Transactional vs. Validational Sex

You cannot negotiate genuine desire.

This is one of my best known quotes because it resonates with so many men. There was a time in the early 2000s when I was doing peer counseling for men – most of whom were at least a decade my senior – as part of my undergraduate study and one consistent theme I got from almost all of them was how their marriages (or LTRs) had been so much more sexually satisfying when they were dating their wives or before they’d committed to some kind of exclusivity. That’s always the crux of it for guys. They mistakenly believed that the hot monkey sex they were having with their women prior to “doing the right thing” and getting married or committed was something that would be characteristic of their quality woman into a long term relationship with them.

Why was this the case for guys? I can remember coming up with this quote as part of the advice I was giving while working for one of these men. He, like many of the other guys, had gotten to the point that he would do almost anything to get back to that real desire that convinced him to commit to his wife in the first place. And, like many of these guys, he’d convinced his wife to go to marriage counseling in order to find out what exactly it was that he needed to do to “get her to come around” to wanting to bang him. Nothing was working for him. Even after his sessions he was still either sexless or his wife only begrudgingly would have lackluster ‘starfish’ sex with him. We called that a ‘grudge fuck’ back then.

As a student of behavioral psychology my interest was (still is) in what motivates or incentivizes behavior in people (sometimes animals). What was it that inspires genuine desire as opposed to behavior that still has a purpose, but was more motivated by future outcome. You can make a case that genuine desire is also motivated by a perceived outcome, but in this instance I’m making a distinction between a natural, unsolicited desire as opposed to an incentive based on a preconceived outcome – if all goes according to plan.

This guy broke down in tears with me on at least two occasions. He just couldn’t understand why what was supposed to work (open communication, rational discourse and honest negotiation) wasn’t getting her to “come around” to having sex with him. It was then I thought, you cannot negotiate genuine desire. Either a woman wants  to fuck you or she doesn’t. There are definitely ways to prompt that genuine desire – most of which are behavioral and conditional – but as has been stated many times in the ‘sphere, attraction is not a choice. The key word there is choice. Few men would ‘choose’ to be attracted by an obese woman and in many ways this choice dynamic is why women promoting the ‘body acceptance’ narrative have a tough time of it. For all the nonsense about beauty being a social construct, arousal for men is very much rooted in evolved biology. Men can’t choose to get an erection for a woman they’re simply not aroused by.

The same holds true for women, but the conditions are different. Women can and do have sex for reasons other than genuine desire. Negotiated desire really isn’t desire at all, but women have readily used sexual access to achieve those perceived outcomes I mentioned above here. Negotiated desire only ever leads to obligated compliance. A talented hooker or stripper may be very convincing in her act that she’s really into having sex with a man, but the negotiation that takes place before the act can never make a woman want to have sex with her client. Attraction is not a choice, but really, arousal is not a choice either.

Hormonal

I am presently about half way through my read of Dr. Martie Haselton’s new book Hormonal. I was really anticipating this book’s release, and I had intended to do my first-ever book review of it here, but as I read through I’ve decided not to. I still highly recommend reading it. As you might guess it’s chock full of stats and research confirmation of so much of what I write here that I want to put it at the top of the required Rational Male reading list. I’ve been referencing Dr. Haselton’s (and her colleagues) work since I began this blog, but the delivery of the information was disappointing, and in a lot of instances, very immature and sophomoric. It’s written almost as an apologetic to feminists for having to kill a lot of sacred feminist social convention cows. I feel as if she’s writing ‘down’ to the women who she’ll inevitably market this book to, but, if you can get past her constant attempts to legitimize her feminist credentials, the information is absolute gold.

One aspect of female sexual dynamics that Haselton and her team detail quite a bit is the idea of an Estrus state in human females. I’m not sure how well appreciated this research is in the manosphere, which is one reason I included it in Positive Masculinity, but this concept is really integral to how we define Hypergamy. As most of my readers know, Hypergamy – women’s dualistic sexual strategy (and really life strategy) – is much more than a tendency of a woman to ‘marry up’. In Hormonal the ideas of Alpha Fucks and Beta Bucks really solidify with the research.

However, as useful as it is as a catchy euphemism Alpha Fucks and Beta Bucks could better be described as Alpha Seed and Beta Need. In a woman’s peak ovulatory phase of her menstrual cycle she enters an estrus state and becomes subject to behaviors that can only be defined as a pretext of seeking Alpha seed. In other words, nature and Hypergamy are very practical in maximizing the chances that a woman may get pregnant with the best available genetic specimen. Granted, the true outcome of all of that is subject to environment and a woman’s personal conditions, but the practicality of it remains the same as it has for 100,000 years. It’s also important to keep in mind that a woman’s behaviors, strategies, rationales and her own interpretation of all of them in those various times and conditions are also a part of the overall latent purpose of a woman consolidating on the best Alpha Seed and Beta to supply her needs.

While women are subject to an estrus state they still require the second half of Hypergamy – the Beta need for security, provisioning, protection, comfort and at least the sharing of parental investment responsibilities for any offspring. Estrus in women is concealed, meaning it is (or used to be) nearly, but not totally undetectable in women. There are in fact various ways men evolved to intuitively determine whether a woman is in an estrus state of fertility; most of these today are socially shamed in men so as to further confuse them and advantage women, but that’s a topic for another essay. A concealed estrus aids women in optimizing both Alpha Seed and Beta Need and it’s likely that much of what accounts for women’s sexual strategy is the result of this concealment.

Now, a lot has been written by myself and others about the impact of meeting a woman’s Beta Need aspect of Hypergamy being served by the state and/or direct or indirect transfers of resources from men to women. Most of my readers are well aware of how this side of Hypergamy has been progressively accommodated for over the past fifty years. In spite of this it’s important to remember that this accommodation of provisioning needs doesn’t eliminate the deeper needs that this side of Hypergamy engenders in women. It may be true that women have never been better provided for in history as far as money and opportunities go, but women still look for emotional security, protection, dominance and comfort in men as part of their innate mental firmware.

As a result of Hypergamy and this concealed estrus state women have been put into a condition of evaluating sex in different aspects today.

Validational Sex

When women look for that Alpha Seed in their peak ovulatory (proliferative) phase, the sex they seek is a desired sex with a man who meets evolutionary criteria. He’s the ‘hawt’ guy, or the man who leaves a woman with an perception of danger or excitement. A lot of men who don’t meet this criteria have a tendency to over-exaggerate this type of man as the ‘Alpha Chad’ and make a ridiculous parody of him as an ego protection mechanism for themselves. Let me state for the record here that every aspect and adjective that this type of guy embodies is mitigated by conditions and contexts. It is just as likely that this conventionally masculine dominant guy is only so according to his most immediate social situation. So spare me the “Chad Thundercock” anxieties.

The sex that women give “enthusiastic consent” for is validational for them. The easy assessment here is that women have a genuine desire to mate with conventionally masculine men who look and act the part – yes, behavioral congruency is vital. If you follow the research women consciously and unconsciously will actively put themselves into environments where the likelihood of their meeting a dominant masculine man who most closely matched that masculine ideal when they are in estrus. They openly and discreetly look of arousal cue from men who best embody what can only be described as Alpha Seed.

I should also add that women in “satisfying relationships” (meaning LTRs where a woman is still very hot for her husband/boyfriend) report an increase in sexual desire (proceptivity) for that guy during this phase. A lot of guys mistakenly think ANY woman will want to seek out extra-pair mating (cheating) opportunities when they’re in estrus. This is only true if a woman isn’t into her current man.

I don’t want to get too lost in the descriptions here. Rather, I want to focus on the associative feelings women get in and after having sex with that Alpha man during estrus. I would argue that Alpha Widows are made in the estrus phase. This is the sex women want to have and are enthusiastic in both the hunt and the act itself. This is largely (presumedly) the sex that men have with their wives-to-be before they marry. It’s this validational sex, the sex that women fantasize about, that men and women want to get back to once they are committed to each other monogamously but now have a dead bedroom. This sex validates a woman’s ego in that it proves to herself that a man of this SMV caliber would want to pin her to the bed and have marathon sex with her. Remember, the latent purpose of this sex, on this side of Hypergamy, is to access the sperm from men with high reproductive value as defined by what our evolved nature predisposes women to be aroused by. Validational sex is sex by choice and genuine desire, and is satisfying on both a psychological level and an evolutionary level.

Transactional Sex

One of the benefits of a concealed estrus is that it allows women a few luxuries. One of these was the ability to confuse men of their paternity. Today this confusion is little more difficult because we’ve got DNA figured out well enough to make accurate assessments, but in our evolutionary past it was important to trick cuckolded fathers into second guessing whether a child was his or not before he killed it and impregnated a woman on his own (this is also why men evolved mate guarding behaviors).

The other advantage of concealed estrus was essentially prostitution. Now, to pretty this up a bit, lets say that women who were sexual with men outside of their fertility window found that sex could be leveraged with non-Alpha men (men they didn’t want to have children with) to encourage them to help with a lot of the chores more Alpha men were less willing (but not entirely unwilling) to do. Enter transactional sex.

As mentioned, the most overt form of transactional sex is prostitution, but it’s impolite to call every woman a whore. In fact it’s impolite to even imply a woman may be having sex for other reasons than validational sex. Today women are contemplating whether or not transactional sex is itself rape since it technically meets the definition of rape (sex women don’t want to have). I discussed this “grey area sex” recently in another essay, but it’s interesting to see women wrestle with transactional sex in an era where the Future is Female and women ought to only have the (validational) sex they want to enthusiastically have.

For most men (i.e the 80% Beta men) transactional sex is where the rubber meets the road. In fact, I’d argue that for most Beta men transactional sex is the only definition of sex they ever really know. That’s kind of sad to think about, but most men never really experience the unfettered feral lust of a woman they’ve chosen to spend the rest of their lives with. I got into this in Saving the Best and Hats Off to the Bull, but I think it’s important for the average man today to acknowledge that it’s highly likely that their wives have shared parts of themselves with, and have lost all inhibitions with, men in their sexual pasts they may never know anything about. That’s a cold bucket of reality a lot of men who unplug from all this have to confront.

Marriage today is almost entirely predicated on on the transactional sex side of Hypergamy. I’m not saying it has to be, nor am I saying it always is, but I’m fairly comfortable in speculating that for most married women sex is reward she uses in the operant conditioning of her husband. And the very fact that this is effective with most husbands throws the power dynamic and Frame of the relationship firmly over to the wife. This has the effect of disqualifying that man from ever (or very rarely) being a candidate for validational sex within that marriage. And this too is another aspect of the transactional sex dynamic that modern feminists are contemplating today – if a woman doesn’t want to have sex with her husband, but does anyway, is it rape? But again, NAMALT, not all marriages are like this or have to be like this. I would also argue that a confident man whom a woman admires, who she recognizes as being above her SMV even if slightly and who has internalized Red Pill awareness within that marriage needn’t be doomed to transactional “duty” sex in his marriage.

Unnegotiated Desire

And so now we come full circle to the men I was counseling back in the day. Because all they’d ever known was transactional sex their deductive male brains attempted to solve their “sex problem” in the most logistical and pragmatic way – negotiate with her. If all sex ever is for a guy is a transaction – a quid pro quo – then it follows he’ll try to find the best way to ‘pay’ for his wife’s sexual access. Hunter Drew and I were recently discussing a man who Dean Abbot has been counseling and one thing we’ve all seen a lot of from young and old Blue Pill Beta men is this logical tendency for them to want to ‘sacrifice their way to happiness with their wives’. It’s as if the more they sacrifice the more they pay for that intimacy they seek, but what they never get is that this only buries their sex lives that much more.

One amazing turn around a lot of married and single Red Pill guys experience when they unplug is the attention they receive from women when they switch from a transactional disposition to a validational disposition with regard to sex. When a man unplugs and cuts himself away from his Blue Pill conditioning one change he makes is a shift from viewing sex as transactional to validational. In the beginning, when men are first learning Game and becoming more Red Pill aware about the nature of women they really don’t recognize this shift in attitude towards sex. When I say men need to make themselves the “prize” with regards to sex and their attention what happens is they go from the “how can I pay for sex to qualify for it with a woman” to “women will recognize that I represent and opportunity for validational sex”.

The Blue Pill conditions men to base their understanding of sex on a transactional paradigm. It’s all scarcity, and luck or providence that a woman might want to fuck them. This is why women get aggravated by the presumption that men might feel they are ‘owed sex‘ in exchange for what they do for them. And why wouldn’t men feel that way? They’ve been conditioned for half a life to believe that they should follow the old social contract and become a man with a lot to offer a woman, a wife. This is the transactional paradigm; I build my life to better accommodate a woman and she reciprocates with sex. Women know this too, so all pretenses of indignation about are complete bullshit. What upsets women is that a Beta man would feel entitled to her sexuality for having accommodated her. Alpha men are entitled to it, accommodations be damned, because he’s the man they want to have sex with.

Published by Rollo Tomassi

Author of The Rational Male and The Rational Male, Preventive Medicine

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EhIntellect
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@Yollo Word. Re: controlling women Though Validation and Transactional sex are clear concepts, and Rollo made them so, making hay from that is much harder because women and sex and the environment we live in aren’t algorithms as much as we’d like to think. RP manages complex intersexual dynamics (notice TRM isn’t subtitled intersexual statics) and is best understood and practiced wholly vs. algorithmically. We’re not controlling women per se, just managing them better. “One complex system that most people have dealt with is a child. If so, you’ve probably experienced that when you give the child an instruction, you… Read more »

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@EhIntellect “So, if you have a teenager or if you invest in the stock market, you know that a complex system cannot be controlled. It can only be managed. “ Have you read any of the Nassim Nicholas Taleb books? I suspect so, but if not, you might enjoy them. To your point, he addresses how to deal with the randomness in daily life that we don’t understand. It’s particularly relevant for risk management with stock market investing (or trading). I’ve come to think about women the same way. They are too complex to predict, but Red Pill awareness acts… Read more »

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@ status

No I haven’t, I’m not well read, trying to be better read so thank you and enjoy your weekend too.

Sentient
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Rollo

Magnificent Bond illustration. Should be in all 13 yo boy’s rooms.

Just Getting It
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20 year marriage – told wifey that rare ‘duty sex’ wouldn’t cut it. Asked her can you do better, or do I need a girlfriend? She told me I couldn’t get a girlfriend – in other words ‘I don’t need to treat you any better bc you can’t do better’ Well, it’s costing me a house, but it’s a bargain. Girlfriend is pissed that I’ll never marry again, tough shit, marriage cuts your options – if she plays up you can’t just walk. If I was a conspiracy theory guy I’d think it was to put me under her thumb.… Read more »

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Whisky with a twist? Rollo I know you’re in the spirits’ business so I think you’ve seen this.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qmoBb7wNq6Y

This deserves a post on its own. Johnny Walker scotch panders to feminists and alienates its core consumers by introducing Jane Walker Scotch and of course no one is happy. Women’s groups feel it panders while men who drink it think wtf?

Women I know who drink whisky do so because it’s a mans drink. Making it a feminist drink suddenly means equality making it no longer appealing.

What’s next? Rebranding “cocktails” to “cuntails”?

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walawala
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@Sentient it’s the James Bond You Only Live Twice poster…

@Rugby. Nooooo. We talked about this. One post per page, no more videos or links please…seriously be considerate with the feed. We can’t read comments with you jamming 10 videos per comment.

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To the brother running day game on bitches at the chocolate ice cream store whatever: be careful with direct blunt dread. I think Rollo adressed this too. You think she is turned on while more likely she get offended and takes revenge; covertly pick fuka boy on facebk and is now pulling the “shameless-girl-who-was-flirting-with- you while she is still leaking cum from the facebk guy. Please apply dread with tact. Girls want to operate from guesswork.

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Just Getting It
March 9, 2018 at 7:06 pm

You have to keep pulling. To remind them. Generally a woman you are dating will notice another woman’s IOIs faster than you will. If she pretends not to notice – remind her.

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cheupez
March 10, 2018 at 12:04 am

And if it takes sledgehammer dread to excite her? You have to calibrate it to the woman. And they are all different.

If you come across an “I like to watch” type it will require as much dread as you can muster.

kobayashii1681
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Straight.Facts.

kobayashii1681
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@Rollo: On the Vox article….
Couldn’t even finish it – Jeezusss!!!😅

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Rollo

Lol. That’s the first time I’ve been able to actually listen to Jesse Peterson in years. Good interview material and it will hit the correct target audience for sure.

kobayashii1681
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@Silver Fox: Exactly. The woman should always want & need you more by order of magnitude.

I’ve been seeing this bullshit quotes on social media recently – “My mom always told me to find a man whobloves you more than you love him.”😂😂😂😂

I mean, the F.I. echo chamber that is social media is just setting up more of this “rape-in-marriage” nonsense!

If a woman knows you need her, want her & love her more than she does you, it’s all down hill from there I’m afraid, whether she leaves or cucks you, or not.

kobayashii1681
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@Superion: 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
That Jennifer Lawrence article is hilarious!!!!

“Meanwhile, the ‘American Hustle’ actress recently admitted she has a drunken dare-devil alter ego named Gail”

😎 SHOCK!!!

kobayashii1681
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@Walawala: Johnny Walker did what?!!😂😂😂😂😂😂 Faaakin’ ‘ell mate!

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@ j March 8, 2018 at 6:41 pm

Re: essay

https://theamericanscholar.org/solitude-and-leadership/#.WqPWL0yIahB

Forwarded to a senior officer overseas still in the trenches; he sends thanks & is passing it on to the officers in his command.

Thanks.

kfg
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“Johnny Walker did what?!!”

Shut down all operations in Kilmarnock, just to make sure people understand that the brand has nothing to do with tradition anymore.

kobayashii1681
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@kfg: Indeed!😂
Pandering to the F.I. as part of some shady money/relevance play. Uninspired!

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To bookend the Johnny Walker story, Jon Favreau has been announced to be producing and directing a new Star Wars series.

Feminists loose their minds that the announcement was made on International Women’s Day.

kobayashii1681
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@kfg: On the Favreau announcement – Well played! 😂😂

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“https://theamericanscholar.org/solitude-and-leadership/#.WqPWL0yIahB Forwarded to a senior officer overseas still in the trenches; he sends thanks & is passing it on to the officers in his command. If he is really a senior officer, I doubt he will be passing it on. The article is dated, and Petraeus is no longer an example to emulate. I’m sure many armchair generals (who obtain their information from the media and nowhere else) believe they know the reason why, but the main reason is…although he was indeed a rare independent thinker (can’t say he’s a rare intellectual, most people would be surprised at the level… Read more »

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It’s almost always transactional for her though – at least initially. She gets the validation at the point she’s certain you intend to fuck her. Her actually going through with sex has a lot more to do with comfort (aka sensing you won’t be crazy/possessive after) and derived benefit (transactional, aka maybe i can get this guy to be a part of my life). There are certainly exceptions – sluts seeking tinder bangs (waning trend), girls fucking dudes way above their SMV, and fly by night/travel hookups – but even that you could frame as transactional. The best way to… Read more »

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Oh one other thing – While animalistic “validational” sex is somewhat more enjoyable than “transactional” sex with all things being equal, I prefer “transactional” sex with a new woman to “validational” sex with a woman I’ve already been banging for a while. By a mile. I just read a whole lotta comments along the lines of “I only have validational sex and wouldn’t settle for less” – and good for you, but then ask yourself who’s frame you’re in if you need to view it as having been validational. There is a game term for that – outcome dependence. I… Read more »

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For all the wonderful lurkers reading along ( we lurv y’all😀😀), ” validational sex ” isn’t about you as a man being validated as such. It’s not in the woman’s frame either because a strong masculine frame is initiative of validation sexual activity. Let’s not get it all twisted out of shape, it’s very simple. Desire can’t be negotiated, true? It is either there ( because you turn that spark into a virtually uncontrollable flame ) or it isn’t, and sometimes a woman will go forward banging you halfheartedly with other expectations of you. Butnshe ain’t into you. Transactional sex… Read more »

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http://m.worldstarhiphop.com/android/video.php?v=wshhs14Jbo04I3JtwcG2

In the interview she pretty much declares she’s a 44yr old unwed woman, because she decided it was better (cock carousel days) to go for the supposed bad boys as opposed to the good. Go fempowerment, go. Ladies are as delusion as there current state of affairs. No pity on my end.

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Joe K
March 10, 2018 at 8:28 am

you need to view it as having been validational.

It is not a matter of view. It is a matter of experience.

Would you rather have sex with a girl who is thinking, “do I have to?” Or one who is thinking “”I can’t wait. This is so HOT.”

cheupez
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I would say validational sex has itz place and transactional sex has its place too. If a woman wants to screw you just for the screw but you dont want any strings attached, adapt a negotiation stance and that should kill it pretty fast. Have you ever scrwed a woman and have her ass quivering like a vibrator then she starts with the endless line of lover texts the next day that you are not so eager to respond to? Sometimes the reason you pay the woman is so she can leave you alone. By the way, the moment a… Read more »

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“I need to be able to say painful stuff that’s going to piss you off, — that’s going to kick you in the ass.”

Thanks for not selling out to profit, Rollo.

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Awesome. Brilliant Rollo/Carlos/Scott//Donovan/Anthony broadcast.
Each bears a unique perspective and strength. When get these together it’s the blast-furnace at the core of steel. It is the way forward.

M Simon
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cheupez
March 10, 2018 at 11:57 am

You should read Feynman (“You just ask them”) on the inadvisability of giving a woman anything.

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cheupez
March 10, 2018 at 11:57 am

Transactional sex. – she is buying you.
Validational sex – you own her (at least until her period passes)

M Simon
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at least until her estrus passes

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Alednam Uon
March 10, 2018 at 9:38 am

And you got 3 kids by killa black lil quasion and shooter rest in peace? Nah hoe I got me a white girl with a good credit score

http://www.worldstarhiphop.com/videos/video.php?v=wshhs14Jbo04I3JtwcG2#comment-3796782900

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Women always let me fuck them bareback. Even the few pros I’ve done. I often don’t realize just how different things are for alpha dogs, he he. But then again, I fuck them stupid…Again, something many guys here probably rarely if ever see. That dazed, cock-crazed state women can get in, their eyes roll back in their heads, and they are just kind of feral. Every woman wants to go there, they all have that gear. Many are dying to do so. HB9 is gone. I milked that plate, holy cow, 2 years and a bit. She set a high… Read more »

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Had the displeasure of watching this episode of Better Things… Wirh the repulsive Pam Adlon and co created with the vile Louis CK. http://www.vulture.com/2016/11/better-things-recap-season-1-episode-10.html I stuck in as an anthropologist. Rollo should do a breakdown of this episode. It shows the heros women are daily, as the confront all manner of difficulties. Especially the single mom. Such as feeding their kids, taking them to school, going on vacation… It’s got it all. Trangenderism, staying on the phone so your BF can masturbate from a safe distance… It does an unintentionally good job of showing how a generation of needy, selfish,… Read more »

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@ scribblerg “Women always let me fuck them bareback…” Same, same. It’s always amazed how in this day and age of “safe seX” blah blah blah, hot bitches on the whole (there have been, as there will always be, exceptions) over the past 20+ years have never asked me to roll one on. Nothing is a greater passion killer than a chick who insists on a condom. It is also a great indicator of how much they really want to fuck you, for sure. Especially when they let you cum inside them… Girls can be very dirty bitchez when they… Read more »

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@ scribblerg pt 2 “Women always let me fuck them bareback. Even the few pros I’ve done. I often don’t realize just how different things are for alpha dogs, he he. But then again, I fuck them stupid…Again, something many guys here probably rarely if ever see. That dazed, cock-crazed state women can get in, their eyes roll back in their heads, and they are just kind of feral. Every woman wants to go there, they all have that gear. Many are dying to do so…” You’ve hit the nail on the head, my man! The Serpent’s eyes would just… Read more »

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@Wala

LOL Her ” I’ll be your server this evening. Would you care for a cunttail tostart things off?

boulderhead
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@cheupez

You have arrived, now as you turn transactional sex int validational sex, then back again. With a new twist on 50 ways to leave your lover, at least two ways to get her to leave you alone after.
Hat tip.

M Simon
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“He actually hit me, threw me to the ground, put his foot on my chest. He was really angry. He grabbed my face,” said Coates, who described at least six incidents of physical abuse. “I thought it was normal. I cannot explain the logic. It seemed like he cared about me when he did that.

https://www.politico.com/story/2018/03/07/ben-wolf-illinois-congress-candidate-444371

walawala
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@Boulderhead

Jill Daniels…

rugby11
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https://www.e-reading.club/chapter.php/71262/34/Feynman_-_Surely_Youre_Joking%2C_Mr._Feynman__Adventures_of_a_Curious_Character.html “OK,” he says. “The whole principle is this: The guy wants to be a gentleman. He doesn’t want to be thought of as impolite, crude, or especially a cheapskate. As long as the girl knows the guy’s motives so well, it’s easy to steer him in the direction she wants him to go. “Therefore,” he continued, “under no circumstances be a gentleman! You must disrespect the girls. Furthermore, the very first rule is, don’t buy a girl anything–not even a package of cigarettes—until you’ve asked her if she’ll sleep with you, and you’re convinced that she will, and that… Read more »

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“Why Women Need Twice As Much Sex As Men”

So – d’ja reckon Dr. Stephanie was in the estrus phase when she wrote the article? 😁

Also kinda wonder – has she managed to advance beyond the “I Feel, therefore I Am” philosophy of the feminine, if not it will give a man a headache.

(In jest of course – first pass interesting.)

boulderhead
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@Wala

Anita Dickle…

How about a shot of Old Grandma?

Shaved Mills anyone?

Mega
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Got a question for Rollo … don’t need an answer but hopefully maybe a little food for thought for a future post. I’ve been fascinated on your views on biology for awhile, think they are mostly right but somewhat incomplete. For example, what is the major difference between humans and all other kinds of animals ? Not an opposable thumb, walking upright, or speech. Its this … male parental investment. Given 9 months of gestation and another 2 years where the baby is basically helpless its 3 entire years where the woman is basically helpless … and needs a man… Read more »

M Simon
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Mega
March 10, 2018 at 8:36 pm

My Dad was an Alpha. He stuck around. And the marriage lasted until he died. Mom never remarried.

Their secret? She surrendered to him. Totally. So he could be as Beta as she wanted without her losing respect for him.

Female surrender is the key. And it is a lost art.

M Simon
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Mega
March 10, 2018 at 8:36 pm

My experience is that if you keep her pussy wet all the time – she doen’t dry up.

Of course I have no means of telling if this is normally possible or just a special case.

But it is probably worth a try. And of course it is the Alpha thing to do.

boulderhead
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“My experience is that if you keep her pussy wet all the time – she doen’t dry up.”

I’ll second that. She never matures in a rational way.

boulderhead
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Wala

Canadian Hooker…

M Simon
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Re:

M Simon
March 10, 2018 at 7:39 pm

Feynman got taught the rudiments of Game in the 1940s. The book was published in 1985.

cheupez
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M Simon I have just read the Feynman thing, I think he is referring to the situation where you buy a girl drinks who doesnt think you have a dick (funny how he is the Dick in the story). A girl who looks at you and gives her hair a flick, licking her lips n placing her hands on your thigh as you chat: that girl knows what she is going to do to you as soon as you point to your hotel room door. What I was saying was: There are girls you have no wish to keep who… Read more »

M Simon
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boulderhead
March 10, 2018 at 9:05 pm

The female body is a wondrous thing. It responds to stimulus. (well I am extrapolating from a sample of 2 – heh)

M Simon
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cheupez
March 10, 2018 at 9:19 pm

Did you give her anything before you sealed the deal? Did you respect her?

rugby11
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Rollo
Each time i read the article I’m amazed at how much i see this play out. My self improvement is not isolating.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KhW6EEkYLng
” If you follow the research women consciously and unconsciously will actively put themselves into environments where the likelihood of their meeting a dominant masculine man who most closely matched that masculine ideal when they are in estrus.”
https://www.havocscope.com/prostitution-statistics/
“Alpha men are entitled to it, accommodations be damned, because he’s the man they want to have sex with.”

Culum Struan
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Hahah, that Feynman book – I loved the whole thing as a teenager, but that chapter about “You just ask them?” I read so many times it’s not funny. First inkling that there was a system to anything like this. It doesn’t work as practical advice though. I mean, I have no doubt Feynman did it with success and the chapter was an accurate description of his experiences – but without the underlying framework of why you’re doing it and why it works, it is pretty useless. As pointed out above, it’s basically a version of injecting a “man/woman vibe”… Read more »

scribblerg
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@Sentient – Killing it as usual. “It does an unintentionally good job of showing how a generation of needy, selfish, spoiled, lazy cunts are desrroying millenia of civilization. One bottle of white wine at a time.” Yup. Might as well glaze as many of them up like donuts as I can while I watch this shithole of a society implode. What else am I left with? @SilverFoxwho’s a Solo Act – I am finding that my T level waxes and wanes though at 55. Being good sexually at this age takes some fitness, technique and strategy. But one of the… Read more »

kfg
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@Mega: “Alpha’s are the cads and scads, and the aholes and psychopaths who attempt to take over the tribe …” You were doing great until then. And the model is not AF, it is AF/BB. Calum” ” . . . . you can’t use that chapter as a Game manual . . . .” No, but if your’re someone like Feynman you can use it as a starting fact to derive one over the years. See his bit about ant behaviour. The second fact he got in that story was experimental – he negged a girl’s “virtue” so hard she… Read more »

scribblerg
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Re: Mega – LOL – seriously. Betas are not succeeding at passing their genetic material along at higher rates than alphas, lmfao. Truly, what a delusional thing to believe. 50% of men don’t get to pass on their genetics at all, while 80% of women do. Betas often end up raising alpha men’s children, in fact. Difference between alpha and beta? I’d never dream of being with a woman in a serious way with another man’s kids around. I’d never, ever raise or provision for a child who isn’t my own. The very idea is insulting to me. I’ve fucked… Read more »

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I wonder how many of you MGTOW,angry-beta types out there have really thought about my last statement? In fact, a Western/Christian patriarchal society did indeed conspire institutionally to shame and restrain female sexual agency. Now that society also institutionalized a form of courtly love that turned men into pussybeggars formally, overtly – even though it was never really true. Cuz while the beta in court wrote poetry, the courtier was still sneaking back to her village to get plowed by the local thug…So romantic love has always been a double-bind game for beta men, both delusional and failing to moisturize… Read more »

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@M Simon
I am not talking about one specific girl. But usually there is no deal so to speak. I dont know how to put it but mostly there is just a vague understanding that someone is getting fucked tonight.

Respect? I don’t know what you mean by respect. I respect my mom, my grand ma, my sisters, and few other women here and there. The fuckees, I just either like or dont. Respect is a bit too formal for my purposes in this respect (for lack of a better way to put it).

Sentient
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Scribbs in a purple patch. Nice posts. This here “You’d think young guys would be better lovers what with porn?” Just touched on this in the FR section. Porn is false. The porn gymnastics are false. The porn kata of you blow me, i eat you, fuck you doggy, you on top, come on face… False. The porn catechism of “oh yeah give me that nice cock” “yes yes yes” etc. False. It’s not real sex without real emotional connection. Her brain is the biggest sex organ. Fuck her mind. Understand Sex God Metgod and the DEVI structure. Understand what… Read more »

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“But it’s not just those girls by any means. White girls are full on ho’s as much or more than any girls – just have to let them signal it to you. Hot girls are often insanely sexual these days. Not all of them, of course, some have had their pussies sewn tight by fathers like @SJF, but for many young hotties, today is a bonanza for them. “ Lol. Sorry Scribs. My daughter is already taken by a fine young man she chose who is pretty damn fortunate in finding her and he doesn’t show Blue Pill tendencies. Just… Read more »

JT McMahon
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Mmmmm eyedunno.
Seems alpha’s no demographic. It’s under no flag.

Fascinating dissection of the whole courtly-love-chivalry myth:
https://therationalmale.com/2013/01/02/the-feminine-imperative-circa-1300/

FoxGuy
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scribblerg, “You see this phenomenon in a certain type Dominican girl, and in general black and hispanic girls that favor white men very clearly. They pick a provider type, but back in da hood, well, an ex of some sort or an old friend or whatever is often still banging her like the slut she is. There is also a certain type of white girl who just loves black dick, but has a white beta boyfriend. Who she talks into cucking with the black guys. Think I’m a racist? Imagine how many more white guys are cucking for black dudes… Read more »

Blaximus
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… damn, I better watch my back then.

Blaximus
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Question though, since you brought it up – how come American’s in America don’t ” understand ” other cultures? And what is supposedly different about the moralities? Background noise: I was raised around various different cultures right here in America and I don’t grasp this kind of thought process. People are different. Regions are different. Classes are different. Question for some of the other commenters here – Do y’all buy into this stuff? Has this been your experience in life? How many of y’all were raised in a place where EVERYONE was exactly like you? And do you think that… Read more »

mersonia
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@Blaximus

“Do y’all buy into this stuff?”

You should probably what ” this stuff” is…….in bullet points. or just expect random areas of contention.

mersonia
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@Blaximus

“Do y’all buy into this stuff?”

You should probably define*** what ” this stuff” is…….in bullet points. or just expect random areas of contention.

Sentient
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Interesting

“Some 8,350 kids under 18 (about 7,050 girls, 1,300 boys) have married in Missouri since 1999, ranking it among the top 10 states in the nation for child marriages, with Texas and Florida leading the pack at more than 40,000 and 16,000 respectively.”

So not all are waiting to 30s…

http://www.kansascity.com/news/state/missouri/article204287484.html

Blaximus
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mersonia

I figured that…

Simply put guys they don’t respect you, that’s the reason they are with you to begin with, because it’s easy. Rest assured they are getting plowed by other guys of their own culture. Never get into any serious relationship with anyone outside your own culture, you don’t understand theirs and most likely they don’t understand yours, two different worlds with very different moralities

… is pretty stand-out-ish. Or maybe giant blanket condemnations based on race/culture are very hard to discern? Idk.

Lmao.

Blaximus
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Mersonia In any case, I just asked. I’m not looking for a huge fall out or anything, just wondering why some guys have had the experiences they have had in life that make them come to the conclusions that they’ve reached. As far as women are concerned, They Are All Just Girls. You know, AWALT. If you’re dating an Asian chick and she goes out and gets boned by an Asian guy behind your back, the only thing you need to do is 1) look in the mirror and 2) get you Game/Mind/Sex action correct. Because Miss Scandinavia will do… Read more »

mersonia
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@blaximus

After realizing that 92% of people here are autistic……….. I figure it makes easier for them to stay on topic and have coherent discussions.

mersonia
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“If you’re dating an Asian chick and she goes out and gets boned by an Asian guy behind your back, the only thing you need to do is 1) look in the mirror and 2) get you Game/Mind/Sex action correct.” This is true tho…. “” Simply put guys they don’t respect you, that’s the reason they are with you to begin with, because it’s easy. Rest assured they are getting plowed by other guys of their own culture. Never get into any serious relationship with anyone outside your own culture, you don’t understand theirs and most likely they don’t understand… Read more »

M Simon
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Culum Struan
March 11, 2018 at 4:11 am

The essential advice – “don’t respect them” – still holds and is the core of game.

Blaximus
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Blue Pill is a real motherfucker.

M Simon
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scribblerg
March 11, 2018 at 5:37 am

back in da hood, well, an ex of some sort or an old friend or whatever is often still banging her like the slut she is.

Women know what they are. And in fact don’t respect themselves.

If you respect them they KNOW you are clueless. The only point for them in chasing the clueless is to run a con.

Blaximus
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….

comment image

M Simon
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SJF March 11, 2018 at 9:24 am The old rules were not too bad for LTRs (and STRs were VERY frowned upon). 1. When you find the right man surrender to him 2. Be very careful because surrendering to the wrong man is dangerous. The danger is now mitigated. But also #1 is no longer taught. The shit tests never end. My Mom knew how to surrender to my Dad (it may have been rare even in those days). The LTR has no clue on how to surrender long term – despite the fact that it makes her happy. My… Read more »

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M Simon
March 11, 2018 at 2:09 pm

Victim (pity) parties are notorious among women.

“I was in labor for 16 hours. It was terrible. ”

“That is nothing. I was in labor for 28 hours. They had to cut me open to get the baby out. I still have the scars.”

Or

“There was no spark between us and yet he expected sex weekly. Just because we were married.” is the latest complaint.

M Simon
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Now think of the value loss in women’s social circles.

“He keeps me excited all the time. He is thrilling to be with.”

A woman with no complaints is a low value woman – in other women’s eyes.

“She got a prince? I despise her.”

M Simon
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Blaximus
March 11, 2018 at 2:02 pm

Interesting cameltoe in the last picture. With her $$$ and access such a look is never an accident.

Blaximus
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Yes. Money can’t stop ” accidents “.

comment image

kfg
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I don’t which came first, the Royal Wedding or the crazy eyes, but that woman had crazy eyes, and by the time she talked to Baba Wawa she was bugfuck.

SJF
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“but that woman had crazy eyes”

She had situational Sanpaku eyes. Especially when looking upward.

The Solitary Silver FoX
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scribblerg March 11, 2018 at 7:49 am “The big shift came when I was mostly focused on what I wanted, and was just less concerned about the ego approval of being “liked” or wanted. Mostly I’m looking for IOIs, or even better, annoyance…Remember, attraction for women is based on criteria that can be gamed, or better said, addressed. These days, just not being a pussy beggar and apologizing for being interested sets you apart, as long as you aren’t a complete dick about it… I spend ZERO time thinking about my “losses” cuz I don’t care. I don’t internalize that… Read more »

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@ScribblerG “Dr. (Steven) Gundry’s Plant Paradox, read it. Changed my life.” True story. I recommended it to my mother. She stored the info (as she eats an extra-ordinary good diet @83 y.o.) But she recommended it to a good friend her age. It changed her friend’s life. (..from horrible lifelong gastro-intestinal issues.) She sent my mom a $50 gift certificate for the local grocery store. And sent me a $100 gift certificate for Amazon. I never met or spoke with the woman. On my mothers insistence, I called her twice but she works for charities and call screens her calls… Read more »

LEX
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“I’ll do anything you want” – the most pussy dehumidifying phrase a man can possibly utter.
If all you can get is transactional, yes, pay and walk away and feel good about the fact that someone else can deal with her BS.

Blaximus
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Sentient
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For older guys struggling with themselves over younger women. https://www.instagram.com/p/BfoTEXFhmrp/?hl=en 56 Steven Lyon. Hard at work. The issue is not age. It’s proximity. That’s the hardest part. Being in environments where there are hot young women. The rest is game, same as a 25yo would need to run. But remember you have a lifetime of actual experience, in the world, travel, culture, business, arts… And women. Decades of experience to draw upon. You just need to convey your high value being cognizant of cat games and knowing you are truly the prize. In the places i frequent 20 year age… Read more »

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https://www.instagram.com/p/BfYRQRwhG4i/?hl=en

Lyon, side hustle with benefits…

Sentient
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https://www.instagram.com/p/Bfy4baLBbvK/?hl=en

Playing with a friend who popped in…

We all need friends.

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