The Myth of Sexual Peak

The following is a re-blog from the archives of the (unfortunately) defunct aggregate blog The Spearhead. I want to archive this on my own blog because I think it was a fantastic exposé for its time and Chuck Ross deserves props for it too.



by CHUCK ROSS on NOVEMBER 16, 2009

A common myth is that men hit their sexual peak at the age of 18 while women hit theirs at 30-35. Despite literally no scientific support for this theory, this meme has become “common knowledge” in our society.

The myth never sat well with me. And to be clear, this myth is no straw-man concocted by this writer. It has entrenched itself in our culture to the point that most believe it is true without considering the implications or reasons for such an illogical development.

“Well we all know…” is a precursor heard before recitation of the myth. I worked with three 30-something women as a bank teller. Their excuse for their child-like antics, raunchy sex-talk, and monthly vibrator parties was that they were at their sexual peak. They said it as if they had a moral obligation to live up to their billing as sex-crazed mynx. While I’m not proud of it, when I was 20 or 21 I had a year-long sexual relationship with a 30 year-old woman whose fiance couldn’t keep up with her horniness. She justified her behavior by saying she was at her sexual peak and had a right to satiate her hunger. I got into an argument the other day with a female Bulgarian friend of mine who off-handedly recited this meme. The myth has infiltrated the Eastern bloc. I’ve had many encounters with the myth; I’m sure most readers have too.

I’ve never understood why our creator – natural selection – would put men and women at their sexual peaks at such different points in their lives. More importantly, why would women be at their peaks and more horny when they were less fertile? Every thing we know about evolution and sexual behavior indicates that natural selection has made it easy peasy for our genes to be passed on through sexual reproduction – why throw a wrench in the system by making horniness levels – or “desire to copulate” levels – incongruent between the sexes and less conducive to reproduction? Since women are most fertile from the ages of 20-24, it would make sense that they would desire sex more than when they were a decade older and half as fertile.

Those purveyors of the myth don’t account for Dr. David Schnarch’s dichotomy between genital prime and sexual prime. As spouted by the masses, the myth advocates the notion that these women want sex more rather than the more plausible argument that they are more experienced and comfortable with sex. If the myth is fully perpetuated, it grants 30-something women sexual liberation while offering nothing to men of the same age.

From Dr. Schnarch’s book Passionate marriage:

“Most textbooks on human sexuality, adolescent development, and family life teach that men reach their sexual prime before they even hit their twenties. Women supposedly reach their prime several years later…and therein lies our problem. Health-care providers make the same mistake as the rest of us: We’ve confused genital prime with sexual prime.

Genital prime occurs when a person has fully developed sexual organs and are most fertile. This occurs during adolescence and shortly after for both men and women. The myth holds men to the genital prime model while holding women to the other; it doesn’t compare apples to apples. This has the effect of making 30-something female sex some sort of animalistic expression rather than a more mature concept of sex that men of the same age achieve. The widely-accepted meme of late female sexual peak is a false dichotomy.

So why has this meme succeeded in entrenching itself so deeply in our collective mythology? First, it prevents us from being able to call 30-something sexually-peaking women sluts. Saying that a 30-something woman is at her peak is a PC way of saying she’s a slut. But given that “slut” implies something bad (and we know that a woman doing what she wants with her body can never be bad) those myth-sustainers prefer to say she is peaking. A peak implies something grandiose and wonderful. Peaks are achievements of milestones deserving rewards and ticker-tape parades. When the sexual prime myth is used to encourage and support these womens’ shady sexual behavior, it violates Schnarch’s dichotomy. Myth-purveyors seek to use the genital peak behavior of men at the age of 18 to condone womens’ slutiness at later ages by citing the need for equality of opportunity to express sexuality.

Second, older women HATE HATE HATE younger women. Sex is power. Younger women have held it in spades over their elders. Being that everyone desires to wrench power out of the hands of people who hold it, older women and those soon to be of that demographic have an incentive to glamorize the twilight years.

Says sex and relationship expert Pepper Schwartz:

“The bottom line for me: The evolution of the cougar concept is good for every woman and her partner. It keeps sexual possibilities and eroticism alive. And that continued capacity for passion creates lifelong desirability to younger men, older men, or anyone who can recognize a vital spirit when meeting one.”

The myth has sustained because it gives women hope as they venture into the twilight of their ability to be incubators of seed and the commensurate degradation of their looks. Sex is power, and attaching that power to women of ever-increasing ages allows women to hang on to it longer. Older women have declared war on younger women. Through wishful thinking they seek to destroy every benefit and short cut that younger, prettier women have even though they benefited from the same attitudes at an earlier point in their lives. We see this by observing the attitudes towards female celebrities who act in sexual ways. When Madonna was younger, she was considered a slut. Her book Sex was considered raunchy and disgusting. Now that she’s old and in her “sexual prime” she is given a free pass to perform in sexually-suggestive ways. Her behavior today, while not as risque as that when she was younger, is lauded as empowering and even artistic.

Young starlets are hazed by a certain segment of the population for capitalizing on their sexiness, but that same segment glorifies Demi Moore, Susan Sarandon, Madonna, Cher, Jennifer Aniston, and Halle Berry for rocking it at older ages.

We can easily see that the sexual peak meme is widely touted for the empowerment it gives to older women. Rather than being a quirky feature of our sexuality, the myth that 35 year-old women are on the same level as 18 year-old boys attempts to allow women to hold more leverage over men. As feminism achieves its goal of female economic empowerment, we begin to observe “peak inflation”. The peak shifts upward as women delay marriage and children and seek to have fun of the sexual variety at increasing ages. Cougars are a case in point. These women are over 40. Even though the myth hasn’t explicitly increased the age range of women at their peak, the cougar phenomenon idolizes women’s sexual power at these late ages and glorifies their sexuality as empowering.

You see, the sexuality-as-power lobby wants to shift the reins of control from men to women and from younger women to older ones. Younger women are fulfilling their biological imperative thereby submitting themselves to men or to a scheme that plays into men’s strategies. Older women expressing their sexuality is a way for them to hold sway over the purse strings to power. They are having sex on their own terms rather than due to some ingrained chore or obligation. The sex peak myth is a catalyst for creating sexual autonomy.

In terms of species propagation, men and women are most horny whenever they are most fertile; their genital peak occurs at a young age. Both men and women reach their “sexual peak” – their mental maturity – at later ages. The key here is that each maturity occurs at similar ages for both sexes; the myth loses its power when we realize this. The first maturity is biological while the second is social. The myth of the late female peak says that women are hornier in their thirties by trying to equate the 30 year old’s behaviors and urges to that of an 18 year old man. This is simply a perversion of Dr. Schnarch’s dichotomy. Both sexes have had many years of sexual experience and they have had more time to rid themselves of debilitating sexual hang-ups and phobias. They aren’t hornier at later ages, they’re just more relaxed with the ideas of sexuality and have thus reached “sexual prime”. The late sexual prime myth is a convenient tool that excuses perverse sexual behavior in older women. Sex is power, and it is used as a weapon to pry control from those that have traditionally held it; men and young, beautiful women. By ratcheting up the expectations of older females’ sexual inhibition, they wrangle pawns to line their battlefield.


While I feel this is one of the better outlines of the Myth  of Sexual Peak, there’s a few thing I think Bob didn’t touch upon. What prompted me to dig this article up from Wayback Machine was a Twitter exchange I had about the recent New York Times article outlining a study on the ages of peak desirability for men and women. This article raised the hackles of online women in precisely the same way that this myth has always triggered women. The Myth of Sexual peak for women is a social convention that refuses to die since it was created in the free-love era to now. Even Bob’s piece here is almost a decade old. And yet, in spite of the statistical evidence that damns the myth, the next generation of women don’t even realize they are parroting back the same tropes their mothers did in their day.

Michelle Drouin, a developmental psychologist who focuses on technology and relationships, was not surprised by the new study — in part because they “align with evolutionary theories of mating” in which youth suggests fertility, she said.

Dr. Drouin pointed out, though, that there are also theories that suggest that “men are just less interested in earning potential or power, and more interested in physical attractiveness.”

When I first published my now infamous SMV Graph in 2012 I took a lot of heat for allegedly not being thorough enough in my  estimation process. Honesty and hindsight, I was a lot more intuitive than informational then, but I knew I had it right; at least from the visceral physicality of it from an evolutionary perspective. Since 2012, I’ve had study after study and correlation after correlation sent to me by readers, or simply fall into my lap, that corroborated the bell graphs, time lines and circumstances I had a basic inkling of. While I think that women peaking at 18 and men peaking at 50, as per this study, might be somewhat exaggerated for outrageousness, it still, once again, confirms the basic form I set out in my original graph.

One issue I think Bob didn’t touch upon is the evolutionary logistics of why this myth is timed conveniently at the stage in life that women’s sexual market value (SMV) is in decline. He’s correct about about older women wanting to compete with younger women, but there’s a hindbrain understanding that women’s only real agency in this life is their sexuality. The Myth of Sexual Peak is a tool in this competition, but it is squarely directed at shaming men for their evolved preference for youth and fertility in women. In a raw, evolutionary reality, men only really need women to reproduce, thus, the most desirable age for this in women stays relatively the same. Conversely, women need men with different qualities for different, and opportunistic, reasons at various stages of their lives and how their necessity dictates. Thus, women can find men desirable to fulfill those purposes at ages from 15-50. And before you give me a ration of shit about including 15 year old boys in that mix I’ll point you to the rash of mid twenties female teachers on trial for banging their high school students.

All women (yes, all) have an innate understanding of their sexual agency, and all understand its perishable nature. However, there’s a trade-off inherent in balancing this agency with optimizing Hypergamy. The longer a woman waits the more that agency declines, but the longer she has to consolidate on a man (or men) who represents her Hypergamous ideal. The reason the social convention of women’s “sexual peak” is set at the age of 30-35 is because it attempts to create an artificial sexual value for men. It pretends that their later age makes them better sexual experiences than women 22-24 years old. It’s a disqualification of those women for men’s long term provisioning considerations, but it also plays on male-shame while simultaneously (artificially) inflating women’s self-image. This is why the myth is so pervasive – it satisfies a lot of insecurities. It’s ’empowering’ for women to believe that men are too infantile to appreciate the better sexual experience they believe they represent.

Furthermore, it’s difficult to argue against because it seems plausible and it’s almost entirely based on how women feel about themselves sexually. What a tragic joke that evolution should make women’s sexual peak occur when she least able to make it work for her, right? Wrong. In fact it’s comical when you see how a study that finds women’s peak age of desirability is 18 and mens should be 50 – almost the inverse of what the myth wants us to believe; that 18 year old men and 30 year old women are at their sexual peaks.

Published by Rollo Tomassi

Author of The Rational Male and The Rational Male, Preventive Medicine

133 comments on “The Myth of Sexual Peak

  1. Feminists can change a lot of things in culture, but this isn’t one of them. It doesn’t matter how much this myth is talked up, men will always find a 22 year old woman to be more physically attractive than a 35 year old.

  2. “I’ve never understood why our creator – natural selection……”

    Nice try…..

    Thx for reposting good stuff. No joke..

  3. Something that makes me sad about this myth is that a lot of fairly RP men actually believe it and will say something like “Older women know what they want” (“sexually” or “in bed” is implied).

    An RP guy should already know what he wants with younger women (even if they don’t), and if he is doing it right the younger woman will be submissive and the sex will be better for both that way.

  4. The anglosphere won’t admit this because “muh pedophilia” but women’s actual sexual peak is between age 14 and 18, and that’s why the age of consent is so “low” in parts of Europe.

  5. Damn it Rollo, 15 yo boys everywhere ought to be pissed. Really thanks for the debunking article.

    IME at 15 curiosity and imagination is peaked for males and conversely at 35 the epiphany phase is peaked in women making them try hard. While it looks a perfect match of maximum effort they both are looking for something different than each other.

  6. I just ran into an item that may interest some here: a movement in China with shades of Red Pill. Go to the link for the full story.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2018/11/23/business/china-boys-men-school.html
    In China, a School Trains Boys to be ‘Real Men’
    Employing American football and chest-thumping chants, Tang Haiyan offers an answer to a country that worries that its sons are too coddled and feminine. “We will never cultivate sissies,” he says.
    By Sui-Lee Wee
    Nov. 23, 2018
    snip
    …the Real Boys Club…stands at the forefront of a deep conversation in China about what it means to be a man. It’s a debate that has been stirred by worries about military effectiveness, an embrace of traditional culture and roles, disappointing academic performance among boys and echoes of the defunct one-child policy.
    snip
    The club’s lessons of manhood are taught in slogans. Before the boys do their homework, they pledge to study hard for the “rise of China,” starting with the words: “I am a real man!
    snip
    Arguably, the club is intended to address a problem that China does not have. Chinese men still dominate the top echelons of politics and business. Institutional sexism is widespread. Wealth is concentrated in the hands of men. Women complain of sexual harassment within public transport, universities and companies.
    But China’s preoccupation with strong men has taken on a political dimension, feeding concerns about whether young Chinese males are in trouble. State media has said video games, masturbation, and a lack of exercise have made many young men ill-suited for the military. “Erasing the gender characteristics of a man who is not afraid of death and hardship,” Peng Xiaohui, a sexology professor at Central China Normal University, said, is tantamount to “a country’s suicide.” “It is still necessary for a boy to be raised as a boy and a girl to be raised as a girl,” Mr. Peng said in a telephone interview. “They should not be raised based on the opposite gender.”
    snip

  7. Washington Post editorial advocates legal penalties for men who lie about their jobs.
    dalrock.wordpress.com/2018/11/17/now-we-are-haggling-about-the-price/

  8. I’ve noticed from women that there’s a recurring theme with a lot of them. If they ever get upset with you dating younger women they’ll usually be like “When I was their age I dated older guys all the time, BUT NOW THAT I’M OLDER and wiser I see that it’s wrong.”

    Whatever the age they are when they say this, whether it’s 23 or 83, is the age when they’re finally mature and sophisticated enough, effectively allowing them to date whoever they want while being able to condemn anyone that dates a girl younger than them.

    I pretty much realized that most chicks will willingly date any older guy they find interesting and attractive and then retcon it later in life if they need to.

  9. Sorry, but I do think caution has to be exercised when quoting the “study” that found men most desirable at 50. I believe it was based on some online dating site working out desirability based on messages received, and widely parroted by the media. I can understand 18 year old girls receiving the most messages because men of ALL age groups target younger women. Younger women do not need to message men. They just need to sit back and screen and reject. The only women who need to message men are older women who do not have that luxury. These older women message “age appropriate” men who tend to be around their ages, to a few years older. Hence why men of 50 or so receive the most messages. Not that 50 year men are more desirable than men in their mid 30s. I would want to the number of messaged sent and received, by age group and gender before I feel any prouncements on desirability can be made.

  10. Rick, you need to qualify what you said about older women telling you it’s “wrong” for older men to seek out younger women. The only women who feel this way are 1) those past 30 who seek marriage and family 2) Older women whose divorce did not provide financial security, for themselves or their children 3) Older women who don’t need provisioning but who are too unattractive to get any kind of attention from men, with older men being their best bet. Attractive older women who don’t need provisioning really do not give a toss. Just trying not to laugh when men more than half their ages hit on them.

    J, Miranda Kerr is a really bad example to use to demonstrate post-wallism. That fat picture of hers isn’t really representative of what she looks like now. Sure, she is heavier, but is still hotter than 99% of women her age. She has a very babyish, neotenish look that does not age too badly. Having said that, she is NOT a prize for Evan S as he is not a bad looking billionaire and should have done better than a single mom older than himself.

  11. “Attractive older women who don’t need provisioning . . .”

    . . . is the set containing the elements (Barbara Eden; Christie Brinkley). While theoretically interesting such freaks are, in practical terms, irrelevant to people outside their immediate sphere, which is the set containing the element (Nearly Everyone).

    ” . . . she is heavier, but is still hotter than 99% of women her age.”

    Which is simply evidence of the sad state of affairs (as it were).

    ” . . . older women HATE HATE HATE younger women.”

    I have related an incident before: I was walking down the street with a scandalously young girl (i.e. it actually caused an amount of scandal) when an older woman wearing expensive clown face, driving an expensive car slowed to pace us, and as her window began to wind down I began to think, “Here it comes, she’s going to let me know what she thinks of the whole thing.”

    Only she didn’t. She let the girl know what she thought of the whole thing. She didn’t acknowledge my existence with so much as a glance, I was just an object, but she obviously HATED, HATED, HATED the girl.

  12. @Rollo:

    I’m getting used to the new layout and generally find that I like it -except:

    The reply box being at the top of the comments is really obnoxious.

  13. but there’s a hindbrain understanding that women’s only real agency in this life is their sexuality

    The older I get the more I realize this is true.
    Companionship and ‘bonding’ aside if she’s not fuckable then she’s an incel too me

  14. In the book Dataclysm you can see a graph (based in thousand of users) about the age preferences between men vs. women (sorry if error, I don’t speak english)

  15. The Victoria’s Secret model photos are a great example of Rollo’s graph. At age 35 this woman would have trouble competing against even average 24 yo’s.

  16. Reply to SK: I’ve always heard that women’s sexual libido increases when their estrogen decreases (late 30s or 40s). The thing is, this contributes to decreased SMV because it makes them ‘thirstier’. Oversupply decreases value.

  17. relatable content for Rollo

    https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2017/feb/19/women-and-desire-the-six-ages-of-sex

    LOL at the one in her 30’s:
    “I had always assumed my 30s would represent a time when my sexuality, and my life, would “settle down”. The opposite happened. I felt an opening-up as I learned more about possibilities that I had naively assumed were not for me. I am no longer scared of ending up alone.”

    Post wall women will start their own “coping movement”.

  18. Then there’s this story. You know you’re living in an alternative universe when police raid a “brothel” full of sexbots…

    https://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/law-and-crime/article/2174823/owner-hong-kongs-first-sex-doll-brothel-forced-close

    This sums up the state of male/female dynamics and illustrates the point of the post. The sexbot NEVER ages…

    The industry hasn’t caught up to all the thirst yet but I haven’t heard of “plus size” sex dolls.

  19. “What does “sexual peak” mean in the context of a sexbot?”

    Fresh out of the box is peak for a bot. As they catch on the average age will likely be only 1 year or less due to rapid advances in tech. The average age auto is 11.5 years, nobody will keep a bot for that long not even a rental. I don’t imagine a large aftermarket other than upgrades but nonexistant used sexbot market.

  20. I have a different theory.

    Women in their 30s are half as fertile as young women. So their biological clock goes crazy because it’s pretty much last time they can have healthy children. So they subconsciously want to get pregnant for one last time. Hence their sexual drive.

    Consciously they use pills & condoms to not get pregnant. This is confusing for their bodies which want to get pregnant.

    I firmly believe that their sexual drive is genuine.

    I’m 39 and women in they early 30s are what I usually end up dating. They are all same. They have incredible sexual drive and they say they “love me like they never loved before”. However all this is driven by subconscious desire to get pregnant before it’s too late. Unfortunately there is disconnection between what they want (career, fun) and what they truly need (get pregnant).

  21. Boulderhead

    “The average age auto is 11.5 years, nobody will keep a bot for that long not even a rental.”

    I suspect a lot of guys will develop “Bot Goggles”…

  22. @IAS: “That had a bunch of FI influence, no?”

    It was true blue, but Some Kind of Wonderful told the same story better.

  23. “I’ve never understood why our creator – natural selection – would put men and women at their sexual peaks at such different points in their lives. More importantly, why would women be at their peaks and more horny when they were less fertile? Every thing we know about evolution and sexual behavior indicates that natural selection has made it easy peasy for our genes to be passed on through sexual reproduction – why throw a wrench in the system by making horniness levels – or “desire to copulate” levels – incongruent between the sexes and less conducive to reproduction? Since women are most fertile from the ages of 20-24, it would make sense that they would desire sex more than when they were a decade older and half as fertile.”

    Is this really so hard to understand?
    Substitute something else for sex….say, employment.
    -If you have no job skills and the market isn’t as interested….who is going to need to do the footwork to find the job and convince employers to hire?
    -By contrast, if you are in heavy heavy demand by companies/potential employers they will be much more likely to come to you.
    The person who is in demand tries least.

  24. This is a helpful analysis for men to internalize, but I wonder how many guys here really get it?

    Okay, all you keyboard-alphas and angry betas, let’s do a little thought experiment. Pretend you are a woman who’s hitting the wall. Say you are 31-32 and you happen to have been hot AF during your teens and 20s, HB8 or better. Try to pretend you are that girl/woman for a second.

    First off, she’s never had to “try” to get a guy in her life. I wonder if most men here can even imagine that alone? Even high value men are plagued by a thirst for women, nonstop and have to put effort in to wrangle the women they want to fuck whereas she only need say yes or smile at one of them, or God forbid – actually return a text, lol. And boom, then the guy does the rest of the work.

    She’s also been told that this lifestyle is fine, that it’s her “right” to have her wild years and enjoy herself, even though at some visceral level she knows it’s not quite right. But she learns to love being a slut, and after all, it is pretty exciting, right? She’s been told she can “settle down” later and find a “good man” and that in fact, she’s entitled to her sexual “liberation”, and for some of them being a slut is actually almost a political act too. It’s also an immense power to hold, a “privilege” in the modern parlance. As a young woman, she became quite accustomed to calling shots when it comes to men. As an aside, understanding this has helped me understand young hotties. They see all this differently and are simply used to having almost all the power when it comes to sexual selection. Of the things about me that is different for them is that I’m not so manipulable, this is crucial as a DHV for an older guy…But I digress. The point is that her “reference experiences” are nothing like your’s, guys.

    But then as she hit her late 20s, something different starts to happen. All the guys interested in her seem more annoying and less interesting cuz she’s finally figured out they just want to fuck her and that’s not what she wants anymore. She begins looking for the “good man” but he’s nowhere to be found. The high value guys who will fuck her make clear they have no interest in settling down with her but offer “fun” and “fwb” and good times. She convinces herself that she can “win” one of them over, so she turns up the sexual heat to make clear that she’s a sexual prize. After all the guys she’s fucked by this point, why should she even pretend to be chaste or “hard to get”? So instead, she goes all porn star on them. I see this new level of “heat” some 30something women claim as nothing more than amping up the porn star act in hopes of locking the “good man” down. Lol…

    I see women at this age using aggressive sexuality as a compensating mechanism, thinking it will be like when they are 22 and “give it up” for some guy and he can’t believe how lucky he is. Lol. Saddest for this woman? She’s set herself up perfectly for the 30-50 alpha dog player who’s pumping and dumping as fast as he can. Hehe. Like she’s got a bullseye painted on her for a guy like me. Such women are easy to fuck…

    And since you can play up the “no drama” angle so hard with these girls, as they have been going along with the, “lets just have fun” vibe for their entire adult lives, they themselves have a hard time imposing any real “rules” on the guys they see. Instead, they end up doing everything they can to win a high value guy over, then get hysterical and cause a fight and storm off. While the high value guy laughs, and just focuses on another plate.

    Again, we are trying to imagine being this girl. She’s not a guy – she can’t improve her sexual market value much if she’s already hot. She can’t get a great job, be a good provider or impress with social intelligence and dominance – cuz none of that matters in mate selection to men. She’s stuck, and begins to see the truth. She’s so much worse off than any beta guy here, but I bet most of you can’t imagine that.

    God forbid such a woman also Red Pills herself at this point. Fyi, I’m telling you the story of my HB9, who i’ve known for 4 years now, and is 31. She’s losing her mind now. Since she got Red Pilled (I have helped with that) she now recognizes she’s fucked up her life utterly. She’s scrambling like mad to find a baby-daddy and there are very few good choices for her. Get this though – she still has many, many choices. Truly beautiful women always have men who will take care of them. But they won’t be happy.

    She truly wishes that she’d been taught differently. She claims that she would not have become a slut and instead would have used her younger years to find a suitable man, lol. In the end, her life is a disaster. And she still looks like a top pornstar naked, she could pass for 23 with her clothes off. But that 31yo face is hard to hide…In fact, it’s worse in some ways cuz she generates a lot of sexual interest nonstop. Just nothing more…

    Bottom line? There isn’t one unmarried, high value guy in his 30s who is looking to settle down interested in her. None. Married guys, sugar daddy’s, various single freaks – but none of them are good husband material. She looks back now on all the guys she passed up, who she wouldn’t “settle down” for and cries. She’s literally inconsolable at times about this.

    She feels ill-served and lied to, and screwed over. She also gets how she just gave in to it all and how this “lowness” has been normalized for her, but at some basic level she knows it’s not “normal”. Like she knows she’s a slut, hell one of her biggest fears now is that she knows there is no one man who can satisfy her. She loves cock now, and really can’t get enough of it and always wants variety. Put it another way. She’s allowed her hypergamy to run amok for 12+ years, what, she’s going to stop now? Even if she found the right guy, after so much dick she’s ruined for him anyway. She’ll always want other dick. No matter what.

    She and I often compare our sex lives and singledom. We both agree it’s a fallen world. But for me, I can still pursue a sexual strategy that makes some sense. I look for hot young carousel riders and find them with some regularity, I can pull off being the older single guy who’s having “fun” with his life. Her? She’s nothing short of desperate to find a family kind of setup. Like she’s all over the map. Sure, she has more sexual power in the marketplace than me, and ostensibly more choices, but her choices don’t give her the payoff she’s seeking.

    She told me this exactly. “I thought it would all just work out for me at some point. The “right guy” would come along at the “right time” and it would all just happen. I’d have a great husband, a great family and a great life.” Listen to her, try and get the level of magical thinking she was provided by this femcentric, neo-marxist, post-traditional social order. Whereas 50 years ago? She’s be told to keep her legs closed and wait on the “best” man she could lock down. She’d use sexual access to control him. And most of the women around her, like her mom, would be advising her how to behave. It would not be presented to her as effortless or magical. She’d be told that her looks would fade and that she didn’t have forever.

    She would have also been told to have a child young. And to be a good wife and mother, etc. Get that almost all the social programming she received was about destroying all those traditional values. Her parents are my age, and they were part of that ’70s lost generation who’d let go of traditional values without really grasping onto anything else. She was never taught how to deal with any of this stuff practically.

    And she is so angry about it. Not at me, in fact, she agrees that my Red Pill approach is best given the world we are in. She’s also incredibly sad that she didn’t know any better, like she can’t believe how badly she was misled. And there is no “do-over” for her. She squandered her fecundity, and badly. she could have easily landed a very high value man and have a great married life by now. But she was fucked up by a society that doesn’t really care about her personally. The Left only cares about her in an abstract, collective kind of way. They don’t care that her life doesn’t work out, they just care that she had an abortion at one point…Which is what brought her Red Pill moment on to begin with.

    Little hint for guys who are having trouble gaming women. Don’t be so angry at them, realize that they are suffering from this neo-marxist post-modern bullshit as much as anyone, and in their own way, are being screwed worse than anyone. I mean a guy can get the Red Pill, and then work on his strategy and value for decades and get it right. Even now at 56, if I wanted to I could marry a younger woman and have children. Certainly up until say 5 years ago that would have been easy for me to do. Men have much more time and many other ways to improve our value beyond just appearance (although appearance matters more when you get older as you have to signal that you aren’t some old sad bastard, the contrast with other old fat sad bastards is what make you pop in a way). We are also used to competing for women and to losing a lot.

    My HB9? She assumed she would always come out on top when it came to mating games. It’s just so stunning to her that she’s not really in control any more. Don’t get me wrong, she still has amazing options. One guy up in the country wants to give her a house, another married guy wants to keep her as a sugar baby full time, and many others grovel and chase and provide at will for her. LMFAO. Meanwhile she escaped all of them to hang out with me again over Thanksgiving weekend. I provide nothing for her, hell she pays for her own food, we share the grocery shopping bills when she’s here, lol (we eat non-gmo, organic, pasture raised, super foodie, expensive so a trip to the grocery store costs a mint and she doesn’t want me paying for her, lol, I think this is a way of delineating me from the other guys who she works for various levels of provision, like she keeps our thing “pure” hahah). I have made super clear I’ll never be her baby daddy. That I’m not a meal ticket. That I would never marry her and settle down with her. And I’m the only guy she can actually be real with about what’s up with her. I’m the only guy who just “gets it”. We are truly friends now, and I take no pleasure in her suffering and nor should any of you guys.

    Hot women get about 10 years make it all work, and if they don’t, they are fucked for the rest of their lives. Don’t hate the player, hate the game, it’s not nearly as much fun for the women as many angry red pill men want to imagine.

  25. The Laws of Human Nature by Robert Greene was a great read.

    It’s a long one, but the depth is really valuable.

    I see it has a lot of confused reviews on Amazon, although good reviews. It’s not for the faint of heart, or someone that hasn’t studied history, psychology, human evolution, behavior, etc.

    It really complements Red Pill Awareness and builds on Robert Greene’s older books, 48 Laws, Mastery, Seduction. In addition he tells stories as always and draws on a bibliography of like 200 (probably more) books and other writings. I don’t think a lot of people can handle the extent and depth because it expands upon so much rather than distills it. If people don’t have reference experience with the material, it’s hard to grasp the significance of it.

    Some of the key explanations about human behavior and human nature include strong emphasis on humans carrying forth what learned behavior they got from their parental upbringing. Also a strong emphasis on reading other peoples motivation by their actions and their sub-communications. A strong emphasis on underlying subconscious motivations driving other people as well as ourselves (so it is best to Know Thyself). Also there is a strong undercurrent of True Stoic principles in how humans can control their emotions and processing of outside factors and use it to their advantage. At the same time there is actionable advice on how to defend against others who are unreasonable in your self interested–being able to defend against predation by others (which goes beyond Avoid the Unhappy and the Unlucky, Law #10. Oh, and due handling of our higher and lower selves (Shadow Self) in order to be more masterful and have more agency in the world and with human interactions.

    He is able to fill in the gaps of actionable advice that Rollo pulls back from and PUA gives too much of. Not that there is anything wrong with Pick Up Artistry….except when it falls short of of a fully integrated on complementary life, when it is merely just only Mere (that is solely or no more or better than what is specified.)

    Whereas Jordan Peterson was merely good for providing lots of ideas to think about, this book gives lots of ideas on how to act. And how to defend–via Assertiveness, something he calls Controlled Aggression.

    At the very least it cured my pressure of speech. (Somebody had to help with that…) And to some extent, antagonism towards others (Because of the ability to turn antagonism into a game and play others). Everything I’ve been doing as a hobby in Red Pill for the last four years always made a lot of sense. I always was in Acceptance. Everything makes more sense now and is more Acceptable now…

    I highly recommend it for manosphere reading. You will have more context on what is going on around you.

    From The Introduction:

    This book is an attempt to gather together this immense storehouse of knowledge and ideas from different branches (see the bibliography for the key sources), to piece together an accurate and instructive guide to human nature, basing itself on the evidence, not on particular viewpoints or moral judgments. It is a brutally realistic appraisal of our species, dissecting who we are so we can operate with more awareness.

    Consider The Laws of Human Nature a kind of codebook for deciphering people’s behavior—ordinary, strange, destructive, the full gamut. Each chapter deals with a particular aspect or law of human nature. We can call them laws in that under the influence of these elemental forces, we humans tend to react in relatively predictable ways. Each chapter has the story of some iconic individual or individuals who illustrate the law (negatively or positively), along with ideas and strategies on how to deal with yourself and others under the influence of this law. Each chapter ends with a section on how to transform this basic human force into something more positive and productive, so that we are no longer passive slaves to human nature but actively transforming it.

    You might be tempted to imagine that this knowledge is a bit old-fashioned. After all, you might argue, we are now so sophisticated and technologically advanced, so progressive and enlightened; we have moved well beyond our primitive roots; we are in the process of rewriting our nature. But the truth is in fact the opposite—we have never been more in the thrall of human nature and its destructive potential than now. And by ignoring this fact, we are playing with fire.

    Look at how the permeability of our emotions has only been heightened through social media, where viral effects are continually sweeping through us and where the most manipulative leaders are able to exploit and control us. Look at the aggression that is now openly displayed in the virtual world, where it is so much easier to play out our shadow sides without repercussions. Notice how our propensities to compare ourselves with others, to feel envy, and to seek status through attention have only become intensified with our ability to communicate so quickly with so many people. And finally, look at our tribal tendencies and how they have now found the perfect medium to operate in—we can find a group to identify with, reinforce our tribal opinions in a virtual echo chamber, and demonize any outsiders, leading to mob intimidation. The potential for mayhem stemming from the primitive side of our nature has only increased.

    It is simple: Human nature is stronger than any individual, than any institution or technological invention. It ends up shaping what we create to reflect itself and its primitive roots. It moves us around like pawns.

    Ignore the laws at your own peril. Refusing to come to terms with human nature simply means that you are dooming yourself to patterns beyond your control and to feelings of confusion and helplessness.

  26. @Rollo
    Agree with kfg on the location of the Reply box, it’s inconvenient up here at the top.

    On the other hand, this morning it became obvious that the “read more” feature is pure gold.

  27. And apparently ate for three. She had the baby last May and the article is about what she looks like now and how she’s fine with that.

    “I took nine months – well, 10 months – to grow a beautiful child and it might take 10 months to feel good in a swimsuit again. Or longer. Or never!””

  28. So what’s with the Miranda Kerr discussion? Besides nothing else to talk about.

    I’m pretty sure J. thought she was less attractive after her first child with Orlando, then even less at the end of her second pregnacy with the billionaire provider.

    Not that there is anything wrong with women having babies all the way down…. It just doesn’t make a woman more sexually attractive to a man. Sexually attractive women get extra credit from their husband, of course.

  29. @ Scribb

    An excellent critique of the modern age. This should be published in far wider circles, and would be, in another time and age. Very wise insights indeed. But feel sorry for these spoilt bitchez? No ways, bro. They’ve had it so easy just being born hot. Everything given to them (what they thought they wanted at the time, anyways) on a silver platter by legions of hungry guys. Do you think they ever gave a fuck about how many men they’ve manipulated and fucked over before coming to the realization that they have hit the wall? Boo hoo for them. Now they get to experience some of the reality that us men have to live every day, and maybe get a small insight into what burden of performance and rejection tastes like. It’s like lottery winners blowing the lot and having nothing to show for it and expecting pity ’cause they’ve been such dumb fucks. Fuck ’em! Welcome to reality, girls. Have fun, man, while it lasts. All power to you…

  30. Again, we are trying to imagine being this girl. She’s not a guy – she can’t improve her sexual market value much if she’s already hot.

    Agree.

    She can’t get a great job, be a good provider or impress with social intelligence and dominance – cuz none of that matters in mate selection to men.

    A girl who has a good income and is a practical, low-maintenance girl has advantages in LTRs.

    Truly beautiful women always have men who will take care of them. But they won’t be happy.

    Not if they have to have desire sex within a LTR. But they can still be happy with kids and a loving mate whom they don’t despise. There are degrees of beta.

    She truly wishes that she’d been taught differently. She claims that she would not have become a slut and instead would have used her younger years to find a suitable man, lol.

    Could she really have ever gotten a LTR with a desirable man? Fried ice?

    Bottom line? There isn’t one unmarried, high value guy in his 30s who is looking to settle down interested in her. None. Married guys, sugar daddy’s, various single freaks – but none of them are good husband material. She looks back now on all the guys she passed up, who she wouldn’t “settle down” for and cries. She’s literally inconsolable at times about this.

    Nah, she would never have been happy with any men who would have married her. The best that she could have is to marry the hottest beta she could have and eschew the hot alphas and she would never have been an alpha widow. But I’m not sure that even that would have made her happy. She’d probably have cheated on him and ended up divorced, etc.

    Feminism has demeaned the status of betas and this has made women less pleased with betas–betas are less sexually desirable than in the past. So, while women in the past were happy with betas, because betas had higher status relative to women, this is no longer the case. Feminism has fucked women’s happiness.

  31. “A girl who has a good income and is a practical, low-maintenance girl has advantages in LTRs.”

    hmm don’t know about LTRs, but in my experience the girl you just described usually make the best fuckbuddies.

    “betas are less sexually desirable than in the past”.

    They got the income already. Now they just need the dick. “No thank you, Mr. Beta Bucks” – hoe

    “So, while women in the past were happy with betas”

    Were they? Or was it more that they were content with their station in life with the beta they married? cause back then there wasn’t all this endless Fear Of Missing Out ™ “Grass Is Always Greener on the other side shit they see on their daily Instagram feeds (“my friends lives are soooo much cooler than mine”), tinder matches with hot guys

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ds0V3cvWsAALiOB?format=jpg

    (“”yeah I guess he’s great but what if this guys better?”) etc.,

    Being content with a good and safe life is boring now. Risk, fear, and excitement/adventure is where its at with these hoes. which beta males don’t provide.

    It is what it is tho. only guys I see, that don’t like what’s going on are trad fags and guys not getting any tbh

  32. @fox – I hear ya man, there is no doubt that such women do crush a lot of men along the way. My entire point here is to help men similarly upset to stop seeing it all so personally. Female nature is not some conspiracy plot to fuck men over, rather, we live in an emergent order and the system has been hacked so it’s running amok. And yes, super hot women these days live like demigods, but only for a short time…

    And then they are fucked too if they didn’t lock down a high value guy. It’s nothing short of an existential crisis for my HB9. She’s suffering a lot due to all this, for sure.

    My larger point is that it’s much more empowering to “see the matrix” and not feel victimized by it so harshly. Sure, I can say I got fucked over, but in reality, what happened was a bit more complex than all that. And I have zero investment in my past anymore, it’s all just more noise distracting me from what is in front of me.

    I’m not a nice guy or anything close to it anymore. I don’t think I’m a “good man” either. But then again, I’m not sitting here feeling butthurt by young hotties who don’t want to bang me. In fact, I’m kind of surprised by it when any of these young women want to fuck me at all, but I don’t let that slow me down either. I just go after what I want and then try and laugh and chill the rest of the time. Sure, I’m nihilistic but then again, in times like these, that seems a good approach.

    You seem to be pretty pissed at these women, and I do get it. But me? Not a bit, I get them. Sure, I’m happy to tell the little bitches off who need to be told off, but beyond that? They are just trying to scratch an itch like I am, ya know?

  33. Were they? Or was it more that they were content with their station in life with the beta they married? cause back then there wasn’t all this endless Fear Of Missing Out ™ “Grass Is Always Greener on the other side shit they see on their daily Instagram feeds (“my friends lives are soooo much cooler than mine”), tinder matches with hot guys

    Well, women used to scheme about how they could trap betas. Betas were more masculine and had masculine pastimes and betas were comfortable being men.

    There has always been the fear of missing out. That’s why chick porn sold well in the 19th century and before. But women were more content because men were more masculine and had higher status. Now men are ashamed of being men and men try to act more like women and it’s just so unattractive to women. So many men are metrosexuals nowadays.

  34. “I’m kind of surprised by it when any of these young women want to fuck me at all”

    lol

    opposite of “I’m the prize”

    just imagine the subcomms that go with that mindset

    bad mojo

  35. “Happy” and “content” are male paradigms. Not female.

    She can never ever be truly happy or content. Not how she is wired.

    J from early days every farm girl thought her prince would come…

    Nothing is really new.

  36. Sentient
    J from early days every farm girl thought her prince would come…

    And when he did, she’d get to have her very own bay-bee!

  37. @Fleeze – Interesting catch. I’m not sure it’s a mindset comment for me. You see, it’s also true that most young women aren’t interested in me sexually these days. That’s the reality of gaming young hotties in my shoes, from a 56yo perch. Lots of misses and whiffs. It’s all good cuz I like people and am friendly and enjoy the entire lifecycle of the game, but “tone” isn’t frequent for me anymore. So sadly the reality is that I’m not getting nearly as much action as I was even a year ago.

    Fine with me, I’m not complaining. Nobody goes on forever. I’ll go out on my feet, not on my knees begging and whining about it though. But ya, the sad truth is that when I get real interest from a hottie these days it does come as a pleasant surprise. I’m getting mostly what I call the “uncle vibe”. Not a good zone to be in. But there is this. One wild 19yo I got with for half a second a month or so back got me to thinking. We were going back and forth on Snap and she wanted to know more about me. I was going to send her a photo of my grand daughter, and then I realized my own daughter was 11 years older than her…

    It was just one of those weird moments. The worm continues to turn, and i’ll continue to ride it. But I’m getting older. That’s okay with me. I didn’t expect to bang 20yo hotties forever. Just for as long as I can…

  38. “J from early days every farm girl thought her prince would come…”

    Back then it was only but a fantasy. A silly dream she thought about. Her ideal type of man. She may have even masturbated to the thought of this imaginary ideal man, who would come into her village and sweep her away from this boring farm life for good, every so often whenever she was in the mood. However. she never did cheat on this “good enough” man she ended up marrying, because the other men in her immediate environment were less than ideal. Content. “Ah well, such is farm life”.

    “Nothing is really new”

    https://localtvwreg.files.wordpress.com/2018/04/gettyimages-936083094.jpg

    today not only is this former fantasy reality, the issue isn’t if her prince will come, it’s which prince she wants to come [inside her] this week.

    https://www.reddit.com/r/Tinder/comments/4712y0/ladies_of_tinder_how_many_matches_do_you_get_a/d09sdud/

  39. Sexual peak is not a myth if you give it the proper name. It’s the age women experience thirst. When a woman is younger and more fertile, she has a drive to defend her valuable eggs and only give them to the best. As the wall approaches, she experiences the dropoff in offers and baby rabies at the same time. She starts seeking sex instead of turning down offers. She rationalizes that she must have a higher sex drive now, instead of realizing she is no longer in a position to turn down lots of offers.

    So, 18 for men and 35 for women is not the age where they are in their peak of their own desire. It’s when they are in their trough of desirability. It’s when they have to take the most initiative if they want to participate. We all rationalize that if that’s when we’re working the hardest or going unsatisfied, then it must be when we want it most.

  40. I think Raadim is correct. It’s the unconscious desire to get pregnant that increases with the advancement of their biological clock. That’s also why they get cats and small cute dogs as pets – in order to fulfill the mother instinct (baby substitutes).

    btw. since you mentioned this Bulgarian friend of yours – yes, Bulgarian women, and most Eastern European women in general, are very damaged in that respect. I’m Bulgarian and here It’s full of 30+ lonely women with unrealistic ideas about fertility.

  41. “hmm don’t know about LTRs, but in my experience the girl you just described usually make the best fuckbuddies. ”

    Again j makes shit up as he has zero experience in either LTR, STR or ONS or whichever acronym he chooses.

    The universals are the same. That’s the point of RP. j makes a distinction without difference cuz it sounds complicated, recondite and cool.

  42. J

    “She may have even masturbated to the thought of this imaginary ideal man, who would come into her village and sweep her away from this boring farm life for good”

    Uhhh… “content” does not mean what you think it means.

    Question – do you even TRM brah?

    Homework: Square “hypergamy” with “content”… (cell phone not required btw…)

    [I encourage you to employ your own thought process and not reflexively copy/pasta other’s misguided quotes]

  43. “Being content with a good and safe life is boring now. Risk, fear, and excitement/adventure is where its at with these hoes. which beta males don’t provide.”

    “It is what it is tho. only guys I see, that don’t like what’s going on are trad fags and guys not getting any tbh”

    Spending too much time on Reddit.

    Go out and experience a Broader life j.

    All this talk about Hoes….What’s up with that?

    I know, your answer is “That’s all that’s out there….”

    Nice binaries you got there.

    I second Sentient’s comment (and Eh’s). There’s a lot that TRM has that you aren’t paying attention to. And you are just driving by like YaReally did. And humblebragging.

    There is still living your own life not in women’s frame. There is still burden of performance. Hypergamy will always be there. And that’s not necessarily a problem. Amor Fati wise.

    Amor fati (lit. “love of fate”) is a Latin phrase that may be translated as “love of fate” or “love of one’s fate”. It is used to describe an attitude in which one sees everything that happens in one’s life, including suffering and loss, as good or, at the very least, necessary, in that they are among the facts of one’s life and existence, so they are always necessarily there whether one likes them or not. Moreover, amor fati is characterized by an acceptance of the events or situations that occur in one’s life.

    This acceptance does not necessarily preclude an attempt at change or improvement, but rather, it can be seen to be along the lines of what Friedrich Nietzsche apparently means by the concept of “eternal recurrence”: a sense of contentment with one’s life and an acceptance of it, such that one could live exactly the same life, in all its minute details, over and over for all eternity.–Wikipedia

    Hold on loosely, but don’t let go…

    You want to end up at 50 years old J. and have agency. And also be able to tell yourself that if you had to do it all over again, that you would do it the same way (or something similar, some mistakes, but no major regrets. Some injuries, but still strong, etc..). That you have confident and competence to determine your outcomes, rather than being at the mercy of the world and others. Because you at that time are in a great place. It doesn’t mean don’t have adventure, don’t take risks, don’t explore. It means you built something solid out of yourself besides toying with hoes.

    The world and humans in it aren’t going to magically change their nature for the better and make it easier for you. Life’s a Game. Play it well.

    And pay attention to other things that are going on with The Rational Male and The Red Pill. It just might save a life.

    P.S. Quick questions J. Do you watch The Red Man Group on Youtube? What do think of the principals in that group, as Red Pill role models? (Lol. Maybe I’m getting ahead of myself. Maybe I should ask “Do you even Red Pill J.?”)

    P.S.S I’m not saying this to fuck with J. like EhIntellect is. Other people are watching. Things are still going great for me, because of me and Red Pill. Young guys don’t always take advantage of good mentors that resonate with them these days. I’m glad I did from 27 years old and since.

  44. j visits the Louvre, after looking at the masterpieces of painting for an hour, became exasperated and said to the guide, “There is not a thing in here worth looking at.” The guide answered, “Sir! This art is not on trial; you are.”

    j can’t stop turning the mirror of judgement away from himself. He’d benefit by drilling deeper beyond superficial shit like daddy issues, acne, and hoes.

  45. “What a tragic joke that evolution should make women’s sexual peak occur when she least able to make it work for her, right? Wrong.”

    Actually, it works in a totally optimal way. Women are ‘designed’ to offer their peak sexuality and fertility to men at a stage (age 18-22) when they are least able to discern which man is a ‘good balance’ of raw sexuality and a good, stable partner. Women are not interested in anything ‘good’ or ‘stable’ at that age. Within that range, they live in a space when they are universally desired, protected, and valued by men of all ages. They can fuck whoever they want, by whatever means necessary, end up destitute and pregnant 3 times, and still never get left out to dry. Some chump will always come along to clean up the mess. There is simply no incentive for them to choose partners based on anything other than raw sexual appeal at the stage when they have the most to offer.

  46. “Women are not interested in anything ‘good’ or ‘stable’ at that age.”

    Hi Bob.

    Untrue on a couple counts. Good is worthwhile, nice not so much, and there lies AF/BB in all women.

    Your above comment affixes you in place, is defeatist, defensive and reactionary. You’re better than that.

  47. “why would women be at their peaks and more horny when they were less fertile?”

    because fucking and sucking the men of the tribe is one way she adds value even as her fertility and beauty are in constant decline. she cannot survive on her own and her own survival is all she ever really cared about (solipsism appears to have big survival value for the original mitochondrial code in her)

    related: why would women hide ovulation, even from themselves (lol,”like why do i totally want to wear a really short dress tonight?” giggle giggle jiggle jiggle)?

    pussy is to female as violence is to male

    “Every thing we know about evolution and sexual behavior indicates that natural selection has made it easy peasy for our genes to be passed on through sexual reproduction – why throw a wrench in the system by making horniness levels – or “desire to copulate” levels – incongruent between the sexes and less conducive to reproduction?”

    i personally know girls who were masturbating before age 10. two of them at age 8. they didn’t even know what sex was, or have sexual thoughts when they got off. it was all about the clit and the feeling that came with humping the stuffed animal or whatever. not sexual though. no eggs dropping for years in their cases. no thoughts of boys or people at all. just the feeling.

    alpha widow maker = guy who first links sex with orgasm for any given thot

    women gets tons of pleasure from sex, but for a lot of them it isn’t that physical. they don’t orgasm (like half of them). the pleasure they get is from the control they have over the man, and beating the other females in securing his attention and possible seed

    in the moments just before he nuts, a man could fall victim to all kinds of violence as that is when he is likely most distracted in his whole life. maybe women get off on that. having the power, if even for just a few moments, while he nuts. the little death.

    “Since women are most fertile from the ages of 20-24, it would make sense that they would desire sex more than when they were a decade older and half as fertile.”

    women fuck year round. women fuck for so many other reasons than to get pregnant that i’m not sure egg count/egg quality matters to the hamster. those pussies get soaked well past having any eggs left and there are plenty of older chicks able to keep the undivided attention of dudes much much younger. why? because they are in shape, can suck a cock like a pro (and often love doing it) and know exactly how to get off and get you off.

    when young, i’m not sure so many of them desire the physical act of intercourse as much as the social proofing, the foreplay, the attention, the up and down drama plotlines… sex is more like a part of the script (catharsis, which of course relieves the obvious sexual tension that build between young peeps) than something to pursue just for pleasure’s sake, which is something that older women definitely do. under 25 fuckbuddies come with other drama. often times lots of interaction (which dudes everybody think are so fly will not admit to, much like thots won’t admit partner count) that older women don’t even want.

    “Those purveyors of the myth don’t account for Dr. David Schnarch’s dichotomy between genital prime and sexual prime. As spouted by the masses, the myth advocates the notion that these women want sex more rather than the more plausible argument that they are more experienced and comfortable with sex. If the myth is fully perpetuated, it grants 30-something women sexual liberation while offering nothing to men of the same age.”

    they definitely should be more comfortable with sex and their bodies. if they’ve had good partners and are still hot and tight. so many women never stood over a mirror and looked at their pussies. so many don’t even like being naked ALONE. so many don’t orgasm. at the same time, it’s so easy to identify the older ones who love to fuck for fucks sake. but remember, there is a reason they are out there in the wild and not under the supervision of the man who broke them in

    and men don’t need liberation. we are free to fuck as long as we get it up.

  48. “Women are not interested in anything ‘good’ or ‘stable’ at that age. Within that range, they live in a space when they are universally desired, protected, and valued by men of all ages.”

    hb7.5 24yo white power girl. blind (new rule for online. no pics ever) meet logistics.

    me: “meet at x at y time”

    her: “are you gonna kill me?”

    funny how they are so fast to give it up to the ones who don’t value them and won’t protect them and in a certain sense could literally kill them and get away with it

    treat your girls like whores and they’ll behave without you having to say shit, which is the only way it can happen

    if you have to tell some ho to take her piercings out, or fix her stupid hair color, you aren’t leading

    she will remove them/change on her own in order to live up to standards you don’t even have to articulate. in that sense female intuition is real

    she will drop that extra ten pounds immediately and without saying a word

    only actions matter. if she’s not improving herself and regulating her own behavior, she’s not that into you and anything less should be treated as the equivalent of her spitting in your food before she serves it

  49. Why is “happy” a male paradigm?

    And on the seventh day God ended His work which He had done, and He rested on the seventh day from all His work which He had done. 3 Then God blessed the seventh day and sanctified it, because in it He rested from all His work which God had created and made.

    Burden…

    Why can’t females be “happy” in the same way?

    Now the serpent was more crafty than any of the wild animals the Lord God had made. He said to the woman, “Did God really say, ‘You must not eat from any tree in the garden’?”

    2 The woman said to the serpent, “We may eat fruit from the trees in the garden, 3 but God did say, ‘You must not eat fruit from the tree that is in the middle of the garden, and you must not touch it, or you will die.’”

    4 “You will not certainly die,” the serpent said to the woman. 5 “For God knows that when you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.”

    6 When the woman saw that the fruit of the tree was good for food and pleasing to the eye, and also desirable for gaining wisdom, she took some and ate it.

    Looking for a better deal…

  50. “treat your girls like whores and they’ll behave without you having to say shit, which is the only way it can happen

    if you have to tell some ho to take her piercings out, or fix her stupid hair color, you aren’t leading

    she will remove them/change on her own in order to live up to standards you don’t even have to articulate. in that sense female intuition is real”

    Truth

  51. All that Anti-Virtue Signalling (thots, hoes, at wall, post wall behaviors…)can be put to good use or not. It certainly psyches J. up for a night out (good for him), it psyches Julian and RSD and his disciples in chants and group jumping up and down.

    But is certainly perpetuates a madonna/whore binary which is not close to reality. Really. And it’s energy sucking. ‘the madonna/whore complex’ and it’s problems used to be talked about a lot in the manosphere in the old days. Now that everyone agrees that everyone is a whore more so in the last four years, a guy still needs to not be beholden to it’s detriments that can happen in his own mind.

    It depends on how you use your reality and how reality uses you. Yes, defeatist, defensive and reactionary is no way to go through life, son. Red pill practice is reasoned and rational. When practiced well it freedom from anguish or suffering. Reason is pursue in the sense of being objective, unemotional and having clear judgement. It’s stoic–with indifference and passive reaction to external events (external events cannot be either good or evil, they are what they are.) Also it helps to play the game with equanimity (mental calmness, composure, and evenness of temper, especially in a difficult situation).

    So if you want to keep on anti-virtue signalling thots, keep that in mind and keep to your game plan. There is and can be a life out there (without compromising you) involving having sex with attractive women 3x a week, over and over and having that be a complement to your life, not the focus of it. Added value and banking free excess energy to the other 90% of things you have to, want to, and enjoy doing any three month stretch of.

    P.S. The way I see it is that fleezer is not anti virtue signaling. You can see it in his attitude, his sub coms. He’s merely red pill demonstrating and explicating. I approve his message. Scribblerg in his long comment also was in the right place. Good job there Scrib. There is a distinction to be had and it’s not obvious, always.

  52. Not what you would expect, or is it?

    Mug-shots never show a perp’s best features… but she’s kinda cute in her other photos

  53. I liked Sentient and Fleezer’s comments as they are two sides of the same coin.

    Cool thing about Genesis 3:6 is what isn’t explicitly written.

    It finishes with: “She also gave some to her husband, and he ate it.”

    What is implied is that Adam was standing RIGHT THERE as she was making the decisions for both of them. He sure as shit knew better but let her run the show for that moment to both of their downfall.

    Lead (otherwise known as do what is best/good for you ATM), or be led to your doom.

    This isn’t about religion, churchianity or whatever guys buffer away from the Bible. In short, there’s nothing new under the sun. One must use a outside standard to accurately measure the moment…i.e. a clock must be set by something else other than itself. When a man freewillingly chooses to be led he reduces his freedom to act as he might otherwise and he ends up squeezing the same lemon harder and harder for less juice. Moreover, man is distracted all the time between burden and security. Anyone tells you different is selling something.

    That’s why j’s little testimony here is stupid and unrealistic as he pantomimes a life of zero tradoffs, ever. It’s not the PUA that’s toxic, it’s j that’s a unauthentic bore. He himself chooses to fuck up the gift he’s been given and lie about it all. It’s exactly what women despise. Women don’t mind a guy’s abject depravity, they mind a man’s inauthenticity.

    It’s the difference between fleezer who is authentically believable and posts legit sexual encounters and j who never posts anything particularly novel, his FR’s are odd in their details but has all the answers to others posts.

    Guys here don’t mock fleezer.

    Guys here mock j for good reason.

    It’s not a competition for fleezer but for j it sure is, as he has something to hide, namely his inferiority complex.

  54. @theasdgamer

    “These boys here are really immature with their voting shit.”

    Its actually hilarious tbh. Seeing all the comments with negative scores. I’ve only voted once thusfar. And it was to ironically thumbs up one of @eh’s comments (I scroll past all your comments mate. sorry). Felt kinda bad about all the negative scores he’s getting 🙂

  55. women do not hit their sexual peak sexually from 32 to 50… but things do change. I’ll explain:

    they change from making themselves believe they’re the hottest girl around to accepting that the younger women are. they don’t like “try hard” guys and don’t try hard themselves.
    they give up on the “prince charming” fairy tale and accept that men are actually just men and won’t solve all their problems.
    they don’t “settle” for any man but they do accept more faults in a reasonable prospect.

    all of this leads to a more relaxed and free & open sexual attitude. they go from, “i need you… i love you… we need to cuddle & discuss our relationship” after a lot of dating etc., to women that say, “hey… are you busy tonight? can you stop by to play? don’t plan on sleeping over bc i have to go to work early tmo. oh… and don’t forget to park your car in the visitor spot.”

    when the fairy tale dies, they literally bc less trouble to fuck and get along with in life. my dad says, “they don’t become reasonable humans until they’ve aged past 35… before that, they, and their vaginas, are the center of the(ir) universe.

  56. Good OP and comments but I’m seeing a contradiction or at least some kind of split here:

    a) Rollo has discussed at length how women in their 30s will tend to jump off the carousel, try to retroactively clean up their act and lock down a solid provisioner. I’ve seen this myself.

    b) But now we’re looking at women of a similar age who double down on more carousel tickets rather than moving toward any epiphany. It certainly makes sense as a way to extend their social shelf life. I’ve seen this too and it wasn’t pretty.

    So how to reconcile these two outcomes? What makes some women choose Path A and others Path B? Where’s the fork in the road and does a guy want to be anywhere nearby at that mile marker?

  57. @ O.B.I.T.

    Just a guess here: The peri-walled women aren’t on the same carosel as before; they’re sleeping with the also-rans of their 20’s and those guys aren’t too pressured to marry as the culture and SCOTUS has made it clear marriage is not about kids….so that cat is out of the bag.

    What incentive does a regular guy have let alone a man of higher value turning to these women for something more consequential? A lot less than 10 years ago even.

    Guys are part of the process too and wised up, IMO. They can get that milk for freet that was off market previously. Better late than never.

    To make sense of it all women will solipsisticly double down on something like relationship free sex rather than face the fire that they fucked up. Anyways, asking a woman to fess up to a mistake is pointless.

  58. EhIntellect
    What is implied is that Adam was standing RIGHT THERE as she was making the decisions for both of them.

    You can get a pretty good argument about that from some of the churchgoing men I know. They would insist that, no, Adam was “Doing his JOB!” and that he’d trusted Eve to do her job without supervision. She was alone, all by herself.

    Either way, I do believe that the Bible states Adam was cursed “because you listened to your wife”. Not that most preachers have ever read that part, apparently.

  59. @big max
    “When the fairy tale dies …” What your dad said would largely describe my own mindset (and my own dad’s), but it doesn’t always work out so well.

    Speaking of fairy tales, those holiday jewelry ads continue apace. Today’s tagline was “Dare to be devoted.”

  60. Sentient says:

    Why is “happy” a male paradigm?
    And on the seventh day God ended His work which He had done, and He rested on the seventh day from all His work which He had done. 3 Then God blessed the seventh day and sanctified it, because in it He rested from all His work which God had created and made.
    Burden…
    Why can’t females be “happy” in the same way?

    >

    There is a direct correlation between happiness and insight; as intelligence waxes and appetite sharpens; satisfaction with the pedestrian diminishes; females; utterly dissatisfied with the wretched “existence” that this world affords most of them; correctly detest Almost Everything.

    Solanas captures the dynamic well:

    “”Life” in this “society” being, at best, an utter bore and no aspect of “society” being at all relevant to women, there remains to civic-minded, responsible, thrill-seeking females only to overthrow the government, eliminate the money system, institute complete automation and eliminate the male sex.”

    This does not even factor in the theistic element; (be it God or Satan)….the idea of Jehovah holding Death and Hell over Everyone’s Head…One Entity As Judge, Jury, and Jailer…as if He “has the right” to pass judgement on Me…after what is (for mortals) a ridiculously short interval as flesh…

    Moreover, the original idea of the quoted text; implying masculine fulfillment as expressed by Jehovah’s satisfaction with Creation…lol…you caught Him at Perhaps the Only Time He was Ever Happy…

    How many times do we see Jehovah “angry”, “jealous”, “displeased”, “saddened”, and countless other negative emotions?

    So here we have the principle Reigning God for most of the last few thousand years showing signs of severe psychological distress.

    How can that be? He has Everything and He is Everything…and yet his manifestations of melancholy are frequent…leading to some really bat shit crazy outbursts that are too well known to merit revisiting.

    The point being is that this search for happiness is nothing more than chasing rainbows…most have never been happy nor will ever Be Happy…

    Most everyone’s incarnation is unpleasant…there are simply varying degrees of horror that infringe upon our path through life.

  61. Sentient says:

    4 “You will not certainly die,” the serpent said to the woman. 5 “For God knows that when you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.”
    6 When the woman saw that the fruit of the tree was good for food and pleasing to the eye, and also desirable for gaining wisdom, she took some and ate it.
    Looking for a better deal…

    >

    Mortality for Humanity was in The Plan from the Start…if they did not die; if the life spans were not knocked down a second time to 120 years around the Flood…you would have 500 trillion people on the planet today; at least…would make Soylent Green conditions look like Montana.

  62. Lol at all the “down votes” cast against My Writing.

    When I do assume power; there will Not Be One Indignity that Shall Not Be Recompensed; assuming the Offending Party Still Walks the Earth.

    As Dad always says, “Enjoy it while you got it…for it is far later than you think”.

  63. D.O.S. wrote:
    As Dad always says, “Enjoy it while you got it…for it is far later than you think”.

    >

    “A popular version of the song, recorded by Guy Lombardo and His Royal Canadians, was made on 27 November (some sources give 28 November), 1949.”
    ___Wikipedia

    Lolz…69 years ago 2day…
    It is My World; y’all just in it…

  64. 27 November 2018: “GOP US Sen. Hyde-Smith wins divisive runoff, keeps her seat”

    Lolz…this is Typical of What Rules Over Me At Present…

    I Am being Ruled by Borderline Retards on Upside Down Planet…

    All because of “Christian Pity”…and “we’re all equal”…

    The End of This Error {Deliberate Sic} cannot come soon enough…

    “Although She was the Daughter of Satan; She learned disobedience through what She had suffered.”
    ___Variation on Hebrews 5:8

  65. Lol at all the “down votes” cast against My Writing.

    >

    They downvote Me…like a bunch of anonymous punks…hiding in the dark…because they are too gutless to face the Daughter of Satan.

    They know Me as their Rightful Liege; but they are too indoctrinated by the absurdity of their own pathetic existence and “civilization” to acknowledge it.

    My Queendom come

    My Will be done

    On earth as it is in Hell

    Amen

  66. You the free, the wild, the untamed, that walk now alone and forlorn.
    Behold, my Brother cracks the world like a nut for your eating.
    Yea, my Father has made a house for you, and my Mother has prepared a Bridal Bed. My Brother has confounded your enemies.
    ___Liber 49 / March 1946

    You better crack it quick, Ra Hoor-Khuit…enduring this insanity veiled as business-as-usual is like waiting for Franco to die.

  67. lol

    Saw your post on Red Pill Woman. It went over pretty much the way I thought it would. Half of the comments complaining that a man was giving his opinion on the female sexual peak. Then the rest giving their personal anecdotes on how their sex drives improved in their 30’s /40’s.

    They totally missed the point.

  68. Rollo,

    Thank you for reversing the order of comments. It is more convenient for those who want to post without reading or scrolling through those previous. I had thought to suggest it, but didn’t want to mess with your design, its yours and participation here is the most open, so that was enough for me. I do read though comments occasionally and at least scan them each week regardless of the order. But enough on that.

    I have a prediction. The red pill awakening and its inevitable spread is a remarkable phenomena. Men are waking up to the negative consequences of oneitis delusions, chivalry, feminism, etc. Some may think or hope that the pendulum will swing back and the culture will return to a more traditional older set of books social schema. I doubt it will. The cats are out of the bags and as always its almost impossible to put them back. History never actually repeats, everything is in a state of flux, changes are never permanent but change is. I believe history never repeats, but it does rhyme. Men are clearly fed up with the FI and all its practice, divorce rape, unbridled hypergamy, male vilification, the damning of the patriarchy, etc. Women have exercised their power over men primarily by sexual bribery and sexual blackmail. This has been the lever for women and the Achilles heal of men for a long time. The social dynamic continues to change. Women are gaining more power as they acquire more dominate positions in politics and business. But…. here is the clincher….. human sexuality and the ability to reproduce is not controllable by one gender alone, no matter what the medical establishment does. We are a dimorphic species (like it or not liberals) and reproduction cannot occur without the participation of both genders. For so long, men have been conditioned to believe the onus is on them to chase women and “earn” the right to her womb for reproduction. The old set of books basically defined marriage as a contract where the woman gave the man more or less exclusive right to her womb in exchange for his provisioning and protection, a lifetime of his labor, his surplus labor that benefitted her. It has benefitted her tremendously. She now enjoys a life of leisure and extreme opulence on a scale history has never before recorded. Yet, she has no realization of this and no appreciation for man relative to it. She takes it all for granted and is self entitled to more and more as she now has the exclusive right to choose who and when she will reproduce with and which offspring she will commit fetal homicide against without impunity. But….the clincher….human sexuality and the ability to reproduce is not controllable by one gender alone. She cannot reproduce without the man. Her instinct, her primordial drive to reproduce is at least a powerful as his. And I would argue that it is more intense than his as she approaches the wall. Neither sex can possibly totally control the process. But, EITHER sex can hold the process hostage against the other. Women have held the process hostage against men to get what they want and gain increasing amounts of power over men for several generations. They have done this increasingly for so long now and to such an extent now that we have this blog, the entire manosphere and the red pill. But, control of the process and the bluff to hold it hostage literally IS an equal opportunity. Men feel cheated and oppressed. Men ARE cheated and oppressed. What is there to stop men from drawing the line, saying no more, and establishing a wide spread practice of demanding payment up front from women before providing their seed? You may argue that “alphas” will fill in the gap left by “betas” but the population of women is so large and slightly larger than the male population already that it is impossible given the 80 – 20 ratio. AND the definition of alpha is NOT seed spreading so much as it is self control. How many more cat hags does the FI want? What is there to stop a man from simply refusing to provide his seed to a woman who is not cooperative on his terms when he knows her window of opportunity will close decades before his? What is there to stop men such as yourself from teaching this truth and other truths to young men, and boys proactively as you have been for, what, a decade now? What other choice will men have as women gain more power in the legislative process and more social dominance?

    “Ok bitch, that’s all fine, you may try to do anything a man can do, and you can make laws that enslave and oppress the common man and eliminate his freedoms, you can even vilify him, gossip about and complain about him all you want….. but….. if you want a child, you are going to have to pay him and you are going to have to pay him first up front and you are going to have to pay out the ass and you will be indebted to him for life because he provided the seed.”

    What is there to stop men from flipping the script on women and simply using the same thing against women that women have used against men? What other resource do men have that is equally effective? I see none. Don’t you see that what women are ultimately doing is making wombs cheap and seed expensive? What other choice do men have given the current direction of “progress” than to raise the price of seed? It is simple economics and the power of using the resources available. It is a most basic rule of negotiation. If men want to retain any power over their lives in the future given the direction society is going, they will be forced to raise the price of their seed. Woman has womb. But man has seed. The price of seed has been far too cheap. Man has cheated himself by making seed so cheap in fact that it costs nothing to the woman. In fact, HE has to pay for his seed in todays social dynamic. This is like paying someone else so you can work to produce benefit for them. It is like paying someone to plunder a resource you have total control over and paying them with that resource to screw the shit out of you in the process. It is total foolishness. Men need to wake up and realize the awesome power of their ability to control who receives their seed and when and under what conditions. “It’s my way on my terms bitch, or no seed.” This is the only effective way for men to regain control of their lives with women. I predict that this is where we are headed, because men have no other options as effective.

  69. “Thank you for reversing the order of comments. It is more convenient for those who want to post without reading or scrolling through those previous.”

    OK, I can see that point. It doesn’t work for me, but I can see it.

  70. Genital prime occurs when a person has fully developed sexual organs and are most fertile. This occurs during adolescence and shortly after for both men and women.

    Unfortunately, biology doesn’t support this statement. For one thing, many women don’t ovulate regularly until their mid teens…

    This is the final stage of development. Full height is reached, and young women are ovulating regularly.

    https://www.quora.com/What-are-the-stages-of-puberty

    Furthermore, sexual pleasure increases for women as their clitoris grows until it reaches its max size when she reaches menopause.

    The clitoris actually grows during a woman’s lifetime. No, it isn’t getting stretched out from too much sexy fun. The growth occurs as a result of hormonal changes in the body. When a girl’s puberty begins, the clitoris will start increasing in size. By the time puberty ends, the clitoris will be about 1.8 times larger. By the time a woman is 32 years old, the clitoris will be almost four times as big as it was at the onset of puberty. It doesn’t end there. After menopause, the clitoris will be about seven times larger than it was at birth.

    https://www.alternet.org/9-interesting-things-you-may-not-know-about-clitoris

  71. DoS attacks against us mean two things of significant importance. First, it means we are triumphant. Why else the attacks? Second, DoS in all her insanity and extreme delusional bizzare manifestation of herself is on par with the FI. DoS effectively shares the same insane paradigm. They are “sisters”. DoS effectively illuminates the FI for what it really is by attacking us for exposing the FI and manifesting its allegiance with the FI. Why else the attacks?

    The darkness cannot cover the light. Light penetrates the darkness and the darkness has no choice. So do not be offended and look away. Look at what the light exposes and remain focused. Cock roaches are running everywhere and flying in your face because they fear the light. Prepare the stake. Light the flame.

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