Alpha Agents of Righteous Karma

Karma

Reader Keyser Soze had an interesting comment last week that I thought would be a good jump off point for today’s topic:

@Siirtyrion: You said, “Many scientists still go by this notion because it explains the frequent tradeoffs in mating and gives us a more complete picture for sexual selection as a whole. I understand that I uphold physicality as king, but understand that hypergamy isn’t completely about a short-term mating strategy, regardless of what some people may think. Women may be able to fund their our lives currently but rest assure, they still seek out Beta Bucks in other forms aside from monetary or material gain (i.e they still seek out physiological and emotional comfort from less than ideal males).”

Question for all:

Reading this, I had a thought. We often talk about women hitting the wall at 35ish and their sudden willingness to be me more reasonable with their expectations in a mate as they realize their SMV has decreased. I wonder if the above quote also plays into this. By the time women hit 35ish, historically (without modern methods of assisted conception) they are past their childbearing years. I wonder if their mating strategy changes at this age not only because of diminished SMV, but also because they are no longer looking for prime genetic material for reproduction as much as they are looking for “physiological and emotional comfort”. Perhaps this was implied all along, but I never thought about it this way before.

I hate to think this is going to come off as sympathy for the aging spinsters who had their cake in their youth and now, late in life, are looking to make honest amends for their past decisions, but it probably will.

A few months ago I broke-down Robin Korth’s aging sexual denial and in response we got a glimpse into the rationalization engine (a.k.a. the Hamster) at work in feminine solipsism:

http://twitter.com/RobinKorth/status/486636301207093248

My intent here isn’t to pick on Korth personally or really any woman in the post-Wall demographic in particular, but this self-insight is an excellent illustration of the feminine solipsism I often refer to on this blog. Furthermore, this sense of ego-blamelessness is then combined with the easy rationales and social conventions ready-made by the Feminine Imperative to affirm her self-importance.

Deti comments:

Robin Korth should be reposing in the love of her husband of the past 35 years, give or take. She should be doting on children and grandchildren as the esteemed matriarch of her family.

Instead, Ms. Korth is still out there acting as if she’s 25 years old. She’s still trying to navigate the sexual and dating minefields. In the end she’s trying to show everyone (but really herself) that she’s still “got it”; that she can still arouse a man sexually. It is all really about self aggrandizement. It is all about self- validation and affirmation. In the end, it’s all about Robin Korth. It’s pathetic and sad, really.

And no, Ms. Korth, your life is not the result of what you think about yourself. You are what you do. You are NOT what you think, read, or write. You are not what you were or what you’d like to be.

You are what you do. Period. Full stop.

And from The Difficulty of Gaming Women by Age Brackets by (the old) Roissy:

36 to 38 year olds

She is at peace with her spinsterhood and her failure in the dating market. She will acquiesce easily and gratefully to sex with very little game, as long as you don’t look like a grandpa. Her expectations are so low, it will be a challenge to disappoint her.

If you are prone to guilt, you might feel it when you inevitably dump a woman in this age range. Don’t. Remind yourself that her past is littered with her insouciant dumping of many beta men before you. You are merely an alpha agent of righteous karma.

Granted, Robin is well past the 38 year old mark by over 20 years, however even at 59 the description is still remarkably apt in light of Deti’s overview, however, the real lesson here is for men.

There comes (or should come) a certain empowerment for men after a point of maturation in life where he grows into an understanding of how the Game is played by women. As I’ve noted in the past month, this game, the former secret of women’s dualistic sexual strategy, is becoming more and more of an open secret amongst a feminine-primary culture becoming increasingly more assured of its primacy. If anything this plan for women’s optimizing hypergamy is just this side of proudly flaunting it to men.

As I pick my way through exactly this ‘plan’ in writing the next book, I’ve actually become less surprised by so many examples I find of this willingness with which women will overtly share their strategy for assuring short-term Alpha sexual desires during their SMV peak, and then consolidation on the security a Beta provider represents as their SMV decays beginning at around 30 years of age.

My purpose in writing this next volume of The Rational Male is to make men aware of just this life-schedule and sexual strategy, but even with my own efforts and the glaring willingness with which women will now confirm it, a larger whole of men simply don’t mature into this overall understanding.

For all the education the Red Pill represents for men, the larger blue pill whole simply don’t want to accept the ugly reality of women’s sexual strategy even when women openly confirm this for them – or when they do it’s too late for anything but pensive self-reproach and then signing the alimony/child support check anyway.

As this understanding becomes more widespread some social change will have to follow. Men will either become so pathetic as to ‘normalize’ it for themselves, and personally identify with what amounts to their open (proactive or reactive) cuckolding under women’s grossly overt championing of their Alpha Fucks / Beta Bucks sexual strategy – or Men will come to the realization (hopefully sooner than later) that the fantasy of monogamous bliss based on a notion of intergender compromise and the ‘give & take’ (but mostly give) they were sold on was never in the best interests of feminine-primacy.

The Feminine Imperative was (and is) only ever concerned with men’s imperatives or male-specific priorities insofar as they align with the superseding, primary imperatives of women. Thus, as open hypergamy becomes more common and the truth of this duplicity and imbalance (really disinterest) of mutual sexual imperatives becomes more evident, men will again (as with Game) evolve methods and mentalities to consolidate on their own imperatives or simply live in denial of it all.

The Long Game

For almost 6 months I’ve had this post from Cail Corishev bookmarked. It’s an excellent driver for exactly this point: prior to the digital age men tended not to play a long game when it came to socio-sexual strategies. The short game is all that matters in the moment, and all that stimulates, but until the advent of digital forums where men could figuratively compare notes, most men were simply unable, and perhaps too distracted to ask the obvious questions about women’s hypergamy and how it plays out over the course of 10-30 years and the roles women expect men to play during those stages of their lives in order to accommodate their strategy.

In Cail’s piece he describes a woman he knew at age 30 and how attractive she was, and his consideration of starting a relationship with her. After a failing interest and 10 years of no contact, she reinitiated with Cail:

But while we were chatting, I saw some of her recent pictures, and whoa!  She’s gone from a 7-8 to maybe a 5, and that would be adjusted for age.  She hasn’t gotten fat, but that’s about the only positive note.  She looks so rough that I found myself wondering what I was thinking ten years ago, but I looked back at some old pictures, and she really was pretty at 30 — not a model or anything, but enough to turn heads.  Now she looks like she’s lived 20 hard years in 10.  She works nights at a pretty demanding job and has had some serious health problems, so I guess it’s no surprise, but it was really striking: ten years ago I ached for this girl, and now I wouldn’t look twice at her if I passed her in the grocery store.

That got me thinking about Rollo’s chart.  My own SMV, as far as I can tell, hasn’t changed much from mid-30s to mid-40s, just as his chart would predict.  I’m about the same weight, same build, maybe a little less hair, but I’d lost quite a bit of it already back then.  I’m not much better-off financially, but at least not worse, and I have more of a sense of direction in my life.  I’m certainly more confident, especially with women, and more established in my communities.  So some pluses and some minuses, holding steady at about the same level.  The amount of interest I get from women seems to support that.

She, on the other hand, going from 30 to 40, has gone from fertile to not likely.  She’s also a grandmother now, so instead of looking to start a new family, she’s focused (and rightly so) on helping her kids with theirs.  (If single moms don’t have much spare attention to give a husband, imagine the single mom of a single mom.)  An additional ten years of dating and relationships under her belt certainly doesn’t add to her appeal.  On top of those reasons, add the drastic decline in her looks, and now I not only don’t want to marry her, but as we chat I’m mostly thinking, “How soon can I politely say goodnight so I can get to sleep already?”  Harsh, but true.  Just as Rollo’s chart predicts, her SMV has been on a steady decline since we met — maybe more of a free-fall in her case — and now mine is well above hers.

I had a similar post to this I published back in December of 2011 – Protracted SMV:

It’s a simple matter to tell a guy he’s dodged a bullet in the cosmic scheme of things, but it’s altogether different to provably show him how he’s dodging it. For all the evils of facebook at least it gives him [men] an ability to see the forest for the trees, but the feminine can’t even afford him that. You must stay dumb, you must stay plugged-in for the feminine to maintain primacy. For all the benefits of a globally connected world, the feminine imperative expects you to accept a feminine-centric normalization of it.

What the Feminine Imperative fears is men becoming what Roissy terms Alpha Agents of Righteous Karma. Due to a lifetime of feminine conditioning, men tend to underestimate the leverage their SMV has in the context of women’s biological imperatives.

Pity for Reneé

I have a similar story to Cail’s. When I was a senior in high school I had a ‘friend‘ named Reneé, she was a gorgeous auburn-red head with a fantastic 17-18 year old body. We were good ‘friends‘ in the sense that it was clear I wasn’t ever going to see her naked and she had all of the personality trappings of a girl who knew she was attractive (she did modeling after high school), but also had the beginnings of a very self-important ego-invested feminist mind set.

I never really stayed in touch with her after graduation since by then I had moved on to women who enthusiastically reciprocated my interests and I moved along in life. It wasn’t until 2009 that I got on FaceBook and began having old friends look me up – Reneé was among the first. Very similar to the woman in Cail’s story we started to catch up with what the other had been doing through their 20s, 30s and now 40s.

As it turned out she was still fairly attractive for having had one daughter and never marrying the father, or any other guy for that matter. Most of the predictable single mommy issues and false-empowerment memes were bandied about by her, but the short version is here she was at 41 and her daughter was a year away from leaving for college. She was between jobs, but the one she had and the one she hoped to get were mediocre low to mid-management type, subsistence level employment.

She was and still is single 5 years later. The predictable questions about what my wife was like and how long we’ve been married came up, how we met, and where I’ve travelled in my work, etc. and I can honestly say I felt bad for her just recalling all of the life I’ve lived in the interim and basically forgot about her since high school.

She’s 46 now, and loves FaceBook as much as any aging spinster, but I really don’t want to call her that. In between the many pictures of her 4 cats (no lie) she occasionally posts some lament about how lonely she is now that her daughter has gone away to school and she comes home to an empty apartment these days. She makes not-so-subtle pleas to her FB community friends to set her up with ‘a great guy’ and all the dutiful Betas come out of the woodwork to tell her how pretty she (still) is and to keep her chin up and the right guy will “come along” – not so unlike the advice she gave me and at least half a dozen other guys I knew back in the day.

Reneé still clings to all of the feminist memes and mantras (reposts all the most popular), and complains of not being able to find a “great guy” anymore. This is of course infantile men’s faults for not manning up to her fem-correct standards, or else it’s a complaint about the ‘creepy’ men who really just want to bang her when she out with friends.

Unhappy Feminists

I hadn’t really ever considered using Reneé as a blog post subject until I read this article in Psychology Today:

According to a new survey released this month, your odds of winning the cash would increase if you skipped any 40-something, single female professionals and focused on the middle-aged male managers with one child at home and a wife who works part-time. In its Office Pulse survey, Captivate Network, a media solutions company, says its uncovered “profiles of the happiest and unhappiest workers.” And here it is:

  • Male
  • 39 years old
  • Married
  • Household income between $150,000 and $200,000
  • In a senior management position
  • 1 young child at home
  • A wife who works part-time

And the unhappiest profile?:

  • Female
  • 42 years old
  • Unmarried (and no children)
  • Household income under $100,000
  • In a professional position (doctor, lawyer, etc.)

Minus the professional status, essentially Reneé fits the profile for the most unhappy person in the western world today. Now, return back to Robin Korth’s comment, her life is the result of what she thinks of herself. What does this say about the decision making both she and Reneé have made in their lives?

I can’t say I have any sympathy for the likes of Korth, but for Reneé I do feel a pang of pity (in spite of Roissy’s advice for women of this age). For all of the accusations of red pill “misogyny” I genuinely do like women, and I’m not rooting for them to smash into the Wall. However I can see why my observations make this seem so – hard truths are often warnings that we don’t like to heed.

I often wonder if women of this profile aren’t as much victims of an ideological conditioning as Betatized men are over the course of their lives. Much of what’s resulted in Reneé’s life are the consequences of having (and still subscribing to) a mindset that’s based on equalist individualism, and she’s now beginning to reap what she’s sown – knowingly or not.

I don’t know the father of her daughter, but my red pill instincts (and knowing how hot she used to be) tell me the guy was likely a pump and dump Alpha bad boy. Reneé never struck me as the type to ‘settle’ on a Beta provider because she was too headstrong and independent® for that – she was certainly hot enough to attract the Alphas and independent enough to never consider a Beta for a relationship.

Observations

So my observation is this; while granting that women’s decisions are their own, and they should in all ways be accountable for the consequences that follow from them, how much of those decisions are based on a conditioning that promotes an idealized ideology of feminine, equalist independence?

For the same reason I can’t entirely fault a man with an internalized blue pill mindset over his conditioning, shouldn’t we also consider that women are likewise mislead by a similar influence? Are we (again) giving women too much credit for being rational independent agents under different circumstance?

For men’s part, it’s hardly avoidable that we become Alpha Agents of Righteous Karma by default for women in this cohort. Perhaps not as Alpha as we’re perceived, but as our SMV ascends in our 30s and (sometimes) through our 40s, it’s almost unavoidable that, even with a baseline of ambition, we’re seen as more desirable long term prospects.

In all honesty, were I to find myself single tomorrow, Reneé or women like her would never make my ‘to date’ list. Women love to complain that mature men really aren’t, and all they want is a young girl to fuck and coo for them. I would argue that men in my demo (at least should) have the depth of experience to know what the Feminine Imperative (and its social arm feminism) has bred and conditioned into women, and we honestly don’t want the hassle of dealing with it.

There is precious little reward for a man, and no appreciation, for having a big enough heart to save a woman from the consequences of her past decisions. That’s not meant as a callous punishment, just simple pragmatism.

As I stated in The Threat,

Nothing is more threatening yet simultaneously attractive to a woman than a man who is aware of his own value to women.

When you’ve spent your whole life attempting to ‘have it all’ on your own, perhaps men can’t help but be an agent of Karma when that ‘all’ includes a man’s participation.

282 comments

  1. Thought provoking post as always. To highlight a point you made “I can’t say I have any sympathy for the likes of Korth, but for Reneé I do feel a pang of pity … I’m not rooting for them to smash into the Wall. However I can see why my observations make this seem so – hard truths are often warnings that we don’t like to heed.”

    This really struck a chord with me. It’s actually a ridiculous shame because I feel like a lot of girls with “potential” (good heart, good looks, feminine etc) get screwed up along the way because of what they’re told they “should” want or strive for. I’ve personally known sweet Midwestern girls with traditional values that moved to the coasts and literally forced themselves to change what they valued at the pressure of other girls and what the media and a liberal arts education told them they should want.

    Just as many men have noted that the obesity epidemic has limited men’s mate choices, I find that the feminine imperative not only limits men’s check choices for finding a suitable long term mate but it also ruins a girl’s chances at being happy or fulfilled in life. They’ve been sold the same lie we’ve been forced to swallow.

  2. I was unexpectedly single at 43. I made all of the mistakes, as a blue pill doofus, but what I quickly learned was that I was supposed to repair (for my dates) the results of their 20 years of strong independent freedom. Even I, doofus, could figure out the right response: “If you want me to fix the last 20 years of your life, would you please give me back the last 20 of mine? Because I just spent 20 years taking care of other people while you were living it up.”

    I stumbled around a bit, very expensively, but these days it’s plain within 30 seconds if someone is throwing hail marys and I’m supposed to catch them. Everyone needs to own their own behavior, past and present.

  3. The Myth, the reality is (I’m a midwesterner who has made his living in DC and NYC) that educated women are more concerned with what other women think of them, than what a lover thinks of them. We are a secondary cohort, today.

    This is evident even with a good girl from North Dakota with a proper heart. She’s going to act on the direction of her left brain — please the gurrls — before she acts on what is true in her heart. So the game is to recognize this and manage both impulses, if one is interested in a woman. Otherwise, failure.

  4. As usual, this is right on point. I agree that the majority of women are conditioned to expect men to be available for whatever purpose they wish whenever they wish it. I have seen little evidence that the average woman analyzes this any further than to make a determination that she is owed “a real man” whenever she decides she’s ready to hop off the carousel. In fact, I’ve overheard 30-something women telling girls in their 20’s to sleep with a bunch of guys and get it out of their system before they settle down with a guy who is “marriage material”.

    Because a woman with any level of attractiveness can have almost any man she wants, at least for a night, in their minds I imagine there is little evidence to indicate that the party may end. Just like the notion many young guys have that they could never end up like their dad’s friends who got divorced-raped and lives in a crappy apartment, I’d guess most young girls think becoming a cat lady is about as likely as living on Mars. Hell, if Madonna gets hot, young guys at 50, why can’t I? Right?

    I often wonder what percentage of women who shit-can an AFC to have their eat-pray-love “fulfillment” wish they could undo it 10-15 years later. I wonder if deep down inside, there is ever a moment of truth that pierces the facade or if they really do believe that they’ve been screwed out of their happily-ever-after by legions of juvenile and misogynistic men who refuse to see them for the diamond that they know they are.

  5. Great article, Rollo, and I agree with your premise.

    I once asked myself the question why, if being beta does not work to attract women, do men still overwhelmingly act beta. The answer is that society teaches them that if they act beta, they will attract a woman. Boys are taught from an early age that if they ever want to get married (ie. have sex) they will need to get a job and treat a woman right. The boys who are most susceptible to societal messaging are the ones who internalize this message the most. The boys who do best at school (thereby demonstrating their susceptibility to external messaging) are the most beta, while the ones who do worst at school (and thus demonstrate their lack of susceptibility to external messaging) are the most alpha.

    But keep in mind that girls are, generally, FAR more susceptible to societal messaging than most boys (hence why girls tend to do better at school, on average). Thus, if we ask the question why, given that beta men do not viscerally attract women, do WOMEN THEMSELVES teach men to be beta. I do not believe it is due to a feminist conspiracy to have disposable betas lying around awaiting women to hit the wall. No, it is because WOMEN THEMSELVES believe their own crap. Other women (and society) teach them that they SHOULD be attracted to providers and protectors – nice men who treat them well – in spite of the fact that they aren’t actually attracted to such men. Thus, when women make up their lists of qualifications for a potential husband, they include all kinds of beta traits….and surprise themselves when they meet an alpha who viscerally attracts them and has none of those qualities! They tell themselves that such men are only for flings, but with each fling that they have, they increase their desire for alpha in addition to beta, thereby making the man they eventually hope to find more and more impossibly perfect. At that point they can’t accept any real man (who would have them), since by doing so they would see themselves as having “settled.”

    They have been trapped between a rock and a hard place – the rock being their own inherent personalities, and the hard place being the criteria that society foists on them.

    We men have our own problems, and need to be aware of feminine strategies….but that should not harden our hearts to basic human empathy.

  6. A woman’s solipsism prevents introspection. So even though her predicament is the result of her own life choices, she will blame the alphas who pumped and dumped her and the betas who bored and annoyed her.

    The feminine imperative is ‘out’ about hypergamy but assumes that it and the rest of its equalist empowerment will lead to some endpoint of fulfillment.

    Apparently not.

  7. I recently googled a woman who is 55 and I knew her 20 years ago. She was ok then but somewhat plump. She is now obese and hideous and never married. I on the other hand don’t look very different 20 years later.

  8. Jeremy- “I do not believe it is due to a feminist conspiracy to have disposable betas lying around awaiting women to hit the wall. No, it is because WOMEN THEMSELVES believe their own crap.”

    Oh, I see. It’s not intentional, it’s just the result of thoughtless, selfishness therefore it’s OK. Since incompetence is often identical to malice the only thing that matters is results.

    As for empathy I’m gonna have to first see some of that from the other side. I won’t be holding my breath.

  9. “For the same reason I can’t entirely fault a man with an internalized blue pill mindset over his conditioning, shouldn’t we also consider that women are likewise mislead by a similar influence?”

    Yup. But at a certain point, the women have to take responsibility for where they’ve ended up and figure things out.

    “In all honesty, were I to find myself single tomorrow, Reneé or women like her would never make my ‘to date’ list.”

    Bear in mind you will never be able to declare yourself “single” again. You can only be “separated” or “divorced.” And as I wrote before, there is a stigma for men too. The options you think you’d have are not the ones you’d actually have.

    “There is precious little reward for a man, and no appreciation, for having a big enough heart to save a woman from the consequences of her past decisions. That’s not meant as a callous punishment, just simple pragmatism.”

    Not all women are interested in saving men from the consequences of their past decision either. But regardless, divorced women should not attempt to date single men for a variety of reasons. They should marry divorced men.

  10. Kate: “But regardless, divorced women should not attempt to date single men for a variety of reasons. They should marry divorced men.”

    Somebody ban me if I ever try to tell someone else what to do, without bothering with the pesky “why” part. Since I’m not an oracle, etc.

  11. As always, a very interesting read Rollo. As a man gets on a bit he learns to be very glad his prayers were not answered 10-15-20 years ago. I’ve also had a chance to reconnect with several woman from the past in recent years, one, at 18 had the power to turn most men into gibbering fools with just a smile, now she’d scare the hell out of them. When we reconnected over Facebook a couple of years ago the change in her appearance shocked me, I did not recognize her at all. The only thing that had not changed was her entitled attitude.

    In some ways I don’t believe women really mature much beyond 25. They realize the clock is ticking, but are so used to just having to show up to get male attention there is no need to improve either their personality or keep themselves in shape. It is a major shock when this attention quits happening, but rather ascribe it to a flaw in themselves, their attitude is there must be something wrong with men.

    When I was much younger I used to think women were very complicated creatures, but in fact they are far simpler than us, their prime directive is simply the BBD ( Bigger, Better Deal). Most men are generally place holders for them to present a respectable front to society, a sort of short term serial monogamy until they can harpoon the Great White Whale. They’ll cut their losses eventually and settle for lesser fish, but will always dream of the whale.

    If you are a 45+ male in good shape with all your ducks in line you are the Great White Whale, but dating can a curse, because there are very few female matches anywhere near your own age group. So one does end up being an agent of Karma to find what you want. I wish I had a dollar for every glare I get from 40+ women when I’m with a woman much younger in public.

  12. Ronin: “I wish I had a dollar for every glare I get from 40+ women when I’m with a woman much younger in public.”

    I take my daughter to ’21’ or similar places in NYC. The tables in the Club Room are close by each other. The last time, some matron to my left was *ELBOWING* me. All the defeated husbands were staring, spittle practically dripping down their chins. Fucking pathetic. We had desert with another couple (my age) who asked “How did you meet?” “I fell in love with her 25 years ago today (it was her birthday). Love at first sight.”

    We’re surrounded by sleepwalkers living with monsters.

  13. Ronin, I am 60 and in great shape. When I run on the beach without my shirt I am rightfully ignored by the sub 30’s, RBF’ed by the 30-40’s, aggressively glared at by the 40-50’s, and once again ignored by the post-menopausal 50+’s. The only ones who smile are the fuglies of all ages, who in reply get a smile and a tip o’ the hat with a middle finger from me.

    Such is life…

  14. Reneé still had her kid, and presumably was even paid for it. That’s her life mission fulfilled, if she wasn’t complaining about not having a man she’d be complaining about having one.

  15. I believe two factors are the cause (and aggravation) of what we see happening to women in the lows of SMV (as they get older) and open room for “Alpha Agents of Righteous Karma” to grow. These two factors are: the vast ecological changes that the West has been facing and a woman’s innate prime directive. I’ll cover the ecological factor first because this is the one factor which currently drives a woman’s innate prime directive even further. Take into account what I’ve written before:

    …because of the economically prosperous, systemically mediated welfare state dynamic that prevails in developed world populations, economic and ecological pressures no longer mediate their mate choices to the extant they did in the past.

    One consequence of this is that erotic capital (physical attractiveness) has supplanted other forms in the stratification of male status with respect to mate availability. So, being a high status male (with respect to mating) now says less about material wealth,than about physical beauty. All things being equal, females will still preferentially mate with males who provide the highest measures of direct/genetic benefits available to them.

    This is a conundrum women face in the developed world (i.e low mate availability of high erotic capital). Now, I personally wouldn’t call it a result of “feminine conditioning” backfiring on women per se, but rather it’s a systemic effect by economic prosperity skewing mating choices as a whole (where women uphold the Alpha Fucks strategy above all). As much as we may laugh or sometimes get a kick at the result of this strategy (reading about an old spinster’s life riddled with cats), this is a real problem that will indeed cause instability in the near future.

    Now onto a woman’s prime directive:

    Understand that two strategies are at play in a woman’s mating game (AF-BB). While women currently favor the AF side of the equation since they can provide for themselves, understand that short-term mating does not represent female optima, given its low reproductive potential. Thus, while they may engage in short-term mating (male optima)- their optima is to extend that mating interval for as long as possible with the highest quality male they can attract.

    This can be observed, frequently, in females who succumb to designs of monopolizing a high quality male, even after the most casual of intentions. Alas, this rarely works as planned, speaking to much female consternation.

    Women want to pair bond with attractive men and want desperately to keep them around and help raise the children they hope to have with them. In other words, it’s evolutionarily better for a female to risk it all on the attractive man that all women love than to risk nothing on the average Joe provider (that only some women can tolerate). Such is the power of the force behind a woman’s prime directive. It’s so powerful that even old women will continue to further delude themselves that “the right man” will come their way (just look at Renee’s story).

    Maybe women rate physically attractive men as more likely to cheat or desert a long-term relationship, but however, women show strong desire to the idea of forming long-term relationships with attractive men.

    Remember that Females do indeed fixate on the top %10-20 of the most physically attractive males, in the *general case*. But that doesn’t mean that only 9 or 10 males are the only ones who are getting laid – it just means that the odds of a lower ranking male finding a receptive female is that much more remote. Which, of course, renders less available ‘average’ females to be mated with average guys – necessitating an imbalance that progresses down the attractiveness scale(rendering a sexually asymmetric mating dynamic).

    The other thing to remember is that even if human variance follows a normal distribution, the way that attractiveness is subjectively deemed will not be assessed symmetrically between the sexes. But rather, it will be sexually dimorphic, out of necessity for the way sexual evolution works.

    Now compound the above with the West’s ecological prosperity and you get a cyclical problem where not only are attractive men ‘pumping and dumping’ as Alpha Fucks is held king in the SMP (because currently, women can provide provisioning for themselves, thus Beta Bucks is less relevant to them) but they are also (inadvertently in some cases) leaving women with the hopes that maybe one day, they too, can have their “prince charming”.

  16. I’ve considered the sympathy question on occasion. Ultimately I find it difficult to even feel the slightest sadness for any of these women. I certainly agree with the sentiment of @badpainter 3:25. Another important factor, though, is that I hardly ever see women trying to teach younger women to avoid their mistakes (excepting Susan Patton, and even she may simply be seeking wives for her college aged sons). Throughout the manosphere men describe their struggles and advise the next generation on solutions. Is there anything like this for women? Do lonely forty y/o former party girls tell young women to recognize the value of their youth before it’s too late? Are the calls of “misogynist!!” directed toward any man who dare question the consequences of unfettered sluttitude ever joined by praise from women who regret their past mistakes? No. These women have no remorse. They are not looking for solutions. They know encouraging even basic prudence in young women would mean fewer beta bucks for themselves. If women truly felt sorrow for following feminism’s poisonous principles they would try to prevent others from reaching the same predicament.

    I feel no pain for the plight of the purely selfish.

  17. It’s amazing how many times these exact scenarios have played out in my life. I’m 38 and my SMV has definitely been increasing over the past several years however I still enjoy dating the occasional woman in her mid 30s. I just ended a mini-relationship with a very beautiful woman in Mexico, 34, and easily an 8 in face and body. She could tell the wall was near and was very nervous about finding someone to take care of her. In her twenties she grew bored and left her older millionaire husband despite the fact that he took her in with a kid that wasn’t his. Then as the years went by she found it harder and harder to find Mr. Right. It’s almost like these women have read the script and are living it word for word. We had had a great time together and she treated me like a king trying to impress me. I do feel a tinge of guilt ending it but I have already made enough beta mistakes to last a lifetime.
    As an aside there are so many beautiful women in Mexico who are lusting for American guys. They are exceptionally friendly, feminine, and very sexy. The iPhone has only hit the top demographic down there so the women you can meet online are quite nice. Easy to smash a couple on a week or two trip.

  18. Great article. Just because women are susceptible to the same societal conditioning men are doesn’t mean we have to forgive them for their choices. There are plenty of men who will gladly do that anyway.

  19. I’m with Buena Vista on this: “Everybody needs to own their own behavior, past and present.”

    I’ve been banging this same drum lately, because more and more women are seeking to excuse their own behavior and are getting lots of help from everyone else in doing so. That’s not going to fly with me. If others consistently call me to account for everything I do and have done, then women won’t escape that same accountability, at least not with me. Whatever a woman does or has done, that’s what comprises who she is now. If you were a lazy sloth, that’s what you are. If you slutted around, then you’re a slut. If you wasted a lot of time on men who weren’t willing to marry you, then you’re not very smart.

  20. There is precious little reward for a man, and no appreciation, for having a big enough heart to save a woman from the consequences of her past decisions.

    This sums it up.
    I still don’t know why, as men, we struggle to acknowledge the fact that women & marriage are both inherently bad deals for men. That resources invested rarely equals or exceeds resources returned.
    And I can’t understand why we should feel for sorry for someone who at one point in her life was saying “ewwwww” while turning up her nose at good men, with no understanding that one reaps what one sows.

    For every “ewwww” she gave out in her prime, she’s going to get at least one back in her Post Wall Spinsterhood.

    Sowing and reaping is not the law of man; it is the Law of God.

  21. > divorced women should not attempt to date single men
    >for a variety of reasons.
    >They should marry divorced men.

    Wow. It takes all types to make the world go round!

    Ummm, whatever happened to the concept of getting out of the house, meeting males and screening them for things like intelligence, appearance, social and general life togetherness, humor, good in bed . . . you know, all those things that *actually* relate to whether you’d be good together rather than some weird factor like whether the guy has been previously married . . .

  22. Its always the most beautiful ones that end up alone. The beauty breeds social dysfunction, then the beauty fades-the dysfunction doesn’t.

  23. Rollo,

    As you note:

    I often wonder if women of this profile aren’t as much victims of an ideological conditioning as Betatized men are over the course of their lives. Much of what’s resulted in Reneé’s life are the consequences of having (and still subscribing to) a mindset that’s based on equalist individualism, and she’s now beginning to reap what she’s sown – knowingly or not.

    I believe this is the point we are beginning to see in society now, where the feminine imperative and the feminist imperative diverge (e.g. disillusioned women, red pill women, women against feminism, etc.). As Roissy recently pointed out with scientific research (here), feminist women are significantly more physically and psychologically masculine than the average woman. Therefore, while the feminist imperative has included enough token support and empowerment for the feminine imperative to solicit the majority of women’s buy-in, it does not have the same ultimate goal. In fact, the feminist imperative is as much an intra-sexual competition strategy against feminine women (covertly), as it is an inter-sexual competition strategy to subdue men (overtly).

    Therefore, other than a handful of pleasant memes, platitudes, and feel-goods to emotionally influence their acceptance of the ideology, feminine women do not ultimately get any more real-life satisfaction from this arrangement than men. In fact, much of the true feminine imperative was actually better served under the traditional sex role paradigm, than it is by the feminist imperative now. That is why we are seeing such dissatisfaction and “glitches in the matrix”, even for the feminine women it is “supposed to” empower.

  24. Rollo- “For the same reason I can’t entirely fault a man with an internalized blue pill mindset over his conditioning, shouldn’t we also consider that women are likewise mislead by a similar influence? Are we (again) giving women too much credit for being rational independent agents under different circumstance?”

    I think this is likely true.

    But I wonder at the abstract ethics of how men should then proceed. Is the Redpill aware man now ethically obligated to behave differently? Is the question of a woman’s independent agency really even relevant when the social structures default that women can choose to be or not to be their own agents?

    I think that AFBB works fine in the Stone Age when there were no real restrictions on either sex to act on biological impulse. Hypergamy is regulated by the need for provision and protection. However, a complex technically advanced civilization needs people that can suppress, control, and be aware of the difference between biologically rooted psychology and social constructed ethics and modes of behavior. In other words we all have to choose.

    Hypergamy unstrained means never having to make durable choices in the real world today, Or at least until reality begins limiting choices to only those that are undesirable. I think that would suggest the plight of the post wall women is every bit as organic and designed into the system as the seemingly endless options were pre-wall. The only new twist is the number of women who didn’t get their biological legacy due to birth control, and with that loss was the loss of a long term provisioning and protection of a male partner.

  25. Rollo,

    Another one hit out of the park! I’m inspired to comment and say how much I appreciate your writings and the ideas expressed. I have lived a life pretty much by alpha standards and am discovering that the ‘manosphere’ is codifying ways of behavior I have long considered just basic common sense. It’s interesting to me to find concepts and words behind so many of my instinctual actions.

    I do hear a lot of anger and bitterness from many of your commenters. Let me say as an over the hill guy (I’m 67) that there can be light far down the tunnel (not at the end certainly, as that is the headlight of an approaching train).

    Talk about SMV, I’m retired, tall and very fit and can both cook and dance. I never thought I’d be a chick magnet in my dotage, but it’s happening. Oh I know, you are all thinking; who would want to screw his peers? But among my peers there are a few (maybe 1 in 50) who are still hot in some way. Every one of them lets me know I’m an object of desire. And the weird thing is I have a live-in girlfriend.

    Talk about good retirement planning. I’m enjoying it in spades. I cannot say however I saw it all clearly when I was younger. I’ll get back to this at some future time as there are a few paths I have found that will help a man of any age meet attractive women and practice his alpha traits.

    For now, just my thanks for all you do. Funoldguy

  26. @Badpainter,

    Is the Redpill aware man now ethically obligated to behave differently?

    Certainly not. My consideration here is are we making the same mistake of appealing (or even just wanting to appeal) to women’s reason after-the-fact and after the consequences have already taken place?

    You know I leave ethics up to my readers, but If anything, ethically, it seems men ought to abandon women to the fate they created for themselves. However, what about the women who avoided that fate by cashing in their SMV chips before the casino closed for them?

    For example, ethically, my wife’s sister deserves an entirely different existence than the one she’s living now with her millionaire husband and her first husband’s suicide on her life-ledger. I may feel a bit of pity for Reneé for having been conditioned into her lot, but never for my sister-in-law.

    Maybe you’re right.

  27. I wonder at the abstract ethics of how men should then proceed. Is the Redpill aware man now ethically obligated to behave differently? Is the question of a woman’s independent agency really even relevant when the social structures default that women can choose to be or not to be their own agents?

    One of the best pieces of advice I ever received was:

    “Treat a lady like a lady, a woman like a woman, and a whore like a whore. And learn to tell the difference.”

    For the life of me, I can’t see why some (many?) people find this old-fashioned good sense to be even slightly controversial.

  28. For the life of me, I can’t see why some (many?) people find this old-fashioned good sense to be even slightly controversial.

    Because not all women can be ladies and many can’t even be women. If you bring all women down to the same level, then supposedly everyone will be happy. Only this is obviously just not so.

  29. The truly unhappy women are the ones who missed their calling in life to be a wife and mother. Whether they were suckered into it or whether they willingly bought into the rationalizations really doesn’t matter. What matters for society is that they ended up there and are voting their feelings to the detriment of the rest of us. Check out the single woman vote for Obama vs the other demographics. It’s telling that some stats were saying that 25% of older women are on anti-depressants. Maybe that’s not the right number, but it’s a significant symptom. Meaning if one ever goes to an older woman’s house (past 30 or so), check out her medicine cabinet and her vitamin/supplement stash.

  30. Rollo- “…but If anything, ethically, it seems men ought to abandon women to the fate they created for themselves. However, what about the women who avoided that fate by cashing in their SMV chips before the casino closed for them?”

    I agree the practical ethics is to be responsible for that which one is truly responsible for. The fate of post wall single women is no where near my own list of personal obligations, not even a generic sympathy. Likewise it’s not my job to exact justice on those who successfully cheated the system at the expense of others. Perhaps more importantly it’s of no consequence for me to care one way or the other. Such worrying about someone getting away with something is energy I should be focusing elsewhere. 

    But, I suppose similar to  your feelings about your sister in law, I do find the energy to carry grudges against a couple of ex-wives of close friends. I wouldn’t lift a finger save ’em if the need arose, they’re already dead to me.

  31. So much of pop culture and mass media(mainly tv) caters to women that it’s not just shy of flaunting, it’s here. Like the pop diva catered to for everything, they quickly get comfortable not only asking for far fetched list of items on their rider, they feel very comfortable in announcing it and how much they’re deserving of it.
    The mating strategy changing to emotional comfort would still be due in large to smv decline. Because if the smv would stay high, that high genetic material would still remain within grasp. Like the woman who claims she can get any man she wants. She just waits for signs of interest from a man, knowing that if the man is initially interested she doesn’t really have to do anything but let him in.
    Any guy that she would actually want, she would just never let on about her interest because he doesn’t show interest in her first. So he becomes the man she didn’t want. Explained away with any ready made reason.
    If men can no longer compete for something, they reminisce when they could. If women can no longer compete, they say they’ve grown and moved beyond that to something they really wanted.
    So women are conditioned. When you’re not allowed to disagree, or if you do you can be removed, or if you can do no wrong, but even if you do others will have to get over it( men had to just get it, now it will be just get over it) you can get conditioned.

  32. Deti: “If others consistently call me to account for everything I do and have done, then women won’t escape that same accountability, at least not with me. Whatever a woman does or has done, that’s what comprises who she is now.”

    Agreed again, but my reflection is how transgressive this is today.

    In the 30 year-old movie, Walter Hill’s The Long Riders, I was jarred by the passionate and explicit relationship of Keith Carradine and his (beautiful, by far the most beautiful woman in the movie) prostitute girlfriend. Per usual, she decides it’s time to retire from the trade. She’s about as subtle in her suggestions as, well, a good hooker is subtle. Carradine laughs (he’s been gaming her to the max, incidentally, though she runs a “let’s you and him fight” gambit on him successfully) and dismisses her without remorse. He happily states that it’s not happening. “Because you’re a *whore*, Belle. And you always will be.” They have this conversation a couple of times, and both times he just grins and let’s her have it between the eyes, to the effect of “Are you nuts? You’re a w-h-o-r-e.”

    My point: I really don’t think this dialogue survives to the final print in the movies today. It’s judgy, it doesn’t respect her sex pozzie sex worker agency, it clearly doesn’t respect her totally awesome naked form, it’s not her fault that the love of her life leaves bank notes on her dresser, she should have an invitation to the town dance like any other girl, and why, she owns a buggy rig as fancy as any of the town’s respectable crowd. Carradine, in our present context, is shocking in his casual statement: “You did it, Belle, you own it, that’s how you are.”

    If I’m right, this is another example of how what we discuss here, beyond being simply taboo, actually reveals that we are a secret society. No? See what happens if you tell a 38 year-old SIW who brags on her sexual profligacy: “The thing with you is I don’t believe you can actually sustain an intimate relationship for more than a few months. Because you never have. But I’m enjoying your attentions, and hey, thanks!” Shit will hit the fan.

  33. Unfortunately mainstream lib media will extol Korth et al. as maverick trailblazers battling against the shackles imposed by a ‘loving and caring’ husband . It seems beta-loathing truly knows no limits!

    The hard truth is that these women possess nothing remotely resembling learned wisdom as their cliched self-characterization would have us believe. They inhabit worlds strewn with psychological defense mechanisms shielding them from brutal but patently obvious truths – an existence rife with rationalization and euphemism.

    This life changing ‘self-acceptance’ Korth purports to be enjoying at age 60 is not coincidental. It follows the denial and anger at her sexually invisible post-wall self, which have finally given way to a form of highly manufactured tolerance. Her self-loathing has ceded to an attitude of non-performance. She would put her best foot forward… if only she had one. For Korth, it seems, losing all hope was freedom and now the pressure is off well, who gives a shit!

    Turning to the anecdotal Renee, I see nothing but a warning shot to be heeded by younger pre-wall women. However alluring the alphas in your life, playing brinksmanship with your sexual value and the ability to optimally secure beta bucks can be all-out hazardous. As brutal as it sounds we ought to resist the temptation toward a more altruistic sympathy. Her regret is perhaps not so much aimed at the specific betas (and former betas) she passed up but rather a general discomfort with her failure to secure the ideal scripted happy ending – the ‘good enough’ beta.

    Similarly Korth may engender pity and feel good amongst women only in so far as proof of how much worse things could be.

    Anyway, as a 23 year old male inhabiting one of the most betatized countries in Europe and the Western Hemisphere I’m enormously grateful for the teachings on this blog and the way it’s transformed my life and relationships. Massive thanks Rollo.

  34. Jeremy Ph.D notes: “Therefore, other than a handful of pleasant memes, platitudes, and feel-goods to emotionally influence their acceptance of the ideology, feminine women do not ultimately get any more real-life satisfaction from this arrangement than men.”

    I don’t think they mind much. We see the absurdity of this arrangement, again, in popular culture.

    Amazon Prime gives away one of four books chosen by their editors each month. So they are choosing novels that they believe are both popular and ‘significant’ within a few verticals. I’m laid up with way too much time on my hands, so a research interest reared its head. Today I downloaded an “edgy” romance novel, _Playing it Safe_, by Barbie Bohrman. (And as her last name suggests, she frequently does.) Again, in the romance genre, Amazon is saying this book is “important.”

    Bohrman’s SIW (self-described incidentally) is a mess of manosphere cliches, in regard to her tastes and practices with men, her pretensions about her high value, and even her competitive “I’ll outsex these bitches and get the dick” outlook. So it’s a sex-pozzie, tramps-r-us romp. What’s so weird is that this very quality now is meant to celebrate her as a strong, independent winner in the sexual marketplace. There’s a complete disconnect, to anyone who has dated such women, between her strategies, her practices, her emotional destitution — and her presentation as a role model. Obviously, in the end, she gets the guy — YAY! — because the edgy, cool dude with the art gallery has nothing better to do with his life than couple up with someone with the emotional maturity of a 12 year-old.

    That’s our job: wife up the broken and restless. No one does, in sufficient number, but the storyline is powerful to our distaff side. Only logic would impair such behavior by men, but because most women dismiss logic and accountability with a “But I’m a gurl!” triumphal shout, this stew of contradictions that we can spot at 500 meters has a deep and significant market. Eat the stew, boys, eat the stew. If you don’t, you must be a hater.

  35. I cringe now days when I see women out today pounding drinks and sleeping with new guys every week. Sure they are having fun but that wall is going to hit at some point and the harder they go the earlier that wall hits. Majority of women are doing this.

    For guys they shoot themselves in the foot by denying their SMV and by giving their power away to women and others. They lack the true self esteem that drives them to make something of themselves. Let’s be real, most men have lots of self doubt and are willing to do anything for a women to like them. Will follow society and what it says for them to do.

    To me it’s quite simple about how this works itself out. Quality women find themselves with quality men. They aren’t out every week slamming drinks and looking to fuck they are taking care of themselves and are pretty adamant about finding a male who they want to support their lives to. Men just need to be that strong, goal driven, and knows when he is dealing with a women who compliments his life in the way he needs to help accomplish his goals in life. No matter what they may be.

  36. @Siirtyrion. Seriously good stuff. That is exactly what is happening. The 10% high status alphas are like Jesus Christ to women. Only the alphas are worthy to receive the good sex, only the alpha can save them from a life of misery and boredom. Listen to how women talk about celebrities and it’s like omg are you fucking kidding me!! Women of all age groups are effected by this phenomenon as you pointed out. Very bizarre.

  37. ” ..all the dutiful Betas come out of the woodwork to tell her how pretty she (still) is and to keep her chin up and the right guy will “come along” .. “
    Those sound more like merry roissyard pranksters than sackless obliging herbs to me, mister.
    “Just keep flippin’ the coin, dahling, one day it will land on its edge. Because you’re worth it. Trust me.”

  38. This is by far the best article I’ve ever read in the sphere. It’s destilled red pill wisdom.
    Keep up the good work, Rollo!

  39. “Therefore, other than a handful of pleasant memes, platitudes, and feel-goods to emotionally influence their acceptance of the ideology, feminine women do not ultimately get any more real-life satisfaction from this arrangement than men. In fact, much of the true feminine imperative was actually better served under the traditional sex role paradigm, than it is by the feminist imperative now. That is why we are seeing such dissatisfaction and “glitches in the matrix”, even for the feminine women it is “supposed to” empower.”

    Women’s hypergamy was not served better under the traditional sex role paradigm or they wouldn’t have abandoned it en masse. I think men still have the idea that women as a group are more unhappy the way things are now and that is just false. The cat meme is funny in that it’s supposed to represent the failure of women. Women really do like cats more then they ever liked or will like their beta husbands! Stop deluding yourself by pretending women are all old unhappy spinsters. Every time I take a walk in the morning on a week day I always see groups of women (2 or 3 or more) in there tight yoga pants chatting it up and laughing with their girlfriends, sometimes pushing a baby stroller and/or sipping a latte. The women can be in there 20’s, 30’s, 40’s, 50’s doesn’t matter. Always look like they are having the time of their lives. I guess that’s just an illusion I have. In reality according to the manospherean meme they go home and cry after…raising fists to the sky and exclaiming “where have all the good men gone”?! Men are almost never taking a leisurely stroll at 8 in the morning on a week day. Why is that? You know why. Women are all about the business of hypergamy, and business is good.

  40. Part of breaking out of the Matrix and truly swallowing that bitter Red Pill is to let go of the white knight beliefs that I could have been the one to truly make her happy. All that you write is true and Karma is a bitch. But my renewed focus has been on my own happiness and inner confidence.

    This has in turn lead me towards meeting and banging younger women whose optimism seems to compliment my maturity and seasoned experience.

    There is another pressure that Blue Pill guys face: dating “age appropriate” women.

    But have you noticed that these women in their late 30″s and beyond don’t want a guy in his 60’s…they still think they can entice and seduce a young buck in this 20’s if they play the “I’m experienced in bed” card.

  41. Every time I take a walk in the morning on a week day I always see groups of women (2 or 3 or more) in there tight yoga pants chatting it up and laughing with their girlfriends

    Of course you do where they’re in a group. They are in an unspoken competition as to who is the happiest. Don’t watch them in groups, watch them when they are alone, especially if they are walking home alone in the morning after going out to party the night before. They don’t call it the walk of shame for nothing.

  42. I have an overall theory of AFBB, and how the hamster rationalizes it. Yes, AFBB is women’s preferred sexual strategy. But no woman intentionally sets out to hurt men (or herself) by pursuing it. Most of the time, the strategy doesn’t work to get her what she wants – early commitment from a high status, attractive man.

    First, I think AFBB is the corollary to the male strategy of “have sex with lots of hot sluts who will give it up for little effort and work all that out of your system; then settle down with a nice, cute enough virgin who will give birth to and raise your children”. It’s to be expected that we should see women pursue a parallel strategy, as women become more and more masculinized.

    Women do know what they’re doing. The important thing here is that they don’t truly intend to hurt anyone. They don’t believe anyone will get hurt.

    Women are just doing what they do, because it serves their interests. They believe that all men are out there just doing what they do; just serving their own interests. They believe ALL MEN are out there, making money, having some fun, and getting some sex now and then when they feel like it. The woman pursuing the AFBB strategy believes all men eventually marry “the right person” in the end, just like she herself will, when she feels like it, when she is ready.

    Feminists, a la Sheryl Sandberg and “Lean In”, have gone public with AFBB because they can. They know what they’re doing and are conscious of it. They feel free to be open about it because the FI is now enshrined in law, customs, practices, culture, and judiciary. AFBB is now “normative”.

    Women speak openly about it is because they honestly believe it’s not hurting or injuring anyone – or at least it doesn’t hurt anyone who doesn’t deserve it. And to her way of thinking, nobody’s getting hurt because everyone else is doing it. And if someone does get hurt, well, then he fucked up and he deserved it.

    See, most women believe that what they do – have sex in their 20s then marry in the 30s when older – is what most guys are doing. It’s classic apex fallacy – she sees men (the attractive, sexually desirable, high status men, the only men she notices and can see) out there, working, earning money, living well, traveling, and having sex with women when he feels like it, all with varying degrees of involvement and casuality.

    That’s what she sees them doing; so that’s what she does. She’s trying to replicate the life she believes her ideal man is out there living. This is so that her experiences are similar to his, and perhaps because she believes her similar life will put her in contact with The One Man Of Her Dreams. She doesn’t intend to hurt anyone.

    Any guy who deviates from this, who wants her to commit, is “hurting” her. He’s weird, he’s odd, he’s “insecure”, he’s “jealous”, he’s a pussy, he’s “creepy”. So if he gets hurt, well, then he deserves it. Serves him right, to her way of thinking.

  43. Buena Vista:

    “Because you’re a *whore*, Belle. And you always will be.”

    “it clearly doesn’t respect her totally awesome naked form, it’s not her fault that the love of her life leaves bank notes on her dresser, she should have an invitation to the town dance like any other girl,”

    I agree that today, you just can’t say this to a woman. A couple of times I’ve heard women say words to the effect of “well, having sex before marriage is just de rigueur”. One woman said, quote, “I wouldn’t think that her having had a lot of boyfriends [we all know what THAT means] before would disqualify her from marriage”.

    Boyfriends = “serious” boyfriends, fiancés, sex partners, flings, FWBs, ONSs, fuckbuddies, etc.

    Sluthood is normative now but it means different things to different sexes. To a man, a slut is a woman who has slept with more men than he would be comfortable with for a woman to whom he’d offer commitment. To a woman, a “slut” is a woman who has slept with more men than she herself has. But seriously, today, it’s considered “normal” for a woman to have around, oh, 3 to 8 prior sex partners. Probably 2 or 3 of those were “serious” boyfriends; a ONS or two, and some “in between” guys. That’s “normal” now. Ten is slutty. 20 is REALLY slutty.

    But not to a woman. No woman considers herself a slut. Or if she does, she still believes she’s worthy of commitment, in spite of all the nasty things she’s done with other men but won’t do with you. Because you probably did them too, with other women before her. Or you wanted to. And if you didn’t get to, well, it all works out in the end, according to femlogic. (So don’t you dare spout off, you judgmental hypocrite.)

    So yeah, we are a secret society. Because you cannot say this. Oh no you cannot. Because after all, she’s come to her senses. She’s changed. She wants to get married now, and who are you to say she can’t? You, who has slept with girls just because you wanted to and they were hawt? You’re no better than she is. So you can’t say jack shit about it, and if you do, you’re a hypocrite. And you’re HURTING her. It’s not supposed to be like this. No one was supposed to get hurt.

  44. Deti said: “Any guy who deviates from this, who wants her to commit, is “hurting” her. He’s weird, he’s odd, he’s “insecure”, he’s “jealous”, he’s a pussy, he’s “creepy”. So if he gets hurt, well, then he deserves it. Serves him right, to her way of thinking.”

    I posed a question earlier in the comments wondering if women later regret getting rid of the disposable beta males who actually cared for them earlier in their life when chasing high status men has failed to work out for them the way they thought it would. After some thought, I’m not sure that they ever do. While it’s comforting for an average guy who has been thrown away like the weekly trash to think that someday she will realize the mistake she made and there will be some level of vindication for the pain he suffered, I think Deti is right – the cold hard truth is that they just don’t give a shit about any man deemed to be beneath them, regardless of their history together. The concept of the alpha widow rings true here. I think even if they end up old and alone, the men they will think wistfully about are the alphas who got a away not the betas that got thrown away.

  45. BangoTango: “Every time I take a walk in the morning on a week day I always see groups of women (2 or 3 or more) in there tight yoga pants chatting it up and laughing with their girlfriends, sometimes pushing a baby stroller and/or sipping a latte. The women can be in there 20’s, 30’s, 40’s, 50’s doesn’t matter. Always look like they are having the time of their lives.”

    True this. They are self-validating and consequently at their most vicious. They are then best treated as invisible. If you happen to make eye contact, you will be eviscerated by the others.

    Just come back at the same time the next day.

  46. You know I leave ethics up to my readers, but If anything, ethically, it seems men ought to abandon women to the fate they created for themselves… Rollo

    Yep the more pain they suffer the faster they will fix their shit. The younger the suffer, the faster they will fix their shit. Without this emotional pain women have no need to change their behavior

  47. Keyser:

    I think it all comes down to the fact that women believe that AFBB doesn’t hurt anyone. They believe that you’re out there having sex with cuties when you feel like it, just like ALL OTHER MEN do. So if they are out there having sex with hawt men and going for the longshot odds at commitment with one of them, no harm no foul.

    Everyone’s doing it. Nobody’s getting hurt unless they’re playing the game wrong. Nobody’s getting hurt unless a guy wants “commitment” when she doesn’t, for whatever reason. So if she hurts him, it’s because he had it coming — he didn’t play the game the right way (i.e., the way she wanted him to play).

  48. Keyser: I have never — not once — known a woman to regret dumping a A Good Man, a Nice Guy, or even a Drafthorse Provider.

    We do it all the time (or at least, if still blue pill, do), by comparison, but women have a desirability meter, and once her interest level drops below some mysterious threshold, they are so done. Then they celebrate with their real mates — other women — their ability to dump a guy. It’s empowering for them.

    A woman like Korth, who is probably attractive to some 75 year-old guy who enjoys being lectured on who or what is sexually desirable, remains entitled (in her head) to the man her ideology teaches her is her birthright. She’ll go to her grave happily repeating this delusion; she’s got bad software and it’s stuck on endless loop. Our only responsibility to such a woman is to be able to identify her, and get clear.

  49. re: “it’s evolutionarily better for a female to risk it all on the attractive man”

    This hypothesis has never been proven. In fact, there is empirically at best very very weak and contradictory evidence.

  50. jf12!

    Good to see your alive. People were worried.

    I think you make an interesting point. Too many people assume if it’s nature it must be for the good. Strikes me as the ultimate rationalization because disease is natural and yet we humans fight like hell to stop it.

  51. Well, disproving my prior thesis, this woman is riven with neglect for dumping the lumpy beta who worshiped her pedestalized butt:

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-2263518/I-left-love-life-I-thought-I-better-Now-Im-childless-42.html

    It’s a concise summary of so many red pill observations, and delivered without the slightest self-awareness by the female confessor, that in any anthropology of intersexual relations it has to be considered a primary text (same category as the Katie Bolick piece in The Atlantic a couple of years ago).

  52. Badpainter asks again “Is the Redpill aware man now ethically obligated to behave differently?” and I have, finally, decided: No. Personally my moral obligations, maybe *especially* those governing my interactions with worldly women, are set forth in the principles of Christianity, which haven’t changed even though the worldliness of women has changed. This is not to say that my being a Good Man will work well with women, because it doesn’t work well with women.

  53. @Badpainter, as Liz and others kept reminding me, it’s too easy for those of us with susceptible personalities to get too wrapped up in the social aspects of commenting, so I had to quit. Plus, all the aspects about trying to be badder etc. just wasn’t me, and although it was fun I can’t actually advocate for being badder (even though it works better).

  54. @ Buena Vista:

    Regarding the “woman is riven with [regret] for dumping the lumpy beta who worshiped her pedestalized butt”:

    Only because she ended up alone, or with a man “less than”.

    On the other hand, I’ve seen flashes of introspection from a woman or two who lost out at AFBB and married beta providers they aren’t attracted to. One was quite the stunner in her day, but age, stress, use of intoxicants of various kinds, and weight yo-yo-ing have taken their toll over the years. At 44, she’s been married 13 years but has ended up childless because she couldn’t get pregnant. I once heard her ask rhetorically “Am I just getting what I deserve?”

    I just didn’t have the heart to give her an honest answer.

  55. Buena Vista:

    I often wonder about those lonely hearts club articles in the DailyFail. They just seem so… contrived. It is as if a red pill writer is trolling; authoring these as parody, satire or inside joke.

  56. Reality…the ultimate red pill! Brilliant stuff brother.
    I can see the feminine primacy becoming more aggressive over the next 5-10yrs.
    Especially here in developing / emerging economies (I’m from Kenya).
    Nowadays societal discourse centers around “women are doing it”, “men should step up”, and so on. Extra marital affairs, especially those instigated by women are on the increase, and so is the single mother phenomenon.

    I think reality will hit harder here where there is still attachment to traditional values.

    Women don’t realize that men at some point will just say, ‘Enough’ & ‘no thanks…I’m good!’
    It may not be all of us but it doesn’t have to be.

    I’m 32 now, used to operate as a beta, trying to act in a way my sisters would be proud of, in the way I treated women – proscribed by the feminine primacy, where you’re called a ‘good guy’ ‘husband’ material (‘ever the fuck that is!)
    Not anymore…the red pill came late, but better late than never.
    It’s a great time to be a man!

    Keep up the good work Rollo, we appreciate you brother.

  57. Deti, they seem so obviously contrived, but I think the reality is that most women consider such unselfconscious testimonies “brave”, and their real mission is to articulate feelings, rather than insight or evidence. I mean, the tl;dr version of that story is “I bailed on the boring guy, nailed bad guys instead, now I’ve hit the wall childless.” But summarizing in this fashion would lead a normal person to ask “You’re pretty stupid and self-centered, eh?” So we get a mile of breathless purple prose describing tragedy.

    Put another way, I think even SIW are convinced that their lives should conform to romance novel conventions. The market for those books is so large because their readers don’t see the internal contradictions, either. Fortunately, we’re not responsible for the critical thinking ability, or lack thereof, of those people. Writing these weepers, though, does improve a woman’s social standing with other women. Men tend to respond differently, as in, “Don’t be such a putz and figure it out.”

  58. We reap what we sow.

    I have zero sympathy for the Renee’s and Korths of the world.

    How can anyone believe women like them could possibly be caring and sensitive enough about others to appreciate true consideration from a “great guy”. After 10, 20 or 30 + years of callous hypergamy? Suddenly, they have become sensitive and respectful of the need for a “great guy”? Do not be fooled. They are still the same crap they were when they were younger.

    They now employ a very predictable shit ass scam by indirectly advertising they “care”, now they “understand what really matters……”. This is all nothing but bullshit substituted for the sexual agency they lost. Some of the most destructive ass wipes disguise themselves as poor pathetic little soles who were dealt a bad hand in life and just need your help. Any woman regardless of age who is selling herself based on this sort of shit isn’t worth the shit she’s made of. Do not cast your pearls before swine.

    Always consider first and foremost what she has to offer you, not what you can do or “should” do for her.

  59. @Stringray, by bad I mean objectively evil. Ungodly, unholy, ungood. Romans 1:29-31 gives one summary list of characteristics of a bad man, and suffices for the purposes here. The more a man acts bad, including being irrationally violent, thieving, lying, murdering, adulterous, and the list goes on, the better women will treat him.

  60. “This is not to say that my being a Good Man will work well with women, because it doesn’t work well with women.”

    Disagree. Being a Good (righteous, upstanding, honest) Man (boldness, brashness, fearlessness, confidence, dominance, power) works well. With everything.

  61. “The meek shall inherit the earth…”

    Far more often than not the scripture above is misconstrued, misrepresented, misinterpreted. misused for control of the masses. Common misunderstanding is that humility and meekness will be rewarded. The strong, confident, unafraid to step forward and fight in the face of adversity, to stand up for themselves and speak out against popular lies will inherit “the kingdom of heaven”….who would want to inherit earth with its cesspool of lies and mortality?… this is what is meant by the scripture.

  62. @deti, your opinion is nice, but wrong. Empirically an unrighteous, sneaky, dishonest man will have many more girlfriends who will treat him much better.

  63. …but religion is no consolation or solution….

    The Magicians Rapture

    I have heard stories often sold
    For today and times of old

    Over many thousand years
    To bear upon hopes and fears

    Beseeching all to hear good news
    While kneeling in the chambered pews

    Where the languid count their beads
    To mock resolve and quell their needs

    Wrapped within a woven scheme
    Spun upon their hopes and dreams

    Lies a promise delivered hollow
    Empty souls are sure to follow

    To be lost in battles fought
    For cryptic fortunes sought

    Betrayed the heart is diverted
    When words of truth are perverted

    Beware the god who dispenses
    False prescriptions of repentance

    Yet grand is the encampment
    When devising such entrapment

    And the magicians magic tricks
    Enthrall the horde with theatrics

    For all the world is a stage
    With script upon a written page

    Where ambiguous tales are penned
    Of shame for those who don’t pretend

    And glory for those devoid of pride
    Who forfeit their choice to decide

    Where vows befit a veil to hide
    The magician’s pretentious bride

    Feigning joy, this reigning empress
    Is shrouding for an evil temptress

    A growing host now courts this whore
    Forsaking all they know and more

    Beneath a steeple where she stands
    I see money changing hands

    Earned by weary bodies laden
    For countless image graven

    Few distinguish the magician
    Or the truth of his ambition

    As he comes to raise a chalice
    Adorned in robes his home a palace

    Beaconing all to bear their fruit
    Gathering all to reap his loot

    Persuading all to pay the cost
    Caring not for all who’s lost

    As they shuffle through the aisles
    Each spirit fading all the while

    With blinded eyes and empty stares
    So near to death and unaware

    Befalling carnage as they die
    Hence the futile war of lies

  64. jf:

    Without getting too far into this, I don’t agree with you. It’s not the Good part that guys have a problem with. It’s the Man part. Girls don’t mind a man’s Goodness — can take or leave it. They mind a man’s lack of masculinity, his lack of “Man-ness”.

    Most Christian males are, or tend toward, Good, but they’re not Men.

    It’s much easier for a man to learn to be Good, and to be Good; than it is for him to learn to be a Man.

  65. Do women like “bad boys” because “bad boys” are men with feminine psychology?

    Most of the “bad boys” I’ve known who were also popular with the ladies had the same basic pathological behaviors as women. Impulsive, dishonest, narcissistic, unreliable, opportunistic, ambiguous, and no personal agency. The only real difference was in the tendency toward physical violence.

  66. Women don’t hit the wall at 36. They hit the wall at 25. At that age they already have the 1000 yard-long stare, aka, the pissed off look from being pumped and dumped by Alphas. They’re also ugly behind the make-up, their body is saggy, and those tight pants and what not hide physical flaws.

    It also doesn’t help that most women spend their teens up to their 30s drinking, doing coke, and partying all night. That adds up to them turning 25 and looking like 40.

    As for the rest, sure. That is true. Physicality is king(height/handsome face/symmetrical body features) but women are extremely emotional needy and they are dependent on male approval. They need to feel desirable, they need to feel like men are willing to fight for them. I’ve gone back to college for another year and the freshmen women are already trying to get the beta’s attention secured.

    . Now, one would say that average women need to have a man’s ”interest” on lock-down for them to feel secure, but as I take the bus and train everyday, I make it a prerogative to never give attention to women(looking at them, making their existence comfortable etc) but they try to get me to validate their existence by smiling, preening themselves and getting closer to me. They also don’t respect boundaries. Average-looking man in the presence of a woman? He’s a rapist.

    The key is to teach the real Alphas(tall, handsome etc) to not date women, to only pump and dump them, and to teach the young betas to not give to women what women. Access to resources and free attention. make them feel ugly, make them grow paranoid over the lack of the future suckers they’re expecting to net in their 30s. Don’t make them feel ugly. Ugly women get laid. Make them feel like they don’t exist at all. Trust me. Women begin to feel like crap when even the betas aren’t interested in looking at them,and let me tell you how enjoyable it is to make women feel like trash.

  67. Don’t forget to be unforgiving. A woman looks at you? She’s hot? So what? No matter how hot a woman is, there’s some guy out there tired of paying for her shit or tired of dealing with her. Most of the hot women rarely ever see their high value boyfriends, those guys only show up to empty their balls on their girlfriends, so don’t be the sucker who is the emotional nurturer and professional blue-baller.

    How to prevent yourself from ending up like this? Look angry. Women can’t manipulate their environment. Men use tools, persistence and our brains. Women use men to get what they want. When I see a woman looking at me waiting for me to ask her what she needs, I look at her with this very angry expression on my face. She moves along and I don’t waste my time, effort and possibly money on some skank that is being banged by guys who don’t bother to learn her name. win-win for me.

  68. ”Most Christian males are, or tend toward, Good, but they’re not Men.”

    I’m sorry, bro, but lets take the Ancient Greeks for example. Most of them disliked women for they knew the real nature of women. They only spent time with women when it was time to mate. it is the modern man who makes it feel like the only way to be a man is if he gets laid or if he does something that makes him look masculine, i.e bodybuilding. Then again, Socrates and his ilk could probably bench-press you to death and they didn’t bother with machismo BS.

  69. Badpainter:

    Part of the “attraction” might be that “badboys” are men with some feminine traits like impulsiveness and lack of agency. But I think women like bad boys because bad boys tend to be rules breakers and they tend not to care what others think of them. The “independence” and aloofness are considered masculine. Most women are used to men kowtowing to them, giving them whatever they want, caving in to their demands. “Badboys” won’t do that, which can trigger or increase attractiveness.

  70. @Badpainter

    Do women like “bad boys” because “bad boys” are men with feminine psychology?

    No…”bad boys” (the ones who get laid with most any girl they want, etc.) are not men with feminine psychology. They are men who really don’t give a shit what any female thinks of them and aren’t controlled in the least by feminine psychology.

  71. Prof:

    Whatever. Fact is, most men today are not Men. They’re Good, but they’re not Men. They’re not bold or brash. They cower at adversity or conflict. They fear everything. They favor consensus at all cost. They seek safety, not adventure. They cannot control even their own bodies.

  72. deti-

    Nothing has changed from yesteryear…”The mass of men lead lives of quiet desperation” Henry D. Thoreau 1854

  73. “Do lonely forty y/o former party girls tell young women to recognize the value of their youth before it’s too late?”

    Never. These post-wall women jump at the chance to lay tinder (pun intended) at the feet of those younger versions of themselves so that their youth and beauty and hope will be immolated to fuel hedonistic pursuits and impulsive indulgences.

    Worse, sooner or later those charred remains will be repackaged and lofted up like some badge of strength and independence and the deluded mares will cheer her on once again while the men continue to avert their eyes and pas on by, obviously intimidated.

    I work in nonprofit (think pear-shaped Masters degrees entitled to $50k for 30 hours “work”) and I see the passing of the baton almost every day. The old birds cannot see how they got to where they are; the young birds cannot see how they tread the same path as those old birds.

    In fact, these days the path is moving with them, like those moving walkways at airports, comfortably accelerating them toward their own special irrelevance. They think it is an escalator, up toward their man in waiting, but we know differently. To speak of such would get me a cup of tea with some HR beast at best. I take my leave of those poor souls ASAP, though I can’t resist some water-cooler schadenfreude come monday. “No, he hasn’t called yet.”

  74. Of college educated Gen X women 43% are childless, 25% are predicted to be childless by 40. Forty percent over 50 are single, not to mention the glut of single mothers.

    Marriage age gap is shrinking ( the bigger the gap the better for men, it’s demographically the equivalent of having more females, the smaller the gap the worse it is for men) and slowly women are marrying younger men (currently 14%).

    As far as I can see this does not auger well for men, it’s just creating a sea of lonely betas.

    Alphas aren’t visiting karmic revenge on women they’re burning betas.

    Women are social creatures, they’ll find their niche and survive (family, friends, social groups etc.) it’s the betas with no purpose that will sink into an abys of loneliness and misery.

    Just look at MGTOW and the comments on online media and blogs, wall to wall diatribes by men.

  75. @Buena Vista
    Deti beat me to it, but the truth is, again, she does not regret leaving BetaBoy. She regrets ending up alone when she thought she was going to be able to trade up.

    @Deti
    I tend to agree that the real issue is not “niceness” or “Bad Boyness”…..it’s sheer masculinity. The fact that the West and the Western church as a whole breeds all masculinity out of men is a clear sign that they have no idea who the Middle Eastern born Savior was. A man that was able to cleanse His temple of money changers by Himself with only a whip, and no one seemed to be able to stop Him. A man that called out the religious leaders of His day and called them vipers and snakes right to their faces.

    If Western men got back to being men, they’d find a whole lot more women interested. This is the basis of the Red Pill…nut up, and the women show up.

  76. ”Prof:
    Whatever. Fact is, most men today are not Men. They’re Good, but they’re not Men. They’re not bold or brash. They cower at adversity or conflict. They fear everything. They favor consensus at all cost. They seek safety, not adventure. They cannot control even their own bodies.”

    Brash and bold men usually end up dead or without a limb or two. World war I was filled with young volunteers who wanted to impress the ladies, gain glory, and the respect of their friends, and what most got out of it was an early death, or a return home without legs. Meanwhile, the soft, timid men who either pretended to have some physical problem that made it impossible to join the army lived a whole life to their old age, without having a stump at the end of their arms or legs.

    What’s a man? A human being born with male genitalia is a man, regardless of his sexuality or how many or how little sexual partners he had in his life. And what makes a man, a self-actualized version of himself? When he lives for himself, when he doesn’t try to fill in some list of requirements women have for their potential partners or one-night stands. Life is much more successful when its viewed from one-single window.

    The man who doesn’t wallow about what he can have or can’t is far more likely to live a full life, over the guy who either spends his time and his few decades of life either trying to emulate Alpha male personality behavior, or pumping his body with steroids to look whatever version the mansphere considers to be masculine. Then again, the men we descend from, the hunters of those many dozens of thousands of years ago were lean and slim and didn’t look like Van Damme, yet I’m pretty sure hunting huge mammals is masculine enough of an activity.

    Anyway… I don’t enjoy losing. I’d rather focus on what I can become better at and with enough work, become the best at one day. A man can hardly ever be secure in his ability to secure a woman and lets be honest. Most women(as most men) aren’t attractive. Men have no trouble sleeping with them if the chance offers itself, but most women are Daisy Buchanan and even if you become Super Alpha male Superman 2.0, women of any quality are impossible to get.

    Regardless of how attractive or how much richer you might be compared to the guy she jumped ship for.

    Have you ever read the novel, ”Summer in February?” Or seen the movie?

    Let me summarize it for you.

    Very beautiful young Victorian woman runs away from her strict father. She moves in with her brother, an aspiring artist who lives in an English seashore closed community for painters(and their groupies!). She’s presented with two Apex Alpha males; the best painter of them all, who is also brash and passionate and gruffly. He’s ruggedly handsome, I suppose.

    The other one is a tall, rich, very handsome blond man with blue eyes always clean-shaved, a Captain in the queen’s army, has family money, land and titles and he’s a strong, masculine yet very patient and compassionate man. Her father approves of him, he’s in love with her and wants to marry her as fast as possible but guess who gets the girl?

    The drunk guy who sleeps with groupies(possibly has venereal diseases) doesn’t have a job or a house and has an unstable personality.

    I don’t see it only happen in books or movies. Movies and books are representations of real life and women have always gone for the bad boy. you can be stronger, taller, or far better-looking than the guy who snorts coke and has a foot-long history of spending time in jail. And she will always choose that guy over the man who is worth her time.

    Yes, a man can work on himself and become a ”real man” or whatever definition you use for your version of what a man has to be, but all he’ll get is either a Susan Walsh – a very average-looking woman who in her prime banged a ton of Alpha males and then got herself a sucker.

    Or you can lock-down an ugly/whatever version of average is there and hope for the best.

    Meh, the only women worth fighting for are either in love with $$ or with a man’s jail tattoos. Sadly its not that easy to become a Rockfeller and I’m not interested in being raped in jail.

    Also, I have this weird tendency to only want what wants to be wanted by me. When I look around I witness the women who are good-looking pair up with men who treat them like trash. Sure, I could get one of those not-obese/not ugly women but they aren’t attracted to me. They want the same douchebags every woman wants, but only a few can hold on for more than a few pumps and dumps. I’m not interested in having children(and If I wanted children I’d only wanted children with tall, natural blonde women with blue eyes to pass along those genes to my kids) and guess what?

    Beautiful German women are more expensive than a brand new mercedes-benz 🙂

  77. ”They cannot control even their own bodies.”

    Who can? I can’t control how tall I am or how healthy I’m going to be in the future. heart disease, cancer, Alzheimer and all of that is already decided for me. I can’t do anything about it so I don’t bother thinking about it.

    It reflects in real life, this viewpoint. I don’t suffer from sexual frustration because I don’t desire what I can’t have. What do I want? What am I attracted to? To younger versions of Claudia Schiffer. Heck, I think I’d do her even at her current age. Can I have her? Nope. I don’t have the money nor the looks for a 25 year old Claudia Schiffer to look at me. Does it pain me? Nope. Its actually an adaption device. I am not attracted to the majority of women. They’re plain-looking to me even if they have ” dat booty” which is one of the reasons I can be surrounded by 18-25 women who are deemed very attractive by other men and not feel anything. On the other hand, I do feel a slight discomfort at being near my womanly ideal, so I tend to avoid them.

    My tip for men who don’t want to feel sexually frustrated? Avoid your type of women. My tip for young men? Avoid all women, your hormones will eventually settle down, LOL.

  78. ”His temple of money changers by Himself with only a whip, and no one seemed to be able to stop Him. A man that called out the religious leaders of His day and called them vipers and snakes right to their faces.”

    Yeah, about that. Jesus Christ died a virgin. So did Peter and if I recall it correctly, the guy told men to stay away from women, to only deal with women if they really needed to get laid, and to do it within the realm of marriage. What is considered masculinity by the mansphere is dying out in the west. The behaviors I witness meeting any success at attracting women are done by feminine-looking and feminine-acting men.

    i mean, come on, young men smile every 3 seconds or so. I have never seen men smile this much in my life. That’s a feminine quality. Yet they do get laid if they have the looks to make up for their lack of ”masculinity.”

  79. @Professor
    Peter did not die a virgin; he was married. Matthew 8:14.

    Jesus didn’t speak that much about marriage; what He did say was, how permanent it is in His eyes, and how men can’t divorce their wives unless sexual immorality is involved. Matthew 19:1-11. Also, that there’s no marriage after the resurrection Mark 12:25.

    Paul was the one who said it wasn’t good to touch a woman 1 Corinthians 7:1, but if you can’t control your urges, it’s better to marry than to burn with lust 1 Corinthians 7:9.

  80. @Professor

    You claim to have adapted yourself to not care about being with women,yet here you are on a blog for men about gender relations spilling thousands of words imploring others to espouse a dislike and contempt for women. If you truly don’t care about women, why spend so much time talking about it? I see parallels between you and Korth. It seems that you both desire intimate relations with the opposite sex, but since that hasn’t worked out in the desired way you convince yourself that you’re better off without it and feel the need to push it as the enlightened way to others.

    It’s like someone who really wants to be a billionaire but decides it’s too hard and then becomes a monk and spends their whole life convincing others to give up their wealth, all while secretly wishing they could have been a billionaire.

  81. “You know I leave ethics up to my readers, but If anything, ethically, it seems men ought to abandon women to the fate they created for themselves… Rollo”

    When I was a younger man I used to believe the stories I heard about what a bastard their X’s were and how it was never their own fault, hook, line and sinker. The simplest laws of probability should have told me the odds simply did not line up for that scenario.

    The problem in our present Betaworld is women are rarely expected to take responsibility for their actions and there is no longer any societal punishment to keep them in line. To compound matters our thirsty brothers continue to line up drink at the well of shame for a shot at getting laid by 5’s.

    Of the women in their mid 40’s, they are the most delusional and self centered of all. Many seem to sense the wall’s well past, deny it and floor it for one last shot the alpha/EPL adventure. Of the women in their 40’s+ I’ve dated, nothing’s changed, many have reverted backto the age of 16. it’s extremely rare I’ve heard any suggest they even think about the damage to decent men in their past life, changed out like batteries in a vibrator. Solid marriages of 20+ years to betamen are blanked out like they never happened for flings with some X from Highschool and sex in Mall parking lots….Delusional, yes, do I feel sorry for them, not a bit.

  82. Good women are not unicorns, and certainly not extinct. The professor’s rant notwithstanding, they exist. Discovering them, filtering for them, requires some original thought and an ability to reject current cultural definitions of “good”, while at the same time learning how to interact with them in a constructive manner (which is profoundly counter-cultural, and requires us to abandon greater-beta, femme-centric, drafthorse behavior and pretensions).

    For example, most of us as our former blue pill personalities might be inclined to believe that the Daily Mail woman is a victim of life’s circumstances, and believe her when she asserts that she is “finally ready for The One.” Certainly this outlook has created some major corporations like OKC and Match.com.

    Post-red pill we might instead see someone who has made a now-hardwired habit of terrible decisions, and who is now incapable of the innocent, transcendental “love” she prattles on about. We might see that she is not even asking the right questions about her many stupid life decisions.

    We might even smirk at the Daily Mail piece, for surely it will result now in a flood of inquiries and proposals from dreary white knights (it’s a perverse form of online dating profile, that testimony and self-expose). I predict we’ll have a follow-up, “happy ever after” testimony from the same woman, in a year or two, in which she talks about how she finally met a man “who just gets me”. That man will not be someone we interact with at The Rational Male.

  83. “The Bible”…”Jesus”…”St. Peter”…ect.

    Perhaps I will burn in hell……

    If someone walked up to you on the street today and said…

    “Hi, my name is Brian and I am the son of “God” and if you “believe” me you will live in paradise for eternity.” “If you do not believe me, you are condemned to eternal damnation and suffering”, Oh, and by the way, me and my father are the same person.”

    Would you believe this person? Would you go around pretending that you know what he said is true? If not, then why would you “believe” or pretend the same thing about a person who you never met, a person in a book that was initially written 300 years after the person died, a book produced primarily by a Roman Emperor who was seeking power over a larger number of people and a larger geographical area to increase tax revenue, power, etc… and had been rewritten numerous times over a period of 2000 years.

    Religion accomplishes nothing for our purposes here other than the fact that it has it’s own Red Pill.

  84. Despite the internalized wisdom of the manosphere, some men understandably go their own way rather than feast on war pigs. Exposure to “media” sets higher-than-otherwise standards, but the hard truth is that quality women are only for the winners. A loser can try harder or he can give up. He may not want the trophy for 14th place.

    I have been married for 37 years. The manosphere has helped me understand the (variable) behavior of my wife and the other women around me. Keeping fit, upping game, amassing wealth are my mantra. Amused mastery during shit tests and application of soft dread at all times are essential to my (our?) happiness.

    My computer wallpaper is a picture of my wife at 26 posing in a bikini. When I look at her now at 60, I honestly see the younger version of her as well as what is there now. She points out this and that: I tell her I don’t see it. And truly I don’t.

    But it’s work – hard work – keeping things somewhat on an even keel. The shit tests are endless. Example: “What would you rather see, me losing my hands or you losing your balls”. Answer: “You losing your hands, because if I lost my balls, I might as well be dead.” Result: pissed off wife, but no more shit testing for a day or two. Conclusion: to make an omelette, one has to break some eggs.

    If my wife were to leave me (always a possibility) my learnings here would direct me to unformalized serial monogamy until the day I die.

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