In last week’s comment thread, we were linked to a study that purported cuckoldry is far rarer than previously suspected. While I and many others are skeptical of the methodology of the findings I think it’s far more telling about the state of the Feminine Imperative that such a “study” (really meta-study) would be so triumphantly emphasized in the femosphere, thus highlighting the latent purpose for such a study to begin with.
Culum Straun links it for us:
New research suggests that the percentage of men (unknowingly) raising children who aren’t their own is only around 1-2%, as opposed to the 10-30% figure previously accepted over decades.
Reasons are unclear – the first hypothesis was that birth control may have reduced the *pregnancy* rates of women but not the infidelity rate – but apparently the 1-2% figure holds steady going back centuries, so that can’t be it.
The study authors conclude that in all probability the benefits of “superior genes” are outweighed by the risks of being caught and the social stigma etc.
I’d be really interested in seeing what you guys think – is this information that needs to be used to revise our view of the world around us, or is there some flaw in the reasoning/logic leading to 1-2%? The most obvious thing I can see is that we don’t know the methodologies of the underlying studies which were combined to find the meta survey..
I found it interesting that the first reflexive from the femosphere was to wave this in the air as if it were some kind of vindication or a refutation of Hypergamy. “See guys? We don’t actually lie about paternity; if we marry and fuck you we statistically have your kids.”
It’s important to remember that the definition they are exploring here is one where men are “unknowingly” raising the progeny of another man. From the article:
This challenges evolutionary psychologists who have suggested that human women “routinely ‘shop around’ for good genes by engaging in extra-pair copulation to obtain genetic benefits.”
They conveniently ignore the genomic evidence that shows roughly 80% of women bred with 20% of men in our evolutionary past (including Neanderthals), but the basis of the study is flawed because they ask the wrong question. Whether or not the women in our evolutionary past were pair-bonded in whatever social arrangement that passed for institutional monogamy at the time is functionally irrelevant to the latent purpose of cuckoldry.
It does, however, expose the mental point of origin of author Annalee Newitz. If she had cited the source for her quote I’d be less skeptical because no evo-psych researcher worth their salt would presume that women exclusively seek better genetic stock while within a pair-bonded relationship. It’s an indictment of the openness with which women embrace Hypergamy that they’d still need a janitor to sweep its ugliness back under the rug occasionally.
For the greater part of evo-psych research, the emphasis of study has centered on biological and evolutionary motivators (Estrus) that prompt women to Hypergamous predispositions and the end-purpose implied in women fulfilling their sexual strategy.
The Ends of Cuckoldry
The term “cuckoldry” isn’t strictly confined to duplicitous women duping husbands/boyfriends into believing the kid is theirs when it’s some other guy’s. Consider the marked increase in single motherhood since the Sexual Revolution; the statistic for abortion, the declining marriage rate and the fact that now, in westernized society, and the majority of births (close to 60%) are born to unwed mothers.
Now consider the social imperatives and zeitgeist of the past 70 years that promote women’s Hypergamous choices to the point that every woman’s sexual strategy and breeding choices are legislatively mandated to be supported. Men are mandated to support women’s breeding imperatives both directly and indirectly. Is that not the end purpose of cuckoldry?
Cuckoldry is implicative of far more than this woman’s narrow definition. And it’s narrow because women like Newitz are selling a salve to misdirect men in a larger society from considering that their cuckolding is really by and of their own volition. This is because men have been conditioned over the course of successive generations to think they are some kind of hero for ‘saving’ a woman from her own breeding decisions by directly or indirectly forgiving indiscretions and supporting and raising a child he didn’t father.
Just because a man knows the child isn’t his own doesn’t make it any less cuckoldry.
The question that needs to be asked, and is conveniently avoided in the article, is “what is the latent, evolutionarily motivated purpose of cuckoldry that would best serve women’s dualistic sexual strategy?” This is the uncomfortable question those nefarious evo-psych researchers really ask.
In the past, duplicitous, concealed, cuckoldry was a very risky prospect from a social perspective. It could mean family/tribal ostracism or even being stoned to death. So the larger, most deductively efficient way to achieve the same Hypergamous ends of cuckoldry is to reengineer a society where men are either ignorant of their own role in that cuckoldry or provided social rewards for their knowing participation in a socially acceptable form of cuckoldry. The latter is where we’ve progressed since the Sexual Revolution.
The ends remain the same, but it is cuckoldry by a different name. When we can restructure a social order that accepts and excuses both proactive and retroactive cuckoldry before the fact, we normalize it and defuse the consequences for women, while holding men accountable for its consequences or their unwillingness to participate in it. And even when a woman aborts a child – the ultimate confirmation of Hypergamous disapproval – that social order pre-approves her choice, pre-approves holding her unaccountable for it and concurrently makes the men who would find fault in it villains for judging her pre-approved act.
Sons of Cuckolds
Reader Petherton linked me to a fascinating article which not only illustrates that Hypergamy was an issue for the Greatest Generation, but also details the wages of ‘secret’ cuckoldry. Apparently the Archbishop of Canterbury has discovered he is the illegitimate son of Sir Winston Churchill’s last private secretary after taking a DNA test to prove his paternity.
Petherton:
This is a perfect example of women’s hypergamous nature. She rides the cock carousel and gets impregnated by an Alpha who’s already taken. She quickly marries a Beta who is hovering in the background and cuckolds him. He never unplugs, she loses respect for him (if there ever was any in the 1st place) and he drinks himself to an early death.
Eventually the truth comes out. Instead of taking responsibility for her actions, she paints herself as a victim. The pregnancy is blamed on alcohol, and she successfully generates pity from everyone. In fact she generates admiration from everyone for her brave and successful fight against alcoholism, and for putting up with an alcoholic husband.
No one anywhere suggests the truth: that she had a strategy (whether conscious or subconscious) to find the best genes for her offspring, while fooling another man into providing for that offspring. When she gets busted, she successfully paints herself as the victim. You couldn’t make it up!
Needless to say, I found this article and the blatantly revealed cuckoldry oddly karmic in its timing coinciding with the “cuckoldry” study’s release. However, we should now consider the Arch Bishop’s response to his mother’s proveable cuckoldry of his “father”.
“His deepest identity isn’t about which man was his father, but who his heavenly Father is.”
This is exactly the diplomatic response I’d expect from men (albeit a religious one in this instance) steeped in a feminine-primary social order and conditioned from birth to affirm his Blue Pill existence. While egalitarianism is ostensibly about baseline equalism and “it’s what’s on the inside that counts”, on the outside, there is no better social mandate that serves the evolutionary ends of Hypergamy. The Arch Bishop’s response to his mother’s cuckoldry is a textbook example of how the Feminine Imperative conditions men to excuse, affirm and perpetuate its ends.
He said the right thing.
From Schedules of Mating:
Cheating
For this dynamic, and the practicality of enjoying the best of both genetic worlds, women find it necessary to ‘cheat’. This cheating can be done proactively or reactively.In the reactive model, a woman who has already paired with her long term partner choice, engages in a extramarital or extra-pairing, sexual intercourse with a short term partner (i.e. the cheating wife or girlfriend). That’s not to say this short term opportunity cannot develop into a 2nd, long term mate, but the action of infidelity itself is a method for securing better genetic stock than the committed male provider is (or was) capable of supplying.
Proactive cheating is the single Mommy dilema. This form of ‘cheating’ relies on the woman breeding with a Good Genes male, bearing his children and then abandoning him, or having him abandon her, (again through invented social conventions) in order to find a Good Dad male to provide for her and the children of her Good Genes partner to ensure their security.
I want to stress again that (most) women do not have some consciously constructed and recognized master plan to enact this cycle and deliberately trap men into it. Rather, the motivations for this behavior and the accompanying social rationales invented to justify it are an unconscious process. For the most part, women are unaware of this dynamic, but are nonetheless subject to its influence. For a female of any species to facilitate a methodology for breeding with the best genetic partner she’s able to attract AND to ensure her own and her offspring’s survival with the best provisioning partner; this is an evolutionary jackpot.
The Cuckold
On some level of consciousness, men innately sense something is wrong with this situation, though they may not be able to place why they feel it or misunderstand it in the confusion of women’s justifications for it. Or, they become frustrated by the social pressures to ‘do the right thing’, are shamed into martyrdom/savior-hood and committed to a feigned responsibility to these conventions. Nevertheless, some see it well enough to steer clear of single mothers, either by prior experience or observing other male cuckolds saddled with the responsibility of raising and providing for – no matter how involved or uninvolved – another man’s successful reproduction efforts with this woman.Men often fall into the role of the proactive or reactive Cuckold. He will never enjoy the same benefits as his mates short term partner(s) to the same degree, in the way of sexual desire or immediacy of it, while at the same time enduring the social pressures of having to provide for this Good Genes father’s progeny. It could be argued that he may contribute minimally to their welfare, but on some level, whether emotional, physical, financial or educational he will contribute some effort for another man’s genetic stock in exchange for a limited form of sexuality/intimacy from the mother. To some degree, (even if only by his presence) he is sharing the parental investment that should be borne by the short term partner. If nothing else, he contributes the time and effort to her he could be better invested in finding a sexual partner with which he could pursue his own genetic imperative by his own methodology.
However, needless to say, there is no shortage of men sexually deprived enough to ‘see past’ the long term disadvantages, and not only rewarding, but reinforcing a single mother’s bad decisions (bad from his own interest’s POV) with regard to her breeding selections and schedules in exchange for short term sexual gratification. Furthermore, by reinforcing her behavior thusly, he reinforces the social convention for both men and women. It’s important to bear in mind that in this age women are ultimately, soley responsible for the men they choose to mate with (baring rape of course) AND giving birth to their children. Men do bear responsibility for their actions no doubt, but it is ultimately the decision of the female and her judgement that decides her and her children’s fate
Who’s the Daddy?
Finally, we complete the cuckoldry trifecta with the Spectator article, Who’s the Daddy. Again, serendipitously, the rationale of this article exposes (perhaps obliviously) the social underpinnings of the Feminine Imperative’s motives in getting men to accept women’s Hypergamous choices as the preeminent social norm.
Many men have, of course, ended up raising children who were not genetically their own, but really, does it matter? You can feel quite as much tenderness for a child you mistakenly think to be yours as for one who is.
[…]Uncertainty allows mothers to select for their children the father who would be best for them.
If the definition of cuckoldry ought to be confined to deceptive duplicity, as AnnaleeNewitz suggests in her article, why then should we need a push to legally mandate men to being accountable fathers by default when they proveably are not?
Ironically, the very same DNA swab test that betrayed the Arch Bishop’s mother’s cuckoldry is the test Melanie McDonagh proposes we make illegal or irrelevant in a court of law. And unironically, the Arch Bishop parrots back the mantra of the Feminine Imperative to excuse his own mother’s birth-fraud.
But in making paternity conditional on a test rather than the say-so of the mother, it has removed from women a powerful instrument of choice. I’m not sure that many people are much happier for it.
Novaseeker had an excellent comment on this:
From the time paternity tests became more available and reliable, and men started using them to avoid paternity claims, the same argument has been made: it’s bad for the kids. Who cares if he isn’t the bio-dad, fatherhood isn’t about biology, it’s about a parental relationship. We should trust women who determine who the father is, so that she can choose the best man she thinks to be the father, etc., etc. The same arguments have been made for some time. In fact, medical ethicists also make the same arguments, to a large degree, in support of not disclosing non-paternity when it comes up in tests that were not specifically undergone to determine paternity — in other words, if your kid is getting tested for inherited disease, and the hospital finds out that it isn’t your bio kid, they don’t tell you that, for all the reasons stated in the article.
This really is a visceral issue for women. Paternity tests strike at something fundamental in women, even if the actual cuckolding rate remains low: the possibility to cuck, if needed. It’s a visceral issue for women, at a very deep and basic hindbrain level, for fairly clear reasons. If paternity tests were ever to become standard/mandatory at birth, the cucking strategy, even if it is a rather uncommon one, would become completely unavailable, and almost every single woman finds that to be a problem based on her hindbrain (and regardless of how her forebrain will formulate that deep, basic discomfort).
I’ve stated it in the past, but as the Feminine Imperative becomes more comfortable with Open Hypergamy and Open Cuckoldry more men will find its machinations unignorable. Thus, as increasingly more men refuse to participate in the game of their gender’s debasement the imperative must pursue legal mandates and fluid social restructuring to force men to comply with it.
Novaseeker again:
An amazing thing is how easy it is for women to dismiss the significance of biological fatherhood. It’s almost as if it simply doesn’t matter to them.
If that’s not an obvious flag of the FI, and the attendant idea that one sex’s sexual strategy must always impinge on the other sex’s sexual strategy, I don’t know what is. It places zero, zilch, nada importance on the male interest in having genetic progeny — again, it’s as if that interest simply doesn’t exist, and is illegitimate to even take into consideration.
There was a time when I had difficulty explaining the difference between men’s idealistic concept of love and women’s opportunistic concept of love. I’ve recently come to see that the best explanations and contrasts come from the openly embraced examples set by women that can’t be ignored.
There is no better example of women’s opportunistic love, indeed, women’s innate solipsistic nature, than the phrase “it shouldn’t matter to the man who the biological father of the child really is – he just needs to accept it and support it.”
And there is no greater evidence of the Feminine Imperative’s purpose than a society structured to ensure that men and women believe this, as well as perpetuate it.
@all
Can you guys please just stop responding to females that post in general.
Since you repeat the same cycle of comments and I get tired of scrolling through them to find ( your post that actually contain value)
@Karen Go make a iirc or something and post it and invite the people who respond to you and have fun trolling them there please
“Can you guys please just stop responding to females that post in general.”
No.
KFC writes:
>Three strikes and you’re out
Translation: *He is going to call his friend the moderator and have the *dangerous* influence removed*
@kgf
True enough you can’t
Shows enough about your character
KFC writes:
>No.
Translation: His erection is getting bigger….
*Giggles*
“Shows enough about your character”
Thank you, kind Sir.
Menses says:
>Shows enough about your character
A stiff dick has like noooooooooo conscience…lol
I dig kfg’s character.
@Karen – Serious question. Rollo claimed that you are ShoeOnHead, June what’s her name. Can you confirm that? As for subjective and rife naughty bits, well, given the bitchy smirk, my preference would be your narrow ass. Hard and deep. Tends to remove bitchy smirks quickly…
@Blaximus: “I dig kfg’s character.”
I believe, technically, there are three of them.
@ Cattaro Your English sucks, but it seems you feel that your wife has more power now because she needs you less. And you seem to want her more because of her increased power. Is this what you are trying to say? This would be described as her going One-up on and you going a little more One-down from her status. This can insidiously create an imbalance in your current relationship. Don’t let it. This shouldn’t be a problem if you are aware of your feelings and your behaviors. You need to not act out on your feelings. Be Stoic.… Read more »
>Scribbler queries:
Serious question. Rollo claimed that you are ShoeOnHead, June what’s her name. Can you confirm that? As for subjective and rife naughty bits, well, given the bitchy smirk, my preference would be your narrow ass. >Hard and deep. Tends to remove bitchy smirks quickly
All questions must be submitted on papyrus and notarized by the clerk…
You know u luv me….xoxoxox
@Sun
I’m afraid this strain has mutated. We’ll have to use….stronger measures.
http://i156.photobucket.com/albums/t26/PhoneCardLady/Troll-B-Gon.jpg
If a rich woman really wanted to save her 5th marriage,she could wear a chastity belt and give huby the only key,send him to rsd boot camp,pay for his mma training,buy him a new fatboy,a new sled,some technical climbing gear,only speak kindly and softly when spoken to,learn to cook and clean and respect all of his decisions.
This would be constructive and less expensive than alimony.
Forgery says:
>I’m afraid this strain has mutated. We’ll have to use….stronger measures.
It is really a totally unfair fight…dozens of males against all of me…
As an airplane is about to crash, a female passenger jumps up frantically and announces, “If I’m going to die, I want to die feeling like a woman.” She removes all her clothing and asks, “Is there someone on this plane who is man enough to make me feel like a woman?” A man stands up, removes his shirt and says, “Here, iron this!”.
“I believe, technically, there are three of them.”
http://danwaldschmidt.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/confused-man.jpg
A man is sitting at a bar enjoying a cocktail when an exceptionally gorgeous, sexy, young woman enters. The man can’t stop staring at her. The young woman notices this and walks directly toward him. Before he could offer his apologies for being so rude, the young woman says to him, “I’ll do anything you want me to do, no matter how kinky, for $100, with one condition.” Flabbergasted, the man asks what the condition is. The young woman replies, “You have to tell me what you want me to do in just three words.” The man considers her proposition… Read more »
“It is really a totally unfair fight…dozens of males against all of me…”
I think you’ll find a riposte more effective than a reframe, little one. It’s better for, ya know, communicating.
An investigative journalist went to Afghanistan to study the culture and was shocked to discover that women were made to walk ten paces behind the men. She asked her guide why and he said, “Because they are considered of lesser status.” Outraged the journalist went home. A year later she returned covering violence in the region and was surprised to see the women walking ten paces ahead. She turned to her guide and this time asked, “What has changed?” The guide answered, “Land mines.”
How do you know when a woman is about to say something smart? When she starts her sentence with, “A man once told me…”
A man calls 911 and says, “I think my wife is dead.” The operator says, “How do you know?” The man says, “The sex is about the same, but the ironing is piling up!”
Only did this to drive Mersonia crazy…
http://i.imgur.com/gpyU0KO.jpg
Why is a beer better than a woman?
If you pour it right you get good head.
A frigid beer is a good beer.
If your beer goes flat just order another one.
You can have two or three beers at once and none of them care.
You can leave your beer sitting on the bar go to a table and drink another and the one at the bar won’t get jealous.
A woman’s husband had been slipping in and out of a coma for several months, yet she had stayed by his bedside every single day. One day, when he came to, he motioned for her to come nearer. As she sat by him, he whispered, eyes full of tears, “You know what? You have been with me all through the bad times. When I got fired, you were there to support me. When my business failed, you were there. When I got shot, you were by my side. When we lost the house, you stayed right here. When my health… Read more »
An ugly, fat, bad woman with two kids enters Wal Mart, shouting angry at the kids with no reason. The man at the reception says cheerfully to her: “Good morning and welcome to Wal-Mart. Cute kids! Are they twins?” The horrible woman stopped shouting, just enough to say, “Hell, they’ re not twins… The older is 9 and the other is 7! Are you blind or just stupid?” “No madam… I’m neither blind nor stupid… I just can’t get that there’s a man out there who had sex with you twice.”
“Honey,” said this husband to his wife, “I invited a friend home for supper.” “What? Are you crazy? The house is a mess, I haven’t been shopping, all the dishes are dirty, and I don’t feel like cooking a fancy meal!” “I know all that.” “Then why did you invite a friend for supper?” “Because the poor fool’s thinking about getting married.”
Last one for now… On the first night of their honeymoon, the new bride tells her husband, “I have a confession to make. I’m not a virgin. I’ve been with one other guy.” “Oh yeah? Who was the guy?” “Tiger Woods, the golfer.” “Well, he’s rich, famous and handsome. I can understand that.” The couple then makes passionate love. When they finish, the husband gets up and walks to the telephone. “What are you doing?” asks the wife. “I’m hungry. I’m calling room service.” “Tiger wouldn’t do that.” “Oh yeah? What would Tiger do?” “He’d come back to bed and… Read more »
A man came home from the store with two black eyes.His wife asked what happened?
There was this big woman in line with her dress stuck in her crack so i pulled it out for her.
How did you get the second one?
When i saw how mad she was i reached down and tucked it back in.
Much thanks Blax
Had to stop and clean the granola of the screen FLMAO!
@ stuff
Welcome man.
Needed a distraction from the distraction.
A theory over at Le Chateau is that these teachers are driven to sexing their kids not out of a search for alpha seed, but rather in response to relentless competition from higher SMV HS hotties. @sentient I wouldn’t say that it’s outright competition Consider Rollo’s post about making up for lost time, and also consider his post on attention. A couple teachers I’ve seen that have gotten caught, were good looking but must weren’t that attention getting in high school, plus the personality types that usually get into teaching aren’t that bold about getting attention. They want to be,… Read more »
@Blaximus: Excellent. “Paint my house”! ROTFLMAO.
I wouldn’t say that it’s outright competition Consider Rollo’s post about making up for lost time, and also consider his post on attention. A couple teachers I’ve seen that have gotten caught, were good looking but must weren’t that attention getting in high school, plus the personality types that usually get into teaching aren’t that bold about getting attention. They want to be, but aren’t the types that go about it very well. Simpler explanation – those upper 20-something teachers are just doing the same thing they did 10 years previous in high school, 5 years previous in college. It’s… Read more »
Lower SMV women. Hmmmm…… Lower SMV chicks do have sex with high SMV men, but it is not in any numbers high enough to be statistically relevant. Why would it be? A man eating Prime Rib all of the time, might just want a greasy burger on occasion. A free burger is even better. Fat and less attractive broads are having sex due to ” dating ” sites and social networking. This has been an awful development because it has enabled lower SMV women to have equally shitty attitudes as their higher SMV sisters. I’ve watched, from a distance –… Read more »
AR said -” Simpler explanation – those upper 20-something teachers are just doing the same thing they did 10 years previous in high school, 5 years previous in college. It’s just a bit different if they get caught now, vs. then.” Exactly. I smashed 2 of my high school teachers during summer recess. Both of them younger than 25. No real difference between them and an 18 year old senior. Thing is, I NEVER talked about it with ANYONE. I’d bet my left nut that quite a few guys bent over some of the young teachers. It’s probably still going… Read more »
Blaximus Fat and less attractive broads are having sex due to ” dating ” sites and social networking. This has been an awful development because it has enabled lower SMV women to have equally shitty attitudes as their higher SMV sisters. Ding! See OKCupid or other sites. Heck, see Dataclysm by one of the founders of OKCupid, all one hasta do is read between the lines. He’s even got a graph showing the 80/20 attraction issue. YaReally has told us what the under 25 girls are like, with their phone blowing up full of texts from beta orbiters. HopelessHypergamy chimed… Read more »
Also on the low SMV woman,
Males are confused too. All of this ” I’m beautiful just as I am ” bullshit being spread by the media/FI takes it’s toll on quite a few beta/afc/ super white knights.
It’s fairly relentless. There was a show on television actually called Ugly Betty for fucks sake.
I’m telling you, we need a fucking MI to counter this FI shit. Nature abhors a vacuum.
@ AR
“Low SMV women can get a similar attention / dopamine fix on any dating site, just by posting a profile, for years and years. ”
This right here. I’ve seen this with my own two eyes. The attention, such as it is, has a long assed shelf life. That entitles low SMV broad to become ” choosey “….lmfao.
All of this ” I’m beautiful just as I am ” bullshit being spread by the media/FI takes it’s toll on quite a few beta/afc/ super white knights. Part of unplugging from the Matrix involves unplugging from the mainstream media. That may include Sports Illustrated pretty soon. Or not. But for sure anything electronic needs to be heavily filtered for my own peace of mind. A man would be better off with a fast internet connection and Netflix or some other service, than the standard cable. I stopped watching prime time stuff years ago because of work schedule and never… Read more »
Oh, lookit this, it’s been 10 years since Eat, Betray, Luv was published, and golly, how many women were inspired by that. There’s even three different women interviewed, with pictures (Not Safe For Dinner). http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-3533057/Eat-pray-love-walk-husband-s-bestseller-inspired-generation-transform-lives-left-trail-broken-relationships.html Lizzy Gilbert looks more than 10 years older. And notice there’s no pic of her 60+ year old hubby…now, why would that be? Then there’s this comedy gold, where the Mail may well be trolling its readers: During the Indonesian third of her book, Gilbert lived in Ubud in the Balinese uplands, a town which became a mecca for middle-aged women wearing white linen and… Read more »
Blax “Lower SMV chicks do have sex with high SMV men, but it is not in any numbers high enough to be statistically relevant. ”
The winning moment for feminism – in the intended destruction of western women and thereby the West – was when women began confusing SMP success as “having sex” with SMP success as “having commitment”.
Once they started viewing it the same, it was all downhill from there…
AR, Agreed. I can watch some primetime stuff occasionally, but my head auto-filters bullshit messages. They bounce off my eyes and ears with great velocity. This week the Smithsonian Channel had a cool series called Civil War 360. It was in 3 parts. Then they had 4 hours of Civil War era programs on following that. I was hooked. Not a feminist/FI inspiration in sight. I keep informed on the latest media fuckery only insofar as ammunition to uncoil my daughters mind from it. I gave up on the ” News ” a while back. I only depend on them… Read more »
@ Sentient “The winning moment for feminism – in the intended destruction of western women and thereby the West – was when women began confusing SMP success as “having sex” with SMP success as “having commitment”. Once they started viewing it the same, it was all downhill from there…” You ain’t never lied!!!! I don’t hear much, if any, talk of commitment these days. Only when a chick springs a Pussy Trap and takes that as a sign of commitment, but even that is getting ever more rare. I feel for young cats in the world getting beaten over the… Read more »
@ Softek
Man, that is my favorite Tyson quote. I was looking for it to post here a while back and couldn’t locate it.
Thank you sir!!
Re: Amy Schumer catching dicks whenever she wants.
Ha ha ha, he he hee.
She should try catching some Nutrisystem.
@ Blaximus
Lmao, happy to help.
Can’t beat it. And the pause. Speaks volumes that it’s both hilarious and admiral in a weird way when a guy like Tyson just blatantly speaks his mind without literally any regard for anyone or anything around him.
i.e., his frame is so solid that there is no ‘Frame.’ He’s just Mike Tyson.
“She should try catching some Nutrisystem.”
I think she caught it all – for lunch.
Lustful abandoned…
Built a garden with a buddy today today spoke about the red pill… Beautiful stuff
Right, yeah, Mike Tyson is a role model, telling women they can’t talk unless they fuck, smacking them around and raping them too. He’s a fucking animal and a moron. Not “co-signed”. @Sentient – Schumer is a piece of work. What she doesn’t admit is that she can’t get a high smv man to call her back or date her or be seen in public with her. She can catch his dick though, if it’s convenient and the guy doesn’t have better options that night. She’s a “moped”. Fun to ride, but you wouldn’t want your friends to see you… Read more »
@AR and Blaximus
Speaking of media and watching/not watching it, the new series by Louis C.K. called “Horace and Pete” is simply phenomenal when watched with a red pill lens. The writing and acting and casting is out of this world. It’s Seinfeld on hard mode.
Pretty much the best $31 you can spend on a series of 10 episodes of an entertainment series. LoL, so far on IMDB it is only giving a 9.9 rating out of 10.0 for the first episode from 55 raters.
It’s available for purchase on Louis C.K.’s website.
For the Record your Honor
Tyson did not rape anybody.
Court adjourned.
To the lurkers present.
The idea of Tyson saying what he said to a ” female ” reporter only serves as an example of a man saying whatever he damn well pleases, and no one in the room being able to do anything about it.
Not a role model, but he never claimed to be one either.
Take your lessons wisely and dissect the theory and example.
” Animal ” is subjective.
@ scrib Like the Corey Worthington thing, as Rollo pointed out, him being a piss-poor example of a human being doesn’t take away from the Alpha mindset. For me anyway, being able to find humor in that clip doesn’t mean I idolize any of that stuff. I laugh at a lot of fucked up shit, but if it ever comes across as an endorsement, it’s not. On a serious note, though, as far as rape/abuse go — obviously I’m not down with that shit, but I have it in my head that, for example, fucking another girl while I’m beating… Read more »
Scribblerg “telling women they can’t talk unless they fuck, smacking them around and raping them too.” IDK man, most women seem really really down for this shit these days… LOL But for real, maybe FI still in your head? Some residual WK/BP? Perhaps? Dynamic, passionate and authentic = Alpha. Over and over and over again. That’s it. It’s amoral and not following BP society rules. For sure I get it still might not be one’s style. Granted. But Alpha is going to be alpha no matter what style it is and what conventions it crosses… There is no ZFG frame… Read more »
@kfg lol was just about to post that. The thing is though: @Softek “Half-assing going into a committed relationship with this girl, and half-assing fucking other girls. I’m like stuck between a halfway point in both directions.” Not sure if you meant this with your wording so disregard this if I misinterpreted it (but lurkers pay attention), but there’s no “middle of the road” here. Going into a committed relationship with this girl is NOT AN OPTION. You can be single or you can fuck this other girl, but committing to a Cluster-B psycho is not on the table anymore.… Read more »
SJF
recently started watching The Last Man on Earth. really interesting to watch with RP lenses on. Pretty much a Purple Pill show, but a lot of truths on display…
” committing to a Cluster-B psycho is not on the table anymore.” Yeah.. well here is the thing, this has been a very interesting EMO discussion and all, however I’m a bit put back at all this Cluster B and BPD terminology. I think it is a bit off, a misdiagnosis… Spend any appreciable amount of time with a woman and you will see these are NORMAL and COMMON behaviors that come out when they are not getting what they want… it’s just the back of the rolodex for most cases… No special snowflake unicorn status… the cluster B is… Read more »
Leading story’s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SQ7qKKQrSBY
How men talk and share ideals round table and human exhange’s….
Softek “Half-assing going into a committed relationship with this girl, and half-assing fucking other girls. I’m like stuck between a halfway point in both directions.”
Question – do you like women? Do you lust for them? Or not? real question… No need to answer.. something to think about.
The Platinum Rule conquers all [do what ever YOU want to do whenever YOU want to do it].
@softek “I at least have to give myself credit for Gaming another girl. Even getting that far is making me feel better. At the same time making me feel awful, lol, but at least I have other guys like the people here and vids like Tyler’s to help explain WHY I feel awful.” remember the entire time what i’ve been saying to you is that she’s just WAY FUCKING BETTER at all of this than you. this being ‘the game.’ right now it sucks and it’s killing you and fucking you up, but here’s the cool thing…keep gaming those other… Read more »
@softek
““Half-assing going into a committed relationship with this girl, and half-assing fucking other girls. I’m like stuck between a halfway point in both directions.””
WHOA WHOA WHOA
my advice to you was to just LIE ABOUT THAT
LITERALLY LIE
TELL HER ONE THING AND DO ANOTHER
(she deserves it: fuck her)
so you SAY you are committing but you ACT as though you are withdrawing (see her less: LIE. MAKE UP SOME BULLSHIT. BE CONVINCING. SHE DOESN’T DESERVE BETTER)….and yes, game those other girls HARD.
@ kfg Holy shit did that hit home. @ YaReally As the anxiety medication is kicking in, I’m kicking myself thinking I could be balls deep in another hot girl right now. I’ve been craving that for months. I just want to experience something new. I just want to clear my head and I feel like that’s what I’d need to do. If I have to use medication to help with that, so be it. I wasn’t planning on her messaging me so I wasn’t prepared, it takes a while to kick in. Haven’t heard from her in about a… Read more »
@softek and the reason why is because if you’re where most people are with this shit…right now you just DON’T HAVE the balls to flat out dump her. (if you do, just do that and leave) she’s too fucking strong and she’s pressing you too hard. you need to get her to ease up. so if she thinks she’s getting what she wants, she will do that. you’re trying to pull the rug out from under her at the LAST SECOND. i.e. after she has relaxed a bit and grown secure that you’re compliant (you know, you’re just working late… Read more »
@Softek
What? And my shit didn’t?
@SJF
Thanks….something about fear. I have no fear of her leaving me, I have no fear of her going for some other man, but I have a fear of her going for some other and me not know. I have a fear for my pride….
The Last
ManSoap Opera on Earth.FIFY
@Cattaro You have fear of her going one up on you and having more power. That being defined in a relationship as: The person that needs the other person less has more power. Stay strong. Depending how good your English is, when this happens it is actually a problem for her and you. A relationship imbalance needs to be managed. The one more powerful has problems with his or her psyche and the one that is less powerful will demonstrate a weakness based on their faulty emotions. For LTR’s, the thing is, you actually should actually care for others–esp. your… Read more »
@ SJF Please understand this is a lot to take in for me. I always read everyone’s replies to my comments, even if it’s through lurking. Nothing’s going unread on my end, and I always deeply appreciate everyone’s replies to anything I put up here, and am doing my best to take everything into account. Panic disorder, or whatever it is, is a major priority. I do have meds but have to be careful and strategic in using them because they’re extremely addictive, have some rebound effects (depression), and I also don’t have a regular prescription. It’s authorized refill so… Read more »
@SJF I can prety well understud english, my problem is sending my minds on paper. I had an situation abouth month ago when my wife got a promise of larger salary. I know it like a doctor who look at his patient and can predict every fucking fiver simptom….I was stoic, and wery well equpied for that moment. I had made Dred by telling that I what to go to military mision in some other coyntry, not for money but for fun and danger. She always suspect that I have some other women on the side and it is a… Read more »
Not being an apologist for Mike Tyson makes me Blue Pill or stuck in the FI? Being down with terrorizing and menacing a woman on camera like he did is about ZFG? Thanks, I needed a good laugh before I go to sleep.
Whole song no longer on YouTube since it’s been going deeper into Nazi mode and people are making bank on Hendrix’s life work 40+ years after he was murdered, but in a way it makes it that much more powerful. Says it all.
@Softie – You are correct – most men don’t understand actual mental illness so don’t listen to what they have to say. Mental illness is stigmatized as is taking medication. Listen to trained professionals who you trust and people you know who have successfully treated their mental illness. I was really touched by your last comment. You are valuing yourself enough to see that getting help is GOOD FOR YOU. You are being strategic about approaching what’s holding you back. I can tell you this without hesitation. You can learn to deal with anxiety effectively. It may take a bit… Read more »
@Rollo This story deserves a separate post. In Hong Kong, the Equal Opportunities Commission ruled in favour of men…by declaring Ladies’ Nights effectively illegal because they discriminate. By charging men MORE money to enter, by giving women free drinks or lower entry fees they’re not embracing “equality”. Read the reactions of the bar owners to this, then substitute “Ladies Nights” for any other male dominated sport…and you can see how the concept of equality of the sexes is a convenient illusion for women to further make men irrelevant… http://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/law-crime/article/1935697/hong-kong-equality-watchdog-wins-interlocutory-judgment The man suing the bar in question cites “hurt feelings”…nice. Now… Read more »
Thing with FaceBook is it makes for easy, automatic orbiters for the chick without doing all that much work. I have had that done to me. Talked with a chick at a meetup party, went OK, talked for a couple of hours after. Sends me a message later, says she just wants to be friends. Fine, whatever. She looks good… for 49. Like a lot of them, she’s put on weight and the face looks better as a result. It’s fine if the weight looks decent on them. So I meet her at another meetup later and we just catch… Read more »
“Yeah.. well here is the thing, this has been a very interesting EMO discussion and all, however I’m a bit put back at all this Cluster B and BPD terminology. I think it is a bit off, a misdiagnosis…”
Yeah, I’m not completely sure either. Unless I missed a story about her being drunk and picking fights with bouncers. lol. But anyway, YaReally and scray seem convinced. Good enough for me. Regardless… doesn’t change the advice he’s getting.
“Regardless… doesn’t change the advice he’s getting.”
Well not in the immediate instance, given where things are ATM for Softie, but in terms of probability of this behavior in future women it does… I think putting this kind of label on common female behavior encourages unicorn hunting… AWALT and all…
@Sentient and Andy
I’m totally convinced of the BPD traits in question. And I do think that it is defined as an inherent trait of all women to some degree. It’s the matter of amount of that degree that makes it a problem.
One the other hand:
http://www.examiner.com/article/borderline-women-actually-psychopaths-researchers-suggest
Talked with a chick at a meetup party, went OK, talked for a couple of hours after. Sends me a message later, says she just wants to be friends. Fine, whatever. She looks good… for 49. Like a lot of them, she’s put on weight and the face looks better as a result. It’s fine if the weight looks decent on them. A point for guys to remember. This doesn’t end in the 40s or 50s. It used to do so, when (1) people didn’t take as good care of themselves and deteriorated more quickly than they do now and… Read more »
” Unless I missed a story about her being drunk and picking fights with bouncers. ” That’s just a generic crazy bitch. A BPD will get drunk and blatantly try to pick up a bouncer right in front of you. When you react negatively to it, she will pick a fight with you, gaslighting the shit out of you denying that such a thing ever happened while simultaneously explaining that what just happened was all your fault, probably using “arguments” that make no fucking sense in this particular universe. When a generic crazy bitch acts out you think: “This thing… Read more »
“Not being an apologist for Mike Tyson makes me Blue Pill or stuck in the FI? Being down with terrorizing and menacing a woman on camera like he did is about ZFG? Thanks, I needed a good laugh before I go to sleep.” Now this is interesting… I rewatched the Tyson video, and it is more likely he was flirting with her in his way than “terrorizing and menacing”, but that language there, that seems mighty like residual WK language… The seed of guys frowning at guys for hitting on a woman comes from somewhere… the FI has us all… Read more »
KFG – your excellent take on BPD also describes – in a meta way – what every divorced rape guy hears when in the crucible…
“I’m totally convinced of the BPD traits in question.”
Says the guy that wishes a hot BPD would move in next door.
“Says the guy that wishes a hot BPD would move in next door.” Well, the two white gay guys with the black child next door have turned out to be no value added (except for the wonderful boost in housing value) socially to the neighborhood. Boring. With no added personality points for drama. Occasionally I remember their names by carefully studied mnemonics. I had a go-around with a BPD chick back in 1984-ish. And I firmly beleive if you can see them a mile away and do have an abundance mentality (which is definitely possible in a monogamous marriage), and… Read more »
@Sentient – Lol, still at the Tyson thing. Get a grip on yourself.
“And I firmly beleive if you can see them a mile away and do have an abundance mentality (which is definitely possible in a monogamous marriage), and you have strong frame, then there is little damage they can do.”
When they’re next door? You’re delusional.
@Andy & Sentient – I’ve cautioned in the past to not make “web diagnoses”. Many in the manosphere throw around BPD and Cluster B disorders quite freely and it’s never a good idea to listen to amateurs make psychological diagnoses 2nd or 3rd hand based on website forum comments. That said, KFG offers a good rule of thumb for men when trying to decide whether a woman is really whacked or not. “When a generic crazy bitch acts out you think: “This thing just happened. Bitch be crazy.” When a BPD acts out you think: “WTF just happened? Am I… Read more »
Just pointing out a dynamic. Men shouldn’t rush in to defend grown women, especially when women invade male realms. I’m a supporter of men speaking their minds, and if folks don’t like what’s said then they can speak up. But men getting offended at something said to some random broad is suspect behavior. Chivalry is dead. The FI killed it. Don’t save hoes.
@Softek at 8:02pm That, and this girl might potentially have more issues than the girl I’m seeing. Yeah, she’s hot, but the point is, do I just go out for the experience of sticking my dick in another girl and experiencing some abundance mentality, or should I have some more discretion? how’s that committed monogamy working out for you…lol…i just want to point out to you (and the newbies and lurkers…bc you are living out a classic case study…lol) is that this situ is the exact OPPOSITE of a great ‘pickup’ in play…lol in a great pickup, you have ALL… Read more »
@ Sentient “Dynamic, passionate and authentic = Alpha. Over and over and over again. That’s it. It’s amoral and not following BP society rules. For sure I get it still might not be one’s style. Granted. But Alpha is going to be alpha no matter what style it is and what conventions it crosses… There is no ZFG frame without ZERO.” I find myself a little too composed at times and a little too much with a passionate inside (always) and a cool to the touch exterior as in Law #30. So occasionally I have to dance like a monkey… Read more »
I find it’s not that it’s not so much ZFG about every single thing in life, but ZFG about shit that genuinely doesn’t matter. If something stands in the way of your life goals, then you give a fuck about that. You should tear it down without delay or apology. But if one woman out of the 3.5 billion on the planet is being a cunt? ZFG, NEXT.
It’s a strategy for discarding that which you shouldn’t concern yourself with.
“I find it’s not that it’s not so much ZFG about every single thing in life, but ZFG about shit that genuinely doesn’t matter.”
Lol, Sun.
I could reframe that for LTR Game. In LTR game, pretty much everything always matters. (SJF Maxim #1 is Everything Matters).
So ZFG–because of the power of Next in STR GAME– becomes NBD (no big deal) in LTR Game. NBD means perceived small hurdles that otherwise would have one dreamed up as big hurdles.
re: BPD Gonna be another long post, but I’ve been thinking about BPD quite a bit. My friend, the 1200 N count guy, was with a BPD. Probably multiple ones but this was the worst and one of his several ONEs. When she’d get drunk she’d get violent. One time she punched him in the head and knocked him out and left him in his driveway. One of her classic quotes to him was “For every time you cheat on me, I’ll cheat on you three times.” If she ever caught him hanging around with another girl, she’d start shit.… Read more »
“. . . ZFG about shit that genuinely doesn’t matter.” We discriminate and judge. “But if one woman out of the 3.5 billion on the planet is being a cunt? ZFG, NEXT.” Got any collectibles? If you have sports cards, action figures or anything that is sold as a complete collection, then no, you don’t. These things are mass produced consumer items, targeted at the lower classes who ape the acquiring of collectibles by the upper classes. Collectibles are rare (ideally unique) and have some sort of high value. Stradivarius violins are collectible. Monet paintings are collectible. Fujiwara Kanenaga katanas… Read more »
Question to the group-If you were to recommend only 1 post from the RM arsenal to blue pill men to bring awareness, which would it be ?
@Softek: “She has issues, for sure, and has crossed lines, but when I had the balls to make it clear I wasn’t going to tolerate that behavior, whether it was by not responding to her, or telling her to cut the BS, she responded perfectly every single time.”
Kind of like when defendants dress is suits and ties to make a better impression when they’re on trial and fear getting their salad tossed.
@Snowman, I’d say the best of year one post (the basics) would be a good start. For me, I had read some game stuff, but my resistance was strong. I viewed it all as “asshole tactics,” so I dropped it for a few months, but luckily a voice kept telling me to go back and read more. Not until I read the following post (specifically the KFC example listed on the post) did I finally see the utility of game for a dude in a relationship:
https://heartiste.wordpress.com/2009/08/14/relationship-game-week-a-readers-journey/