Dangerous Times – Part 1

We live in a very dangerous age for men. The Blue Pill is even more of a liability today than it was in times past, because we live in an era that encourages men going all-in in their life’s investment in that conditioning.

Welcome to the #MeToo era. What we’re experiencing in our social environment today is a sea change in intersexual dynamics. The underlying fundamentals haven’t changed; our evolved natures and the latent purposes that are driven by them haven’t shifted, but the social dynamics and sexual acculturation that serve as checks and balances on them has drastically shifted, and in a very short time. While you could make an argument for an idealized free love era that took place right after the Sexual Revolution, now we find ourselves in a time that is so calculating in its design on intersexual social dynamics that it makes the late 60s seem romantically naive.

Back in October of 2014 I wrote a post called Yes Means Fear. This essay was a response to the, at that time new, Yes Means Yes sexual consent legislature that was being instituted on California university campuses. Dalrock had written similar essays regarding this latest form of sexual consent aptly titled The Sexual Revolution’s Arab Spring and Making the World Safe for Promiscuous Women. It may take you a while to review these posts, but please read these and skim the comments to get a gist of the conversations we had going on just three years ago.

One of these comments was the inimitable Deti:

At the end of the day, college women (soon all women) will be able to use the “lack of consent” law/policy as a weapon against undesirable men to do the following:

1. Weed out and eliminate unattractive men by chilling their conduct

2. Making even the most innocuous sexual conduct (i.e. approaching, asking for dates) so dangerous that the only men who will engage in the SMP are attractive men with proven successful sexual track records who will never get reported for doing anything “untoward”; thus ensuring that only attractive men will approach them for dates and sex

3. Giving women more power over the SMP so even unattractive women can use and select men for alpha fux; then have the sole ability to pursue and select men for beta bux when they see fit.

Open hypergamy. It will be “we women are going to do this, and if you want sex, you’ll do it our way, and there’s not a damn thing you can do about it.”

Deti posted this comment on October 15th, 2014. The inter-blog debate then (at places like the now defunct Hooking Up Smart) was that Yes Means Yes was solely meant as a firm response to the supposed on-campus rape /sex assault panic that was being circulated in the mainstream media at the time. From the Red Pill perspective, we saw what potential this legislation represented to what would later become a societal scale institution.

Of course, they called us reactionaries, called us ‘rape apologists’ for simply pointing out all the ways this legislation would be expanded to a societal scale. They said we were exaggerating when we illustrated that, even for long-married couples, there would need to be a check list of approved acts of intimacy for each and every act performed, and men would need some form of hard evidence to prove that consent had indeed been granted.

The new California college/university sexual assault policy requires the following:

“An affirmative consent standard in the determination of whether consent was given by both parties to sexual activity. “Affirmative consent” means affirmative, conscious, and voluntary agreement to engage in sexual activity. It is the responsibility of each person involved in the sexual activity to ensure that he or she has the affirmative consent of the other or others to engage in the sexual activity. Lack of protest or resistance does not mean consent, nor does silence mean consent. Affirmative consent must be ongoing throughout a sexual activity and can be revoked at any time. The existence of a dating relationship between the persons involved, or the fact of past sexual relations between them, should never by itself be assumed to be an indicator of consent.”

There was sex, which is clearly “sexual activity.” The question then becomes whether there was “affirmative consent”. In order for there not be consent, the woman would have had to show affirmative conscious and voluntary agreement to engage in sex with the man. It is the man’s responsibility to make sure he had that consent. She had to manifest, verbally or nonverbally, consent to it.

Silence doesn’t mean consent. Her not resisting or saying “no, please stop” doesn’t constitute “affirmative consent”. So really, the only way to make sure that consent is present is for the man to continue asking her throughout the encounter: “Is this OK? Can I keep doing this? Is this thrust OK with you? Is THIS thrust OK? Can I thrust again? How about this one? Can I keep going? Do you want me to stop?”

If that did NOT happen, if the man did not get EXPRESS, VERBAL statements that he could continue, then yes, there was sexual assault.

The way this plays out in situations like this is that verbal consent is REQUIRED. She cannot manifest “ongoing” “affirmative consent” any other way. That’s because of the way the law is written. Lack of protest is not consent. Lack of resistance is not consent. Silence is not consent. Thus, a wife, just lying there, starfishing it, giving duty sex to her husband, is putting him in jeopardy, because she is not manifesting “ongoing” “affirmative consent”.

All of that they said was ridiculous. Women would never be so petty as to make a man ask permission for, nor hold him accountable for, sex that she wanted to have with him. Furthermore, this ruling was only meant to curb campus assault; any extrapolating to a larger societal norm, we were told, was just us Red Pill men and their insecurities about the intentions of women and sex. If we’d Just Get It we’ll have no problems.

We were told it was limited to penis-in-vagina sex only. We were told it was just in cases of “drunken sex”. All of these proved false. This law was intended to govern, regulate and control every single sexual interaction between a man and a woman. This law is intended to require a man to get express consent at every single step of the process, from initial touch to banging. This law is intended to chill all male sexual conduct. This law by its very terms requires express consent for every sexual act, starting with kino.

The goal of feminism is to remove all constraints on female sexuality while maximally restricting male sexuality – Heartiste

A World of Fear

When I wrote Yes Means Fear (also 3 years ago) it was initially in response to an article by Ezra Klein, Yes Means Yes is a terrible law, and I support it completely. This reads through as bad as any gender related article on Vox, but Klein’s salient point was summed up in one sentence.

To work, “Yes Means Yes” needs to create a world where men are afraid.

I’m reasonably sure Ezra was aware of the larger scope – larger than just California college campuses – that his giddy Beta love of a world where men would be afraid to so much as approach a woman would lead to. But now we find ourselves here in his idealized sexual marketplace founded on men fearing to interact with women at the risk of losing everything. At the risk of being Zeroed Out. Today, just three years later, we’re experiencing the #metoo moral panic based exactly in the fear Ezra said would serve us so well. Ezra must be proud that the gold rush hysteria of sexual misconduct allegations any and every woman (who ‘might’ have ever felt an accidental hip brush 50 years ago) feels entitled to is the result of this cleansing fear he loved so much. Unless he’s defending allegations himself of course.

If you go before the college board and say that the woman accusing you of assault simply doesn’t remember that she said yes because she was so drunk, then you’ve already lost.

Gone is the college board now in favor of the popular court of social justice – the court that condemns a man for even the suspicion of an allegation of sexual misconduct. Gone too is part of women’s remembering the pretense of a sexual encounter. Whether a woman was drunk and doesn’t remember the details, or if she conveniently recalls them 40-50 years after the fact is immaterial. The operative point is that we always believe any and every allegation of rape or misconduct a woman brings forward.

Articles of Belief

Shortly after I wrote Yes Means Fear I wrote Hysteria, an essay intended to address the disgraceful (now thoroughly proven) UVA fraternity rape hoax story written by Sabrina Erdley and published by a complicit Rolling Stone Magazine. Just daring to question the validity of so outrageous a rape account was heresy to women back then. Bear in mind this took place after the Yes Means Yes consent ruling in California. At this time, just to question the story of a woman’s rape account was enough to earn you the title of ‘rape apologist’. But moreover, we were popularly expected to repeat this mantra and always accept a woman’s account as infallibly true:

“No matter what Jackie said, we should automatically believe rape claims.” http://t.co/3HFlXR7jme True insanity pic.twitter.com/AFXIyn32FS

This was the sentiment (now deleted) tweeted by Zerlina Maxwell on December 6th, 2014. Since then this meme that anything a woman had to say about sexual assault must be believed by default has snowballed into a default belief that anything a woman alleges against a man must also be believed. Whereas a male college student might stand in front of his kangaroo court at a university, now men must stand in front of the kangaroo court of public opinion where a woman’s word outweighs all pretense of due process. That college kid is now the average man who must prove his innocence because if a woman alleges it due process is reversed.

What we’ve witnessed in just 3 years is the systematic removal of a man’s right to habeas corpus with regard to women’s allegations.

And I expect that this removal will extend to much more than just women’s believability in regard to sexual misconduct. Imagine a culture where it’s expected that anything a woman accuses her ex of is to be believed in divorce proceedings.

We’re now seeing exactly what myself, Deti, Dalrock and countless other Red Pill bloggers and commenters predicted would happen, but it’s also so much more that what we could see coming. In just 3 years Yes Means Yes moved off the campus and into mainstream culture; a culture predicated on female social primacy. In a feminine-primary social order even “affirmative consent” isn’t enough – “enthusiastic consent” must now be established and maintained. That “enthusiastic consent” is a new ambiguously defined terminology, and part of the larger narrative meant to further confuse and instill fear in men.

Last week Novaseeker, once again, had a terrific comment that illustrates what consent has come to today.

Yep, that’s the newest goalpost move.

We went from No means No (which meant that if she doesn’t say no, it’s on … which pretty much is the basic human mating script) to “affirmative consent” (“may I kiss you now” … “may I lick your breast now?”, etc., per the “rules” required before any physical contact *and* at “each stage of escalation”). Very few people actually follow affirmative consent, as we know, but it’s the rule at most colleges and universities. It isn’t the legal rule for rape, in terms of determining what was “consensual”, currently, but the FI is working on that, believe me.

Now, we have the goalposts moving even further along, from “affirmative consent” to “enthusiastic consent” — which means that if her consent is even verbally expressed, but isn’t clearly enthusiastic, then it isn’t “reliable as consent” because it could be the result of “pressure”, and if the consent “was real, it would be expressed enthusiastically, because when people really are consenting to sex, they’re always enthusiastic about it”. So essentially the standard they are pushing now (and which is getting rolled out on campuses right now) is that if the girl isn’t jumping your bones and begging for your cock, it’s rape/assault. Of course, again, not the legal standard, but that doesn’t matter that much — as we can all see what is happening right now is that the legal standard is being marginalized, because people can be destroyed in our media saturated environment without any involvement of the legal system at all, and the standards that apply in that extra-legal environment are the ones that the FI wants to apply, whether the legal system applies them or not.

There are a few ways to look at this, but one obvious one is that this is a way for the FI to tighten the screws on betas. Very little sex that betas have, if any, is “enthusiastic consent sex”. Everyone knows this. Under this standard, basically all sex with betas is rape. That’s the intention.

And thus we come full circle to the latent purpose of legislating Hypergamy that I’ve continually repeated in many essays. It is Roissy’s maxim of feminism: The end goal of feminism is to remove all constraints on female sexuality while maximally restricting male sexuality.

Recently I found myself in a Twitter war on a story by CBS Los Angeles asking whether it was still OK for men to hug women. I used the cartoon I posted in The Creep 2 to illustrate my bigger point:

And of course the feminist tropes (from men and women) and the point & sputter ad hominem attacks flowed from there. However, this rage is precisely what I would expect from women who are now coming into a default expectation (entitlement) of all men to ‘Just Get It‘.

Only in this instance it is Blue Pill, Beta men who should know better than to approach a woman below their (self-perceived) sexual market value. Those men, the lesser men that her social media overinflated sense of SMV has convinced her are beneath her attraction floor should ‘just get it’ that they shouldn’t be flirtatious or even too friendly with her or risk the punishment of an allegation that might be his zeroing out. The Beta man who doesn’t ‘get it’ is an insult to her self-worth and deserving of an optimized Hypergamy.

In the next post I’ll be exploring the ramifications of the “enthusiastic consent” concept and how even consensual-but-unwanted sex and “duty sex” will be the next chapter in marital rape. I’ll also be detailing the the “Cat Persons” story that’s been making the rounds this week.

Published by Rollo Tomassi

Author of The Rational Male and The Rational Male, Preventive Medicine

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boulderhead
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Excerpts from The Heart of Everything That Is by Bob Drury and Tom Clavin by Bob Drury “1825 was also the year when Secretary of War James Barbour had begun to act on a concept of the forcible removal of the eastern tribes, ” “The more salient fact for Red Cloud that year was the death of his father, Lone Man. According to his incomplete autobiography as well as statements he made late in life, the cause of Lone Man’s death was an addiction to what the white man called whiskey” “Perhaps because he was a child whose father had… Read more »

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“The Sioux war Chief was raised by a single mother.”

There were fatherless boys among the Sioux, but there were no “single mothers.” When his father died, Red Cloud was moved into the lodge of his mother’s brother, Chief Smoke, and trained by the warrior guild with the other boys. After puberty boys would move out of the family lodge and camp communally with other unmarried men.

Sioux men were raised by men.

kfg
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@Boulderhead:

OK, I haven’t read that one yet. I’ll have to put it somewhere near the top of the list.

SJF
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“The ability to destroy something and build something without having to manipulate it…. I’m still struggling with that…” Didn’t you ever watch Fight Club? Destruction was the coin in the realm. You have have the ability to destroy something. You have the the ability to to build something. You can manipulate it. You have to manipulate it, and them, and her. To do less is to do a disservice to it, them and her. She, it and them benefits by you taking charge. And lead by any means necessary. Don’t let them guys (it,them,her) down. Don’t struggle with that. Employ… Read more »

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@kfg

The wikipedia claims both parents died at a young age.

The Heart of Everything That Is, was hard to put down.

SJF
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My HTML coding has left the building. I swear I checked it twice.

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Albert
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@boulderhead “Who knows, maybe your five or six step plan of coms will work? If we have censoring and only communicate online that is.” The point is, its not a five step plan, its an ethos. In game language its inner game of adopting a mode communication, here is the shortlist of the others rules I have currently identified: · Do not psychoanalyze the people that you are addressing, unless a direct connection to the argument can be made · Frame the conversation as born from curiosity and wonder · Do not mention you pain, sacrifices, sorrow or setbacks unless… Read more »

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DisgruntledEarthling
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“The Sioux war Chief was raised by a single mother.”

Naw he was raised by his tribe.
Can’t really compare today’s fucked-up society with native-American fucked up society

boulderhead
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“Can’t really compare today’s fucked-up society with native-American fucked up society”

I am not an advocate for single motherhood, neither will I write off men that were raised by one.
My main point is as you say the impact of societal influence can’t be overlooked in the final outcome of all young men.

This is old news.

https://www.thefreelibrary.com/Can+democracy+survive+the+war+of+tribalism+and+globalism%3F-a0238176412

An interesting phenomenon was the rise of communism in western culture coinciding with the war on communism in europe and asia. Should we expect a rise in tribalism in the current conditions? If so it is worth some study.

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Boulderhead,

https://www.thefreelibrary.com/Can+democracy+survive+the+war+of+tribalism+and+globalism%3F-a0238176412

That was quite a read. It goes into a larger discussion about economics, markets and democracy, which isn’t really the scope of TRM. But, I’m curious what a few of the more vocal conservative folks here think about it. Asd? Sentient?

A Lady of Reason
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Agreed! It has gone too far! The witch hunts, the whole “victim blaming” excuse to shut up any criticism, no due process etc.. is insane! Many of those women were not “victims”. They came out in these cases decades later, just to help smear someone, or get money. If they really wanted justice, they would have spoken up years ago! This whole movement infantilizes women into little children, too immature to realize what sexual coercion is, which is not true for grown women! They knew what they were doing, when they accepted the boss’ offer to sleep with him. It… Read more »

boulderhead
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@Roused

It reads like a call for democracy,what more interests me is the democracy in tribal decisions and the mindset of the village at large being that of a feminine primary social order. The mix isn’t a good one, no matter weather both parents are in the home the children get input from toddler care through college from the villiage. Intetionally misspelled.

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@Albert: “yeah I know that violence is often directed at the other, often using the ‘logical’ rational that they need more Lebensraum.” If my point were that simplistic I could have simply posted a rendition of paleolithic men shaking spears at each other. Where do Stukas come from? WHY do Stukas come. Other points to consider: That your axiomatic ideal model is held as an axiom, not a deduction. The actual long term consequences of your model outside of its idealized setting. There are some other questions I could ask, but as you hold your idealized model as an axiom,… Read more »

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Rollo – great link… looks like you got the same enthusiastic response I did from the guys here

https://therationalmale.com/2017/12/18/dangerous-times-part-1/comment-page-5/#comment-232016

there really is so much to pull out of the article and it relates nicely to this post

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@kfg “Where do Stukas come from? WHY do Stukas come.” These two statements and the inherent explanation within them take me to the absolute edge of my knowlegde. For several reasons, in my estimation; philosophy, biology, psychology, economics, history, geography, sociology, genetics and loads of other spheres of human knowlegde have to be combined in order to even attempt an answers. From what I have observed and learned so far, nobody as of yet has provided a satisfactory answer to account for these types of technological progress. (E.g. how scientific knowledge knwolegde accumulates is still a knowlegd gap within philosophy… Read more »

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*As such, they merely represent post hoc rationalisation where one causal factor is enlarged to be THE explanation (e.g. psychoanalysis).

boulderhead
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@kfg “Which are you more concerned with: Seeing that your rent is paid? Seeing that some guy on the other side of the world who you don’t even know exists except in theoretical form can pay his rent?” My own of course. Having a personal view that paying rent is throwing good money after bad I left that cycle 30 years ago. Owner financed property has been good to me leaving the bank out of the loop. I neither pay rent nor collect it. The “system” of usury and greed can only defeat itself as all parts are interconnected. It… Read more »

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http://images.mentalfloss.com/sites/default/files/styles/insert_main_wide_image/public/1500a8933d77cc95feabefda176e1a24.jpg “Harrison Ford was married to his college girlfriend Mary Marquardt from 1964 to 1979. The couple have two sons together. He married screenwriter Melissa Mathison in 1983. They met during the making of 1979’s Apocalypse Now. They had two children together before separating in 2001 and finalizing their divorce in 2004. Ford has been romantically involved with actress Calista Flockhart since 2002. The couple married in 2010. A longtime pilot, Ford made headlines in March 2015 when he was involved in a plane crash. He was forced to make a crash landing on a golf course in Venice, California,… Read more »

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“enthusiastic consent”

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“Of course, they called us reactionaries, called us ‘rape apologists’ for simply pointing out all the ways this legislation would be expanded to a societal scale. They said we were exaggerating when we illustrated that, even for long-married couples, there would need to be a check list of approved acts of intimacy for each and every act performed, and men would need some form of hard evidence to prove that consent had indeed been granted.”

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Roused

I concur with kfg’s comment

“Democracy can survive only where there is a common culture, a supermajority of the people, who hold democracy as its highest ideal.”

Reposted for emphasis.

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Roused

“We call the new corporations of McWorld multinational, but they are more appropriately understood as post-national or even anti-national. They abjure the very idea of national boundaries or any other parochialism that limits them in time or space. ”

Drove through a large swath of dystopian corporate landscape… All fast food chains, restaurant chains, Wal-Mart s, cut rate cell phones, cut rate banking and check cashing… On and on. Chain after chain.

The only independents were some of the pawn shops.

Ask a simple question – is anywhere better off from the descent of these locusts? Better wages, nutrition, relationships or culture?

Sentient
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And Roused in our current year I am a radical, not a conservative. There is nothing to conserve.

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theasdgamer
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Sentient, it will take a bit of time for consumer societies like we have here to get going in Asia…wages will level between the U.S. and Asia, tending higher once Asia gets more consumerist. Asia’s standard of living will improve and ours will rebound…

time…

A Lady of Reason
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I apologize. You can take it down if you wish. sorry.

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Albert
Without proper communication etiquette the male hivemind that is the our collective cultural brain

The what?

Sentient
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ASD

“for consumer societies like we have here to get going in Asia…”

Consumer societies are the cause of the dystopian effect.

Atomization of society can only result in regressive tribalism. People always will self organize on this basis. They do now in enclaves and pockets. See Pac Heights for example. More is coming.

btw – heard the same thing 20 years ago on asia etc.

Albert
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@AR

https://youtu.be/-7zxWErGu8Y

Guess what the main gender is that collectively figures and negotiates these societal wide rules within the human ape? Hence my improvised label for this collective mental activity that creates, evolves and rejuvenates/destroys cultures.

The (male) rules of communication is how you speak to the top dogs of the dominance hierarchy w/o coming across as a clueless little puppy. There is an etiquette to follow, however it’s very different from getting a cat to like you (sexual game).

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Roused

“Videology is fuzzier and less dogmatic than traditional political ideology: it may as a consequence be far more successful in instilling the novel values required for global markets to succeed. ”

It’s clear that Apple based their entire I strategy (pod, phone and pad) around this. Amusing that article was written in 1997, now it just restates the obvious.

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Albert
Guess what the main gender is that collectively figures and negotiates these societal wide rules within the human ape?

Das.

Hence my improvised label for this collective mental activity that creates, evolves and rejuvenates/destroys cultures.

“Collective mental activity” — Hanging onto that 60’s blotter acid still?

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@AR or you could simply call it a metaphor of a collective human cognitive ability that works out ideas collectively. The hivemind space that I am most familiar with is science. However, it applies to all human cultural activities. Now politically correct newspeak is that it’s humans, however if you drill down it becomes ‘man’, with the occasional honorary women. Now in the domain of science if you don’t like the word (male) hivemind you could call it a ‘thought collective’ (Fleck, [1936] 1979), a ‘paradigm’ (Kuhn, [1962] 1970), a ‘republic’ (Polanyi, [1962] 2000), an ‘episteme’ (Foucault, [1966] 1970), a… Read more »

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P.S. if your one of these ‘postmodernist are the devil’ people, here are a few modernist that came to a similar conclusion, enjoy the reading!

Merton, R. K. (1973). The sociology of science: Theoretical and empirical investigations. Chicago: University of Chicago Press.

Popper, K. [1963] (2002). Conjectures and Refutations: The Growth of Scientific Knowledge, 2nd Edition. London: Routledge.

Russell, B. [1948] (1992). Human knowledge: its scope and value. Oxford: Routledge.

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Albert
@AR or you could simply call it a metaphor of a collective human cognitive ability that works out ideas collectively.

Or I could call that “spinach”.

The hivemind space that I am most familiar with is science.

How is that hivemind science space doing with the little crisis of replicability?

However, it applies to all human cultural activities.

All? Every single human cultural activity is being worked out by a collective hivemind?

Fill in the blanks:
False premise leads to __ __________ __________.

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@Albert “Without proper communication etiquette the male hivemind that is the our collective cultural brain will fragment down into tribal communities congregating around specific topics and interests, making such an exploration of our collective cvilvilisation growth practically infeasible, hence my emphasis on it.” So, Albert what is your agenda and end game here? You are asking for a feminizing of dialogue. And a globalization of all things. In effect anti-tribalism. Tribalism is hard wired in men. Men don’t operate in large collectives because men are not dumb enough to think that it serves their interests in a self interested mental… Read more »

boulderhead
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“What is this about rules for males communicating? ”

Reminds me of old Sam, he would say “mind your business, mine starts here at the end of these knuckles and your ends at the end of your nose?”

That is a rule for male communication that works.

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@ Boulderhead Well that’s kind of a non sequitur kind of statement. https://quoteinvestigator.com/2011/10/15/liberty-fist-nose/ We are kind of here trying to discuss manosphere collective thought. It’s not meant to be exclusive rather than inclusive of what males think and want and to. Imagine a discussion blog that discusses: Mastering the Challenges of Women, Work, and Sexual Desire (as well as fulfillment of that desire). And imagine that discussion worked wonders for an individual male. That is the pursuit, the passion and the goal. Rollo has been able to accomplish that. It’s not about having rights to swing your fists. It’s about… Read more »

boulderhead
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“We are kind of here trying to discuss manosphere collective thought. It’s not meant to be exclusive rather than inclusive of what males think and want and to.”

Carry on.

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@sjf December 30, 2017 at 4:05 pm

nice

Albert
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@SJF Thanks for the feedback, much appreciated! You are asking me “what is your agenda and end game here?” I find this a really difficult question to answer due to my own ignorance, however I will try to do so below to the best of my ability. Regardless of this, thanks for articulating your points of contention, such a STRUCTURE and ETIQUETTE allows me to qualify my argument and communication better, sorting out where: A) I lack knowledge, B) the disagreement is a mere semantic issue or C) were we have different assumptions. From the outset, such aspects are not… Read more »

boulderhead
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@Albert Perhaps AR isn’t connected to the same er “hive mind as you”. I’ll take a crack at this, relating the the story of the the tower of babble where the workers were caused by God to speak different languages, bringing about structural failure. The mechanics like kfg, Blaximus and myself, have mastered more fundamental trades as they are all necessary to success in completion. Yet to market the product of our labors we need salesmen that can relate the value of it to the customer. If we rely on our own marketing skills this would narrow our market to… Read more »

DisgruntledEarthling
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Ton should peep up soon and stop this nonsense

boulderhead
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Ton does have a way with words.

O.B.I.T.
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SJF
“The masculine goal is to advance toward a goal. The feminine goal is to slosh around in an ocean of emotion …”
So well said. TRM — Rollo and the comment squad — has a way of slapping the precise set of words to things I’ve seen or suspected for decades but could never quite put my finger on.

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@boulderhead I reply properly next year, when I have had some time to digest and mull over your comment, many good strains of thought in there. In the meantime, I just want to clarify that I wasn’t diminishing what AR said, is simply I cannot practically continue a dialectic with mere one word replies. This works when you already have the same understanding as someone else, e.g. if you have two mechanics talk shop, however when roofer talks to a painter about repairing an engine and both do not articulate about the source of the engine trouble, there is no… Read more »

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Albert In the above example with AR, in that exchange, he/she is returning back to the same point again and again. Since you keep making the same mistakes again and again, this should not be a surprise. Now by manifesting a third time the SAME comment AFTER I have given, A) further elaboration, B) provided references and C) opened up for further questions, Elaboration of the same mistakes. References to books that either were not read or were not understood. Unwilling or unable to answer any questions in a true fashion. Refusing to examine premises, while insisting that all men… Read more »

SJF
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The blogger at Western Mastery posted eight of the most insightful tweets he came across this year. http://www.westernmastery.com/2017/12/30/eight-insightful-tweets-2017/ Here are seven of them: If you naturally have a distaste for the majority opinion you’ll see opportunities nobody is seeing. — Veritas (@veritasnaut) September 22, 2017 If you are worried about failure or going through a period of mental and financial instability…your worries will be reflected in the results. — Robert Greene (@RobertGreene) December 29, 2017 When is everyone gonna stop apologising? When is everyone gonna stop trying to appease permanently offended fucking idiots? — Paul Joseph Watson (@PrisonPlanet) December 28,… Read more »

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Albert
I cannot practically continue a dialectic with mere one word replies.

So?

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Albert
The scientific ethos, as I understand it is such a intra male communication script and it is inclusive to everyone.

Your understanding is flawed, incomplete.

DisgruntledEarthling
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I guess with your appeal to authority SJF had a point

Not an appeal. I just get fed up of sloughing through reams of overly-obfuscated soliloquies. We get the occasional newcomer here that insists on being over-analytical and sure that we’ve got it all wrong according to their own version of the “truth” and how things should be. They either crack the door open and let new ideas in or leave after a while.

The simplified bottoms-up approach of Be The Man and Fuck Dem Bitches seems to be the simplest working model that works. The rest is mental masturbation.

SJF
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boulderhead
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@Albert

Here is a short tutorial on the evolution of male communication. I like to call it the wisdom of Tuco.

https://youtu.be/sTcBgs2huRo

boulderhead
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theasdgamer
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@AR

PS: Writing fewer words will help you in many ways, including clarifying thought.

Word. Check my FR where I barely said anything to the broad who put my hands on her boobs out on the dance floor.

Höllenhund
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How will that work in the future beyond turkey baster breeding?

It mostly won’t. There are already many cities in Western Europe where the population’s average total fertility rate is below 1.

Höllenhund
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Maybe. But so far I don’t see evidence of collapse for that reason. Every time I wander into a college zone bar I see 80 / 20 operating…because now i know what it looks like. Seriously, testosterone levels keep dropping across the industrialized world, and it’s affecting how men behave at the individual level and the group level. It’s all relative. A society where the average T-level is low is a society where few men are able and willing to cause any trouble. It also means there are few men around willing and able to defend that society from any… Read more »

Novaseeker
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It also means there are few men around willing and able to defend that society from any threat. That’s especially true in a society where hypergamy is unrestrained and thus many men have no investment in society. In other words, it’s like a house of cards, prone to collapse. Hasn’t the FI solved that by having a highly technologically advanced military which is (1) professional and therefore by choice, (2) requires a relatively small amount of manpower and (3) fully and thoroughly indoctrinated in the rules and standards of the FI? Really, the FI doesn’t need most men willing to… Read more »

Höllenhund
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Maybe it has indeed solved that. On the other hand, that’s exactly what they thought in every society in history that collapsed.

Yollo Comanche
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@Nova

Yes, but whenever someone doesn’t conform to the hivemind it sticks out to the collective, causing anxiety. Also porn doesn’t satiate. It highlights the difference between fantasy and reality. Hope and Futility.

EhIntellect
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“I am asking for structure, etiquette and leading by example.”

Albert,

In the spirit of etiquette I ran your longwinded Marquess of Queensberry Rules apologetics past my boys today.

Survey says:

I fart in your general direction, Senor Pantolones de Caca.

rugby11
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“Maybe it has indeed solved that. On the other hand, that’s exactly what they thought in every society in history that collapsed.” https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KrJXgyUeJhs Quis custodiet ipsos custodes? audio quid ueteres olim moneatis amici, “pone seram, cohibe.” sed quis custodiet ipsos custodes? cauta est et ab illis incipit uxor. noui consilia et ueteres quaecumque monetis amici, “pone seram, cohibes.” sed quis custodiet ipsos custodes? qui nunc lasciuae furta puellae hac mercede silent crimen commune tacetur. “Also porn doesn’t satiate. It highlights the difference between fantasy and reality. Hope and Futility.” Porn is a distraction… Manwin was built as an ideal by… Read more »

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“Rick Salomon Salomon is probably best known for the sex tape he made with then-girlfriend Paris Hilton in 2004, but he’s a big-time poker player in his own right: He won $2.8 million at the 2014 World Series of Poker’s Big One for One Drop event. In Molly’s Game, both sides of his persona are on display. How it plays out in the book: Rick Salomon showed up next. Rick was hot. He was crass and dirty, but he was still hot in a caveman kind of way. I pulled him aside to show him the board. “Wow, they are… Read more »

Yollo Comanche
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@Albert

Oooooohhhhh snap!

Intellect just called you poopy-pants!

If-I-Fell
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My son came to me saying he was tired of his girlfriend’s drama. They have been seeing each other for about 2 years. He described a situation, where she wanted ice cream. So, he brought some to her apartment. Then, she complained that she wanted the experience of going out to get ice cream. He also described a situation where they argued and she got out of his car in sub-zero weather and wouldn’t come back inside until she cooled off in an emotional and hypothermic way. He asked what he should do. I told him, I gave him a… Read more »

theasdgamer
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@IIF

Your son should have done a better job of calibrating his gf’s feelings…she obviously needed drama…my recommendation is that when girls start giving off signals of boredom, they will ambush a man with drama shortly after…it’s best to head these off by creating some drama…just part of being a man.

self-improvement for your son…get better at calibrating girls’ feelings…they all do this stuff and moving on to a new girl won’t “fix” the situation because it’s biology

Blaximus
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He should read the book/trm thoroughly.

boulderhead
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If-I-Fell

Maybe now he is miserable enough to read the RM and accept some of the basic principals.

If he is anything like my son spinning plates would be like splitting queens on a dealer jack. There is a reason the oneitis chapter is first and foremost.

Blaximus
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Girlfriends don’t get me to bring them ice cream and stuff until they bear me a child and move past gf status. And then it depends on if I’m in a satisfied state of mind.

Step into my frame. It’s comfy and there might even be some ice cream….occasionally.

EhIntellect
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“Also porn doesn’t satiate. It highlights the difference between fantasy and reality. Hope and Futility.” Lack of self awareness is animalistic as they are self-preserving but not self-aware. They find no meaning in their existence. Freedom is human nature. What makes a dolphin? Its dolphin-ness. What makes man, man? Freedom. We’re aware of our own meaning because we know it life will end. That’s the difference between man vs. animal. When men lose sight of their own freedom they choose to replace it with an temporary satisfaction. Men use pornography, Columbine-style violence, MGTOW, etc. as an escape from permanent meaning,… Read more »

Sentient
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The GFE, Girlfriend Experience, is her bringing you ice cream. Set hurdles, have her jump.

rugby11
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“Step into my frame. It’s comfy and there might even be some ice cream….occasionally.”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xmUZ6nCFNoU

EhIntellect
“Lack of self awareness is animalistic as they are self-preserving but not self-aware. They find no meaning in their existence.”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ACCoL8xk0Jg

“When men autoconvince freedom is nonexistent and inconsequential they limit their lives to what is presented, auto-orient to hoplesness, aka death, suicide, homicide, on the margins.”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8n2vsSHAs0w

Happy new start man thank you for your post.

rugby11
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“Pornography is an active dcision to reduce one’s freedom. closing in on ourselves, grasping for control and becoming our own gods.”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GU_FUlOapf8

When death is meaningless, life is meaningless.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LMU895wYEDI

“Freedom to choose includes the freedom not to choose.”

Albert
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@Yollo Comanche No worries, sticks and stones and everything, you know. Intellect is already in my good books, as he provided me some valuable insights. @Disgruntled Earthling Acknowledging that someone else has a point is not appealing to authority. @AR Cool, if you have the truth, please feel free to share with the group. I actually love being wrong, this means I can learn something. FYI if you think I misunderstood these books I have read, feel free to point out to me how I did so. I am all ears, so far you haven’t done so, more in stating… Read more »

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@boulderhead “You get the point. What Rollo is about here is an unmoderated space for men where we can find what works and save the rest for a time when our view widens with our experience. This is more inclusive across the board to all men, than setting out a particular way of communication that doesn’t translate to individual experience.” That’s fine, I dont take an issue with this. However, Tuco does have feelings too https://youtu.be/ZSkeQkb8NMo So does Tuco’s brother, furthermore imagine if Tuco and Pablo both could talk in a langauge where they could understand each other. Imagine Tuco… Read more »

rugby11
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“‘male game’ and male modes of communication”
Albert it comes out without planning it… You speak and observe and say certain thing’s around men because in this climate everything is legislative. You have to ask for permission to pee almost as a prison complex of existence. Everyone is ready to report on anybody. Participation comes with observation. Males don’t just say thing’s to anybody that’s a common mistake I’ve been learning about myself. We say thing’s when we work an a project in partnership.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iwqAmXYW_gU

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-K977NxGhyU

kfg
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“Now I think you and others seem to be under the impression that I am trying to IMPOSE rules of articulation . . .” It might have something to do with your persistence in trying to show your grandparents how to suck rocks. I can answer both of my questions at once with a single word: Q:Where do Stukas come from? Q: WHY do Stukas come? A: Civilization. “Maybe hitting each other is part of dog talk” Well, duh. In fact I have been sitting here reading up to this point thinking that maybe what you need is to get… Read more »

Höllenhund
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Hasn’t the FI solved that by having a highly technologically advanced military which is (1) professional and therefore by choice, (2) requires a relatively small amount of manpower and (3) fully and thoroughly indoctrinated in the rules and standards of the FI? A military “fully and thoroughly indoctrinated in the rules and standards of the FI” isn’t an organization I’d entrust with the defense of anything important, for one thing. Its only use is as a welfare program for women and their enablers. The main issue here, I guess, is that such militaries are specialized for certain tasks and nothing… Read more »

Höllenhund
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@Novaseeker

“the men they want sex with is small relative to the total number of men”

Yes, this is exactly what I wanted to convey.

A bit like a starving person who accepts nothing but caviar and oysters. I would not call that “starving”.

I see others basically calling you a blue-pilled dummy, but you have a point there. Imagine a guy saying “yeah, I have, like, a really high sex drive. For real! As long as I get to bone the hottest chicks. Otherwise I can’t be bothered”. Everybody hearing it would laugh out loud, for good reason.

Albert
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@rugby “Males don’t just say thing’s to anybody that’s a common mistake I’ve been learning about myself. We say thing’s when we work an a project in partnership.” I know, I experienced this myself when closely working together with other men. You need a common purpose to integrate and congregate around. The flipside is, without allowing for others to say stupid things and joke around no such common purpose can be found, if there is none. BTW, I watched the male role models video you linked previously, the one about the first nation tribes resonated a lot. Especially, when one… Read more »

boulderhead
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@Albert Civilization does not and never has existed, civilized society does however exist at least at first glance until we look beneath the surface. “where/why do Stukas come?” these did not come from a hunter gatherer ,ag, or tribal order. Modernization does however exist and produces non civil inventions daily. Solipsism in women is not bad, rather it is one reason the human species has survived. We need to understand this nature to understand women, watch what they do not what they say. A man without his own MPO is more of a sheep than man, a woman’s mpo is… Read more »

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EhIntellect
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“Now fighting against windmills can be fun for a while…”

Fine. I’ll be explicit.

The law of diminishing returns has reduced the value of your commentary to essentially zero.

Not zero, mind you, but in a quotidian application sense, it might as well be.

I don’t know much about you, I honestly tried. Your personality gets lost in the walls of webpage. You’re more work than I’m used to.

Your commentary reminds me of a fly fisherman who enjoys feeling the rod load more than fishing.

EhIntellect
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“Problem is “I do get it”

Albert, if ya gotta state it…hmmm.

C’mon man!

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