actually I have a ton of Jack in me but in general and in the scouts I was Ralph. What part of the book do you resonante with?
Speaking of Asia Argento…#SheToo
https://www.breitbart.com/big-hollywood/2018/08/20/sabo-responds-to-asia-argento/
With Kirk and Bones casting an accusing eye on her
The heart is () above all things
https://people.com/movies/rose-mcgowan-distances-herself-asia-argento-i-loved-you/
Ivan had it right
Of course Rosie McGowan is “distancing herself” from Asia Argento, she pretty much has to in order to maintain her SJW righteous-wronged-woman
actcred.#SheToo might just have done some real damage to #MeToo. Even Norm Normal should be able to see that, and Nancy Normal might just need to dial indignation back.
Where’s Blaximus when such lolz are here for the taking?
Blax and ASD both gone…
Coincidence?
@ Anonymous Reader “Speaking of Asia Argento…#SheToo” Great article! Thanks for sharing that. Excellent work by Sabo. I’ll have to check out his other subversive work. It’s a very powerful poster, with the witch pulling a very nasty face and a big “fuck you” to all men. Her middle finger looks way too long, a bit like ET’s, don’t you think. There is certainly a bit of Gollum about her, the more she ages. She’ll be rather hideous by 50. Her ugly heart is manifesting itself into her physical appearance, which often happens. The malevolent male version, Rupert Murdoch, is… Read more »
@SJF – Stardusk is a pseudo-intellectual poseur. He manages to stretch some knowledge of the world into a POV only because he speaks and thinks so goddamned slowly. His understanding of economics is childlike, fyi. And his political worldview, while very broad is also quite shallow. He’s one of those reflexive libertarians who can’t let go of his anarchic ideas at some basic level. MGTOW is a “Rage Quit”. But don’t get me wrong, I’m personally witnessing the phenomena of how young women are evolving socially. Many young men are living in a pussy-less world in which even HB3 fatties… Read more »
“The first step in a real Red Pill ride is realizing that trying to figure out the world’s problems is a fool’s errand in the first place. ” Exactly. Work on your RP self and everything else falls into place. Give Ceasar, Ceasar’s. You keep the rest. It’s the difference of force fitting a rote PUA on a girl (process) vs. being the best version of you (flow). The former limits out quickly as there is a predictive quality to it, and you are working within a circumscribed area of success, success defined by others. The latter doesn’t predict, takes… Read more »
@Eh – Only drawback for me is the tendency towards sociopathy and megalomania, lol…
@ Scribblerg
I get it. I really do. There’s a superpower with machivellian inhibition. Unbridled inhibition is self-destructive. I’ve known both.
I’m not dead yet and there’s a lot unknown ahead of me. IMO, I don’t need to know future details anymore, anyways.
Have a great day.
@Palma – Funny story, he he. The HB9 just reached out, she’s bored. The new guy is a pussy liberal and is just not cutting it, lol…I think I may have alpha widowed her mind for me, lol. Gonna plow her like fresh earth over the next few days. He he. I’m in the midst of a “staycation” and am loving it. Up to all kinds of shit…Every time I get my mind right about pussy and plates – a piece of ass drops in my lap. Good reminder. Now, to get some more prospects in the door this afternoon.… Read more »
It’s not a numbers game. It’s a learning game. You put in numbers to learn skills. When you develop skills you don’t need numbers. Looking at it from a numbers game perspective is going to retard your game. It becomes a buffer.. well 6 down no big deal 93 more to go… and keep you from a ruthless focus on closing each set. The biggest obstacle as an older guy is being proximate to a population of young girls. Because most of the time they aren’t going to be where you prefer to be. Especially for night game. Night game… Read more »
and “night game” on the streets in front of bars is good as well.
Palma We have 22,000 students here in walking distance and I absolutely hate being in the bars they are in. I hear you… lol But if you want that demo… you gotta go get it… Actually you should go hit it for a month at least just to get in the experience and start squashing some beliefs… Field being king and all… But street game will get you some of the demo and you have momentum going for you, i.e. they are leaving or looking for someplace to go. Solves the noise problem as well. But if you are bored… Read more »
and don’t go home early!
Going home early is a problem.</i. Yeah. It's another facet of "proximity" though… when I was full on into learning mode I'd start at happy hours at 5, then go eat around 8, then do street game for a bit or go take a nap until 10:30… then go out and hit the clubs/bars and then after hours places, food stalls… Till i was one of the few people left on the street. 3AM etc… Then go to work and do it all over again. Wrecked… a lot of guys leave at 10 or 10:30… Before the young girls are… Read more »
Here you go Palma. Brit too…
Never pole dance with the main tentpole
Deplatforming comes to open source software:
https://github.com/lerna/lerna/pull/1616
How about this?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xxe6DJOC5lo
Maybe a few minutes amirite?
Now this is interesting…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-SMDDI5pQB8
same girl [Playmate] with a high status guy… LOL she is invisible. Guy is sooooooper chill.
Lessons.
@scribb I’m headed into town, 2k 18-25yo female college students just showed up in my town, If you haven’t already, I’d be interested in hear more how you approach this young fresh meat. @Palma I am 50 and they are 20 as some are just grossed out by the idea In my experience with sugar babies, this is just BS. Seriously none of the girls I contacted were grossed out by the age difference when $ was involved. These are the same girls you find on Tinder. The biggest ‘gross-out’ factor are the hits to their reputation if they are… Read more »
Palma
Odd really.
Not at all. You simply cannot find a girl who you can relate to the same way as a guy. Interests, thinking, etc…
Use them for what they are good at. complimentary energy, feminine energy, sex, gestation, child rearing, etc.
Save all the other stuff for guys.
Much easier to deal with them when you aren’t expecting so much, that they can never give.
Use them for what they are good at. complimentary energy, feminine energy, sex,
So very true!
woman?
Palma
I get it. Hard stuff. But try to follow Draper’s advice.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=dOgB4aaZhZM
And to get really good with women you do have to enjoy them.
“Looking at it from a numbers game perspective is going to retard your game. It becomes a buffer.. .” HooBoy! Have I talked about this offline. Keeping tabs, score, notches is about a completion, a champion’s belt. It is insecurity stuff. Tabulated N-count = scarcity mentality. N-count matters though in the mindset as the count increases, not the accuracy. As an example, in an LTR, it shows when he tallies the successive days of sex. In the single guy, an accurate n-count becomes a badge of honor. Both examples place women as the prize, not the man. It subtle stuff… Read more »
@ Palma,
What do you enjoy? Do you enjoy life less in general and women in particular? No need to answer. Something to think about.
I had a physical today. The first few minutes was focused on my attitude. Questions revolved around a potential loss of happiness in things that I once enjoyed. Do I move slower? Do I move too fast?
Palma
“You don’t get it because you didn’t live it.”
Sure, your particular circumstances. Which sucked.
But nearly everyone has reference experiences of pain, dissapointment, slights slings and arrows. There could be a TRM competition for suckiest. Doesn’t matter.
You carry it with you or you dont. That is a choice. And that choice is up to each of us every day.
I generally look at what makes me unhappy and start to trim around that, cut it out or build a way round it.
“The barmaid in my local pub called me a sexist the other day for saying that all the men would be watching the football.”
Agree and amplify…
Take the piss…
“The barmaid in my local pub called me a sexist the other day”
Me: Are you coming on to me? Down girl.
Sounds like you’re gonna have to make lemonade from lemons. Not fun. You’ve been through worse. Remember this: All those queers despise you for what they will never have. Unfucked up desire sex that produced the greatest thing in your life that’ll outlast you…and them.
I notice that they can get really drunk and still not drop the phone. Is that some kind of evolutionary advance?
https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-08-29/wife-trump-ethics-lawyer-fined-after-she-was-busted-boffing-inmate-car
@ Palma “I have to say, I have no choice. I’m bored shitless by women my age. I’m so bored shitless that I can’t even be bothered to game them properly. At least I enjoy hitting on the young ones even if so far I’m shooting blanks…” Of course, there are very few women our age we would be attracted to, even for one night. The last one i fucked drunk at a party i just couldn’t do again, even though we had booked a flash hotel for the night. Earlier at dinner she showed me pics of her “emotionally… Read more »
another case of a man fearing getting zeroed out? https://americanmilitarynews.com/2018/08/police-man-kills-son-and-daughter-both-10-then-fatally-shoots-himself-in-chicago/
“old man game – 56 trying to fuck 20yos – is very hard. Huge failure rate. Not for the faint of heart”
“Your game needs to be tight but it is numbers when I am 50 and they are 20 as some are just grossed out by the idea”
“Back when i was slaying pussy…”
50 is the male wall. (inb4 instagram pics of staged photos of a high status old celebrity surrounded by beautiful girls)
Palma
I have usually enjoyed women, but since moving to this new location which is the LGBT capital of the UK I just feel this bloody hostility from the vast majority of my interactions with almost everybody.
I’m a straight white middle aged man and I think that half of them bloody hate me for it.
I really don’t think it’s my imagination. I’ve travelled and worked over a lot of the planet and I’ve never felt anything like it.
Well, this just means the straight girls must be even hungrier for non-soy boy?
“50 is the male wall. (inb4 instagram pics of staged photos of a high status old celebrity surrounded by beautiful girls)” Not even close J. Even if it were true. What are you going to do about that? Better to burn out, than it is to rust? No Sleep Till Brooklyn? https://youtu.be/07Y0cy-nvAg There is plenty of evidence to the contrary in the red pill community. And also in my community. But you might think, as you should, that that is an Apex fallacy. Because it is. My advice? Be in the Apex. Demonstrate with your life that there is no… Read more »
@ScribblerG
Props on you being more mentally healthy. And serving yourself. Oxygen mask on first. Your comments demonstrate you’ve done better in your purpose and mission.
And rocking and rolling with Red Pill.
I could quibble (psychologically), but don’t need to. Different strokes for different folks.
God Bless you, you genius. Your comment are genius level. But you know that. Thumbs up.
Comment when you feel it.
@j
Making things blurry once again, huh? lol
50 is the male wall.
YaReally and scray should have said that and left scribblerg where they found him!
Push the limits to find them, don’t draw them…
Too many guys end up clinging to reasons why something is fucked up for them and that there’s no way out. A beaten down state is a sign of trying something the wrong way too many times. Wrong focus. Change in approach = change in attitude.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Agez9MSD0LQ Jeff Bullet is 52 years old and he consistently dates women less than half his age. He has trained with many of the big names in the Dating Science industry starting with Neil Strauss, Ross Jefferies, etc., and then moving up to Love Systems and the world’s best coaches. Over time Jeff has worked out which techniques are the most effective in picking up hot girls and as he says, “You soon know what works and what doesn’t when you’ve got 20+ years on your target.” Bullet hails from Australia and had a series of long term relationships including… Read more »
From Jeff Bullet’s clip above:
Let’s start by saying there’s only one person in the world that can make you happy, alright? And that’s you. Having a smoking hot young girlfriend is not necessarily going to make you happy. However, when you’ve got game and you’ve learned how to apply game to pick up younger women, this certainly brings a lot of happiness in your life to have the power to do that.
Alphas have different reference experiences than betas. “Having the power to do that” is one. Gather your reference experience right.
For me, the definition of the Wall: The Age at which you notice a significant drop in the level of sexual interest from the 1st tier option of the opposite sex (for women that’d be the best looking males, and average looking dudes with master level game. For men, that’d be the HB8+ <25 girls). Can you still score with the 1st tier? sure. but it will be significantly more difficult than you're pre-Wall phase. Hence the definition. "Even if it were true. What are you going to do about that?" Accept reality and follow @IRL's advice: "Change in approach"… Read more »
@j less than half his age.[52/2+4 =30] What’s with the math, bro? Lemme FIFY: 52/2+4+7*2+1=45. There! Target second tier women (HB6+ >25 year olds, and HB6-7.5 30+ women) Internetz guidelinez are harsh! lolz (someone in the crowd shouts: not enough tiers and bins!) instead of cold approaching 100s of women Why the false alternative. Be the high value guy at your favorite venues is not on the table any more? It ain’t game? Mystery wept. Ok, let’s get back to the main bit: Find your purpose and enjoy your challenges. Whatever gets your juices flowing. Pussy = added value. Same… Read more »
@Palmasailor
You have to take women for what they are and can offer, hoping for more is a recipe for disappointment, it places undue burden on her and leads to disappointment for yourself.
Enjoy them for what they are, no judgement needed.
@Palma Your problem is not your location. It’s not women that surround you. It’s not their silly nature either. You feel alone, incomplete or unfulfilled one way or another. There’s an annoying hole, something’s missing. Company? Meaning? Whatever that is, women won’t fix that. No point in complaining about them. Moving to a different location just to discover that pussy juice doesn’t get your juice flowing is not a solution either. That’s the common ground for Blue Pill and PUA fallacy. I think it’s better to uncover the right cause than to waste time trying to build an assumed solution.… Read more »
What will we have conquered? None but ourselves. –George Mallory
@SJF – Kind words, my fellow traveler on the road of happy destiny. Ya, ditto, your commentary is full of progress and growth as well. I feel honored to share this journey with you. Palma et al – Love the return to game talk here, but watch out, surely some sage here will tell us to ‘take it to the field report page’ – lol, not fucking likely. All the meta mental masturbation is just so whatever after a while. Best thing many guys here, particularly the young ones, could internalize is this. In fact, I’m not going to give… Read more »
“REAL LEARNING IMPLIES A PERMANENT CHANGE IN BEHAVIOR”
No link’s
I hit 200 in deadlift on Thuesday an sunday i meet Sarah and Erin at a dance i hit up. They both know so much about thing’s i enjoy already dance for one. 431 is my over goal for deadlift’s so halfway their.
Palmasailor
Whatever get’s to where you need/want to go it’s worth reading about.
@ Scrib I don’t recognize you anymore. @ Palma I’m right there with you. I get in unproductive circular thoughts, usually while idling in liminal spaces. Feels great coming out of it and I remind myself never, ever to stray from the script. Before we get too distal from Palma’s description of the homosexual ascendency/hegemony, I was reminded of this: Suicide is the 2nd leading cause of death among young people ages 10 to 24. LGB youth seriously contemplate suicide at almost three times the rate of heterosexual youth. LGB youth are almost five times as likely to have attempted… Read more »
Scribbs Forget age. Gauge interest. Generate interest. Be happy. Enjoy your life. Enjoy being a sexual being. And who cares of you get shot down as a creep – almost never happens now, fyi – get on the field and into the game. magnificent… FWIW – I’m intermediate, maybe highish. But essentially a hobbyist. Game is out there and accessible to all. You just have to work it. I worked it like a job for a couple of years. Following Mystery, Ya, Scray, (yes those two were idiots on many many things but on game we always saw eye to… Read more »
“Forget age. Gauge interest. Generate interest. Be happy. Enjoy your life. Enjoy being a sexual being. And who cares of you get shot down as a creep – almost never happens now, fyi – get on the field and into the game.” Lol. I was in a back alley brewery bar yesterday. Had a sweet java porter, not that that is my cup of tea. I was killing time and it was 16 ounces. My son/wife wanted to dump sell his college/grad school scooter to the neighbor kid in our hometown who is freshman at college for $650. Last time… Read more »
JJJJJJJJJJJ Stop speculating on what life over 50 is liKe for a masculine male is like. You saying shit like that is disingenuous (not candid or sincere, typically by pretending that one knows less about something than one really does). What the fuck do you know? And why do you care? There is proper living for your own script. And there is fucking up your own script from what you have heard. Since when do you have a crystal ball? Live your life in the moment and remember that “it seemed to be the right thing to do at the… Read more »
https://www.theguardian.com/science/2018/aug/30/ready-steady-pout-how-selfies-can-help-you-climb-the-social-ladder http://www.pnas.org/content/115/35/8722 Publicly displayed, sexualized depictions of women have proliferated, enabled by new communication technologies, including the internet and mobile devices. These depictions are often claimed to be outcomes of a culture of gender inequality and female oppression, but, paradoxically, recent rises in sexualization are most notable in societies that have made strong progress toward gender parity. Few empirical tests of the relation between gender inequality and sexualization exist, and there are even fewer tests of alternative hypotheses. We examined aggregate patterns in 68,562 sexualized self-portrait photographs (“sexy selfies”) shared publicly on Twitter and Instagram and their association with city-,… Read more »
” . . . we provide an empirical understanding of what female sexualization reflects in societies and why it proliferates.”
Ummmm, let me take a wild stab at it.
Sexual reproduction?
“Ummmm, let me take a wild stab at it. Sexual reproduction? Short cut. Matt Ridley took a less wild stab at it. Long cut. https://www.mcgoodwin.net/pages/otherbooks/mr_redqueen.html Chapter 10: The Intellectual Chess Game Brains are large in dolphins (1500 gm) in part to deceive. Lucy the Australopithecus afarensis had brain size 400 c.c.s (bigger than chimp, smaller than orangutan). Current human capacity is 1400 c.c.s. Brain growth occurred because of Red Queen sexual selection. Chomsky theory of hard-wired deep structure in brain preprogrammed to learn language. But vocabulary and syntax is plastic and variable. Dogma of sociologists (Emil Durkheim) 1895: anything that… Read more »
@SJF “Stop speculating on what life over 50 is liKe for a masculine male is like.” I’m going by what the 50 year old guys still in the game are talking about. IRL, I don’t know any successful old players. So I come here for hope that there is an suitable alternative to retiring from the game and settling down with a girl before I hit the wall. “why do you care?” because I have no aspirations (never have tbh) to go the traditional route and settle down with a girl and pop out kids like the OMGs here (I’ll… Read more »
“I have accepted the fact that when I hit the Wall ™, my odds of banging the top tier pussy will be vastly diminished.” Then you have accepted a falsity. What you are likely to find is that your odds will be diminished with about 25% of them, 50% will be about the same (although perhaps less likely to want their gaggle to know about it. Isolation and discretion may become more necessary) and 25% your odds will be enhanced. The curve of viable targets shits, but the overall odds are a wash. Or you could fail to adapt, let… Read more »
J
“IRL, I don’t know any successful old players.”
This is a function of who you are. A 24 year old nobody from nowheresville. You won’t find the keys by your lamppost.
” . . . shits . . .”
I got the f out. My bad.
Funny story
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/24/business/media/james-wolfe-ali-watkins-leaks-reporter.html
“Colleagues of Ms. Watkins describe her as a reporter of unusual talent.. “
I said settle j, not settle down.
Apex fallacy time, you can take a girl for an ltr, attractive and value added. Then mold her. And chose without making necessity a virtue each three months. Rinse, fuck, repeat.
In my book, settle means not having an ltr you really want to be with. To make necessity a virtue.
Miss the Age of Pics, Rollo
https://media.gettyimages.com/photos/johnny-hallyday-et-adeline-blondieau-lors-dune-soire-au-fouquets-le-picture-id967719714?s=612×612