What Makes a Man?

When I was compiling the material I was going to use for my second book, Preventive Medicine, I chose to use the essay Vulnerability in the hopes that I might be able to dispel one of the more egregious fantasies about masculinity – that vulnerability is in some way a strength for men. At the time I was rebutting the Mark Manson claim that men’s vulnerability was a necessity in whatever it was he used to consider Game, or the idea that a lot of Purple Pill hacks like to cling to about men’s vulnerability being some foundation upon which a “healthy” relationship ought to be built on. This trope is pulled straight from the Oprah / Dr. Phill handbook and really the belief that a man’s vulnerability is in someway a strength is part of a Blue Pill conditioned belief set that young boys are taught from a very early age.

Go to any woman’s dating advice for men blog today and you’ll likely read some variation of it. It’s actually part of our pop-psychology social consciousness – transvaluation is a very common theme; reversing weakness with strength has been the order for feminizing men and masculinizing women since the Sexual Revolution. I can remember hearing this ‘advice’ since the late 80s on any number of daytime talk shows. Reading this pabulum coming from ‘dating coaches’ with any association to the Red Pill was enough for me to want to dispel the notion. That, and the need for men to get in touch with their Jungian feminine sides as a means to better identifying with women and thus eventually getting laid by all the women who supposedly swooned for vulnerable, sensitive and emotionally available men (also known as ‘Beta Orbiters’).

However, as I was editing that essay for inclusion in the book I realized that what I was considering wasn’t so much the transvaluation of vulnerability and strength, but the model upon which the Feminine Imperative would like to convince men is appropriate and best suited for women’s needs in a relationship. The provable fact that women’s Hypergamy predisposes them to being aroused by men who display the most opposite aspects to this vulnerability (Dark Triad traits for example) doesn’t seem to matter; vulnerability is only beneficial to women seeking comfort and security in a long term partner.

In that essay I outlined a few things about what masculinity has become in a post-Sexual Revolution female-primary social order:

For the greater part of men’s upbringing and socialization they are taught that a conventional masculine identity is in fact a fundamentally male weakness that only women have a unique ‘cure’ for. It’s a widely accepted manosphere fact that over the past 60 or so years, conventional masculinity has become a point of ridicule, an anachronism, and every media form from then to now has made a concerted effort to parody and disqualify that masculinity. Men are portrayed as buffoons for attempting to accomplish female-specific roles, but also as “ridiculous men” for playing the conventional ‘macho’ role of masculinity. In both instances, the problems their inadequate maleness creates are only solved by the application of uniquely female talents and intuition.

Perhaps more damaging though is the effort the Feminine Imperative has made in convincing generations of men that masculinity and its expressions (of any kind) is an act, a front, not the real man behind the mask of masculinity that’s already been predetermined by his feminine-primary upbringing.

Women who lack any living experience of the male condition have the calculated temerity to define for men what they should consider manhood – from a feminine-primary context. This is why men’s preconception of vulnerability being a sign of strength is fundamentally flawed. Their concept of vulnerability stems from a feminine pretext.

Masculinity and vulnerability are defined by a female-correct concept of what should best serve the Feminine Imperative. That feminine defined masculinity (tough-guy ridiculousness) feeds the need for defining vulnerability as a strength – roll over, show your belly and capitulate to that feminine definition of masculinity – and the cycle perpetuates itself.

I returned to this essay today because I think that over the past six months we’re seeing a strengthening push from the Feminine Imperative to clamp down on what we’re to believe should be an acceptable expression of masculinity. In essence the imperative (or the Village if you like) has been using every mass shooting tragedy to reiterate what masculinity should mean to men. And, failing this, the hope is still that men will be confused as to what conventional expressions they can subjectively define it in, in a more female-correct way.

The Feminine-Correct Paradigm

Since the most recent school shooting in Florida, the focus on what constitutes masculinity has come to the forefront of our social consciousness. What exactly is masculinity they keep asking, and then provide definitions that only have meaning to a social order that’s founded on female social dominance. They are definitions that most men heard repeated constantly as boys from their overwhelmingly female-taught and feminine-primary educations. Since the beginning of the Sexual Revolution and the rise of Fempowerment boys and men are expected to grow up into a female-defined masculinity. Boys are acculturated in contexts that feminize them, yet we are meant to believe that all the horrors of Patriarchal masculinity are still being taught to them today:

Two decades ago, the psychologist William Pollack wrote that boys start out sensitive but through a “shame-hardening process” — told to stop crying, to be a man — they learn to hide what they really feel. And if they don’t know or understand their own feelings, how can they care about anyone else’s?

This has become something of a cliché. And the truth is, there’s no single culture of boys, but many. In my memories of adolescence, beneath the constant ribbing and occasional pyromania, we had tremendous affection for one another. And we longed to connect with women with an intensity that was difficult to contemplate.

This was a quote from Real Men Get Rejected Too. It’s a good illustration of the paradox masculinity presents to parents and educators. The idea that boys are these sensitive delicate souls who, through the evils of their Patriarchal (typically male) upbringing, are conditioned to become ‘macho’ violent men is a popular trope. After Nikolas Cruz killed 17 kids at school it was the go-to rationale. “Boys are brought up to be violent gun-loving beasts thanks to a perpetuated misogynistic culture of men” or some variation of this is common. It’s an easy, digestible, info-bite that sounds right because we’ve heard it for so long. If only boys we’re taught more like girls to get in touch with their emotions and were vulnerable in expressing them we could avoid these male-created tragedies.

That’s the pretense we’re supposed to believe – and it’s important that a larger society does believe in the inherent evilness of masculinity if the Feminine Imperative is to maintain social dominance. But the truth is boys have been systematically feminized for the past 3-4 generations. Boys are taught like defective girls. Since the 1970s it is increasingly women who have dominated academia from kindergarten to doctorate degrees. The entire western education system is founded on a feminine-primary, feminine-defined teaching methodology. In the process of advantaging girls to the utmost efficiency in school (to fempower adult women) the educational atmosphere had to be defined by what best served girls. School and teaching became ‘for girls’ and the educational landscape shifted to teaching styles that girls were most benefited in.

In that shift the idea that boys might be disadvantaged had little bearing, but overtime the conditions of teaching ‘to girls’ defined the teaching style as the correct style. In fact, teaching in a way that girls learn best, and disciplining boys for not learning this way, is no longer a style – it is just the way children are taught. Boys and men today are the product of female teachers who actively advantage girls at the expense of boys. So normalized is this teaching that boys disrupting the advantaging of girls in class is something we’ve decided needs to be medicinally curbed. Boys being boys is diagnosed as an illness and drugs are prescribed so as to sedate them long enough for the girls to learn.

This focus on empowering girls isn’t limited to the classroom. In every form of early childhood through adolescent media, music, social networks and social exchanges this theme is continued; girls have the future in their reach, boys are potential rapists and criminals if they don’t fall in line with female-correct way of how things just are. I get asked a lot about what I think defines Blue Pill conditioning and I’d say this ambient social theme of fempowerment is a strong basis for it. Boys are not taught this old-school, much-feared Patriarchal masculinity, they are bombarded with themes of how masculinity is incorrect, laughable, and a shameful ‘act’ that boys have to put on to cover the ‘real’ female-correct versions of their sensitive selves. Boys are taught from the earliest age that being a boy is an incorrect mask, while being a girl, learning like a girl, emoting and relating like a girl is ‘real’ and the correct way of developing a personality.

Who would ever want to be a boy when so much is rewarded and praised about being a girl? There’s so much more advantage to be had if you’re a girl. As early as five years old boys are deliberately taught to loathe their own gender, but they are also being taught a redefinition of what a female-correct form of masculinity should be for them. The best they could do would be to become female to the best of their ability. They learn they must agree and support girls’ empowerment, identify with the feminine and above all, despise the parody of masculinity they are shown is ‘illegitimate’ and inauthentic.

Boys are systematically taught to make women and womankind their Mental Point of Origin. This is why it is so difficult for men to unplug and abandon their old Blue Pill selves; feminine-primacy was literally conditioned into them since they were kids.

Nikolas Cruz, like many other teenage shooters is the product of this feminine-primary education system, not a Patriarchal “teach boys not to cry” machismo school. He is a monster of their creation; one taught to cry on demand and emote like a girl. He’s the result of a participation trophy mentality that demonize men and masculinity to the point that he never learns how to bounce back from defeat, rejection or simply life’s adversities. No men and no masculinity is available to teach that kid how to harden up and be resilient, or how that masculine discipline is not bullying or hazing, but a necessary part of a boy’s maturation into a masculine man.

But to throw society off the trail a false narrative of hyper-masculinity ruining our otherwise feminine-correct boys is perpetuated. When the next school shooting takes place the Village will again want the public to believe it’s masculinity and men’s fault for what is really his emotional outburst. The Village will attempt to place the responsibility on men, on fathers, while in the meantime perpetuating the idea that men/fathers are superfluous at best, a societal burden at worst. Men are useful catspaws in so many ways, and in perpetuating this narrative the Village reinforces the female-correct theme for grown men too.

Masculinity is what they say it is, or else

In the Honor System I proposed the following:

Man Up or Shut Up – The Male Catch 22

One of the primary way’s Honor is used against men is in the feminized perpetuation of traditionally masculine expectations when it’s convenient, while simultaneously expecting egalitarian gender parity when it’s convenient.

For the past 60 years feminization has built in the perfect Catch 22 social convention for anything masculine; The expectation to assume the responsibilities of being a man (Man Up) while at the same time denigrating asserting masculinity as a positive (Shut Up). What ever aspect of maleness that serves the feminine purpose is a man’s masculine responsibility, yet any aspect that disagrees with feminine primacy is labeled Patriarchy and Misogyny.

Essentially, this convention keeps beta males in a perpetual state of chasing their own tails. Over the course of a lifetime they’re conditioned to believe that they’re cursed with masculinity (Patriarchy) yet are still responsible to ‘Man Up’ when it suits a feminine imperative. So it’s therefore unsurprising to see that half the men in western society believe women dominate the world (male powerlessness) while at the same time women complain of a lingering Patriarchy (female powerlessness) or at least sentiments of it. This is the Catch 22 writ large. The guy who does in fact Man Up is a chauvinist, misogynist, patriarch, but he still needs to man up when it’s convenient to meet the needs of a female imperative.

It’s important to review this premise if we want to understand the real intent the Feminine Imperative has in redefining masculinity for men. Aspects of conventional masculinity are useful for women, and masculine duty (appeals to men’s “honor”) is a means to access it while avoiding the aspects that would in any way advantage men over women. Conventional masculinity is largely disparaged and parodied in order to disenfranchise men, but men are still needed to save women from natural disasters and protect them from physical harm (so long as they never expect sex for it). On some level of consciousness women understand the transactional and validational aspects of sex. They know that men’s serviceableness comes with an implied transactional cost, so to circumvent this women had to be put in charge of defining what masculinity should mean to men.

Masculinity as defined by men is almost always illegitimate and inauthentic in a feminine-primary world order. The presumption is that “macho man” ridiculous masculinity is a mask that men wear. That mask is meant to cover their true feminine-correct selves; because men cannot be authentic in any other context than the taught, feminine-correct context. So, of course, men can only be fakes or insecure of their masculinity (the masculinity defined by the feminine) and can never ‘really’ be that strong, dominant male apart from the permission the Feminine Imperative gives him.

Because the Feminine Imperative controls the overall context for what should be correct for men this has the effect of making women the sole deciders of what is masculine. In effect, and in this Blue Pill context, women become the gatekeepers of manhood. If masculinity imbues men with manhood (literally being considered a man) a ‘man’ is only whom a woman will designate as such within her presumed, feminine-correct context. In other words, do the imperative’s bidding and it dubs you a ‘man’.

Breaking the Cycle

As you might’ve guessed, this social dynamic conflicts with women’s Hypergamous imperatives. A Beta who thinks he’s a ‘man’ and presumes entitlements because of that is a woman’s worst fear. A Beta transgressing into a manhood that the imperative didn’t give him is the making for a guy being considered a sexual predator. However, an Alpha man, a man of high sexual market value still needs to accept the feminine-correct social frame, but he must also know his role within that frame. I’ve made the comparison in the past that women only see men as either draft animals or breeding stock. In a feminine-correct paradigm the breeding stock must know that his conventionally masculine aspects mean different things to a woman (Alpha Fucks sex) than the draft animal’s masculine aspects (Beta Bucks service). As such, masculinity and a designation of being a man becomes a constant qualifier for a Beta male. Manhood becomes a carrot he follows to pull the feminine-correct cart.

In fact, Beta men hold their female-correct ‘man’ designation as an unwitting point of pride. Examples abound of self-righteous Betas AMOGing other men for not being ‘real men’ (according to the imperative) like themselves. What they’re ignorant of is that this self-righteousness is defined by how well they conform to the masculinity that the imperative tells him is useful – and avoiding the ‘toxic’ masculinity it also defines for him – all according to his role in the scheme of a woman’s sexual strategy.

Should a man awaken from this Blue Pill conditioning and coronate himself as a ‘man’ outside the approval of womankind, this is when he’s ridiculed as an old school Patriarch and an anachronism of the old male-incorrect social paradigm. This is the control the imperative has against men stepping out side this female-controlled masculinity. The first response any female critic has for men who make themselves their mental point of origin is to remove that status of manhood.

Because they don’t accept feminine-primacy this disqualifies them from ‘real’ manhood.

One of the most difficult aspects men face in unplugging and living in Red Pill awareness is the social stigma that follows when they remove womankind from the pedestal and make themselves their mental point of origin. He gets called an asshole, he gets called selfish, he gets called a misogynist, but he’s also “less of a man” because he no longer conforms to the definition of masculinity that the Feminine Imperative has taught him from his earliest memories. Learning to redefine his mental image of what makes a man a man in his own Red Pill aware state is tough. Most of what he considered the very limited and controlled aspects of an ideal masculinity are a big part of the Blue Pill idealism he was raised on. This transition to conventional masculinity is also hampered by a deep learning of shame and gender loathing for finding anything positive in masculinity.

These are some important things to keep in mind if you are moving into a Red Pill awareness and learning to live in a new paradigm based around a conventional understanding of masculinity that isn’t inherently evil. It’s hard to do, but that old mental model of masculinity your teachers (all of them) convinced you was incorrect is something you must unlearn and cut yourself away from. Know that women don’t just long for that dominant masculinity, they need it for the health of their own life experiences. They need the protection, the comfort, the security and the discipline that masculinity balances their lives with.

Women ask, “where have all the ‘real’ men gone?”, but they exist outside the presumed, feminine-correct paradigm they mistakenly believe they have a secure control of. They don’t want to let go of that, so they will fight you to maintain a control over masculinity (which by definition can be chaotic as well as comforting) that they never really had – even with all the social engineering.

 

Yes I know my enemy, they’re the teachers who taught me to fight me.

 

Published by Rollo Tomassi

Author of The Rational Male and The Rational Male, Preventive Medicine

551 comments on “What Makes a Man?

  1. @Rhysling: “. . . I buy you all a beer . . . ”

    I’m a celiac, you insensitive clod.

    As for Ragnar, he wrote one of those books that you read and take what you need and leave what you don’t. No way in hell that London wrote it. Most money is on Desmond these days ,but I don’t see that eifher. Where there is a void of knowledge people will fill it up with all sorts of speculation.

    Just read the book and make what you will of it.

  2. M Simon

    Thanks for the clarification. I’m not much for blogs, mainly because I’m a much better communicator over a couple of brewskis in a quiet bar. Then one can see the twinkle in my eye when I’m joking around. Or the frown when I’m being serious. Hard to do that online and I REFUSE to use a webcam. What is seen cannot be unseen.

    Just as in any other social group there is a period of adjustment when a new guy come on board. Please feel free to gently or not so gently correct me as needed. If I think you’re right, I’ll adjust. If not, I’ll let you know why and we’ll go from there. I know from personal experience how important the information from this blog can be. I want to contribute positively where I can.

    RE: “Might is Right”. Jack London was a very interesting guy. Looking forward to reading it myself.

  3. kfg

    “…you insensitive clod”. You sound like my wife.

    Let’s redefine the word “beer” to mean “libation of choice”.

    I’m suppose to be a writer. Word choice is important. But definitions can be stretched. Into a pretzel if need be.

  4. Dr zipper I had to look it up too. Penury. I’d Rollo don’t send me to the fucking dictionary ever post the commenters Do.

  5. “You sound like my wife. ”

    I sound like a 15 year old Slashdot meme. A bit long in the tooth for a meme, but it’s 99 44/100 percent pure, all wool and a hard wide.

  6. @ConstrainedLocus

    I’m asking myself how and why in the fuck does someone hold or develop such self-centered thoughts like this in their head at such an inappropriate time?

    Short term, contextual shit testing of Betatized husband codified by Briffault’s Law.

    When he gets back wife will hold it over him to extract more investment in her and the children from him. She’ll get a good ROI on that, always has, always will.

    @Dr.Zipper

    Just got back from birthday dinner with my daughter. You had ask what’s up with celebrating her birthday on the 29th of February. In 1992 the calendar had one of those. That’s what we do in Unicornlandia. We have our girls delivered on Feb 29.

  7. @kfg

    I meme to say – you can have the pretzel, too.

    Puns – lets not go there. [grin]

    I feel like a newbie fighter pilot on his first mission.

    Now what did they tell me in training? Something about yelling “Banzai!”?

  8. @Rhysling

    (respectfully backs away to into the twilight of his four years’ plus of lurking)…

    I’m not much for blogs, mainly because I’m a much better communicator over a couple of brewskis in a quiet bar. Then one can see the twinkle in my eye when I’m joking around. Or the frown when I’m being serious.

    Just as in any other social group there is a period of adjustment when a new guy come on board. Please feel free to gently or not so gently correct me as needed. If I think you’re right, I’ll adjust. If not, I’ll let you know why and we’ll go from there.

    This is no criticism of you. Welcome to the comments section.

    Don’t be so apologetic but understand what I just quoted from your recent comments is not a masculine way in a tribe. That’s right out of the female social matrix playbook. Or the soy boy playbook.

    Male groups don’t actually have a period of adjustment in ranking someone’s merit to the tribe. The tribe here being an intellectual discussion of red pill and inter-sexual strategy. It’s not a masculine thing to “adjust” your well thought out stuff to not rile anyone. Although you will be told in a male group how you merit by being tested of your mettle (male to male shit testing). But you should proceed with out trepidation. Don’t be a girly man.

    Once again, not a criticism. I don’t think you’ve said anything of content. It’s just that males and females socialize in male only and female only groups. When males communicate like females do, it’s the modern manifestation that is going around called soy boys.

    Speak in a masculine tongue and expect to be challenged. Hold to your convictions. Tussle Wrestle and argue to seek understanding.

    Most here are strangers, until some of us reach the elevated status of A Buddy. Which is on a much different status than friend. It’s closer to the heart. And is a huge difference maker. Then what you can just get is:

    A man’s capacity to receive another man’s direct criticism is a measure of his capacity to receive masculine energy. If he doesn’t have a good relationship to masculine energy (e.g., his father), then he will act like a woman and be hurt or defensive rather than make use of other men’s criticism. –Deida, Ch. 10 TWSM.

    There is a tipping point when elevated to buddy status, relationships with male only groups elevates to that of in-group agreeable-ness, which generates more masculine self improvement.

    Which then becomes more valuable and powerful than a female social matrix or a matrix composed of feminized me can ever hope to do.

    Men agreeing with each other often is criticized by some as a hug box. It’s nothing of the sort. Tribal members still jab their counterparts with a pointy stick if they aren’t holding up their part of their own bargain in the tribe (not being the best representation of their self). Men elevate their counterparts in a buddy group. Support them when they are holding themselves up. Not looking into the abyss for their own buffering weaknesses. Criticizing them when they can do better for themselves and for the group/tribe.

    Reference: Look what happend to Anthony Johnson of the 21 Convention. He got jabbed with a pointy stick a few times by Red Pill icons. And look what happened there…. He elevated his masculine self and reformulated his Tribe, on task for a pursuit of Red Pill Awareness. And others benefited by that.

    Lately I’ve found a trigger point for females. Go around using the adjective “buddy” for your deep, good male friends. Use buddy five times when it’s only called for once because she understands who he is to you. And sit back and watch your female partner object to you using that adjective. She might even say: “skip that adjective”, that’s what 7 year old boys use. You’re a man, you shouldn’t use that adjective. She will because that is an affront to her hegemony over you, in her non-submissive state. Your response: “No.” Because it’s a Thing. Strong inter-personal male bonds.

    https://twitter.com/MasculineDesign/status/968847313581076480

  9. @constrainedlocus

    Because she’s a solipsistic selfish bitch. To her, he’s just a draft horse provider.

    She followed the script of what she was supposed to say: “go, just be with them” , but her actions say that she really doesn’t give a shit about his mother or his needs.

  10. @constrainedlocus: “I’m asking myself how and why in the fuck does someone hold or develop such self-centered thoughts like this in their head at such an inappropriate time?”

    Women lack empathy. They go out and do good deeds, charitable works (with money earned by men, of course) only after they have secured themselves. And SHE will show empathy only when SHE know that others will notice and give HER the “brownie points”.

    I have seen this in women in family too.

    WOMEN RESPECT AND DO THINGS ONLY FOR THE MEN THEY WANT TO SLEEP WITH. EVERYOTHER MAN IS DESPISED AND IS AN ANNOTANCE AT BEST OR AN OUTRIGHT PREDATOR.

  11. @palmasailor:

    “That’s your two choices.”

    Well said and I agree.

    However, would like some clarity on “They look up because they respect OR desire”

    To me it appears that a woman cannot have respect for a man she does not desire. For women there is no “Respect OR Desire”, It is more like “Desire AND Respect”.

    Can a women have genuine respect for a man she DOSE NOT sexually desire?

  12. “Can a women have genuine respect for a man she DOSE NOT sexually desire?”

    I will interject that they love opportunistically so the attention and respect comes when you have something she wants. The respect will only be earned by a man that drives a hard bargain for his service, if you are an easy mark and just give it to her she won’t respect that and whatever you do will lose value, even to the point of being a slight to her or an insult in an extreme situ.

    This applies to mothers, sisters, wives, daughters, girlfriends even random customers……

    The best time to get along with women is when they want something see Rollo’s cardinal rule on power and who needs who the most. When you have the power and don’t use it this is an asault to her senses, and you are insulting or defective take your choice.

  13. One example of many where the far left shows their true colors.

    I believe that schools, as they are, are people-factories that breed the next generation of school shooters, army generals, cops, wife beaters, etc. I think we can create something better than what we now know of as schools, something that eliminates the line that modern schools draw between learning and living, for instance. I believe that nuclear families, as they are, promote isolation and foster some early and basic “us and them” thoughts that are dangerous.

    theanarchistlibrary.org/library/francesca-reframing-the-question-of-gun-control-in-the-context-of-a-school-shooting-english-2

  14. @constrainedlocus

    Also, a woman thinking only of herself isn’t a bug, it’s a feature (can’t remember where I originally read this, but I think it was Rollo).

  15. @boulderhead @palmasailor:

    The below is the perfect explanation of this.

    “The best time to get along with women is when they want something see Rollo’s cardinal rule on power and who needs who the most. When you have the power and don’t use it THIS IS AN ASSAULT TO HER SENSES, and you are insulting or defective take your choice.”

    Thanks a lot.

  16. @sjf

    nice post re: Tribe. Esp liked the trigger point for females idea. I hadn’t considered intentional provocation as a point of game in ltr. Totally the opposite of *everything* I’ve ever heard. Nice, because it’s subtle, not provoking directly. (i can’t help but provoke sometimes, but it’s too direct and a point of criticism towards her – which only makes a mess, doesn’t elevate me).

  17. whoops…that last comment from Naloorider was from me…forgot to mention but I’m changing my handle. From now on I’m Naloorider.

  18. “I will interject that they love opportunistically so the attention and respect comes when you have something she wants…”

    Don’t be fooled that attention and respect have any meaning outside the moment, and the man THINKS it to be respect doesn’t make it so.

    How often does a woman think of her man in pro/con fashion? Never.

    Her feeling in that moment is your past, present and future value.

  19. “Her feeling in that moment is your past, present and future value.”

    Word Man.

    The downside of this is, you must always game in a sense, the burden of performance never ends.

    There is however an upside, everyday is like a new beginning, hell every moment in the feels.

    Unless you go to the opposite of deep conversion, I will call it deep repulsion, then forget it man , better luck next time.

  20. “Being a man alone has not saved him because when it comes to her he’s a fucking mess. He has deferred to her, put her on a pedestal and made her the primary focus of his life.”

    Grounds for deep repulsion.

  21. “Past is gone.”

    To a man ,yes the past is gone and you can’t change it.

    To a woman the past is whatever she feels it was at this moment. In an LTR she will bring up your shit like a crystal clear memory if it suites her current jibe, or all is forgotten and you were the man ultimate unwavered in her eyes in the moment of feels.

  22. @palma

    If your ex had to describe your past relationship with her, would she use how she feels now about it or how she felt then?

  23. @Sailor

    lol….I don’t rightly know exactly. Not need, just want to associate with something more personal, and less with Rollo’s eponymous posts about some poor AFC named Mitch. While I learned a lot from those posts, and contained a lot of truth, they are so NOT about me.

  24. the next thing is to dispense with this lavendar gravatar I’ve been “assigned”. That is the absolute fucking worst! lol!

  25. @sailor

    She would use how she feels now but to shape that thought she’d remember all the ‘bad’ things and ignore the good things which were the very very vast majority.

    my wife does this. brings up the same shit over and over and over. She’s funny though, I call her on it, and she says, yes, of course, that’s what women are like… she has this meta-awareness of what she’s doing, and that it’s not particularly good, but oh well, she’s a woman, and what can you do about *that*!?

  26. I appreciate the conceptual nature of your posts, Rollo. In this specific post, could you provide a handful of examples (blue/purple/red pill) that would help solidify your points?

  27. “She would use how she feels now but to shape that thought she’d remember all the ‘bad’ things and ignore the good things which were the very very vast majority.”

    This ^ needs fixed.

    He will remember the good and the bad in shaping thoughts.

    She will remember whatever fits her jibe in the moment, a good sailor (hint) will set that jibe for her.

  28. “From now on I’m Naloorider”

    Mitch. I’m not so sure you want to do that. (It ties to your social media)

  29. “the burden of performance never ends.”

    Internalized perfection
    wardrobe
    fitness
    Mental point of Origin On a mission of self creation.

    “Unless you go to the opposite of deep conversion, I will call it deep repulsion, then forget it man , better luck next time.”
    I find that even getting here once can cause a total backlash of rage and indignation on her part. Or the sisterhood in general. The most vicious people I’ve meant are the ones who impose this on men in life. A collective set of women who expose their rage out of anger for being made aware of the burden of performance… Not getting it… Or avoiding or forcing out least for me an emotional conversation about the Irony of doing anything ‘right’ For me growing up i constantly got plastered with shame for doing anything that came naturally. Sex workers where the closet’s place i would go to speak about the Moral contradiction’s of righteous tyranny.

  30. @sailor

    yeh – before that would have really gotten to me, but being able to see it for what it is is awesome. I either ignore it, or just laugh and carry on. I am passing shit tests with more regularity, and I see the calming effect it has on her. Amazing. And….I am fucking her harder.

  31. @ Mitch

    “I call her on it”

    What you can do is stop calling her on it. Why you do that to yerself?

  32. @rugby

    ” A collective set of women who expose their rage out of anger for being made aware of the burden of performance”

    Oh, you’ve been to the nurses lounge too?

  33. my wife does this. brings up the same shit over and over and over. She’s funny though, I call her on it, and she says, yes, of course, that’s what women are like… she has this meta-awareness of what she’s doing, and that it’s not particularly good, but oh well, she’s a woman, and what can you do about *that*!?

    Laugh?

  34. EhIntellect
    Anywhere i go and listen while waiting to give blood or just hear about upcoming pregnancy’s It’s all scary as child with no male influence.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wgejeEm_X6E
    When i bring up incest i mean being emotional open to a women who demand’s it without ever expecting the answer “No”
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uAmIIaXgHhc
    Learning from the a Role model helps if not you becoming one is the price to the world.

  35. @ palma

    Masculinity precludes putting women on a pedestal. Masculinity is much more than a man’s toughness or male ingenuity ( although those are components ). I think a lot of it Wrt relationships boils down to essentially understanding your natural role in the relationship hierarchy. The same could be said in general about a man’s natural role in all of his life.

    Quick ( or maybe not ) story as I to on have a friend going through a similar situation.

    Married, 3 children, 1 his wife had with another man prior. The man is/was the embodiment of old school ” macho “, in that he ruled his home with an iron fist. Almost cartoonishly so.

    About 3 years ago, he injured his back seriously. Not only could he not work, but he was in the middle of rehabbing his house and could not finish. I offered to help him on a fee occasions and he politely declined.

    His wife was a stay at home mom, mainly because he forbid her to work. In fact, he tightly controlled her movements. Wemused to jokingly refer to her as prisoner # 987765, but not in her presence. Early 30’s now…31 or 2 I think. I’d guess a ” 7 “, but a very cute one.

    2 years ago his family and my family wound up in Florida at a family function, and we all stayed with my brother in law. He was constantly complaining that no one understood his pain and suffering, but more than that, I noticed the micro reactions onmhis wife’s face. Ohhhh shit. Add to that his wife ” innocently ” playing footsie with me under the table, and I knew I needed to have. A talk alone with him.

    I had a very similar injury to my back, so I tried to help. I volunteered how I handled it and made suggestions to him, which he soundly rejected. He saw himself as terminally broken, and it made him angry along with abusing pain meds while washing them down with alcohol. He couldn’t work, and was awaiting some kind of settlement. A hefty one. So he was basically in neutral with life until then, in his mind.

    But for now his family was struggling financially.

    I tried explaining to him that he needed to try to maintain his same position in the family regardless of pain, but he felt that everyone would just need to understand. So I tried a more blunt approach by telling him that he will absolutely have serious marital issues if the overly strong master of the family is just reduced to being perceived as the drunk, suffering guy on the couch every day, spouting negativity day in and day out, until passing out.

    I couldn’t reach him. He convinced himself that everyone, including his wife, will give him credit for who he was, what he’s done, and his current medical situation – PERIOD. Empathy and understanding.

    Fast forward. Marital unrest ensues. Wife take a job ( !!! ) to try to alleviate some of the financial strain. Constant arguing and fighting ensues as now no one is around to ” take care of ” him.

    Fast forward again, Valentine’s day… Lol…. He sends flowers to wife’s job, and then calls to make sure they arrived. He is told that his wife did not come to work that day. His words : I saw her get dolled up and leave for work this morning.. He asks what I think, and I tell him ” I think it’s time for you to brace yourself. Like when you put your head between your legs when a plane crash is immanent “.

    That night he confronted her, and she announced that the marriage was over.

    Family tried to intervene, but I stepped back. Intervention is a couple of years too late. He needs to prepare for something else now. And he needs to understand from a red pill perspective why this happened and not fool himself into believing that he was abandoned because he was injured. That’s not true and it will cause him unnecessary suffering to falsely believe that.

    My wife summoned his wife to our home for ” a talk “. She showed up at my home, and the cute 7 had transformed into a pretty hot 8 , lol. New hairdo, heels, makeup, clothes… I never noticed her body like that before. Even her mannerisms changed to super feminine sexy. I was on my way out, but I looked at my wife and mouthed ” it’s over ” and she nodded.

    My wife called me later and said that she told her that she was absolutely done, she didn’t want to hear about kids or anything. The prisoner escaped while the guard was incapacitated.

    But the prisoner didn’t realize she was a prisoner while the guard was a strong – overly strong- masculine figure. In fact the prisoner relished being his captive. For 16 years. Then the guard was found in a heap on the floor whimpering one day. And the prisoner told the guard he had to try to remain a guard, but the guard refused, sighting pain, weakness, anger and defeatism.

    Now, shit happens. I did know the pain he had because I had the same thing. Inactively considered heroin if I thought it would give me an hour of relief from the constant pain. And of course no one can understand that level of pain. But I kept going as much as I could, and I kept the complaints down to an absolute bare minimum. Not for others perception, but because that negative inner dialogue would only serve to weaken me more. So I kept working, even bent at an almost 90 degree angle, lol, and I spent more time out of bed than in it, doing my normal routines as much as possible. I stayed myself.

    Oh, and I banged wifey regularly.

    Masculinity has to be voluntarily given up most times. A conscious choice. The exception is when it’s snuffed out while one is young. Masculinity is just as much mindset as it is ” what you do ” . Hormones help to drive manhood, but there’s more to the equation.

  36. “Her feeling in that moment is your past, present and future value.”

    The only truth to a woman is emotion.

    “He has deferred to her, put her on a pedestal and made her the primary focus of his life.

    Masculinity is a good start but it’s not enough on its own.”

    Masculinity is just fine… As long as you don’t define it to leave out essential parts.

    HABD will be along shortly to discuss the FI hand on the shoulder.

  37. From now on it’s rent, I don’t want to own another one.

    At some time in each man’s life this decision is made. Thanks to places like this it can be made rationally.

  38. “And the prisoner told the guard he had to try to remain a guard, but the guard refused, sighting pain, weakness, anger and defeatism.”
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=evxEOXkxRIA
    Backlash… Blues…

    “Masculinity has to be voluntarily given up most times. A conscious choice. ”
    I find suicide to be a part of this… Self criticism at the max.

  39. Palma

    Not sure. Is it still Game if you don’t know you are playing it? Game with a capital G is just decoding the female language of seduction. If what you are doing isn’t working, if you aren’t having the results you want, by all means learn.

    But there is a natural part in men that knows enough… Then that part gets rubbed off, twisted and turned around.

    That’s what all the cultural brainwashing is about.

  40. @ rugby

    Good morning. Yes, badness is everywhere. I don’t deny it.

    Your mental point of origin is elsewhere, surely not in you.

    I know, I know, easier said than done. Though you’re not the only one who’s experienced incest. They’re just not posting here.

    It’s tempting to use TRM as emotional comfort food delaying the hard work of moving on. You feel more relevant when you post and that’ll do until later until something changes in your life, a leap of faith, an epiphany, to knock your stuck servo into gear.

    When men ever shrink their circumference of freedom, perspective, control, which you have, they lose their ability to emotionally maneuver, limit their pathways to resolution.

    When you look at others, your glass is half empty and, self destructively, that comforts you. That’s a bitch.

    Misery loves company thing, maybe.

  41. “I couldn’t reach him. He convinced himself that everyone, including his wife, will give him credit for who he was, what he’s done, and his current medical situation – PERIOD. Empathy and understanding.”

    This was tough,hard to accept, all the sacrifice and devotion a man gives to his family loses value in the bank, kinda like negative interest rates on a grand scale. You have to keep making deposits or soon it is gone.

    Scribbler’s story from the hospital bed is clearer in my mind than,my own experience with this.

    A common male condition is a short memory for pain.

  42. @Blax:

    “But the prisoner didn’t realize she was a prisoner while the guard was a strong – overly strong- masculine figure. In fact the prisoner relished being his captive. For 16 years. Then the guard was found in a heap on the floor whimpering one day. And the prisoner told the guard he had to try to remain a guard, but the guard refused, sighting pain, weakness, anger and defeatism.”

    I have seen this happen in my family. However, my mother did not leave my father after his accident, she cared for him till the day she passed away, but it was clear that she had lost much respect for him. She would start fights for no good reason and two hours later everything would go back to normal as if nothing happened. It appeared as if SHE HAD TO let off some steam at least once a day. It was all very confusing to me back then. But it all makes sense now.

  43. EhIntellect
    I’m far from miserable… Doing 31 days of March with Hunter helps stay connecting away from isolation.

    Hitting gym blast’s through misery

    palmasailor
    Leaving now to do coach training, what are some ways you have been dealing with what happened in your family dynamic…

  44. Boulder

    A man has to always do for self. Full stop.

    I only expect a ” return ” from my job or investments. The return is for myself. I didn’t raise my child because I expected some kind of recognition or reward for doing so. I did it 1) because she was mine, and 2) because the internal obligation I felt towards her didn’t have anything to do with anyone else ever. Not one solitary soul.

    Lol, I’ve spoken here about my massive rose bush. I’ve had people constantly give positive comments over the years, and people have stopped to take pictures of it, and one older lady actually rang my doorbell to ask questions about it.

    Those things are nice and all, but that’s not why I grew the bush. Imhave a personal goal I’m trying to achieve with it. Compliments are only a side effect. People could just as easily tell me that it’s an awful eyesore.

    Most things I do are for myself first and foremost, without too much regard for how other’s feel about it, or whether they want to compliment or criticize.

    It’s like lending money. I don’t usually lend anyone money, but if I do, I ignore their promise to repay the debt, and I only lend what I can afford to not get back.

  45. theasdgamer
    March 1, 2018 at 7:00 am

    “You were angry for 40 years – against my advice. How did that work out for you?” is what I say to the LTR.

  46. ehi – “It’s tempting to use TRM as emotional comfort food delaying the hard work of moving on. You feel more relevant when you post and that’ll do until later until something changes in your life, a leap of faith, an epiphany, to knock your stuck servo into gear.”

    yep, I’m guilty of this very thing…. and I’ve had to cut back on this site and do more ‘doing’; comfort food is a wonderful analogy

    good bit of wisdom I heard one time from a totally unexpected person, which is partially why I remember it so well, something like “be wary of anything that gives you pleasure or comfort because you might become a slave to it”

  47. “A man has to always do for self. Full stop.”

    Thanks for the reminder, I am always building and fixing things for others, it is what they pay me for. They are always trying to convince me that I am doing this for myself, therefore I should help them for free or at least less money. This is a constant game played while working for the general public.

    I am a big fan of the written contract and constant reckoning, keeping things up to date is the best way, don’t let it get out of hand IYKWIM .

  48. @ palma

    Just talking here.

    It’s hard to fully comprehend a totally free life. Free of job, TPTB, my own insecurities when dealing with the former. Were born into that static.

    SSFox, SJF, Boulderhead escaped the static by getting back to nature. That helps.

    Throw in a woman who’s less able to deal with all that shit plus at all times has different incentives and that’s our responsibility now too. It just is.

    My contemporary family is a font of respite from that dysfxal cultural static. I’m a much better, less cynical man, husband, father for RP.

  49. @ Incubus

    Form my experience, the caring for incapacitated mates was more common in the past, and usually more frequent among those of an economically ” lower ” class.

    I joke with my dozen goddaughters, that if I’m ill and confined to a bed to die, I’d better have them around to bring me glasses of water. The consensus is that none of them will empty my bedpan, nor change soiled sheets, but on the bright side, they promised to all chip in to pay for people to do that for me.

    I didn’t marry a woman who I’m confident would actively care for me around the clock is that time came. I understood that about her from the start. She might just do it when then time came, because over the years she’s done many things that her frame said wasn’t possible, lol, but I in no way expect it nor would I hold it against her.

    Rollo has stated a disbelief in relationship ” equity “. I mostly agree because on average it’s an awful thing to believe in. It’s not something to be overtly counted on by men as any kind of life strategy.

    Yet, you may be surprised when the shit hits the fan in life.

    Just don’t count on it.

  50. “The other thing you have to do is actually tell someone what has happened.

    You need to choose this person carefully, and for me it was a paid counsellor.”

    This is what separates the men from the boys.

  51. Eh
    I don’t call her on it anymore – that was my point. I ignore or laugh it off. It works well.

  52. women expect you to be attracted to them if they like you. I find this very difficult to handle and it pisses me off.

    Why? Just don’t tell girls that you aren’t attracted unless it’s a key that opens another door. Soft next. I’ve always done soft nexting except for the future Mrs. Gamer’s roommate so that it freed up Mrs. Gamer to go out with me.

    Don’t spend too much time with any girl you’re not keen on so that they don’t build up expectations. Part of being a man.

  53. “Don’t spend too much time with any girl you’re not keen on so that they don’t build up expectations. Part of being a man.”

    Set boundaries covertly rather than overtly.

  54. ” I like hiking,it gets me close to nature.there is this other woman I am seeing,it is getting serious. Before I settle down I would like to meet other women socially to be more sure of things.”

  55. Sailor
    Sounds like you’re too good at this. Maybe try going out as an AFC in disguise, only revealing your bad ass self to a target.

  56. Gamer..
    You’re married but you go dancing at the weekend.
    If you were actively in the game full time like I am at 50 you’d know that all the social environments are full of women, most of whom you don’t like and you have to swat them off like flies.

    Not sure what you mean by “actively in the game full time” or what your “social environments” are.

    I do hiking and game meetups as well as dancing. I use nonverbal cues to communicate disinterest.

    Shit, girls are all over me like flies on shit…a little self-deprecating humor there…I don’t have to swat them…I just don’t spend much time with any one girl…I’ll dance with one…find another to dance with after the last one…it’s so easy to play DodgeGirl.

    Girls have grabbed my ass, brushed my ass, swatted my ass, poked my ass, put my hands on their tits, brushed their tits against my arm, danced cuddly, etc. Most are very pretty to beautiful. Highly bangable.

    Big fucking deal. Doesn’t mean they get my cock.

    I don’t try to be particularly nice to girls. Nor do I try to be a jerk.

    Maybe you are being too nice and they interpret your social interest as sexual interest.

  57. @Blaximus

    “Rollo has stated a disbelief in relationship ” equity “. I mostly agree because on average it’s an awful thing to believe in. It’s not something to be overtly counted on by men as any kind of life strategy.”

    Yep, I see my wife as I see Social Security. Most likely won’t be there for me when I need it.

  58. What makes a man?

    We’ll never know if we keep viewing men through the prism of female ideology.

  59. @Blax: “I didn’t marry a woman who I’m confident would actively care for me around the clock is that time came. I understood that about her from the start.”

    “Rollo has stated a disbelief in relationship ” equity “. I mostly agree because on average it’s an awful thing to believe in. It’s not something to be overtly counted on by men as any kind of life strategy.”

    Unfortunately, this is where men get blind sided and get zeroed out thinking their sacrifices will be rewarded by their cookie cutter. As you rightly said a number of times, vetting a woman is important, it is more important to not have expectations based on “relational equity”. And having a good understanding of Red Pill / female nature and Game will help men accept reality the way it “IS” and not be bitter about it.

  60. Vulnerability – what woman DO NOT want, Evidence – my wife, whom once explained to me one of the reasons that she married me was that I was her rock, someone she knew would stand tall and not bend with the wind when things got difficult.

  61. @palmasailor: “Perhaps she’ll definitely be there as long as she’s sure you’ll never need her.”

    True that.

    And it is because women cannot handle “the burden of performance”. No such thing as “woman up and get on with it”.

  62. @palmasailor, “Perhaps she’ll definitely be there as long as she’s sure you’ll never need her.”

    Correction: “Perhaps she’ll definitely be there as long as she’s sure she needs you.”

  63. @palma

    Oh, you’re talking about women you’ve bedded wanting to move you into a LTR. YaReally had something to say about how to avoid that and dial down the bf vibe.

    Probably you need to keep most girls in FB mode and avoid FWB mode.

  64. @palmasailor:

    Women can’t handle rejection. The more you say NO, the more they want you, and will do anything to be in your life, even if it as a “plate”.

    I had girl who wanted to be in my life at any cost. I told her that I am seeing other women and I will not commit. She said she did not care if I was going out with other women, as long as I kept her in my life. It was the first time I heard a woman say such a thing. Back then I though she was crazy, but now I know that women desire a man with options. And if she knows that she is your “only option”, she will run for the hills.

  65. @palmasailor / Incubus Rising,

    I have an ex that keeps contacting me wanting me to divorce and marry her. It’s a trip. Told her I’d never remarry, but I’d spend some time with her but she has to wait until my kids graduate and I roll out. Drives her crazy.

  66. What makes a man is the impulse to attempt to rig the game in your favor when you keep getting your shit kicked in by bigger better-looking guys.

    Hence, the current year.

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