Don’t Hate the Beta

beta_hate

A common refrain I hear from even some well meaning Red Pill aware men is that there is some degree of disdain for the “Beta” man in the sphere. There’s not so much a rejection of apparent Red Pill truths as there is a schoolyard mentality when it comes to characterizing a guy as Alpha or Beta. This is where where a lot of guys turn themselves off to the Red Pill in a community sense.

In a way I suppose it becomes reminiscent of guys having been bullied in their formative years by the guys they now have a mental image of being archetypically “Alpha”. So it follows that concepts like AMOGing or running a ‘Boyfriend Destroyer’ script is distasteful; a lot of men, that is to say the 80%+ Beta men, have likely experienced this disqualification in direct or indirect ways in their youth. Sometimes that may simply be a girl he had his ONEitis sights set on opting for a more Alpha guy after telling him she wasn’t ready for a relationship, or it may be a more direct experience of having sand metaphorically kicked in his face.

Thus it becomes a matter of course to entirely dismiss the nuts & bolts understanding of how abstracts like Alpha and Beta are used in the sphere. The default understanding goes something like this, “Those Red Pillers just hate on Betas to build themselves up” or some other version of this where the Red Pill becomes a Machiavellian free for all at the expense of other, ‘lesser’, men.

It’s either this or the abstractions of Alpha and Beta are reduced to absurd binary interpretations; Alphas become ridiculous ‘douchebag’ parodies and Betas become pathetic, simpering doormats for the world to tread upon. In either case the purpose of reducing these abstracts as such is an effort in dismissing the uncomfortable, as well as evidently observable qualities and truths of the intersexual environment that plays out around us.

For the record I think it’s important for Red Pill men to remain as objective and disinvested from making qualitative assumptions about what constitutes the Alpha and Beta abstractions. I don’t hate, pity or resent Beta men. Neither do I embrace the idea that Alpha archetypes as necessarily positive or negative. For the moment however, I’m going to focus on Beta men.

The Presumption of Control

As I mentioned above, one of the primary dismissals men have when they encounter Red Pill thought is to blow it off because “it’s all just a bunch of hating on Betas.” And that presumption comes only if a guy is willing to consider the abstracts of Alpha and Beta in the first place – most simply don’t want to recognize specific ‘statuses’ or defining characteristics of men or women, and just fall back on the “all is relative, all is subjective” mindset they’ve been conditioned to. People are People, there is no human “nature” so there is no male or female “nature”.

But for the guy who at least accepts the idea of human natures, I can certainly understand the reservations of men whose identities were conditioned to a more Beta role. There’s not much positive to characterize a Beta mindset with beyond the utility that conditioning serves to society and women’s sexual strategy. Betas do in fact get laid; the terms on which, and how their sexuality fits their utilitarian role in women’s Hypergamous plan is the real question.

I was recently asked if I thought Beta men employing Beta Game was a successful strategy in the larger scheme of things. If success means that Beta Game will get him laid, I’m incredulous about it. The presumption is that the Beta man employing that ‘game’ is in some way directing and controlling the outcome of his ‘success’. I’d argue that what he believes is ‘game’ is simply his utility to a woman coming into an optimal window for her necessity of him. So is his ‘strategy’ really successful, or is he simply the best ‘Plan B‘ a woman has available to her while her own SMV decays to the point where he’s her best option?

Is that Beta really in control? Or is he simply situationally useful?

I think a lot of what guys new to the manosphere perceive as Beta hate is simply the presumption of control they believe they should be able to exercise with women. After having been told for the the better part of their lives that the more accommodating and identifying with women they are will lead to them being accepted by women it’s a presumption that this is some means of socially acceptable control for them.

It’s very galling to have men place fault on a guy for things he knows are out of his control. I fully understand the angst and frustration that leads to things like Beta Uprising and men frustrated with intersexual dynamics taking it out on the whole of society before they swallow a bullet themselves.

It essentially amounts to victim blaming; Betas are hapless and hopeless mules brainwashed and indentured to serve not just the Feminine Imperative (which would be galling enough), but also to have the pains and strivings that society demands of them be rewarded with women’s genuine intimate interests focusing on Alpha men.

That sucks.

PUAs telling a guy it’s on him as to why women are boring to him, or uninterested in him sexually, only reinforces that angst. It’s like a pastor telling you that if you’d only prayed harder or more earnestly God would have cured your Mom of cancer. So they hate the Alpha, they hate the PUA, they hate the hotchickswithdouchebags guy, but they also hate women and the social/biological mechanics of the position they’re placed in. It presumes a control that he believes he’s never had, nor ever will.

So there comes a point where that Beta wants, sometimes adamantly insists, for his own burden of performance to be replaced, or at least handicapped, by a woman meeting him half way. This want is rooted in his Blue Pill presumption that people are people and in the equalist notion that women’s hindbrains can (willingly) be overridden when it comes to arousal, attraction and intersexual dynamics. Again, if there is no human nature it should stand to reason that a woman could potentially choose that Beta for all the reasons he’s been conditioned to believe she should choose him for. If there is a female nature, and that nature follows (with some degree of consistency) Red Pill aware truths, then his frustrations are founded on his own lack.

But these guys aren’t Blue Pill oblivious men, they are Red Pill aware. They see the truth and that leads to their awakening to the cruel reality that they’re in. So when these guys are put into that place they have a few choices: Snap and take out themselves and as many others as they can, go isolationist MGTOW and retreat to minimal societal investment, go MRA and impotently try to enact legislation that they think will even the social playing filed from the top down, or they can take a realistic look at themselves and reinvent themselves to better play the Game.

The Burden of Fault

Whether it’s fair or not, by virtue of being a man, you’re going to have to accept your burden of performance. That burden includes your liability of accepting fault even for things that aren’t your fault per se. It’s not your fault that you were born and raised into a feminine-primary social order that conditioned you to be an accommodating utility for it – but irrespective of that, you will be held liable for not complying with it or resisting it. You are a man, you will always be accountable.

Is that fucked up? Yes. So with that in mind it is up to you as a Red Pill aware Man to decide for yourself what is worth your investment. Yes my friend, women can be amazing, interesting vivacious and fun, but they can also be fucked up and stupid and absolutely not worth your time, money and effort. It isn’t your fault they are the way they are, but it is your fault for investing yourself in something you’re not enjoying or profiting by.

With all of the railing against women not being worthwhile one would think that would prompt these men to being indifferent to women – but they aren’t. Even the most ardent MGTOW and hapless Beta Red Pill denier still wants women; he simply wants her in his context and his frame on his terms – and to genuinely want to be a part of all that. There’s nothing wrong with this desire, this is precisely what I advise with regards to Frame control, but the disconnect comes in how men go about establishing a Frame women want to be a part of.

Get Out There

I may debate with other men’s takes on how the importance of looks plays in to a man’s overall Game and appeal, but one thing I won’t argue with is the importance of men putting themselves out there and into situations that will most certainly take them out of their comfort zones.

For almost 20 years I have made a living doing exactly this. I have worked in gaming, liquor and brand development ventures that have put me into venues that range from Goth/Alternative/Hipster sets to LGBT events, to mixing with men and women who have the type of wealth that most people don’t even know exists. My career, family and personal life has been my Red Pill classroom and laboratory for all this, and in all of these contexts I have found a way to enjoy myself and/or learn from these interactions.

One reason I will never look to writing Red Pill books as a career option is because it would remove me from the very source of my observations. Living it is the only way keep learning from it. On my own time, I would very likely prefer to lock myself in my studio and paint or sculpt, or to create something new to work into a brand, often to the exclusion of my wife and family and the many friends I have. I’m a very social guy, but I would probably not feel compelled to head off to a night club or any of the events I involve myself in professionally on a weekly basis.

When I’m doing a promo, I know I’m not going to hook up, so I find enjoyment in watching and learning from what I see going on around me. I can’t drink when I’m on a promo or doing a trade show, so even that can’t be a source enjoyment. So why fucking do it right? I make money at it, and it beats living in a cubicle, but I’d much rather be creating new things, new brands, new ideas than interacting with half-buzzed hipsters who think they’re too cool to be there or obnoxious 40 something divorcés ‘sampling’ vodka and hoping to drink their spinsterhood away.

I enjoy what I do and it helps me help other guys. I put myself out in the wild because it’s part of my job(s), but I honestly enjoy interacting with even the dullards and the drunks. It’s what I invest myself in. That may sound like torture to you, but it’s really contextual. I have friends I’ve made at underground Goth events who would blanch at the thought of what I do at a golf tournament. I’m not saying you need to be a social chameleon, but understand that your social education will always be domain dependent if you stay in the settings that make you the most comfortable.

Don’t Hate the Beta

As I mentioned earlier, I don’t hate Beta men. For a long time in my Blue Pill past I was one of them, and I can fully understand the want to mischaracterize an Alpha mindset in order to preserve a sense of self-worth. Beta men don’t warrant pity or disgust, but rather they need a tough harsh awakening to the reality of the situation they find themselves in.

I don’t think Beta men are hopeless, but they will remain in a state of hopelessness so long as they subscribe to a want of making things easier for their condition rather than improving themselves to better play the Game. That’s hard to hear for most Beta men and I understand the protective need for denial in this, but I know of very few Red Pill men who really despise Beta or Blue Pill men. They despise his indentured state, they despise his willful obliviousness to his conditioned uses. They despise the lengths to which Blue Pill men will go in their hope to be appreciated by the system that made them what they are.

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Published by Rollo Tomassi

Author of The Rational Male and The Rational Male, Preventive Medicine

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kfg
kfg
5 years ago

One of my maxims (I suppose someday I should collect and number them): A man can best judge the looks of a woman when she is asleep. A woman can best judge the looks of a man when he’s chopping wood. What a man means by looks is not what a woman means by “looks.” A man’s burden of performance is part of his looks. Every male model you’ve never heard of looks physically better than George Clooney or Harrison Ford, and women hold them in the top ranks for looks. How does Harrison Ford look to a woman?: “I… Read more »

redlight
redlight
5 years ago

You can say with almost total confidence that a guy with below average looks, or even average looks, working in McDonald’s in the lowest grade position, will have a hard time attracting women and it will get harder the older he gets and they get. I don’t see how anyone can possibly deny this. so if average dude went out tonight to a club, he would have a hard time attracting women, since, whey they asked, he would tell them he is working at McD in the lowest grade position? What about if he was the lead singer of a… Read more »

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
5 years ago

He probably wouldn’t have got a wife at all if he was an average computer programmer. Ridiculous. Plenty of average computer programmers got married in the 1980’s. So much for your babble about money. As he’s one of the richest men on the planet, sooner or later it was obvious that someone would settle for him. Wait, I thought that money was the magic pull for hot women? He was born with massive disadvantages because he is just not attractive. There is nothing anyone can say or do that is going to change that. He did the best thing for… Read more »

kfg
kfg
5 years ago

“He was born with massive disadvantages . . .”

Yeah, being born from a long line of lawyers and major bank presidents. Somebody please disadvantage me.

Gates married exactly the sort of woman he expected to marry when he was still a college kid. He settled for his social paradigm instead of using his improved status to lever himself up.

CaveClown
CaveClown
5 years ago

Bill gates is an example of under achieving in my opinion.

Richest man in the world? I’d be rollin’ in bitches.

But, that just shows a limiting belief of mine too.

Blaximus
Blaximus
5 years ago

” You can say with almost total confidence that a guy with below average looks, or even average looks, working in McDonald’s in the lowest grade position, will have a hard time attracting women and it will get harder the older he gets and they get. I don’t see how anyone can possibly deny this.” Watch me deny this: I completely deny that statement. True story ahead. I worked at Mickey D’s while in high school and while in college. I even worked at Dunkin Donuts as my second job while in college. I was never hungry. On more than… Read more »

kfg
kfg
5 years ago

“It’s not necessarily harder to attract women with age.”

In fact, if you are an older man it becomes considerably easier to attract women who are attracted to older men. Go figure. Even if the pool does shrink a bit, the drive to self-qualify grows.

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
5 years ago

The best was when girls from school would show up at closing time looking to “hang out” because they were ” bored “. I kept a school towel in my car and it wasn’t because I sweated.

Might be a clue here for those with daughters, by the way…keep them busy, not “bored”, etc.

keyser Soze
keyser Soze
5 years ago

A friend of mine is very wealthy , major league beta provider, raised his pride and joy son to be another beta, father bought son a condo + Audi, son flashes his wealth when meeting girls, son fell in love with a naughty girl upon his first BJ, son takes the naughty girl to balling, son goes down on the ground to show her he can do 80 push ups, naughty girl dumps him and his money, son is devastated, son keep asking why she dumped me, son say to himself : I have money and nice car and can… Read more »

YaReally
YaReally
5 years ago

@redlight “I don’t see why YaReally has to waste his time when these idiots show up.” I almost wrote a reply and then was just like meh lol. This is why I write all those pages about the subject though, because so many guys are DYING to hamster rationalize everything into supporting their fucked up world view like this guy that if you give them even an inch they’ll use it as an excuse to stay Blue/Purple Pill and keep their victim complex because being able to blame not winning the lottery for why you’re not rich is a lot… Read more »

YaReally
YaReally
5 years ago

@whoever said this silly shit “working in McDonald’s in the lowest grade position” One of the original oldschool community lines was telling girls you work at taco bell and are hoping to be promoted to head fry chef or some shit, can’t remember it exactly. Any guy who thinks his job matters should spend 6-12 months sarging and telling girls he works in the lowest value job he can think of, to find out how little it matters. I purposely tell girls I do a very low value boring low-paying job just because it’s funny to me that they’ll fuck… Read more »

Tim
Tim
5 years ago

The only thing more detrimental to a male than testicular cancer or heart disease is a white knight. Alpha males are the most ignorant of white knights. Why? Because they think their sex appeal is the most important aspect of living. There is much to despise and loath regarding these supposed alpha males.

Please God – let there be a disease that wipes out alpha males and their female alpha-female counterparts. Please God, spare the future of of the world alpha males and females. Most of society hates them to death. Give us a break, God.

Blaximus
Blaximus
5 years ago

kfg Preach it brother. Popular opinion is to belittle or make fun of older men, but my experience has been much different, even though I have no real interest in much younger chicks…right now. And there are much more women attracted to ” older ” men than I would’ve thought possible. And it’s not just the Sugar Daddy syndrome either. : ) A couple of weeks ago I went to the market 10 minutes before the midnight closing. I was trying to rush in and get out. I was wearing sweats, sneakers ( Jordans given to me by a goddaughter…)… Read more »

Blaximus
Blaximus
5 years ago

“…This seems like it will also have overall societal consequences because I think the 20% of men fuck 80% of the women divide is going to become more like 5% of the men fuck 95% of the women…”

Holy fuckin’ shit.

Please Lawd, say it ain’t so!

Blaximus
Blaximus
5 years ago

” The only thing more detrimental to a male than testicular cancer or heart disease is a white knight. Alpha males are the most ignorant of white knights. Why? Because they think their sex appeal is the most important aspect of living. There is much to despise and loath regarding these supposed alpha males. Please God – let there be a disease that wipes out alpha males and their female alpha-female counterparts. Please God, spare the future of of the world alpha males and females. Most of society hates them to death. Give us a break, God.” Ladies and Gentlemen… Read more »

LM
LM
5 years ago

“As such most males being raised are told information which is effectively self-destructive to their SMV.”

Such as? Serious question from someone new to this. Thanks.

Tim
Tim
5 years ago

I dare one of you to dispute the truth in this video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zg-ivWxy5KE

These are the true alpha males.

YaReally
YaReally
5 years ago

btw the 21yo didn’t even ask my age. And I don’t look like I’m in my 20s lol I would stop going to this kiddie nightclub but I keep ending up making out with <25yo's there. An older man with a solid "oak tree" frame/dominance with a sexual undertone is a fantasy for most of them, especially being surrounded by weak-framed "squirrel" asexual younger guys all through their lives up till then.

theasdgamer
5 years ago

@ Jeff

ASD,

Keep writing partner (you go girl!)… you are the alpha of alphas.

You obviously feel threatened by me. I recommend therapy.

bnon
bnon
5 years ago

Gates was not a programmer and I’d not choose the term “underachiever” for “he’s not banging the quality of chicks he could”. If he would all be about banging hot chicks, he’d probably not be the person doing the things he does.
Newton, Tesla, Kant, etc. all died as virgins, so thank you history for “underachievers”.

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
5 years ago

These are the true alpha males.

Alpha is situational. Alpha is relative. Alpha is not absolute.

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
5 years ago

Nice goalpost shift, bnon. Way to not stick to the topic, too.

PS: If you want to discuss what Bill Gates accomplished you can start with where DOS 1.0 came from…

theasdgamer
5 years ago

For some reason, even without the presence of Rollo’s girl groupies, the odor of estrogen is very strong today in the blog.

keyser Soze
keyser Soze
5 years ago

Tim
“Please God – let there be a disease that wipes out alpha males and their female alpha-female counterparts. Please God, spare the future of of the world alpha males and females. Most of society hates them to death. Give us a break, God”

Tim, that is a lot to ask God for , I mean, how about ask God for one thing instead of 10 things, how about ask God to send you one woman? The probabilities of God accepting one wish is much achievable, no?

theasdgamer
5 years ago

@ Blax

I think you made Tim tingle.

CaveClown
CaveClown
5 years ago

If 80% of men are betas, then it stands to reason that most inventions and such would come from betas.

None of that helps me get my dick wet.

What does this 5% of men that will be banging the chicks look like? Is it still looks, money, game…pick two?

If only 5% are in the game, won’t most chicks not get laid than? Are they really content with the social media validation instead of real flesh and blood men?

Tim
Tim
5 years ago

A “real man”, an “alpha male”, is a man that can be happy with himself devoid of any female approval or satisfaction. An alpha male see’s through the manipulation and brainwashing that so commonly destroys men. A real man doesn’t need a woman to boost his self-esteem and ego. A real man rejects the notion of female totalitarianism. A real man can see through the countless lies shown and told to him through each second of the day. White knights (alpha males) and feminists are men’s worst enemies.

“Alpha is situational. Alpha is relative. Alpha is not absolute.”

LM
LM
5 years ago

Are women not allowed here? I’m not trolling, I’m seriously interested in understanding where we are going wrong in how boys are being raised and since I’m a woman obviously I don’t have that frame of reference.

farmlegend
5 years ago

SJF – “Women, femininity and their potential as mates can be a life force of positive input into a male’s life if you can utilize them as such ” But of course. And the Detroit Lions can win the Super Bowl if they build the best team and execute. In the main, in today’s America, most women are a life-sapping force to most men. Even for natural alphas. Sure, lightning can strike, and camels can pass through eyes of needles. But how much would one wager on the Lions hoisting the Lombardi in February 2017? For me, about the same… Read more »

CaveClown
CaveClown
5 years ago

“A “real man”, an “alpha male”, is a man that can be happy with himself devoid of any female approval or satisfaction”

This?…yes.

The rest of your comment?….no.

How can you say this and then say alphas are white knights?

Contradiction…

Read what you write, then push post.

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
5 years ago

It’s cute how nerds pop up from time to time, insisting that their definitions of words are the Only True Definitions. Because arguing about definitions is infinitely more entertaining to nerds than, say, having a decent time with a woman.

Echoing another poster, I say: empty your cup. Can’t learn anything as long as you can’t admit there’s something you don’t know.

For some reason, even without the presence of Rollo’s girl groupies, the odor of estrogen is very strong today in the blog.

Seems to me, more like some cosplayers stumbled in the door.

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
5 years ago

LM, how many sons do you have, if any, and where’s the father?

kfg
kfg
5 years ago

@Some call me – Tim:

http://www.poetryloverspage.com/poets/kipling/tommy.html

@LM:

Women are allowed here, but they are not catered to, in any way. Here you will be expected to adapt to the locker room and attempts to change the locker room to suit you will be rejected, in locker room manner.

LM
LM
5 years ago

@anon, no children, not married

LM
LM
5 years ago

@kfg

Not problems there

theasdgamer
5 years ago

@ LM

Not for me to say who’s allowed here, but women comment here occasionally.

Boys are being taught to pedestalize woman and seek “true love” instead of playing the field and treating girls like bratty kid sisters who are to be teased and not taken seriously.

Have you read Rollo’s old posts? I recommend doing that.

Tim
Tim
5 years ago

“Tim, that is a lot to ask God for , I mean, how about ask God for one thing instead of 10 things, how about ask God to send you one woman? The probabilities of God accepting one wish is much achievable, no? Keyser – God, if he exists, is too busy for my demands. I didn’t really want anything from God. I’m pretty self sufficient. If God does exist, then all I want to say to him is “thanks”. “Thanks for my life – God.” If God exists, then my life is a result of His existence. If God… Read more »

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
5 years ago

Tell me, Keyser. In whom do you believe?

Keep moving those goalposts all over the place, you’ll break something. Just saying.

Tim
Tim
5 years ago

How’s about a little inconvenient truth and honesty no anti-feminist, feminist, mangina or white knight would care to hear? What follows is the stuff that gets me banned from AVFM and all other men’s rights and MGTOW sites combined. Hopefully, I get banned here, too. If we just look at feminists as “women gone amuck”, we’re missing the true point. Women haven’t gone amuck – they’re just doing what women do. It’s horrible to see the men in this thread so easily manipulated by white knights, gynocentrists and the like. Men have been manipulated and exploited by women for centuries.… Read more »

Blaximus
Blaximus
5 years ago

Hating Betas. I don’t really hate on betas. Only the ones who balk at truth can be frustrating. As I’ve mentioned before here, I work with the biggest beta I have ever seen in my life. At first, I thought it was an act, but no, he really has his brain wiring all fucked up and fights mightily to hold on to beliefs that have not ever served him well. So I don’t council him. I used to even try to show him some things about women, but he is firm that he could never do ” it ” like… Read more »

SJF
SJF
5 years ago

@Farmlegend Hey. That’s no way for my mentor to speak. Come on, be positive. And fun. (I freely admit I get a little too positive and optimistic here on occasion, you’ll have to excuse me for it. I also have a little too much pressure of speech and that comment was in such a moment.) And who said anything about making any investment? (Although I would suggest leaving a decent tip for the bartend-ress with the 35 1/2 inch inseam. …..What with the dearth of alcohol on the bill and all. It might give her a touch more desire in… Read more »

Blaximus
Blaximus
5 years ago

Damn Tim. You disappoint me.

Tim
Tim
5 years ago

“Damn Tim. You disappoint me.”

Thanks. Twas my goal.

LM
LM
5 years ago


By the media? Religion? society? Parents? All of the above? I see what you’re saying about putting women on a pedestal (though I don’t understand why) but playing the field is not exactly discouraged in youth, is it?

YaReally
YaReally
5 years ago

@Tim I don’t understand what part of that would get you banned lol I agree with most of what you wrote and most of it is pretty obvious to anyone looking objectively at the world around us. “Women haven’t gone amuck – they’re just doing what women do.” This is really the crux of understanding the Red Pill and game. If you don’t tell a 5yo to not eat cookies for dinner, that 5yo is going to eat cookies for dinner. The 5yo isn’t malicious, they’re just a 5yo running on impulses with no one keeping them in check. The… Read more »

Tim
Tim
5 years ago

“You’re still an edgelord with comments like “Hopefully, I get banned here, too.” tho lol you’re not some 13yo goth kid on an call of duty forum jesus.”

Yeah. Well. I was really looking to get banned.

Blaximus
Blaximus
5 years ago

LM …what are you wearing? ” By the media? Religion? society? Parents? All of the above? I see what you’re saying about putting women on a pedestal (though I don’t understand why) but playing the field is not exactly discouraged in youth, is it?” Answer= All of the above. Tell LM what she’s won Bob… It’s a NEW CAR!!!!!! Playing the field is discouraged, even in youth. Boys and men of all ages are being actively discouraged from treating women as anything but ” equals ” and never, ever as sexual ” objects “. All forms of media exhort the… Read more »

theasdgamer
5 years ago

@ LM

Pro-women laws (e.g., VAWA, Title 9), comedy that belittles men and fathers, etc. Culture. Law. Focus on the Family. Dennis Rainey.

Men aren’t encouraged to play the field but rather are encouraged to commit to one woman. It all serves women’s mating strategies. My mother taught me to play the field. It was excellent advice.

theasdgamer
5 years ago

To pile on to Blax’s comment, treating women as equals really means treating women as superior beings because women can get away with all kinds of bad behavior that won’t be tolerated in men, so men get the message that women are a superior kind of men. And, of course, women want a man who has higher status than she has and who is confident. Confidence is blasted out of all those future rapists, don’t you know? So, men end up being psychologically castrated. Especially young men. Not old farts like me who ignored all the codswallop shoved at us.… Read more »

theasdgamer
5 years ago

Women adore being treated as sex objects. I refer you to my comment where I played Taillight Game with a waitress. And to the one where I described examining the hips/butt of a 21 y.o. broad.

SJF
SJF
5 years ago

@Blaximus “Society thinks they need betas but I disagree. The idea that a man can’t be an ” alpha ” and be married, a father, and a strong positive influence in his community is laughable. The fear of a mostly alpha society is overblown because of the mostly negative connotations being assigned to alphas via the FI and butthurt betas. There will always be betas and I am more than cool with that. What I am NOT cool with is the overwhelming numbers that currently exist, and the number of beta males who don’t even recognize that there is another… Read more »

CaveClown
CaveClown
5 years ago

I was talking to my junior in high school aged niece. She has an old fashioned traditional mom and dad, so she is struggling a bit with gender relations. She told me that nobody really “dates” at all. She said some boys pursue girls, but most are “cheeto eating gamers” that don’t. She said most of the girls have fooled around and had sex with one or two guys, but that only a few were “sluts” that did more than that, and only with the top guys. The top guys were not necessarily the jocks either, but usually the ones… Read more »

LM
LM
5 years ago

@blaximus

Nothing.

Are you unfamiliar with hook up culture that permeates high school and college? Ok It’s been a minute since I was in college but I’m having a hard time believing kids today are opting out of the f**k fest (can I say that here?) in favor Searching for meaningful companionship at the bars. Besides Why is it now impossible to see someone as an equal human being but only want sex from them? Are the two mutually exclusive?

Not sure what single moms have to do with it.

kobayashii1681
5 years ago

Tim is funny…only just.

Blaximus
Blaximus
5 years ago

LM It’s not about seeing someone as an equal ” human being “. I’m talking about the push for equality between the sexes. ASD touched on this above. I’m not familiar with hook up culture all that much, but I gather from having a teenaged daughter that it is not what it used to be. Idk about college. I do know that it’s a popular thing for high school chicks to bang college guys and that it’s looked upon favorably by their peers. I attribute this more to the state of high school boys than anything else. I also don’t… Read more »

LM
LM
5 years ago


Agree with all of those except title 9. how has title 9 been bad for boys and men?
I’m curious how old are you?

Blaximus
Blaximus
5 years ago

SJF

I cosign the ” volunteer ” description.

I dunno man. I mean, I feel great. I don’t even have words to describe how good and alive I feel. Maybe I have a brain tumor and I don’t know it yet.

But thinking about the nuts and bolts… Jeezuz. I’m hopeful. I’m mostly optimistic. But this situation is a fucking MONSTER, and it kills my natural buzz a little.

Espresso time.

theasdgamer
5 years ago

@ LM

how has title 9 been bad for boys and men?

See, you just don’t get it. Where are the laws to benefit men? There aren’t any. All the laws are written to benefit women. (Title 9 causes schools to end men’s sports programs.)

I’m curious how old are you?

Old enough to know better and young enough not to care.

redlight
redlight
5 years ago

@tinytim if Rollo banned ranters, there would be a lot of banning As rants go, you need MORE CAPS, and those parts NEED TO BE REALLY GOOD For example this is lame AS A PART OF BEING ALLOWED TO REGISTER FOR CLASSES? now if somebody was to skim read your wall of text, as almost everybody who does not ignore it completely will do. this part in CAPS makes no sense. Next your transitions in the rant are poor. For example, you cross from rape into don’t give women “the ring of power”, a confused metaphor where her ring becomes… Read more »

LM
LM
5 years ago

@Blaximus “It’s not about seeing someone as an equal ” human being “. I’m talking about the push for equality between the sexes” What exactly is the difference? “I’m not familiar with hook up culture all that much, but I gather from having a teenaged daughter that it is not what it used to be.” I’ll say this as gently as I can…you are her father. You may not be getting the whole story for obvious reasons. I’m not suggesting anything bad about her behavior at all, but I know that I can’t recall having any such conversations about the… Read more »

theasdgamer
5 years ago

@ SJF

The FI and females are successful in turning males into betas, driven by their imperatives and allowed by their victims volunteers.

Of course, the volunteers don’t know that they have other options. So their “volunteering” is baked in.

Blaximus
Blaximus
5 years ago

Cave ” She told me that nobody really “dates” at all. She said some boys pursue girls, but most are “cheeto eating gamers” that don’t. She said most of the girls have fooled around and had sex with one or two guys, but that only a few were “sluts” that did more than that, and only with the top guys. The top guys were not necessarily the jocks either, but usually the ones that had a “reputation” (not sure what she meant by that) or access to weed. But, she stressed that they were not the weed “losers” either. She… Read more »

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
5 years ago

Tim – not nearly tl;dr enough. Moar words, and butthurtedness. MOAR! C’mon, put Green Day’s I Walk Alone into Pandora, get your headphones on, and feel it. Really feel it.

LM
LM
5 years ago

@theasdgamer “Title 9 causes schools to end men’s sports programs.” I knew you were going to say that. I was a D1 college athlete so I’m well aware of title 9. To say title 9 causes schools to end men’s sports programs is misleading. Greedy universities have set up a system that makes revenue generating men’s sports fund all other sports (men’s and women’s) and when profits aren’t as large as overpaid coaches, ADs and regents want them to be, they cut into the non-revenue generating sports. Yes it adversely affects men’s sports more than women’s because they have to… Read more »

YaReally
YaReally
5 years ago

@CaveClown “What does this 5% of men that will be banging the chicks look like? Is it still looks, money, game…pick two?” What happens when women have thousands of options for looks and money at their fingertips? Those things lose their value. And even if they had value, do girls make a rational logical calculation before they get turned on, of “well this guy only has 6/10 game but he has 9/10 looks and 8/10 money that my final calculation is–” or do they just run with their tingle emotions in the moment when Blaximus flirts with them behind the… Read more »

LM
LM
5 years ago

@YaReally You misunderstood me or you’ve not been on a college campus in the last 40 years. Men and women hook up without strings all the time and it’s celebrated, and it’s not just the so called alpha males hooking up either. It won’t blow my mind at all. If you’ve read my comments you know I’m well aware that everyone is fucking around. Which brings me back to my point and where I do not agree with theasdgamer and blaximus — who is telling young men they have to be monogamous these days? Their parents, the church? And do… Read more »

Shane
Shane
5 years ago

So much fucking jargon, makes no sense!

YaReally
YaReally
5 years ago

@LM “Men and women hook up without strings all the time and it’s celebrated,” When did I say they don’t? “and it’s not just the so called alpha males hooking up either.” I never said it was. “If you’ve read my comments you know I’m well aware that everyone is fucking around.” I have no idea who you are. I just quoted some shit you said and responded to it. “who is telling young men they have to be monogamous these days? Their parents, the church?” Media, influenced by the FI. “And do you seriously think they’re listening? All the… Read more »

kfg
kfg
5 years ago

@LM: “What exactly is the difference?” The former is a metaphysical entity. The “soul,” if you will. The western idea of “equality” comes to us from the Christian idea (whether you are Christian or not) that all souls are equal before God. The latter is a physical entity, our actual, corporeal beings. The contemporary collective holds that all of us are equal in the sense of being the same, except, perhaps, for a few anatomical differences that make no difference. I have had a young woman explain to me that men are not actually stronger than women. It only appears… Read more »

LM
LM
5 years ago

@YaReally No I don’t think everyone gets all of the sex they want all the time. I just think some of your thinking is a little outdated, that’s all.

And you can stop with you’re just another feminist accusations. Nothing I’ve said has been in defense of feminism or women.

Some men here have pointed out the same things I have — that ideas like the jocks are the only ones getting sex and young men are expected to be monogamous are just not true anymore.

rugby11ljh
rugby11ljh
5 years ago
Reply to  Rollo Tomassi

@Is this thing on? “We simply have no idea how much alpha is in us until we take the red pill and reemerge. The harsher our blue-pill indoctrination, the longer it takes.” http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=YPmzA_cRMgM @Chump No more “Becoming a RP aware man gives you the ultimate gift of ‘choice’… most men will go through their entire lives never having known that re-gaining their personal power was as easy as merely *choosing* to do so. What happens afterward is entirely up to you.” Doing this now and it’s killing my old self with a real pleasure. @Jeff “Alpha will not conform. He… Read more »

LM
LM
5 years ago

@kfg
Equal does not mean identical. Take any two men, unless they are twins they are not identical, but that doesn’t mean they aren’t equal.
.
“It only appears that way because The Patriarchy (dum dum duuuuuuum!) forces women to lift weight in a masculine manner.” She’s an idiot. I hope you’re not suggesting it’s common for people who aren’t idiots to think this way.

cheupez
5 years ago

@Jeff “A true Alpha is just that. He needs no friends, will burn bridges to get money or ass. He can’t hold a job long term. Divorced or left his live in girlfriend. Or divorced a couple of times. Moved from one state to another.” We are human, we have to be beta, noble humans. That is what you are implying. “True” alphas are not human at all (or may be I mean humane) let alone noble. They are worthless scoundrels; animals without a touch of humanity to them. Thanks. I think you are right. But I think if that… Read more »

kfg
kfg
5 years ago

“I hope you’re not suggesting it’s common for people who aren’t idiots to think this way.”

It is a fact that it is taught in the colleges, by tenured professors with PhDs. Whether it is correct isn’t relevant to my answer to your question. It is still what they mean by equal.

And therefore, if some group does achieve the same results as some other group, there must be some force holding them back. A force which must be counteracted if there is be equality.

kfg
kfg
5 years ago

Errata: ” . . . if some group does not achieve . . .”

LM
LM
5 years ago

@Rollo, Please explain to me how I am only considering how outside experiences relate to myself (meanwhile Blaximus is drawing conclusions about the same topic based on the word of his teenage daughter???)

The majority of college kids are sexually active. Studies support this. Every conversation I’ve ever had with a college graudate, employee, faculty, student also supports this. For the record, virtually everyone I regularly interact with and have for decades is college educated so I’m not talking about 3 people here.

Seriously this is so off topic from my original question.

LM
LM
5 years ago

@rugby11jh

Me: “they don’t pay their players (don’t even get me started on that).”
You: “Oh hell that’s still going on? My school team got cut because we where to “violent” so we went to a club then got cut from that for being to “dangerous” than got cut from that.”

Confused. My comment had nothing to do with violence.

LM
LM
5 years ago

@kfg

And “they” would be feminists?

James
James
5 years ago

Hey Rollo, I thought this article would be a good opportunity to share some of my problems. I haven’t spoken to anybody about this, but it bugs me, and I’d love your input. I’ve been getting into your posts recently, and into the entire Redpill sphere of ideas and concepts. I’ve never been particularly “beta”, and generally a well-liked, flexible person – socially speaking, that is. I’ve always been close to masculinity thanks to my father, and the manosphere has enabled me to piece it all together. Now, when I go out into groups of men that have internalized the… Read more »

cheupez
5 years ago

@James “I want to be able to have conversations without the all-familiar snappy, edgy tone and the strict relevance. Fuck it, I want to be able to say boring shit from time to time and not have my ass chapped.” As you wait for Rollo, let me just say: Get new friends. Or better, get none. Life must be on your terms. Live on your terms. Not on the terms of some AMOGer(s). And Alpha is neither here nor there. I have no idea what it is and I don’t think anyone does. It does not matter what it is… Read more »

matt
matt
5 years ago

@adsgamer I don’t deny that you or any other older guy can successfully run game on 20-something clubsluts or cougars and engineer a one-night lay or grope or strong iois. It sounds like you are a situational alpha in your establishments, which should be taken full advantage of. My contention is with the conflation of sexual market value and marriage market value. My premise is based on the idea that the vast majority of guys on this site and who discover the red pill are not PUA’s. They are not interested in generating an endless amount of hookups with randoms.… Read more »

matt
matt
5 years ago

@ James, honestly seek out older males to be friends and mentors. Some professors can be pretty great lifelong friends as well.

YaReally
YaReally
5 years ago

@James When people become rich/successful, they often begin to find value in philanthropy, charity, mentorship, etc, helping elevate other people to their level to share in their success. If you don’t like the selection of pre-made alphas at your level (which is entirely understandable, a lot of them are douchebags), befriend some betas with decent basic qualities, and over time help them elevate themselves to your level but with a proper non-douchebag structure underneath. Most of the alphas I’ve hung with are the ones with a variety of friends…in high school they bounced around from the jocks to the nerds… Read more »

SJF
SJF
5 years ago

@James November 17th, 2015 at 2:20 am You have to understand that you are an introvert and these frat boy douchebags are extroverts. Social interactions drain your batteries. Social interactions recharge theirs. You need time alone to recharge your batteries when being in a social group of extroverts steals your energy. Cultivate your strengths and minimize your weaknesses. One tool to understand and work on this is to understand your Meyers-Briggs personality type (oh noes, not this again for the regular readers) and go with your flow. http://www.16personalities.com/articles/our-theory https://badgerhut.wordpress.com/2011/11/04/caring-for-your-introvert/ Frome the above link on introversion: COMING OUT OF THE INTROVERSION… Read more »

kfg
kfg
5 years ago

@LM: “And “they” would be feminists?” It is feminist intersectional theory, although at this point not everyone who subscribes to it is, consciously, a feminist. It has become a central tenet of progressivism and one of the strongest forces in all of western civilization, with many people who consider themselves conservatives promoting its values. Again, you do not have to believe in it for the above to be so, just as you do not have to believe in Hinduism for Hinduism to be so. Nor, just because you are not a feminist, does not mean you have not absorbed and… Read more »

YaReally
YaReally
5 years ago

@James Channing Tatum (in general, but his role in 21 Jump Street) is a great example of what I’m talking about: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D-MVBiP19Mg At 4:25 in this (tho the whole clip is hilarious and worth a watch, they spike this girl’s emotions through the roof and bust on her a bunch and self-amuse etc (being high probably helped lol)): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D0q-NAHFpbc&t=4m45s Brad Pitt at to this first lady’s question: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yaxy_lNQrkE He’s way less comfortable/natural around Brad Pitt but that’s ’cause he’s just closer buddies with Tatum, but the point is even a guy like Brad Pitt tries to elevate the guys around… Read more »

MeAndDating
5 years ago

If we were all the same alpha male then there would be too much competition.

Besides there’s enough talent around for everyone to find their match. It just takes a bit of education,patience and perseverance to find her.

kfg
kfg
5 years ago
Jeff
Jeff
5 years ago

Asd, Intimidated? I agree whole heartedly with your wisdom of the subject and i have absolutely no reason to not believe your exploits. I just think a true alpha isnt going or even thought of a red pill, manosphere. He is what he is and lives it. Commenting in ANY blog is beta. A high ranking beta is res pill naturally is most likely too busy to read anything unrelated to getting himself ahead in his own life of production. I do absolutely agree with you older men can land and do have hb8/9/10 hitting on them. I have experienced… Read more »

chronicalibash
5 years ago

@ASD “…Broken Taillight Game ™ within a minute of meeting her. She chatted me up quite a lot and was very friendly. Ran my Out-of-focus Headlight Game on a 50ish HSE blonde I’ve known for about a year.” I would appreciate an explanation of those techniques. ———————————————————- I’ll echo a lot of what I read here and elsewhere. I find myself switching from Alpha to beta, but not as much as before. I can identify past beta behaviors and cringe appropriately. As far as looking in the mirror, as I become more relaxed, decisive, and confident, I see a lot… Read more »

Is This Thing On?
Is This Thing On?
5 years ago

@YaReally Good post. I’ve been reading other comments and there seems to be this trend to equate “alpha” with “complete psychopath” You did a great job of pointing out what I will call socially beneficial alpha behavior. I even noticed how you managed to include a reference to Rollo’s Alpha Buddah. Well played. @James I can’t find the comment now, but I’m not sure why someone would automatically label you an introvert because you don’t like douchebags. Maybe you are and maybe you aren’t. Take YaReallys advice. Do what alphas do, lead betas. Find some good ones and make great… Read more »

CaveClown
CaveClown
5 years ago

“This ” reputation ” thing is akin to the BadBoy.” Blax, she didn’t really describe a bad boy as you and I probably know of from our time in school. What she said was, “I don’t know WHY all the girls like these guys, but like, they really like them!” Me, “Almost like they are supposed to like them?” Her, “Yes! Like they are supposed to like them…” (trailing off as things click in her head) As yareally said, preselection and social proof. I’ll say this, in 10 years there will be a lot of dead men from suicide and… Read more »

theasdgamer
5 years ago

@ rugby

I’m curious how old are you?

Old enough to know better and young enough not to care.”

Fucking Brutal

Women love it when I’m hard on them. Meh, I screwed up the lyrics:

“I’m old enough to know better but I’m still too young to care”

theasdgamer
5 years ago

@ Tim The only thing more detrimental to a male than testicular cancer or heart disease is a white knight. Alpha males are the most ignorant of white knights. Why? Because they think their sex appeal is the most important aspect of living. There is much to despise and loath regarding these supposed alpha males. Who are alphas white knighting? Some Blue Pill alphas might white knight women, but so will Blue Pill Betas. Why do you hate alphas so much? The problem is the Blue Pill, not alphas or betas. The good news in the Red Pill is that… Read more »

theasdgamer
5 years ago

@ James

I have news for you. There are plenty of judgmental betas who are assholes. Asshole-ishness isn’t an alpha or beta quality.

keyser Soze
keyser Soze
5 years ago

@Theaassgamer,
Who is more ” natural “, a guy who attract s HB5 or HB 6?

theasdgamer
5 years ago

@ Jeff Apology accepted. No hard feelings. I’ve been a target of other men a few times due to their feeling threatened by me. I’ve never noticed it before, but now it explains some things. It’s eye-opening. I always thought that I had done something offensive to cause some people to dislike me. Ain’t necessarily so. Some women also feel threatened by me. (Remember, I’m married and go out dancing solo.) Those women are afraid that their men will imitate me and ask young, pretty women to dance. I create Dread when I’m out–among lots of women and men. Just… Read more »

theasdgamer
5 years ago

@ keyser

Who is more ” natural “, a guy who attract s HB5 or HB 6?

What’s your point?

LM
LM
5 years ago

@thesdgamer

Lol, you thought that was being hard on me?

“Brutal” lmao

keyser Soze
keyser Soze
5 years ago

@Theaassgamer,
I’m a natural like you, I always get HB4s and 5s, never 9s or 10s, why is that?

rugby11ljh
rugby11ljh
5 years ago
Reply to  keyser Soze

@LM
I meant that I know sports where getting pushed over but the ones I enjoy got cut for being to violent.

Jousting is my official state sport.

SJF
SJF
5 years ago

@Itto “…but I’m not sure why someone would automatically label you an introvert because you don’t like douchebags. Maybe you are and maybe you aren’t…” James sub-communicated that the frat-boys were exasperating him and reading between the lines, sounds like they are taking energy from him, not giving energy to him. Sounds like he’s tired of socializing with them. He has to calibrate the time spent with those he isn’t enthused with. And find venues where he is inspired/enthused. I’d recommend he find a mentor rather than a mentee at such a young age.(but good luck with finding a red… Read more »

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