A Woman’s Prerogative

prerogative

“A woman talks to one man, looks at a second, and thinks of a third.” – Niti Sataka

Reader/Blogger Ian Ironwood had a really on-point comment about last week’s piece that I’d already considered for the next essay to continue this series:

Excellent post, Rollo. It goes without saying that the Pill and liberalized divorce law was the first step on this path, but few appreciate its logical conclusion. Especially feminism, in the face of evolving technology. Pendulums swing both ways, and the reverse can be devastating.

In particular, your discussion of evolutionary biology/psychology and evolving technologies is spot-on. One element many men (and almost all women) do not appreciate is the social change that will erupt when Vasalgel or one of the similar products/procedures is finally authorized by the FDA. For the uninformed, Vasalgel promises ten baby-free years for a man before it breaks down, and can be removed at any point to get a woman pregnant. It works without messing with your hormones by simply shredding the sperm in the vas deferens. It costs about $1000. One time.

The social implications of this are clear: suddenly for the first time in history, a woman would have to seek a man’s permission to have a child with him. This small, subtle shift will have dramatic consequences, especially as we head into the Age of the Herbivore. When all of those egg-freezing women and their younger, more opportunistic sisters can no longer practice rampant reproductive coercion, then the social balance will shift again, and hard. Men who screw without the shredder are not to be trusted and are demonstrably irresponsible…but men with it are impervious to the traditional biological means of ensuring a commitment. Suddenly we are very much on an even playing field, and everything is back on the table. It will take the conscious will and permission of both parties to have a child, and men in that position will find themselves in a far more powerful spot than they have ever been in.

Finding a suitable father for your kid is hard enough, from a female perspective. Finding one who also sees you as a worthy enough mother for his children to make the conscious decision to remove his birth control is going to be much, much harder. And the prospect of starting all over with a new man as her biological viability evaporates is going to be . . . problematic. We’ll see a much more intense emphasis on the Epiphany phase, and a multi-layered cultural panic as competition increases among women across the board.

The cultural freakout will include more-of-the-same “where did all the good men go?” “manbaby” “dropout loser mother’s basement” frustrated criticism of men; which is why it’s important, from a cultural perspective, that there are men articulating our essential cultural position: marriage, as it stands, no longer serves our interests, and we will select only women of the highest quality to raise our children with – mindfully.

It will be interesting to see how it evolves, but I predict this one little fact alone – independent of the other sexual distractions available to modern man, from internet porn to Tindr to prostitution to robotic sex dolls – will put modern feminism and womanhood in general into a crisis. I look forward to your next few parts.

Despite what a handful of new commenters believe, I have written in the past about the dramatic cultural shift that unilaterally feminine-controlled hormonal birth control has meant to Western culture. I started this by addressing the feminine side of the birth control situation in posts like Fem-Centrism (also an important chapter in The Rational Male) because it offers and confirms for Red Pill men so many examples of how the psychological nature of women interacts with their biological natures:

Sexual Revolution

I got into a hypothetical debate with an online friend as to what it would mean to humanity (and masculinity in particular) if a new method of birth control was developed with the specific and unique ability to allow men to control conception to the same degree women were given with hormonal contraception in the mid-sixties. I thought it interesting that human effort could create reliable contraception for women in the 60’s, yet in 2011 we can map the human genome and yet not figure out how to afford men the same degree of birth control?

Put simply, the feminine imperative will not allow this.

Imagine the social and economic damage to the feminine infrastructure if Prometheus gave such fire to Men? Imagine that balance of control veering back into the masculine; for men to literally have the exclusive choice to fulfill a woman’s sexual strategy or not.

The conversation got heated. Men could never be trusted with such a power! Surely humanity would come to a grinding, apocalyptic end if the feminine sexual strategy was thwarted by reliable male contraception. Societies would be sundered, populations would nosedive, and the nuclear family would be replaced with a neo-tribalism dictated by men’s sexual strategies. Honestly, you’d think the discovery of atomic weapons was on par with such an invention.

The ridiculous, pathetic endemically juvenile and perverse masculinity that 50 years of feminization created could never be trusted to further humanity in pursuing their sex’s inborn imperatives.

Yet, this is precisely the power that was put into the hands of women in the 1960’s and remains today. The threat that male contraception represents to the feminine imperative is one of controlling the framework of which gender’s sexual strategy will be the normative. Prior to the advent of female-exclusive hormonal birth control and the sexual revolution that resulted from it, the gender playing field was level, if not tipped in favor of masculinity due to men’s provisioning being a motivating factor in women achieving their own gender imperative. Latex prophylactics were available in the 40’s, and this may have afforded men a slight advantage, but both parties knew and agreed to the terms of their sexual activity at the time of copulation.

Once feminine-exclusive birth control was convenient and available the locus of control switched to feminine primacy. Her imperative became the normalized imperative. His sexual imperative was only a means to achieving her own, and now the control was firmly placed in favor of feminine hypergamy. Whether in the developing world or in first world nations, the onus of directing the course of humanity fell upon women, and thus the feminine reality evolved into what it is today.

Freelove 2.0

It would appear that if all clinical testing goes according to hopes, Vasalgel will be this new form of unilaterally male-controlled birth control. I am, however, cautiously apprehensive about how accessible this breakthrough in male birth control will actually be. From the research I did for this piece, and coming from the usual feminist suspects, you’d think that Vasalgel would be a Godsend for sex-positive feminism. If I’m a bit skeptical it’s because the usual feminist sources are following the same shortsighted emotionalism that put them into virtually total control of the course of the human species.

Naturally, feminism would like to paint Vasalgel as some equalist responsibility for men. Almost every feminist article I read aboutVasalgel had some exasperated variation of “well, it’s about time men were given some responsibility for birth control” and then citing how difficult it was to remember to take a pill regularly. The other refrain was about how women couldn’t wait to get off the birth control hormones that made them fat, moody or just ornery, and how great it would be to have men be responsible for the convenience of their sex lives – more on that later.

But this is more than a bit facetious for women, because it only illustrates women’s (or feminist writer’s) obliviousness as to how male birth control will affect a base of power the Feminine Imperative has enjoyed for over five generations now. The fact that we’ve had female-controlled hormonal birth control, as well as legal, medically safe, abortion since the mid 60s and we’re only now developing/testing a male-controlled alternative in 2016 should speak volumes about our culture’s feminine-primary priorities.

This idea never occurs to women apparently; at least not publicly. Bear in mind all the development for Vasalgel has taken place almost entirely outside of western cultures (India being the test-bed). It could be that Vasalgel is still in its infancy with regard to a feminine-primary public awareness and women are still caught up in the hedonistically entitled mindset that only speaks to convenience in their sex lives. My guess is that not a lot of critical insight has been given as to how, as Ian and myself have explained, a feminine-primary social order would be affected by men’s far greater control of women’s Hypergamous strategies.

The ‘greater good’ of Vasalgel at this stage is all couched in the hope that it will help end unwanted pregnancies. That sounds like a progressive’s idea of a benefit to society, but at this stage what’s being overlooked is how a new technological advancement will immediately and irrevocably alter the direction of our larger culture.

I spoke to this in last week’s article. The rapid advancement of Vasalgel represents the potential of altering the direction of a social order that’s depended on the presumption of a unilateral control of Hypergamy for almost sixty years now. My guess is that once we get closer to realizing the use of Vasalgel as practical birth control for men the more resistance and legislation will be lobbied against it as the idea of what it could mean to the Feminine Imperative starts to sink in.

Her Prerogative

Now, we have to bring the implications of male-controlled birth control full circle here. There’s been a common idiom about women’s ‘right’ to choice for centuries now – a woman’s prerogative; a woman always has the right to change her mind. I actually looked up where this notion first started and it went as far back as (you guessed it) courtly love of medieval times:

Breach of promise is a common lawtort, abolished in many jurisdictions. It was also called breach of contract to marry,[1] and the remedy awarded was known as heart balm.

From at least medieval times until the early 20th century, a man’s promise of engagement to marry a woman was considered, in many jurisdictions, a legally binding contract. If the man were to subsequently change his mind, he would be said to be in “breach” of this promise and subject to litigation for damages.

The converse of this was seldom true; the concept that “it’s a woman’s prerogative to change her mind” had at least some basis in law (though a woman might pay a high social price for exercising this privilege, as explained below)—and unless an actual dowry of money or property had changed hands, a man was only rarely able to recover in a “breach of promise” suit against a woman, were he even allowed to file one.

This is another one of those old books ideas that women playing by the new books of modern times still clung to even after the Sexual Revolution. An important part of men’s Blue Pill Beta conditioning is to always defer to a woman’s judgement and choices no matter how duplicitous they may initially appear. Part of the old books social contract was based on a pre-understanding about what was at stake were a man and woman to come together, have sex and potentially bring a child into the world. Prior to the advent of birth control both sexes were on relatively equal presumptions of risk. A woman’s fickleness, duplicity or even prudence made a woman’s prerogative something pragmatic.

Now we move into an era where women have almost unchallenged, unilateral control of the birthing of the next generations of the human race. As I’ve mentioned before, with safe and legal abortion, feminine-controlled birth control, feminine-primary societal norms, feminine-controlled definitions of rape or harassment, and feminine-controlled legislation of men’s responsibility to fatherhood (irrespective of genetic origin) women’s consolidation on power is nearly complete.

All of these bases of social control revolve around a woman’s control of Hypergamy and the complete exclusion of men’s influence on it, beyond his genetic and provisional qualifications to satisfy it. When we combine the old books idiom of a woman’s right to change her mind with the nearly total control of Hypergamy, we see that the more we progress socially the more evident this feminine base of control is.

All social mandates revolve around satisfying women’s Hypergamous doubts, or allaying or justifying the fear of living with the consequences of them. Even in the current Presidential election we see this dynamic in action with the potential for the first female President.

Changes

In the next post in this series I’ll get into how women’s hindbrains struggle to keep up with the immediate rewards of social media and that the advancement of technology that gratifies their evolved psychological natures. However, for this discussion it’s important to understand that the advancements that have led to women’s social primacy of today are still tenuous. Vasagel could be one catalyst that is a game changer; a challenger not just to our intersexual dynamic, but the power hold women retain in directing Hypergamy and putting the direction of human breeding (in a much larger part) in the control of men.

I find it ironic and fitting that the promise of unrestricted sex which men believed they would enjoy with the advent of women’s hormonal birth control is the same rationale I’m reading from women about Vasagel. What they don’t consider is that this new invention will give men a new male prerogative with regard to who they will or will not start a family with.

I understand that in some ‘sphere communities Vasagel is the ‘big fuck you’ to women for have had such uncontested social control for so long, but to them I would advise not to get too elated too quickly. For the most part the socio-psychological infrastructure that conditions men for the Blue Pill will still exist, and there will always be Betas, even ones with the male prerogative that Vasagel implies, who will still defer to the feminine as their only means to sex and intimacy. The Feminine Imperative is nothing if not fluidly redefining itself to work around challenges to it s power. Vasagel may represent a change (assuming men are allowed to have it or can afford it) in our intersexual dynamics, but it will take some time before there is real change in our social dynamics as a result of it.

443 comments

  1. Just reading about all of this in sperm wars.

    We move with the times. Our body’s don’t care about the law they only care about high stress situation to limit reproduction. Both males and females have natural contraception mechanism dating back 10 thousand yrs.

  2. I have two baby mamas so far because I trusted them to use birth control responsibly. Both got pregnant thinking it would keep me around right around the time I was realizing each of them were insane. I learn things the hard way. This breakthrough in male birth control couldn’t come soon enough. Wish it was around a decade ago. Also wish I was red pill aware ten years ago. Oh well.

  3. “In the next post in this series I’ll get into how women’s hindbrains struggle to keep up with the immediate rewards of social media and that the advancement of technology that gratifies their evolved psychological natures.”

    First time commenting. Can’t wait to read it. Being fairly young, I’m very eager to hear your thoughts on the social media era, as I have no choice but to deal with it due to how prominent it has become. Experiencing and coming to certain realizations on my own, I feel I have a good grasp on the subject but I have a feeling you’re gonna say something that will spark my interest.

  4. This is an interesting post. I have a plate who has been causing me considerable drama. It’s become clear she has a series of Cluster B/BPD traits. One of those is a constant self-pity/victimhood. This has included a false pregnancy scare which I told her off about yesterday.

    Around a month ago, she texted me in the middle of the day to say her period was late by a week. I was at work. I was furious. Firstly, it was just not possible for her to be pregnant. But the fact she was “just letting me know”…made it clear this whole pregnancy concept is still a weapon women use against guys.

    Yesterday I had very firm talk with her about her overall behaviours. It stemmed around the fact she was blowing me off for an entire week in a passive aggressive move…over what it’s not clear. But I told her that not contacting me for a week or sending me a holiday greeting was disrespectful and not on if she wanted to keep me in her life.

    The discussion then shifted to a frame control battle which I then brought up that if she was not texting me because she “didn’t want to bother me because I was busy” why did she decide to text me mid-day about the pregnancy scare.

    She stared blankly….it’s great when you catch a women in mid-hamster spin. She then insisted that she wanted to share this information with me because it was important blah blah blah. I told her, no, it was an improbability, I’m not a doctor and this kind of thing was out of line.

    Women use pregnancy scares and other health-issues to manipulate and control.

    The girl in question tried to smooth things over but her own defensiveness and sarcasm made the whole thing like dealing with a small pouty child. I had to keep saying “Dial it down and once more without the sarcasm.”

    As a follow up…I sent her home, then made plans to meet up with another plate.

    Abundance.

  5. Men could use a condom or get the snip. Men don’t do these things because they’re inconvenient. If Vasegel isn’t some easy to apply medicine, men won’t use it.
    Men’s own sexual strategies revolve around convincing a woman to willingly have sex with him. How many men in a long term relationship, whose partner has stopped having sex with him, will bring up the possibility of having children as a means to having sex with her?

    Men are programmed to seek sex at any and all costs. Playing the game to some degree means you’ve already lost.
    Alphas know this, that’s why they fvck and leave. But some betas know it too and act on it. They stay single.
    The uncle who never married, has no children. But owns his house, car and is generous with birthday and christmas presents to your offspring. The man your wife has given up on pairing off.
    The eternal bachelor will be ostracised by society. Branded a loser. But I’d rather be a happy loser than an indentured servant to the whims of a woman who can no longer make you “happy”.

  6. The whole social media scene will grow tiresome for orbiters. They can’t get the woman on their screen because she’s off with alpha bucks. Beta will learn to make do without. After enough betas do this the validation women get from social media will wane and they’ll seek these pleasures in the world around them.

  7. I’d really love to, but I’m not buying it entirely. It won’t be a wholesale game-changer overnight.

    If it isn’t banned from Western countries before it’s available, it might well become so. On the grounds of “medical safety concerns”, I’d bet. So the only way to get it will be medical tourism, which is rather inconvenient for those men without the financial means to do so. One may argue that women aren’t really interested in getting pregnant with such low-value providers, but I’d beg to differ.

    If it doesn’t get banned, it wouldn’t be unreasonable to assume that some sort of social shaming techniques would be developed by the FI to dissuade men from accessing it. And it would be difficult for a man to hide having had it done, unless he kept it a secret from the woman he’s banging, and still insisted on using condoms, withdrawal/prayer etc. (Another thing to consider is that Vasalgel won’t protect against STDs). Then again, who knows? Maybe the “don’t worry, I’m on contraception” line will work. For some men.

    And if a man gets seduced into an LTR (or marriage – but his life is forfeit, then anyway), what are the chances that he’ll stick to his guns, and either not disclose he has it or refuse to have it removed? For fear that she’ll leave him. Alternatively, if she’s clueless but deceptive (ha! NAWALT), she’ll eventually go get pregnant by some Alpha and try to pass it off as her LTR’s. Time for a break-up, and then an expensive court fight with DNA testing to prove it isn’t his. Or worse, the schmuck will allow himself to be cuckolded.

    Let’s say that we eventually have a huge amount of young, unmarried, sterile-by-choice men. There’s no guarantee that they’ll be having risk and commitment free sex like it’s the Apocalypse. SMV will still play a part in getting laid. If a guy can play his cards right and string along a succession of women that he’ll give them kids (whilst avoiding de jure or de facto marriage), that might be the way to go. But women are like The Borg – they will adapt. It might be that the only way a Beta can get laid in the future (with a woman, but not a prostitute) is having a doctor’s certificate certifying his fertility. (And forgeries will likely be caught by some “rape by fraud” chicanery.)

    Given the geopolitical situation today, there may soon be a rather large cohort of unsterilized men who don’t give a shit about impregnating women. And guess what? They’re likely to be of a social-justice-protected class, so they won’t be sent to prison en masse for not paying child support. And it’s unlikely that the government will let single whore mothers and their bastard spawn starve. Guess who’ll have to pay their taxes to support these women they aren’t banging and the kids which aren’t theirs?

    Another thing that needs to be considered in the mix: artificial wombs. This is a very recent break-through. There has also been talk of being able to create embryos using two ova, or two sperm. Before men start rejoicing that they will be able to have their own kids without having to deal with a troublesome woman at all, I don’t think they’ll be selling the technology to anyone (“socially infertile” cat-ladies, maybe, upstanding bachelors, no).

  8. The only way Vasalgel can fail is if it is banned; you get the procedure, and look blankly when she says she’s not pregnant *again*.
    Take a day off work to ‘have it reversed’. You won’t know if the reversal was effective for 3 months….

    Men can actually be as deceptive as women for once….

  9. Color me skeptical.

    Vasagel won’t change the game to men’s obvious favor .

    First -remember that we live in the Age of the Beta, and the males who derive their life’s worth from the FI will obey the system over their own interests and that of the male gender.
    When their women say to remove “The Plug”, they’ll do it. Just like when cupcake demands they marry, buy her a car, move to the suburbs, and so on.

    Next – how much practical bargaining power does this offer a typical beta? I’d say zero. Read your local statutes on child and family support. Most rule that child support and asset division in divorce is separate of biological paternity. If a Betabux stands his ground on staying “Gelled” in defiance of his woman’s wishes, she’ll gladly hit up Tinder for a fertile stud and brag to the world about how her husbands “stubbornness” ! forced her ! to cuck him. That’ll be the narrative , and he’ll either have to raise someone else’s kid directly or lose half his stuff so his ex wife can do it without him.

    For the redpill guys determined to buck the system, given how blue pill the medical profession is I can safely state that Vasagel will only be accessible under conditions suitable for the FI. I’m reminded of cases where single men are denied vasectomies by FI indoctrinated doctors , some of whom demand signed documentation from a spouse before doing the procedure!

    It’ll be something like that in practice for Vasagel. On paper “any” man can get it done. In realistic practice unless you’re married and wifey signs off you can’t do it. Unless you wave a fistful of dollars under a docs nose and have it done after hours , or know a friend of a friend who will do the procedure off the books.

    Guys who do this and plow will have to keep it on the DL like being a “Borrowed Ladder” in the movie Gattaca. A man who withholds his seed from society will be considered a Patriarchial scumbag worthy of total social scorn and ostracism.
    I only say that because being an unmarried single man today can gather no small amount of social disapproval even now; I’ve lost a professional job because the female -centric office became socially hostile to an attractive man uninterested in being tied down. The beta males resented the fact I drove sports cars and didn’t answer to a woman’s dominion every weekend, and the women resented the fact I was out of their league and unwilling to kneel before the Almighty Vag.

  10. And until then…….quietly and discreetly get a vasectomy and get multiple lab test verifications that you are in fact really shooting blanks. Tell NOBODY that you went out and did this – especially any women you’re sleeping with. A caller on Tom Leykis told a story of a woman he was dating that tried to pull a variation of the “oops I’m pregnant and now you are my man slave for the next 18 years stunt” (and if I remember correctly, I believe she really was pregnant too, no doubt by an alpha of the same ethnicity – lol). He had her over to discuss plans for them and “their” child and then he sprung the lab verification papers on her which called her out on her lie that the child was actually his. What an epic moment that must have been for him – lol. I would love to have seen the expression on her face when he did that.

    Yeah, I think the FI will find all kinds of creative excuses to forestall and delay any kind of easy/convenient access to birth control for men other than condoms which women know all men hate. It’s a shame really that so many BP men can be so stupid as to actually really trust women to tell the truth about being on the pill, much less fidelity. I suspect that many of these same men are too naive and timid to demand paternity tests as well; for fear of being shamed and scorned. But hey, at least those alpha genes get propagated and those children get raised by a good dutiful beta man servant. That’s got to be the ultimate play for a modern day woman to make if she has the moxy to try to pull it off. You go girl!

  11. Not getting the “shit on Vasagel” comments here…

    I don’t think anyone, including Rollo, is saying it is a Panacea for what ails men. It is merely one game-changing shift for the social dynamic.

    YES, any guy still steeped deeply in Blue Pill mindset is going to get rolled. By definition, such a person would allow themselves to be influenced by whatever social pressures to NOT have the procedure done, for one. But that seems like a circular argument.

    So? Isn’t that is what Red Pill thought is for, right?

    The point is that for someone who is even remotely Red Pill aware, such a device, if it works as billed, would allow them to reduce their chances of being tricked into fatherhood down to near zero, AND to do so secretly, AND to do so without diminishing his pleasure at all. Hell, a father may invest in one for his son as he reaches puberty or before he heads off to college. When doing so, he almost guarantee’s his progeny won’t be saddled with some BPD witch before he approaches HIS peak SMV.

    How is that not a bonus? And how does it NOT greatly frustrate women’s machinations when it comes to her Hypergamy?

    As for men being held responsible for children they never fathered, that is where men need to start fighting back and use their CONSIDERABLE economic influence on politicians and have those laws struck down. That shit happens because men don’t push back on it.

    Take the doctor who would refuse a man a vasectomy without a note from his wife…If any doctor I went to made such a demand, and did not back down, I would sue his ass and seek to have his license revoked. If it went to court, I would have my lawyer argue whether or not woman EVER has to seek her husband’s permission to get:

    1) Her tubes tied
    2) An abortion
    3) Birth control pills
    4) An IUD
    5) A hysterectomy

    You get the idea. It is a double-standard like so many others, but they exist because we allow them to exist.

    So, no. A birth control device, by itself, is not going to cure all of what ails us in modern society. It does, however, as Rollo points out, shift the balance back toward the middle along with any number of factors including Red Pill awareness. It removes one of the legal chains, a big one, women try to latch onto men to do their bidding, and with that removed, a lot of leverage goes out the window.

    Other advancements, things like the legalization of prostitution in the social realm, and VR porn, sex robots, whatever, in the tech realm have all been touched upon her before, and none of them will completely ‘solve the problem’.

    All of it will, however, will diminish the overt power women wield over men and that, combined with a hopefully invigorated male population which will fight for it’s rights, will restore the balance.

  12. @ollieoxenfree1

    > ‘Men could use a condom or get the snip. Men don’t do these things because they’re inconvenient.’

    Gotta call BS on this one.

    Men don’t use condoms because sex doesn’t feel as good when they use them.

    And this is even more interesting to me: as a longtime participant in the PUA community, I would say the feedback I get from women, and other guys in the community is, that sex without condoms feels better for women too.

    And getting the snip is “inconvenient” … really?

    Nah, it’s “inappropriate” because it’s permanent.

    Also try “side effects.” It’s interesting to me that many so guys in the PUA & Red Pill communities are informed on the surprisingly high rates of inflammation & chronic ball pain that occur with vasectomy, and the psychological side effect of some women becoming revolted by men who shoot blanks.

    > ‘If Vasegel (sic.) isn’t some easy to apply medicine, men won’t use it.’

    We’ll just have to see. Many guys are motivated enough by their hatred of condoms that maybe they’ll go through with the injection to the balls. Vasalgel is still in clinical trials. If it gets FDA approval & goes on sale, then proof will be in the pudding.

    Guys predicting a revolution should also remember that this is still speculation. An FDA permit is not guaranteed. It’s looking good for Vasalgel, but revious attempts at reversible long-term male contraception have failed in clinical trials.

    Don’t count your chickens before they’ve hatched.

  13. A woman’s first reaction to understanding Vasagel is, “I can’t trust a man who tells me he has it. I would still need my own BC”.

    Everything about their mental process is “Its all about me.” They loate to admit baby rabies can be so compelling that they would baby-trap or sperm-jack a man. The truth is they will all tell their sisters, “you go gurl, get that baby you want so bad.” And when its their own rabid turn, their posse will tell them the same.

    Do not try to enlighten women about the overarching consequences of Vasagel. Let them find out the hard way; when baby-trapping and sperm-jacking are Vasagel impossible.

  14. Having a male-control contraceptive such as Vasegel available might not lead to social upheaval *this* generation. There are BP’ers now and they won’t be changing anytime soon…

    But think of the effects in 3 to 5 generations.

  15. Agree with @Colbert that if you’re single and working the plates, a vasectomized guy should never tell any woman he’s snipped.

    This is because of this psychological thing many women have where a guy who’s shooting blanks turns them off. Readers might find the anonymous comments by women on these blog posts very enlightening:

    http://marriedmansexlife.com/2010/04/vasectomy-causing-loss-of-wifes-sexual-interest/

    http://marriedmansexlife.com/2012/10/vasectomy-killed-her-sexual-interest/

    http://marriedmansexlife.com/2010/06/follow-up-vasectomy-causing-loss-of-wifes-sexual-interest/

    What they don’t know won’t hurt them, or you !

  16. @Rollo, Sentient, married dudes… This article deserves a post on its own.

    It’s written from a feminist perspective (of course it’s MSM) but worthwhile to interpret from a Red Pill perspective.

    Brad Pitt…alpha disciplines the kids, smokes a doob, isn’t getting any from his wall-hitting, globe-trotting wife…bangs a hottie from work…

    Poor Angelina…. read it and weep:

    http://www.theatlantic.com/entertainment/archive/2016/09/the-reason-for-the-pitt-jolie-divorce/500789/?utm_source=Quartzfb

    Angelina drinks wine every night.

    Angelina barely eats.

    Angelina smokes constantly.

    Angelina has had “many health scares,” leaving Brad “terrified.”

    Angelina lost weight.

    Angelina gained weight.

    Angelina is too preoccupied with her humanitarian work to concentrate on her marriage.

    Angelina isn’t attracted to Brad anymore.

    Angelina is “feeling bad for thieving Brad Pitt from Jennifer Aniston” in the past.

    Angelina is “intensely” jealous of Brad’s co-stars.

    AAAAAAAANDD…**I’m looking at you Softek:

    Angelina is suicidal.

    Angelina is suicidal because she is intensely jealous of Brad’s co-stars.

    And here’s where I nearly spit out my coffee at what was clearly sarcasm but is in effect Red Pill truth:

    “”Here is one of the most regressive notions about marriage—that it is ultimately a woman’s responsibility to maintain it, whatever the cost.””

    Absent from this story is any mention of that Red Pill gremlin: hypergamy.

    I’m now analyzing my own plates. Two of them are just amazing, one as I have mentioned is ….well….Angelina.

    Two of my plates “get it”….they dress hot for me, send sexy selfies, are available when I’m free…dote on me…

    In exchange for all that they get my full attention—when we’re together and for now, that’s great. I’m the prize.

    The third has suddenly displayed all the typical BDP traits: withdrawl, self-pity, resentment of my success, snide comments that go beyond the normal shit test into sarcasm.

    Had I not had previous experience with this I would not have known how to handle this: unpredictability and flashes of anger followed up with acts of generosity and DHV’s.

    Angelina in this case isn’t suing Brad’s ass off…that would ruin her BPD waif image of being the humanitarian who clearly neglected her man, likely shamed him for his manly needs.

    Read also ex-wife Jennifer Aniston’s apparent comments that this was “karma”—read Alpha Widow…still wishing Brad will suffer.

    This whole story crystalized for me why a Red Pill life is so important.

    Do you want a woman who resents your success and Who’s jealousy is based on bringing you down…so she can feel better about herself.

    Guys it’s critical to know your worth and not fall into her frame.

    In my “talk” with plate #3 she was saying “I have nothing, you have everything”….to which I responded: “I’m bringing you up to my level not going down to yours.” That is the value I bring to the table in my interactions with women. That is what you need to be saying or at the very least be thinking.

    I just got flaked on by the 32 year old who just didn’t show up and then said she had a class an hour after we were supposed to meet. My response: “you didn’t show up” followed by radio silence.

    No problem, I made plans with one of the other two plates.

    Man-shaming is now a sport for media—making it seem like Brad Pitt’s penchant for a joint and a beer made him somehow unfit to be a partner and father is a smoke screen. These jibes at the “dudes just being dudes” are a last grasp shit-test by women to bring guys down to their level instead of rising to his: the essence of frame control.

  17. @Rollo: All social mandates revolve around satisfying women’s Hypergamous doubts, or allaying or justifying the fear of living with the consequences of them.

    This is why Vasegel may help an individual man but will not help men in general. The FI is protean thus, to paraphrase another commenter, some men will become better tamers.

  18. @ Ed Wapole,

    “Do not try to enlighten women about the overarching consequences of Vasagel. Let them find out the hard way; when baby-trapping and sperm-jacking are Vasagel impossible.”

    Their collective hive mind hindbrains are no doubt at least subconsciously already astutely aware of the awful consequences this development could have on their hypergamic options. The Huffington Post and the rest of the matrix media will be all over it when/if it ever arrives and will no doubt come up with creative rationalizations as to why it is bad for BOTH men and women. I suspect you’re gonna hear a lot of clucking noises in the background on this issue going forward. They may be good at the charade of playing dumb, but when it comes to this issue – they are not. They will intuitively know at least peripherally on some solipsistic level the negative consequences this would have on the power and options/strategies they currently wield in their current relationships and future ones with men. Women understand options and the power associated with relationship dynamics better than you think. They are, after all, natural Machiavellians. Deception and manipulation IS their bread and butter and has been for the last 100k + years. No more “you go gurl” – not if they can help it. Let the clucking and hen pecking commence!

  19. FI will have it covered ‘obtaining sex by deception’, expressing the intention to impregnate while on vasagel will be seen as deception and ergo rape. Contraception rape!

    The cuckservatives will love it, poor women trying to get pregnant denied by dastardly men…

  20. Pitt/Jolie lol time to drop some reality bombs:

    That one’s an actual shame to me. I thought of any LTR, that one might make it. Pitt was a country boy with good ol’ southern values who WANTED to be a dad (VS a Dicaprio type getting dragged into it unwillingly). And Jolie being a AAA celeb would need another AAA celeb to bare minimum balance out the value (VS a case where a AAA celeb chick ditches a guy who’s way lower value than her). Brad didn’t let his value drop or anything, he’s as famous and high-value and successful as ever. She clearly likes/wants kids since she has a million of them and he looks like a good caring father and all she does is praise what a good father he is. That’s GOTTA work out, right?

    Made it to just past the 10 year mark, legally married 2 years ago…huh. I remember some asshole around here mentioning that making modern LTRs last past 10 years (and legal-marriage past the NRE stage, legal-marriage helping KILL the NRE stage) was tricky and a guy might have to accept that girl may bail around that mark because marriage doesn’t mean as much to them (compared to girls in the OMG’s day, yes Jolie is 40 which is “old” but she also grew up in LA in full Hollywood culture so she would have been at the forefront of shitty modern cultural influences that are now widespread to normal girls) and there’s no real negative consequence to bailing and that 2016 guys should expect to go through a custody battle around the 10 year mark and plan for it as much as possible.

    But hey, maybe they weren’t UMC enough? Ya they seem pretty poor and destitute. Maybe he let himself get too fat and ugly? He sure looked fat and ugly in his last movies, what an uggo in Fury. Maybe he stopped making movies and money? I haven’t even seen his name anywhere in films the past 10 years that’s for sure. Maybe he wasn’t an involved enough dad raising 6 kids with her? Those million pics of him with the kids going on family trips (to save the third-world and all, full high-value admirable behavior) and spending time together were probably just fake and photoshopped. Maybe he didn’t show enough commitment staying with her through her double-masectomy? I totally remember all those interviews where he was like “ew no, she has no tits now, I’m bailing on my family to bang strange poon instead!”

    Maybe all his monogamy just wasn’t monogamous ENOUGH? ’cause monogamy and voluntarily limiting your options sure builds attraction. Maybe him wanting a family and wanting to be a dad just wasn’t quite enough commitment or fatherly involvement? Not like those assholes discussing pLTRs who would be shitty fathers by default that abandon their kids baseball games to go hit up nightclubs and would never be involved in their kids life. Maybe he’s unattractive and other women don’t want him anymore? That’s probably it, most vids and pics posted of him have girls commenting “eww what happened to him he’s so hideous now” (‘course even if somehow a girl COULD still find him attractive (which is impossible really), it’s not really dread when you’ve legally promised monogamy and neutered the dread that would come from worrying about you straying…or given her justification to boot you if you DID promise monogamy and DID stray). Maybe she should’ve also grown up in Oklahoma with him? Picked up some of those good wholesome religious values that would have made him immune to all this (like Jennifer Garner, born and raised in Texas, who bailed on Affleck, another AAA celeb in his prime)?

    It’s ALMOST like a guy with traditional values trying to make a legal monogamous marriage work with a girl who’s grown up in the heart of modern culture and values (she grew up in LA, and that culture has spread and gotten worse since then), just MIGHT have a little more difficulty than the FI would have people believe, especially when he voluntarily makes it difficult to do the things that first sparked attraction and then keep attraction going.

    I’d swear someone around here was talking about that recently, but I just can’t think of who that was…probably some idiot with no kids who doesn’t know anything about anything.

    But hey, Brad Pitt is a big blue pill beta chode and there was never any passion or anything, right? He was always a big ol’ chode? We ALL know that, I mean, look at him in interviews and stuff NOW, what a big ol’ chode! Let’s completely rewrite history and pretend he was always just a big ol’ beta who got by on his looks and was never actually alpha or had any game so we can avoid the reality that monogamy marriage and kids whittle most guys down, not even to the point where they’re fat and lazy and quit their movie careers etc, but to the point where they’re just seen as a Provider instead of a Lover despite their massively high-value.

    ’cause objectively Brad Pitt was a charismatic alpha:

    He wasn’t a beta chode when they met (aside from believing NAWALT and thinking legal marriage was a good idea lol). He’s negging and teasing her like crazy in that interview, running beautiful game, and she’s responding with all sorts of natural iois (of course).

    Check out his swagger at 33 seconds into this one, back when she fell for him. That’s not the walk of some chode, that’s a guy who feels like he owns the world:

    Check the bloopers on YouTube from Mr & Mrs Smith, lots of Brad teasing her and making her break character and then negging her for it and self-depreciating and being cocky and generally being alpha.

    The bloopers and the interview above were when they were were first hooking up on set (or maybe NOT hooking up if Brad kept his monogamy promise to his wife and they may have just had insane unresolved sexual tension built up if they didn’t bang…you know, like your wife with the guys at work and orbiters and social media guys that flirt with her if you’re out of the NRE stage with a <25yo 8+/10 raised in 2016 culture) and fully in the NRE stage (while Pitt was with Anniston…huh…kind of sounds like non-monogamy/jealousy triggers attraction…I'd swear someone mentioned that here)

    Now if he could STAY like that, with that swagger and teasing etc till the grave, cool, he might keep her attracted long-term. But he became a nice safe Provider in her view, instead of the sexy bad-boy with a wife on the side flirting on-set in a "we CAN'T be doing this" risky situation etc, with no outcome dependence ('cause he already has a wife), bla bla

    And she's clearly attracted to him in this montage of appearances together from a few years back (you know, before they got legally married), that's not how a girl looks or acts around a beta chode. He's not trying to kiss her as she gives him the cheek and she looks away bored.

  21. Unfortunately as I said in the marriage debate, the NRE stage and first few years are very different from 10+ years later when the NRE has worn off and boredom sets in.

    But I mean, don’t believe ME, I’m just some idiot who hasn’t been married. Listen to Angelina Jolie’s own words:

    “No we’re not talking about making out on the red carpet and wearing blood vials ala Billy Bob Thorton (aka a Lover), Angie means sweet affectionate RESPECTFUL love between a mother and father (aka Provider)…”

    “One of the things we’re particularly conscious of is how we treat eachother in front of the children. We want to be an example of how to treat the opposite sex.”

    “We’ve grown up as a couple, a relationship is one thing when you’re first together and it’s exciting, but now we’ve been together for many years, and we have the children, it becomes a DIFFERENT kind of love…it’s not just being LOVERS and partners and friends (aka a Lover), it’s being a family man (aka a boring Provider) which I love in him and feel very lucky about.”

    She feels SO lucky that she’s bailing on him and taking the kids and painting him as a shitty father now. And she’ll have the full support of the media and all her friends and family. Because it’s 2016 Eat Pray Love culture. There’s no consequence for her leaving, only reward and validation and positive attention, while the man is thrown in the shitter and his reputation tarnished.

    Imagine you bond with your 6 kids for 10 YEARS, thinking “this is how it’s gonna end, I’ll grow old and have this loving family around me on my deathbed, I love being a dad there’s all this chaos in the house and I thrive on that ’cause I’ve wanted the family life for years, I’m so fortunate” and then whoops, nope, she decides in like a week (the divorce happened in 5 days or something apparently) to just take it all away from you and now you wake up in an empty bed with an empty house at 50+. Pitt will be fine, he’s a AAA celebrity. But how will Joe the Plumber do?

    The point of all these vids is that Brad Pitt WAS alpha when she met him. And his situation at that time was conducive to spiking attraction. But after enough years of monogamy, plus legal marriage, plus kids, he lost that edge. You can’t remove the “having kids” part if you DO want to pass on your genes, but you can eliminate the monogamy and legal marriage part since they don’t come with any benefit, not even for Brad Pitt.

    Now can Joe the Plumber stay alpha for 18-40+ years to raise kids? In 2016 with 2016 girls? If he isn’t in the UMC religious clique? When fucking BRAD PITT, a good-looking AAA movie star can’t?

    Sure, MAYBE, just like MAYBE I can pull off a skateboard trick that Tony Hawk can’t pull off, every day for 18-40+ years. But I sure wouldn’t advise men to legally gamble their lives on it when I can’t name any benefit to it that they can’t get without that gamble.

    At least she’s rich too so there shouldn’t be much fighting over money. So I guess the recipe to get legally married is: make sure you legally marry a girl who’s rich at 21. Rich, but with traditional values and no smartphone or technology. Who will legally marry you, Joe the plumber, the hard-working average family man who just wants a nice wife to grow old with and kids to raise. No problem! TONS of those girls out there all over the place! I met 5 on my way to type this post!

    TMZ has updated with:

    “Our sources say, Angelina became “fed up” with Brad’s consumption of weed and possibly alcohol, and mixed with what she believes is “an anger problem” … felt it became dangerous for the children.”

    So another successful man’s career and reputation can be destroyed by social media gossip because he’s now a drunk pothead abusive monster who’s one step away from abusing his own children.

    And don’t worry, incase you thought that wasn’t enough the Jezzies are on the case:

    http://jezebel.com/angelina-jolie-has-filed-for-divorce-from-brad-pitt-1786846265

    By fluke timing a story about a successful Hollywood family man type who molested the Coreys and runs a pedophile ring just went out and even though Pitt was a nobody instead of a high-powered celebrity AND only like 18 for the timeline to work, they’re pretty sure Pitt is probably the pedophile ring king.

    And they’re of course rooting for Jennifer, shitting all over Pitt, because they identify with the mousey girl who got dumped by the high-value guy. Because everyone in society will dog-pile on the man. She won’t have a single person telling her to make it work the second she says she’s “unhaaaappy”.

    So even Brad Pitt, the guy who defined alpha in Fight Club and put in 10 years of solid monogamy starting out as an alpha and being a good dad and keeping his value sky high the entire relationship, can’t make modern marriage to modern women work. At least he has time to hang out with his buddy Ben Affleck, who’s in the best physical shape of his life playing fucking BATMAN, was divorced by his aging mousey wife from Texas at the 10 year mark (of course he’s still living with her while she nags him to death and is surprised he doesn’t want to get back together now because he’s moved on to banging other hotter younger girls that don’t nag him). And they can both call Johnny Depp to go hang out and talk about how much they love to all get wasted and be angry and beat women and children with all their addictions and abusive tendencies that they all coincidentally have while all of the women are just struggling perfect unicorns who aren’t at fault for anything at all.

  22. Actually, there is no reason why such a contraceptive should give men any real power. Those who are strong enough to stand their ground, don´t need it, for those who are not, it wouldn´t be enough if they had a magic wand, an ejaculation timer and vasalgel all at the same time.

    It could, however, be an excellent tool for limiting fatherhood scam.

  23. So in conclusion I guess the lesson must be: screen quickly for a higher-quality woman than Angelina Jolie.

    Good advice…now if only we were able to have a discussion without people’s panties twisting in a knot, about how to teach men to properly screen faster…and then not legally marry them, since there’s no actual benefit to it since marriage doesn’t mean anything outside of the deeply religous UMC circles anymore.

    Because the first response all these guys will have is “Angelina Jolie is clearly a batshit nutcase no man should marry”. Duh.

    But what if I told you…

    …that in 2016 ALL women with social media, with male orbiters and men in their social circles, and working around men have become like LA-raised Angelina Jolie, thinking they’re minor celebrities thanks to social media with endless seemingly high-value (because she won’t know until she interacts with them and they fail some shit-tests) options coming at them from all angles 24/7.

    This is what guys are working with in 2016. Your OMG wives don’t exist now except in some corner of SJF’s farm. Guys have to either not reproduce or figure out how to have kids safely with all these Angelina Jolies running around if they want to raise kids with a <25yo 8+/10 raised in 2016 culture.

    lol but don't worry, Joe the plumber reading this debating legally marrying your high-school sweetheart, YOU'LL make it work. YOU have the NAWALT. Now you just have to be more successful and high-value than Brad Pitt…and stay that way for 18-40+ years.

    And fucking lol at the other guy who got dumped after 20 years too. I feel bad for him but this picture, it's everything about 2016 culture wrapped up in one pic:

    #youGoGrrl #socialMediaHasntChangedAnything #sheEvenUsedEmoticonsLololol

    And hey, since we're on the subject of men being demonized in 2016:

    http://jezebel.com/jim-carrey-sued-for-enabling-his-ex-girlfriends-suicide-1786833460

    See, when your BPD ex steals your meds and kills herself, it's actually YOUR fault.

    "Carrey employed surveillance cameras to keep an eye on White, but he did not alert authorities after learning that she had not ventured outside the house for 24 hours"

    I wonder what the headline would have been if he DID alert the authorities. "STOP SPYING ON HER!!" "SO CONTROLLING!!" "ABUSE!!!!"

    Because men are evil in 2016 and women are responsible for NOTHING anymore.

    Don't legally tie yourself to a woman. The ONLY ties you can't get around are when you have a kid with her and enter that legal system, and that comes with a high risk too, but at least you get an actual reward/benefit for that risk, aka you have a kid and pass on your genes, and living with her so you can raise your kids in a 2-parent household. Other than that, don't legally tie yourself to her in ANY way.

    …unless you're better than Brad Pitt and can stay that way for 18-40+ years to a 2016 girl being bombarded with options 24/7. Then go ahead and gamble lol but try to name the benefit of rolling that dice if you win first…you won't be able to name anything you couldn't get WITHOUT rolling that dice.

    Don't worry, I'll find something happy and uplifting to post about, to balance out this "TOO NEGATIVE" realistic look at Pitt/Jolie lol

  24. @Rollo

    “The Feminine Imperative is nothing if not fluidly redefining itself to work around challenges to it s power. Vasagel may represent a change (assuming men are allowed to have it or can afford it) in our intersexual dynamics, but it will take some time before there is real change in our social dynamics as a result of it.”

    here’s something you might want to think about… one ‘method’ girls use to secure continued ‘beta provisioning’ is to have their kids then get ‘dad’ to get the big snip (bc ‘they’ are done having kids)… then frivorce him… so she doesn’t have to worry about ‘sharing’ resources with a new baby momma/wife… as she branch swings while she still has some SMV to get some other BB to play ‘dad’ (and maybe have a another kid with HIM)… and provide more resources to her… (i’ve known a couple guys this has happened to…)

    the FI is cunning and pervasive… there is no reason the FI couldn’t codify that strategy into law… you know… ‘for teh kids’…lol…

    the big snip is pretty invasive/permanent, so it’s not likely to be court ordered… buuuut, vasalgel is not permanent (not sure how invasive it is), so how long before it’s application becomes a part of the ‘child custody’ model of marriage/kids? either through a divorce deal (state enforced) or court ordered child support (i could easily see the state’s reasoning behind requiring this = more likely for ‘dad’ to be able to make his child support payments (by limiting HIS sexual strategy…)… FI = state enforcement)… one application will take the kids up through at least age 10 without competing for resources with later baby mommas… and the cost could just be a part of the child support requirements…

    OR (i just thought of this) the state could require ALL men to get it when they hit 18 (and every 10 years… like a drivers license…lol) and require them to have a girl’s permission/request to have it removed to have kids… that would be one way for FI to maintain control over the sexual strategy/choice… that still results in the man’s ‘choice’ but the illusion is that the FI is still in control… and would be to some extent… and that would just reinforce the social conditioning of ‘girl’s choice’…

    just some ‘fast food’ for thought…lol

    good luck!

  25. RE: Brangelina

    Think that it’s possible that she got so insecure/crazy about her fading looks and health and that she prematurely nuked it to save face?

  26. Today, families are defined by what women want them to be. Women can chose 1) marriage and children, 2) baby daddy with resources provided by baby daddy, and 3) baby daddy with resources provided by the tax base.

    Janet Bloomfield calculated that women as a demographic consume $150K more than they produce in taxes. Of course, women in the first two categories might not consume much more than they produce in taxes.

    I was curious about the cost of option 3 so I crunched some numbers. Stefan Molynoux stated in one of his videos that the average welfare that a single mom consumes per year is $61K. I previously googled the benefits and came to $75K of potential benefits if you had to work and pay taxes to consume them. Therefore, Stefan Molynoux’ numbers sound plausible. So with an average 25 years of welfare, a single mom would consume $175K in earned income taxes (pocket money) and $1.5 million in total taxes.

    In 2012, the total federal government spend on means tested welfare was $1.03 trillion. I’ve been unable to find total spends after that year. This is almost entirely spent on single moms. The “do not feed the animal” signs that you see at national parks are to prevent animal dependency on human intervention for their survival. The exact same thing happens with humans. One generation of welfare will create infinite dependency.

    So what about option 2? Apparently, no one has learned anything from the Soviets, and that is incentives matter. The more disincentives you create for men who play by the old rules of education, work, marriage, and children, the more men will change their behavior. This results in fewer women being about to choose options 1 and 2 because men are not willing to get married and our reducing the potential work quota that could be imposed on them in the event of a baby.

    Of course, women have responded to this change by opting for number 3, which causes more cost to society and a higher tax base / debt burden.

    My guess is the male birth control will reduce the number of working men from becoming baby daddies against their will, but will not significantly reduce the number of women choosing option 3. They will just need to find the jerkboy who has nothing to lose.

  27. Also Vasalgel will be awesome. Would sign up on day 1 but they’ll probably prevent it from hitting the market (at least over here, maybe you’ll be able to order it online from India or some shit). Soon as my money is in order I’m going to freeze some swimmers incase something happens (with a chunk of money dedicated to keeping ’em frozen somewhere), and either get a snip or hopefully reversible Vasalgel will be out by then.

    Hefner and Holly tried to have a kid but had troubles ’cause Hefner was sterile by then and freezing swimmers probably wasn’t available back when he was fertile. She peaced out ’cause she wanted to have a kid and he was a dead-end for that so it was time to move on, survival and replication and all that. Bad luck with timing/technology on his part, he probably didn’t even think about it.

    Would still use condoms though, ’cause of STDs. Once guys have something like Vasalgel they’re all gonna go condomless (’cause girls rarely want to use condoms with high-value guys anyway despite what the media would have you believe) and STD rates will skyrocket, esp since the 80/20 will increase to 90/10 and beyond so girls will all be fucking the same dudes while the rest are checked out into VR worlds like the Grasseaters.

    “a feminine-primary social order would be affected by men’s far greater control of women’s Hypergamous strategies.”

    Straight-up it’ll be fucking CHAOS. All these elements are coming together at about the same time (Vasalgel, VR, MGTOW movement, hollywood divorces every week, Feminism overstepping it’s bounds, all these post-wall women realizing no one wants them, egg-freezing, university kangaroo rape courts, social media name/career slander, etc etc)…society 25-50 years from now will look nothing like it does now.

    If you need me, I’ll be poolside with a drink in one hand and a girl in the other, watching it all burn down lol

  28. @habd: Your last bit is probably the most likely unintended consequence; while forced sterilizations of the past is now seen as a human rights violation, temporary male sterilization with reversal administered by a primarily female bureaucratic licensing agency would probably be accepted with few overt qualms. The rationale would be eliminating unintended (from the female’s perspective) pregnancy.

  29. I cannot wait for vasagel. Gentlemen, enter a world where “yes I am on birth control” lies do not matter. Vasagel will change the game, because now you are in control.

    The more control you have in your life the better. This is a major step forward. I fear that someone will try to stop it. It does give men total power to not be tied down to any children.

  30. Scenario: Girl gets pregnant. Boyfriend is on Vasalgel without her knowledge. Girl tells boyfriend. Boyfriend accuses her of fucking around. She is busted. Boyfriend forces her to abort.

    Scenario 2: Girl gets pregnant. Boyfriend is on Vasalgel and she knows. Girl gets abortion.

    More power for betas and abortion numbers increase due to Vasalgel.

  31. How about pulling out? No man has to blow his load inside the chick he’s banging. Even if this isn’t as easy for beta men who are easily pressured to let go inside the woman, I don’t think these will be the kind of men to put their own interests ahead of a woman’s and use vasagel. At what point does a beta ever think about his long term sexual strategy outside of what the FI dictates to him? I think immersive porn and sexbots are going to be much more effective in lowering female SMV.

  32. @A wise man

    “pulling out”

    See Amy’s acceptance speech (and picture a guy making this type of speech, and shaming an aging woman actor):

    5:35 “you make a shelf”, and then your sperm get shelfed to the washroom where who knows what happens to them, and then Amy gets pregnant

  33. This might prove to change the surprise babies, but it’s not going to change the feminine imperative until the Divorce Laws are changed. Western women are still, today, making plans while they’re still young to “have fun”, and then later marry a sucker and divorce him for cash&prizes. They’re not planning on getting married; they’re planning their divorces before they even meet their suckers. So long as Divorce Law allows cash&prizes as a reward to women for divorcing good-yet-boring men, then there isn’t going to be any changes.

  34. @theasdgamer

    Let’s finish the scenarios.

    Girl gets knocked up. Boyfriend is on Vasagel.Girl kicks boyfriend lose and dates baby daddy.

    Girl gets knocked up. Boyfriend is on Vgel. Girl convinces BF to man up and raise it as his own.

    Girl gets knocked up. BF on The Gel. She leaves him, files CS against the baby daddy and promotes her richest orbiter to Main BF.

    It gets easier if a guys married. She goes directly to Divorce,cleans out current hubby before the scandal hits and now has the same options as her unmarried counterpart below, except with more money.

    Those of you expecting a grand revolution in gender dynamics because of Vasagel are in for a disappointment .

  35. +1 about STD’s with Vasalgel. I never understood what was so hard about using a condom. If a girl tries to stick your dick inside her raw, just shove her off of you. Don’t let her pussy get anywhere near it.

    Men DO have birth control already, it’s called not cumming inside a pussy. Or ever going in raw if you’ve cum recently without taking a piss after, or inside a condom or in any way where any cum was left on your dick or anywhere in the area.

    Nobody has a gun to your head telling you that you have to cum inside some girl’s pussy. A vast majority of ‘accidental’ pregnancies come from guys cumming inside girls that lie about being on birth control, or claim they have a tilted uterus or cysts or something and claim they can’t get pregnant.

    Birth control doesn’t give women TRUE control. Men still are the ones who decide to cum in them.

    I wouldn’t trust Vasalgel 100% just like I wouldn’t trust a vasectomy 100%, or a copper IUD 100%. By that token I guess you shouldn’t trust condoms 100% either and go with YaReally’s advice to cum outside of her even if you have a condom on.

    Honestly at that point I feel like I’d just rather jerk off. Of course it’s a tradeoff. Being celibate sucks. Dealing with women also sucks. Pick your poison.

    But just having sex is so fucking stressful, not to mention everything you have to do, and all the time and energy you have to invest that leads up to it. How much sleep do you want to lose in your life worrying about whether you got some girl pregnant or not, or whether or not you might have an STD?

    These are legitimate concerns. Especially with the potential HUGE rise of STD’s with more men fucking women raw.

    There’s a reason they say you can’t live with them and can’t live without them. That’s the fucking truth. Grasseaters get a lot of shit, but it seriously is coming to a point where it’s valid to ask:

    Is life really any better with women compared to life without women? Especially considering the trajectory we’re on, where that line is getting even more blurred?

    I doubt Vasalgel is going to change much, except for increasing the amount of STD’s floating around and making fucking strange women seem more unappealing than it already is.

  36. Legally speaking:

    Salem Witch Trials.

    Just like a man can be in a shitload of trouble for being ACCUSED of rape or abuse, he can be in a shitload of trouble if a girl gets pregnant because he can’t know if it’s his until 9 months down the road.

    I can see it now: “Vasalgel not as effective as promoted.”

    Maybe it DOES have a near 100% success rate, but women will start getting pregnant “in spite of it”…..and the media will get on that like rabid dogs.

    When in reality most of these chicks are probably fucking other dudes who don’t have Vasalgel, and blaming the pregnancy on the Beta they’re with who does have it.

    And then it might make a lot of men second guess Vasalgel. Even if it’s legal and approved, do you really think the feminized media isn’t going to try to slander it and discourage men from using it in more underhanded, manipulative ways?

    Women’s LEGAL power has to disappear, which is probably not going to happen anytime soon, IF EVER.

    If anything, they’re getting MORE legal power by the day. Vasalgel won’t change that. And how many men on it are going to “do the right thing” by raising “their” child with this girl, who “accidentally” got pregnant due to a failure in Vasalgel….when in reality she fucked some other dude who knocked her up?

    As I said, it’s a tradeoff. Not having women in your life sucks, but having women in your life sucks too in its own special way.

    As far as progression goes, I’m just hoping they legalize weed nationwide. At the very least men deserve to have a legal, legitimate escape from this shithole of a society we’re in that’s only getting worse.

    Would take “grasseater” to a more literal level too.

  37. Brad was living with but not married to Angelina for 8 years. Would anything different happen if they never got married? Maybe, but my guess is no. [not for brad who only cares about custody] I don’t see a magic bullet. Kids complicate things.

  38. My bet is that Angelina now wishes that she did not get married. She would probably have 100% custody then but now Brad will likely get regularly scheduled custody.

  39. Vasgel? Who gives a fuck? Stick it in her ass, blow your load down her throat, clean your junk off in her hair and bounce

    OR do it to her again when the grudge fuck of her life has her more lubed up them ever before

  40. Wow, this is going to be great, you guys. Break out the popcorn indeed!

    A lot of immediate thoughts on this. Wanted to share. I’m probably wrong on most of them though:

    1. Vasalgel potentially wipes out any woman’s ability to use subterfuge to become pregnant (“Don’t worry I’m on the pill!). Her lack of a goalie effectively means nothing now. It’s all stick and no puck! The outcome of the game is academic. Score: 0-0.

    2. The shoe is on the other foot. She won’t even necessarily know that he’s using Vasalgel. And morally, for privacy reasons, one could argue he is not obligated to tell her either.

    3. Even men who are married will have, in theory, unilateral authority to decide whether the wife EVER gets even one child, let alone more children after the first. The very idea of an “attitude and ingratitude” adjustment requirement for wives is going to go over “like a fart in church” with most women you know.

    4. Upfront conditional terms for intimacy, e.g. spousal behavior compliance, long lists of ridiculous demands, is going shift over to the dudes. Will men wield a 4 page demand list of the ladies in the same vicious fashion as women have for decades? No.

    5. $1000 is a lot of money for the bottom and middle of social economic market of men. Well educated, employed men with social and economic status – i.e. the ones women find most desirable for provisioning and babies – will be able to afford or finance Vasalgel easily. Ricky the pizza delivery guy, not so easily.

    6. Will Vasalgel treatment be covered by health insurance (ACA in the US)?
    After feminists went on the political warpath to ensure ACA covered female birth control (IUD, the pill), perhaps it should. Female birth control is covered and coded however as a “hormonal therapy”.
    Vasalgel will not affect male hormone (testosterone) level one iota.

    7. At what young age can Vasalgel be applied and used?
    Given current levels of sexual promiscuity, STIs, teen pregnancies, and the train wreck of consequences to young grandparents (i.e. retirement destroyed), one can imagine mothers and fathers of sons clamoring for Vasalgel’s early application, like the current HPV vaccine for their daughters, which by the way as a series costs aroun $450. What’s another $1000 worth to ensure no unwanted stops on your way to retirement?

    8. Shifting the baby-making prerogative and mate selection from women to men will detonate everything we currently understand about the current mating schedules and planning of “career-minded” women. What happens when medium- to high-value, family-minded, 29-33 year old bachelors act on their preferences and only release their Vasalge-protected status, only temporarily, and only for younger, healthier 22-24 year old women citing the importance of the health of the mother, health of the babies, longevity of the marriage, and meeting his sexual needs (her higher libido)? There will be a mushroom cloud of female rage and righteous indignation, that’s what.

  41. Yareally

    So desperate to fit a beta peg into an alpha hole… Sad.

    Dude FIGHT CLUB is a movie and Brad Pitt and actor… If you cant see that choosing a twice married single mom and establishing a de facto cuck relationship on Day One is the defining characteristic of this situation it’s just because all the sparks from your poorly reasoned axe grinding continue to blind Ya…

    Lol.

  42. A few years after kid number 5, wife hearing from a friend of hers about vasectomy brings it up as something to think about…

    Me: “my next wife may want to have kids”

    Shit test status = smashed.

  43. If you need me, I’ll be poolside with a drink in one hand and a girl in the other, watching it all burn down lol

    Syria burned down in 2011. The only men poolside with a drink and a girl were members of the small ruling elite, in fortified enclaves. For the rest of the male population, there were no drinks, and no functioning pools to lay by. You’ll probably be dead meat if chaos ensues.

  44. Brad Pitt left People magazine’s most beautiful person of 2013 to marry People magazine’s most beautiful person of 2004 with whom he cheated on to go out with People magazine’s most beautiful person of 2006 with whom he cheated on with another movie star. The reason I can tell he is a beta is [30 minutes of Keyboard jockeying]. Sad!

  45. @Sentient
    That’s why I posted behind the scenes stuff where you see him being himself, instead of scenes from his movies.

    Pitt was exactly like half the natural alphas and red pill studying guys out there: alpha enough to get the girl but not prepared enough to screen properly (since even discussion of teaching men to screen can’t be done without red pill guys throwing a fit) but still holding out for that unicorn white picket fence FI-based lifestyle that certain people promise him he can have if he’s just alpha enough, instead of stomping that dream out and bringing some reality into the discussion about modern marriage/monogamy.

    “It has also been revealed that Pitt was blindsided and was told that Jolie was divorcing him just a day before she filed the legal papers”

    “Brad will still “fight and fight hard” for joint custody. Their “Brad sources” claim:

    “There’s no chance that’s going to happen.” Pitt wants joint custody … he doesn’t want to interfere with Angelina’s ability to be a co-parent, but he won’t allow her to thwart him.

    They continue:

    As we reported, our Angelina sources claim Brad heavily indulges in weed and alcohol and that, combined with what she claims is an anger problem, poses a danger to their kids.

    Our Brad sources insist … he’s never put his kids in danger … ever.”

    He was the model dad to her before this. Tons of footage of her praising him as a father. So what exactly didn’t she like about his parenting?

    “Often, the arguments were over “disciplining” their six children – Maddox, Pax, Zahara, Shiloh, Vivienne, and Knox – the source says.

    “Brad has always been stricter,” the source explains. “He has wanted the kids to have more structure. Brad will get frustrated sometimes and yell at the kids. Angelina always had a more relaxed attitude when it came to the kids. She definitely never yells.”

    Further, the large brood could lend itself to chaos, according to the source. Thus, Pitt was focused on “having rules.””

    But…but wait. I was told that in 2016 you can have discipline and structure and run the household like a boss for everyone’s own good and no one will have a problem with it. No one will view that as toxic masculinity and frame it as abuse and use it in a court battle to take your kids.

    Whoops! Off to the slaughter, Brad! If only someone had given you a reality check that modern marriage is stacked against you.

    Is it POSSIBLE to beat the odds? Sure. But for what benefit? Brad’s house is as empty as mine is and he’s at the same risk of being a Lonely Old Man(TM) as Dicaprio.

    Don’t risk it. Even if you really really really want to be an involved father, there’s no guarantee you’ll get that chance if she pulls the plug and throws out some claims about how abusive and dangerous you are and sheds a few crocodile tears. Why wouldn’t she, she has nothing to lose and everything to gain lol

    Don’t legally marry and don’t promise monogamy. You’ll still risk losing your kids and/or money to child support etc, but at least that’s ALL you’ll be risking and be in an arrangement that promotes dread (aka attraction). No reason to stack the deck even harder against yourself, unless you’re in the religious/UMC clique.

    @Hollenhund
    “Syria burned down in 2011. The only men poolside with a drink and a girl were members of the small ruling elite, in fortified enclaves. For the rest of the male population, there were no drinks, and no functioning pools to lay by. You’ll probably be dead meat if chaos ensues.”

    All the more reason to live it up now lol

  46. SJB
    @habd: Your last bit is probably the most likely unintended consequence; while forced sterilizations of the past is now seen as a human rights violation, temporary male sterilization with reversal administered by a primarily female bureaucratic licensing agency would probably be accepted with few overt qualms. The rationale would be eliminating unintended (from the female’s perspective) pregnancy.

    Churchians would be all for it, especially the TradCons, because it would reduce the chances of one of their Purity Ring wearing, speshul snoflake daughters getting seduced by some wascally PUA and knocked up. As a bonus, mandatory Vasalgel would be sold as indirectly reducing abortions. Of course, no Purity Ring wearing speshul snoflake church going Trad Con’s daughter has ever, ever, ever gone out of town on a “short term trip” and wound up having a “procedure” that need not be named. No. way.

    So the conservative feminists would support it, the 3rd wave sex-pozzies would be all for it, the aging 2nd stage crones would be torn between grandchildren and yuGOgurrl, and of course anything that increases state control over men is always A Good Thing to manginae.

    Oh, and you could sell it to the few fiscal conservatives around now on the basis of “reducing welfare / EBT costs” as well.

    Yeah, this might just happen in the next 4 to 6 years. A big media / “doctors agree [*]” push as was done for Gardasil would get probably 80% or more of young men snared in.

    [*] Nowadays if there is something that “doctors agree” on I figure it’s probably bogus, based on shoddy science, or makes money for Big Pharma. The list of junk that “doctors” have agreed on is long and getting longer every year. But that bandwagon / argumentum ad populum fallacy works really well on people who “think” with their emotions.

  47. A “Wise” Man
    How about pulling out?

    Yeah, that’s totally been working for thousands of years. Not.

    Look, maybe you are still in high school, but there’s no excuse to be this ignorant about reproductive biology.

    Fail.

  48. Even his BFF Clooney was blindsided. Brutal:

    Which means that shit happened FAST.

    https://therationalmale.com/2011/10/03/war-brides/

    Imagine being Brad Pitt right now, he must be completely mind-fucked…”I’m literally the 10/10 role model in almost every category there IS from looks to money to status to career success to fame to preselection…I’m the guy who’s characters entire forums try to emulate. What the fuck else was I supposed to DO???”

    Unfortunately once you leave the NRE stage and once “real life” throws something like health problems into the mix, none of that adds up to any kind of guarantee. Luckily he’s a zillionaire like her so the financial battle probably won’t be bad, but if she was some waitress he would be about to be hit by a financial nuke.

  49. ” I understand that in some ‘sphere communities Vasagel is the ‘big fuck you’ to women for have had such uncontested social control for so long, but to them I would advise not to get too elated too quickly. For the most part the socio-psychological infrastructure that conditions men for the Blue Pill will still exist, and there will always be Betas, even ones with the male prerogative that Vasagel implies, who will still defer to the feminine as their only means to sex and intimacy. The Feminine Imperative is nothing if not fluidly redefining itself to work around challenges to it s power. Vasagel may represent a change (assuming men are allowed to have it or can afford it) in our intersexual dynamics, but it will take some time before there is real change in our social dynamics as a result of it. ”

    Nice summary Rollo.

    As I read the article, I was slowly shaking my head, thinking that Vasagel, or any other type of ” invention ” is not going to be a holy grail of any sort.

    Vasagel will take generations before it can have any kind of true impact ( if ever ), and it might just be too late to make a meaningful impact in the plight of FI controlled males.

    If unintended pregnancies are indeed a really huge problem, then I guess this stuff can’t get to market soon enough.

    Personally, I think that men as a whole have MUCH bigger fish to fry.

  50. @kfg
    “Not counting the year she spent setting it up.”

    From Brad’s perspective I mean lol Even if they had problems, it doesn’t look like he had any idea this was coming. Just a guy who fell for the dupe that marriage was different from a live-in girlfriend and made things special and magical.

    “Jolie is being represented by divorce lawyer Laura Wasser, who has earned her “Disso Queen” nickname handling marriage dissolutions on behalf of some of Hollywood’s biggest names.

    Among those she has represented is Johnny Depp, who ended acrimonious divorce proceedings with actress Amber Heard with a $7 million settlement last month.

    Miss Wasser, a partner at Los Angeles family law firm, Wasser, Cooperman & Mandles, also represented Kim Kardashian, Stevie Wonder, Heidi Klum, Ryan Reynolds, Christina Aguilera, Mariah Carey and Kiefer Sutherland in their marital splits, and helped Britney Spears to win joint custody of her children despite the singer’s public meltdown.

    She represents so many celebrities she told Bloomberg she sometimes advises clients to keep their divorce on hold so she can file several high-profile cases at once to spread the media attention, which is why there can be a flurry of break-ups summarised in magazines.

    She reportedly charges $850 an hour, requires a $25,000 retainer, and rarely represents people who have less than $10 million.”

    “The couple were photographed together back in July, celebrating her son’s birthday in a West Hollywood restaurant.”

    From celebrating your son’s birthday with your 6 kids and wife who says you’re the most amazing man in the world in every interview, to an empty bed and empty house and a custody battle and slander in 2 months, with half the world laughing at you calling you a cuck beta who had it coming or an abusive father because you tried to discipline your kids a couple times and it made your 12-year monoLTR unhaaaaappy and in 2016 there’s no consequence for blowing the marriage up…for her, at least.

  51. As far as the procedure goes, I would definitely pay the $80 bucks extra for the laughing gas first. In fact, it should be offered as a package deal.

    I would not want any man to witness Stage 1 of the procedure with a Nurse Ratched or some Igor waving around a syringe anywhere near my fuzzy nuggets.

  52. @yareally

    It’s funny how our guy brains work to be honest :

    ” – Can you approach the hottie in this mixed set at the bar?
    – I don’t know man, I’ll have another drink and maybe I’ll go. But I need a haircut, and she looks like a mean girl, she will probably shut me down, and one of those guys is probably her BF and he’ll bash my head in because he is bigger than me and blablabla”

    ” – Can you stay alpha for 40+ years without slipping once, and if you do you have good chances of losing your kids and half your stuff
    – DONT WORRY BRO, I GOT IT”

    It’s like how 90% of drivers think they are in the highest quintile, same with students passing exams, people thinking their jobs will never be replaced etc.
    We are under-confident when it comes to concrete direct action, but over-confident when it comes to longer term consequences

  53. @constrainedlocus
    “As far as the procedure goes, I would definitely pay the $80 bucks extra for the laughing gas first. In fact, it should be offered as a package deal.”

    lol for real though it’s just an injection. I don’t get the guys who are like “oh man a needle in my junk?? NOPE I’ll risk pregnancies thanks!”

    But what if this is all a ruse…maybe Vasalgel is designed to stop working after a few months/years so that we all end up having a bunch of babies since birth rates are dropping?? :O lol

    I will be amazed if it’s available here though…there’s no WAY this doesn’t get blocked hardcore the same way they want to try to block sexbots and shit.

    I don’t even know what a world with male contraceptive would look like when you factor in all those other dynamics I listed:

    “All these elements are coming together at about the same time (Vasalgel, VR, MGTOW movement, hollywood divorces every week, Feminism overstepping it’s bounds, all these post-wall women realizing no one wants them, egg-freezing, university kangaroo rape courts, social media name/career slander, etc etc)…society 25-50 years from now will look nothing like it does now.”

    Like, Vasalgel NOW, if it appeared tomorrow, the impact it would have would be one thing…but Vasalgel PLUS all those other dynamics all coming into play and escalating over the next 25 years…That’s a hell of a thought experiment, I gotta sit down and think that one through…

  54. @yareally

    Did you see my FR from a few days ago?

    https://therationalmale.com/2016/09/13/stalling-for-time/comment-page-3/#comment-170200

    Did a lot of two sets and pulling. Unfortunately I cant do as many FRs for a bit, but I think I am just going to try and do them on sunday mostly. there were an unusual number of girls out last time, hope it isn’t a fluke

    @pua

    anyone interested in notes on Pimp by Julien? I’m typing up my notes now on the bulletpoints from it, since its hard to “flip” back through videos real quick. I could post them when I finish them here in a week or so. I’ve found that what I have so far is very helpful on reviewing important points from Pimp.

  55. @sfer

    Brad Pitt left People magazine’s most beautiful person of 2013 to marry People magazine’s most beautiful person of 2004 with whom he cheated on to go out with People magazine’s most beautiful person of 2006 with whom he cheated on with another movie star. The reason I can tell he is a beta is [30 minutes of Keyboard jockeying]. Sad!

    I was gonna suggest you discuss how good looks are really only good for a few initial IOIs and have very little bearing on mindset or good Game with YaReally,…

    …but that’s none of my business.

  56. @yareally

    yeah…don’t like those notes style lol. Mine is way more streamlined and easier to look through — for me anyway. thanks though.

  57. Are you all retarded?
    We have had this option for decades!
    Inject 250 mg or more of testosterone weekly and you will become infertile but incredibly horny at the same time.
    Estrogen is the female sex hormone and was the main component of the early versions of female birth control pills, testosterone is the male sex hormone and when taken in sufficient quantity (200+mg/week ) performs the same function with the extra benefits of high T levels.
    Seriously? $1000 for vasagel ?? 😂😂😂 I could supply you with high grade T for 5 years for that and you would have many other benefits other than birth control too 😋.

  58. @playdontpay

    Seriously? $1000 for vasagel ?? 😂😂😂 I could supply you with high grade T for 5 years for that and you would have many other benefits other than birth control too 😋.

    Like shrunken balls, roid rage, and jiggly boobies?

    ;P

  59. @Rollo
    “I was gonna suggest you discuss how good looks are really only good for a few initial IOIs and have very little bearing on mindset or good Game with YaReally,…”

    No idea what you’re trying to say, less vague hinting, moar actual words plz lol

  60. @Walawala

    And here’s where I nearly spit out my coffee at what was clearly sarcasm but is in effect Red Pill truth:

    “”Here is one of the most regressive notions about marriage—that it is ultimately a woman’s responsibility to maintain it, whatever the cost.””

    Do you want a woman who resents your success and Who’s jealousy is based on bringing you down…so she can feel better about herself.

    Guys it’s critical to know your worth and not fall into her frame.

    Agree with your sentiments. It is about vetting.

    Your Plate #3 has been properly vetted. And she is not passing the testing.

    In regards to YaReally wanting to discuss vetting, I would advise him to read Practical Female Psychology for the Practical Man by Joseph W. South and Franco–in regards to vetting. The book is not even properly formatted well in the Kindle format that costs $10 (possibly because I converted it to EPUB) and the free versions online are poorly formatted.

    It does give a good framework to vet and it give practical advice on vettinig for PUA (Via Early Frame Announcements) as well as for LTR’s (as in the mother of your children type).

    The overarching theme is stay the fuck away from Low Self Esteem Women.

    Now unfortunately, the Practical Psychology framework is not very summarizable, because the vetting awareness and practical advice is convoluted and has many variables including Materialista, Adventuresss (Angelina Jolies’s type with her low self esteem) and Good Girl (including high and low sex drive ones).

    Angelina was always the lowest of low in the self esteem department. Type in her name and self estteem into Google search:

    “Oh, God, I struggle with low self-esteem all the time! I think everyone does. I have so much wrong with me, it’s unbelievable! Angelina Jolie”
    ________
    Urbanette: Are you ever insecure?

    Angelina: Oh, God, I struggle with low self-esteem all the time! I think everyone does. I have so much wrong with me. I’m odd looking. Sometimes I think I look like a funny muppet.

    Urbanette: How do you find true happiness?

    Angelina: We come to love not by finding the perfect person, but by learning to see an imperfect person perfectly. Love one person, take care of them until you die. You know, raise kids. Have a good life. Be a good friend. And try to be completely who you are. And figure out what you personally love. And go after it with everything you’ve got no matter how much it takes.

    She was always an adventuress with low self-esteem and loved herself first as much as possible until she had children. And Brad was always going to be third. Dare I say it is not her fault? It was his for not being aware or being able to do anything about his being placed third for the last ten years. I don’t think he ever had a chance. I’m not blaming him and he’ll turn out fine.

    What was Angelina Jolie’s value to Brad Pitt after she filled up her nest with six children, three of which were not Brad Pittfail’s?

    What was her attention spent on? Children orphans on the other other side of the world while she neglected actually raising her children with discipline and didn’t treat Brad well in the last two years after they got married.

    After they actually got married it was all down hill from there. The marriage was a manipulative betatization move on her part. He failed that shit test (and her gambit failed). He should never have gotten married.

    Since he failed the shit test, her respect for Brad tanked and she then went all in on herself and the the kids (in a failing manner).

    She surgically had her femininity removed. I’m not judging her for this, but it is a fact. She was afraid of death from breast cancer. And at that point the traces of femininity she had left were just that. And her bioidentical hormone replacement wasn’t even a replacement.

    I’m sure Brad was a natural before Thelma and Louise, but he could have used some red pill awareness about 10 years ago. He shouldn’t allowed her to adopt two of her children after he got with her.

    It wasn’t all of the sudden. She set him up for all of the sudden, as someone said a year before. They were fighting like cats and dogs for the past year. Being a natural (just being himself). He probably didn’t have any ability to learn dad and mom relationship game beyond 50/50 relationship game.

    Angelina tried to Betatize Brad. He should have walked away two years ago when her value to him declined and he tried blue pill tactics why she turned up the Betatization dial up to 11. He should try to get custody of his three natural children only and move on gladly. There is nothing left to salvage behind him.

    First link here:

    https://www.google.com/search?q=married+red+pill+reddit+Female+stages+of+manipulation&oq=married+red+pill+reddit+Female+stages+of+manipulation&aqs=chrome..69i57.20957j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

  61. Last two paragraphs from that last link on Female Stages of Betatization by Joseph South and Franco:

    Putting a price to your leadership also means having your own moral standards, whereby it’s subcommunicated from the beginning and throughout the relationship that you, as a man, expect certain behaviors and certain types of treatment from the female, if she is to retain your interest in being her leader and protector. As we discussed in the chapters on Screening and Female Self-Esteem, certain women, obviously, will never he able to submit to male leadership, no matter how strong you are. Self-Determination This stage is a very strong signal from the woman that — in her mind — the relationship has ended, or is about to end. She is effectively telling you that she no longer views the two of you as a unit. As difficult as it may seem, at this stage you may need to be prepared to let her go. Your best chance to salvage the relationship may be to start right back at the beginning; let her know that you are equally prepared to leave the relationship if you are not getting the respect and admiration that you want and deserve.

    You never want to be in a position where you are chasing or begging a woman. Not only is that a pathetic position for a man to find himself in, but any shred of sexual attraction that had remained in the woman will be completely destroyed by such actions. In reality, a man can survive just about anything, including the ending of a cherished relationship. Therefore, consider this stage as the ultimate test of how much of a man you really are. If you fail this test, the game is over with this particular woman.

  62. @SJF
    “In regards to YaReally wanting to discuss vetting, I would advise him to read Practical Female Psychology for the Practical Man by Joseph W. South and Franco–in regards to vetting”

    Saw it when you posted it in the marriage thread. But 1) it needs updating to account for 2016 culture/dynamics/changes, 2) it needs to be more concise and less flowery for most guys to bother with it, and 3) it needs action plans VS just “screen for girls who aren’t low self-esteem” oh okay HOW exactly give us a step by step or some things we can pro-actively to do screen faster.

    Same things I said in that thread: we should have guys pro-actively screening in year 1 instead of knowing not to waste time on a low self-esteem chick but not find out she’s low self-esteem until year 4 when he’s already massively invested in her and the relationship, etc

  63. ” . . . okay HOW exactly give us a step by step . . .”

    1. Let off the gas.
    2. Apply the brake with the left edge of your foot. You’re going to need the right edge later.
    3. Depress the clutch.
    4. Shift into neutral.
    5. Let out the clutch.
    5. Dab the gas with the right edge of your foot just enough to match gear speeds.
    6. Depress the clutch.
    7. Shift down.
    8. Let out the clutch.
    9. Back on the gas.
    10. Don’t forget to steer while you’re doing all of this.

    There, now you know how. Piece of cake.

  64. Don’t worry. Just watch. Dubious FDA Vasogel drug approval trial studies are coming … which will then be picked up and fueled by the high exposure from FI-backed mass media.

    Something along the lines of: “Numerous studies have linked Vasogel to alarmingly higher risks of testicular cancer and/or permanent male ED and impotence…”

    The mere thought of (never mind the actual veracity) will serve to scare the majority dutiful blue pillers back into their proper cages.

  65. Vasagel may evoke the law of unintended consequences and open up unforseable consequences, opening up Pandora’s box has a way of biting you on the arse.

    First there is a potential of creating a genetic bottle neck by reducing the number of men impregnating women. I’m certain a small pool of the scum of society will have no problem with pregnancy serving clucky women.

    Second, the cream of the crop alphas won’t reproduce, too much fun to be had.

    Third, artificial insemination will explode overnight and the cost of semen will hit the stratosphere. It will no longer be the purview of the dregs of society, how many alphas will knock back 10 grand to jack off in a cup.

    Fourth, single motherhood won’t be abated, if anything it will increase in the middle class and upper classes. Single mothers will be the norm.

    The name of the game of reproduction is genetic diversity, Pareto and 80/20 take a back seat to biodiversity. Implicit in 80/20 is that alphas don’t reproduce alphas.

    I’ve lived in low genetic diversity cultures (cousin marrying cousins Middle Eastern Cultures) and it’s a nightmare, low I.Q and high rates of retardation.

  66. @Anonymous Reader – on the “doctors agree” point – while it’s true that medicine (and a lot of other science) has been twisted by Big Pharma financial incentives (sometimes in outright corrupt and illegal ways but mostly subtler ones), the fact is there are also plenty of things on which “Doctors agree” that are actually true (as far as we know in 2016, blah blah).

    @SJF – Why the distinction between the adopted and biological kids? Assuming he actually wanted to adopt them too (and wasn’t just bullied into it by her), he’s every bit their father as much as the other kids (I am not familiar with the details of Brangelina’s personal life – I am assuming we are talking here about a joint decision to adopt orphan kids with no parents – not Brad being bullied to take on Jolie’s kids from a previous relationship, which is a different kettle of fish)

  67. “..it needs updating to account for 2016 culture/dynamics/changes..”

    Hey, I agree. It was poorly organized, but I think that no man out there interested in game should fail to read older stuff. Just like no one out there interested in game should not fail to read Mystery Method.

    Or that any man that wants to have his own children with a woman should not ever fail to read the married red pill reddit sidebar material. Before he actually needs to assimilate this classic information.

    “….but not find out she’s low self-esteem until year 4 when he’s already massively invested in her and the relationship”

    I wouldn’t spend more than 18 months vetting a LTR prospect.

    Well within the NRE time frame.

    And don’t get me started about relying only on NRE. After NRE wears off, Relationship energy can be generated at any point along the time frame of a relationship. Thanks to the manosphere. The info is out there if a guy has desire and there is actually value in the relationship and in her after fucking her. Unfortunately it takes work to learn how to do this and yes plans can fail.

    Klem mentioned: “We are under-confident when it comes to concrete direct action, but over-confident when it comes to longer term consequences.

    Don’t call your shots. Take them as they come.

    TIP #51 from Little Book of Talent by Daniel Coyle

    KEEP YOUR BIG GOALS SECRET

    While it’s natural and oh so tempting to want to announce big goals, it’s smarter to keep them to yourself. In a 2009 experiment at New York University, 163 subjects were given a difficult work project and forty-five minutes to spend on it. Half the subjects were told to announce their goals, while half were told to keep quiet. The subjects who announced their goals quit after only an average of thirty-three minutes, and reported feeling satisfied with their work. Those who kept their mouths shut, however, worked the entire forty-five minutes, and remained strongly motivated. (In fact, when the experiment ended, they wanted to keep working.)

    Telling others about your big goals makes them less likely to happen, because it creates an unconscious payoff—tricking our brains into thinking we’ve already accomplished the goal. Keeping our big goals to ourselves is one of the smartest goals we can set.

  68. Sentient

    Ah, okay then point taken – that’s different.

    Still sad from the kids perspective – I actually know some kids (twins) like that (now adults). Mom left dad for second husband when they were like 5 or so and they grew up calling Husband 2 “Dad” (I can’t remember if he legally adopted them) and also had a younger half-sister. All three kids had Husband 2’s last name too.

    They were pretty upset when he walked out of the marriage when they were in late teens and the younger kid was about 11, and the subject of a custody battle.

    I heard the story from the Mom’s side and there were lots of accusations of “emotional abuse” and stuff..but post Red Pill it’s hard to know how seriously to take those. Like obviously it happens sometimes, but you never know if any particular allegation is true..

  69. @Culum

    Jolie adopted then-seven-month-old Maddox, and Zahara three years later – while both were later adopted by Pitt as their blue-pill-relationship blossomed.

    The third child was adopted by Jolie herself because of Vietnam’s laws about letting unmarried couples adopt. You can say she cheated. (Vietnam might have actually know something that Jolie and Pitt didn’t at the time.)

    Six children may not be too many for Pitt’s $250 mil net worth and Jolie’s 150 million net worth (nannies) and all. But in my estimation, the problem was in actually parenting them and actually having a sexual, polar (masculine/feminine complementary) relationship among the parents.

    They did the 50/50 non-complementary thing. He became less masculine and she became more masculine and less feminine. And somehow he lost respect as a father and a husband in her eyes.

    They couldn’t manage the management. My contention is because it was too many children. And lack of ability. Bit off more than they could chew.

    My assumption is she wanted him. I assume he would have been better off without them. But that is speculation on my part and my opinion only. (Who knows what his pursuit and passion is? And whether he compromised himself.) The good thing is I don’t think the children will suffer at all (even if they end up spoiled). I think they will thrive as persons.

  70. Culum

    “Never know if an allegation is true”

    Care to imagine how the following line of questioning will play out in family court? You, know with witnesses callled and testimony etc.

    “Mr. Yareally… You are petitioning for custody. Just how many… What do call them… Plates? Fuckbuddies? Just how many do you have over on the weekends you want to have visitation. I remind you sir you are under oath.”

    If you think custody fights as a playa are going to be smoother. Lol.

  71. @Sentient
    “Just how many do you have over on the weekends you want to have visitation”

    WUT TEH JUDGE WONT LET ME TAEK TEH KIDS TO THE NIGHTCLUB TO HOOLD PUSSY OPEN FOR MY DICK TO GO INSIDE?!?!!?!11111

    Zero, your honor. Under oath. Discretion and all.

  72. @Anonymous Reader: To your list add the military as a test bed for mandatory albeit temporary male sterilization: we’ll be told the cost saving of not having to dismiss pregnant female soldiers from the theater as well as ensuring training costs are recouped by the female really deploying.

    If the male military members are sterile, it will be interesting to see what happens when a female soldier is impregnated by a civilian and subsequently dismissed from the theater. Dishonor? Shamed? Doubtful.

  73. @Sentient
    “Care to imagine how the following line of questioning will play out in family court? You, know with witnesses callled and testimony etc.”

    How many times did you bring the stripper you were fucking home to play with the kids? Under oath.

    Or is this another of your “rules for thee, not for me” situations where YOU have self-control and discretion but OTHER men need rules and restrictions.

  74. @SFJ Yes, there is an element of “If it can happen to a guy like Brad Pitt imagine….” and then add the rest about any other married Blue Pill guy.

    Vetting. Interesting post and insights. Plate #3 I was very clear in terms of what I wanted and what I expected. She just alternated between trying to get me to feel sorry for her and ridiculing my expectations but not wanting to leave or end things= pure ambivalence.

    But when as a Red Pill guy you lay it down for a girl that you know she’s not pulling her weight and as I put it: “Step up or fuck off” it instilled dread. We’ll see whether this produces any behavioural changes or more shit-testing. We’re set to meet up later this week.

    Back to the Angela Jolie/Brad Pitt break up, what stands out for me in that story is the demonization of Pitt for “doing what dudes do”. The Feminist Imperative dictates that women now can be both the damsel in distress and the woman hear me roar and there’s absolutely no incongruity with that while men are supposed to be sensitive and strong and …..whatever whatever.

    When a man leaves or threatens to leave as I am doing with Plate #3 i’m a dick. When a woman leaves…it’s because a man is ….(fill in the blank).

    Hypergamy is tacitly accepted while a man’s needs for attention and affection are ridiculed. Pitt seeks that in another woman—what an awful cad. Angelina meantime can jet-set around the world, invest all her time in everything but Brad and that’s seen as a price paid for commitment.

    The only perspective I gain is by having a rotation. When I had only one girlfriend that I invested in, I had no frame of reference. When she shit-tested or ridiculed or mocked some part of my life…I accepted this and had to find a way to accommodate. Now I can see while AWALT….not all women are like that at the same time.

    I think it’s hard for many guys raised in a Blue Pill world to actually feel good about putting their needs first and making their lives a priority in any relationship.

  75. @SJF – Yeah, the 6 kids thing sounds insane. Like that’s hard work anytime but at least in the old days on a farm or whatever everyone just hung out on the farm together and worked and saw each other all day. How the hell do you actually actively parent 6 kids in 2016??

    @Sentient/YaReally – I have actually *been* a witness called in a custody battle in family court to give evidence on the Mom’s behalf and was cross-examined by the Dad (who was fool enough to represent himself). Not the family mentioned above – different custody battle.

    Probably better not to go into too many details but suffice to say: crazy highly strung post-Wall chick who could be an Eat Pray Love cliche has kid at 40 with an equally crazy dude with delusions of grandeur (dude is intelligent, good looking, great shape for early 40s, has a good professional job and plenty of money – but you meet him and you can just feel he’s a bit nutso – like his grasp on reality isn’t the strongest and he’s kind of manic, but very intense – you can see how that translates to a strong frame and is attractive to chicks).

    Unsurprisingly things went south very quickly, cue the allegations of emotional abuse plus I personally saw him acting a bit unhinged at times, along the lines of threatening to take his daughter away so he could spend time with her because he hadn’t seen her since Mom left – and I had to testify about some of that (some of the other specifics about what he allegedly did in private do sound bad, but post-Red Pill I’m just questioning that sort of stuff more and more. I don’t think the Mom outright lied (she was close to my aunt and I happened to be around for some of the conversations when she initially left the guy) but so much of this stuff is context based – like “he raised his voice and did X and scared me” could mean anything.

    Similarly “He was really controlling and made me feel coerced about having sex after I gave birth to my daughter” could mean anything from a joke about when she would be ready to have sex to physically holding her down and forcing her.

    And some kids ARE better off away from their dads..maybe the little girl is really going to be better off away from her father (he lost the custody battle of course) because he genuinely came across as unstable to me, but I just look at all this stuff differently now.

    Last I heard he’s found some other woman and has actually had kids with her and they seem to be happy although he doesn’t see his first daughter. while the single mom’s flakiness and lack of job and 24/7 focus on her now-10 year old daughter mean she hasn’t had a relationship in years – not sure if she’s even had any dates..

  76. Ya

    Hey a few pages ago you were advocating and open poly relationship, so you’re baby mama is going to know who your girls are.

    And when in a custody fight she can leverage these facts watcha gonna do? You can be sure her attorney will push this advantage.

    Sorry to tell you. If you are married and not seeking a divorce I’d say you are in a much better position in court than an open poly relationship.

    But hey Brad did not get divorce raped… Like millions of guys, mostly young, who simply have no assets and wife makes same or more then they do.

  77. Culum

    Yeah have relatives been through the same thing… For years. And my kids have been called for families they babysat for etc.

    An open poly relationship sounds like a slam dunk for the mom. On top of all the other leverage.

  78. “I think it’s hard for many guys raised in a Blue Pill world to actually feel good about putting their needs first and making their lives a priority in any relationship.”

    Isn’t that why the internet was developed, why Rollo lectures on red pill awareness and why YaReally cares to explain game? Of course it is hard. But we are men. And we try not to be Blue Pill.

    “Plate #3 I was very clear in terms of what I wanted and what I expected.”

    That’s you keeping Frame. Frame is not power when you vet a girl and she doesn’t actually measure up to your standards. If the Plate #3 can’t come around despite your dominant Frame, then she can’t come around. (The signs are there and you are not Superman.)

    I have still been listening to Dr. Laura Schlessinger on long drives. She is red pill and has been hearing-it-all in counseling sessions for 40 years (the same damn thing over and over in different context). She calls callers out all the time because the vettee behavior was there all the time originally. The vetter was blind or refused to see the signs. Dr. Laura is also big on the longer the vettee has been used to this type of behavior, the less likely that you cannot change them, so practical advice is to accept their behavior, or move on.

    That’s what plate theory is all about. Some plates do crash to the ground.
    (Sorry, I got no actionable list. Still just theory. Umm, sorry?)

  79. Having been Funkissed [all juice and no seeds] for 22 years now,I don’t think this shift in prerogative will effect me,for another five years or so.When as has been said,female competition [hypergamy]will increase.By this time I may have to color the top of my head for the paul newman effect.

    It is interesting that seemingly most women don’t get the full implications of the male prerogative in birth control,on the contrary they are more than happy to be relieved of the responsibility.Must be they are to short sighted to realize the loss of power.Looking back 22 yrs Mrs Box was more than happy with me being funkissed,although she had already optimized her hypergamy,secured commitment and succesfully reproduced.I believe she saw it as insurance against other women with children laying a claim to me.Sort of like a presuposition of my infidelity hmmm.?

  80. Haha@Sentient.

    I’m going! I have a work drinks thing I need to attend then probably checking out some hotel bars nearby. I could do with a break from the nonstop kiddie clubs.

    @YaReally – dude, I agreed with your logic on the marriage discussion last time around (although I wanted – and still do -to understand where the successful married guys were coming from), but hadn’t considered the impact of poly relationships (esp for the guy) in the context of a custody battle.

    That is a totally new angle and as Sentient says any half-way decent attorney can make a guy in a pLTR type arrangement look like Satan – or at least some kind of unhinged loser playboy irresponsible manchild sex addict type. At least in the current social climate. You joke about skipping ball practice with your son to go South Beach or whatever – but that IS the image of you they will be portraying.

    In a weird way, in the context of a custody battle (not the actual relationship with the woman – just the custody battle part) it’s actually BETTER to be in a monoLTR/marriage and be cheating because unlike in a pLTR you’re not giving your primary girl all the ammunition she needs to hang you in court (yes, mixed metaphors I know) by being open about stuff. Like her attorney can’t cross-examine you on stuff she doesn’t tell him about you know?

    That doesn’t mean you can’t have a pLTR (and who knows, given all the other limitations of legal marriage/monoLTR you may decide the trade off is worth it) but you sure as hell need to be clear that this kind of lifestyle will be serious ammo against you in a custody battle and you have to add preparation for it into the plan. Like I know you’re already planning stuff like “be an involved dad” (that’s a good idea in itself lol) and “build evidence to prove you were an involved dad and attending PTA meetings and knowing the name of your son’s second best friend” etc. You need to crank that up 100x AND be prepared with evidence to prove how your poly lifestyle was kept separate from the kids and didn’t affect them etc.

    It’s one more wrinkle.

  81. @ walawala

    ” @SFJ Yes, there is an element of “If it can happen to a guy like Brad Pitt imagine….” and then add the rest about any other married Blue Pill guy.”

    TBH, Pitt is just a guy. He’s an actor. We don’t really know anything at all about him. We are guessing and assuming mostly. My motto is Anything can happen to Any guy – barring preparation.

    ” Back to the Angela Jolie/Brad Pitt break up, what stands out for me in that story is the demonization of Pitt for “doing what dudes do”. The Feminist Imperative dictates that women now can be both the damsel in distress and the woman hear me roar and there’s absolutely no incongruity with that while men are supposed to be sensitive and strong and …..whatever whatever.

    When a man leaves or threatens to leave as I am doing with Plate #3 i’m a dick. When a woman leaves…it’s because a man is ….(fill in the blank).

    Hypergamy is tacitly accepted while a man’s needs for attention and affection are ridiculed. Pitt seeks that in another woman—what an awful cad. Angelina meantime can jet-set around the world, invest all her time in everything but Brad and that’s seen as a price paid for commitment.

    The only perspective I gain is by having a rotation. When I had only one girlfriend that I invested in, I had no frame of reference. When she shit-tested or ridiculed or mocked some part of my life…I accepted this and had to find a way to accommodate. Now I can see while AWALT….not all women are like that at the same time. ”

    The demonization of Pitt shouldn’t matter to men, and by default this means that it shouldn’t matter. Of course the FI is gonna FI.

    Don’t ever get caught up in worrying about what ” women ” think. Lol, that’s a lost battle right there.

    AWALT is by degrees, always. If you are not dealing with a crazy, low self esteem chick, there are sides of her that you may never, ever see if you don’t trigger them. But you can rest assured that they are there, beneath the surface. Your actions may just push them ever deeper, and that’s a great thing.

    Skill. Knowledge. Awareness.

    I cosign SJF’s 18 month vetting timeline. It’s been my experience that the timeline may even be shrunk down to 12 months, but that depends highly on the woman. Some are better at hiding shit than others. Some like to play more games than others. As always, test the fuck out of a new prospect, listen to what/how she says what she says, but ALWAYS watch what she does. This is paramount.

    Any mocking or ridicule that is sincere and not a joke ( jokes go sideways sometimes ) is cause for immediate dismissal imo.

    One last bit.

    A man’s need for affection and attention is really his problem. A woman is not ever obligated to provide these things, Men desperately need to understand this right here. Women can be coaxed, trained, and thrilled into providing you with what you need. Basically they become like fresh clay waiting to be molded. Ignore your role in the molding and you will not get what you require over the long haul.

    This too is part of the vetting process. Will she take direction or will she compete and demand ” equality “? Is she willing to be lead?

    I’ve read lotsa shit here about being ” alpha ” for 40 years or what ever. That’s not the point at all. If you have understanding, why would you falter? If you’re faking it, sure, you are gonna slip up when you get tired and complacent. Understand that relationships with women are not magic. They operate under certain rules and guidelines. This is where AWALT will usually work in your favor.

    It’s a beautiful thing. Ha ha haaa….

  82. …oh yeah

    Lol, fuck Brad Pitt.

    Damn celebrities man. We don’t have royalty here, so we replace them with celebrities.

    I care as much about them as they care about me.

    ZFG.

  83. Rollo

    Will you do a post on the Alex Smith RSDvrape trial. The New Yorker has picked up the story.

    Heartiste has a post up…

    Watch it playas…

  84. Inject 250 mg or more of testosterone weekly and you will become infertile but incredibly horny at the same time.

    TRT makes you LESS fertile, not infertile.

    Also doesn’t always shrink your nuts.

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