Socialized Hypergamy

2

This weekend’s discussion post was inspired by commenter Johnnycomelateley

Rape hysteria also has a deeper motive, equalitarianism (high taxes and social distribution) has changed the economic ecology and altered the incentives for female bonding patterns.

Several economists and anthropologists contend that society is transitioning from monogamy to serial monogamy (serial polygyny).

For serial polygyny to be facilitated women require absolutely unfettered, unrestricted, unconditional, uncommitted, unrestrained, unmoralizing, independent and completely free and unqualified safe access to sexual free choice. Unbounded by contracts, agreements, social norms, moral restraints, religious injunctions, social ties, aesthetic norms, maternal obligations, infanticide (abortion), selling progeny (adoption) and economic restrictions.

Anything that is deemed as restrictive is seen as limiting this choice, male spaces, employment obstacles, undesirable attention, unsafe neighbourhoods, male aesthetic standards, religion and of course rape.

What we are seeing is ‘choice hysteria’, anytime someone somewhere restricts female sexual choice it is met with unbounded fury. Even centuries long legal precedents and wrongful imprisonment must acquiesce to facilitate free choice.

Here are some quotes showing we are transitioning to serial polygyny.

Murdock’s (1967) Ethnographic Atlas categorized just 16% of 862 cultures as exclusively monogamous, with polygamy being found at some level in the rest.

A 2011 study from the U.S. Centers for Disease Control found that just 23% of women and 14.7% of men aged 25-44 had one (or zero) opposite-sex lifetime partners.

Frank Marlowe, Biological Anthropology – Cambridge
When males provide all the income but some have much more than others, richer males achieve polygyny, while ecologically imposed monogamy prevails in case of moderate inequality. When males provide an intermediate level of investment with little variation, females are not excessively dependent on males and serial monogamy may arise.

David de la Croix, Professor of Economics
In a society with few rich males and virtually no rich females, polygyny is supported by rich males, who can naturally monopolize a larger number of partners, and poor females, who prefer to be the n-th wife of a rich male rather than marrying a poor male monogamously.

Eventually, however, the number of rich males increases enough, and poor females prefer to marry monogamously.

Serial monogamy follows from a further enrichment of the society, through a rise in either the share of rich males, or the the proportion of rich females.

Monique Mulder, Anthropology
A key finding here is that while men do not benefit from multiple marriages, women do. Although the data are very variable (large standard errors), women appear to gain more from multiple mating than do men.

I’ve written more than a few posts about equalism here, but one thing that needs to be made clear is that a true state of egalitarian equalism among the sexes is neither tenable nor sustainable in any realistic measure. There is always a dominant / submissive dynamic in all human relations (not just intersexual ones), even in same sex pairings. While that dom-sub relation may be flexible in various circumstantial instances, the meta-relationship dynamic tends to place the more dominant personality at the top of an intersexual relation.

For the better part of human history this dominance has been expected from a Man, and I daresay as a species we evolved into that dominant role both physically and psychologically. But for the past 60+ years, since the advent of ubiquitous, unilaterally female-controlled hormonal birth control, the social and physical constraints of women’s innate Hypergamy, that had been kept in check by Men’s default dominance, has been unfettered.

When I wrote Owed Sex I went into detail about how women’s perception of their hypergamous choices have been contained by men:

The premise that a man would ever be ‘owed’ sex for anything is offensive to the feminine imperative because it offends women’s self-entitlement to being filters of their own hypergamy, plain and simple. Women’s hypergamy dictates whom they will and will not fuck according to their sexual strategy’s most urgent needs.

To presume a man is ‘owed’ sex for services rendered, or due to his own self-perceived prequalifications for a woman’s intimacy, is to remove women’s control of the decision making / filtering process of their hypergamy.

The offensiveness doesn’t come from the notion that men would need to perform in order to get sex, but rather that a man might forcibly assume control of a woman’s hypergamous determining of his sexual suitability for her.

When I wrote that post it was before the Yes Means Yes law had been enacted as well as before the “rape crisis” hysteria we find ourselves in as the result of the machinations of a feminist writer who actively hunts for pulp fiction rape stories to embellish. All now proven a complete and calculated fabrication.

However the base motivation is still the same, and I agree with Johnnycomelately, the social press for equalism is a suitable mask for socialized Hypergamy.

The Feminine Imperative isn’t interested in anything like an idealized state of egalitarian equalism between the sexes; it is only interested in unilateral, uncontested, and socially assured optimization of women’s Hypergamy.

Equalism is an anathema to Hypergamy.

So long as women are subject to innate hypergamous influences there can never be a socialized state of egalitarian equalism between men and women. By its very nature the Feminine Imperative will always seek an unequal state – maximal restriction of male sexuality and maximal unrestriction of optimized feminine Hypergamy. The persistence of pressing the idea that equalism between the sexes is a realizable goal state is necessary to achieve those maximized / optimized conditions.

For men, the end result of that optimized state is really a form of normative, accepted, socialized cuckoldry. However, the efforts to achieve this state are in social evidence all around us now.

Milo Yiannopoulos has an excellent two-part article, Sexodus, on Breitbart London outlining the cultural impact socialized Hypergamy is having on men today and how they are “checking out of society”.

In part two Milo explains:

Men, driven, as many of them like to say, by fact and not emotion, can see that society is not fair to them and more dangerous for them. They point to the fact that they are more likely to be murder victims and more likely to commit suicide. Women do not choose to serve in the Armed Forces and they experience fewer deaths and injuries in the line of work generally.

Women get shorter custodial sentences for the same crimes. There are more scholarships available to them in college. They receive better and cheaper healthcare, and can pick from favourable insurance packages available only to girls. When it comes to children, women are presumed to be the primary caregiver and given preferential treatment by the courts. They have more, better contraceptive options.

Women are less likely to be homeless, unemployed or to abuse drugs than men. They are less likely to be depressed or to suffer from mental illness. There is less pressure on them to achieve financial success. They are less likely to live in poverty. They are given priority by emergency and medical services.

Some might call these statistical trends “female privilege.” Yet everywhere and at all times, say men’s rights advocates, the “lived experiences” and perceived oppression of women is given a hundred per cent of the airtime, in defiance of the reality that women haven’t just achieved parity with men but have overtaken them in almost every conceivable respect. What inequalities remain are the result of women’s choices, say respectable feminist academics such as Christina Hoff Sommers, not structural biases.

And yet men are constantly beaten up over bizarre invented concepts such as rape culture and patriarchal privilege. The bizarre but inevitable conclusion of all this is that women are fueling their own unhappiness by driving men to consider them as sex objects and nothing more, because the thought of engaging in a relationship with a woman is horrifying, or too exhausting to contemplate.

I don’t see men as ‘checking out’ of society so much as I see them being  forced to develop personal and cultural contingencies to adapt to a feminine-primary social order that’s based on socialized Hypergamy. The obvious comparisons to Japan’s culture of “herbivorous” men is nothing new to the manosphere, but what is new is the increasing awareness of the consequences of socialized Hypergamy.

The MGTOW movement (such as it is) is a good example of this adaptation, but even men going their own way are still directly and indirectly subject to the social pressures created by feminine social primacy and socialized Hypergamy. Irrespective of how insulated a man may think he is with regard to interacting with women, he’s still subject to the correlative impact of the societal changes that mandate maximally restricting his sexuality while legislating women’s right to optimal Hypergamy into law.

Imagined “rape crisis” hysteria, affirmative consent laws, politicians attempting to redefine rape as men ‘misrepresenting’ themselves in order to have sex with a woman, and defining domestic abuse as “restricting of finances“, higher divorce rates, marriage rates at an all time low, are all evidence of a feminine-primary socialization of Hypergamy that hides behind an egalitarian ruse.

The more men refuse to cooperate with socialized Hypergamy, the more the Feminine Imperative will legislate their compliance with it. But at some point it will reach a state of critical mass. The UVA gang rape hoax, the fem-centric maliciousness of Sabrina Rubin-Erdely and the blind, ego-invested adherence to an unassailable feminine correct narrative of its ‘believers’ was a good primer for this critical mass.

Most of what I’ve delved into here has been manosphere staple for more than 13 years now, but the mainstream exposure from the likes of Milo and even the national dialogue generated from the UVA gang rape hoax (as deliberately distractive as it is), is evidence that the previously hidden social machinations of feminine social primacy are becoming unignorable.

As Open Hypergamy and the Sandbergian embrace of women’s sexual pluralism becomes more normative, so too will Red Pill awareness become more mainstream. Men aren’t dropping out of feminine-primary society, they’re adapting contingencies for it, learning workarounds, comparing notes, and a growing Red Pill awareness is at the heart of that adaptation, even for men who’ve never heard of it.

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strauMan (@strauMan)
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The irony is how the “Patriarchy” is being replaced by a much realized Matriarchy in the name of “equality”.

TC
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TC

Feminism is the new Fascism.

melmoth
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melmoth

The more power women get, the more insane their claims of victimhood will become. That’s what’s so troubling. —-War on Women —–1 in 5 rape hysteria, now often 1 in 4 (Oh, go ahead and whittle it down to 1 in 3. And not just 1 in 3 assaults but go on with ‘1 in 3 will be raped’ You know that’s coming and will soon be gospel.) —–International rage against a T-shirt —–Slut walks —UVA —-GamerGate (which I’ve hardly followed. Sounds crazy.) —–‘Free the Nipple’ Documentaries. (How perfect. Simultaneous victim pandering with veiled crowing over their sexual power.) —-Eva… Read more »

LiveFearless
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One of my doctors is the best in the world at her specialty, she has a waiting list for new patients. I credit her with figuring out how to make an important part of my body work again after the hit and run accident had caused permanent damage. She recently asked for my advice on a long-distance relationship with a man that lives more than 1,000 miles away, has children and an established medical practice that he cannot move away from. I’ve been the man in a few LDRs in my life (though I have no children), and further, “Professor… Read more »

LiveFearless
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@melmoth It’s a risk to publicly associate with GamerGate but it’s important. Why? It’s a template for how to stand up against the false narratives which receive unlimited funding even if advertising dollars do not exist. Most people, not just men, have chosen to be completely oblivious to how destructive the popular narratives are. They continue to absorb the “news” and other popular content. Few have challenged the narratives until recently. Only ONE journalist (Richard Bradley) challenged the false UVA story at first. I’m not a Gamer, but I admire heroes that are Gamers that have been attacked yet they… Read more »

Hmmm
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Hmmm

Rollo (and others), what do you predict will happen when we reach this “critical mass” you referred to?

Mr T.
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Mr T.

Up till the 60s married people use to have 5 to 8 children sometimes 14.

When the feminist war began, married people stated to have 1 or 2.

Now men and women -if- they Co- habit
They have no children.

In 50 years, everyone is for him/her self.
What a great population control.
Thank you feminists, you are the islamists best friend…now I know why moslems think one day they will rule the western world.

M Simon
Guest

Mr T. December 12th, 2014 at 3:22 am It is happening to the Islamists too. Why do you think that one of their promises to newly recruited fighters is a captured woman? Why do you think they are such crazed fighters? Their world order is breaking down. Wealth reduces birth rates. The tipping point 10 or 20 years ago was $4k per year. I have no idea what it is in today’s dollars. Now a look at who is actually reproducing in the first world. Jews in Israel. You can look it up. =========== A GamerGate primer: http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-London/2014/12/11/GamerGate-Anti-Bullying-Campaign-cost-Gawker-over-a-Million-Dollars The cost… Read more »

Hobbes
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Hobbes

We need more options. The invasion of male spaces,I think, has been the most brilliant move on the part of the FI. MGTOW, Game etc are basically the two paths available to men at this point- well, I guess you could also choose the path of head-in-the-sand-beta, but I think that quickly becomes impossible for any man who sees the current climate clearly. I think this may be the greatest motivator for the FI’s invasion and destruction of all male spaces- it basically not just keeps men from enlightening each other, but also keeps men from setting up systems that… Read more »

M Simon
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Hobbes December 12th, 2014 at 4:44 am IMO no matter what – the old life is not coming back. The conditions required continual fear and danger of violent death, and the life of man, solitary, poor, nasty, brutish, and short. are generally undesired – even by men. So who wants that kind of life today? The Islamists. And they are not very popular. They gain ground by violence not acclamation. And the beginnings of our robot armies are being deployed against them. Time is not on their side. The FI is here to stay and if you can’t stand having… Read more »

BC
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BC

Men aren’t dropping out of feminine-primary society, they’re adapting contingencies for it, learning workarounds, comparing notes, and a growing Red Pill awareness is at the heart of that adaptation

Red Pill awareness and resulting contingencies and workarounds are equivalent to the birth and growth of a black market. When free economic activity is suppressed and penalized to the point that people are unable to get what they want/need, a black market always arises because “nature will not be thwarted for long.”

MGTOW in all its forms and degrees = smugglers and pirates

Johnycomelately
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Johnycomelately

For the sake of accuracy (this is an important blog read by important people), the Marlowe quote was a summary statement of one of his conclusions by David de la Croix concerning this paper:

Marlowe, Frank. 2000. “Paternal Investment and the Human Mating System.” Behavioural Processes 51:45–61.

If any of the readers is an academic it would be most appreciated if a link could be provided to this paper as it is a seminal work in the field and very difficult to get a hold of.

Niccolo Machiavelli
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Niccolo Machiavelli

“Fhank you feminists, you are the islamists best friend…now I know why moslems think one day they will rule the western world.”

Finally, someone got it! 🙂

M Simon
Guest

Niccolo Machiavelli December 12th, 2014 at 6:52 am Uh. I don’t think it will work out as you envision. The Islamists are in fact weak. They are trying to bring back an age long gone. The environment is not conducive to their endeavor. They are very good at 20th century warfare. Boots on the ground. But they are unprepared for 21st Century robots in the air. And on top of that great wealth everywhere militates against the culture they wish to revert to. It may take 20 or 30 years but they will be but a road stain when it… Read more »

heyjay
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heyjay

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0376635700001182#

The paper can be found here, however I can’t upload it…

M Simon
Guest

To the extent that one sex invests more in offspring than the other, the one that does more investing sex is in short supply resulting in operational sex ratios greater than unity and competition for mates among members of the sex that does less investing. This public goods problem generates the third major trade-off: that between mating and parental effort. Sexual reproduction involves two components: finding a mate and achieving a mating, on the one hand, and investing in the resulting offspring to increase its viability, on the other. To the extent that there are gains from specialization in the… Read more »

Badpainter
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M. Simon – “But they are unprepared for 21st Century robots in the air.”

They aren’t capable of 20th century warfare either, and it’s a good thing they didn’t face it, and they’ll do just fine against robots so long as those robots are directed by the types of pussies that gave us a double loss in the GWOT. The greatest weapons are useless in the hands of those unwilling to use actually use them.

M Simon
Guest

Trivers’ parental investment model states that individuals facing higher levels of parental investment will become increasingly choosy in their choice of mates. For humans, this leads to two predictions. First, both males and females will be choosier in relationships more likely to lead to the production of children. Second, females will be choosier than are males, because their minimum risk of parental investment is higher. Previous studies of human mate choice found support for these predictions, with one curious exception: …….

http://beheco.oxfordjournals.org/content/16/1/57.full

M Simon
Guest

Badpainter
December 12th, 2014 at 7:57 am

It is a long war. And leaving the field to the enemy is not what I would consider a loss.

You may recall that we “lost” ‘Nam. And now 40 years on they are supplicants.

If jihadis annoy us enough we will go back and do something.

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Fighter+Copters+gone+wild+IRAQ

M Simon
Guest

Given this, the phenomenon of human paternal in vestment is extraordinary and the focus of this chapter (see also Draper & Harpending, 1988; Flinn & Low, 1986; Geary, 2000; Geary & Flinn, 2001; Marlowe,2000). Human paternal investment is considered in terms of the benefits of providing care to children and the costs of investment from the males’ perspective, as well as cost-benefit trade-offs from the females’ perspective.

http://web.missouri.edu/~gearyd/paternalinvest%5BChapFINAL%5D.pdf

Sisyphean
Guest

High stability, high security, lots of available food, low chance of being murdered or raped, begets feminine control. The less strength matters, the less being able to shoot or live off the land or build something of value matters, the more the civilization will be dominated by those born with people skills, the emotional, the manipulative, the useless in a fight. If you really want to return to women needing men, we need only have a civil war here again, one that touches every city, every state. The funny part is, I don’t think anyone will have to make this… Read more »

Brett
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Brett

Sisyphean

December 12th, 2014 at 8:52 am

That sounds about right, need something to just kill hypergamy and put FI in its place.

Bango Tango
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Bango Tango

“Fhank you feminists, you are the islamists best friend…now I know why moslems think one day they will rule the western world.” Finally, someone got it! 🙂 As much as I believe the only real solution is putting women back in birkahs and stoning them to death if they are sluts, I have to concede that in the modern world that is probably never going to happen (unfortunately). Men raised in western culture who have daughters could never adopt a hardcore stance like that and no matter how sympathetic they might be to some men’s issues would still rather see men… Read more »

Glenn
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Glenn

Another great piece, thanks Rollo. My thoughts: Male spaces – I remember falling in love with the game of golf when I was about 34. I was dragged out on a corporate golf outing, but luckily had a great caddy who showed me how to swing a bit. I hit a 7 iron 155 yards, dropping in 5 ft from the cup and I swear, it was the best thing that had happened to me in a long time. I bought clubs the next day and began taking lessons and playing in earnest. One of the things I quickly discovered… Read more »

agent p
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agent p

Every once in a while I read the Misandry bubble as a reminder of one idea of what could happen. Then I reflect and think to myself, nahh, that’s all a bit overcooked. Then Rollo goes and does a post like this and I go back and actually give it a little bit more weight in my mind. As a Red Pill Guy, I have to be aware of my own potential ego-investment in the idea of something like the Misandry bubble coming to pass, or my secret longing for the world to shit itself and for things to go… Read more »

theasdgamer
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“Relationships are complicated and take communication and work.”

Red Pill translation: “She needs a man to manage her emotional chemistry” See my blog post about relationships.

TAnon
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TAnon

M Simon
December 12th, 2014 at 5:20 am

“IMO no matter what – the old life is not coming back.”

I don’t think this model is sustainable, something will have to happen at some point.

M Simon
Guest

Bango Tango December 12th, 2014 at 9:24 am Men used to be so good at understanding nature and working with it. And now you propose fighting it on unfavorable ground? You want women to fall in line? Then men must endeavor to be uncivilized again. We must institutionalize a life of continual fear and danger of violent death. Poor, nasty, brutish, and short. Then men will again be in their rightful place in the order of things. ====================== Nostalgia for what was is not going to return us to those thrilling days of yesteryear. Hypergamy is the natural order. Monogamy… Read more »

M Simon
Guest

TAnon
December 12th, 2014 at 10:45 am

I agree. We will need to find a new model. But that is up to men.

And men will have to take woman’s nature into account. Nostalgia for a lost civilization retards that.

The one thing that is achievable is DNA testing of the children so that no AFC is forced to support offspring not his. That is doable. If men united around it.

M Simon
Guest

Brett December 12th, 2014 at 9:21 am …need something to just kill hypergamy and put FI in its place. You are forgetting that it is genetic and that FI/hypergamy is the best strategy for women. So good it is inborn. And gets passed down. Too much blaming of women. Do we blame hungry tigers for eating people? Or adapt to that as best we can? We are going to have to adapt to women in a rich society. I don’t think being poor is the answer. Even if we could do it. Women have the vote and outnumber us. NEXT… Read more »

M Simon
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For those of you who haven’t read it:

http://www.singularity2050.com/2012/06/a-first-quarter-poll-on-the-misandry-bubble.html

Which links back to “The Misandry Bubble”.

As to Western Governments going bankrupt: doubtful. We are on the threshold of so many advances that I think such a thing is unlikely.

Just for one – full exploitation of cannabinoids in medicine could save $1 trillion a year in the USA alone.

Nuclear fusion – It may be closer than you think. And lots of other stuff.

BuenaVista
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BuenaVista

In respect of thwarting MGTOW, and the availability of porn as an alternative to female companionship, we see the collaboration of a tradcon male and some feminist academics who would criminalize the transmission of pornography (which they deem universally demeaning and degrading to women, and promoting violence against women). They deem it now a ‘public health’ crisis, which is also a 2nd Amendment rhetorical workaround the gun controllers use.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/dec/11/pornography-use-affects-real-relationships/?page=all#pagebreak

TAnon
Guest
TAnon

M Simon
December 12th, 2014 at 11:18 am

“Maybe a society with 80% Male Alpha Game is possible.”

But is Alpha/Beta a dichotomy? Isn’t it more of a spectrum? With more and more men learning game wouldnt the bar just keep rising?

Softek
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Softek

“…so too will Red Pill awareness become more mainstream. Men aren’t dropping out of feminine-primary society, they’re adapting contingencies for it, learning workarounds, comparing notes, and a growing Red Pill awareness is at the heart of that adaptation, even for men who’ve never heard of it.” That’s the most inspirational quote I’ve seen here so far. And too true. As Hobbes said…the gloves have to come off. And they are. My eyes have been opened a bit uncomfortably to what’s going on in social media. Since reading all of the stuff here on RM so many things have become crystal… Read more »

TAnon
Guest
TAnon

Softek
December 12th, 2014 at 11:39 am

“From MEN. MEN are writing things like this.”

Well, in the end it is men that gave women rights (regardless if a certain group had a hand in it).

Water Cannon Boy
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Water Cannon Boy

The hard work may not need to be more than calling out the crap that’s happening as is. Be vocal about all that was wrong with the Rolling Stone article and don’t allow that to morph into how the truthfulness some how doesn’t matter because the “epidemic” of college rape is being looked at. Point out how asking for he for she and whatever other appeals for men to facilitate women’s needs or feelings of safety is asking for patriarchy. If you decide a career goal to avoid a bowling shirt, you weren’t going to make it anyway. Like the… Read more »

New Yorker
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New Yorker

Great article Rollo. What the current situation does is show the nature of human relations in its true light. While it destroys the blue pill bubble, I don’t think that it automatically makes one a hedonist. We can enjoy the physical and emotional intimacy with women while understanding that it only represents today. It comes down to living and appreciating life one moment at a time no matter what it brings. Once we stop investing ourselves in virgin fantasies (although a low N woman is a must for any serious LTR) we can enjoy people as they are without the… Read more »

thedeti
Guest

Good article. THe point to me is that we’ve transitioned almost completely away from men having any real social power as men. Hypergamy is no longer simply a feature of women that served to get her the best man she could get. Hypergamy now is a societal pillar, a foundational element, an organic basis of the social order. We see this in Sandberg’s statement arguing for the institutionalization of alpha fux, beta bux. And it won’t be necessarily set in stone, but AFBB is already firmly acculturated, meaning it is just the way it’s done now. It’s de rigueur for… Read more »

kobayashii1681
Guest

“The Feminine Imperative isn’t interested in anything like an idealized state of egalitarian equalism between the sexes; it is only interested in unilateral, uncontested, and socially assured optimization of women’s Hypergamy.” “So long as women are subject to innate hypergamous influences there can never be a socialized state of egalitarian equalism between men and women. By its very nature the Feminine Imperative will always seek an unequal state – maximal restriction of male sexuality and maximal unrestriction of optimized feminine Hypergamy.” Every man should have this engraved into hi subconscious and always have it as a mantra in his daily… Read more »

kobayashii1681
Guest

*his

redlight
Guest
redlight

“…doesn’t matter because the ‘epidemic’ of college rape is being looked at”

also point out there is no epidemic

see report now out: Rape and Sexual Assault Victimization Among College-Age Females, 1995–2013

http://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/rsavcaf9513.pdf

“rate of rape and sexual assault was 1.2 times higher for non-students (7.6 per 1,000) than for students (6.1 per 1,000)”

Princess
Guest
Princess

When you say men are adapting to the changing society, you’re talking about middle-aged men, right? Because I spend mosto f my time with young men and they aren’t adapting to anything. They’re pursuing young women. Men will never stop chasing after women. Its human nature. Most men cannot live without female approval and MGTOW will never work out because those guys are old and no one wants them anyway. You honestly believe that any young guy is going to reject women/stop chasing after them because women are ”hypergamous” and can rack up the numbers of sexual partners in a… Read more »

charles
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charles

Great post and great comments. Although i do not have the ability to say all of above so eloquently, which in past frustrated me to no end, now i am glad to see that you guys can do it for me. With all of being said i do not believe that any prediction or speculation of future development is accurate. Just consider how much crap is coming every day. We may not be surprised but did we expect it? It may be that that in it’s core we have full understanding of the matter but still we are actually not… Read more »

Mark Minter
Guest

I have determined there are two deeply ingrained instincts in women, deep, deep down in the functional wiring of them similar to the way that they might see the color red, or how they might interpret the notion 2+2, and in the case of one these instincts, in the same manner that vommit or feces repulses them. These are not learned instincts in the least, they are inherent, foundational in how they receive the stimuli of the world, process it, and form values, judgement, and action. The first is a deep fundamental entitlement to access to all forms of cooperation… Read more »

Princess
Guest
Princess

”Every man should have this engraved into hi subconscious and always have it as a mantra in his daily life. Our sons’ should be raised knowing this.” Man, only a handful of men are worth anything. The great men of history, the male models, the football stars, the Brad Pitts and the Tom Cruises of the world. The rest of us exist to make women’s lives as comfortable as possible. One thing I learned when I was a teenager is that regardless of what I achieve, I will never be anything to half of the human population because i’m not… Read more »

kobayashii1681
Guest

After reading Milo’s article I just snigger at the way the FI is constantly pushing the whole idea that women are ‘stronger’ or ‘better’ than us….shit is laughable, inordinately stupefying lack of awareness.

Princess
Guest
Princess

The first is a deep fundamental entitlement to access to all forms of cooperation and support from men. They cannot fathom any other way. It is so ingrained in each of them that it is collectively expressed as a given among women.” This is true. During my first year in college I met a French-Canadian girl, she was attractive and had long dark hair with long legs and very white skin with incredibly blue eyes. Obviously I figured this girl was trouble on heels and although I was pleasant to her when I first met her, I realized that I… Read more »

kobayashii1681
Guest

@ LiveFearless

Well said…We adapt!

“She brought up her friends, saying, “most of my girlfriends are wonderful women with so much to give. They are independent and strong and do not need a man to take advantage of. Most women I know want to raise a family and take care of a man. Relationships are complicated and take communication and work.””

FI INGSOC delusion/anthem…

kobayashii1681
Guest

@Hobbes – “Men need to develop the same ruthlessness.”
Indeed…

I remember Helen Smith, on an interview, saying something to the effect of, one day men will get tired of putting up with all this FI business…that day, in all its forms, is fast approaching.

Novaseeker
Guest
Novaseeker

Mind the trolls, Rollo ….

TAnon
Guest
TAnon

Mark Minter
December 12th, 2014 at 12:30 pm

“My opinion is that this bias needs to addressed in the courts in the same manner as Civil Rights. That it need be recognized under the law, in a manner as real, as demonstrable, as pervasive, as oppressive as Civil Rights. And that institutions needs to recognize this, revise policy to prohibit it, and even search their institutional soul for existence of it, and move to stamp it out.”

You’re forgetting something. You live in a democracy where women can vote.

Glenn
Guest
Glenn

Redlight – Such a great link. But the facts don’t matter. To those here who think they can argue women into a state of reasonableness, I suggest you talk to the old married guys here. Never works. Ever. I guess I just accept it. For me the most important Red Pill truth is this. Women choose. Men compete for sex with them – it’s an innate power imbalance in our social system. What really made me be okay with that is recognizing that all of life is a competition of sorts. I mean, why should I whine that women want… Read more »

Nathan
Guest
Nathan

The solution is simple.

What kept this in check before?

Answer: fire and brimstone severely conservative Christianity.

The regain of that, NOT howdy doody Joel Osteen(!), is what will work.

“civil rights” cannot hold a candel to Jonathan Edwards

kobayashii1681
Guest

@ CountingStars – I hear you brother. Be selfish.
Don’t think I’m casting pussy aside tho’…:) whether I pay for it or game women to put it in my hand. I will do me regardless.
It is great being awake!

Mr T.
Guest
Mr T.

Yes. Feminist movement is destroying the society by destroying families, and there you have it, a failed state.
How long it will take? Another 100 years?.
Yeah, keep on destroying men.

Princess
Guest
Princess

” then excludes all others and denies these men the possibility of participating in relationships key to fundamental happiness in life.” Dude, I’ve read your long-winded rant and I gotta say that as a young man, I am not entitled to sex. I know that its hard to undertstand that, but men aren’t owed any woman. If you read any literature from, I dunno, any friking century, you’ll realize that even the super hot dudes like Siegfried and Lancelot had to win over the chick they wanted. And even super Alpha males like King Arthur who was both very handsome,… Read more »

Princess
Guest
Princess

”Welcome back Princess. I keep telling you, there’s no need to spoof the comments, it’s an open forum. Bonus points for impersonating a man this time though.” lol dude, that paranoia. I would text you dick picks but I don’t swing that way, and if I did, there are plenty of hot guys in their 20s I know of. I know its hard to consider this but a guy can still be a man while staying away from the herd. Which is what the red-pill/mgtow movement is. A bunch of guys who are rejected by women and band-up to whine… Read more »

Tam the Bam
Guest
Tam the Bam

“The MGTOW movement (such as it is) is a good example of this adaptation, but even men going their own way are still directly and indirectly subject “ I can see the ShakyCam drone footage now, as a ticker tape plays bogus rape stats below the talking head. “MigTows discovered hiding Rapists in backwoods cabins!” “MigTow: The underground railroad for Misogynists” “MigTows infiltrate the working class; The President must act at once!” “Any man not in a relationship with either a Gay or Lady owner is a saboteur! Denounce these criminals, citizens!!” and then the orgasmic shudder of the local… Read more »

agent p
Guest
agent p

CountingStars

December 12th, 2014 at 1:47 pm

”Welcome back Princess. I keep telling you, there’s no need to spoof the comments, it’s an open forum.
Bonus points for impersonating a man this time though.”

lol dude, that paranoia. I would text you dick picks but I don’t swing that way

Is it me or is princess now mixing up his / her / cis-whatever aliases?
Writes as princess, gets welcomed back to the conversation by Rollo, responds as Counting stars.

Funny shit

kobayashii1681
Guest

Just saw this in Milo’s article – “”The media now allows radical feminists to frame all debates, in part because sensationalism attracts more clicks than any sort of fair or balanced discourse. Women can basically say anything about men, no matter how denigrating, to a mix of cheers and jeers.”

The pyschos are running the asylum….

Tam the Bam
Guest
Tam the Bam

“We would be so much better if, at age 16, after figuring out who is handsome or not, we’d get castrated.”
Yup. CuntingStars is quite unmistakable, like a fart at a funeral.
Same old same old.
Cycling on repeat for all eternity (at soul-destroying length, adding more and more interminable comments because they’re incapable of focusing their “argument” and considering it in the abstract).

Some people seem to be so “shut-in” and disordered that they’re incapable of learning from their mistakes. People like Professor Hardwank.

Princess
Guest
Princess

”Writes as princess, gets welcomed back to the conversation by Rollo, responds as Counting stars.” I’ve been to this forum a few times before but I never bother to comment because when I do visit this blog, I’m to busy laughing my ass off as I see young men approach young women(in college ofc) and getting rejected time and time again. I love to next see a good-looking guy who is both arrogant and treats the woman like shit go up to her and get laid without any effort. I’m a bit of a dark triad in the aspect that… Read more »

Princess
Guest
Princess

”is handsome or not, we’d get castrated.” Yup. CuntingStars is quite unmistakable, like a fart at a funeral. Same old same old. Cycling on repeat for all eternity (at soul-destroying length, adding more and more interminable comments because they’re incapable of focusing their “argument” and considering it in the abstract). Some people seem to be so “shut-in” and disordered that they’re incapable of learning from their mistakes. People like Professor Hardwank.” Dude, ask some guy who just arrived from a war-ridden African Country if he would take a pill which could remove forever the desire and the need for food.… Read more »

Softek
Guest
Softek

If you have the stomach for it, check this out: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPD0L0M7rtA That makes it pretty clear how much the FI is pushing that masculinity in women SHOULD be attractive to men, and how if men don’t find those traits attractive in a woman (or repulsive, actually), it means they have little dicks and are insecure in their manhood, or some other low blow/personal dig aimed at shaming/demeaning masculinity. As opposed to not finding those traits attractive simply being the result of being a man, and having innate preferences for what females should be like, just how women have innate preferences… Read more »

Princess
Guest
Princess

And as I said, i do get a few days per month of sexual desire. Thing is, the woman has to be a complete knock-out for my sex drive to come back to life. There are very few women like that in the real world. It only tends to happen, very occasionaly, in colleges and maybe in high schools. I sure as hell won’t ever see a woman like this in the workplace 10 years from now as most women past the age of 22 are obese or ugly LOL.

Tam the Bam
Guest
Tam the Bam

“If I was 6 feet tall and if I looked like Brad Pitt I would ..” I’d forgotten how short the Prof said he was. Seems to really grip his shite for some reason, always harping on about it. Hey ho, the nitwit has triumphantly derailed the thread though, job done I suppose. Yeah well of course it’s my fault for giving the twat some food, but if people shrink from commenting for fear of activating another trolling, the thread dies anyway. It’s actively and obsessively seeking to get a ban, to knock Rollo off his “all comments, even stupid… Read more »

Sisyphean
Guest

Countingstars might not actually have female genitalia but I’ll bet he does have a short ring finger, probably the index and ring finger on his right hand are the same length and the index may even be bigger, denoting a male who got a tad less T in the womb (and probably started talking early and has extra talent in the literary world compared to most guys). Come on over to my blog guy. I’m starting up a support group. 😉

David W
Guest
David W

@ Glenn “But the facts don’t matter. To those here who think they can argue women into a state of reasonableness, I suggest you talk to the old married guys here. Never works. Ever.” I have been with the same woman for 10 years, and married for the last 5, with a couple of short break-ups prior to marriage. Unfortunately for me, I have been red pill aware only for the last year. I have yet to ever argue my wife into a state of reasonableness; I *thought* that I had done so a few times, but about a week… Read more »

TAnon
Guest
TAnon

@David W

Best of luck dude maybe you will manage it. At least you didn’t discover it after a divorce rape.

Glenn
Guest
Glenn

Princess or Counting Stars — While I guess you are a fraud, Princess, I was going to say that you could have fucked that French Canadian girl. You could have turned the anger into a seduction. Here’s a hint for guys who don’t know how to deal with angry women. If he’d merely replied, with a smirk, “Yeah, I cut you out completely cuz I’m never going to spin around you like the rest of those losers – I have better things to do with my time.” she would have been caught up short, and I bet you 100 dollars… Read more »

roe
Guest
roe

Hi Rollo. Martie Hasselton just tweeted about a new paper she’s published with Gangestead on the possible implications and future directions for research on human estrus, though you’d be interested:

http://www.sscnet.ucla.edu/comm/haselton/unify_uploads/files/gangestad%20and%20haselton%20current%20opinion%2012-1-14%20in%20press.pdf

Note, please, the table which specifies “dual strategy” (AFBB) is one of four competing hypothesis for shifting mate preferences during fertility.

Novaseeker
Guest
Novaseeker

Sometimes it’s fun to feed the troll, fellas, but sometimes it’s not.

Just a thought.

theasdgamer
Guest

@ Cuntingfarts They whine more than 13 year old boys who haven’t masturbated in a week. At 13 I couldn’t have cared less about girls. Once I hit puberty, I don’t think I went more than a day or two without a wank. Did pickup at 15. If a super Alpha male has to kill dragons for a hot young chick, I have to say, scaring off a 6’2″ 180+ lbs stalker who was after a woman I had a fling with probably made her DTF. And I’ve discovered that I have a kissable face, which probably didn’t hurt. I… Read more »

redlight
Guest
redlight

“life IS a competition of sorts; I just worry that I may end up a loser in this particular competition called marriage”

@davidw one thing to consider is what is the relative SMV gap at this time, and what is was when you are married. Following the SMV chart, since you are now older you should have the opportunity to obtain a higher SMV, and thus can work on widening that gap. since this is a competition, then, leverage it

J.J.
Guest
J.J.

@ Glenn “Or just stay angry and hurt like MGTOW. Have at it guys, but I’d rather be happy and really free to move among women and deal with them easily.” I enjoy your posts and I think they are the most lucid and comprehensive of all the posts on this board, but I think (you) not being (a) MGTOW colors your understanding of what it is – but that also goes for the majority of men in the developed world. “I’d rather be happy and really free to move among women and deal with them easily.” And why would… Read more »

Glenn
Guest
Glenn

Princess – Lol, this really is too much now. You stated: “. I watch so much porn and I wank the monkey so hard that I end up completely burned-up when I have to go to college. I am surrounded by beautiful women and I am not affected by it.” Uhh you sure are affected by it – that’s why you are hiding out in your dorm room fapping all the time. You are free of exactly nothing. Here’s another tip. Your life it pathetic – why are you giving advice? Who in the fuck would want what you are… Read more »

David W
Guest
David W

There was a commercial posted in a previous thread, I think it was a TGIF’s commercial, where the women switched out her dinner date with a younger guy. Welp, here’s a similar commercial by Verizon. Unbelievable.

http://youtu.be/JnNMlOEPao0

David W
Guest
David W

@redlight
“one thing to consider is what is the relative SMV gap at this time, and what is was when you are married. Following the SMV chart, since you are now older you should have the opportunity to obtain a higher SMV, and thus can work on widening that gap. since this is a competition, then, leverage it”

Good advice. I am working on it.

Glenn
Guest
Glenn

@ J. J. – I had a MGTOW channel on YouTube and took it down after 6 months and had 22,000 views and 50 vids. I know very well what MGTOW is and is not. Most MGTOW are exactly what I describe – whether you like it or not. And many are very, very angry at women. What, you’ve never watched a video by the gutter-snipe GoodFella? Or Stardusk? They aren’t dripping with anger at women? Really? Or you could tune into Sandman’s Daily Ten Minutes of Hate. These arguments go on all the time and it’s uninteresting to me.… Read more »

Darryl Long
Guest
Darryl Long

I’d like to hear Rollo’s thoughts on how threatening “male exhuberance” is to the FI. The decline of male spaces means that men can’t let loose and get their energy up with each other. Women in STEM who feel “threatened” see male exhuberance as a thing that makes them feel unwelcome. The cry becomes “check your privilege” whenever a man shows pride. Now it’s seen as dysfunctional or “toxic masculinity.”

TAnon
Guest
TAnon

@David W

That video is disgusting.

TAnon
Guest
TAnon

@Glen

“I also am not some anarchist who sees himself as being exploited by the state who is wiling to live a subsistence and drop out of the “system” ”

Give it some time until they put taxes on being a man haha.

Bango Tango
Guest
Bango Tango

Glenn on December 12, 2014 at 3:02 pm @ J. J. – I had a MGTOW channel on YouTube and took it down after 6 months and had 22,000 views and 50 vids. I know very well what MGTOW is and is not. Most MGTOW are exactly what I describe – whether you like it or not. And many are very, very angry at women. What, you’ve never watched a video by the gutter-snipe GoodFella? Or Stardusk? They aren’t dripping with anger at women? Really? Oh god you’re not that Glenn are you? The one who created the video about Fishtown and… Read more »

Princess
Guest
Princess

No, dude. There are plenty of young guys out there who are aware of the nature of women and decide not to play, instead of aging to the age of 40-something and whinning that women aren’t interested in them. Most women in their 40s aren’t picky at all, I’ve seen older women with the most disgusting exemples of middle-aged men, so if you people complain of hypergamy, that happens because you want 20 year old women. A guy can see women and men for what we are and understand that we are all basically dispendable. Most women have immense value,… Read more »

thedeti
Guest

I’m with Nova and Rollo. Princess isn’t even an interesting or fun troll.

Sun Wukong
Guest
Sun Wukong

@strauman
‘The irony is how the “Patriarchy” is being replaced by a much realized Matriarchy in the name of “equality”.’

I wouldn’t call it ironic. I think they label it “Patriarchy” in order to make rationalizing the installation of a Matriarchy easier. It’s the meta-hamster talking, basically. Rationalization at the societal scale.

manosphere lurker
Guest
manosphere lurker

Heartiste recently quoted an article on his recent Dark Triad post. As usual, he misinterpreted the study and I called him out on it but he felt the need to delete my comment. I’ll let that slide for now but I bring this up because the study does give us some insight, rather indirectly, on why “socialized hypergamy” exists in the first place. From the original study (Jonason & Buss, 2012): “Although men and women may share the same overarching problem in short-term mating, the manner in which they solve it may differ as a function of their different sexual… Read more »

Sun Wukong
Guest
Sun Wukong

@thedeti
Agreed. Good trolls don’t walloftext. Trolling is a form of humor. Good trolls understand humor as Shakespeare explained it: “brevity is the soul of wit”.

But hey, we’re probably talking about a chick or very feminized man here. There’s a reason the vast majority comediennes (of both sexes) aren’t funny: women don’t get humor.

Sun Wukong
Guest
Sun Wukong

@Princess
I suggest you take a couple years to study the works of Ken M before your next outing. There’s no point to trolling if you’re bad at it. Here, I’ll get you started:

http://www.collegehumor.com/post/6794210/introducing-ken-m-troll-extraordinaire

Princess
Guest
Princess

”@thedeti Agreed. Good trolls don’t walloftext. Trolling is a form of humor. Good trolls understand humor as Shakespeare explained it: “brevity is the soul of wit”.” hard to be a good troll when you aren’t trolling. On the other hand, approach any respectable social scientist with this garbage of the red pill/red pill women and you won’t be called a troll. You might be sent to a nut house. And not without motive. This blog is a bible-sized blog on why women sleep with good-looking men. ”Hypergamy.” So do tell me the male equivalent for wanting to bang the 6… Read more »

M Simon
Guest

TAnon
December 12th, 2014 at 11:36 am

It is a spectrum in terms of the quality of woman you can get. I was thinking more in terms of keeping the woman you get domesticated.

Just Saying
Guest
Just Saying

To presume a man is ‘owed’ sex for services rendered This is one of the reasons that I NEVER do anything for a woman till after I have bedded her. Up till that point she has no “skin” in the game, so why would I do anything for her? I’ve told women that when they ask for my help – “What’s in it for me?” I’m not looking for her to “owe” me anything – I want payment up front. It is as simple as that – after I’ve pumped a load or two into her, she can ask me… Read more »

Sun Wukong
Guest
Sun Wukong

@CountingStars
Already shortening your posts, I see.

You’re still a shit troll though.

Princess
Guest
Princess

”Socialized/Open Hypergamy, is in essence, an avoidance of reproducing with a low quality mate (betas) and in pursue of attractive mates (alphas), while making all men openly aware of this. The hysteria that was covered a while back, acknowledge this by understanding that women despise men of inferior genetic quality so much; they’ll do whatever it takes to dis-empower these men, even at the cost of fabricating and spreading lies. Women follow their sexual pluralistic strategy to a tee by giving alphas the goods in their prime and with minimal investment on the alpha’s part, versus making the beta wait… Read more »

Badpainter
Guest

“Most women in their 40s aren’t picky at all…”

Most women in their 40s are barely worth a fuck, and mostly not worth anything else. They truly have nothing to offer but sex. One aspect of hitting the wall not discussed much is that in addition to losing their physical appeal their non physical appeal almost completely evaporates as well.

Or there are the dichotomies of disappoint:
1. beautiful on the outside barking moonbat, bitch on wheels on the inside.
2. Interesting, intelligent, great personality weighs 350 and bad skin.

M Simon
Guest

Why are you guys in your 40s and 50s so obssessed with women and with what women can or can’t do?

High testosterone levels. It is a blessing/curse.

M Simon
Guest

This is one of the reasons that I NEVER do anything for a woman till after I have bedded her.

That rule can be found in “Surely You’re Joking Mr. Feynman” by Nobel Prize winner Richard Feynman.

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