The Surrogate Boyfriend

From a soon-to-be-unplugged 30Darren from the SoSuave forum:

I made a big mistake and got involved with a coworker. We dated for a little about a year ago but it never went far. Never slept with her. We became close friends though. We would hang out, Go to movie, Get dinner go for drinks and just hang out. We always talked even late with text and everything. I liked her a lot and she seemed comfortable with me.

I guess i felt i always had a chance with her because when we hung out she always flirted with me and having sex with each other seemed to be the topic we most talked about. She even mentioned shooting a porno with me. I don’t know if it was just mind games or if she was serious. Right now i don’t know what i was thinking, i should of let actions speak louder than words. But i really felt for her so i grasped on anything that made me feel like she was interested in me. This went on for about 8 months.

We had up and downs. I’m not completely stupid, there were times where i was trying to leave her alone and let each other move on but then she would get this increased interest in me and id fall back in line. I would leave her alone when she would have her little flings but eventually she would gravitate towards me again.

This week was a crazy week though. We went out had she took something i said completely the wrong way. We decided to give each other space (which i did) but then she was all over again when i gave her no attention. She started telling everyone i was her best-friend and then when we went out for drinks with co-workers she started calling me her Man. I didn’t play into and give that too much attention because i felt it wasn’t real. Two days later she is completely ready to end it with me. Said she was blocking my number from her phone and to not expect to hear from her again. she said it was “time for her to spend energy talking to a guy she actually likes more than just friends and that she’s not attracted to me and cant force herself to be, good-bye”. Ill admit. That really hurt. So abrupt and harsh. And remember i work with her.. What am i to do and how do i act. Is it a power game or is this is.

Women have Girlfriends and Boyfriends. If you’re not fucking her, you’re her Girlfriend.

One of the more heinous crimes inflicted upon the men of Generation AFC is the curse of the Emotional Tampon. Hapless Betas being cast into the role of perpetually having to be “supportive” and emotionally available for a woman he’s enamored with all in an effort to prove himself the ideal boyfriend is an 80’s Brat Pack movie plot cliché now. Oh, if only she could see past the hot jock jerks and find the true love that’s been here all along,…swoon,…

Typically when I read classics like this it’s on the high school forum at SoSuave, and for good reason; usually all it takes is one or two passes at this experience for young men to come to an understanding that they’re being manipulated. As we progress through adolescence and into early adulthood (if all goes as it should) there are a series of valuable learning experiences that teach us (albeit harshly) a mature adult set of social skills. This is generally where I begin when I assess particular intergender situations – are the participants using an adolescent social skill set? Has some factor retarded this maturation (such as premature monogamy, or a stubborn clinging to Disneyesque ideals) into an adult social skill set?

What makes Darren’s situation interesting is the pseudo-relationship he’s entertained with this girl for 8 months. For all the shit slinging about Three Strikes or the sex never being worth the wait for a Wait for It girl, it amazes me how readily and willing a majority of Beta men will be to entertain a sexless, quasi-monogamy. I’d like to blame the girl for her playing along, but I can’t – she’s only doing what women do when they pursue their pluralistic mating strategy. Don’t blame the Doberman for eating the juicy steak. It’s Darren’s failure to consolidate, and consolidate early, on ratcheting up his sexual interest in the girl that’s the primary issue.

In addition, Darren still doesn’t want to acknowledge that he never had a relationship with her, instead wondering if her ‘abrupt'(?) rejection is some kind of power game, and hoping against hope that he can salvage a monogamy that only existed in his head. What his part really amounts to is a Buffer against the very real rejection he could potentially experience by putting himself out into the real world by spinning plates. The longer her perpetuates his pseudo-relationship, the longer he forestalls having to face potential rejection.

The Surrogate

Darren was playing surrogate boyfriend, voluntarily accepting and internalizing all of the responsibilities and accountabilities of being a woman’s exclusive, monogamous partner with no expectation of reciprocating intimacy or sexuality. It is the ideal situation for a woman in the same manner a Booty Call is for a man – all sex with no expectations of monogamy, commitment or emotional investment.

You essentially become a surrogate boyfriend for her – fulfilling all the emotional availability and security needs the Jerk isn’t providing with no expectation of reciprocating intimacy on her part.

How Cruel?

From the standpoint of a guy who’s aware he’s become a surrogate boyfriend, and those who can objectively see that he is, it seem incredibly manipulative and deliberate for a woman to put a guy whom she knows has a definite interest level for her into that role. I would argue that, more often than not, a woman doing so has done so repeatedly in the past so often that it becomes normalized for her.

Is she aware of it?

On some level of consciousness perhaps, but it’s comfortable for her to do so because she’s unable to have both her emotional / security needs paired with her physical needs in the same guy. So her coping mechanism is to entertain a Nice Guy (sometimes multiple Nice Guys) from whom she gets emotional support and a security response from, while wallowing in the physical rush and the resulting drama caused by the Jerk. I go into this splitting of needs in Schedules of Mating:

There are methods and social contrivances women have used for centuries to ensure that the best male’s genes are selected and secured with the best male provisioning she’s capable of attracting. Ideally the best Man should exemplify both, but rarely do the two exist in the same male (particularly these days) so in the interest of achieving her biological imperative, and prompted by an innate need for security, the feminine as a whole had to develop social conventions and methodologies (which change as her environment and personal conditions do) to effect this.

Maintaining a series of surrogate boyfriends is one of the most directly observable manifestations of women sexual pluralism.

Women get off on perfecting a gestalt boyfriend from both the Nice Guy and the Jerk, but relatively few are aware of it, and among those who are, even fewer will expressly admit to it. They’ll quite happily allow a surrogate to continue in his qualifying himself to her in his efforts to “be a good listener” and “be there for her” until such a time as he grows frustrated and he becomes a liability in his own right, or a liability to her Jerk sex / drama interest. The hot guy who uses her up and leaves her on the bed wanting more will always take precedence over the emotional surrogate because they’re so easily attracted and entertained.

Published by Rollo Tomassi

Author of The Rational Male and The Rational Male, Preventive Medicine

Leave a Reply

  Subscribe  
Notify of
A.B. Dada
Guest
A.B. Dada
Offline

That’s why there are three female definitions in my life:

1. Girlfriends
2. Family
3. Female wings (for social proof, DHV, etc)

I have no female friends, and if they try to be my friend, I explain quite clearly that I have no interest in platonic relationships with women, ever.

My last remaining ACTUAL female friend I cut out about 3 years ago when I realized her losing weight made her really bangable and she denied me. Chop chop, next.

Pete
Guest
Pete
Offline

Rollo, It sucks to hear about a man not being able to see past the glaring issue in front of his own nose. I understand that his infatuation both mentally and physically hinder him from sound judgement, but, how many times does it have to happen? I mean eight months is an incredible amount of time to be led to the water then pushed back to the dirt. Even though I don’t and will never let this happen, I do feel bad for him. He is in a rough spot. He obviously just needs to throw in his cards and… Read more »

YOHAMI
Guest
YOHAMI
Offline

Yeah. This subject alone could fill a book.

A.B. Dada
Guest
A.B. Dada
Offline

And that book should be titled “How mom and dad forced you to swallow the blue pill.”

I’m proud that my dad didn’t, and warned me specifically about this at a young age. Even my mom encourages my plate-spinning ways.

samplexus
Guest
samplexus
Offline

I knew about this when I got out of high school and cut myself off from my own version of being a surrogate boyfriend but I didn’t know why. I didn’t understand the reasons why a girl would be so cruel. It’s so clear now.

Thanatosis (@lmMirin)
Guest

If you want to bang a girl and she denies you. It’s always better to end the relationship then and there. It will only become emotionally toxic for all parties. I adopted this policy at around 16. Never looked back.

gritartisan
Guest

Ignorance is no defense when you see other guys getting what you want. That’s naivety and ego. So I don’t feel sorry for guys who become emotional tampons- they can’t accept the facts. Not once do these guys think, “hmmm go for the kiss now” or ” I’ll put my hand here and let you get comfortable with it.” instead they prop up excuses like ‘coworker’ that just translate to “I’m a pussy and should have moved on.” Use roissys advice- if your relationship was blasted on the jumbotron at a Dallas Cowboys game, is the crowd going to boo,… Read more »

KarlVonMox
Guest
KarlVonMox
Offline

“I have no female friends, and if they try to be my friend, I explain quite clearly that I have no interest in platonic relationships with women, ever.” Pretty stupid, imo. Some women genuinely do have more to offer than simply being sexual playthings. One of my best friends now is a bisexual woman who I had a sexual relationship with at first, but now is just a platonic friendship. I dont need the sexual intimacy with her – I simply enjoy having her around, smoking cigars or drinking bourbon, and checking out other females. The problem with this blog… Read more »

deti
Guest
deti
Offline

Sure, you can have female friends. But what invariably happens is that you’ll end up playing into their frame, because it ‘s female nature to get others into their frames. It’s much easier to fall into this with a woman you aren’t sexual with. Other people, men and women, will see you submitting to her frame and peg you as an emotional tampon or a beta orbiter, even if you are neither. What will matter is the perception that you are. Not a great place to be. Female friends? OK, but only if you’re good with eventually playing to her… Read more »

Good Luck Chuck
Guest
Good Luck Chuck
Offline

I very much agree with the premise of this post, but as I have mentioned many times in the past I will never fully agree that you are either a woman’s boyfriend or her girlfriend. For a beginner, yes. But for someone who knows better than to let a woman take advantage of him and knows how to harness the power of social proof taking this advice verbatim is like cutting off your nose to spite your face. The real danger isn’t in being friends with women, it is in allowing a woman to take advantage of you. It’s all… Read more »

Hero
Guest
Hero
Offline

I’ve seen this situation from the other side. A couple years ago my wife made friends with a guy and turned him into one of her “girlfriends” in a short period of time. It shook my confidence which caused a beta backslide in me. It was obvious that she was enjoying having the new “girlfriend” around. Lots of talk/email/text time with him. At first I could see that she still had the hots for me but that temperature cooled as my confidence and strength in the situation was compromised. All that changed when I decided that I wasn’t going to… Read more »

Nas
Guest
Nas
Offline

“Said she was blocking my number from her phone and to not expect to hear from her again. she said it was “time for her to spend energy talking to a guy she actually likes more than just friends and that she’s not attracted to me and cant force herself to be, good-bye”. Ill admit. That really hurt. So abrupt and harsh. And remember i work with her.. What am i to do and how do i act. Is it a
power game or is this is.”

– As to how do you react? Like this: http://heartiste.wordpress.com/2012/03/29/women-understand-the-concept-of-hand/

Sam Spade
Guest
Samuel
Guest
Samuel
Offline

I know how to accommodate female sexual pluralism and maintain hand.

Thanatosis (@lmMirin)
Guest

It depends on if the woman actually shares many of your interest that would make her a good friend.

Thanatosis (@lmMirin)
Guest

Nobody is disagreeing it’s just that most women don’t make good friends.

Ask a woman if she prefers male or female friends.

Stingray
Guest
Stingray
Offline

On some level of consciousness perhaps, but it’s comfortable for her to do so because she’s unable to have both her emotional / security needs paired with her physical needs in the same guy. I can’t speak of the young women today as more of them seem keenly aware of what they are doing and dimply don’t care, but it used to be that girls didn’t do this knowingly. Having a surrogate or an orbiter is a way to be validated. “This man likes me, so I can’t be completely ugly/awful/etc.” A lot of girls used to be very confused… Read more »

itsme
Guest
itsme
Offline

I dont need the sexual intimacy with her – I simply enjoy having her around, smoking cigars or drinking bourbon, and checking out other females.

in other words, she’s your bro.

Rollo Tomassi
Guest

This is a good addendum to Darren’s situation:
https://rationalmale.wordpress.com/2011/09/19/playing-friends/

It’s almost as if he LJBF’d himself in this scenario.

jonas
Guest
jonas
Offline

the hotter the girl, the more surrogate boyfriends she will have. it’s really weird observing this through blue pill glasses at first, but this blogpost really hits home with me. girls shamelessly and pretty elegantly line up an army of providing betas. my girlfriend at the moment has kept 30+ surrogate orbiter boyfriends around, before she met me. one to watch movies with and pay for it, one to go have dinner with and pay for it, one to go on vacation and pay for it, one to invest into her art school dreams, one to drop her off at… Read more »

xsplat
Guest
xsplat
Offline

Off topic, but here’s a strange manosphere development some people might be interested in.

Apparently Heartiste is going the way of Aunt Sue and blocking comments, in the service of maintaining an echo chamber. He replies to my xsplat comments on this thread http://heartiste.wordpress.com/2012/04/10/bad-news-for-smart-nerds misrepresenting me, then refuses to publish my rebutal, (which I put on my blog).

Read for yourself and see if you don’t agree his hamster is as of today as big as they get.

itsme
Guest
itsme
Offline

i agree, a lot of women genuinely don’t realize that they’re stringing male girlfriends along by their dicks. they just assume that the guys really do just want to be friends. you know, because men and women are equal, so they can be just friends, and gender and sexuality are social constructs…

remember that youtube video where they went around a college campus asking students if men and women can be just friends? the overwhelming majority of girls answered ‘yes’ whereas the guys mostly said ‘no’.

itsme
Guest
itsme
Offline

but at the same time, you don’t want to eliminate all of them completely. unless you want to listen to all her shit.

me, i’m content with merely being the guy a girl bangs after one of her orbiters takes her to dinner. they’re much more absorbent emotional tampons than i am.

it’s normal for a good looking social girl to have orbiters, but she should have at least that many female friends too. if not, that’s a red flag.

Good Luck Chuck
Guest
Good Luck Chuck
Offline

A man shouldn’t have female friends in the same way he has male friends. It’s not an “I got your back bro” kind of situation. You can’t count on women for shit, especially when you aren’t banging them. With women it’s more of an acquaintance thing. You get together for a night of partying or a bbq or whatever, then you don’t talk to them for awhile. If she has a boyfriend at the time you hang out with the boyfriend too, no big deal. One of my female friends is particularly valuable to me. We messed around in the… Read more »

LionSoul
Guest
LionSoul
Offline

I like your insights. Do you have a blog?

LionSoul
Guest
LionSoul
Offline

I never understood the appeal of being friends with a chick at the job. You get more respect and they are willing to do more for you as an employer when they have to earn your time. Never allowing them into the ‘friend or fuck’ zone allows you to get better production, especially if they like you. The women that work for me are going after me like a Twinkie on a stick, and they love it. Yet, I do think you can have women ‘partners’ who hook you up with free food, movies, and other discounts. It’s good to… Read more »

YaReally
Guest
YaReally
Offline

Healthy outlook. Thumbs up lol I think newbies need to go thru a “sex or GTFO” stage because they don’t have the calibration to understand when they’re benefitting or not benefitting from a friendship with a female so it’s better for their training that they just make it black and white like that. Like telling them to never buy a girl a drink. Down the road when you’ve developed a stronger frame than most girls, it’s different. Tho I think what you say about the type of friendship to expect from a woman VS a man is a very important… Read more »

LionSoul
Guest
LionSoul
Offline

It’s ridiculous. Like I’ve said before, most game pushers are trying to scam the weak. They are like the ten pound weight loss in a day product. Easy, quick, and not long term. Any natural or someone who has done game for awhile eventually gets enough pussy to understand that it’s not everything(blasphemy!). They start to work on their looks by working out, get a career, and become masterful in something worthwhile. You know, be a man and not just live for pussy. Afterwards, they get more pussy then they ever had before without even trying to game. Why is… Read more »

Rico
Guest
Rico
Offline

“Ignorance is no defense when you see other guys getting what you want. That’s naivety and ego.”

Well, I can say from experience as a former emotional tampon that the rationalization when you see a girl go for the bad boy is “well, that girl’s a slut – I can do better.” At least until you red pill and realize that all girls have the potential to slut it up with the bad boys.

Rico
Guest
Rico
Offline

I had one of those… we took in a ton of movies and concerts, but there was absolutely no sexual chemistry there whatsoever. Still a good friend, though I eventually realized that I was spending time with her when I should’ve been chasing women I sexually attracted to.

William
Guest
William
Offline

1.I don’t take a friendship between a male/female with a past sexual relationship seriously.
Your sexual past still plays a role in your friendship and will definitely be suspicious to future partners.
2. If you can only see yourself hanging amongst a group and not the two
of you alone together, you’re not friends you’re acquaintances.

YaReally
Guest
YaReally
Offline

That IS weird. I notice you deleted my comment trying to help you understand your alcohol addiction from your blog lol what’s that about hamsters? wink

Johnycomelately
Guest
Johnycomelately
Offline

This post clearly shows why ‘waiting for a good girl’ is a load of baloney.

xsplat
Guest
xsplat
Offline

It’s one thing to block out a comment, or even a commenter you don’t want to deal with.

It’s quite another to comment on his comment, grossly twist around and misrepresent it, argue against a straw man, then to disallow a direct reply.

That’s bad form, in my book.

Lionsoul, you can get to my blog by clicking on my icon.

walawala
Guest
walawala
Offline

Years ago, I began “hanging out” with a female work colleague. We did everything together: dance lessons, hanging out, dinners…everything except getting physical. She had a boyfriend…who was away…and a dick. One day I did make a move. We made out. Then she brought up the boyfriend thing and he came back from whatever it was he was doing. I told her I was letting her go. She did everything to keep my attention. Finally, she caught boyfriend cheating….I thought this would be my “Opening” to move in. You know how this ends…of course it wasn’t. You can game for… Read more »

Good Luck Chuck
Guest
Good Luck Chuck
Offline

Yea, making it a black or white issue is helpful for beginners. Once you truly grasp how things work though it becomes a hindrance to automatically dismiss all women if they aren’t on your cock. It’s all about frame. If she is living in yours, all’s good. If you are living in hers it’s time to move on.

Thanatosis (@lmMirin)
Guest

Exception that proves the rule.

Coy
Guest
Coy
Offline

I just offered a friend an invitation to be a fuck buddy. Refused!!!Just took the red pill a few weeks ago. Shes now fucking someone else and I am glad I made it clear.My confidence went up.

Rollo Tomassi
Guest

This is a pretty good primer for Good Girls:
https://rationalmale.wordpress.com/2011/11/10/good-girls-do/

djPacMan
Guest
djPacMan
Offline

@LionSoul, I agree with doing things that increase your self-confidence and doing things you find interesting, and then meeting women. “F-zone” is cool. @xsplat, that happened to me recently too, where I heard about that site so I went there and over a few days read some of it, parts of it sounded right on (even if some of it might have been from other books), then I read a few current posts and aside from being strange there was statements in those posts that was the opposite of previous posts, so I just asked a question about this and… Read more »

Jason
Guest
Jason
Offline

Many men out there, such as myself, will sleep with women and then friendzone them.

theprivateman
Guest

I have a rule about female “friends”. Sure, I’ll have female friends but only if they are actively working to set me up with her single friends. If she’s not doing that, she’s not a friend and gets the heave-ho.

walawala
Guest
walawala
Offline

I have noticed that girls who do want to bang you don’t “Friend” you.

A girl I’ve been gaming for a while suddenly contacted me and amid the chit chat that I lead to a meet up, at some point she texted:

Her: “were there a of girls in those places you traveled to?”

Me: Wow

Her: I knew it

Me: Change subject…..

This comment alone to me shows there some shit test. shit test= IOI.

Any thoughts on this observation?

guesticle
Guest
guesticle
Offline

Meh. It’s not always rationalization, sometimes it’s old-fashioned logic bringing you to the correct conclusion. Some girls ARE just trash and you CAN do better. I used to think I always did something wrong when a girl went another way, and while its good to learn from mistakes, sometimes its not you. I gamed and pursued a girl who I later learned was an actual cheap slut who would bang the absolute dregs of society. She was borderline hystrionic and seriously self-destructive. As hot as she was, she doesn’t deserve my dick or my time. In other cases, just make… Read more »

PaleoGuy
Guest
PaleoGuy
Offline

Reading 30Darren’s post feels like reading my own autobiography. I can’t count how many times I cluelessly played the “surrogate boyfriend,” hoping that the woman in question would eventually realize that I was what she was looking for all along.

Holy shit was I ever a clueless chump.

Claire
Guest
Claire
Offline

PaleoGuy – I hope I don’t sound heartless, but how would she just realise unless you told her or demonstrated in some way that you wanted to be more than friends?

matt
Guest
matt
Offline

Ya but so what? As a guy I also have emotionally needs.I will have “surrogate girlfriends” too who I use to bitch about problems I wouldn’t with the girl I’m sleeping with or my guy friends. Why is this is a bad thing? Sure I’d bang some of my surrogate girlfriends, but I’d bang 25% of the planet.

Opus
Guest
Opus
Offline

It’s difficult for Darren as she is someone he works with. He is thus unable to avoid her, and seeing her will only inevitably rekindle his feelings. If he is offish with her he will only tend to look bitter.

I don’t think women are really sufficiently self-aware to realise how cruel and unfair they are being. Women who split their attentions between Tampons and Jerks tend to be women who ‘have problems’ anyway, so are best avoided.

trackback

[…] like this generally end up as the infamous emotional tampon, or the Surrogate Boyfriend to a woman who’s banging the most Alpha Man her looks can attract. However, this […]

Mike
Guest
Mike
Offline

Hey Darren all you need is just turning the table..This is right what happened to me, but I was playing a donkey for 3,5 years with colleague ..(but fucking from time to time other women secretly).. then realizing that I told her to go to hell..Told her she is kicked out of my life..I let her know either I fuck her or no more “friendship”… So I started chasing other women and let her know about that..I started acting like a man..I stopped contacting her whatsoever..She is chasing me now but I ignore that stupid bitch…She doesn t deserve my… Read more »

Chibiabos
Guest
Chibiabos
Offline

Emotional tampon? Goddam you people are creepy. There’s little mystery here and you don’t need some creepy, kludgy, sociopathic scheme of social theory to explain it. Guy met girl, they danced around each other for a while, guy was tired when girl was frisky and girl got a little sour grapes at him. Maybe Darren should accept the fact that being an adult is complicated and try to reconnect with his friend. It’s pretty normal to be attracted to someone and not want to have sex with them. It’s also possible for you to be forced to want to have… Read more »

YOHAMI
Guest
YOHAMI
Offline

“It’s also possible for you to be forced to want to have sex with someone who you find physically attractive.”

Get help.

kobayashii1681
Guest

“Never slept with her. We became close friends though. We would hang out, Go to movie, Get dinner go for drinks and just hang out. We always talked even late with text and everything. I liked her a lot and she seemed comfortable with me.

I guess i felt i always had a chance with her because when we hung out she always flirted with me and having sex with each other seemed to be the topic we most talked about.”

http://www.quickmeme.com/img/11/1198c5157585b5434a45382ee5fcde9a060cb6389a536aa79aca3c9e3bcf2d76.jpg

kobayashii1681
Guest

Reblogged this on 254MGTOW and commented:
“Women have Girlfriends and Boyfriends. If you’re not fucking her, you’re her Girlfriend.”

Believe it!

kobayashii1681
Guest

“What am i to do and how do i act. Is it a power game or is this is.”

YESSSSSSS!!! The game never ends!

Stoic101
Guest
Stoic101
Offline

Being an emo tampon is like a girl giving you bj’s for free. Guys need to get that through their thick heads. I realize guys are romantics and genuinely like the conversation, but the point is pretty obvious, if your not fucking her your simply a shoulder to cry on. She ‘gets off’ having an emo tampon. Its the male equivalent of a girl giving you blowjobs and its NSA. Every guy would jump in their car and drive to meet a bitch if he knew he was gunna get a blowjob everytime he saw her if he didn’t have… Read more »

Anonymous Reader
Guest
Anonymous Reader
Offline

Stoic101

That’s a copy/paste bit of words that many bluepill AFC’s would benefit from.

Stoic101
Guest
Stoic101
Offline

ya man – guys don’t realize how much ‘sex’ they give girls – its fucking insane man – every txt, every email, likes on facebook and shit, every fucking compliment just fuckin feeds her – its literally like porn for girls – if a girl would show up at your place and suck your dick daily and you didn’t even have to do anything that would be the same shit as you telling her how ‘great’ she is and listening to her bullshit – its the exact fucking same man – girls eat that shit up – validation is literally… Read more »

trackback

[…] the beta orbiter’s keep the free drinks and compliments coming. These men are generally just emotional tampons that the woman uses for validation, while real men are what get her rocks […]

%d bloggers like this: