Rites of Passage

aboriginal-passage

In the past I’ve discussed the hesitancy of young men to refer to themselves as ‘men’ or to really even embrace what might be considered a ‘conventional’ idea of masculinity. You’ve probably read me using that word before. I use the word conventional because I feel it conveys a better understanding of a naturalized expression of masculinity in a way that men evolved into. Occasionally I have a reader ask me why I don’t use the term ‘traditional’ with respect to masculinity, but I’m not sure they really mean the same thing.

It’s easy to think of masculinity in terms of tradition, but whose tradition are we really referring to? ‘Traditional Masculinity’ as a term has assumed a derogatory meaning in a feminine-primary social order. It’s become one of those catch-terms that we’re all supposed to understand as being characteristic of backward mindsets. It’s part of the social convention that seeks to ridicule, shame and confuse boys who later become men about what masculinity ought to mean to them. So, it’s for this reason I use the word ‘conventional’. It conveys the idea that masculinity in a binary sense has evolved aspects that are inherent and unique to men. So while certain cultures may have had different traditions and traditional roles for men, there is a unifying conventionality of masculinity that relates to all men and maleness in general.

Feminine-centrism doesn’t like this idea. It doesn’t like the idea that masculine characteristics or behaviors are the sole propriety of men. The reflex then is to paint any conventionally masculine attribute, way of thinking, aggression, passion or aspiration as either representative of ‘toxic’ harmful or anti-social, or, depending on its usefulness in securing power, it’s cast as something “not necessarily masculine” since some women can lay claim to that trait.

In several prior posts I’ve outlined how boys are taught from a very early age to gender-loathe their maleness. It’s part of Blue Pill conditioning, but more so, I think it’s important for Blue Pill or unplugging adult men to understand the mechanics and reasoning behind why it’s in the Feminine Imperative’s interests to keep conventional masculinity something ambiguous, arbitrary or something men ought to be able to fluidly define for themselves. That last part there is important, because what most men think is their own self-definition of masculinity is always founded in what the Feminine Imperative has conditioned him to believe is correct.

Latent Purposes

In a social order that’s ostensibly founded upon a baseline equalism (in principle) among men and women we have to look at why it might be necessary for boys to be taught that ‘traditional’ masculinity is toxic. The easy answer is a want for control, but not so much in the terms of convincing boys to become men who will loathe their maleness. Remember, there’s a lot of conventional masculinity that is conveniently useful to further the interests of women and Hypergamy – but the conditioning becomes one of selectively classifying the useful aspects as ‘healthy’ and the non-useful ones as ‘toxic’.

The most important thing to consider here is that, for future men, equalism’s purpose in their upbringing is to prevent them from ever internalizing the idea that they should be their own mental point of origin. This I think is one of the fundamental issues most Blue Pill men struggle with in their own unplugging.

One of the old books, traditional, understandings is that men, by virtue of being male, can expect a degree of authority in their lives and in their families. A man may not be the boss at work, but the traditional understanding was that he could expect to be the head of household in his own home. Feminine primacy, under the auspices of equalism, has effectively conditioned this idea out of men over the course of generations. If men and women are blank-slate functional equals, ideally, there will never be a default authority in an intersexual relationship.

From a conventional, evolutionary perspective we know this baseline equalism is not just false, but we also understand that it serves as a control over the masculine nature men are born into. Men and women are different; cognitively, neurologically, biologically and psychologically, but our socialized presumptions with regard to how boys are raised to be men deliberately conditions them to believe we are the same – or at least functionally so.

The Crime of Being Male

There’s been some pushback to this in our Red Pill awakening, and not all of it is the result of the manosphere. As Hypergamy becomes more openly embraced in a larger social respect, more men are made aware of their deliberate conditioning to accommodate it. What they choose to do with that awareness is up to them, but the response from the Feminine Imperative to this awareness is to criminalize or make toxic the embrace of conventional masculinity on the part of men. It becomes a hate-crime to express any conventionally male attribute.

This is a potential danger for Blue Pill men in that the expressions of maleness that they display are on one hand desired by women, but also a risk to their reputation or livelihood if that expression is offensive to women. Red Pill aware men may have the advantage of knowing women’s nature well enough to mitigate the risks, but Blue Pill men will be stuck in a paradigm that puts them at risk for wanting to be men.

Again, equalist Blue Pill conditioning’s purpose is to prevent men from assuming themselves as their mental point of origin, but once a man’s disabused himself of putting the feminine as his primary internal concern there must be an opposite, contingent, reaction on the part of the Feminine Imperative to put him back into compliance. Thus, we see the criminalization of maleness.

Pedestals

For some time it’s been a manosphere staple to tell guys to take the girl off the pedestal if he wants to be successful with women. We call it pedestalization, but one reason that dynamic, to put a woman on a higher order than oneself, is so pervasive in men is due exactly to this “equalist” conditioning. The internalization is one of making that girl, that woman, the centerpiece of a man’s headspace. This becomes who he is and it’s the result of a childhood that taught him he must place the concerns of girls above his own on many different psychological levels.

Once that guy becomes Red Pill aware, no matter who does his unplugging, not only does he remove girls from the pedestal personally, but also on a larger sociological scope. And this scope is what the Feminine Imperative must pushback against.

Blue Pill conditioning teaches boys/men to cast doubt on their own masculinity. What constitutes masculinity? Is it a mask or a performance they put on? Is it something to be proud of or some problem to keep in check? Should boys/men feel insecure or secure about it? These are the consistent ambiguities the Feminine Imperative wants to invest into the next generations of men because it keeps women on the pedestal. Only women possess the solution to their problem of maleness.

But the Blue Pill also conditions boys/men to never presume to consider themselves as a “man”. The joke is that men are never really men, but rather they become ‘bigger boys’. This is a social convention that attempts to keep men in a juvenilized state and thus ensuring women are the only ‘adults’ to make the judgement call. This ridicule has the purpose of denying men their status of ‘manhood’. If men are perpetual boys, they can never assume the default ‘headship’ of being men. It is a control for authority.

This is another reason men are conditioned to keep women on the pedestal; only women can confirm ‘manhood’ from a superior (mental) position in that man’s mind. When a woman is at the top of a man’s mental point of origin – and not even a specific woman, but womankind – she decides his status of being a man. So it follows that men ought to internalize the doubt of understanding manhood or conventional masculinity.

So, the struggle men have in coming to a Red Pill awareness is one of removing women from this pedestal, but also one of giving oneself permission to be a man. This may seem kind of simplistic, but to a guy who’s been conditioned to put women before himself in his own internal, mental, conversations it’s a very tough challenge. Blue Pill conditioning invests a doubt into boys and then men. They are conditioned to self-regulate on many levels, but to generally put their own concerns beneath those of others and largely the feminine. They are taught to self-sublimate by never giving themselves permission to be “men” in a conventional sense.

Iron Rule of Tomassi #9

Never Self-Deprecate under any circumstance. This is a Kiss of Death that you self-initiate and is the antithesis of the Prize Mentality. Once you’ve accepted yourself and presented yourself as a “complete douche” there’s no going back to confidence with a woman. Never appeal to a woman’s sympathies. Her sympathies are given by her own volition, never when they are begged for – women despise the obligation of sympathy. Nothing kills arousal like pity. Even if you don’t seriously consider yourself pathetic, it never serves your best interest to paint yourself as pathetic. Self-Depreciation is a misguided tool for the AFC, and not something that would even occur to an Alpha.

One important reason I made this an Iron Rule was because it’s almost a default response of men to presume their own ridiculousness. The reflexive response is of course to not take yourself so seriously and have an ability to laugh at yourself when it’s merited. That’s all fine and well, a necessity for a healthy sense of self, but few men realize their ease with self-deprecation is a result of their conditioning to find themselves ridiculous as men. “Men” are ridiculous.

It’s very easy for Red Pill aware men to lose sight of what the Blue Pill conditions men for and how this conditioning has evolved over the course of generations. The latent purpose remains the same (preventing men from adopting their own mental point of origin), but the methods and social mores change fluidly with what the Feminine Imperative finds most efficient for the time. For the past 20 years there’s been a concentrated effort to remove men from deciding their own manhood for themselves.

Rites of Passage

From Remove the Man:

Guys vs. Men

I was participating in a conversation just recently with a young woman of 26 and a young man of 18. The conversation itself wasn’t important, but at one point the young man referred to himself as a ‘Man’. He said something to the effect of, “Well I’m a man, and men do,..” At the word ‘man’ she cut him off with the unconscious snigger that’s resulted from years of feminine ridicule conditioning. Just the mention of a man self-referencing as a “man” is enough to inspire feminine ridicule. It’s laughable for a man to consider himself a man.

This exchange got me to wondering about the turning point at which I began to self-reference as a “Man”. In the face of a constant conditioned ridicule, it’s almost an uncomfortable recognition to distinguish yourself as a Man. It’s too easy to just think of yourself as a ‘guy’ and never be so presumptuous as to insist upon your manhood. In girl-world, to claim to be a Man is to admit to arrogance – it’s to embrace a flawed nature.

It’s important to note here that in embracing your status as a Man, instead of ‘just a guy’, you are passing a meta-shit test. By embracing self-referenced manhood, you are rejecting what a world aligned against you would like you to believe about yourself. You’re endorsing yourself as a Man with self-assurance despite the self-doubt the Feminine Imperative relies upon men believing about themselves, masculinity and the dubious state of manhood as a whole. By flagrantly referring to yourself as a Man you are passing the meta-shit test – you’re overtly stating you’re a Man, but you you’re covertly stating “I Just Get It.”

One of the key elements to unplugging is changing your mind about yourself. This is one of the biggest obstacle to guys coming to accept a Red Pill aware reality. This self-denial of their own ‘manhood’, which becomes a resistance to embracing anything conventionally masculine as being positive, is a foreign thought.

As I mentioned in that post, there used to be a time when boys would go through some rite of passage and be considered a ‘man’ by his family and peers. It’s important for Red Pill men to realize how this passage into a state of manhood has been deliberately confused or shamed out of significance to all but the most traditional of cultures.

Most male rites of passage are painted as cruel and barbaric hazing rituals in a fem-centric society. That’s a popularized and easy connection to make, but what underlies this effort to disqualify manhood as legitimate is a push to force men into compliance with the Feminine Imperative and feminine-primacy.

I would suggest that men coming into a Red Pill awareness need to embrace being a “man”. Red Pill men need a rite of passage of some sort. Sometimes we ask about when a guy finally came into his Red Pill awareness. We compare stories about what we were like when we were still living in a Blue Pill paradigm and then what form of trauma (or not) triggered that Blue Pill disillusionment. We discuss going through the various stages of grief for our past Blue Pill idealism, the nihilism, the anger, the disbelief, then the acceptance and the new enthusiasm of being Red Pill aware and the potential that means.

But there needs to be a rite of passage for passing from that Blue Pill state to a new Red pill awareness and part of this should be a conscious acknowledgement of  giving yourself permission to be a man. This needs to be part of changing your mind about yourself as you become more aware of the agency you really have in a conventionally male respect. You need a point at which you set yourself apart from Blue Pill men and a feminine-primary social order.

Most (Beta) guys have a difficult time embracing the authority and due deference that being a conventional man should convey to him. They are uncomfortable on an ego-personality level with accepting this dominant male role because it goes against everything their feminine-centric upbringing has taught them to internalize.

However, with that authority comes responsibility. I would argue that many a Blue Pill guy is comforted by the lies of equalism because he believes that egalitarianism and the expectations that men and women are functional equals in some way exempts him from his uniquely male burden of performance. On some level of consciousness, even the Beta men who are comforted by equalism still realize that their maleness, their ‘secure’ masculinity, will only ever be merited and judged by his performance. And that performance is firmly grounded in conventionally male tests.

 

634 comments

  1. Great post Rollo, this is something I would like to see more discussion of in the manosphere.
    Especially with regards to fatherhood– what kind if rites or initiation could a red pill aware father put his sons through, for their own betterment, for their self-identification as “men”?

    For some reason the first thoughts that come to my mind are rifles, camps, motorcycles.

  2. “For some reason the first thoughts that come to my mind are rifles, camps, motorcycles.”

    Then it appears instinct is not dead yet, as those are the things you should have thought of first. I take it as implicit that camps imply knives, axes and the use of the guns in hunting and the motorcycles perhaps for getting at least part way there.

    Bear in mind, however, that the boy in the photo is not with his father. The passage from boyhood to manhood must necessarily be done alone, as that’s the whole point of thing, to emerge a man on the other side, still the father’s son, but no longer his child.

    It was the misfortune of that particular boy in the photo to chance upon a girl during his trial. Not every boy makes it through and that is something fathers have to come to terms with. If you step in and save him the trial is ruined and so is the man.

  3. “As Hypergamy becomes more openly embraced in a larger social respect, more men are made aware of their deliberate conditioning to accommodate it.”
    (The post an religion is all about that with me.)

    “One important reason I made this an Iron Rule was because it’s almost a default response of men to presume their own ridiculousness. The reflexive response is of course to not take yourself so seriously and have an ability to laugh at yourself when it’s merited. That’s all fine and well, a necessity for a healthy sense of self, but few men realize their ease with self-deprecation is a result of their conditioning to find themselves ridiculous as men. “Men” are ridiculous.”

    “As I mentioned in that post, there used to be a time when boys would go through some rite of passage and be considered a ‘man’ by his family and peers. It’s important for Red Pill men to realize how this passage into a state of manhood has been deliberately confused or shamed out of significance to all but the most traditional of cultures.”
    http://www.ign.com/videos/2008/11/25/australia-movie-clip-opening-scene

    “But there needs to be a rite of passage for passing from that Blue Pill state to a new Red pill awareness and part of this should be a conscious acknowledgement of giving yourself permission to be a man. This needs to be part of changing your mind about yourself as you become more aware of the agency you really have in a conventionally male respect. You need a point at which you set yourself apart from Blue Pill men and a feminine-primary social order.”
    I do this with art and solitude..

    “However, with that authority comes responsibility. I would argue that many a Blue Pill guy is comforted by the lies of equalism because he believes that egalitarianism and the expectations that men and women are functional equals in some way exempts him from his uniquely male burden of performance. On some level of consciousness, even the Beta men who are comforted by equalism still realize that their maleness, their ‘secure’ masculinity, will only ever be merited and judged by his performance. And that performance is firmly grounded in conventionally male tests.”

  4. The Old Set of Books seemed to plot the path to becoming a man quite clearly. Learn a trade or profession, work, acquire your own home, marry, sire children, provide for and protect your wife and children. Alternative routes include service to your community. And you would be identified and respected for doing those things. Not any more.
    Perhaps it’s much simpler. The day a “guy” can do whatever it is he really wants, for the simple reason that he so desires, and can make this want a reality, and can sustain it without assistance, ie he truly realises that HE (and not society and the Feminine Imperative) is his own point of mental origin. For example, the teenager who moves out of home into albeit crappy lodgings, working to support himself (and not relying on his parents one bit)… arguably, he has become a man.

  5. Great post. I’d suggest @Rollo include it in his second book as a companion to ‘The mental point of Origin’ instead of the third.

    Few things come to my mind after i read this. It’s a bit scattered at the moment, so bear with me.

    1. >>However, with that authority comes responsibility.
    Maybe. But male freedom is far more important than male responsibility. In fact, feminine imperative has shamed men for long to be responsible and do the right thing. It’s useful to have rough approximate ground rules for an unplugged man, so i’d suggest men add this to the top of their list.

    Men have no responsibility towards any woman; They owe them nothing.

    2. >>This is a potential danger for Blue Pill men in that the expressions of maleness that they display are on one hand desired by women, but also a risk to their reputation or livelihood if that expression is offensive to women.

    Yup and that is why, if you’re an unplugged man, always hide your fangs. Always act bluepill. ACT bluepill, think redpill. Not with your girls though.

    3. A great book on rites of passage is “Iron John” by Robert Bly. It’s purple pillish so you’ve to be careful about the frame, but it has some good ideas.

    4. >>Most male rites of passage are painted as cruel and barbaric hazing rituals in a fem-centric society.

    Barbarism is a masculine characteristic. What’s not natural is not accepting it as a way of being. The ancients respected the potential of a man to kill other men. An evolutionary sandbox of limited resources is not a happy clappy place to be. Accept it – You are dangerous. And that’s ok.

    5. >>Red Pill men need a rite of passage of some sort.

    I have the perfect thing in mind – the first cold approach daygame close.

  6. Powerful and essential post. I’ve needed this one for a while but hadn’t realized it yet. I recall giving up my Esquire subscription many years ago after they delivered an issue touting “How to Be a Man” on the cover. I didn’t like it but didn’t consider that it was coming from a feminine place.

    Ideas for a rite of passage are off to a good start in comments. Camp is perfect for insulation from feminine influences. I’d say any ROP should include both a physical and a mental component–a test of performance burden and a test of mental makeup. Physical ought to entail defending oneself, defending/aiding another man (perhaps a staged wilderness rescue or drowning), or performing a survival skill like hunting. Maybe all three. Just as important, the mental ought to demonstrate the initiate’s poise, confidence, and ability to lead a small group of men to the right conclusion in a theoretically life-threatening situation.

  7. wife asked me to return some romantic novels to the library. Woman staff looked weirdly at me. I said, “My wife asked me to return these. If I had read any of them, I would have to turn in my Man Card!” The women got severe lemon face. Then I said, “Bazinga!” and they looked confused. They were angry that any male could even consider having a “Man Card”.

  8. Are you a man by biology, or a man by social construct?

    All of the rules laid out in this post suggest many things a man must do to become a man. That borders on declaring that “man” is a social construct.

    If “man” is not a social construct, then just be.

    If you have to become a man, then you probably weren’t born a male.

    I will reject any arguments that one can be born male, but they have to “prove” they are a man. The truth exists, regardless of our ability to perceive it. Gender exists, due to chromosomes, not due to what someone else perceives. You are a man, regardless of whether someone else perceives it.

    Just be. But “be” in socially accepted ways. Elsewise you will be thrown in jail.

    If male and man are determined by genetics, then you are a man, regardless of whether you behave in ways that will keep you out of jail.

    To me, that is the ultimate in not being defined by others.

    But if you really do care what others think, then nevermind.

  9. Comment about my comment. I won’t develop the thought – but I’m coming to think more and more that the manosphere is really grappling with the distinctions between the warrior class and the ruling class and the worker-bee class – without knowing it and without defining those distinctions. I think some thought should be given to making those distinctions.

    One is a man by dint of biology. So we have millions of men. But they don’t all have the same natural levels of testosterone and they don’t all have the same personalities. So – levels of agressiveness and levels of intellectual cunning are going to, and do, vary wildly amongst all who biology calls “men”. The manosphere so far is not accounting for those distinctions.

    To say that all “men” must be the same in order to be called men is as foolish as those who claim that all men should really be women, cause women don’t like the idea of men.

    We are all of us different: men from men, men from women, women from women – for biological reasons. Our conversations should reflect this. They don’t. I’ve been reading long enough to see that.

    I guess no one wants to be considered a professor or scientist who relies on double-blind studies for trying to figure out what the data means.

    It is a fools errand to claim that men and women are alike, except that women can make babies. It is likewise a fools errand to claim that all men are alike and all women are alike. Yet they are still men, even tho different, and they are still women, even tho different.

  10. Being a Man these days has never been more difficult to achieve. It has become a Meta shit test that requires a very strong sense of self to achieve.

    The main components of being a Man in my eyes are the following; being ones own Mental Point of Origin, protecting your agency from being diluted by external forces (eg marriage) and doing exactly what you want to with your life a majority of the time without feeling guilt or shame for doing so.

    Somebody has already commented “you need to ACT blue pill, but Think red pill”.
    I say Fuck that! I just need to “Do me, to be the real me, a man as nature intended”.
    If your circumstances dictate that you Need to “act blue pill but think red pill” then you need to change your circumstances, you may think you are being machavellian but you’re not you’re living by somebody else’s rules.

    It amazes me how often I read things like ” I’ve been red pill for X number of months now” personally I believe to undo a lifetime of femenine conditioning and giving yourself “permission” to be a Man and building the life that allows you to do that takes YEARS not months! For me it took just over 4 years to arrive at this point.

    I have needed to reorganise my whole life into one that is geared towards my happiness as I believe that like the hierarchy of love happiness flows downwards, I cannot help anyone else unless I’m happy myself, that is my new “burden of performance” I just do me so that I can be in the right place to help others if I so choose.

    To arrive at this point i have needed to change many areas of my life;

    1.) Work. I’m an electrician by trade but I was working for a TV production company, as you can imagine this industry is about as Politically correct, all inclusive and Fem centric as you will find with an all female HR department that I found myself dealing with on a couple of occasions.

    The first thing I did was to go freelance ( but still within the Film/Tv industry) but at least I could choose when I where I worked.

    2.) I sold my house and used the proceeds to downsize to a 2 bed apartment, this left me mortgage free and able to save at a faster rate.

    3.) I started to work on my side business in my free time and using some of the money I had saved to develop my idea. I will not disclose what my business is for reasons I’m not prepared to go into either but I will say that it’s internet based, selling my own products and once established will allow me to relocate anywhere with good internet access and reliable postage services. ( being location independent is very important to me).

    I have very recently stopped all other work to focus on what was my side business and so far it’s paying off , my income has already exceeded what I used to earn by working for other people and in two years or less I should be able to relocate to my country of choice.

    I doubt I would have done any of this had it not been for the trauma that led me first to the manosphere and set me on my journey to red pill awareness, and it’s not been easy but I now have an internalised mindset that has made it possible and for that I have to thank the following people/ red pill resources.

    1. Rollo/ TRM aka the red pill bible, what can I say? You helped me see what I needed to see to change my life, thanks man I need to meet you some day ( drinks will be on me).

    2. ) illimitable men. A good resource for understanding the dark triad personality types and how you can utilise them.

    3. Blackdragon blog for his concepts of alpha 2.0 and non monogamous lifestyle.

    4. Ester villar and her book “the manipulated man” for confirming everything you learn here straight from the horses mouth as it were.

    And lastly the first red pill site I ever visited chateau heartiste ( mainly political now I no longer read) but it led me here to TRM and Also the hugely entertaining Solomon 2 blog( no longer active but still around in pdf form) .

    The red pill can change your life, as Rollo says he isn’t very often prescriptive on here, you have to find what works for you, he just gives you the knowledge and the tools needed to become a MAN. The rest is up to you, I probably had a more difficult time of it than most as I only found the manosphere at 45 a little over 4 years ago and I wish I had this knowledge sooner but if I can do it at my age there’s no reason why you can’t change your life too.

    Good luck.

  11. Great post… This “Rite of Passage” I saw for myself as discovering game and swallowing the Red Pill…it’s been exactly 7 years since I discovered the manosphere and have started to transform myself.

    “”One of the key elements to unplugging is changing your mind about yourself. “”

    Part of the “rite of passage” for myself was adopting the “I’m the prize” mentality and abandoning all forms of pedestalization.

    The first 5 years were the toughest…the last two years I’m enjoying myself more and that concept of ZFG is becoming more internalized.

    Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand…..cue endless RSD videos to prove my point…(joke)

  12. I have been trying to sort out what my son’s rite of passage may eventually be. Distilling it down to its essence for me it becomes about proving to himself he can become independent by means of accomplishing it over some period of time under some adverse conditions. It means improvising, being strong, accepting failure may happen, it means toughening up for his own sake.

    Why else do tribes in the bush send their boys off for a sojourn of a couple of days on their own to sort shit out?

    I know I went through a rite, but in a different context, it was a fitness test at a sporting event with a lot of older guys, I was just 16 years old. It was all pretty good natured and not too punishing but I knew after that I had been accepted into the group and to me that was really important. I was still the young guy in the group but I had earned the respect of the older men in the group for being able to deal with the shit they were handing out and then ask for another. To me this was important, no matter what, after that, with any of those men, I was too a man.

    There were other events I went through in my life that were also about leadership and independence from my family that to me contributed to my sense of being a man. I would still have called myself a “guy” in all liklihood at that age as it is / was a social convention as observed by Rollo, but in my mind, I knew I was “ahead” of many other young men or boys in my age cohort. I know one thing that changed and sharpened my outlook was skippering boats offshore where I was responsible for the lives of others. To me that brings a kind of weight or gravitas to your decision making, things become serious at that point and it changes you towards being a man, or at least it did for me.

    It’s sad how many males yearn to be Men, but are cowed by social conventions of the FI. It’s fun to put those men in their own “safe spaces” and let them roam and rise to challenges no matter their age, they come alive in those situations, until one putz goes all FI and speaks outside the group to his hambeast wife about what was going down.

    Life will get harder for young boys coming into their manhood in this day and age. A critical part of rites of passage has always been the fitness test(s). However today most of what you and I would call a fitness test would be pilloried as “bullying”. From off color FB posts to physical dust ups it all falls under “bullying” in any kind of school setting in this day and age. It precludes separating the men from the boys by age old sorting techniques and stamps out “toxic” masculinity.

  13. What constitutes masculinity?

    4 part answer

    The ability to effectively commit violence
    Being the sort of man other men want around when shit gets ugly
    The ability to control yourself, over ride fear etc
    The technical and tactical skills nessacary coupled with the will required to dominate the small world around you. Women, kids, strangers, critters, tools etc.

    Violence keeps your shit your shit, your bitch your bitch instead of someone else’s war trophy and your offspring from having their head smashed in or turned into slaves

    Everything else is self explanatory

  14. “Again, equalist Blue Pill conditioning’s purpose is to prevent men from assuming themselves as their mental point of origin, but once a man’s disabused himself of putting the feminine as his primary internal concern there must be an opposite, contingent, reaction on the part of the Feminine Imperative to put him back into compliance. Thus, we see the criminalization of maleness.”

    I run into this meta shit test daily,first response see it coming,shoulders back,head high,ignore them.They will test,ignore test,they will at some point break frame and try to commiserate as an equal (most guys are pussies or nobody knows how to work anymore,they want stuff handed to them)at witch point I respond it takes a village to destroy a generation.

    After 14yrs of benching automatics,I became an incel to a point having not looked up from my task to see the world around me.When the interest rates stayed low(and various other factors) the bottom fell out of this work and I looked up to find the world had changed drastically.Falling back on my building skills I landed a gig doing a remodel-addition for a man with a righteous MPO he loaned me this book “Iron Joe Bob” by Joe Bob Briggs.This was 1994 and my first glims into the pilling up of problems for men in the feminists world.Before this I had a feeling that things were out of place but couldn’t put my finger on what it was.

    For a man out there minding his business,he doesn’t have the time to keep up on social trends and these trends sneak up and one day the world around has changed,all the things that I thought could never last (and still do) became a mainstay of society.

    On these rites of passage and initiations into manhood,they are the first priority in unplugging and will be different for every man depending on his conditioning,the only suggestion I have for now is discover the truth,how things should be and how they are and maintain a healthy balance in MPO.

  15. Also I am not a fan of the single rite of passage idea.

    There are to many stages in a man’s life for it to be a one and done sort of deal.

  16. @RichardP, I get where you’re coming from, which is why I make the distinction here about traditional vs. conventional masculinity. It’s not that you aren’t born a ‘man’ it’s that a feminine primary social order wants to define what that should mean to you by keeping you perpetually confused to its definition.

  17. 1) It seems to me that everyone is born with themselves as mental point of origin. No one has to learn this, and it is plainly seen in most any kid. The FI has crafted a diabolical system really. You have to give credit where it’s due. Women never lose this infantile sense of being center of the universe, whilst it is selectively socialized out of most boys until they ultimately arrive at blue pill manhood.

    You see right here in the comments that a man may need years to retrain himself. A woman has retained her mental point of origin throughout her entire life.

    2) Self deprecation can be an effective leadership technique amongst men. I’m going to suppose iron rule #9 applies almost exclusively to interactions with women, and it is a good lesson for me to bear in mind.

    3) @Ton – people have written whole books about masculinity, without offering anything as good as your four bullet points.

  18. There is no single rite of passage that can be used like flipping a switch I agree Ton.

    I can still remember at 10yrs taking the first life,and the feelings that came with that.Without any guidance in this matter my fall back was the ten commandments and no end of guilt that i had to work through on my own.

    This was only one stage,and there are many.

  19. Thanks Lost

    ———–
    It seems to me that everyone is born with themselves as mental point of origin. No one has to learn this, and it is plainly seen in most any kid. The FI has crafted a diabolical system really. You have to give credit where it’s due. Women never lose this infantile sense of being center of the universe, whilst it is selectively socialized out of most boys until they ultimately arrive at blue pill manhood.

    Legit. It’s enslavement. A soft version of slavery like debt but still slavery

  20. For the record, Sentient is really a 350 lb. virgin from Biloxi who occasionally does drywall when he can get the work.

  21. “If “man” is not a social construct, then just be.”

    Easier said than done.

    “If you have to become a man, then you probably weren’t born a male.”

    You were born a helpless infant, totally at the mercy of a woman. You had to become something else.

    “Gender exists, due to chromosomes . . .”

    A ship has gender. It is feminine. What are its chromosomes? By accepting its terminology you are already operating under the influence of the FI. Sex is genetic. Gender is a social construct. That’s the whole point of it. People arguing that it isn’t are fighting with one hand tied behind their backs and your argument essentially boils down to ” I can be any damned gender I want.” The point of view you think you are fighting against.

    You have already lost before you have begun.

    The word “man” has taken on a number of meanings over the years, without its former modifiers to signify what specifically is meant by it. One must rely on context to work it out. In the case of this article the word “man” is being used to distinguish from “boy.”

    ” . . . .the manosphere is really grappling with the distinctions between the warrior class and the ruling class and the worker-bee class . . .”

    As I constantly point out, women are members of the women’s circles by virtue of their sex. Men, on the other hand, are men by virtue of their trade. They do not simply exist in a “men’s circle,” they join a special guild.

    This guild prepares a boy for his right of passage.

    “I guess no one wants to be considered a professor or scientist who relies on double-blind studies for trying to figure out what the data means.”

    And now we find your sore spot that has been poked.

    As I learn more about the men here I’m starting to get the impression that the only place on the web you’ll find a higher concentration of physicists and engineers is on a physics forum. Maybe not even there.

    Shall we all make our proofs of having undergone the rite of passage by waving around our guild emblem, our copies of Halliday & Resnick?

  22. I also don’t intend to imply those four bullets points are the sum total of being a man. Those are the basic foundation and building blocks. It would be a shitty and drab world if that’s all men did.

  23. You were born a helpless infant, totally at the mercy of a woman. You had to become something else.

    Fuck yeah! That becoming something else is the great adventure of our masculine lives

    I know folks think I am either full of shit or some ubberman with no problems but it ain’t so. I have dealt with the same kind of shit 80+ percent of all men have, at all points in time and space.

    Difference is, I like the fight and look forward to it. Hell by now it’s more like an addiction

  24. “I also don’t intend to imply those four bullets points are the sum total of being a man. Those are the basic foundation and building blocks.”

    Just as the problem Jack Donovan faced in writing The Way of Men was not to define the sum total of being a man, but to cut through the sum total to find the irreducible essence of it.

  25. Ever see that flic “Runaway Train” with Jon Voight?

    Voight escapes the state pen in 1980’s Alaska and board a driverless train.
    The warden chases by helicopter; comes down on a ladder from the air and boards the train; but Voight handcuffs the warden before he can take action against him.
    Since the train is a runaway and going to crash; death is minutes away for both warden & prisoner.
    The warden, resigned to his fate, tells Voight, “You think you’ve won, eh?”.
    Voight, having led a life of unmitigated horror, replies, “Win? Lose? What’s the difference?”
    Life is over before you know in this world; and its a rotten life for most.
    In the long run, who gives a shit one way or another about any of it.

  26. Anyone who does (or does not) do something Because of what Someone Else thinks needs to see the head doctor…except for acts of actual criminality; because odds are you’ll land in jail.

    Who gives a shit what anyone else thinks? Do they ask your permission when they decide to do something?

  27. A bicycle is freedom. A weapon is your ability to defend and maintain that freedom.

    Over the past 60 years or so a great deal of literature has been produced revising history to boost the importance of women, to show that without women, nothing would have been accomplished.

    And yet, in all that literature not one word has been offered claiming responsibility for this; this is entirely the work of men, no woman could have conceived of it or took part in inventing any of it, it is a picture of the essence of men:

  28. For the record, Sentient is really a 350 lb. virgin from Biloxi who occasionally does drywall when he can get the work.

    <Who gives a shit what anyone else thinks?

    Indeed.

  29. “Burden of performance?”

    Lolz

    Any “burden of performance” is in a person’s convoluted brain. The only obligation you are born with in civil society is to not infringe on other people’s rights. If you believe you have some affirmative duty or obligation beyond that, you’re a well-brainwashed drone.

  30. @RichardP

    Young men are confused because of the Blue Pill programming that they have received, so that their biology gets stifled by culture/upbringing/etc. Young men must first be de-programmed so that they can discover what it is to be a man.

    “Culture” includes education, media, friends.

    It has never been easy to be a young man and it is tougher today than ever before because the FI is in control (= matriarchy).

  31. Indeed.
    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

    I can’t prove it; but a man who brags as much as you do must be exaggerating on some counts.

  32. Funny story, I’ve been a bodybuilder for most of my adult life. Not a competitor (my brother was) but just because I enjoy it, and I like the strength and the looks I get from women as a result (free IOIs, remember?) So, one day, my mom looks at me and my brother and says, “I don’t understand why you two think you need to be a at the gym so early in the morning. Really, what all good is it gonna do you in the long run? You could be hit by a bus today, but you went to the gym.”

    I looked at her and said, “because this is what I choose to do with the time I have. I’ll be in better shape dead than 90% of the fat living people at my funeral.”

  33. “Any “burden of performance” is in a person’s convoluted brain.”

    Until you get hungry. Then you will find that a good deal of your burden of performance is in your cells.

  34. Awesome photo KFG! 6 year old me would be completely jealous

    I never gave bicycles much thought until I wandered into the Wright brothers museum on Kitty Hawk. Those things were game changers back in the day since folks were tried of dealing with horse shit stacked up everywhere

  35. Until you get hungry. Then you will find that a good deal of your burden of performance is in your cells.
    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

    I’d eat out of a garbage can before I would serve some scumbag.

  36. Back in the 19th century, a Confederate officer wrote, “To work for oneself is acceptable; to work for another is detestable and the mark of a coward.”

  37. “The Burden of Performance isn’t an obligation, it’s a metric.”
    Game to be is performance. The complete expression lead not manipulated in the entirety of yourself. No ego investments.

  38. “I’d eat out of a garbage can before I would serve some scumbag.”

    And where do you suppose the garbage can came from?

    ” . . . . eating roadkill is a mindfuck and pretty humbling”

    Been there, done that. Used the hide to tie some flies and catch live fish.

  39. Kfg
    Before the red pill my bike was the tool of my adventures. About to go an a bike ride.
    “A bicycle is freedom. A weapon is your ability to defend and maintain that freedom.

    Over the past 60 years or so a great deal of literature has been produced revising history to boost the importance of women, to show that without women, nothing would have been accomplished.

    And yet, in all that literature not one word has been offered claiming responsibility for this; this is entirely the work of men, no woman could have conceived of it or took part in inventing any of it, it is a picture of the essence of men:”
    It’s a solution driven by adventure no society can take that away entirely. It can get close as we are seening. But not entirely.

  40. I wonder how hungry you have been? Because contemplating eating roadkill is a mindfuck and pretty humbling

    _____________________

    You know, if you think about it, life is the most peculiar torture of them all; for it is the only torture its victims actively seek to perpetuate.

  41. Women ‘are’, men must ‘become’.

    ___________________

    I kind of liked that line by Martin Sheen in Wall Street. His kid tells him, “One day you’ll be proud of me.”

    He replies, “Its yourself that you have to be proud of.”

    In other words, what anyone else thinks don’t mean squat.

    And if you are allowing things like the praise of others (which is usually nothing more than a manipulation) to influence your behavior and sense of self worth, you are well on the road to slavery.

  42. For hunter gatherers, a “Rite of Passage” is specific and difficult. Usually some sort painful circumcision rite. They don’t actually want people to fail though, because warriors are needed to fight neighboring groups. when you pass, you pass.

    Currently, there is “winner take all” masculinity. Nobody really needs other men to be masculine so maybe 10% of dudes are considered to be masculine. This would be a total waste in a hunter gather situation where your neighboring groups want to kill you.

    Current “Rite of Passage”’s are arbitrary never quite stick. There is no central authority so you can do things but it all becomes fodder for a “winner take all” masculinity. Being the best. Which is fine, but isn’t actually a real “Rite of Passage”.

  43. Sam

    I can’t prove it; but a man who brags as much as you do must be exaggerating on some counts.

    What you call “bragging” is merely my reality… This is why Point of View matters… especially if you’ve never been exceptional… you have no frame of reference for the possibility of what that looks like…

  44. In other words, what anyone else thinks don’t mean squat.
    ——-
    Sounds great until you need to put together a buiness deal, or charm a jury or any number of things

  45. “Women ‘are’, men must ‘become’.”
    This is what gets me up ever morning and work on dealing with my trauma as a boon. Everything is beautiful its hard to see aspects of that in times of turmoil. However beauty in observing yourself passed points on where you used to be is what makes life wonderful.
    Men who don’t complain about the troubles in their lives are inspiring because they still have to work at dealing with it. But they internalize that without complaint. I am always competing againt’s the expression i gave myself in the mirror.
    Pay no mind to the battles you’ve won
    It’ll take a lot more than rage and muscle
    Open your heart and hands, my son
    Or you’ll never make it over the river

  46. What you call “bragging” is merely my reality
    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

    Well good for you then. Brings to mind another good quote from Wall Street, this one from the dumb blonde the kid was dating:

    “You’ll find that when you’ve had money and lost it; its far worse than never having had it at all.”

    Like I always say, what goes up must come down…

  47. or charm a jury or any number of things
    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

    To bad we live in a world where “charming” a jury supersedes the finding of the truth….

  48. is sam yet another bot?

    Great post Rollo! (I don’t know why some think they have nothing more to learn here)

  49. Great and timely OP Rollo. We must’ve been channeling each other in some measure.

    @ Sam

    ” Bragging” is subjective and is dependent on the accomplishments and over all mindset of the observer leveling the accusation.

  50. Sentient:
    I guess you have sort of adopted that Medici family slogan, “Money to get power; power to keep money.”
    Since time is everyone’s enemy, we all still lose in the end…though your time will probably go by with a few more laughs than the average schmuck on the street…so you got that going for you, I guess…

  51. ” Bragging” is subjective and is dependent on the accomplishments and over all mindset of the observer leveling the accusation.
    ______________________

    Yeah, same as jealousy…

  52. Hey, I take him at his word. If he’s had a nice life, good for him. The only reason I posted that was when I read his comment on the day after Thanksgiving where he gives a minute by minute account of his amazingly obedient & compliant wife and family to his every whim…sort of wish I had people react to me in that way.

  53. I have not repeatedly pointed out that teenage girls hit on me, or that I set all time local speed records on a bicycle to get people to see how great I am.

    I do it so that they might see how great they could become.

    Part of the power of that is that I’m not all that great, merely above average. For someone in the fat part of the bell curve, as most are, all it takes to become above average is putting in the effort.

  54. @Sam, I’d argue that commenting on a blog is a type of right of passage. You are putting yourself out there for others to read and judge (and hopefully bond with), and judging from your comments, life has been a difficult right of passage for you. Your words reek of negativity, defeatism, and anger. Are you just venting here? Do you have a goal you are trying to meet? Do you want to talk about any of that?

  55. @Ton

    Sounds great until you need to put together a business deal, or charm a jury or any number of things

    I bet that Sam has never had to lead men…a good, early test for men is to form a gang.

    I’m planning a night where I focus on breaking bitch shields just because I can. I think that that’s a good skill to have. Probably gonna try a very quick “Hey, darlin’,” followed immediately by cutting distance, triangulating (looking at eyes and lips), and slowing my speech (long…time……no……….see) to see if I can get them lit up. I’ll take her waist and pull her close if she holds my gaze.

  56. The boss man said Sam was a bot so not much point in continuing down that trail

    I will say it’s a common enough mindset among young men and blue pill dudes of all ages. To a large degree blue pill equals a lack of maturity regarding the way the world works and it can be difficult to suss out if you are talking to a 15 year old young man to be or a 60 year old simp

  57. @Blax, I seem to get these things whenever I link to the MGTOW sud redd forum. Usually it’s female bot trying to promote men as the ‘slave gender’ or it’s a male bot like Sam that promotes MGTOW individualism.

  58. why don’t you stop lying?

    Coward….you hated it when I took you apart as Karen in the springtime and you hate me now.

    What a loser you are. So much for “getting better” when you are afraid of one pretty smart person sitting before a keyboard.

  59. I like to promote MGTOW individualism, but I also like not being a damned fool about it.

    As I intimated to the bot, garbage cans don’t just “sprout out of nowhere” like fungus. They are a consequence of society. Living out of them isn’t the individualism of a man, it’s the individualism of a cockroach.

    Which is fine. I’ve occupied that particular survival niche a few times myself and may well do so again, but I know that that’s what I’m doing.

  60. I am not a chat-bot…I am The Great Whore of Babylon…who the doctors just released from the insane asylum last week…I like sooooooooooooo totally fooled them!

  61. @ Rollo

    The bots can be somewhat entertaining with the knowledge that they are what they are, at least for a short while that is.

  62. Yes, I’m insane…but its a tortured genius…

    You know you love me…who is also your beloved

    K A R E N

  63. “Want me to unblock it? Heheh,…”

    I think we’ll get by with our own collection of organic damned fools.

  64. The feminazi attacks on manhood and male heterosexuality are merely the usual female efforts to control men for their own purposes. The same feminazis utterly reject any man defining womanhood as controlling and misogyny.

    Related:

    http://heatst.com/life/women-like-alpha-males-feminists-should-stop-complaining/

    “When you men get home and face an anti-war protester, look him in the eyes and shake his hand. Then, wink at his girlfriend, because she knows she’s dating a pussy.”

  65. what about the equivalent of a car title service company but instead of reporting whether you’ve got a flood/collision salvage title they present evidence of a chronic carousel rider? courtesy of online tidbits someone savvy could connect the dots and provide a valuable service.

  66. “When you men get home and face an anti-war protester, look him in the eyes and shake his hand. Then, wink at his girlfriend, because she knows she’s dating a pussy.”

    My 1st platoon sergeant told me his 1st platoon sergeant told him that on his way home from Vietnam

    Really is nothing new under the son

  67. @Zipper, only because it logs previous previous comments and uses snippets for a particular commenter on a particular URL. I’ve become quite the student of chatbots in the last year.

  68. And for those who consider their bicycle as some sort of low flying Sopwith Triplane (which I never, and the fact that I’ve been known to refer to it as Black Maria is a mere coincidence):

  69. The romance novels to the library thing reminds me of this joke Kevin Pollak tells:

    He’s at the register with a package of tampons among his stuff. Some wise guy in line snickers, he turns around, puffs out and snorts back: “well at least we know these aren’t for ME! I at least have a chick I’m buying them for!”

    Decent gag, even if the comeback response would be “yeah, yo momma.”

    One rite of passage: your father – who in my case was far smarter than I would ever pretend to be – starts asking you for advice. (Or anyone else you looked up to as a boy).

  70. Sam: “Hey, I take him at his word. If he’s had a nice life, good for him. The only reason I posted that was when I read his comment on the day after Thanksgiving where he gives a minute by minute account of his amazingly obedient & compliant wife and family to his every whim…sort of wish I had people react to me in that way.”

    Wow, quite a bit going on there…. amazing how it can synthesize ‘facts’ and data into what appears to be a human response.

    I’m in the industry and even I had no idea how sophisticated the Turing/AI stuff has become. Looks like I have some studying to do.

  71. I have several other examples of exactly this beginning with a bot named Karen from about 10 months ago. All have similar, static IPs and their generated emails all follow a similar protocol.

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