Dangerous Times – Part 3

In writing and editing this series for the last few weeks a lot has happened in the Future is Female movement. I’m not a big fan of awards shows for obvious reasons; they have all gone from being a celebration and acknowledgement of creativity and performance in entertainment to being little more than a stage upon which political and social protests are aired by pampered celebrities. However, the recent Golden Globes anti-male / anti-masculinity screed by Oprah Winfrey initiated the next step in what can only be described as socially accepted misandry. I have no doubt that the (now annual) Women’s March planned for January 20th will see this anti-male, female supremacism go far beyond what it did in 2017 and echo Oprah’s open hatred for men and an unapologetic call for the removal of men and the criminalization of any semblance of conventional masculinity.

The original intent of this series was to raise awareness of the dangerous inherent in our coming intersexual social relations. And in the time I’ve been considering this I had to finally take a birds eye view of where we’ve come from and where we’re likely to end up with regard to the social direction I see the sexes headed today. For the final installment of this series there are a couple of articles I’m going to reference that got me thinking recently. The first was an article on Quillette by William Buckner titled Romanticizing the Hunter Gatherer. I’m using this as a starting point today because I think this piece speaks to some common misperceptions of our evolutionary past as hunter gatherer, tribalist beings.

When it comes to evolutionary psychology (evo psych) and biology (evo bio) there is always a tendency to want to focus certain speculations on particular ideological bents. In fact, there is a current push to typify all science as being inspired by male-primary sexism and a motion to reform the sciences by requiring them to basically concur with what ever serves the Feminine Imperative’s most flattering interests. Another popular idea amongst egalitarian equalists is the speculation (really romanticization) of our hunter gatherer ancestors being natural egalitarian equalists themselves. Equalists love to presume that human beings’ natural state is one of collective cooperation and gender equality, but according to new studies there’s no evidence to support these ideas (emphasis mine):

But what about egalitarianism? In a 2004 study, Michael Gurven marshals an impressive amount of cross-cultural data and notes that hunters tend to keep more of their kill for themselves and their families than they share with others.12 While there is undeniably a great deal of sharing across hunter-gatherer societies, common notions of generalized equality are greatly overstated. Even in circumstances where hunters give away more of their meat than they end up receiving from others in return, good hunters tend to be accorded high status, and rewarded with more opportunities to reproduce everywhere the relationship has been studied.

[…] In the realm of reproductive success, hunter-gatherers are even more unequal than modern industrialized populations, exhibiting what is called “greater reproductive skew,” with males having significantly larger variance in reproductive success than females.15 Among the Ache of Paraguay, males have over 4 times the variance in reproductive success that females do, which is one of the highest ratios recorded. This means some males end up having lots of children with different women, while a significant number of males end up having none at all. This is reflected in the fact that polygynous marriage is practiced in the majority of hunter-gatherer societies for which there are data. Across these societies, the average age at marriage for females is only 13.8, while the average age at marriage for males is 20.7.16 Rather than defending what would be considered child marriage in contemporary Western societies, anthropologists often omit mentioning this information entirely.

Much of this article confirms a majority of what the Red Pill has been observing and considering for a long time now. The Pareto Principle being the highlight in this last part here; 20% of men reproducing with 80% of women. I’ll also draw your attention to the studies that suggest that only one man for every 17 women reproduced as little as 8,000 years ago (after the advent of agriculture). The Quillette article is a fascinating read, particularly from a Red Pill perspective, and I’d encourage you to read it. The operative point in this is that this research confirms that, despite the feel-good belief that human beings are naturally monogamous and naturally egalitarian, our hunter gatherer ancestors were largely polygamous.

The second article I’m going to reference is The Link Between Polygamy and War from the Economist last month. This is a very in-depth research that breaks down the connection between modern polygamous social orders and their tendency for political unrest and unstable societies. The Economist is a paywalled site, but again it’s well worth the read. This is a very thorough detailing of how men in these countries are systematically disqualified from reproduction in polygynous social and religious societies due to their lack of resources. Only wealthy men are permitted a wife (the only sanctioned way a man can have sex) and if a man can afford more it is a sign of his prestige that he can take as many as he has the resources for.

Men in South Sudan typically marry as often as their wealth — often measured in cattle — will allow. Perhaps 40 percent of marriages are polygamous. “In [our] culture, the more family you have, the more people respect you,” says William, a young IT specialist in search of his second wife. Few South Sudanese see the connection between these matrimonial customs and the country’s horrific civil war. If you ask them the reason for the violence, locals will blame tribalism, greedy politicians, weak institutions and perhaps the oil wealth which gives warlords something to fight over. All true, but not the whole story. Wherever it is widely practiced, polygamy (specifically polygyny, the taking of multiple wives) destabilizes society, largely because it is a form of inequality which creates an urgent distress in the hearts, and loins, of young men. If a rich man has a Lamborghini, that does not mean that a poor man has to walk, for the supply of cars is not fixed. By contrast, every time a rich man takes an extra wife, another poor man must remain single. If the richest and most powerful 10 percent of men have, say, four wives each, the bottom 30 percent of men cannot marry. Young men will take desperate measures to avoid this state.

The article goes on to link the unemployment of young men to their resorting to criminal (and often open war) means to take the wealth necessary for them to procure a wife. This then leads to violent and social unrest. When we look at militant Islamic organizations one of the first, and probably most convincing, rewards young fighters are offered is the guarantee of a wife – even if she is the spoils of war. Much of what prompted the Arab Spring uprisings has been attributed to the unemployment rates in these countries and the consequent result that those young men cannot ‘legitimately’ afford to marry or have a family. They literally have nothing to lose and a wife (sexual release) and a family to gain.

When one man can monopolize 20 wives and thereby force his rivals from the gene pool we have a similar condition to that of our hunter gatherer ancestors. Only in this instance polygamy (really polygyny) is a socially mandated, socially approved convention.

One persistent debate I read in the manosphere is the contention that human society, achievement, stability, etc. is the result of post-agrarian monogamy. Usually this debate crops up between the more traditionalist faction of the sphere and the more brutally pragmatic of Red Pill aware men. I understand the premise from the traditional perspective; there is every evidence that the conventional family structure has been the lynchpin of social progress. I agree with this assessment, but from an evolutionary perspective human beings are not innately monogamous. Our conventional monogamy and family structure, and the resulting progress is really in spite of ourselves. The evidence is there in our genomic records. Our success as a culture was due to controlling the feral aspects of both men and women’s natural sexual strategies via social conventions, religion and personal conviction. And the result of this control is a social contract that is based on monogamy.

That said, there is no denying that monogamous societies make for the most stable societies – or at least they have up to this point in history. Even the Economist article highlights this fact. Monogamy reduces reproductive stress on Beta men – or at least until recently. One reason we have Disney myths of soul mates so prevalent in the past generations is as social a social reinforcement for monogamy. The social convention of idealistic love being a mutually accepted concept between the sexes is also a social reinforcement for monogamy. These were conventions that held men in an idealized state of monogamy. Even the worst Beta still had a hope to reproduce if the mythology was such that “there’s someone for everyone.”

But again, all of this idealization of monogamy is really in spite of ourselves. Left to our own means and our unfettered sexual strategies men will be ruthlessly polygynous and women will resort to ruthless Hypergamy.

The New Polygamy Polyandry

You can probably see where I’m going with this now. Since the time of the Sexual Revolution (and unilaterally female-controlled hormonal birth control) we have seen a systematic degradation of this monogamous social order in favor of a female-primary social order. This social order is predicated on women’s complete control over the reproductive fate of society. Whereas before there were social checks and balances in conventional monogamy, these have been replaced with the unrestrained, unquestioned imperatives of women’s sexual strategy – Hypergamy. In just 5 short decades men have ceded any claim to not only our own sexual strategy and interests, but to any right to paternity.

When we look at how social trends have shifted with regard to women’s sexual selection process we can see the end game more clearly. We’ve gone from ’No Means No’ to ‘Yes Means Yes’ , to itemized permission documentation of every sex act, and now to “enthusiastic consent”. Women’s end game is not unlike our original state of polygamy in that only the most desirable Alpha men will be allowed breeding rights to women – with the social contract being all women are entitled to Alpha Fucks. Enthusiastic consent is a ‘thing’ because on some level of consciousness women loathe the idea of transactional sex with Beta men. And as women’s provisioning and security needs are already met by the state and men’s own direct or indirect resource transfer, there is no longer any desire for “sex they’re really not that into.”

If not for ubiquitous, free online porn and soft prostitution (Sugaring, Tinder, Seeking Arrangements) western culture might find itself in a similar situation to the polygamous countries described by the Economist.

I think it’s important for Red Pill aware men to consider that as women consolidate more and more power via social conventions that only apply to men (MeToo, Times Up, etc.) the end game is one of polyandry for women. This cartoon was a funny one because it accurately describes women’s sexual selection process, but it’s unfunny because it also belies women’s idealized state – one in which men are either draft animals or breeding stock. 

I had quite a few men ask me where I think we’re headed with regards to intersexual social dynamics and I would say that what I’m ultimately seeing is an erasure of conventional monogamy replaced with a Hypergamous polygamy in which women will have uncontested control over reproduction. I see a lot of similarities occurring with men who drop out of life, and either neglect or refuse to build their lives around supporting a family or entertaining a wife. The guys I talk to very much want to get married and have kids, but the downsides are so unimaginably dangerous for men it seems hopeless to them. The old monogamous social contracts no longer exist, but men are still being held responsible for not putting themselves on the line to take risks that only apply to them.

So, not unlike the young unemployed men in the Arab Spring, today’s drop out guy has very little hope for a monogamous future with a woman. But this hopeless circumstance is being instituted by western women, not a religious dogma. Un restrained Hypergamy leads us back to our feral, tribalist polygamy, simply because women have no use for Beta men. Sex with Betas is (or soon will be) considered rape and without porn or some other sexual sedation Betas would likely resort to violence to solve that problem.

What to Do

Anonymous Reader hit me with this comment:

Distilled to it’s essence this is how women in uncontested control of men and masculinity will view men: according to their basest Hypergamous needs and in the context of complete solipsistic self-interests.

Something more like an ant colony or beehive than a civilization of humans. A society of women owners, a handful of males allowed to breed and a whole lot of neutered workers.

I’ve used the Sadie Hawkins’ World analogy for some time now, but this is what the new order of Fempowerment has created for men and women going forward. As much as it goes against every evolved instinct for women, it will be women who must pursue and make the effort to initiate sex and intimacy with men. There will likely be some pushback from more traditional/conventional women who truly desire men to pursue them – nothing is more flattering for a woman’s ego – but the social environment will be such that the risk of personal destruction will become so high, and the juice not being worth the risk of the squeeze will be so low, that even the top tier men in the SMP will be incentivized to allow women to make the first move.

Essentially what MeToo, Enthusiastic Consent and Fempowerment is establishing is an even higher standard of what constitutes an ideal Alpha. It is a tightening of the market of sorts. Women are reluctant (and then resentful) to settle for a less-than the best Hypergamy with a suboptimal male as it is now, but add to this the condition that only the most ideal of Alphas represents the only legitimate sexual experience

Some Solutions:

  1. Play the Game better: Learn Game so thoroughly that you can use the corrupted system to your best advantage. The bar is set so low for men today that even marginal self-improvement, Red Pill awareness and Game savvy can set a man apart from the overwhelming majority of Beta, feminized symps. In essence men can make themselves into commodities women will compete for. There is a danger in this though; women who want to consolidate on the Alpha who wont commit open themselves up to false accusations in reprisal.
  2. MGTOW: As there are varying degrees of MGTOW I can’t say that the most isolationist of MGTOWs response is really a solution. Distilled down, MGTOW is an abdication of meta-Frame to women. However, not all MGTOWs are cut from the same cloth. Many will explain that MGTOW is just men not using women as a benchmark for their ego validation, and my response is, great, I think any Red Pill aware man ought to do the same. Taking womankind off the pedestal and replacing them with your own Mental Point of Origin is key in any man’s unplugging. That said, isolation may not be the best approach to dealing with the Future is Female crowd.
  3. Transactional sex: Reducing intersexual relations to Tinder hook ups, Sugar Baby/Daddy contractual agreements, or ‘Seeking Arrangements’ will preclude a transactional understanding and imply specific positive consent. This still has its dangerous though. Even a Tinder hook up can go bad for a guy if a woman still has regrets at a later date. However, at least from a social standpoint a woman seeking a sexual encounter can be thought of as being proceptive about the experience and not a victim of coercion.

I’d encourage more solutions in the comments. I’m sure a lot of this series seems overly reactionary or disheartening for men who are looking for a return to that stabilizing monogamy. There is an element in the manosphere today who are looking for their Red Pill Trad-Con woman who will police the worst of herself in order to return to the golden era of monogamy. I have my reservations about the real motives of the few women who subscribe to this story, but the issues isn’t about what they will do, but rather what they can do in a feminine-primary social order that allows them to renege on their convictions without consequence.

5 1 vote
Article Rating

Published by Rollo Tomassi

Author of The Rational Male and The Rational Male, Preventive Medicine

Speak your mind

638 Comments
Inline Feedbacks
View all comments
anonymous
anonymous
6 years ago

Great series. Artificial insemination and surrogacy may bear mentioning in the context of these posts. Saying that men will become either draft animals or breeding stock is on point; in 2016 Sweden, the Government released a report that concluded that all forms of surrogacy should be outlawed, then a short time later made state-sponsored artificial insemination legally accessible to single women. There was a headline at the time that read: “Sperm donors in Sweden rush to help single women”. You can’t make this stuff up. And we all know how tough it is to be a single mother, but Sweden… Read more »

Yollo Comanche
Yollo Comanche
6 years ago

@M Simon

“Another instructional video. About 11 minutes.”

Jesus that was informative. And it alerted me to the fact that I went to one SHITTY high school.

kfg
kfg
6 years ago

” I went to one SHITTY high school. ”

They’re all shitty. Some just have a better polish than others.

theasdgamer
6 years ago

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qrRRhoS3KFk

When I think back on all the crap I learned in high school

It’s a wonder I can think at all…

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
6 years ago

I went to one SHITTY high school.

Cue John Taylor Gatto…

princeps
princeps
6 years ago

rollo you are too pessimist. you are just describing the agenda of a political lobby in isolation from the context. there are other forces just as strong or even stronger who are operating against this lobby (e.g trump won the elections). if you want to be more accurate you should give the full picture and also describe what opponent lobbies are doing to defeat liberalism and femminism. women are very passive, frightful, weak and lack of ambition: they would not be capable alone to stage such an orwellian nightmare. the right question is: who is funding feminism and why? [dontchu… Read more »

Blaximus
Blaximus
6 years ago

Hee.

theasdgamer
6 years ago

Typo correction:

The original intent of this series was to raise awareness of the dangerous inherent in our coming intersexual social relations.

I think it should be:

“The original intent of this series was to raise awareness of the dangers inherent in our coming intersexual social relations.”

Blaximus
Blaximus
6 years ago

I’m curious so I have a question for you guys: out of all of the women you know cordially or familiarly, or even just observationally, approximately what percentage would you say are feminist?

I would classify 2 women that I currently know and deal with regularly as full on feminist. So that breaks down into fractions of a percent in my case.

What are there in America, about 150 million women give or take? Maybe more? ( I looked it up months ago but it doesn’t come to mind now ).

Blaximus
Blaximus
6 years ago

Oh, clarification. By observationally I’m talking about IRL and not media or movie or entertainment related examples. We all already know what’s up with those venues.

theasdgamer
6 years ago

From Rollo’s referenced article by Buckner, Among the Hiwi of Venezuela, and the Ache of Paraguay, female infants and children are disproportionately victims of infanticide, neglect, and child homicide. It is in fact quite common in hunter-gatherer societies that are at war, or heavily reliant on male hunting for subsistence, for female infants to be habitually neglected or killed. In 1931, Knud Rasmussen recorded that, among the Netsilik Inuit, who were almost wholly reliant on male hunting and fishing, out of 96 births from parents he interviewed, 38 girls were killed (nearly 40 percent). Lots of X Chromosomes don’t get… Read more »

Novaseeker
Novaseeker
6 years ago

I’m curious so I have a question for you guys: out of all of the women you know cordially or familiarly, or even just observationally, approximately what percentage would you say are feminist?

Co-workers it’s around 50% — it varies by paygrade the higher paygrade colleagues are all feminist, often stridently so, the lower paygrades assistants are mostly not identified feminists (although some are).

Real life, around 40%, but that varies depending on the group/family you’re talking about.

Keep in mind I move in highly educated circles in the DC region, which is very, very, very feminist.

Sentient
Sentient
6 years ago

I would classify 2 women that I currently know and deal with regularly as full on feminist. So that breaks down into fractions of a percent in my case.

But 80% of women will subscribe to Sisterhood Uber Alles… ’cause it always means more for them, even if just theoretically.

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
6 years ago

Blaximus I’m curious so I have a question for you guys: out of all of the women you know cordially or familiarly, or even just observationally, approximately what percentage would you say are feminist? For what definition of “feminist”? I know churchgoing women who call themselves “equalitarian”, who wear dresses all the time and will even say they are opposed to femnism. They don’t approve of lesbians marrying, they are totally opposed to abortion. On the other hand, they support Title IX, they are all in favor of young women’s sports teams, they have no problem with scholarships and other… Read more »

Sun Wukong
Sun Wukong
6 years ago

@M Simon

“BTW the main cause of PTSD in America is child abuse.”

Technically that’s not the same PTSD suffered by soldiers, so it’s classified as cPTSD. Source: therapist I spent the past few years talking about what he ultimately evaluated as my case of that exact problem and cause. Doesn’t surprise me at all that a nation of single moms results in a nation of abuse related psychological trauma.

Lost Patrol
Lost Patrol
6 years ago

approximately what percentage would you say are feminist?

This is a trick question. I could say one hundred percent, or zero, and be right.

Blax, you are the one often pointing out that many things exist on a sliding scale.

What percentage of women do you personally know that would voluntarily give up any feminist gains since the right to vote?

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
6 years ago

In fact, the 19th Amendment is a good first-order test. Any woman who would willingly give up her right to vote might not be a feminist. More testing would be needed. Most of them bristle at the very idea, though. Try it yourself.

Lost Patrol
Lost Patrol
6 years ago

Slow typer. AR gives many details and Rollo the theory. Feminism is embedded so deeply that it works without having to call it that anymore.

CSI
CSI
6 years ago

theage.com.au/entertainment/master-of-none-star-aziz-ansari-accused-of-sexual-misconduct-20180114-h0ia6s.html

This is exactly what these articles are about. The sex didn’t meet her expectations. He pushed for sex like an Alpha. He wasn’t really Alpha enough to convince her he was though. But even by her biased account, it was consensual. So she writes a pompous, ambiguously worded letter which doesn’t accuse him directly of rape, but sort of implies he did. And of course the feminist media have taken this, and he is now guilty of rape in their eyes. Bad sex = rape apparently. Will Netflix cancel his show now? The odds are good.

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
6 years ago

I know churchgoing women who call themselves “equalitarian” complementarian, who wear dresses all the time and will even say they are opposed to femniism.

Fixed that for myself. How I ever could confuse “equalitarian” with “complementarian” is such a huge mystery. But they do call themselves “complementarian”. Their husbands tend to be the sort of men who have to “check with the boss” before doing anything out of the routine, too.

But they are not feminists. Just ask them…

The Solitary Silver FoX
The Solitary Silver FoX
6 years ago

@ CSI A good summary of what most likely took place. I mean, if she didn’t want sex, why in the hell was she at his place anyways? She chose to be there because she wanted sex if he proved to be worthy. But just look at the poor symp, he screams Beta. I doubt whether he’s ever had enthusiastic sex. Wearing that badge just confirms he’s a mangina, so why was she there in the first place? Maybe she’s going for some notoriety, even though she’s being anonymous at the mo. A bit of a non-entity dancer and he… Read more »

scribblerg
scribblerg
6 years ago

All I can say is that it’s nice to be in the top 20%…But the burden is there. And simply put, the reason I’m top 20% is cuz I carry the burden better than the bottom 80%. Betas can have the sex robots, as long as they can pay for them. Maybe their female overlords will let them do that? Where is this all going? Lol. This is what a civilization in decline looks like. The end will come and we will be dust. As is always the way. The question is can you play the game and win anyway?… Read more »

Novaseeker
Novaseeker
6 years ago

He pushed for sex like an Alpha. He wasn’t really Alpha enough to convince her he was though. It sounded to me like he didn’t even try to run rudimentary game on her, and instead was using his fame/money/status as a buffer. This is the real lesson of #metoo. Guys who are rich, famous, high status can no longer use those things as a buffer to get around using game to generate genuine desire. It’s a part of the transition from 80/20 to 90/10. The message is this: “hey you rich/famous/high-status guys, you need game to, or you’re going to… Read more »

walawala
walawala
6 years ago

@Anonymous: Hardly anyone teaches boys frame anymore=feminist imperative.

Boys are now more afraid than ever to make a move. When they do it’s awkward or if they do and get a shit test they recoil or retreat. Learning game is critical.

On the earbud thing…yes looking for an IOI is the gateway.

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
6 years ago

Novaseeker
This is the real lesson of #metoo.

There’s an alternate reading of the hashtag that I missed for weeks: “BangMeToo”.

Aziz has included obligatory bowing down before feminism in his routine. That might have been enough a few years back, but…now? Nope. Wasn’t enough. Because he’s beta.

Notice that this ups the ante: a single anonymous charge at babe.net is now enough to cause a problem, it remains to be seen if his netflix deal goes away or not.

SJF
SJF
6 years ago

I’m curious so I have a question for you guys: out of all of the women you know cordially or familiarly, or even just observationally, approximately what percentage would you say are feminist? I agree with the sisterhood uber alles is a ruling thing. But I travel in circles where feminism doesn’t run amok among my seven female employees, my wonderful neighborhood of 20 years and my delightful country club socializing. Feminism and feminists barely register in my world. That’s not to say that holding a masculine frame is not important. It is. And most of the guys do. Everything… Read more »

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
6 years ago

walwala Boys are now more afraid than ever to make a move. When they do it’s awkward or if they do and get a shit test they recoil or retreat. Learning game is critical. Learning Game involves trial and error. If the first error such as a mis-calibrated approach results in a nuclear rejection that will make learning more difficult. If the first error results in a social media storm…that will make learning even more difficult. Zero Tolerance comes in many forms… On the earbud thing…yes looking for an IOI is the gateway. It can be a single IOI such… Read more »

trapjaw20
trapjaw20
6 years ago

@ Rollo I’ve lurked on this site for almost two years now, first time for commenting. Anyway, I’ll occasionally get into arguments with a couple of my buddies who also use the Milo statistic saying that women will often refuse to acknowledge that they are feminists. Which on the surface sounds like a great thing, but I think we know the real story behind this. Even if women refuse the tag “feminist” they still benefit from the indoctrination and laws that have come with the feminine imperative. I graduated from a pretty liberal university and had classes with a lot… Read more »

rugby11
rugby11
6 years ago

Lost,kfg “Blaximus is the ball bearing between the earth and the sky.” “kfg is the Earl of Esoterica and mind expansion.” https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0o757fqz3WU (Technically that’s not the same PTSD suffered by soldiers, so it’s classified as cPTSD. Source: therapist I spent the past few years talking about what he ultimately evaluated as my case of that exact problem and cause. Doesn’t surprise me at all that a nation of single moms results in a nation of abuse related psychological trauma.) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dwTQ_U3p5Wc “Where is this all going? Lol. This is what a civilization in decline looks like. The end will come and… Read more »

Jafyk
Jafyk
6 years ago

@ Walawala
“I’m going to predict that women are going to start protesting or challenging the me too movement.”

It’s already happening. Here, have a look.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-42643504

Jafyk
Jafyk
6 years ago

@ Hank Holiday Your racism or ignorance (if giving you the benefit of the doubt) is evident in the types of pics you chose to use in your comparison. You compare a Japanese building probably built in modern times with a rural hut in an African village. You do know that it is 2018 and Africa has cities with skyscrapers, the latest cars, airports etc. Of course Japan would have better resources to build nicer homes than a sub-Saharan African village due to their climate. People also build houses that are practical to their environment. Mud houses are cool during… Read more »

Jafyk
Jafyk
6 years ago

@ Walawala
Here’s another female that’s had enough of the #metoo http://www.theage.com.au/lifestyle/news-and-views/has-metoo-has-gone-too-far-20180116-h0ivul.html

The Solitary Silver FoX
The Solitary Silver FoX
6 years ago

@ Palma Once again, very astute, my man. Yes, resource transfer was what she was after, for sure. They are really shameless hussies, these whores. I sort of feel sorry for him, but as he was a male-feminist apologist, he deserves to be taught a harsh lesson. Though he shouldn’t lose his job because he tried to crack onto some whore who was simply stringing him along. We really should go to war against these bitches, but really, the incels would most likely turn against against us in all their White Knight glory. Most of them will never “just get… Read more »

CSI
CSI
6 years ago

She had him down as the type total incel beta she’s got in the friendzone and has easily extracted resources from before with no payback

Yeah, I can see that now. She was thinking she was going to be able to tease patronage and professional contacts out of him with the implied promise of sex, and he’d be too timid/”gentlemanly” to actually explicitly ask.

To my surprise I’m seeing considerable pushback against “Grace” and babe.com from many feminists. I think its dawning on them that getting Aziz’s career terminated over this might look back bad for them.

The Solitary Silver FoX
The Solitary Silver FoX
6 years ago

@ Rollo

Would it be possible to flip the comments so that the newest appear first and the oldest last, so we can more easily keep up with the convo…

Love your work, man! You’ve given me much perspective in this mad world we currently inhabit…

Yollo Comanche
Yollo Comanche
6 years ago

@Solitary Silver Fox

We tried that before, majority hated it. Doesn’t need to change, in my opinion.

kfg
kfg
6 years ago

“extinction curve”

Response extinction is also known by a phrase I’ve used here time and again: “losing your pigeon.”

scribblerg
scribblerg
6 years ago

@CSI – No difference between Aziz and many of these other guys in Hollywood. Azis is a beta cuck pussy pipsqueak who would never get any attention from women without his fame. And just like Louis CK and Weinstein, they were frustrated betas with a Blue Pill mindset. I read the girls account of Aziz’s incompetent seduction and louche behavior. It had the ring of truth – but of course who knows. Aziz was uncalibrated, seeming to confuse interest for arousal and then just went hardcore handsy/gropey/pushy, attack mode. Not seduction. Any woman would complain. You see, cuz he’s beta,… Read more »

DisgruntledEarthling
DisgruntledEarthling
6 years ago

Will Netflix cancel his show now?
They should – it was such ‘nice guy’ drivel.

scribblerg
scribblerg
6 years ago

@Palma – You’d benefit greatly from reading The Biology of Desire, a great scientific update on what we know about “addiction”. There’s more to it than you described, but it’s too long to go into here.

kfg
kfg
6 years ago

“Forgive me I’m doing this on the piecemeal as I have actually got a life”

My own usual mode. Some of my longer comments come when I don’t have time to compose a shorter one.

“Specifically was it:

A treat

A food stuff it needed

A drug it was addicted to and needed at have at any cost”

Yes. Depending on the specific behavior being investigated, but basic stimulus response experiments are done with Scooby Snacks.

M Simon
6 years ago

People in chronic pain, chronically take pain relievers.

Biology at work. And look at what has happened to that attempt to overrule biology. The FI will do no better in the long run.

kfg
kfg
6 years ago

When you lose your pigeon it is referred to as response “extinction” because it it is truly gone. You don’t get a lost pigeon back by repeating a program of stimulation. The pigeon has fucked off and gone Galt. It’s worth noting that there are behaviors on the on the other end of the spectrum known as “extinct proof.” This happens when negative stimuli are perceived as positive in some manner. Ya ever wonder why people play slot machines? The people who run slot machines don’t. They literally have it down to a science and actually call the players pigeons.… Read more »

kfg
kfg
6 years ago

You are asking the metaphysical question of psychology. Essentially, are we just biological machines or do we have free will. I’ve already given my own answer here a few times: We have free will, but within biological (and physical) bounds. Bounds that are much tighter than most people are happy about thinking about. The extreme behaviorists take the machine analogy too literally. It is a very useful analogy, but it is just an analogy. We are a very complex chemical reaction made of feedback loops nested inside other feedback loops. The system is chaotic. While there are a number of… Read more »

scribblerg
scribblerg
6 years ago

@Palma – Cool. A few thoughts. The part of your comment that caught my attention was something like ‘an addict will spend all the money in the world to get high’ – actually that’s untrue. Back in the ’80s numerous behavioral studies tested addicts and alcoholics ability to not take that next drink/hit. They took the lowest bottom addicts they could find and in a detox facility, they would place a hit/shot in front of them and make different offers. Turns out most addicts will delay or skip their next hit for as little as 5 dollars. What this means… Read more »

kfg
kfg
6 years ago
scribblerg
scribblerg
6 years ago

Alrighty, KFG, let’s go deeper. In fact, science has little to offer in terms of explaining what “human purposiveness” is and how it works. Dawkins “Blind Watchmaker” theory doesn’t explain it. As an aside, he’s also been proved wrong about “kin selection” theory, E.O. Wilson offers a much better solution than Dawkins. But that doesn’t slow Dawkins down, he just keeps arguing… Great piece here on the complexities of human purposiveness and ends driven behavior. https://www.thenewatlantis.com/publications/evolution-and-the-purposes-of-life Why do we seek to survive? To reproduce? Go higher level, bring some Jung into it. How do we see ourselves? What is the… Read more »

kfg
kfg
6 years ago

I have recommended Wilson here any number of times. I have never recommended Dawkins. For that matter, for anyone who wants a look at the “Dawkensian” point of view, I recommend Dennet.

The philosopher working on the “meaningless” question of consciousness does a better job of presenting the biology than the biologist does.

M Simon
6 years ago

kfg
January 16, 2018 at 7:23 am

Even belts and pulleys are not completely “mechanical”.

When the pulley breaks…….

scribblerg
scribblerg
6 years ago

@KFG – Dennett is amazing. His book, Darwin’s Dangerous Idea helped me understand evolution so deeply. It’s not an easy read though.

I was debating politics with a close friend, former dna researcher and all around smart guy. He keeps up with science on many fronts. He was babbling about some Progressive future he believes technology is going to bring about, things like the “Singularity” and other BS many lightweight silicon valley “seers” buy into. I closed by noting that he studies science, while I study history. I understand the real world far better than he does…

O.B.I.T.
O.B.I.T.
6 years ago

As some commenters were discussing the coming era of sexbots, I was thinking that my money is still on VR to cre a more effective substitute for the real thing. So could VR become a drug to be abused, a way for the desperate to “just not feel bad?” How much free will will we have in the face of realistic fantasy? Barry Malzberg way back when did a series of stories in which VR starts out as a psychiatric therapy but soon hops the tracks and degenerates into fantasy score-settling — with “patients” reveling in vengeful sex and violence.… Read more »

kfg
kfg
6 years ago

The holodeck is one of the things that ruined Star Trek for me. It didn’t seem to me that they could have that technology and maintain a space faring culture.

For that matter, Simak predicted, in the 50s, that the Internet would first atomize society as people stopped being able to deal with each other face to face and eventually lead to civilization collapse when they couldn’t stand to leave the house.

O.B.I.T.
O.B.I.T.
6 years ago

Right, the potentially addictive aspect of VR, as per what you and Scrib were discussing — addiction, operant conditioning, free will — plus now add sex to the equation.

O.B.I.T.
O.B.I.T.
6 years ago

… And the holodeck also was a crutch for the writers. Not a fan except for the original version so I don’t know if they ever explored the dark aspects of that technology

kfg
kfg
6 years ago

Well, I stopped giving it any attention after they made Q an actual character and the writers ignored civilization collapse into nihilistic apathy.

O.B.I.T.
O.B.I.T.
6 years ago

Hey Rollo has a new post already — cue the sirens, alarm bells and airlocks snapping shut like on MST3K

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
6 years ago

O.B.I.T.
As some commenters were discussing the coming era of sexbots, I was thinking that my money is still on VR to cre a more effective substitute for the real thing.

Who says it’s either / or? What about “and”? Search “teledildonics” and if camgirls are new to you, bear them in mind as well.

O.B.I.T.
O.B.I.T.
6 years ago

I certainly did look up teledildonics last time you mentioned it — it sounds like something Philip K. Dick (appropriately enough!) would have to make up if it weren’t already real. As for camgirls, if that means what I think it means, I expect VR to someday provide a much more total and possibly addictive immersion for the 80-percenters

Blaximus
Blaximus
6 years ago

[youtube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y4bAULTwAJU&w=854&h=480%5D

Let the Shark Jumping commence.

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
6 years ago

Blaximus Let the Shark Jumping commence. Older woman decides younger PoundMeToo woman is entitled, world gasps in surprise. I just laugh. Oh, teh poor wommenz in a toxic environment! Her way smoothed through college via Title IX, her first job and first promotion made easy by Affirmative Action, her ability to get any man fired via Sexual Harassment accusations unquestioned…and now she’s pissed at the younger woman who is behaving just like her, only a little bit worse. LOL @ such hypocritical feminist cowshit. The diff between Aziz’s bad date and Harvey Weinstein’s potted plant is just a matter of… Read more »

Blaximus
Blaximus
6 years ago

I guess I’m looking at it like this: The narrative so far regarding accusations is pretty much a death penalty career-wise without charges, proof or conviction by a court/jury of your peers. And it appears so far that nobody was willing to defend themselves stridently, or call bullshit. Men were just automatic pariahs via accusation. Of course this mode of operation is just too ludicrous to continue indefinitely, and it seems that men weren’t even close to being willing to pose a united front ( instead scattering like roaches when the lights come on ), so I was kinda waiting… Read more »

Blaximus
Blaximus
6 years ago
Blaximus
Blaximus
6 years ago

…. Heather McGhee should be at home sucking a dick or something. Black feminist is like saying desert whale.

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
6 years ago

Blaximus I guess I’m looking at it like this: The narrative so far regarding accusations is pretty much a death penalty career-wise without charges, proof or conviction by a court/jury of your peers. Sure. Say, did you notice that #MeeToo is sorta kinda like anti-Family court? No Constitutional rights, just “she said”… And it appears so far that nobody was willing to defend themselves stridently, or call bullshit. Men were just automatic pariahs via accusation. You calling Tavis Smiley “nobody”? In this case it’s not about Ashley’s age or looks, it’s about a precedent. LOL, you didn’t listen to her?… Read more »

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
6 years ago

Blaximus Black feminist is like saying desert whale. LOL! That’s just your male privilege talking, Blax. Ask the two girls who are the face of BLM, the ones that pushed Bernie Sanders to one side at his own rally, they can give you the full ration of “intersectionality” and all that other stuff. Insert a bunch of obligatory slogan-words here… Seriously, don’t be so naive. #meeToo is a great tool for career girls to use with their Old Girl network to push Old Boys off of their perch, they don’t need younger girlies using it to punish beta manginas like… Read more »

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
6 years ago

Of course there’s also Condoleeza Rice

Aging spinster politician? So? She’s in the wrong party for any public feminist to pay any mind to her. Sure, the conservative feminists will cluck right along, but so what?

Blaximus
Blaximus
6 years ago

@ AR I’m not looking for peak feminism as I don’t believe that will ever happen. At least not during my lifetime or until SHTF. I’m just looking for a shift in the crazy assed narrative of #metoo that’s gaining too much momentum for anybody’s good – including teh wimminz. As a father of girls I’ll hazard to say that nobody is in favor of actual, sexual assault, but #metoo witch hunts are ridiculous and I’d think that there are enough active brain cells left in the womanhood to halt it as it runs off the rails. When dudes here… Read more »

Blaximus
Blaximus
6 years ago

@ AR ” LOL! That’s just your male privilege talking, Blax. Ask the two girls who are the face of BLM, the ones that pushed Bernie Sanders to one side at his own rally, they can give you the full ration of “intersectionality” and all that other stuff. Insert a bunch of obligatory slogan-words here…” 42 million black folks. Most give no shits about BLM feminist, and yup, it is a feminist movement in disguise ( to most folks anyway ). If the media darlings didn’t cover them, they’d have vanished in a puff of smoke a long time ago.… Read more »

M Simon
6 years ago

Sun Wukong
January 15, 2018 at 3:50 pm

I have been looking at the PTSD issue for a while. cPTSD is a new term for me. I’ll have to look into it. Scribbler’s description fits what I know.

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
6 years ago

Blaximus But towns/cities surrounding me are probably rife with it, and I know Gotham across the river from me is most definitely. It’s not just Gotham anymore. Do a search for #ChurchToo and see what you get. The more conservative feminists are just now getting on the train. 42 million black folks. Most give no shits about BLM feminist, Wait, the MSM told me something that isn’t true? How could that happen? I’m shocked! Anyway, yaz there are black feminists..wait, scuse me, Black Feminists… er… Feminists Of Color, wait dang it, Intersectional Feminists Of Color…I dunno, my buzzword dictionary is… Read more »

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
6 years ago

Blaximus
As a father of girls I’ll hazard to say that nobody is in favor of actual, sexual assault,

Sure. Nobody’s arguing otherwise.

but #metoo witch hunts are ridiculous and I’d think that there are enough active brain cells left in the womanhood to halt it as it runs off the rails.

LOL! You’re expecting them to grasp “cause and effect”? Didja ever read about the Salem Witch Trials? How long did they go on and how did they end, and that was in the days of horses as transportation.

Cue kfg to write: “More weight”.

O.B.I.T.
O.B.I.T.
6 years ago

But what happened to Ashleigh Banfield’s “I’m Smart” glasses?

Blaximus
Blaximus
6 years ago

….. 20 years ago I woulda banged Ashley very hard, but on 1 condition: The glasses had to stay on. And it had to take place in a library.

Blaximus
Blaximus
6 years ago

@ AR Re: my ” how many feminist do ya know ” question, I agree with Rollo, Nova and yourself. Odd…. Your point about definition of feminist is well taken. So of course women won’t ever relinquish gains made through terroris… er… I mean feminism . At first I was shocked when Nova said ” 50%” at work, but yeah, in his field that’s probably par…or even low. Rollo cast a wide net though, but he’s right about the influences. Thinking about it more deeply, I look like a raging feminist myself when compared to my great grandfathers. I think… Read more »

If-I-Fell
If-I-Fell
6 years ago

Dangerous Times for men in the ever-ratcheting FI in U.S. TV commercials during NFL Football games. Nationwide Tori Kelly – Song, Tag Line: “Nationwide knows that there’s more than one side to every person. We can help you know, protect, and grow your many sides.” Mom teaching “little guy behind the wheel” how to drive. Father builds business, retires and passes it to his daughter giving her a Boss mug. Isn’t it great to imagine a world where mothers teach sons to drive and fathers pass on businesses to daughters… Well, not so much. //www.nationwide.com/about-us/song-tori-ad.jsp TurboTax Tag Line: “At least… Read more »

kobayashii1681
6 years ago

Hi Rollo, guys!

Just watched JP being interviewed on Channel 4 in the UK.

Have a gander of it and enjoy:

https://youtu.be/aMcjxSThD54

I still I’m skeptical about how JP sees things but this is one of the best take downs of post-modern, leftist, strawman dumping, harpies I have seen.

Sri
Sri
6 years ago

You should see what happened here and what both the woman and the feminist author have to say https://www.nytimes.com/2018/01/15/opinion/aziz-ansari-babe-sexual-harassment.html When bad sex becomes harrasment. When bad “….The feminist answer is to push for a culture in which boys and young men are taught that sex does not have to be pursued as if they’re in a pornographic film, and one in which girls and young women are empowered to be bolder, braver and louder about what they want…” “….If you go home with him and discover he’s a terrible kisser, say, “I’m out.”….” Looks like now feminists believe they are… Read more »

Sentient
Sentient
6 years ago

I look like a raging feminist myself when compared to my great grandfathers.

Rollo’s retweet…

https://twitter.com/Isamovs/status/952254957306163200

dr zipper
dr zipper
6 years ago

koba – great link of JP, thx

the whole thing is a beauty but starting here at the end, just watch the last minute and half

dr zipper
dr zipper
6 years ago

auto goto time didn’t work, try this one:

dr zipper
dr zipper
6 years ago

lol, the ‘lambasted’ part is hilarious

the whole interview is a masterclass of cool hand luke laughing off this harridan’s snipes

dr zipper
dr zipper
6 years ago

also see 22:10

aha, gotcha!!

kobayashii1681
6 years ago
Reply to  dr zipper

@Dr.Zip: That part at 23:00 crowns it all….and then ‘lobsters’😁😁😁

Yollo Comanche
Yollo Comanche
6 years ago

@M Simon

Have you read a book called “Running on Empty” by Dr. Jonice Webb? In it she explores a concept she calls childhood emotional neglect and how it can shape a person’s capacity to relate to their own emotions. You bring up PTSD and cPTSD. A person’s lack of connection to themselves and lack of connection to their own lives as a consequence are likely very intertwined with PTSD.

CSI
CSI
6 years ago

> Looks like now feminists believe they are entitled to instant experts and that all men should, without experience or development, be the god of love in bed. Yes, get a horny inexperienced guy and a girl who want tell him anything about what she wants, and gives mixed messages but doesn’t say “no”, bad sex is inevitable. And this is all his fault, of course. Feminists say the have solution to enable even inexperienced men to deliver good sex – enthusiastic consent. Ask permission before doing anything, even kissing. Ask her what she wants. Stop if you detect any… Read more »

Blaximus
Blaximus
6 years ago

I have the same solution that I’ve had for years. Get your sex game up. There’s really no excuses. Crawl before you walk. You can’t sit on your ass jerking off until you are so overcome by horniness that you rush out and awkwardly try to grope and stick your tongue down the throat of some random chick because need pussy. Women are everywhere. Learn game, learn to talk to them, start slow and LEARN. Instant gratification only exist in video games and Disneyland. Don’t pay any mind to what feminist are saying. Fuck them…not literally. Women like sex. Women… Read more »

GhostofSteveMcQueen
GhostofSteveMcQueen
6 years ago

This thought just occurred to me: As we (particularly in America) continue down this road, maybe “polyamory” is going to be the adaptation to the dangerous times ahead. We already see it today, the typical example being the overweight “pagan” gal with the funny colored hair and nose ring having two boyfriends (both obviously beta manginas). And of course there are alphas spinning plates, or having open LTRs or multiple LTRs. So maybe as this latest breakdown in male/female relations and destruction of the old books accelerates, and more lower SMV men and women are abandoned along the roadside, those… Read more »

Blaximus
Blaximus
6 years ago

A majority will never go for it, so it will forever remain a fringe semi trend.

Men would be I. Even worse shape sexually than they are now. Most know nothing about 1/chick, much less multiples. Sounds great. Sounds cool. For most men it would be a complete clusterfuck.

…. And not in a good way.

Blaximus
Blaximus
6 years ago

Oh I forgot, poly-whatever is always in the feminine frame.

Patriarch
6 years ago

As far as I can tell, it’s actually up to women to set things right. They’re getting fucked over by this too, if statistics are any measure – women are unhappier now than in the past fifty years.

https://medium.com/@yaycapitalism/hypergamy-and-the-gender-wars-babfae347e70

kobayashii1681
6 years ago
Reply to  Patriarch

@Patriarch: Women follow. So men must make the right moves, including calling out bullshit on a macro scale.

Sri
Sri
6 years ago

Rollo, it looks like we are turning into a society of bees, just replace the sterile females with the betas (in a way, that’s how they are seen and treated as ….) When merely bad or less than satisfying sex becomes assault, it’s a sign that women feel they are entitled to no less than the god of love and anything less is an insult. The question is though — what have these women done to earn their godly rights? Oh, that’s sacrilegious now, right? In the old days, we had spirituality, checks and mechanisms and duties to keep our… Read more »

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
6 years ago

“Patriarch”
As far as I can tell, it’s actually up to women to set things right.

LOL! No, not even.

They’re getting fucked over by this too, if statistics are any measure – women are unhappier now than in the past fifty years.

Prescriptions for drugs tell that. So? You gonna expect them to fix..anything? Hah! They might break a nail!

CSI
CSI
6 years ago

When merely bad or less than satisfying sex becomes assault, it’s a sign that women feel they are entitled to no less than the god of love and anything less is an insult. I was thinking that even sex with full verbal consent could be turned into a harrowing tale of date rape with a bit of creative retelling. I mean, apparently voluntarily undressing yourself and then voluntarily performing fellatio don’t count as consent because of the implied threat of male violence and anger. And no woman can safely say “no” because of the risk this statement could turn any… Read more »

Blaximus
Blaximus
6 years ago

Kobayashi I didn’t even respond to Hank’s assertion that Ethiopia is in northern Africa. He seems so certain that he’s right, and likes schooling me, even though I’d traced my maternal grandmother’s ancestry back to Ethiopia decades ago, hank know better than I. I don’t recognise ” north Africa ” as separate from the rest of the continent, and I understand that the ” Arab ” inhabitants aren’t the original people. I didn’t even bother to go into Nubian culture and Egypt. Hank doesn’t pay me tuition to teach him all of the shit that he, and most of the… Read more »

O.B.I.T.
O.B.I.T.
6 years ago

There’s already an analog for the kind of sexual “buyer’s remorse” we can expect when you consider that 8 percent of all purchases — $260 billion’s worth a year — get brought back to the store, and this can hit 30 or 40 percent for online purchases, especially apparel. This is not broken down by gender but I have a feeling the lion’s share of returns are from female consumers.

Blaximus
Blaximus
6 years ago

CSI I don’t think that men have to overcomplicate the whole ” consent ” issue so much. We can’t veer off into abject fear. It mostly boils down to 1) abundance mentality and the understanding that no one chick holds the key to sexual access, including wives and gf’ and the SNL/ons. 2) calibration and the willingness to know when and how to walk away . I was invited to a woman’s apartment for ” coffee ” once at midnight. This woman and I had been flirting with each other for many months and we’d been openly discussing having sex.… Read more »

GhostofSteveMcQueen
GhostofSteveMcQueen
6 years ago

@Blax – I’m not advocating “poly” anything. And yes, that frame is why I put it in quotes.

My suggestion is that, extrapolating this metoo trend 50-100 years from now, male and female Anglo Americans who are not near the top of the sexual market will either be incel, or choose to be haremed by higher market value men and women.

This will be given the veneer of legitimacy and “respectability” by calling it “poly”-something.

As to using the word “never” I’m sure 100 years ago a lot of things people thought would never happen is currently happening….

Blaximus
Blaximus
6 years ago

@ Ghost

Okay cool, but my money’s on the #metoo thing to run out of steam and collapse on itself very shortly. It’s too patently ridiculous to survive. The only lasting concern is possible legislation arises from the ” movement “.

I don’t think harems and the like are an option for any males in the west, but admittedly I won’t be alive in 50-100 years, so what do I know?

kfg
kfg
6 years ago

“It’s too patently ridiculous to survive.”

Markets can remain irrational longer than you can remain solvent.

lalit
lalit
6 years ago

I think what will happen is that some Ambitious enterprising Alpha male will make a power grab by assembling, organizing, arming and leading an army of betas via the promise of a wife. No way we will get to the sadie Hawkins world. Women’s own nature will not permit that. They will gleefully submit to the armed beta army. Men like to fight and women like men who fight. Its really that simple

638
0
Would love your thoughts, please comment.x
()
x

Discover more from

Subscribe now to keep reading and get access to the full archive.

Continue reading