Cheaters

Cheating Husband 9

I was picking through The Private Man’s blog a few months back and I came across this gem from about 3 years ago. It’s a pretty quick read if you want to click over and come back. PM recounts an all too common scenario from a Red Pill perspective – casually explaining what the Red Pill is to a guy who’s been immersed in a Blue Pill conditioning and experience for most of his life.

“What’s your blog about?”

“I help men be more attractive to women so they can reach their relationship goals.” It’s my standard go-to response when questioned about my blog.

“I don’t understand.”

“Men can learn how to be more attractive to women and I help them with that.”

James looked shocked and then quickly got angry.

“That’s cheating!” He was emphatic. He was pissed off. He was not attacking me, just my message. Again, the guy code applied.

This reaction did not surprise me. James is of the “be yourself and the right woman will magically appear” school of thought. I know where this comes from. For years I held the same point of view. I didn’t back down.

“A man can learn new things to make himself more attractive to women so he can meet his relationship goals.”

James was stubborn.

“I want a woman to love me for exactly who I am.”

That’s a noble sentiment based on an idealized view of attraction, dating, and relationships. It’s the standard response borne of shitty social expectations. But as I deal in the sometimes difficult realities of the situation, I had to be honest with James.

In this instance, James’ anger was the reflexive response I expect from ‘plugged in’ men when they first come into contact with a Red Pill aware man. It’s interesting when you consider this interaction with a Red Pill Lens. You begin to see just how saturated Blue Pill conditioning is for the average guy in real time. It’s one thing to see its influence in popular media, read a blog or book, see a movie or hear a song on the radio, but it’s quite another to experience it first hand with a guy maybe you know, or maybe you don’t.

Private Man doesn’t elaborate on it in his post, but this exchange is illustrative of how a Blue Pill mindset conditions an almost hostile defensiveness in men. Before I started the blog, and before I had a book out, I encountered this fairly often when I thought a certain man might benefit from my own awareness. It took some time for me to see the wisdom in the fourth law of power – always say less than is necessary.

Blue Pill men’s investment in the “truth” that their conditioning leads them to necessitates a constant confirmation of it from others, from his surroundings and from popular culture blanketing his awareness of it. When a Red Pill aware man verbalizes his truths, his observations, and his perspectives it’s often an affront to that Blue Pill guy’s ego-investments. And these are investments that he’s likely unaware he even holds, and he presumes everyone else holds too.

Think as you like…

There’s a comfort in presuming others believe as we do. It’s an interesting contrast when you think about it in terms of your political or religious views and then apply it to how we differ in respect to our respective Game with women. Most guys understand that other people have differing political leanings and religious dispositions, and it makes sense that they won’t see eye to eye with them. And from a cultural perspective – at least from a progressively western one – we are more or less socially expected to respect those differences in the name of mutual cooperation and mutually beneficial tolerance.

How that actually flies in the real world is a topic I’ll let other blogs explore, but when we consider how the Blue Pill and the Feminine Imperative conditions men across various cultural, political and religious spectrums we see a decided intolerance for even a casual, passing disagreement about how men ought to regard, respect and interact with women.

I won’t rehash the influence feminist ideology and the Feminine Imperative play in that conditions ( I have plenty of essays addressing that), but what I want to draw attention to here is the reflexive response James had with Private Man, and how it finds its root in a subconscious conditioning that was only mildly challenged by PM.

James first presumption was that what PM was teaching men was in some way ‘cheating’. What PM was advising was against a predefined rule set that every man ought to be abiding by. This was a Blue Pill reaction to even the premise of a Red Pill truth – that men can and should learn to interact with women in order to come to a more satisfying relationship with them; one defined by that man’s desires.

This actually offends two rules presuppositions: the first, that men would ever presume to ‘know’ women well enough to outdo other men (women as universal choosers) and second to put his imperatives above a woman’s.

When I interviewed with Alan Roger Currie recently I was asked to give my take on what exactly constituted Red Pill / Blue Pill status, and what my definitions were for the abstract terms of Alpha and Beta. It’s exceedingly difficult to apply concrete definitions in a quick hit info-bite, but with respect to the Blue Pill, Blue Pill conditioning is foundationally about a presumption that all men ought to mutually follow and be accountable to an expected rule set; a rule set that now openly serves feminine-primacy.

I developed this idea in The Second Set of Books post, but with regard to men’s dealing with other men and the implied social contract, there is a definite conflict between men invested in the old set of rules and Red Pill aware men who acknowledge, use and endorse a new set of rules. Thus, using Game or making personal choices based on Red Pill aware wisdom seems like the man applying them is in fact “cheating”.

He’s cheating on the first set of rules that the ‘plugged in’ man expects him to adhere to, and adhere to even when those rules make little realistic sense or have scant appreciable reward for. In other words, a martyr for the concept of honor.

Blue Pill ideology is something learned and internalized over the course of a man’s boyhood into his adult life. When you consider a guy’s upbringing and the extent that the Feminine Imperative conditions and reinforces his investments socially, culturally, religiously, etc., it’s easy to see how ‘natural’ and unlearned it seems to the guy who’s centered his identity on it.

To the greater whole of Blue Pill conditioned men the Red Pill is foreign and an affront to that conditioning. In fact, part of his feminine-primary conditioning focuses on the hope that some man will express some ‘sexist’ remark, or express some unapproved thought about women in the hopes that he can rebuke and correct that man. It’s part of Beta Game to look for opportunities to do just this in the hopes that some woman will witness it and find his gender-heroism attractive:

Every random chump within earshot of your conversation about Game, about your ‘changed’ way of seeing inter-gender relations, about your most objective critical observations of how women ‘are’, etc. – understand, that chump waits everyday for an opportunity to “correct” you in as public a way as he’s able to muster. That AFC who’s been fed on a steady diet of noble intent, with ambitions of endearing a woman’s intimacy through his unique form of chivalry; that guy, he’s aching for an opportunity to prove his quality by publicly redressing a “villain” like you for your chauvinism. Even under the conditions of relative anonymity (like the internet), he’ll still cling to that want of proving his uniqueness just on the off chance that a woman might read his rebuff and be fatefully attracted to him.

This is the bread and butter of the White Knight beta. It’s best to assume that most guys who pick up on just your Game vibe, to say nothing of overtly talking about it, are going to side with the feminine imperative by default. For practitioners of Beta Game (which is to say the better part of 90% of guys) this is an organic opportunity to identify with women and engage in the same shaming conventions women use without the fear of having it seem contrived.

…but do as others do

That said, this dynamic is not always so dramatic. There was a time when I lived in Florida before I had started the blog, but well after my time at SoSuave, where I had a get together with some friends at my place for some beer and bullshit time. We’d gotten to talking about ‘how our wives were’ and as you might expect there was all of the “she’s the boss” preprogrammed rhetoric being laughed about until I mentioned that my wife was definitely not the boss.

At that point, beer or no beer, it became apparent that the proverbial crab was about to crawl out of the barrel, so then comes the predictable ridicule about how I’m fulla’ shit, I must domineer her, or how I’m being cocky but my wife really owns me like them – because wives have the pussy so wives make the rules. Real, masterful, masculinity was a joke to these men because they were invested in the idea that they were fortunate to have any woman fuck them, and the one who did was not to be disrespected even in her absence. They wanted confirmation of their investment in the ideology that brought them to their indentured existences.

To the Blue Pill conditioned, wives run the show; to think otherwise is a delusion of masculine power for the Blue Pill man, and all men should acknowledge this.

As I mentioned a few posts ago, Hypergamy needs security. Alpha Fucks and Beta Bucks seeks to set up social conditions and to socially engineer men who will at least attempt to provide women with some semblance of Hypergamous assurance. It may not seem it, but the social convention that men ought to Just Be Themselves is an effort to confirm this Hypergamous certainty about a man. Men are honor bound (through notions of whatever chivalry might mean) to be who they are, do what they say and say what they mean – and any man who changes that for whatever reason must necessarily be “cheating”.

This trope has the latent purpose of aiding in women’s Hypergamous filtering process. The old set of books, the rules a Blue Pill man expects all other men to play by, find its roots in a man’s worth being the truthful representation of what he really is. This is not so for women. Women’s self-representation is founded in socially acceptable misdirections that serve her Hypergamous interests (makeup to appear young, hair, nails, cosmetic surgery, etc.)

Popular culture ridicules men who falsely “wear masks of masculinity” in a social order that deliberately obfuscates his understanding of what it means, and all while reinforcing female deception of who men really are.

When men aren’t “just being themselves” it’s ‘cheating’. What it’s cheating is Hypergamy. It is cheating the ignorant Blue Pill ego-invested men whose identities are dependent upon men abiding by a rule set that no longer serves their best interests.

Published by Rollo Tomassi

Author of The Rational Male and The Rational Male, Preventive Medicine

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hank holiday
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hank holiday
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@fleezer “if you took her into the coat closet and shoved your cock down he throat. . .you would have gamed a married woman.” Lol. We’ve been over this. You are a natural with a maddona/whore complex. Anon getting IOIs from the married chick is definitely game. You’re like some guy commenting on a race car driver who got in a wreck and crashed his car before he could finish. “But did you get first? No? SECOND PLACE IS FIRST LOSER LOL! YOU AREN’T A REAL RACECAR DRIVER FAG! LOLOLOLO.” ANYTIME you get ANY interest from a girl (IOI) is… Read more »

quixotic
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quixotic
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@Culum Thanks man. Onto your FR: “Anyway..one terrible street approach at traffic lights yesterday – I made some comment about how the lights hadn’t changed and the girl vaguely nodded at me and then literally stepped several paces away. But then I replayed it in my head and it was *terrible* – voice was more of a croak, there was no EC and it was sort of half-hearted over my shoulder..no wonder it got such a bad reaction. Went it to McDonalds just after that because I hadn’t eaten most of the day and needed to get something down and… Read more »

YaReally
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@Rollo @Blaximus @all If you wanna see some cool shit look up Keanu’s life and what people who’ve worked with him say about him. Dude has gone through a nightmare of a life that would crush most dudes but he’s still humble and down to earth and selflessly gives value to the people around him. Had no idea about any of that. Solid FRs from everyone, good to see them (and note how your FRs inspire other guys to go out, that’s important). @quixotic Probably Molly’ed up but either way you handled that solid. The moment where you first turn… Read more »

Amit
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Amit
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@Blax

Thanks for sharing that Prince story. I’m also legit shook about his passing. Dude always looked the same lol…was like he would live forever.

kfg
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kfg
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” . . . the bushes are coming back. Even in porn you’ll see a lot more bush. Not sure how the fuck THAT happened . . .”

You have it backwards. Young people who grew up in the era of a fad generally do.

Andy
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” (I never did more than maybe two or three loads of laundry in 25 years for example… etc. etc.)” haha, I’ve done one load of laundry in the last 3 years… And I washed my phone. “Solid FRs from everyone, good to see them (and note how your FRs inspire other guys to go out, that’s important).” Definitely inspirational. I’ve been leaving the house regularly lately. The other day my wife practically raped me before I left. I figured it was a shit test to see if I would stay home, so afterwards I made sure I left anyway.… Read more »

Diode bridge engineer
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The really funny point is that the “be yourself” does not really mean be yourself. Because if your true self be “masculine” it will automatically be labelled a mask and a cover-up for weakness & insecurity. In practice it works very much like an idea diode bridge. Whatever the man´s behaviour is, the conclusion from it will be that he is weak and insecure. If he acts weak & insecure, he will be considered as such (and laughed at). If he acts strong & self assured, he will be considered weak & insecure anyway (and laughed at). Isn´t that the… Read more »

scribblerg
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@Stuffin and OldOli and others offering encouragement etc, thanks!!!! Ya, no quitting here. Just keeping on keeping on. I’m reading more, talking less…

Sentient
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Yareally… See you COULD have just said “I’m going to press you up against the wall and run my hands bla bla” and gone hardcore direct sexual, which is what she kept trying to get you to do, but there’s a pretty good chance that she’s doing that because she wants to then throw down the frame of “I’m not just a booty call you know” and start leading you into the date frame, where you feel like you’ve made a faux pas by going too direct and feel apologetic and offer up some fine dining and sexless date shit.… Read more »

scribblerg
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Re: Prince – His recorded work was good and certainly he had a lot of top 100 hits, He was very talented and original etc. But I never got why people went so wild over him until I watched some video of him live. He was an incredible showman. His stage presence was truly amazing. I wish I had seen one of his shows but i never got the chance. Don’t have time to link a good one but go to YouTube and just look for yourself. He reeked of power and confidence and charisma and mystery. It was like… Read more »

PlatinumJ
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since i reached out to you guys a couple weeks ago ive spent alot of time analyzing my interactions with women. i still have yet to achieve a true abundance mentality. logically i know better. but i still get caught up in what must be residual blue pill ideals. still trying to be a boyfriend to these bitches. feeling. i hate it lol. lost 2 plates, one is drifting. ive started fucking my ex again. thinking of ghosting all of them. I’ve never gone more than a couple months without getting laid since i was 19 and the thought of… Read more »

scribblerg
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@PlatinumJ – One dickslave to another, I get it. But just a couple of weeks isn’t anywhere near the time or effort required for a man to shift his internals around. I’m a particularly hard case, been around for a couple of years and only really started doing the hard internal work about a year ago, and only for realz maybe in Sep of last year. I sincerely hope it goes faster for you but it seems to take about 2 yrs for most men. And game is mandatory. Approaching is mandatory. Women are the whetting stone upon which we… Read more »

having a bad day
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@Sentient One of the things I had to get past, in resetting the relationship 4 years ago, was all the anger at all the many years wasted – by me – in misunderstanding, passive aggressiveness and depression… She was and is still there to be led… up to us to do it. Burden of performance right HABD? props on putting in the work. those FRs don’t just write themselves…lol… i had an ‘epiphany weekend’ where everything came together for me too… everything CH, TRM, YaReally, early MMSL, etc. said would happen…did…and everything BP/FI said would/should happen…didn’t… and yeah, i’m right… Read more »

scribblerg
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@HABD – Ah. So it’s a shit test cuz I’m in the running? My ego and identity is so weird right now my I actually panic during approach which never happened to me before. It’s like I’ve pulled the self-loathing forward, lol. But on the other hand, I’ve begun doing this super chill thing that is much less aggressive and have gotten some really nice, fun conversations going, coming from a place of “staying within myself” as Roger Clemens used to say. Something very authentic about it. Realized that I’ve been chasing it so hard with game and am so… Read more »

scribblerg
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Re: Prince – Found one. The moment I realized he was an awesome guitar player. I really had no idea.
[youtube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7INsVaR-S-w&w=560&h=315%5D

theasdgamer
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@ fleezer

no. you talked to a married woman. this is what social interaction looks like between men and women. it’s always sexual. always.

“no. you talked to a married woman. this is what social interaction looks like between alphas and women. it’s always sexual. always.”

There. Fixed it for ya.

theasdgamer
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@ HABD

Funny how these young punks think that they understand LTRs because they’ve been in one a max of 5 years. I’ve been in an LTR longer than most of them have been around and my wife is still in love with me.

theasdgamer
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@ Anonymous Reader I did my standard “Just Being Myself” ™ Game. Wasn’t trying to game a girl. I was chatting up a waitress and a manager at the coffeehouse/bar/bakery/whatever place (lol, it’s a real mélange of operations that closes early in the evening). It was a board game meetup. So this girl I don’t know walks through the front door nearby and I ask her if she’s there for the meetup. She’s a 6. I chat her up for a bit and a couple of other guys show up and we start a cooperative game and I blow it,… Read more »

theasdgamer
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@ kfg

I started out . . . as a child.

I had that album once.

kfg
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“Funny how these young punks think that they understand LTRs because they’ve been in one a max of 5 years.”

I am reminded of a 22 year old girl who claimed she understood LTRs because she been in, several.

kfg
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“I had that album once.”

That’s the only one of his first four that I’m missing. Have no idea where it went to. I used to be able to do the whole thing myself, start to finish.

I started out . . . with that as a lead, because it’s an example of a joke that only works because of the timing. Timing Cos learned from Jack.

PlatinumJ
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@scrib started studying game a couple years ago to apply to ltr. the fact that it worked made me hate her even more lol (didn’t help that i was deep in anger phase) i started actively gaming in nov last year and its definitely been 2 steps forward 1 back and i can see that im in a regressive mode right now. I’d say i’ve always had strong internals… like i legit think im better than 80% of these chodes but had no idea how to express this properly. I’ve made good progress but have been slacking. went out for… Read more »

kfg
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” . . .too bad she got fat as fuck lol”

My first wife was an 80s size four, or a contemporary size 0. I left her when she was 29, and a half. She hadn’t put on an ounce while we were together.

I’ve been absolutely no contact, but she was on the local news a few years ago, covering the Mayday celebration of her wiccan church. She looks like Terry Jones in drag, only fatter.

Andy
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Andy
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Speaking of breaking social conventions… The top comments are predictable.

https://www.facebook.com/humansofnewyork/posts/1238526239554807/

Sam Botta (@sambotta)
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Rollo Tomassi is on live right now with Niko Choski: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kCBdriBK8LA

theasdgamer
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@ kfg

That’s the only one of his first four that I’m missing. Have no idea where it went to. I used to be able to do the whole thing myself, start to finish.

Drunk: That’s a funny lookin dog ya got there. Does he bite?

BC: No, but he’ll ram the hell out of you, that’s what he’ll do.

theasdgamer
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9 years with the wife before i blew her out. almost 7 years later she still loves me and would take me back in a heartbeat. too bad she got fat as fuck lol

If Mrs. Gamer got fat, I’d abandon ship. She’s a little overweight now–10#. Not eating much because she has walking pneumonia. Hopefully it will help her lose some adipose tissue.

If wives really love their husbands, they will lose weight somehow.

Sentient
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Andy… hehehe…. if I ever punch out, that’s about what I would do… leave her everything, and go bartend at a beach resort… I would say good bye though… LOL

theasdgamer
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@ Sentient

Andy… hehehe…. if I ever punch out, that’s about what I would do… leave her everything, and go bartend at a beach resort… I would say good bye though… LOL

Just send it from the cell of someone named “Trixie”.

Craiger247
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Just to add to what YaReally posted (and he does a great job, so thank you sir!) which applies best to the new guys entering the “Field” or “Game”, whether thats from divorce, bad break up, relationship gone, whatever etc, we all remember that stage, that uncertainty, that feeling of “am I enough” and that little negative voice inside your head telling us, “Am I the creepy guy in here alone?…is everyone watching me?”. But that state just reinforces the true reason you just have to push through it, get out there and embrace being uncomfortable. Start slow, set bar… Read more »

Blaximus
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Scrib,

The YouTube clip. Prince was asked by Dhani Harrison to please play on stage. Look at his face….lol, Prince accepted. He did not practice the song. Tom Petty was not amused. So Prince tried to give him solo back but he balked.

I have seen him in concert a dozen times. No one comes close.

The last time was 6 years ago. I was at BB Kings in NY to see Larry Graham and Prince just showed up and joined the band. That jam went about 4 hours.

having a bad day
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having a bad day
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@scribblerg i’m busy, but wanted to get this to you before you start approaching for the weekend…lol… @HABD – Ah. So it’s a shit test cuz I’m in the running? yes…girls don’t react like that if their hindbrain isn’t at least considering it…and so it has to shit test to know for sure…attraction/arousal go hand-in-hand with shit testing… they ramp up together until you bang her silly…lol… just get used to it, it’s like getting hit in football, just part of the game… can you think of a better way for a girl’s hindbrain to separate BB from AF?…lol…by pushing… Read more »

having a bad day
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@Culum you’ve been getting great advice…buuuut (lol) all this analysis is ‘too soon.’ it’s going to mess with your head… you’ll start to second-guess yourself in set… and that’s overthinking it and will kill your vibe… just run your own race… keep your notes after, and then post up the FRs… unless you NEED a specific answer to a specific question, just follow your ‘game plan’ (lol)… you did do one, right?… then get out the door… and just to ping off @quixotic’s comment: Stop sabotaging yourself. You are fine to recognize your mistake of no hard eye contact and… Read more »

SJF
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@ScribblerG Just wanted to ride on the coattails of HABD with some objective observations. I think he nailed it. Yes, you have been trying too hard and were being needy and sub-communicating being needy. And a bit of that neediness is also sub-communicated in your pressure of speech. (As a digression, notice my past behavior in the past year with my pressure of speech here on TRM. That was a sign of neediness. My lack of pressure of speech lately commenting is my lack of neediness. See how that works? Which me looks better to you?) The ball is slowing… Read more »

Andy
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Andy
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Did you know that it’s Earth day? I’ve got a renewable resource for you… In my pants.

ghersolas
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ghersolas
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Did anyone know Prince is a feminista hero? I was surprised at the hits on “is prince a feminist” in google..

Blaximus
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He was a fem hero. A gays hero. A nerds hero. Handicaps hero. Poor peoples hero. Etc. but he was none of these things.

Google. Lol.

Fems love him because he had lots of females in his various band configurations. He also creared and promoted lots of female artists and groups.

He was also known as a huge mysoginist. Lol. Even abusive at times.

Truth is, he kept his private life private. He sang about it in many songs, being labelled. ( see: Controversy ). He got off on watching the oublic try to figure him out and slap labels on him.

Blaximus
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…..damn phone

Glengarry
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Glengarry
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“His daughter messaged me saying I was destroying their marriage and ruining their life.”

Lol, at that point all you can say is “The only way I’m letting her go is if I can have your body.” (fingers crossed she’s not a fatty).

Glengarry
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(Rollo has probably mentioned it in a link above but what the hell.)

Here’s what someone should have told that guy:

James, the point is not cheating or being someone you are not. It’s to become a cool guy. Inner game.

Culum Struan
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@Quixotic – read through all your FRs. Not much to say about druggie girl night club FR except for (a) Fantastic work and props on it – you’re clearly on the right track because that was an awesome FR, especially the end and (b) Er..why would you go to a night club for a date with a girl you’ve already fucked? Unless you genuinely enjoy dancing and stuff I guess, which is cool but otherwise I tend to other activities with girls I’m dating and keep clubs for new girls..but that’s a personal choice. BTW, has druggie girl contacted you… Read more »

Culum Struan
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YaReally Sentient HABD Wala Scribblerg Forge Scray et al So Blitz Day 3 – Friday – online date with a late 40s HB5.5 MILF (yeah I know, I know, but beggars/choosers etc and I need to get a notch soon..she did pass the boner test – not as bad as the Tinderbeast from a few months ago). I was planning to go out to a club after that, but she messed up my back with her “massage” and I had to stay in and take a hot shower lol. Basically was kinda weird. Ran my textbook date Game and stories… Read more »

walawala
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@Culum Thanks, one comment and one story to share. 5.5. MILF “beggars can’t be choosers”. I think you’re at the point where you can afford to be more selective. The “beggar” mentality is holding back your game. You’re not going for younger, hotter, tighter because you think you have to work up to it. It’s a mentality. Until I shed that mentality I was banging that lot and my game didn’t improve. Second is a story on the “Soft Next” I employed and the impact. Girl I banged a few times, HB7, 28, cute, kind of bitchy but it’s kind… Read more »

kfg
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kfg
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“Literally had not heard about Airbnb.”

Well, I’ve heard of it now.

” . . . ten seconds seems a long time to hold it down by accident.”

Your chain is being yanked.

SJF
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@Walawa @5:47 Because there are other lurkers reading along, there is one point that is going without saying by you. You’re putting a lot of emphasis on your alpha posturing/text game. But perhaps the best gauge of what defines her behaviors is in her hormones and cycles and cues she is giving. She is painting a picture with a big broad brush for you: namely menstruation-is-your-friend game. If she is a compliant/supportive of you as a plate, you are surely going avoid giving her time and attention when she is premenstrual and menstrual, right? (heheh, she is telling you to… Read more »

YaReally
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@Culum Struan “c) The main thrust seems to be Sentient’s point that I should have just gone sexual since I have nothing to lose. Now the reason I didn’t do that has nothing to do with YaReally’s point (that didn’t even occur to me then) – I didn’t do it because first, I have learned my lesson about not triggering ASD by over-sexualising on text too close to a meet up causing flakes. This was the biggest reason – if it had been a ping text I’d have happily sexualised and talked dirty but I didn’t want to risk triggering… Read more »

YaReally
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@SJF
“Sure, ego-investments by PUA’s are going to dismiss menstruation game as non-necessary”

lol yup. Chick just had cramps and bailed on the party early and was hoping he would miss her or come over after and when he didn’t contact her she worried he was mad at her. He could go bang her on the rag but why? She’s hooked, just bang her whenever she’s done on the rag. She’s still a girl and still responds to game whether she’s bleeding or not lol

Her feelings kind of don’t matter, you MAKE/SPARK the desire in her with game.

theasdgamer
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@ wala We banter. I never mention anything about her texts or leaving. She calms down. Point made. Let her blow up….then return like normal.</I. Yeah, women need their drama fix, even though they say they don't like drama. "Listen to what women do, not what they say." Lol through drama. A little humorous engagement is usually best. Not too much humor and not too much engagement with a woman on her drama fix. I tried saying "slut" over and over without even looking at Mrs. Gamer as she ranted and I played a game of chess on the computer.… Read more »

SJF
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@YaReally

My point was more that she is going to be more DTF on day 7 to 14. (besides the point that her behavior was not weird, it was normal)

And I’m not trying to make this point to Walawala but to other readers. Some guys might need fundamentals of game pointed out to them. You know, those without apex PUA game.

(And I’m a big fan of all PUA game, especially in LTR game.)

scribblerg
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@HABD & SJF – Thanks for the feedback. Culum, great FR, I think you know that reading them is really instructional for many of us beginners. Sentient etc too, very, very helpful to see all this taken apart and then critiqued by others.

I didn’t get out to cafe yesterday due to life. But will be out and about today.

YaReally
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@SJF “Some guys might need fundamentals of game pointed out to them. You know, those without apex PUA game.” I think we disagree that it’s a fundamental of game lol I wouldn’t have replied to this but you had to throw in the “apex” thing. Now you’re (unintentionally I’m sure) giving guys the hope of a loophole so they don’t have to learn all that hard “apex PUA game” that you’re putting out of their reach by using the word “apex”. ie – “this game stuff IS hard to learn so I’ll get the calendar out and stick to this… Read more »

theasdgamer
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Had a wonderful time out last Fri. night at my country bar. Learned that I was triggering envy in bouncers because they responded to one of my real life stories with bullshit stories. I think that they thought I was a gullible idiot because I didn’t call bullshit. My friends & I all have so many fun stories from real life that we have never needed to bullshit each other. I don’t have a lot of experience recognizing bullshit. Anyway, I danced a bunch (7-8 times?) with a lovely Asian-American girl (7-8 in looks) I cold-approached that night. No one… Read more »

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If anyone wants to read some good links today or tonight. Here are a few. First off, there is a blogger named Eric Barker that sends out good emails when he posts a new essay. His blog is dedicated to being better at being a man with bits of info backed up by science. In the latest he talks about Emotional Resilience. Sure it is basic, but the links in all his stuff really expound well on tactics. At its basic PUA is all about Emotional Resilience as demonstrated by all Yareally’s references to videos and Tylers excellent demonstration of… Read more »

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And since I already expended two links in that last comment…

Anyone that is new to red pill or is trying to introduce receptive males new to red pill to fundamentals, there is a compilation of the red pill reddit sidebar here (it can be downloaded in PDF format and read at one’s leisure):

http://a.trp.red/files/RPSidebar.pdf

Some great perspective articles compiled there.

theasdgamer
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@ SJF, YaReally

“Apex PUA game” = “high level game skills”

That’s how I read SJF’s comment. Of course, game is game and all men have some kind of game unless they are asexual. Some kinds of game are better than other kinds of game.

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@Asdgamer Yes that is how I meant it. I’m an advocate of high level game skills. Some don’t just have them yet. (I’m doing well at game, BTW.) I reinforced an important lesson this past week in attempting to mentor a buddy. And that was discussed in Tylers video that YaReally linked to. April 20th, 2016 at 12:07 pm. Create Relationships For Your Current Stage Of Life: Be Self Aware, Make Only Promises You Will Keep. I told my buddy to “figure out what you want in life/relationships and go with that”. What he wanted is OK and I told… Read more »

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@SJF @theasdgamer This is what I mean about forcing it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ey0cHvLFzB4 There are pro-active things you can do to trigger that sexual state that don’t take any magic level of game, just watching this video and then going and applying it. It’s not some mystical mystery, you CREATE the state and bring her INTO it. Like the classic pacing someone’s reality and then leading them into another state which Mystery used to say was one of his favorite things to do. If you’re gaming over text you can’t really do this but infield in general the ovulation stuff just doesn’t… Read more »

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That’s part of why she’s not really into it and not genuine with her emotions and she’s compliant but kind of jaded and robotic about it and can’t have an interesting/genuine conversation and form a connection and shit. She’s a walking corpse just going through the motions of what she thinks she remembers being human was like 20 years ago before she went through LIFE and right now COMPANIONSHIP (talking about filing your emails) is more of a draw to her than SEX. She’s lonely and had enough sex (who knows where her sex drive is even AT at that… Read more »

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Culum again you avoid doing the work of cold approach because your ego would prefer the “safe bet” of a snaggly 5.5. Time to unplug completely from the online world… and if you are in a situation like this one again, now perhaps you can experiment with BURNING IT DOWN… like there is zero possibility of you even wanting to see this woman again, you started out wanting her for some easy sex so PUSH the angle of what you want now, for the sex… You don’t need to worry about future game for this one, you are out either… Read more »

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@YaReally Sorry, I didn’t catch your comment @ 8:02 am when I made subsequent replies. I’m in total agreement of what you said there. And it was un-intentional on my part to imply not shooting for high level game skills. LTR game is my Frame. And I recognize my solipsism. And I’m not trying to draw anyone here into that frame. OTOH, I still believe menstruation game is not for nothing even if: in good game it doesn’t matter. Your point is well taken, but for a guy’s sexual strategy to succeed, he must get laid. More guys aren’t getting… Read more »

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Fyi, found this on Prince. Full disclosure, I was not some big fan of his for most of his life – not a hater but always put off by the effeminate stuff. I also saw him as a primadonna. Funnily, the RP has me realize this was an ego buffer, lol. But I certainly got how talented he was at a point. Someone posted this to FB earlier and I thought it said it all quite well. ?oh=69677741e7146fef465760adacea613c&oe=57BA0AD9 What is interesting from an RP POV is the importance of how one presents himself. Been relistening to The 48 Laws of… Read more »

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@Culum Reminds me of a guy was telling me about this rich widow he was doing some handyman work for,she had had a stroke and had half a smile IYKWIM.So she is hanging around watching him work and telling her story and he offered to fuck her if it would make her feel better. This is where i interrupted him with ya and being a gigelo wouldn’t make you feel better? Any how the game you were playing with this older gal is a gigelo game and to make it work you have to convince her of your own desire,in… Read more »

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Well I’d have been much better served by this latest brilliance if I’d have read it on wed like I meant to. I’ll be better prepared next time. I had two guys like this wed afternoon-both later 40’s/early 50’s w/swollen bellies who both had the compulsion to sort of redress me for my newfound confidence and attitudes. One said I was becoming an asshole. I said Thank You Absolutely, thanks for noticing (agree & amplify). In my head I was jumping for joy-CH would be so proud, I’ve earned my Asshole Card!

Culum Struan
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Thanks everyone – points well taken. Walawala and YaReally – yes, you’re right about the hotter girls not necessarily being harder… ..and yes, Sentient, I guess it’s easier for me to schedule online dates (despite the epic flake rate and time wasting) because it’s easier than cold approach although the biggest reason is just that it’s been a while since I got laid (since the couple of hand jobs I had with the Tinder chick and then “epiphany chick” on successive days last month – actually getting laid even longer than that) and I want to tick that off. But… Read more »

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PS – I think I forgot to mention in my FR about late 40s HB 5.5 – when we were swaying to music in the bar and I was groping her, I asked her why she doesn’t drink at all (she doesn’t fit the profile – more likely to be a lush than a teetotaller) and she sort of smiled and was like “I just become an enormous slut when I drink”, and I looked her in the eye and went “You say that like it’s a bad thing” and she split her sides laughing..

Culum Struan
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YaReally Sentient HABD and the usual gang: Saturday night solo night street/bar game FR Happy with the night – night street game solo in the nightlife district on Sat night..set myself a target of two conversations (more than 1 minute) with women, since I am already okay(ish) with openers and I hit the target (and I’d have done more if I’d stuck around longer, but I had an early start today). Also probably would have done better if I’d stayed out later but I had finish by 11ish PM which is pretty early for Saturday. Note for next time I… Read more »

theasdgamer
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@ YaReally

Whatever day of her cycle it is, closing the gap on her while you look her in the eyes will cause a hindbrain reaction in her…if her dream sexy celebrity appears and says he’s leaving in an hour, she’ll GET horny for him lol

Yeah, even if a woman’s acyclical (menopausal or post meno) a woman can still get freaking horny IN THE MOMENT. Game shouldn’t rely on a cyclical testosterone bolus.

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PS – Sentient I’m not sure what you mean about “a neediness to be wanted vs a hunger to take what you want”..do you just mean I should be more focussed on the Platinum Rule generally and pushing for what I desire?

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@Mazrim – Co-sign on being an asshole. While I’ve always had a certain knack for it, now I don’t bother being ashamed about it. Just had a run in with some trespassers who were fishing on the lake on the property I rent. I’m usually chill about it and people have become brazen, like i’m a public fishing spot. These people parked in a spot they really shouldn’t have. After walking the dog I’m watching for my sister (awesome young beagle who they have bothered to train properly), I decided to approach them and tell them where to park. I… Read more »

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@ Culum

Yes like Sentien was saying,his request for thoughts,got me writing.

The older woman takes more eye contact and conversation if you get it right she may even rape you.

The SJF comment was the one last week where he trashed his plans and spent the day with his wife just to get shot down in the end,then turned it around,absence makes the heart grow fonder.

bluepillprofessor
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Another great post Rollo. Why do I get so pissed off when BP crabs say shit like this? Cheating? CHEATING? Your g-d damn right! The fucking game is a whole lot easier to play when you have the cheat codes from The Rational Male. I guess it angers me because the same guys who speak like this would freak out if you suggested women “cheat” with makeup and magazine articles and the henhouse which largely focuses on how to control men and win the game. Cheating? What the ever living Hell? I would rather “cheat” and WIN than play fair… Read more »

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Culum Sentient I’m not sure what you mean about “a neediness to be wanted vs a hunger to take what you want”..do you just mean I should be more focussed on the Platinum Rule generally and pushing for what I desire? Well play back your episode with the 5.5… You picked her for sex explicitly… she was there isolated with you, she gave you a back rub (wtf did she do? LOL), she kissed you, you “groped her (hate that imagery and wording BTW) etc… I didn’t see any real hard no to the escalation (No to the verbal, yes,… Read more »

theasdgamer
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@ YaReally

Thanks for posting the Todd vid about leading a woman into a sexual state by focusing on your own state first.

Dancing can put you into a dance state where you’re just looking for your next dance partner and your system is filled with oxytocin and you’re feeling fine. In that situation, it’s easy to forget to set your state to sexual.

theasdgamer
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@ Culum, Sentient

“Just that HER lack of demonstrating wanting you triggered you to back off”

Amp a woman’s sexual desire with more teasing. Get up in her grid and hold her there with lots of lasering and amused mastery grins and dancing eyes but don’t let her kiss you. Put her hand on your thigh, but don’t let her touch your dick. Stuff like that. Avoid closure. Make her work to qualify herself.

I do this with Mrs. Gamer alla time.

Forge the Sky
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@Culum Thanks for the FR’s, was gonna comment on the text exchange but everyone piled on that one already lol. But reading all the replies has been helpful for me given that I’ve been trying to set up a meetup w a girl over text at the same time. I think (and YaReally can correct me if I’m wrong) that it’s pretty difficult to generate all that much interest over text. I mean, it’s possible to generate emotions in her with text messages, but usually that’s more a product of you capitalizing on emotional investment on her part that you’ve… Read more »

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@ Scribblerg Having been run out of prime fishing spots myself,yes these people totally blew it,i would have thanked you and moved my car.It never pays to be a jump off in someones face especially when they are holding the keys. One time i was spincasting my way around a favorite lake,you are supposed to pay the toll road to get in,and i hiked in. Had in my pack 5 nice ones[1 over limit] and came around a corner,there was the game warden fishing.I thought he saw me at the same time so i just kept coming.Saw him catch a… Read more »

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@Culum Struan The side benefit to going out even if it’s for a short while is how much more likely are you to go out again to scratch this itch: “and I’d have done more if I’d stuck around longer, but I had an early start today). Also probably would have done better if I’d stayed out later” “solo game is DOABLE. I can do this and have fun..and it shouldn’t be *that* hard to close..a few more conversations, a bit more SOI and then close.” “And I could have had more if I’d stayed out longer…” …compared to having… Read more »

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@TheOldOligarch said: > “Tom, you said: “The blue pill in its totality consists of all the lies “society” as a whole tells people, to mislead them into doing things that serve the agenda of others rather than interests of the person themselves”. > > That’s morality in general: using public relations to get people to do the right thing(what you want them to do).” Wow, TOO … that’s really freaky. You do realize that the most blue pill of blue pill guys is the one who doesn’t even know what he doesn’t know … do you? I guess you don’t.… Read more »

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@Forge the Sky Try toning the texting down and see what happens. Don’t have gay go-nowhere conversations that aren’t leading toward actually meeting up. Even if that means days of not txting her. Have the mindset of “if you want my attention and all the awesome feels I give you, you’d better be meeting up with me because I don’t just hand those out”. If you’re txting her regularly when she isn’t playing along you’re showing that she doesn’t HAVE to meet up with you to keep you around. Could mean a month of radio silence, who knows, but giving… Read more »

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Forge

A big part of establish the “make her chase you frame” is actually having the abundance tobmske her chase you… If you had 20 of the girls to ping texts on, your entire vibe with this one girl will change dramatically…

Seek abundance first, outcomes second..

scribblerg
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Newsflash – The lower SMV women are bitchier on approach, lol. Wow, another chunk of the matrix reveals itself. They have more to prove it seems, like the need to have their ego validated more by me and my approach than the legit hotties. Fuck, yeah. I got this. Re-opened a girl i’d wrecked it with over the past 3-4 yrs. History isn’t worth replaying, although she basically threw her pussy at me one night way back, pre-RP and I fucked it up. 22yo hottie then. 25 yo, still hottie now but acts weird around me and can’t even make… Read more »

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Culum yareally Neediness is a bad thing because it will always put you in someone elses frame. That lends to validation seeking. That leads to a loss of your identity. Its great to feel wanted, its bad to need it. Enjoy it when it happens but avoid needing it to happen. As to the sex likely being shitty… Well he picked this girl out of all the women in the world to start with… Some threshold was met… Lol But Culum, seriously props… I cracked up reading this FR… Ive had some head scratchers… All you can do is laugh… Read more »

Culum Struan
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Thanks guys, more later cos I’m just heading out now for a couple hours to solo game but just to say to Forge re “Netflix is more appealing” – I just had an online chick an hour ago (cute late-20s HB7 pole dancer blonde) agree to come and meet me for a drink (she’s just sitting at home watching TV right now) and then text me 20 mins later literally saying she just realized she’ll need to wash her hair and she doesn’t feel like washing her hair so she can’t make it. I just lol’ed..that barely even counts as… Read more »

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I’m considering posting a FR here soon but as you may remember I don’t want to push things too far. I stop at arm-around/hand-holding and usually that is 90% with the girls that are part of the social circle.

I’m writing it regardless for my own sake, I just wonder about if posting it is worth it. Is that still interesting for you experts to analyse?

Sentient
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On night street game… Concur. Good opportunities… If you want a good opener and have a good vibe/state builder try this… Post up in front of a bar (without doormen) and hold up people and ask for ID… Its very fun… With the guys and girls you can fuck with them “this is the worst fake id ive ever seen… Your 64!?” shit like that. Amazing how most people just respond… Another one is when the girls walk up tell them its closed… Blah blah ac broke, toilet overflowed… Etc… Then just be like nahhh just kidding. But now they… Read more »

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IAS

Post away my man… All are welcome. Observing the cognative dissonance alone is worth it wink

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@Tom:

Trying reading this again:

“That’s morality in general: using public relations to get people to do the right thing(what you want them to do).”

. . . and see if it doesn’t parse a bit differently this time.

@Stuff in Box:

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@KFG

Lol i still have that red stringer the warden gave me,not sentimental but some things i have to keep.

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@IAS By all means post a field report. And next time don’t ask because that is a beta move. And you don’t have to apologize for being monogamous, catch-and-release is a time honored monogamous-married-man practice tactic when in a different city. (…sure it flies in the face of Plate Theory, but so what?) Your last field report out with colleagues was helpful, no? Your learning game in a married relationship is you practicing and having the mindset that you are a single man once again and your wife is welcome to come into your Frame. (whether you desire monogamy or… Read more »

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@YaReally, Sentient Thanks. I’m actually texting this girl a whole hellava lot less than I would have not even that long ago – like pretty much only when I think there’s some chance for a meetup – but I could probably stand to dial it back a whole lot less. I’ve initiated nearly every convo. “I mean, she put all that effort in last time and didn’t get laid, why’s she gonna do it again? lol” Lol, keep facepalming about that one. I mean, there were reasons but that’n a nickel and you just have a rationalization. I’m wondering re:… Read more »

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@Scribb Good stuff! re: “Fyi, the way she changed towards me was “proof” of my creepy oldguyness at one point, and even recently she would avert her gaze and ignore me weirdly. Now? RP? I get that it can be reframed.” I had this Lebanese chick back when who had a crush on me. She kinda stabbed me in the back a bit (she might have been trying to get this other girl away from me so she had a shot, but who knows). You might remember the story. Anyways, I just went dark on her for like three months.… Read more »

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Forge

You may get something out of ijjjji’s method of no flake day 2’s…

http://www.pua-zone.com/showthread.php?11360-100-Method-for-Meeting-up-with-Girls

Basically, you combine abundance (non needy, lots of girls), flirt and in the up moment have her invite herself into your party…

Forge the Sky
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Thanks Sentient! That’s surprisingly helpful for being so simple.

It changes the frame of how you arrange meet ups whenever you don’t have hardcore pursuit from her.

Just got back from sarging! No huge reports but I’m fucking THRILLED I got myself out there. Overly enthusiastic FR tomorrow on the new thread, I’ve gotta sleep now and only have a smartphone to type on.

Roy Hobbs
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@Culum et al… Write off the whole neediness=you thing; not that at all! >35 (divorced Mom optional) is my wheelhouse… remember: I’m a pithed “old guy” who freezes at a gaggle of college girls- but you deal me 1/2 dozen divorcees on a “girls night” & I’m money! I call it “the void” I can not tell you how many times I’ve met up for a “get a drink” test-date (previously where she displayed significant interest) yet the void was in her eyes on meetup time. A couple of factors to consider – usually meet up on a Tues/Wed so… Read more »

theasdgamer
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Several game questions for scray, HABD, YaReally, et. al. 1. If a girl puts her hand on your butt, is that a strong IOI? I just assume that it’s a strong IOI. Is it possible that she thinks that you are moving too slowly? 2. How do I categorize a girl spanking my butt while I bump hips with her? Strong IOI or a girl just having fun? 3. If a girl starts discussing where you and she live, is further calibration required to determine whether she’s working out logistics because she’s DTF or she is just making convo? 4.… Read more »

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@asd Previous posts indicate you dance a lot… #1) While I will dance opportunistically in smaller/local venues to a good band, I probably look like a beaching whale- so don’t do it much unless I’m feeling it; but, yes, an ass grab in an IOI. “Is it possible that she thinks that you are moving too slowly?” Again, don’t dance much, so usually this is in bed & yes – I’ll speed up “as requested”. #2) see above = IOI + beyond #3) Hell yea that’s her checking logistics!!… can she scoot out early & get back home pretending its… Read more »

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@SJF: yes I did read that MRP series on Frame.

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