Adaptations – Part III

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Today’s chart comes courtesy of Time’s recent analysis of how Americans met their spouses (h/t to Heartiste). Heartiste provides the most obvious reasoning for these stats:

Every inception source of romance is down over the past 70 years except for bars and online. What happens in bars and online that doesn’t happen in the normal course of events when couples meet through the more traditional routes? That’s right: Intense, relentless, and usually charmless come-ons by drunk and socially clumsy men, that pump girls full of themselves. We’ve entered the age of the narcissistically-charged woman who houses in the well-marbled fat of her skull ham a steroid-injected, Facebook-fed hamster spinning its distaff vessel’s place in the world as the center of existence.

Not to be outdone, but what CH doesn’t address here is the adaptive strategies men are pragmatically employing in order to facilitate their sexual strategy. What this chart illustrates is a graphic representation of the adaptive sexual strategies of the sexes over the course of 70 years.

Granted, in contemporary society women’s attention and indignation needs are as ubiquitously satisfied as men’s need for sexual release (i.e. internet porn) is . This of course leads the mass of women to perceive their social and SMV status to be far greater than it actually is – and when that inflated SMV is challenged by the real world there are countless social conventions already established to insulate women and simultaneously convince men that their perceived status should be the fantasy they believe it is.

It’s important to keep this in mind because men’s adaptive strategies key on women’s self-impressions of their SMV (and often personal worth). I start with this for the last installment of this series because the intergender conditions we’re experiencing today were seeded by the adaptive strategies men used in the past and the contingent counter-adaptations of women employed then too.

From The Abdication Imperative:

The Abdication Imperative

Hypergamy is rooted in doubt. Hypergamy is an inherently insecure system that constantly tests, assesses, retests and reassesses for optimal reproductive options, long-term provisioning, parental investment, and offspring and personal protection viability in a potential mate. Even under the most secure of prospects hypergamy still doubts. The evolutionary function of this incessant doubt would be a selected-for survival instinct, but the process of hypergamy’s assessment requires too much mental effort to be entirely relegated to women’s subconscious. Social imperatives had to be instituted not only to better facilitate the hypergamous process, but also to reassure the feminine that men were already socially pre-programmed to align with that process.

In an era when women’s sexual selection has been given exclusive control to the feminine, in an age when hypergamy has been loosed upon the world en force, social conventions had to be established to better silence the doubt that hypergamy makes women even more acutely aware of. And nowhere is this doubt more pronounced than in the confines of a monogamous commitment intended to last a lifetime. Thus we have the preconception “Happy Wife equals Happy Life” pre-programmed into both gender’s collective social consciousness. It’s as if to say “It’s OK Hypergamy, everything’s gonna be alright because we all believe that women should be the default authority in any relationship.”

When you disassemble any operative feminine social convention, on its most base, instinctive level the convention’s latent purpose is to facilitate and pacify hypergamy.

Heirs of Free Love

Over the course of this series I’ve mentioned the “Free Love” movement. When most people hear that term their first mental impression is usually something like the picture I posted for part one; hippies at woodstock smoking pot. Later it quickly morphed into the 70’s adaptation of socially permissive promiscuity. However, it’s very important to understand that this most recent Free Love social push is by no means the first in human history.

Our impression of Free Love today was colored by the Baby Boom generation, but there have been many Free Love “movements” in the past. This was a fascinating read in light of the SCOTUS recent ruling on gay marriage:

A number of utopian social movements throughout history have shared a vision of free love. The all-male Essenes, who lived in the Middle East from the 1st century BC to the 1st century AD apparently shunned sex, marriage, and slavery. They also renounced wealth, lived communally, and were pacifist vegetarians. An Early Christian sect known as the Adamites existed in North Africa in the 2nd, 3rd and 4th centuries and rejected marriage. They practiced nudism and believed themselves to be without original sin.

In the 6th century, adherents of Mazdakism in pre-Muslim Persia apparently supported a kind of free love in the place of marriage,[15] and like many other free-love movements, also favored vegetarianism, pacificism, and communalism. Some writers have posited a conceptual link between the rejection of private property and the rejection of marriage as a form of ownership

[…] The challenges to traditional morality and religion brought by the Age of Enlightenment and the emancipatory politics of the French Revolution created an environment where ideas such as free love could flourish. A group of radical intellectuals in England (sometimes known as the English Jacobins), who supported the French Revolution developed early ideas about feminism and free love.

Notable among them was the Romantic poet William Blake, who explicitly compared the sexual oppression of marriage to slavery in works such as Visions of the Daughters of Albion (1793). Blake was critical of the marriage laws of his day, and generally railed against traditional Christian notions of chastity as a virtue. At a time of tremendous strain in his marriage, in part due to Catherine’s apparent inability to bear children, he directly advocated bringing a second wife into the house.[19] His poetry suggests that external demands for marital fidelity reduce love to mere duty rather than authentic affection, and decries jealousy and egotism as a motive for marriage laws. Poems such as “Why should I be bound to thee, O my lovely Myrtle-tree?” and “Earth’s Answer” seem to advocate multiple sexual partners. In his poem “London” he speaks of “the Marriage-Hearse” plagued by “the youthful Harlot’s curse”, the result alternately of false Prudence and/or Harlotry. Visions of the Daughters of Albion is widely (though not universally) read as a tribute to free love since the relationship between Bromion and Oothoon is held together only by laws and not by love. For Blake, law and love are opposed, and he castigates the “frozen marriage-bed”.

There are certain manosphere writers of note who believe that our current state of “social degeneracy” is unprecedented in human history. And while it’s certain that no prior generation did it in the same manner as the one before it, ours is simply one more chapter in a Free Love flareup that’s punctuated history for many cultures, not just the west – all prompted by the underlying bio-evolutionary / psychological impulses our race has always been subject to.

That said, it’s important to consider the residual social after effects of our most recent Free Love incidence. I can’t speak to the era in the past, but the Free Love ideology is very much an evident part of the egalitarian equalism ideology that’s rooted itself in our contemporary culture. As western culture spreads, so too does that equalism rooted in Free Love.

The Rise of Fem-powerment

By the time the 80s had begun the redefinition of conventional masculinity – masculinity adapted to capitalize on women’s short-term, Alpha Fucks, sexual strategy – was beginning to take shape. By the mid 80s gone were the Captain Kirk and Han Solo archetypal machismo characters. They were systematically replaced by sensitive, supportive, asexual and unthreatening Dr. Huxtable and increasingly contrasted with laughable parodies of conventional masculinity; these roles redefined to fit into shaming and obfuscating any former idea of masculinity and the men who’d attempt to embrace it.

The action heroes of the era abounded, but the expectation to accept a new archetype, the Strong Independent Ass Kicking Woman® was coming into its own.

Granted, the feminization process was gradual. Throughout the 80s this feminization was primarily reinforced by men (or men like them) who’d borne the brunt of the ‘macho men’ of the 70s sexual opportunism. Beta men of the post Disco Generation and the men who identified with them adapted their own Beta Game of increased identification with the feminine, and thus began the rise of the era of fem-powerment.

A new paradigm was evolving; a social environment founded on the same ‘higher selves’ faux-equalism of the Free Love generation(s), but one predicated on Beta men’s enthusiastic supportiveness of women’s imperatives. Gradually the Free Love narrative was sublimated by a one-sided expectation of male supportiveness and self-identification with women.

From Identity Crisis:

Far too many young men maintain the notion that for them to receive the female intimacy they desire they should necessarily become more like the target of their affection in their own personality. In essence, to mold their own identify to better match the girl they think will best satisfy this need. So we see examples of men compromising their self-interests to better accomodate the interests of the woman they desire to facilitate this need for intimacy (i.e. sex). We all know the old adage women are all too aware of, “Guys will do anything to get laid” and this is certainly not limited to altering their individual identities and even conditions to better facilitate this. It’s all too common an example to see men select a college based on the available women at that college rather than academic merit to fit their own ambitions or even choose a college to better maintain a pre-existing relationship that a woman has chosen and the young man follows. In order to justify these choices he will alter his identity and personality by creating rationales and new mental schema to validate this ‘decision’ for himself. It becomes an ego protection for a decision he, on some level, knows was made for him.

Beta Game is predicated upon this effort to become more alike, more in touch with a calculating feminine ideal men they were being conditioned to believe was equitable to their concept of love and would be reciprocated with appreciation and intimacy. Into the 90s, men built their lives around the ‘high self’ hope that if they could just relate more to the feminine – supporting their girlfriends and wives in equalist endeavors women of the past never had access to – they could out-support the ‘ridiculous cad’ parody straw men they’d created for themselves.

The burden of performance that the men of the Free Love eras had hoped to avoid with higher self conditions of love were replaced with a burden of more accessible Beta supportiveness. Thus, into the 90s we had more and more characterization of masculine competition become associated with men out-supporting one another. Stay-at-home Dad became a socially lauded life choice to be proud of. Tootsie, Mr. Mom, Friends, and the culmination of total abdication to feminine identification, Mrs. Doubtfire, became apex examples of men adapting to a socio-sexual environment they’d been conditioned for – a burden of support.

Mrs’ Doubtfire was a particularly egregious depiction of this male to female transition. The apex Beta Father Provider versus the social and sexual Alpha ‘great guy’ in a battle for the genetic rights to the Beta’s children (which he eventually concedes and accepts). This story epitomizes the subtle undercurrent of socially acceptable cuckoldry that would define men’s adaptations during this era.

By assuming the female role, by identifying with the feminine they’d been convinced was so lacking in themselves, men reinforced, aided and abetted the rise of contemporary women’s default entitlements; not just to support, but to conventional masculinity when convenient, and equalist independence when convenient.

There’s a presumption in the manosphere that women have become more masculinized today, and while this is true, the Hypergamy that’s defined every era for women is more dominant now than in any other age. There is nothing that defines the feminine more than the Feminine Imperative’s want for the security of provisioning and sexual optimization that the masculine provides for women.

As men we’re prone to believe that if we’ve become more feminine women have become more masculinized, but is it this or is it the expectation that women need to adapt a masculinized outlook to counter men’s conditioned Beta passivity? Even staunch feminists get tingles from conventionally masculine, unapologetically Alpha men.

328 comments

  1. I lived and worked through the disco era, and the change in women, from being wallflowers in high school, to being outwardly aggressive with the guys they wanted to fuck in the disco’s (I was “picked up” by 3 women during my bartending career) was a sight to behold.

    Lot’s of fun back then.

  2. If you couldn’t get laid in the era of polyester, you were a total dweeb! When the women came out of their “you chase me” phase, to “I want to fuck” phase, the gates were fully breached and cum was flying everywhere!

  3. I was born in 1968, went to a small college for four years in the late 1980s, and graduated with a bachelors degree in 1990. For all the people that believed being a nice guy was going to work, it was truly astonishing back then how many quote unquote “ASSHOLES” got laid more often than anyone else, with better looking women and had funny if you like dark twisted humor. I will relate some stories later.

  4. Obviously, my name is a pseudonym and I will use pseudonyms to protect myself and those people from any harm. Rest assured, that the stories are true and that I am trying to tell them as accurately as possible. I had college friends who were by far more wild with women than I ever was at the time.

  5. > Hypergamy is rooted in doubt. Hypergamy is an
    > inherently insecure system that constantly tests,
    > assesses, retests and reassesses for optimal
    > reproductive options, long-term provisioning,
    > parental investment, and offspring and personal
    > protection viability in a potential mate.

    > Even under the most secure of prospects
    > hypergamy still doubts.

    @Rollo – this is a point that needs to be expanded. You’re right that the subconscious requires higher support from societal structures but it also requires support at a level even lower than the subconscious. I would put this down at the limbic level of affect.

    I have noted that women are capable of breaking strong emotional bonds that men are simply incapable of severing. This appears to be “hardwired.”

    When a woman starts to feel that a man is detrimental to her reproductive and child rearing success, she can fall completely out of love with him, even start to be repulsed by him, and will feel completely justified in kicking him out of her life. I have seen a number of women do this . . . while talking to me as though their disconnect is so natural and obvious it doesn’t even merit mention.

    Meanwhile their schlubby beta husband pines away in heartbroken agony, whining about how traitorous women are, and how he still loves her and always will.

    I have seen men hang on for years absorbing abuse in loveless, sexless marriages where it is obvious to all us outside observers that the woman is staying with him only for strategic reasons while she prepares her parachute to bail out at the optinmal time.

    This male female dichotomy manifests in the external world in many ways. The perpetual doubt, testing & reassessment you talk about above. The fact that women initiate 3/4 of all divorces. The fact that divorce gamesmanship involving false abuse charges that can destroy another person, even kill them in a few instances, is overwhelmingly a female activity. This is an activity so heinous and so destructive that one will only engage in it against a person they actively hate rather than love and is a stark example of the “clean break” women are capable of making.

  6. The John Stories 1
    I remember my freshman year talking to Peter about a young freshman woman named Jenny. Peter said that he thought Jenny was a cute girl to which I agreed, but he thought she was better looking than I did, but I told him that I respected his beliefs even though I did not agree with them. He also said that she seemed innocent to which I responded that I knew she was not. He asked what I meant. I retold the story of what had happened a weekend before. On Saturday night, John said he got a blowjob from Jenny the night before on a Friday night at a dorm room party. He said that he was talking to her and saying funny stories and jokes and hitting on her then she suddenly and explicitly said she wanted to give him a blowjob. He was surprised for a second as he had never had a woman do this before, but he said,” Ok, let’s go.” As Jenny was giving John a blowjob, she could see, hear and feel him get excited and told him not to come in her mouth. He said that he was fine and to keep going. She did. Then John grabbed Jenny by the ears and came in her mouth. After releasing her ears, Jenny went and spat into the sink and called John an asshole among other things while John called her a stupid slut and laughed at her. Everyone in the dorm room laughed including me. I was the only one to say that I was probably going to burn in hell for laughing at this because it was so wrong even though it was so funny. I also told John that this was a bad idea to repeat in the future. John got angry at me as we were aquaintenances and not friends yet. He said that I was a loser virgin, an idiot and to stop giving him chivalrous and feminist advice that his oldest sister did. I responded that I was not a virgin and had gotten sex once before which would be described into a term called “Fool’s Mate” by Neil “Style” Strauss and Erik “Mystery” Markovic years later. It was true that I was not a virgin, but got sex with little to no GAME because the girl was drunk and horny a year and a half before at a party. John said let’s throw shit at me. Everyone in the room threw empty beer cans at me. I threw them back. I then said, “Hold on. I won’t give you nonsense reasons like your sister. I said if a gal gives you a blowjob so willingly and easily then why would you do anything to mess it up.” John said that he didn’t care as there were plenty of other sluts to satisfy his sexual needs unlike me because stupid worthless sluts liked him better. I looked at him and agreed for as hard as that was to admit. I looked at John and told him that I didn’t think it was a good idea as a woman could spit his semen back in his face or accidently gag and bite hard on his dick or purposely bite hard on his dick. He said that I had a valid point, but he liked to see how much he could get away with women to see whether they were good girls or sluts, and that he treated good girls well but regarded sluts as garbage to be thrown away at any time for any reason or no reason at all. I realized later in life that nearly all men have the Madonna/Whore complex to some degree, but his was the most pronounced as I had ever seen. John also had a by far bigger abundance mentality than I did. Peter was surprised and shocked at this. I told Peter to keep his mouth shut and keep it amongst us men as I believed in a BRO CODE implicitly but not explicitly yet to which he agreed. He called Jenny over and started to tell her the story which he started to mess up in telling. I told him this was the last time I was going to trust him with such a story and then proceeded to tell her. She denied it at first, then asked how many people heard this to which I responded about 2 dozen at the party a week prior and some of them were women who were by far meaner in their insults then the men especially calling Jenny a slut. She started to curse at me for thinking this was funny and laughing. I cursed right back at her and said that no one not even me can 100% control what he or she laughs at and that I was the only one to stand up to him and tell him it was wrong and the reasons I did so. She said that you did the right thing for all the wrong reasons which is the same as doing the wrong thing. I told her that I didn’t care and to admit the truth of what she did. She finally admitted it. I told her that I sympathized for how poorly he treated her, but she was the one to put herself in that position, and that word or stories be they lies or truth travels fast around here. I told her that I never told the name of the one girl I had sex with in high school even though it was a one night stand and I would never see her again and that I would not have acted so poorly after sex to a woman, but obviously some men do. She started to blame men for being assholes to which I responded not all men are like that and even most men are not like that, but there’s a reason why there is a saying among men that nice guys finish last and assholes finish first and this seems to be especially true when it comes to getting women. She said that wasn’t true then I asked why asshole men seemed to get laid more often, with more women and better looking women. She denied it and I rolled my eyes and said let’s move on to something else. to which we did.

  7. The John Stories 2
    The first John story happened in the beginning of the 1st semester of my freshman year.This 2nd one happened at the beginning of my 2nd semester freshman year. John and I had become friends at this point. We were drinking in Titus’s and Trent’s room with . John was there as was Travis. So was Lana, John’s girlfriend of the time. John and Lana are a year older than me, and Titus, Trent and Travis are 2 years older than me. Lana was a pretty blonde woman with big boobs with a nice face and body. She was ditzy and promiscuous. John had gotten very drunk and had passed out sitting up on the lower bunk bed. She tried to get him back into his room by saying let’s go to your room, but he was too drunk to move. It was obvious that she was horny and wanted John too. Titus and Trent were passed out drunk sitting and sleeping on their couch. Travis was up and still drinking and drunk. So was I. Everyone else had left. Travis told me to look up her dress at her panties, She said that he needed to stop, and I said that I did not want to do so. At that point, she said that she would kill me if I did. I thanked her for provoking me unnecessarily and looked up her dress at her panties. I was sitting at one end of the lower bunk with her in the middle between me and John. She slapped me and Travis and I laughed and drank some more. I passed out at the other end. The next thing I knew is that I was laid out at the edge of the bunk with my head at one end and John’s feet to the left of my head all laid out on the other side of the same bunk. Lana had woken me up by touching and rubbing my right shoulder and penis with her hands. Apparently, she had pulled off her panties, pulled up her dress to just above her waist, pulled down my pants and underwear then proceeded to have sexual intercourse with me until I came and passed out again. I awoke with John still laying as before with my pants and underwear pulled up but my zipper and button unfastened. I wondered what had happened as my balls felt someone had been lightly slapping them a few times. Travis was passed out drunk in a chair and Lana was gone. I got up, zipped my zipper and buttoned my pants then went to my room for sleep. I woke up hungover the next day then went to the showers on my floor. I passed Dan who was 3 years older than me with Travis behind him. Dan asked how was Linda last night. I looked and Dan strangely and said fine not remembering at this point with Travis laughing. In the shower, I remembered. I came out of the shower and saw that Dan and Travis were still in the hallway. Dan cheered me loudly and said at least now we all know that I was not a virgin freshman and that I got laid by a hot girl. I said that she essentially raped me although as long as I don’t get diseases, charged for child support or beaten up that I didn’t mind. I begged them to stay quiet as she was John’s girlfriend, that I couldn’t move and get away from while she was riding cow girl on me as I was to drunk to do so, that I would never have done that sober(which was true), and that it was wrong even if John was weaker than me. John happened to be stronger than me and I told them that I didn’t want to get beaten up. John walked up to me later and stated that at least he knew that I wasn’t virgin and that he, Titus, Trent and Travis saw what she did. John said that he was too drunk to have sex with her, and that I wasn’t so she hopped on me. He told me not worry about it as friends share sluts. I was relieved that he didn’t want to beat me up. He told me I got a technical win which is still a win and that a lot of these other freshman guys are still virgins and that many never had sex with a hot girl and that I was not virgin and had sex with a hot girl. He told me Titus had slept with her a year before. Titus confirmed it. I know this sounds like a Penthouse letters story and I would not believe it if I was not there. all four men in the room saw it and told me what had happened too. Basicly, you could say Lana got drunk and fell on my cock.

  8. The John Stories 3 and 4
    This happened at the very begining of my sophomore year. Maria was a half Irish half Mexican gal my age with a pretty face, great body with big boobs and a nice round well shaped bubble butt. She was pleasant to be around. A lot of men including me wanted her, but knew it was unlikely for us to get her. To be honest, most men couldn’t get her. She came into Tony’s room where we were drinking and was sending obvious verbal and non verbal Indicators of Interest to John. He finally yelled at her, “Look you stupid slut, I told you that I do not want you for a girlfriend only a fuck buddy! If you don’t want that then leave me alone. You are not girlfriend material!” She stormed out. I asked John what his problem was. He said that I didn’t understand and that I was foolish not to believe that she was a slut pretending not to be. I told him so what if she is one, just tell her whatever she wants to hear the 2nd time and bang her as virtually all men would love to get a chance to get inside her and he was the only one who had a chance and that he should have taken it. I said that she was just as good looking as Lana. He stated that he was honest and that other women would come along. I ran into her later and she asked what she did wrong. I told her nothing. Maria wanted me to convince John that she could be his girlfriend. I told her that was not going to happen and that he would only want her as a fuck buddy. She started to complain and I told her to accept it. I told her to be grateful for John be honest even of it was wrong for him to be so openly rude and crude. I told her that she could have almost any man she wanted as she was very pretty and very pleasant to be around so why not pursue other options. She was still fixated on him. I told her that most men including me would date her. she told me that she thinks of me as friend. I told her that she was too good looking to have any strait man not want to change the relationship from platonic to romantic. She didn’t believe me. I told her that all her “male friends” including me wanted to have sex with her and that everyone of them besides John would love to have her as a girlfriend. I told her that I like other men probably would not ask her for a fuck buddy relationship but rather a romantic one. Then I told her that even if I had asked for a fuck buddy relationship, and she said no because she wanted a romantic one, then I would be sorely tempted to lie just to have sex with her as I like every other strait man had overwhelming urges to have sex with her and if she wanted to hear a lie, then many a man would lie to her just to have sex with her Then she believed everything I said.She asked why I was friends with him I told her that he was a great friend to me, but was often poor with women whom he regarded as sluts. She said that she was not a slut. I told her I did not care one way or the other. At the end of the semester as I was walking down the hall with my buddies including John to go to the next party, Maria said that she would give me a blowjob if I didn’t get drunk so much. She then said,,”Sorry, I didn’t mean that!” I called bullshit. I looked at her and said that she would have done anything for John at one point even though he got drunk more often than I did. She said that was true, but that it was different as John was the hot bad boy women really wanted for a fling and I was the nice guy boyfriend material. I looked at her and told her in a stern but low voice, “Why should I pay more than him for the same thing or to get less?” She said that I would get better than him. I told her that was false no matter if she believed it was true or not. I told her that her problems with men are her own damn fault as she had more ability to get better but acted like a fool. I walked away and seldom talked to her afterwards. That night I told John he was absolutely right about her and that he was the 1st one to see it and I apologized and he accepted.

    John was in Tony’s room with 2 women. Tony was a friend 2 years older than me. John was in the bottom bunk with Penelope and Tony was in the top bunk with Priscilla. This was at the beginning of my sophomore year. Both men were having sex with these women with Tony and Priscilla on the top bunk and John and Penelope on the bottom bunk. Penelope and John had a fuck buddy relationship. Penelope asked John where this relationship was going. John replied what do you mean. Penelope replied that she wanted John to be her boyfriend. John flatly refused saying he liked how things were, that changing from fuck buddy to a dating relationship seldom worked. She got into an argument with him. Finally he said that he was either going to go to sleep staring at a mural on the wall he painted or that the two of them could fuck again and he wasn’t going to discuss, talk about or argue with her about that she wanted more out of the relationship. Either way was good for him he said. She asked, “Where is this relationship going?” He yelled, “On the Floor!” He tossed her naked ass on the floor which was absolutely filthy. She got up and slapped at him, yelled at him and cursed him while he laughed. Ten minutes later they were having sex again.

  9. The Martin Stories
    Martin came into the college cafeteria laughing in the 2nd semester of my Freshman year.. He then told me what he did 10 minutes ago laughing hysterically. Denise offered to give him a blowjob. He agreed. I liked Denise, but she was not a good looking woman to put it ever too kindly. She told him not to come in her mouth. He agreed and told her to keep going. She did. As she pulled out to breathe air, he came in her left eye. He proceeded to laugh and call her an ugly slut. Five minutes after Martin came in the cafeteria, Denise came in and had a black eye. when people asked what happened, she said something got in her eye. Martin pointed and laughed at her while I put my head down and laughed.

    Martin was telling me and Dan that he was having problems with his girlfriend who was 2 years older than him, 1 year older than me and 2 years younger than Dan. Martin was a 17 year old Freshman and I was 18 and she was 19 while Dan was 21. Martin told Melanie, his girlfriend that they needed to break up because all they do is fight and fuck. She argued with him and told him he was being immature. Then she asked if he was having sex with other women. Martin responded, “Hell Yeah! Did you think you were the only one?” They argued some more. I asked how many days before he had sex with her again. He said, “Days? Try like an hour later!” I laughed. Martin said that Melanie was crazy. I told him that he wasn’t going to leave her. He asked how I knew as he had more experience with women and then insulted me. I told him to fuck off. Then I told him how I knew. I said she was a pretty redhead with a great body, nice face and big boobs and that was hard to come by. I said that money grows on trees but not big boobed good looking redheads and that he was addicted to this. Dan said American Money was made from cotton and not paper. I said it was almost the same as cotton grows on a bush and bushes are really just very short trees. He stayed with her until he transferred his sophomore year then transferred back his junior year. Martin left without warning anyone and no one knew what happened to him until he retuned our junior year.

    My sophomore year, Mark, who was Martin’s roommate the previous year, was in Melanie’s room. Mark and Melanie were the same age and year in college. She complained about Martin abandoning her and not saying a word before he left and that she still loved him. Mark drank all her beer, got drunk and said yeah a lot trying to enjoy drinking without paying too much attention to her. The next thing Mark knew is he was having sex with her. He passed out on top of her. Mark was 6 Feet 4 inches tall and a big man so he laid on top of her and she could not move him for 8 hours. I laughed and said that I was more of a gentleman. Mark asked why. I said I passed out underneath Lana the previous year. He laughed. Then Melanie got a boyfriend whose face was exactly like Martin’s. Martin was 6 feet tall and the new boyfriend was 5 feet 5 inches tall. It was the weirdest thing I ever saw. When Martin returned, Mark and I told him what she said and did. Martin walked up and said hi to her, she told Martin to never speak to her again. Martin and Melanie never spoke to each other again. She broke up with the small boyfriend the next day.

  10. “Even staunch feminists get tingles from conventionally masculine, unapologetically Alpha men.”

    One of my plates is a feminist. Constantly posting feminist shit on her FB, talks about how men should respect women always, we need to stop sexual assault, we live in a patriachy, etc.

    Yet when I randomly grab her tits in public or slap her on the ass because I feel like it, she giggles. I choke her during sex and call her a whore while pulling her hair, she’ll later tell me she would NEVER let anyone else dl that but it’s ok if I do “because you make me feel different”. She begs me to do the filthiest shit.

    When we’re in public she always walks behind me. She asks me to make decisions for her and tell her what to do. She giggles constantly, like a little girl, even though she’s 30. I tease her CONSTANTLY, and she comes back for more.

    This is a girl who made her last 3 boyfriends wait SIX WEEKS to “make love”, yet we fucked like animals for 4 hours first time we met.

    AWALT. Women need masculinity. They crave it. They go insane over it. And in a culture that’s currently lacking it, you’ll slay if you have even a hint of masculinity.

  11. The Tony Stories.
    Tony was an average height man but was deemed by women to be very good looking and he had a reputation for having a big dick. He would get his room very dirty and women would come and clean it up for him They would also help him with his homework and even do his homework. He would call them love slaves behind their back often and sometimes to their face in a silly charming way to which they laughed. He would say things like, ” If they are old enough to bleed, they are old enough to breed.” Then even as a 23 year old man, he dated a 17 year old gorgeous girl. He is 2 years older than me.

    One day he was walking down the hallway with a Penthouse magazine. I saw 3 women walking up to us who I thought were bitches, but out of a sense of decorum, I told him to put it away. He said to watch what he did. He had sex with all 3 women before. I told him to put it away as I did not want to be collateral damage when they slapped him or complained to the administration. He told me to watch what he was going to do. They asked what he had in his hand. He turned it around and showed them Miss Penthouse Italy, then said, ” See this woman in this picture. She and my right hand have done more for me than you ever have or ever will.” He pointed the finger and laughed at them. I was in the middle of him and the 3 women. I jumped behind them not to get hit which I was sure they were going to do. Instead they laughed. Then I laughed. Then they got angry at me and told me not to laugh. I told them to go fuck themselves, that I knew that they all had sex with him, and it’s not my fault that they allowed themselves to be treated this way. I cursed at them. They acted much better towards me from that time on.

    One day Tony convinces me to bang on a floor of women where he had a lot of sexual partners after a night of drinking. He yelled out that he was not a slut, he was a virgin, and that women should stop treating him like a piece of meat. They asked if I was with him. I said yes. Then out of half the rooms, the women started yelling out the days they had sex with him and laughter erupted from behind the dorm rooms. He hung his head in disbelief and I laughed pointing at him.

  12. The David Stories
    David was a friend of Tony and Charles, but we were only aquaintances. All were 2 years older than me. I was friends with Charles but better friends with Tony. Charles told me of one day before I attended this college, the 3 of them decided to have a contest lasting a week to see who could have sex with the most women. David won despite the fact that he admitted he had a small dick and most women said he was creepy. David won because he would literally have sex with any women who would let him, and he was relentless in his pursuit of women. He would go after women as long as he did not get arrested or beat up and sometimes he would still go after them despite this. Charles came in second and Tony Third. The reason is Charles had higher standards for women than David and was less relentless than David, but Charles had lower standards than Tony and was more relentless than Tony. Tony was known to be a good looking guy with a big dick and Charles was just average in looks and everything else.

    One day David who had dropped out of this college to join the Air Force said he wanted to show me and tell me some things. He said he joined the Air Force because it had more women and that military women are easy. He did not want to wait long in line to have sex with them and wanted to fight as little as possible over them as it usually wasn’t worth it. He said gangbangs were common in the military. I found out that was too often true when I joined the Army just before my 35th birthday, but I was 19 when he told me this. He was known to be a pervert and constantly horny. Stories came out that he would do weird creepy things. If he was dating a young woman, he would flirt with her mother. The girl would accuse him of cheating and he would counter accuse her of cheating and put her on the defensive to throw her off and frame the conversation the way he wanted it to go.

    He came to a party where a woman he had slept with before named Dana was attending. she said that she never slept with him and that he was a small dicked creep. He hit on her in the party. She called him names, said he was small dicked and a creep. He said it was a 1000 nos to a yes. Then he triangulated another woman who liked him. Dana got jealous and vied for his attention. Granted, we were all drinking to excess, but what I saw next was almost unbelieveable, but I saw and heard it. Dana walked down the hallway with her head in his shoulder and said I can’t believe I’m doing this again. The other woman was ok looking while Dana had a pretty face, a nice shaped ass, one of the best I had seen, and small but well shaped boobs.

  13. The Simon Stories
    I have a friend named Simon who went to another college a long time ago. He saw similar things, and he is 2 years younger than me. This happened in the early 1990s.

    He knew someone named Mike who decided to get into a contest with his friends to see who could sleep with the most women a year. Mike won. Even a highschool girl in the town who heard about the contest walked up to the college and volunteered herself to Mike for sex because he slept with a lot of women the previous years, had a reputation for being a good lay and she wanted him to win. Mike won, and Simon says Mike was a complete douchebag. Mike slept with at least 20 women in one year.

    He had a roommate who had a girlfriend went to college some place else. However, the girlfriend’s friend named Michele wanted to have sex with him. Michele attended the same college as the roommate. Finally because his girlfriend was a hot blonde and Michele was a hot brunette, and he always wanted to try variety and a hot brunette, he thought about sleeping with her. He asked how many men she had slept with. Michele was 19 and stated 27 men in a lifetime. He got disgusted, walked away and never talked to Michele again.

    Simon had gotten to 2nd and 3rd base with at least 2 women but never any further. I told him not to say anything about him not having intercourse before as these women did not want to have sexual intercourse with him as it was too much of a burden and responsibility or so they said. He was too honest with them and I told him this was a mistake.

    Simon met a woman named Kim. Simon had not got any sexual intercourse at all and he was 20. He got a one night stand with Kim. When he awoke with her the next morning, she told him that she had a fiancé in another college. Simon thanked her for the sex, but said that he did not want a repeat performance. she asked why. He said that the only way it could be worse id if she were married. Kim responded that if he didn’t have sex with her she would probably have sex with another man. He said he didn’t want to fight this man over it and that this fiancé man might chase him with a shotgun. She told Simon that her fiancé was over 80 miles away and not to worry. Simon had sex with Kim for 3 months and then she decided to end the fuck buddy relationship with Simon to work on her relationship with her fiancé. Simon told her that she should not marry her fiancé because she was already cheating and they weren’t married yet. Kim said that they were communicating better now and the relationship would work. Simon was dating a fucking another woman a month before Kim broke it off with Simon. Kim sent Simon a wedding invitation. Simon threw it away. Kim called Simon’s home. she asked why he did not respond and come to the wedding. He asked her if she was out of her mind. Simon said her family would want to kill him and the husband and his family would want to kill him more.

  14. I should add Simon told to never speak to him again. They never spoke again. He was smart enough to stay single all his life. He has gotten more successful with women as he got older.

  15. I know that I made a lot of posts and even long posts. Since this article was about the 1980s and 1990s, I decided to post true stories I personally knew of that time. Just think, some men manned up and married those terrible women. The sexual market place was bad and mostly as bad as it is now.

  16. > or is it the expectation that women need to adapt a masculinized outlook to counter men’s conditioned Beta passivity?

    If so, we would expect feminists to double down on their demands when men are more and more bending over backwards to fulfil their requests.. Wait..

  17. This is a graph of “spouses and romantic partners”. I’d be interesting in seeing a graph of “how did you meet the last person you had sex with”.

  18. Excellent wrap up of the series! Proof once again that “feminism” is just one big shit test. Another method to facilitate female hypergamy by essentially getting men to cancel themselves out of the game by displaying BP beta-esque behaviours. Feminism is a very bad joke, a very sick joke with men committing suicide because of it. Had these men had some sort of red pill knowledge before they most likely could have improved their lives & carried on.

    Even the most ardent badge wearing feminist will still base her arousal on an alpha male that gives her the tingles. All this egalitarian bullshit is just smoke & mirrors. As much as technology & social media have encouraged the FI, the manosphere as benefited as well & I think that in itself is the current masculine adaptation.

    @Alex

    “If so, we would expect feminists to double down on their demands when men are more and more bending over backwards to fulfil their requests.. Wait..”

    I hear you but women get only as much power as we give them. Hopefully with enough red pill awareness across the male population things might change. (I’m not holding my breath)

  19. Seems that some people never learn and jump from one LTR to another. Like it was hard to just look back and see the patterns! I never get it, why some men can’t grasp few fundamental truths.

    They are just losing time. After another LTR only thing that changes is their age, giving them less and less time to finally wake the hell up.

    Regards,
    __
    Datson H.
    https://redmalehummingbird.wordpress.com/

  20. Sun, (from last post)
    “Hahaha whether you mean what you say or you’re just a bad false flag plant,”

    It’s probably just Chokma (chicken) or Insane in deep cover. HA

    Simon, (from last post)

    Now that’s a FR! Next! Awesome, you AAORK!

  21. Re: Where people met their spouse

    1. Less people go to church now.
    2. You don’t pick up chicks at work, lest you get a sexual harassment charge.
    3. People have less real human interaction now, thanks to tech. (less of the “friends and family” options)

    That leaves college (male enrollment is down; fake rape risk), online dating (easy buffer for fearful beta men; the perception of convenience) and bars (which are filled with thirsty betas spewing validation to fat girls, and true alphas/pua’s that get their pick of the women)

    Basic laws of supply and demand at work here. Lifestyle choices have virtually eliminated four of the seven survey options. That leaves three, two of which naturally attract beta’s, and allows the chicks to both receive validation and conveniently qualify the alphas.

    Is there a single dating site on the planet that was invented by an alpha? Or were they all started by beta nerds?

  22. I wonder what the evolutionary advantage of “free love” is?

    Is there a correlation of governments taking the role of provider during the various free love era’s in history?

    Then it would all make sense. Government provider beats beta provider hands down (you don’t have to occasionally fuck the government like you do a beta provider, plus why have one man provide for you when you can get an entire nation to do it?)

    Having the provider side of things handled leaves you free to pursue to alpha fucks side of things…which leads to promiscuity as women pursue that strategy.

    Meanwhile, its all wrapped up in a few social conventions to hide the truth.

    The funny part is how the conventions are slowly (?) being discarded, and hypergamy is just out in the open. Openly mocking the betas anyway.

  23. CaveClown
    July 1st, 2015 at 9:03 am

    The government as Beta Bucks is important. The driving force is the M/F ratio in the 15 to 25 cohort. Not enough men? Girls gone wild. 1920 to 1929. And during any major war. It is not mathematical either. It is what the female sees in her environment. Thus college campuses with low M/F ratios are happy hunting grounds – for those not a part of it. Outside agitators. When the M/F ratio is lower than about 0.66 it is girls gone nuts.

  24. According to the feds, the sex ratio of the USA:

    United States

    at birth: 1.05 male(s)/female
    0-14 years: 1.05 male(s)/female
    15-24 years: 1.05 male(s)/female
    25-54 years: 1 male(s)/female
    55-64 years: 0.97 male(s)/female
    65 years and over: 0.77 male(s)/female
    total population: 0.97 male(s)/female (2014 est.)

    So the two categories that matter to me are at best exactly even. (I realize there are regional differences)

  25. Even under the most secure of prospects hypergamy still doubts.

    I have taught the LTR how to give up her fear and doubt. (“When you bond with me does the fear recede?” Her, “Yes”)

    None he less she prefers a life with fear to one without it. My guess is that they are hardwired that way. “Always looking for a better deal” requires constant fear. Trying to find a reason to break the current situation to find a “better” one.

  26. CaveClown
    July 1st, 2015 at 9:46 am

    That is mathematical. And that is not the correct test. It is all location, location, location. What is her environment like? How about the excluded men? The men off to war?

  27. CaveClown – “Having the provider side of things handled leaves you free to pursue to alpha fucks side of things…which leads to promiscuity as women pursue that strategy.”

    I would add that the availability of reliable birth control acts as an oxidizing agent to the fire of hypergamy making it burn hotter and longer than it might otherwise. Without birth control the risk of pregnancy will reduce the frequency of intercourse, and changes the outlook of what constitutes promiscuity. Government provisioning reduces the urgency to secure material provisioning, birth control reduces the is risk of sex, together there is little motivation to seek a long term mate until biology brings its own imperative near end of fertility. Still man made social structures reduce the urgency to pair bond because the need for protection and provision is met.

  28. “I have taught the LTR how to give up her fear and doubt. (“When you bond with me does the fear recede?” Her, “Yes”)”

    Lol on the overt communication with your LTR. Sorry you’re having troubles with the relationship, but your overt communications certainly aren’t helping?

    Of course her “fears” are hard-wired (more “anxiety” than fear) but why is that a bad thing?

    I’m serious…who says the women in our LTR’s have to be 100% comfortable? In fact, isn’t her having “comfort” when the troubles start?

    Subtle dread game…subtle anxiety on her part.

  29. @badpainter

    Good points.

    The birth control thing really kills me. I make really good money, but we get “free” birth control for my wife.

    Crazy stuff.

  30. CaveClown – “I’m serious…who says the women in our LTR’s have to be 100% comfortable? In fact, isn’t her having ‘comfort’ when the troubles start?”

    It would be nice though wouldn’t it? Even 85% comfortable would be nice, assuming that were ever noted.

    But we can’t have nice things. We perform they never stop testing. We perform they get fat. We perform they get old. We perform and they leave. We perform and they punish us for performing.

    I mean we are to be the ROCK! but at some point it would be nice to not be burdened with the bullshit. It’s one thing to perform but there must be a limit to the extraneous and bothersome nonsense. It seems to me M.Simon has found his limit. I can’t speak to his feelings, but when I am in similar circumstances I stop caring entirely. Call it emotional quitting if you like, or whining even. But really at some point the shit has to stop. The test must be deemed as having been completed and a score given.

    In M. Simon’s case after a 40 year test I think he’s more than justified in putting pencil to blue book and answering “fuck it” to the current essay question. Despite some quibbles with his methodology, I have to admit great admiration for his perseverance, both as described by and in his continuous commentary here.

  31. @badpainter
    @M. Simon

    I’m not being critical of anyone here, just pointing out what I see. Overt communication is one of the things I did wrong for a long time in my marriage.

  32. @ CaveClown

    Apologies, I came off as a bit hostile there. Call it a militant empathy for a man who seems to me to have had all he will stand.

    I get you on the overt communication thing. It’s a problem. I might be willing to give more than little on that if I ever get the sense there’s a reciprocal effort to simply take my words at face value. I won’t be holding my breath. It’s the paradox of idealism vs. reality.

  33. “Apologies, I came off as a bit hostile there. Call it a militant empathy for a man who seems to me to have had all he will stand.
    I get you on the overt communication thing. It’s a problem. I might be willing to give more than little on that if I ever get the sense there’s a reciprocal effort to simply take my words at face value. I won’t be holding my breath. It’s the paradox of idealism vs. reality.”

    No worries. I hear ya on the empathy. I did a bad job of vetting before I got married, then I spent 10+ years being a beta bitch and letting her get away with whatever. The amount of pain a women is willing to give a man that will accept it is astounding.

    Now that I no longer take any shit, and am living my life the way I see fit, she worships me. Still divorcing her though. Eventually it will revert to the mean. Easier to pursue new prospects than fix the old. Sad stuff all the way around.

  34. “I mean we are to be the ROCK! but at some point it would be nice to not be burdened with the bullshit. It’s one thing to perform but there must be a limit to the extraneous and bothersome nonsense……… But really at some point the shit has to stop.”

    Said Cypher as he hatched a plan to return to the Matrix as a Bluepill.

  35. “Said Cypher as he hatched a plan to return to the Matrix as a Bluepill.”

    Exactly. As @badpainter said, idealism versus reality.

    If you yearn for something that DOES NOT EXIST, you will only be disappointed.

  36. CaveClown
    July 1st, 2015 at 9:57 am

    I’m really not having trouble in the sense that it bothers me. She made me breakfast this morning which she rarely does. I gave her one word answers with a sarcastic tone. When I answered her at all. Her constant anger is “miraculously” clearing up.

    But ya know? I have lost interest. The children are grown. There is no point in Gaming her any more.

    As to teaching her Game being ineffective or counter productive? Probably. It is an experiment. And I’m interested in the results. One thing I like to throw in her face is that “I’m teaching you to be a woman. I know female psychology better than you do.” And she admits it is true. That totally disarms her. And it totally amuses me.

    When I’m Dread Gaming her I make her ask for it. “Transgress me. It makes me hot for you.” So I do. Then when her hormones die down and she complains, “You are always transgressing me.” My comeback is simple. “You asked for it.” That ends the argument she is trying to start right quick.

    I think the rules for an LTR are different from those for a bar pickup or getting started with a woman.

    Like any good “bad boy” I make her double cross herself. It is one of the ways I play Dread Game with her in fact. “You will bring me a woman. It makes you hot for me to watch me with her, don’t it?” Her, “Yes!”

    Then when she goes into her “You are always talking about other women” phase I throw at her – “You asked for it.” Well she has no ammunition. Because she did ask for it.

    But as I said. Keeping all this going is an effort. I’d rather do other things. Not because like a lot of MGTOW I have no other options – but because I do.

  37. Off-topic question gents:

    I’m in my 30’s, about to be divorced. (3-4 months)

    What’s the best forum in the manosphere for me to ask specific game advice, have a progress thread, and so on?

  38. “It would be nice though wouldn’t it?”

    It would be nice if manna fell from the heavens as well.

    ” . . . at some point it would be nice to not be burdened with the bullshit.”

    Even Atlas shrugged. If the burden is too great, put it down and take a rest.

    ” . . .at some point the shit has to stop.”

    All my sickness will be over, when I lay my burden down.
    All my troubles will be over, when I lay my burden down.
    I’m feeling so much better, since I laid my burden down.

  39. @Cave Clown: “I’m not being critical of anyone here . . .”

    Certainly you are. And your criticism was on point as well. Own it. Don’t do that passive aggressive back pedalling, that shit’s for the women’s circle. Women taught you to do that to keep peace with them.

    How’s that workin’ out for ya?

  40. “@Cave Clown: “I’m not being critical of anyone here . . .”
    Certainly you are. And your criticism was on point as well. Own it. Don’t do that passive aggressive back pedalling, that shit’s for the women’s circle. Women taught you to do that to keep peace with them.
    How’s that workin’ out for ya?”

    Correct. Thanks for the reality check.

  41. Idealism vs. Reality is not really a paradox the way I see it.

    “And isn’t it a bad thing to be deceived about the truth, and a good thing to know what the truth is? For I assume that by knowing the truth you mean knowing things as they really are. .. What is at issue is the conversion of the mind from the twilight of error to the truth, that climb up into the real world which we shall call true philosophy. .. When the mind’s eye rests on objects illuminated by truth and reality, it understands and comprehends them, and functions intelligently; but when it turns to the twilight world of change and decay, it can only form opinions, its vision is confused and its beliefs shifting, and it seems to lack intelligence. (Plato)”

    “My purpose therefore is, to try if I can discover what those principles are, which have introduced all that doubtfulness and uncertainty, those absurdities and contradictions into the several sects of philosophy; insomuch that the wisest men have thought our ignorance incurable, conceiving it to arise from the natural dullness and limitation of our faculties. (George Berkeley)”

    “Nothing seems of more importance, towards erecting a firm system of sound and real knowledge, which may be proof against the assaults of scepticism, than to lay the beginning in a distinct explication of what is meant by thing, reality, existence: for in vain shall we dispute concerning the real existence of things, or pretend to any knowledge thereof, so long as we have not fixed the meaning of those words. (George Berkeley)”

    “At first, I shall say something of natural philosophy. On this subject it is, that the sceptics triumph: all that stock of arguments they produce to depreciate our faculties, and make mankind appear ignorant and low, are drawn principally from this head, that is, that we are under an invincible blindness as to the true and real nature of things. (George Berkeley)”

    “Hence a great number of dark and ambiguous terms presumed to stand for abstract notions, have been introduced into metaphysics and morality, and from these have grown infinite distractions and disputes amongst the learned. (George Berkeley)”

  42. CaveClown – “If you yearn for something that DOES NOT EXIST, you will only be disappointed.”

    Too true. But I am an Eagles fan so disappointment is my constant companion.

    The only answer for me has been to stop yearning altogether. I am not particularly inspired by what does exist. I relish the little moments that break the numbness of reality. I look for those but don’t seek them. I know they are transitory and hold no deeper meaning, but are simply pure amusement. That realization has largely solved my crisis of motivation.

  43. @ M. Simon.
    “As to teaching her Game being ineffective or counter productive? Probably. It is an experiment. And I’m interested in the results. One thing I like to throw in her face is that “I’m teaching you to be a woman. I know female psychology better than you do.” And she admits it is true. That totally disarms her. And it totally amuses me.”

    How do you explain your actions in the light of the Law #9

    Law 9
    Win through your Actions, Never through Argument

    Any momentary triumph you think gained through argument is really a Pyrrhic victory: The resentment and ill will you stir up is stronger and lasts longer than any momentary change of opinion. It is much more powerful to get others to agree with you through your actions, without saying a word.

    Demonstrate, do not explicate.

  44. CaveClown
    July 1st, 2015 at 11:09 am

    This is the very best place to discuss stuff. Without a doubt. A LOT of guys new to Red Pill. A lot with some experience. And the occasional guy who has been living it for a very long time. All with different perspectives. All with something to add. And all willing to hash it out to come up with the best formulas. Or good formulas. Or formulas YOU can use in your particular situation. Or just get you thinking so you can find your own way.

    I have been RP for a very long time. And I’m still learning. This is the best place. No Doubt.

    Thank you Rollo

  45. @M. simon

    I mean a chat room essentially, where I can say, “I approached with blah, blah, blah…she rejected me/gave fake number/gave real number/fucked her in the restroom…what can I do better?”

    Like rooshv forum, but not rooshv forum…

    TRM is not really the place for that.

  46. kfg – “All my sickness will be over, when I lay my burden down.
    All my troubles will be over, when I lay my burden down.
    I’m feeling so much better, since I laid my burden down.”

    Exactly.

    And I will point out that the issue is the burden of performance, not the performance itself. The burden is performing to an audience insufficiently receptive of the performance. The challenge, the goal is finding the right audience.

  47. sjfrellc
    July 1st, 2015 at 11:31 am

    Good question. And I think the answer is that an LTR is not a skirmish. It is a long war. At the beginning the best she could do was stalemate But through constant victories I am now to the point where victory is certain and swift.

    As I said. I think LTR rules are (some) different. It may also depend on the intellect the female has. But I can’t speak to that since my experience of LTRs with different women is limited. The price of success. Less experience.

    There is also an element of “call your shot”. That has a tendency to demoralize the opposition. “What is the point of fighting? He tells me how and with what he is going to beat me. And then he does.”

    I wouldn’t do any of this in early stages. That should be done with a maximum of silence and a maximum of demonstration.

    The problem we are faced with is that there is damned little experience of LTR + Game articulated. And that is because there are so few examples around and in general men are not articulate. My Dad did LTR Game. No record is left except what I remember. And since I did not know what to look for my memory is incomplete at best. In another 20 or 30 years we will know more.

  48. CaveClown @ 8:52 am:
    “1. Less people go to church now.”

    That’s the effect, not the cause. The wrong time to show interest in a girl is when she’s in church trying to convince herself she’s not a slut or you’re blocking her view of Fuckbuddy Guitarist. My social circles were Christian for most of my life and I’m still half-convinced women don’t like sex at all because of how they behaved towards the merest suggestion of romance. A literal Madonna/whore complex.

    One of my most disturbing red-pill epiphanies was realizing Churchian parents had warned their daughters away from the boys in church… but not the boys outside church because what her parents were truly worried about was premature marriage, not premature sex. A side effect of Free Love beliefs?

    And that’s why church dating died.

  49. CaveClown
    July 1st, 2015 at 11:38 am

    I was never a chat room fan. So I’m no help. But I have seen what you ask for done here. On occasion.

  50. Badpainter
    July 1st, 2015 at 11:52 am

    To amplify on that some I’ll repeat something I have been saying for a while.

    For LTR success she has to have oneitis for you. That is the audience you are looking for. An you may have to NEXT a lot until she finds you.

  51. @Caveclown

    Re: Chatrooms, more likely “forums”

    I’m sure Rollo would endorse SoSuave Forum on his sidebar links.

  52. “….the Free Love ideology is very much an evident part of the egalitarian equalism ideology that’s rooted itself in our contemporary culture. As western culture spreads, so too does that equalism rooted in Free Love..”

    Tomassi, it’s a good post, so please don’t take this personally, I mean no disrespect. It’s just that free love is not egalitarian at all and female hypergamy does not rule. Women are the ones who have lost in the equation. Our sexuality used to have worth and value, now we just freely hand it over to men we don’t even like for reasons we can’t even fathom. What do women get out of the deal? We now bear children alone, we turn to the state for protection, and we attempt to deny and pervert our own sexual needs. Women lose all the way around. Do men lose too? Of course, we are tied to each other in this kind of symbiosis and when women can no longer see men’s value in the equation, men can no longer see it in themselves, either.

    Men have benefited the most from free love, birth control, declining marriage rates. Endless access to sex without consequences, without commitment, no intimacy with women, avoidance of spirituality, no motivation to develop your higher selves. It’s sad actually, and the fruits of that are all over the manosphere, resentment, grief, loss, all masked with the usual male pride and hostility, but still it comes across loud and clear.

    And to console yourselves, you speak endlessly of game, as if you can somehow find away to regain some control over what has been lost, stolen, without even recognizing what is missing. An entire ideology or praxeology that has sprung up in the face of such a huge deception, all designed to try and protect and defend male pride. Sheesh, no wonder you guys break my heart.

  53. @M. Simon

    Good points in regard to my question. I have employed overtness and direct talk in LTR game. But only sparingly. I learned early on in Red Pill awareness not to speak out much about it or to explicate Game. Except to confidants or to those that I am not peripherally invested in.

    But since I have a seedbank of monetary provisioning, I can rely on that as long as the emotional account is not overdrawn–so much so as to rely on soft economic dread.

    As in the last essay’s comments at the end, an occasional outburst of indignation to either say no or to accommodate me is necessary in a LTR.

  54. “What do women get out of the deal? Women lose all the way around. ”

    There you go again.

    I’ll answer for the group here. We are indifferent to that.

    “And to console yourselves, you speak endlessly of game, as if you can somehow find away to regain some control over what has been lost, stolen, without even recognizing what is missing. An entire praxeology that has sprung up in the face of such a huge deception, all designed to try and protect and defend male pride. Sheesh, no wonder you guys break my heart.”

    It is not consolation it is improvement. Red Pill awareness explains what is missing and Game practice prevents that from being lost or stolen.

    You can lecture all you want in your Church about the evils of Pride, but don’t lecture about that shit to us here.

    A man without Strength, Courage, Mastery (and pride in that mastery) and Honor (among men) is nothing more than a pussy to society.

    Your ignorance is showing. What other crudely amusing squeaky sounds you got?

  55. I don’t like the term “Beta Game” or “Beta Provider Game” because it requires the player to fake a type of behavior which most guys struggle to change…..For many of us..”Beta Game” is “just be yourself game” with an edge…as long as your conscious of what you’re doing…then it’s game and not reverting back to type.

    I prefer calibration game…or vulnerability game…revealing some intangible about yourself….”I used to be afraid of the dark…but I overcame that by xyz”

    “With the right person, anything can happen…”

    The women I’m now gaming, the 7’s and 8’s who are not used to being gamed because most guys are truly beta…respond well at first to negs and teasing, but when they start asking “Where you from?” that’s when to tone down the asshole game and start working on comfort…while at the same time escalating kino with sexual spikes.

  56. “Do men lose too? Of course, we are tied to each other in this kind of symbiosis and when women can no longer see men’s value in the equation, men can no longer see it in themselves, either.”

    Your symbiosis is my saprophytic. The Rational Male does indeed see men’s value in the equation (so too does one of the other Three R’s). And that is what you have a problem. In order for one’s imperative to succeed, the other’s must be compromised. Talk about idealism vs. realism.

    How bout you try: “….we are tied to each other in this kind of non-equalist equilibrium.”

  57. “I’ll answer for the group here. We are indifferent to that.”

    You actually are not indifferent at all, although you try very hard to be. The flip side of love however, is not indifference, it is actually hatred. The hatred of women, the constant attempts to try and make us smaller, to reduce us to nothing more than a crude squeaky toy, betrays your own lack of indifference and reveals great insecurity, and oddly, love.

    “….we are tied to each other in this kind of non-equalist equilibrium.”

    If you prefer. I have no desire for anything to be “equal.” Symbiosis actually means, “interaction between two different organisms living in close physical association, typically to the advantage of both.”

  58. @CaveClown

    > I mean a chat room essentially, where I can say, “I approached
    > with blah, blah, blah…she rejected me/gave fake number/gave
    > real number/fucked her in the restroom…what can I do better?”

    http://pua-zone.com/

  59. “The flip side of love however, is not indifference, it is actually hatred.”

    Amusing.

    “I have no desire for anything to be “equal.” ”

    Maybe so, but NAWALT.

  60. “The flip side of love however, is not indifference, it is actually hatred.”

    Idiot.

    And Eve blamed Adam for her choices of fruit that day.

    And Adam and all his sons have forever since been trying fix that which they didn’t break, and be responsible for choices they never made.

    The daughters of Eve will never be satisfied. The sons of Adam never unburdened.

  61. I would correct that the opposite of love is indifference, not hate, alas…I did not care enough to do so.

  62. “The flip side of love however, is not indifference, it is actually hatred.”

    It’s quite true, you know. When one is truly indifferent, there is no emotional investment, whatsoever. Hatred requires a great deal of emotion, passion even. One must care to hate.

    And Adam and all his sons have forever since been trying fix that which they didn’t break….

    Au contraire. Adam’s sin was bad all by itself, for he tried to blame his own irresponsibility on God Himself. “This woman YOU gave me…” Adam was created first, in His image, he walked with God. To whom much is given, much is expected. Eve was simply clueless, easily deceived, and quite honest with God about who had deceived her. Adam tried to pass the blame.

    Adam and all his sons have being trying to pass the blame off ever since.

  63. AlphaMen have benefited the most from free love, birth control, declining marriage rates. Endless access to sex without consequences, without commitment, no intimacy with women, avoidance of spirituality, no motivation to develop your higher selves.

    Fixed.

  64. “And that’s why church dating died.”

    “New to the church” game. Go to a new church for awhile. Be real friendly, as everyone will want to meet you. Perfect way to meet women in an “innocent” setting. Men will readily and eagerly introduce you to their bored housewives…if you’re into that.

    Act indifferent to whether you will keep going to the church, and whether you think “her” church is any good, always make sure to miss a few Sundays. This keeps you out of “the flock”, and still an outsider, but still meeting women.

    Get what you want and GTFO before the good christian beta husbands catch on.

    Many years ago and not the highlight of my gaming career, but it worked really well.

    How’s that for, “Endless access to sex without consequences, without commitment, no intimacy with women, avoidance of spirituality, no motivation to develop your higher selves.”???

  65. The opposite of love is hate, both are feelings, opposite sides of the same coin, can be flipped instantly.

    The DEATH of love is indifference.

  66. sanity is right on her description of hate, means that caring is still there, hate can always be flipped back to love, but indifference?

    No chance in hell.

  67. “How’s that for, “Endless access to sex without consequences, without commitment, no intimacy with women, avoidance of spirituality, no motivation to develop your higher selves.”???”

    So that’s how a beta soothes his wounded pride, pretends he’s an alpha, exposes sexual hypocrisy within the church, and performs a rather feminine shit test of God Himself?

    And here I thought men couldn’t multi-task.

  68. https://therationalmale.com/2015/06/12/adaptations-part-i/

    The social contract of Free Love played to the base sexual wants of permissive variety for men, or at least it implied a promised potential for it. Furthermore, and more importantly, Free Love implied this promise free from a burden of performance. It was “free” love, tenuously based on intrinsic personal qualities on the inside to make him lovable – not the visceral physical realities that inspired arousal nor the rigorous status and provisioning performance burdens that had characterized the intersexual landscape prior.

    It should be mentioned that ‘free love’ also played to men’s idealistic concept of love in that freedom from a performance-based love. The equalist all’s-the-same environment was predicated on the idea that love was a mutually agreed dynamic, free from the foundational, sexual strategy realities both sexes applied to love. Thus men’s idealism predisposed them to being hopeful of a performance free love-for-love’s-sake being reciprocated by the women of the age of Aquarius.

    That’s how the social contract looked in the advertising, so it’s hardly surprising that (Beta) men eagerly adapted to this new sexual landscape; going along to get along (or along to get laid) in a way that would seem too good to be true to prior generations. And thus their belief set adapted to the sexual strategy that, hopefully, would pay off for them in this new social condition.

    For women, though not fully realized at the time, this Free Love social restructuring represented a license for optimizing Hypergamy unimpeded by moral restraint and later unlimited (or at least marginalized) by men’s provisional support. For the first time in history women could largely explore a Sandbergian plan for Alpha Fucks and Beta Bucks and, at least figuratively, they could do so at their leisure.

    The problem inherent in the Free Love paradigm was that it was based on a mutual understanding that men and women were functional equals, and as such a mutual trust that either sex would hold the other’s best interests as their own. That basis of trust that either sex was rationally on the same page with regard to their sexual strategies is what set the conditions for the consequent generations to come.

  69. “And here I thought men couldn’t multi-task.”

    We can’t. That’s why threesomes aren’t nearly as much fun as they appear to be. Too much going on. How am I supposed to concentrate on MY pleasure with TWO chicks fighting over me like that?

  70. Insanity
    “It’s just that free love is not egalitarian at all and female hypergamy does not rule. ”

    The egalitarian free love is women’s rights to fuck the guy who gives them the tingle. Beta men don’t fit women’s egalitarian love/fuck.

    “Women are the ones who have lost in the equation. ”

    Because the tingle guy didn’t want to marry you.

    “Our sexuality used to have worth and value,we just freely hand it over to men we don’t even like for reasons we can’t even fathom. ”
    Freely fucked the tingle guy for free.
    The reason you don’t fathom is:
    AF/BB.
    You do fathom that, but I know what it is like to be a woman. , ,To tingle or not to tingle, that is the question.

    What do women get out of the deal?
    The Tingle deal, gets you tingle.
    The bet deal gets you kids + government support.

    ” We now bear children alone, we turn to the state for protection, and we attempt to deny and pervert our own sexual needs. ”

    The tingle fuck is much more sexy “perverted “.

    “Women lose all the way around. Do men lose too?”

    So you end up marrying the beta the you have kids with him then you through him out of the house and then to clear your guilt by telling yourself : I slept with him without tingles so I was a victim.

    Of course, we are tied to each other in this kind of symbiosis and when women can no longer see men’s value in the equation, men can no longer see it in themselves, either.

    It’s men who finally got “it”.

    “Men have benefited the most from free love, birth control, declining marriage rates. Endless access to sex without consequences, without commitment, no intimacy with women, avoidance of spirituality, no motivation to develop your higher selves. ”

    It’s the tingle guy/women who benefited
    The beta had to spend his money on you.

    It’s sad actually, and the fruits of that are all over the manosphere, resentment, grief, loss, all masked with the usual male pride and hostility, but still it comes across loud and clear.

    It’s mostly the betas who are angry not the tingle guys.

    “And to console yourselves, you speak endlessly of game, as if you can somehow find away to regain some control over what has been lost, stolen, ”

    So you knew what was stolen.

    I doubt an attractive sexy woman would have written what you just wrote.

  71. Check out A Renegade History of the United States by Thaddeus Russell.

    During the American Revolution years in Philadelphia, “Never in American history have more ‘illegimate’ children been born, per capita, than during the ear of independence…From 1790 to 2799 there was one parent of a bastard in roughly twenty adults. Between 1805 to 1814, the next documented ten-year period, there was one illegimate for parent in roughly ten adult in the cradle of American liberty.”

  72. “It should be mentioned that ‘free love’ also played to men’s idealistic concept of love in that freedom from a performance-based love.”

    Tomassi, do you ever notice how intricate and deliberate this whole perversion seems, almost as if it were deliberately designed by something far more intelligent and evil then us? No woman could have dreamed that all up, no feminists, no political party. We don’t even possess enough awareness of our own selves, let alone of men, to have even imagined a design that would manage to hit people on so many different levels, biological, sexual, spiritual.

    “Because the tingle guy didn’t want to marry you…..I doubt an attractive sexy woman would have written what you just wrote.”

    All in good humor here, Mr T, but I managed to marry “the tingle guy.” Anything I may have lacked in attraction, I managed to more then compensate for with seduction. I have no idea how. It simply happened. Best “mistake” I ever made, what can I say.

  73. @ Rollo

    What, if any, was the impact of AIDS on the early ’90s? Did this have any particular effect on Gen X men and how they behaved? Any lingering after effects of that?

  74. Insanity
    “All in good humor here, Mr T, but I managed to marry “the tingle guy.” Anything I may have lacked in attraction, I managed to more then compensate for with seduction. I have no idea how. It simply happened. Best “mistake” I ever made, what can I say.”

    I wish you kept ignoring me and my comments .
    Ignoring me felt better.
    Coming here proves you did marry a tingle guy!.
    And you still have no idea how you married a tingle guy?
    WHAT?
    You doubt your pick?

  75. @ Insanity (Agent Smith)

    “And to console yourselves, you speak endlessly of game, as if you can somehow find away to regain some control over what has been lost, stolen, without even recognizing what is missing. An entire ideology or praxeology that has sprung up in the face of such a huge deception, all designed to try and protect and defend male pride. Sheesh, no wonder you guys break my heart.”

    The thing that breaks your heart is that men here and on other sites no longer have women on the pedestal you crave. You hate the red pill, Rollo and Dalrock especially, because they lay bare the feminine mystique. No more performance from men to “have a woman gaze lovingly into your eyes” (I think was the Hallmark comment you made a while back). Now it’s performance to have her lips around your member. That kills you. Yet you keep coming back. Never modifying your approach; never adjusting your strategy. Post after post you are insulted, reviled, out thought, out argued and yet still, here you are.

    To me, the two main points of the red pill are that women are not special and they are not better than men. Forget the mechanics of seducing and living with them upon which you seem so hung up. You said above that women have lost in the equation, they now longer see men’s value in the equation and men can’t see value in themselves. How unbelievably selfish. You didn’t say women don’t see value in men and men don’t see value in women. You just don’t understand that you are not the beginning, middle and end anymore.

    Don’t respond. From now on I will scroll by your name.

  76. Insanity
    The experience of an attractive woman is not the same of an unattractive one.
    If there is a pill to swallow and turn you to Claudia schiffer you would be somewhere else with a different tingle, and your current tingle would be a commenter in this blog.

  77. “I wish you kept ignoring me and my comments. Ignoring me felt better”

    Of course it felt better. What men tend to fear the most is love. It makes them vulnerable. Being hateful or indifferent isn’t nearly as painful.

    “The thing that breaks your heart is that men here and on other sites no longer have women on the pedestal you crave.You hate the red pill, Rollo and Dalrock especially, because they lay bare the feminine mystique.”

    If I genuinely craved a pedestal, you know perfectly well I could have it in about two minutes. With no more effort then it takes to walk into a room, it is all but assured. Terribly unfair, isn’t it?

    I don’t hate Tomassi or Dalrock or the red pill at all. I just dislike seeing men so palpably miserable and unhappy. Even worse, I can clearly see why so many of you are and I still cannot help you.

  78. That’s the finish move for that woman

    ” To me, the two main points of the red pill are that women are not special and they are not better than men. Forget the mechanics of seducing and living with them upon which you seem so hung up. You said above that women have lost in the equation, they now longer see men’s value in the equation and men can’t see value in themselves. How unbelievably selfish. You didn’t say women don’t see value in men and men don’t see value in women. You just don’t understand that you are not the beginning, middle and end anymore. ”

    Perfectly written Atticus

  79. Rollo,

    I gotta beta question for Rollo and whoever else.

    Wife will give me head if I ask, but not any other time.

    In Rational Male world that is seen as: Alpha because she will… Beta because I have to ask. If I applied 2000lbs of pressure on her shoulders while foreplay it’s… Alpha because she will… Beta because she will not just go down on me.

    I use to be AFC until dread worked fantastic in our marriage sex life. Due to the BB forced upon my pathetic life I have hesitations about asking her, when in the past I would just sort of expect it/nudge her down.

    By not addressing these issues for married men on here it is difficult to get those Alpha qualities back. Do I just ignore that she isn’t going down on her own and ask her/slightly nudge her down? Or live with the fact that I will never get head because she will not do it with out prompting from me because I am not her Alpha?

    To me, anyone on these boards is B with A qualities or lower. Maybe a few A with B qualities with a genuine interest in social studies. I have no problem being B. I have/had friends or relatives who are Alpha and their lives are way worse with a crap load of drama. Married at 21 and 23 N count I can live with!

  80. And again it’s all about self-interest.
    There is no love between man and woman….just self-interest.

  81. “If I genuinely craved a pedestal, you know perfectly well I could have it in about two minutes. With no more effort then it takes to walk into a room, it is all but assured. Terribly unfair, isn’t it?”

    In other words

    I can leave my husband at home tonight and knock at the door of my sexy neighbor and flash my boobs when he opens the door and then grab his dick and jerk him off till he comes and at that moment I found myself not at a pedestal but on the floor.
    Now that is power.
    The wild oats project was a good read wasn’t it?.

  82. insanitybytes22…..i really hope for you, that your husband doesn’t discover RP one day

  83. sjfrellc
    July 1st, 2015 at 1:14 pm

    “The flip side of love however, is not indifference, it is actually hatred.”

    Amusing.

    Yes it is. And the Buddhists knew it a LONG time ago. Attachment brings pain.

  84. @Insanity: I notice you left out God’s response to Adam.

    @Mr. T: “If there is a pill to swallow and turn you to Claudia schiffer you would be somewhere else with a different tingle . . .”

    I notice that she left out that she got married four decades ago.

    ” . . . and your current tingle would be a commenter in this blog.”

    It would be an interesting exercise to take the bloke out to a bar, get him a bit tipsy, and turn the conversation to women.

  85. Jeff-

    You are trying to negotiate a sex act in your mind and here because you fear her reaction to a direct request or forced compulsion. You are investigating how you should negotiate with her. This should be a red flag in your mind concerning your sexual self confidence. Sex is a language of sorts where certain acts can be perceived as delightful or repulsive. You are inviting repulsiveness with your apprehension. Psychologically we hamstring ourselves when we cannot completely relax and enjoy.

  86. Insanity
    “you know perfectly well I could have it in about two minutes. With no more effort then it takes to walk into a room, it is all but assured.”

    And this is from a woman who can’t “fathom” Hypergamy?
    You can run but you can’t hide.
    Pussy pass?

  87. Women lost? Well no. They gave it up.

    For things to work the female must commit. The male must commit. Once the choice is made you are stuck with it. You do your best. Continuously.

    Now everyone is looking for a better deal. All the time. What do women get out of it? Used up at 30. Men? About 20% run up their score and most of the rest get little or nothing. This may be the natural order of things. Which only says that civilization is unnatural.

    My idiot LTR at least committed to one thing – divorce and impermanent relationships are bad for kids. What ever her other faults – she at least knew that much. Which is a hell of a lot more that most child bearers know these days.

    Thing is – the LTR wanted romance – and funny – she couldn’t get up enough commitment for that. Ah. Well. I’m not going to romance some one I expect will break up with me next week. I used to think I could teach it to her. But no. It is not that I can’t teach it. It is way worse than that. It is she doesn’t want to practice what has been taught. I have given her the experience of ecstatic bonding. And she prefers fear, uncertainty, and doubt. And I used to think – well it is just her. AWALT.

    Women are godless creatures. Anti-spiritual. The LTR used to say in the early days that she was looking for God. I showed her how to live it. And she? Preferred the occasional taste as relief from her self destruction. Permanent ecstasy? Not interested.

  88. Spanish word for wives – “esposas”

    Spanish word for handcuffs – “esposas”

    Spanish word for engagement – “compromiso” (compromise)

    Poverty, marriage, monogamy, religion, law…..all are inventions of civilization.

    We are not what we pretend to be….what we are conditioned to think we “should” be.

  89. http://www.examiner.com/article/how-women-s-beauty-interferes-with-men-s-rationality?cid=sm-twitter-6.30.15-9.00pm-BeautyRationalityStudy

    Wow.

    Men must reject standards of beauty as defined by group-think. I’ve always been just a tad uncomfortable with all of the SMV talk with regards to females. HB9? whatever. What does that even mean in the big picture? By the time I was in my mid 20″s I had a revelation. A lot of this revelation had to do with having 3 very pretty sisters, dozens of female cousins that I spent a lot of time around, and many more female friends that I grew up with.

    Watching women grow up from toddlers to womanhood is amazing. It’s not that THEY are amazing, but the circumstances around their existence is amazing. The ” beautiful ” chicks get separated from the herd and singled out for special treatment, and this treatment continues until they fuck up and gain too much weight, or go crashing hard into the wall at older age. This is the rule and there are precious few exceptions.

    Take notice of how some of the most beautiful bishes you’ve ever seen didn’t appear to be all that interesting beyond their looks. Be honest about it and don’t let your eyes trick your mind.

    The article above is an example of brainwashing at it’s very finest. What I mean by that is that men guide and establish standards of beauty, and we often reinforce these standards to each other ad nauseam. Scientists try to establish measurements of beauty and, well, who can argue with scientists?

    And what is the end results? Men losing rationality over something that they SEE and assign some special value as dictated by a set of standards.

    Be very, very careful with your mind gentlemen. Bending your brain to meet standards established by others through group-think is what got many of us into Blue Pill hell in the first place.

    Sidestep that shit if at all possible.

    I don’t doubt the veracity of the article. I’m just sayin’ don’t be those guys. Talk to pretty chicks but mind your thoughts. She looks the way she does via an accident of birth. She didn’t do anything but be born. And don’t fall for all of the extras. Develop and ability to see through all of the Revlon and Maybeline and hair coloring and eyelashes, spray tan, teeth whitening, push up bras, tight clothes… etc. etc. etc.

    It’s just a broad. They’re all just broads until you discern something else other than broadness in them.

    So should you go chasing after homely chicks or linebackers in skirts? Nah, not if that’s not what you want. Just don’t work yourself up too much over visual cues. Sometimes all that perceived beauty is wrapped around the most miserable, ether brained bitch. Make judgment calls that suit your requirements, and one of your requirements is not to be made a fool of.

  90. The majority of new relationships are now being started in the two environments where men who are not in the upper 20% of the population are heavily disadvantaged.

    Seriously, that graph alone tells so many important stories I don’t even know where to start.

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