Changing Your Programming

tilting_at_windmills

Changing Your Programming

I mentioned in the first book that I am not a motivational speaker.

I’m not anyone’s savior and I would rather men be their own self-sustaining solutions to becoming the men they want and need to be – not a Rollo Tomassi success story, but their own success stories.

That said, let me also add that I would not be writing what I do if I thought that biological determinism, circumstance and social conditioning were insurmountable factors in any Man’s life. Men can accomplish great things through acts of will and determination. God willing, they can be masters of those circumstances and most importantly masters of themselves.

With a healthy understanding, respect and awareness of what influences his own condition, a Man can overcome and thrive within the context of them – but he must first be aware of, and accepting of, the conditions in which he operates and maneuvers.

You may not be able to control the actions of others, you may not be able to account for women’s Hypergamy, but you can be prepared for them, you can protect yourself from the consequences of them and you can be ready to make educated decisions of your own based upon that knowledge.

You can unplug.

You can change your programming, and you can live a better life no matter your demographic, age, past regrets or present circumstances.

These are the last words from The Rational Male – Preventive Medicine. I wrote something similar in the first book too, but I’m quoting them here because they are just as important now as they were when I was writing them then. I’m not now nor have I ever been interested in creating a cult of Rollo. I’m not interested in creating better men, I’m interested in those men making themselves better men.

Descriptions and Prescriptions

You’ll have to forgive me, I wrote this part about a year ago, but I think it’s still relevant now. In part 4 of Preventative Medicine a commenter (who, for the record is not an InCel by any stretch) asked me why I had no real prescriptive plan for men to follow with regards to ‘preventing’ or avoiding the bad decisions associated with the time line I laid out in that series. This was my response:

Imagine for a moment I had the temerity to presume that I know exactly what a 60 year old reader experiences in his personal life with a post-menopausal wife. I could take a good stab at it, but anything specific I could prescribe for him would be based on my best-guess speculations and according to how I’ve observed and detailed things in this series or any of my past posts.

From my earliest posts at SoSuave (in 2004) I’ve had men ask me for some ‘medicine’ for their condition; some personalized plan that will work for them. This sentiment is exactly what makes PUA and manosphere ‘self-help’ speakers sell DVDs and seats at seminars. They claim to have the cure. I say that’s bullshit.

I’m not in the business of cures, I’m in the business of diagnoses. Imagine a PUA guru attempting to force fit their plans to accommodate that 60 year old man’s situation. Athol Kay makes attempts to remedy married men’s (non) sex lives, but what’s his real success rate? Is it even measurable? Even Athol recognizes that his MMSL outline is just a map, a diagnosis, that men have to modify for themselves per their individual experience and demographic. You see, your cure, your plan of action isn’t what another man’s will be, or your future son’s, or anyone else reading my work. I can give you a map, but you still have to make your own trail. I’m not a savior, you are your savior

Short version: I’m not interested in making men be better men, I’m interested in men making themselves better Men.

What’s more legitimate, my prescribing some course or template to follow that leads a man to a success that ultimately I define for a reader, or my laying out an accurate landscape for his better understanding and he creates his own success with it?

Are you your success or my success? I’d rather a Man be his own.

Most men already suspect they know what the keys are, and most even know how to use them, but what they really want is confirmation that they actually have the keys.

My approach to Game is defined in much broader terms than simply ‘how to get girls’, and I think for the better part of the manosphere the understanding of Game has evolved beyond rote memorization of scripts and plans. It’s gotten to a stage where even the most enthusiastic proponents of PUA techniques acknowledge a need for an individualized approach to relating and interacting with women based on a broader applied understanding of feminine psychology, sociology and the particular conditions that apply to themselves as well as the women they’re interacting with.

It’s been noted before, my approach to Game / Red Pill awareness is descriptive, not prescriptive.

I’m humbled by the men who email me and let me know how something I’ve written or shined a light on for them has saved them from suicide or some particular hell they would’ve endured longer in. For the most part though I get email and comments from men who tell me that they have built better lives for themselves because a Red Pill awareness made their situations more intelligible. I don’t sell a program or a prescription because each man’s circumstance is different, his acculturation is different, his ethnicity, society, upbringing, body composition and mental faculties are all different.

But we are all men. If the Red Pill is anything it’s a consortium of men who relate their individual experiences about women, about themselves and about their circumstances in what’s now become a feminine-primary social order. As I’ve stated in the past, I’m humbled and flattered to be considered one of the pillars of Red Pill awareness, but most of what I write is the result of piecing together the related experiences of other men.

I didn’t create the Red Pill, I just describe that awareness in terms I think are intelligible. I connect dots, but much of those dots are presented to me by a collective of men who’ve had common experiences. If those dots don’t follow, if those dots would be better connected in another way, I expect the Men who make up Red Pill awareness to offer their new ideas in an open exchange, in a marketplace of ideas.

Sometimes that marketplace gets weighed down with disingenuous critics, trolls and attention seekers, but this is the price, I believe, is necessary to distill and test the strength of those ideas. Only in a crucible of open debate where all are encouraged to participate can those ideas be sussed out.

Men with questions don’t frighten me; men with no questions do.

Law 18: Do Not Build Fortresses to Protect Yourself— Isolation is Dangerous
The world is dangerous and enemies are everywhere— everyone has to protect themselves. A fortress seems the safest. But isolation exposes you to more dangers than it protects you from-it cuts you off from valuable information, it makes you conspicuous and an easy target. Better to circulate among people, find allies, mingle. You are shielded from your enemies by the crowd.

From Nursing Power:

A handful of my male readers often ask why I don’t moderate comments, or that the message of Rational Male would be better served if I banned certain commenters. I’ve mentioned on several posts and threads as to why I won’t ever do that (except for blatant spamming), but in a nutshell it’s my fundamental belief that the validity of any premise or idea should be able to withstand public debate. People who aren’t confident of the strength of their assertions or ideas, or are more concerned with profiting from the branding of those weak assertions than they are in truth, are the first to cry about the harshness of their critics and kill all dissent as well as all discourse about those assertions.

That’s the primary reason I’ve never moderated; if people think I’m full of shit I’m all ears – I’m not so arrogant as to think I’ve thought of every angle about any idea I express here or on any other forum. However, the second reason I don’t censor, ban users or delete comments is that I believe it’s useful to have critics (usually women or fem-men) provide the gallery with examples of exactly the mentality or dynamic I’m describing in an essay. With a fair amount of predictability, a blue pill male or an upset woman will just as often prove my point for me and serve as a model for what I’ve described.

I never intentionally try to make rubes out of the critics I know will chime in about something, but I will sometimes leave out certain considerations I may have already thought about something, knowing it will get picked up on by a critic. I do this on occasion because the I know that the “ah hah! I got him, he forgot about X,Y, Z” moment serves as a better teaching tool and confirms for me that a critic does in fact comprehend what I’m going on about.

Last week Roosh came out against the various tribes of Game such as it is. While I understand his intent I must disagree with his methods. A couple of weeks ago I got into a bit of political discourse with regard to how the Feminine Imperative and how Hypergamy influences social dynamics. That post generated a lot of conversation, but from it I made this statement:

It’s my opinion that red pill awareness needs to remain fundamentally apolitical, non-racial and non-religious because the moment the Red Pill is associated with any social or religious movement, you co-brand it with an ideology, and the validity of it will be written off along with any preconceptions associated with that specific ideology.

Furthermore, any co-branding will still be violently disowned by whatever ideology it’s paired with because the Feminine Imperative has already co-opted and trumps the fundaments of that ideology. The fundamental truth is that the manosphere, pro-masculine thought, Red Pill awareness or its issues are an entity of its own.

As most of my readers know I have a great deal of respect for Roosh and I still do. Nothng is going to change that. I think time will tell what direction his push for Neomasculine philosophy truly goes in. As far as what he’s describing in that “new” doctrine there’s not much I disagree with. I’ll take issue with his anti-evolution, anti-evo psych stance. I’ll take issue with his want for some as yet undefined moralism; and not because I don’t think morality or reverence to a higher power shouldn’t be part of it, but rather because it pollutes and distorts open discourse.

I’m not an atheist, anyone who’s read my commentary on Dalrock’s site knows this. That said I don’t think there is a substitute for critical inquiry, and when that is stifled, that’s when we lean over into dogma.

From Moral to the Manosphere:

Putting angel’s or devil’s wings on observations hinders real understanding.

I say that not because I don’t think morality is important in the human experience, but because our interpretations of morality and justice are substantially influenced by the animalistic sides of our natures, and often more than we’re willing to admit to ourselves. Disassociating one’s self from an emotional reaction is difficult enough, but adding layers of moralism to an issue only convolutes a better grasp of breaking it down into its constituent parts. That said, I also understand that emotion and, by degree, a sense of moralism is also characteristic of the human experience, so there needs to be an accounting of this into interpretations of issues that are as complex as the ones debated in the manosphere.

Although I’m aware that observing a process will change it, it’s my practice  not to draw moralistic conclusions in any analysis I make because it adds bias where none is necessary. The problem is that what I (and others in the manosphere) propose is so raw it offends ego-invested sensibilities in people. Offense is really not my intent, but often enough it’s the expected result of dissecting cherished beliefs that seem to contribute to the well being of an individual.

There was a time I sat in a behavioral psychology class back in college. Behaviorism appealed to me because it was very nuts & bolts, not at all like the touchy-feely humanist schools of psychology. Behavior is the only reliable proof of motive. It was cause and effect, modify variables, and watch for behavior.

At one point I began to see that women are masters of operant conditioning – they had the natural reward 99% of men want, sex. Men’s behavior could be modified just by the prospect of sex, and they could also be influenced by negative reinforcement and punishment. It was one thing to make these observation, but quite another to express them in the classroom. Many of the more intelligent minds I dealt with then would adamantly refuse to recognize the truths that operant conditioning played. After I thought about it I understood that they were likewise motivated to deny what I thought was right in front of their faces.

I had connected some uncomfortable dots; dots that had the potential of making a man less desirable for having connected them. This was really the beginning of many more uncomfortable connections I would make later.

Roosh has tried to make a case that the Red Pill community (subred) has now reached critical mass. He sees it as inbred; a community of complainers – and in some instances I can understand that. Debate can often sound like complaining. However, what I get from Roosh now is a need for answers, it seems to me he’s looking for a plan of action. He wants something prescriptive for himself and other men to follow on with. I get it.

He’s still included Red Pill truths as being an important part of his new doctrine and I’d respect him for that, if not for the wholesale disownment of the consortium that’s been the testbed for those truths for so long. As I stated above, I think Neomasculinity may have some merit, I don’t disagree with about 90% of the manifesto Roosh went to great effort to put together. What I disagree with is how he’s initiated all of this. He does no favors to himself with casual dismissals of principles he knows are deeper than he wants to give credit to – in fact most are principles he influenced personally.

As for my part, I’m going to keep doing what I do and that’s making men aware of the world that’s been pulled over their eyes. I will likely have some strong disagreement with Roosh in the future, but as I’m fond of saying unplugging men from the matrix is dirty work. We’re both in the same family, and sometimes brothers will fight, and that’s OK.

I disagree with him that the Red Pill will cease to go on. It may be called something else, but it’s been around before he or I started writing about it. The “Red Pill”, like many other terms, is an abstraction; a place holder for an idea. Don’t like the Matrix movie references? Fine, but the truth is the truth and freely expressed ideas need words to describe them.

Maybe Neomasculinity is the prescription you need, but from what I can gather so far it’s a movement based on exclusion; not inclusion, not on a free exchange of ideas. Maybe the christianized Red Pill of Donalgraeme or Dalrock is a better prescription for you. Maybe you need the inspiration of a guy like Victor Pride and a better outlook on your physique.

Or maybe all you need is a truth and an awareness to help you lift yourself up. Yes, Red Pill awareness can be very depressing in the beginning, I’ve written several posts and book chapters dedicated to helping men come to terms with that, but ultimately it will be that awareness that becomes the catalyst for changing his life.

The Red Pill isn’t one size fits all, you have to tailor your own life with what it shows you.

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Published by Rollo Tomassi

Author of The Rational Male and The Rational Male, Preventive Medicine

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Badpainter
Badpainter
8 years ago

“I simply will not understand why women who say they are supportive turn around and chide us for actually having an emotional core.”

A shit test best ignored.

insanitybytes22
8 years ago

“So why then is it an anathema to women for men to have our angry little space as the manosphere is so often characterized?” Much of the manosphere is actually not angry, not to the point where they get off on taking rage based pot shots at any woman they encounter. Many men in the manosphere are actually kind and rational. However, this rage based, hate all women, thing has been growing and it’s being supported in some quarters. Some of it is coming from fake trolls trying to create the impression that everybody is violent and advocating abuse, but… Read more »

kfg
kfg
8 years ago

Badpainter: “Are the women going to STFU and follow? ”

Insanity: “Tomassi, has got to . . .”

But bear in mind she gives testimony that that is not a command tone. That would make it an imperative tone. Totally different.

Tabitha
Tabitha
8 years ago

If one reads between the lines, it quickly becomes apparent that most of the invective that passes for commentary here is fueled by deeply rooted V-envy…

Is This Thing On?
Is This Thing On?
8 years ago

I think I’m agreeing with Insanity here, but I’m not really sure. Much of this is the fault of men. Specifically the pussy begging white knights out there. If men collectively said we are done playing this, it could all change over night. Unfortunately much of the judiciary is made up of Captain Save A Ho’s. How can a man be a man in that environment where merely quarreling with your wife or cutting up an overused credit card is now seen as abuse. I realize this is getting into MRA territory. My view I think is a bit different… Read more »

kfg
kfg
8 years ago

Incoming!

insanitybytes22
8 years ago

“I think I’m agreeing with Insanity here..”

Actually I’m agreeing with you. I have no idea how much is the fault of men nor am I interested in shaming men, but I do know that whoever picks up the responsibility than holds the power. So watching men endlessly blame women (or other factions of the manosphere) is like watching men continuously hand their power away.

Is This Thing On?
Is This Thing On?
8 years ago

Take this nonsense with Roosh for example. What the hell is this all about anyway? I don’t know how one reacts to Roosh right now, but what he is doing is dumb, and he’s a guy. You can call it throwing the red pill under the bus if you like, but if we all join in the fracas it becomes a circular firings squad in short order. Can he just be ignored?

Is This Thing On?
Is This Thing On?
8 years ago

@insanity: I should clarify that I don’t agree with everything you say, just the part about men needing to own this. I would be much happier in a space where women could not ride on top of our anger like we are children. Back in the day, guys could punch each other in the mouth get up and shake it off and have a good chance at being best friends afterword. These days that is impossible because every action is taken out of context and amplified across the web. I understand why Rollo doesn’t ban and moderate, but where can… Read more »

Sun Wukong
Sun Wukong
8 years ago

ITTO:

I understand why Rollo doesn’t ban and moderate, but where can men talk without the constant judgement of the ever watching FI?

Nowhere. But in a place like this, they’re able to not give a fuck about it. Hence the reason I make minimal to no effort to interact with the women who do show up here. If they spout FI horse shit continuously, I just scroll past their posts; they have nothing to contribute that I haven’t heard continuously pounded in to my ears for three decades.

Is This Thing On?
Is This Thing On?
8 years ago

Insanity has been on this site for some time. This Charlotte person however is clearly a part of the Roosh back to tradcon what ever the hell it is neoman thing. That puts them in different camps in my mind. I can deal with post feminist women trying to make sense out of this mess. It doesn’t surprise me or piss me off in the least when they end up acting like women. They are after all women. Anyone part of this Roosh thing deserves nothing less than to be blocked in my mind. Insanity may be insane, but I… Read more »

insanitybytes22
8 years ago

“I would be much happier in a space where women could not ride on top of our anger like we are children.” I get that. And truly, no matter what women say, most of us really don’t want you to even show us your negative emotions. We have a limited ability to deal with it. Try to empathize there, many of us depend on men, it’s disconcerting to have them show too much emotional vulnerability. We’re relying on you, what we really want to see is confidence. So women aren’t really “riding your anger like children,” we simply become distressed… Read more »

Sun Wukong
Sun Wukong
8 years ago

Insanity was abused by a man at some point and projects that on to all of us. That’s all there is to it.

Her input is just as useless as Charlotte’s.

kfg
kfg
8 years ago

Although she is a chronically recurring infection, as opposed to Insanity’s chronically persistent one, Good Charlotte is no stranger. I have responded to her as I have not because she is a woman, but because we have prior history.

I suspect she is just a carrion crow, drawn to the site of discord, as nasty little pieces of work are wont to be.

Although whether she is a carrion crow or a moby is probably a moot question. It is as it does.

Badpainter
Badpainter
8 years ago

“And truly, no matter what women say, most of us really don’t want you to even show us your negative emotions.” No shit eh? “Try to empathize there, many of us depend on men, it’s disconcerting to have them show too much emotional vulnerability.” So what? This is so not my problem. Grow up or shut up. “So women aren’t really ‘riding your anger like children,’ we simply become distressed when we see too much of it.” Distinction without a difference. “It has nothing to do with you, it’s simply the nature of women.” Yes we are of no consequence,… Read more »

Sun Wukong
Sun Wukong
8 years ago

Women come here only to promote the Purple Pill. “OK, you got us. Hypergamy is real, so we’ll acknowledge that much since it will result in us having more dutiful workhorses available to women. However, don’t forget to take care of what the FI wants before you take care of yourself.” The Blue Pill: Be unaware of your chains. Maintain them happily through your own actions and thoughts. The Red Pill: Be aware of your chains. Break them. Find happiness in ridding your self of the shame that keeps you bound. The Purple Pill: you’re allowed to be aware of… Read more »

insanitybytes22
8 years ago

“Insanity was abused by a man at some point and projects that on to all of us. That’s all there is to it.”

That is like a projection within a projection! What you try to say about me, you are really saying about yourself. I took responsibility long ago, got over it, and went on to marry a lovely man.

I am curious why so many of you choose to remain trapped in self imposed misery?

kobayashii1681
8 years ago

“Men aren’t angry at women, men are angry at bullshit.”

Well said…

kobayashii1681
8 years ago

@Sun – “Unless it’s dick. Feeding them dick after midnight is just fine.”

Brilliant!

Sun Wukong
Sun Wukong
8 years ago

The real funny part is that modern women of all stripes, in their infinite sense of entitlement, think this is yet another space for them to air their never-ending list of grievances against men. It isn’t.

There’s a place for that. It’s called everywhere else in society that isn’t here. Go there to find men that give a shit about your problems with men. You won’t find them here.

Is This Thing On?
Is This Thing On?
8 years ago

Here is the problem gentlemen. I think it is widely accepted the the RP is under a Moby attack right now. That is a two part thing. First the troll that asks a bunch of hot button questions that are guaranteed to piss off the target but appear innocuous to the masses. If the trolls get the response they want, then there is no need for part two. Part two happens when the desired response is not obtained. Then more Moby trolls come in acting like they are a part of the target group and they come unglued on the… Read more »

Badpainter
Badpainter
8 years ago

@ Sun Wukong It’s the old gambit of insisting the man must be perfect before he can be permitted a critical voice. We can’t be legitimately angry or show negative emotions unless we are perfect, which means we’d never be angry, or have negative emotions in the first place. Actually that pretty easy to do with individual women. Just make sure you are completely indifferent to them. Treat as infinitely replaceable and interchangeable. With nothing invested nothing can be lost, nothing is risked, and nothing is gained. They are as fast food hamburgers all the same and of no real… Read more »

Sun Wukong
Sun Wukong
8 years ago

@ITTO

Are you hearing raging out of control unreasonable anger, or directed calm justified anger in what I’m saying? Are you naturally uncomfortable with all forms of anger? Do we need to make a safe space for you? Am I triggering you?

Is This Thing On?
Is This Thing On?
8 years ago

Funny Sun. I think you may be missing my point. I don’t care what anyone says to anyone including myself. I’m merely suggesting that someone has clearly hung a target on the back of TRM. It might be wise to not give them what they want.

Sun Wukong
Sun Wukong
8 years ago

@Badpainter

It’s the old gambit of insisting the man must be perfect before he can be permitted a critical voice.

Yep. A shit test easily dealt with, however. Ignore them like any troll and it will drive them batty.

Or one has conceal himself to invest in one and feign indifference, faking a perfect psychology with only those emotions that women deem permissible ever shown.

Hence the need for exclusively male spaces without societal consequence for the lack of shame about masculinity.

Mr T
Mr T
8 years ago

hey insanity22 and to every woman in this universe .

tell me something ,
if you lose your job your man will keep loving you and care for you and give you money and fuck you too.

if your man loses his job and become dependent on you , do you still FUCKING fuck him with a wet pussy .so please save us your man loving bull.

sex is the game , marriage is the penalty .

insanitybytes22
8 years ago

Yep, precisely, words of wisdom from “Is This Thing On.” I just ask that you take those words under consideration. It’s a bit ridiculous to call me a troll since Tomassi has my real email addy and I’m linked to my blog. Men are being socially engineered to feel and express their anger in negative ways. Look at the media, look at the racial divisions, look at the faux fems like Valenti and Marcotte. Men, you men are being gamed. You are being played like some of those empty headed 20 year olds you try to brag about. Unfortunately it’s… Read more »

zdr01dz
8 years ago

@ Is This Thing On? In the last three months I’ve seen TRM vs AVFM. AVFM vs MGTOW Aaron Clarey vs MGTOW and now Roosh vs Tomassi. Name calling is a waste but a debate on ideas is the only factor that can ensure long-term success. The M-O-S is still minor league. Ten years from now it might be huge. It’s better to ferret out all the wrong thinking right now before the mainstream notices a competitor and uses its power to club RP for any little mistake. The fact that mainstream society doesn’t debate anything makes it fragile and… Read more »

Sun Wukong
Sun Wukong
8 years ago

@ITTO Or, you could stop giving a fuck about what FI-driven interests think of us. They will condemn us regardless of how we behave. We are not obeying “The Narrative”. We are off script. By merely going outside heavily feminized solutions to distinctly masculine problems, we are in violation of the rules. No matter how we act, we will be condemned as a “hate group”. That is The Narrative. We must serve as an example for men who would act on their frustration and anger: do it and we will destroy you like we did these guys. They have already… Read more »

kfg
kfg
8 years ago

“There is an old saying. It’s great you aren’t interested in war, but what if war is interested in you.”

Then you can’t avoid it by any means, and particularly not by concern trolling.

Sun Wukong
Sun Wukong
8 years ago

I learned a lesson long ago that I should have applied more widely in my life: women have no place giving men advice in how to resolve their problems. My mother constantly punished me for anything resembling fighting or anger, insisting I call bullies at home and try to reason with them. Of course this appearance of weakness became one more thing for them to bully me about the next day at the bus stop. The first time I beat the shit out of another kid because he and two buddies were ragging on me, he shut his mouth. When… Read more »

kfg
kfg
8 years ago

Insanity: “Yep, precisely, words of wisdom from “Is This Thing On.” I just ask that you take those words under consideration.” Good cop, bad cop. @ITTO: Having been in the game for more than 50 years, one thing I have learned is that it doesn’t matter what you give them. They will construct what they want to try to control the narrative. The rules of the game as they have constructed it is lose/lose. If you try to construct what you have to say in order to “not give them what they want,” they control the narrative. If you don’t… Read more »

Badpainter
Badpainter
8 years ago

Sun Wukong – “…women have no place giving men advice in how to resolve their problems…”

This.

And it should be noted the criticism offered by women is meant to serve the best interests of women not men. When push comes to shove no woman is going to advise a man to act in his own best interest at the expense of her own interests. Not even a man’s mother would do so. Sacrifice is a one way street.

Is This Thing On?
Is This Thing On?
8 years ago

Sun, I don’t disagree with anything you say in principle. The problem is the army of white knights that will put another man in a cage because a vagina told him to. The MRM has its flaws, but at least they acknowledge that part of the problem. Turning a blind eye to it doesn’t mean the problem isn’t there. If someone here can tell me how game alone gets you out of jail for being falsely accused of something, I’m all ears.

insanitybytes22
8 years ago

“Having been in the game for more than 50 years, one thing I have learned is that it doesn’t matter what you give them. They will construct what they want to try to control the narrative.”

Then you have actually never set foot in the game, because when one steps into the game, one controls the narrative.

Mr T
Mr T
8 years ago

answer me Insanity

would you still be with your husband if he became dependent on you ?
ask him if he would stay with you if you became dependent on him ?
now go ask him to..

Sun Wukong
Sun Wukong
8 years ago

@ITTO

You’re still worrying about shit you can’t control. Knock it off.

Is This Thing On?
Is This Thing On?
8 years ago

God you guys. You’d swear I was suggesting we drop our drawers and bend over for the pegging. I’m simply suggesting that we just ignore the trolls. It’s advice as old as the internet. Don’t feed the trolls. There are nearly 1000 posts on the forum that have nothing to do with the OP because we can’t seem to ignore the trolls.

Jeremy
8 years ago

Having insanity around the board is literally like having a very smart person post the opposite of wisdom in the comments section. I swear I’ve not seen a single worthwhile perspective come from that woman. It’s hilarious. @Sun Wukong I learned a lesson long ago that I should have applied more widely in my life: women have no place giving men advice in how to resolve their problems. Almost every single woman in the world lives a life of nearly no-accountability. They can’t conceive of actual negative consequences for failing to live up to a standard, because it’s never happened… Read more »

Sun Wukong
Sun Wukong
8 years ago

For instance, I can’t control if people keep validating Insanity’s continued presence here by interacting with her, so I stopped expending energy on the matter and scroll past her inane drivel. Problem solved. For me at least.

insanitybytes22
8 years ago

“For instance, I can’t control if people keep validating Insanity’s continued presence here by interacting with her, so I stopped expending energy on the matter and scroll past her inane drivel. Problem solved. For me at least.”

You really are exceedingly stupid, aren’t you?

Is This Thing On?
Is This Thing On?
8 years ago

@Sun

We are saying nearly the same thing. We can’t control trolls showing up and derailing the conversation, but we can certainly control how we respond to them. Like you I’m suggesting we don’t respond at all, no matter how justified a response may be. Others here choose to engage and throw insults at the trolls. I suggest that does more harm than good.

Sun Wukong
Sun Wukong
8 years ago

@Jeremy I swear I’ve not seen a single worthwhile perspective come from that woman. It’s hilarious. Insanity: “I’M REALLY MAD AND REALLY TIRED OF YOU GUYS SAYING AWFUL THINGS TO ME BECAUSE EVERY MAN IS A VIOLENT ASSHOLE ENCOURAGING OTHER MEN TO BE VIOLENT ASSHOLES. I’M LEAVING! BYE FOREVER.” TRM: “k.” Insanity: “THIS NEW POST HAS MADE ME SO ANGRY I’M BACK AGAIN BECAUSE YOU’RE ALL VIOLENT ASSHOLES GETTING TOGETHER AND REVVING YOURSELVES UP TO BE VIOLENT ASSHOLES SOME MORE AND I’M GOING TO KEEP PROVING IT!” TRM: “k. Looking forward to the next time you quit forever again.” repeat… Read more »

Mr T
Mr T
8 years ago

insanity

did you ask your husband the questions yet ?
why dont you ask him you coward .

insanitybytes22
8 years ago

Insanity: “I’M REALLY MAD AND REALLY TIRED OF YOU GUYS SAYING AWFUL THINGS TO ME BECAUSE EVERY MAN IS A VIOLENT ASSHOLE ENCOURAGING OTHER MEN TO BE VIOLENT ASSHOLES. I’M LEAVING! BYE FOREVER.”

Bahahaha! That’s the spirit, boys. Refuse to engage IN ALL CAPS!!!

Sun Wukong
Sun Wukong
8 years ago

@Rollo

I think the default is to call it a “male space” simply because female opinions don’t get priority. That’s all it takes for something to be seen as a male space these days.

Sun Wukong
Sun Wukong
8 years ago

@ITTO

Difference between me and you is that you’re worrying about how others deal with it.

Jeremy
8 years ago

It might be the rounds of drinks since sailing today, but what exactly is meant by overseers?

Is This Thing On?
Is This Thing On?
8 years ago

@Sun

I like reading TRM. I’d hate to see it get shuttered because some political players successfully got it labeled as hate speech. I’ve advocated for calmer tongues as well as I am personally able. That pretty much sums it up for me.

Badpainter
Badpainter
8 years ago

ITTO – “I’d hate to see it get shuttered because some political players successfully got it labeled as hate speech.”

HA! If TPTB want to label it hate speech and shut it down they need look no further than the articles, or simply their own whims. The very existence of TRM is hate speech when comes to the FI’s dominant narrative and the standards of political correctness.

Your fear is itself a preemptive surrender.

Is This Thing On?
Is This Thing On?
8 years ago

@badpainter

Suggesting we ignore the trolls is preemptive surrender? Alright then.

Sun Wukong
Sun Wukong
8 years ago

@ITTO You’re ignoring his point. The point is that by merely existing as it is, without any commenters at all, TRM is “hate speech”. By association with TRP and not obeying the “girls = good, boys = bad” paradigm, it is “hate speech”. It is already condemned as such. I have directed a couple friends here when they complained about having problems with chicks. They looked it up, realized it was associated with TRP, and instantly wrote it off as misogynist hate speech without reading a word. This place is already condemned as “hate speech”. Nothing any of us in… Read more »

Badpainter
Badpainter
8 years ago

No.

You’re suggesting ignoring them because you fear a hostile response if the trolls are offended by words.

“I’d hate to see it get shuttered because some political players successfully got it labeled as hate speech”

You’re suggesting everyone follow your plan because of your fear.

Is This Thing On?
Is This Thing On?
8 years ago

You say I am preemptively surrendering. I say, if you are facing possible execution you would do well to not hand the executioner the axe.

Jeremy
8 years ago

You can’t kill an idea whose time has come with censorship.

sjfrellc
sjfrellc
8 years ago

I’m bored by this line of discussion. Men thinking with logic. Women roaming with emotion. I just got back from my wildlife habitat farm. I’m slightly less anxious and will be back to stoic in a couple days. I want to ask Rollo a question. Rollo Tomassi, did you see any interesting psycho-social dynamics in the hospital as you were accompanying your mother in her orthopedic surgery? While I am sure your mother’s surgeon was a congenial and pleasant doctor with a good bedside manner, imaging a scenario: You as a sentient masculine male knew there were two orthopedic surgeons… Read more »

Sun Wukong
Sun Wukong
8 years ago

Worrying about getting this place labeled hate speech is like rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic.

Badpainter
Badpainter
8 years ago

@ ITTO

Moderation inspired by fear is surrender.

sjfrellc
sjfrellc
8 years ago

Any one want to race toward one thousand comments on the blog?

sjfrellc
sjfrellc
8 years ago

Sun Wukong,

Stop being so serious and be a bit more mischievous.

And hook up with some excellent wingmen after your apartment move.

Best wishes with your move.

sjfrellc
sjfrellc
8 years ago

Heh, Insanity and Good Charlotte, what is your opinion of Rollo’s essay on Male Spaces?

http://therationalmale.com/2014/06/03/male-space/

kfg
kfg
8 years ago

” . . . what exactly is meant by overseers?”

People who think they are in the game, because they think they control the narrative, and who, therefore, think you are not even the game.

Sun Wukong
Sun Wukong
8 years ago

@sjfrellc

Shut up! You’re not my real dad!

insanitybytes22
8 years ago

“Heh, Insanity and Good Charlotte, what is your opinion of Rollo’s essay on Male Spaces?” Women have always desired men and to become the first woman in a male space is like becoming the pretty princess. Women love to be the only woman in a group of men, the first, the conquer. Women also often prefer male company to our own. That is why we don’t simply build our own Elks club or Nascar circuit or write our own games. In spite of feminism, in spite of culture, we really don’t ever want to do anything on our own, without… Read more »

Chump_No_More
Chump_No_More
8 years ago

I know I’m late to the party but, from personal experience, this whole “motherhood theory” by @zdr01dz is complete, utter bullshit. Women can (and will) flush their ‘motherhood’ down the toilet, in deference to their hypergamous nature. About 15 years ago, my ex (married 20 years), hooked up with an old HS beta orbiter online… I became aware of her shenanigans and her response was to kidnap my daughter (left the boys behind) and run off to a different state under the pretext that she was just going to visit her mother… Of course, I wasn’t duped, but she pulled… Read more »

jason@att.com
jason@att.com
8 years ago

I know that Glenn will cringe at my endorsement of him. However, a spade is a spade. I have read everything that Glenn cites, to the end notes. What Glenn has been telling you, for months now, is truth. How he and I are able to come down to different applications of the same knowledge base, is beyond me. c’est la vie. Here is an interesting factoid for the readership to consider: although Glenn and I disagree about application of facts, we agree 100% on the facts, themselves. Why? Because root source data is indisputable. Fact is fact, regardless of… Read more »

zdr01dz
8 years ago

@ Chump_No_More

You’ve convinced me. The motherhood care instinct is a myth.

http://i.imgur.com/nkT2cjf.jpg

This mom had 6 children to aid her branch swinging strategy.

zdr01dz
8 years ago

@ Chump_No_More

Women don’t want children. You can see it in their eyes.

http://i.imgur.com/I9mplev.jpg

Sun Wukong
Sun Wukong
8 years ago

@zdr01dz

I can see it in the falling first world birth rates where Open Hypergamy is becoming the norm rather than the exception. But please, don’t let the general rules reflected by actual numbers stop you from believing the far less frequent exception is the rule.

insanitybytes22
8 years ago

“You’ve convinced me. The motherhood care instinct is a myth.”

It’s actually a very complex instinct that is heavily influenced by learned behavior, hormones, and environment. If those three are not playing well together, she’ll just eat her young.

zdr01dz
8 years ago

@ Sun Wukong
I can see it in the falling first world birth rates

2 kids – each gets 1 hour of mom time per day.

VS.

4 kids – each gets 30 minutes of mom time per day.

Same number of motherhood calories expended.

zdr01dz
8 years ago

@ insanitybytes22
It’s actually a very complex instinct that is heavily influenced by learned behavior, hormones, and environment. If those three are not playing well together, she’ll just eat her young.

http://i.imgur.com/Bqv6hu9.jpg

Most animals appear to have intact wiring for this sort of behavior.

kfg
kfg
8 years ago

“Most animals appear to have intact wiring for this sort of behavior.”

Especially if you have more contact with cute web pics than you do actual animals. Where do you think the phrase “eat their young” comes from?

Watch some animals long enough and you might start to believe that the only reason they reproduce is to make sure they have something for lunch.

The Diplomat
The Diplomat
8 years ago

Getting back to the original post topic, “Changing Your Programming,” and in the interest of open discourse, this comment goes to Insanity, who stated: “So what happens as we go into an election year in the US? Here, have a look at the rage within the manosphere, here is the face of the right, of conservatives, of Christians. I’d so much like to see us change that narrative and in order to do that we need some calmer heads to prevail.” For the record, I am neither right-leaning, conservative, nor Christian. I am an agnostic and an unapologetic liberal man.… Read more »

Badpainter
Badpainter
8 years ago

“Women love to be the only woman in a group of men, the first, the conquer.”

Got it. Women invade to conquer, not render assistance, not enjoy men unfettered by women’s demand. But rather to count coup and gain status in the heard, accrue validation, and demonstrate power by poisoning the male space.

Honesty appreciated, you’re not here to help but to destroy.

rugby11ljh
rugby11ljh
8 years ago
Reply to  Badpainter

@M Simon Interesting sounds… On childhood https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=bWKkUlbLyyU Here’s something I’ve found as a Timeline of collapse. comments Overbearing mother. First open conversation starter from a cinematic angel that brought me in the Red Pill. @Is this thing on? “It’s about women completely discounting men” It’s what brought me here ” We are told our whole lives that we can expect the kind of love we offer women in return, but we can not. When the reality of that is made clear…. I think anger is a justifiable reaction.” KFG told me the trick “I simply will not understand why women… Read more »

lh
lh
8 years ago

Sun Wukong has several very good points. The most important for this space just not to give a fuck about what women say here. The difference between women being nice decoration/a fun toy or a nuisance/danger is only as what you’re taking them. I understand it may be a problem for some not yet fully unplugged. But then they should learn it: Why should you ever care for what a women says about you, judges about you and your thoughts? She’s nice to you? Good, play with her. She isn’t: ignore and next. What’s the problem with women making demands?… Read more »

lh
lh
8 years ago

@Badpainter: Female conquer isn’t done with the sword and it’s not to destroy. They may try shaming etc, but it’s just a shit-test to see if the conquer is worth it. If you pass, the tool they use for conquer is love & sex and that’s what we want and like. It’s only important never to let them conquer everything, so they come back and try more.

Badpainter
Badpainter
8 years ago

@ lh

Where’s the sex and love in taking over a male space? How do we benefit?

The beauty of a male only, or male primary space is being free of, temporarily, the need to perform for women. Which is of course why they insist on gaining entrance and taking over. They rightfully fear te possibility the men sequestered from their concern, and tone policing may well be acting and thinking in wys seditious and rebellious to the interests of the FI.

lh
lh
8 years ago

@badpainter: I’m not saying they should take it over. Never. But as Rollo said: it isn’t a pure male space anyway. What do you think how many women are just silently reading here to understand the men better (of course not out of care, but for their benefit)? For me the benefit of some women here is practice and giving those seeking practical examples of how to deal with women. How to manage to have them around, being a pleasure but not letting them dominate or take it over ever. All the much appreciated theoretical advice from Rollo helps only… Read more »

stuttie
8 years ago

I’m comfortable that the TRM is self policed by experienced red pillers and those who value what we have here.

I think Rollo encourages insanesque trolls to further cement the points expressed here. Because everything they spew out here ultimately gets destroyed by RP truth.

I actually enjoy a new post from Insantity/Charlotte etc now because I know their FI dribble will be succinctly dissected and pulverised by the more astute RP guys – and I learn from that in real-time. Plus it’s very entertaining.

M Simon
8 years ago

Sun Wukong
May 31st, 2015 at 6:24 pm

I make minimal to no effort to interact with the women who do show up here.

Sound advice. Also good Game.

M Simon
8 years ago

zdr01dz
May 31st, 2015 at 1:49 pm

Yeah I think most people imagine a Fury Road

Every time I see that I think of a Furry Road. But I’m from a different generation. Heh.

M Simon
8 years ago

As to monetary collapse. Suppose all currency of any significant volume becomes worthless. Will we have to depend on gold and silver to start transacting again? No. There is now crypto currency. And if the various issues are backed by productive capacity? Well we can then bypass government currency. And that means government can’t steal from us by inflating the currency. The money is now backed by real wealth. Without gold or silver. Can some folks run scams with this? Probably. Will it be better than government backed thieves with government backed guns? Probably. What happens in such a situation?… Read more »

M Simon
8 years ago

M Simon
June 1st, 2015 at 7:40 am

Was #999. I’m going to kick it to 1,000. I would have liked #666 better. But I will take what I can get.

Is This Thing On?
Is This Thing On?
8 years ago

I spent some time reading more of what Insanity has written. I believe she is simply a tradcon that wants to go back to the way it was before feminism. I think she is here because she honestly does want men to wake up en masse. She is everything Rollo says women are. She wants us to collectively pass this feminist shit test with cool indifference. She comes here and sees anger and it frustrates her, because that isn’t how you pass a shit test. She wants to see amused mastery and instead she sees anger, so she keeps coming… Read more »

M Simon
8 years ago

The Diplomat June 1st, 2015 at 2:01 am Getting back to the original post topic, “Changing Your Programming,” and in the interest of open discourse, this comment goes to Insanity, who stated: “So what happens as we go into an election year in the US? Here, have a look at the rage within the manosphere, here is the face of the right, of conservatives, of Christians. I’d so much like to see us change that narrative and in order to do that we need some calmer heads to prevail.” That is too funny TD. “Calmer heads should prevail.” Well no.… Read more »

M Simon
8 years ago

Is This Thing On?
June 1st, 2015 at 7:52 am

At least she is a woman who recognizes the feminist error.

I’ll believe that when she starts talking small government and wanting a man as a protector and not a gang of thieves disguised as “benefactors.”

M Simon
8 years ago

Badpainter
May 31st, 2015 at 6:52 pm

“And truly, no matter what women say, most of us really don’t want you to even show us your negative emotions.”

No shit eh?

“Try to empathize there, many of us depend on men, it’s disconcerting to have them show too much emotional vulnerability.”

That is what men do in men’s spaces. If you (insanity?) can’t handle it hang out with the girls “honey”.

And Bad – that was very nice.

Is This Thing On?
Is This Thing On?
8 years ago

I think if you read what she writes, she isn’t shy about saying any of that.

insanitybytes22
8 years ago

“I’ll believe that when she starts talking small government and wanting a man as a protector and not a gang of thieves disguised as “benefactors.” I want small government and men as protectors. I live that way as much as it is possible to do in this world. “The FI is enforced and succored by government. The ladies are using government to bypass a man. Not men.” No! Reverse that.The government is using ladies to bypass men. The FI as it relates to government, run mostly by men, is only a tool being exploited by government to oppress men. The… Read more »

Is This Thing On?
Is This Thing On?
8 years ago

Feminists are indeed useful idiots.

stuttie
8 years ago
Is This Thing On?
Is This Thing On?
8 years ago

@Stuttie there is absolutely nothing surprising in that second link is there? Guys have no business getting married until they have become who they are becoming. Both of these two listened to the blue pill lie. They need to get divorced before they have kids. She can find an established man in her home town, and he can have a different woman in every port.

447
447
8 years ago

@ zdroidz; re: motherhood-pictures: You start from a certain position on the issue – and argue only along that position. The problem is NOT that women have a something like a mothering instinct – and thus greatly enjoy mothering in many contexts (though not all, cf. –> abortions & cock carussel riding, pot-belly 447 banging “single moms” in the ass while their spawn crawls around behind the next door etc.pp.). Female mothering instinct is a) useless for fucking them (b/c the activation of “caring” automatically excludes you from the pool of “raw attraction mating prospects”) b) useless to leverage it… Read more »

Seraph
8 years ago

@Droidz, “I interview biologists/geneticists a few times each year. My last interview was with an Orthopaedic Surgeon that holds the patent on a specific type of robotic implant. I’d love to talk to Dr Hasselton about her Estrus studies. I’m fairly sure she’ll set things straight.” GREAT! Do it. If you have a history of interviewing people in the science field, set up an interview with her, record it and make the unedited version available for all the world. I am sure it would be illuminating for all of us. I am betting, however, that you will do no such… Read more »

Jeremy
8 years ago

@M Simon There is now crypto currency. And if the various issues are backed by productive capacity? This is now thoroughly off-topic, however since this is a fascinating topic… Crypto-currency in blockchain format needs no asset backing. However, in order to service the world monetary needs, it needs far far greater transaction bandwidth. What bitcoin has proven is that digital gold *can* exist, bitcoin is the closest thing to it at the moment. Like gold, bitcoins value resides in its usefullness as a form of international ledger. Bitcoin excels at this, and even has advantages over Gold. Barring the invention… Read more »

Glenn
Glenn
8 years ago

@ LH and M. Simon – Lefitst parties “saving the day” for Spain and Greece? That’s like saying, “I only mortally wounded myself with this .22 pistol, but now that have a .44 Magnum, yeah, that will really cure things.” Greece – They committed fraud on an epic, global scale, to the tune of tens of billions of dollars with their EuroBond floats. Smart people knew it at the time and the Euro govt has known it for a long time, but we just let it slide. The Greek govt cooked the books on its fiscal mess to raise huge… Read more »

Glenn
Glenn
8 years ago

@Insanity – Listen, shitbird, I didn’t attack you until you started denigrating all men. It’s very clear to see, just look back through the comments. Your non-stop characterization of that as some kind of pathology or proof of a woman hating culture is a fiction in your own mind. But it is true that I really enjoy telling women where to get off these days. I treat them just as I do men. I don’t suffer denigration or insult from men either, and the men here can tell you I’m just as harsh on men who I deem assholes or… Read more »

Glenn
Glenn
8 years ago

@ All – Re: Insanity – Do you guys see what she’s doing? She’s dividing us now, in order to destroy our own community. She’s got some of you believing that I am representative of many’s men’s out of control rage against women when in fact, as I’ve demonstrated here, I focus my rage at targets that I don’t want in this community. Go back and look at comments I made in the past to racists here or Minter or other’s who have incurred my wrath. Also note the many, many substantive comments I make that are not angry at… Read more »

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