Ghosting

ghosting

Lately I’ve been refocusing my take on the process of mens’ unplugging and dealing with a new Red Pill informed way of living. The Gamer Girls post, while intentionally light reading (for TRM), was really a side of things I’ve wanted to explore for a bit now.

As most of my readers know I make efforts not to be prescriptive in what I write. I realize there’s going to be bias involved in any observed process, but as I’ve stated on this blog and in my books, applying the Red Pill isn’t one size fits all. While the truth of Red Pill awareness is universally understandable, the application of it needs an individualized approach.

I don’t sell sunshine and rainbows here. You wont find deliberately inspirational reheated Zig Ziglar quotes you can frame in some motivational poster. Anyone doing so has a business based on it. What you will get here is unvarnished, un-sugar coated Red Pill awareness that is actionable in ways you choose to leverage it. My intent is not to make you a better man, but to have you make you a better man, and I trust you to be intelligent enough to make the best decisions for yourself based on your new awareness.

As I stated in The Bitter Taste of the Red Pill,…

The truth will set you free, but it doesn’t make truth hurt any less, nor does it make truth any prettier, and it certainly doesn’t absolve you of the responsibilities that truth requires. One of the biggest obstacles guys face in unplugging is accepting the hard truths that Game forces upon them. Among these is bearing the burden of realizing what you’ve been conditioned to believe for so long were comfortable ideals and loving expectations are really liabilities.

At it’s most distilled, the Red Pill is a Praxeology (h/t SJF):

Praxeology is the study of those aspects of human action that can be grasped a priori; in other words, it is concerned with the conceptual analysis and logical implications of preference, choice, means-end schemes, and so forth.

Praxeologyis the deductive study of human action based on the notion that humans engage in purposeful behavior, as opposed to reflexive behavior like sneezing and inanimate behavior. According to its theorists, with the action axiom as the starting point, it is possible to draw conclusions about human behavior that are both objective and universal. For example, the notion that humans engage in acts of choice implies that they have preferences, and this must be true for anyone who exhibits intentional behavior.

As such, and by the way I define it, the praxeology of the Red Pill is subject to the same capacity for revision and refinement as any other science. A lot of critics, including ones who’ve come to it after failing to re-plug themselves back into the Matrix, would like to believe that the foundations of Red Pill awareness are just overly complex opinions based on the anecdotal, negative, experiences of a handful of manosphere luminaries.

The truth is that as a praxeology Red Pill awareness is ‘open source’ and will necessarily evolve as our understanding of human nature advances. As new biological, psychological and sociological understanding expands so too will our understanding of Red Pill awareness, and consequently methodologies to operate on them will too.

However, in the now, we still must deal with the consequent painful disillusionments from being cut away from a formerly Blue Pill existence. As I illustrated in The Bitter Taste of the Red Pill, that freeing truth comes at a price, and sometimes that price manifests in ways you don’t expect.

Many newly unplugged men make the connection that Red Pill awareness fundamentally alters the way they see the world and certainly the latent purpose of pop culture and media trends. That’s the easy recognition, however, the Red Pill Lens reveals many more painful truths and a lot of them hit pretty close to home. Dealing with family, interacting with close personal friends still mired in a Blue Pill conditioned existence, is not only frustrating, but revealing your new awareness can sometimes draw hostility and abandonment from them.

I’ve personally known guys who’ve read my body of work, came to a Red Pill awareness, and then immediately wanted to explain it all to their friends only to find themselves ostracized from their regular social group because their sudden change diametrically conflicts with what they’ve been conditioned to expect from him. It’s very frustrating for guys who want to excitedly, sometimes proudly, talk about the particulars of their new awareness and how it’s changed them for the better.

I know better than most I think. I’m Rollo Tomassi and I can’t exactly advertise it or even drop hints about the Red Pill in my daily life without some reservation. Mrs. Tomassi would like nothing better than to blather off about my two books to her family and friends, but I’ve dropped the hammer on this since I started this blog. Obviously it behooves me to maintain at least a semi-anonymous profile to make sure my wife and daughter aren’t the target of anyone’s net hate retaliations, but I also know that most of my family and certainly all of hers will never be ready to accept Red Pill awareness.

Never appeal to truth and reality unless you are prepared for the anger that comes for disenchantment.

Ghosting

PlansAndPlates from the Red Pill sub brought up an interesting topic recently.

People who knew you in your beta past will never respect you and you will never respect yourself if you choose to associate with them anymore.

I made a pretty brutal decision to ghost a lot of ‘friends’ from my past.

I decided if people treated me in a way they wouldn’t treat someone of high regard/respect/authority (their boss, their parent, whoever they look up to) then I would next them. Boy, girl, plate, ‘friend’, family member, whoever.

If a person doesn’t respect you, it could be your fault and it could be their fault – whoever enabled and created the relationship of disrespect is not actually important.

What’s important is the result; you’re associating with someone who treats you with disrespect, or lesser respect than those they actually respect, and there is no way a man can respect himself if he’s choosing to spend time with people who don’t respect him.

Note the word choose. Sometimes you have no choice, but when you have the option to say to yourself “You know what? Fuck this, I’m bailing” or “No fucking way am I going to see that guy” you must use it.

How can you respect yourself if you choose to associate with someone who doesn’t respect you? How can you do anything in life worth a shit? You’re going to spend all the time with them ‘proving’ to them you’re worthy of respect? You’re going to spite them until they respect you? Who gives a fuck what they think? Not only is it bad to give a fuck what someone thinks, they’re likely never going to respect you. Never ever. Once you decide you don’t respect somebody, how often do you change your mind? Do you erase your memories?

How can you believe in yourself if you don’t respect yourself? How are you going to follow a plan out to get healthy, get wealthy, get smart, if you don’t respect yourself?

For that reasons I ghosted a number of friendly acquaintances I considered friends, once I understood where I was in their hierarchy. Some I’d known for 10 years and had shared some good and bad memories with.

I do not regret it one bit.

People who don’t respect you won’t change how they perceive you once you better yourself, they’ll see the old you and a new imposter.

I am a strong believer that first impressions last, forever, and that if you have made an impression on some people that you are a beta, they will never forget where they’ve pigeon holed you. They will never treat you like an alpha and defer to you, how could they? They don’t respect you, they ‘know’ that you’re just ‘acting different’.

Compare that with new people. New people see what’s in front of them and they take it at face value that you’re a lean mean fucking machine who appears to have his shit in order and probably always has. Don’t tell them about your past when you didn’t, they don’t need the dream ruined. And if other people talk about your old ways, just agree and amplify and laugh about it – the new person wasn’t there and it’s just the other persons word against yours – and you’re a likable alpha, so they’ll think fuck it and believe you’re an alpha and always were.

Lesson: You should consider making some hard decisions about ghosting some people in your life who have disrespected you and boxed you into a ‘beta’ category in their memory. You could turn from the guy from Revenge of the Nerds into Connor McGregor and they’d only tell people about how you were the guy from Revenge of the Nerds. New people will take your fucking greatness at face value and when they hear reports that you’ve upgraded and shit test you, defuse the shit test with great laughter.

His point is simple with regard to respect, but this need for ghosting is a pragmatic response most guys see coming when they shift into Red Pill awareness. They know well ahead of time that certain friends, particularly close friends whose lives are invested in the illusions of a Blue Pill contentedness, will neither accept this new awareness nor the genuineness of their change in perspective.

Law 10 Infection: Avoid the Unhappy and Unlucky

You can die from someone else’s misery – emotional states are as infectious as disease. You may feel you are helping the drowning man but you are only precipitating your own disaster. The unfortunate sometimes draw misfortune on themselves; they will also draw it on you. Associate with the happy and fortunate instead.

Remember those Zig Ziglar optimistic ‘mindset’ peddlers I mentioned earlier? One tenet of that build-a-positive-fantasy-life mental model is the clichéd notion that you should surround yourself with winners and blow off the losers in your life. It’s a simple aphorism that rolls off the tongue easy; associate with winners and that winning will rub off on you. What they don’t tell you to do is how to cut out the unhappy and unlucky persons in your life who also happen to be your oldest friends or closest family members.

This is one of those painful truths that will set you free, but still stings like a bitch.

But eliminate them, or marginalize them you must. Most guys know this, or they come to know it as the first thing once they unplug. There’s a cost to Red Pill awareness.

The Price of Truth

I only rarely make an active effort to help unplug men these days. Now, I get that my books and this blog are an effort as such, but I mean in the sense of reaching out personally to a guy whom I think may be ready to consider the Red Pill truths about men and women.

I did make one recently and I was reminded again about the part in the Matrix where Morpheus explains to Neo that he’d broken protocol to unplug him. They never tried to free a mind once it reached a certain age. The mind has difficulties in letting go of “truths” it’s become dependent upon for its own survival.

That’s a pretty accurate analogy for dealing with unplugging other men as well as revealing Red Pill awareness to people too invested in a Blue Pill existence to listen to, much less acknowledge the rationality of a truth that destroys their self-sustaining ego investments.

But attempt it I did. The guy was a fairly high profile, but minor local celebrity who at 48 years old had just had a painful split with his 30 year old girlfriend. He’d been married once before, divorced for all the Blue Pill misguided pandering you might expect, and now here he was ‘blindsided’ by a girlfriend well above 2 SMV steps to his own. Even a basic understanding of the intersexual dynamics that the Red Pill illustrates would’ve spared him a repeat of his Beta behavior and her consequent dumping of him.

But there he was, again, in the same familiar depression due to the same repeated behaviors stemming from the same misinformed Blue Pill conditioned mindset. So I made the effort. I liked the guy. In most other aspects of life he’s very pragmatic, driven, focused and definitely Alpha. He’s got social proof, a low grade of celebrity, he’s affluent, and while somewhat arrogant at times very likable. However, he suffers from one fatal flaw – he is ego invested in a Blue Pill illusion of women so thoroughly that only a man who’s lived it his entire 48 years can understand it.

So I made an effort to just get him to read my book, or at least the Best of Year One posts. He’d have none of it. The reflexive response to what he’s been taught by the women in his life is misogyny short circuit for him. To be honest I was never really hopeful, but I made the effort from that base need to help another man avoid a painful fate – not unlike my reasons for writing at all.

I’ve got to ghost him now. Not because I’m an asshole or I’ve given up, but because it’s just not pragmatic to apply that effort when others would benefit more from it. He’s past that age Morpheus says the mind should never be freed and I’ve got to be OK with that.

That’s just the price of truth.

Published by Rollo Tomassi

Author of The Rational Male and The Rational Male, Preventive Medicine

506 comments on “Ghosting

  1. YaReally Sentient Quixotic et al

    Just a quick follow up to my FR reports (ASD girl and kiddie club) from the previous thread – thanks for the feedback on the club and the ASD girl.

    My key takeaways for ASD girl from what you’ve all posted are as follows.

    Basically it’s like YaReally says – you go to one extreme, then you correct back, then the other way etc. Too much sexualising, too little, etc.

    The previous “circle” I did in late 2014/early 2015 taught me not to trigger ASD by turning on a girl when I had no logistics to get her home (i.e., just in the pub) and while I did get some toilet BJs doing that (low percentage), I incorporated that into my Game to be more consistent.

    This time around, I stopped over-escalating when I had no path to extraction/isolation – I only get the girl turned on when my logistics to get her home are good.

    But the KEY learning point this time around (same thing that happened to quixotic really) is that EVEN IF my logistics are good, I shouldn’t be getting her too horny and pumped up BEFORE I have her in isolation – because then any attempt to extract her home will be viewed as “going to have sex” and trigger her ASD, which would have been far milder if I hadn’t turned her on so much.

    Now I HAVE broken all these rules and still gotten girls home and banged them after getting them dripping wet in public with full making out etc – but it’s not a high percentage move (and those girls it worked with would still have come home with me with lower levels of arousal).

    So with a view to that:

    1. Talking about sex and light kissing/kino (plus obv laser and EC and physical dominance) is fine

    2. Sloppy make out and groping is probably going too far (basically if it’s anything that will make people stare at you in a chill bar (not a nightclub), then it is probably over doing it) (I have also recently started doing takeaways more consistently on dates including with this latest ASD girl and it’s amazing how well it works even with silly takeaways – at one point when we were in the middle of the heavily sexual talk and make out, she said something like “I really like hanging out with you and your stories and want to see you again…do you like hanging out with me?”. Me, deadpan, “I’ll tell you in an hour or so”. You could just SEE the sharp emotional spike go in there…

    3. Plus important to seed the pull early on in the date (I always mention I live nearby but I should also add something about view/music/photos/whatever and casually say “you should see it sometimes” and later I can call back to it when extracting. And if she brings up sex, deflect as someone said above by saying “Is sex all you think about?”). PLUS (assuming sexual frame already set), good idea to add in False Time Constraint (and even get some takeaway food to have at mine..and defuse ASD further – I am so rigid about not buying them dinner before the bang that I’ve missed this trick till now).

    4. I have had success before with every variant of pull (from saying “lets go to mine” to saying “Lets go for ice cream” and walking her past my place on the way to the (real) ice cream place, but stopping at my place to use the toilet and inviting her in, etc. But I think optimal may be to do points 1-3 above and then just say “Let’s go to mine to do [callback to see the view etc]”. If you just say “Let’s go”, she is GUARANTEED to ask “Where?” and if you don’t want to lie, it’s quite difficult to deflect that one.

    5. In this case (or any case like mine or quixotic’s) where ASD has been triggered, I will be scheduling an asexual date activity and then trying to extract to mine (no sexualising except maybe some light kisses and hand holding). This girl is only free day times (single mom) so my usual live music options are out..I’m thinking a small art gallery near my place (I want an ACTIVITY, not just talking to her like last time) and then seed the pull during the gallery and then keep fingers crossed.

    BTW I’m hitting a Latin dance bar tonight solo – let’s see how it goes. Keeping my goals process-oriented as YaReally said – only want to open 10 sets and try and stay in conversation while keeping my state decent as I’m solo.

    And Sentient tomorrow night I am finishing work late-ish so probably gonna hit a circuit of hotel bars around 10pm to see how they are. It may be a bit later than ideal but will keep your comments in mind. Particularly bartender as pivot and drawing girls into conversation while speaking to bartender – that’s gold, as are the Phone Destroyer (lol) lines.

    PS – You know it literally just occurred to me. I was thinking about how strippers always come and sit on you and ask the same stupid questions (name, where are you from, work) to keep conversation going. It’s because the real sexual attraction happens on a different level (because you have a hot girl rubbing up on your lap and giving you sexual EC). I just realised this is IDENTICAL to what Julien recommends in PIMP. That’s why he basically recommends going in asking the same “questions of death” and riffing off them to create conversation – because the actual attraction happens on the sub comm level – body language, kino, EC and the tonality of those questions, which he goes into in detail. So he’s basically reverse engineered what strippers do?

    PPS – I am just going to look now at the Tyler Eye Contact videos YaReally linked (and the Guy Dancing at Festival video and breakdown from the last post) but it looks like it is related to stuff RSD is teaching in the new 2016 Hot Seat program. I attended it recently and I have a review coming up soon (I’ve not posted it yet because I want to be a bit vague about when I attended it, otherwise too easy to identify which city)…

  2. @ Rollo Tomassi

    My interpretation of ghosting is not the same as nexting or writing people off and I would assume yours isn’t either.

    Immediately after posting my comment at 5:55am I picked up the phone and texted my son.He is 33yo w/ 43yo wife she and her two early 20s daughters have taken over his life for the last ten years.A total feminist witch and two party girls.
    I personaly have been labeled a mysoginist prick since the age of 13,and speak my mind w/zgf.
    I bought him your books for his 33rd b day,and told him they were 20yrs late,apologeticly. We went fishing and discussed rp praxeology,he found it depressing.
    Two weeks later we went fishing again and he told me he and his wife were getting along fine,denial as the youngest daughter had recently thrown a fit over being told to clean,smashing his guitar into his drum set,ruining both.Shit I witnesed him sitting her down and trying to rationaly explain things w/ wife sitting by zgf.Fine frustrated.insecure neurotic and egotistical,fine.
    I ghosted him,meaning mind my own biz and wait for the inevitable,to be there when needed.
    A few days ago I heard the rumor of divorce,not surprised hardly ever am.
    After reading this post of yours I texted him and he returned my call twice and agreed to have breakfast.
    We met and he immediately supposed I had heard,I changed the subject to pictures and small talk for fifteen min denying any knowledge of his problems.The kid just couldn’t wait to tell me about it.
    Long story longer he met a 28yo and felt guilty told his wife and they are calling it quits.I’m thinking interesting sounds like ten years ago rinse and repeat. I asked if she is epiphany or wall and got a what is that? You haven’t read those books have you?No working nights and going to university and cleaning house doing the dishes,band practice and having problems,haven’t even gone fishing. Explain please so he heard a 55yos 45min dissertation on the red pill and evo psych. And a you have nothing to feel guilty about speech. We are going fishing later this week.

    I see ghosting as holding back and watching like Casper.I can’t next my son or anyone for that matter. Just because they have bought into some wholesale lies.I can’t really shove the truth down there throat either.All that can be done is plant a seed and wait “ghost”.

  3. YaReally thanks dude.

    It seems to me that those two approaches aren’t mutually exclusive..you can run the routines and also sarge a lot and it should speed up the process of being able to wing it. ANd you’ll have the routines to back you up if needed anyway.

    What would I have done differently? Hmm.

    Basically I could have run a modified version of my online stack which I’ve done like a million times and can do on autopilot (derived and heavily modified from something Walawala posted – it starts with “You look like trouble” and goes on to a mildly sexual cold read).

    I can talk about that for a while. Then, since I already had some attraction, move to asking some mild comfort questions about her (but being very careful to maintain the right breaking-rapport voice tonality that Julien talks about in PIMP while asking questions of death).

    Keep a bit of teasing and mild sexuality/playfulness going in A2, then A3 qualify her and do some takeaways and find out her logistics.

    May be 20 mins later..suggest instadate to the bar across street (it was about 5pm).

    Then providing her logistics were still okay, run pretty much my usual Day 2 game (but faster, and keeping in mind the anti-ASD stuff mentioned in my last post including seeding a reason for the pull to my place).

    Then get her from the coffee shop to very close to my place (15 min away) by taking her for ice cream or a hot chocolate and then (that particular shop has no seating) suggest having it at my place 5 min away and she can see [some kind of callback] at my place.

    That’s pretty much it I guess.

    Interesting thought experiment. Actually once I get to the bar instadate I’d be pretty confident because I’ve done so many Day 2s from online dating..

  4. @Sun

    I guess that’s what happens when you’ve ghosted on your own family for their abusive behavior. Makes ghosting on future damaging relationships much easier.

    I did this as well, actually before I read a single word of an RP blog. There were a number of reasons for it, but the short of it is my entire family was subtly dominated and abused by the women in it. It’s accurate to say the women had no conscious knowledge of their abusive behavior. My dad was never alpha, as he had been emotionally abused by his dad. Quite the string of failure, and to all outward appearance, there’s nothing wrong in the family, except that I’m not there.

  5. @Newlyaloof

    LOL… But I’ve made a change

    Wife: What do you want for your birthday?
    Me: Well, the ex offered her pussy for me to cum in, [PAUSE] I’M THINKING ABOUT IT… WHAT YOU GOT?

  6. @Sentient Commitment to self-improvement does not a purple-piller make. I did issue the ultimatum and she said leave. That was a year ago. She hasnt made a move and I’m still there.. Sex 3X per week including stuff I hear most marrieds lose out on after the first year. I have a bugout bag and cash and still dont know if/when the shoe drops but definitely mixed signals and still trying to figure out is this just mild BPD brattiness that I can live with or about to get divorce raped. you’re probly right re: upping Alpha, thanks.

  7. AJ

    Trying to process this… So YOU issue an ultimatum, SHE tells YOU to leave (wtf?)… and then you sit around waiting for HER to make HER move?

    That right?

    Sounds to me she is going to monkey branch you hoss… If you issue an ultimatum and they challenge you and you fold, what does that say?

  8. Sun Wukong

    “ABG. Always Be Gaming.”

    YES!!!! There is no difference… just BE game. Once you get past the fear of “failure” it will become just a part of you. It will become YOU.

    And in fact, you won’t be able to turn it off… like you will struggle to real yourself in in situations where you might have to…

    The other day I was at a business conference – lot of clients I work with and professionals I work with. Since I’m married, I don’t try and pick up these things typically [had a few slips… ooops] because I’m well known.

    So the first night I meet this little 27YO 6, and we just chit chat at the cocktail reception. Give her a little “friendly laser” (IAS you listening?) and some rapport. Move on with my night [was planning on going offsite and gaming but client popped up looking to hang out… bleh]

    Next night after dinner wiht a client, in the lounge with some guys from the conference and a couple of their fat women co-workers. I’m in Bar Posture #2, locked in Mystery style, laying back against the bar, very chill. Facing the room. They all assembled in a semi circle around me. It’s chill, low energy place. we are just all BSing, people I know well.

    Little 6 comes back in the lobby from her dinner event and makes a bee line over to us. Merge her in. we are all just chatting, I’m not even thinking about her, just hitting her with the laser every now and then. During this as other people filter back in from their dinners, they are coming to the bar for a drink. I’m well known, work with everyone so all the heavy hitters that are there come by to say hey to me, and we chit chat and cheers… Huge DHV going on for a young girl. But I’m in NO GAME mode, so not even thinking about it. But my subconscious self is still running good indirect game…

    So the hour comes to bounce, my group knows of an afterparty onsite, so I say let’s go. I go in a different direction, say the long way, because I didn’t now there was another door right next to the others. So I am on this long loop to go round some couches and get back to them. LOL. Anyhow I stride off, have a good five steps on the group and i hear tip tap tip tap tip tap… a girl RUNNING in high heels to catch up to me.

    I give a quarter turn and see it is little 6, eyes beaming. And I swear, it probably looked funny, I start to just naturally reach out in boyfriend dominant kino and pull her in close and walk with taking her hand… one of my main moves when bouncing… But catch myself at the last second and straighten up… LOL But once you see the signs like that, you become trained to just ACT – BAM! – in the moment…

    So she comes along with me the long way, we hit the afterparty… Now I’m like hmmmm… this little thing is right here. Maybe if we get out of sight… huh? But we get into the room, and a hot (married) late 30’s woman, super slender, hair down to her waist (very unusual!) and fun latches on to me, just draped on me, taking my arm, while I get a drink and start chatting with a 30YO dude who wants to do biz with me. And then another 7.5 30YO joins us who I was negging earlier in the day, and we are all chatting. You get a lot of “fun time” kino and flirting while at business events, all these married women want some validation and a little plausibly deniable contact… which you CAN switch into “it just happened” as long as you can get isolation with no eyes on you… LOL

    But little 6 sees this interest… stands around basically by herself for a while and after probably 10 minutes of this I look back and she is gone… leaves the party.

    Sent her an email today, she is down for drinks when I swing by her city this year. All on the up and up of course.

  9. Despite the fact that I had read Ayn Rand at an early age, and had various “lite” red pill awakenings as early as my late teens, early 20s, it wasn’t until my mid-30s that I started actively Ghosting certain (albeit few) people and political causes (gave up being a democrat for example), because I realized a couple things:

    1) I was wasting my time investing anything in someone or some purpose that either not take my advice, listen to guys like me, or do stupid things;

    2) Our entire relationship, and this includes personal friends, or women, or how liberals feel about guys like me, was predicated upon them shaming me based upon moral standards (including guilt and shaming) that were respected and/or NATIVE TO MY CULTURE, but not theirs, the very same people making demands of me, or calling me or others like me a racist, or misogynist or whatever.

    It’s also why I stopped volunteering, and why, as other guy’s have noted in the past here and on Dalrock, I really don’t do ANY favors for women (that’s their man’s job), and I care ZERO if “the blacks” or my fellow Latinos (who resent White Hispanics like me), think I am a racist, or whatever.

    Ghosting people and/or political causes, companies, concepts, etc, liberates you from a constant state of soft anxiety at proving a negative, or “arguing” a case, a position, and lifestyle.

    Zero Fucks Given, except for my (beautiful foreign, and Red Pill) wife and kids.

  10. @Culum
    “But the KEY learning point this time around (same thing that happened to quixotic really) is that EVEN IF my logistics are good, I shouldn’t be getting her too horny and pumped up BEFORE I have her in isolation – because then any attempt to extract her home will be viewed as “going to have sex” and trigger her ASD, which would have been far milder if I hadn’t turned her on so much.”

    https://i.memecaptain.com/gend_images/Bt0NqQ.jpg

    “but it’s not a high percentage move”

    This. Anything will theoretically work if you try it enough, that’s how human beings have gotten to where we are. But PUA is about increasing your consistency rate. Like Mystery says the ultimate goal is to have the skills to turn 5 cold approaches in a row into 5 long-term girlfriends (aka you’ve run proper tight game from start to finish with an end result where she’s madly in love with you).

    “Sloppy make out and groping is probably going too far”

    Ya, stick to romantic kisses and ending them first, or going for a heavier makeout and then after a couple seconds go in for another kiss but then give her the cheek and pull away saying “we shouldn’t be doing this…” with a teasing grin and then pull away and resume the conversation “so you were saying about the–” and leave her frustrated and wanting closure. Escalate further when you have isolation in the sex location. Again it’s not that you CAN’T get laid escalating earlier, and in some situations that’s actually the BEST move for that particular situation (calibrate with field experience), but in terms of consistency not getting too raunchy before you have sex location isolation is the highest %.

    “Plus important to seed the pull early on in the date (I always mention I live nearby but I should also add something about view/music/photos/whatever and casually say “you should see it sometimes” and later I can call back to it when extracting”

    This…you living nearby is just logistical information, it doesn’t disarm ASD. NOT saying where you live at ALL or saying you live 4 hours away but saying “I should show you my music sometime” is 100000x better than saying you live a block away and not having an excuse for her ASD to use to allow her to go there. It’s not the distance that prevents her from coming with you, it’s the ASD.

    “And if she brings up sex, deflect as someone said above by saying “Is sex all you think about?””

    Ya I like to say “we are NOT having sex tonight” with a grin and basically play the chick role while DHV’ing and teasing her with those pull-away kisses. At first she’ll be like “lol of course we aren’t” because she came into the interaction with the same frame as me, but after I flip her attraction switches and leave her hanging for closure on being turned on etc she’ll switch to “oh yes we are, you think you can resist me do you??” or “errrghh I like him and I want to fuck him so bad but I can’t tell if he likes me!!” which is a much better state for the final pull to a sex location.

    “good idea to add in False Time Constraint (and even get some takeaway food to have at mine..and defuse ASD further”

    Yup, you can’t diffuse ASD too much. Like, you want ASD at flat out zero 100% of the time if you can somehow do that. A LOT of those good-looking rich dudes end up not pulling the girls that throw iois at them because they don’t understand these kinds of nuances and trigger the girl’s ASD because they think “well she likes me so she must WANT to fuck me so we are on the same page let’s go!!!!” and just bull in a china shop it and then the girl gets ASD and the guy ends up blueballsed and not understanding that a girl can want to fuck you SO FUCKING BAD but if she feels too many bad feels about it she can’t do it.

    “I am so rigid about not buying them dinner before the bang that I’ve missed this trick till now”

    You can try to make them pay for their own slice of pizza to eat at your place or whatever if you want to save money or sometimes they’ll offer to pay (in both cases it kind of helps make them invest in the interaction, like “of course I have to fuck him I paid $10 for our pizza!! I gotta get something for that or I’m just some dumb girl who bought a guy pizza for no reason!” lol), but as an older dude if your finances are in check you can always just avoid risking any state-breaking hiccups and pay for it BUT qualify it like “NORMALLY I wouldn’t pay for a girl until after we’ve had sex because bla bla golddiggers bla bla I like independent women bla bla, BUT you’ve been more fun to hang out with tonight than I was expecting…I thought you were going to be this ditzy bar girl bla bla but you turned out to be bla bla actually you know what the turning point for me was? No this is too gay I don’t even want to say it lol ok fine whatever, it’s dumb but it was when you did that (insert some random cute little thing she did at some point that made you lol, not something sexual, so it sounds more speshul) that’s when I was like ok I like this girl lol So the pizza is on me tonight, pick a slice out.” And then of course ideally be getting that pizza at a place near your apartment so you can eat it there and escalate.

    ““Let’s go to mine to do [callback to see the view etc]”. If you just say “Let’s go”, she is GUARANTEED to ask “Where?” and if you don’t want to lie, it’s quite difficult to deflect that one.”

    How about “Let’s go.” “Where?” “I’m going to show you my music.” That’s more likely to avoid ASD compared to “my place” because you are going somewhere for a nonsexual PURPOSE, VS going to a SEX LOCATION, ya know? Plus her hindbrain can infer that of course you would listen to your music at your place, without her forebrain hearing the words “MY PLACE”…make sense? A lot of game is just these little inches here and there that add up to make the difference. Like just throwing in “but you can only stay for one drink” can switch her from being resisting and bailing to going “oh just one drink OKAY!!”, or when you lead a girl somewhere during a sarge saying “Two minutes, just two minutes” can diffuse a cockblock completely even if you end up talking for 20 minutes after that, when not saying it might have the cockblock drag her friend away. Game of inches.

    “I will be scheduling an asexual date activity and then trying to extract to mine (no sexualising except maybe some light kisses and hand holding)”

    Yup, optimal strategy. Think about it like this: she already KNOWS your intentions, they’re VERY clear, so you can go full friend zone asexual mode to let her ASD calm down and keep it from re-triggering, because her hindbrain KNOWS you’re going to fuck if you two end up isolated in a sex location. Same concept but on a smaller scale with the hardcore sucking face on a Day2…when you do romantic kisses and kino etc, she KNOWS what your intentions are, you’re already out of the friend zone, so it’s cool to chill and let the whole movie play out VS trying to fast-forward to the ending from there. Just enjoy the Day2 and hanging with a cute fun girl and lead things to your place without triggering ASD and then escalate, she’ll be relieved you did it so smoothly.

    Whereas the problem ACTUAL “friend zoned” guys have is they don’t show ANY intention at ALL, VS showing some intention and then playing it cool.

    “I was thinking about how strippers always come and sit on you and ask the same stupid questions (name, where are you from, work) to keep conversation going. It’s because the real sexual attraction happens on a different level (because you have a hot girl rubbing up on your lap and giving you sexual EC). I just realised this is IDENTICAL to what Julien recommends in PIMP. That’s why he basically recommends going in asking the same “questions of death” and riffing off them to create conversation – because the actual attraction happens on the sub comm level – body language, kino, EC and the tonality of those questions, which he goes into in detail. So he’s basically reverse engineered what strippers do?”

    http://cdn.meme.am/instances/65604320.jpg

    Like Valentino Kohen says in a video I can’t find right now: “other guys will SAY to a girl that they want her, but they won’t SHOW it on all the other channels (eye-contact, kino, etc)…I show it on all the other channels but don’t SAY it”

    If you want to do a funny experiment, when you get the grasp of laser eye-contact, go to a strip-club and when the strippers try to seduce you into a lapdance getting in close face to face with you, lock that seductive laser eye-contact while turning down the dance. You’ll see a SUPER confused expression blink across their face because their brain is confused: you’re indicating with your subcomms that you want her bad, but then indicating with your verbals that you don’t want her, and they don’t know how to process that because they’re trying to get you to take the dance and you SEEM like you SHOULD want it since you’re CLEARLY showing sexual intent with her with your laser eye-contact, but the rest of your subcomms communicate disinterest in getting the dance. They’re not used to that because normally guys show NO sexual intent (just sexual INTEREST (aka them wanting the stripper to fuck them)…vs INTENT (aka you wanting to fuck the stripper)) with their eye-contact, but show massive sexual interest with all their other subcomms. It’s the funniest shit when you see that expression and then it gets super awkward because your eye-contact is telling them to keep trying but they’re getting shot down and can’t comprehend why when you’re projecting so much sexual intent, you should WANT the dance but don’t and their circuits fry as they try to figure out what to do with this situation.

    “I attended it recently and I have a review coming up soon (I’ve not posted it yet because I want to be a bit vague about when I attended it, otherwise too easy to identify which city)…”

    Good man. Take your time and change dates leave out location identifiers or descriptions of shit etc

    Tyler said the eye contact vids are the new Hot Seat program material but from a previous seminar, like a test-run of it or something. So what he did on your program may have been better or worse or different from those vids. Give ’em a watch and see what you think…personally I like seeing something like this in video more where I can rewatch it and focus on different things (his eyes, the student’s eyes, each of their body language, etc) but hearing someone project their voice and use intense eye-contact etc in person can be eye-opening if you haven’t been around that before.

    @Culum
    “It seems to me that those two approaches aren’t mutually exclusive..you can run the routines and also sarge a lot and it should speed up the process of being able to wing it. ANd you’ll have the routines to back you up if needed anyway.”

    Ya this is ideal in my opinion. Naturals all use their own routines too, you’ll hear a Natural tell you the same fucking DHV story 50000x as if he’s telling it to you for the first time each time lol

    “Interesting thought experiment. Actually once I get to the bar instadate I’d be pretty confident because I’ve done so many Day 2s from online dating..”

    🙂 That last sentence was the point of it. Note how much of your “I guess I could have done…” strategy is all shit you already know how to do and have done on auto-pilot a million times in a million other forms. So getting that girl was completely in your power, you HAVE the skillset, you just need to combine that shit in the moment. Like the Power Rangers all teleporting in from around Angel Grove to combine together and form Megazord. lol

  11. Yareally blowing it up as usual… despite this kind of awkward sentence:

    “Like the Power Rangers all teleporting in from around Angel Grove to combine together and form Megazord.”

    Huh???? LOL

  12. Culum…

    Funny story.

    “I couldn’t think of anything quickly enough”

    Here you go. No charge

    you: Hey…

    That’s it!. memorize it. Hey.. Hey… Hey… Hey… Hey… Hey.. Hey…

    If you think you can remember it, throw in a “what’s up” head nod. Practice that for an hour…

    If you REALLY are a bright spark… practice this, Hold hand up and motion closer, or if close enough extend hand for a shake…

    But don’t bight off to much tonight… LOL.

    HEY!

    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    Come to think of it..even last night at the diner where I ate while stewing over being ditched for two dates – there was a HB 7.5-8 late 20s blonde having dinner with her HB6 friend and the HB7.5-8 made clear eye contact with me 2-3 times..they weren’t even in the same side of the diner as me, and she was facing the wrong way to see me easily

    why aren’t you going over and opening these girls. You have no reason not to!

  13. Culum… one last thing… I find daygame especially ripe for just going into a story… It’s commanding. And heavy laser eye…

    You:Hey.
    Her: Hi.
    You: Nice to meet you (shake hand, laser eye)
    Her: Blah blah…
    You:(getting close or motion her to sit with you) So check this out… the other day [DHV story]

    That’s it. Just launch into it. Check this out…

  14. You guys FR’s and stuff are fascinating.

    I’m thinking as hard as I can, but I don’t have any ” ghosting ” stories. I’ve only really ghosted chicks.

    So in the meantime I’m devouring fr’s and what-not.

  15. My post here is actually kind of about the article.

    I’m no fan of social media. I dabble with facebook, grumbling about the habit the whole time. Check in 5 minutes a day. No twitter or IG or anything else. I’ve contemplated quitting FB a thousand times, of course.

    But it’s actually a very effective tool for ghosting. A few ‘likes’ and a few ten word notes a year and basically a sacred, old friend (who you have no urge to be around anymore due to reasons listed in the article), can be kept in a decently respectable place. You’re talking about less than two minutes a year to keep up appearances and truly ‘ghost.’ Ghosting could mean ‘drop out or change your life without people even knowing it.’ That’s true ghosting to me. If people know you are a drop-out, red-pill wacko etc then you’re not in ghost mode because you’re drawing attention to yourself which is not what you need or want. So FB can smooth that over with extremely minimal time expenditure. Put in your two hours a year with the old boys, family members etc and go live your life. The time I spent visiting with family and old friends has dropped off since facebook began and it’s very hard to think it’s an unrelated thing.

  16. About the fixated social hierarchies that people are comfortable with….Man, what a great point. Just when I think the manosphere is stuck on repeat a little too much (RT excepted) I get a great new point to think about and add to my life, also use in my life. Thank you for that. One half of my family has me in that exact role. I am still the laughably awkward, frequently transplanted 15 year old to them nearly 3 decades later. The fact that I’ve rebuilt myself only adds to their amusement, I’m sure.

    It’s extraordinary how stagnant most people are. If you are a reader or any kind of learner in life, you are going to leave 95% of humanity in the dust. So this ghosting concept is of utmost importance in terms of living the life of self-improvement or being a dynamic learner.

    So many people have their self-satisfaction cast in gold by age 18 that they simply don’t even know that people change. They will never acknowledge you’ve changed yourself since they basically don’t even know it happens>>>>Ghost ’em.

    We aren’t alive for a thousand years. One single afternoon with people who are just using you as a tool for their amusement or a foil for their own self-image play is a sinful waste of your own time.

  17. @Culum/YaReally My recent text game with girl I’m inviting out to a Latin night…lots of banter, but i’ll pick it up on the relevant points outside logistics

    Me: If you promise not to step on my feet, I’ll show you a few steps (ping text…keeping it light and fun….there’s also a qualification here…non-needy)

    Her: If I step on your feet it’s only because your feet were in the wrong place.

    Her: Hashtag women’s always right (double-barreled shit test)

    Me: such a rebel (passed)

    Her: International women’s day (shit test)

    Me: Man leads woman follows…just like in life (passed)

    Her: Women allows men to think he’s leading… (shit test)

    It’s cute

    Me: Behave, don’t make me sent you to the naughty corner (Passed)
    Starts at 9, drinks before (seize the thread and lead)

    the rest of this follows a bunch of logistics until we agree on a time and place

    Me: I’m going to x meet you there. (lead)

    Her: What’s wrong with Y? (shit test)

    Me: More people, diverse group….Y is….the kids pool…water wings…the shallow end (passed)

    Her; So you wanna throw me in the deep end???? You’d make a terrible parent (shit test)

    Me: and stand by the shore and laugh (passed)

    xxxxx

    The final outcome was we skilled meeting up for dancing and agree to drinks… It’s on.

    A girl who banters like this clearly gets the whole thing. Without proper game it would have been beta white knight “so what do you wanna do?” crap.

    Notice the framing. It’s her feeding me the lines and me acting like a “jerk”…..note the “you’d make a terrible parent” line I’m framed as a bad boy. I play along.

    Notice also how I frame her club choice as lame without saying it’s lame….note the imagery, the playfulness. This is the essence of text game. I knew it was on from the time I met her. It was just a case of finding a mutual time.

    She made the suggestion of drinks since we couldn’t agree on a venue—which was always the desired outcome for me….Interesting to see how my text game got her to not only adopt it, but propose it.

    I now game from the minute I get an IOI. It’s teasing, negs, then moving into some comfort…then proposing an outing and time, date and place. That I do in person with strong eye contact.

  18. Naturals all use their own routines too, you’ll hear a Natural tell you the same fucking DHV story 50000x as if he’s telling it to you for the first time each time lol

    I resemble that remark! YaReally, thanks for linking JM. It was awesome! I saw a lot of myself in there, the good, the bad, and the fugly.

  19. @Jeremy

    There were a number of reasons for it, but the short of it is my entire family was subtly dominated and abused by the women in it. It’s accurate to say the women had no conscious knowledge of their abusive behavior.

    Yeah. A bunch of this. I’m about to have to tell my mother to stop asking me to come visit. I’ve already heard her repeatedly “But I’ve changed! I’ve changed so much!” Yet she subconsciously always falls back in to old patterns of behavior around me wherein she starts the emotional abuse of trying to assert complete control over my behavior. What expressions I’m allowed to make, tone of voice I’m allowed to have, words I’m allowed to use… and these days my reaction is to just ignore her or walk away.

    I just don’t even want to deal with the shit anymore. It drags me in to old mindsets and keeps me in a past I’m trying to move on from, even if I nuke the shit test every time. She can’t stop doing it. She can’t change. She thinks she has and doesn’t even realize she hasn’t.

    I don’t even want to explain it to her, I’m just basically telling her she can visit me on my turf but I refuse to set foot on hers as a subtle way of subcommunicating “You have failed to change yourself, so I will change the circumstances. We will only meet in my frame under my rules.”

  20. @ Sentient

    Sun Wukong

    “ABG. Always Be Gaming.”

    YES!!!! There is no difference… just BE game.

    I think of it as “Always bring the party with you.” I went to a pizza meetup and was telling my “Bad fun” stories to the three people sitting with me and they were rapt.

    Another time I was at my wife’s dentist and told my Boy Scout “Bad fun” story to a Scout leader and he had one of his own about one of his scouts. We had a little party right there at the dentist. The receptionist listened in.

    I tell my stories whether there are hotties around to Game or not. It’s just fun. I enjoy telling my stories. I think it’s my autistic “stimming” acting up. Some autists like Owen Cook (RSD Tyler) rock side to side when stimming–you can see it in some of his vids. (Yeah, I rock too, sometimes, like in dance class while the instructor is talking.) Some autists like me talk about their obsessions or tell stories. Robin Williams may have been autistic. He seemed obsessed with standup comedy. Standup comedy may have been Williams doing his own stimming.

    Stimming = self-stimulation (produces good feels) = happy place

  21. Interesting realization. When I ego gratify on IOIs I destroy the chance of amping up the attraction by going direct to comfort. It’s like I’m just so goddamned happy that they are interested that I gush and “dhv” – ooops, not. I don’t get them qualifying – this is what I noticed.

    Also makes me realize that flirting with girls working at the cafe etc. has very limited upside. Since I’m not working off strong externals, I have to game to spike the attraction and simply can’t do that while they are working. And since I can’t get the temp up, I can’t even number close. Even in the cafe environment with girls who show up, Kino is out, and peeling off from friends is hard. The context is all wrong, what, she comes in to study with some friend and leaves with me, leaving her friend behind? No place to isolate, logistics ar all fucked up. Good place for pinging but it’s a bad setup.

    Getting clearer though, which is good. Cafe is a great place to soothe my ego – and kill the mystery and attraction I build there. Better to invite them to a gig I’m playing casually and work them there. Need to work the music angle harder. There is interest there I just can’t take it anywhere. But at a music venue there are all kinds of possibilities.

  22. @stuffinbox

    Thanks for sharing about your son. I know how much seeing him that way must hurt. Honestly, one of the biggest motivators for me is thinking that my example so far might trap my son in a beta life if I don’t take care of my shit.

    And to everyone else trying to save their sons, there are a lot of us reading TRM who appreciate your sharing advice and perspective.

  23. @Yareally

    Thank you for the notes and refined pointers, I will put into my arsenal.

    “We need more guys in their 30s picking up <30yo (and <25yo especially) girls to write FRs and compare notes lol”

    Well sir, I’m your huckleberry. Here are some notes that I hope are helpful to your research efforts.

    I am like you it seems, doing good for a guy in my 30s but act young cuz im carefree and party a lot.

    Plate 1 is early 20s 7.5 in college. She is cool with my normal "I have sex with other girls, you only have sex with me" arrangement. Makes sense to them when their hamster/hypergamy recognizes you as a high value man. According to her, went several years without sex because she couldn’t find a guy “worth it”. During this period she went out on 80+ dates but none cut the mustard (although im a sure a few blow jobs were given lol). Just tingle-free betas throwing up free food, free trips, free drugs, job offers, and 100 jillion texts a day saying “hey”

    Adores that I confiscate her phone and turn it off whenever I see her. She loves to buy me food and gifts and play homemaker. So exactly what you said, she wants to feel grown up and “have experiences” like travel, try new food, play homemaker etc. I position myself similarly to you like I am not a cheap skate but I aint paying for food every time, not gonna be bf/provider. I pretty much just have a ton of sex and good times but inexpensive and low time investment.

    I would guess she has around a dozen male orbiters not sure who cares lol. These guys are free whenever and trip over themselves to bring her food on demand, give her money for any half baked reason, offer her jobs, and text her/Instagram/etc all day and night. Seem to range in age from early 20s to early 40s; models, students, even doctors and lawyers. I feel bad for em but they hopefully will see the light someday. i dont ask about this stuff, just picked up across random convos when she tells me about her day etc.

    Like you mentioned in a previous post YES she hates her gym rat fuckboi friends her own age as dating prospects. She says she knows how insecure they really are and how disease ridden so she wont date them. Of course they talk shit about me to her lol say I probably have old balls; I just agree when she tells me. I am sure some of her gym guy friends are are cool guys but damn she makes it out like they are un-dateable. Its crazy how much you know Yareally you are the pussy buddah lol.

    She has slutty hot girlfriends her age. These girls have a dick for each day of the week plus endless fuckboi prospects lined up. Their dudes all send dic pics lol. They play games to get free rounds of drinks from chumps at bars. Evil shit. Many of these girls all have beat up looking stretched out pussy lips lol she says they look loose in the locker room. They all masturbate every day too like these girls are pretty much like horny frat bros lol straight amazon trophy hunters for alpha dick. Thanks feminism lol.

    She says all she wants is a guy to seduce her mind; mind most important. She likes the 50 shades books and calls me mr grey, loves rough sex. Daddy issues galore. Absolutely loves to be knocked off her high horse/taken down a peg lol I guess because no other guys in her life ever criticize her? Or because it puts out a judgmental Fatherly vibe?

    ++++
    Have a prospect female friend who is a early 20s single mom milf. She has a badboy (literally a criminal) fuckbuddy she wishes would be her bf but he wont commit. She is desperately in love with him. Buys him shit even though she is broke, the usual lol. …But she also texts me filthy nudes lol. Really likes thugs, has no attraction toward nice/successful/good guys. Obsessed with 50 shades of grey style books.

  24. @YaReally and Sentient: The Power Ranger comparison is brilliant, because the Power Ranger episodes are very consistent. So when Culum gets to that part of the “episode” where he destroyed the girl’s smaller shit tests and they get supersized, he can just assemble the Mega Zord and go save the day.

    Genius.

    Also, the Red (Pill) Ranger is the leader.

  25. @ Beta Throwaway

    I appreciate your comment,and no wucking fories about being a bad example. Even if you completely submit to the women,or hold total frame and lay down the rules as an alpha,you will be shit on or held up as a bad example. And unless you raise your son in a bubble he will be totaly steeped in feminism even before puberty. Over protection lowers ones chances of survival.
    The saving grace is that any male in todays society with even 1/2 of 1 nut dropped can sense that something is awry.
    The key is finding some common ground,sport,hobby,work something that girls just wont do. For us it is fishing,even before I taught him basic knots and fish habitat,as a lad he could noodle them from under the creek bank.
    The kid is a natural with blinders on,when in male space he dominates,when in female space he closes off.
    It is apparent that this tendency for young men to just shut down is a basic survival instinct in a feminine imperative world.And the cure is a surgical removal of the blinders,mainstream media,modern entertainment,educational curriculum and general consensus reality.While gradually replacing each fallacy with a bit of truth.
    The survival instinct is already there,and the only thing killing it is feminism’s propensity for emasculation,androgyny and relentless ball busting tactics.

    I can’t help looking at RT’s celebrity friend mentioned and thinking if he is part of this wholesale bs than it is some kind of karma that he just won’t get the RP and be doomed in the BP cycle.But if you could wake up a man w/ this power it would have a great ripple effect.

    Did Dan Akroyd sell out?

  26. FR of when I was in the different city.

    I check-in to the hotel before going out for dinner.
    The girl checks-me in and mentions my nationality (from my ID).
    She has a fairly strong accent which I’m 95% sure is Spanish.
    I tell her “you are certainly not from here”
    She goes “do I look like I’m from here” (she also looked a bit Southern Europe, probably referring to that). I tell her “that isn’t even it, is your accent” and before I could cold read her she says she is Spanish and that people don’t usually guess from the accent.
    Meaning I probably should have cold read her as such before she “scooped” me to it. Asked which part and so on, tell her I really like the food there.

    Later on when I got back, which was a few hours later, I saw her and said hi and she goes “Oh forgot to say check out is before 11:00”. I was a bit surprised she remembered the conversation to that level.

    Minor chat up of the bartender at dinner when she was pulling the handle on a draft beer, I asked her if she “Always uses the same arm” and she smiles and goes (kind of predictably) “No, no I alternate” and I go “Good for you, otherwise you would get just one beefy arm”.

    After dinner walked back to hotel, thinking about opening a mixed set to get opinions on night clubs after coming out of the hotel. It is night time and there aren’t that many people around so opening a single girl or a 2-girl set may be scary for them I guess, unless you are fairly good at game to disarm that instantly?

    I pass a mixed set that are standing around, where one of the girls is kinda dancing kinda hopping around (I think to get warmer), it looked pretty funny and girlish to me so I smile and make eye contact, she reciprocates holding the eye contact and smiles as well. I really liked this mini-interaction because she added value to my night and I also added value to her night (in both cases, small bits of value but nevertheless).
    I really should have just gone there and opened the guys and then talked to everyone, ask if they were going out to some club, etc. but I rationalized it as wanting to go to the hotel first to put my stuff down, go to the toilet, brush my teeth and such and then I would have more opportunities. Which I mostly didn’t, not as good because this set was stationary which I think is much easier to open than sets walking (the only ones I passed through later).

    Anyway after stopping at the hotel, I go out and walk around for a bit. I didn’t really interact much because the streets were fairly empty, low density of sets in general. Probably because it was early for night life and cold.

    I had looked up on the net where one of the big clubs was and headed out that way, thinking I would go through sets on the way but it didn’t really happen. When I got there I didn’t feel like going into the club (surprise), so I decided to head back. At that stage I finally passed through 2 to 3 sets of people that were almost surely going to that club. Eventually I see 4 girls taking selfies and continue going in their direction thinking of opening them. 2 of them headed towards a fast food place to get something and the other 2 stayed a bit behind hugging each other I think for another selfie, and then those 2 just fall to the ground before I’m particularly close. I keep my slow pace and go there.
    Now, instead of playfully making fun of them for not even being able to stand up (which I think is the right move here) I ask if they are ok. I think they probably got some sub-communicated condescension from me here. They are all very drunk already and it isn’t even midnight yet, which I find distasteful, even though they were fairly drunk they may have picked up on that. One of the others that didn’t fall says (I think dismissively, I’m not sure, but it wasn’t aggressive) “They’re ok”. So I keep moving and go on my way back to the hotel and go sleep.

    I have a specific request which is a bit related to the above issue. There are a couple of social circle events that are coming up and I want to practice my social skills. Is there any specific game strategy I can run on girls I want to socialize with that can get them to *not* get drunk? My own attempt would be just saying “Don’t drink, I want you to remember this tomorrow” but I’m not sure how effective that would be.

  27. Dumping family when you are an adult, particularly controlling moms and the beta fathers that come with them, is most liberating.

    Never understood people that stayed with their family of origin (FOO, as Stefan Molyneux calls it) when it did nothing but harm them emotionally, financially, etc

  28. @enrique

    “Blood is thicker than water” or some variation is drilled in to many a mind, particularly in religious households. On top of that, parents and family are the ones that teach you what love is. If they define it to be abuse you simply don’t know any better, and on top of that the world will all too happily reinforce that notion repeatedly.

    I can say this was most certainly the case with me. It took a very long time to get a clue and give them distance since my entire world view had been colored wrong from day one. It’s very hard to get away from.

  29. @IAS

    In regards to your field report: You are too focused like a laser on the outcome of your interactions. Notice how it was easy to interact with the desk clerk and the bartender because you actually just reached out and interacted.

    Try to hit baseball game singles. Don’t try to hit a home run each time. You need to work on getting talent at socializing which we spoke of earlier as a soft skill. Like when the Brazilian soccer players got 600 touches of the ball in a small arena, rather than 60 on a big field.

    Just interact. Interact with guys that seem lost in thought at a bar. Interact with unattached people. Don’t wait for the perfect set.

    You ask about a tactic for controlling girls so they don’t drink too much. You are being too self centered there. You don’t drink, so you are being judgmental about drunk girls. You are trying to take away from girls. Girls want to filled up (with alcohol, or with anything). Don’t take away from them. Give value, be fun, let them roam. Interact sooner, before they get drunk. So go earlier to the party. Open sooner and often. Go for the low hanging fruit in any social party and work your way up. Go for quantity in socializing, not quality. Don’t be a sniper, be a machine gunner. You need experiences in socializing. A lot of them. Then you need to analyze these experinces, get pissed off, learn, then do it again.

    I’ve been busy this week (and practicing my ghosting skills here, Lol).
    Did you read NewlyAloofs YaReally compilation at his blog for newbies to nightclubs. That gives the outline of how to start this get into the game thing.

    Also, don’t be afraid of expansion and don’t be afraid of contraction like YaReally was explaining back in a TL;DR post when he was addressing Sun Wukong back in Gamer girls.

    You have to surge forward and get experiences, fuck up, regroup, consolidate (plateau) and then surge up the mountain again. Don’t be afraid of surging in scary social situations, don’t be afraid to plateau, consolidate and then get up and get more experiences.

    This was good: http://therationalmale.com/2016/03/03/gamer-girls/comment-page-3/#comment-144155

    YaReally: @Sun Wukong
    “It’s stupid, I know, but I didn’t want to do it if I’m going to do a shit job of it.”

    Don’t worry this is common. Imposter syndrome and all that. A lot of buddies will drop contact with me once they LTR up or stop going out because they feel embarrassed that they’ve settled or aren’t gaming and have lost their skills etc and sort of don’t want me to know because they think I’ll look down on them the way they’re starting to look down on themselves for not being as awesome as they used to be. It’s pretty common, but red pill guys should be the least judgemental, we understand that there are periods of expansion and contraction.

    (Separate concept but it explains why guy buddies ghost. Lol, I’m watching you Scribbler and Forge……)

    But watch this video ~13 minutes long. Then watch it again. (I’ve had this mentality for the last 30 years and it is an essential life skill. It works.)

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k08ESEOyYBc

    TIP #48 (Daniel Coyle, Little Book of Talent)
    GIVE A NEW SKILL A MINIMUM OF EIGHT WEEKS

    When it comes to growing new skills, eight weeks seems to be an important threshold. It’s the length of many top-level training programs around the world, from the Navy SEALs’ physical-conditioning program to the Meadowmount School of Music program to the clinics of the Bolshoi Ballet to the mission training for the Mercury astronauts. A recent study at Massachusetts General Hospital showed that practicing meditation for twenty-seven minutes a day created lasting brain changes in (you guessed it) eight weeks.

    Of course, this doesn’t mean that you can be proficient in any skill in eight weeks. Rather, it underlines two more basic points: 1) Constructing and honing neural circuitry takes time, no matter who you are; and 2) Resilience and grit are vital tools, particularly in the early phases of learning. Don’t make judgments too early. Keep at it, even if you don’t feel immediate improvement. Give your talent (that is, your brain) the time it needs to grow.

    TIP #49

    WHEN YOU GET STUCK, MAKE A SHIFT

    We all know the feeling. You start out in a new skill, you progress swiftly for a while, and then all of a sudden … you stop. Those are called plateaus. I hit one recently, in fact, after our family bought a Ping-Pong table. For a few months, I improved each time I played. Then, suddenly, the progress stopped. This was a problem, because my teenage son, who hadn’t hit his plateau, started thumping me. The scores went from being fairly even to 21–10, 21–8. What happened?

    A plateau happens when your brain achieves a level of automaticity; in other words, when you can perform a skill on autopilot, without conscious thought. Our brains love autopilot, because in most situations it’s pretty handy. It lets us chew gum and walk and ride bikes without having to think about it, freeing our brains for more important tasks. When it comes to developing talent, however, autopilot is the enemy, because it creates plateaus.

    Research by Dr. K. Anders Ericsson, a professor of psychology at Florida State University and coeditor of The Cambridge Handbook of Expertise and Expert Performance, shows that the best way past a plateau is to jostle yourself beyond it; to change your practice method so you disrupt your autopilot and rebuild a faster, better circuit. One way to do this is to speed things up—to force yourself to do the task faster than you normally would. Or you can slow things down—going so slowly that you highlight previously undetected mistakes. Or you can do the task in reverse order, turn it inside out or upside down. It doesn’t matter which technique you use, as long as you find a way to knock yourself out of autopilot and into your sweet spot.
    In my case, it turned out that one half of our Ping-Pong table could be raised into a vertical position, creating a practice wall. I started hitting against the wall a few minutes a day. At first it felt awkward and wrong—the ball, rebounding from a few feet closer than I was accustomed to, shot back at me so quickly that I could barely get a paddle on it. But I got used to it, gradually adjusting to the faster pace. The games with my son got a lot more competitive; I even started winning a few.

    YaReally refers to this all the time:

    The Four Ftages of Competence

    Unconscious incompetence

    The individual does not understand or know how to do something and does not necessarily recognize the deficit. They may deny the usefulness of the skill. The individual must recognize their own incompetence, and the value of the new skill, before moving on to the next stage. The length of time an individual spends in this stage depends on the strength of the stimulus to learn.

    Conscious incompetence

    Though the individual does not understand or know how to do something, he or she does recognize the deficit, as well as the value of a new skill in addressing the deficit. The making of mistakes can be integral to the learning process at this stage.

    Conscious competence

    The individual understands or knows how to do something. However, demonstrating the skill or knowledge requires concentration. It may be broken down into steps, and there is heavy conscious involvement in executing the new skill.

    Unconscious competence

    The individual has had so much practice with a skill that it has become “second nature” and can be performed easily. As a result, the skill can be performed while executing another task. The individual may be able to teach it to others, depending upon how and when it was learned.

  30. Scribblerg

    “Also makes me realize that flirting with girls working at the cafe etc. has very limited upside. Since I’m not working off strong externals, I have to game to spike the attraction and simply can’t do that while they are working. And since I can’t get the temp up, I can’t even number close. “

    Not true at all… you can get a number in under 5 minutes. You just need to focus and run better game. Don’t get lost in your feelings, continue to focus on the next step, what’s around the corner, be aware of what’s going on right now, but FOCUS on the next step, where you are headed. Race car drivers are not focusing on the turn they are in, they are mentally 1/4 mile down the track preparing for that turn.

    An example back in the fall – 5 minutes…

    https://heartiste.wordpress.com/2015/10/01/high-sexual-market-value-chicks-dig-mass-murderers/#comment-712716

    Come back from a business lunch… Stop at a coffee shop. Cute very young skinny dark girl there with an accent. I aks her if they have coffee still… She says she will make me an americano.

    Ask her where she is from with the accent. She says Turkmenistan and asks if I’ve ever heard of it. I say of course it’s the next big thing. She laughs. She says well there was a US base there. I say I know I was there with the CIA during the cold war. She laughs.

    I ask her if the kitchen dudes milling about where her family. She says what they are all Mexican lol. I say good because if we were in Tstan and I was talking to you your brother would chase me with a sword and tell you to get back to the kitchen… Little laser eye. She is laughing.

    I say ok what do I owe you. She say nothing take it. I tell her, well write your number down there and we will get a drink later. She does the look around for coworkers then writes her number down and her name. Her hand is shaking a little.

    I take the number and shake her hand goodbye. She asks if I speak Russian. I tell her she will find out later and turn and stroll out with my coffee.

  31. I just had a revelation that I’m never not going to be obsessed with this stuff. Even when I am completely in touch with my id and, after I’ve loved women of every personality type and every nationality I will never stop. Fuck… life is beautiful.

    Sadly it may(probably will) end up destroying my marriage.

  32. Sribblerg… damn.. you bringing up the coffee shops… LOL

    Here check out Chris from Good Looking Loser. I’ve used a lot of his concepts in field. He has zero verbal game, all about subcomms and action and very fast… Culum this is an example of how direct cold approach works in your favor and why I was suggesting on your last online ASD girl to move faster vs more comfort. 6 minutes from meet to make out to pull… Watch! (and check out his other stuff, Chris seems to get no love from the community? IDK why?)

    And Scribblerg here is an example of some coffee shop game that CH made into a blog post. It was a good one because everything was done consciously with intent… spike attraction, cold reads, neg, kino, handling interupts, sexualizing, laser eye, roll off, compliance test, rapport… Special bonus 3 different set flame out FR’s in the comments… LOL!

    You got this.

    https://heartiste.wordpress.com/2015/11/05/coffee-shop-game-venti-vaguccino/

    ¡Sentient! has been posting some really good field reports lately.

    an interesting vignette from today… always fascinating how quickly attraction can develop…

    In the local coffee place this morning, I usually run into half a dozen people I know here in the neighborhood, so I keep game on a low simmer. Long line today, backed up to one of the entrances. I get on line. a few minutes later a real cute 7 comes in, short super fit body, pale blue eyes, strawberry blonde short hair, pale white skin. Was wearing a really nice short dress and a scarf and heals. Love when women make an effort, she was stylish.

    so she comes in, right behind me and looks at the line and her phone to check the time. I turn to her, square up and say “don’t worry it will be worth it” with full eye contact. She says “Oh yeah I know I have a client to meet though”. we are about 16 inches apart and I give her full laser eye treatment and slow down speech. I sensed she was in some psych profession, she just seemed really tightly wrapped but I don’t cold read her with this, I go with “You say you had a client, you look like a hairdresser” she is like no no I am a mental health counselor. So we banter a bit I say “well you look very stylish that’s why I thought maybe you worked in a salon”. She says she buys vintage clothes and we chat about that a bit, gives me a chance to graze her stomach and feel the fabric, “what’s this made out of”. Her eyes are getting bigger and I can see that start of the smile they do when they don’t realize it.

    “what do you do?” she asks. I tell her to guess. Now I’m squared up to her, arms crossed across my chest, in workout out gear and a hat. She says “cop”. I laugh and ask if I’m intimidating her (emotional anchoring) she’s like “why?” and I say because cops are getting a lot of bad press lately. I can see her licking her lips more and swallowing, keeping direct eye contact with me. we chat about her job as a counselor and she checks the time again. Then another guy comes in, young dude with a man bun. They know each other so she says hello to him. Now instead of just abandoning the convo or turning away i engage the guy directly. Turns out he is a barrista but works nights so I’ve never seen him. I keep him engaged in conversation about the place at night, crowd etc. and this keeps the girl quiet just watching. a good way to neutralize the guy, not even amoging, just keeping him focused on me. This also keeps the attention off of her, so she is pent up.

    The line moves we shuffle forward. She blurts out “The DSM just made a new entry today on caffeine”… so I engage her on this, now her attention is back to me. The guy, though right behind her, now vaporizes… he no longer exists. I ask her what it’s about and she says it’s an addiction entry. So I say why an entry for caffeine, addiction is a behavior seeking a response, it could be anything”. We are close again, lasering. She say “yeah like sex addiction” BINGO… there it is sexualized convo in the coffee line. LOL! Huge window.

    We are lasering each other now, and the vibe is forming, focus closing on just the two of us. I say really really slowly “tell me… how would you… treat something like that… …. I mean… for me… I think like full immersion therapy or something would be required… you know… to get it out of your system…” while nodding my head and lasering her and she is smiling and nodding and saying “hmmm hmmm yeah”. I continue ” i mean… it would need… like… really really aggressive treatment… right? (nodding)” and she is really grinning now and nodding back. She says ”well it doesn’t always have to be sooooo aggressive”. I say, smirking, “sure, I mean it can be gentle too… start aggressive and then get gentle… mix it up” And she is like “yeaaaahhhh (nodding and grinning) right… gentle…”.

    The line moves and we shuffle forward again. Now I am up to order. I turn away from her (roll off), order my coffee and do NOT turn back to her at all. Go way down the long empty counter 25 feet and take the last seat. Farthest from the door we came in. Did this as a compliance test, she was in a hurry so let’s see if she comes down there and waits by me for her order instead of right next to the counter. And she does… she comes down and sits by me and we continue some more banter, not much now, ask her if she could do anything for work what she would do, some comfort stuff. We get talking. She mentions crime increasing in the area as a result of “people” from the wrong side of the tracks coming over, and quickly says “I’m not a racist”. I get to go into “you are a realist” and we talk a bit about this. Interesting that SWPL psych girl feeling fear from the environment, second one I’ve come across recently… I think there is a change in the air… bodes well for TRUMP.

    She tells me her name and I shake her hand, hold it too long and she asks my name… her coffee is up she gets it and comes back. We chat a bit more.

    Now she is looking at her phone and the time has come to part, she has a client to see across town. she is waiting, waiting, waiting for me to ask her number… I smile at her “you better get going then. I’ll see you around” she says “take care” and heads out the door behind me then walks back the other direction outside to her car.

    Some times game just bubbles up even when you aren’t trying to do anything…

    This vagnette deserves a post-game analysis, as a teaching moment for the greenhorns.

  33. Thank you so much for this Rollo.

    An important part of the Red Pill is squeezing out negative people in your life. The first person I ghosted after taking the Red Pill was my mother. The Ho’ lied to me my entire life. She treated- and treats- my dad with complete, seething contempt and disrespected me routinely. One day I stood up to her- the first time a man has ever done that- and told her I did not want to hear her complain about my father any more. She threw a hissy fit. I walked out of my childhood home and will NEVER, EVER speak to her again. Ever. Not interested in associating with negative people.

    I am really having trouble in my life right now and this post helps me a whole awful lot. In just the last couple of months I have lost 2 very close friends and a brother.

    First, I tried to go into business with my 2 friends. I financed everything to the tune of several thousand dollars. I bought everything and helped set up the operation. The deal was I would get 1/3 plus my money invested off the top. No problem, right? AS SOON as we got the factory outfitted and the employees hired guess what happened? Yes, my “friends” decided that costs expended up front should not be reimbursed after all! What are you worried about Professor? There will be plenty of profit for all of us. I tried to explain if we make $30,000 then we each get $10,000.00 BUT since I spent $6,000 already that means THEY get $10,000.00 but I only get $4,000.00 even though I risked all the money up front. They moneyman gets 1/2 PLUS his investment in most cases. They didn’t care- the operation was set up already so why would they?

    I am ghosting my former friends with just enough contact to get my investment back and then I am out. A guy don’t have time for lying motherfuckers. Now I need a new set of friends and it is depressing.

    Second, I talked to my brother about the Red Pill last month. He is recently divorced and seemed receptive. The next night he ended up physically attacking me at the bar accusing me of spouting “hate women bullshit.” Yes, that is right, he bitch slapped me right in the bar and then grabbed my lapel and threatened me with violence. I laughed in his face because, obviously identifying female Shit Tests is “mytho-gyny” and being a strong masculine man means you “hate women.” OK bro, not interested. Next. Now I don’t even have a brother. I hope he chokes on the blue feeding tubes snaked up his nose and just before he dies I hope he awakens like Neo and thrashes around in a panic before the machines flush him out of the matrix like a putrid turd being flushed down the drain.

    I am ghosting him for the rest of my life. Although I told my sisters I would be cordial to him at our parent’s funerals, a guy doesn’t have time in his life for motherfuckers who don’t respect him.

    Gentlemen: If a Blue Pill Mangina wants to argue Blue Pill bullshit it is time to move on. If a White Knight “buddy” tries to shame you or wants to extol the majesty of the divine feminine it is time to find another buddy. If a “friend” breaks his word and fucks you over then cut your losses. If your own family tries to crab you back into the divorce-rape bucket it is time to go your own way.

    Rollo is right- again. Thanks so much for this.

  34. Culum,

    I’m confused. What exactly do you thinnk you are going to get from YaReally that you couldn’t get from watching YouTube videos of your fellow countrymen Tom Torerro and Nick Krauser? Not to mention the army of London Day Gamers that they have inspired. Your “interaction” with the “scorching hot” 8 (jesus what’s a 10 then?) was weak and basically pathetic. Now am I saying this to insult you? No. I’m saying this because you have hundreds of infields out there that show successful daygame interactions with hot women. Its not a mystery what they look like. You should know this, you’ve been reading this shit for close to a decade. Just imitate them for god’s sake.

    Here, here is my favorite cold approach video. Look how calm Torero is and how he wins her over and uses every tactic YaReally has written about, but does it as a distinguished English gentleman instead of the airhead American idiot:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tw_ejvradkU

    And Torero explains “Tiger Eyes” here:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4WSiE7KDdvE

    YaReally is going to link to RSD guys. Forget them. You’re British! Emulate someone who possesses the same emotional disposition as you. Forget American idiot game. Focus on emulating Torero who is your exact age or Krauser who at 41 just SDLed a 19 yo a few days ago. Now you also have guys like Daniel Blake, Ed Lopes, Matt Eastwood as other LDM proteges and they all have infields. But the best of the new guys are the guys at Street Attraction; Ed and Richard. Richard is an example of a cocky, personable Englishman. If you want someone who is more extraverted, copy him.

    Street Attraction guys in EE:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VDpd4KFBk6Q

    And with London Girls:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KFNYFQtSDd4

    I don’t know what you’re looking for posting here. Your answers are right in your home city. All you have to do is watch and study the guys who are good at this, copy them and practice. All the good Daygamers say the same damn thing. It takes THOUSANDS of approaches to get good at this. Krauser didn’t get laid his entire first year! If you haven’t done at least 1000 approaches following some proven daygame model then NOTHING YaReally will say can help you.

    Here’s inspiration for you. You are Nick Krauser’s age when he started daygame. And you know what he went through. He’s written like three memoirs already of his life (and he keeps writing more). Torero has written his memoirs and he just published a god damned text book on Daygame. Between that and Krauser’s book, all the information is out there. Posting field reports here is a waste of your time. Go approach 20-40 girls per week for the next 2 years. Then get back to us.

  35. and a post script – saw the girl that was the subject of this story the other day. She was getting into her car with her coffee, I was walking by. I waved hello, she said hello.. got into her car… I kept walking.

    This kind of thing happens all the time in these kind of social setting interactions… you CAN drive mad attraction and move quickly (see video) BUT if you you don’t and you see them again, the moment is gone. Worse than starting over, you start from behind because a) you chumped out and did not do the Alpha thing and escalate and b) ASD / buyers remorse / bad feelz winning over good feelz…

    So when you are in the moment DRIVE, because you may not get another chance.

  36. @Sun Wukong

    …I’ve already heard her repeatedly “But I’ve changed! I’ve changed so much!” Yet she subconsciously always falls back in to old patterns of behavior around me wherein she starts the emotional abuse of trying to assert complete control over my behavior.

    This brings to mind one of Rollo’s paragraphs from a while ago wherein he likens shit-testing to boob-gazing, as in most women can’t help it just as most men can’t help it. It’s part of the firmware and under certain circumstances it becomes such a well-trodden behavioral path that nothing short of severe trauma can shake it.

    What this subject also brings to mind is the mother-son relationship, and the question of whether it is EVER acceptable for a mother to attempt to fall into such patterns of behavior with her son. Doesn’t this fall into the same category of a father leering at his daughters boobs to the point that she is aware of it? Shouldn’t children be free of the firmware-driven SMP behavior from parents?

    I am of the opinion that a mother shit-testing her son or manipulating to get desired (by her) behavior out of her son is abuse, just as it is abuse for a father to regard his daughter as a sexual object.

    I just don’t even want to deal with the shit anymore. It drags me in to old mindsets and keeps me in a past I’m trying to move on from, even if I nuke the shit test every time. She can’t stop doing it. She can’t change. She thinks she has and doesn’t even realize she hasn’t.

    And this keeps the conversation going… Your ABG quote from earlier is apt here. I totally accept the precept explained so clearly here that you can’t escape the game, so you’d best be gaming. But if this is to apply to a mother-son or father-daughter relationship, then by extension daughters should be expected to look sexy for daddy, which is clearly wrong.

    I believe your expectations, and my own expectations that parents should be actively shielding their own children from their bio-firmware if it takes active work to do so, are correct. I don’t think this should even be a question. For women who so often are in self-denial about the effects of their own behavior on men, this is often extremely difficult for them to recognize. This gets compounded by the fact that emotional abuse is so pervasive (and affects women in motherhood just as abuse of boys affects those same men when they become fathers), and that society has absolutely no public recognition of emotional abuse by women to raise awareness.

    So with this said, yes we should always be gaming… But we should *never* need to game our parents, at least imho.

  37. gb_hill

    “All the good Daygamers say the same damn thing. It takes THOUSANDS of approaches to get good at this. Krauser didn’t get laid his entire first year! If you haven’t done at least 1000 approaches following some proven daygame model then NOTHING YaReally will say can help you.”

    Nahhh this is total bullshit. It may take someone 1,000 reps to get good, but shit I’ve gotten pretty good in less than a dozen (yes I’ve done more than that but was already getting good results ate that low rate). Hotel bar game was just shooting fish in a barrel, I had a close rate of like 70% or so… Just by IMPLEMENTING off of the FREE stuff from CH, Yareally, RSD, Mystery etc etc.

    No need to scare guys off… Not sure about the Krauser stuff, and Tom paying for infields was NOT cool, unless you shilling bro? (note: I don’t dislike Krauser, seen his stuff, he is a little self absorbed though and no doubt this will trigger a 4,000 word rant from Ya)…

    Go out and do, agree with that 100%. But Culum IS definitely going out and pushing his boundaries, and FR are useful diagnostic tools not just for the writer, it gives back to everyone who reads them, there are always things to learn if you are so inclined.

  38. “He’s past that age Morpheus says the mind should never be freed and I’ve got to be OK with that.”

    A cool aspect about my ongoing awakening..

    I’ve always been a healthy skeptic, if not a cynic at times. But I pride myself (and thank some former teachers/professors) on being a true critical thinker. Critical thinkers are taught how to think critically, it’s a learned skill. I’m an extremist, and propaganda-based brainwashing (consciousness-raising, PC, etc) makes me see red (I see a lot of red nowadays). Let’s face it, there are many matrices from which to unplug for the common person nowadays, not just the one encompassing inter-gender dynamics. It’s painful for me to know people who’s ego investments rule their lives, and they have zero ability to challenge their own beliefs or what they’ve been told.

    But anyway, the cool thing is the timing. It was tough getting back into the game after 20 years and at my age, but I suppose I’ve still got it, so to speak.. or at least enough of it to get a share of attention from women.

    So, what did I have to lose by embracing the wisdom on this site and others, and testing the theories? Outcome independence was my number 1 MO.. And once I had that, I was free to experiment. Hard as it is, I would reconsider and suppress saying what came to mind, and replace it with some game tenet. I overcame my over-honesty, and instead started being pragmatic wrt behavior in line with TRP.

    The predictability of results is what I find most amazing.

    The 48 year old friend should have at least read some of your work with an open mind and then field tested some of it. Why the fuck not? It’s a lot of fun, and it certainly gets you through the healing process efficiently. It would also help him conquer rejection-avoidance, because at least when he’s gaming, he can chalk up the rejection to the game, instead of internalizing it. Rejection is hardest and most painful right after being dumped cuz the old self esteem is already reeling.. If you treat it like a game, you can blame the game (or your poor execution of it), instead of yourself.

  39. @Jeremy

    So with this said, yes we should always be gaming… But we should *never* need to game our parents, at least imho

    Would I apply exactly what you’re saying to my own children if I had any? Absolutely. Would I force their mother to do the same? Absolutely. However, this is a case of ought versus is. She should not act as she does, but that doesn’t stop her from doing so. My only choice is how I handle it, and I choose to control the Frame and dominate the relationship.

    It’s a shitty choice to be forced in to, but that’s a big part of what makes a shitty parent: forcing your kids to make choices they shouldn’t have to. I can mourn it or deal with it using the best tool at my disposal.

  40. @Sentient – Great stuff, thanks so much! Busy day going here so I’m going to have to revisit tonight and dive into the vids.

    I guess I’ve hit the conscious incompetent stage, and given Ya’s observations about naturals and their particular challenges (when he describes natural shit it’s a 100% fit, it’s fucking eerie sometimes how spot on your guys are but now I’m starting to understand why, you guys have the subtleties nailed). In the cafe the other day instead of intuitively going for the feelz, I tried to think through what i was doing and also observe myself more clearly and saw exactly what Ya laid out. My natural shit was workable for me 15 years ago, but not today. Given that…

    Your input is priceless. I’m studying all of this much more carefully now and will implement it. One last thought. I’ve been saying my reference experiences fucking a lot of women helps but actually it ain’t so. Sure, I can see some of the patterns and ideas in things I’ve done intuitively in bits and pieces in the past but that makes me think, “I’ve got this”. No, I don’t. That’s okay, I can revise and play the new game. Just have to go through the awkward phase of trying shit that isn’t intuitive for me.

    What does motivate me is actually knowing how fantastic the submission of a young hottie is, and I’m not intimidated by the actual sex. I fixed the sex part with my soft-sugar babies, I recaptured my younger, drunken, wild dominance with them so I’m all set with that. Just need to work through the moment time after approaching to the close. Not easy of course, but a closeable gap.

  41. @Sentient

    The day of the FR is over. Its unnecessary. Callum doesn’t need to have his field reports analyzed. He needs to compare what he did with in-fields of guys who are getting laid. That’s it. If you have high enough IQ and no personality defects, all you need to do is follow a proven model, mass approach (but with quality sets), keep a journal, track progress and then seek consultation from either a pro one on one (live or Skype) or ask targeted questions to a proven gamer *in that sub-type* from a specialty forum (no one on this forum knows shit about street daygame, not even you). YaReally doesn’t know jack shit about daygame in general or large city street game in particular. He doesn’t do it. A guy like Torero has done over 10,000 approaches in 50 cities around the WORLD. Nick isn’t too far behind. The Street Attraction guys are in that ballpark too.

    There are infields out there that go from meet to mate. We’ve seen this now in different countries, different styles, etc. There is NO MYSTERY to this anymore. Conceptually, its easy. The layout is well known and proven. Hell daygame SDLs were mapped out by Tokyo PUA in the late 90s!! Conceptually nothing has changed, although our tools are far better and we are dealing with a more promiscuous culture.

    Cullum is trying to run daygame. He needs to use a daygame METHODOLOGY that was built from the ground up. There are many of those out there now. The best ones I’ve seen are 1) Justin Wayne’s system although as practiced by Deepak Wayne (and recently there’s a small wimpy Mexican kid in California using Justin’s system whose posting in-fields of sdls and meet to fuck in mall bathrooms lol, the bar is NOT set high to be good at game anymore), 2) The LDM model practiced by Krauser and Torero over the last 2 years (their “r-selected” model), 3) the Street Attraction guys, and 4) lastly I would say RSD Todd and the RSD method in general (Max, Julien, Madison, Alex, Valentino, they’re all running the same free-form unstructured system). RSD is good for general principles but I find their free-form method better suited to under 25 yo Americans. Its not ideal for older guys or Europeans. That’s my opinion. YaReally can post six novels defending them but I don’t give a shit.

    Cullum has an army of quality British PUAs who specialize at attracting “scorching hot” girls from coffee shops. I just posted one of them. Torero worked a masterful set on that Polish girl. And he didn’t need to do any RSD set merging to do it. If Cullum wants to fuck hot girls off of daygame then he needs to ask himself this question “how close do I resemble Tom Torero in that video?” From his “FR”, he’s a million miles off because he hasn’t practiced enough and he doesn’t really have a verbal model. That’s why he’s not getting laid. Nothing YaReally will tell him will help.

    As for you, at 48 you should have accumulated some life experience to make you a more interesting person which would help your learning curve. But daygame is still a performance art. You have to practice to get good. If you haven’t done at least 3000 quality sets, then I say that you suck now compared to what your skill level would be if you reached that mark.

  42. Here, SDL heaven from Deepak Wayne:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=icNmD8-40PI

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HWRTWB99X4A

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C72clWAt9aM

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0338D6QLjGY

    Now ask yourself, do your sets look like this? If no, then its no surprise that you are not getting laid. It took Deepak years to get good. Better looking normal guys will get results far faster though. But the model is there. Choose one and follow it.

    FRs are a waste of time. Just keep a journal, accumulate experiences, formulate questions and then consult someone who is good at it. And if you are not a good looking guy or naturally charismatic don’t expect results for a while. They should come (unless you have some genetic personality defect which is not that uncommon) but they will take time.

    Don’t wast time on FRs. I’ve seen this now for over 3 years on pretty much every major seduction forum. The FRs are all shit. Guys that good don’t post FRs anymore. This is not the era of Strauss and Mystery. This is the advanced internet era. Video rules. All you have to do is copy – internalize – innovate and personalize. That’s it.

  43. The most painful guy to ghost is yourself. When you are spinning plates it is just not easy to be totally honest with all these women. To get something off the chest…

    The other day I went to a club with a woman who had travelled quite a distance to meet up and fuk. In the club I spotted a girl I had been with not long ago and she was visibly surprised to see me with this new girl. She did not come anywhere near where we were but kept making quick glances in our direction. I think she felt like shit. I felt like shit a bit. That girl is a nice person. Not a unicorn but she is nice.

    I told my girl we needed to leave and we took the lift. I didn’t realize nice girl had apparently decided to leave also but had taken the stairs instead. We bumped into each other on the ground floor just as we were getting out of the lift. She was a few paces ahead. I was not going to spoil the night for the one who had travelled to meet up for this other one. Threesome was out of question.

    Two days later I met up with another woman in another city. I spent about two hours with her (screwing) and left. This one does not even know for sure that I spin plates. I was imagining how it would have been if it was her the other night?

    I think all these women imagine we are in a relationship even when I have made it clear to them I am not up for a relationship. I think nice girl feels that she is not good enough so that is why I “ditched” her. Some say they are happy to do FWB but I can tell from some of their reactions that they are hurting. We say; “fuk that”. But still…

    Killing the conscience is not very easy.

  44. Also, I should add that everyone here who is considering getting good at PUA should understand that the “Manosphere” is NOT the place to get good at game. Roosh, for example, is a shit PUA whose game system is weak. The Manosphere is a good place to get a fundamental bio-centered view of female psychology and female socio-sexual behavior patterns. Which, I should add, is crucial if you are a man living in today’s Leftist Western world.

    BUT, do NOT learn your PUA from Rollo, Roosh, or even Roissy. Use Roissy (CH) as a source of meta-knowledge on socio-sexuality but not for specific game tactics. Whatever his name (and he’s been outed), CH is almost 50 and he hasn’t been in the field for a long time which is why he’s now obsessed with racial politics. Gaming women is no longer his focal point. And his game personality was formed back in the late 90s. He hasn’t updated his understanding of game since 2005-ish. You can tell this as he is still in love with the neg which is one of the LEAST important of PUA tools (Disqualification which is the broader category that the neg belongs to is important however.)

    Get game knowledge from the guys who are actually doing it. These are good game sources:

    * All London Day Gamers (there are over a dozen of them now with Torero being the best, one of the best in the world. Nick Krauser is the second best and his books and products are well worth the money, especially if you are looking for good meta-theory. He gives it, better than CH imo.)
    * Steve Jaba
    * Street Attraction
    * RSD including their former instructors Alex and Valentino
    * Love Systems
    * Venusian Arts (for those desperate to run the Mystery Method)
    * Willy Beck
    * Honest Signalz
    * Deepak / Justin Wayne (if you’re under 30 years old you should work this system before any other because it is the MOST physical of any daygame system out there. Really, just specialize in this and if you hit mastery level you WILL get laid.)
    * James Marshal and his Natural Instinct gang (although I think the black guy he has working for him sucks – affirmative action hire it seems)
    * Squating Casanova – an Asian PUA that works out of Vegas. He has a pay for program that you see meet to mate infields every month (only $20 per month); both day and night game. This dude is a real good source of ACTUAL knowledge of how SDLs and SNLs work. The hell with FRs just break this guy’s sets down, he actually does it for you as well. Don’t reinvent the wheel.
    *Magic Leone – an Indian PUA who teaches similar sexual game to 60 Years of Challenge but he is better at it and offers more info. He’s an unknown jewel in the PUA community. As good as Liam McCrae when it comes to eye contact and space cutting. Better actually imo.
    * Good Looking Loser – not exactly PUA, but good solid advice on how to improve your smv and how to run screening DTF game which is actually a better use of time if you are young and good looking.

    This is where you learn “game” from. Not from the Manosphere. YaReally has stuff to offer but you can get it from guys who actually show infields. And you don’t have to read walls of text from someone who, while smart, has the personality of an annoying teenager. (And who uses the word “like” the way he does. For that alone he should be thrown out of a god damn helicopter Operation Condor style).

    My 2 cents. Or 3.

  45. @gb_hill

    Just wanted you to know some asshole is using your username to post stupid comments 😉

    If you dont want to read FRs skip them. Until the big man himself Rollo tells us to take it elsewhere or sets up a forum section for FRs, guys are gonna come here for help.

    Its about time Rational Male had more FRs in my opinion. Most of the convo here is generally very high level abstract concepts that are not easily digestible by noobs. For example, I used to skip comments by scribbleg, now he is waking up and less bitter and you can feel the excitement in his writing because he is taking action. That is awesome and he deserves praise for that, not denigration.

    On top of that, game is all about action, not solely intellectual navel-gazing. Rollo is amazing and deserves recognition for his amazing insights and thoughtful articles. People are still coming her for the articles and commenting on the articles. But Rollo is happily married with kids. So yes he is great if you are married and trying to fix your relationship. But lots of young men come here to get laid will get lost in the PUA vocabulary or higher concepts of plate spinning. They need to learn to approach.

    If Yareally and sentient and scray are willing to offer their time to help other men, they deserve a nod of respect, not your childish tantrum that FRs have no value.

    If you build it, they will come. Rollo built it 🙂

    Men of all stripes read this website, hard case noobs to MRA to MGTOW dudes to intermediate and expert-level PUAs. Its a big tent.

  46. Lol @ gb_hill

    In DayGame, you have to know your escalation logistics (where you can escalate without triggering ASD), sexualize, escalate aggressively, create and ramp up sexual tension (this is key!), act entitled, etc.

    Apt. complex swimming pools are a great place to look for a hookup, especially when they are nearly empty. Play rough pool games, sexualize, dunk, create sexual tension, tell her, “Meet you underwater.” Kiss underwater, etc. Escalate quickly and pull to a nearby apt. Be careful to hold the mood and maintain the sexual tension and intimacy. Get her to qualify that you are not just a piece of meat to her; keep her chatting. Get her to say that you are fun and understand her needs and desires and feel like a great guy. Expect shit tests when you are in the apt.

    Find a bored clerk alone in a mall store. Bring the party to her. Get her to acknowledge that she’s bored and to qualify that she’s fun. Suggest a game to relieve boredom and help pass the time. Play hide and seek and do a very little rough-housing in a corner, then run away. Switch to limited area slow speed tag (chasing is great for playing into mating expectations). Do a boob graze and accuse her of setting up the boob graze. Show your strength by picking her up. Switch to grab ass tag, but do it in such a way as to minimize ASD. Tagging has to be on the lower back. Sometimes you cup her butt instead of her back, but you quickly try to get away instead of holding her butt. Eventually you let her catch you and hold you as you hold her. Laser, cut the distance, quick romantic kiss and release, turn away, etc.

    Use conspiracy and the thrill of discovery. Find different places in the mall or store to do a 10 sec makeout. Bounce to a mall restaurant when she goes on break, then to the back room or to your vehicle where you have a bottle of chianti. Ok, it’s only red wine, not chianti. Doesn’t matter. It’s the fantasy and the mood. It’s chianti if I say it’s chianti.

    If you can’t close, tell her when you’ll text her, then text her and set up Day 2, preferably later that evening when she gets off.

    Lots of options. Good luck.

    My FR

    I never studied DayGame and about 35 years ago it took me 30 min to be making out/escalating in a non-fugly girl’s apartment from when I first cold approached one girl during the day. I’d had a fight with my fiancé and wanted to have the nonverbals that showed my fiance that I had options when I told her about making out with a girl in her apt. It needed to be authentic.

    No one else was in the pool and I sexualized by swimming between the girl’s thighs. (She squealed.) That also created sexual tension. We were playing rough pool games (marco polo and dunking). No real verbal game. The girl instigated moving to her apt. because we were making out in the apt. complex pool and escalating quickly.

  47. @cheupez

    ” I think all these women imagine we are in a relationship even when I have made it clear to them I am not up for a relationship. I think nice girl feels that she is not good enough so that is why I “ditched” her. Some say they are happy to do FWB but I can tell from some of their reactions that they are hurting. We say; “fuk that”. But still…

    Killing the conscience is not very easy.”

    Ahh, the fwb trap. It’s been my experience that women will accept the fwb scenario at first, and then get miffed when they see you with another female. That sounds about right.

    The fact that they are miffed, even when they are made aware of the circumstances, is not really a concern for you. I know it makes you feel badly because it appears your actions have hurt another, but you were honest. Some of us can’t be completely cold hearted.

    What you will have to do though is just accept that some chicks are going to butthurt. It’s part of the game when you’re sexing more than one broad at the same time.

    Steel your Resolve my friend.

    Sex drives a good number of women to become yoked to you and form a relationship in their heads. This is not a bad thing, and it’s actually pretty natural. But that is besides the point after the ground rules for engagement have been decided and explained.

    Work on not feeling badly.

    Banging more chicks usually lessens uncomfortable feelings.

  48. @ cheupez

    I’d try to bring the party to the other girl and tone down girls’ competition. Qualify each girl to the other as you introduce them. Build each girl’s value to the other. Group hugs, group pics, suggest meeting up later for drinks. Don’t even hint at a threesome. It’s just hanging out because the girls are both so cool and fun and high quality. Maybe a threesome will happen, but there has to be a lot of rapport between the girls.

    I can imagine lots of potential problems in executing threesomes. I imagine that it takes practice to figure out how to do them well.

  49. @GB, You didn’t read the book How to Win Friends & Influence People did you?

    You come right out of the gate and insulted respected commenters, AND THE HOST. Then you linked to what you say are videos showing better game, but they are of an Indian guy with adequate English skills doing the standard lines we’ve seen a thousands times by other guys you put down, and the girls sound like chipmunks. The overall quality of the videos is sub-par too.

    No matter how good your information may be, you squandered your opportunity to win over new people. You make yourself sound like at 20-year-old punk that lacks class. Mighty un-British of you, my good man!

    We are not new to British people thinking they are better than us Americans though.

  50. @Blaximus

    What you will have to do though is just accept that some chicks are going to butthurt. It’s part of the game when you’re sexing more than one broad at the same time.

    Actually, isn’t this situation where women see you out with other women, isn’t that a NECESSARY feedback that women should be getting? If they’re not getting that feedback, they are free to assume that all men they know are available to them without effort.

    When women en masse SEE men they “date” out with other women, and enjoying themselves, this is frankly a necessary feedback to those women that they need to try harder to keep your attention if they actually want you.

    In that light, I see absolutely no reason to feel bad about being seen with another woman, women need that feedback. You don’t exist on this planet to protect the sexual marketplace egos of women, so you shouldn’t try.

  51. @ Jeremy

    ” When women en masse SEE men they “date” out with other women, and enjoying themselves, this is frankly a necessary feedback to those women that they need to try harder to keep your attention if they actually want you.”

    Absolutely.

    I understand his bad feelings, but a change of perception is required to alleviate this.

    Single guys need to have multiple women in their lives, not sexually in every instance, but because women want men that other women want.

    If your actually banging them all, even that much better.

  52. gb_hill

    I’ve no need to try and change your mind. It’s clear you are at a minimum shilling for paid systems… IDC…

    But you don’t know much either. “Daygame” is a misnomer to begin with. It’s cold approach… daytime is merely a subset, with slightly different techniques…

    But to your call out squad in London… I hope they keep Yad stopping and mesma’ing to their hearts content… fumbling through THOUSANDS of lousy sets (by your own account – LOL), wasting a year to NOT get laid… because they refuse to learn solid basics of evo-bio/psych and Mystery Group theory. EVERYTHING gets back to this core. All of it.

    It is weird though, one constant criticism I’ve heard about this “London” daygame crowd is – why the fuck are they not IN London most of the time (Poland? Ukraine?) and why if they are in London are they never picking up a Local Kensington girl, always tourists?

    And way was Torero paying models for infields?

    http://krauserpua.com/2014/12/12/tom-torero-fakes-an-infield-kiss-close/

    But this takes the cake “All you have to do is copy – internalize – innovate and personalize. That’s it.”

    maybe that’s why they are having trouble and doing thousands of busted approaches… I mean I watched this:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=67XvafkoHhQ

    I got my rag on my head… grew out my beard… grabbed my fiddle but fuck man, just didn’t sound the same??? Maybe I’m not internalizing enough or something?

  53. FRs WILL help you, period.

    whether it’s in learning how to recall your interactions in greater detail which will heighten your perception of them in real time or in getting ideas for what to do when certain things happen.

    if you are a man who wants to get women who are more attractive than the women you are currently getting, you will have to get better at interacting with women (game).

    good-looking guys mostly end up with chicks who are not on their looks level.

    the inability to interact with women is widespread.

    and it all comes down to fear.

    there are a lot of factors outside of your control in the interaction, and those factors may cause it to go south. daygame/cold approach are full of these factors and aren’t that efficient wrt getting laid.

    like….you should cold approach and sarge, esp in the beginning, to get good. and you should never stop. like you should leave your friends for a few minutes at every venue and talk to a few hotties and try some new shit.

    but if you’re still relying only on cold approach and sarging to get laid 2, 3, 4 years into it….idk….that strikes me as strange. like in that time you can build your own pussy harem.

  54. @gb_hill @Culum

    “YaReally is going to link to RSD guys. Forget them. You’re British! Emulate someone who possesses the same emotional disposition as you. Forget American idiot game.”
    “I don’t know what you’re looking for posting here.”
    “Posting field reports here is a waste of your time.”

    Culum (and everyone) should definitely learn from any source they can. Check out material and instruction from everyone and see what resonates with you. But I would be pretty wary of anyone who tells you to actively avoid resources and people that may be able to help you. You’ll never see Tyler telling you not to look at the London daygame guys’ stuff.

    “no one on this forum knows shit about street daygame”
    “YaReally doesn’t know jack shit about daygame in general or large city street game in particular. He doesn’t do it.”

    lol I did for a while, but I prefer nightgame because I like the dolled up girls and the challenges and chaos infield because they make my skillset/frame tighter. Down the road I’ll probably get back into daygame as I get older and tire of the bar scene. But when you boil it down, the London daygame guys are just doing the same thing as RSD guys in nightclubs: they’re hitting extremely high-traffic areas with tons of hot girls around to mass approach and hone their game quickly. Which is great if you live in a city with that kind of daygame traffic, but it’s a lot easier to find a busy nightclub than a busy daygame spot in most non-major cities. If a guy has a high-traffic daygame area though, he should for sure take advantage of it.

    “YaReally can post six novels defending them but I don’t give a shit.”
    “And you don’t have to read walls of text from someone who, while smart, has the personality of an annoying teenager. (And who uses the word “like” the way he does. For that alone he should be thrown out of a god damn helicopter Operation Condor style).”

    Your weird hostility is so bizarre to me lol “LOOK AT YOUR FELLOW COUNTRY-MEN, WHY ARE YOU BEING A TRAITOR?!” like, wtf?? lol

    “And he didn’t need to do any RSD set merging to do it.”

    That’s sort of the main problem with the daygame crowd. They’re definitely worth checking out but their skillset is pretty limited. They’re teaching a very specific “approach a girl who’s alone in a nice quiet environment with no distractions or interruptions” situational game, but most of them don’t seem very equipped to handle tougher scenarios, obstacles, groups and mixed sets, heavy resistance/bitch-shields, cockblocks, AMOGs, etc Pretty much all of these guys would get steamrolled in a daygame set by a Tyler or Julien or Max etc because the RSD guys make more emotional impact in set.

    RSD has basically added more charisma and attraction-spiking to their interactions (aka emotional impact). Compare the reactions of girls in their daygame infield to the Krauser/Torero snoozefest infields, the interaction is usually a lot more fun in general:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yTE7LOq-_Vc

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J8M2_tgCszg

    Do the interactions HAVE to have big attraction-spikes and fun energy and makeouts etc to get laid? Nah, not if you stick to solo girls in the daytime. What the Krauser/Torero crowd is doing, picking off solo targets in areas where they won’t be interrupted, is a totally valid way of gaming (no sarcasm) and in a major city with high-traffic daygame areas a guy could get laid enough off that alone. Janka was out in NYC running short-set daygame because he lived in a city with an insane ratio of women travelling by foot/subway everywhere so why not take advantage of that.

    But personally I prefer to have a well-rounded skillset (and prefer guys learn to have one), but that’s because I like the art as a whole and I like to be able to approach anywhere and not pass up a girl because she’s with her friends or lose a girl because some other guy interrupted etc. Plus it’s like training with weights on…running a nice simple quiet interrupt-free and distraction-free daygame set on a single solo girl strolling around by herself in a nice quiet environment is pretty much a cakewalk when you can take over loud chaotic nightclubs lol

    “YaReally is going to link to RSD guys. Forget them.”
    “YaReally can post six novels defending them but I don’t give a shit.”

    “and 4) lastly I would say RSD Todd and the RSD method in general (Max, Julien, Madison, Alex”

    …lol. Make up your mind.

    “Posting field reports here is a waste of your time.”
    “The day of the FR is over. Its unnecessary.”
    “FRs are a waste of time.”
    “Don’t wast time on FRs.”

    “If you haven’t done at least 1000 approaches…”
    “If you haven’t done at least 3000 quality sets”
    “All the good Daygamers say the same damn thing. It takes THOUSANDS of approaches to get good at this.”
    “Krauser didn’t get laid his entire first year!

    …maybe Krauser and the 10,000 approaches guys should’ve done some FRs and watched some RSD vids to shave some time off their learning curve. 🙂

    You shouldn’t need to do thousands of approaches lol Do your FRs and break them down and learn what’s going on so you understand exactly what you’re doing out there, then go out there and apply it, rinse repeat.

    The London guys are all running game based on early PUA concepts even if they repackage and rename them so they can cash in off them to an audience that wasn’t around in the old days and doesn’t realize it. Everything Krauser is doing, Mystery was doing back in the day and already broke down and explained.

    The RSD guys have just added a bit more charisma and emotional impact to the interactions so they don’t look as dull as a Torero pickup but like, fundamentally they’re all doing pretty much the same thing: Open, Attract, Rapport/Comfort, Close (insta-date, number, fuck, etc) and focusing on leading the interaction forward, qualifying/disqualifying, push/pull, rewarding/punishing, etc etc

    You’re acting like these guys have all just created some kind of magical new wizardry out of thin air that no one has ever seen before lol It’s basically the bare bones of one on one concepts from Mystery Method combined with some standard direct game (“you’re adorable and I had to come say hi” comes from Tim from RSD) and a bunch of Juggler Method rapport building. I’m not a fan of older guys going direct and forcing the girl to judge them before they can demonstrate very much value (since they’ll have to make a snap judgement based on looks and the 2 seconds of interaction they’ve had) but I recommend MM and Juggler all the time, and MM in general covers way more situations and nuances than the daygame guys demonstrate when they approach a solo girl by herself in a friendly tourist area who barely gives them resistance.

    The RSD guys travel the world and run daygame all over. There’s lots of RSD infield in London and around Eastern Europe and shit. It’s all the same. Girls is girls.

    “I should add that everyone here who is considering getting good at PUA should understand that the “Manosphere” is NOT the place to get good at game”

    Now THAT I agree with. Go to the experts. Check out the London daygame guys, and see if they have stuff that helps. I link James Marshall and Liam McRae and Gambler all the time. Getting caught up in the politics is like the McDojo martial arts craze…collect information and guidance from everywhere, it’s silly to obsess over the politics of different companies. I link a ton of RSD stuff because they PUT OUT a ton of solid free content.

    And a Tyler/Julien/Max video is a thousand times more engaging to listen to and makes faster sharper points more concisely in a positive charismatic fashion than the droning slow videos the London guys tend to put out that put me to sleep like those slow droning MGTOW videos do.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5TEWXVp-lAc

    Jeffy is 40 and he still sounds full of life and both of them are making interesting concise points with solid examples and look like they actually ENJOY life and sarging.

    VS

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Um9_XT860vk

    This podcast makes me want to kill myself lol They sound so miserable and tired of life I can’t even listen to this thing it’s too depressing. I would never link this to newbies to get them excited about the game.

    @newlyaloof
    “@GB, You didn’t read the book How to Win Friends & Influence People did you?”

    lol’ed at this.

  55. @ Rollo,

    I’m all like ” meh ” on the vids, but I assume they are serving a purpose.

    I’m a Ya fan because he challenged me a while ago to open my mind, and I did learn a few things. That’s always very cool.

    But man, I was thinking…..(smelled smoke too )

    What if you would have had a camera following you around during some of the more exciting times in life?

    I ponder this often when I watch some of the vids posted here.

    It’s a different time now. Much different. It’s actually kind of sad to me.

    I know, I sound like the old ” back in my day..” guy, and I can feel Ya laughing right now, but Rollo, can you imagine?

    I’m not a big fan of the digital-video/ Hey Look At Me thing, but I indeed do wish I’d have had a cam on me for a few hundred encounters.

    @ Ya-

    You’re gentleman and a Good Guy. I appreciate you immensely, and I dig what you do here for the fellas ( although, damn, I’m starting to hate Tyler’s face… that’s your fault… he he ).

    And now, a video near and dear to my heart.

    [youtube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9XY34ew3gAE?feature=player_detailpage&w=640&h=360%5D

    Here’s Tom Nelson practicing his Street Game…

    [youtube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bqoz9hyz_SM?feature=player_detailpage&w=640&h=360%5D

    Tyler is nowhere to be seen.. lol.

  56. in a world with finite resources, where a man’s time is also finite….

    an aging, fattening, self-proclaimed pua with no assets, no car and no fame stumbles upon a method to seduce women that is so far ahead of the curve that it will be studied for is prescient genius one hundred years in the future.

    this man would:

    A. live in a shitty apartment, eat fast food, spend thousands of his precious hours on earth posting on low traffic websites on the internet for free, fuck bitchy girls that also fuck other guys, call said girls to get rides and money for shitty pizza and cheap wine, spend thousands of his precious hours on earth watching videos of guys in clubs hitting on low value sluts, fly from city to city trying to extract a few hundred bucks from some down-on-their-luck guys hoping to get laid

    or

    B. fly to europe. seduce a beautiful princess. marry into the highest level of society. have her recruit his royal virgin harem. never work a day in his life. polish his gold bars. ride around in bentleys. dine nightly on haute cuisine and romanee conti, float around on his yacht, fly around in his plane, fuck the most desired women in the world instead of whatever skank he crosses paths with sarging, use his social prowess and connections to do anything he can dream

    hmmmm. tough call.

    when someone discovers a valuable new process one of two things happens;

    1. they keep the information to themselves and profit wildy from it before anyone else catches on or catches up (example: high frequency trading with lasers while everyone else is using fiber optic cable. proof: you get filthy rich. example: the manhattan project. proof: you become the biggest bully on the block and your standard of living rises higher than ever before seen on planet earth)

    2. they share the information for whatever reason. (example: bodybuilding protocols. proof: thousands and thousands of people post before and after photos where they went from fat and flabby to big and cut. example: well-regarded mba program. proof: graduates go on to run successful companies based on what they learned and the connections they made)

    pua infield stuff/method/frs do neither;

    no one is getting rich (proof that your information/process/discovery is in demand and or exploits a previously untapped or underutilized market niche)

    there are no before and afters (I have yet to see pictures that show a guy went from fucking girl A to fucking hotter/better girl B using any pua materials, let alone thousands of them posted freely for all to see. and they would definitely be out there because people post pictures of their morning shits, so they’d definitely post pics of their upgraded slampiece.

    nope, all we have to go on is the unverifiable testimony from a few guys, most of whom post using handles, and seemingly endless edited video that hasn’t once shown a woman at the club saying the date and time and then the same women the next morning looking like she got put away wet saying the date and the time. that would be quasi proof that the pua in question at least got her home for an overnight but for some reason that footage never surfaces…

    except from high-profile alpha male rappers, athletes, actors etc who despite their best efforts end up naked and fornicating on screen in lots of embarrassing positions for the whole world to see. i wonder why they have so much raw sex footage they’re desperate to keep hidden while the puas have nothing despite claiming to be pros. hmmmm.

    the girls that pua stuff works on are by default low value because;

    A. high value girls secure commitment from alpha males and cannot be poached

    B. high value girls, having secured commitment from alpha males, self guard.

    the girls out at night looking for cock are by default the ones that no one wanted.

    is competition for a resource no one else wants really competition? is securing that resource, for however briefly, really a victory?

    if any of these program-peddling bootcamp heroes wanted to prove that his method was worthy of the “so good science will verify my genius in one hundred years” tag he would simply:

    announce a famous, high-value, single, but in-demand target. he would fly to her city, seduce her and fuck her. that would be enough. but to show the true value of his new discovery and the massive depth of his social savvy, he would be announced to the world as her new beau, live off her fame and riches and also fuck her friends in threesomes.

    yeah. i’m sure that’s going to happen any day now.

    and also it would be nice if these puas read a little more because red pill goes back to the cavemen (no, your sub comm revelations aren’t anything new despite the names you give them) and the parties of ancient greece make even the wildest nightclubs look like a 4th grade birthday party

    red pill knowledge: good for all men

    pua knowledge: good for all men

    puas claiming/insinuating they reinvented the wheel, are more desired/alpha than nfl quarterbacks/famous actors/business moguls and can fuck any woman they want: lol

    you can’t fake your way into that club. if you could, these guys would be there. but they’re not. instead they’re paying covers to buy overpriced well drinks at the same places any joe schmo can go. yeah, that’s some heavy social capital there. next thing you know he’ll be landing his private plane on some island off the east coast to decide who’s going to be the next president.

    that bootcamp pua who went on cnbs and fucking choked like an old lawnmower is not the hundred-year-ahead-of-his-time-genius field scientist that he thinks he is otherwise underwear models and young actresses would have been chasing him down after his big national moment and we would never hear the end of it. oh, what’s that? right. not a peep.

    or maybe they did and he just kept it a secret. lol

  57. Fleezer

    A. You have a crush on Ya…! Cute.

    B. “The girls out at night looking for cock”… This is why I say a solid evo/bio/psych background is important as a base to build game upon. Because all of game can be fit BACK into this framework… So you know the whole hypergamy and solipsism thing right. grrrrrrr. Fucking bitchez! Right?

    Well that tells ya ALL women are always seeking new cock. They just don’t know it.

    Game is the great translator.

    Now fuck along… Go try and then comment.

  58. I must be really growing cuz all I’m doing is looking for what I can learn from @gb…And I can see how unproductive the negativity and anger and dissing are. Who the fuck am I?

    @Quixo – Thx for noting the shift. Dude, I was just so angry and cynical and hopeless but fighting my up through it regardless. Not an excuse, just an explanation. I felt embattled in my life. The truth is that I came within a cunt hair of killing myself 100 times after the shit went down with my daughter. I was so lost. It was like there was nothing left for me but at least here I felt some kind of identification, it was the only place I didn’t feel like I was crazy.

    Coming at this all at age 50 is no joke. A lifetime of social conditioning was so baked in. I went MGTOW, then raged my way out of it. I played MRA for like 15 mins and then threw up. I came here and thought Rollo was leading the “He Man Woman Haters Club” with dime-store, pop psychology bullshit. I began to buy in but would never be a PUA – I banged plenty of women years ago, but actually was soft sugardaddying and not getting desire sex most of the time these days, and then realized that I was kidding myself about the entire thing. Still angry, I started to game.

    Only then could I begin to see who I was really being. How fucked up my internals were. How my subcomms were shit and how at war i was with myself most of all. I saw how my ego and buffers were protecting a false self and my own alienation that I had created to deal with this life based on the FI and my fucked upbringing. Confronting this finally, honestly, was the hard part. Moving past it really is not that hard once I realized it was all self-imposed and unnecessary. But also, without the community here and the higher level concepts and evo psych and societal view, I couldn’t really put it all in context. Once I had the big picture handled, it only made sense to focus on the micro, my personal world.

    Now? I’m just a grain of sand on the beach. I’m not changing the world, running for POTUS or anything else. Just another bozo on the bus, trying to get mine and enjoy life and be a decent person before I check out. Build my business up, get fitter, stay healthy, fuck hotties, keep calm and that’s it. Life is life, I get to be happy no matter what. Daughter or not. That is truly a miracle.

  59. @Sun Wukong

    What are they saying?” the manosphere would be great if it wasn’t for all the men”?or ? you could be more like me if you just try harder”.

    Old Stuff says ” I’m fuckin this cat you just hold its tail for me.”

  60. @ Stuff-

    ” ” I’m fuckin this cat you just hold its tail for me.”

    Aw shit. My uncles used to say this all the time. You’re the only other person I’ve ever heard use that phrase. LOL.

    I said it a few times at work and just got blank stares.

  61. @Blaximus

    That is an old saying best used on the most expert of advisors and efficiency experts.We were drilling rock and this expert was watching so I offered up some of those foam ear plugs,the guy said thanks and tried to eat them.

  62. I believe that a loser is someone that stops trying and a winner never will stop trying.I read those vox comments and it is appears that most didn’t read the whole post.Still some pretty good comments on cutting ties that bind.

  63. @gb_hill

    British?? Oh, because I use British spelling? That’s a legacy of early education in a British international school. I need to be good with coastal American girls, not British ones (not that they are different – I don’t see how, even if I was British, that YaReally’s advice wouldn’t be applicable to British girls).

    Thank you for your comments – I appreciate them. I don’t agree with all of it but I appreciate it and I’ll check out the videos you posted and learn what I can from it.

    I think all of us here agree that it’s all about taking action and maximising reference experiences. That’s what I’m doing – the biggest roadblock for me is my work schedule which has me somewhere I can’t game for large chunks of the year and then I fit a lot of going out into the chunks when I can (like this week). But I do what I can.

    I also agree with you about journaling being useful – that’s what my FRs ARE. The only additional details I put into my private notes are the names of the girls and venues. This way I get all the benefits of journaling (recording experiences, referring back, reflecting etc) AND I get a world-class expert like YaReally (plus all the other guys here who are great) to give me me advice and break down my FRs on a personalised level. And it keeps me accountable – writing this up for other people and not just myself.

    Maybe that style of learning doesn’t suit others, but it suits me and it helps me (it’s basically the same process you describe in terms of having one-on-one with a coach). I can’t even count the number of times very specific help on here has helped me from YaReally and others based on FRs. To pick just the first one that occurs, YaReally and HABD gave me very specific actionable advice that helped me extricate myself last year from a nasty situation that was potentially heading towards an FRA accusation before I pulled it back.

    And while watching videos is very helpful, my main point is that you have to choose who can help you best. Who you trust the most. Whose teaching resonates the most with you. Not enough time in the world to consume all the content out there. And without a doubt, for me that’s YaReally (and the community of guys here). I was only exposed to RSD after watching YaReally’s links and I really like them too.

    Would it suit someone else? I dunno, but it suits me – the combination of Rollo/hypergamy/manosphere for the big picture and YaReally (and the others here) for the more specific stuff works really well for me.

    I don’t know anything about Tom Torero (but I’ll check out that video you linked – I am happy to learn from anyone). I haven’t seen any of Krauser’s products but I am very familiar with him because I read several years of his blog religiously a couple years ago. I’m not questioning his results and some of his content is good stuff (I’ve grown past it now and have my personalised pattern, but a lot of my early online game Day 2 successes were based off his date model), but I just don’t like his attitude. I find it hard to learn from someone with such negativity and bad energy. I love women, I love feminine energy, I don’t hate or resent them. This whole process is supposed to be fun and it IS fun..not some painful hard slog to be endured to stick my dick in some chick..which is the subcomm I get from Krauser (and this doesn’t mean it isn’t hard work or draining – but the process is ultimately rewarding in itself, not just banging chicks).

    I don’t know a lot of the other names you mentioned. I think I’ve seen one or two videos by Daniel Blake – he was quite good. And Deepak Wayne..is that the Indian guy with a thick accent who games in Europe somewhere (not England)? Think I’ve seen some of his too..he was okay and he actually has a camera in his bedroom showing proof of his bangs, but nothing great (I see you’ve posted some videos of his – I’ll check it out).

    I’m not sure where you got the idea I’m some kind of serious day gamer though – I am about 99% night game and online game (and now shifting almost exclusively to night game). I only day game (like with coffee shop girl) if I’m out on my normal day and run into chicks. And yes, my interaction with the coffee shop HB8 could have gone a lot better – because my cold approach generally is not great. But that’s the whole point of this process – you’d have seen the comments from YaReally and Sentient which have already ensured I’ll do better next time…

  64. @ stuff

    ” I believe that a loser is someone that stops trying and a winner never will stop trying.I read those vox comments and it is appears that most didn’t read the whole post.Still some pretty good comments on cutting ties that bind.”

    Agreed. The only way you can lose is to give up and admit defeat.

    At a point in life, I’d lost a lot of what I had, and came a cunt’s hair close to bankruptcy, but I never stopped fighting. I was able to recover everything that was initially lost, and then some. Lesson well learned.

    Winning is a different animal imo. One commenter at vox said something about winners that are morally repugnant ( paraphrase ) and I absolutely 100% cosign that sentiment. Winning is a decidedly personal qualification in my eyes. I have an old friend who worked for Goldman Sachs once upon a time. His salary was 950.000 usd per annum. For about 3 years, his bonus was closer to 1,000,000 bucks. He was a very mean spirited asshole that literally hated ” people “.

    He often bragged about how contracts were written for various products, specifically with fleecing the client and that if a contract lawyer rejected terms, they would keep re-wording the contract with just as many trapdoors in it until someone slipped up and approved the contract.

    That’s why years later when the whole Housing/Mortgage/Pension Funds crisis struck I was totally not surprised. I was only taken by the scale of the brash robbery. And when these thieves demanded bailouts with tax payer money, while refusing to take a haircut on some of the outlandish contractual obligations, I said ” but of course “.

    My ex-friend always said ” working people…tax paying people…law abiding people… are pure suckers “.

    Winner? Fuck no. Not by my standards. Multi-Millionaire before age 30? Yes he was. Should be spending a few decades behind bars? Without a doubt.

    Society often makes winners out of those undeserving of the title. That messes up the meaning of the word and places the bar in a realm it does not belong.

    My estimation designates a person that strives to learn and develop the ability to think and work his way out of practically any difficulty as a winner. The caveat would be ” Do No Harm “.

    So I was trying to think of an occasion where I ghosted a guy and I was coming up blank. Thanks stuff, you jarred my memory for me. I ghosted this low-life motherfucker.

    A man is capable of many great things by virtue of maleness. The converse is just as true ( I will not pull Hitler out of my ass for use as an example this time. That shit’s worn out ). Evil has it’s fans among the mean, ignorant, soulless around us. ” Power ” comes ill defined and awaits form and substance always.

    Winners at least try to achieve goals without doing harm, regardless of what’s popular at the moment.

    …. but, it’s subjective I guess. Lol.

  65. I said ” A man is capable of many great things by virtue of maleness. The converse is just as true ..”

    Should be “A man is capable of many great things by virtue of maleness. The inverse is just as true ”

    …damn. Mult-tasking skills declining

  66. gb_hill

    “Wish in one hand, shit in the other. See which one gets filled first.”

    (Translation:When a person wants the impossible.)

    I find it painful enough to watch any video, let alone that Tom Torerro video in which he obtained the privilege of texting a HB5 Polish chick with a belabored British day game routine. That video sucked. No offense to TT, but wtf?

  67. Heh Blaximus

    How bout the saying “This, too, shall pass.”

    Should hopefully chasten the guy you ghosted.

    Should console a guy in the depths of an affliction.

  68. @Sentient: “running the MAP” uh oh another AK purple piller… How long you been running?
    Doesn’t sound like you ever issued any ultimatum, that WAS a core part of the Male Action Plan… it’s gone now right in the Mindful Attraction Plan.”

    –On Married Red Pill we have TWO ultimatums- the soft ultimatum (Dread Level 9) and the hard ultimatum- fuck me or fuck you (Dread Level 10- aka purple Athol’s MAP Level 5.

  69. @ SJF

    Hey man.

    You know, everything shall pass.

    Incidentally the guy I ghosted suffered an affliction.

    Cocaine and alcohol, breakfast of hard driven Wall Street champions.

    Not to mention the 5,000 dollar hook…um…” escorts “.

    About vids.

    I admit I will watch hours and hours of guys building outrageous engines and cars. I can’t believe my good fortune at finding so much information on the interwebz. My guilty pleasure.

    But watching guys try to pick up broads is painful. Always. I will watch if Ya posts them as an example of something he’s discussing, but if not for Ya, I’d never watch them at all.

    Fleezer said some mean spirited stuff above, but a lot of it is laugh-inducing truth in many ways.

    But I will admit this much, reading Ya and all the fr’s has me practically convinced to hit up on some chicks in a club or two, just to see if I still can. I know what I think , but now I’m curious. Silverhair mode. Ha ha he heee.

    Maybe I’ll even dust off the old David Lee Roth line from Ladies Night In Buffalo…

    ” I got a sense of déjà vu
    I could swear I’ve seen you before..
    You don’t think you’ve ever seen me before?
    Must be two other people…”

    If a chick laughs at that line, Winner, Winner, Chicken Dinner.

  70. YaReally – I finally saw the dancing guy clip from the last post and your breakdown. I need to rush off for my online date now but I’m really glad I concentrated and watched it.

    That was just awesome. One of my favourite posts for sure. So much there in so little time, so much to learn and notice. And here I am thinking I’m learning to read subcomms by noticing some chick licking her lips or pupils dilating. There’s an entire world out there and it’s fascinating.

    One thing I have noticed though is that I need practice. Like I have enough practice at Day 2s now that I can actually run through the conversation in most dates on autopilot which frees up my mind much more to notice subcomms and IOIs and think about other stuff.

    Same way, right now my focus area is simple cold approach (and will be for the rest of 2016 I imagine), because I suck at it as you’d see from recent FRs. But I FIRST need to get to a point where I can do a basic cold approach and number close with reasonable confidence, enough to go on autopilot before I can set the rest of my brain free to notice all this stuff in the background.

    BTW, one thing I noticed right off in the clip (even before I read your breakdown, but you haven’t mentioned this) is that for some reason ALL the early followers are men. The chicks only start to join in when a critical mass of men is reached (except for early in the video one girl talks to the leader briefly) and then of course the rest of the guys start chasing the girls and joins.

    Is that even relevant? Why wouldn’t dancer no. 3 or 4 be a girl? Or is it just a coincidence?

  71. “Fleezer said some mean spirited stuff above, but a lot of it is laugh-inducing truth in many ways.”

    Lol. I see it the same way.

    “But now it’s just another show
    You leave ’em laughing when you go
    And if you care, don’t let them know
    Don’t give yourself away

    But now old friends are acting strange
    They shake their heads, they say I’ve changed
    Well something’s lost, but something’s gained
    In living every day”
    Joni Mitchell (Lol, look how she turned out)

    Life can be strange. But I never saw it as such.

    Seems we’re kindred spirits Blaximus.

    I seemed to have ghosted much of my family who are nice people as I moved on. I ghosted my nice brother when over the last 20 years, when I heard one too many times from him ” I just don’t understand how…..”, when that voice in my head kept telling me “I understand just about damn near everything, I just don’t don’t always accept other peoples misunderstanding of how things work”. Hence my enthusiasm here on this blog.

    Ghosted my sister in law from another brother when she disrespected my wife for being smug and condescending to her and me. She was one of those types that got a Ph.D in psychology to figure out her own shit. That project failed…..

    Ghosted my wife’s brother in law and my sister in law. We used to go shooting handguns in competition and then go to the bar after back in the day when you could smoke cigars in a regular bar and drink beers. He was sposed to be decent fellow. One time I caught him attempting to flirt with my wife in my presence at the same after-shooting-handguns bar. (I dismissed it as a mirage, he couldn’t be that stupid, as he respected me as wise and observant in the ways of the world.)

    He got busted once smelling my wife’s underwear (by her and my SIL) after offering to carry her luggage to to car on vacation.(Can’t blame him, my wife was a HB8 and he had a fetish for her) Yeah, he and the sister in law have been ghosted for a decade. And the nice nieces and nephew and my kids are paying the price of not engaging with their cousins.

    I never thought twice about ghosting anyone. And this past six months I came to realize that I have no unhappy and unlucky people that I call my own. That all came via my instincts. No one had to tell me that.

    I’m humored by the dialog here, and can get both sides of the dialog now (Joni-Mitchell-wise). I must be growing. I like the dialog and the growing.

    I’d rather have a woman interloper like Emily say stupid shit and see that dialog than watch the men fight among them themselves here, though. But I get what people are doing here. I don’t like it, but I get it.

    And I surely know which hand I can fill first. When a person wants the impossible.

  72. Interesting video on how women admire strength and how women will jump to your defense if they respect you.

  73. @ SJF

    Kindred indeed.

    It’s funny, I never used the term ” ghost ” in the exact fashion as we are in the OP. In my younger days, right around the time the movie Ghost came out, a bunch of us started saying ” I’m Ghost ” before leaving. That slowly morphed into ” I’m Swayze “.

    Your bro-in-law story reminds me of yet another person I ghosted. For the same kind of vibe that also went beyond the pail.

    But what I’m learning here, is that evidently when I ghost someone, they get pushed so far down into my memory that they almost cease to exist at all. If you put a gun to my head, I couldn’t recall. But in discussion, someone will trigger a long discarded memory for me.

    Maybe the comment section should have an hourly psychiatry rate?

    ” I never thought twice about ghosting anyone. And this past six months I came to realize that I have no unhappy and unlucky people that I call my own. That all came via my instincts. No one had to tell me that.”

    Interesting. I don’t give this a lot of thought. Maybe I’m broken and don’t realize? I feel so strongly about other people’s situations not affecting me that maybe it’s rendered me blind to an extent. I don’t think I know if the people around me are happy or unhappy. I mean, I know my family is good, but in general I seem to have a huge blindspot.

    Damnit SJF!!!!

    Now I have to pull out that damned Introspection suitcase from under my bed when I get home.

  74. Hello, This red pill shit, has me fu#$ed up. When i go out now i see the world,male-female interactions in a new way and although i can get women, i have alot of difficulty getting attractive ones, Tonight i went out solo ( as i do sometimes, i live in europe ) I opened an 8 set of brazillans and danced with them etc but i still was not foward enough or really didnt give a damn about the outcome, and nothing materalised , f#$k this i need success with hot women with a red pill awarness , big time, how do i do this? later, i meet a girl who was here for spring break, ( in europe, Ireland) travelled to europe for spring break is that common? I just hit my 30s and have a good education but finacially i am in a tight situation due to poor decisions nut i will recitfy that in time( had to move home, not good i know) look i am asking for help / advice om how i can improve my situation with women in general with a red pill mindset. I am free and no commitments as such, Guys, what do i need to do , so that from a year or two from now i will look back and smile at how much i have developed, Thank you Gentleman, This is not a rant from me, i am just really fustrated ever since i become red pill aware and my old way of seeing the world keeps dragging me back. Thank you

  75. Hello, This red pill shit, has me fu#$ed up. When i go out now i see the world,male-female interactions in a new way and although i can get women, i have alot of difficulty getting attractive ones, Tonight i went out solo ( as i do sometimes, i live in europe ) I opened an 8 set of brazillans and danced with them etc but i still was not foward enough or really didnt give a damn about the outcome, and nothing materalised , f#$k this i need success with hot women with a red pill awarness , big time, how do i do this? later, i meet a girl who was here for spring break, ( in europe, Ireland) travelled to europe for spring break is that common? I just hit my 30s and have a good education but finacially i am in a tight situation due to poor decisions nut i will recitfy that in time( had to move home, not good i know) look i am asking for help / advice om how i can improve my situation with women in general with a red pill mindset. I am free and no commitments as such, Guys, what do i need to do , so that from a year or two from now i will look back and smile at how much i have developed, Thank you Gentleman, This is not a rant from me, i am just really fustrated ever since i become red pill aware and my old way of seeing the world keeps dragging me back. Thank you guys, would love some tips guidance on where i can improve and go from here…

  76. I realized that I’ve been ghosted by some dancers for going clubbing without my wife. My clubbing is like smoke in their Blue Pill eyes, so I’m not surprised that they ghosted me. I’m cool with that, actually.

    One woman has ghosted me, but her very popular husband continually greets me with a beaming smile and spends a few minutes chatting me up. She’ll pass me and ignore me (I ignore her too, though I’ll smile at her because I find her nonsense amusing) and he’ll stop and chat with me, then she’ll rejoin him and greet me and I’ll return her greeting with an amused mastery smile. Her husband sees her crap and won’t tolerate it. When the wife rejoins her husband, he doesn’t even look at her or acknowledge her with his body language until he has finished chatting me up. Ain’t the Red Pill grand?!

    The ghey, judgmental types dislike me, unsurprisingly, while the more fun, accepting types are warm to me. I like ghosting and being ghosted.

  77. @Culum Struan

    BTW, one thing I noticed right off in the clip (even before I read your breakdown, but you haven’t mentioned this) is that for some reason ALL the early followers are men. The chicks only start to join in when a critical mass of men is reached (except for early in the video one girl talks to the leader briefly) and then of course the rest of the guys start chasing the girls and joins.
    Is that even relevant? Why wouldn’t dancer no. 3 or 4 be a girl? Or is it just a coincidence?

    Did you watch the first dancer video or just the second with YaReally’s breakdown?

    The first explained the first and second follower being important. And this just points out simple concepts of social proof from both men and women.

    Granted, the first and the second followers in the video were not attractive men (but neither were any of the women that came to join in). But it was a clear demonstration of physical leadership by a man for other men.

    Why else does Mystery keep pointing to his guy friends he can never seem to find initially in his video in-fields, or why a guy would have time constraints like “I have to meet up my guy friends in two minutes”.

    This demonstrates the added value and importance of having a wingman or be sarging with other guys (even if they are geeks like in the video). A pre-made first and second follower. A good wingman is nothing other than a first follower.

    (Funnily, when I was winging for my buddy in my last field report on 3/5/16 I built my buddy up by stating that we have other pursuits in life as “real” men like “I have a very small hunting farm of 40 acres but my buddy Mr. MIM has a “huuuge” 300 acre farm……I was the first follower, he is the leader……)

    Women are more reluctant to follow one peacocking man that a peacocking man that has social proof of other men with a subsequent first and second follower if he starts out alone.

    Pre-selection of men, and HB women if possible……

  78. @Blaximus

    “Interesting. I don’t give this a lot of thought. Maybe I’m broken and don’t realize? I feel so strongly about other people’s situations not affecting me that maybe it’s rendered me blind to an extent. I don’t think I know if the people around me are happy or unhappy. I mean, I know my family is good, but in general I seem to have a huge blindspot.”

    It is very simple Blaximus. You were sent a plethora of memos by your cultural man set when you were growing up. You were constantly indoctrinated by all the masculine men around you growing up. So guess what, early, young experiences mad you a Natural. And no apologies for that. You ended up good in my estimation. You are not broken. It is not more valorous to have thought about it a lot, or discovered it from others, like you are doing now that the manosphere was invented for this shit.

    No one sent me any goddamn memos when I was growing up. I had to learn all this shit on my own. And I had courage and gumption to learn it as I went. An I ended up well in my estimation.

    It’s all good. Natural or learned.

    And Joni Mitchell didn’t turn out well. So don’t let the clouds matter. They are just in the way of what really matters.

    “I’ve looked at clouds from both sides now
    From up and down, and still somehow
    It’s cloud illusions I recall
    I really don’t know clouds at all”

  79. @Miguel

    That video is a waste of time.

    The long 3:54 story short of it is the FI story of put woman on a pedestal because they have a vagina and they will hide it from you. It’s hidden for the imperative. And then some. And then shame you for “You males have it all wrong if you won’t pedestalize me and get me off via the clit.”

    Nice try. It is not very thought provoking. But feel free to ponder red pill praxeology. And wonder why your eyes hurt because you have never used them.

    Sorry for my bitterness. I don’t know what has come over me. (Heheh I’m good. I’ll explain later….)

    And welcome for posting.

  80. @Blax

    Thanks. You are right. I think when I used to fuck more women than I am doing now and I cared less. There were times I could do more than one in a day. I don’t think I would do that now. It appears as if I am just becoming more conscious that it hurt the women even then, and it makes me a bit uncomfortable…even blue at times.

    @Gamer

    Great suggestion. Actually I have no problems bringing some of the girls together. I do it sometimes. But some particular ones are not easy to put into “the mix” so to speak. I guess it has to do with their personalities or social circumstances, I have no words for describing the situation with some of these women. Bringing some of the women together requires skills I think I do not possess yet.

  81. @scray
    “but if you’re still relying only on cold approach and sarging to get laid 2, 3, 4 years into it….idk….that strikes me as strange. like in that time you can build your own pussy harem.”

    Ya ultimately social circle game is the most efficient way of getting laid (and often leads to consistently hotter girls overall). Buuuut there are benefits to cold approach (like I like the anonymity and that it’s all on my terms…I’ve had big social circles before and it can be time consuming to maintain them and deal with drama etc, VS now where I’m keeping a nice simple little life where I just have girls early in the week and sarging late in the week and I’m working on my career goals whenever I’m not doing either of those lol).

    Often the preference comes down to whether the guy is a Thrill of the Hunt man (cold approach being more appealing) or a Pleasure of Sex man (social circle being more appealing). And I would recommend a guy cold approach for a while first because there are a lot of things you need to learn as a hardcore newbie from cold approach (self-reliance, fucking up a ton as you learn calibration, cut-throat AMOG battles, handling HARSH blowout rejections, solidifying your frame etc) that will help you do better with social circle game in the long-run.

    I still love the nightlife scene so I’ll be doing that for a while, if I don’t end up settling down I will probably head more toward daygame in my mid/late 40s and social circle game in my 50s+. But in my mid-30s I still love the energy of the nightlife scene and the dolled up girls and satisfaction I get from cold approach…even if I got sick of going IN the bars themselves I would probably run street game outside them.

    @Rollo
    I view your work as vital reading for men in general, especially PUAs (as I’ve mentioned before, Hypergamy and Solipsism are fucking HUGE key concepts that PUA generally doesn’t discuss in depth or have terminology for etc) and is great at helping with the bigger picture and internal game and general societal/social dynamics as a male etc. But in terms of what Culum should say to a girl in a coffee shop etc, I’d send him to the PUA community for that stuff. That’s not even a diss, I think it would be almost disappointing to everyone if the next TRM article was titled “10 Sick Pickup Lines To Bang A Girl In A Campus Bathroom!” lol

    But in general the Manosphere has a really negative edge to it, especially in pickup…none of the guys running pickup in the Manosphere seem like they really enjoy it. It’s pretty depressing and part of why like, Tyler isn’t reading the RVF forum. There’s not a lot of value in the often negative attitudes in the Manosphere. I’d love to see everyone lighten up a bit and remember that this is a GAME and that if you’re out there sarging you are in an incredibly lucky position…your hobby is “going out and flirting with hot young girls” Like, what a life that is compared to some of the alternative paths you could’ve gone down and a lot of guys around you are stuck on lol

    @Blaximus
    “I’m a Ya fan because he challenged me a while ago to open my mind, and I did learn a few things. That’s always very cool.”
    “You’re gentleman and a Good Guy. I appreciate you immensely, and I dig what you do here for the fellas

    <3

    "( although, damn, I’m starting to hate Tyler’s face… that’s your fault… he he )."

    It ain't a pretty face lol On a side-note though someone mentioned Good Looking Loser and I think part of why it's harder to recommend GLL's stuff is BECAUSE he's good-looking and has an awesome deep voice and shit, like he's got enough of those external attributes society conditions all these AFCs to believe is the secret to success that it's easier to dismiss his success and be like "oh, it's because he's good looking, I'm not good looking so this is useless" and completely miss his subcomms etc Like I have a 6'4" good-looking Natural alpha white guy with amazing game who, if you hang with him and objectively look what he's doing he's running really solid game and applying all these game principles naturally, that's why girls will consistently choose him over his other tall good-looking alpha white guy buddies…but my short minority buddies will NEVER learn anything from him because they attribute all his success to "oh it's just because he's good looking".

    Whereas when a guy who looks like THIS:

    http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_4cNQuSUTzOw/TLroCgTQN-I/AAAAAAAAADU/SK7yxzOqdqA/s1600/Screen+shot+2010-10-17+at+2.05.50+PM.png

    Is putting out infield like this:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fIaHxQIvy6o

    …it's like "well shit, okay I guess I can listen to his nasally voice for a few minutes and see what he's teaching because he's clearly doing WAY better than society has told me a guy like that would be able to do."

    "What if you would have had a camera following you around during some of the more exciting times in life?"

    We wish you DID, we probably could have learned a TON from it. But we make do with what we've got and ultimately as a Natural you'll have a harder time really breaking down in depth what it was you were doing step by step to create those exciting moments in your life…which is fine if the guy you're helping is a relatively normal dude with a nice little social circle that goes out now and then and just needs some inspiration and general advice.

    But PUA is designed to like, give a friendless "lives in his basement computer room" BRONY the tools and understanding of social dynamics and chick psychology to get his dick wet lol

    I LOVE Naturals, I would often rather hang with a cool fun positive Natural than a weird newbie PUA, buuuut in terms of helping other guys a Natural would be showing guys video footage of their prime moments for props and bragging rights, whereas a Tyler is showing them video footage to pause it frame by frame and explain every subtle nuance going on and how it relates to the teaching the students have been absorbing so they can see "oh THAT'S why a girl backs away from me quickly when I touch her, because I need to calibrate to her body language like Tyler is showing".

    @fleezer
    http://www.quickmeme.com/img/35/359e9a3b36a4b1a81be7d6f1062a1b10d98d9b6c953c8a7d12982665b91e365b.jpg

    @scribblerg
    "I must be really growing cuz all I’m doing is looking for what I can learn from @gb…And I can see how unproductive the negativity and anger and dissing are. Who the fuck am I?"

    lol'ed hard at this. Good progress. 🙂

    @Culum
    "To pick just the first one that occurs, YaReally and HABD gave me very specific actionable advice that helped me extricate myself last year from a nasty situation that was potentially heading towards an FRA accusation before I pulled it back."

    This is a good example of what I mean. Torero probably doesn't have a video up about "avoiding false rape accusations" but you'll see the RSD guys cover it here and there and there's some old PUA community material on the whole Buyer's Remorse thing. Even IF Torero is your lord and savior you should still be looking at other sources for help. Part of why I link RSD is that they have SO MUCH content up there (and it's in an engaging format instead of the droning depressing Krauser talks) that they cover a massive range of topics so it's kind of any problem a guy has there's likely a few RSD vids I can link to help him sort it out.

    Like man, I HOPE Culum opens some Krauser vid and like "THIS IS THE ANSWER I'VE BEEN LOOKING FOR!!!" and skyrockets upward with success. That would be AWESOME to me. And hey, when I decide to get back into more daygame and focus on it, I will probably grab Krauser's book and scour all these boring London podcasts looking for any edge I can find. I'll probably even read Roosh's collection just to find that one little scrap of information that might make a difference.

    "but I just don’t like his attitude. I find it hard to learn from someone with such negativity and bad energy. I love women, I love feminine energy, I don’t hate or resent them. This whole process is supposed to be fun and it IS fun..not some painful hard slog to be endured to stick my dick in some chick..which is the subcomm I get from Krauser (and this doesn’t mean it isn’t hard work or draining – but the process is ultimately rewarding in itself, not just banging chicks)."

    Ya, this is his biggest issue. This vibe just radiates off him and it's really hard to recommend to newbies "emulate THIS guy, you should want to end up like THIS". I mean hate on Tyler all you want but the guy lives in a mansion these days, is a very successful entrepreneur who works his ass off 24/7 and built a very successful company from the ground up (even navigating crazy negative press etc), has helped COUNTLESS men improve their lives, puts out nothing but positive motivational instructional content with high-quality production values, doesn't drink smoke do drugs or eat shitty food and works out regularly to take care of his health and encourages other guys to live a similar clean healthy lifestyle, has sexual success WAY beyond what society would have allowed him to have if he took the default path, has a baby-mama who takes care of his 2 adorable kids (no kids for Roosh, Krauser, myself, etc so in terms of biological success Tyler is nailing it so far and he plans to have more kids (he wants a little army, I suspect to get back at the universe "you make me a short balding nasally-voiced ginger that shouldn't be able to reproduce? Fuck you I'm having 10 kids!!" lol)) and has threesomes with him and lets him go fuck other girls etc etc

    Ya, Tyler is a little spergy weird and he KNOWS that and he'll probably ALWAYS have a bit of that because, well, he probably DOES HAVE Aspergers/Autism to some degree lol But in terms of who I would point guys to and say "try to life a lifestyle and have internal mindsets like this guy", I'd point them toward Tyler over Krauser.

    I mean:

    https://twitter.com/krauserpua

    (read the description of this next video):
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t2WzCg9IvmA

    (listen to how fucking depressing this is, if you can):
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B1_ZuJi-JRk

    Versus:

    https://www.instagram.com/rsdtyler/

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sttagQ1YfDY

    Even when Tyler covers negative topics like how life sucks sometimes, it's always in a way where it's like "look, you can handle this, it'll just be a little harder for you than it is for some lucky others who don't have your obstacles, suck it up and handle this shit":

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s3r-KvakUzU

    "One thing I have noticed though is that I need practice. Like I have enough practice at Day 2s now that I can actually run through the conversation in most dates on autopilot which frees up my mind much more to notice subcomms and IOIs and think about other stuff."

    Right, this is the purpose of routines in-set and having default routine openers you enjoy using (ideally they should be self-amusing like Julien talks about all the time). It puts part of the interaction on autopilot so you can notice other stuff in the interaction that will help. That doesn't mean you HAVE to use routines, just that there ARE some valid benefits from going that route and having your opening feel as auto-pilot as your Day2s when you see that coffee shop girl.

    "for some reason ALL the early followers are men"

    A single girl running over to join 2 men might be judged as a slut. A group of girls (notice the girls tend to run over to join him as a group, even the cameraman's girl is like "wanna go down there??" to her friend, and the BlondeChick that wants to join but can't needs someone else in her group to join her for her to be "allowed" to join even at critical mass) running down to join a large GROUP of men is just a party forming. Plus in general women ping off their environment for how to feel, so they often need a bigger group consensus that something is "the "in" thing to do" (which translates to all sorts of areas, like women having closets stuffed with outfits they've only worn once and are "outdated" while guys will do stuff like wear the same shirt they've been wearing since college zero fucks given etc).

    But observe the dance floor at the start of the night in nightclubs…who's almost ALWAYS the first gender on the dance floor? And what happens once that first group goes up there? And how/when do the genders start to mingle like what instigates that etc. It's all interesting to watch and part of why I still like those venues, lots of dynamics to watch regardless of how I'm doing that night.

    @omajourney
    We can't diagnose your problems if we don't know what exactly you're doing out there infield. Write some Field Reports and we might be able to give you some guidance.

    @SJF
    All good points on men/followers and what Mystery was doing etc "Leader of Men" is one of the key switches Mystery originally talked about and this is a good way of explaining an ideal wingman dynamic:

    "A good wingman is nothing other than a first follower."

    If my buddy is in set, my job as his wing is to make him look like a boss leader badass compared to me, so dropping in for a second to ask if my buddy needs a drink makes him look like he has a follower.

    And in a bigger set where I'm trying to help him out (like say a hot girl and an uggo and he opened the set and wants the hot girl), the girls will naturally think I'm cool just from my interaction with them but by doing stuff like asking if my buddy needs a drink, or whispering to my buddy "lead us to the patio" when we need to venue change instead of me just leading us, or deferring to his opinion at points or telling DHV stories about him when he does a takeaway etc, I'm making sure the girls (and his target) think he's that 1% cooler than me and I'm his follower. And when he's helping me out we switch roles.

  82. Hi All,

    First post and I’d like to start by thanking all the regular commentators here (and of course Rollo!) for the knowledge and time they contribute for men. It’s invaluable.

    I am in a slightly unique situation at the moment and would like your advice.

    I currently live on a small island with a complete derth of younger attractive women. I moved here a couple of years ago for the job oppurtunity and will be moving back to a big city come September.

    I’ve always done well with women (60+ notch count aged 25), but this place is whole different ball game. It’s like hypergamy on steroids, and the few attractive girls know they can extract any price.

    I swallowed the pill over a year ago, and have absolutely killed it whenever I’ve travelled back to London, and have had the odd plate here to keep me going (a fair few bored married women).

    I’ve been seeing a girl for the past five weeks and have run into issues. We have never talked about commitment or any kind of exclusivity but the island doesn’t have many top quality options and it’s almost a given when we are spending as much time with each other as we have. Last night I found out on a girls weekend away last week she ditched her friends and stayed out with a guy she knows till 5 in the morning getting pissed. She is also staying over at his for an upcoming event which she booked without telling me.

    That’s all fine (if disrespectful to me), we are not exclusive. You never own a girl, just take your turn, etc. I’m just wondering how to play it, we already planned to spend the weekend together and my gut reaction is to cancel and hard next. This could just be protecting my bruised ego, and the sensible thing is to go pure fwb and start actively hunting other girls. The problem with this being again the complete lack of high quality options here. I’m also wondering whether to even bring it up and confront her about it, or just go after other girls without telling her (though this would potentially ruin my reputation on the island if she spun it against me).Thoughts?

    The other more general point is this girl has only slept with two other guys and is aged 19/20, with a very cool/strong father. She went from having a fantastic time with me last Thursday to drinking with another guy the next night. I’ve never had anything close to that happen to me before, girls normally fall hard. Is this an age thing, are young girls so whimsical now that they can change day to day? She has also never brought up commitment, something girls will bring up after two weeks sleeping together in my experience. Again, a one off, or symptomatic of the girls coming up on the dating scene in that age group? Dear god, she’s very head on her shoulders and down to earth, if she’s this bad that generation of girls is more fucked than I thought.

    That was far more rambling than I intended. I look forward to contributing more in the future (particularly with some fun FR’s, I have some good stories as well).

  83. On the article, I’ve never found the need to ghost people consciously. Bring up red pill concepts with those friends you know will be receptive, and steer the conversation away from it with those that aren’t.

    As long as they are still fun people who you enjoy hanging out with and bring value to your life. Those who become negative I’ll just naturally see less of, eg wont think to go for coffee’s/dinners/invite to events.

Speak your mind

%d bloggers like this: