The Quick Fix

quick_fix

Becoming the Captain of My Boat dropped this comment in the This is now thread (emphasis mine):

You know, I found the RP about a year and a half ago. I’ve been working on applying things to my life, and for the most part things are going well.

Most of the articles though are about what to avoid, what to look out for, or how to think about women when you’re in your 20’s. The difficult thing is now being aware and seeing it all around you and being married.

I see the Sandberg quote, I hear it all the time from women in one form or another, and then my wife says similar shit. Like she dated the assholes, or had to find herself. Now I’m like, shit, I’m the nice guy she married. I don’t want to be that guy.
I was the asshole in college, what the fuck happened to me and how do I fix it quick? But there is no quick, once you’re in this it’s an uphill battle, a necessary one, but an uphill battle none the less.

I read the Rational Male, I’ve read a number of the books, but it get’s tricky when you’re already in it.

My wife isn’t a terrible person, and I can see firsthand how all this applies to her, but she isn’t malicious. This is subconscious shit reinforced by all their surroundings. Hell, my own betaization was subconscious shit reinforced by my surroundings.

I can say without a doubt that if your’e not already in a LTR or married and you’re younger than 30-35 don’t get in one. Read this stuff, make yourself a better man, fuck around and “find yourself” then you can get into a LTR, because it’s much harder to take control of a ship and right the course with your now demoted wife psychologically kicking and screaming than it is to captain a boat from the get go and then find a hot, willing first mate along the way when you’re already a seasoned salty captain.

He can only speak for himself of course, but Captian’s situation is not an uncommon one. Far too many men discover too late that the great relationship they swore they had with their wives was founded on their having fulfilled a Blue Pill set of achievements.

This belief is part of the plan Hypergamy had intended for him to follow, but as women’s sexual strategy has become more visible (if not outright flaunted) to him he begins to see the code in the Matrix he’s been a willing participant of. The machinations of Hypergamy are unignorable, or soon will be, but it’s one thing to be single and young enough to be able to leverage that plan to your own benefit when you still have the options and maneuverability to do so – it’s quite another to become aware of your own participation in it once you’re committed legally, emotionally and familially to going along with the plan.

For men, one of the more unfortunate consequences of Open Hypergamy is the degree of comfort their wives have in revealing the part their husbands play(ed) in their sexual strategy. As I’ve mentioned in prior posts, in a previous social order it was simply a matter of course that women should keep the mechanics of Hypergamy secret from the men they paired with in the long term.

Amongst themselves women were (and are) very open and frank about their sexual exploits both in the short term sexual and the long term provisional. I’ve always been convinced that women’s insistence on proliferating the trope of men’s “locker room talk” or ‘Humble-Bragging’ about their sexual conquests is a distraction from their own peer clutch groups congratulating themselves on the successes of their sexual strategy.

In a prior social climate keeping these ‘hen house’ Hypergamous revelations to themselves made sense. There was little point to informing the men they depended upon for parental investment and security that they were really the best available option to be their means to an end.

Not so in the present social climate. There is an eager brazenness on the part of wives to openly explain the part their husbands play(ed) in her Hypergamy. I’d attribute most of this to a social climate that encourages women to believe they have nothing to lose by doing so, but there’s also a want to participate (even if vicariously) in the single-woman peer clutch that has openly embraced revealing the ins and outs of Hypergamy publicly.

It’s a rough transition for men to have their Blue Pill idealisms dispelled by the Red Pill community, but it’s far more devastating for men steeped in Blue Pill merit badge accomplishments to have their wives openly confirm what the Red Pill aware have been trying to awaken him to for some time.

Open Hypergamy isn’t just a game for single women; it’s made its way into contemporary marriages. It’s now part of the egalitarian equalist expectation of men in marriage – that in order for men to truly be men worthy of marrying a co-equal ‘modern woman’ he must dispense with any notion of ownership of her, forgive the worst of her Hypergamous indiscretions as part of her “finding herself” and then accept his role as the Plan B, Beta provider for her in the nick of time to help her fulfill her sexual strategy in the long term. All of this coming with no expectation of any reciprocal value on a woman’s part – in fact to believe so is tantamount to marital rape.

I see the Sandberg quote, I hear it all the time from women in one form or another, and then my wife says similar shit. Like she dated the assholes, or had to find herself. Now I’m like, shit, I’m the nice guy she married. I don’t want to be that guy.

I was the asshole in college, what the fuck happened to me and how do I fix it quick? But there is no quick, once you’re in this it’s an uphill battle, a necessary one, but an uphill battle none the less.

This is the revelation men in this situation find themselves in. Even the men who may have fulfilled the role of “a great living dildo” for women in their 20s can still find that their role may have shifted to that of ‘non-threatening relationship material guy’ who she’d never have sex with on the same night she met him.

Now granted, all of this comes back to the subconscious expectation of cuckoldry women place on the men they cast in the passive, supportive role. Women don’t expect the Beta Bucks men they pair with will ever be the Alpha Fucks men their biochemistry predisposes them to want to fuck. But ‘great Dad’ must believe he was chosen as her best option, her best choice for the balance of the two. Only later, once she’s consolidated on him with family, children, financial and professional liabilities to her, is she comfortable in letting him in on how the game was really played.

As I said, the truth of that is hard enough to hear from Red Pill writers on the internet, but to have it viscerally confirmed by a wife without the social filters of an older social climate is a much harder pill to swallow than the red one.

The Fix is In

That sounds like an awful lot of gloom and doom doesn’t it? I can’t speak for Captain, but a woman delivering the confirmation that a guy is really a Blue Pill consolation prize is rarely couched in so melodramatic and sinister delivery. I’ve had many men (mostly disillusioned husbands from MMSL) relate similar stories as Captain’s and none of them were screaming confessions of deceit on the part of their wives. Most were simply matter of fact comments in passing that aligned with their suspicions about themselves.

I hate to harp on Pixar’s Inside Out cartoon, but it’s the simple everyday open Hypergamy that goes unnoticed by Blue Pill idealists. It takes a Red Pill lens to even be sensitive to it, but when you see how casually the wife/mother in this movie fantasizes about her widowed Alpha, the Alpha fantasy she couldn’t consolidate on, and how frustrated she is every time her Beta husband fails a shit test, you begin to understand the passive nature of an overt Hypergamy in women.

Women get frustrated that Blue Pill men Just Don’t Get It. The Blue Pill idealism blinds them to having the insight needed to realize the role they’re supposed to play and the frustration comes from their being over-supportive and over-engaging in order to make things right for their women. Blue Pill men will graciously ‘play equal’ in their marriages in order to live up to the equalist goal-set they were taught would pay off for them for a lifetime if left uncheck or unchallenged.

It’s my belief that wives will use a married form of open, or certainly casually overt, revelations of Hypergamy in order to rouse a man to a Red Pill awareness in the hopes that he’ll Just Get It.

And to answer the inevitable question, yes, this is a meta-scale shit test on the part of wives. However, it’s important remember that Hypergamy is rooted in existential and life-security doubt for women – “Is he really the best I can do?” – and that the shit tests associated with this vary depending on the influences of a woman’s phase of maturity as well as which part of her menstrual cycle she happens to be in.

Revealing the machinations of Hypergamy to a husband has potentially disastrous consequences, or at least it used to. As I said before, women generally don’t sprout horns and a forked tail and say “Ha ha, sucker!” when they reveal Hypergamy; it’s usually a casual inference. If a Blue Pill husband isn’t Getting It about his participation in women sexual strategy from outside means (media, social networks) then the passive or overt shit tests about his awareness of it need to be implemented.

In a previous social order making men aware of this could just as likely result in a woman being divorced or ostracized socially. Today, in men’s never ending quest to satisfy “equalism’s” approval, men are less likely to even believe their role when a woman confirms it for them. Ego-investments meets cognitive dissonance. Not only does he not get it his ego refuses to get it.

This then is the pathetic state of 80%+ of contemporary men. Men so inured by Blue Pill conditioned idealism that they’ll entertain ‘open marriages‘ in order to make themselves ‘better husbands‘ according to an emasculated equalist ideal.

Help! Quick!

So now we come to a situation like Captains – one where that husband Just Gets It only he’s gotten the message, received the awareness, from his wife (either passively or overtly) and he’s both pissed off at his state and equally wants to improve it. I expect most men would advise Cap to sack up and dump that bitch; and they’d probably be right in that assessment. She was duplicitous and then felt so self-assured in her position (reinforced by feminine primary social influences) that she was comfortable in revealing it to him. What’s he gonna do about it, right?

The right answer is to preemptively detonate the marriage. When you consider he’ll be cast in the role of villain no matter who files for divorce (he’s an asshole, or he’s the asshole who couldn’t meet her needs) why not, right? Any kids, any family discord, certainly the financial liabilities, should all be small shrift, collateral damage, when we look at this in terms of justice. It’s just revenge for her double-cross.

And yet that’s not what the vast majority of men in Cap’s situation first consider. Their first thought is “How do I fix this? I’ve lost Frame! How do I get it back fast! Help?” For all of the duplicity inherent in Hypergamy, for all of the insult that comes from a wife confirming he’s her Beta ‘sure thing’ (not the ‘hawt’ college asshole), that guy still wants to make lemonade from lemons, knowing full well she deserves piss.

That husband wants to still be all things, the mythical Good Guy balance, to his wife. There’s something in men’s romantic natures that wants this to work for themselves and in spite of women who fundamentally lack the capacity to appreciate it.

The first question I think men in this situation need to confront is whether it’s worth the effort to attempt to change their wives’ impression of them. If you’re 35 and (should be) entering your SMV peak years, this open Hypergamy revelation is particularly tough to accept since it’s likely you’ve invested 7-8 years in a woman who’s just told you what you are to her (and confirming it’s not who you are that’s of primary importance to her). As I’ve stated many times before, going from a Beta character to an Alpha (or more Alpha) one is always an uphill battle:

How many of the simpering, socially conditioned, Betatized men these women seeth about would make for believable Alphas once they had a red pill epiphany? It is precisely because of this impressionistic, binary solipsism that women will never be happy with ‘fixing’ their Beta. This is why he has to Just Get It on his own.

It is a far better proposition to impress a woman with an organic Alpha dominance – Alpha can only be a man’s dominant personality origin. There is no Beta with a side of Alpha because that side of Alpha is NEVER believable when your overall perception is one of being Beta to begin with. This is why I stress Alpha traits above all else. It’s easy, and endearing to ‘reveal’ a flash of Beta sensitivity when a woman perceives you as predominantly Alpha. If your personality is predominantly Beta, any sporadic flashes of Alpha will seem like emotional tantrums at best, character flaws at worst.

Women may love the Beta, but they only respect the Alpha.

That’s not to say a real transformation isn’t possible, but rather it’s a question of whether the juice will ever be worth the squeeze. There is no ‘quick fix’, no magical formula that will reverse Frame to your favor. Even if you won the lottery tomorrow, you’d still be a Beta with more money to your openly Hypergamous wife now. Frame establishment (not re-establishment if you never had it to begin with) takes time and active, practicable Red Pill awareness.

As I was telling Goldmund in my interview, that awareness needs to become a man’s internalized nature. He needs to become his own self-important mental point of origin; that and a Red Pill aware nature take time to develop. Anyone telling you they have a ‘one-size-fits-all’ Red Pill solution that ‘guarantees results in your marriage’ is selling you something.

I say they’re selling you something because of one simple truth – no quick fix that could make you seem more Alpha, more like the asshole college guy your wife loved to fuck back in the day will ever be believable to her if it happens overnight. On a root, hindbrain level, your Beta designation was set for your wife when she was having her Epiphany Phase. She knows and is comfortable with what she expects your nature and your character to be.

As I illustrated in Archetypes , women need consistency in behavior – they expect you to be Beta and are so comfortable in that assessment that they feel no guilt and have no fear in revealing to you the role you play for her. Thus, any radical shift in that comfort doesn’t seem genuine, and in fact it seems childish that you wont accept your designation.

So, is it worth it? I think my advice in this instance would be this:

Iron Rule of Tomassi #7
It is always time and effort better spent developing new, fresh, prospective women than it will ever be in attempting to reconstruct a failed relationship. Never root through the trash once the garbage has been dragged to the curb. You get messy, your neighbors see you do it, and what you thought was worth digging for is never as valuable as you thought it was.

Once your wife has openly revealed your part in the plan, you’ve effectively broken up. Logistically that may not be the case, but I think most guys need to see this for what it is; a rejection of a husband’s authority, masculinity, his decisiveness and his capacity to read the nuances in behavior and a society that’s been (sometimes literally) screaming to him to Just Get It.

Your wife’s garbage can was dragged to the curb by your wife’s admissions, only the trash truck never comes for it because you’re committed to that can staying on the curb until you walk away from it. If you go digging through it to find what you think is valuable, prepare to get real dirty and look for a long time.

You’ve effectively been ‘friend zoned’ in your marriage. You may still have sex, you may still share special moments, but never forget, her confessions make you ‘just a friend’ in your marriage.

 


*Standard disclaimer: Yes, men should forego marriage altogether and/or stringently vet women for virginity, homemaking and childrearing. Importing wives from third world countries is duly noted. Rollo Tomassi has been married for 19 years to a magical unicorn he found after being a semi-pro rock star and lives an idyllic life of riches and extravagance. NAWALT. Your milage may vary. See dealer for details.

Published by Rollo Tomassi

Author of The Rational Male and The Rational Male, Preventive Medicine

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charlesthundercock@gmail.com
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charlesthundercock@gmail.com
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NAMALT – Not all marriages are like that. Married young, am constantly pursued by wifes friends. Wife is always on her toes with me. Wife is constantly cooking, cleaning, and pursuing sex with me. Gets mad when I masturbate because she loses a turn. Difference? I pass shit tests, I lift, a dress well, make lots of money, and remain alpha post marriage. ( hold frame ) Marriages where you continue to run game and follow RP principles can be engaging and fun. I have the security of a marriage, a foundation for my children, a wife that finds me… Read more »

rugby11ljh
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rugby11ljh
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“a rejection of a husband’s authority, masculinity, his decisiveness and his capacity to read the nuances in behavior and a society that’s been (sometimes literally) screaming to him to Just Get It.”

I Now Just Get it

redlight
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redlight
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@charlesthundercock “Difference? I pass shit tests, I lift, a dress well, make lots of money, and remain alpha post marriage. ( hold frame )” This was my mistake. Living the nomad existence of a writer, I found the low N count (not a virgin, but never a BJ), homemaking and childrearing. Employment, married, kids. Figured my job was provision and comfort. Maxed it. Sex declined. Tried the usual shit. Nothing worked. Depressed. Got myself in shape, dressed better, making things happen, told her I want to separate. Now, she lets me run the show, in fact she expects me to… Read more »

redlight
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redlight
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I was at an event this weekend. I didn’t ask my wife if I could, I just invited her along if she wanted (she did). I was wearing something most guys wouldn’t. A 20s with big tits says to our group, “it takes a strong man to wear that”.

Karl
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Karl
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I’ve been married 15 years (I’m 45) and discovered the Red Pill about two years ago. Although my employment of dread game and improvements in my confidence and masculinity have helped my relationship with my wife, she still constantly shit-tested me and bitched and complained. So, I used my game knowledge and started banging other women on the sly. They were almost all one-night stands, I made no emotional investment in any of them. My wife found my anonymous online journal in which I described my activities, including the fact that I had banged 11 women since January this year.… Read more »

Augustus
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Augustus
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Rollo,

I agree that the right thing is to detonate the marriage. If: There are no kids involved. I’m seriously having a difficult time with your statement that kids should be small shrift in terms of justice.

That being said, I have the utmost respect for your body of work. I have learned so much from your writing.

Thank you for being a voice of truth and enlightenment for men.

Mark Minter
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I bought these “workout” gloves. It says it right on the box, P90X Workout Gloves. They are a full palm, half glove, 1 pound each. The weight is some sort of metal BB or pellet things and they are distributed on the back of the hand and with this one compartment that fully covers the knuckles, mostly on the front of the fist, the punching locus. I was standing next to Kate in the store, tried them on, and gave the display shelf a moderately light right jab. Nothing much, a little harder than maybe a first fist bump you… Read more »

cheupez
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cheupez
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@ Karl Story of my life! Except I didn’t, and cant stop. [For those men who find the idea of fucking around when you are married offensive, just don’t read]. My wife is the career type. She is also a joy killer, cant stand my kind of music, cant stand my driving style, cant stand my general conduct, says I am too rowdy, restless… Problem is she had no issues with all that I was before marriage and then suddenly flipped and started trying to change me after marriage. Did not work. So I take my holidays alone, and when… Read more »

Desdinova Superstar
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Trying to become “more alpha” with regards to your marriage isn’t the only uphill battle a man with newly opened eyes is going to have. It rocks your entire world with regards to your existing relationships. People are resistant to change, and that includes when their friend’s personality changes. If you grew up in a house where your parents treated you like a doormat and a servant, they will continue to see you as such. If you have friends who take advantage of your good nature, they will continue to attempt doing so. After my awakening 14 years ago, I… Read more »

M Simon
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M Simon
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It doesn’t matter how well they have done in their choice. How much oneitis they have for you. The shit testing never stops.

Which is why a woman’s word is seldom worth anything. Maybe they will come to a better decision later.

sgtted
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I’ve always been convinced that women’s insistence on proliferating the trope of men’s “locker room talk” or ‘Humble-Bragging’ about their sexual conquests is a distraction from their own peer clutch groups congratulating themselves on the successes of their sexual strategy.

The trope is also asserted because women think men are just like them in the cold calculation of sexual conquest.

BigAl
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BigAl
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Great post and a hilarious disclaimer

D. Horrenbrand
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I side with this except that I don’t recommend marrying anyone. Why on earth I would want to do that.

M Simon
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Re: Disclaimer. Better than virginity is oneitis for you. But not perfect.

Because even behind that is “Well, He has passed all the shit tests so far, and no suitable replacement is on the horizon, but what if he fails the next shit test?”

She can’t help it.

Excalibur
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I have to chuckle to myself every time I hear a married man after discovering Red Pill knowledge talk about how “alpha” they are, how they “maintain frame,” they “run the show here,” keep their wife in line, etc. Every married man is a supplicating beta. Every. Single. One. – No exceptions. Marriage instantly beta-izes every man, because both of you are now in a three-some with the State, where she has the upper hand. No supposed alpha male can out alpha the State. Every married woman with half a brain knows very well the power that they have with… Read more »

CaveClown
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Definition of ‘Rationalization’ per Merriam Webster:

“to think about or describe something (such as bad behavior) in a way that explains it and makes it seem proper, more attractive, etc.”

Staying for the kids.
Staying to preserve wealth.
Staying because “she could be worse”
Staying because “she’s not malicious”
Staying because I am now “alpha”

Etc…

I don’t wish the hell that is divorce on anyone, especially the kids, and I judge no man that chooses to stay…but understand and accept the rationalizations!

Shiva H. P.
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“Your wife’s garbage can was dragged to the curb by your wife’s admissions, only the trash truck never comes for it because you’re committed to that can staying on the curb until you walk away from it. If you go digging through it to find what you think is valuable, prepare to get real dirty and look for a long time.” V. good allegory, can’t explain it better than this. Blue pill fantasy deludes men not just make do with but even enjoy the garbage. Blue pill men are like a group of pigs rolling in sewage while calling on… Read more »

Dreamer
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@Excalibur – I presume that includes Rollo too then. The question is not merely checking about no exceptions. But takings your view has implications – it discredits not on those commentators, but anyone else too. And leaves an open question how far exactly to take that thought. @CaveClown – I don’t particularly want to go around making arguments and stuff. But I need to point out if we are going into semantics, part of the meaning of rationalize, if you look via Google’s definition (which is based from an official dictionary somewhere): “attempt to explain or justify (one’s own or… Read more »

M Simon
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M Simon
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Excalibur
August 3rd, 2015 at 10:40 am

Tingles.

Richard
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Richard
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“You’ve effectively been ‘friend zoned’ in your marriage.”

Sorry Rollo, but this is wrong. This man has been cuckolded, not friend zoned.

Becoming the Captain of My Boat
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Becoming the Captain of My Boat
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This is the harshest article I’ve read, because it’s about me. I don’t even know what to say. My first instinct is to defend myself, as there are some details that are different about my marriage versus most of the guys that come in here, namely I wasn’t super blue pill when we first hooked up, I picked her up in a bar and fucked her hard the first night, it’s just moving in 6 months later that all of a sudden you become ‘non-threatening relationship material guy’. Regardless of my desire to defend myself, as it stands, Rollo is… Read more »

Patrick
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Patrick
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I spotted a variant on the wife’s beta bucks unveiling. Jason and Crystalina Evert are speakers on purity and chastity to high school and college kids. They wrote booklets respectively called Pure Manhood and Pure Womanhood. Turns out she was a reformed slut basically who at about 28 married a 28-year-old virgin. *She really, really regrets her past (and shows that by writing books and speaking about having been promiscuous while her husband was waiting…just for her!)* In Pure Manhood, he tries to create an impression that he was pretty sexually immoral in his day and regrets it. But his… Read more »

Aelorne
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Aelorne
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Rollo- I’m beginning to see a duality to a lot of young men’s situations, when they are getting into an LTR/marriage. It seems there are two major considerations: 1- Did your relationship begin and progress in a way which indicates you are alpha to her, and she just wants to lock you down? If so, progress to question 2: 2- Are you pre-emptively cuckholded by her (college) de-souling days? If the answer to number 2 is “yes”… should alphas move on? Is this a categorical disqualifier? What if a “yes” to question 2 doesn’t disturb your alpha status because she… Read more »

Aelorne
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Aelorne
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Rollo, also– as a follow-up, do you see “ledger inequity” as an intractable source of resentment which would preclude a healthy relationship?

kfg
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kfg
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If you are staying together “for the kids,” “Your” kids have already been weaponized against you.

SJB
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SJB
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@kfg,

Weaponization–very true. I’d like to think I blunted the betaifcation of my sons and the bitchification of my daughters. Time will tell; perhaps they will start to see things through red-tinted glasses.

Chump No More
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@Captain, the ‘Stay’ and the ‘Go’ plan are the same.

Work on yourself for you, follow your passion, do what pleases *you*, provision for yourself and those in your life that are worthy (i.e., your kids).

Suspend disbelief that your wife wont come around and internalize *your* new paradigm until you can’t anymore.Then, walk away with a clear conscience and new understanding and a better life.

the Son of Tydeus
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Rollo,
I don’t often comment but today I am compelled. As a man who preemptively detonated his 12 year marriage upon Red Pill awareness, I would say your advice is spot-on. Let men know it is possible to find yourself again.

You are doing good work for men.

dragnet
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@ Mark Minter

“I am nobody’s cuck.”

I thought your wife had children from a previous relationship?

SD
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SD
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As a single man of 30 , I’ll say that Rollo’s words on game and marriage are important. Why? Because the feminist imperative is not going to stop here.Like all social movements it is a constantly evolving model. Ten years back a man could game many women without much personal risk. Today a PUA could be jailed depending on where and when he runs his game. In the years to come I can easily see a day where single , unmarried males are discriminated against openly because they’re not upholding the feminist imperative-or even taxed or hit with legal sanctions… Read more »

Chump No More
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@Aelorne,
The risk in not being her only alpha is if you aren’t her ‘alpha high score’, she will be marginally less resentful than if you ware a full-on beta.

Joe
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Joe
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@Captain – things can get better. I started out the asshole and maybe a bit of a natural PUA and met my wife in a similar kind of random way, screwed her silly, and found later I really liked her and we built a relationship from there. I was that ueber alpha guy to her. 20 years of marriage takes a toll though if the guy doesn’t stay on top of his game. She’s a good caretaker of me and my son most all the time, has always been like that, she’s basically a red pill girl who wants to… Read more »

ADI
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ADI
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Rollo, I have been following your blog for a while now. I agree with all of your points about RP awareness. However, help me understand this — How is the advice “Read this stuff, make yourself a better man, fuck around and “find yourself” then you can get into a LTR” for a guy different from oft-quoted sandberg’s advice to women. Essentially both of them are telling one to fuck around before settling down (as in marriage and not as in finding some one sub-par). We guys fuck around in our 20s, why is there a problem when women do… Read more »

bob
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bob
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Have you spent much time on Tumblr? The number of girls who claim to be kinky and into S&M is incredible. In truth, I doubt they are really into the kink, it is just the rationalization hamster at work. They have learned that in our culture, having a kink means you can’t help it, which means you’re not responsible for it, which means you can’t be held responsible or shamed for it. So by claiming to be kinky girls get to escape responsibility and follow their desire to be submissive to men.

Will
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Will
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@Karl Agree on not trying too hard to hide everything. I was caught, but with little evidence. I did the full denial, yet no apologies. I told my wife she is paranoid because she knows she’s behaving terribly. She couldn’t deny I was right about her behavior. No divorce. I can still handle her crap while having a good outlet for frustrations.

James M
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James M
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This post couldn’t be more timely for me. My wife and I filed for divorce today. Per her initiative. She left me about a year ago. When I was spotting the first red flags in the month prior to the separation, I found The Rational Male in Amazon after some hopeless browsing. I ordered it together with MMSL. My first instinct was to improve myself very quickly with MMSL, even abruptly, to revert my Beta personality and prevent the shipwreck. That hope helped me remain calm even after separation — I would win her back. Such motivation led me to… Read more »

Vitriol
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@Excailbur I’ve always laughed over the past couple of years when I see comments on various manosphere blogs and forums telling guys to just “keep frame,” “step up their alpha game,” or “find an 18 year old virgin to marry”. As if any of those things will work on a timeline of years and reverse the greater social trends we’re seeing regarding marriage, divorce, and open hypergamy. There’s absolutely no reason (going forward from 2015) for guys who are uncommitted to ever enter into a marriage or serious monogamous LTR. The sex is going to eventually become infrequent or non-existent,… Read more »

ManlyMan
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ManlyMan
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ADI = Female troll.

fleezer
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fleezer
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“that in a marriage with a woman that sees you as the nice guy to relax with, the likelihood of changing that is low.” *this is for entertainment purposes only. none of the following is true* this is tough stuff. red pill can be brutal but it is necessary. “relaxing” = lazy failure. a sign of age, falling T levels, weak frame. watching garbage/sports on t.v. is a low point. there are so many things to do in this world and so little time to do it. I can’t blame women for calling us out on our shit. when guys… Read more »

Seething Lurker
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I have a co-worker, a female professional in her early thirties who confides in me. Her hypergamy is open and there for all to see. She out-earns her husband, pays the bills and makes all the important decisions. She admitted to me that she married him because her clock was ticking and she wanted a baby. She admitted she “settled” for him. Of course, she dated a bad boy when younger. The marriage is predictably playing out; she is hating the beta, sex is declining and/or sex is a reward for his doing the bitch-work around the house. It is… Read more »

Seething Lurker
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@fleezer Corey Worthington, is that you? All grown up now?

Aelorne
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Aelorne
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@Rollo- I was speaking of “sexual ledger inequity”- as in, the girl has been on the carousel far longer than the guy was alpha, and her history is wilder and more extensive.

Is that an intractable source of resentment in the guy, that would preclude a relationship and necessitate a NEXT?

Jeremy
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@Karl If she does, and things end up working out, then it looks like one way for men who have been placed in a beta provider role by their wives to change the relationship is to shake things up like this. Step out on them as if you’re Bill Clinton in his prime, with no apologies. I know this is a dangerous strategy, but if you can pull it off, I think it’s a workable one. Comments? Success in this all depends on what frame has existed, I would guess. I doubt this would work for men who have been… Read more »

Seven Dials
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I wonder if the Captain isn’t being a little harsh on everyone involved? He says he’s still having sex a few times a week. That doesn’t happen to men who have been broken on the wheel of marriage. Maybe the sex isn’t as hot as it was, but heck, it’s still there. His wife is surely thoughtless as all hell to say that he’s the BB to the past AF’s, and she may be one of those women who just open their mouths and out come the words (“the woodwork squeaks / and out come the freaks”). Anyway, if all… Read more »

redlight
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@bob August 3rd, 2015 at 2:57 pm “The number of girls who claim to be kinky and into S&M is incredible. In truth, I doubt they are really into the kink, it is just the rationalization hamster at work. They have learned that in our culture, having a kink means you can’t help it, which means you’re not responsible for it, which means you can’t be held responsible or shamed for it. So by claiming to be kinky girls get to escape responsibility and follow their desire to be submissive to men.” By kinky/S&M they mean 50 shades, and since… Read more »

The Lone Planet
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The Lone Planet
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Be the alpha? Why? What’s in it for me?

Excalibur
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Excalibur
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There are no married alphas. There, I said it, and I stand by it, despite the kerfuffle of butt-hurt commenters and nay-sayers that may arise. You men need to understand this, and understand it well. They cannot exist. They exist only in mythology and this blog. They are a fiction. Tingles only go so far. Women will be only so loyal depending their options. Every woman has her limits. The husband serves his wife at her discretion, with the threat of the real alpha, the State, ever present and all-powerful. Sure, she may enjoy the romance and tingles of letting… Read more »

xabi
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xabi
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I doubt any woman would be sympathetic at a man telling her at a night club: “I’ve been hitting every hot girl at this party and I’ve been rejected every single time. Now I’m talking to you because you are substantially uglier than them, and I think I can’t aspire to anything better if I want to get laid this night.” Open Hipergamy is not just an instinct, is an insult. There are things that can’t be said if you “love” your partner. If you disrespect your partner it can only mean two things: either she doesn’t love you or… Read more »

stuttie
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stuttie
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@ Captain – “I picked her up in a bar and fucked her hard the first night, it’s just moving in 6 months later that all of a sudden you become ‘non-threatening relationship material guy’.” This IS part of their ‘plan’. Let’s face it – betas can on occasion pick up and fuck like a champion – but that doesn’t exactly set the alpha frame for any marriage. You were expected to fuck her hard and give her those initial tingles. She still wants to semi enjoy that maintenance sex she is required to give you to keep you around… Read more »

kfg
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kfg
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The purpose of basic training is to create the perfect beta. The difference between marriage/the military and a business venture is that in a business venture the parties have control over the terms of the contract and the right to enforcement. Unless outright criminal behaviour is involved only commensurate fiscal responsibility is at risk and in a corporation even that may be limited to the loss of what you put in. In marriage/the military, the government controls the terms of the contract, which it can change and enforce post hoc. Not only do the terms you sign strip you of… Read more »

Is This Thing On?
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Is This Thing On?
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@Becoming the Captain of My Boat

We should talk. I’m in a similar situation. I have no idea how to exchange private information via this public forum though.

redlight
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redlight
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One thing about 50 shades and the 125M copies sold. Wives didn’t read it, rush out to the sex store, buy a little bondage stuff, and that evening say to their betas, now do what you want to me. It was mommy porn to the exclusion of their husbands. The SNL Mother’s Day skit: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o88AqmbzIuI To married men in the Captain’s chair, as above, look at your sex life. Getting the quantity and quality you want, then you have turned things around. Getting starfish duty sex, you are a beta to her. When I’m running alpha, I get more sex… Read more »

Is This Thing On?
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@James M

You got off easy. Count your blessings and never get married again. Kids change everything. They give the wife infinitely more power from the state. You’ll be fine.

Excalibur
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Excalibur
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“And again I’ll say marriage existed before the bureaucracy did. In a contemporary context I don’t disagree, but the concept of marriage long predates the social controls marriage represents today.” My post above was directed at what marriage and what the wife and husband relationship is today, in the contemporary context as you say. Of course marriage existed in olden times, prior to the modern feminism movement and its manifestation in modern marriage and divorce laws and the anti-male family courts. In these earlier times, men had the legal authority and power in the marriage, and rightly so. The husbands… Read more »

Excalibur
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“The capacity to strip a man of his livelihood does not preclude whether he has an Alpha mindset. You could make exactly the same claims about men who willingly join the military or make a legally binding commitment to a business venture; are they all Betas for doing so?”

And no, I would not consider men in the military or in a business venture necessarily “betas.” There are differences between these arrangements and marriage as indicated above.

redlight
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@Excalibur

There are no modern day “alpha” males who are married. The only kind of “Alpha” can be considered a true Alpha is a patriarch, i.e., a self-confident, competent man who is in charge of his own life and that of his family.

You are saying there are no modern day married men who are self-confident, competent and in charge of his own life and that of his family.

Tom...
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@Excalibur Thanks for speaking some sense. The first rule of red pill ought to be: DO NOT MARRY. Why the fuck would you abdicate your masculine power to the state? The state can effectively force you to give up “frame.” The state can strip of you of nearly all wealth. The state can turn you into a cuckold.
NAMALT contradicts another well known redpill maxim: AWALT.

Tom...
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@Rollo Tomassi Joining the military is rarely beta. From the n>30 sample of military men and women I’ve known, they are far less patriotic than one would assume. Many are ruthlessly pragmatic and career focused. I’m talking about enlisted and officer alike. Free technical training, high quality work experience and/or a security clearance is a ticket to the upper middle class. As for the poor men and women who make up the majority of the enlisted ranks, most could care less about “service.” It is a paycheck and a way out. The military is fantastic investment if played correctly. Marriage… Read more »

Tom...
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@SD Obamacare is a bachelor tax. I’m not sure feminism can just continue into infinity. It relies on state support for enforcement of its policies and the Western state is bankrupt. Did anybody in 1962 predict the fall of the USSR only a generation later? Feminism is an edifice built on an unstable foundation and it is bound to fall. Makes me think of an old poem… And on the pedestal these words appear: ‘My name is Ozymandias, king of kings: Look on my works, ye Mighty, and despair!’ Nothing beside remains. Round the decay Of that colossal wreck, boundless… Read more »

Rocket
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Rocket
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Rollo, just want to thank you for your post. Like many, I’ve contemplated what can be done about the decline going on all around us. I’ve gone MGTOW except for seeing escorts. I’ve said that before. But what can be done ? And for those already in relationships, like marriage … what can be done. And you got it right … as soon as you see the writing on the wall … NUKE IT. What you said in this post is very important and hopefully can make a difference. Its a wakeup call to ALL MEN. In marriage, when you… Read more »

Jeremy
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I would say marriage, or civil unions likely predate language. Most social customs, though distorted by modern living, are older than humanity and existed in our direct predecessors. The handshake is little more than a modernized version of demonstrating you mean no harm. The hand wave is little more than an acknowledgement that you see someone. Gathering around a campfire feels good because humans have been doing it since before humans were fully human, it’s in our blood to enjoy fellowship around fire and food. Marriage is no different than these simple behaviors we take for granted. It was never… Read more »

Tom...
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It’s still a shock to hear Rollo tell a man to nuke his marriage. The red pill is harsh and brutal but sometimes it brings a smile to my face.
Sometimes it is best to not just “Think of the children!” If women truly thought of the children, I doubt they’d initiate 70 percent of all the divorces…

Just Saying
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You know, in thinking back I think the first time I saw hypergamy so blatant was in a family I was enjoying – I hooked up with the older sister, then the mother and finally the youngest sister. They were convenient, and so was I – no entanglements. Basically I was a dick to satisfy their needs, and they had what I wanted, so it was good. But the youngest knew what she wanted – targeted a pre-med and did the whole “I want to wait till we’re married schtick” with him all the way through his residency. Of course,… Read more »

stuttie
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stuttie
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@ Just Saying – A married buddy of mine was fucking a work colleague senseless 3 months before she was getting married. He even got invited to her wedding and gave her a wink as she walked down the isle. To top it off, she gave him a lift home after the reception and gave him a BJ in her car. I never underestimate the depravity a woman will stoop to in this regard. @ tom – they detonate 70% of marriages because they usually get the kids by default. The man usually gets blindsided, while she’s been calculating and… Read more »

Thelien
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Thelien
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Picking up a future wife in a bar of all places, and believing she hadn’t “dated the assholes”? Why would she be alone in a bar and go with you (self-professed asshole) otherwise? In this situation everything must be clear from the beginning. It reminds me of one man who stole a younger woman from her husband, married her, and in ten years she switched him for another man! He should have thought before marrying a 100% proved cheater that she could cheat on him as well as with him. @ADI It’s good you don’t have a Madonna-whore complex (if… Read more »

Excalibur
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Oh, and lets not forget this one: “The state can turn you into a cuckold.” Regarding, child support and paternity fraud, Youtube is plastered with videos a mile thick and any Google search is stacked to the rafters of men regaling everyone with their tales of being forced to pay child support for children that aren’t theirs. For a wife to have another mans’ child is beyond ridiculous and evil. And for the State to be complicit and condone this behavior is really insidious. A woman is not punished for bad behavior due to default divorce and the man has… Read more »

Excalibur
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“Nature has given women so much power that the law has very wisely given them little.” – Samuel Johnson.

This quote obviously does not apply today, since women are given a fuck-ton of power over men today, but it shows that men in earlier times understood female nature very well.

Excalibur
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“@Excalibur – I presume that includes Rollo too then. The question is not merely checking about no exceptions. But takings your view has implications – it discredits not on those commentators, but anyone else too. And leaves an open question how far exactly to take that thought.” Yup, even Rollo and others with their vehement protestations to the contrary. No exceptions. The State is the 900 pound gorilla in the room in a marriage. If the husband isn’t aware of it, the wife is surely cognizant of this fact, and she will assuredly educate him when and if the need… Read more »

Is This Thing On?
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Is This Thing On?
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@Excalibur There are lots of alpha males in prison. Just because they are in jail does not mean they aren’t alpha. The state has them beat for sure, but nobody ever said alphas where invincible. Guys like Rollo got married before the feminist apocalypse was as obvious as it is today. Saying a true alpha will not get married today makes some sense, but older alphas simply find themselves in jail. The fact that they are alpha keeps them from becoming the prison bitch, just like in real jail. I would also argue that it is possible to be blue… Read more »

stuttie
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stuttie
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“When the Matrix was first built, there was a man born inside who had the ability to change whatever he wanted, to remake the Matrix as he saw fit.. “

Thelien
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Thelien
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@Excalibur I googled Samuel Johnson. He became a trophy husband of a 46 year old rich widow at 26, on her promise to provide for him. Not surprising. I bet he ignored the existence of all the maids, seamstresses and launderesses and menial workers who were used like horses and didn’t have a tenth of power his wife gained by inheritance. It’s the same as when Islam apologists point at rich Muslim women in Dubai (“look how she sits at an air-conditioned home all day and wears designer clothes under her hijab – Sharia is a great deal for women!”)… Read more »

Jeremy
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Jeremy
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ace
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ace
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Becoming the Captain of My Boat August 3rd, 2015 at 12:21 pm ” I don’t even know what to say. My first instinct is to defend myself, as there are some details that are different about my marriage versus most of the guys that come in here, namely I wasn’t super blue pill when we first hooked up, I picked her up in a bar and fucked her hard the first night, it’s just moving in 6 months later that all of a sudden you become ‘non-threatening relationship material guy’.” Wifing up the chick you ran through the first day… Read more »

Is This Thing On?
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Is This Thing On?
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@Jeremy, that is some kind of funny. Totally on topic if you ask me though.

teddj4g
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teddj4g
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A man always has authority over himself, even married men. You want authority? Always be willing into walk away at a moments notice. Don’t explicate that you have a foot out the door. Simply be prepared to start over on your own. So prepared that you are comfortable with the thought of leaving it all behind today. That is half the battle. If she knows you wont tolerate shit, and you would rather burn it all down than give her half plus child support, her desire to eject will diminish substantially. Of course if she is a raging bitch from… Read more »

NARWHALT
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NARWHALT
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Best post to date in scope and value.

Jeremy
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Jeremy
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Rollo, Have you already written, or has anyone discussed the finality with which women judge men alpha or beta? The question in my mind is why is changing a woman’s mind about a man such an intractable problem? It’s almost a cliche for a round woman to lose the weight and regain her figure, or a young ugly duckling of a woman to grow into herself and for men to suddenly start chasing her, and men who rejected her in her past to find her worthy. However, women are not like this, or at least I believe that is the… Read more »

ace
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ace
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Thelien

August 4th, 2015 at 3:01 am
“Past should be buried and only brought out when you’re old and writing memoirs.”

Sluts typically speak in this fashion.

A female’s past is actually extremely important. Female n-count is directly related to marriage stability.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_R-WhB9g9eYk/TJDSr8V_ShI/AAAAAAAAAOg/VmMGTymAVcI/s1600/teachman

Seraph
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Seraph
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So, this post kind of hits it on the head for me, instead of nibbling around edges as I sometimes do when talking about it. I don’t have dead bedroom, but it is on life support. Sex about once a month, twice if I push. Could be more, certainly, but at this point I am not that interested. It is not that my wife is unattractive; she has managed to keep herself in decent shape at her age, particularly compared to the fat women I see all around me. She just doesn’t do sexy. I just don’t see a lot… Read more »

kfg
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kfg
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“In real life, no man ever, including the husband, was interested in my sexual past, and I was not interested in theirs. No one asked. Who cares? ”

Q.E. Fucking D.

Rocket
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Rocket
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Couple of comments. First Rollo’s article is easily the most powerful that he has ever written. And dead nuts on as usual. The problem of course is that that the vast majority of men will not take his input. First, most BPers will deny what is happening right before there eyes … and TO THEM. In addition, many of those who do see the truth will not do anything because of 1) Potential Negative impacts to children and 2) The do not have the courage 3) Agree that maybe its true and the should nuke the marriage but … that… Read more »

Seething Lurker
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@ace

It is also written ” you can’t turn a hoe into a housewife.”

Tom...
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Tom...
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On sexual pasts.
In my old blue pill days, I would have gladly accepted a “sexually experienced” woman as a wife. These days, I see that the only reason to do this is to be a willing servant to Sandbergian hypergamy.
Divorce rates in traditional marriages where the woman is a virgin are as low as 6 percent. Maybe traditionalist redpillers should convert.

Jeremy
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ADI said: How is the advice “Read this stuff, make yourself a better man, fuck around and “find yourself” then you can get into a LTR” for a guy different from oft-quoted sandberg’s advice to women. Essentially both of them are telling one to fuck around before settling down (as in marriage and not as in finding some one sub-par). Thelian said: In real life, no man ever, including the husband, was interested in my sexual past, and I was not interested in theirs. No one asked. Who cares? Past should be buried and only brought out when you’re old… Read more »

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