Domain Dependence

domain_dependence

I received the following email from a reader this week:

Hi Rollo, I ran across the below thread on the TRP discussion on Reddit. I’m not normally a big follower of reddit but this one was good and is something that I’ve thought for a long time. Online Dating really, really, really sucks for men. And turns women into bitches. And has changed the world from an 80/20 market to a 95/5 market. The average male and actually for most above average males too … like SMV 6s and 7s have been completely shut out. And learning Game does little good for these men.

Was wondering if you’d care to discuss such things.

One of the founding Red Pill principles I explored over a decade ago was the tendency for men (and women) to create Buffers against rejection for themselves. I’ll still argue that men being the ‘initiator’ sex are subject to the consequences of rejection far more than women ever will be, but left unchecked, and if we’re honest, deliberately ignored, these rejection Buffers often develop into psychological schemas men internalize as a specific “preference” when it comes to interacting with with women:

Buffers are generally the paths of least rejection that become ego-invested “preferences.” Buffers aren’t so much about those “preferences” as they are about the motivations behind them.

At this point you might be thinking, “well, what the hell, I don’t want to feel rejection, why not employ buffers against it?” The main reason for embracing rejection is that rejection is better than regret. Scan back through this short list of buffers; how many of these have become greater, longer term problems for you than a briefly painful rejection would’ve been? Buffers also have a tendency to compound upon themselves in that one tends to dovetail into another, or more, until you no longer realize that they were originally rejection prevention methodologies and gradually become associated with your genuine personality. After a long enough period, these buffer become “just how I am.”

In the past Roosh has gone into some speculation that there will be a narrowing of the already harsh 80-20 rule of the SMP the closer western society gets to a total consolidation of feminine social primacy. Certain bloggers will debate the numbers, but I tend to agree with his proposition, though I’d say that a starting point of 80-20 might be a bit generous. However, considering the comfort with which women and popular culture are embracing open Hypergamy, I think I would actually step up his timetable for ‘Peak Hypergamy’.

For now, men are being presented with some very simple and pragmatic choices:

  • Learn Game, stay in the Game. Make the most of what they have to work with in their given circumstances and focus on self-motivated self-improvement. In a sense it’s a form of MGTOW, but with the expressed purpose of actively engaging in the SMP as it’s accessible to an individual guy. In other words, don’t wish it were easier, wish you were better – play the game better but always with yourself as your own mental point of origin.
  • Exit the Game. No one truly exits the Game, but they can minimize their active involvement in it. For the most part this doesn’t have to be a complete capitulation to one’s sexless, intimacy-less fate, but it does imply a degree of self-imposed indifference to women’s interest. Unfortunately this option seems the most pragmatic for men who either haven’t the patience or circumstance to opt for improving themselves and succeed at the Game, or they simply don’t see a commensurate reward for the investment they’d need to make in assuming the liabilities that come with dealing with most women these days.
  • Continue on in a Blue Pill ignorance. Although this ‘choice’ is the most common (i.e. at least 80% of Beta men) it will be the one to disappear the most rapidly. Even without a growing Red Pill community, Red Pill awareness is becoming more difficult for even the most plugged-in of men to ignore. Women’s flaunting of Open Hypergamy and blatant admission to a sexual strategy of Alpha Fucks / Beta Bucks combined with a widespread Red Pill awareness will challenge even the most ardent of White Knight’s and idealistic ‘average frustrated chumps’. Still, there are diehard self-righteous Betas who’s dedication to the path that the Feminine Imperative has set before them has made any deviation from it unthinkable. They build a life of dependency on the untenable Blue Pill goals and the means to realize them.

The problem inherent to all of these options is that to a lesser or greater degree they rely on a static state of a particular environment, condition or domain.

Domain Dependency

Just for the record, yes, I’m quite familiar with the anti-fragile doctrine proposed by Taleb with regard to domain dependency. I do see a parallels in this with regard to Red Pill awareness, but this is in no way an endorsement of the book – I simply don’t have enough familiarity with it.

For Red Pill purposes though, Domain Dependence is being good at what you do in one setting, but completely unable to transfer that ability to another setting. I think this dependence is one of the more overstated preoccupations Game critics have in really accepting the validity of greater Red Pill truths.

A cheetah is a deadly and effective predator when he can use his speed to run down prey on the wide-open African plains, but put him in the Brazilian rainforest, with its dense jungle, and he’s probably going to sleep hungry more nights than not.

Translated into predictable Red Pill critique, the idea is similar – “Yeah, sure, game works well for picking up low self-esteem bar skanks, but I’m looking for a Quality Woman.” What’s implied isn’t necessarily incorrect; the most ridiculed, stereotypical examples of Game came from the trials and errors of early PUAs making observations and applying what they’d learned in a contextual domain – night clubs, bars, etc. While those observations were, and still are, invaluable information to a greater meta-understanding of Red Pill awareness, for the most part those early successes were dependent on that specific (club style) domain.

Game has branched out from that beginning to be applied in broader domains. Thus we have specific areas of application dependency based on what can produce at least somewhat replicable results in those settings. Nick Krauser writes the book on day Game, Roosh the book on South America and Northern & Eastern Europe, while other authors ply their trade writing about Game in marriage or under the auspices of religion(s).

And while I have a great deal of respect for the most of them, a creative mind doesn’t work like this. The creative mind has the ability to migrate from one realm to another without even thinking about it. It’s what allows us to connect this dot with that dot. There is a certain applied reasoning and science behind a Red Pill awareness, but it’s important to remember what the ‘A’ in PUA stands for – Artistry.

Crossing Domains

I’ve known a number of guys in my time who swear that there’s nothing hotter than a woman 15 – 20 years their senior. Others love to explain to me how behind the times I am by pointing out the inherent dangers and liabilities of dating single mothers (for anything more than a one time bang). Still others tell me how enthusiastic a lay the obese women they regularly bang are. All of these guys express a preference for the type of women they can reliably get into bed with and will staunchly defend and praise their preferred type of woman.

Their domain dependency became their internalized, ego-invested preference.

I’ve touched on this dynamic in a few of my earliest posts, but I think it’s important to realize that domain dependency isn’t just about the type of woman you’ve developed a preference for, but rather how you’re predictably rewarded (in this case with sex) within that particular domain. You can semi-reliably do well with Goth girls, fat girls, older women, single moms? It’s important to understand the specifics and motivations of the women within that domain. You went on a sex safari in Southeast Asia or the Philippines, yet get flaked on by every western girl you approach? There are (obviously) specifics that influence those domains.

After all of this, the Red Pill is universally applicable, or it’s not. The same fundamental Red Pill dynamics, operating within the context of a specific domain, are applicable with the correct art necessary for that domain.

Red Pill truths are domain independent. Hypergamy is the same to a girl in Brazil as it is to a girl in Vegas. The domain changes, and with it the necessary art based on a woman’s incentives and the priorities for that given domain, but the underlying purpose and requisites of Hypergamy is unchanged. Yes, cultural, religious and familial limitations of that Hypergamy may apply within that domain, but root level Red Pill truth is still the prime directive for women.

Within a man’s lifetime he will have no choice but to cross into, and adapt to unfamiliar domains many times. These domains are not just locales or social settings, but the specifics of a particular stage of a woman’s life as well as his own life. Marriage is a domain. Single man sex life plate spinning is a domain. Online dating, a dependency on impersonal texting, really any of the Buffers I’ve elaborated on in the past are all examples of a domain men develop a dependency on, and later a rewarded preference for.

While it’s vitally important for a man to have a solid grasp of the elements of his own, temporal, domain it’s equally important to understand how and why he came into it. What rewards did he receive or hope to receive that led to his developed “preferences”? Were those preferences dependent upon a Blue Pill condition for reward?

This is key in avoiding domain specific dependency. That’s a pretty tall order for most men, and actually it’s one of the prime reasons most Blue Pill men never come to Red Pill truths. The Blue Pill is itself a meta-domain that men are largely conditioned to be dependent upon. Coming to Red Pill truths requires the self-realization of a domain dependency on Blue Pill idealisms, their promised rewards and then letting them go.

It’s important for a man to develop a fluidity of transitioning from domain to domain. Red Pill awareness prepares him for fundaments that will be applicable in all domains, but accepting that those domains exist and influence (sometimes adversely) his ‘preferences’ is the first step in developing the art necessary to excel in a new domain.

Isolation is dangerous. The presumption that conditions will never change and / or the preoccupation with security is a woman’s realm. Men must accept that they must adapt themselves to adequately perform in changing domains.

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Published by Rollo Tomassi

Author of The Rational Male and The Rational Male, Preventive Medicine

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Glenn
Glenn
7 years ago

Check this out – this women explains women’s dualistic mating strategy right out in the open. and hitting the wall and looking for nice guys after that – it’s freaking amazing. “Do women like the “nice guy”?” http://youtu.be/vjnN1fJhP98

It’s really just stunning to watch.

M Simon
7 years ago

Glenn
December 25th, 2014 at 7:00 pm

Poincare Maps – thanks for that. Stability analysis is important for what I do and I hadn’t run across that before. At least not often enough to remember it. Next time I do a servo design I’ll see if it helps.

M Simon
7 years ago

Glenn
December 25th, 2014 at 10:06 pm

Jeeze. “Women LOVE nice guys” after they (women) have passed the a-hole stage.

But even with the “nice” guy she wants to be gamed. TooFnFunny.

M Simon
7 years ago

Should an alpha woman go with an alpha man?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Av6VpAVk3r8

In my limited experience that is all the alpha woman wants. And she wants to defeat all the other women. And she will do that by keeping her desire focused as good as a woman can (i.e. just barely long enough).

Unlike the beta woman who will dump you at he first scent of another woman the alpha woman sees it as a challenge Her insecurity makes her rise to the occasion rather than give up.

sfcton
7 years ago

LOL @ alpha female.

theasdgamer
7 years ago

Nothing absurd about the idea of a woman who is dominant over other women in the herd, yet submissive to her man. We just need to remember that “alpha” in a herd context has a different meaning than “alpha” in a Game context.

Glenn
Glenn
7 years ago

http://youtu.be/F9mz37n1cTs Another beauty. This woman preens about the female imperative and her power of choice in an amazing way.

Fyi, had trouble posting so if this is a double post, sorry…

Drew
Drew
7 years ago

Any man that says he would rather be with a woman 15-20 years old than himself or prefers obese woman is lying to himself or suffers from deep mental issues.

jf12
jf12
7 years ago

re: alpha female.

We are agreeing that an alpha female is a female that other females follow and do not compete with. She demands servicing, and is not a good servicer herself. Her best match is a greater beta. She is a lousy choice for an alpha male almost always.

theasdgamer
7 years ago

@ jf12 Looked at the msimon vid. As usual with women, they don’t get the alpha male thing. They think that a man can be 60% dominant, which is malarkey. Having some alpha qualities doesn’t make a man alpha. The essential alpha male quality is confidence with women, of course. if he has that, he’s alpha. It’s a binary thing. It’s possible that a woman will not submit to a man who doesn’t show confidence in a particular way, so that they will not be a good fit. Some alpha females aren’t good fits for some alpha males. E.g., a… Read more »

TAnon
TAnon
7 years ago

@ Retrenched I disagree with this freedom being a positive factor at all when taking in consideration the rising rates of depression, incels and the economical and demographical problems resulting from the collapse of the marriage institution and men retreating from society. I’m not sure if it is even worthy to call it freedom because it completely relies on the existence of porn, video games and other types of escapist media. Without these outlets there would be no men that would want this freedom. Also it was not a patriarchy. Saying it’s a patriarchy and that it burdens men at… Read more »

jf12
jf12
7 years ago

@tasdg re: “As usual with women, they don’t get the alpha male thing.” Correct. btw, since these are my social circles, my domains, I have noticed my whole adult life that the more a woman dominates other women, the LESS likely she is to seek domination by a man. In contrast, the more a man has to dominate other men day by day, the MORE likely he will be to have a domineering woman. The conventional manosphere wisdom gets this wrong too, claiming that an alpha female wants an even more alpha male, and that dominating men is the way… Read more »

Glenn
Glenn
7 years ago

@ jf12 – You always assert yourself as more scientifically minded yet make this laughably weak argument to essentially just confirm your biases while presenting them as having some weight or meaning “Correct. btw, since these are my social circles, my domains, I have noticed my whole adult life”. Let’s take this gem apart. “…these are my social circles” – what? You have exclusive access to social circles in which female dominant behavior is displayed that the rest of us don’t have? It’s a weak appeal to an authority that I think only exists in your head. “…I have noticed… Read more »

jf12
jf12
7 years ago

@Glenn, re: “You have exclusive access to social circles in which female dominant behavior is displayed”

Don’t be such a girl.

George
George
7 years ago

Are these graphs really telling us the actual truthful frequency of female orgasm related to male partner wealth?

Or…

Are these graphs telling us the frequency that FEMALES ARE CLAIMING to orgasm related to male partner wealth.

Be careful of the lies you embrace.

Hank Flanders
Hank Flanders
7 years ago

So…will there be any direct discussion on the reader’s question about the expectations of women on online dating sites? This was the part in which I was most interested, and I can’t see that it was really ever addressed. What I took from this article was that if you’re good at Game, you should be able to pull it off anywhere. (I guess that includes online, too). However, the reader was absolutely right. Being a 6 in looks doesn’t seem to get a guy anywhere with good or even decent looking women on online dating sites. It doesn’t matter if… Read more »

jf12
jf12
7 years ago

re: domain independence. I’m going to extol the virtues of my lil sis, because I want to. She is 100% salt of the earth preacher’s wife, as comfortable getting all floury making biscuits from scratch as she is speaking at a conference of thousands of women. She is the same yesterday at age 14, today at age 54, and as much of forever as I hope she lasts here on earth. This comment is made specifically to tick off trugingstar, btw. After our mother died, at age 20 my sister set her cap for the most godly available young man… Read more »

zdr01dz
7 years ago

@ Glenn
Your Neely Steinberg video post is jaw dropping.

rr
rr
7 years ago

A few years ago “Money, game looks. Have at least two”

Rollo today; Alpha fucks and beta bucks. If your value is not looks based, then it is beta value and she is faking her orgasm.

Woman CAN’T have a valuu system that includes many variables when evaluating what is alpha. And women in China CAN’T orgasm more for wealthy men.

Because some guy with a massive “meta perspective”, or is it a massive ego says so.

Retrenched
Retrenched
7 years ago

It’s not complicated really. I think we want to make it so sometimes, but it really isn’t. Women are going to choose who they want, and as a man you have to either become what they want, or just avoid them. Or perhaps move to a place where the women have different preferences and make different choices. If women don’t want you today, and you don’t change, they’re not going to want you tomorrow either. (Speaking here of women wanting men for “alpha fucks” of course, not beta bucks. A lot of guys could earn enough to be an attractive… Read more »

Retrenched
Retrenched
7 years ago

Yes, times are hard for a lot of men re: sex and relationships. But crying about how unfair the system is isn’t going to make things any easier or better for them. Sure, it’s an uphill climb, and the average omega is going to have to put in a lot of work before he can bed a woman of peer level attractiveness, looks wise. But the tools are out there, game is out there, the red pill is out there, and women themselves are increasingly admitting to all of this, as well. If a man who isn’t getting laid chooses… Read more »

Retrenched
Retrenched
7 years ago

@ TAnon

Re: the use of the word ‘patriarchy’: fair enough, it’s admittedly not the best term for the old system, the way things were in the west before 1960 or so. I find myself doing that quite a bit, using the word patriarchy as the feminists do, perhaps out of habit of arguing with them over Twitter and such, using their terms for the old order, traditional values or what have you.

M Simon
7 years ago

Rollo,

Comments are not showing up on Red Pill Lens.

M Simon
7 years ago

theasdgamer December 26th, 2014 at 9:19 am I think that is exactly correct. I posted this on Red Pill Lens but it is not showing up so here goes (a little truncated so it makes more sense here): I have been Red Pilling the first mate and today I pointed out to her that she was very alpha. Not in the way guys are alpha but in the fact that at least some part of her was secure in that fact that she could out compete any other woman no matter what the other woman had to offer. I’m working… Read more »

sfcton
7 years ago

Pert sure I have a reply stuck in the spam folder.

Also Rollo, I have different replies from different posters showing up on my iphone vs laptop. That’s some strange shit right there.

theasdgamer
7 years ago

@ msimon

Agree, what some of the other commenters here are missing is that alphas have to game their alpha women in relationship game: 1) Tingles, 2) Comfort, 3) Validation, and 4) Drama. I have posted about this on my website.

Rol
Rol
7 years ago

@ Freshman I hear you loud and clear. I have a decent face which is my only saving grace because I’m short AND skinny (I am however, in great physical shape). A woman asked me how tall I was and I said “probably 5’5″ or 5’6,” and she said “no you can’t be 5’5″.” You see I’m most likely 5’6″ but that one inch is meaningless when you’re this height, you’re short no matter what. I know she likes me and my point is that women will embellish things about you when they’re attracted to you. I don’t do cold… Read more »

Rol
Rol
7 years ago

Also, what’s very amusing is watching how a guy behaves when he’s with a woman he doesn’t need. I have a close friend who’s as clueless and beta as they come, but I saw an amazing transformation in his attitude and demeanor when he was around this old chick he was banging because she had no other options. The guy could have written a book, that’s how impressive it was. He was naturally cocky, poking fun at her, walking ahead of her and pretty much treating her the way PUAs describe in all their material, naturally. There was no script,… Read more »

sfcton
7 years ago

Rol, never directly answer questions like how old or tall you are
Her; how tall are you
You; how tall do you think I am?
Her reply is the height she wants you to be. Same goes for age etc. I am 5’7″ & 44 years old. This past year I have been told I am upwards of 5’10 & as young as 33 years old

Direct answers are generally not your friend on topics that go against your smp value.

M Simon
7 years ago

theasdgamer December 26th, 2014 at 5:55 pm Yes. I have, in the last couple of days, been working the OL with “You are an alpha woman. Be strong.” It has had quite the positive effect on her. She immediately got that being strong like a man was of no use to her in our relationship. But that being strong enough to defeat all the other women who might want me was definitely in her power. We discussed how she didn’t have to beat them in a beta female manner (in fact with me she couldn’t). Beta female – withholding, pouty,… Read more »

olympiapress
7 years ago

One of the first examples of game I ever saw was a guy from Duluth, MN, of all places, who managed to hook up willy-nilly, just thanks to a playful personality. I was living in Seward, AK at the time, in a tent city with a number of other cannery workers. There were, needless to say, no women, save a few players for the other time and a handful of fatties who thrived on male attention. Also, we all smelled like fish. Except for Nick, who’d generally end up getting showers with his tourist conquests in their hotel rooms. Just,… Read more »

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anon
anon
7 years ago

Please explain what this is?:

“80-20 rule of the SMP”

anon
anon
7 years ago
Bobbu
Bobbu
7 years ago

Oh..The 48 Laws Of Power makes more sense now.

trackback
6 years ago

[…] covered the topic of domain dependence before, and how it behooves a newly unplugged man to see what social context he finds himself in […]

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