Hypergamy – The Misconceptions

At the end of September last year I gave two talks at the 10th annual 21 Convention in Orlando, Florida. This probably isn’t news to any of my regular readers as it was the only in-person appearance I did last year. My first talk was a familiar one – Hypergamy; Micro to Macro – and was an updated version of the talk I delivered at the Man in Demand Conference in 2015. I’m happy to announce that the video of this dissertation is almost ready to go live on the 21 University site. I should also mention that this video marks the first time I’ve put my real face out in the wild so be gentle.

Before this video is made public I wanted to address some of the more common (and often deliberate) misconceptions about Hypergamy I read floating around Twitter, more than a few Red Pill forums and the blogs of Purple Pill ‘life coaches’ who need to dismiss Hypergamy as a ‘thing’ in order to keep their clientele mired in Blue Pill Disney dreams coming true. Some of these are honest mistakes, and some are just the opinions of guys who only see one side of the Hypergamous equation. A lot of critics think Hypergamy is all there is to Red Pill awareness, and while it’s true that women’s sexual strategies extrapolate a great deal into our social order, there’s a lot more to understanding intersexual dynamics than just wrapping your head around Hypergamy.

I’ve written about Hypergamy for as long as this blog’s existed (I own the google search term) and as new readers become initiated in the Red Pill I can’t expect them to have read every essay describing the ins and outs of Hypergamy. So in the interests of clearing the air and consolidating all of these misunderstandings for everyone benefit – and to refute the disingenuous – I’m going to run down the most common Hypergamous hate I see here.

Hypergamy is a Straightjacket
This is easily the most common misperception I read. Hypergamy is an evolved social dynamic. That is to say it is the behavioral extension of biological factors; most notably Ovulatory Shift. I’ll delve into this in the 21 Convention talk, and I’ve covered this in Your Friend Menstruationbut Hypergamy is a sexual strategy exclusive to women. It is the behavioral manifestation complementary to women’s hormonal and biological realities. Hypergamy at its root level is about the most efficacious, pragmatic, means of women becoming fertile with the best genetic breeding opportunities, and simultaneously pairing in the long term provisioning opportunities available to a woman.

To a strictly deductive, analytical mindset Hypergamy seems a lot like a straightjacket. If you measure up, you’re golden. If you don’t, you’re fucked. This reflex is a binary either / or extreme and as such it paints Hypergamy as something insurmountable and very deterministic. I will admit, I’ve read some Red Pill guys either triumphantly or defeatedly cop to this idea about Hypergamy. What both fail to consider is women’s individual capacity to optimize Hypergamy in relative contrast to their own SMV. I’ve seen low SMV Pickup Artists pull off what to this mindset should be impossible. There is so much more to Hypergamy than just what a man’s looks presents. There are factors and circumstances that can circumvent Hypergamy, and there is nothing deterministic about it. Yes, Hypergamy is often ruthless, but resigning oneself to binary extremes about it gets men nowhere.

Hypergamy is only defined as “marrying upward”
This is a pedantic dismissal of a phenomenon based on semantics. Yes, the original term was developed to describe women’s “tendency to marry upwardly into higher socioeconomic strata” by sociologists, but the term deserves a much broader definition in light of the biological and psychological realities we observe in women today. We could create some new term that would describe the phenomenon, but Hypergamy would describe it in the abstract just as well. Critics resorting to this dismissal only seek to discredit the one proposing an idea based on terminology.

Some women are more Hypergamous than others
This is usually trotted out by the ‘not all women are like that‘ critics, and a lot of these are, of course, women. But there are also the ‘Quality Woman‘ seekers who want to believe that their unicorn woman wouldn’t be as Hypergamous as most slutty skanks on a constant lookout for the bigger and better deal. Hypergamy in this case takes on a aspect of social conditioning and becomes a part of women’s personality.

While it is true that acculturation and learned social practices can be a buffer against Hypergamous excesses in women, it doesn’t lessen or dissolve Hypergamy’s influence in women. Just as men’s sexuality is learned to be reigned in, so too can Hypergamy be learned to be controlled. Needless to say in our post-sexual revolution era Fempowerment has effectively unfettered that buffer for women. Learning Hypergamous restraint is viewed as some male chauvinistic repression of women’s sexuality, but the truth is we are expecting women to self-police their own Hypergamy (with no real instruction). We hope that women will effectively select against their Hypergamous best interest in exercising that control, and today men pay the price for that foolishness.

All women are Hypergamous. Some have learned to curb its excesses, some live in a cultural environment that moderates it for them, but all women are Hypergamous to the same biologically inspired degree. All that changes is the context in which Hypergamy is expressed in women.

Both men and women are Hypergamous
I covered this fallacy in False Equivalencies, but to recap it briefly, Hypergamy is a sexual strategy unique to women. Women have attraction floors for men with whom they will breed and/or settle into pair bonding with. Women only consider an equal to, or better than, arrangement with regard to sexual market value of a man in contrast to (what they perceive as) their own. Men will date and have sex with women who are sometimes 2 to 3 steps below their own SMV. Hypergamy never seeks its own level; women seek an advantage in the mating game, men simply want to reproduce. This is what defines each sex’s imperatives.

Men and women are different in various facets. It is the equalist mindset that presupposes we are the same (or more alike than different) and because of this the False Equivalency argument is always the go-to response to Hypergamy in women. The equalist believes that if women are Hypergamous then men, being equals, must also be as well. Really, this is a retort intended to refocus an unflattering truth about women onto men to even the scales and make men’s pointing out Hypergamy an equal shame. This false equivalency is also used for many other unflattering truths unique to women, so don’t be fooled.

Hypergamy is overemphasized in the manosphere
I see this more and more because as women openly embrace Hypergamy in a public sphere this leads to men becoming more sensitive to their (often ugly) roles in that strategy. There’s a real want to mitigate the importance Hypergamy plays in men’s lives because most men don’t like the idea of being controlled. Which then goes back to the straightjacket notion. Men accept Hypergamy, but they refuse to see it’s larger influence on social and political dynamics. I wrote about this in The Political is Personal. It’s almost impossible not to be accused of being conspiratorial, but in a feminine-primary, gynocentric social order it is women’s interests that define what is ‘correct’ discourse.

We read all the time about how western (millennial) society has become overly PC (politically correct), but I would argue that we are overly female correct. When women are afforded unchecked power their first imperative is controlling men to accommodate the Feminine Imperative. Women’s Hypergamous interests influence and dictate legislation and political discourse. It may not be something most men want to consider. Most guys in the sphere are only focusing on women they know personally, but there is a larger social narrative that is inspired by women optimizing Hypergamy.

Hypergamy only applies to men with the best social / provisioning status
I’ve seen this one-sided perspective promoted by Dr. Jordan Peterson. The idea is that, in women’s natural beneficence, they will only be attracted to the man with the best capacity to provide for her long term security and parental investment. This idea myopically ignores the Alpha Fucks side of the Hypergamous equation. This concept is very complimentary to women and usually guys who limit their definition of Hypergamy to the inherent goodness of women also tend to think of Alpha in terms of men being pro-social, leaders of business and community. This is false on many levels, but it’s very virtue-satisfying for men who believe that they’ll eventually be rewarded by women (quality women of course) who will after time think “nothing’s sexier”. I should also say that this fallacy is very popular for Betas in Waiting.

It’s men who are responsible for Hypergamy
This is a reversal of the origins of Hypergamy, but from a socially constructed perspective. I see a lot of well meaning Red Pill moralist men trot this out as a complement to (again) their hope that women might ever find their virtuousness at all attractive. This fallacy presupposes that men are the real power distributors and the nebulous Patriarchy women complain of is something a majority of men are in someway in control of. It also reverses the origins of male dominance hierarchies. It presumes those hierarchies exist separate from the women who actually perpetuate them with their own Hypergamy and upward sexual selection.

This appeals to men who’ve bought into the ‘Man Up for the Red Pill’ ideology. Women are only as Hypergamous as men allow them to be. While there’s some truth in that in certain cultural contexts, it is women who are deciding for themselves how Hypergamous they wish to be today, and they’ve got the full force of the law and social norms to enforce their choices. While I’m all for men establishing a dominant frame that women naturally want from men, I think it’s unnecessarily self-defeating to believe that women don’t understand how their own sexual strategy works and are responsible for it.

Hypergamy means only 20% of men will ever get laid
Newsflash: Beta men can and do get laid. This is one concern that a lot of critics think is promoting self-defeat in men newly exposed to Red Pill awareness. The concern is that, again, men will become despondent because they’ll classify themselves as one of the 80% of guys who don’t get laid or women would rather not sleep with, because Hypergamy. This theme is actually carried over to a lot of these misconceptions; PUAs and Purple Pill ‘coaches’ alike are concerned that their clients will just give up and go MGTOW because that Rollo guy showed them the ugliest side of Hypergamy and they’re hopeless.

First off, nothing could be further from the truth. Second, this fallacy stupidly (binarily) ignores the individual circumstances of women at the various stages of life. Not all women can get with that guy in the 20th percentile for any number of reasons. Thirdly, the primary edict of this blog and the Red Pill in general is using this information to better a man’s life on a by-man basis. If anything, being exposed to Red Pill truths like Hypergamy should embolden men to become more than they are in a new paradigm based on Red Pill truth rather than Blue Pill false hope – hope that, unfortunately, a lot of Purple Pill coaches are selling.

Hypergamy requires trust on the part of women
No, it really doesn’t. What this premise ignores is the dual nature of Hypergamy, and trust has nothing to do with the sexual urgency a woman feels for a guy who represents a 2-3 level bump in SMV compared to her own while she’s in the proliferative phase of her menstrual cycle. Trust, rapport and comfort are post-orgasm feelings. These are reserved for the Beta Provisioning side of Hypergamy and ones women usually associate with their luteal phase of menstruation. This is why the Betas women trust are the first guys they call to cry to about the guy they fucked who had no trust prerequisite. This fallacy is just stupid, but it does illustrate the Hypergamous process from both sides.

Men should stay ignorant of Hypergamy for their own good
This again goes back to the idea that men (usually Blue Pill Beta men) who know too much about the visceral aspects of Hypergamy will naturally become despondent and go MGTOW or worse, kill themselves in the thinking that they’ll never measure up. If you’re at all familiar with my writing you’ll know that I think the only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance. As I’ve said many times, the truth will set you free, but it doesn’t make it pretty. It also doesn’t absolve a man of the responsibility that comes along with that truth. I get that guys are hopeful that they can find a magic formula that’ll get them their dream girls without much effort. Telling them that’s not gonna work for them makes them hopeless because they still cling to Blue Pill ideals being resolved with Red Pill truths.

This is where guys get the notion of ‘leagues‘ and that they don’t qualify for certain women because they’re out of their league. As I stated earlier a lot of the “keep the guys in the dark” notion is really a misguided way of supposedly helping a guy become something more by keeping him ignorant.

Hypergamy give women an “out” for bad, evil treatment of men
This is a play on the personal responsibility trope. I covered this in Our Sisters’ Keeper. It really comes down to the capacity men believe women have or don’t have with regard to their personal agency. This returns us to the question of women’s Hypoagency:

Hypoagency – the idea that certain individuals (e.g. women) lack agency in their own actions.They lack control. They are not actors … rather, they are acted upon. The corollary to that argument being that they are not responsible for their own actions. Yet the cultural narrative of the omni-empowered, Strong Independent Woman® is completely at odds with exactly women’s hypoagency with regard to rape. They are powerful and purposeful when it serves and entirely unaccountable and blameless when it’s not convenient.

There was a time when the book The Selfish Gene was being bandied around the manosphere and the concern was men might use the premises of the selfish gene to absolve them of cheating on their girlfriends or used as an excuse to pursue one woman after the other. They couldn’t help it, it was written into their DNA. The same argument is now used by (mainly moralist) men who promote the reverse of the idea that men are responsible for Hypergamy. Thus, women being acted upon by a Hypergamy that’s written into their DNA can use it as an excuse for the worst behavior and ugliest results imaginable to men. The logic then follows that women are either active agents and have moral agency or they lack that agency and need men to provide the self-control women are incapable of.

Personally, I believe its a combination of the two; women do have agency for which they should be responsible and accountable for, but also, men need to provide a confident dominant frame under which women want to submit and be associated with. It is not men’s fault that women are Hypergamous, but if there is to be a healthy control of it for the best interests of both men and women, men must understand it and master it. I would say the same of men’s own sexuality and sexual expression – however, we are already overwhelmingly held accountable for not mastering it.

Women aren’t slaves to Hypergamy
This is one more question of women’s agency. Just as hypoagency and the biological element of Hypergamy can be used to socially absolve women of the responsibilities of it, so too can women’s awareness of their own Hypergamy be another way to excuse bad behavior. Again, it’s about personal responsibility. I’ve never stated that women are “slaves” to Hypergamy. I have explored women’s conscious awareness of their behaviors being influenced by their innate Hypergamy. Most women don’t realize they are giving a guy a shit test, it’s part of their limbic subroutines. Most women don’t consciously plan their girls’ night out around the proliferative phase of their menstrual cycle. They largely do, but they don’t realize the coordination. Women aren’t slaves to Hypergamy, but they aren’t immune to its subconscious influence, and this applies to your “good girl”, your trad-con “Red Pill” woman and your “Quality Woman”.

Women are Hypergamous, men are hypogamous
Here we have another attempt to confirm a false equivalency in the hopes that some egalitarian balance might be found between men and women. I’ve heard Purple Pill men trot this one out occasionally: Hypogamy is the idea that men must marry down, or the increasing tendency for women to marry down in the face of men’s socioeconomic status being less than that of women’s. The salient point is that there is no biological element in men that would suggest anything about men opting for hypogamy. This is simply another effort to balance Hypergamy for an egalitarian mindset. I’m not suggesting hypogamy isn’t a thing, just that it’s a sociological phenomenon. Mens biological imperative is unlimited access to unlimited sexuality, and this we can see manifested in their own behavior. Men don’t seek out hypogamous circumstances as a point of their imperative. Sometimes that may be the result, but again this is an extrinsic circumstance not an evolved drive.

Hypergamy should end after marriage
Oh man, wouldn’t that be nice? Actually no, it would put men and women into a state of personal stagnation. While I try never to deal in “should be” I do recognize that there are still guys who still believe that all the anxiety they felt in their dating years should fade to unconditional comfort after they get married. This is false for many reasons, but then there is the extreme reversal of this; “Aww man if I’m not the highest apex Alpha in my wife’s world she’ll cheat on me with him as soon as her proliferative phase comes around.”

Some critics like to overplay this stupid binary to prove that “women are people too” and Hypergamy isn’t even a thing for them once they’ve settled in with a great guy like you. Hypergamy is alway in effect for women by order of degree; marriage is no insulation from the sexual market place, you fool yourself in ever getting comfortable (or vulnerable). Guys who buy into this fallacy are usually equalists who believe their Burden of Performance ended when they said “I do”.

Now, that said, it’s not all gloom and doom. If you’ve established a strong dominant frame prior to marriage Hypergamy actually works in your favor. The same studies that showed women in unsatisfying LTRs or marriages sought out extra-pair sex with more masculine men also showed that women in satisfying relationships were more sexually proceptive (horny) for the men they were paired with when in their prime ovulatory phase.

Hypergamy is only about Alpha Fucks
Another type of critic likes to overplay the importance of looks and Alpha dominance in the Hypergamous equation. I’m of the opinion that looks and confident dominance (bordering on cocky arrogance) stimulates tingles in the most natural visceral way, but that’s not the entirety of the Hypergamous equation. As most PUAs will belabor, looks without congruence in behavior can actually be anti-seductive. Looks will cover a multitude of Game sins, but Game and generating an emotional impact in a woman is always the keystone. There are two sides to Hypergamy, Alpha Fucks and Beta Bucks. In today’s world women’s primary focus is on the Alpha Fucks side of the equation, but it doesn’t mean the Beta Bucks provisioning side has been erased.

Hypergamy isn’t so important, you’re overstating things
I get this from Purple Pill guys, PUAs and women – guys who obsess over Hypergamy are reactionary losers. And to them I’ll once again point out the  story of Daniella Greene, the FBI translator who left her military husband to marry the very ISIS fighter she’d been tasked to investigate. Watch the video at this link and then think about how many Red Pill truths this story confirms. Think about the far greater scope and importance an understanding of Red Pill intersexual dynamics and how Hypergamy factors into what was an international incident that threatened national security. Are we just going to say “well, bitches be crazy, she must be damaged” or do we see the mechanics behind her actions with a Red Pill Lens? This is only one example of the scope of the importance a developed Red Pill awareness should mean to men.

Look at the significance to which Hypergamy influences everything from divorce laws to child custody to even abortion. Hypergamy is a much larger dynamic than most men really want to digest. It’s not being reactionary to see the forest for the trees here.

You pronounce Hyper-gamee wrong, thus you are uneducated and your information is flawed.
Ok, you got me, disregard everything on this blog then.

4.7 11 votes
Article Rating

Published by Rollo Tomassi

Author of The Rational Male and The Rational Male, Preventive Medicine

Speak your mind

518 Comments
Inline Feedbacks
View all comments
Markos Beers
Markos Beers
4 years ago

@ all [Stefan Molyneux falls under the ‘Hypergamy is only about Beta Bucks long term provisioning / parental investment’ fallacy.] I don’t think it’s a complete fallacy. Humans want to bang, men and women both. Women get tingles and guys get hard. So that’s covered. What women need much more is safety and security (themselves, kids, community, etc) In fact, much of what makes women so different is their own fear. They are wired to see danger where none exists, and have developed more social networks to assuage fear and increase safety and security. Men achieve safety and security through… Read more »

Roused
4 years ago

But today, a basic undergraduate lecture, done as it used to be done before the post-modern, cultural Marxist wingnuts stuck their noses into everything, appears revolutionary to his younger audience.

You’re so mean KFG. Those cultural Marxists have feelings you know.

http://sheikyermami.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/02/truth-700×357.jpg

M Simon
4 years ago

Mineter
January 17, 2018 at 4:37 am

Well. I’m teaching the LTR. And it is working. “Think of me with another woman. See how that excites you?”

Would I recommend teaching? No. It probably isn’t worth the trouble. But I wanted to see if it could be done. A 43 year process so far. LOL.

I was inspired by my first GF who was very self aware when it came to what turned her on.

M Simon
4 years ago

Mineter
January 17, 2018 at 4:56 am

The LTR married a “bad boy”. Me. Fortunately I had a few other qualities that made it work. I like electronics. I self-taught my way into aerospace engineer.

Not your usual bad boy. I got my bad boy chops by spending 3 years with an outlaw MC gang. Then decided to pursue other interests.

marelius
4 years ago

@Simon – Men test ideas. Women test men.

GOLD! Of course this implies that until we can train all men into the nature of shit tests and how to routinely pass them, we are in for a long and tedious battle with the FI

scribblerg
scribblerg
4 years ago

@M.Simon – “They really don’t want to know that your continual interest in other women excites them.” I constantly let the HB9 know i want to fuck her friends, girls on random videos etc. She castigates me for it but also respects me for it. This just developed naturally for me, as I do want to fuck her friends. It’s part of my Red Pill growth, owning my sexual desires and not being ashamed of them. It’s so interesting how this grinds her gears though, I can see them spinning away…

O.B.I.T.
O.B.I.T.
4 years ago

@Mineter
re teaching your daughters
Is there any positive sweet spot to be found somewhere between those two grim outcomes?


“It’s really uplifting if you take the message as positive”
I feel much more positive since reading TRM. I just came in from shoveling snow and actually thought, “Hey, at least it probably helps boost the ol’ T-count.”

rugby11
rugby11
4 years ago

“owning my sexual desires and not being ashamed of them. ”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jOP6dl9ewpU

“Men test ideas. Women test men.”

Lost Patrol
Lost Patrol
4 years ago

British ex-wife of senior US ISIS fighter stuns Piers Morgan by admitting she still loves the jihadist and he ‘has a good side’ during tense TV interview

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5278591/UK-ex-wife-ISIS-member-says-loves-him.html

dr zipper
dr zipper
4 years ago

lp – in the the article, she doesn’t seem that whacked…. bit of an alpha widow maybe, but other than that all I read were clear-headed responses to a couple of ratings-chasers trying for sensationalism

did I miss something?

status confirmed
status confirmed
4 years ago

@William Ward “I read The Rational Male. The red pill is depressing to say the least, but no more so than the feeling that something was seriously wrong with dating. What you have to say makes so much sense. I hope Preventive Medicine is less depressing and has some kind of a solution. I get the feeling that you don’t see a solution.” I first discovered Rational Male in April of last year. My reaction was much like yours, and I’ve read it’s common. Initially, it sucks to face the reality of all this. On some level I “knew” most… Read more »

M Simon
4 years ago

Re: women live in fear. (from up thread). It is true. What calms them? Having a protector. An Alpha protector. HE has to be willing to fight to be fully qualified. My specialty in that area was seeing trouble far enough in advance to be able to steer around it. OTOH – if it came down to it I was willing to fight. So right off the bat roughly 60% to 80% of women will never have that kind of protection (or it won’t last long, NEXT). So how do you make them feel secure? Empire works (for the Emperor… Read more »

Fred Flange, GBFC (Great Books For Cucks)
Fred Flange, GBFC (Great Books For Cucks)
4 years ago

I’ve stayed out of this until now – had nothing smart to say. The Usual Suspect commentariat are carrying the weight ably. Here is a splash of water in the face. http://jameelajamil.co.uk/post/169720263620/what-we-need-to-learn-from-the-aziz-ansari Legislated hypergamy is pulling out (!) of the station and is on its way. To those of you who think unplugging is too painful, that you can just go back to sleep: You can’t go back. You will eat or be eaten in this new SMP. Sit back and smoke dope, think you can take it easy, this will shiv you in the back while you’re reloading the… Read more »

Lost Patrol
Lost Patrol
4 years ago

dr. z

did I miss something?

I don’t think so. I saw what you did. I stumbled on the article and it made me think of the hypergamy post and where alpha widows fit in. How does a woman like that replace, or scale up from joe the killer who can be further romanticized by virtue of time and distance?

Maybe it’s a non sequitur here but at the moment I saw it it seemed relevant.

gregg
gregg
4 years ago

There is another problem with “hypergamy”. It is in the core of its definition – that women seek men of “better quality” then themselves. Again we are projecting our values and applying wishful thinking. This is giving a sense to us – when I am in a good shape, have a lot of money, good status, great looks, leader or men – its only logical that I am, ehm “alpha” and all women should want me. What women are programmed and drawn to in men is evolved sexuality and high T level. The more primitive, animalistic and energetic, the better.… Read more »

rugby11
rugby11
4 years ago

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aMcjxSThD54
“Women do not seek the better quality of men than themselves just the opposite. Majority of beta men already ARE better quality then women. Women are drawn to sex obsessed men with high T level. Aggressive, primitive, sex-obsessed. Should the guy have psychopatic traits in addition, he is irressistible to women. Therefore young educated betas from good families mimick “dark triads” ..traits of loosers from the streets from low level families. At lest they are able to see what works.”

O.B.I.T.
O.B.I.T.
4 years ago

Alphas in prison … Don’t forget the pathetic Joyce Mitchell, the upstate NY prison employee who helped those two murderers escape in 2015, out of “love.” She wisely decided at the last minute not to flee with them, or she’d certainly be dead today.

I attended some of Ted Bundy’s trial, around 1980 I think. Killed 30 women but still was drawing the adoration of many more.

ItalyMich
ItalyMich
4 years ago

1) Someone is initiated INTO a subject (not IN, as you wrote) 2) “I think it’s unnecessarily self-defeating to believe that women don’t understand how their own sexual strategy works and are responsible for it.” Women are by a standard deviation more susceptible to societal programming than men are. This means that, while they still are at the root biological organisms following the pertaining laws, they have a much stronger need to disassociate their consciousness from their deep drives (and real wants). A much strong need to rationalize (away) their real self. So when you say “women do know about… Read more »

kfg
kfg
4 years ago

“Are those men “better” quality than models they are banging? ”

Yes.

ItalyMich
ItalyMich
4 years ago

@Novaseeker One of the realistic ways to “adapt” may be to leave the playbattlefield, and go the hermit’s way. To use women as they want to be used (their nature wants them to be used, I should say). To still strive to make a long term monogamy work — knowing that, societal constraints lacking, it will be as stable as the woman’s mind, that no relationship can last a sizable lapse of time without hiding your mind on a set of topics and lying to a degree, and so on and so on. I agree with your comment, but you… Read more »

Blaximus
4 years ago

Gregg Your premise is wrong, so your conclusions are misguided. Your money, good looks, education, none of it will ever equate automatically to alpha. You’re making a very common mistake. A man not being ” sexual enough ” is not a mark of sophistication, it’s a problem. Being ” primitive ( lmao), animalistic and whatnot ” is also misunderstanding the mechanics in favor of the extremes. Men can’t reliability discern whether or not they are ” better ” than women. In order to do that would be to assume women and men are the same and you’re trying to parse… Read more »

Sentient
Sentient
4 years ago

Ted could rock a turtleneck…

http://www.thecrimemag.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/why-ted-bundy-killed.jpg

comment image

comment image

comment image

It’s cold out there…

Incubus_Rising
Incubus_Rising
4 years ago

@Gregg: Good points there. This is what I observe too. Everybody tries to define Alpha according to the traits they possess (and exclude the ones they don’t). The God Particle that makes Alpha is high T (natural, not injected) from birth and maintained over time.

“Aggressive, primitive, sex-obsessed” … you got that right.

There is lot to write, but I got to run to the gym. Got to keep that damn T as high as I can.

Laters

Blaximus
4 years ago

Forrest, trees.

… Sigh

Blaximus
4 years ago

When men believe a healthy, natural male sex drive is ” primitive “, the FI will have truly won.

Don’t sophisticate yourself right out of existence.

Blaximus
4 years ago

BURN THE DICTIONARIES!!!!!!! DILLY DILLY!!!!

😀

theasdgamer
4 years ago

Everybody tries to define Alpha according to the traits they possess You know, I always used to question whether I was alpha…I’d even argue a bit with Deti that I wasn’t alpha over on “Just Four Guys” blog (now defunct). He’d say that having finger banged around 15 girls over the years made me alpha even tho I only actually banged two. Those almost all involved isolation and same day/night cold approach. And at least three girls have either begged me for sex (while she was naked) or argued for sex with me (while sitting in my truck). I’ve been… Read more »

Blaximus
4 years ago

ASD My ” notch ” count happens to be stratospheric, but I’m not real big on that being a definer of whether a man is alpha or not. All kinds of men band all kinds of women all the time. Some folks are fuxking by the billions right now. Alpha is a mindset. Imo, a man can be a virgin and still be ” alpha “. That’d drive women completely insane. I’ve heard it said lots of time that alphas bang tons of chicks I only think that’s the case if it’s what that individual chose to do. That alone… Read more »

EhIntellect
EhIntellect
4 years ago

Hypergamy theory understanding is critical to LTR success. You must be be her best option AT ALL TIMES.

Perfectly optimized hypergamy = ride or die girl.

I owe a debt of gratitude to Sentient for this concept, how it’s done, what’s at stake if you go this route.

May all your LTR’s be ride or die.

CSI
CSI
4 years ago

Anyone seen 2000s UK series “Shameless” or its US remake? The lead character in both series, Frank Gallagher, is a natural Alpha. He’s a severe alcoholic, compulsive liar, petty criminal and con artist, but he’s strongly attractive to women, and that’s the main definition of what “alpha” is.

theasdgamer
4 years ago

Blax, what is your self-improvement project currently? Just curious.

j
j
4 years ago

“a man can be a virgin and still be ” alpha “”

http://i.imgur.com/4zmAHSC.gif

EhIntellect
EhIntellect
4 years ago

“…both men and women are Hypergamous” I’d been thinking about to this IRT children and how since 1963 college admissions changed from a nepotism/legacy/wealth admission policy to IQ testing policy. THIS ISN’T A IQ VALUE COMMENT. Ahem. There’s a 50 year clustering of high IQ people in university students that before 1963 wasn’t seen. Theretofore, smart, successful BB guys would choose from the girls available in their town dumb or smart. They didn’t have a choice of the smartest girls within the greater region until our culture went all test taking admissions requirement nutso. By statistics alone increased education =… Read more »

Blaximus
4 years ago

@ j

And yet it’s true.😁

j
j
4 years ago

Virgin Tim Tebow ‘chooses’ not to bang his hot girlfriend, so according to Blax, that makes him alpha:

http://thebiglead.com/2015/11/29/tim-tebow-allegedly-dumped-because-he-wouldnt-have-sex-with-girlfriend/

lol

EhIntellect
EhIntellect
4 years ago

Oh and guys want smart kids too, so why not fuck the prettiest smart girl combo one can find? There’s a female AF/BB balance (if that’s possible) men desire too…not to the extent of the ladies…it’s not all HB. Is it? Ask ASD. I believe his wife is beautiful but her well behavior isn’t all learned. He values her genetic potential beyond her looks. Right? That’s what I’ve been reading… She’s gotta be a quick learner to learn quick. Example: women would rather choose a self+made success than a lottery winner. I believe, given the choice, all things equal…or even… Read more »

Blaximus
4 years ago

J don’t do a hank impression. That’s not what I said at all.

EhIntellect
EhIntellect
4 years ago

Suicide watch:

http://abcnews.go.com/US/washington-state-quarterback-tyler-hilinski-found-dead-apparent/story?id=52404164

Why is this guy killing himself?

No one’s talking beyond the phony “Our hearts and prayers…” pat press release.

Well sexed guys don’t do what he did.

j
j
4 years ago

@palmasailor

on the field sure. dude was alpha. leadership skills, motivated, passionate, fierce competitor:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-qodBTlMtA

but off the field…well:

EhIntellect
EhIntellect
4 years ago

Hank impression

Playa dawg.

http://www.dogsinduds.com/pictures/pimp-and-hoes.jpg

j
j
4 years ago

@blax

Hey I’m just saying I’ve never heard of/met an alpha dude who was still a virgin (someone who hasn’t lost his virginity past 25 years of age).

Blaximus
4 years ago

@ ASD My current self improvement project is to turn back my aging clock. Well, no not really. I began experiencing problems from decades of lifting way too much weight and spending too much time hammering the heavy bag with everything I could possibly throw at it. I was rewarded for my stupidity, in my 50’s, with a bad shoulder that may or may not require surgery, and as of a year ago, creaky knees. So my project has been to adopt a different training philosophy, drop 40 pounds ( shrinking some of the muscle imbalances ) and attempt to… Read more »

boulderhead
4 years ago

j, the way this works is if you do without for 30days you are a born again virgin with experience.

Blaximus
4 years ago

My mind’s not made up about Tebow being alpha or not. I detect a lot of Wonder bread softness in him.

Tebow is an excellent football player. He’s one of the worst quarterbacks I’ve ever seen on a field. But he insisted he wouldn’t change position, so he’s out of the league.

I don’t get the whole ” saving myself ” thing, but it’s his life and his choice.

hank holiday
hank holiday
4 years ago

“a man can be a virgin and still be ” alpha “”

comment image

Not many guys like that in the past few hundred years though lol

SJF
SJF
4 years ago

“My mind’s not made up about Tebow being alpha or not. I detect a lot of Wonder bread softness in him.”

Sucking down a whole container of Blue Pills will do that do you. Faith based abstinence and maintaining virginity until marriage and all. That’s just straight up feminine. Not a very workable ideology for a man.

Radium
Radium
4 years ago

I think there might be a component of hypergamy that is not often explored. The standard definition of hypergamy appears to be women marrying up. When you look closer, you see that it is women attempting to get the very best genes during their peak fertility and then attempting to get the very best previsioning the remaining time during her fertility cycle. I know everyone here understands this. Of course, this creates an inherent instability in any intimate relationship with a woman, which is likely why lesbian relationships are so unstable. [Actually, lesbians couples have the highest instances of domestic… Read more »

Novaseeker
Novaseeker
4 years ago

I don’t get the whole ” saving myself ” thing, but it’s his life and his choice.

Tebow? He’s an evangelical Christian, so that’s his deal. His problems with women are related directly to that — he wants a top shelf woman (HB9 and above) but he wants to act like a fringe outlier sexually. No can do, man. Not in 2018. You can do one or the other but not both. So … stuck. Oh well, that’s his problem, not ours.

The Solitary Silver FoX
The Solitary Silver FoX
4 years ago

Check out this feminist apologist James Muldoon white knighting in this article. He really needs a good reality check, like all pathetic manginas do. He pretty much blames men for women’s sexual strategy fuck ups. Another dangerous symp lecturer, shaming our young men. He should be named and shamed himself, as a traitor to men and masculinity… “The recent shift in public opinion on these issues is a welcome change. Now it is time for men to start modelling positive forms of behaviour rather than being dragged through these processes kicking and screaming. With the term “male feminist” in almost… Read more »

The Solitary Silver FoX
The Solitary Silver FoX
4 years ago

Rollo, it would be great if you could set up hyperlinks which also open on a new tab…

Sentient
Sentient
4 years ago

J Hey I’m just saying I’ve never heard of/met an alpha dude who was still a virgin LOL. Hang out with some 14 year olds… Ya know all those “natural” alphas the sphere is consumed with? None were born with an N+1. Blax Alpha is a mindset. While this may be true [jury out], a mindset can only be revealed through actions. By actions ye are judged. Women will fall for a sexy mindset, if it is backed by actions. Passing shit test/fitness tests are demonstrable responses/actions. Shame Tebow was discriminated against, if he were 50 shades darker, there would… Read more »

The Solitary Silver FoX
The Solitary Silver FoX
4 years ago
The Solitary Silver FoX
The Solitary Silver FoX
4 years ago

Above pic is of horrid Aussie man-hater Clementine Ford. Isn’t it amazing that the uglier the harridan, the more misandrist they are…

http://www.theage.com.au/lifestyle/news-and-views/were-asking-the-wrong-questions-about-aziz-ansari-20180116-h0jdcl.html

Mineter
Mineter
4 years ago

@OBIT I have been pondering your sweet spot question all morning. We can observe that half of marriages don’t dissolve. I don’t have stats to hand, but there must be a significant minority where one of both spouses aren’t still together in silent desperation (which is the third depressing option to present to teenage daughters). I think Rollo has spoken at length about being an Alpha with a side of Beta and vice versa. A girl can try her luck finding a bad boy who has earning potential who she thinks she can reform, or find the cockiest, sexiest nerd… Read more »

theasdgamer
4 years ago

lolo jones is smokin’ and an outspoken virgin.

SJF
SJF
4 years ago

Tim Tebow down on bended knee. Doesn’t make sense.

He has choices presented to him.

DPA. Can’t pull the trigger. Can’t flip the switch.

Holds out.

Why?

comment image

Sentient
Sentient
4 years ago
j
j
4 years ago

@Sentient

“LOL. Hang out with some 14 year olds… Ya know all those “natural” alphas the sphere is consumed with? None were born with an N+1.”

Ya those naturals all ended up losing their v card soon thereafter. Blax said, ““a man can be a virgin and still be ” alpha “”” So I’m talking about dudes that are still virgins post college experience…I’ve never met or heard of a 25, 35, 40 year old virgin (lol) alpha male.

Sentient
Sentient
4 years ago

J

Ya those naturals all ended up losing their v card soon thereafter.

Presumption. Would you believe 24? 22? 20? Where is the line?

Rare I’ll grant, but structurally very possible.

cheupez
4 years ago

Women cant help themselves. They cant seem to get what is best for them. She has a “low life” living in her lousy apartment while she screws a “high life” in five star hotels. But the “low life” that the woman pays to fuck soon gets ditched when the “high life” gets the wind of it and disappears from picture. One for tingles, the other for cash, one for quick time knock me up, the other for give me the money to feed this “low life” brood with.

j
j
4 years ago

@Sentient

if you haven’t lost your virginity by 25 you can not be alpha. Fuck, i’m not even alpha yet (lesser alpha according to CH https://heartiste.wordpress.com/2007/09/19/defining-the-alpha-male/)

Sentient
Sentient
4 years ago

with all these virgins or abstinent guys (Russell Wilson, Rivers Coumo, Tom Cruise) it’s either they are looking for a wife and divorce is an issue, so search search search or they are taking a break to focus on a bigger issue in their life. Not pussy beggars, not enslaved to the cooch…

Not saying I’d do it… But this alone is not alpha criteria.

Sentient
Sentient
4 years ago

j

So 24 and 2/3rds is beta?

j
j
4 years ago

lol

Blaximus
4 years ago

How much sex a guy gets is only one manner of measure regarding alpha. Remember, betas bang every day. Majority rules, and all that.

EhIntellect
EhIntellect
4 years ago

“My target is just to get below 200.”

A good BM should do.

theasdgamer
4 years ago

B-lax

then re-lax

SJF
SJF
4 years ago

I don’t watch TV much, but when I do I like it to be red pill.

New series on Fox called 911 might fit the bill.

And drama enough for the gf or wife. Real drama. Not just melodrama.

Markos Beers
Markos Beers
4 years ago

@Radium You said “I see the influence young women have over both men and women as part of hypergamy. When you look at the psychology of a fertile young woman, it is that of a princess. She seeks the admiration (aka resource redistribution and protection) of both powerful men and women. This is where I think gynocentrism originates. Both men and women default to the needs of young fertile women. Men appear to be white knights and women appear to have an in group preference. Both of which are true, but there is a common origin of both.” I like… Read more »

theasdgamer
4 years ago

As I pointed out over on heartiste’s site, many hunter-gatherer groups don’t participate in gynocentrism. They tend to kill/not support juvenile females, up to 40% of them. I think that gynocentrism has its origins in western civ, maybe in chivalry.

kfg
kfg
4 years ago

It’s babies all the way down for turtles as well, only turtles have the advantage that they’re not smart enough to think their way into extinction.

rugby11
rugby11
4 years ago

“One can be so… anti-law-of-the-jungle in nature, and anti-trade, that the best choice for his health be retire from the game altogether (and invest in friendship bonds with other males, if he’s the social skills to).” https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W6WDYpEewrI “Hypergamy theory understanding is critical to LTR success. You must be be her best option AT ALL TIMES.” Their is no rest in being a man… Only repose… “Example: women would rather choose a self+made success than a lottery winner. I believe, given the choice, all things equal…or even she’s a little uglier…he’d chose a LTR mate with better smarts, emotional compatibility for… Read more »

The Solitary Silver FoX
The Solitary Silver FoX
4 years ago

If in any doubt of what Alpha is, here is an example of pure, unadulterated Alpha, though a touch on the psychotic side…

http://123movies.ms/movies/bronson/#option-1

rugby11
rugby11
4 years ago
cheupez
4 years ago

Most of the time when the term alpha is being usedn it is to describe a male that doesn’t know it applies to them. Alpha is not aware until something is pionted out to it and then when alpha looks back at its life it identifies with a pattern that suggests that it may be a victim. I think most alphas would be opposed to the insinuation because when you look at much of what alpha is like, not many want to be it. A lot of what alpha is can be misconstrued to be an insult. And to be… Read more »

Yollo Comanche
Yollo Comanche
4 years ago

The problem with “Alpha” is that people who seek to become it, seek it thinking it will help them procure the ego-stroking and validation that they needed in their developing years. NEEDED mind you. You don’t grow up right without mommy and daddy telling you they loved you and you believing it and FEELING it. So while the deprived schmucks fight for a better position, society never gets the wise leadership it needs to whether the storm of resisting the people who want to destroy the people who put their belief in you to make the next leg of the… Read more »

Yollo Comanche
Yollo Comanche
4 years ago

@cheupez

“Better to reign in Hell than serve in Heaven”

rugby11
rugby11
4 years ago

“I reckon you can be Alpha and gay though” Jack donovan “Most of the time when the term alpha is being usedn it is to describe a male that doesn’t know it applies to them. Alpha is not aware until something is pionted out to it and then when alpha looks back at its life it identifies with a pattern that suggests that it may be a victim. I think most alphas would be opposed to the insinuation because when you look at much of what alpha is like, not many want to be it. A lot of what alpha… Read more »

rugby11
rugby11
4 years ago

This is incredible and really cool…
https://dpo.tothestarsacademy.com/
“You must be determined to make the decision every time. The counter to it is also that the masturbation is not bad. Its the shame thats bad. If you fail at your mission, there is not shame in that. It doesnt invalidate your efforts. You must just get back up and keep moving forward. Winning a war means winning many battles”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Co6eDUAi2OQ

DisgruntledEarthling
DisgruntledEarthling
4 years ago

Interesting:
http://www.breitbart.com/london/2018/01/17/youve-got-me-feminist-cathy-newman-crumbles-in-channel-4-interview-with-controversial-prof-jordan-peterson/

That Cathy Newman interviewer – is that what passes for journalism these days? What an awful human being she is.

Not Born This Morning
4 years ago

We are each a compilation of our experiences as well as our biology. Most tend to experience (observe without bias) little else. We observe existential external phenomena but our observations are through the lens of our individual constitution. Because of this, we all risk being at least a little solipsistic. For this reason, it is nearly impossible for any writer or “thinker” (i.e. self described “dot connector”) to formulate ideas without, to some extent, projecting himself or herself into the formulation. Consequently, the results expressed typically tend to be reinforcements of and reconciliations for personal experience rather than revelations of… Read more »

Not Born This Morning
4 years ago

A man who cannot tolerate hearing anything other than his own voice, lives in a prison built by himself as its walls echo his voice.

kfg
kfg
4 years ago

@NBTM:

Gregg, who isn’t a regular commenter but is no newbie here, was the playing the backspin game:

“I’m not Alpha, but that just proves the laws of physics are wrong and women are evil, because, by my standards, I ought to be the real Alpha.”

rugby11
rugby11
4 years ago

http://jonathansoma.com/singles/images/20-29-relative.png “We are each a compilation of our experiences as well as our biology. Most tend to experience (observe without bias) little else. We observe existential external phenomena but our observations are through the lens of our individual constitution. Because of this, we all risk being at least a little solipsistic. For this reason, it is nearly impossible for any writer or “thinker” (i.e. self described “dot connector”) to formulate ideas without, to some extent, projecting himself or herself into the formulation. Consequently, the results expressed typically tend to be reinforcements of and reconciliations for personal experience rather than revelations… Read more »

O.B.I.T.
O.B.I.T.
4 years ago

@DIsgruntled Earthling
“Is this what passes for journalism these days?”
You betcha, that’s what I’ve been trying to say as a refugee from the smoking ruins. And the feminization of the industry is a big reason why. (Sounds like JP is winning a lot of new fans with this vid, at least)

Meanwhile, USA Today has a fawning advance story for the upcoming Pussyhat March II. With not a hint that many women and most men are not on board this clownshow.

kfg
kfg
4 years ago

He’s begun to take some criticism for it, and I understand why, but Jordan Peterson has become Jordan Peterson(tm). His “brand” is now pulling in more money than his professor’s salary.

The harder they push against him now, the stronger he becomes. He isn’t just cashing in on his notoriety, he’s made himself extremely anti-fragile, even to the point of developing alternative teaching outlets should he be given the sack (with an ultimate goal of giving universities themselves the sack).

I expect you’re going to see him taking the brakes off.

Markos Beers
Markos Beers
4 years ago

Jordan Peterson has jumped the shark. He was big before, yet this interview with Newman was some of the greatest PR out there.

The biggest reason? Execution of Amused Mastery re: emotional control, knowledge, precision, humor. A very good performance, all in all.

O.B.I.T.
O.B.I.T.
4 years ago

Just so there’s no misunderstanding, “Jumped the shark” is when something becomes too ridiculous to take seriously anymore. WIth JP I think you mean that he’s burst into the mainstream consciousness or something like that.

dr zipper
dr zipper
4 years ago

loved the JP interview and noted some highlights starting here (don’t want to re-post the same shit):

https://therationalmale.com/2018/01/10/dangerous-times-part-3/comment-page-7/#comment-235317

I will use his performance as my go-to whenever in need of an exemplar

dr zipper
dr zipper
4 years ago

although my son has heard of “jump the shark” and sorta knew what it meant, I had to show him this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WvGopsM1G9g

along with about a 15 min primer on Happy Days, Ron Howard, ChaChi, the Fonz, etc.; it also helped with him understand some Simpson’s references and knowing that Mrs. Cunningham (Marion Ross) is the voice of Spongebob’s grandmother

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
4 years ago

That Cathy Newman interviewer – is that what passes for journalism these days?

Yeah, where “these days” means “for the last 30+ years” of course. Peterson could no way buy advertising as good as that interview. This has to increase his book sales not just in the US but the rest of the Anglosphere.

@Markos
That is not even close to what “jumped the shark” means.

DisgruntledEarthling
DisgruntledEarthling
4 years ago

The biggest reason? Execution of Amused Mastery re: emotional control, knowledge, precision, humor. A very good performance, all in all.

Agreed. I was impressed by this display and also by his previous displays of AM and sticking to the facts. He also maintains frame by patiently stating “No, that’s not what I said” and re-iterating the facts. Refusing to be bulldozed.

I suspect he’s been coached somehow on this particular inquisitor. He handled her smoothly and didn’t need to do it in Spanish

kfg
kfg
4 years ago

Peterson is still standing today because he wasn’t the sort to toe the line and didn’t fold with the first attack. He has been under constant attack ever since, and I mean constant (he’s not just a university professor, he’s a university professor in Toronto). He is an observant psychologist and has been coached by every attack he has survived, and as I mentioned upthread was a top class lecturer before the shit hit the fan.

pigglywiggly99
pigglywiggly99
4 years ago

Could you elaborate on the FBI lady running away with the ISIS person in our context?

cheupez
4 years ago

kudos O.B.I.T

O.B.I.T.
O.B.I.T.
4 years ago

Right, for my treasure trove of useless trivia. Actually kudos belong to everyone who does the heavy lifting here at TRM.
(I love old-fashioned words like “kudos,” by the way)

Sentient
Sentient
4 years ago

pigglywiggly99

Could you elaborate on the FBI lady running away with the ISIS person in our context?

True Lies…

518
0
Would love your thoughts, please comment.x
()
x
%d bloggers like this: