In last week’s comment thread, we were linked to a study that purported cuckoldry is far rarer than previously suspected. While I and many others are skeptical of the methodology of the findings I think it’s far more telling about the state of the Feminine Imperative that such a “study” (really meta-study) would be so triumphantly emphasized in the femosphere, thus highlighting the latent purpose for such a study to begin with.
Culum Straun links it for us:
New research suggests that the percentage of men (unknowingly) raising children who aren’t their own is only around 1-2%, as opposed to the 10-30% figure previously accepted over decades.
Reasons are unclear – the first hypothesis was that birth control may have reduced the *pregnancy* rates of women but not the infidelity rate – but apparently the 1-2% figure holds steady going back centuries, so that can’t be it.
The study authors conclude that in all probability the benefits of “superior genes” are outweighed by the risks of being caught and the social stigma etc.
I’d be really interested in seeing what you guys think – is this information that needs to be used to revise our view of the world around us, or is there some flaw in the reasoning/logic leading to 1-2%? The most obvious thing I can see is that we don’t know the methodologies of the underlying studies which were combined to find the meta survey..
I found it interesting that the first reflexive from the femosphere was to wave this in the air as if it were some kind of vindication or a refutation of Hypergamy. “See guys? We don’t actually lie about paternity; if we marry and fuck you we statistically have your kids.”
It’s important to remember that the definition they are exploring here is one where men are “unknowingly” raising the progeny of another man. From the article:
This challenges evolutionary psychologists who have suggested that human women “routinely ‘shop around’ for good genes by engaging in extra-pair copulation to obtain genetic benefits.”
They conveniently ignore the genomic evidence that shows roughly 80% of women bred with 20% of men in our evolutionary past (including Neanderthals), but the basis of the study is flawed because they ask the wrong question. Whether or not the women in our evolutionary past were pair-bonded in whatever social arrangement that passed for institutional monogamy at the time is functionally irrelevant to the latent purpose of cuckoldry.
It does, however, expose the mental point of origin of author Annalee Newitz. If she had cited the source for her quote I’d be less skeptical because no evo-psych researcher worth their salt would presume that women exclusively seek better genetic stock while within a pair-bonded relationship. It’s an indictment of the openness with which women embrace Hypergamy that they’d still need a janitor to sweep its ugliness back under the rug occasionally.
For the greater part of evo-psych research, the emphasis of study has centered on biological and evolutionary motivators (Estrus) that prompt women to Hypergamous predispositions and the end-purpose implied in women fulfilling their sexual strategy.
The Ends of Cuckoldry
The term “cuckoldry” isn’t strictly confined to duplicitous women duping husbands/boyfriends into believing the kid is theirs when it’s some other guy’s. Consider the marked increase in single motherhood since the Sexual Revolution; the statistic for abortion, the declining marriage rate and the fact that now, in westernized society, and the majority of births (close to 60%) are born to unwed mothers.
Now consider the social imperatives and zeitgeist of the past 70 years that promote women’s Hypergamous choices to the point that every woman’s sexual strategy and breeding choices are legislatively mandated to be supported. Men are mandated to support women’s breeding imperatives both directly and indirectly. Is that not the end purpose of cuckoldry?
Cuckoldry is implicative of far more than this woman’s narrow definition. And it’s narrow because women like Newitz are selling a salve to misdirect men in a larger society from considering that their cuckolding is really by and of their own volition. This is because men have been conditioned over the course of successive generations to think they are some kind of hero for ‘saving’ a woman from her own breeding decisions by directly or indirectly forgiving indiscretions and supporting and raising a child he didn’t father.
Just because a man knows the child isn’t his own doesn’t make it any less cuckoldry.
The question that needs to be asked, and is conveniently avoided in the article, is “what is the latent, evolutionarily motivated purpose of cuckoldry that would best serve women’s dualistic sexual strategy?” This is the uncomfortable question those nefarious evo-psych researchers really ask.
In the past, duplicitous, concealed, cuckoldry was a very risky prospect from a social perspective. It could mean family/tribal ostracism or even being stoned to death. So the larger, most deductively efficient way to achieve the same Hypergamous ends of cuckoldry is to reengineer a society where men are either ignorant of their own role in that cuckoldry or provided social rewards for their knowing participation in a socially acceptable form of cuckoldry. The latter is where we’ve progressed since the Sexual Revolution.
The ends remain the same, but it is cuckoldry by a different name. When we can restructure a social order that accepts and excuses both proactive and retroactive cuckoldry before the fact, we normalize it and defuse the consequences for women, while holding men accountable for its consequences or their unwillingness to participate in it. And even when a woman aborts a child – the ultimate confirmation of Hypergamous disapproval – that social order pre-approves her choice, pre-approves holding her unaccountable for it and concurrently makes the men who would find fault in it villains for judging her pre-approved act.
Sons of Cuckolds
Reader Petherton linked me to a fascinating article which not only illustrates that Hypergamy was an issue for the Greatest Generation, but also details the wages of ‘secret’ cuckoldry. Apparently the Archbishop of Canterbury has discovered he is the illegitimate son of Sir Winston Churchill’s last private secretary after taking a DNA test to prove his paternity.
This is a perfect example of women’s hypergamous nature. She rides the cock carousel and gets impregnated by an Alpha who’s already taken. She quickly marries a Beta who is hovering in the background and cuckolds him. He never unplugs, she loses respect for him (if there ever was any in the 1st place) and he drinks himself to an early death.
Eventually the truth comes out. Instead of taking responsibility for her actions, she paints herself as a victim. The pregnancy is blamed on alcohol, and she successfully generates pity from everyone. In fact she generates admiration from everyone for her brave and successful fight against alcoholism, and for putting up with an alcoholic husband.
No one anywhere suggests the truth: that she had a strategy (whether conscious or subconscious) to find the best genes for her offspring, while fooling another man into providing for that offspring. When she gets busted, she successfully paints herself as the victim. You couldn’t make it up!
Needless to say, I found this article and the blatantly revealed cuckoldry oddly karmic in its timing coinciding with the “cuckoldry” study’s release. However, we should now consider the Arch Bishop’s response to his mother’s proveable cuckoldry of his “father”.
“His deepest identity isn’t about which man was his father, but who his heavenly Father is.”
This is exactly the diplomatic response I’d expect from men (albeit a religious one in this instance) steeped in a feminine-primary social order and conditioned from birth to affirm his Blue Pill existence. While egalitarianism is ostensibly about baseline equalism and “it’s what’s on the inside that counts”, on the outside, there is no better social mandate that serves the evolutionary ends of Hypergamy. The Arch Bishop’s response to his mother’s cuckoldry is a textbook example of how the Feminine Imperative conditions men to excuse, affirm and perpetuate its ends.
He said the right thing.
From Schedules of Mating:
For this dynamic, and the practicality of enjoying the best of both genetic worlds, women find it necessary to ‘cheat’. This cheating can be done proactively or reactively.
In the reactive model, a woman who has already paired with her long term partner choice, engages in a extramarital or extra-pairing, sexual intercourse with a short term partner (i.e. the cheating wife or girlfriend). That’s not to say this short term opportunity cannot develop into a 2nd, long term mate, but the action of infidelity itself is a method for securing better genetic stock than the committed male provider is (or was) capable of supplying.
Proactive cheating is the single Mommy dilema. This form of ‘cheating’ relies on the woman breeding with a Good Genes male, bearing his children and then abandoning him, or having him abandon her, (again through invented social conventions) in order to find a Good Dad male to provide for her and the children of her Good Genes partner to ensure their security.
I want to stress again that (most) women do not have some consciously constructed and recognized master plan to enact this cycle and deliberately trap men into it. Rather, the motivations for this behavior and the accompanying social rationales invented to justify it are an unconscious process. For the most part, women are unaware of this dynamic, but are nonetheless subject to its influence. For a female of any species to facilitate a methodology for breeding with the best genetic partner she’s able to attract AND to ensure her own and her offspring’s survival with the best provisioning partner; this is an evolutionary jackpot.
On some level of consciousness, men innately sense something is wrong with this situation, though they may not be able to place why they feel it or misunderstand it in the confusion of women’s justifications for it. Or, they become frustrated by the social pressures to ‘do the right thing’, are shamed into martyrdom/savior-hood and committed to a feigned responsibility to these conventions. Nevertheless, some see it well enough to steer clear of single mothers, either by prior experience or observing other male cuckolds saddled with the responsibility of raising and providing for – no matter how involved or uninvolved – another man’s successful reproduction efforts with this woman.
Men often fall into the role of the proactive or reactive Cuckold. He will never enjoy the same benefits as his mates short term partner(s) to the same degree, in the way of sexual desire or immediacy of it, while at the same time enduring the social pressures of having to provide for this Good Genes father’s progeny. It could be argued that he may contribute minimally to their welfare, but on some level, whether emotional, physical, financial or educational he will contribute some effort for another man’s genetic stock in exchange for a limited form of sexuality/intimacy from the mother. To some degree, (even if only by his presence) he is sharing the parental investment that should be borne by the short term partner. If nothing else, he contributes the time and effort to her he could be better invested in finding a sexual partner with which he could pursue his own genetic imperative by his own methodology.
However, needless to say, there is no shortage of men sexually deprived enough to ‘see past’ the long term disadvantages, and not only rewarding, but reinforcing a single mother’s bad decisions (bad from his own interest’s POV) with regard to her breeding selections and schedules in exchange for short term sexual gratification. Furthermore, by reinforcing her behavior thusly, he reinforces the social convention for both men and women. It’s important to bear in mind that in this age women are ultimately, soley responsible for the men they choose to mate with (baring rape of course) AND giving birth to their children. Men do bear responsibility for their actions no doubt, but it is ultimately the decision of the female and her judgement that decides her and her children’s fate
Who’s the Daddy?
Finally, we complete the cuckoldry trifecta with the Spectator article, Who’s the Daddy. Again, serendipitously, the rationale of this article exposes (perhaps obliviously) the social underpinnings of the Feminine Imperative’s motives in getting men to accept women’s Hypergamous choices as the preeminent social norm.
Many men have, of course, ended up raising children who were not genetically their own, but really, does it matter? You can feel quite as much tenderness for a child you mistakenly think to be yours as for one who is.
[…]Uncertainty allows mothers to select for their children the father who would be best for them.
If the definition of cuckoldry ought to be confined to deceptive duplicity, as AnnaleeNewitz suggests in her article, why then should we need a push to legally mandate men to being accountable fathers by default when they proveably are not?
Ironically, the very same DNA swab test that betrayed the Arch Bishop’s mother’s cuckoldry is the test Melanie McDonagh proposes we make illegal or irrelevant in a court of law. And unironically, the Arch Bishop parrots back the mantra of the Feminine Imperative to excuse his own mother’s birth-fraud.
But in making paternity conditional on a test rather than the say-so of the mother, it has removed from women a powerful instrument of choice. I’m not sure that many people are much happier for it.
Novaseeker had an excellent comment on this:
From the time paternity tests became more available and reliable, and men started using them to avoid paternity claims, the same argument has been made: it’s bad for the kids. Who cares if he isn’t the bio-dad, fatherhood isn’t about biology, it’s about a parental relationship. We should trust women who determine who the father is, so that she can choose the best man she thinks to be the father, etc., etc. The same arguments have been made for some time. In fact, medical ethicists also make the same arguments, to a large degree, in support of not disclosing non-paternity when it comes up in tests that were not specifically undergone to determine paternity — in other words, if your kid is getting tested for inherited disease, and the hospital finds out that it isn’t your bio kid, they don’t tell you that, for all the reasons stated in the article.
This really is a visceral issue for women. Paternity tests strike at something fundamental in women, even if the actual cuckolding rate remains low: the possibility to cuck, if needed. It’s a visceral issue for women, at a very deep and basic hindbrain level, for fairly clear reasons. If paternity tests were ever to become standard/mandatory at birth, the cucking strategy, even if it is a rather uncommon one, would become completely unavailable, and almost every single woman finds that to be a problem based on her hindbrain (and regardless of how her forebrain will formulate that deep, basic discomfort).
I’ve stated it in the past, but as the Feminine Imperative becomes more comfortable with Open Hypergamy and Open Cuckoldry more men will find its machinations unignorable. Thus, as increasingly more men refuse to participate in the game of their gender’s debasement the imperative must pursue legal mandates and fluid social restructuring to force men to comply with it.
An amazing thing is how easy it is for women to dismiss the significance of biological fatherhood. It’s almost as if it simply doesn’t matter to them.
If that’s not an obvious flag of the FI, and the attendant idea that one sex’s sexual strategy must always impinge on the other sex’s sexual strategy, I don’t know what is. It places zero, zilch, nada importance on the male interest in having genetic progeny — again, it’s as if that interest simply doesn’t exist, and is illegitimate to even take into consideration.
There was a time when I had difficulty explaining the difference between men’s idealistic concept of love and women’s opportunistic concept of love. I’ve recently come to see that the best explanations and contrasts come from the openly embraced examples set by women that can’t be ignored.
There is no better example of women’s opportunistic love, indeed, women’s innate solipsistic nature, than the phrase “it shouldn’t matter to the man who the biological father of the child really is – he just needs to accept it and support it.”
And there is no greater evidence of the Feminine Imperative’s purpose than a society structured to ensure that men and women believe this, as well as perpetuate it.
Water Cannon Boy
I really would tag a girl in the butt with a water cannon at the water park.
Yes, yes you would. Even the special snowflake daughters of very special snowflake grrrrrlbloggers.
Here you go Softie… cheer up… wisdom from the bards…
Children of Cucks.
12 angry Cucks.
No country for Old Cucks.
Lord of the Cucks: Return of the Cuck.
Super Cuck Brothers.
Fast Times at Cuck High.
………..coming to a theatre near you……….
Have you guys seen that recent eharmony commercial where she said, “I was looking for a man not only for me but also my son.” Smdh
Softek’s post and toxic people comment got me to thinking about mental point of origin. A rundown for my own clarification. Self mental point of origin * I control who enters my frame (internal validation) – I allow you to enter my frame (benevolent rule/amused mastery/dominance) – I will force you to enter my frame (coercive/violent) – I refuse you permission to enter my frame (rejection/ostracism) – I will trick you to enter my frame (manipulative/psychopaths/bipolar women) External mental point of origin (external validation) – Will you allow me to enter your frame (docile/submissive) – You must allow me to… Read more »
Man eating Monday. Forge said: “There are people that can be taught, who can learn to be better. There are some people who just need to learn better relationship skills. They tend to learn them rather than control the relationship so that they don’t have to. Fumbles are fine. Power games aren’t.” In regards to relationship skills. (And I have a few of them). I have been most impressed by the book listed in the second link below that I found from this 2012 article on “Relationship Control and Female Domination” http://www.girlschase.com/content/relationship-control-and-female-domination. Understanding how things go wrong and why imbalances… Read more »
Softek- I strongly recommend signing up for a shaving club provided by one, Ockham. I prefer lurk modus but following your situation compels me (in the name of JC!). I find it dangerous to prescribe solutions to one-sided stories (yours), so respectfully decline. So, sspeaking from vast experience with LTRs with NPDs and BPDs (yes, I’m aware this is my kink and that I attract high damage for reasons only known to me), do not get sspun up on this one. Why? The Ockham answer is what you discovered from day one: she cheated on her BF with you. Please… Read more »
To add … Your oneitis is creeping like kudzu. Don’t fret. It’s what happens to inccels and hopeless “Cap’n Save-a-Hos” as I was once.
Great massages aside, what’s more important? Your physical pleasure or mental/emotional MPO? Once more, a great girl only enhances your already great life, she does not burden/countermand your MPO.
Benny B- Sigh. Don’t mind me, just rummaging through my vast end-of-bed locker full of damaged hotties. Ah, there she is — looks just like your girl. Again, I only know your sitch from one side (suspect),and you asked for help, so I will not prescribe. But what I do know, from my own experience, is you should prepare for an eventual Fujita F5 situation from her. It starts out with ccrying but the worst thing you can do is to apply the blue pill emotional tampon salve. It’s what Pattrice O’Neill called a “brackish bitch.” Brilliant analogy. Basically, Patrice… Read more »
The Melanie McDonagh article displays the full spectrum of modern female spoiled bratitude: a presumption women and children are more valuable than men, a cavalier who-cares attitude toward defrauded men, an assumption men must pay for women and their breeding, a refusal to hold women accountable for poor behavior (it’s not her fault for fucking someone else, it’s his fault for catching her!), and an indelible naive belief women are pure with wholesome intentions. Women present themselves as deities of a religion. The deities are pure and infallible. The religion has its dogma: thou shalt respect women, thou shalt believe… Read more »
@ all Thanks a million for all the advice. Working on all this now. Ended up confronting her about the contact with her exes and guys sleeping over, etc. Talking to her now. I can’t believe I was so blind to this. If it was an arrangement where she wasn’t giving me shit about looking at other girls, and trying to put a chastity belt on me that only she has the key to, it would be different. But I just had a moment of realization where it’s like…..okay, she’s giving me shit for looking at other girls, but it’s… Read more »
@Softek: Bruh! No thanks needed… That being said, in my opinion, that convo was too long… You’re letting her dominate the airwaves and it’s fucking your MPO. I remember a plate I had last year try to pull that shit and get me into oneitis, I basically just told her I don’t do exclusivity and I don’t share pussy, and that I understand she wants a certain type of guy, but I will NOT change…then I told her to leave. Needless to say I’m now dealing with pleas for her to be my slut…go figure. Lay down the fucking law… Read more »
Scratch that…get away from this chic period. There’s more, juicier fish in the sea….
Ajax Parallax, thanks for the wisdom, bro. Can’t fuckin’ believe this, but your words reminded me of when her and I had been seeing each other for 13 months. We got really drunk with a couple friends of ours and the bitch was fucking around with me in the backseat and laid a deep scratch in the back of my neck, like one that people could see for weeks. Anyway, she was being a drunk cunt, my friends dropped us off in a hotel parking garage. I saw she wasn’t following me, like she wanted to play a fuckin game,… Read more »
@Scray & @FtS
1 word: Calibration
@FtS “When you’re first learning how to generate attraction, you’re looking for the MAXIMUM IOI’S to validate your efforts. But very open, abundant IOI’s often indicate that a chick is just having fun flirting with you, not that she’s really intending to take it anywhere.” There was a concept the old-school Speed Seduction types had that was golden. Their Guru, RJ, gave it the unfortunate name of Doggie Dinner Bowl (DDB) look. Stupid nomenclature aside, it’s a look (outward appearance of a state) that’s unmistakeable after you’ve been trained to see it, a trance state, but aware, and focused, and… Read more »
“I’ve only seen it in 1 video up on the interenet, where it was caught randomly . . .”
The RSD Forum provides this, a woman doing an interview of Louis C.K.; go to 2:30:
Opps. Wrong one: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BjNgNDZzH5o&fmt=22
@Softek Still talking to her about all this, giving her more shit about it, and seeing how she’s evading all my questions. And now you understand why you don’t try to reason with or have discussions with a woman about situations like this. You lay out what she has to do. No “Why are you doing this?” blah blah blah… just “Your behavior is unacceptable. Here’s what it should be,” then soft next if anything other than “OK” comes out of her mouth. She wants to be lead. Lead her. If she refuses to be lead, you find someone who… Read more »
YaReally Sentient HABD Scray Forge scribblerg et al: April Going Out Blitz Week is coming up (next week) so I’ve made these notes for myself – a ritual to prepare and pump up my state each evening I go out. Comments welcome – will try it out and see how much it helps: 1. Feel/look physically good – feel well rested and fed and food and showered and dressed well etc after getting home from work (yes, not absolutely necessary but good for state). 2. 10 minutes meditation after getting home from work to reset for the evening out 3.… Read more »
@Kfg: thanks. I was curious about that. She also licks her lips at 3:30 or so with a very similar look on her face. Would be interesting to see other examples. I watched the whole interview and it is interesting because it doesn’t look like Louis was doing much to get that kind of result. Presumably he had very strong eye contact throughout, and he had massive social proof going in anyway (also there are cutouts so maybe there was some other Game going on not shown). Maybe it is too subtle for me to spot with my lack of… Read more »
@culum great attitude… Biggest one is work on the inner game narrative about being the prize, being outcome independent… I banged girl number 8 this weekend…slim 24ish, cute , fun and a self declared “feminist”. Opened her at a dance party. Negs tease then comfort spikes and dhv keeping myself mysterious. She was following me around peppering me with questions. Dances again the. Said : “I’m going for drinks, join me” She was surprised at my invite and asked “just the two of us?” I looked at her with amused mastery and said “duh”. Then she tried to rationalise it… Read more »
“Stupid nomenclature aside, it’s a look (outward appearance of a state) that’s unmistakeable after you’ve been trained to see it, a trance state, but aware, and focused, and intense with desire.” I’ve called it ‘greenlight face’ in past comments here. That allows me to contrast it with ‘redlight face,’ which is the friendly/betabait sort of look lots of guys think means they ‘have a chance with her.’ Redlight: http://livesuperfoods.com/media/wysiwyg/pretty-woman-blog.jpg Greenlight: http://www.portrait-photos.org/_photo/4423878.jpg It’s a bit hard to illustrate in photos or even video though. A lot of it isn’t any static part of the expression, but the way she starts reacting… Read more »
@ kfg I’m watching that clip and wondering how I would close. I’ve gotten that look before and I know it’s a dead giveaway IOI that the girl is dtf. The key is following through on that. Even when I was at the supermarket the other day I noticed some girl giving me pretty heavy IOI’s, but I was too nervous to approach. She kept ‘accidentally’ showing up in the same aisles I did. First time I saw her there she did a walk by where we made eye contact and as she passed me she turned her head to… Read more »
#1 pre game rule – KNOW YOUR LOGISTICS… plan the 3-4 bounce spots – i.e. another drink, food, coffee, late place.. and the PATH BACK to your place!!!
How will you get there, how long will it take, what will your wing do?
Get this stuff as right as your pregame plan…
as to that, looks solid. Would add, eat early… ijjjji at Sedfast swears by 4 hours before gaming or more… I will agree, less food in the gut will give you better energy…
Have fun, tear it up.
CH had some very interesting stats on this topic. According to an English study, 1 out of 50 children were of “cucked” (2%) marriages, female rape rates were 1 out of 200, or .005%. It would appear that cuckholdry is a much larger problem in English society that female rape is. Of course facts and appearances don’t mean shit to the FI. I’ve been thinking that Trump sort of symbolizes the alpha crab trying to climb out of the barrel, but the GOP cucks of the land like George Will won’t allow Trump to rise above and lead us fellow… Read more »
@Softek What Sun said. See, by writing all this out you’ve made it very clear that you can use impeccable reasoning and she can still kick your ass in the interaction. And your own brain will go along with it cause it wants to believe a lot of what she’s saying. She learned what sorts of things work from trial and error. She tells you ‘maybe this wouldn’t have happened if you hadn’t done X’ because she knows it’ll work. Now you can see the circumstance you’re in. How little power you have here. And, unfortunately for the bluepill part… Read more »
I love that vid Forge.
He doesn’t keep great eye contact (I presume partly to look at the camera), but whenever he does laser her, her head bobs up and down in agreement at everything he’s saying.
It’s almost hypnotic…
@Culum Yep, that sounds great! I’d only add, I’ve found that having some way to change my state/reset in field w/o meditating is pretty helpful. I’ve personally found a milder version of this to work for me, so long as I’m in a noisy place lol: https://youtu.be/P41ER1Wmkj0 It just gets me to focus on my body and breath for a few seconds, creates a bit of full-body stimulation. Boom, reset, then I’m off again. Other guys will breath deep, swing their arms, jump, yell a bit, clap their hands…it’s actually a normal sort of thing when people are trying to… Read more »
@Softek at 11:17pm props on the self-awareness… but this whole post is just you trying to talk yourself back into being f*ked up… lol… you KNOW what the right choice for you IS… you just are having trouble fighting the FI and doing that… bc that means putting yourself FIRST… and it sounds like you are having to overcome a bunch of childhood shit too (which also seems to be about putting YOU first…). So, i’m changing my recommendation… to ‘move on’… not that it will matter what i advise…lol… bc those flames are very colorful and pretty…lol… have you… Read more »
@Culum at 6:31am
if you are going to go through all that trouble to plan the blitz week, it might make sense to write out the whole ‘week’, so you can have a logical progression on skill building throughout the week…
and don’t forget to START with ‘logisitics’…lol…
then work backwards from there…lol… that way, even if you do f*k up the ‘opens’, you’ll STILL get bangs…lol…
@Harlequin It is hypnotic. During this timeframe, everything he was doing seemed like literal magic to that reporter. Girls get really swept up in their attraction. You may have noticed. It changes their whole reality. Most guys have no clue what they could all do to a girl at that sort of moment (logistics allowing.) Effective game is rather like being a wizard at times. Literally, you can change a girl’s name in her own head for a little bit. I’ve done this. [Girl is really attracted] Me: you’re Darkeyes now. Her: what? Me: that’s your name. Her: noooo, it… Read more »
@softek We are having an eerily similar experience. I was having a lot of success, thinking I was completely unplugged and this shit was too easy. One girl came along, stunner who was completely my type, I fall for her, and low and behold blue pill behaviours come back. I didn’t want to commit and show low value, but I stopped actively trying to find other girls. As the guys here pointed out, I was still demonstrating in my sub-coms I wanted something serious, girls can tell whether you are actually fucking others or not. She became distant and started… Read more »
I love the name change thing, will have to try it this week.
I realised the visceral attraction/bedroom eyes when I saw it, even in my pre red pill days. In fact, looking back, it massively improved my game in that moment. I knew that I could toy with her and escalate at will, I’d say it’s how I got most of my lays.
Now I need to try and replicate that with girls who aren’t super attracted just from first looks.
“Softek, what the fuck are you doing? Come on! I had her warmed up for you, and you didn’t do anything!”
Routine stack, man. Have one. It’s just to keep you from stalling or saying something stupid while the two of you get comfortable around each other.
Do it, man. Girls love it when you name them so long as you have high value to them. It’s like putting your jacket on them, but more intense, personal. It makes them feel owned or possessed by you. “I’m his Darkeyes.”
@ Sun, forge, bad day I feel like I have a better shot pursuing other women while I’m still with this one. And that makes me feel like a piece of shit. But I feel like if things got cut off with her, I would feel too fucked up and get too depressed and discouraged to try striking something up with any other girls if I didn’t already have something else going on. While I’m still having sex, I feel like I have some momentum going. Guys need momentum. Women don’t. They just have to show up to the party.… Read more »
@softek “She literally COMPLETELY DEFLECTED and just resorted to asking me, “Why don’t you want me to be your girlfriend?” She even said that the guy staying over her house was ON ME, because “I never said anything about it” or she “didn’t know that bothered me.”” she’s technically not wrong. you’re being wishy washy about commitment. like i said in my first post, she’s playing within ‘the rules’ and because she’s insane, she’s way BETTER than you are at it. “Then she comes back with “So who’s really to blame here?,” mentioning how I don’t want commitment and haven’t… Read more »
@ Harlequin Thanks for the advice and anecdote. That does help for me to know that. I’ve thought the same, that she’ll just keep coming back. My friend thought the same with his old GF that he cheated on probably 20-30 times. He only got caught red-handed a few times, and she took him back every time. He said that was the first time he ever felt heartache. He just figured she’d keep taking him back, like she did every other time. The last time she said “You’ve hurt me for the last time,” and that really was the end… Read more »
@Softek, bookmark this video and play it whenever you feel like going back to your SPECIAL SNOWFLAKE:
You like RPG games by chance? ALL of them SATURATED with the “Her frame” mentality and “REPRODUCE, IT’S GOOD FOR YOU.” And “Don’t juggle bitches, you’ll go to hell!”
“other people are going to pull the ‘WOMEN ARE ILLOGICAL/IRRATIONAL LOL DONT DO IT!!111!!’ card.” Why do you think they call it game? Is it logical in the sense of an Aristotelian syllogism? No. Is it logical in the sense of a game tactic? Yes. Once you’ve actually read the rule set (rather than the rules you pick up by osmosis and deception by the other side) and looked over the lay of the playing field. Then you realize that women’s behaviour makes sense. They are playing the game, and they are playing to win, with tactics that work (the… Read more »
@ scray Thanks for the insights. And you’re dead on. I’ve been hesitant to write her off as BPD, not because that isn’t a potential reality, but because she IS psychologically dominating me, and I’m being incongruent and my frame is all fucked up and has more holes in it than a package of swiss cheese. I absolutely am acting monogamous, but refuse to say that I’m monogamous. I’m confusing even myself. I keep writing in circles here because even I don’t know what the fuck I’m doing. I’m trying to ‘hold frame’ but in reality I don’t have a… Read more »
“It just turns into a circus because she asks me point blank if I want to fuck other girls, and if I don’t want to fuck other girls, then why won’t I commit to her?”
Bloody good damned question. You better come up with a bloody good damned answer. Not for her, for yourself.
“She said she wanted . . .”
@Softie – Listen to Scray. And get this. You are monogamous. I pointed this out months ago, fyi. One of the most bizarre things to witness here is your commentary about refusing to be monogamous in your comments but in your actions you are monogamous. Sure, OneItis is one way to look at the problem, but I see it as a bigger problem. You are being fundamentally incongruent and of course she recognizes it. She knows who has the value in this equation, who’s thirsty and who isn’t. Sun Tzu from The Art of War – All battles are won… Read more »
i mean here’s some insight into those times….
those were actual messages and exchanges….
lol…idk reading it as written at the time and remembering more, ehhhh….maybe i still come out worse idfk
@softek It sounds like you need to get your internals sorted more than anything. I appreciate you have had a tough upbringing but I hope good advice is good advice. If you can get one girl at that level attractiveness you need to believe you can get that again. This wasn’t some cosmic level one-off event, you can apply the same mechanisms and get a girl like her again. The first one is the hardest, take you who had 0 experience before and now you have a solid 7 months experience playing the game. This girl I fucked up with… Read more »
Sentient, HABD, Forge et al – Thanks guys – Good point about logistics – I have a reasonable idea for my usual venues, but always good to have it clear in advance. My week is already pretty much planned out in terms of venues, with some space left for potential Day2s with some girls I’m texting (and for early evening stuff or earlier in the week I will be doing the hotel bar circuit stuff Sentient posted about before). All about optimizing the going out time – one week this month, two weeks next month focused on gaming. More importantly,… Read more »
@kfg “Then you realize that women’s behaviour makes sense. They are playing the game, and they are playing to win, with tactics that work (the only metric to gauge the logic of them against), logically (and deceiving you about the rules of the game is one of those tactics).” yup. guys are like ‘womyn are so irrational lol wtf!’ while at the same time caving in to their tactics. @softek “I absolutely am acting monogamous, but refuse to say that I’m monogamous. I’m confusing even myself. I keep writing in circles here because even I don’t know what the fuck… Read more »
i’d change 5 (or add another number) where you take your cell phone, place it somewhere, and record yourself walking into an invisible group and spitting your game.
it can make a huge difference in your confidence
when you do it in a way that you smirk at when watching on camera, you’ll carry that confidence with you the rest of the night.
“lol…idk reading it as written at the time and remembering more, ehhhh….maybe i still come out worse idfk”
Read that stuff a little while ago. Thanks for sharing it with everyone to learn from.
@Scray – that’s a great one, thanks. Will def do that when doing the warmup exercises.
(and Walawala too – just saw your post. Hopefully when I start spending more time in the big city I’ll have the stability to consistently be seeing different girls..)
“More posting and commenting is a waste of time and actually provides an emotional payoff for us that makes us feel like we are progressing when we are not. ”
sometimes. but sometimes posting helps us make intellectual leaps that lead to places we could not have anticipated.
when you come to a fork in the road…. take it
“…so other people will know and then either rat me out if I cheat or stay away from me in the first place because I’m in a relationship…”
this is why God invented cold approach.
@ scribblerg Thanks for the input, and you’re completely right. @ scray Thanks for the links, checking those out. @ Harlequin I think I need to *focus* on my hobbies outside of girls. I already have a lot of hobbies, but I’m not going anywhere near my full potential. Scrib’s called me out on this before. If I put as much effort into my hobbies as I did with all this roundabout thinking I could be creating full fledged businesses. I do need more connections. That means going out and making them. I’ve had a little success but I know… Read more »
“Feeling a little more on track after scrib’s much needed slap in the face too especially.”
Next time, get on the fucking train (which all by itself would be a win for you) and have him teach you . . . poker.
“Next time, get on the fucking train (which all by itself would be a win for you) and have him teach you . . . poker.” He can’t. He has to ignore people who are being rational towards him so he can carry on forgiving his dad for ignoring him as a kid. Its why he’s with BPD GF in the first place. He tells her stuff and she just fucking ignores it. That’s the pay off. Being ignored. If he can be in a relationship with someone who completely ignores what he says, then he had love as a… Read more »
Softek, when I was young I was terrified to talk to staff in a store. Even to pay for something at the counter. Common enough for a shy boy of 8 I suppose, but likely i would have been slow to get past it if my father hadn’t made a point of driving with me to a store, parking, then saying – OK, we need a and b. Go get them. And he wouldn’t leave, and he wouldn’t get out of the car, so I had to do it. And I rationalized and pleaded and raged, but I did it,… Read more »
Alright, Softek. Strategy if you don’t know how to push your comfort zone. Go to the train station. Look around, figure out how it all works. Ask an attendant for a schedule, how often x train runs or something like that. Just run through your head how the whole deal will work when you need a train ride in the future. I did something like this the first time I traveled in Europe by myself. Figuring out the transit system in a country that spoke a foreign language, where I knew no-one….guess I just needed a dry run. The next… Read more »
@Softie – That comment was so much more awesome! Nice to hear you are on mission with the biz. Also, I get that growing a business is not a straight line thing, trust me. Keep at the invention, etc. Also great news on the other approaches and making friends. As for meds. You will get a lot of negative feedback about it, mostly from people who aren’t actually mentally ill. For me, using meds was an important step on my mental health journey. It’s a great sign of your humility and practicality – they may help, why not? For me… Read more »
Softek – all these guys are giving you great advice, so I won’t add any more except to say that as Forge says – you need to push the comfort zone, but that’s hard for EVERYONE. I have a Natural buddy with an insane notch count who is trying to learn cold approach and he has now gone weeks literally unable to ask a strange girl for the time on the street. This is a guy with rock solid subcomms and entitlement like you wouldn’t believe. But cold approach is outside his comfort zone (he’s mostly pulled from his extended… Read more »
Came across this site while searching from something… a lot of Tyler circa 2007 or whenever… some very interesting bits… small site. Some things explained in detail that you don’t see in the videos… http://thewapzone.blogspot.com/2007/07/partea-4.html a snippet Anyway, I’ll post more on this later. So on to the outing report. I get a phone call from another one of my ex-girlfriends’ ex-boyfriends. This is the guy that I “stole” my ex-girlfriend from. I slept with her while they were still together, and she dumped him supposedly for me (debatable). Then we stayed together for a while. So its funny, because… Read more »
One more note: she’s big on wanting it to be ‘FB official.’ Bahahahaha, welcome to part of why I don’t have a social networking account anymore. Last chick I had that did this got told “No”, and then when she pushed it “Oh look, I accidentally closed the FB account I don’t use.” That was 6 years ago. I haven’t missed it. At all. I love the internet and all, but social networking is social masturbation. Get rid of all that shit and go make a real social network for yourself. Far more rewarding, and people actually buy you beers… Read more »
” . . . social networking is social masturbation.”
If a commercial website is “free,” you are not the customer, you are the product.
The world will never be the same again after Facebook. First the West, then everyone else.
Networking is something that should be done regarding work and work related things. Social networking is a ridiculous oxymoron. People sitting around staring at screens? really?
Oh yeah, Get Off My Lawn!!!!!
It’s digital sharecropping, yes.
For all the self-respecting RP men here who just can’t imagine Softek’s girl having plenty of beta orbiters and her *not* putting out on some level to keep them…. Women don’t need to do *anything* to keep our orbiters. We don’t even need to flirt. We don’t even need to be nice. We can be awful, bratty, self-centered batches as long as we agree with the orbiter out loud that we are, indeed, friends. You look from the outside at these men and see them acting so far out of their own interests that they *must* be getting *something* from… Read more »
Just… in general… it seems like the power of the pussy *in practice* still reigns supreme more than TRM faithfuls care to acknowledge.
Rather men have a powerful drive to turn a furrow and plant seed. Men practice husbandry. Women practice deception.
“And, here, We Go . . . Again . . .” I’ll bite first this time: “… it seems like the power of the pussy *in practice* still reigns supreme more than TRM faithfuls care to acknowledge.” You cannot have read much here, nor are we in any way involved with being average. A weight lifting site is not there to create men with average strength. A cycle racing site is not there to create men of average speed. A chess site is not there to create average chess players. Do you really believe that because these sites strive to… Read more »
Not a damn bit of what you’ve said there:
A) Is something we’re not aware of. Look around on almost any TRP site (this one included) for talk of “The Thirst” if you don’t believe me.
B) Is something Rollo doesn’t address and acknowledge.
TL;DR: Uh, duh?
For the record, I am not now nor have I ever been for the past few minutes posing as a troll, or masquerading as a cis-gendered female-type questioningly semi-demi-hemi-sexual persun.
That’s not me wearing a dress either. For that you have to come pay to see me in the drag club on North State Street a half block up from the Starbucks near the corner with Grand Ave. Third bearded dancer on the left. (I hate when that happens)
Tee-hee, (FX :laughs)
Intersectionally yours, etc.
@kfg I’ve read every article on TRM at this point, and every comment thread since finding it last fall. But, as a woman, I can’t learn, relate, empathize, etc. And everything I think is actually how I feelz at the time. I know. Certainly, I can’t relate to the striving for excellence of the male RP commenters here. I can only react to that these comments of surprise do happen. Often. Or I wouldn’t have been able to read them, and then be surprised myself at how out of touch with the reality of how really thirsty the ‘average’ AFC… Read more »
Cockblind, lane changing skank and psycho hits lotto. Lindsay Lohan, age 29 marries 22 year old son of Russian millionaire. Any guess how this is going to turn out? Bang out a kid or two and boom, she’ll be done with him. Cha-ching! You can make book on that bet.
Read the deets here. Just amazing, even Lohan, who’s skankery and insanity is plain to see can rope in an unsuspecting victim. @Softie – Don’t feel so bad, the magic vadge has hypnotic powers once it gets it’s hooks into you.
Look at her, is that the look of a woman in love? Or a predator?
Lol. It’s the look of a crackhead.
Afraid to push your boundaries? Well I’m afraid you’re gonna have to suck it up.
Scott Adams is no master PUA but he has a point.
Aw, c’mon, leave the rich Russian guy alone. Lohan’s a catch!
@ Hopeless I agree with your first point, and that was my argument. That women have to hardly do anything to keep orbiters around. All she has to do is give them the slightest shred of hope that something MIGHT happen to keep them around. This is how I got stuck in the ‘friendzone’ for so long with so many girls. I was that guy who would hang around and do favors and all that and on exceptionally rare occasions I might get a hug. Maybe too much of that was too ‘creepy’ for them, lol. Can’t string Beta Softek… Read more »
Blax “the world will never be the same after Facebook” How true… Zuckerberg one of the most dangerous men in the world, approaching 1 billion daily users… and pushing his equalist narrative 24/7/365… http://www.usatoday.com/story/tech/2016/04/12/zuckerbergs-10-year-plan-expand-facebook-empire/82936814/ SAN FRANCISCO — Facebook CEO Mark Zuckerberg laid out a 10-year plan to connect the world that sounded as much like a political cause as a grab for potential billions in dollars. In a sweeping address that took on sharp political tones at times, Facebook’s 31-year-old CEO detailed how Facebook aims to reach the planet’s 7 billion people — half of whom do not have Internet… Read more »
Look at this poor chode, Egor Tarabasov. What, do you think Lohan saw him and was like, yummy? Lol.
Like I said, crackhead.
As far as this knucklehead guy she’s caught, people will but shit on a stick if it’s available. Of course some idiot went for her. Zfg.
Crack hoes earn money. Somebody finds them useful.
@Sentient – Saw the Zuckerberg thing and vomited. This manlet, this adult child believes that he can sweep aside the nation-state order with gauzy sentimentality. Sadly, he represents the idiocy of our new elite.
@Blax – I like fucking skanks and sluts, and would bang Lohan given half a chance and call myself lucky. I just wouldn’t marry her. I mean, if you are going to rule out every chick who’s ever done a bit of coke, that’s going to cut way down on the available pool of chicks. Coke use might as well be the equivalent of DTF. I mean, you do realize that most women aren’t doing ONS and three-ways etc? Read the studies, most women have fewer than 10 sexual partners in their lives. I bet 50% of the women who… Read more »
He’s not even old enough for a moustache to grow in, lol. Poor fucking schmuck.
That’s why you need good male friends you’ll trust around no matter what. You need somebody to catch you doing this shit that’s gonna hurt you and be all like:
“WAKE UP BITCH!”
Indeed Zuckerberg is setting himself to be even more Soros/Koch Bros than they are… he has the platform and his new organization has $45B in fake money pledged to it…
Add Google and those nutters to it… damn…
[is it just me or has Google gotten much worse in search results? More edited?]
The internet and other modern tech does have the effect of making the world smaller and more accessible, so globalism is inevitable to a degree. However, that’s no reason everyone should have to hand all the profits from their labor and data over to Fuckerberg & Co.
Many of the same people happy Apple’s protecting their privacy by refusing to decrypt phones are happily posting away about it on Facebook. Oh the irony.
Hiding right in plain sight…
still think money and status automatically = alpha?
Spot the alpha – LOL
That Russian guy is a total simp. Lohan hit the wall years ago. She looks at least 10 years older than her age, and that’s being generous.
The other moron is that young art dealer that hooked up with Heidi Klum. Klum is a great partner for a 55+ man with money, not a man in his 20’s.
There is no better example of women’s opportunistic love, indeed, women’s innate solipsistic nature, than the phrase “it shouldn’t matter to the man who the biological father of the child really is – he just needs to accept it and support it.”
And if you’re a SIW you do not even need to make that point; just have a vulgar rag soft-peddle your FI: “Pregnant Megan Fox Jokes About Who Her Baby Daddy Is” (http://www.usmagazine.com/celebrity-moms/news/pregnant-megan-fox-jokes-about-who-her-baby-daddy-is-w202492)
@Sentient Zuckerberg isn’t going to do shit to truly impact anyone’s life positively. Fucking apps do not count. They are inedible and you can’t drink them. Zuckerberg is a part of the New techno Elite. They don’t really creat anything of value ( actual value ) but they manage to make hundreds of billions of fake dollars in the process. A really bad day on Wall Street could make him vanish. Exhibit A) My city was/is undergoing a true crisis in education. The system is broken via corruption and flat out ineptitude. An entire generation of kids are getting left… Read more »
People will not care at all about any of this, as long as they can network socially.
Panem et circenses seems to never completely go out of style.
100 million bucks + poor, half assed planning = shit. This is part of the problem with Common Core and the upcoming SAT revision as well. A handful of people are actually creating both, and those people are strictly upper crust Ivy League types, who have never had a real, shovel the gravel, job. Therefore they cannot relate to middle class students, who still make up the bulk of the high school student body and the SAT takers. The upper middle class is more like French aristocracy in the 18th century than any of the rich SOB’s in America in… Read more »
“She married Zuckerberg on May 19, 2012, a day after Facebook’s stock market launch”[wikipedia]
The FI leaves nothing to chance…. I can’t stop laughing…
A 4… a 4 waits until the IPO…. Lulzzzzzz.
But watch out Blax…
The Chan Zuckerberg Initiative [note top billing] was only getting warmed up in Newark…
Elementary teacher wins twerking contest in Cabo, loses job.
Guess which school?
Looking through the pix it’s wonderful to see all the support for breast cancer research…
http://guardianlv.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/Lindsay-Lohan1-e1375796301259.jpg So 29 YO Lohan snags a young millionaire as the clock is hitting 0:00… Nice! High fives all around. TEAM LOHAN! Are there parralells to Zuckerberg. and his 4? Did both of these guys lock down their virgin taking oneitis? I mean, in the dark, Lohan… well with the miles of cock she has trod… must be an experience at least… maybe too much for our young hero? For damn sure Zuck was a virgin when she hit that in Hahhvaaahd… his mission became showing her. Behind every “great” man is a woman… telling him he can’t do it… Read more »