Jails & Churches

self-control

Slut Walkers & Soccer Moms

This picture has been making the rounds on Face Book recently. Last I looked it’d been shared about 89,000 times from the source I pulled it from. For the most part, what passes for some organized debate in most comment threads about this centered on a conflict between two factions of women – the responsible mothers and the ‘Slut Walk’ feministas faction of the femosphere.

Yes, ‘responsible mothers’ and Soccer Moms are in fact a very vocal part of the Feminine Imperative’s sphere of social control. It’s a mistake to believe women of a feminist bent are the only driving factor in influencing a feminine-primary social order. It’s not just grrrl-power demi-lesbians with fuschia hair, it’s that sensibly dressed lady in Target too. As I mentioned in last weeks post, Peak Hypergamy is yet to be settled, but until then the women who’s sexual strategy would best be served by keeping the ugliness of it secret will be at odds with women who proudly embrace open Hypergamy with gusto.

It’s easy to apply our Red Pill lens for such things as TV shows, popular music and media, and see the social undercurrent messaging of the Feminine Imperative, but there are some more subtle instances that need a proper lens focus on them. One trapping of the Red Pill lens is that aware men often overlook the more personal, more localized influence of the Feminine Imperative when they see the most public displays of it.

I’ve stated in prior posts that if you took a roomful of God-fearing traditionalist women and asked them if they identified as feminists the answers would range from “No” to a resounding “Hell no!” However, if you asked them specifics of how a woman’s role in society should be defined, what a woman’s obligations to a man ought to be, or in what way women’s influence in should be expressed in our culture (westernizing), then you would get your real answer.

Most traditionalist women would be appalled to be associated with anything bearing the Feminist® brand name, but still find themselves carrying the same flag when it comes to their rationalized beliefs. The ‘Sisterhood’ comes before all other considerations – be they politics, religion or personal interests – the Feminine Imperative is the common thread that underscores all intrasexual relations with women.

Tribe of the Sisterhood

In a social context, a principle strength of the Feminine Imperative is a presupposed, tribalistic sense of intrasexual belonging amongst women that transcends politics, race identity, religious conviction and ideology. We euphemistically refer to this dynamic as the sisterhood, but this female ‘belonging’ shares it’s roots in our foraging evolutionary past. Thus, women from starkly different cultures or socio-economic tiers still share that common theme of pre-known ‘oppression’ by the nebulous patriarchy.

One problem I have with recent rise of self-styled anti-feminist “Red Pill Women” is that while on the surface it appears that they are “pro-men”, the real impetus is that they are “anti-feminists”. In other words, their primary concern becomes one of opposing the methods and ideologies of how best to assert the influences of the Feminine Imperative they both ultimately serve. The common tribalism of the sisterhood is still present, but the applications of how best to instrument it is the source of that conflict.

This is what I believe we’re witnessing in debates of this nature; it is a conflict between women who’d be better served by keeping men confused and in doubt of the mechanics of Hypergamy versus women who believe they’d be better served in openly and proudly embracing Hypergamy. This is the primary reason women despise other women who are openly ‘Gold Diggers’ or ‘Attention Whores’, or even prostitutes – their method of optimizing their own hypergamous interests reveals their sex’s larger sexual strategy which they’d rather men not fully comprehend (until such time as they are ready to consolidate on men’s commitment).

It’s important that Red Pill men not be fooled into thinking that ‘traditionalist’ women are in anyway less predisposed to the influences of their sex’s imperatives. They’re not unique or better suited to a feminine role because of their ideology, they simply can’t afford to have sexual rivals with different methodologies competing for the same optimization of Hypergamy.

Social Saturation

This may seem an unlikely way to address the core issue of this notice to school administrators, but read me out here. There are two presumptions implied in this message. The first is the presumption that these school-age girls are being shamed by expecting them to adhere to some modicum of dressing to a certain standard – a standard they can expect once they exit school as well I should add.

The second is that these girls wearing shorts that are too short, and bra straps so noticeable as to draw attention from school administrators (God forbid a male teacher make such a judgement call) would be more concerned with the their educational prospects than influencing the boys in their environment is questionable.

And lastly the presumption is that boys of a certain age should be taught to control themselves to counter their synaptic wiring and biochemical responses and not ‘objectify’ the girls who take it upon themselves to dress provocatively.

These are relatively easy assessments to make about the intent of this note, however, what both factions of women debating this presume is a condition of feminine primacy. The feminine presumption is one that this school is nominally founded in male primacy – the girls distract the boys with their advertised sexuality – but the expectation is one based in the male Burden of Performance.

While it’s important for men to have an objective understanding of their burden of performance, it’s equally important for men to realize that women understand the utility of that burden and put it to their own opportunistic ends. In a feminine-primary perspective that burden translates into these boys needing to be taught to act against their biological impetus.

The shaming isn’t about girls having their education interrupted for wearing booty shorts or their tits pushed up by exposed bras; the implied shame is that these boys are not being instructed to understand that their burden is one of controlling the very biology that compels them to distraction. In a feminine-primary context the real “shame” should be on the boys who see girls (who are signaling sexual cues) as the sexual objects these girls are intentionally making of themselves.

The implied prioritization of undistracted education is presumed to be focused towards the males in the class, but the reality is that this education is taking place in a feminine-primary environment that is being inconvenienced by social standards.

The Feminine Expectation of Performance

Instead of adapting to the realities of their environment, women expect men to accommodate their sexual strategies and incorporate them into their accepted burden of performance.

CH maxim: The feminist goal is removing all constraints on female sexuality while maximally restricting male sexuality

This goal is eminently more achievable when men are taught that it is an aspect of their Burden of Performance to self-restrict their sexuality for a feminine-primary purpose. It was recently brought up in last week’s comments that the rise in unfettered, openly acknowledged Hypergamy is (or is becoming) a comparable condition to men’s unrestricted sexuality. The contrast of course was flipping the script and considering what the results would be if it were men who’s sexual strategy was unrestricted to the degree Hypergamy has currently.

In an exaggerated feminine-primary context, women like to believe this was once the case. Granted the apex fallacy is rife in that presumption, but the Feminine Imperative needs to establish a preexisting notion that women must necessarily suffer in a masculine-primary social order. That’s the presumptive social context this note was crafted in. The truth of the matter is that the Feminine Imperative cannot afford for both women and men to believe anything different if it is to remain the primary social influence.

This presumption is what brings women of conflicting ideological bents together in solidarity despite their disagreements; there is always a common enemy, a common opposition, in the belief that it’s men who are calling the shots for them. And as I said, this apex fallacy presumption is universal in that it transcends ideology and religious convictions. Thus we see similar social conventions used to maximally restrict male sexuality in those same institutions.

Holistic Game had an interesting take on this restriction this week:

I was raised Southern Baptist, then moved on to some form of megachurch-style evangelical Christianity in high school. I felt that sex before marriage was sinful, that lust was evil, and that the female body was a source of lurid temptation. It was a constant struggle not to look at porn. I remember being in a men’s young adult service when I was 24 and the pastor asked, with heads bowed, if any man in the room hadn’t looked at porn. I peeked and realized no one had raised their hand – every man in the room had indulged at some point. Though I couldn’t grasp it at the time, I’ve since come to understand that there is no point in repressing natural human desire.

I certainly couldn’t contain my urges forever, and ended up losing my virginity later that year. I was teaching guitar to a hot blonde beach babe a couple years older than me, and we got drinks one night. We fooled around, tipsily, and after a few weeks of on-and-off gropings I finally decided to fuck her. After the act was completed, I sat on her deck and looked at the ocean and searched myself. I never imagined the staining of my chastity happening in such a fashion, but I had to face the reality that it had happened. I tried to be honest with myself, and to my surprise, I found that I didn’t feel guilty. At all. The one thing I’d tried to save, that seemed to matter so much to God and his plans, I’d wasted on a stupid blonde I’d end up dumping. I should have felt overwhelmed by holy conviction, but didn’t feel anything but normality. I felt like I was finally part of the human race. This lack of guilt was the crack in the foundation that eventually led to the shattering of the whole rotten edifice.

Holistic expounds on this experience into doubting the existence of God (which I honestly think is a shame), but it’s important to understand how this presumptive state of male social primacy, and the necessity to mandate chastity as a man’s Burden of Performance has effects that go well beyond a man self-limiting his participation in his sexual strategy.

I think a necessary stage in becoming Red Pill aware is truly understanding not just our preconditioning, but the social environment that condition takes place within. This acknowledgement needs to take place in order to really unplug; it cannot simply be an acceptance that a guy was raised into his Blue Pill circumstance, he must also recognize the social conditions he’s still operating within, and he must recognize how to avoid the pitfalls and make the changes he wants to see in that world.

In a Blue Pill, feminine-primary social order plugged in men are left to participate in two institutions: jails and churches. I can imagine the frustration Red Pill men must feel when they see their friends trapped in those institutions. They see their friends in an endless tail-chasing of a performance of their own doing, but a result of their ‘teachers’ investing it in them. They contort in an endless self-expectation to be better men by self-defeating the essence that make them men. Then they are punished for the slightest infraction of acceding to that male essence, not so much by the women they hope to perform for, but rather a disappointment in themselves for not living up to what they believe are their own self-developed expectations of a standard that only serves the feminine.

Yes I know my enemies, they’re the teachers who taught me to fight me.

498 comments

  1. Insanity’s own words :

    “Something I find intriguing Eric, so many men seem to want to be valued sexually, not unlike women often are. But women seldom perceive men that way, we’re usually looking for something else, provision, protection, your higher selves, your confidence? It’s an elusive thing to try to name and sexuality plays a role there, but it is not the whole story.
    Often I think much misery could be alleviated if men and women would just accept that we are different and our attraction triggers are different. This is a good thing, it’s an awesome thing.
    A few times I’ve been compelled to say, hypergamy? Well shoot, this really starts to more resemble the nature of men than it does women….”

    When was the last time you saw a man wearing yoga pants?
    When was the last you saw a man wearing a thong?
    When was the last time you saw a man’s dick?

  2. And each time you feel compelled to “win,” you actually lose.

    for example, sports teams that feel compelled to win are actually losing? Just pick a bunch of things that involve winning, such as elections, games, bets, and amaze us (okay, only Rollo) with your insight

  3. Jupiter
    That’s okay, circumstances do that sometimes.She enjoyed the flirting so doubt she’s going to be too weirded out by it. She stops flirting, just say what’s up to her.
    Circumstances can make girls get extra willing, like knowing they won’t see you again. That’s why they can meet you at noon and bang you by midnight on vacation when the two of you live a country apart. But meet them at back home and you live within an hours drive, they have to get to know you. You know, there’s that secret mass murderer thing they have to watch out for.

  4. “When was the last time you saw a man wearing yoga pants?
    When was the last you saw a man wearing a thong?
    When was the last time you saw a man’s dick?”

    I saw all 3 this morning, but than again, I do live in the 9th circuit of hell, so that’s really not unusual. I also saw a man in pink heels and a satin miniskirt that ticked me off because he looked far better in them than I would.

    What’s your point?

  5. I think we have the opposite problem. Too many women dressing frumpy and unsexy. Feminism wants women to look as unattractive as possible . Modesty has gotten out of hand in the U.S. I would rather we become more like eastern Europe and Latin America where women doll themselves up and dress sexy.

  6. The ultimate goal of feminism is to persecute men for woman’s inability to perform at levels only men can in the intellectual realm primarily. Feminism tells us that where women cannot equal or exceed mans intellectual performance, man has by default automatic assumption oppressed her and prevented her ability to perform at her true level of ability. This assumption is founded on the assumption that her intellectual abilities equal or exceed his. Feminist con artists tell us a woman can do anything a man can do, except man prevents her from doing so due to his evil selfish, insecure, inferior nature. When performance is isolated where there is no possibility of his interference her failure to compete is always blamed on the playing field being male established ie “it’s a mans world” as if reality itself was established by the male gender to intentionally degrade and stifle women.

  7. @Water Cannon

    Ha, yup. Ted Bundy and John Wayne Gacy in the hometown house!

    Chicks are a chore, with short bursts of enjoyment thrown in. All the time I’ve personally had to spend figuring them out and unplugging – I probably could’ve invented something world-changing by now.

  8. This line of “reasoning” is feminist chicanery. No special intellect is required to recognize this or the fact that it is actually (although unmentionable) an admission of feminine inferiority apparent when comparing females to males regarding performance.

  9. Guys, it’s impossible to discuss these concepts with this IB woman. She doesn’t want to absorb and integrate it. That’s not what she’s here for – she has an agenda, albeit a disjointed one: to criticize and try to delegitimize Rollo.

    Ignore her.

  10. “I think we have the opposite problem. Too many women dressing frumpy and unsexy. Feminism wants women to look as unattractive as possible ”

    Totally agree with Jay Fink here.

    So why would a soccer mom like me want young girls to not have bra staps and thongs showing? Because it’s not really attractive, because it’s sloppy and cheap and that will begin to color her own perceptions of herself, convince her that her only worth and value as a human being is in her sexuality. Boys are nearly irrelevant in that equation, they’d oogle girls wearing pillow cases, but how does she perceive her own self?

    Although male attention is great fun, how girls and women dress is more about how we feel about our own selves.

  11. @kid

    “That’s not what she’s here for – she has an agenda, albeit a disjointed one: to criticize and try to delegitimize Rollo”

    that assuming a guy type thing

    she’s here for the feelings, and she feeds on Rollo’s replies, they give her the drama she is missing in her everyday dreary life

  12. Although male attention is great fun,…

    Ahh, finally, something to work with!

    Attention is the coin of the realm in girl world. Don’t kid yourself, it’s as much a need for women as sex is for men:
    http://therationalmale.com/2011/09/21/your-attention-please/

    … how girls and women dress is more about how we feel about our own selves.

    So if I came over to your house unannounced at like, 4 in the afternoon, you’d be wearing some sexy outfit ‘for yourself’ while you were vacuuming the house and not in sweatpants and a t-shirt?

    Once again, bullshit.

    http://therationalmale.com/2013/07/18/crisis-of-motive/

  13. Good point, red.

    I thank the gods for bra straps, and bras, in general. Not only do they give me a dexterous challenge in removal, but they keep those titties from going south, National Geographic style. All hail brassieres!

  14. “Although male attention is great fun, how girls and women dress is more about how we feel about our own selves.”

    LOL! I nearly wet myself laughing. But thanks for validating the OP as true and accurate.

  15. There is nowhere you can go that I haven’t already been.

    @redlight, as a posted upthread, IB comes to me for the tingles her husband doesn’t even know she needs.

  16. @ Kid Jupiter

    FYI, smiling and laughing at jokes is not a sign of attraction from a woman, most especially not when she’s performing a service job where kissing the customer’s ass is a job requirement.

    Smiles and laughter at one’s comments (unless they are truly deeply funny) is not a sign of sexual interest, it’s a sign of placating someone, manipulating them, and showing that you’re not a threat so they can trust you. This is in fact the number one con of women over men…they think smiles indicate sexual interest when they are really ways to win over a person with more power to your side. Have you ever been to a third world country where street vendors and con artists try to get you to buy something? What do they do? Put on a huge smile and act incredibly nice. To get something out of you.

    Smiles are what women do to men they want something from (which may just be his being not being hostile to her). It’s what subservient people give those in power so that the person is power either (a) gives them something, or (b) doesn’t harm them/will be nice to them.

    The actual sign of sexual attraction is a non-smiling, direct and very serious gaze. It’s animal, almost predatorial. A woman will give a dead serious face at a man with direct eye contact that is held for a second or two (which is a LONG time for two people who don’t know each other to look directly in each other’s eyes without smiling). Then she’ll look away. If she REALLY wants him she’s give him the “elevator” up and down look before making the eye contact.

    A lot of men have probably never actually seen this look and therefore may not know it exists. When a man gets it, I assure you, there is ZERO doubt between the woman giving it and the man receiving it of her interest. It’s called eye fucking. The look is the type that a pouty non-smiling supermodel gives when she stares directly and seriously at the camera. It is not the shit-eating smile that the people in fast food ads give.

    Smiles and laughter at non-funny everyday joking aren’t signs of attraction, it’s what people do for their bosses and customers and other people they want to manipulate.

    A chick in a bar who wants a guy sexually will not be smiling and giggling, she’ll be staring at him across the room with a drop dead serious expression.

    21 year old women do NOT genuinely flirt with or become attracted to 40-something year old men who are their customers. They manipulatively flirt and make appeasing gestures so that those men are nice to them and like them. That doesn’t mean you couldn’t fuck her, just saying if you think she was attracted to you based on her laughing at your jokes and not cutting off conversations with you that were non-sexual, you’re dreaming. I would imagine Rollo knows plenty about this, given that his work involves regularly hiring “bottle girls” to get guys to open their wallets.

  17. “IB comes to me for the tingles her husband doesn’t even know she needs.”

    You’re wrong, Tomassi, quite wrong. Also, it’s a bit sad that you don’t understand that you might have worth and value to me in other ways.

  18. @Kryptokate

    Point taken. I know the look of which you speak. But I’m actually a very funny guy in real life (if I must say so myself) and women seem to enjoy my company because I’m irreverant and make them laugh. Daresay, my funnies have even gotten me laid, egads! With service type girls! Double egads!

    There’s subtlety to humor, and you work with what you have at hand, in the moment. It’s an exercise in awareness in the moment. A lot of guys try to be funny, few succeed.

  20. @cupcake

    could you dumb-down and shorten your posts to IB’s level, you are setting a bad example

    your point is accurate. At a local grocery store, the cashier smiles at me but what most customers can’t see is a 7 item checklist that I’ve seen, where 1. and 7. are smile at the customer, 2. ask for loyalty card etc.). However there are other IOIs, such as absentmindedly playing with their hair. To learn, one can go to a bar, pick out what seems to be the best looking dude there, and watch the body language of the girls that interact with him.

  21. Wow! IB and Kryptokate commenting on the same.post! #blastfromthepast

    “…you might have worth and value to me in other ways…”

    Again IB confirms that most men are nothing more than are nothing more than “utility objects” for women to use and discard.
    She says she here’s to help us men. How exactly?

  22. “, it’s a bit sad that you don’t understand that you might have worth and value to me in other ways”

    this is so sweet, Rollo you can be both a AF and a BB, congrads

  24. aside due to Rollo evilly linking his attention article and I’m an attention gigolo

    I’m at work and need to arrange something with one of our technical people. She took a walk at lunch with her wonderful BFF. They continued talking after lunch, then it was coffee break time, so they left to talk there, and then came back after break to talk some more, and finally several hours later I had to intrude for 30 seconds, taking 5 FI hits of hull damage.

  25. There’s a lot of folks here don’t realize why Rollo interacts with IB and the like. She’s not another teacher like Rollo, and she ain’t another student like one of us. She’s a lab rat to provide experimental evidence. Nothing more.

    Don’t take anything she says personally. Just observe and document like any good scientist would. If you’re going to interact, do so only to observe the reaction.

  27. KryptoKate – “The actual sign of sexual attraction is a non-smiling, direct and very serious gaze. It’s animal, almost predatorial. A woman will give a dead serious face at a man with direct eye contact…”

    Describe the set of the eyes and brow please. Narrow, or wide eyes? Brow line does it dip as in a frown? Please such submit sketches if possible.

  28. Krytokate’s on the money. I was in a wedding this weekend, and I got to witness some German dude from Harvard spend all day ‘gaming’ one of the bridesmaids. I had had an hour or two conversation with her at he rehearsal dinner, she was cute and quite friendly. He seemed to take her intent interest in what he was saying, her smiles, her amenability to his boxing her off to other guy’s attention, her occasional hair flip, as signs that she was genuinely into him.

    Lol.

    I heard from the bride that she does this a lot. She’ll be very friendly with guys, talks with them a long time, but doesn’t let them touch her.

    After the wedding we hit a few bars, the wedding party and a few other younger people who were invited. I made a huge impression on the dance floor, got the place a bit abuzz, took control of the group of guys, and then went back to the table talking loudly and slamming glasses against the table. Almost boorish if it weren’t so congruent (the fancy suit probably helped too lol). She gave me a deer-in-headlights look when I threw myself into the seat, didn’t break it for a second or two. Then she started pushing the german dude with all sorts of tests – ‘you should go out there, c’mon, go and have fun,’ etc. He refused, and dragged her out of there a few minutes later to (I’m sure) approximately no action.

    As a man, you really need to learn the difference between attraction and arousal indicators for women. I’ve known a few girls – OK a lot of girls – who will flirt with guys all day for the attention. I look now for the unconscious things like pupil dilation, stroking erogenous areas, open mouth with wet lips, allowing close proximity and intimate contact, a throaty laugh upon innuendo, strategic display of or brushing against you with breasts/ass, and that sort of serious, fixated look that Kryptokate describes.

    The rest is just ‘being friendly’ – social manipulation, if you wish.

  29. @SunWukong

    “…She’s a lab rat to provide experimental evidence. Nothing more.”

    Truth.

  30. Keep in mind the difference in comments from IB and Rollo Tomassi are the differences in spouting off ideologies and explaining systems of practice. (I tried to quote the original blog articles upstream but it didn’t get through the WordPress shredder, so I will dispense with links.)

    Quoting Ian Ironwood:

    {Insanitybytes} mistakenly calls the Red Pill an “ideology”, similar to feminist or any other ideology. The thing is, the Red Pill isn’t an ideology, it’s a praxeology. Why does that matter? Isn’t that just an intellectual technicality? Actually, it makes all the difference.

    “Ideologies are belief systems which hold up ideals – moral, ethical, social – as standards by which to live or guide us. Humanism, Marxism, Christianity, and the Boy Scout Law are all ideologies of various sorts. They establish lofty goals toward which we aspire, celebrating unifying beliefs that, theoretically, guide our purposes.

    Praxeologies, on the other hand, are not systems of belief, they are systems of practice. They are not concerned with whether or not something lives up to a preconceived ideal, they are concerned with whether or not something actually works. Engineering, small engine repair, computer coding, fishing, and first aid are all praxeologies. The Red Pill is a praxeology, not an ideology. “

    And quoted from Hawaiian Libertarian (the Christian Morality stuff was part of his essay, not something I’m trying to introduce) :

    “Praxeology is the deductive study of human action based on the action axiom. The most common use of the term is in connection with the Austrian School of Economics, as established by economist Ludwig von Mises.”

    The deductive study of human action based on the action axiom…so what’s the action axiom?

    “An action axiom is an axiom that embodies a criterion for recommending action. Action axioms are of the form “If a condition holds, then the following should be done.”

    “Game as we’ve come to know it here on these fringes of teh Interwebz, is a Praxeology…i.e. Game is the deductive study of human sexuality and inter-relational behavior based on the action axiom – “If a condition holds, then the following should be done.”

    “Here is but one example that I can think of off the top of my head, that is a game-based action axiom:

    *** Women often “fitness test” or “shit test” men. Men interested in mating with a woman need to learn how to recognize when she does this. When he ascertains that in fact she is attempting to fitness test him, there are several known responses that other men have employed with varying degrees of success, such as “agree and amplify.”***

    Looking at game as an exercise in Praxeology should help those who struggle with the morality of accepting these ideas of game description and proscription, versus the vehement distaste for the immorality of promiscuity many (but not all) game proponents advocate and celebrate.

    While I am not trying to speak for anyone else here, I do believe the defining line between those of us in the MAndrosphere who are nominally Christian and advocate Christian Marriage (Vox, Dalrock et al), and see no conflict between Game and Christian morality, versus all the other Christians who are up in arms about it and repeatedly denounce it, is that those of us in favor, simply view game as a Praxeology; it is not a hard science, nor is it a moral code to live by. Rather, it is simply using deductive reasoning to come up with action axiom’s to describe the hows and whys of human intersexual attraction and mating behaviors.

    These action axioms are useful tools for men to recognize and reverse engineer the myriad of deliberately inculcated dysfunctional behaviors and characteristics that pervades societies institutions, mass media programming and subversion of our churches with the idolatry of Goddess worship. As more and more men embrace the axioms of the Game Praxeology, more and more discover anecdotally that they are based on observable truths regardless of the morality of the men doing the “testing in the field.”

    Just because men committed to Christian morality may take ideas from and discuss with the axiomatic truths of game with the immorally promiscuous PUAs, does not mean we are holding it up as a new religion, a new moral paradigm or a new idol to be worshiped blindly and in total faith; nor does it mean we are deifying or glorifying fornication, adultery and promiscuity.

    We are ALL fallen sinners. Based on our common, fallen and debased nature as sinners, throwing out the axiomatic truths of game simply because they are espoused by sexual sinners is akin to throwing out YOUR argument (any argument on any topic, that you choose to make) based on your own sinful nature.

    If one considers the ideas on their own merit, and not the person who is voicing the idea, there should be no moral problems with men employing the axiomatic actions prescribed by immoral game practitioners for his own use, to achieve his own Godly goals of sustaining the covenant of marriage and leading his family. “

  33. “That is if you are man enough to take it. I believe many of you are actually just beta pussies using Christianity to justify your unwillingness to embrace and own your masculinity and all it entails.”

    This is f*cking stupid . . . I’m sorry you have no greater aspirations in life than to stick your dick in it.

    “Glaze them up like donuts. Leave them sticky and confused. Next any one who gives you grief. This is a recipe for happiness.”

    Riiiight . . . that explains why so many of these successful PUA types burn out and fall apart.

    I wish I could be like you and be happy with banging out sluts like the biggest baboon on the block . . . not. I can literally never imagine wanting to switch my mind for yours; I wouldn’t do it for anything.

    BTW not a Christian nor particularly religious.

  34. @Forge

    Sounds like German dude was trying too hard. Trying too hard always leads to failure. Trying easier, on the other hand…

    @SJF

    Great comment, right on target.

    @Forge (again)

    Red light face turns to green light face if we do it right. No woman is just walking around through everyday life with green light face. Red light face is an invitation to disarm and build some rapport (not too much, lest we fall into Friendzone Quicksand). Then we can get her to green light face.

    It’s yellow light face that might be the problem. Or no light (indifference) face.

  36. I love that Dateonomics article. Apparently there are more women than men in college because women are smarter than men. Larry Summers lost his job as President of Harvard for even suggesting that there was a biological basis for differing numbers of female vs. male scientists, but apparently this is a perfectly acceptable conclusion.

  37. Keep in mind the difference in comments from IB and Rollo Tomassi are the differences in spouting off ideologies and explaining systems of practice

    Game is what works. Feminism is just more Marxist cowshit. Rollo helps men. Bytes wishes to enslave them.

    She is a useful specimen; an example of the aging, 2nd stage feminist who can’t stand the idea of men actually getting out of women’s control. Flaying her stupid misandry is instructive.

    And Bytes, dearie, we all know just what “useful” means to women.

  39. @Fred Flange, Master of Spoofs

    “Well well! This is the answer to what’s happening at big college campuses. Following on the no-dating discussion above, viddy this, O my brothers, courtesy of Dr. Helen and the Washington Post:”

    Their premise that college educated women are only interested in comparable men is blatantly false. A 24 year old college educated female in the U.S. is fucking her weed dealer who looks like Kid Rock (purple eyelids and all). The “creepy” computer science majors and engineers aren’t even on her radar, and if they try to talk to her they’re going to be labelled stalkers. It’s not that there are not enough available men (because there obviously are) it’s just that the available ones are not up to their standards.

    These articles are blatant horseshit meant to feed the female hamster. I got something about the 2015 census in the mail recently. The U.S. is gradually becoming more and more disproportionately male because men aren’t dying in wars and most of the population added through immigration is male. I can’t wait for the numbers to come out, it will confirm all the field reports (and my owns observations) that going out on the weekends in a major American city is a total sausagefest. I’m a male with a college degree and a professional degree in one of the cities mentioned in the article that has so many more college educated women than men. Do you think they’re ripping my dick out of my clothes every time I go out? I obviously wouldn’t be posting this shit at 1 AM on a Friday if there were girls knocking down my door to check out my diplomas and suck my dick.

    The game literature aimed at American males in 2015 basically tells them to “step up” to the point that they should be a bodybuilder, CEO, and club promoter / DJ if they want to get laid at all. Obviously, that isn’t fucking happening and the women are fucking pissed that these guys can’t all be celebrities, because they won’t settle for anything less.

  40. @Kid Jupiter

    “Red light face turns to green light face if we do it right. No woman is just walking around through everyday life with green light face. Red light face is an invitation to disarm and build some rapport (not too much, lest we fall into Friendzone Quicksand). Then we can get her to green light face.
    It’s yellow light face that might be the problem. Or no light (indifference) face.”

    Right. I suppose my terminology could be misleading. ‘Red light face’ isn’t a bad thing, initial friendliness is a good thing to build real attraction on. It just doesn’t indicate a specifically sexual interest. And if you’re stuck there for literally hours of interaction time with a girl you want to bang, you’re clearly doing something wrong.

  41. @Rollo Tommassi

    There is nowhere you can go that I haven’t already been.

    “Because I am a man.”

    http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=K3OXs_5AD2A

    @Not Born this morning
    Women are more important than men in politics went to my house today and while hearties was writing about trump and frame my sister was ripping him apart.

    @Jay fink
    “Modesty has gotten out of hand in the U.S. I would rather we become more like eastern Europe and Latin America where women doll themselves up and dress sexy.”
    Agreed

    @Vitriol
    “The game literature aimed at American males in 2015 basically tells them to “step up” to the point that they should be a bodybuilder, CEO, and club promoter / DJ if they want to get laid at all. Obviously, that isn’t fucking happening and the women are fucking pissed that these guys can’t all be celebrities, because they won’t settle for anything less.”

    I wouldn’t say that about this blog. It does both without pretension and awareness of how to adapt in 2015.

    Had the best Rugby practice today the male bonding is the best I can get other than this blog.

  42. @ Forge the Sky

    I was in earnest in my question.

    As a figurative artist body language and facial are essential to communication. The discreet points of facial expression are the most difficult in both concept and execution. What Kate described is, if accurate, valuable in that realm for me as well in real life.

    Thanks for the examples. I’ve seen the first several times and misunderstood it. I never have much credence to the second. I always assume the first example Redlight provides is bullshit.

  43. Teenage girl drives her “online” boyfriend to suicide via text:

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/teen-texts-boyfriends-suicide_55db712de4b04ae4970401b5

    Some quotes:
    “‘Everyone will be sad for a while but they will get over it and move on,’ 18-year-old Michelle Carter texted boyfriend Conrad Roy III in reference to him dying by suicide.”

    “When Roy expressed hesitancy at going through with his plan, Carter sent him text messages expressing her frustration. ‘You always say you’re gonna do it, but you never do,’ she texted. ‘I just want to make sure tonight is the real thing.'”

    “‘Like, honestly I could have stopped it,’ Carter said in a text to her friend months after Roy’s death. “I was the one on the phone with him and he got out of the car because [the carbon monoxide] was working and he got scared. I fucken [sic] told him to get back in.'”

    “The district attorney’s office argues that in the immediate days after Roy’s death, Carter “sought sympathy and attention” when she created a Facebook event to hold a baseball tournament fundraiser in Roy’s honor.”

    “‘I want to put myself out there to try to save as many other lives as possible,’ the event description read. When a friend of Roy’s mentioned the event on his Facebook page, Carter allegedly contacted him and asked: ‘You’re not taking credit for my idea though, right?'”

    Something tells me she’ll probably be acquitted.
    Why? Sperm is cheap; eggs are expensive. A lot of things stem from that small biological truth.

  44. In regards to the “seductive stare,” strippers usually have it nailed down. I remember the first time l experienced it at a strip club. It was like a jolt of lightning, then I remembered that I was dealing with a mercenary and that it wasn’t real. But the effect was undeniable.

  45. @doclove, that man is no longer a Christian because he grew up in a lie. It’s like being Truman in the Truman show. The hardcore Christians tell their men no sex until marriage, and then won’t marry off their daughters young. It’s a huge bait and switch, you reach a certain age and realize that you be been lied to your entire life. The so called people who loved you, and the entire way u view the world was a lie. It’s some heavy shit!! The supposed holiest leaders were using you, a d ur a tool. Wish I had a nickel for every late 20″s woman who found God. She also found the perfect beta well trained and waiting to give a well supported family.

  46. @NBTM: “When performance is isolated where there is no possibility of his interference her failure to compete is always blamed on the playing field being male established ie “it’s a mans world” as if reality itself was established by the male gender to intentionally degrade and stifle women.”

    This has now extended beyond intellectual abilities to the purely physical, with women claiming that they are just as strong as men, but as the weight lifting field is established by men that they are held back. If they were only “allowed” to lift like women, they could lift just as much as a man.

    Basic physics and physiology (Patriarchy!) be damned.

  47. @Kid – I quote – “Learn what? I didn’t do anything wrong or make any mistakes. I expressed my interest” – Listen up, you are doing way too much talking and not enough listening.

    You utterly fucked this approach up. First mistake? Expressing interest. What you want to do is fan the little ember of her interest. Expressing interest lowers your value in her eyes, you become easily available and that lowers your value.

    And you blew the shit test badly. But you set yourself up for it by telling her you were doing nothing this weekend. Tell her instead you are “plotting world domination” or “writing the world’s next great novel” or “practicing so you can win the World Pachinko championship”.

    The woman was interested or she never would have told you she had nothing to do this weekend. The easiest and most common lie a woman will tell you is what she’s doing. But you made yourself too available. A better close would have been, “Maybe I could take a break from world domination to hang for a bit if you bring over some burgers to grill.” Also, hand her your phone, and put the number in and text her immediately to confirm the number.

    You aren’t activating her fantasy hamster. You aren’t nurturing her interest. You have no game. It’s not a numbers game, fyi. If you keep up with this shit, you will never get laid.

    @Teddy – Lol, please keep playing the game not to win – uhh, isn’t that called playing to lose? And I get it, you aren’t willing to do what it takes to attract hot young “sluts” – I see your pic, you look like a grandpa. Why would a 20 something hottie want to fuck you for anything but cash? Don’t make a virtue of necessity…

    And don’t tell me you don’t want to fuck other woman – it’s innate in men. You may not act on it to preserve your LTR, fair enough, that’s your choice. But don’t lie to yourself most of all. All men want a variety of pussy, it’s how we are built. As for your moralizing about sluts, all I have to say is WAKE THE FUCK UP IT’S 2015. Women are much more sexually active in their prime years and are open about it and now feel they are entitled to act on their short term desires during that period of time. You shame them for this by calling them sluts – why? What is wrong with a young woman getting as much hot dick as she can while it’s plentiful for her?

    I can relate to them as this is the nature of male sexuality. I don’t shame my desires, why should I shame them for acting on their’s? As for reproducing – I’ve already done it and I can tell you that being a father is just as much of a shit deal as being a husband is in today’s society. There is no respect for fathers in society, in school, in most families or from most children. And given the risks of divorce or your babymomma moving in a new guy or moving away, signing up for fatherhood these days is ridiculous. And oh yeah, I don’t give a shit about the larger world and whether it collapses or not – I finally figured out that this kind of thinking is what kept the bit in my mouth. The larger world doesn’t give a flying fuck about my happiness or wellbeing. The social order we are in wants me to subjugate my interests, needs and desires to a femcentric, FI soaked social order. Fuck that. And having gotten over all that traditional crap is what has led to my happiness, versus grinding myself to death waiting for “someday” where all my efforts would be appreciated. 50 years of that shit and taking crap from the likes of cunts like InsanityBytes was quite enough, thanks. Now it’s about me, and my wants and my interests and my life. Period.

    @All – The pro-domme, 27 yr old, hard 7+ Nichole has circled back to me yet again. Seems dealing with subsmissive beta pussies makes her crave a dominant, confident real man. Lol.

    Three plates going now, and with each additional plate my game grows stronger with all of them because I’m less focused on any one of them.

  48. I think the difference you see here between what IB said and what KK said is generational. The older generation still seems to want to hide women’s sexuality behind this veneer of “wanting protection, provision, confidence” and so on, while the younger generation is up front about its raw, animal, visceral sexuality, which has nothing much at all to do with protection or provision, and is often raw and physical in nature. The openness about this is generational, and it runs hand in hand with the openness about hypergamy in action. It’s a generational difference, I think, among women.

  49. heir premise that college educated women are only interested in comparable men is blatantly false. A 24 year old college educated female in the U.S. is fucking her weed dealer who looks like Kid Rock (purple eyelids and all). The “creepy” computer science majors and engineers aren’t even on her radar, and if they try to talk to her they’re going to be labelled stalkers. It’s not that there are not enough available men (because there obviously are) it’s just that the available ones are not up to their standards.

    The thing is that analyses like that look at marrying and not fucking. So they’re talking about the frustration these women have when trying to find a guy to marry, at some point, and not the cock carousel which they are enjoying in the years before that.

  50. @Lucien – So what is your formula for success? Please share it with me as I’m hopelessly misguided I guess, lol. But oh yeah, I tried the tradcon thing for 50 years and got my liver ripped out and turned into a hat that the women in my life wore on their heads while they shit down my throat.

    You don’t want to fuck hot women? You don’t want multiples of them? Bullshit. You also assume I can’t have meaningful relationships with them, which is ridiculous. What I bring to the table is real value to these women and real honesty. I say “sticky and confused” as a wiseass statement that is meant to telegraph the self-orientation I now have versus the “cap’n save a ho” and pedestalization that characterized my entire life before the Red Pill.

    Donna, a 21 yr old I was with, told me that sex with me is one of the most serene and calming experience she’s had in her life (i intuitively knew that being rough with her didn’t feel right and instead am super gentle and sweet – we fuck for like an hour and a half in an easy way versus the pounding and throwing around I usually go for). She feels safe and heard and cared for and relaxed because there is no pressure of possession or control or her worrying about expectations of her. I now life-coach her and am helping her manage her life powerfully. I do this as she moves through “boyfriends” with no jealousy or need to have her be a certain way. Tell me, how many women have you given that kind of gift to in your life? How many women have you actually cared about in that way versus wanting them as some kind of validation of who you are?

    I’m able to access a love and wisdom and genuine caring for women as human beings now because they aren’t a symbol of my value. By making them mean less, I now can be emotionally available and invest with less fear and/or resentment when they don’t reciprocate.

    But I don’t tolerate cunts like IB. And I don’t take any shit from any woman ever. Funny, the 27 yr old Nichole who just circled back to me went away because I told her off for behaving disrespectfully towards me. Tell me, should i instead have “been a gentleman”?

    Loving the Beta White Knights here. Keep on riding your high horses fellas, I’ll keep having the time of my life.

  51. @ Kid True, being funny gets girls, I’m a huge sucker for funny guys. I was just pointing out that laughing at the type of everyday, not-really-funny but mildly jokey every day comments that men make is not an actual sign of sexual interest, especially in a customer service context. And it’s been well-proven in psychological research that men generally mistake everyday friendliness and smiling for attraction from women.

    @ Badpainter I can’t explain what’s going on with facial muscles, not much I think. It’s a non-smiling penetrating gaze, usually looking up from a tilted down head or looking to the side when one’s head isn’t pointed directly at the target. So either way the effect is sort of looking up/to the side through one’s eyelashes. If you google images of actress Eva Green, she has this look absolutely mastered. There might be a *slight* smile associated with the look, but if so it is a sort of challenging, smirking smile that says “what are you gonna come do?”, not a friendly, wide chirpy smile.

    This is much more likely to happen in a night-life type venue but can happen in a grocery store, in a business meeting, or walking down the street during the day too. Men give the same look, and when a man and woman mutually exchange it there is zero confusion between the two what it means. I have tested it many times in crowded situations like concerts or the subway, etc, and if exchanged the man WILL come over and approach you, or, if he’s very shy, at the least continuing to exchange the “look” with you in a very obvious way. Many times you can see this look being exchanged between two people who are both actually with other partners who are right there, perhaps holding the gazer’s hand, totally clueless, while both are basically telegraphing “I want to fuck you even though I’m with this other person.”

    Here’s a few examples:

    https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQ6Bg1PBqBOlCHsAko2O42WrAbfSpooyLTZXaixiUAD1i0NBanIOQ

    http://models.com/feed/uploads/1222440357_orig_McNeil3.jpg

    http://markdsikes.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/Lisa-Taylor-Photographer-Helmut-Newton-May-1975.png

  52. @scribblerg

    Who the fuck is this guy?

    Watch your tone with the other brothers, big boy.

  53. If being funny got you laid you’d see guys like Louie Anderson, Danny De Vito and Louis CK, swimming in top shelf pussy.

    It’s value added only if you’ve got a cocky & funny Alpha appeal to begin with.

  56. @Srib – lol not a grandpa yet, and hoping it stays that way for a few.

    I spent about 6 years getting less than 5 pity fucks a calendar. I’ve been desperate. But man, what the fuck would I do with a 25yo hottie after bed? My oldest is 21 and her friends although very attractive are vapid, naive, and shallow. I know you may not get this, but I enjoy having real conversations with my wife. No 21 year old gives a shit about politics, religion, or philosophy. My wife cares enough to at least know something about it.

    And sex? Yes I see women every day I’d consider banging. So what? I don’t long for them. My balls don’t ache for them. I don’t need to put in any effort for them. Sex is important, but for me its not nearly that important. As long as I’ve got a supply, I truly have no drive to go elsewhere. My balls are empty, so I have no hunger to resolve.

    Of course I’m here because AWALT, and that means if I want to keep my supply I need to game her. Cool. Gaming the same woman just gets easier.

    I understand you don’t see my POV, but despite all this modern crap, I still want a marriage. I’m not alone. So maybe instead of trying to convince all men women are whores and not worth marriage, you could help guys get what they actually want. Who are you to known whats really best for them? As long as they go into it eyes wide open, my take is help them succeed where many have failed.

    No disrespect for your lifestyle, but it ain’t for me.

  57. No disrespect for your lifestyle, but it ain’t for me.

    I’d love that lifestyle but I’m not going to give up my kids. Sigh. Instead I’ll just work my wife for threesomes or something.

  58. Loving the Beta White Knights here. Keep on riding your high horses fellas

    I don’t know why you think you’re so fucking awesome. You write like you’re begging for validation.

  59. And oh yeah, on the “seductive stare” lol, I just have to laugh. IOIs (indications of interest) come in many forms. The overt, “fuck me, fuck me, fuck me” look is only one of them. But even then, it’s a vaporous, ephemeral thing that any good Blue Pill or Beta guy can kill in a second by opening his mouth and letting his thirst talk.

    Best thing to do when a chick looks at you like that? After meeting her gaze solidly, turn to speak to another woman or a male friend. Make her wonder why it is you don’t run up to her spraying your pants like every other guy does when she gives them this look. Also, if you get looks like that from women (happened to me with some regularity when I was younger which is why i have an N of 70+ – stopped counting years ago), you get them regularly because you are clearly a very high value man that any women notices immediately. So it’s not that big a deal to you and you pass a lot of them up, especially when it’s a friend’s wife…

  61. @Tedd – Got it. As for what you do with a 25 yo after, the answer is whatever you want. I have a 27 yr old daughter, and no, I’m not going to be bringing a 25 yo to the family barbecue.

    But here’s the thing. Young women are with older guys like me BECAUSE I’m prequalified for short term mating. They often tell me they are sick of the young guys because “they catch feelings for me”, lol. The younger guys can’t deal with the fact that they are on the cock carousel. I get it and just want to be that ride on the carousel. I give off an “aging rock star” vibe. Many young woman have an older guy on their to do list but if they think for a second that you are qualifying to be their boyfriend, you are dead. My line when they shit test me that way? “Good thing I’m not looking to be your boyfriend.”

    But you want something different. I can’t say that I respect that because I think that desire is due to hanging on to self-destructive delusions which you are better off without. However, I completely respect that it’s your right to pursue your life as you see fit. Me? LTRs with a woman are simply not part of my repertoire these days and I’m truly happier than I’ve ever been in my life. I put up with exactly zero bullshit, which keeps the 40 somethings away cuz they can’t process a man who tells them to shut the fuck up sometimes. Funny how the 20 somethings actually don’t freak out as much when I tell them the same thing. But you see, I’m in a position of dominance with them and they actually respect me. Funny how that works, being respected and valued as an experienced, wise dominant man. The 40 somethings want me to play out their delusional fantasies about “40 being the new 30” and act like they are the catch. Lol. They are also all hopelessly crazy like IB by this age, so I’ve just stopped even dating them. Instead I’m in the gym like madman, eating super healthy, have a nice tan, wear attractive clothes and work on DHVing like crazy in the social circles I run in. Works like a charm and makes me happy.

    Also consider this post wall woman’s delusional state is the primary driver for Viagra and other ED meds. It’s not that you can’t get it up, it’s that you can’t get it up to fuck some wrinkled up, fat, sloppy, dried out, smelly old woman who doesn’t excite you. Some women do keep themselves up, but it’s the exception not the rule. And in this society, as a man, you are supposed to still want to fuck the rest of them anyway, it’s their right to be fucked properly well after they are attractive apparently.

  62. @ Kid
    ScribblerG has been a fixture here for a while. He is a genius and a fantastic mentor. (He changed screen names back a couple months ago to protect his offline identity). He is a genuine congruent masculine male that has been redeemed by TRM. His input here is nothing short of stellar. Give him a wide berth, he deserves it.

    @Tedd. I’m in your camp with the marriage is fine thing.

    Scribbler: “Some women do keep themselves up, but it’s the exception not the rule.”

    I have a marriage that is not just my ego investments telling me it is fine. It really is, and red pill/game has made it even finer. It’s up to the individual man to adapt and put himself in the best position possible for his sexual strategy. Be better at being a masculine male and self actualize as your best potential allows.

    ScribblerG has done a fine job of adapting to “and reverse engineering the myriad of deliberately inculcated dysfunctional behaviors and characteristics that pervades societies institutions, mass media programming and subversion of our churches with the idolatry of Goddess worship.”

  63. OMG !!!

    OMG !!!

    OMG !!!

    Somebody killed Cinderella !!!

    Has anyone else here noticed the very disproportionate amount of media time and attention focused on Alison Parker vs the camera man who was killed with her ? Her murder has been presented with significantly more focus, grief, shock and disappointment than the camera man. All propaganda scam producers are presenting more zoomed in close ups of her, more praise for her “Gods angel”, She is being hailed as A flawless most valuable positive energetic human while the camera mans murder and character takes a back seat essentially compared to the time and detail focus on her. The idealistic character they present her with is impossible for any human to be. Does anyone’s death entitle them to such an idealization? Does the camera mans death entitle him to less? Apparently his existence and his life is significantly less valuable in the minds of all journalists compared to hers.

  64. @ Vitriol
    When I brought up the Birger book and article I though it was clear my eyebrow was raised so high it popped off my forehead. Like Mr. T says, the numbers are right but the reasoning is superfucked Man Up and Marry Those Girl Genuises.

    The sexual landscape in the Time piece is even worse insofar as the article chronicles the blinders people refuse to remove. That conduct is understandable given the religious contexts. Actually eye-opening seeing it in regards to Mormons and the Orthodox – it makes Churchianity mating protocols easier to comprehend (not approve of – comprehend).

    This whole thread shows the perfect storm that has developed and will make the social fallout of the next 10 – 20 years fascinating to behold:

    1) bad demographics and education patterns – more women in college than men. This part Birger gets right. Compare what he chronicles with the Chinese upper middle class women and Japanese women in the same boat: they’ve worked hard. If they marry they’re fired. So anyone they might consider to marry must be richer than them.

    2) The women (there and here and Western Europe) are trapped in the Sheryl Sandberg hypergamy loop: fuck the bad boys, maybe marry the good boys who will be there waiting for you, but don’t marry down! They have to make more more more than the “marriageable” women.

    3)And for those in the Sandberg hypergamy loop, the man shortage is due to their focusing on the top 20% of men – the bad boy Alphas, homeless musicians or trust fund playboys – while dismissing the other 80% of men. That 20% is who is “cleaning up” with their choice buffet of hot Mormon gals. Same as it ever was. Even in those religious communities. They may not want to talk about it but it’s there, all over the Time piece. Remember a lot of those religious-based “nice guys” are in the Beta 80% as well. They have been shamed/beaten into incel status by the overall cultural “all men are rapists and that’s all they are” trope like other young men.

    4) But more and more men today AREN’T in a position to make more more more to provision the “marriageable” women who don’t need the money ‘coz they’re Strong and Independent (TM).. The new cultural economic meme for men has sunk in – give up, there’s no point to getting established and having a career, you played the game and your prize is NOTHING. Just get by, rent a room, fap to porn or hire a hooker if things get too tense, and keep your head down. Society won’t protect you, you have no duty to support society. Or feed it your children, who can be forfeit at any time.

    5) And last but not lost: the brainpounding inflicted on all men the past 30 years, including me and you: masculine expressions of sexuality are bad. (If you’re a Beta). To be a better man, be more like a woman. Share your feelings, unless you become clingy, on second thought don’t share your feelings, just say you do. Be a SNAG and women will come to you. Except they won’t, but if you complain about the covert contract not working out you’re an entitlemanned seximaliist pig who looks at women as objects. So don’t do that! Unless you’re a tingles-inducing alpha. Then sex positivity says women can look at you as objects. OK fine. But where have all of you good men gone? Why don’t you look at me?

    6)OK THIS is last: the Yes Means Yes desexualization of the new generation: whereby any approach, any unwanted looking or accidental brushing, let alone kino, is grounds for expulsion and (if the American Law Institute drafters get their way) arrest. This is what has been deemed best to protect our fainting-couch safe-space over-helicoptered college kids. And Birger wonders why there’s no dating? No approaching? Aren’t the boys just following the orders of their culturally intersectionalist superiors? Isn’t that what we wanted?

    So gals, you want kids, get out those turkey basters, or get knocked up by muscular guitarists. Then be ready to raise them yourselves (with your mom’s help maybe), producing an even more epicene generation of men, even further removed from Tingle-generating knowledge except for those few Alpha naturals who always seem to pop up.

  65. @ Kid – Lol. Listen to learn. When you are talking you aren’t learning. And you shared a field report that demonstrates you have no idea what the fuck you are doing. And then you won’t listen.

    Take the cotton out of your ears and stick it into your mouth.

  66. Scrib – different strokes man. Honestly and truly, I don’t want to have to talk to the vast majority of 20-something women out there. I’m not saying you are wrong, and I’m not denying Red Pill truths. I simply don’t aspire to be a pussy hound. It’s a need that I must fill, but I don’t have to fill it with variety.

    I won’t even try to compare my wife with a young hottie on raw sex appeal because there’s no comparison. But she’s plenty hot enough to perform for. I made it clear up front sex and attraction were important to me, and demonstrated it by dropping about 40lbs since we met. If she were to blimp out, I’d course correct or bail, and she knows it. I did my Church wedding and til death didn’t pan out. Since that’s out of the way, and I have my kids full time, I’m not at all concerned over divorce IF it ever comes to it again. There’s nothing she can take from me that I’m afraid to lose. It’s a mercenary state of mind, but necessary for me to get what I want. Make no mistake, I love her and it would suck emotionally. But I know I’d survive and thrive, that the hurt would pass, and I’d find someone new in short order if I wanted.

    In other words, I don’t mind being shackled knowing I can break the chains if necessary. All the time and effort I’d put into getting laid I can put to my career, my hobbies, and my family. I find reward in being responsible for my family, I simply lacked the knowledge to do it effectively in the past. Hell I may still fail, but if so I’ll fail on my own terms.

  68. “girls and women dress is more about how we feel about our own selves”

    Pre-wall woman:
    Cause I just wanna look good for you, good for you
    I just wanna look good for you, good for you
    Let me show you how proud I am to be yours
    Leave this dress a mess on the floor
    And still look good for you, good for you
    (Selena Gomez, Good for You)

    Post-wall woman:
    Cause I just wanna look good for me, good for me
    I just wanna look good for me, good for me
    Let me show you how old I’m getting now
    Leave this dress a mess on the floor
    And don’t look good for you, sucks to be you
    (IB, Sucks to be You)

  69. @SJF

    His last couple of comments have been more valuable and have conveyed good information.

    I have a problem with being told, based on one example, that I “have no game,” and that I “talk too much,” though. I shared my field report to contribute to discussion, not to be put down and ridiculed by some guy bragging about what a mean machine with the ladies he allegedly is. I’ll take all constructive criticism when delivered with respect, and I appreciate the guys here who have given me such; I’ve obtained value from it. Criticism delivered without respect, in a condescending tone, is not constructive and is an invitation to combat. I’d like to see scribblerg come off to me in that tone to my face to see how tough he really is. Would he have the balls, or is he just a keyboard tiger?

    “Game” is fluid, in my understanding of it. There are baseline rudiments – dominance, DHV, etc – but it’s not a one-size-fits-all proposition. The context, circumstances, and environment you’re in determine tactics. To proceed the way scribblerg suggested would have been too over the top and ridiculous in the context of a short, time-constrained engagement in a supermarket that I regularly shop at with a 21 year old checkout girl who’s working. I think he’d be laughed at for trying too hard, and not in a good way. Result would’ve been the same in that context – no #. And even worse, because you made a fool of yourself.

    It’s important to not be trapped by the so-called ‘rules of appropriate conduct’ in order to stand out as a man with balls, as a man with value, a man who’s his own authority, but there are degrees to this – and these degrees are determined by context, circumstances, and environment. Too little balls and you come off as a limp-dicked wimp. Too much and you come off as an overcompensating buffoon.

    The mere act of trying to escalate by confidently asking this girl for her #, without an over-the-top ego compensation mechanism, made me stand out and displayed balls. How many men does she interact with on a daily basis who ogle her and/or awkwardly flirt, who don’t have the guts to even try? I get the feeling she isn’t used to being propositioned at work. So my even trying was a DHV. I didn’t come away with the #, but I can’t force compliance – she either wants to comply or she doesn’t (for whatever reason – fear, doubt, nervousness, doesn’t like me enough, whatever). There was a short time frame for compliance in that situation and context, per my rules and frame, and she didn’t comply. Her loss, not mine – I’ll have plenty more at bats with other girls. I only want to deal with girls who want to deal with me. I’ll do some minimum prep work to make it easier for them to decide that they want to deal with me, but I’m not going to try too hard – that’s a DLV.

    It seems scribblerg has a one-size-fits-all approach – puff oneself up to ridiculous proportions and look stupid in the process – IF such puffery isn’t context-appropriate. I’m not saying this approach wouldn’t work in other contexts, but you tailor it to the context, circumstances, and environment.

    Oh, and by the way – ‘life coaching’ a chick you’re allegedly banging? What is this, the Dr. Phil School of Game?

    There. Did I talk too much, pal?

  70. @SJF – Nice to see you brother. And I can attest, you have a hot, high value wife. Just don’t ever leave her alone with me…

  71. @Fred Flange, Master of Snoods
    “Remember a lot of those religious-based “nice guys” are in the Beta 80% as well. They have been shamed/beaten into incel status by the overall cultural “all men are rapists and that’s all they are” trope like other young men.”

    Yeah about that… It’s a huge part of why I’ve always known about the red pill but never had it organized and explained. I saw behavior and was told to be quiet and not sure the hypocrisy.

    “So gals, you want kids, get out those turkey basters, or get knocked up by muscular guitarists. Then be ready to raise them yourselves (with your mom’s help maybe), producing an even more epicene generation of men, even further removed from Tingle-generating knowledge except for those few Alpha naturals who always seem to pop up.”

    Sister and her baby boy mothers watching him while she still finds guys who give her the tingles.

    @ted
    “I find reward in being responsible for my family, I simply lacked the knowledge to do it effectively in the past. Hell I may still fail, but if so I’ll fail on my own terms.”

    Way to be your own boss and be accountable to yourself. That’s kinda the impression I get with Alpha is a mindset.

  72. @ Kid – You shared an approach and reaction to the approach which demonstrates you don’t know what you are doing.

    Don’t do field reports if you don’t want critical commentary. I come at you hard because you come across as self-indulgent and ill informed and need a shock to wake up. Don’t wake up and keep your approach going. You showed us how well that is working.

  73. Has anyone else here noticed the very disproportionate amount of media time and attention focused on Alison Parker vs the camera man who was killed with her ?

    Sure. Is that a surprise? “Women are wonderful” plus the relative value of eggs vs. sperm, combined with Parker being a fairly cute blond (good dye job most likely) all adds up to “tragic death”. The cameraman? Oh. Yeah, well, that’s a shame. What was his name, again?

    It’s yet another clear demonstration of evo-psych at work. Should not be a surprise to anyone reading this site for any length of time.

  74. Kid Jupiter – “It seems scribblerg has a one-size-fits-all approach –”

    We all come at this from our own perspectives. Game is anything but one-size-fits-all, but the core tenants are all the same. I don’t disagree with most of what Srib writes, it just doesn’t meet my goals. Reviews of field reports are gold, but always understand that you are the best judge of what works for you.

    So while you may not think “puffing up” will help you, it may get him laid daily. Try it if you want, or ignore. Try not to get caught up in the delivery, it’s the info that matters.

  75. This post more than any other speaks to a part of myself that I’ve had the most trouble getting over. Holistic Game’s take is not too dissimilar from my own, though it took me much longer to lose my virginity. I was raised in a somewhat benign cult (by cult standards), no large compound with weapons and ammo, no forcible visit by the cult leader to all girls of a certain age. There was nothing illegal done and only a few things you might consider unethical. In this context, the youths of that organization were taught exactly as Rollo illustrates here. The young men were wholly expected to restrain themselves. There were some restrictions on female attire, but such restrictions were illustrated in sermon with kid-gloves. Pastors talked around female immodesty with anecdotes and peripheral shaming of women who went too far rather than the direct rules applied to men. Basically, whenever you got a sermon about Sodom and Gomorrah, you were getting “code” telling the women to “be modest”. As I recall, they would even flavor those sermons so they weren’t so bitter for the ladies, giving them the story of Esther as if it were a story of a chaste woman (when in fact she was simply a biblical example of hypergamy in action).

    I recall one instance quite vividly where the church doctrine decided to change to wholly ban the use of makeup by women. Such a difficult change this posed for the women that there were literally pre-warnings that made the gossip rounds with the ladies before the doctrinal change came out, so there was an actual buzz before the pre-recorded sermon(s) were played to explain this change. When I consider this in retrospect, it was like watching the feminine imperative in action, as if it were some kind of living force that you could objectively measure.

    As I recall there was some annual festival (based on the Jewish festivals, similar to 7th day Adventists) when this doctrine change was announced. That itself should tell you how afraid the church leadership was in announcing this change, it had to feel as if it was some “ordained by god” sermon that was given on a “holy day” in order for them to feel more comfortable announcing it. They couldn’t just release the recorded message on any old weekend, nope.

    The reaction from the women to this change was largely muted in public view, though there were some objections or pleads for reconsideration from ministers wives (and perhaps ministers themselves). The reaction in private, between women, was literally primal anger. As it happens, a few of my mothers sisters (she has 5) were in town after this doctrine change came out. My mother and her younger sister were in our kitchen the afternoon after the sermon was given. They were nearly screaming in rage, making all kinds of irrational points as to why they disagreed or “didn’t like” this change in doctrine. At one point I recall my mother saying the words, “It’s not fair, men can grow beards!” That’s such a laughable statement to me now, as if male beards are some kind of equivalent visual sexual manipulation on women. I was a young teenager at the time, and when I try to think back on that time I can honestly say I had no idea why they were so angry. With what I know now, it’s quite obvious. Those were the petulant whinings of women with their favorite tools of male manipulation taken away.

    In contrast, any restrictions in cult/church doctrine placed on male behavior were answered with zero whining, and complete capitulation to what must be done. Men responded to doctrine changes as if it were a drill sergeant telling them to drop and give you 50. The men simply did what was asked of them, no complaints, no manipulations, no end-arounds to change the rules. As Rollo has said, never be deceived by a religious chick, she wants to restrict your sexuality just as badly as any feminist ever would, she’ll just try to convince you that you’re having a good time while she’s doing it.

    I’ve gone off track a bit, let me get back on… I was the “golden child” in my own family. Not only did everyone in my family think highly of me, they needed to think highly of me to make themselves feel better about the family. This led to a somewhat destructive spiral where problems that I was having were largely ignored or excused away because everyone in the family needed to feel like I was somehow “awesome” and “flawless”. The problems I was having were a mix of having to live up to being the “golden child” and exactly the deception Rollo and Holistic Game are speaking to, the shifting of the male burden of performance to such a degree that boys are expected to self-restrict their sexuality (and feel better about themselves for doing so). I’ve still never gotten over that shit, my default behavior is STILL to self-restrict my own sexuality.

    OF course, now all the people I know look at me askance from afar, finding me odd that I rarely have “girlfriends”, have never been engaged, and find me with girls so few times. I’m sure they must all regard me as either inhumanly chaste, or absurdly secretive about my sex life. And all this from being raised with some (relatively) minor abuse at home, and some bullshit FI-influenced religion mixed in. Now my life is one of significantly more social difficulty than it should have been, and all because I was decieved as a child to effectively self-mutilate from a developmental point of view. I might as well have cut my dick off as a young boy and teenager, because my self-restrained behavior was so deeply ingrained. This is the power that women have over men, convincing them of the focus their burden of performance should take. Their power is one of directing male performance, and it is especially potent on young boys. Modern women wield it like a drunkard would wield an automatic rifle, indiscriminately shooting people and affecting their lives in the extreme negative. They’ll convince young boys to not explore their own sexuality, to restrain themselves so they don’t hurt other girls their age. But this is like a frog telling a bird to never try flying. Women have never experienced male sexuality, they cannot know what it is like and their advice to young boys is disastrous. These kinds of hooks, laid in the psyche of young boys by FI-influenced mothers (or worse, stepmothers), leads to insanity if not dealt with.

    This is where I find myself looking at the rash of lone male shooters we have in the U.S. these days. I consider most of these guys to be guys who literally went insane from the restrictions placed on their male sexuality. Society ignores this cause, either accusing the men of being anti-woman, or in the case of Bryce Williams throwing up its hands and saying, “there was no way to understand this insanity.” Elliot Roger is a good example, even though he may not seem so at first. There was a guy who was about at close to 100% lonely as you can get, even though he was probably quite normal in all social situations not involving sexual tension. He probably had significant exposure to the FI at the early ages of his sexual awareness convincing him that he should never approach women, should never positively engage in pursuing his own sexuality. I can find no other explanation for a guy who would sit in a coffee shop expecting women to approach him, in fact I’ve found myself with exactly the same mindset in the past. This female restriction of male sexuality, when introduced to men who are just coming to awareness of their own sexuality, is societal poison. I went through it, I lived for decades with the effects of that self-restrict nonsense, I live with it still. It’s horrendously evil. Now that I’m older, I actually am somewhat proud that I never went crazy, despite the pressures on me pushing me towards that insanity.

  76. @kid: I noticed already some pages back you got something with you almost crying “AMOG me”. It takes some effort withstanding that if amoging is a natural behavior for one. It’s just instinct then.

    Wondering where it is coming from? Do you compare yourself to everyone in your mind, trying to feel you are better or something?

  77. @scribblerg

    I come across as self-indulgent? Ha, look in the mirror, bud. Projection is an interesting psychological phenomenon.

    I don’t know what I’m doing? You can determine that from one field report, Swami? Babe Ruth: 714 career HRs, 1330 career strikeouts. I guess he didn’t know how to hit a baseball, right? Struck out nearly double the amount he homered. He must’ve sucked.

    You’ve got AMOG down pretty well, though – I’ll give you that.

  78. @scribblerg

    “So what is your formula for success? Please share it with me as I’m hopelessly misguided I guess, lol. But oh yeah, I tried the tradcon thing for 50 years and got my liver ripped out and turned into a hat that the women in my life wore on their heads while they shit down my throat.”

    I don’t doubt that you’ve “succeeded” according to your own goals, at least in the short-term. But we have different values, and therefore different definitions of success.

    I don’t really blame you for what you’ve chosen to do. I just don’t share the triumphalistic attitude that accompanies it. Hey man, I get it — you’re getting laid, it feels good, you’re having a good time. I’m not trying to take that away from you. But you’re coming on here and telling other people what to do and what to think, and I think you are misleading them.

    The mistake you make is to conflate two different things. You assume that because we don’t share your triumphalism, your great delight in the way things are, because we don’t feel good warming ourselves by the fire of civilization itself burning down, that we somehow don’t get it. You don’t get that this is a deliberate choice made with full knowledge of how sh*t works. To put it bluntly, for myself, I look through history at examples of real greatness — men that came before us, our forefathers and so on, and feel a strong desire to emulate that greatness. Then I look at what I would be if I perfectly fit the description of what today’s whores want: like someone said earlier, some cross between a bodybuilder, club promoter and DJ. A Corey Worthington, who Rollo has held up repeatedly and unironically as an example of pure alpha. F*ck that. I don’t care what you call it, I will never choose to be that no matter how many degenerate whores and “pro-dommes” line up to offer me their pussies in return.

    To each his own, man. Everything I just stated is stated as a matter of personal preference.

    “Tell me, how many women have you given that kind of gift to in your life? How many women have you actually cared about in that way versus wanting them as some kind of validation of who you are?”

    Exactly two. And commitment is a part of that. (But this isn’t about me; nor about you.) According to your plans you will toss these girls once you’re bored of having sex with them. Life advice while you f*ck and chuck! This is what counts as caring now. I think that just shows how far we’ve come . . . but you would have to have known something better to even feel sad about it, and unfortunately most young people now do not.

    It’s possible that those are the only conditions in which girls can have meaningful relationships now. Because they can only feel love with someone they respect, and they don’t respect any man who will do anything more than use them. That’s depressing. In any case, I don’t care if girls like that find love; I hope they don’t, because they don’t deserve it.

    I’m gonna come out and say it — being white must be hard (with respect to these issues specifically, I mean!) because your women are by far the farthest gone along this path. In other words if scribblerg is right that he was tradcon for 50 years before this, that’s sad, but also understandable — because the traditionalist position is falling apart for mainstream whites. All of your churches are half-ass, which is why we see what we do. But I wouldn’t confuse that with Christianity. It’s just what a bunch of American churches happen to be doing. They have simply failed to resist the broader culture.

  79. “To learn, one can go to a bar, pick out what seems to be the best looking dude there, and watch the body language of the girls that interact with him.”
    That’s fine. I can meet everybody there. I”ll wear something that’s easy to pick out so you’ll know it’s me.

  80. By the way, that gif of the shower girl, really only looked like she does that when she’s concentrating on something. Like not falling while stepping out of the tub.
    But I got what everybody was trying to say.
    The playfulness was a better indicator.

  81. @lh

    Me almost crying about AMOG? I was sharing my experiences with group dynamics out in the field and the cockblocking AMOG guys I’ve been encountering. Wasn’t sure how to handle that, not something I really ever encountered until fairly recently. And I got some good information and perspectives from some guys here. There was no crying involved.

    I don’t compare myself to anyone, other than as an objective tool to improve my performance in a given area. I actually admire people who do things I’m interested in better than me and try to use that as inspiration to improve myself. But if they’re an asshole about it and try to rub their superior performance in my face in an effort to keep themselves on top of the hill, then I have a problem.

  82. “The mistake you make is to conflate two different things. You assume that because we don’t share your triumphalism, your great delight in the way things are, because we don’t feel good warming ourselves by the fire of civilization itself burning down, that we somehow don’t get it. You don’t get that this is a deliberate choice made with full knowledge of how sh*t works.”

    This. I fully get it, but I’m not happy about it an refuse to accept it by adopting behaviors that I find distasteful. Here’s the thing though, I realize my point of view is a minority today, so I don’t feel the need to push it on others. However there are men that want a wife, kids, and a picket fence. They can have it, but they need to know what they are signing up for. I get the impression many guys in the sphere see that as weakness. I disagree. I see a man identifying his goals and making steps to meet them. My desire is to make sure they don’t go into it with Disney dreams. It’s a lot of effort, and a lot of sacrifice. I’ve found most things in life worth a damn require both.

  83. @ Kid

    “Criticism delivered without respect, in a condescending tone, is not constructive and is an invitation to combat. I’d like to see scribblerg come off to me in that tone to my face to see how tough he really is. Would he have the balls, or is he just a keyboard tiger?”

    He delivered criticism with respect (masculine male to masculine male within a “gang”), sure in a condescending tone (as is his style), and it is constructive. No, it is not and invitation to combat. He is a virtual (online in a blog) presence and he is on your side in your sexual strategy. Once again, he is a exceptionally congruent presence here. Stand down. In real life he would have balls of steel. Not a keyboard tiger. Trust me. He’s poured out his soul here in the past year (and is not ashamed to admit his faults) and has grown in the red pill mindset and is here willing to shove truths down your throat for your own benefit. And he doesn’t give a shit if you accept anything he says. Your choice.

    Yes we all have our own context. But we are on the same side of the red pill/ game praxeology.

  84. @kid: I didn’t mean something you say or what stories you tell. It’s something covered, probably mostly unconsciously, which is triggering AMOG – instincts.

    I’m not criticizing you for it btw. It’s your business, your life. But from what you told it seems to be a major problem for you, so it might be worthwhile finding out the reasons. And I’m interested too because I like understanding things.

    Maybe it’s the admiration? I think you want to use admiration as a tool to learn from someone? It’s easier to learn from someone you got a positive emotional connection to, for sure. But I think there are other ways not involving that much submission.

  85. Fred Flange, good summary of the situation. The only post Wall women I see getting married any more are those consciously willing to settle for less than perfect, and those women typically were carousel watchers rather than carousel riders.

    The Sandberg open hypergamy model, as Rollo has pointed out, really lets the cat out of the bag. Women following that are counting on unlimited numbers of thirsty Beta’s that will meet their hypergamic requirements and that’s not even true now.

    Mary Daly, Ms. “90%” would be pleased with the current landscape in a way, but probably dissatisfied with the speed of ‘progress’.

  86. Right, so ecology doesn’t matter. You just have to be man enough to overcome all the messages society is giving women and all the privileges it is doling out to make it work for them at our expense. Sure, okay, got it.

    You guys are already married, long term. You have no good choices so you make lemonade of your lemons. But I’ve been around way too long to believe that there are many marriages where men are happy and respected and fulfilled.

    I’ll tell you a little story. When I was going to get married, some 29 years ago, I decided to go to older men that I respected who had what appeared to be great long term marriages. Guys who were real men, often with traditional stay at home wives (or secondary careers to their’s), kids, houses, financial success status etc. and asked them if they had it to do all over again would they do so?

    10 out of 10 said no. Keep in mind the stakes in the conversation. I approached it as seeking real advice as to whether I should get married or not and they were giving me heartfelt, serious and honest input they felt was in my best interest.

    Most telling was my Uncle Joe. A WWII Captain in the 8th Air Force, having flown 34 missions over Germany (where the average life of a bomber airplane was 50 days and 8,000 other aircrew members were killed). He’d built a successful construction/real estate dev business, parlayed that into becoming a banker focused on real estate and then became a high end, specialty appraiser/expert on commercial real estate. He would get 10k a day to testify in court on the value of a commercial building’s rooftop for a satellite dish – in 1979.

    He was quite wealthy but not flashy. He still had a woodshop in his basement and often built furniture or did other projects that required woodwork. He taught me how to use a wood lathe. His wife, Grace, was a devout Christian and just an incredible woman. With a degree in Math but a dedicated homemaker and mother. She was supportive but also brilliant and strong. Her (and his) Catholic faith was rock solid and a huge part of both their lives. They had great kids who went on to amazing lives and were the rock of her and my extended families. There is no man on earth that I respected more (he’s passed now) and who had a more admirable life and marriage. They were also large pillars on their community, active in politics, church and numerous charitable causes.

    And he said to me, “No, if I had it to do all over again I wouldn’t. And you shouldn’t either, especially today.” You could have knocked me to the floor with a feather. I would have bet my entire life’s earnings that he would be rock solid.

    So pardon me if I don’t buy the “I’m a rock and my marriage is awesome and the exception, not the rule” crap. Most of you are making lemonade of your lemons and fair enough, the cost of divorce and the loss of your family isn’t worth it. But don’t tell me most of you are happy, I don’t believe you.

    Even Rollo says he doesn’t know what he’d do in today’s world. This isn’t Dalrock’s site – we aren’t flacking for traditional values and Christianity here. We are talking about reality. And in reality, any man who signs up to get married and have kids today is signing up for misery.

  87. @Tedd

    “Here’s the thing though, I realize my point of view is a minority today, so I don’t feel the need to push it on others. However there are men that want a wife, kids, and a picket fence. They can have it, but they need to know what they are signing up for. I get the impression many guys in the sphere see that as weakness. I disagree. I see a man identifying his goals and making steps to meet them. My desire is to make sure they don’t go into it with Disney dreams. It’s a lot of effort, and a lot of sacrifice. I’ve found most things in life worth a damn require both.”

    I got in (marriage) before the downfall of true masculinity in society and before the self-entitled feminine imperative Facebook culture. In my upper middle class community is it the norm to have a decent marriage and two children and it is non-forced. It is natural. Sure it is an adventurous gamble. I can appreciate the shittiness and decline of intersexual relationships across the country. Without red pill awareness and game it is a near impossibility, so I hear.

    I have been worried for others in the manosphere that when, if by chance a potentially good or great Long Term Relationship comes calling, a man might balk at it with the negativity he has been hearing all around and pass on the chance. Chasing good pussy is hard work and one in the hand is worth a harem in the bush. Possibly.

  88. @ Lucien – So the answer is Christianity, lol. Just for the record – it’s debunked mythology that has exactly zero answers for today’s world. And even then, you have to ignore how ridiculous your own churches and congregations are now to hold this thought.

    I’m speaking for the rest of us who aren’t jumping for Jesus. You evango types can have at it, it seems to be a roaring sucess…

  89. @Jeremy
    “In contrast, any restrictions in cult/church doctrine placed on male behavior were answered with zero whining, and complete capitulation to what must be done.”

    Fucking hell makes me think of being 16 all over again.

    “As Rollo has said, never be deceived by a religious chick, she wants to restrict your sexuality just as badly as any feminist ever would, she’ll just try to convince you that you’re having a good time while she’s doing it.”

    Women in my family

    “the shifting of the male burden of performance to such a degree that boys are expected to self-restrict their sexuality (and feel better about themselves for doing so). I’ve still never gotten over that shit, my default behavior is STILL to self-restrict my own sexuality.”

    I still think that’s blue pill thinking an my part but reading you say that makes in a little more relatable to deal with the fact that their is still so much self hate in me.

    “I might as well have cut my dick off as a young boy and teenager, because my self-restrained behavior was so deeply ingrained.”

    Fucking brutal because it’s so familiar.

    “This female restriction of male sexuality, when introduced to men who are just coming to awareness of their own sexuality, is societal poison.”

    (Passing a a bar over internet page)in appreciation of observable truth.

    @Ted
    “However there are men that want a wife, kids, and a picket fence. They can have it, but they need to know what they are signing up for.”

    Yeah it’s a huge part of being here as well. How do you make this work was one reason I never took my life while being told to act normal. I wanted to build a dream within myself that took both effort and sacrifice.

  90. For the record, I agree with both Tedds and Scribblers most recent comments. I see no discordance.

    Adapt to your best abilities men.

  91. Evangelical Christian Alpha – isn’t that an oxymoron? You are fallen and a service animal in that worldview. Your sexual desires are sinful, and your lust is to be constrained. You are to always put others first – Beta, Beta, Beta, Beta, Beta, Beta, Beta, Beta….

  92. Scribblerg – I’m on marriage #2, but I met her about the time I found MMSL and then Rollo. At the core of it, I decided to marry again because I realized what a failure I was at being a man and a husband the first time through, and I wanted to do it again on my terms. It’s that simple. I’m not making lemonade man, I chose to attempt growing sweeter fruit with better farming knowledge. Why? Because I’ve always wanted to own a farm.

    Get it? I want a wife, kids, and the picket fence. Our fence isn’t white though, too cliche…

  93. @Tedd

    “Because I’ve always wanted to own a farm.”

    I bought one in 2007. It has been my salvation. My preservation and deliverance from harm, ruin, or loss.

  95. Have to make one other thing clear. I’m not happy because I’m getting laid, I’m getting laid because I’m happy. And I’m not getting laid that much anyway. I just happen to shoot high – 20 something hotties who actually get me hard. As Rollo would say, “the juice is worth the squeeze” for them. At 53, I pinch myself…But of course I look 40 and am getting better looking all the time due to working on my fitness like an athlete would.

    Women are less important to me than ever though. Getting laid is just something I like doing when I get a chance. I don’t run my life as a PUA, I run my life as a self-actualized, masculine man. I own a business, am a gigging musician, volunteer in my community, and am a leader in many settings where I put myself. I also am close to a good chunk of my family members. I treat women well and enjoy them more than ever. I also am developing and re-engaging in old interests like working on cars and rock climbing and other kinetic things. I do not run my life around women or sex. At all. Ever. But I like sex, a lot. There is nothing more gratifying in some ways than sinking my cock balls deep into a 20 something hottie. Those of you who can’t get that haven’t done so in a while and have forgotten how awesome that feels, or are kidding yourselves. I own my desires now and set about satisfying them.

    But this won’t get through to most of you. It’s too convenient to dismiss me as some PUA scumbag instead of looking at the bullshit you are selling yourselves. I get it, denial is a very powerful and addictive thing. What if you had to define yourself just as yourself? What if you couldn’t hide behind father, husband and Christian? Who would you be then? I found out…

  96. There will never be the Brotherhood of men like the Sisterhood for women because of the prisoner’s dilemma and who controls access to the goods.

  97. Scribblerg – you are a busy guy, so here’s my take. I have all that shit going on too, and going out to sarge would be one more thing to add to the list. When it comes to sex it isn’t about my wife (as a particular woman) it’s she is a she and has a vagina. She isn’t adding to my life by fucking me, she adds by helping me get our kids all over the place. By cooking dinner. In addition, I enjoy her company. I can talk to her about things young women find boring or too complex. We have common interests and enjoy the same activities. She’s not my best buddy, but outside the bedroom we get along splendidly.

    So why would I want to waste time trading vagina for vagina if I can get one connected to a woman I don’t mind keeping around?

    I don’t think we are all that diametrically opposed. We just look for different things from women. I want sex but variety isn’t essential. You want variety and personality isn’t essential. We both have to use the same tools to accomplish our goals. If that appears to you as me making women a priority, so be it. To me it’s the exact opposite, women aren’t a priority to me because I have what I need already.

  98. The mistake you make is to conflate two different things. You assume that because we don’t share your triumphalism, your great delight in the way things are, because we don’t feel good warming ourselves by the fire of civilization itself burning down, that we somehow don’t get it.

    I’m not happy because I’m getting laid, I’m getting laid because I’m happy.

    Dude, do you understand that we feel the same way? Screaming about how awesome you are in a room full of awesome just makes you look ridiculous.

  99. @lh

    By ‘admiration’, I don’t mean I’m fawning all over guys and fellating them. I mean admiration of a skill.

    For example, I play bass guitar. Been playing for almost 30 years and I’m quite accomplished and skilled at what I do. Been in a lot of bands (including a Rage Against The Machine tribute for about 3 years – yes, I know my enemies, they’re the teachers who taught me to fight me…) But I don’t rest on my laurels; there are a lot of bassists in my area who are much better players than me – maybe not at the Rage stuff or harder rock stuff in my wheelhouse, but guys who have a better concept of the instrument and can do things I can’t do as well on it. For example, I decided I wanted to play blues and R&B a couple years ago. I’ve played basic blues over my career and could hold it down simply with decent feel & groove, but I was lost when it came to walking through chord changes and jazzing it up. I admired the guys who did that effortlessly (still do – I’ve improved immensely over the last 2 years I’ve been focused on it, but I’m still not at some of these guys’ level), so I watched from a humbler perspective and came at it like an acolyte. And, almost to a man, every one of the bassists whose playing I admired was super cool and supportive of helping a fellow bass brother get up to speed when I discussed it with them. They directed me to resources and some even sat and showed me things.

    I also strive to do and act the same when guys come up to me after I play and compliment me or ask for pointers. It’s not a zero-sum game, whereby if you have ‘it’, it’s a threat to me, so I have to obscure ‘it’ from you and/or put you down and hinder you if you’re making progress because I feel threatened.

    The AMOG stuff I referred to is in the realm of women. Seems this IS a zero-sum game with many men out in the field. I’m not surprised by this, though, given that it’s sex and biology, and this seems to be hardwired deep in our primate brain: “The ‘alpha’ male gets all the chicks, so I’d better be perceived as an alpha and eliminate any threats to my position and pool of pussy.”

    I have an ex-friend who was like this. It became impossible to hang around him because he would constantly AMOG. He had to get the leg up on every chick and cockblock and sabotage just about any progress I was making with women in our social circles. To make matters worse, he’d sabotage me, then go hook up with and/or bang the chicks himself. (Girls are really dumb, man – any chick who could fall for this guy’s BS is borderline retarded, if not all the way there…). I had to cut him off before I knocked him out – came thisclose….

    Maybe I’m experiencing the AMOGing more now because I’m becoming more alpha with my RP knowledge and other guys now see me as more of a threat? Conversely, I might be putting off a weak vibe and these guys smell the blood. (But if I’m actually putting off a weak vibe, then I wouldn’t be a threat because the chicks would diss me themselves, right? Would be a waste of time and effort to AMOG me.) I don’t know why it is, but trust me, I’m trying to figure it out.

    I just get the feeling that AMOG comes from a position of weakness and insecurity, not true strength.

  100. PS, by “sabotage me,” I mean underhanded stuff like go talk about my business to the chicks. Real lowlife scumbag stuff.

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