V-Day

Time again for the annual re-post of this Classic:

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Nothing says “I love you” like saturated fat and slutty lingerie.

In the U.S. businesses expect men to spend on average $186 for Valentine’s day – over three times the average a woman spends on a man. Explain to me why women own V-Day? If it’s a “celebration of romantic love” why should it be an annual shit test?

Lets clarify a few things about Vagintines Day since it’s become probably the most irksome manifestation of westernized/commercialized romanticism. V-Day is far and away the most vulgar display of female entitlement. On no occasion – even a woman’s birthday or her wedding anniversary – is this sense of entitlement more pronounced and our refined commercialization of this entitlement/expectation simply twists the knife in further for men to live up to this with ZERO expectation or entitlement to any reciprocation. He gets ‘lucky‘ if his romantic offerings are sufficient to appease her (social) media fueled expectations of ‘good enough’ to reward him with sex.

And exploit the media does. I can’t get away from it; Every radio station, every TV show, every newspaper and magazine article. Go to askmen.com right now, I guarantee there’s a “how not to fuck up this year’s V-Day for her” article there.

I listened to a talk radio show that I regularly tune into on my commute home on Friday; it was about what not buy this year. “Don’t buy lingerie, she knows it’s really a gift for you” or “Don’t pick up flowers at the gas station, women know they’re cheap”, and “God forbid you pick up some cheap jewlery or stop at one of those roadside urchins selling prepared flower baskets or arrangements – women know you didn’t think about it until you were on the way home.” On my way to work this morning, different show, same list. [Side Note: Never buy a woman lingerie, she will never be happy with it. A woman has to do this on her own to “feel sexy”, make sure it fits her right, and it’s HER IDEA. When you buy it for her it’s contrived and it is overt and overt is often the kiss of death for a try-hard guy.]

Why wouldn’t women have these expectiations? They’re relentlessly marketed to as the primary consumers in western culture. V-Day isn’t a celebration of romantic love, it’s a machine that drives a wedge of expectation and entitlement in between otherwise happy, relatively contented couples.

I’m not down on the idea of a special occasion to celebrate love (I actually proposed to Mrs. Tomassi on V-Day 18 years ago), I am down on the twisted expectations that have been perverted into it that puts a woman on some pedestal of entitlement by commercialized popularization of this feminized ideal. Why isn’t there an official “fuck your boyfriend like a wild animal” holiday or a list of criteria to meet that’ll make his day special? “Show him how appreciative you are of all his dependability and hard work this year – buy some lingerie ON YOUR OWN and pretend that you like him cuming in your mouth on his special day!” If women are so liberated and interested in equality, one would think this would be the first thing to occur to them. We need a special day to make us apprecitae each other?

Gentlemen, beware of falling into the trap of negotiating desire for Valentine’s Day performance. Don’t be lulled into thinking Game is any less necessary on V-Day. In fact, I can’t think of a more direct illustration of how the feminine encourages the transaction of men’s goods and services in exchange for a woman’s sexuality than reserving a ‘special day’ just for it. Remember, you cannot negotiate genuine desire; and with the right art, a bag of Skittles can be a more romantic gesture than all the sonnets, flowers and jewelry your inner romantic soul will ever be appreciated for by her.

Note to PUAs

Valentine’s Day is ripe with opportunity for an enterprising Man with the ability to see it. Go hit the clubs tomorrow night, particularly the ones that cater to a 25-40 y.o. affluent crowd. There’s a million different venues you can hit, all with promotions to help single ladies feel better about not having a date – usually with genderist drink specials to help your approach too. You’ll notice impromptu GNOs (girl’s night out) set up just for this occasion to prove to themselves “they don’t need men to have a good time.” A good PUA couldn’t arrange a better opportunity to hook up in multiple sets.

Don’t go play ‘pity friend’ with any girl on V-Day, don’t be the “you’re such a great friend” consolation date.. Call up your best wing man and sarge on the best night of the year to sarge. Wedding receptions aren’t even as good as V-Day for this.

V-Day in the Matrix

Just in case you weren’t already convinced of the complete totality of media control that the Matrix has, let me offer yet one more Valentine’s Day example:

I was in a grocery store this weekend picking up something to grill and thought it would be a convenient time to pick up a Valentine’s Card for my wife since it’s coming this week. So I meander over to the greeting cards section to sift this years crop of mushy sentiment.  Much to my disgust the only cards available in the “For My Wife” section of the Valentines Cards (and I mean ONLY cards available) come in two types:

A.) The sentimental, “My life was nothing before you and would be nothing without you”, tripe that reduces a man to a simpering, codependent who owes his very existence to the woman who deigned to marry the poor soul.

B.)The “humorous” Valentine that is essentially the greeting card equivalent of Everybody Loves Raymond or Family Guy. These are basically intended to beg for a wife’s forgiveness for all of his uniquely male faults and foibles, that only she can solve by virtue of her infallible feminine wiles. Judging from the ‘humorous’ intent of these cards, no man is capable of feeding himself much less ask for direction or leave a toilet seat down, but on “her special day” this card is meant to prompt an appologetic laugh.

Needless to say I’ll be making my own card this year, but for fuck’s sake, how can we ever get a break from this shit when we’re ankle-bitten at every opportunity? You simply cannot buy a card that doesn’t force a man to be self-depricating.

277 comments

  1. “I was going to ask how other men had introduced The Rational Male to their sons, but I saw an opportunity and took it.”

    My boy was learning PUA, eh results. I’d read TRM 1 & 2, handed it off, he read it too. It started as DL, but he couldn’t help but talk publicly about it; women became quite predictable, helped address his shortcomings. I let the chips fall after Mrs. Eh decoded our fight club talk and figured out who I was here.

    Now my boys and I talk about it at the dinner table and she’s dealing with her own existential issues.

  2. @ Roy Hobbs

    He is at that very awkward age range for young men—in college but just shy of 21. He is living the commuter college experience and living at home.

    While Rollo has advised introducing the concepts early to which I fully subscribe, I believe that the book needs to be shared somewhere between a young man’s junior year of high school and his 21st birthday.

    At his age, I remember the blue pill longing for the right girl to make things right. The wrongheaded plan to get the girl first and the rest would fall into place, and the isolation and depression that came along with it.

    Times are different and in some ways better for young men in terms of a loss of idealizing women. How many men of our generation were distracted with misdirectional ideas?—like this from Mahogany (1975), “Success is nothing without someone you love to share it with.”

  3. Re: surgeon suicide.

    “Sources tell DailyMail.com the former couple amicably divorced and remained friends…”

    LJBF

    “She is the author of nutrition books and describes herself on social media as a fitness fanatic, hockey fan and mother.”

    Perhaps she quickly updated her FB status omitting wife.

    Sad.

    On a personal note, I know a M.D. colleague who repeatedly, quietly states he wants his wife to have sex with him. spins it as humor, a buffer. It’s been drip-drip for years. How do I know? He tells me, but if I subtly mention that it could be different (without talking fight club), he chafes, says no, she’d divorce him if he reasserts himself, and switches the subject.

    His life is sliding, personally and now financially. Wife feels need to work more now to maintain her status, lifestyle.

  4. @Intellect

    Children and money are in the picture, correct? And he is not willing to walk away because of them? So your colleague assumes that his wife has the power in the relationship. Why not subtly ask him where his wife is getting sex if his wife is playing hide the vagina with him? He’ll likely say that his wife doesn’t have a sex drive because we’ve been fed the lie about women being able to go without sex. Then you bust that lie. Tell him that if he goes out, he’ll find LOTS of married women in clubs who are looking for sex.

  5. @ EhIntellect

    “….and she’s dealing with her own existential issues.”

    Keep up the good red pill work. You never know, one day you might invite your wife to join the “secret society” of monogamous (or not) parents having raised good kids over 21 and then be empty nesters. In that society, both your sexual strategies are being met with success and when she shit tests you, you just slap her on the ass and say ” Heheh, we all know what’s going on here…..” And she agrees. Because you and her “just get it”. Plus there is actual desire to have sex turned back on because of having worked those switches/or sliders, or whatever those harmonic resonators were called. And you got what all the other couples (that she and you socialize with) don’t have. Lack of contempt, admiration and respect among both, freedom for you, love for her.

  6. ASD

    You said it spot on. Everything.

    I’m waiting for the chance to hit the after work professional crowd with him. Fish-in-barrel meat markets here, if he’d care to look.

    I’ve done this with others. Just for a drink…then juice him up a little…then be his wing. They always chafe, freeze, act much like Sentient’s WK friend. Getting in the way of themselves, me even, if I read it correctly. I don’t talk fight club, I try to perform real time.

    My plan was to get him out. only hang…but his wife must know he’s out…unavailable to her…and he goes radio silence about it…her hamster runs = panic sex or she shit tests…easily passed by holding frame, admit nothing…because honestly nothing happened…she musn’t find out that though.

    Fuck, this’ll probably never happen. But that’s my plan with him.

    He’s concerned about his de facto community social status. He’s got to be subtle, discreet. His income, rep relies on it.

    He’s got to want it more, as yet his income is enough to maintain the lie…ntil the kids are gone and it all falls apart.

  7. @Intellect

    Is your friend ratholing some cash for the solo future? Does he keep an overnight bag packed? Has he talked with a man-friendly divorce attorney?

  8. “Does he keep an overnight bag packed?”

    And has he arranged some place to take it? I spent a few days living in a FIAT Spyder, in a blizzard, and it wasn’t fun. I learned from that and the next time I was nearly, almost ready for it when it came.

  9. ” Heheh, we all know what’s going on here…..” And she agrees. ”

    “Lack of contempt, admiration and respect among both, freedom for you, love for her.”

    She actually said verbatim: “Honey I have a question, well…let’s call this a shit test.” We laughed so hard at that.

    Sex is white hot, daily. Weekends often twice daily. Risky stuff with kids nearby. Cad son stumbled into a room while it was getting raunchy, chair back to the door…he knew the score and scrammed. Hah!

    She has questions, and fears missing out on life, living, wondering aloud all this. It’s all too much at times, I get that and am patient, quiet. She’s read enough, and continues piecemeal, but knows TRM is for guys, thus she’ll never fully understand it as a man would, should.

    Zero fighting, zero spats, zero snark, much one on one.

    We all walked out of a church service recently from disgust, even. It was bad, a woman made a repulsive, well, blasphemous opening statement. Tried to spin it off as humor. We left. A parishioner came to her this week and apologized for the whole to-do. Glad I took my kids out. My cad son: “OMG, if women were priests, homilies would be four hours long!” We all laughed hard again.

    Parenting is unified now. My oldest knows tacitly the frame shift has passed. I’m taking him out this weekend for dinner. I owe him at least that. He deserves it.

    P.S. She was worried the kids might find out or we’d be doxxed. Me: The kids find comfort in our love, affection. It makes more sense than arguing and you’d probably receive a trophy of some sort, you know, hottest marriage of the year. You’d be surprised how many others want this too.

    Thanks again, y’all. From Me, my wife and kids.

  10. “Is your friend ratholing some cash for the solo future? Does he keep an overnight bag packed? Has he talked with a man-friendly divorce attorney?”

    “And has he arranged some place to take it?”

    No. He’s oblivious that it over but the paperwork. I’ve told him such.. he won’t accept it. It couldn’t happen to him, all he needs to do is work harder, cower more, supplicate in just the right way.

    Latest: 2 carat canary yellow, cushion cut.

    Oh man…perhaps I need to step up my sly project here.

  11. @EhIntellect

    How old were your boys when they read the book?

    Mine will be 24 next month and I’m thinking it’s nearly time

  12. “Latest: 2 carat canary yellow, cushion cut.

    I had to look that up. I didn’t know yellow diamonds existed.

  13. Oldest 16 Class President, Dudley Do-right, he’s read them, has done tons of personal work, embarrassing flamed outs and now is in a “Me first!, People stink!” mode. Good on him. I’ve been waiting for this. Hasn’t hit the convincing, angry “Fuck it!” milestone yet. In fact, I don’t think I’ve ever seen him angry. Huh.

    Younger 14, but he’s a turd and does only what he needs to avoid trouble, shams work like Beetle Bailey, and girls flock to him, finds them all a bore. Says he’s read the first few chapters, of TRM book one, but I doubt that. I know me, I know him. Lucky little fucker.

  14. “I didn’t know yellow diamonds existed.”

    Sure. And the Hope Diamond is blue. There is also red, green, brown . . . depending on what chemicals were the adulterating factor during formation.

  15. @kfg

    And has he arranged some place to take it? I spent a few days living in a FIAT Spyder, in a blizzard, and it wasn’t fun. I learned from that and the next time I was nearly, almost ready for it when it came.

    A mobile command center? With a bed, kitchen, and bath?

  16. @EhIntellect

    Thanks

    Think it’s about time. I number closed a girl on the train last week with him in tow.

    He’s beginning to get it.

  17. No bath. I had secured my safe house, but hadn’t quite gotten it ready for occupancy when she sniffed the wind, figured out what that smell meant, and told me I would have to leave in advance of my leaving.

    It made for some awkward days and legal reverberations down the road, but at least I didn’t end up living in a two seat rag top.

    ‘Cause the Miata was in her name anyway.

    I miss the car.

  18. “I number closed a girl on the train last week with him in tow.”

    I’ve been doing PUA with my oldest for months. As I can talk easy enough, get selfies with young things, with him there. I like to chat up anybody, so why not the hottie? He wants it so bad and PUA really messed with him, the techniques/lines were sound, but he stalls searching for comfortable authenticity, add lack of worldly experience, ability to bullshit convincingly (lie), about what he prefers to think about when alone. His sperg is slaking slowly. That’s tough work; thus I’m his biggest fan.

    Being class president didn’t help his desirabilty, he’s cubby-holed. He can open, but amping the attraction, forcing, cheerfully accepting shit tests doesn’t come naturally. He knows it, is a little bitter, that’s o.k., a natural step to killing his Beta. Public displays, speaking are natch. No pressure for him. he can speak to 300 people and not break stride. The girl? The techniques are fungible in a way, he knows it. His dendrites aren’t connected yet.

    He’s been on this “I gotta do this, and own it all, bad and good.” Drives off on Friday, Saturday night and tries his best. I see him have fun occasionally, that’s when he makes it go. He’s getting out there, and it’s all on his own. No group dates, social setups. He found himself forced to hang with people he’d prefer not to.

    If he goes with social convention, the current, he’s Pinto at the 1:00 mark:

    Good talking to you about this. It’s powerful responsibility.

  19. “Should’ve done the down dog (yoga position) shower.”

    I did have running water and have lived where there wasn’t any. I can cope. That wasn’t the issue against immediate occupancy.

    And in retrospect I should have left immediately, it was at least as good as a tarp down by the river (and I’ve known guys who had to resort to that for one reason or another). I learn, but sometimes I’m a little too slow about it. I wasn’t fully engaged with “You’ve got 60 seconds before the Cossacks arrive. Three . . . Two . . . One . . . Go!”

    Because my mind was already in “Right, this time I’m going out prepared” mode, I kept preparing when I should have already been running, even if preparations weren’t quite complete yet.

  20. @ kfg

    Would you leave all else being equal now, would you tell her to go?

    Emotions run high. My frame was so weak early on in this all, I stayed but it was under her frame. That sucked in retrospect…how embarrassing (insert head shake). Only when she left did I feel a seismic shift, a little frame, relief.

    Do you think you could stay at home, hold frame, and kick her out?

    Is it a social convention that men must permanently leave, and we accept it, thus reinforcing it? Or is the benefit to leaving more than immediate pressure release in a incompossible relationship?

  21. EhIntellect

    On the way home from work today (on the radio) Dr. Laura took a call from a mom that wanted validation for being right to be pissed about the dad/her husband of a high school girl who pushed his daughter to take an AP class. Now that the daughter is stressed and freaking out about because she can’t get an A in at this point, the mom is in a tizzy.

    Dr. Laura told her to STFU. It’s a dad’s job to push the children outwards towards their edge of achievement. It is up to the mother to comfort them endlessly and tend towards their feelings.
    The dad was right and the mom was right in their opposing roles. Mom’s and Dad’s are complementary in their lessons for children. The mom approach is not the dad approach to child-raising. That is why Dr. Laura always recommends that children are raised with both a mom and dad in the house. (esp. so the children don’t grow up to be pussies while also having mom’s unconditional love.)

    The being pushed into an AP class was not the problem. More directly, the class was not the problem. The dad was not the problem. And he wasn’t in the wrong. The high school girl being stressed and freaked out about not being able to get an A in the class was the problem. The daughter should relax and make sure she gets a B in the class and be in acceptance of that.

    How bout them apples?

  22. Dutch Proverb:

    From the father comes honour, the mother comfort.

    She’s streaming Laura over the computer during the day.

    Mrs. ordered a Sue Venker book today, too. She’s excited…

    I let her be, she comes to me.

  23. “Mrs. ordered a Sue Venker book today, too. She’s excited…”

    What about the Laura Doyle books that come highly recommended by BluePillProfessor?

    First Kill all the Marriage Counselors or The Surrendered Wife. Or Dr. Laura’s The Proper Care and Feeding of Husbands.

    I haven’t read these or vetted them, but they perhaps do a service that is to have the wife come to the understanding on her own without being instructed on proper wifely behavior.

  24. SJF, I tend to agree with your comment above, “I haven’t read these or vetted them, but they perhaps do a service that is to have the wife come to the understanding on her own without being instructed on proper wifely behavior.”

    Specifically, I have covertly supported her spouse focused friends and unsupported her “go girl” friends while leaving it to her to come to the right conclusions. This has moved us closer and she feels good about our relationship vs. others who she used to envy.

    @Eh

    I agree that he (the Dr. you mention) is toast, and soon. Beta at the slaughterhouse door. Poor Chump needs rescue, i.e, a swift kick in the ass. I failed at my one attempt to do this, though this guy might have been particularly proud about his white-knighting, so I’ll leave the advice to others on “how” to do this.

    Interesting that the future I see is where RP-friendly woman writers are advocating “making sure you have your real alpha” kind of stuff (in other words, don’t buy PUA superficial crap quick fix guides). Of course that will have limited value, but it will require men to raise their game. Good for humanity I suppose.

  25. @Eh Intellect:

    Well, you’ve got me thinking hard about how to answer those questions. I’ve said before that the one thing I’m not is average, and we did not lead anything like an average life.

    That said the FI/MI remains constant.

    I did not kick her out when I could have and knew I should have. Responsibility, yada yada yada.

    At the point I left, I had let myself be in a position where there was no question who had to leave. That’s why I was preparing a safe house. On the plus side I didn’t lose any real property that was family or that I had money in to.

    And I made a number of other frame mistakes along the line that got me there.

    What I would do now is not to let her in in the first place, so the question of whether I could kick a woman out is moot. Plates only. In old money I would be a “confirmed bachelor” if it weren’t for having been married, so in new money I’m happy to go with MGTOW.

  26. @ palmisailor
    Haha love it that you number closed in front of your 14 year old son.

    My son is 14 too but he lives in Italy with my ex so I only get to see him 4/5 times a year, I also asked myself when to introduce him to TRM, I asked Rollo his opinion and his reply was 15-16 years old so I will go with that.

    Instead summer we were in a bar on lake Garda at night ( he looks 18, he’s nearly 6ft and shout 80kg well built) but he was just drinking cola.
    I noticed him checking out this cute young (15ish) German girl who was with her mum and her friend, when a seat became available near them I moved us over and started to flirt with the mum and asked him to wing man me, he was super embarrassed so I left it after I busted his chops a bit for being killing the vibe, so maybe he’s not ready yet ( I’ve been split from his mamma for 8 years).

    I have a long distance plate who lives on lake Garda so i generally go over a few days earlier or stay a few days later after seeing him to play with her, I’m not sure he’s ready to see me with another woman yet, I think I need to toughen him up a bit, but it’s a sensitive issue for sure.

    Would be interested in knowing what other posters think about pulling with kids in tow?

    My situation is complicated by my ex being devastated by the split and still wanting a reconciliation even all these years later, I’m sure he knows this so I feel it’s an issue and don’t want to spoil the limited time we have together but I’m sure this will be less of an issue as he matures ( and I give him TRM books for his birthday) .

  27. “Is it a social convention that men must permanently leave, and we accept it, thus reinforcing it?”

    Oh, yeah, this.

    It is The Model that wealth and real property, virtually all of it, shall be transferred to women. It is not just convention, it is an aggressive ideology.

  28. “Would be interested in knowing what other posters think about pulling with kids in tow?”

    Raise your kids to be adults, not big children. Answer their questions when they ask, but their questions should arise from observation. Show them how to behave. That’s how they learn.

    That said, yeah, be sensitive to where they are. Push their boundaries, but don’t break them. Progressive overload.

  29. “That said, yeah, be sensitive to where they are. Push their boundaries, but don’t break them. Progressive overload.

    Nassim Taleb’s Antifragile:

    Wind extinguishes a candle and energizes fire.

    Likewise with randomness, uncertainty, chaos: you want to use them, not hide from them. You want to be the fire and wish for the wind. This summarizes this author’s nonmeek attitude to randomness and uncertainty.

    We just don’t want to just survive uncertainty, to just about make it. We want to survive uncertainty and, in addition—like a certain class of aggressive Roman Stoics— have the last word. The mission is how to domesticate, even dominate, even conquer, the unseen, the opaque, and the inexplicable.

    THE ANTIFRAGILE

    Some things benefit from shocks; they thrive and grow when exposed to volatility, randomness, disorder, and stressors and love adventure, risk, and uncertainty. Yet, in spite of the ubiquity of the phenomenon, there is no word for the exact opposite of fragile. Let us call it antifragile.

    Antifragility is beyond resilience or robustness. The resilient resists shocks and stays the same; the antifragile gets better. This property is behind everything that has changed with time: evolution, culture, ideas, revolutions, political systems, technological innovation, cultural and economic success, corporate survival, good recipes (say, chicken soup or steak tartare with a drop of cognac), the rise of cities, cultures, legal systems, equatorial forests, bacterial resistance … even our own existence as a species on this planet. And antifragility determines the boundary between what is living and organic (or complex), say, the human body, and what is inert, say, a physical object like the stapler on your desk.

    The antifragile loves randomness and uncertainty, which also means—crucially—a love of errors, a certain class of errors. Antifragility has a singular property of allowing us to deal with the unknown, to do things without understanding them—and do them well. Let me be more aggressive: we are largely better at doing than we are at thinking, thanks to antifragility. I’d rather be dumb and antifragile than extremely smart and fragile, any time.

    It is easy to see things around us that like a measure of stressors and volatility: economic systems, your body, your nutrition (diabetes and many similar modern ailments seem to be associated with a lack of randomness in feeding and the absence of the stressor of occasional starvation), your psyche. There are even financial contracts that are antifragile: they are explicitly designed to benefit from market volatility. Antifragility makes us understand fragility better. Just as we cannot improve health without reducing disease, or increase wealth without first decreasing losses, antifragility and fragility are degrees on a spectrum.

    Robust Is Not Robust Enough

    Consider that Mother Nature is not just “safe.” It is aggressive in destroying and replacing, in selecting and reshuffling. When it comes to random events, “robust” is certainly not good enough. In the long run everything with the most minute vulnerability breaks, given the ruthlessness of time—yet our planet has been around for perhaps four billion years and, convincingly, robustness can’t just be it: you need perfect robustness for a crack not to end up crashing the system. Given the unattainability of perfect robustness, we need a mechanism by which the system regenerates itself continuously by using, rather than suffering from, random events, unpredictable shocks, stressors, and volatility.

    The antifragile gains from prediction errors, in the long run. If you follow this idea to its conclusion, then many things that gain from randomness should be dominating the world today—and things that are hurt by it should be gone. Well, this turns out to be the case. We have the illusion that the world functions thanks to programmed design, university research, and bureaucratic funding, but there is compelling—very compelling—evidence to show that this is an illusion, the illusion I call lecturing birds how to fly. Technology is the result of antifragility, exploited by risk-takers in the form of tinkering and trial and error, with nerd-driven design confined to the backstage. Engineers and tinkerers develop things while history books are written by academics; we will have to refine historical interpretations of growth, innovation, and many such things.

    This also follows from The Red Queen Hypothesis.

  30. “You can blow out a candle, but you can’t blow out a fire.
    Once the flames begin to catch, the wind just lifts it higher.”

    – Peter Gabriel

  31. EhIntellect
    Mrs. ordered a Sue Venker book today, too. She’s excited…

    Ugh. Well, could be worse…

  32. red rain is coming down
    red rain
    red rain is pouring down
    pouring down all over me

    red rain-
    putting the pressure on much harder now
    to return again and again
    just let the red rain splash you
    let the rain fall on your skin
    I come to you defences down
    with the trust of a child

    red rain is coming down
    red rain
    red rain is pouring down
    pouring down all over me
    and I can’t watch any more
    no more denial

    Peter Gabriel: “Red Rain’ was written after a dream I’d had about the sea being parted by two walls. There were these glass-like figures that would screw themselves into each wall, fill up with red blood and then be lowered across the sand, as it were to the next wall, where they’d unload the blood on the other side. I used to have these extremely vivid dreams that scared the hell out of me.”

    “If feelings of pain do not get brought out, not only do they fester and grow stronger but they manifest themselves in the external world.” –songfacts.com

  33. Took no time at all to refresh my memory of Venker, an “ally” or “friend” of men, yeah right.

    Suzanne Venker – willing to let some men have some say sometimes, and she is clearly making such a huge concession in the process.

    https://dalrock.wordpress.com/2012/11/28/suzanne-venker-on-what-men-are-good-for/

    I work outside the home. My husband does his thing. No one would consider me a docile or obedient housewife… I am married to a guy who works so that I can have a cushy writing life. That is the beauty of marriage.

    https://dalrock.wordpress.com/2012/11/29/suzanne-venker-on-womens-rights-mens-responsibilities-and-why-she-divorced-her-first-husband/

    Venker: The mailed fist of the FI with a pink glove and a happy face.

    Maybe she’s learned something in the last 4 years, but color me very skeptical: if feminists were capable of learning, the mess wouldn’t be so complete.

  34. “She replies by wanting to talk more about me raping her as a sexual fantasy. Without a safe word, cuz I convinced her that’s more fun, lol.”

    aren’t you that fucking guy who gave me shit about being abusive? and wanting my wife to leave me or something?

    now you want to play rape time too, huh?

    guess what happens when she likes that? go a little farther maybe? stay on that path for two decades and guess where you’ll end up?

    the shit you do will have other clueless guys calling you an abusive psycho. but you’ll know better.

    hint: it’s much better to just do it. talking about it with her ruins all the fun. if you’re afraid of consequences you shouldn’t be playing

    hint: it’s supposed to be fun for you, not her. giving a shit what she wants isn’t frame. it’s pedestalizing. you shouldn’t want to convince her of anything.

    enjoy your sloppy seconds

  35. Anonymous Reader

    I wouldn’t sweat it about Venker. It is axiomatic and always will be that the sisterhood members will always be out for their own and for the sisterhood’s sexual strategy. So I wouldn’t bother parsing or dissecting their words or distrust their intent. As far as I’m concerned, Venker is in early proto-types of thought. Her terms and her presentation are not very polished. She is trying to wake up other women to how she has fucked up by being a non-submissive female in her own life.

    I would even be wary of Laura Doyle’s books. As a man. That’s why I won’t bother reading them.

    Dr. Laura “just get’s it” about red pill but she will never advocate for anything other than agency in a women’s sexual strategy, but her special trick is that she advocates for children and the best interest of the children in a logical masculine/feminine two parent way. A male would never take sexual strategy advice from her. She gives women good sexual strategy advice for women. But her advice for women is to compromise men’s strategy. She’s can “read the tape” from 40 years of callers calling in. Fair is fair, if a man’s strategy is to succeed, the woman’s must be compromised. That’s also axiomatic. So don’t expect anything less. Just proceed and be the best imitation of yourself with the best agency you can.

    If EhIntellect leads and his wife follows that lead. And if she feels loved, and the children are well cared for, well who’s to complain. I see a win win situation. It’s not like EhIntellect’s wife is not going to want the D because she reads Venker telling her to tone down the Dominant Female tone.

    No women ever will advocate for male sexual strategy. And if they appear to be, they are just being Machiavellian. But that doesn’t mean some women writer’s and speakers can’t give women glimpses of red pill truth via acknowledging that life outside the Matrix exists.

    A woman that can surrender to her skepticism and tendency for self-protection (natural firmware tendency) is not afraid to actually submit. And a guy can flip that switch if she has trust in his performance.

  36. I substituted a bottle of wine for flowers and found this card:

    Why
    not
    live
    for
    fun
    and
    joy
    and
    love?
    -Jack Kerouac-

    On the blank inside I wrote, “With me.”

    I think that Git Er Done for another year.

  37. @SJF
    The Surrendered Wife

    I bought this book a couple of weeks ago. I think it’s a good read. It’s a more formal version of women are from venus men are from mars which I had read years ago and had thought to be quite accurate.
    Funny, I let my copy of The Surrendered Wife on a book shelf with the hopes of having my current gf find it. Was interested in starting that discussion or at least seeing her reaction. instead she found my Mystery Method and she took it home to read. It’s so funny how her solopism is so strong – I keep hearing “I’m not like that” and the concept of placing herself on a bell-curve of behaviors is so difficult.

    Back to The Surrendered Wife – I don’t see how a woman who is not already partially surrendered would not totally freak and resist that book. It just seems so counter to all the Strong and Independent (TM) women I’ve ever known. Either she is or she isn’t.

  38. @Fleezer – Lol, there is a little thing called “consent” involved with me. Please don’t try to use me to justify your actual abuse.

  39. The perfect topic for “V” Day…

    http://nypost.com/2017/02/16/my-day-at-the-designer-vagina-showcase/

    The perfect vagina is pink, plump and hairless.

    There is nothing major about its labia majora, curled primly to frame the entrance of the vagina and a clitoris with a hood so dainty that it might even be called cute. Projected on a screen in front of us in a slick, dark boardroom in Midtown Manhattan, the perfect vagina in the photograph is surrounded by the trademark sky blue of a surgical gown, a slash of orangey disinfectant Betadine on one splayed thigh.

    That’s because the perfect vagina was created on an operating table, during a cosmetic surgery by Dr. Amir Marashi.

    Lolz

  40. Is there Male Hypergamy, AMALT: Wanting to maximize erotic experience with HBs when age 16 to late 20s, then lock down a Quality Woman for LTR/Marriage for having and raising kids?

    So FI is AF/BB. MI is HB/QW.
    Seems to me there is some symmetry M/F.

    Then, in LTR, when kids are raised, guys need to decide whether continue to be with and RP-train QW, or go back to HB focus. Does partner still have some HB qualities and interest.
    And women need to decide according to their priorities: is she getting enough AF/BB from her partner, or does she have better options.

  41. “Marco”
    Is there Male Hypergamy, AMALT: Wanting to maximize erotic experience with HBs when age 16 to late 20s, then lock down a Quality Woman for LTR/Marriage for having and raising kids?

    LOL, try again, dearie.

  42. I’ve had a distance plate that is from my hometown. Was supposed to go visit this weekend, but her dad had a stroke earlier this week and they didn’t find him till yesterday morning. Needless to say, she’s in my house as we speak.

    Previous to swallowing the RP, her slopistic nature would have been explained away as “well, she’s upset!”. Now….I see it on full display. It’s laid bare.

    I was taking care of something for her on the phone, and she got a call from a random relative. She actually gave me the “shush” so she could take the call!

    I’m finally starting to really get it. Kinda disturbing. No, not true – no kinda about it. She’s been on the phone wailing away to one female relative after another, reliving the same story, sharing the emotional experience, for like three hours. Watching it is surreal.

    The whole reason I’m involved with this broad in the first place is I had ONEITIS for her and she blew me out. Thirty plus years ago. She came looking for me after my wife dumped me. She had a reputation for chasing involved men when we were in high school. She never had kids, is 5’11”, and super slim. How many times do you get to sleep with your first oneitis?

    I was actually going to dump her this weekend. Kinda hard to do it right now. Difficult to keep frame, and realize I’m dealing with your buddy’s 12 year old bratty sister, but I’m doing better solely because I realize what’s happening and haven’t internalized it into the autopilot yet.

  43. “How many times do you get to sleep with your first oneitis?”

    30 plus years later: zero. You are sleeping with a vision in your head and the undead in your bed.

  44. There is a word for that vision in your head: Glamour.

    It is a weapon the sidhe and vampires. Enchanting, isn’t it?

  45. Naw! It was great! Only because I took her off my pedestal a looooong time ago. This is strictly nostalgia strange.

  46. I’d bore you how I hooked up with her, but trust me – the first time I fucked her was because I’ve never had casual sex before and I knew I didn’t care and wasn’t interested in anything more.

    Was still BF as F. I kinda led her along because my frame was all jacked up, but somehow I knew that it was the right thing to do at the time.

  47. You guys are a bit snarky with Marko, which may be what he needs, but we could be more direct.

    @Marko

    1. Men are fundamentally different:
    a. We have seed turnover time of 2-12 hours on a perpetual, ongoing basis and thus each of us could impregnate thousands of women, leading to thousands of babies whereas women have one egg per month and can have at most 1 baby per year for 20 years as a 2 sigma result maximum.
    2. Men are fundamentally the creators of things and women the supporters. This takes a while to understand in our modern world, but it is the general rule. Even when there are strong/competent female CEOs, there will be “right hand men”, often COOs & CFOs, who are leading the GSD. Until you are repeatedly gaming women effectively (not that I am one of the experts in this forum), you don’t see how much they naturally prefer being in the following/supporting role. They are happier that way.

    Back to your question, which has some merit. Male hypergamy is basically, “get sex with hot babe(s) whenever you want and keep the ones around you as long as they please you (serve your ends)” would be more accurate.

  48. @Marko,

    Something important that I left out. At a limbic (hard-wired) level, when you can produce at most 25 babies in your lifetime (not to mention the massive investment physically of carrying it for 9 months) you will care for each a lot more than if you can spread your seed to make 5,000 babies with a few minutes-hours effort to create each.
    Of course, we are rational and can care for a handful of children we choose to with more investment, but that would be one of “your ends” mentioned above, and she is around to help you serve that end as well.

  49. “You guys are a bit snarky with Marko . . .”

    They have history with him.

    ” . . .we could be more direct.”

    See above.

    “get sex with hot babe(s) whenever you want and keep the ones around you as long as they please you . . .”

    The word for that is “promiscuity.”

    Women fuck up (you can say that again), men fuck around.

  50. Agreed. Valentine’s Day has become the perfect setting for a real live situation comedy dialogue with your girl.
    No laugh tracks, but still a golden opportunity.

    I worked all V-Day. Hard. It was an ordinary, loaded up with work, Tuesday.

    I have full-stopped all V-Day try-hard bullshit (flowers, perfume, lingerie, dinner, etc.).
    This happened after I finally woke up to how expensive, time consuming, expected, unappreciated and unreciprocated that it all was.

    Besides 90% of it is simply girls bragging to each other with one-up-womanship.
    “What did your guy get?..Well,my guy got me….”

    Horrible.

    More men need to ask the fundamental question “why am I even doing this?”
    So that my girlfriend/wife will:
    a. finally be nice to me?
    OR
    b. not be angry/disappointed/outraged with me for some undisclosed period of time?

    Is this really the best that men can hope for in general? Because if it is, then it makes zero sense.

    There is officially zero romance on Valentine’s Day anymore.
    Congratulations ladies. Now everything is contrived.

  51. We were headed out the door, four hours late. For an appointment she wanted. I literally had my keys in my hand.

    She attacked me. The more I ignore her the more she won’t leave me alone.

    I’m so breaking up with her as soon as she moves back here.

  52. @ Marko – “Then, in LTR, when kids are raised,”

    uh – ‘LTR, when the kids are raised’? When the kids are raised indicates at least 18+ years… multiply that by the number of kids are you are looking at about 25+ years. That’s more than a LTR ‘Marko’. That’s sacrifice, honor and commitment…

    Omitting the idea that raising kids is a lifelong commitment, a woman doesn’t care about raising her kids with any particular man… any old beta bux will do, for a while. Most women’s commitment only lasts until a better man comes along. Or until she gets bored with the current LTR then starts moving up to a better man. A LTR doesn’t exists unless the woman finds her interests served – and her interests usually are not served for the 18+ years it takes to raise the kids.

    By the way – currently ‘The more LTRs the better’ for her. Moving each LTR to the Marriage contract then divorcing and taking 50% of all assets. Then, if she charges her ex with DV or something sexually offensive involving her or ‘her kids’ [no actual evidence needed and no penalty for her when making false charges] he goes to jail [with lawyer fees, restraining orders, criminal background] while she goes to the bank with custody of the kids, deed to the house, the car and monthly CS payments…
    You see Marko a woman doesn’t usually sacrifice, honor or commit to anyone but herself. There is no “Then, in LTR, when the kids are raised”. The LTR continues only so long as it serves Her interests.

    “guys need to decide whether continue to be with and RP-train QW, or go back to HB focus.”

    A RP-train QW – I’m guessing you meant Red Pill Trained Quality Woman… uh, in my experience, a woman is managed, not trained. A QW is one who is constantly ‘gamed’, keeping her ‘on her toes’ and therefore interested in the man who she thinks is alpha.
    “Does partner still have some HB qualities and interest.
And women need to decide according to their priorities: is she getting enough AF/BB from her partner, or does she have better options.”

    “Does partner still have some HB qualities…?” This is the question you suppose a man would ask after 18 – 25+ years of shared commitment, honor and sacrifice raising the kids. hmmm one doesn’t follow the other, logically, reasonably or rationally. I don’t see where 18 – 25+ years of parenting and basically a lifetime of investments all adds up to the LTR being re-negotiated: Does partner still have some Hot Babe qualities?
    But this: “is she getting enough AF/BB from her partner, or does she have better options” – this is classic female hypergamy.

    I’m guessing Marko is actually Marcia…

    or a young man without much actual life experience, who’s parents divorced after he was raised…

    or a blue pill beta boy trying to equate masculinity and femininity…

    The two are different Marko and in ways that you have yet to understand. But do some more reading here at The Rational Male and keep commenting – you have some interesting ideas.

  53. “You guys are a bit snarky with Marko . . .”

    They have history with him.

    We already explained that we can explain it to him, but we can’t understand it for him.

    And the snark comes because of his insistence on egalitarian equalism, which is inherently non-red pill and sometimes can lead to system failure.

    I don’t see it as being critical in a rude or sarcastic way to him per se, more as playing to the other commenters that “just get that” part of of the criticism of EE (egalitarian equalism).

  54. “What about the Laura Doyle books that come highly recommended by BluePillProfessor?”

    Thx.

    AR

    You’ve been much help.

    It doesn’t matter what she reads, really. She’s struggling to grasp that we are on different trajectories, the equalism is melting with her old self. She’s much more emotionally labile, happy, weepy, sexual and calm too. I tell her to just be her, naturally feminine, I got this. She tested me yesterday with a lazing eye stare (she’s on to me) and “I don’t believe you’re being honest.” Me: “What!? This guy!?” (me pointing at my face) and pour more Jack Daniels in her cup.

    We were out yesterday. She really sees the intersexual dysfunction at the college bar we were at. Oh, I busted two other girls, kinda clumsy-grabby at each other, again, told them they were unconvincing as lesbians. They need a real dude…like me! One proudly proclaimed she’s bisexual and the other quickly said “I’m not lesbian!” pulled away from bigirl and avoided her the rest of the night. Heh. No banshee screaming though, bummer.

    The betaization of men is evident to her now, and she sees the ramifications, good for RP men, and bad for men in general. Guys are scared, docile. Women self mutilate-shit test, men are too paralyzed to call them on it, young women careening through life, societal governors off, as Scrib mentioned.

    I asked an college kid buying round after round of shots for his group, why he doesn’t just hit on his available female companion, sexually. It’s obvious he wants to with all his goofy scratching of her back tattoo, and she’s obviously available. His reply? “Oh no. I’ve known her for two years now. She’s like a sister to me.” Sigh. I patted him on the shoulder. Me: Tough break, brother.

    “Would be interested in knowing what other posters think about pulling with kids in tow?”

    I’ve had nothing but positive experiences with my sons. It can be wildly entertaining. It’s tough to read then act upon PUA listicles. The subtle happy opening, teasing out of her details, appropriate sexualization of conversation, knowing where he wants it to end (literally, thanks Forge). Overcoming the fear of insulting someone, desiring the frisson of it is difficult. My son likes to tease about girls Uggs. Starting ez.

    Re: the perfect vagina, I’m sure y’all have talked about this before.

    “The Saudi couple sought out Dr. Goodman because they’d had premarital sex and wanted to make sure their families never found out. “If he’s the one the family chooses [as the groom], then no problem. She doesn’t have to bleed,” the doctor explains. “But she doesn’t know who she’s going to marry. It might not be him so she has an operation they hope she doesn’t need.” ”

    “By restoring the hymen to a “pre-sexual” state, your vagina will be rejuvenated. Hymenoplasty is a simple procedure that will repair a torn hymen and pull together the tissue so it is once again covered by the vagina. In some cultures, a torn hymen can affect her marriage prospects, reputation and life.”

  55. “She tested me yesterday with a lazing eye stare (she’s on to me)..”

    That has become my favorite shit test. Staring back at her with the “married secret society” stare is my favorite response to it. I usually do it without a smirk, as if I mean it and she then breaks her train of thought. And stops testing.

  56. “Hymenoplasty is a simple procedure that will repair a torn hymen and pull together the tissue so it is once again covered by the vagina. In some cultures, a torn hymen can affect her marriage prospects, reputation and life.”

    Read something similar in the novel Aztec.
    (and the miniseries Marco Polo…probably Shogun too)
    What’s old is new.

  57. @SJF It’s egalitarian complementarianism — not equalism. Big difference. Did I state it unclearly, or did you misread? Either way, this is the clarification.

    @SJF Actually I’ve been paying very close attention in class, and have some good questions for the teacher. That’s paying better attention than just repeating back to the teacher what the teacher says. To engage the teacher and class with thoughtful — rational !! — questions is to show the greatest respect.

    @ All : Further clarification: I’m two steps further along in the life cycle than most of you: I’ve done empty nest, I’ve done after retirement. What I write is field tested, long game. My contribution here, I hope, is to get folks really thinking and strategizing Long Game.

    Since some folks seem fond of ad hominem arguments: Just for context, I’m married more than 40 years, healthy successful kids and grandkids. My wife and I get along well with all of them. We’ve had successful careers, multiple graduate degrees, finances in about top 1%, give generously to extended family and to many good causes. Active engaged retirement with many good friends.

    It’s just possible I know something that might be of good use to men reading TRM.

    The reason I write on TRM is I care about men. There is lot of pain, as this site and our own observations document.

    So let me repeat my brief questions, and hopefully get more thoughtful responses. I think these might add conceptual clarity and lead to more strategic actions and tactics:

    “Is there Male Hypergamy, AMALT: Wanting to maximize erotic experience with HBs when age 16 to late 20s, then lock down a Quality Woman for LTR/Marriage for having and raising kids?

    So FI is AF/BB. MI is HB/QW.
    Seems to me there is some symmetry M/F.”

  58. “Is there Male Hypergamy”

    No.

    “AMALT”

    Yes.

    “Wanting to maximize erotic experience with HBs when age 16 to late 20s, then lock down a Quality Woman for LTR/Marriage for having and raising kids?”

    No.

    “So FI is AF/BB”

    Yes.

    ” MI is HB/QW”

    No.

    “Seems to me there is some symmetry M/F.”

    One’s got an inny, t’other’s got an outty. Neither one works for shit until you bring ’em together.

  59. @Marko

    Do you go out clubbing? Do you flirt with 20-somethings and look at their phones?

    I’ve been married almost as long as you and you are peddling bullshit. If today were 1960, your stuff would work, but not any more.

    I’ve done empty nest and after retirement as well.

    Is there Male Hypergamy, AMALT: Wanting to maximize erotic experience with HBs when age 16 to late 20s, then lock down a Quality Woman for LTR/Marriage for having and raising kids?

    Read Rollo’s “Myth of the Quality Woman”.

    https://therationalmale.com/2013/03/19/quality-women/

    In today’s world, the average 20-something has had 20+ partners.

  60. @Marko, for all your accomplishments and success you’ve had in life, why is it you appear to be rubbing most people wrong here? Why do you think your message is failing here? People can master subject matter but be shitty teachers of that subject matter. Your messaging is failing, but I suspect you think this is a problem with us? That’s called a buffer.

  61. @Marko

    I did qualify my snark as in I don’t mean it negatively. (I prefer to be on the same manosphere side of advocating for men’s agency.)

    Props to you on your resume. Honestly, your achievements are my goal over the next 20 years.

    I see egalitarianism and Complementarianism as antagonists. So does Wikipedia.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Complementarianism

    I can’t subscribe to an AMALT paradigm. Cause I just don’t see it objectively in real life. To a certain extent all Blue Pill Men are alike. I haven’t actually witness any two Red Pill guys in alignment.

    I see no symmetry in AF/BB and HB/QW. As Hot Babe is only shin deep and it depends on her quality after fucking her. There is no such thing as a quality woman in my red pill lexicon outside the matrix.

    Nonetheless, your dialogue is engaging. And there is value in that.

    I get the theoretical and ideological value of Egalitarianism, it’s just that there is just too small of a window for it to work as a praxeology in today’s society. (It got homo sapiens out of Africa and on to a global stage–by which I mean large groups of people–at which point it vaulted itself into it own level of incompetence.) Human existence changes over time and The Red Queen Hypothesis still holds. And man will always have to adapt to conditions. Fortunately you got out well ahead of that wave of conditions. (The Misandry Bubble). Egalitarianism was and is good for you and you should keep using it for your own sovereignty, but that doesn’t mean it will work as an ideology for others in the manosphere.

    Complementarianism, meanwhile, is a time honored praxeology.

  62. @ theasdgamer: “In today’s world, the average 20-something has had 20+ partners.”

    Logic fail. Who’s taking commitment/Marriage to “average”?

    Pedestalizing women will blind you and you won’t be able to vet well. Depedestalizing is absolutely necessary.
    But, there are Quality Women, even ones of marriagible age. I agree that the FI has messed up many (maybe most) younger ones. But there is a subset of QW looking for quality men.
    Don’t you know some QW, young and old, asd?
    All this doesn’t mean that a woman can’t turn on you, frivorce, etc. So, Caveat emptor. Be aware, protect yourself, have options. Have insights and skills for maintaining a good relationship with a QW. They will hypergamy on you, if they think they really have better options.

  63. “I’m married more than 40 years, healthy successful kids and grandkids. My wife and I get along well with all of them. We’ve had successful careers, multiple graduate degrees, finances in about top 1%, give generously to extended family and to many good causes. Active engaged retirement with many good friends.”

    There was a debate here ago and the conclusion was this:

    You can live a pre-feminism lifestyle in today’s western world, albeit only in vigilantly defended small tribes. My example is the home-schooling crowd my family runs with. They are traditional, women feminine, men masculine, not WK masculine tho, speak in RP terms but in their own old-style churchy vernacular, have many, many kids. Family tradition and common culture rejection are default responses to any issue. This is an anomaly and does not tip the culture back in any way.

    What you don’t know, Marko, won’t hurt you as much as what you know that just ain’t so. The west is one generation away from losing your ideations, beliefs, cultural capital. You just won’t experience the cultural plunge into the abyss from your affluent life and eventual rapidly approaching grave. No offense honestly, just sayin’.

    Fun fact: Of those who heir millions to their children, only one-two generations are needed to squander the inheritance, assimilated into the failing, feminized, decadent culture.

    “How many generations does it take for an ancestry group that today contains thousands of Victors (millionaires) to become Americanized? Only a few. Most move into the “American normal” range within one or two generations.”

    “This is especially true for those who spend a lot of time reminiscing about how their late ancestors founded steel mills, railroads, and pony express services long, long ago.”

    http://www.nytimes.com/books/first/s/stanley-millionaire.html

    It’s an apt analogy.

  64. @SJF:

    AxALT is meaningless absent a definition of T. Or, to put it another way, the equation is true for the right value of T, ergo, if there is any value of T for which the equation is true, the equation is true.

  65. But there is a subset of QW looking for quality men.+ All this doesn’t mean that a woman can’t turn on you, frivorce, etc. They will hypergamy on you, if they think they really have better options.= invalid argument (non sequitur).

  66. A major issue of contention is whether Quality Women exist, young or old.
    They do. I know many. If we disagree on this key issue, then all kinds of further disagreements follow logically from this disagreement. We just see the world very differently, and pursue different paths of action as a result.

    It seems to me that SJF and Rollo report they are married to QWs. Maybe some of the other posters, too. Anyone want to claim their wife or LTR is a QW?

    If there are no QW, then there is no hope for a satisfying LTR or marriage.

    Is that what those who deny the existence of QW are saying?

    Can you have a satisfying LTR or marriage to a women who is not HQ — how can that work?

  67. Regarding the comment upthread concerning ” consent “.

    A man doesn’t need to get consent from a woman for sexual activity, unless one buys into all of the Yes means Yes propaganda, or a man is truly afraid that a bitch might try to have him arrested.

    But seeking consent is 100% beta/blue pillery. It’s a massive massive loss of frame.

    Also calling other men ” abusive ” sexually especially married dudez whose wives have no issue with their lifestyle smacks of white knighting and sjw’ing.

    Be clear readers, looking for permission from a woman particularly sexually iis a form of pedestalization. The feeling of this being your duty or something you need be concerned about means that maybe you’re fucking the wrong chick for you…. Or, it’s all about you and your bluer thought processes.

    Don’t talk about fuck club.😁

    I’ve always seen ” OW!!!!!” As a damn good safeword.

  68. @Eh Intellect:

    Although culture is at least in part an expression of the I’s, the I’s are independent of culture. They are a constant base level. ALL are like “That.”

    “The west is one generation away from losing your ideations, beliefs, cultural capital.”

    The generation is already extant.

  69. @Marko: “We just see the world very differently, and pursue different paths of action as a result.”

    That would be why the metaphor exists.

  70. “If there are no QW, then there is no hope for a satisfying LTR or marriage.”

    Women and RP men enter LTR’s and marriage under different objectives. RP men see women as…well…tools to actualize their vision.

    BP men see marriage as a partnership, complementary, with aligning objectives. In this scenario he cedes frame and his agency to her sexual targets, which, again, are different than his.

  71. “Marko”

    Define your term “Quality Women”, take all the words you want.
    Be sure to read Rollo’s essay on the topic first.
    There might be a quiz.

  72. @SJF: “Egalitarianism, it’s just that there is just too small of a window for it to work as a praxeology in today’s society. (It got homo sapiens out of Africa . . .”

    What got homo sapiens out of Africa was tribal clanishness. Anthropologically speaking, egalitarian means the opposite of clanishness.

    Clan: Your social status is inherited from your family.
    Egalitarian: Your social status is earned from your individual qualities.

    Clan: “I am the King, because my father was the King.”
    Egalitarian: “I am the King, because I knocked the King’s head in.”

    Biologically, as the word is used in poli-sci, egalitarianism is the praxeology of slime mold. To move beyond that level to form a complex organism requires abandoning it.

  73. @ Marko

    ” High Quality ” woman will be a bit subjective and defined differently among different males. It depends mostly on how a man sees a woman/women, and what role they see women playing iin their lives, long term. Many men don’t really plan for the long game and get terribly tripped up by things like HB rating….lol.

    It takes years and a few trials by fire to truly discern if a woman is ” quality “.

    As far as men being hypergamous, no, there’s no such thing. Men have certain biological drives, but what is of key importance iis the understanding that these drives vary in intensity greatly between men. It is biological, but it is also greatly influenced by culture and an individual’s thought processes and understanding of the world and of himself.

    Women are hypergamous. It’s gotta be in percentages around the upper 90’s. Even high quality women are hypergamous. Even my quality wife.

    If I were to quit my job, blow all of my retirement funds, sell the house and move the family iinto a small apartment where I vegged out on the cough watching tv and getting fat, sold the cars and replaced them with a rusty 1992 Honda accord with no hubcaps and bald tires, my quality wife would pack her quality bags and split.

    Hypergamy is not a bad and evil thing , it just ” is ” and mostly always has been – except that under the influence of the FI, hypergamy is now supercharged.

    You’re better off talking about anything besides Ltr’s and marriage. Lol.

    Right now men need to concentrate more on themselves, finding out what they want and need out of life and how to get it.

  74. “with a rusty 1992 Honda accord with no hubcaps and bald tires”

    Hey, hey!! That’s my work car! 260,000 miles.

    Oy! I’m cheap…how embarrassing.

  75. “with a rusty 1992 Honda accord with no hubcaps and bald tires”

    Hey, hey!! That’s my work car! 260,000 miles.

    Good choice. You can leave it overnight in a hospital parking lot and know it will still be there, unless it gets towed. I knew a real deal millionaire some years ago who drove a beater like that because it blended in with everyone else’s car around some of his industrial zone real estate. He liked to blend in rather than stand out for reasons.

    But you don’t make Mrs. Eh drive it, now do you?

  76. The point is that “Quality Woman” is a construct (an idea or theory containing various conceptual elements, typically one considered to be subjective and not based on empirical evidence). I do agree that there are quality women in certain objective and empirical terms. The problem is that when it it referred to as a construct, the terms are too fluid, and social and interpersonal interactions are too fluid. As in: not able to be nailed down.

    Women can not be labeled as such prior to or in then initial stages of a relationship. (Vetting is a goal directed process. It can’t be 100% achieved. And even if it could, things change.) (And yes, after 27 years a man can be empirical and objective. And yes, my wife is–after the fact–based on what she had done. So much so that I had to beat my One-itis over the head to get it into submission in 2015. All of that, though, is irrelevant to the discussion. And is not a model or a construct for discussion purposes.)

    There are a lot of caring and nurturing former sluts, and there are pristine and chaste women only lacking the proper motivation to move them in a direction no one would ever expect of them.

    So, in my opinion, your using this in a premise make logical debate not flow.

    As illustrated by Rollo’s essay The Pet

    https://therationalmale.com/2012/04/24/the-pet/

    Half the Battle

    The primary (though not exclusive) focus of this blog has been devoted to the critical analysis of the mechanics behind intergender dynamics, Game-practice, Game-theory, social and evolutionary psychology just to name a few. I can understand the want for practical applications of this field of study, and while in my line of work I have done my own ‘field testing’ with the majority of what I explore here, I have neither the time, opportunity or resources to develop practices beyond what I offer here. At least not to the degree of which the majority of my readers are able – and that’s the good news.

    “This is brilliant stuff Rollo, but how do I use this to make my life better with the next girl I sarge, etc.?” This is a common desire from my readership, and the best I can offer is Knowing is Half the Battle. One size doesn’t fit all for everyone in Game or intergender relations. Anyone hawking a book giving you an instruction manual on how to have a great marriage or how to pick up chicks is still limited by their own individual experience. In other words, they’re not you.

    It’s for exactly this reason I spend more time and critical thought on the foundations and functions of gender dynamism than pick up artistry. When I get associated with the “manipulative machiavellian Game gurus” it only serves to highlight an ignorance and lack of any depth of understanding what I focus on here. Game is psychology, sociology, economics, biomechanics, evolution and politics. Game is far broader than simple tricks and techniques. And it’s exactly the latent purpose of these applications (PUArtistry) and the mechanics behind their workings that threatens the ego-investments of those who’s feminized interests would rather see them marginalized and passed off as folly, or usefully ridiculed to shame the curious for fear that the underpinnings might be exposed.

    Head in the Sand

    Sweetening the poison doesn’t make it any less deadly.

    I can remember a time in my mid-20s working as a stage tech for a casino cabaret show. The magic act I set up and struck every night involved a Bengal tiger and a black panther. Both of them were professionally handled by trainers, but even though they seemed the most docile of animals I knew they had the potential to seriously fuck me up under the wrong set of circumstances. The trainers would keep them at distance from the rest of the cast and crew, only myself and one other tech were able to get close since we were the ones wheeling them out in special cages at their particular point in the show. One trainer told me, “the moment you think of them as pets is the moment they’ll go feral on you.” They would play with these wild animals, and they seemed to have a special connection (almost like a pet), but when you watched them eat, you knew what they were capable of.

    I learned a valuable lesson from this when one night I was wheeling the panther out to the curtain. She was in what was basically a reinforced acrylic aquarium on casters with a velvet cloth draped over it. A few minutes before my cue I’d thought the drape was falling to one side and lifted it to even it out. It was then that I was face to face with this “pet” in nothing but faint stage lights and about 4 inches of transparent acrylic between us. She looked at me with those yellow-green eyes and gave me a very low, almost muted growl and flashed just enough of her teeth to let me know this was not a “pet”.

    It’s a mistake (and sometimes a fatal one) to ignore what you know is just under the surface. It’s comforting to believe that you’ve got a special connection, and while the conditions are right, you’ll preserve a relationship based on mutual trust and shared affinity. The flaw is in believing that trust, and kinship is unconditional; that the underlying feral motivators are subdued to the point of being inconsequential. It may be that you do have a special bond that goes beyond just the physical, but that relationship is still founded on physical rules that constantly test and influence that individual.

    You know better, but the desire for that connection is so strong that you marginalize the natural impulses into feel-good rationalizations. Every divorced man I know has uttered some variation of “I never thought she was capable of this.” In their comfort they wondered how they dropped the ball, especially after having played by the rules for so long. Some knew about Hypergamy, others made it their “pet”, only their beautiful panther went feral.

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