Preventative Medicine – Part I

Red Capsules 1

If the red pill and Game-awareness have a lasting effect of any future significance, my hope is that the red pill becomes preventative medicine for young men’s feminized conditioning.

This awareness is the single greatest threat to the feminine imperative and feminine social primacy. I’ve covered aspects of this prevention in Hear Me Now, Believe Me Later, but this post was more of an after-the-fact perspective from older men’s experiences, and how they wish they’d have known about the red pill, Game and the intergender dynamics I’ve written about for the past 12 years of my writing.

When I wrote the now seminal post of Navigating the SMP and introduced the comparative SMV chart I had no idea how influential (and usefully accurate) it would be. My hope then was to educate (albeit a bit tongue in cheek) a younger generation of red pill men about the basic outline of how men and women’s sexual market value waxes and wanes during phases of each sex’s lifetime. This post – and more than few subsequent ones – was prompted by the desire to have an outline of what young men should anticipate in a contemporary, westernized gender landscape.

For as much as the critics of that SMV outline would have you believe it’s just an effort in wishful thinking on the part of older men convincing themselves of a higher sexual market value, the salient message of that graph is an uncomfortable exposing of the strategies women use in optimizing hypergamy over the course of their lifetimes. When considered chronologically, many identifiable patterns become apparent both in women’s motivations and behaviors at or around distinct phases of a woman’s life.

Depending upon her capacity to fulfill them at any particular phase (attractiveness), we can get a better overall idea of what is motivating a particular woman during that period of her life and adjust Game and/or expectations accordingly to a Man’s best advantage.

Roissy wrote a fantastic piece about the difficulty of Gaming women by age brackets back in 2010, and I’m going to refer readers with a mind for Game to cross reference this article while reading what I propose here. With a better understanding of these phases, and the SMV particulars of those phases, a Man can more easily adjust his Game, maintain frame, apply Amused Mastery, and host of other red pill / Game applications covertly and confidently with a reasonable expectation of outcome, or a better understanding of the traps that may await him.

One common understanding most men had with regards to the woman in my Saving the Best post, and how her rationalizations of her past and present sexual behaviors affected the man considering divorcing her, was that she was subject to conditions at particular periods in her life which motivated her to those behaviors. I’m not sure it’s realistic to expect the blue pill guy in that situation to have seen her sexual hangups and self-consciousness with him as the red flags that we can being dissociated with his condition – however, there is a certain awareness that comes with the red pill that helps us better understand what those flags are. The armchair counseling we give him is that he should’ve known that she was looking for her Beta provider when he married her – it was at that woman’s phase of life when women are looking to consolidate on her own long term security.

But can we really expect this from a guy who in all likelihood based his decisions to marry her on false presumptions and a thoroughly blue pill hope that she’d ‘come around’ to being more sexual with him later in their marriage? Can we really expect him to know what her motivations were then for her long term security when he’d never had the benefit of ever having those motivations spelled out for him by the red pill?

It’s with this in mind that I’m presenting that outline here.

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What I’ve constructed is a loose and generalized chronology of how women effect their hypergamy over the course of typical woman’s life between the ages of 15 and 50. I’m fully prepared for the same outcries of generalizations and NAWALT that the infamous SMV graph inspired, but understand this, before any woman or femen comes up with those predictable objections, this is an outline; variables like culture, ethnicity, moralism, socio-economic status and outlying circumstance are all factors to consider when evaluating the motivations of any woman. This timeline however is intended as a roadmap to follow to get a better understanding of what motivates women at particular phases of their lives and hopefully help men to better prepare themselves for the strategies women will use to optimize hypergamy during those phases.

Understanding Hypergamy

Before we get too involved in this chronology it’s important to get a good idea of how hypergamy motivates women during these phases. A lot of the manosphere likes to define hypergamy as a woman getting the best bang for her attractiveness buck, but this is only one side of hypergamy. Using the Alpha Fucks / Beta Bucks principle of women’s dualistic sexual strategy it becomes clear that there is a drive to balance hypergamy between these two impulses. As I stated in Schedules of Mating, hypergamy wants to have both sides of the AF/BB equation satisfied by the same man, but rarely is this dualistic satisfaction met in the same individual.

It’s my belief that a drive for hypergamic optimization exists in both the impulse to secure the best genes (sexy son theory – Alpha Fucks) and the best provisioning / emotional investment (parental investment – Beta Bucks) a woman’s attractiveness can be leveraged for. The problem then is one of leveraging her attractiveness relative to any particular phase of her life and the circumstance that phase dictates for her. Needless to say a woman’s physical conditions, her personal decisions and modern social pressures will influence this ‘balancing act’ (careerism, feminism, religious conviction, etc.), but I think it’s only half correct to apply hypergamy only to the Alpha Fucks side of women’s dualistic sexual strategy.

It’s also important to consider that, from an evolutionary standpoint, hypergamy always seeks an optimization of either side of the AFBB motives that is better than any individual woman’s attractiveness realistically warrants. Keep in mind that modern social pressures (social media etc.) exacerbate this, and further distort a woman’s realistic evaluation of her own SMV at any given phase of her life. The most secure, monogamous attachments women will make are with Men they perceive are 1 to 2 degrees above what she perceives is her own relative SMV.

The Teen Phase

I ostensibly began the relative SMV graph at age 15 since this is about the post-pubescent age during which girls come into their maturation and teenage boys begin to take a real awareness of them. As you’ll see on the overall timeline, Alpha characteristics with regards to teenage attraction cues are largely based on physical attributes and prowess. These physical arousal cues girls find primarily attractive in adolescent boys (later men) will continue for the better part of a woman’s life, but during a girl’s formative years her foremost attraction is for the ‘hawt guy’ with a good body, the correct eye color and the right haircut.

Between the ages of 15 and 25 women associate and prioritize men according to their physical features. Even a relatively introverted guy with a Beta mindset and/or a brooding ‘creative’ personality can still be considered Alpha if his physical presence meets a girl’s archetypal attraction profile.

The main reasoning for this is fairly obvious in that physical cues (though also influenced externally) are primarily innate. This physical interest from adolescence through young adulthood is the top prioritization in attraction. These physical attraction / arousal cues are intrinsic; extrinsic attraction cues such as status / performance do factor in progressively as a woman matures, but the priority is the physical, and other extrinsic factors (status, Alpha confidence, Game, etc.), while definitely beneficial, are prioritized lower by the simple fact that a girl lacks any real experience of a guy with Game or the need for provisioning.

Long term provisioning potential during this phase is rarely even an afterthought for a young woman. From adolescence forward a woman’s dualistic sexual strategy primarily revolves around short term breeding opportunity – Alpha fucks. This can be attributed to a girl/young woman’s provisioning needs being relatively accommodated for by family, the state in some effect or even her own self-provisioning, as well as the breeding urgency that comes with hormones and youth.

I’ll add the caveat here that a woman’s prioritization of the physical is inversely proportional to the degree to which her provisioning needs are being met beyond seeking a mate or mating opportunities. In other words, if thing aren’t secure at home (Daddy Issues) an adolescent girl physically and mentally prepares herself for a long term mate earlier than when a solid masculine father is present in her life and the home. Further reading on the physical aspects of this phenomenon can be found here.

The short version for teenage Game (when you’re in high school) is that looks, physique and physical prowess are a woman’s attraction priority. This priority will build a foundation for her attraction cues later as she matures, but the primary importance is looks and performance.

The Break Phase

I’ve added this phase here because it’s become an increasingly too common, and potentially damaging, occurrence amongst young men I’ve counseled. Generally the Break Phase comes at or about the time of a young woman’s senior year (or shortly after) of high school when she’s forced into a conflict between continuing a monogamous relationship she began in her teenage years, and severing it as college or a simple want for ‘freedom’ looms closer as she approaches young adulthood, graduation and possibly moving away from her home for an indefinite period.

This is a major frustration for Beta minded young men given to a feminized conditioning that convinces them they’ll be rewarded for loyalty, support and building relational equity with a girl. I’m highlighting this phase because often enough it’s at this beginning point young men are prepared to compromise their life’s ambitions to play a role that their feminine conditioning predisposes them for. The danger being long term life decisions made in order to maintain a relationship he believes his sacrifices will be rewarded for in favor of personal goals or developing passions and personal potential.

Here is the warning for any late teen / early adult man: This is generally the point at which you’ll have to make some real personal assessments of yourself if you have a girlfriend. This will be the first test of the red pill versus your feminized conditioning. Most blue pill guys entertain the ‘invisible friend’ of an LDR (long distance relationship) for the first time at this juncture, or they alter their educational priorities to accommodate maintaining their relationship.

Statistically the girlfriend you expected to build a Disney-story life with will break up with you as her options expand while yours constrict (due to prioritizing her goals above your own). The decisions you make at this stage are up to you, but understand (barring personal convictions) this stage will come as a woman’s SMV begins it’s rapid ascent and along with it opportunities she’s been scarcely aware of until now.

The Party Years

The five year span between 20 and 25 are what I euphemistically call a woman’s ‘Party Years’. It’s at this stage women generally experience their peak SMV (22-23 y.o.), and as I stated in Navigating the SMP, at no other point in a woman’s life will so many socio-sexual options be available to her. A lot of manosphere moralists believe that women ought to marry and get pregnant during the party years since this is the point of peak fertility as well as physical beauty, and in the not so distant, pre-sexual revolution past this certainly made sense. However, under the social conditions of the last 50+ years, women’s priorities have changed.

The available opportunities – social, sexual, educational and career-wise – that a woman experiences during these years are afforded to her in relation to her SMV. At no point will you find a woman more cocky and self-assured of her predominance in society according to the option she enjoys relative to her attractiveness. Her personal image will be one based on merit, and while it’s certainly possible she is talented and/or intelligent, her opportunities are predicated on her attractiveness and the leverage it has on other’s (men and women) decision making.

The physical arousal priorities she had in high school remain a top attraction priority, however, as she matures into the new experiences her SMV peak affords her, status, and later affluence (wealth or potential provisioning) start getting added to the attraction mix. As women learn the utility of their relative SMV, and begin to understand a future need for long term provisioning (on some level of consciousness) they come to understand the transactional nature of their sexual agency.

It’s during the party years that women begin to prefer ‘dating’ men older than themselves. Generally this is between a 5-7 year difference, however Roissy postulated that even more mature men still have potential depending upon their own SMV:

Hard to believe, but it is often easier to bed a very young woman than an older woman, if you are an older man. This is because 20-40% of women are specifically attracted to older men. It is hard-wired in them, and this hard-wiring can be reinforced by poor family upbringing resulting from divorce of parents or absentee fathers. Single moms are the greatest source of future generations of slutty daughters the world has ever known.

During the party years, hypergamy is still firmly rooted in physical attraction / short term mating cues, however, women begin to develop an appreciation for personality cues of confidence and (Alpha) character as it relates to her long term investment. Later in the party years a woman’s hypergamy leads her to look for the Alpha bad boy who might also be molded (tamed) into her long term ideal – this is the Tarzan Effect, the want for an optimized balance of hypergamic interests in the same Alpha male. The idea is one that an Alpha Man might be tamed, in some cases coerced via pregnancy, into assuming the providership role the other half of her sexual strategy demands.

One point of attraction older men (who capitalize on their SMV potential) have is that their capacity to provide for more than themselves, and still maintain an above average physique, tends to be a form of preselection for this hypergamic balance as women mature past the latter part of their party years.

Just to be clear, as a woman becomes more cognizant of her decreasing capacity to sexually compete with the attractiveness of younger women, her attraction for more than just the physical aspects of men begins to assume a higher priority. Those aspects (status, confidence, affluence, worldly maturity, etc.) are typically found in men old enough to have had the experience to acquire them.

I should also add here that, there are incidents of women who, for some condition or circumstance opt out of their party years. Either their socioeconomic situation prevents it, or an early, unplanned pregnancy, or for religious convictions, but whatever the reason they move past this phase without a sense of having capitalized on it. In some respects this may seem to be a better choice than riding the proverbial ‘cock carousel’ into her Epiphany and Transitory phase (discussed in the next post), but it’s important to remember that these circumstances don’t disqualify a woman from the maturation process I’ve described here.

In some cases it may be the source of resentment at a man for having ‘held her back’ from all of the experiences her girlfriends went through (through which she vicariously lived), or it may be her coming into a better understanding of how other men (perceptually) meet her hypergamic balance better than the one she settled for earlier than she had the maturity to understand. As we’ll explore in the next continuation post, this resentment can be a later source of marital dissatisfaction (and divorce) for women approaching the Epiphany and Transitory phases.

This post is the first in a 3 part series. In part 2 I’ll outline the Epiphany, Transition, Security and Development phases.

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donalgraeme
Guest

Interesting. Looking forward to reading the whole series. I disagree with your graph in so far as Status always matters to women. Even the teen years shows this. Whether or not he is the best looking guy on the football team, the team captain benefits significantly from a (relative) high status. Also, even less physically attractive high-status men can still get younger women with ease. I don’t think it is so much that younger women don’t care about status, but rather that they spend much of their time among age-peers for men, who rarely have high-status. Also, I was interested… Read more »

silverharkness
Guest

Brilliant as always. Is this in any way a response to Lindy West’s attempted take down of the SMP graph? (Laughable, because she’d be hitting 0-2 at best.)

Johnycomelately
Guest
Johnycomelately

Status matters?

My bouncer buddy reliably informs me the jeanswest model gave a short, fat, bald, 45 year old Arab a blow job in the men’s room for a line of coke.

I wouldn’t want to sully this board with the rest of his stories, you want to know something about women, befriend a bouncer.

Yeh, status matters….party, woohoo!

Tilikum
Guest

i disagree ONLY because in observation, AWALT. only the individual females ability to fully engage the activity defined in that graph is the defining factor.

NAWALT but ONLY because lower value girls don’t have the capacity to “be like that”, but if they could, you bet your ass they would.

chris
Guest
chris

The problem, from a societal perspective, is that the effort required to maximise looks (going to gym a few times a week for a few years, spending your money on nice clothes, whitening teeth, etc) is much much less than the effort required to maximise provisioning (4 years high school getting good grades, 3-4 years college getting good grades, 5 years post college building a career), yet the reward for men who choose to maximise provisioning is much much less than the reward for men who choose to maximise looks (maximising looks=16-24 year old women who are younger, hotter and… Read more »

chris
Guest
chris

Or put another way, all the effort men put into maximising provisioning/making themselves husband material, can’t be used to leverage themselves a better woman. Thus there’s no point putting effort into it.

On a side note, the feminine imperative’s insistence that men still put effort into maximising provisioning/becoming husband material despite what I’ve mentioned above that there’s no incentive for it, bespeaks of a belief that women are entitled to commitment/provisioning from men, rather than commitment/provisioning being a sacrifice/cost that men impose on themselves in order to leverage a better woman/better mating deal.

vinay3543
Guest

As my blog perhaps takes on analysis based on fundamental physical attractiveness relativity, I’ll throw something out on the back of: “Hard to believe, but it is often easier to bed a very young woman than an older woman, if you are an older man. This is because 20-40% of women are specifically attracted to older men” This is totally true, and much of it is with relevance to women’s maternal and fairytale instincts taking over with regards to the need of marriage and kids – with willing beta providers. However, a greater reason older men can bed younger women… Read more »

jf12
Guest
jf12

@donal, no. N. O. Status does NOT matter to many women. Very many women, albeit not the sort you’d choose for yourself. One of my women confessees (I have been, throughout my life, a Confessor of sorts, mostly for young men I’ve counseled) has a 19 yr old son who was locked up in juvi several times, and is on probation for drug offenses. He’s pretending to attend a remedial high school (somehow made it to sophomore status after the fall semester) in order to continue to get his deceased father’s SS check, while living at his 15 yr old… Read more »

Tam the Bam
Guest
Tam the Bam

Much as I appreciate da GBFM, and abhor spelling-freaks, since I suspect the timeline graphic is going to be as widely reproduced as the SMV graph and has your name on it, I’d lose the first “i” in Phy(i)sicality. Otherwise you’re going to drown in the avalanche of whining and adhomming from the nay-sayers, who will pick on absolutely anything except the substance of your argument. Because they can’t. Post duly bookmarked in “In Case of Emergency, Break Glass” folder. Will be retrieved frequently, I predict, as my boys blunder on into young adulthood. This post will self-destruct in ten… Read more »

jf12
Guest
jf12

@chris “Or put another way, all the effort men put into maximising provisioning/making themselves husband material, can’t be used to leverage themselves a better woman. Thus there’s no point putting effort into it.” Succinct statement of current conditions. My short advice to young men, even to young men who want to become husbands, would be: DO NOT work on making yourself a better nice guy husband. Work 101% towards making yourself a more physically attractive bad boy boyfriend.

jf12
Guest
jf12

With regards to the original SMV chart, especially the older peak for males, the salient point is one that women themselves ALWAYS throw out as a bone to formerly undesired young males: “Just wait, and then it will be your turn.” The funny part is, ALL of those women assumed that those males would wait for those women when those women are older! When in reality what happens, if they become desired, then those males become desired by other younger hotter women instead.

jf12
Guest
jf12

More and more, and more and more and more, I’m coming to believe that ANYTHING that isn’t about a man’s physical attractiveness is merely going to affect perceptions of his beta provisioning. Which is fine, if that’s what he wants …

Walawala
Guest
Walawala

Interesting. Girl I’m currently banging is 34 just divorced is up for banging. I see her once a week and apart from hanging out and banging spend no money on her. When we met online she said she was religious. Now she’s up for anything in bed. I just gamed her and offer no promises of anything. It’s fun I am just coming out of he fog of my previous oneitis so this topic is relevant. Before taking the red pill I was stuck in the idea of being a nice guy etx etx Now I realize if I was… Read more »

Walawala
Guest
Walawala

Interesting. Girl I’m currently banging is 34 just divorced is up for banging. I see her once a week and apart from hanging out and banging spend no money on her. When we met online she said she was religious. Now she’s up for anything in bed. I just gamed her and offer no promises of anything. It’s fun I am just coming out of he fog of my previous oneitis so this topic is relevant. Before taking the red pill I was stuck in the idea of being a nice guy etx etx Now I realize if I was… Read more »

Nameless...
Guest
Nameless...

Rollo……. When or if you make a “Rational Male” Vol. 2, this post MUST be in that book. Damn the breakdown on this. I mean, reading your blog for some years now I knew and had a understanding of all of this already but, man. This post just opens it up the “Red Pill” eyes even more. And yet, women “Claim” they don’t know or will balk at this not being true for everyone but, c’mon now. Deep down that small voice just gets louder as they age as it does with us. They just know how to play this… Read more »

kaizersoze71
Guest

Looks like you are dead on Rollo. The Alpha reinterest is what I was looking for, that’s why the divorce rate is so high. Women leave the beta with cash and prizes to ride the cock carousel again.

alcockell
Guest

Fuck that. I’m MGTOW. I was derailed through being the victim of sexual abuse and assault through the proto generation (I’m 43) – fighting back from massive traumatic weight gain…

But trying to enter the SMP at approaching 50 appears futile – until we get some serious soul-searching and better quality women. Why should I go through all that effort for a whore?

deti
Guest
deti

Well done, Rollo. Including the concept of “the Break Phase” is quite important here. My experience, though, is that the Break usually comes later, when a woman is finishing up college or thereabouts, or starting a job or grad school. So the Break from what I’ve seen happens during peak SMV or around the ages of 22 to 25. There could also be more than one Break – one at around 18, and another at around 22 or 23 I suppose. The point is that Breaks seem to occur with women at the time of major life events. High school… Read more »

Morpheus
Guest
Morpheus

I wouldn’t want to sully this board with the rest of his stories, you want to know something about women, befriend a bouncer Ha.  I worked as a bouncer for awhile about 8-9 years ago when I was in between professional white collar jobs. What an awakening.  I saw things, heard things, knew of things that took place that I previously couldn’t have imagined.  Definitely got a glimpse into a different side of female nature.  Of course, some would argue those are the exception made up of the small minority of “unrestricted bar sluts”.  And that actually might be partially… Read more »

Mark
Guest
Mark

The graph in this article should be printed out and posted on every guys bathroom mirror so he can see it every morning.

Mark Minter
Guest

OK. I haven’t read the whole post yet. But I brought up your page today, “on a mission”. But this comment does sit into the point of this post and this request, that idea of a synopsis, a prescriptive list of what is what. I have just gotten back from an appointment at “Behavioral” at the Veterans Administration. I am there for ADHD and sleep issues. I have had 3 appointments so far. Two with a psychologist that specializes in sleep disorders and one with a psychiatrist for the ADHD meds. Now, me being me and then being them, the… Read more »

Glenn
Guest
Glenn

@ Rollo – Alpha re-interest intrigues me. It certainly explains the absurd “cougars” I see out in the bars. Is it that the preference for Alpha re-emerges once a women has handled security/provisioning? Or is it there all along, just sublimated by the urgency of provisioning needs?

jf12
Guest
jf12

One point about your SMV chronology chart I’m wondering about. Women in their 30s “ought” to be most interested in betas (especially relatively high status and high provisioning betas like I was), but they were not interested in me when I was in my 30s. The majority of the women in their 30s I was meeting, e.g. in 1984, were newly divorced and seemed to feel they had missed out on their party years while married. About the only interest I seemed to be generating at the time, what little there was, was from golddiggers, seemingly impressed by my abundance… Read more »

jf12
Guest
jf12

Re: circumstances and environment. Yes, but. Supposing a young woman “settled” for a young marriage (e.g. age 21) to a high-achieving beta, and at age 30 he was an even better beta and even more high-achieving than ever. Clearly, we know, or ought to know, she is not less likely to resent him and to divorce him even nowadays.

The overall point I’m trying to make is that being a beta never makes a man more attractive, even during the life chronology when the women are supposedly on the hunt for betas.

Mark Minter
Guest

@rollo, Thanks for the response. I go back over there this week to see a medical doctor. I don’t see the psychologist guy for a couple of weeks. Let me research some things, and I will walk into the office of the DAV and American Legion reps to inquire about grants, funding policies, provider rules etc. Here is a weirdo fact. A couple of years ago, I was pulled into discussions about creating a web site for a non-profit. The principal was this woman who had been wounded in Iraq and had suffered PTSD. She had some idea about “creating… Read more »

jf12
Guest
jf12

It has been my experience that the re-awakening of alpha interest in a woman’s 40s coincides with the increased libido prior to menopause. So in the chronology is the red area of much of a woman’s 30s ascribable simply to decreased libido? I know, I know, some of you young guys and gals are going “But I thought it was going to get better in my 30s.” Again, I’m not sure, but it is possible that *estrogen* is peak in the 30s, but the ratio of testosterone to estrogen is peak in the 40s. So what would be an evo-psych… Read more »

kaizersoze71
Guest

@glenn Alpha reinterest is when the beta’s wife gets tired of fucking him and realized that she had better sex in her 20’s pre marriage. Thus the divorce rate goes up as these women feel they are “missing out on life” aka mid life crisis and want to be fucked again like the “one that got away” fucked her. The attitude is best described in Saving Your Best. Where she didn’t tell her husband that she was sexually more attracted to the Alphas in her past than the guy she committed to in marriage. This is VERY common and I… Read more »

eon
Guest
eon

I think that women hit two walls, the first in their late teens, and the well-known one in their late twenties. The first wall is the end of “the bloom of youth”, which is the period that starts at the beginning of puberty and lasts until a couple (occasionally, a few) years after the completion of puberty. This bloom of youth was well-known (and obvious) until relatively recently. It makes even plain girls pretty, and allows the truly beautiful to be actual “10s”. (This is why I agree that it is not possible for a woman in her twenties to… Read more »

jf12
Guest
jf12

Re: conditions and situations. In looking again at the proposed chronology, it struck me that there may be some high-frequency/fractal stuff going on. I think a life course perspective would help here. Your outline portrays a typical woman’s life history, including getting married at age 28 (say), getting divorced ten years later (say), swearing off men maybe for a couple of years, and then trying for another marriage at age 40 (say). In other words, the typical serial monogamy. Which also applies to her earlier hookups. Getting “serious” steady at age 17, breaking up ten months later, taking a break… Read more »

fightforlove
Guest
fightforlove

[i]The woman becomes unhappy/unattracted to/ or simply loses respect for her husband (if she ever really had any) and wants to feel the long lost tingle again before it’s simply “too late”.[/i] I once read a comment from a late-20s woman on an online dating discussion forum. She was complaining about a recent dating experience that had turned sour: “I had 3 dates with him and I could tell he was very shy and a little awkward…” she said, “…but I was willing to keep dating him because he made a lot of money.” “Now, it’s been more than a… Read more »

Glenn
Guest
Glenn

@kaizerso – Interesting insights but I think there is something more that you are missing. Why is it she starts missing those alpha humping days? She didn’t do so for a while and starts again. Saying she was bored doesn’t explain anything. What causes her to “Alpha up” again whereas she didn’t for a while? I wonder if income level, net worth, career etc are important factors as well? Or is it perhaps more horomonal like @jf12 says? I don’t think it could be just boredom, no? I mean, it does seem weird to me. I lived in NYC till… Read more »

Steve H
Guest
Steve H

I would move ‘Beta Long Term’ (above) as well as ‘Status’ and ‘Affluence Provisioning’ (below) all 2-3 years to the left (earlier chronologically).

And perhaps jumping the gun here, but the ‘Epiphany’ + ‘Transition’ phases on this chart may be marked by ‘Competition Anxiety’ but they more profoundly are marked by an existential crisis of ‘Who am I, what is my long-term social value, and am I going to get the husband and family I’ve dreamt of since age 5?’. I would emphasize that crisis more centrally to the diagram.

kaizersoze71
Guest

@glenn I don’t know why some women regain the Alpha interest. I think of it as a mid life crisis thing. Some do, some don’t. I’m 43 and it took me 4 years to finally come around. Being in divorce debt for 3 years didn’t help. Once the bitch was paid off, other women started showing up…interesting. Now I honestly I really don’t give a fuck much about women over than occasional sex. They are too much of a liability to me. I wish you well!

imnobody00
Guest

The fact that the bloom of youth makes even plain girls pretty, for a while, is one reason why the common marriage age in the 1800s, and earlier, was rarely past the mid to late teens,

Quite true. In Spain, in the XVI and XVII centuries, a 14 y.o. girl was “a girl of marriageable age”. I think it could be the same in other countries.

And if older women had not labeled relationship with teenagers (which are women fully able to reproduce), people would accept that mid and late teens is the age where women are most beautiful.

BlackPoisonSoul
Guest

Every man needs to get both this graphic and the SMV graphic, print them out, laminate them, and put them up on his wall.

walawala
Guest
walawala

@Rollo This post just sparked me to think of the AFC/Pre-game me. I took the “red pill” at age 45. But looking at “value”…I had a very high-profile job and high status but low self-esteem when it came to women. So even though I did get hot girls–models etc, I never really fully appreciated it and understood what I could pursue. Things kind of fell into my lap or they didn’t but I never went for what I wanted. Game and understanding your own SMV as well as a woman’s is crucial to self-actualization. I am getting over a oneitis… Read more »

Slothrop
Guest
Slothrop

Good stuff. From the male perspective, the important thing about these “breaks” is they completely change your relative SMV. I went to a fairly upper middle-class high school and saw numerous middle-of-the-pack jocky girls rocket up to real-world 8s. The hottest girls were warped into a different dimension of modeling/arm-candy/etc and very high status men. Meanwhile, most men head into college needing to rebuild their social status from scratch, while their soon-to-be ex-gfs are automatically invited into the in-crowds. Likewise, in the post-college “party years”, women will be swooped upon by older men with the job, the house, the luxury… Read more »

Onder
Guest

Yep, I would say the graph is spot on. The dynamic of the girl going off to college and realising her increasing options and SMV was the exact reason of my breakup with my ex when she turned 18 and off to Uni. And it wasn’t as if i wanted it to happen. It was simply her need to want to break things off by increasing the amount of shit-tests and causing unnecessary drama. I simply had no chance. I pretty much know the dynamics a woman will go through simply by looking at the graph as I see it… Read more »

Jules Gold
Guest
Jules Gold

@walawala … “Game and understanding your own SMV as well as a woman’s is crucial to self-actualization. THIS! This I feel is the greatest piece of understanding we Man of aged years/experience must have. Younger guys internalize this, older Men have to reignite this. It’s the reconstruction phase for us Men. Losing what we THOUGHT we lost (game), only to realize later that it was in us all along. All we have to do is understand our OWN smv. Can do.. I too thought my dreamgirl would reciprocate my efforts to please (yuck) only to get broken up on.. Lesson… Read more »

Nathan
Guest
Nathan

“More and more, and more and more and more, I’m coming to believe that ANYTHING that isn’t about a man’s physical attractiveness is merely going to affect perceptions of his beta provisioning.” true. Make as much money as possible, get physically built, like MMA built, don’t give a #uck about her (no oneitis).
Rollo, this is one of your best. Do not be discouraged by the few comments.

Nathan
Guest
Nathan

She does not care about you. Remember that, then you stop with relationship equity, and you suddenly realize, you should not care about her either; caring is a losing proposition and beta

[The Cardinal Rule of Relationships
In any relationship, the person with the most power is the one who needs the other the least.]

Nathan
Guest
Nathan

” For Freud to even ask, after supposedly being the “father” of psychoanalysis that literally created an industry where nothing like it existed before, to fucking ask, in exasperation I might add, because he didn’t know, “What do women want?”, is fucking evidence of how fucked up and how wrong that whole discipline is.”

The significance of what the manosphere has solved is astounding.

Men have grappled, with exasperation and without much progress, (not withstanding Ancient wisdom of women, genesis story etc) until THIS generation.

Softek
Guest
Softek

The term “Feminine Mystique” just popped into my head and reminded me how completely sick I am of hearing it.

Very happy to see posts and graphs like this take that idol out to the barn and put a bullet in its head.

Bachelorocles
Guest
Bachelorocles

Great article!!!! Roissy is 100% correct. I am just on the right side of my peak SMV and I still can’t believe the access I have to women in their 20s. I was told I would be “aged out.” Not true. Dear young men, I bring good news: if you stay in shape, work on your game, avoid the marriage trap, and make money, the power balance between the sexes slowly but completely reverses. You will have access to women of all ages and you will be in control. My experience is this. Unmarried, childless women in their 30s are… Read more »

jf12
Guest
jf12

Re: women “being unknowable, random or in worse case fickle or ambiguous.” The true mystery is why men put up with it. Over at J4G, there was a profoundly redpill comment today “Without male libido to filter our perceptions, women are just incompetent men with bad attitudes.”
http://www.justfourguys.com/the-male-pill-draws-near/#comment-14908

Yes, it sounds misogynist, but the punchline is “But we (men) must like them (women) anyway.” Imagine, as a man, being treated by a small whiny demanding man the way that most women treat most men.

jf12
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jf12

Re: “My experience is this. Unmarried, childless women in their 30s are the absolute worst.” My experience too.

Badpainter
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Badpainter

Re: women in their 30s

Well crap.

I am screwed.

Women in their 40s are mostly useless, 50s entirely useless and I’m not currently the guy who can go 20s. Oh well, I guess it’s time to start playing single moms and setting bad examples for their children, or perhaps a turn to faith and a monastic order.

Why do I feel like I’m at a rummage sale?

jf12
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jf12

“I’m not currently the guy who can go 20s.” Have you tried?

That being said, my experience with unmarried childless women in their 30s was when I was in my 30s.

Tam the Bam
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Tam the Bam

@Bach;
Unmarried, childless women in their 30s are the absolute worst</I.
Aye man, but were they not thus always?
{sneaks off to Saino's yellow-label gondola-end to battle with surprisngly aggressive but foolishly unfit chinese grandmamas for the out-of date fish. Fuckoff dwarf. Chin empire?.. Ah'll fucken chin
yee, here’s .. Emperor Malkie. Your bristly sons I’ll reserve as impromptu footwear).

kaizersoze71
Guest

@rollo They’ve “lived responsibly” for so long and for so little appreciation that when that true realization is made they feel the need to move.

Excellent quote. My other favorite quote from you is “what comes across as love is really a liability”. Man you really helped me focus. Thank you! BTW I own your book also.

jf12
Guest
jf12

I suppose y’all have seen this about 17 yr old Johran McCormick. He was supposed to be in New Orleans for a week and his parents were unconcerned and unaware of his whereabouts for some days. He was found in Houston in bed making noises with a 16 yr old girl when her little brother heard them and entered the room to check on his sister, who was grounded anyway. He got freaked out because she played dead while a strange man made threats at him from under the covers, with apparently just his big bare feet sticking out. The… Read more »

Bachelorocles
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Bachelorocles

@Badpainter Women in their 30s can be a lot of fun. But they’re very much ruled by that ancient female urge to nest. Whether they spent their 20s touring with bands or being serial monogamists, when they hit the 30s their chief focus will be to obtain a close “intimate” (a favorite (meaningless) word of the female relationship industry) relationship and to build a home or nest. She’ll say she’s “matured,” that’s she’s “outgrown” the party scene, but that’s her biology speaking. Her provisioning instincts will prioritized provider abilities over physical attractiveness and raw bad boy vibes. An HB9 in… Read more »

Anonymous Reader
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Anonymous Reader

Note that all of this is predicated on a variety of external existing resources. There is a whole lot of support for young women that is not visible to them, and that support is a product of a tremendous excess of resources at the society-wide level as well as the family level.

The Sex in the City girls, and the Girls of Lena Doughgirl, are a luxury, not a necessity.

Badpainter
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Badpainter

@Bachelorocles I hear ya. I’m 43. My preferred range in 30-35. Usually end up with 35-38. You left out that many of these ticking fertility bombs have also seemingly had their virginity grow back. They’re willing suck me dry in every way but the one I want. Really just kidding about the single moms. I’ve been out with only two, and both failed my test. I asked if they wanted more children. Nope they didn’t, the fact they already had one or two was supposed to satisfy my desire to have kids. It doesn’t. Those were brief and uncomfortable dates.… Read more »

Richard
Guest
Richard

bla bla bla – way too much navel gazing…. – if you have time for this much mental masturbation…… obviously mrs. tomassi is not putting much out lately…. be careful, if you take enough red pills you’ll eventually turn blue….

Johnycomelately
Guest
Johnycomelately

Rollo, I started reading the Sosauve forum after you mentioned it on your site and quoted a commenter. I have slowly noticed marriage coucillors are posting there and other commenters who subscribe to your ‘plate’ theory have been banned. Is it just me or is the sphere slowly being co-opted, obviously the mainstream is aware of your work and most obviously don’t like it. First it was Roissy being outed, Aunt giggle’s bait and switch, Minter, your obvious trolls, fake PUA marketers, the MGTOW forum blow up and now Sosauve being co-opted by ‘relationship’ experts. Am I being paranoid or… Read more »

Yesod
Guest
Yesod

Hey, Rollo, this looks like a great series. Hopefully you’ll address the phenomenon of “frivorce” in your series. Just as an observation to your post, I had read an author who claimed that 1) women usually take a long time to realize and/or accept that the SMV is declining; 2) some women are not likely to get humbler as their SMV declines, but instead they get more demanding and resented towards men in general and her mate; and 3) they often expect many compensations of men they deem “inferior”, such as shopping, travels, etc. to continue giving them a modicum… Read more »

Junior
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Junior

I am enjoying this series too. It helps me understand better women’s motivations and the “roadmap” to relationships for me as a man. Thanks.

Johnycomelately
Guest
Johnycomelately

I find it odd that Epimanes advertises his paid affiliation with Marriage Builders and in some posts proposes infidelity can be ‘worked out’ while PlayHer Man (admittedly a bit rough around the edges but very consistent with plate spinning) gets the ban hammer.

Jeremy
Guest

@Rollo Actually I find that the fewer comments I get on an article the more solid the post was. At least until a side-point comes up in comments that a woman/feminist-lurker wants to comment on, then all bets are off. The break phase is very important, and I agree with where you put it, end of HS, end of living with parents. Putting the break phase at the end of college is not the same because there’s no sudden increase in sexual options, in fact there is a decrease in them. Almost all women in the developed world are literally… Read more »

jf12
Guest
jf12

@Badpainter, the serial killer vibe isn’t workng for you? Try wide-open body language, spraddle legs, combined with a big smirk, and twinkle if you can. Evidently your direct gaze is unnerving; do the flick away instead, like you can’t bear to glance at her for more than a second without bursting, like you need to laugh or to tell her something but don’t know how. As soon as you draw her in at all, immediately escalate to some degree of intimacy/isolation, a shared secret or at minimum some furtiveness on your part, some kind of “I shouldn’t be doing this… Read more »

jf12
Guest
jf12

Re: dynamical SMV chart. Given the changing socio-economic demographics, including sexual demographics, but especially single parenthood and employment issues, do you think there will be some shifting of the presumably non-static peaks? Age 23 is accurate enough for most low-N women, but for high-N age 23 is already well past peak (think Lindsay Lohan). And for the majority of men i.e. undesired betas with therefore low N, 38 is probably accurate because of the MMV boost, but I wonder if there may be some moveout of the peak rather rapidly because of the college gender ratio of the previous generation.

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[…] Preventative Medicine – Part I (Rollo Tomassi) […]

jsr
Guest
jsr

Rollo,

What is your explanation for the apparent contradiction between your “looks” priority for high school girls vs. heartiste’s “preternatural confidence” priority as described in http://heartiste.wordpress.com/2014/03/18/never-put-yourself-out-of-contention/?

Nathan
Guest
Nathan

Jsr,

That’s the question! The ambiguity in preferences in this dymanic is the root question.

Nathan
Guest
Nathan

Rollo,

Is a woman keeping her chastity until marriage her form of relationship equity?

jf12
Guest
jf12

Re: irrational self-confidence. I had it. Bill Gates had it. Steve Urkel had it. It doesn’t help nerds, not one bit.

Perhaps, since it’s totally outside my experience, irrational self-confidence could help some non-nerds. But probably not many. If anything, irrational confidence makes creepy guys even creepier. Far better to work hardest on becoming more physically attractive in order to eliminate the nerd and creep factors.

Badpainter
Guest
Badpainter

Under the Brady rules I would think irrationtional self confidence only applies if one is handsome and attractive. Otherwise one is simply arrogant, and that’s not attractive.

I’m starting to believe jf12 is on to something, that reducing it all to physical attraction might be the correct macro model. Everything else, game, dominance, confidence, etc. is just an appeal to a woman’s desire to escape agency, and responsibility. Thus making attraction a hard fought subtextual negotiation.

jf12
Guest
jf12

The echo of the Brady rulez reverberates for undesired men. 1. Work on your physical attractiveness. Work, work, work. Spend a LOT more time, money, and effort strictly on being better looking for the sake of being better looking, than you would have thought would yield greater returns based on your prior woeful lack of success. Save up for and seriously consider a little facial work, seriously: by far the most bangs for the bucks. By. Far. If not now, when? (I still haven’t convinced myself to bother with surgery, because of my advancing age and marital status.) 2. Since… Read more »

Aaron Bible
Guest

This article read like Erikson or Maslow. Great read.

jsr
Guest
jsr

so you are claiming that Roissy is incorrect when he says that plain/ugly guys that are flabby were getting the most beautiful girls because of their confidence?

jsr
Guest
jsr

Correction. Pudgy, not flabby.

jsr
Guest
jsr

Thanks for the extra details.

Glenn
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Glenn

@ Rollo – Bingo – “it’s when their respective SMV declines and their priority switches to Beta Bucks that “women don’t mind a few extra pounds””. There is no faking attraction, or buying it either…

Anton
Guest
Anton

Just leaving this comment here to say Rollo, you are a god-damned hero among men.
If you believe in a God, then God Bless You. if you’re an atheist, then all love and happiness be upon you. Either way, you’re a Big Star in the Red Pill/Dark Enlightenment constellation, you and Heartiste and Roosh and Dalrock–y’all are frickin’ LODESTARS.

Bachelorocles
Guest
Bachelorocles

Rollo, if I could offer a means to bridge the gap between you and Roissy. You claim “it’s innate physical cues that generate arousal” while Roissy claims “it’s exclusively confidence alone that generates attraction.” There seems to be a scientific basis to believe women receive far less sexual stimulation by way of visual cues. Men are much more aroused by visual sexual stimulation. Men naturally prioritize beauty and the body. From an evolutionary perspective, there was no reason for a man to choose a high status beautiful woman over a low status woman of equal beauty. For women, on the… Read more »

Jeremy
Guest

I would say there are physical cues for confidence that are not all necessarily associated with a ripped body. So in a sense, I agree with Rollo that women’s attraction is sourced/triggered by the physical perception particularly when young, but in a sense I would also agree with others. Female triggers are a mix of appearance (style, passive success triggers), physical stature, healthy body shape, and posture/body language. Since confidence begets better body language and posture on it’s own, you’ll attract women more if you simply stand up straight, keep your shoulders back, and walk with a f-ing purpose while… Read more »

Nathan
Guest
Nathan

Rollo I’d also like to say thank you.
your blog is a big help. and thanks for making your book affordable

Softek
Guest
Softek

Dr. John Mew – Orthotropics. Dr. Brian Palmer on the importance of breastfeeding for proper facial development. Google some images of “orthotropics” and you’ll get the idea pretty quickly. An older work is “Shut Your Mouth and Save Your Life” by George Caitlin, but he makes some very interesting observations in that short book too that complement Mew and Palmer’s work. Ever hear about the attractiveness of that prominent jawline? You face is meant to develop in a specific way through proper oral posture. It reminds me of the studies of women that showed they preferred more masculine looking men… Read more »

jf12
Guest
jf12

@Softek, great information.
Re: overconfidence. The key is the abundance mentality, not overconfidence. It is *partial* truth that as a man thinketh in his heart, so is her (Proverbs 23:7), but *more* of the truth is that a man is not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think (Romans 12:3). Indeed we have warnings not to take our own thoughts too seriously.
1 Cor 10:12 Wherefore let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he fall.
1 Cor 8:2 And if any man think that he knoweth any thing, he knoweth nothing yet as he ought to know.

LucasBly
Guest

@rollo re: When or if you make a “Rational Male” Vol. 2, this post MUST be in that book. / Am I that transparent?

Thank goodness. Sign me up for a preorder copy for my son.

Deep Strength
Guest

Softek:

Have you read Whole Health Source (Stephan Guyenet) series on the Diseases of Civilization and malocclusion.

Nutritional deficiencies shape the face and jaw for the worse whereas hunter gatherers tend to have very good occlusion and jaw posture/alignment. No teeth need to be pulled, cavities are rare, etc.

This relates heavily back to the lies the public is told on nutrition, likely from big pharma as well as big agriculture. But I’m starting to sound like a conspiracy theorist.

Softek
Guest
Softek

@ Deep Strength: I haven’t read Stephan Guyenet’s series, but I’ve read some of his other work and I’m also familiar with the Weston Price Foundation. Ray Peat is my favorite researcher. All of his articles are available for free on his website. Danny Roddy has written a lot about Peat and for a brief primer on understanding the premise of Peat’s work, I’d recommend reading some stuff on Roddy’s blog. Matt Stone, the creator of180 Degree Health has also been one of my major influences and I’m a huge fan of his work. I don’t want to hijack this… Read more »

DBM
Guest
DBM

Game is sales. The product itself has a value (call this looks) but the quality of the salesmanship can increase the perceived value at the time of potential purchase. A man who is fat/pudgy who is the funniest guy in the room will walk away with pussy. We *do* see good looking men get laid but we also hear about the fat frat bro who bangs a sorority slut. I also disagree that men value looks more than women. Men value qualities in women less generally than what women value in men. A man values a woman’s character, personality, and… Read more »