Never Take a Woman Fishing

never_fishing

(h/t to Zelscorpion for the image and ref for today’s post)

Hi Rollo,
On rereading Truth to Power a very inspirational post, I wanted to hear your thoughts on men with families such as my self choosing to travel on vacation alone.

In your videos above you touched on masculine qualities men being in the driver seat around decision making. I have a wife you as with many women is cultured to try assume headship of the household with decision making even vacations etc.

She doesn’t want to travel abroad as we have a 7 month old son where as I feel there is no reason why she should worry about doing so. Anyway the crux of the issue is I am only 28 years old and having sacrificed my independence early (at 25) have a desire to travel and I don’t care about rocking the boat to make that happen.

I would love to hear some advice about the benefits of and good ways of grabbing hold again of control of our own circumstances and decisions!

Never take a woman fishing.

That’s a little idiom I learned way before I was Red Pill aware from the guy who was the best man at my wedding, and my long time fishing buddy. I wouldn’t call him a philosopher, but he was a keen observer of women’s behavior and became salt-of-the-earth wise by default:

“When you take a woman fishing you’re trying to include them in something they really don’t want to be doing, but you like it a lot. So you think ‘I like fishing and I want to include her in something we can do together’, but when you do she complains about EVERYTHING. ‘It’s dirty, I’m cold, I’m hot, I didn’t bring a water bottle, where’s the sunscreen?, there’s too many bugs, why are there so many bugs?, why do we have to hike so far to fish? can’t we just find a spot by the dam? where’s the bathroom?, etc. etc.”

“So what do you do? You force yourself to make her comfortable the whole damn time. You don’t hike, you don’t scout for the sweet spots on the river or, God forbid, you try to get her in a kayak. You end up going out after breakfast and the light’s all wrong. You try to keep them clean and close to the ‘potty’, you bait their hook ’cause it’s filthy, you untangle their reel snarls,…what you don’t do is fish. Your whole trip becomes about making her ‘like’ fishing with you and not about actually fishing and doing all the things we do when we fish together or on our own. I mean, you want ’em to like it, but you’ll never teach them to like it because you’re too busy making everything right for ’em.”

“Unless they were brought up right and they dig fishing ’cause their Dad taught ’em to like it, never try to bring a woman fishing. They gotta come to liking it on their own, they gotta want to do it on their own. I mean, look at Dodge (our dog) he don’t care if it’s cold or 4am, he’s happy to be on the trail going wherever the fuck we’re headed.”

Back in May Zelscorpion tweeted a few of the pictures from this series and made an interesting point:

https://twitter.com/Zelcorpion/status/599493741573971969

I had to admit, he’s got a point and it reminded me of the sage words of my Best Man. I think one of the tragedies of men’s Blue Pill conditioning is the presumption that they must find a way, sometimes forcibly, to become more compatible with a woman. I wrote about the paradox of compatibility a while back:

It’s very entertaining for me to hear guys reason as to why they got into yoga, or my all time favorite, salsa dancing as some means of meeting girls. I mean really, if that’s the goal you choose to devote the precious few hours of your leisure time to then I suppose a guy ought to take up scrap-booking or zumba.

If you’re picking up a hobby in order to meet women all you’re doing is attempting to Identify with what you expect your idealized woman to appreciate. If you get into something for this reason it’s not a hobby, it’s a Buffer.

Successful men don’t chase success – success chases them. Women are going to expect you to have your own uncontrived, interests, passions and hobbies established before meeting them.

When I first began counseling men in my SoSuave days many times I’d read guys telling me, “Well if she’s not into the same things I am she’s just not the ‘right’ girl for me”, as if common interests were some criteria that would trump his sexual interests in a girl. Blue Pill idealism convinces men that the “right girl” will necessarily love doing the same things as himself, but the all too common Red Pill truth is that men will have their peak experiences in life alone or in the company of other men who share the passions and interests their wives simply have no interest in.

Peak Experience

I don’t subscribe to Maslow’s theories in whole, but I do think his Peak Experience idea has merit. There will be times and achievements in your life that will stand out as significantly memorable. It’s easy to point to the experiences that should be the most significant; a marriage, the birth of a child, a religious experience, a first kiss, a school graduation, etc., you get the idea – experiences that should be the standard fare in a romanticized, idealistic sense.

We tend to overblow these experiences because we think they should be something to etch in our consciousness; and if we don’t, well, then there must be something wrong with us for not appreciating their popular significance. Tragically it’s our negative experiences that have the most lasting effect on us; evolution has made pain something memorable so as to help us avoid potentially life-ending future experiences. But the events that should evoke lasting good memories, the ones we are taught should be significant, are often the ones we ruin with unrealistic expectations, or we build up only to have them not quite live up to the fantasy we make of them.

The Peak Experiences I’m talking about here aren’t planned, or are just loosely planned by necessity. Some of the most memorable events you’ll ever experience wont be ones that you had a forethought about. These are often the experiences we hope to recreate long after they occur, but prove impossible to really recapture. Much of what makes up our personal preferences in life come from these spontaneous Peak Experiences. Remember the first girl you got with? Remember that time when things aligned just perfectly for you to hit that hole in one?

One of the reasons I have such a passion for snowmobiles was due to a day I blew off work so I could go out for the entire day on a beautiful Lake Tahoe morning. I went on my own which is something I rarely did. It was a Wednesday so there was nobody on the trails. The snow was only a day old and I took my sled to the top of a place called High Meadows, but even this pristine place wasn’t high enough. I took off in the back country and got to the top of a peak that was as high as I dared to go alone. Once I got there I had a view of the lake that I imagine few people had experienced. Then I fell back on the seat of my sled and stared at a sky that was so blue I never thought of it in the same way again. I laid there for a long time just staring and thinking about life and living and God and the universe.

On my way down the hill I thought how cool it would be to bring Mrs. Tomassi up there so she could appreciate it too. I mean, why wouldn’t I want to share such an incredible Peak Experience with the woman I love; the woman I want to share my life with? To this day Mrs. T has only been on my sled about 3 times. She’s very self-cautious and doesn’t like the smell and sound of the engine. That might seem trivial, but no matter how much I can try to relate that experience or try to recapture it no one but myself will ever have that unique event.

Experience & Frame

When I look at the guy with his dog in these camping shots I can now appreciate them much more because I know he’s experienced that same uniqueness. When you plan an event with a woman, when you make efforts to bring her into an appreciation of something you enjoy the experience of you must remember that you are, in essence, negotiating for her genuine desire to do so.

Now, before I’m run up the flagpole for suggesting otherwise, yes I know that many men and women do in fact find pleasure in commonly held interests. I see women on the river fishing in waders and at Trout Unlimited events all the time. My point isn’t the interest itself, but rather the desire to participate in it. A lot of guys hold the belief that including their wife, girlfriend or even a girl they’re spinning as a plate in something they think she should enjoy will have the effect of bringing them closer. The inherent problem with this is the presumption that including her in it will lead to some new shared experience that will bond them both in a genuine way.

The problem with preplanned ‘date nights’ is the same problem men experience with trying to pull a woman into his Frame by insisting she take up one of his hobbies or passions; it’s contrived and feels disingenuous to her. The point of the experience becomes about her being involved in it and not the actual doing of whatever it is you do together. The vibe becomes one of him making and controlling that experience so it becomes something pleasurable for her to participate in rather than really finding some inherent reward from it due to genuine interest.

Thus you get guys who (figuratively) take their women fishing and the event becomes more about introducing her to it than actually catching fish. Guys get so caught up in controlling unpleasant variables for her that the real experience of fishing is something entirely different. They want that woman to feel the same joy he does in doing something intrinsically rewarding to him, but the truth of it is she must come to it on her own.

Always Maintain Your Individualism

And this leads us back, once again, to establishing and maintaining a positive, dominant and individualistic Frame with a woman. She must want to enter your reality for it to be a genuine desire on her part – you cannot lead her into it, she must enter it of her own volition. Spontaneity is the key. Whether it’s an ‘insta-date’ from a PUA perspective, or an unexpected twist of plans in your marriage, that woman must want to participate in that event, in that moment of her own accord.

A good test of genuine interest with a woman is less about how open she is to trying “your things” and more about how insistent she is instigating her own participation in them. The trap most Betas fall into is converting “his things” into “our things” and he compromises those previously rewarding experiences into a sideshow he hopes will bond he and his woman together.

In Male Space I made this point:

When the influence of feminine-primacy is introduced into social settings made up mainly by men and male-interests, the dynamics and purpose of that group changes. The purpose becomes less about the endeavor itself and more about adherence to the feminine-inclusionary aspect of that endeavor. It starts to become less about being the best or most passionate at what they do, and more about being acceptable to the influence of the Feminine Imperative while attempting maintaining the former level of interest in the endeavor.

A similar dynamic plays out when men try to open the Male Space of whatever it is they find individually enjoyable to the women they hope will share in his enthusiasm. One thing I learned very early on in my marriage was the absolutely vital importance of maintaining my individual identity apart from my wife.

The biggest mistake I made when I was involved in LTRs prior to meeting my wife was allowing myself to get caught up in the equalist idea that since both men and women were functional equals we should necessarily base our compatibility estimates on how alike we were in interests. Consequently I progressively began convincing myself that I found their interests fascinating, but in doing so I slipped into their Frame. I was too scared of losing a woman and was too necessitous to experiment with doing what I should have – insisting on maintaining my individual interests and maintaining my own reality for a woman to enter.

I was fortunate in that Mrs. T expected me to control the Frame from the start of our relationship. I’ll admit, at the time it was something very unfamiliar to me to have a woman expect me to prioritize my interests above her own, but the purpose of this was establishing a Frame she wanted to enter into. Today I adamantly insist on having a life that is apart from her, but she can enter into if she has a real interest in it. This blog is just one extension of that dynamic.

If you are to maintain a dominant Frame with a woman you must necessarily set your interests apart from her own. You must still insist on your individualized identity and the experiences that set you apart from her in order to maintain a reality in which she continually wishes to genuinely be a part of.

Ted had a great comment from last week’s thread that speaks to this:

I don’t expect my wife to be like a man with male interests. I expect her to be a human with human interests. Something deeper than pop culture anyway.

I know a little bit about a whole lot of stuff. I’m willing to chat about any number of subjects other than tech and politics. It just has to he something better than what’s on TV and the weather. I keep hearing women can do anything a man can, so let’s see some intellectual debate!

More often than not truths must be brought to women by men. It’s uniquely refreshing when women have the critical insight to look for truths, but it’s refreshing because it’s rare – and it’s refreshing when they seek them from a man who’s Frame she’s chosen to be a part of. One of the best aspects of the principle of Amused Mastery is that, if you actually have the mastery that comes from individualized experience, it makes maintaining a positive, dominant and enjoyable Frame much easier with the same woman.

Published by Rollo Tomassi

Author of The Rational Male and The Rational Male, Preventive Medicine

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teddj4g
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teddj4g
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“God definitely does punish those who are thankless and arrogant. Thankfully, I’m not one of them. I thank God everyday for what He has given me.”

So Emily, you view yourself as a model of humility? I’d vote you came in here showing arrogance, and your demeanor certainly comes across as thankless in regards to how casually you seem to be spending your fathers money. But keep on thanking Him and going to confession to get rid of those nasty sins. I’m sure He isn’t keeping tabs…

Emily
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^ If you actually believe that rubbish you posted then I feel sorry for your wife. If you believe women are so inferior to you, then your marriage will just adopt a ‘master/servant’ dynamic. Women don’t divorce men for their money moron. If our man is loving, caring and faithful than of course we won’t divorce him. Contrary to what Rollo teaches you guys, most divorces are a result of infidelity (55%) and abuse (30%). Why shouldn’t guys get married right out of college? marriage brings stability. My bf is 23. My daddy was 21 when he got married to… Read more »

Liz
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“Btw, I didnt notice it until Rollo pointed it out, but you are a completely different person on BGR Liz. Kinda odd.”

Funny…now that you mention it, you’re different too.
I didn’t notice you telling anyone to shut the fuck up, calling people morons, misogynists, masochistic, attention whores, or talking about “freeloading parents” how can’t afford to send their kids to college.
Odd.

Blaximus
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…lmfao

Blaximus
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” Women don’t divorce men for their money moron. If our man is loving, caring and faithful than of course we won’t divorce him.”

Stop the presses!!!!

Liz
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What’s most interesting to me Emily is, you seem to have idea whatsoever how arrogantly you come across. Perhaps THAT has something to do with my change in “demeanor”? Just maybe?
I’ve come across people like you in real life, but online people can usually read what they’ve written and think better than to say it (unless they are actively trying to come across as arrogant, which happens, but in your case you truly seem to have no idea)

keyser Soze
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Emily the caring hole,

“My daddy was 21 when he got married to my mom, who was the same age. ”

Can you tell us why your “daddy” married a 26 y.o?
What happened to your mommy?

Ps,
Your spineless bf might be beating off with your step mom in his mind.

CaveClown
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I actually sat down one day and calculated how much richer I would of been if I had stayed single…

…it was an eye opener.

And that was before I had to give her “her half” that *I* earned for her.

Shit, I’d be sipping margaritas on a beach somewhere by now.

kfg
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kfg
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” . . . what’s entertaining to the men here is that you honestly believe they’re novel.”

Sophomoric: The itch to be original. -Pete Seeger.

keyser Soze
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Marriage bring stability to Emily who was sexually very active + $100 k in debt to be stabilized/paid by you future hard working spineless 23 y.o bf.

God(and yourself) forgiven your past N count, and soon your bf (spineless) will forgive your $100k debt.
Yaaaay, Christian stability.

teddj4g
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Emily – “If you believe women are so inferior to you, then your marriage will just adopt a ‘master/servant’ dynamic.” Women are not inferior to men. Women are different than men. Comparing the two is asking for disappointment. Start there and work your way forward. I don’t want a sex slave. In fact, you’d probably be shocked by how much I prefer my wife to be self sufficient and independent. I already have kids, I don’t need an adult one too. If I had to direct her all the time, I would tire of it quickly. This’ll get your blood… Read more »

SJF
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SJF: ” I went to a better college than you and your daddy”

Emily: “Highly unlikely.”

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Liz
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“Liz, it really is amazing how bitter you got about my tuition and ‘prestige’ remark.”

What you are interpreting as “bitterness” is not bitterness but disgust.
I don’t like arrogant people.
I know no other way to react to:
“you just don’t understand that knowledge is important for its own sake”,
“I just study whatever interests me because there’s no way I will ever want to put anything I learn to useful purpose”,
“you don’t understand prestige and my crowd”,
“freeloading parents blah blah..”,
and so forth.

Arrogance bothers me a lot more than pejoratives.

teddj4g
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But Liz, she thanks God everyday and surely goes to confession on the regular. wink

SJF
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You know what is odd? I just remembered. I went to a Catholic University. And I didn’t get laid once in college. But it was a spectacular University. When I went there it was 75% men and 25% women. 50% of the women fell in the would-not-bang category. So I took advantage of the educational landscape and learned how to learn extremely well. I would choose it all over in a millisecond. (And was much better than Emily’s. I can tell by her postings.). I’m sure her’s is fine. But mine was better. But then again, I actually applied myself.… Read more »

Liz
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Was it Boston college, SJF?

Liz
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The son of a close friend of mine goes there.
They have a great deal of money but she is the opposite of arrogant.
She was an RN for while too.

Emily
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@Rollo “Single men have a far greater net worth than married men because, statistically, they retain more of the money they earn” Your children are part of your net worth. Anyway, women actually have much more to gain than men for delaying marriage, so why don’t I support it? The reason is because it’s a selfish thing to do, and it’s bad for society. I support the choices and lifestyles that lead to a productive, moral society. You support the choices that would, presumably, maximize your pleasure and ‘net worth’ (though there is also evidence that married men in their… Read more »

SJF
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No, it was even better than Boston college. But I probably would have gotten laid more if I went to Boston College. I have no disrespect for religion. My college experience was extremely secular. And I have no ill will for those that choose self discipline. I learned self-discipline in sublimating my sexual desires and elevating my intellectual capacities here: http://static.tumblr.com/037492653c81d851f407688101cd58d7/jtzu4dx/Ov6n30hgn/tumblr_static_dome_feature_block.jpg.jpg My intellectual mastery carried me far beyond mere religious epiphanies (which leave a man lacking in real life and in modern society). And the long hours I spent studying in this library were the easiest time of life: http://www.indianablacklibrarians.org/hesburghlib.jpg… Read more »

SJF
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Emily, elevate your game. You are clinically retarded.

Dragonfly
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Emily… I actually do agree with a lot of what’s being said here to you. My dad would have died if I had told him I wanted to major in philosophy in college. Ever since I was little, they tried to steer me in the direction of sensible choices, and to them, one of the most important choice you could make was the skills you learned after high school. I knew what I wanted to do by the time I was 9, and mostly because they helped me understand what made money, what was useful, and what I liked to… Read more »

Liz
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“‘Freeloaders’ means the lazy, not the poor. That’s quite obvious.”
Not in the context you used it: “All it takes is 5,000 a year!”

“And if you have a problem with ‘my crowd’ and my criticism of the lazy, you really should just go pick up your copy of the Communist Manifesto.”

I give up. You are to social intelligence what nails are to a chalkboard.
It isn’t your “crowd”. It’s you! Bye Emily.

Blaximus
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“… I don’t have a problem obeying my bf, unless he asks me to do something against my religion.”. I hope the poor sap understands that ” religion ” comes before him. She said -” Don’t confuse my position. I’m a Christian and a supporter of complimentarian marriages.” After she said _” I have an issue with double standards…”. Clinically retarded indeed. Hey, Em, what about the intellectually lazy? ” Assume now that all women shared the same thought process as you. Well, all of us would then pursue careers and have lots of sex in our 20s. ‘ FI… Read more »

keyser Soze
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@Emily,
The more you talk, the more I know how fucked up your bf ( spineless) is AND for being with you.
Ps,
You haven’t told us why did your “daddy ” left your mother to fuck a 26 y.o?
How come you never talk about your mom,did she dump your “daddy” or he dumped her ?

keyser Soze
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Emily,
“Anyway, women actually have much more to gain than men for delaying marriage”
You mean riding the CC? + using your pussy pass?
Wow, NOW your talking.
In other words :
My bf ( spineless) or any other man should be lucky to marry me and pay my debt, cause, I’m doing him a favor instead of being sexually active (I have more to gain).
And God, he’d better keep on being nice otherwise…I’ll become a slut again.

keyser Soze
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This is the results of pussy commodification .
Emily added religion to it.
That’s not bad, not bad for 20 something y.o.

keyser Soze
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“Your children are part of your net worth.”

Children are part of a woman’s net worth.
You know that, don’t you?
This is another way of milking your ex husband with child support and having the house all for yourself.

Emily
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Thank you Dragonfly. I understand what you are saying, but as I said before, it’s not a useless degree. I’ll ask about a double major. But I really am not worried about my future. What did you study? @Rollo Thanks for the links. Okay, I’ll honestly look at the stats to see what the reasons behind divorce are. I mean, a woman has more invested in a relationship than a man does, you’d think she’d value her marriage more then and only divorce for serious reasons. But I could be wrong. I’ll look it up. I reaaally doubt it’s the… Read more »

keyser Soze
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Emily,
I understand.
I will look.
I.
I
I.
What a narcissist little bitch.

Emily
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Emily
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Keyser, stop trying so hard to get my attention.
It’s cute and all, but I’m not interested sad

keyser Soze
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Emily ,

“But I really am not worried about my future.”

You spoiled it you little bitch.
I wish you kept ignoring me.

Sun Wukong
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Jesus, this daft cunt is still going?

I knew she was young and stupid, I just didn’t realize how stupid.

keyser Soze
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I don’t remember I said 1 positive thing about that little bitch, and yet she thinks I’m in love with her!!.
It tells a lot about her knowing she’s nothing but a stupid attention whore hole.

Liz
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“I’m getting a philosophy degree fir 150,000 dollars!” Q: “Do you think it’s a good idea?” “Doesn’t matter, I’ll never use it anyway.” Q: “But what if you need to?” “I won’t! Ever.” Q: “But what if something happens? And even if it doesn’t don’t you want to have a useful skill even for around the home? That knowledge could come in handy.” “Nope! Your advice is worthless because I’m never going to work. You just dont’ understand the value of knowledge for its own sake. You know nothing about prestige. Why’s everyone judging me?!? Q: “Well, 150k is a… Read more »

SJF
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I like how you put the J in INTJ Liz. I’m a fan of being judgemental. Overall I think Rollo hit a home run with the original post/essay. My impression is that there are a lot of interpretations based on premises of men’s motives that are false. On Biblical Gender Roles blog, I think that Larry Soloman and Emily completely misinterpreted Rollo’s ideas of soft dread to imply he was employing dread actively and therefore it is cruel/misogynist/ and bad. In reality, Rollo is a natural and employs passive dread. He doesn’t actively game his wife. He leads. She is… Read more »

teddj4g
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“Emily could be drawn out. I tried to draw her out. Sorry, Emily, you deserved it for how you came into the comments section like a bull in a china shop. You speak with ignorance for how things really work.” So much this. Don’t taken it personal Emily. You self selected by your tone in the first comment you made. You stormed in here assuming you’d be treated as an equal, and this is probably one of the worst places to pull that, as a woman OR a man. In some ways the shit slung your way was our way… Read more »

kobayashii1681
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@mynameisemily”WAAAA!”:

“Your children are part of your net worth.
Anyway, women actually have much more to gain than men for delaying marriage, so why don’t I support it? The reason is because it’s a selfish thing to do, and it’s bad for society. I support the choices and lifestyles that lead to a productive, moral society. ”

And this neophyte claims to “do philosophy”…Might even see herself as, get this guys, “a critical thinker”. How would daddy feel about that 100k now?

Solipsism gone awry! To quote SJF…clinically retarded.

“I mean, a woman has more invested in a relationship than a man does,”
http://m.memegen.com/0kgrhh.jpg

Emily
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I didn’t take anything here personally folks. No need to apologize! It was all good rather entertaining tbh. I didn’t appreciate the insults towards my bf, but whatever, it’s not like you guys know whether he is ‘beta’ or not. And it’s not like I care. @Rollo From the article: “men, unlike women, are simply more comfortable keeping two lovers simultaneously. Husbands don’t have a problem screwing a mistress and coming home to a doting wife. Wives DO have a problem screwing around and maintaining a happy facade with their cucked beta hubbies.” So essentially, most men and women in… Read more »

SJF
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“…….it’s not like I care.”

Dear Emily, that is part of the problem–that you don’t care. And you saying that is most certainly a Beta Tell.

@Rollo
From the article:
“men, unlike women, are simply more comfortable keeping two lovers simultaneously. Husbands don’t have a problem screwing a mistress and coming home to a doting wife. Wives DO have a problem screwing around and maintaining a happy facade with their cucked beta hubbies.”

“So essentially, most men and women in general are not very committed, but women are much more honest.
Good to know. “

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SJF
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Heheh, Emily you remind me of a song. A young and foolish Emily went ridin out one dark and windy day Upon a ridge she rested as she went along her way When all at once a mighty gang of red-pilled men she saw Plowin through the raging internet and up a cloudy draw Their minds were still on fire and their hearts were made of steel Their eyes were black and shiny and their hot breath she could feel A bolt of fear went through her as they thundered through the ‘net For she saw the commentators comin hard… Read more »

Liz
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The cowgirl seemed to listen, but she didn’t hear a sound
Revealed this in her muddled speech as ghosts all gathered ‘round
Deflecting and rejecting left and right among the fray
Her deftly dandy daftness claimed, “Won’t learn a thing this day!”
And when the ghosts had tired, patience exhausted from nonplus,
Left a message: “Look for sympathy in the dictionary, shyte and syphillus”

SJF
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The song presents an image of misandrist blog readers hell – readers who are doomed to chase the Devil’s feminist ramblings for all eternity.

Liz
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Left out a word above. Intended to say “Look for sympathy in the dictionary, BETWEEN shyte and syphillus”

How the heck did that happen?

Emily
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@Liz, wow, you have a talent! Good for you.

@SJF
Why would I be concerned whether my man is ‘alpha’ or ‘beta?’ Doesn’t matter. He loves me and treats me well, thats what matters. Don’t confuse me with red pill women like Liz who think love is about being dominated, controlled and abused through ‘soft dread’ and discipline.

SJF
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You just made that up about Liz out of thin air. That is what is called an ad hominem.

Why do you think you should be concerned about whether your boyfriend and future husband and future father of your children is either alpha or beta? (And keep in mind Alpha/Beta is a mindset, not a demographic.)

https://www.reddit.com/r/TheRedPill/comments/3j7b3q/alpha_vs_beta_traits/

Keep in mind that even in the wolf packs the red pill draws it’s alpha/beta ideas from, the woman (and esp. her character) that a man has at his side matters.

keyser Soze
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keyser Soze
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@ Emily, Though one cannot find much difference between a Donkey and Mule, they have anatomical and physiological differences. People often find it hard to differentiate between the two — Donkey and Mule ‘“ as they are almost similar in their looks and ways. Donkey is a domesticated hoofed mammal, which is related to the horse. But a Donkey is smaller than a horse with long ears, short hair on the tail, short mane and a dark stripe along the back. A Mule is a hybrid animal from crossing a jack (male Donkey) and a mare (female horse). Well, the… Read more »

Liz
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Liz
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Thought this was pertinent on the subject of worthless degrees and the subject of female academic “accomplishment”: Prostitution to pay off student loan debt http://professorconfess.blogspot.kr/2015/11/prostitution-to-eliminate-student.html ” Yes, even those “cheap” community colleges bury students. CNN fails to ask a question about that, how it doesn’t seem to matter what kind of school, state, for-profit, or community college, victims end up stumbling out after a few years, deep in debt. We’re looking at schools in Michigan, Kentucky, and Nevada, and it doesn’t matter where, our higher education system is creating legions of victims. (snip) We’re told, from a very young age,… Read more »

Emily
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Emily
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I don’t buy it. And even if it’s true, what should we do about it? Have the government further subsidize universities? No way. It’s just human stupidity that’s the problem. The plan should be quite simple: Don’t attend a college you can’t afford, unless you are doing a STEM degree or have a scholarship! People need to hear this more, cause they don’t seem to get it. I also don’t buy that community college makes people go into debt. Really? I live in Texas. My university costs $42,000. It’s NOT for everyone. The average state college has a tuition of… Read more »

lh
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lh
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Here in Germany (and many other European countries) university is free for everyone with the necessary qualifications. It’s even free for Americans coming over to study here. I heard costs of travel and living here are often much cheaper than college in the US and you get international experience on top. I think there are even opportunities to study in English language.

Investing in a highly skilled and educated workforce pays off for a government big time.

Blaximus
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“.. My university costs $42,000. It’s NOT for everyone. …”

Meh.

Humble brag.

Emily
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@lh
And yet, our universities are the best, according to rankings.
You can’t just choose to make universities free… It’s very expensive. You have to raise taxes. Cut spending in other areas. That’s not something we should do, because it leads to many negative effects.

lh
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lh
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@Emily: Ranking these things is difficult, but as far as I know the top US universities are indeed the best, the average not though. And these days even the average is expensive. Education of the workforce is something government can finance very well by debt. A better educated workforce yields better taxes in the future without raising those. It’s not really an economic or financial question. You had it right up there: It’s about keeping those out who can’t afford it. That’s the whole purpose. Driving inequality up. And if you are already rich, this is good for you. If… Read more »

keyser Soze
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keyser Soze
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Emily, “”The plan should be quite simple: Don’t attend a college you can’t afford, unless you are doing a STEM degree or have a scholarship!” Comes from the mouth who owes $100k and made “daddy ” waste his money People need to hear this more, cause they don’t seem to get it. Aren’t the little bitch who said : you want to study what interests you and not necessarily STEM? The HORROR. “TLDR: If you are studying a non-STEM degree, make sure you can somewhat afford it.” You should tell that to yourself. “”You can’t just choose to make universities… Read more »

Emily
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Emily
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@lh. “It’s about keeping those out who can’t afford it.” No, that’s not the point. Universities like Harvard, Yale, Rice, won’t change their tuition even if state colleges are free. These universities are private. They mainly attract people who can afford it, or STEM geniuses, or people with scholarships. You should not attend these unis if you are gonna do a BA and need to borrow 150k to do it. That’s my point. As for state colleges, it should be an investment. The US already has too many people with college degrees as can be employed in the fields they… Read more »

CaveClown
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Emily,

Thank daddy, not God for your paid tuition.

I’m not being sarcastic either. God or luck or whatever did not allow him the ability to put you through school.

Be grateful to God that you were born to a hard working man in a western country, but be grateful to that man for your tuition.

Liz
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Liz
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“Investing in a highly skilled and educated workforce pays off for a government big time.”

If these workers were highly skilled, educated, and employable in a way that would pay off for society to educate them shouldn’t they be able to find said employment?

CaveClown
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Liz, Not necessarily. Depends on the industry really. If there are 100,000 electrician jobs available for instance, and 150,000 trained electricians, you’ve got either unemployment or people working in fields that they did not train for. But if you look at industries like technology, where only 83% of future jobs have a corresponding college student enrolled, then you have high demand for those skilled workers. The problem is “highly skilled” and “educated” are catch-all phrases that mean very little. WHAT skills? WHAT education? That is what matters. Doctors (especially GP’s) Nurses Plumbers Electricians Tech (of most any variety) Mechanics Engineers… Read more »

keyser Soze
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For emily http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20131125-why-the-stupid-say-theyre-smart

A Pittsburgh bank robber called McArthur Wheeler as an example, who was arrested in 1995 shortly after robbing two banks in broad daylight without wearing a mask or any other kind of disguise. When police showed him the security camera footage, he protested “But I wore the juice”. The hapless criminal believed that if you rubbed your face with lemon juice you would be invisible to security cameras.

Ps,
Who paid out your debt ” thank God ” ?

Blaximus
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” @Keyser, you are the least intelligent person here. Also, when did I say I owe 100k? I am zero dollars in debt, thank God.”

Funny, you calling someone else unintelligent.

I concur with other commenters here. You need to thank Daddy for your not being in crushing debt. God doesn’t care about your debt for college.

I have a question for you, since you seem to already have all of the fucking answers in life, why on earth even go to school?

Emily
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Emily
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Wow, Rollo, thank you for taking the time to educate me ❤
I’m obviously not gonna buy it, but from the reviews I can tell where he’s going, and I somewhat agree. As I said above, do not study a non-stem degree if money is a big issue.

Yes, it’s daddy who paid my tuition, but whenever I thank him for anything he says to not thank him but to thank God. Because it was God who made his business successful, God who gave me such a great father. Everything good comes from God.

keyser Soze
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keyser Soze
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“”Wow, Rollo, thank you for taking the time to educate me”” ((oh Rollo, finally you stopped ignoring me, it gives me tingle when you respond to me)). “”I’m obviously not gonna buy it , but from the reviews I can tell where he’s going, and I somewhat agree. As I said above, do not study a non-stem degree if money is a big issue.”” ((why educate myself when I have a dumb “daddy” and a dumbest bf who put me on a pedestal because I’m the Queen of entitlement cause. Remember ! I have a pussy ? Daaaah)). “”Yes, it’s… Read more »

Emily
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Emily
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^
I’m not in debt. I don’t have ‘tingles’ from men I don’t even know. I say ‘daddy’ out of habit. You are an idiot

Liz
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Liz
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Anonymous Reader
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Dammit, Liz, I have been staying as far away from Twatter as I can because I already expend too much time online as it is, so posting lolz like that is totally trolling for my attention to be diverted into yet another online sink hole.

Thanks. Thanks a whole lot. And I’ll be passing it on to people I know with college aged offspring, count on it.

rugby11ljh
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rugby11ljh
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The Peak Experience… I love those moments.

BADMAN
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BADMAN
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A great post Rollo, I always keep coming back to it. Remember the importance of maintaining your individuality is important in life and in dealing with women.

Dan

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