The Princess Experience

 

 

‘Fallen Princesses’ –  photographer Dina Goldstein

Published by Rollo Tomassi

Author of The Rational Male and The Rational Male, Preventive Medicine

505 comments on “The Princess Experience

  1. Yes Liz, I lied. Sue me.

    My bf mentioned that we would get married after he graduated, so I had the idea that we would be married by the end of this Summer. In that way, we were pretty much engaged, in a way. But it was wishful thinking, I admit.

    Redlight, so that is you? Is that really true?

  2. This isn’t the first time you’ve been caught in a lie by a long shot.
    But it’s the most gobsmacking example to date.
    At this point I’m wondering if there actually is or was a boyfriend or if he’s just some guy you’ve been stalking and making up stories about.
    No way to tell. It has been interesting though.
    Wow.

  3. Well, if just thinking of opening can help, perhaps I should try imagining opening and it being successful.

    Before going into venue, take a few minutes to imagine opening, sexualizing/adding emotional spikes, and it working. Also, think of the times I was successful in the past. And when I was in state. Keep focusing on beatboxing and humming early on, since I do that when I am in state.

    Do the meditation that tyler talks about — just clearing thoughts for 30 min. Early on in day.

    Try to do more exercise before — but is tricky with health issues. See if I can walk more, but will have to be careful not to go too far since I have to walk a lot with daygaming.

    Also, loking at those russel brand vids is a good idea.

    Like that distinction between talking about sex in general, which is fine, versus sex with HER, which would be too awkaward in a day venue, esp when she’s working.

  4. Lololol, why the hell would I stalk ANY guy? I’ve been with him for a long time now, but you can believe what you like.

    Anyway, shut the fuck up Liz. Go back to being a doormat for your husband, you are going over your allowed computer time.

  5. @scray

    if you’re the prize, why are you approaching?

    Good question. I approach in order to demonstrate that I am the prize. Rejections allow me to demonstrate that I am the prize. I am not a passive prize, but an active prize. (I do get approached sometimes…usually once a night by a HB6+.)

    Gamer’s Sexual Economic Theory (tl;dr version)

    Pussy is a fungible commodity to alphas. You can’t give away beta dick. Alpha dick is prized more than pussy when alphas DHV.

  6. @theMan

    insinuates that your sentiment is that your manliness in contingent on success with women. Wrong order

    based on what your opinion?

    Maslow didn’t think so….learning how to meet your sexual needs is way before you self-actualize as a man. according to Maslow you can’t even have any real self-esteem until you can fuck some women.

    you are NOT a real MAN until you can fuck WOMEN. sorry.

    thought experiment.

    do you think a male virgin is more or less of a man? the natural response is LESS. many would say he is not even a MAN yet.

    we can argue platonic whatever-my-opinion ideals of how the world ought to be all day, but here and now in this society what i said stands: male virgins are mocked, ridiculed, shamed, and thought of as not even men.

    why?

    no success with women.

    but men gotta get their heads straights over this imo …….. don’t define yourself that way in the primary (or even the tertiary)…… that’s going to ultimately lead to bluepill thinking.

    k well if you aren’t able to get consistent pussy then you DO NOT HAVE THE ABILITY to even define yourself in any other way.

    you guys can go off and climb mountains, be Navy seals, and do whatever the fuck bullshit but when you show up to the bar and you can’t talk to a pretty woman…guess what? you aren’t a real man yet.

    and all this ‘define yourself in so many other ways’ is just shorthand for ‘rationalize not talking to women because they’re scary! i’d rather go CLIMB FUCKING MOUNTAINS AND SHOOT AT TERORRISTS than talk to hot chicks! that’s how SCARY they are to me!’

    we can agree to disagree.

    whoever has talking to and fucking women handled, yes, they’re allowed to progress as a man

  7. Funny thing, I forgot this til now…was holding the door for people for maybe 20 secs…some girls didn’t thank me and got scolded by other girls and one girl touched me on the arm and thanked me as she passed, lol

    Funny how frame shows thru even when you act with chivalry and girls see it and respond. I was dressed in dark gray jeans, black cap, a black and white plaid shirt with snaps, and black boots. Maybe looked a little scary and my actions were a contrast.

    The girls’ appreciative responses were very cool. Wish I’d hugged them and kissed them on the cheek. They were with guys, likely.

  8. Goodbye Liar. Have fun with your Beta orbiters on TBP and all the other “christian” blog forums you snake your lies into.

    Tell the BF I’m proud of him for figuring your lies out.

  9. @scray

    do you think a male virgin is more or less of a man?

    Irrelevant. I think that Christ was an amazing man. Heroic stature and a virgin. Maslow has a right to his opinion, but it’s all sociological guesswork.

  10. @scray, @wildman
    https://therationalmale.com/2013/06/26/you-need-sex/

    Life Experience

    If I said I felt pity for men like the blogger I mentioned earlier, who through their own conviction or bad circumstance, have never had sex in their lives, I don’t think I’d be accurate in expressing myself. I feel a profound sadness for them; a sadness similar to when you meet someone who’s lost a limb or has had to live with a physical or mental disability. For guys who want to tell you that you don’t need sex to live a fulfilling life I’m sure this sounds like conceit. There are plenty of inspirational individuals who live their lives without arms or legs, or with other disabilities, that we can all look up to for “overcoming the odds”, but the reason they are inspiring is because they must strive for a quality of life that others simply take for granted. Run a marathon and it’s quite an achievement, but do it as a paraplegic and it’s a triumph of human will.

    Sometimes a sexless life is a choice of conviction, but more often it’s not a choice for men, it’s simply their circumstance. I grieve every time I read a comment by, or receive a painful request for help from a late 30’s man who’s still a virgin. Sex is a part of a healthy human experience; if you want to apply meaning to it, if you only consider its legitimacy within marriage or monogamy, or if you enjoy sex with many women, the function is still the same.

  11. Anyone wanna bet that Emily has never scolded other girls for not thanking a man for holding a door for them. I’d bet money that Liz has done so. Liz speaks up about false rape accusations in the military. Scolding girls for unthankfulness wouldn’t be far removed from that.

  12. @thasdegamer

    Irrelevant. I think that Christ was an amazing man. Heroic stature and a virgin. Maslow has a right to his opinion, but it’s all sociological guesswork.

    weird to reference the story of jesus as fact and dismiss Maslow as ‘guesswork.’

    our belief systems are too far apart on this one i think. to me, jesus and a lot of that is just mythmaking — if there was an actual man.

  13. So little Emmy tries to play hide the vagina to coerce a marraige proposal from her not so beta guy… And when that fails she tries let’s you and he fight with their mutual friend… And when that fails he dumps her…

    And the Hamster keeps on spinnin on.

    LOL

  14. @theasdgamer

    eh, we just disagree!

    @sentient

    he’s more of a man than a virgin and less of a man that a man who didn’t have to pay for a prostitute.

  15. @scray

    The key to reasonable belief is whether there is rigorous examination of eyewitnesses. We have that in experimental physics where the physics journals report the observations of eyewitnesses and those reports undergo rigorous scrutiny.

    Christianity likewise had rigorous examination of eyewitnesses. Jewish culture required rigorous scrutiny of eyewitnesses as well and the early church was almost entirely Jewish for the first 15 years at least. Hence, the early church would have put its eyewitnesses (the apostles) to some rigorous questioning, which we find mentioned in Acts 4 & 8. There are also the eight quotations of the Law’s requirements regarding eyewitness testimony in the NT, so this didn’t pass away before the NT was written.

  16. fascinating.

    So, if a man calls himself an astronaut, yet never left earth’s atmosphere, is he really an astronaut? Or is he in effect, an astroNaught?

  17. @ Sentient

    ” If a virgin man has sex with a prostitute is he a man or not?”

    Depends. If the prostitute’s name is Mark, then no, it doesn’t count.

  18. @theasdgamer

    The key to reasonable belief is whether there is rigorous examination of eyewitnesses.

    that’s a pretty huge opinion to assert….and it’s one I don’t share. both on the key to ‘reasonable belief’ and how rigorous the eyewitnesses wrt ‘Christ’ were examined

    Christianity likewise had rigorous examination of eyewitnesses.

    lol yeah we have different meanings of the word ‘rigorous.’

    You ventured into an area in which I have done spergy investigation, lol.

    imagine a world where two people could reasonably investigate something and disagree. rejoice! that’s the world we live in.

  19. I often scroll past emily’s crap but today this linkshe put up caught my eye. For those who did not see it, read it. It is a splendid link to put up, one that even rollo himself would post.

  20. OK Scray – just to set the record straight for where I am coming from personally, I have never had a problem getting with a woman if I decide that is important. And I have had 1,000’s and 1,000’s of fucks in my life as per the usual. I also have never had a problem otherwise getting my sexual needs met (and I need release very very frequently – don’t know why exactly – always been like that – and the way I see it it seems to be a hallmark of the overall state of my health – so I do get concerned if on occasion it wanes a bit – then I see to it I get more rest. Otherwise I don’t really give the urge to release too much thought – it’s a bodily sort of life-force need to have the sexual current run through the body on a very regular basis – it seems to me to be more about this “sex current” thing than the release actually – it seems it just needs to happen on the regular – there really is no denying it, and by way of experiment I have tried – but no, can’t be denied). I can’t really remember having a time when I didn’t have sexual needs actually, like always, like way way before the release part was even possible – like probably from day 1 but I don’t know – as long as I can remember anyway – it was just always a need, therefore like the need to eat and poop and piss and move around and everything else of that basic nature. In fact I was one of those very young kids reprimanded and told not to play with it (and you learn real fast not to be doing that in front of others – except deep down that is what everybody actually wants – one of the truly bizarre things about life imo). I’m pretty sure Freud actually got some stuff right about this sex thing. I don’t think I am in any way unusual around this – but people do not want to talk about this stuff for the most part – and truth be told, neither do I (you know the social conditioning is that we wear clothes and cover up for the most part – and the social conditioning works of course – suppression around our sexual nature is hugely intended by way of the social conditioning, and it hugely works too). In fact, I would venture …… that this social script is so universal among people …… that the social conditioning is probably partially upheld by some qualities of the innate nature of humans …… like more self-agency and therefore self-consciousness perhaps …… I’m pretty sure humans are the only animals that purposely cover up our genitals – why would that be eh? (except you know – the odd jungle tribe still does the dicks-a-swaying and the pussies-o-bare thing – so it isn’t just the innate thing – this otherwise almost universal social overlay of covering up genitals with clothing is obviously a social construct, but my point is …. one made possible and probable by way of something different about human innate nature).

    Anyway – I really don’t get this thing about a guy not getting pussy. If a young guy be fucked up that way all he has to do is go see a pro. So … if a guy says he is a virgin and feels victimized by that, …… and he is saying that it is because he can’t get anybody to ride his cock ……. well that’s just not true …. so it’s therefore something else …….and for a lot of these types of guys it’s probably because they are a bit OCD, and have gotten completely freaked out by the shame that they have somehow allowed to creep in around this (and I mean it’s just so easy to see how that dynamic could start up in about 100 different ways – the way people, and therefore for our young guy in question – other people, – are just so weird about sex, all round – shame is contagious).

    So Scray – imo this Maslow thing does not play out the way you are insinuating it does wrt sex, and therefore if you are sticking to your guns wrt defining manliness as contingent on success with women – no – believing that is just another way to fuck your head up, and doesn’t have any bearing on the realities of the matter either (but only seems like it does cause a bunch of people say so – but these people be wrong).

    For instance, in asia isn’t there some cultures where some men decide to remain celibate as holy men or something – like isn’t that a thing in some forms of buddhism. Do you think these guys are just little boys or babies? – that is ludicrous. Look some such guys could be running away from something and therefore weak – true – but to say that is what is going on carte blanche with all the siddhartha types (as in the early part of the character’s life in Herman Hess’s novel) – no. People may have legitimate reason to fashion their life like that and that doesn’t necessarily make them a little boy. And I’m sure these guys still have to whack off.

    Scray – as well there could be plenty or reasons for a guy choosing not to get with women at a particular juncture – like me for example for the last two years – cause every time I go start going the way, by way of social circle game (or just “life” or whatever you want to call it), I start sensing all the fucking drama that I will end up putting on myself. Like these ladies be liking me and then will want to start spending some time with me. I guess that is only normal though. But the point being – it is not drama free. I don’t think it is even drama free for you and YaReally. So …… here is good old me with my particular set of personal convictions that include how important it is for me to be up-front with people, respectful of myself and others – you know the basic golden rule suite of convictions, …… not exactly conducive to just getting down to getting the genitals together sans anything else – is it? So …… for me the choices are …….. accept some drama and do the girlfriend thing, or just get a girl dtf, fuck, and then immediately drop her and repeat (hopefully that’s all she wanted too – but lots of times – not), or do the girlfriend thing … don’t be too up front ….. get some fucks …. then when the drama starts …… drop her and feel shitty about that, or go see pros (a nice option actually except anything half decent costs at least $200), or just jerk-off enough that I won’t actually get worked up enough to actually repeatedly shell out the $200 for the pros.

    Look – absorbing this redpill stuff has helped me ….it has actually helped me to see that …… the ways things inevitably are…….. getting with women does not come without some fairly big costs one way or the other (in the least – at least some of your time and at least a bit of drama, or conversely less of your time but probably more drama). To think otherwise is a delusion. It is good to know this with certainty.

    With that certainty …. when I decide I can afford the time and the drama, …… I’ll go back in with fuller knowledge of what I am dealing with. So that is good. But …… my success or lack of success as the case may be, with women, doesn’t really have much to do with how I define my manliness – that is just ludicrous imo – and for those that adopt that opinion – not hard to see how that is gonna lead to no good for said individuals.

  21. @theMan

    I have never had a problem getting with a woman if I decide that is important. And I have had 1,000’s and 1,000’s of fucks in my life as per the usual

    okay, then what exactly are you disagreeing with me about.

    you literally are coming from a place of ‘well now that I can get legions of pussy, I can define myself as a man in other ways’

    okay….and how is this different from what i said?

    therefore if you are sticking to your guns wrt defining manliness as contingent on success with women – no – believing that is just another way to fuck your head up,

    https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQpL8fRCWFC1j0xiaJ_5rUu-nOXBn8XyDDL6ivpylSi0b7yXyq4Pw

    this poster is funny for one reason alone — what a loser, what a non-man who is 40 and has had NO success with women.

    For instance, in asia isn’t there some cultures where some men decide to remain celibate as holy men or something

    lol there can be a lot of things in a lot of places. Here in Western society esp the USA is where I’m at so who fucking cares about what happens on Mars or what could happen in Neverland.

    I start sensing all the fucking drama that I will end up putting on myself

    because you don’t know how to play the game.

    non-game players approach pussy and getting pussy like a woman or novice would approach things — by feel, by random chance, by blah blah blah.

    men have skills and rules and systems.

    i don’t get much drama because i know what creates drama and how to avoid it. why? because i know exactly how to get pussy in a way to avoid drama.

    getting with women does not come without some fairly big costs one way or the other

    look dude, you’re not the blue guy from Watchmen. you are a flesh and blood man who wants to fuck 24/7 and who would strongly prefer to fuck hot young pussy. trying to live your life as something you DEFINITELY ARE NOT ain’t my bag. shouldn’t be yours either.

  22. ” . . . one that even rollo himself would post.”

    It is one of a type, no different from each other than snowflakes, which is to say that except for irrelevant differences they are all the same.

    Rollo has already discussed one of type.

  23. Rollo

    I’d love to see your take on this recent piece and it’s relation to the FI.

    Bros Before Homes 27/06/2016

    https://newrepublic.com/article/134651/bros-homes

    Seems like caterwauling by epiphany stagers not getting their beta bucks from men eschewing buying homes for a more minimalist and experience based lifestyle. Apparently not owning things is sexist.

    YaReally, that makes you king of the sexists.

  24. @ The Man

    You wrote something that had me thinking for quite a while –

    ” Maybe the people haven’t changed so much as the “authority” as changed. it is only normal for healthy people to abhor the coercion of “authorities”. But back in the 1960’s, the authorities were much more on right on the political spectrum, than today. The rallying of the people for their rightful human liberties (expression of self agency as our rightful liberty), in the face of the dominance, coercion, and contempt of the “authorities” was so successful that the the ideological mindset of the authorities was forcefully moved from right of center to left of center, …. yet these new authorities are still enamored of domination, coercion and contempt for their fellow man. Now we have the apparent unconscious contempt shoved up our ass by way of the PC-speak.”

    Not to get into a 1500 word back and forth here…lol… but I sort of agree with you here, with just minor clarifications/perspective.

    Over the past 50 years or so, give or take, it is very true that the ” authority ” has definitely changed. Defining authority as Those who wield power and influence, along with legislating abilities and the direction of law enforcement ( soldiers on the ground dealing directly with The People ).

    50 years ago, the country still was, at it’s core, center right. Midway through the 60’s, there arose a significant pushback against recognized authority, instigated by the youngsters, teens and twenty-somethings. Over the course of the 60’s, society was violently at times, moved basically center left. The ” powers that be ” relented and softened the stance of the authorities ( except Goldwater and Nixon…lol ). The pendulum always swings.

    When the rebellious acquire concessions from those in power, it is only a matter of time before the rebellious become the new authority. The new power.

    And power corrupts when unchallenged, always.

    So the country was forcefully pushed way left of center. What you are stating is indeed fact. Far right and far left are extremes, and populations cannot thrive en mass under extremes. Both right and left become extreme. Both become intolerant or the other. Both demonize the other. It is amazing to witness.

    Ideology becomes as religion.

    On a personal note and observation, I saw great suffering under one of my favorite presidents, Ronald Wilson Reagan. He was a favorite for me because I expected him to do exactly what he said. I knew who I was dealing with in Reagan. ( incidentally, he would be drummed out of the GOP today as a RINO ). In the community where I dwelled, there was a nickname applied to Reagan – The Anti Christ – 6 characters in each name, 666. He was able to wrestle the nation back to center right. The prez that instituted the badly executed War on Drugs, managed only to triple the price of illegal drugs, igniting a feeding frenzy for cash and destroying millions of lives in the process. Just say No.

    The second fave prez of mine was Slick Billy Clinton. Much like Reagan, I knew what I was getting in Clinton – a master politician/bullshit artist. Clinton was even harder on the ” welfare state ” than Reagan was ( even though revisionist history seems to state the opposite ), but job creation was way up during Billy’s tenure. He did not pull the nation center left, but Center. 2 things I will always hold against Clinton was instituting a mass incarceration strategy, and dismantling Glass Steagal on his way out of office. But he smiled the whole time. Masterful.

    Now society is violently rocking back and forth between the extreme right and left. There is no visible center. This is why our policies and laws appear so ludicrous. This is how you have the Politically Correct nonsense on the one hand, and a Congress that has been paralyzed by extremist ideology. It’s the worst of both worlds. Look at the presidential candidates picked by the base of both parties. Really??? 2 extremes. Whoever is elected, expect a hard pull to the left or the right to follow. LOL, and expect half of the people, in either direction, to be very unhappy campers.

    No center pull in sight.

    Shirts or skins only.

    zfg. I survived them all.

    Just always remember the forgotten truth, there are more of ” us ” than there are of ” them “. Power only concedes to more power.

    Game the system. Obey fully and faithfully at your own risk.

  25. “No center pull in sight.”

    Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
    The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
    The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
    The best lack all conviction, while the worst
    Are full of passionate intensity.

  26. went out today. mall in bad city.

    but already getting burned out of the venues. don’t really want to go to these places besides to practice.

    last two days there have been zero girls i liked.

    also been stopping by some department stores, but same issue. zero girls i like.

  27. @ hank

    My man!!!!!

    Sounds like it’s time for some Night Fever. Time to locate some bars or clubs and see what’s what there.

    Always remember, there are billions of chicks. Billions I say!!! it is only a matter of time until you locate them…or some of them, not billions at once because they’re kinda spread out.

    Don’t get burned out man, just breath deep and relax a little bit.

    Ease your mind bro.

  28. Scray:

    “you literally are coming from a place of ‘well now that I can get legions of pussy, I can define myself as a man in other ways’”

    Well, this abundance mentality is a funny thing – you know the dick tends to say to the brain – hey bro – what have you done for my lately. Ah – but the brain says to the cock – hey dickhead – who is in control here? See what I am saying. Look – it is damaging to OCD-prone young guys to tell them they are worthless if they don’t get pussy. You are just going to royally fuck them up even worse. Why would you want to do that? Now – sure – it is much easier for me to say this basic message (that your manhood is not contingent on your success with women) after a full life of lot and lots of different kinds of experiences including some fucking – but the point being – it is still the correct basic message – so why in heaven’s name would you say otherwise to anyone? But otherwise, your other advice wrt how to get with women for those having that trouble is probably pretty much all good (except personally I would feature the self-respect and mutual-respect thing a bit more).

    Like this movie – the 40-year-old virgin, Steve Carrell – what a great guy – was great in that role. But why does that character have to be fashioned as a “what a loser, what a non-man”? I know it’s fictional, but in the movie his buddies thought he was very OCD and weird, but they still thought he was a great guy with a good heart that deserved their help and respect. And the story arc is …… yeah ….. the view was vindicated. so I think you got the implied sentiment of that poster wrong Scray.

    Scray – I’m sure you either spend time or drama. You be fooling us if you say that not on. I did ask you a bunch of questions a thread or two ago about what actually occurs within your 4-plate dynamic but you never answered. Man – I’m not saying you a shitty person or anything at all like that – I’m just saying I believe there is time and drama spent on your part maintaining that.

    “look dude, you’re not the blue guy from Watchmen. you are a flesh and blood man who wants to fuck 24/7 and who would strongly prefer to fuck hot young pussy. trying to live your life as something you DEFINITELY ARE NOT ain’t my bag. shouldn’t be yours either.”

    Scray – I want alot of things. I want my house renos to be done already for instance. Accepting some current limitations (that may be mitigated for, as time progresses, as I choose to apply energy and effort) without getting freaked out over that is not a mark against my manhood. Not buying that.

  29. @Blaximus

    Midway through the 60’s, there arose a significant pushback against recognized authority, instigated by the youngsters, teens and twenty-somethings.

    More like instigated by Soviet agents via the media, campus organizations, labor, and useful young idiots (of which I was one).

  30. @Hank

    last two days there have been zero girls i liked.

    also been stopping by some department stores, but same issue. zero girls i like.

    So, practice on girls you don’t like, chat up men, create a party on the fly.

  31. Guys that have not gotten pussy are in no way worthless. Not by any stretch of the imagination. That’s not what scray was saying at all.

    I good at readin’ and all.

    lol….

    Part of being a man is having sex with a woman. Call it a Rite of Passage if it must be labeled for argument’s sake.

    The desire is biologically hardwired.

    Having sex is not Nirvana, but it pretty fucking close initially. Off the top of my head, I can’t think of many things that one could consider a benchmark for manhood other than sex with a woman.

    Sure, a guy can be a captain of industry or a fireman or some such, but that stuff doesn’t really describe the most basic and natural achievement for a man. We are designed for sex with women ( regardless of ” preference ” to the contrary..).

    So honestly, a man is not 100% male without sex with a woman at some point and time.

    This sounds like a slight in some way, but it’s not at all. I can’t be called a pilot until I fly a plane.

    And if you think of it like this, it makes even more sense – A man may not be able to earn 1,000,000 bucks a year at any point in life. He probably won’t win a Gold Medal in the Olympics. He may not even be thought of highly by his peers.

    But he can have sex.

    At a bare minimum.

    Functioning as he was designed and employing his capabilities.

    Listen…. Shhhh!!! You hear that?? Millions of guys fucking right now as I type. Millions of men meeting their call in life. Some are rich and handsome, most are not. Lol. I can’t catch a football like Odell Beckham but both of us will be fucking.

    He he he….

  32. @ asd

    ” More like instigated by Soviet agents via the media, campus organizations, labor, and useful young idiots (of which I was one).”

    Not in all cases man. Not at all. That’s a widely accepted Romanticized version. I believe that the whole ” soviet influence ” thing was more of an exception as opposed to being a hard and fast rule.

    Well, at least in my life.

  33. @scray

    Jews are known for being the least capable lawyers, so I’m with you on laughing at their ability to question witnesses. I mean, you know, Jews are all so stupid when it comes to verbal stuff.

  34. @Blax

    All you had to do was examine who funded various events. It was published in newspapers. Sure, not everything was done by Soviets, but they typically started the ball rolling. The elites were in the pockets of the Soviets–media, Hollywood, labor, academia.

  35. Hey Blax – if a young guy is having problems getting the pussy ….. maybe he should just go see a pro that specializes in that sort of thing. For many such young guys – that’l probably fix his head enough he can get on with things (he might need a few visits though). This rights of passage for men thing – if most of that is being eliminated, and then women hold the access to the remaining one – the safety valve for that, by way of the prostitute, might be a necessity for some.

    But after fixing his head, the young guy should try to get past defining his manliness as success with women. This is just so damaging. For one thing it is a sell out to what has been called the FI here. This example of how Scray wants to call some guys out as little boys, babies and not-men, over their lack of success. I mean it is just so stupid that it is actually hilarious. Why would you give women as a group such power that they don’t deserve? That be bluepill – no other way to describe it – bluepill thru and thru.

    Come’on – the sexual market valuation machine is just so fickle and mean-spirited in a lot of ways. Who in their right mind would want to define any portion of their worth in terms of something as schizophrenic as SMV. Game actually reveals this about the SMV (i.e – the fickleness and the ease for which mean-spirited-ness can creep in). So the puas got no excuse reasoning like this.

  36. @Blax

    Remember how the John Birch Society was vilified for pointing out the dangers of the Trilateral Commission, Bilderbergers, etc.? The elites even laughed at the Birchers, claiming that those organizations didn’t even exist. The Birchers’ claims are no longer considered fringe, even though the Birchers’ rep has suffered from all the propaganda.

    The Trilateral Commission and Bilderbergers are run by the elites. No one doubts that anymore and only the naïve think that those organizations don’t wield tremendous influence. The Birchers may have magnified their influence, but not their danger.

  37. @ The Man

    Lol. I don’t think a guy always has to fix his head to get/have sex. He needs understanding and reasoning to go along with his natural drive.

    Idk, I don’t get that scray is saying sex defines a guy’s manliness. I take what he’s saying as, sex is one defining factor. An important defining factor.

    scray is talking about a lack of success insofar as a lack of trying or gaining understanding. That’s where I thought the discussion began, the talk about some men not needing or wanting sex, and the debunking of that train of thought. I might be wrong…. nah, I think I’m right. : )

    Idk about sexual market validation or anything like that. I know that chicks like dicks and magic tricks. I’ve seen guys that looked like the creature from the Black Lagoon get laid, so validate that. Lol.

    What I do know is that ANY man can get laid. Conversely, not all men know this or believe it. FI notwithstanding, women were made for us, and made to submit. It is a part of their nature. Their programming.

    Oh yeah, and water is wet.

    If a man does not believe this, then he will be at the mercy of an unforgiving foe. Remember, the only power that women can maintain is ultimately an illusion made possible by the inaction or lack of knowledge of men.

    Gain some knowledge, set shit straight(er).

    I think you’re off base here with the talk of what PUA’s profess. Buuutttt… YaReally and scray can set you straighter more efficiently than I can, if they so choose.

    Just my 2 cents.

    But what you said about the Rite of Passage being eliminated may have some validity. At least it seems that way to the untrained eyeball. In the end, women are still women at their core ( except for the 300 pound, blue haired ones..). They play a game, we can play a better one.

  38. I couldn’t remember the name of the Council on Foreign Relations that was also considered dangerous by the JBS. The Southern Poverty Law Center is another organization that I consider very dangerous.

  39. @ asd

    ” Remember how the John Birch Society was vilified for pointing out the dangers of the Trilateral Commission, Bilderbergers, etc.? The elites even laughed at the Birchers, claiming that those organizations didn’t even exist. The Birchers’ claims are no longer considered fringe, even though the Birchers’ rep has suffered from all the propaganda.

    The Trilateral Commission and Bilderbergers are run by the elites. No one doubts that anymore and only the naïve think that those organizations don’t wield tremendous influence. The Birchers may have magnified their influence, but not their danger.”

    Man, we could get into a very deep discussion here. But I’ve already veered way off any reasonable topic replying to The Man. I’m exercising self control today…at least.

    Suffice to say that I am familiar with the Birchers and the Bilderbergers, but in my lifetime, I had bigger, different fish to fry. Hence my assertion that the commie/elite angle didn’t really apply in my case, or the majority of folks I knew. That stuff was on the periphery.

    But you are making valid points.

  40. ” The Southern Poverty Law Center is another organization that I consider very dangerous.”

    Lol. see? As a son of the south, I have the opposite opinion.

  41. Blax – yeah the war on drugs and the mass incarceration strategy are two of the dumbest things I have seen in my life time. Shit like this fuels people’s wonderings about behind the scenes puppet-masters and such …. and dark dark conspiracy theories about the future. But it is probably just dumb humans being dumb.

    Hey – like I was alluding to in my comment way above – maybe the solution is ……… getting better at recognizing when rightful human liberties like the expression of self agency, are being trampled by way of the dominance, coercion, and contempt of authorities. You know ….I happen to believe that there are certain personal convictions that actually aid one in making such recognitions.

    “dk, I don’t get that scray is saying sex defines a guy’s manliness. I take what he’s saying as, sex is one defining factor. An important defining factor. scray is talking about a lack of success insofar as a lack of trying or gaining understanding. That’s where I thought the discussion began, the talk about some men not needing or wanting sex, and the debunking of that train of thought. I might be wrong…. nah, I think I’m right. : ) ”

    But Scray did insinuate that success with women defines a guy’s manliness, at least a few times now.

    The convo started when I pointed out that by my logic….. the focusing on “game” in order to have mastery with women is the wrong ordering of priorities, wrt over all success for a man’s life (including the best possible mastery with women).. Blax – from what you have commented over the last long while, I take it that you would agree with my sentiment (and anyway it now turns out that Julien Blanc of RSD agrees with my sentiment as well – but perhaps for different reasons than me – don’t know enough about him to know his full reasons for his similar stance). .

  42. @ The Man

    I too believe that focusing on mastering game is very important for men, because ” game ” is much more far reaching in managing one’s life, than ” just ” for having sex with women.

    Re: People respecting other’s rights or whatever, It is an awful life strategy for a man to depend upon the kindness or understanding of others in any way. If a man gets respect and kindness in some automatic fashion, that’s just a plus. Respect is either earned or taken. You either speak up for your rights, or watch them vanish. Pretty much, this has always been so.

    The attempt to legislate human rights and respect is a tricky prospect imo. It’s hit or miss depending on who has the smarts, or the biggest stick.

    Only death is automatic.

    You’ve read enough here about ” game ” that I am surprised that you don’t really get it. It’s Game or be Gamed in essence.

    Or as the youngsters used to say ” Game recognize Game “.

    Men should have sex in order to be complete. I don’t see any controversy. It does not give women POWER if the man has the correct mindset. That mindset is masculine at it’s core, and men are…wait for it….wait for it… designed to be masculine.

    Women love masculinity.

    Fuck the FI.

    LaughOutLoud.

  43. Concerning the NewRublic article linked above, it seems like the minimalist man is the new incarnation of a counterweight to the FI.

    Minimalism is the perfect exposition of the mental point of origin, my life, my money for me and my journey sans societal expectations, no epiphany beta bucks nesting accoutrements.

    Experience over things. The modern version of the vilified Victorian dandy.

    It stands against the modern tide of ‘things’ representing identity and increases signalling noise for beta bucks status identification.

    The princess gets to play house while Prince Charming is out having the time of his life.

    An an aside, a link to a great new writer in the sphere, if the Last Psychiatrist was up your alley this guy follows in his footsteps, really great writing style.

    https://killtoparty.com

  44. Blax – yes correct – legislating something like common human decency is very tricky. But my point about ….. let’s call it the standard golden-rule suite of personal convictions …… is that such personal convictions provide one with personal power to better recognize when authority is being abused …. and earlier recognition by the populace would be very helpful …… us living in democracies and all ……. and the human tendency to otherwise kneejerk to memetics (as expounded by Bernays for instance). We each have to be more savvy so we collectively can be more savvy wrt earlier recognition of power abuse by authorities. In a lot of ways we are living in Orwell’s 1984-lite …. but it doesn’t have to be this way ….. and if we don’t do something about it is probably only going to get worse, like 1984-heavy. That is my point about the personal convictions around self-respect, and mutual respect, and being up-front with others and such ……. upholding these convictions, personally, and collectively if there is enough individual buy-in, ….. this will naturally begin to bleed into the smaller institutions , and then into the larger institutions and so on ……. that is the cool thing about our culture …… it can be done ……. the 1960’s was a good example of what can be done. But ……. in the 1960’s …… there still wasn’t enough understanding about these common principles of common human decency and so, the “them vs us’rs” hijacked the common human decency agenda, and we end up with the same old thing, but a different flavor. I mean this will sound hokey but … wasn’t what I am saying MLKJ’s philosophy?

    OK Blax – on your contention I am not getting something about game here. Do you think it would be better for humans to conduct themselves by way of application of their personal agency (their power to make meaningful choices), or do you think it is better for humans to conduct themselves by way of operant conditioning strategies designed to thwart the application of personal agency in the other? What is your conception of the game concepts here – wrt which of these is emphasized (pua game as well as redpill-concepts game for a man’s life in general)?

  45. @blax @asd

    Sounds like it’s time for some Night Fever. Time to locate some bars or clubs and see what’s what there.

    been to bars. that’s what I was doing for the past month. But out of maybe 25 hours of doing that, socializing the whole time, saw maybe 5 girls I liked, and 4 were on the same day in a one hour time frame.

    The malls have a much higher number of girls I like, even though its still a small number. At the bars there is just not enough of them practice — I can do socializing, but I am already good at that. I need experience in sexualizing/escalating and in instadating and day 2.

    Nightclubs are perfect, but there are none near where I live. Closest is several hours away.

    So, practice on girls you don’t like, chat up men, create a party on the fly.

    Did that last month. Don’t mind chatting with people, but people here aren’t my type. Very rare to find someone I’d actually want to hang out with besides just shoot the shit for a few minutes.

    Place is bad all around for girls and guys. Don’t have any friends or hobbies. And not many venues to work at, so kind of have to keep going to the same ones.

    I venture to new ones as I find them, but they are almost all very bad. Malls have been the best so far by a large margin.

    Can’t practice on girls I dont like. Need a least a little attraction to get me to push through and game, especially if I am trying to do something I haven’t done before.

    So that’s why I get worn out. Don’t want to be here, don’t have anything to do.

    Still keep going out, I just don’t have the resources or venues that most people would have. Pretty much just have game to work on, and that’s about it.

  46. @theMan

    For many such young guys – that’l probably fix his head enough he can get on with things (he might need a few visits though). This rights of passage for men thing – if most of that is being eliminated, and then women hold the access to the remaining one – the safety valve for that, by way of the prostitute, might be a necessity for some.

    lol we are saying the same thing, you’re just focusing on a part in male development that most people aren’t at yet….

    you’re like ‘yeah if a young guy has trouble getting women HE SHOULD WORK ON THAT YOU KNOW, RIGHT OF PASSAGE AND ALL'” and then skip to ‘but after that….he should…”

    WE ARE TALKING ABOUT THE FIRST PART

    many young men and men in the manosphere HAVE TROUBLE getting women.

    since you have no problem banging hot women on the reg, good job, you can advance up the maslow hierarchy and define yourself in other ways AS I SAID IN THE BEGINNING.

    But Scray did insinuate that success with women defines a guy’s manliness, at least a few times now.

    it’s the first thing, yes.

    you are built to fuck women. you are biologically hardwired to go out and fuck women. this is what you were created and made to do.

    so….yeah, if you’re fucking up on that, it’s hard for me to take this whole ‘look to the heavens and mount olympus and find purpose there’ stuff

    it’s just going to damage guys and make them go skydiving instead of just going to a damned bar and opening their mouth and risking being *gasp!* rejected by a *gasp!* HOT WOMYN!!!!!

    Like this movie – the 40-year-old virgin, Steve Carrell – what a great guy – was great in that role. But why does that character have to be fashioned as a “what a loser, what a non-man”

    i don’t care why. i’m not here to ponder why. the fact is that in this society here and now, that’s what he’s seen as.

    I’m sure you either spend time or drama

    okay well you said drama at first. i don’t mind spending my time fucking hot women, so ya, i put in the time.

    and any time a chick tries to throw me drama, i walk out and soft Next. that’s not ‘dealing with drama’ that’s the opposite.

    without getting freaked out over that is not a mark against my manhood. Not buying that.

    the mark against it is assuming a viewpoint you don’t actually have — the overseer of sexual dynamics,

    @thasdgamer

    Jews are known for being the least capable lawyers, so I’m with you on laughing at their ability to question witnesses. I mean, you know, Jews are all so stupid when it comes to verbal stuff.

    yes because it was Alan Dershowitz 2000 years ago doing the questioning right? you have to use a stereotype that actually dates back more than 120 years or so (Ashkenazi jewish verbal prowess) for the joke to really work.

  47. @blax

    You’ve read enough here about ” game ” that I am surprised that you don’t really get it. It’s Game or be Gamed in essence.

    right there.

    there is a Game out there.

    you can either get tossed around and not know wtf is going on.

    or you can become a Player.

  48. Scray:

    I said: “Like this movie – the 40-year-old virgin, Steve Carrell – what a great guy – was great in that role. But why does that character have to be fashioned as a “what a loser, what a non-man”

    You said: “i don’t care why. i’m not here to ponder why. the fact is that in this society here and now, that’s what he’s seen as.”

    OK I agree with you on that being the current culture. But this “what a loser, what a non-man” meme is fucked up though and should be driven out of culture. Like – if I ever hear that shit coming from a woman I laugh right in her face and call her out for being such a low-value person (or if circumstances dictate and I can’t – I sure do let the others involved know later, that I don’t abide by fucked up shit like that) and then I call it out for what it is – the spinning of the cogs of the woman-status-addiction and the fierce competition women have around status definitions. The guy is being used as scapegoat to further said woman’s agenda on that front. I’m not shy to call that shit out. I don’t care if people be pissed at me over that. Everybody ought to be doing this imo.

    “the mark against it is assuming a viewpoint you don’t actually have — the overseer of sexual dynamics,”

    Yes – or course you are right – I don’t have that viewpoint, but the point I was making is that I don’t only want to fuck hot young pussy. There are other considerations for everybody that just naturally come up as life progresses, and as you get older, the other considerations tend to grow vis-a-vis the consideration of obtaining the hot young pussy, but that condition is not a mark against my manhood.

    Otherwise Scray I guess we agreeing then – yes? Do you agree then that focusing on “game” (as in pua game) in order to have mastery with women is the wrong ordering of priorities, wrt over all success for a man’s life (including the best possible mastery with women), because a man’s priority should be to develop better mastery and control over himself first and foremost, which is the endeavor that will ultimately bring better results all round (including the best possible mastery with women, if that is his desire)?

  49. Not sure how to respond directly to comments on this wordy ass blog but to ya really Most men do not deserve to live, much less a Princess. Get real.

  50. Blaximus
    June 26th, 2016 at 7:10 pm

    It wasn’t just ‘Nam. Thinking differently was in the air. All kinds of strange religions. Drugs. Pot. Psychedelics.

    But things turn. Each generation wants “different”. After unrest, and change all the time stability is wanted. And the cycles repeat. We may be in for a new cycle.

    Risking Rewards.

  51. scray
    June 28th, 2016 at 4:01 pm

    The reports on Jesus were written 50 to 100 years after his departure. I don’t trust any of the specifics. What I do trust is the overall trends.

    1. Old Books should not define how we live
    2. Governments are not your friend
    3. Religion is best done as a solitary adventure. Government is of no help. Worse. It is an adversary. State Religions are for the benefit of the State.

    For the most part very few “Christians” live by those precepts. Why? Human nature. The reversion to the mean. The masses WANT to be told what to do. Mostly.

    But hey. You want the reports of witnesses? I’ll play.

    Hebrew Etymology

  52. @The Man
    “Do you agree then that focusing on “game” (as in pua game) in order to have mastery with women is the wrong ordering of priorities, wrt over all success for a man’s life (including the best possible mastery with women), because a man’s priority should be to develop better mastery and control over himself first and foremost, which is the endeavor that will ultimately bring better results all round (including the best possible mastery with women, if that is his desire)?”

    Look dude, I already broke this shit down in my reply that you ignored. You’re either purposely trolling or just ignoring anything anyone says that doesn’t fit this round hole you’ve crammed a square peg into.

    You admit yourself that you’ve had no problems getting laid. To a guy who’s having sex, sex isn’t a big deal. Julien has stuck his dick inside pussy and felt desire from a woman. So have you, so has Scray, so have I, we’ve all felt what it’s like to be desired by a woman.

    Things are VERY DIFFERENT for an incel. Give this shit a read and really try to wrap your head around how much this shit haunts guys in the background:

    https://whoism3.wordpress.com/2012/11/17/confessions-of-a-reformed-incel/

    No, they can’t go to a hooker to “get fixed”, because a hooker does not DESIRE them. It’s not about the P in V thrusting motion, it’s about having the capacity to handle a part of your life that’s eating at you (whether you try to bottle it up or neuter your sexual desires etc…if you’re masturbating to thoughts of women, you have sexual urges).

    You are a guy who’s been eating steak dinner, trying to tell starving ethiopian children to not define their happiness based on having food in their bellies. You’re either incapable of empathizing with other men (which is entirely possible if you’re on the spectrum or sociopathic or some shit), or you’re purposely trolling.

    When you can put yourself in that ethiopian child’s situation, where food is something they need and can’t get, then you’ll understand what life is like for an incel guy.

    What Julien is talking about is the long-term, for WHEN YOU HAVE SHIT HANDLED. He’s not saying “hey, you haven’t had a woman touch you in 25 years? Go out and start a business! Go out and climb a mountain!” like you’re trying to warp his perspective into, so you can cram it into your retarded hole.

    What we’ve always recommended is getting your shit handled with women and then focus on other stuff. If you just focus on other stuff, you won’t get your shit handled with women and it will eat at you. Try to work on learning to empathize with people who are different than you.

    You are just taking a very roundabout flowery path to make the same incorrect “game is about pussy-begging and putting women on a pedestal!!” argument that thousands of feminists and anti-gamers have made before you which has been dealt with a thousand fucking times in red pill communities, even here and at CH, if you’d do your fucking reading instead of mentally masturbating.

    @scray @The Man
    “WE ARE TALKING ABOUT THE FIRST PART

    many young men and men in the manosphere HAVE TROUBLE getting women.

    since you have no problem banging hot women on the reg, good job, you can advance up the maslow hierarchy and define yourself in other ways AS I SAID IN THE BEGINNING.”

    This. Fucking retarded reading this guy’s shit. I get now why everyone was shitting on this dude way back lol

    @Reb
    “Not sure how to respond directly to comments on this wordy ass blog but to ya really Most men do not deserve to live, much less a Princess. Get real.”

    lol that came out of nowhere.

  53. Giving peak-SMV girls a glimpse of The Wall – the “Not A Princess” experience. Note the realization of how heavily their value is dependent on their looks. I wonder how many of these career grrrrls got ‘woke’ out of their professional ambitions & into the idea of capitalizing on their SMV to start a family ASAP… or am I giving their intellects too much credit lol?

  54. Emily
    June 28th, 2016 at 2:23 pm

    I know you are “gone” but I can’t help myself. Well maybe I don’t want to. This time.

    The LTR is happiest when she is my willing doormat. She fights against it because, “feminism”. But none the less it is what she likes.

    She broke out in tears during our last Congress because I was “mistreating” her. Well OK. why didn’t she get up and walk away? Because I did the worst thing I could do to her. Proved she liked it. A lot. And thus the tears. I was destroying her self image. And it excited the hell out of her at the same time. So much that despite the pain she couldn’t leave.

    Afterwards I pointed all this out to her. And she agreed (for a while).

  55. @Johnycomelately
    “Seems like caterwauling by epiphany stagers not getting their beta bucks from men eschewing buying homes for a more minimalist and experience based lifestyle.”

    Well if you don’t buy a house, what is she supposed to move into so she can quit living in her parents house?? lol

    Google the author of that article and you’re in for a world of lols. She’s exactly what you’d expect. Post-wall lonely single woman self-important hipster douchebag. She has a blog documenting her experiences being cheap as fuck too (that’s literally the theme of the blog…but MEN being cheap? NOPE! Shame time!). And she’s writing a book on Privilege too. lol

    Good article though, and goes back to what I’ve been saying about how culture is shifting. I picture a future coming where guys live together (#nohomo lol) and just go tear shit up until they can afford to or decide to live solo. Focus on gym, casual pussy, career, etc and understanding/discussing life the way we do here, through their 20s, without anything sucking their finances away (girls, mortgage, kids, etc).

    It makes sense on a lot of levels…if you have two guys who aren’t looking to settle in their 20s because they want to focus on that other shit, why not get a sick place you can split rent on and have a cool bro for a roomie and have poon pass through whenever as you go on random adventures separately or with your buddy, VS paying for a less awesome place yourself or shacking up with a girlfriend and locking yourself down into mortgages and having to build a man-cave in your garage and shit. Then in your 30s get your own place and settle if you want. Kind of like a business incubator arrangement lol

    Note that the author picks guys who live with their parents or mooch off their girlfriends on purpose, to paint the lifestyle in as bad a light as possible. But I have buddies with legit bank who have their own pimp looking houses and sick cars and shit who are turning to valuing experiences over settling down. They probably will when they’re in their mid/late 30s, but not in their 20s or early 30s. Part of that is they can’t find a quality Madonna to settle with in 2016, but part is just that more guys are picking up red pill concepts as it spreads and are becoming more independent and feeling like they want to go DO shit and not be tied to some nagging girl who’s probably going to cheat on them lol These are red pill guys though, like the ones who’ve picked up little doses of it, not necessarily PUAs or reading TRM or anything. The Red Pill is spreading all over these days (which is amazing to see and part of why I write, to help spread the teachings).

    “Apparently not owning things is sexist. YaReally, that makes you king of the sexists.”

    The things you own end up owning you, and all.

    @Junior
    Fucking funny vid. Will those girls remember the lesson and take it into the real world after the show? Fuuuck no lol They’ll put on a big show in the moment for this show so they can seem deep and emphatic, but they’ll forget it all the second they get a night of attention from men at their local pub.

    I accidentally hinted to a fuckbuddy that her career success was basically because she’s a hot girl and that guys don’t care about any of that stuff and her face looked like I had just stomped on her SOUL. It was like kicking a puppy dog lol Dat feminism runs deep.

    But girls are jumping on board this “experiences over possessions” thing too, in the classic “well if YOU get to do this, then WE get to do this too!” feminine way. The problem is 1) they aren’t happy when they hit the wall and realize the more “experiences” they had and the more time they spent on those, the less a high-value man will want them and 2) they still cling to possessions like crazy…they won’t just travel, they’ll travel to a 5-star hotel and eat at a 5-star restaraunt lol So they just rack up debt on top of it which, again, no high-value guy wants to deal with. You can be the hottest girl in the world but if you come at me with $100k of debt and you’ve got like an english lit degree instead of being a fucking neurosurgeon or something, I mean, you’re throwing me alllll sorts of red flags lol

  56. @YaReally

    Profound how that plays out irl. A close bud married a girl from a latin country renowned for it’s millions living in poverty. The girl doesn’t come from affluence but yet somehow didn’t have the monetary sense to avoid coming to the relationship with at least two (possibly three) maxed out credit cards, which he cleared for her on the assumption that she’d pay him back. She’s now a Phd candidate lol & refuses to cook… while he works full time to return home & prepare dinner 7 nights a week. 7 FUCKING NIGHTS A WEEK lol. While she has apparently made an effort to repay some of the money, pretty sure the guy hasn’t recovered the majority of his coin, & now she’s all clear to walk away with half his hefty savings that I know he’s been working hard to bank – her ‘half’ would easily be twice as much as she could expect to save in her LIFE overseas. Blows my mind but all I can do is be the best support for him & make sure to amp up his value by playfully pointing out to her what he’s actually bringing to the table when she complains about whatever issue’s bothering her that day.

    I tried dropping advice to him back in the day to get the fuck out there & be social & learn to understand you’ve got waaaay more options than a chick 30,000 miles away when they were in a long-distance relationship (fucking INSANITY lol) but he wouldn’t have a bar of it. Took him out a year ago & opened a group of girls & had an HB6 wanting to take him home within 30mins – he was like a deer in the headlights lol didn’t know what to do. But now it’s just damage control. And it’s going to be even shittier if the marriage busts & he loses half his shit & hits hard times in early / mid 40s, & guys like me around him have to make the call on how much we step in to support vs. like, “look man, you knew the risks & went ahead with it all – I’ve got my own shit to handle”. Obviously you do what you can, but it’ll be fucking nasty no doubt.

  57. “Lololol, why the hell would I stalk ANY guy?”

    Your personal motivations remain a mystery to me. I’m still trying to understand why you’ve lied about so much, so often, in a completely anonymous forum where no one really cares and candor would probably get you further if discussion is the point.

    But since you asked… it’s pretty clear you’re stalking Rollo. So there’s one. How many times has he kicked you out of here now?

  58. @Liz

    I’m still trying to understand why you’ve lied about so much, so often, in a completely anonymous forum where no one really cares and candor would probably get you further if discussion is the point.

    She’s a young woman and needs the practice. As you’ve said before, she’s terrible at it. hah

  59. Liz
    June 29th, 2016 at 5:10 am

    She is probably not completely anonymous to Rollo. Some where along the way she probably gave a valid e-mail address to register.

    I’d say your conclusion is highly probable.

    LOL.

  60. “She’s a young woman and needs the practice. As you’ve said before, she’s terrible at it. hah”

    As an Italian I almost feel compelled to offer some pointers.

  61. “Bring those supplies on over to us, Axis friends. We have North Africa covered and the Mediterranean is secured! No worries….”

  62. YaReally:

    I said (to Scray): “Do you agree then that focusing on “game” (as in pua game) in order to have mastery with women is the wrong ordering of priorities, wrt over all success for a man’s life (including the best possible mastery with women), because a man’s priority should be to develop better mastery and control over himself first and foremost, which is the endeavor that will ultimately bring better results all round (including the best possible mastery with women, if that is his desire)?”

    You said: “Look dude, I already broke this shit down in my reply that you ignored. You’re either purposely trolling or just ignoring anything anyone says that doesn’t fit this round hole you’ve crammed a square peg into.”

    OK – your answer to the question I put to Scray it is – “it is not the wrong ordering until it is” – right? So …… correlating that with the other sentiments implied here, around that dynamic …. you get ……”my manhood is defined by my success with women until I have success with women and then I get to find out that that POV was fucked up” – right? Why is it weird for me to point out that there is a zen-like output provided by this recursive irl algorithm? If one can allow themselves to ponder that ….. you probably are going to wonder what else is occurring in the psyche of the irl practitioner of said algorithm, that will allow for the output of the zen koan – yes?

    I read the incel rant you linked. That was interesting. I especially liked the part about the turning point in this guy’s epiphany when his meltdown led directly to him is getting desire sex from the strippers. Yes!! Reminds me of Blax’s story about what happened after then end of his first marriage and went all “revolving door installation needed for his stripper-banging bachelor pad”,at that particular point ion his life adventures. Yes!! I love these kind of life stories from other guys. Like I’m not being facetious when I say somebody should handle that material in just the right way, for a screenplay – handled by way of Tarintino meets Scorcese meets Bergman meets Kubrick. Yes!! (maybe I will do that! – yes!).

    Anyway, back to our ‘practitioner of zen by way of women’ – what is really going on here within this guy’s psyche? I think there are two main elements. First he must understand that sex and love are very loosely correlated but do not exist in a causal relationship. Look – I can not claim to be an expert at all wrt how this particular false belief arises, because for me I never even ever had this false belief. I remember our social studies teacher in grade 8 I think it was, asking the class of 13 year-olds for hands wrt to who thought sex was contingent on love and then asking for hands wrt to who though sex was not contingent on love. So ……. I really couldn’t believe it ….. nerdy old me (who alot of other people pretty much thought I was disturbed at that time – though I really wasn’t) …… I was the only one that didn’t raise my hand for the first question and the only one the raised my hand for the second question. I still remember just thinking to myself as I looked over at everyone else, all the other boys and girls …… social conditioning man …… either these people are brainwashed or they are lying …… either way … wow – the power of the social conditioning to just go along with everyone else. Mindblowing. And now they are all going to probably double down on labeling me as disturbed. Ha! I have had many similar experiences about all kinds of other socially conditioned memes, for which the unconscious buy-in, once you see it clearly … is just mindblowing. And that does make me realize I am subject to this too!, and probably don’t even know the social scripts I am subject to in this way, that I have incorporated so deeply that it is unconscious – and instead I just think that I have made up my own pretty little head about it – Ha! – the human condition man – you gotta have some compassion for people (and yourself too) when you see this shit.

    Anyway, back to our ‘practitioner of zen by way of women’ – what is the other element going on here in this guy’s psyche. Well …… it is the want for ironclad confidence isn’t it? He doesn’t have it ….. therefore has a lack of success with women …… until he gains at least a strong facsimile of it …….. and then …. presto …… he has success with at least some women! Ha! So …… what the guy is actually looking for, and what the women are attracted to, what everybody actually find attractive about other people is ……… good old genuine self-confidence …… the kind that is ironclad …… why is it ironclad? Cause it has been well tested, man, and found to be worthy ……. by what dynamic does this happen? ……… for the man …… by way of forming some strong convictions that inform his behavior, allowing him to more or less effortlessly act in ways that do not produce too much if any anxiety for himself ……. because his particular convictions are just so good ……. no longer can anybody kick the confidence-legs from beneath him, because the constellation of his convictions hang together in tensegrity (a Buckminster Fuller term), each conviction strengthening the rest, by way of a tension that is not so irreconcilable as to be akin to a breaking tension.

    YaReally – it is my contention that, at the basic, this is what is really going on in a man’s life. I’m just calling it the way I sees it man. Pretty sure that don’t make me a retard or a troll or whatever.

  63. @man

    “I’m just calling it the way I sees it man. Pretty sure that don’t make me a retard or a troll or whatever.”

    What makes you a retarded troll is your inability to see it any way but yours combined with your endless regurgitation

  64. “as well there could be plenty or reasons for a guy choosing not to get with women at a particular juncture – like me for example for the last two years – cause every time I go start going the way, by way of social circle game (or just “life” or whatever you want to call it), I start sensing all the fucking drama that I will end up putting on myself.”

    @theman

    Sounds like ego to me. Drama isn’t something you have to deal with. You have all the answers right here. If you’re afraid of social circle drama then approach some strangers.

  65. redlight

    “What makes you a retarded troll is your inability to see it any way but yours combined with your endless regurgitation”

    Are you sure your criticism makes any sense? Tell me your perspective in terms of the differences, as compared to the perspective that I have just outlined.

  66. Andy – by “drama” I mean having to deal with another person’s motivations, focus, desires and the like. I say “drama” instead of just “time”, because though dealing with this dynamic entails the consumption of one’s time, it also entails the consumption of one’s cognitive/emotional resources, by way of having to actually consider someone else’s motivations, focus, and desires that are not all going to magically align with yours. I don’t actually mind dealing with this in a more limited way, by way of a simple exchange of perspectives, like regular friendships, with well mapped out boundaries at to just how much will be expected of the other party around this (pretty much should be limited to “consideration” only for friendships). But when romantic (don’t like that word but you know what I mean) partnering occurs, the boundaries are usually redrawn, and then there is often an expectation that each should pay at least some homage to the other’s motivations, focus and desires. Unless you approach strangers and do fuckbuddes like you said. Until that isn’t really on (perhaps for same reasons I have outlined) and then you gotta drop that, rinse and repeat.

    Look – I ain’t complaining Andy. I’m just saying I see clearly that this in fact is the way it is. I’ll probably do one of the various options I mentioned earlier when I am willing to provide the necessary cognitive/emotional resources for said dynamic. You know – that might be any time now. Coming to the conclusion that redpill does not actually offer any escape from this dynamic (but does help one more clearly see this dynamic in action, while it is occurring – which of course is real power) has been a necessary and helpful step for me to come to in my own mind.

  67. @yareally

    “Google the author of that article and you’re in for a world of lols. She’s exactly what you’d expect. Post-wall lonely single woman self-important hipster douchebag. ”

    She’s married

  68. Rollo retweeted a reference to a list of 25 books every man should read (to which the original tweet mentioned that TRM and 48 Laws should be added.)

    I mention this because it is a maxim that red pill practice and game has a lot to to with self improvement and improving mindset (inner game). There are some good books on that list and with just browsing the reviews and google searching you can become more self aware about your own personal goals and happiness.

    http://www.wellbuiltstyle.com/25-books-every-man-should-read/

    @Blaximus and YaReally:

    In the one particular book 30 Lessons For Living, author and gerontologist Karl Pillemer interviews thousands of Americans over the age of 65 and distills their advice on a wide variety of topics including love, happiness, money, and health into an easy to read format.

    Here are a few gems from the book:

    “Almost to a person, they viewed happiness as a choice, not the result of how life treats you. Even if nine decades long, life was seen by the elders as too short to waste on pessimism, boredom, and disillusionment.”

    “No one – not a single person out of a thousand – said that to be happy you should try to work as hard as you can to make money to buy things you want.”

    In one of the reviews on Amazon for this book:

    What can you do to live a life without regret? How do you want to look back on your life? Are you spending this finite time well? In one of my favorite lines, the author depicts the experts’ perspective: “Looking at how younger people squander time, they are like members of a desert tribe staring in dismay at our profligate use of water.”

    I see a lot of old people in my office every day. A lot of them are very calm and non-anxious. But there is an earnestness about them. I can sense that they take there own responsibility for their lives and their happiness or self satisfaction or self esteem. I don’t sense that the outside chaos of a way of life in decline really matters to their sense of a life well lived.

    Think of all the frustration and woe is us in the manosphere. Do not let outside influences dictate your happiness, your motivation or your limits to accomplishments.

    Here was an author’s anecdote:

    An idea began to percolate in my mind: maybe there is something about getting older that teaches you how to live better. A question dawned on me that gave birth to this project: Could we look at the oldest Americans as experts on how to live our lives? And could we tap that wisdom to help us make the most of our lifetimes?

    I’m a bit embarrassed to say that this insight came as a surprise to me, because I have spent my career as a gerontologist: someone who studies people in life’s “third age”–typically thought of as the period after age sixty-five. Over the past thirty years, I have conducted dozens of studies and published scientific articles on topics like the stress of taking care of parents with Alzheimer’s disease, ways of helping elders deal with chronic pain and disability, and how to improve care in nursing homes. In my studies I have used rigorous methods, scientifically selected samples, and proven measures to try to understand the aging process. But I felt I was missing something nevertheless. Despite decades studying the problems of older people, I had a nagging suspicion that there was more they could tell me about how to live the good life.

    Then one particular event pushed me firmly in a new direction and launched an effort that would occupy (some would say obsess) me for five years. It was a turning point, the importance of which I didn’t realize immediately but which eventually led to 30 Lessons for Living.

    My work often takes me into nursing homes. I don’t know how much time you have spent in nursing homes, but you can take my word for it that they aren’t the happiest places on the planet. Although most provide good care, they have an institutional feel that depresses the spirits as you pass through the front door. Both the residents and the staff know that entering the home is a one-way street; for almost everyone, the only exit is the end of life. Nursing homes look after the sickest and most vulnerable people in our society, many of whom have lost their loved ones, their ability to care for themselves, and sometimes even their memories and sense of self.

    On this particular day, a nurse I was chatting with said, “Do you have a minute? I’d like you to meet June Driscoll. I hear you like to meet interesting older people”–which I do–“and I’ve got one for you.”

    The room was typically institutional, with two beds. June, sitting in an armchair next to the window, turned at the nurse’s greeting. I could see that June was thin, her face framed by a halo of cottony white hair. Her skin had the waxy translucency one sometimes sees in the very old. I knew from the nurse that June was a “total care” resident, requiring assistance with every activity of daily living, including the most personal. “Her vision is going,” the nurse told me, “so stand close so she can see you.” After nearly ninety years, June’s body was in the final process of failing her.

    The nurse’s greeting was conventional: “How are you doing today?” But the answer had a dramatic effect on me. “Just fine!” June replied in a surprisingly strong voice. “Fine day so far! I’ve had my bath, lunch was good, and I’m getting ready to watch my pro-gram.” Without a pause, she went on to ask the nurse about her toddler at home who had been ill for the past few days. Reassured that he was fine, June turned her attention to me. I don’t know how else to put it: she seemed to be having a very good time.

    I was intensely curious about where a cheerful attitude like hers came from, near the end of life and despite a host of physical problems. Maybe it was something special in the moment, but before I had time to think I found myself actually asking her that question. And June didn’t seem surprised at all. She nodded in a friendly way and told me: “Well, it’s like this. I was raised in what you could call a shack, with a dirt floor and no indoor bathroom. I had six kids, and my husband was partially disabled and in and out of work. I worked hard every day of my life until I was bone tired. I’ve been through the Depression, when we barely had enough to eat. Now here I am, in a place where I have a roof over my head, three square meals a day, and very nice people who take care of me. There’s a lot to do here. I wake up and the sun is shining in the window. I’m alive, after all. I can hear. I can still see okay.”

    June sat forward a little. “Young man,” she said-and I am not ashamed to admit that it was gratifying to be called “young man” at my age-“you will learn, I hope, that happiness is what you make it, where you are. Why in the world would I be unhappy? People here complain all the time, but not me. It’s my responsibility to be as happy as I can, right here, today.”

    She repeated the last sentence, as if to make sure I understood the urgency of the insight: “It’s my responsibility to be as happy as I can be, right here, today.” Then, politely, she let me know that her show, a current events program, was coming on the television: “I like to keep up with things!” I thanked her for her time and took my leave.

    I didn’t go back to that nursing home, and I imagine that June Driscoll lived no more than a few months. But I found myself thinking, “What’s that all about?” How can it be that someone at the end of life and beset with a host of physical problems would have such a positive and optimistic outlook?

    And so I went on a quest for wisdom. I didn’t search in the usual way, by traveling the world, finding a therapist, or taking up an esoteric religious practice. To find practical guidance for living, my answer was to search for the life wisdom of older people. And I was not disappointed.

    I came to believe that the knowledge of America’s elders can serve as an extraordinary guide to finding fulfillment when life gets difficult. Older people bring firsthand experience to the table. They have lived life and learned from it. Suddenly the answer seemed obvious: why not interview a large number of elders so others can take advantage of “the wisdom of crowds”? We know that large groups of people often prove smarter than a few elite pundits and are better at solving problems and making good decisions.

    When you put together lots of older people who have lived rich and fulfilling lives and who are willing to share their life lessons with others, you have a unique source of guidance–one that can help Americans of all ages. Their wisdom makes them the true experts on living well, even when times get tough. Readers will find in this volume both practical solutions and assurance that it is indeed possible to overcome life’s major challenges and to discover joy in the face of adversity.

    That long anecdote by the author of that book is kind of special to me. And it reminds me of a funny non sequitur nearly thirty years ago about wanting something good for yourself. (The gist is you have to want something good for yourself. A truly desirous thirst for something good for yourself.)

    I met my wife after taking care of a particularly dehydrated, delirious and particularly ill-cared for elderly woman (because of neglect by her alcoholic daughter).

    After my medical team brought her back to her usual state of health and she was lucid as she could be, and the nursing staff groomed her, one Sunday morning, I strolled in on rounds and the patient was happy as could be, looked radiant and the sun was shining brightly through the windows and and she was preparing to read the thick Sunday paper while propped up in the head elevated hospital bed. This hot babe 8 nurse (conservatively) was doing her nurse-ly things and everything was in order. I stood there with command presence and as we both beamed with pride at how well this patient was looking and doing since admission, the patient seemed appreciative. When asked how she was, solipsistically, she expectantly voiced the non sequitur: “I want something good!” she paused, ruminated for a second and then blurted: “I just don’t know what it is yet!”.

    I remember that day and that moment 28 years ago. Later at the charting desk the hot babe nurse was looking through a sexy clothing catalogue while I was earnestly charting and she leaned into me (to shit test me) and asked if “she would look good in this” as she pointed to a skinny model in a short black leather mini skirt. I nonchalantly paused, looked her in the eye (slight lasering) and remarked: Why yes, I think you would look great in that skirt”, while I glanced down at her hips (that weren’t that wide, and she was hot in faded hospital scrubs) and then slowly and articulately asked: “but don’t you think your hips are a bit too wide for that particular skirt?”. Shit test passed with flying colors. Later the nurses were going out for drinks at the corner bar and she invited me to come. I went, had pre-selection and prototypical game and then she came home with me that night. And I lived happily ever after with one no big deal struggle after another every day since then. With a growth mindset.

  69. Speaking of mindset, one of the problems I would criticize the back and forth comments from @The Man is that I’m seeing a fixed mindset in The Man and it is not red pill or game centered.

    Mindset: The New Psychology of Success
    by Carol Dweck

    Dweck: “In a fixed mindset students believe their basic abilities, their intelligence, their talents, are just fixed traits. They have a certain amount and that’s that, and then their goal becomes to look smart all the time and never look dumb.

    “In a growth mindset students understand that their talents and abilities can be developed through effort, good teaching and persistence. They don’t necessarily think everyone’s the same or anyone can be Einstein, but they believe everyone can get smarter if they work at it.”

    Dweck: “Both mindsets are widely held. Generally we find about 40% of people, students and adults, endorse the growth mindset, 40% the fixed and the remainder are in the middle – they can’t make up their minds.

    “I think both mindsets are rampant in our culture. We’ve always had the message that practice makes perfect, anyone can do anything if they put their minds to it, but we also have this worship of genius and talent. When we look at tremendous performers, like Michael Jordan, when we look at superstars, when we look at geniuses, we assume they were born that way because we don’t see what went into their accomplishments.

    “I teach a freshman seminar here at Stanford every year on mindsets. For one assignment I have the students do research on their hero and find out whether the hero was so famous or successful because they were naturally talented or whether they in fact they had to overcome a lot of adversity and work really hard. Not once has it ever been the case that their hero coasted.”

  70. “I mean having to deal with another person’s motivations, focus, desires and the like. I say “drama” instead of just “time”, because though dealing with this dynamic entails the consumption of one’s time, it also entails the consumption of one’s cognitive/emotional resources, by way of having to actually consider someone else’s motivations, focus, and desires that are not all going to magically align with yours.”

    @theman

    That doesn’t sound red pill to me at all. That sounds like pedestalization and social conditioning. You can have whatever kind of relationship you want with women.

  71. Yes Andy – of course I grasp what you are saying (as so much of the discourse here over the last 8 or 9 months has been about how I am wrong about certain convictions I have).

    So what I left unsaid wrt my above comment to you is that the reason I see that redpill does not actually offer any escape from this dynamic of having one’s cognitive/emotional resources to be called upon, in either a less limited way of a more limited way, within sexual partnering, depending upon the depth of the relationship, – is partly a personal issue for myself …. and has to do with some of my personal convictions strongly aligning with the standard golden rule suite of convictions.

    So it is true for me. And of course I’m not willing to drop these standard golden-rule-type suite of convictions, just because some within redpill may counsel that …… and the reason for that of course is that these personal convictions of mine have been well tested in my life and not found wanting …… and furthermore I have determined that the redpill knowledge itself does not contradict said convictions (though some of the conclusions drawn by some redpill pundits do contradict said convictions, but I have been able to see for myself where the faulty logic in such conclusion-operations have occurred – so these arguments are not convincing to me).

    Anyways – everybody does have differences Andy. In the end, for men, in a way, it really is about the male consensus around the best constellation of personal convictions – and like I said earlier – closer to truth tends to prevail in the long run wrt said consensus. So for human beings …. all is as it should be.

    There is a difference of opinion here wrt what is closer to truth. I have said my piece in that respect in regards to the standard golden rule suite of convictions. I got no more. If it hasn’t convinced …. well …… we all have to live by what we have decided is right. I guess that would mean comparing notes when we get old – ha! (except Andy – no fair! – I gonna be old before you!).

    Andy – could we at least agree that redpill knowledge is applicable to a man’s life outside of just one specific type of constellation of convictions a man has chosen for himself? If you disagree – then it’s a no to praxeology (an unfortunate choice of words anyway) and yes to ideology wrt repill – but everybody here is adamant that redpill is not an ideology – right?

  72. “Coming to the conclusion that redpill does not actually offer any escape from this dynamic . . .”

    Red Pill has never offered escape from anything other than illusion.

    ” . . . I’m not willing . . .”

    We know. But hey, at least your eyes won’t hurt.

  73. SJF – on the Dwerk fixed/growth mindset dynamic – as applied to your perception of my psychology:

    To my way of thinking it is growth mindset from birth to death, however the beauty of it is that each of us, though very similar in basic human “design”, are just different enough wrt strengths and weaknesses, some of which may be innate and some of which may be shaped by circumstance, and furthermore, we are also just different enough wrt the pragmatic conditions we find ourselves in by way of the circumstances of our surroundings, ……. and the fact that we can conceive of the abstract and have the sublime power to talk to each other about our abstract perceptions and judgements…….. that makes this human life just such an astoundingly magnificent affair all round.

    I very much liked what you linked about the perceptions of older people. Wisdom. I didn’t know all the wisdom hidden there until I got a bit older myself and got knocked down by life a few times. The old people (if they are generally the unselfish type) have alot of wisdom wrt the best perspective for dealing with the limitations that life keeps throwing at us all. The key message – you always have you self-agency – that is primarily what is of value – the precious.

  74. @john q shaft June 29th, 2016 at 8:28 am

    The psychology behind the Taylor Swift lyrics for Wild At Heart are that women evolutionarily want the alpha genes. And they know that after they get the alpha male, the next step in manipulation of that male is to tame him and betatize him.

    And when they accomplish betatization, they are left with: boredom.

    Taylor Swift knows this instinctively, so she puts her Alpha out of reach and unobtainable. That way she doesn’t lose her lust for him.

    Compare to the female artist’s song song lyrics “In Sleep” by Lissie.

    “I know that when the story ends
    The one that’s in my head
    Well, I’ll be alone again”

    Romance porn novels play on this, the unobtainable perfect male specimen. Girls love the unobtainable perfect male.

    Taylor Swift has taken a few rides on the carousel and she knows the score of her feminine desires.

    For more on this read the chapter in Franco’s “Manual of Seduction” book:

    The most powerful aphrodisiac on the planet: challenge……………………………………………..page 101

  75. @SJF – that Carol Dweck book is on my Kindle, but it’s way down my reading list.

    Recommendations if you like that genre/subject area (like The Talent Code and Outliers, and so on): Bounce by Matthew Syed (who was an international table tennis player) and more recently The Gold Mine Effect by Rasmus Ankersen – all in the same sort of area about practice, performance, training, natural talent and how it intersects, how to develop skill etc.

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