Obesity Culture

Protein_World

In the almost 4 years I’ve had The Rational Male up and running I have neither monetized nor commercialized the blog. I began with the explicit intent of making everything I do accessible and in the past year and a half since the first book published I’ve turned down at least seven different (lucrative) requests to put ads or promos on the blog.

I’m happy to say I’ll still never monetize this blog, but if I were to offer ad space my first spot would be reserved for Protein World. I can’t vouch for the quality of their products beyond what I know in general of protein supplements from years of bodybuilding, but that’s not the point. The point is that these guys had the balls not only to stick to their guns, but to double down when social justice warriors and body fat acceptance “activists” took it upon themselves to systematically vandalize their most recent ad campaign.

Protein_World_2 Protein_World_1

I’ve made my living in brand development for over 20 years now, these guys deserve some respect. Granted, at this point they have no option but to go on offense, but in today’s fem-centric social order this is an anomaly.

I’m drawing attention to this selective vandalism to illustrate a larger point; in a feminine-primary, feminine-dominant social order any reminder of how that order might be challenged (especially on a visceral level) must be met with a selectively sexist countermeasure.

You see, what Protein World’s campaign does is remind less than physically ideal women that despite all social efforts to convince them otherwise, men still evaluate a woman’s sexual market value based on her physical appeal. No amount ‘personal acceptance’ or clinging to internal worth and validation will change the sexual response men evolved to optimize over a hundred thousand years.

I covered this briefly when I explained the misconceptions of Robin Korth in Separating Values:

Conflating Values

One of the major problems women have, and more than even some Red Pill men have, is the conflation of sexual market value with their intrinsic personal value as a human being.

It needs to be emphasized that while personal value is influential in sexual market value, SMV is distinct from your value as a human being. I’m stressing this because, in the age Disney Princess empowerment, this conflation of the two has become a go-to social convention; and not just for women.

What Korth suffers from is presuming her personal value is her sexual market value.

It’s disruptive to her self-perceptions and ego-investments when that presumption is challenged by a man who doesn’t want to fuck her for reasons based on the intrinsic value she believes she’s entitled to by virtue of maturity and imaginings of self-sufficiency. Just as women aren’t aroused by men’s own self-concepts of virtuousness and aspirations of higher purpose, men aren’t aroused by whatever ephemeral self-perceptions a woman may have.

[…]

Feminist ‘equalism’ is always shocked that evolved human biology and its feral predispositions won’t cooperate with it, but such is the frustration with any social order or ideology which fails to account for the realities of human being’s natural states and biological imperatives. There is a conceived, higher-order expectation that, through freewill, conviction or some other learned, reasoned means, people will rise above the influence of their base nature and comply with what they believe will make for an idealized existence.

What egalitarian equalisim, struggles against is basic human instinct, nature and impulse.

This refusal of understanding base motivations is at the heart of these “activists” outrage. Feminized egalitarian equalism fosters the idea that men and women are essentially equal beings with different genitalia and a co-equal capacity for rational agency. Under those auspices men and women should be able to bypass their inherent, evolved, sexual prompts and make the conscious rational effort to focus their arousal and attraction on the more intrinsic personal worth of the opposite sex.

In the egalitarian plan Hypergamy should be as self-consciously sublimated for women as men’s should be for repressing any expression of being sexually aroused by a woman for anything other than her intrinsic personal worth. Any man with a baseline awareness of female behavior knows how effective this plan is.

But that’s not to stop women from simultaneously being offended by visceral expressions of men’s sexual ideals while holding a double standard for their own physically ideal men.

Protein_World_3

You see Protein World applies an equal standard across their ad campaigns, and the message, when paired like so, is one of encouraging a physical ideal for both sexes. To my knowledge there was no initial outrage over the male version of the ad on the right. There was no outcry or messages scrawled on these ads stating “Contrary to popular opinion, men’s bodies do not need to be changed for the beach or anywhere else.”

It’s easy to get caught up in the indignation of yet one more female double standard, so lets back up for a moment and examine why this is.

The most common refrain you’ll hear from Blue Pill trained men and less than physically ideal women is that men have a predilection to sexually objectify women, to see them as objects rather than their esoteric notion of “human beings”. What they fail to understand is that this objectification is exactly what the male brain evolved for.

Objectification Your Honor

In our tribal beginnings men’s sexual response, his very reproductive survival, depended on his capacity for sexual immediacy. While women may require foreplay and pre-coital stimulation, men had to be ready to fuck and go at a moment’s notice. Survival, mate poaching, even the uncertainty of women’s ovulatory/estrus phase of her menstrual cycle, all these factors and more predicated a need for instant sexual reflexiveness for men.

That reflexiveness required a capacity for a man to see a woman, evaluate her sexual/fertility value to him (the boner test) and take action accordingly. About two years ago on another forum, I’d gotten involved in a discussion regarding this sexual evaluation reflex and how women were literally dumbfounded that men would “size up” a woman sexually within the space of a few short seconds. Even men who were only peripherally aware of women outside of their visual focus would make SMV assessments of those women.

In order for this assessment to take place the mental construct of perceiving women as objects was a necessary evolutionary step. The simple truth is that it’s part of men’s neurological firmware to see women’s bodies as objects. It’s a well studied fact that when men see an arousing woman’s semi-nude body it triggers the same area of our brains associated with tool use. Sexual objectification is a survival feature for men, not a bug.

On a limbic level women understand this aspect of male nature. In a very visceral way women know that men put a primary value on their bodies and sexual availability. Ads like this only remind women of, and highlight the fact, that despite all of its concentrated social effort the Feminine Imperative simply cannot undo thousands of years of men evolving that physical objectification – and successfully reproducing as a result of it.

Generation Hypergamy

In a social order that follows the dictates of female sexual strategy it’s unsurprising that women would seek to eliminate that aspect of the male sexual response. Only by controlling that response can women completely enforce Hypergamy as the predominant socio-sexual strategy. These ads offend that desire for control. They remind a woman that her Hypergamous sexual selectivity is (at least presumptively) still mitigated by men being aroused by their physicality, objectifying them and desiring them for reproduction.

Women’s innate solipsism prevents them from ever truly attaining the egalitarian equalist fantasy they ride in order to consolidate that control. Women’s hindbrains want a better-than deal with regards to Hypergamy. Hypergamy doesn’t seek its own level, it wants, it expects a better than deserved exchange for its investment with a man, and it desperately wants assurances that its getting it.

Thus, on a Hypergamous social scale we see that Protein World’s male focused ad gets no such vandalism. The message is clear – It is Men who must perform, Men who need to change themselves, optimize themselves and strive for the highest physical ideal to be granted female sexual approval. Women should be accepted, respected and expected to inspire genuine desire irrespective of men’s physical ideals.

In 2011 I wrote Women’s Physical Standards and I think it bears quoting here:

This may come as a shock to the “men have impossibly high beauty standards” gnashing of feminist teeth, but it is in fact women who have a much higher standard for an idealized male physique. For all the endless kvetching from women about men wanting “living barbie dolls”, it’s men who’ve historically displayed much broader interests in female body habitus than women ever have.

You see, men will very readily cater their physical sexual “preferences” in accordance with what has proven sexually successful for them in past experiences. In other words, men tend to return to the same watering hole they found to be plentiful in the past. These preferences of convenience manifest themselves as ‘fetishes’ for men. And you don’t even need all that extensive research to prove this.  All one need do is search the vast variety of porn available catering to the physical attributes that men will fetishize. Big boobs, small boobs, big ass, small ass, every hair color of the rainbow, shaved snatch, hairy snatch, teen girls to MILFs and older, tan, pale, ultra-thin to the ubiquitous BBWs (Big Beautiful women). Ladies, name the physical attribute(s), and there’s a fan-group just waiting to bang you. Rule 34 was never more provable than in men’s willingness to fuck damn near any physical demographic of women – just ask the female midgets catering to that fetish of porn.

On the other hand, from a purely physical perspective, it’s women’s idealized masculine form that hasn’t changed in millennia. While there may have been a rubenesque period when men loved the fatties of the 1600′s, no such era ever existed for women’s physical preferences. The classic broad chest, wide shoulders, six-pack abs and squared jaws of greco-roman athleticism are still the idealized male form that has graced EVERY romance novel cover in existence. I’m still waiting for someone to post me a link for a dating site that caters exclusively to women’s fetish of BBMs – average to good looking, fit women specifically looking overweight men. Executive Introductions caters to women seeking affluent, influential men, but women just looking for overweight men, that site doesn’t exist.

On more than a few occasions I’ve made the connection that what we see in a feminine-primary societal order is really a reflection of the female sexual strategy writ large. When we see a culture of obesity, a culture of body fat acceptance and a culture that presumes a natural evolved order of innate differences between the sexes should be trumped by self-impressions of female personal worth, we’re viewing a society beholden to the insecurities inherent in women’s Hypergamy.

A feminized, feminist, ordered social structure is one founded on ensuring the most undeserving women, by virtue of being women, are entitled to, and assured of, the best Hypergamous options by conscripting and conditioning men to comply with Hypergamy’s dictates.

End Note

It’s been brought to my attention that Roosh will be appearing on the Dr. Oz show tomorrow.

I’ll admit I’m a bit apprehensive of this “interview” as it smacks of red meat for Dr. Oz’s largely overweight viewing demographic (not to mention his obese wife). That said, this interview came at a good time since it should give readers a first hand look at exactly the rationales and social conventions I illustrated in today’s post. Keep this material fresh in your mind while you watch.

Published by Rollo Tomassi

Author of The Rational Male and The Rational Male, Preventive Medicine

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Mad Yale Grad
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“Well when you are a one trick pony like Roosh, eventually, people get tired of seeing the same trick. So if he is going to expand and start doing live pubic appearances…” Roosh recently announced his world tour. This summer he’ll be speaking in Berlin, London, Toronto and New York. All he had to do to prepare for Oz was watch a few youtube videos and use Oz’s own content to back his (Roosh’s) own claims. The one I posted above would have been enough. Oz says right there that humans used to judge mate-worthiness in a split second and… Read more »

Liz
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Mad Yale Grad is PJ.
A female sphere troll.

Sun Wukong
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@zip

The dynamic you’re looking at there would probably be covered by Rollo’s recent article on Idealism.

TL;DR: Women only care about your works and interests only in as much as she benefits from the wealth and status they bring you. Clearly they did not see that in Kant (or Tesla or Newton), despite his incredible contribution to society.

Tom
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Roosh will recover or benefit from this. He’s designed his life to be antifragile and shocks only seem to grow his business. However, the manosphere does need more voices to represent its diverse constituents. Mike Cernovich does a commendable job on social media. Rollo does an outstanding job in print. We need a telegenic personality to represent us on youtube and the talk show circuit. We need a male version of Dr. Helen Smith.

Mad Yale Grad
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zip

April 29th, 2015 at 4:06 pm

@MYG

You do not understand, you must be a woman.

Kant was not simply “smart”. He was one of the pivots in human civilization, facilitating the fact that u tip in ur dam computer.
___

That’s great. But it doesn’t mean tingles. If philosophy or intellectual brilliance meant tingles this world would probably be a better, smarter, kinder place to live.

Glenn
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@MadYaleGrad – You miss that your approach here, posing as some arbiter of the validity of the comments when most of what you say is idiocy, and deigning to respond to my rhetorical questions at all reveals how superfluous and ego driven you are. You don’t make a difference here. None at all. You take away from the space, you don’t contribute to it. How sad that this is what you are reduced to. My guess is that you don’t matter anywhere in this world and that this is all compensation. You see, my engagement here is real and authentic.… Read more »

jeff
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Rollo,

Has anyone actually seen Roosh as a PUA? Can he just play one on….. the internet?

I mean watching that I can’t imagine a beta with balls dealing with that crap. Alpha would have taken over that show and had the crowd ending in agreement. He just bent over and cries that he didn’t get a reach around. Dr. Oz is gamma. The only thing he has is that show. Roosh could have flip the whole thing with amused mastery a crowd kino.

Mad Yale Grad
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Where can I watch the whole baklava fight? All links lead to a 3 min preview only.

zip
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@ rugby

Top comment. Thank you for the link (was new to me). Lots of papers of Dr. Bruce Perry are available in the web and worth a read.

Sun Wukong
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@Lead

You seriously didn’t see the fucking link that Rollo fixed on the previous page of this very comment thread?

You have all the situational awareness of Helen Keller in a sensory deprivation tank. Seriously.

Blaximus
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@Glenn

Thanks man, but trust and believe Mad Blah, blah isn’t driving me anywhere. No female troll can move me.

I’m always here soaking up the commentary.

I’ll just bypass MYG’s trollishness and stick with the other commenters here who have insight and are interested in actually helping one another.

Fred Flange, MansLaughter
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Thus far I have not responded to our special guest commentaterer Sen. Ted Cruz, I mean, isn’t that who MYG really is? (Oh wait sorry Cruz was Harvard)

Like it or not, some of the audience here is or was married, and for what we call reasons, are willing or feel compelled to be/remain so. You don’t like ’em, fine, but I don’t see much difference between mocking the married men employing RP tools to cope vs.the usual SJW intersectionalismist transgender transsexual trans* trans@#$%^ transport-of-delight shaming.

Badpainter
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@ Liz

I think you’re right MadYaleGrad is PJ. All the signs are there including a an axe to grind with black men. Good catch!

@ Glenn

MadYaleGrad is a halfwitted angry, anti-western, misandrist, woman who does little but offer anecdotal support to the notion that women are both stupid and dishonest. She is a waste of your time, and Rollo’s bandwidth.

rugby11ljh
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@Zip More self surgery Outdoors included on new Frame Cody Lundin Safe environments are preventive medicine https://childtrauma.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/01/Bonding-and-Attachment.pdf http://www.ou.edu/cwtraining/assets/pdf/handouts/2010/Altered%20brain%20development%20following%20global%20neglect.pdf https://childtrauma.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/01/MacKinnon_AusNZJFamTher_2013.pdf http://www.lfcc.on.ca/mccain/perry.pdf Dissociation http://www.mentalhealthconnection.org/pdfs/perry-handout-effects-of-trauma.pdf Human family biologically https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=2rpfd_H4euU Structures in brain development Blue vs red = human https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=uOsgDkeH52o Outdoor male interest self reliance and danger https://m.facebook.com/cody.lundin.1?refsrc=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.facebook.com%2Fcody.lundin.1 Over the years, Americans in particular have been all too willing to squander their hard-earned independence and freedom for the illusion of feeling safe under someone else’s authority. The concept of self-sufficiency has been undermined in value over a scant few generations. The vast majority of the population seems to look down their noses upon self-reliance… Read more »

Atticus
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I seem to be the only one that thinks Rollo should make some cash from tRM. He won’t sell out, he won’t be beholden, he won’t be Roosh making an Internet living. I’m not talking about RoK with the annoying Verizon survey that pops up. Just a simple banner. Look at Drudge’s small ad at the top that 10’s of millions see. Rollo, do it, bank it for years and give your daughter 70k for her wedding (kidding).

Mad Yale Grad
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rugby, followed your attachment disorder link. “Now: take the radical changes since 1996 in how we relate, after the rise of cell phones, texting, the internet and social networking. There’s nothing social about it. Well-developed human beings can self-regulate their emotional state by being with other humans,” said top neuroscientist Dr. Stephen Porges recently. “But what about people who regulate their emotional state with objects?…We’re in a world now being literally pushed on us, by people who are challenged in their own social and emotional regulation, and we’re calling this ‘social networking.’ We’re using computers, we’re texting — we’re stripping… Read more »

DeNihilist
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Jeff, good spot on the roosh alphalpha issue. Anything to learn from that?

rugby11ljh
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@Mad Yale Grad Interesting page 8 http://www.mentalhealthconnection.org/pdfs/perry-handout-effects-of-trauma.pdf I grew up and people would keep telling me that speaking with was like pulling teeth out of a tiger. I used to run away from loins screams when people would yell at each other around me. Their is a lot of violence that my body has internally firected at myself and to some extent trying to build something new. Such as a family eventually not even close into the red to get into a relationship. But my brain isn’t able to cope with basic truths about the red. First of all I… Read more »

Atticus
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Ha! If you do, hook a brother up and have them throw in the girl for me.

rugby11ljh
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@Atticus ahaha
Hey @Mad Yale Grad
This is why I would end up getting a family going with a wife. Closes thing I can find in a visual way about it.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=uYNJwfpRGlk

Not Born This Morning
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Roosh handled it exceptionally well; I highly doubt Dr. Oz viewers agree. They are not watching for mentally healthy reasons or to gain truthful insight. Their agenda is quite the opposite. Dr. Oz is just another disgusting fraudulent quack scam artist feeding off the stupidity of weaklings. He is one of many modern day snake oil salesmen slithering in the cesspool wake of those who recently began to plow the sewer before him like Opera, Dr. Phil-O-Shit, and Geraldo. This scene from Outlaw Josie Wales accurately depicts the fundamental persona of Dr. Oz by the character in the white suite…… Read more »

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@Glenn: ” I want STRENGTH not just muscles. ” Weight work stimulates muscle growth, but it does not control it. Mass is controlled by diet. Eat 2000 Cal/day and you can use any training routine you want and you won’t add mass. That means that any strength gains you make will be neuromuscular adaptation. Making the most out what you have. There will, however, come a time when you max out what you can do with what you have and the only way forward will be to add muscle. Strength, although not equal to muscle mass, is proportional to it.… Read more »

Simba
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Rollo I found this http://www.npr.org/blogs/13.7/2015/04/16/400075715/is-it-sexist-to-say-that-women-are-superior-to-mens?utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=npr&utm_term=nprnews&utm_content=20150424, it’s quite interesting. I know it’s not directly related to this post, but it shows the contrdicting behaviours of feminists and manginas which, judging by the twitter feed of ozbodypositive will soon start contradicting each other.

Jeremy
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@DeNihilist Dropped him from my reading list a few years ago, and now remember why. Roosh still has insight, and he still self-analyzes. His (personal blog) writing (not necessarily his satellite sites) is still worth reading, imo. This latest episode with Dr Oz is the only thing that would make me question his motivations. I can’t imagine Roosh wanting a 9-5 in the states. However, planning for a financial future with the quite unique flavor of expertise he has put himself in could seem like quite a pickle. From my ignorant perspective I think that’s more because it’s an unpaved… Read more »

Not Born This Morning
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Atticus

Rollo making cash off TRM poses a danger to the open integrity of this forum. Rollo is strong obviously and maintains far more integrity than most. However, no one is completely immune to the dangers of outside influence in marketing. That influence will exercise great control potential if commerce is involved here. It is impossible to provide advertising space here without relinquishing some control. The advertisers will not allow a completely open forum as Rollo does now. They cannot afford to due to competition unless they seek a very limited market.

TheLastCoyote
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I had mixed feelings about Roosh before the Dr. Oz show. Some of his stuff is really good, some of it is really out there. No biggie – same can be said about other manosphere writers too. But with the Dr. Oz debacle and Roosh’s subsequent YouTube video explaining how horribly abused he was on the show, I now take Roosh with a massive grain of salt. Anyone with half a brain knows these shows are rigged to make the host look good, sometimes at the expense of the guest. It’s mostly chicks who watch these shows, so it’s beyond… Read more »

Sun Wukong
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@TheLastCoyote

Gotta agree there. Whether he was genuinely broadsided or not, the whiny tone he takes in the video is a big DLV. Better to just laugh it off like a prank that got you, take it in stride, assess your own mistakes, then move on.

kfg
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Roosh’s Bang gig has just about run its course and he knows it. Not only is it getting tired, but so is he. He’s looking for a new one to go forward with, hence RoK and now the Dr. Oz appearance.

The thing that you have to bear in mind is that he’s a clown. I don’t mean that in any derogatory sense. He’s a classical clown, in school of Dan Rice. Eyeballs and entertainment will always take a certain priority, because that’s the shell he wraps his message in. And it pays better than academic analysis.

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@Sun Wukong and Glenn. I’m looking forward the Teamspeak round table discussions. I think it is a great idea.

But I can’t make it tonight.

Didn’t have much time to comment today.

I recall an article by Jonathan Frost (I think at Freedom 25) about men only roundtables.

http://www.freedomtwentyfive.com/2012/11/getting-the-gang-back-together/

Atticus
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@NBTM Have you ever heard the term “Fuck you money”. It means you have enough that you can tell the world “fuck you” if they piss You off. You may not be rich but you don’t need an employer, a banker, a realtor, a credit rating…anything. I have fuck you money. I don’t know Rollo, but he seems like he has his financial house in order. He doesn’t need cash from tRM. But if you have fuck you money, why not take the gravy? It’s like, oh my advertisers don’t like the fact that mad Yale Grad is a total… Read more »

Not Born This Morning
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@TheLastCoyote

What the Dr. Oz bunch told Roosh would happen on the show before the show was most likely very different from what actually happened on the show. Usually these type show hosts pretend to befriend their “guests” both before and after their “tar and feathering” escapades. It is all part of their quackery.

Sun Wukong
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@sjfrellc Thats fine man, this evening is going to mostly just be about getting ideas together and meeting folks. We’ll be glad to have you in the future. With that said, The Man Table teamspeak server will be up at the address ts3.themantable.net with no need for a password to get in. If that doesn’t work for you then neo.themantable.net should. In the connect dialog for teamspeak just use your usual handle from here and either address to get in. I might be a tiny bit late getting on, but will try to maintain presence here as well to help… Read more »

Forge the Sky
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Aright, I’ll try and get on!

Mad Yale Grad
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High IQ is not valued in a sexual partner. What is valued is average IQ coupled with social skills. That and boner/tingles inducing looks. These are the factors that game focuses on because for mating purposes, nobody cares if you are Tesla level brilliant.

Mad Yale Grad
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Dr. Mehmet Oz: “I find overweight people fascinating.”

LOL!!!!!

Atticus
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Talking to you guys would be awesome, next time.

SFC Ton
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Glen your trainer likely knows pretty much nothing and your success from actually training harder then normal. The quack to real professional ratio weighs extremely heavy to.the quack side. Generally they are taught to squat wrong, doing the work with their knees vs hips and a natrual sitting motion Youtube “so you think you can squat” to learn how. Read up on Westside, Louie Simmions, Dave Tate and you’ll get the hang of it quick enough. Mostly it’s about unlearning( if that’s a real.word) Personally there is to much bodybuilding in the american strength training community, bad technique usually stems… Read more »

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@Rugby – Doing some catching up here, wow, this: “If we, as a society, continue to ignore the laws of biology, and the inevitable neurodevelopmental consequences of our current childrearing practices and policies, our potential as a humane society will remain unrealized.” Suffice it to say that I’ve lived far below my potential due to the trauma I suffered and the other damage from my childhood. As I’ve gotten older, that knowledge has become far more pointed and clear. What Rugby is sharing about trauma and attachment disorder hits way close to home for me. Thanks so much for this,… Read more »

kfg
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” . . . there is to much bodybuilding in the american strength training community . . .”

Seconded. It’s particularly harmful to athletes, which is why Sean Connery gave it up.

Rocket
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Back to the original topic, kinda … I started something a little over a year ago that you guys might want to try experimenting with. I like to walk in the evenings and where I live has lots of nice walking trails. I noticed several years ago a new trend. Almost all women on the trails want nothing whatsoever to do with men. Most wear headphones and when they approach you from the opposite direction, they look down or away so as to not make eye contact. Seemed just weird at first but am now mostly used to it. You… Read more »

Not Born This Morning
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Atticus –

Fuck you money – I never herd it put that way, but understand you completely.

However, someone else’s money isn’t necessary for any of this or any other form of success. The greatest success is achieved by personal effort, not bribery or being owned in some way by another.

I am glad Rollo will not risk the openness and integrity of this by “buying” the “gravy” and I suspect his net receipts are higher than if he indulged any “hitch hikers” with deeper pockets.

Sun Wukong
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@All

We’re on now for those who wanted to join.

ts3.themantable.net or neo.themantable.net in the Teamspeak3 connection dialog, use your usual handle from here with no password.

SFC Ton
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I don’t think MYG is PJ; PJ practically worshiped black men, thought all women wanted them.etc So.far the only two.areas MYG doesn’t seem completely off on is 1) Black dudes dig big chicks; there is no shortage of old school.blues songs singing the praise of big legged women. 2) infidelity rate among military spouses. Pretty much every deployment means 50% of the wives will get caught fucking around, and that’s the ones who are dumb enough to get caught. Doesn’t work the other way round though. Not because the dudes are saints but because of the male to female ratio.… Read more »

stuttie
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@ Sun – I live in Australia. I think there a few of us that comment/read here at RM, but if I/we can’t join in in real-time, it would be great to hear a recording somehow. btw hence the sarcastic question/joke re GWTDT… @ BigAl – That link to bodycomposition.com looks interesting; but I’d like to research more about Lyle McDonald’s credentials before I read his stuff though. @ sjfrellc – no worries mate, glad you liked it. Another great book is The Encyclopedia of modern Bodybuilding – by Arnold Schwarzenegger. Some very good stuff on nutrition as well. @… Read more »

stuttie
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@ rocket – I’ve been doing that my whole life

Signor Farfalla
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@Jeff, BigAl, sjfrellc, Glenn, SFCton (training sub-thread) Yeah, Glenn. I think SFC is right. Squatting and deadlifting are structurally optimal, imo. I’ve been doing the low bar back squat and my knees are the very least of my concerns in life. Deadlifts are good too and I bet casual deadlifters have less back issues by far than normal people. Whatever a ‘casual’ deadlifter is. Me, maybe. I can’t comment on the real deadlifters getting up into the 500-900 pound ranges, of course. That’s a whole different world that must have some added risk, but everyone in that game knows that.… Read more »

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@SFC Ton Umm, big legged women didn’t refer to land whales. MYG was off with most of his/her sputtering’s I can’t speak on the whole military cheating issue, as I have no experience in the military. I have family and friends who serve(d), but I wouldn’t assume to know a great deal just by judging from their experiences. So I defer to your statement re: military adultery. But Jeez Lawd have mercy, I’ve been black my whole life. I’ve been all over this country and halfway around the world. Seen a lot of life (shit), been in a lot of… Read more »

kfg
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When Kate first hit the scene she was reasonable, but over the past couple of years she’s added enough larding that her waist has nearly disappeared.

She’s well past maximum density for my money.

Watch for her to reposition herself as a “realistic” model to extend her career.

SFC Ton
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Stu, if your training is going well and you are motivated to work you aren’t over training. Not real scientific but it’s a good rule of thumb. Don’t worry about perfect just keep doing shit 80% correct. Be careful with paleo; I know 0 high level athletes running it. Doesn’t mean there are none, but the guys I know could not train like they needed to and do paleo. Course here we are talking training 2-3 times a day every day The overload principle stuff works for a certain level. Like beginner to intermediate. Again it would be to much… Read more »

Blaximus
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@SFC Ton

You speak the truth man. I never have a problem with a thoughtful man making observations and reaching conclusions.

Besides, I like my southern brethren, having been born in Va. right on the NC border, and having gone to school and spent summers below the mason Dixon.

rugby11ljh
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@SFC Ton I good sir reckon you would a great person to train with. You know one thing I noticed I live in the north south of the south. MD is still below the mason Dixon line. While we are on Roosh one thing he said once stood out to me. Black men naturally pick up the red pill because life is inherently more difficult in are society and they have little or no time to deal with blue pill middle class white educated society. @Rollo I would raise money for it to be ad free. If trouble was money… Read more »

Sun Wukong
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@rugby We actually chatted for longer than intended (just finished up), had a really good time, hashed out the ideas for recording in the future, and had some unfocused but good discussion for a bit because nobody could wait for an actual recording session. Buncha impatient bastards, I’m tellin ya. I think when we actually go to record it’s going to be awesome. We’ve got a great bunch of guys to work with. I’ve just got to work out a few technicalities and find a way to avoid cluttering up Rollo’s board too much with the coordinating and such. It’s… Read more »

sjfrellc
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@Stuttie “Another great book is The Encyclopedia of modern Bodybuilding – by Arnold Schwarzenegger. Some very good stuff on nutrition as well.” I have read a third of that encyclopedia in the last six months and found it exatraordinary. I would highly recommend it to anyone here. Read it. I can follow along with it well. The Yogi Berra saying “It’s 90% mental and the other half is physical” is well expressed by Arnold. He delineates well the difference between bodybuilding (gaining muscle mass) and powerlifting (pure strength and masculinity enhancing pursuits) and the wisdom to know the difference. I… Read more »

rugby11ljh
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@sjfrellc
My goodness you must be a boon to your son and family.

@Sun wukong
“Buncha impatient bastards, I’m tellin ya. ;-)”
Sounds like a rugby game between the all blacks and the spring brooks to me.

Bromeo
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@Sun Wukong

Thanks for setting that up, was good talking to the boys live, puts a different dynamic when your able to communicate through live speech. Shout out to @Glenn, @Forge The Sky, @Jeremy and @Rocket, had some good discussions and laughs as well.

progretarian
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Proteinworld aren’t the only seasoned players out there not catering to angry fat women. Something similar happened recently in Germany with a company selling vegan/organic smoothies. The company’s name is “True Fruits” and they are sort of positioned in the hipster niche, printing funny and witty comments on their little glass bottles about all kinds of things to gain marketing attention. They have one banana-vanilla-smoothie on offer, that apparently doesn’t sell that much – supposedly because of its pale banana color compared to the other pink, green and bright orange smoothies. So the company produced a limited edition of that… Read more »

rbrtolson
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rbrtolson
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Are ugly german hipster girls a big problem? Hahahaha.

Driver
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Driver
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It’s interesting how Dr. Oz tries to “examine” Roosh while he is on the show to “help” him. Since when did this “doctor” become a psychologist or psychiatrist?

Three very fat women are standing in front of this “doctor” on the show and not one word was mentioned (by a doctor present) about how too much weight gain causes major health issues (including death). It’s the very reason why no one needs to take this “doctor” seriously when he’s dispensing medical advice.

His advice is all based on how many dollars flow into his pocket.

Glenn
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@Rugby – The attachment disorder and trauma stuff is so perfect for me. I was number 4 in my family and was known to be a crier and to get upset easily as a baby and not calm down quickly – and guess what? During my Mom’s pregnancy with me, her father was dying and she was tending to him in the hospital. The first six months of my life involved me schlepping from Long Island to the Bronx with my mom to be there for her father. I had no idea that maternal stress could result in fetal stress… Read more »

Glenn
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@SFCTon – “One camp I was on had 73 hoglegs to every whisker biscuit.” Dude – you have to make the next yackathon on Teamspeak, that comment is bumper material Fyi, SunWu is producing this as a “show” so it should be quite good instead of just rambling, or so we hope. . Training: (Hope you don’t mind answering these questions). Spoke with my trainer last night. He reminded me that he also nixed squats because I have a troublesome knee. I had an ACL recon and have articular cartilage damage and it can get tweaked very easily. Strength training… Read more »

sjfrellc
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Glenn, I’m glad to hear it.

Thank you again Rollo for doing what you do. I’m being helped tremendously The Rational Male blog.

Water Cannon Boy
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The fight continues
comment image:large

Sun Wukong
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@Bromeo

“So was it a shit test or was she crazy?”

That caught me off guard so badly.

@Rollo

Dunno if you saw this on TRP Reddit yet, but a bit more on the original topic:

http://www.theguardian.com/media/2015/apr/29/beach-body-ready-ad-faces-formal-inquiry-as-campaign-sparks-outrage

TL;DR: apparently the SJWs managed to get government attack dogs involved. Protein World isn’t too bummed, since apparently the ads were at the end of their run for the season anyway.

Forge the Sky
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Right on Glenn! Was good talking with y’all last night. We do tend to emphasize male/female dynamics primarily on this site, Jack Donovan’s book is a great compliment to that – as is the whole ‘fireside’ dynamic. I had a great time. I hear you about the depression. I’ve tried to train myself to recognize when I’m depressed, because yeah, there are good specific things I can do to kick it in the teeth if I realize it’s there. But when you’re in the thick of it, it can really just seem like you’re reacting naturally to external factors. If… Read more »

Glenn
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@Forge – Please do smack away if warranted. I will look into all this information. I did some “healing” and neurological work on this with a couple of modalities but stopped because my BS detector kept making me question some of it. But the experiences with energy healing and “body work” by real professionals (Reichian and others) were nothing short of amazing. My entire state would change. The amount of tension I carry around in my body at any given moment is ridiculous and I didn’t know that until I did that work. But the relief always seemed temporary. This… Read more »

YaReally
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Fucking lol at Roosh on Dr Oz. The best part is reading the thread on their forum. This is the same forum that RAPED Juline for his apology: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mXWb9H9Fbx8 The entire world hated him, way beyond anything Roosh felt in that TV studio. The dude was banned from a country at the point of this apology. And the footage people saw was cut up to make Julien look way more of a vagina than he actually was in this uncut footage where he’s holding eye-contact, holding his voice tone, making statements, dropping solid quick soundbyte snippets and rebuttals for the… Read more »

Sun Wukong
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@YaReally Agreed. I’ve never found Roosh a bad speaker, but I’ve never found him that good either. His style always feels a little stilted to me. I didn’t think it would play well on day time TV, and it didn’t. Strangely enough, his speaking style is best suited to an interview on something like NPR. I know it’s a subject that they wouldn’t touch, but seriously listen to his cadence of speaking and his tone. Totally fits the style of interviews most NPR shows like to do. The only “success” Roosh had was avoiding rage mode. Everything else was a… Read more »

YaReally
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@Sun Wukong Ya, it’s not that he isn’t well-spoken in his YouTube vids, it’s that it’s not going to play well in the media circuit over here just like it probably doesn’t go over in a chaotic nightclub where girls have ADD and there’s loud music and stimulus everywhere compared to a quiet half-empty lounge. Roosh could do better if he wants to. But he’ll have to actively work on that and take this interview as a wake-up to step his game up. Maybe that can be the next chapter of his life since he’s getting bored with pickup itself:… Read more »

Not Born This B
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No matter how Roosh handled himself or how anyone else would, charisma, confidence, etc…we can be absolutely certain anything said about the truth concerning this in main stream media will be instantaneously and vhelmently attacked and most of the public is preconditioned to consider any of this truth as blasphemy against women and society. Just a few hundred years ago, people speaking about unadmitted truths such as these were burnt alive, banished, etc. Most men who privately agree are too weak and lack the self confidence to publicly agree. We aren’t publicly popular in the least with pop culture or… Read more »

Lucien
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@Glenn

The feminization of society and 1) consumerism; 2) de-industrialization and the decay of the American economy are exactly coterminous.

The landmark women’s rights cases were being decided at the exact same time that the country was entering the economic crises that would mark the end of the golden age of the United States. It’s quite fascinating. I don’t know what the mechanism is, if there is any.

YaReally
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@Rollo To be honest I guess I’m naive myself, I didn’t even realize there’s payment involved in these shows lol So I wasn’t even thinking about that angle. But I don’t even care if he DOES cash in. Go nuts, just cash in in a way that helps men instead of makes them go “ya those red pill guys look like weird autists, I’m not checking out that forum or reading those books”. That’s why I don’t care that RSD makes money, because they put out a ton of free content and guys get help from it. So that’s fine,… Read more »

Lucien
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“Roosh has the balls to go on one of the most feminine bullshit mainstream quack shows and tell it like it is in front of everyone and make no apologies. For this alone he should be admired regardless of his mannerisms and tone of voice. In this sense he is a pioneer of sorts. More of us should step forward and do,the same.” Couldn’t agree more. Don’t diss the man. I actually think this was good exposure. Ironically, for the very reason other people in the manosphere don’t like it. He didn’t conform to the masculine aggressor stereotype. He actually… Read more »

rugby11ljh
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For some reason viewing this and reading this calms me down. It helps

Burden of performance

Women fuck men other women wanna fuck.

Approach and anxiety.

Monogamy in sex industry

http://www.masqlen.com/interview-of-johnny-sins.html

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=FiYd_eKX-c0

YaReally
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@Not Born This B “Roosh has the balls to go on one of the most feminine bullshit mainstream quack shows and tell it like it is in front of everyone and make no apologies.” I agree. But that’s also the reason that he should have been better prepared. I can’t believe that he would think he was going on some rational debate 60 minutes type show. To think that he would have to actively have no idea how the media has handled similar guys before and would have had to have not even YouTube searched Dr Oz to see what… Read more »

Sun Wukong
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@NBTM Most of us can’t step forward to do the same without an attack on our livelihood. For him stepping forward is his livelihood. I don’t doubt that there’s guys in the ‘sphere who could do just as well or better than Roosh, but they have other work that’s more lucrative. Risking it just to make a point to some landwhales isn’t a favorable risk/reward ratio. @YaReally The big problem I see with points Roosh tried to make isn’t that they aren’t valid; we all know they are. It’s that they stand on concepts that we consider axiomatic in the… Read more »

Sun Wukong
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And for the record, I think the one word response to the stack of “shaming doesn’t work” horse shit is “Japan” with a laugh. If shaming doesn’t work, why is it the primary mode of operation for the very fat whales and their SJW cohorts to try and stop fat shaming? Hmmm…

Lucien
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Damn, I looked at the Julien Blanc video as well. This is upsetting; these people aren’t getting out the part of their message that is good. They’re not redirecting to feminism and feminized culture. They’re not making the bigger point. They’re also not “holding frame.” For example, Roosh never really mentioned the double standard. He indirectly alluded to it by pointing out that he tells dudes to go to the gym. Blanc never points out that men are being taught comprehensively today not to do anything remotely manly. And that there are tons of guys who wouldn’t imagine making the… Read more »

rugby11ljh
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@Lucien I agree @Not born this morning We aren’t publicly popular in the least with pop culture or mainstream culture. It is easy for us to discuss this among ourselves and intellectually dissect it. Roosh has the balls to go on one of the most feminine bullshit mainstream quack shows and tell it like it is in front of everyone and make no apologies. For this alone he should be admired regardless of his mannerisms and tone of voice. In this sense he is a pioneer of sorts. More of us should step forward and do,the same Yeah that’s a… Read more »

rugby11ljh
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@Rollo
Holy hell this guys my age Julien and the FI did a huge job annihalating his existence.
https://m.youtube.com/playlist?list=LLTyvDKLQnpIivQzX9qa5sWA

Roosh I hope your hanging in their. Fuck I feel angry about being online now and not being able to do this openly.
@Sun wukong
Get me in are your next update on campfire learning caveman talk.

YaReally
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@Sun Wukong @NBTM “Most of us can’t step forward to do the same without an attack on our livelihood. For him stepping forward is his livelihood.” This. There’s no real benefit for most of us to going public, and for the Manosphere all it does is give the haters a face and name to try to use to slander you with, if they don’t flat out destroy your livelihood. But if Roosh is determined to go public and make this his life, then he should WANT to do better at it and improve where he can. Like Mr Miyagi said:… Read more »

Forge the Sky
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@Glenn The book I linked is mostly hard neurology, exploring what we currently know about how and why stress and trauma (especially at a young age) affects us as profoundly as it does. I’m not pushing any woowoo crystal healing bullshit here @ All, Re: Roosh – I kinda wonder if he just didn’t really think it through all that much. That may sound crazy, and I don’t know how the whole process works, but if you just get a call asking if you want to be on TV to discuss your views, and oh by the way we’ll give… Read more »

M3
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“Going mainstream should not be about convincing Dr Oz or his audience to swallow the Red Pill……elping reach the men that need to hear the message. It should be a selfless act. If it’s not, then don’t do it, because you can NOT win over Dr Oz’s fat zombie crowd.” This. It’s the same reply i have given to people who sometimes ask why i argue or debate people in public that i have no chance of changing their minds on, so set in their dogmatic beliefs, whether feminism, creationism, etc.. I simply tell them i’m not there to change… Read more »

rugby11ljh
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Self surgery Today I learned One (life is wonderful) Two it helps to be a chump so that you don’t stay one Three being aware is a gift Four focus on myself Five allow yourself to make fun of yourself Six I wouldn’t change a thing about anything I “had” the privilige to experience. Seven rugby is my outlet for male bonding without an Internet buffer 8 rejection is a boon to behold 9 I really miss being able to laugh at pain. Going on. 26 mile run later 10 I am learning to change and its really fucking hard.… Read more »

YaReally
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@M3 Thanks for writing that incel thing you did. I’ve linked that around to help people understand what my life used to be like. Can’t remember if I gave you props for it yet or not but since you’re here there ya go lol Anyway, on media Tyler breaks it down in detail here. The media and crowd don’t want nuanced points. They want simplistic truths: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CEsr6XoACHs This is where Roosh and Cernovich failed, they both try to make nuanced points because as Red Pill guys we KNOW shit isn’t black and white and there’s tons of shades of grey… Read more »

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[…] (HT The Rational Male.) […]

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[…] Dalrock had an interesting post this morning – Black Fathers Don’t Matter – that mends nicely with a topic I was poking at in Obesity Culture: […]

Blaximus
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@Rollo This topic is complex, and at the same time it is ridiculously simple. Rand Paul makes a good point that there is a moral/familial breakdown. I contend that much of it is due to government interference. It’s an old song, but never the less relevant. In the late 50’s through the mid 70’s, if you were a poor family and wanted the available gov’t assistance, the able bodied male could not inhabit the residence. This was a recipe for disaster. Social workers would check up on recipients of gov’t funds and inspect the residence to assure the money wasn’t… Read more »

Blaximus
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….Damn, I just read that post back. Sorry to be a downer.

Carry On.

M3
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@YaReally Hey, thank you man. I’m always appreciative when i know it helps some dude wake up from their bluepill nightmare and steers them the spherian knowledge. Always enjoy reading your comments too. Always informative and insightful. My personal opinion regarding the mainstream and doing interviews where you know the attack dogs have been starved for your appearance, is to steer the conversation where you want it to go – ignore the presenters question completely if you must and go for the throat. Roosh could have had a field day simply questioning Ozzy’s motivations, his questionable health advice, his being… Read more »

SFC Ton
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Glen, I am no doctor, hell I don’t even play one on tv or stay in Holiday Inn Expresses but I also don’t see why having an ALC injury automatically takes squatting off the table. Reckon it depends on the damage and how well you have healed up BUT…. Squatting correctly takes the pressure off your knees. The high bar, straight down method which I taught through bodybuilding wrecks your knees. The correct way, slightly sitting back at the start and spreading the floor changes the mechanics greatly ( & make it easier to hit parallel) sitting back 1st makes… Read more »

sjfrellc
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“Glen, I am no doctor, hell I don’t even play one on tv or stay in Holiday Inn Expresses but I also don’t see why having an ALC injury automatically takes squatting off the table. Reckon it depends on the damage and how well you have healed up BUT….” Glenn, I hit the gym today at 7 pm and I was actually thinking about what SFC Ton is saying. I am a doctor and am too busy to have concentrated study on weightlifting, but I’m not in doubt about my gestalt thinking. I think Ton has it right. Anatomically an… Read more »

Glengarry
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“he said she [300 pound beast] ate 7,500 calories the first day and 9,000 the second and didn’t want to see [the calorie tracking app] anymore. The sad part, she’s cheating on him.”

If I were him, I don’t think I’d mind all that much. Time to move on.

Tom
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Tom
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Thought you guys might like to have a look at Proein World’s director of marketing, Richard Stavely, and his fiancee

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2015/05/01/15/2834DA2400000578-3062467-image-m-58_1430490277656.jpg

Says it all . . .

rugby11ljh
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rugby11ljh
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@Tom
That’s beautiful an priceless.

Mad Yale Grad
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