Case Study – The Crazy

From a Rational Reader who shall remain anonymous:

I’m not sure what’s going on lately.

I’ve been in a weird way lately…about ready to jump off a bridge with the stress I’ve been feeling. I just don’t know who else to talk to.

Remember that long thread about the “obsessed girl” I was dating who I thought was “crazy”? I’ve been seeing her again…and it’s been a weird, weird story I can’t even get my head around.

I was honestly convinced she was borderline/insane, based on her murky past and her “unstable behavior”. I was done with her…had completely blown her off and was ready to wipe her out of my life forever. Then some crazy shit happened and we found ourselves forced to sit down and talk with each other about what had been going on.

She tells me that every time SHE came over my house, SHE was telling herself, “I can’t do this any more, I can’t keep seeing him, etc”. She said she saw a really great guy in me but the things I was saying and doing were driving her nuts.

She started rifling off this list of things that I did that drove her crazy/drove her to drink herself stupid…things like:

* Suggesting other women were interested
* Teasing her/negging her
* Staying detached
* Treating her like I didn’t need her/wasn’t that into her (she says, “like a call-girl”)

I’m sitting there thinking…god dammit, this all sounds familiar…Has becoming a “disciple” of all this Game bullshit been sabotaging me with women for years now?? Am I the “crazy one”? Has all of this nonsense just been a defense mechanism I built to deal with my OWN lack of self-worth??

I decided to drop all of the BS…and just give it a chance with this girl, legitimately, for real. No more Don Juan games…just seeing each other for who we really are. I’ll tell you…I’m at full-scale war with myself…and I’ve lost complete perspective over which side of me is “right”.

There’s one side of me that is absolutely in love with this girl. I mean, she is smoking hot, she’s intelligent and insightful (though she has what I’d consider to be “flakey” ideas about stuff), she has good practical skills (runs her own business), she’s VERY physical…more than me even. She does ALL of the good “wifey” things that everyone talks about…she cleans, she cooks (deliciously!), she dresses to impress when we go out together. She even tells me she doesn’t want to “monopolize all of my time” and constantly encourages me to do stuff I want to do.

As I said before, her past is a bit “wild”, but she honestly seems like she’s become more mature and intelligent and is REALLY taking steps to leave all of it behind. Who am I to deny her a chance at redemption??

 

“wild past”

“unstable behavior”

“obsessed”

“crazy”

These are your terms.

Her list of prerequisites to stay with a “crazy” woman:

* Suggesting other women were interested
* Teasing her/negging her
* Staying detached
* Treating her like I didn’t need her/wasn’t that into her (she says, “like a call-girl”)

One would rationally think a ‘normal’ woman would find any of these intolerable, yet there you are. So either she is in fact crazy, finds reward in abuse and lacks sufficient self-worth to NEXT you, OR, you are approaching your LTR (such as it is) from a healthy, self-interested perspective that she actually does respect; in fact so much so that she’ll pursue you in spite of it.

I think what you’re experiencing now is not so much confusion with her as you are in owning your role as being the primary partner in your LTR. This is a VERY tough transition for a former AFC to accept. In truth, I would say that accepting and internalizing a dominant role in an LTR for a nominally beta guy is more difficult than realizing that applying Game actually works in attracting women as well as thriving with them in an LTR/Marriage.

It’s really a second unplugging for guys. The first shock of ‘unplugging’ comes in the actualizing that everything feminized society, everything any woman ever told him about the ‘appropriate’ way to engage with women is almost entirely the opposite of what produces the results he wants. Once he’s become so frustrated by his dating life that he experiments with un-conventional Game and discovers that Negs work, C&F works, Amused Mastery works, etc. there comes a point of disillusionment – and sometimes despair.

This comes from the realization that everything he’s held as a long-loved ego investment about women falls apart. Half his life was spent in the ignorance of believing women were equally as rational, equally shared the same mutual desires, equally as sincere in her words. The idea of duplicity based on her being female, or not understanding the gender differences in how women communicate, was shamefully due to his inability to become more like her. In his plugged in life, any failure, any misstep, was the result of his inability to identify with her more perfectly.

So it comes as no surprise when his eyes are opened to how much he’s invested of himself in these female-primary conventions. This is where most men turn back. It’s too much to bear in the revelation that what he’s believed for so long could be other than what women have told him so he enters a rationalized denial. And of course there is a well established social network ready welcome him back and reward him for his denial.

The Second Unplugging

The second unplugging comes when a Man is forced to come to this power dynamic realization again when entering into an LTR. Most guys who reinvent themselves and accept their masculine primacy role after having been subjected to an egalitarian gender equality doctrine for most of their lives feel strange in owning it in an LTR and/or marriage. It’s really put up or shut up time. Essentially you need to become the Man you sold yourself as when you were spinning plates. Guys who unplug and employ Game are initially mimicking the behaviors that used to be respected and attractive to women. Now they’re considered socially inappropriate or rude at best, borderline abusive at worst under feminine social auspices. Regardless, the results are undeniable.

In an LTR you have to actually be THAT guy, and for a formerly plugged-in AFC, the old mental schema of equality returns. Guilt sets in because he doesn’t feel deserving of the primacy he holds because he still hasn’t let go of that antiquated equalism he thought was valid for so long. He wants to play fair, but what he doesn’t realize is his concept of what is ‘fair’ is still rooted in his plugged-in mindset. It’s at this critical point that most LTRs destruct, because the guy reverts back to his old AFC mental habitus, or the girl settles into the comfort knowing she controls the frame and can dictate the terms of her intimacy as she sees fit.

This is one reason I emphasize a complete internalization of why Game works. I catch all kinds of criticism for being primarily theory based in my approach, but if, and when, you transition to an LTR monogamous commitment, by God you’d better understand why those theories are the bedrock of Game.

This is where you’re at. Your distress is coming from a want to return to a simpler way of dealing with your personal life that really never existed. Bear in mind that the “abusive” behavior your “crazy” girlfriend is complaining about is the same behavior that attracted her to you. If you’re feeling guilt for playing X-Box while she waits on you, then put down the console and do something productive, just understand that feeling of guilt comes from you thinking you need to “play fair” with her in order to keep her. That’s the path to her controlling the frame of the LTR.

Published by Rollo Tomassi

Author of The Rational Male and The Rational Male, Preventive Medicine

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The Shocker
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The Shocker
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Lol he’s getting played, she only wants him because he gamed her crazy ass and it worked—- she’s only playing the wife because she’s riding high on the “I’m the woman who was able to lock his alpha down.” lulzy that he wants to up the beta game, yea that’ll last, clearly she loves hard alpha game, dumb fux…. run!!!

anonymouslyanonymous
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anonymouslyanonymous
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I actually think this post is very insightful & says something I haven’t seen written in any other manosphere blogs. This is actually one of the best posst I’ve read so far on any manosphere blog, as short as it is. Personally it confronts and confirms something I’ve been questioning and struggling with throughout my unplugging, and even with this last BPD [for sure100%] ex gf, I have to admit I wish I had stopped “gaming” her once the establishment for a potentially working LTR was in line. Even if she was BPD, I was pretty aware of the fact,… Read more »

Rollo Tomassi
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Actually I was concerned it was too long, but I’m glad you benefitted from it.

Samuel Solomon
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Man I think you veered way off course of what is really the problem. When a woman shows deference and cooperation and respect, she should be rewarded with a better closeness and intimacy. She has shown that she can be trusted, and has taken a submissive position willingly. If she keeps doing everything right / the way she is told, and gets no further reward, no additional closeness, then her investment-by-deference is a poor deal for her and she will KNOW she is getting dogged and that he really doesn’t value her much at all. It is OK to show… Read more »

Samuel Solomon
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Additionally, if the man rewards her submission with a little love, he is likely to get more of it, just as a dog will be forever obedient if you give him a fucking treat for it.

Throw that girl a bone…

Jon
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Jon
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Should refer the guy to “The Pet”.

“the moment you think of them as pets is the moment they’ll go feral on you.”

PermanentGuest
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Correct me if I’m wrong, but this looks like a person who’s not comfortable in their own skin. This might be due to seeing ‘game’ as a set of tools and tactics when he should view it as a primer for a lifestyle change.

Yes, it’s a tough position because you’ve been indoctrinated on both fronts: mainstream and the pua community.

The real guide is going to come from within. Do what you feel is right. And for your own sake, know your own value.

Last [type]: Stop Caring What other people think about you

JHSD
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Rollo, I notice that this was a letter sent in from one of your readers. How would one go about emailing you? At the moment I have nothing juicy to be analyzed, but I may at some point in the future.
Thanks,

Suz
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Suz
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Yes. Here comes the tricky part – maintaining the delicate balance between alpha and beta. It’s the glue in physical/emotional intimacy.

(R)Evoluzione
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(R)Evoluzione
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Good stuff, Rollo. It seems to me that this “second unplugging,” once in a relationship, is really a constant reinforcement of the positive masculine perspective, a.k.a. the alpha state, and a constant beating back of the betatized conditioned responses, until one truly embodies the alpha state. When that happens, the natural masculine responses take hold, and at some point become the default programming, . After spinning plates for a couple years now in MLTR mode, I still occasionally look back on those bad old days of betatized necromancy (literally, to love death, which is the epitome of the betatized state)… Read more »

Ceniek
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Ceniek
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HOLY SHIT!!!
That’s all I can tell.
I am only very sorry I cannot read all comments. Day and life are too short.

FFY
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FFY
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I’ve been in this situation before. This guy is seeing a girl hold up his game as an example of what drove her nuts. I see a girl who became desperate that she had too high value of a man and felt that she couldn’t keep him anymore. In the closing days of the relationship, they’ll throw all your game back at you and say *that* was the problem in a last ditch effort to regain some hand. Nevermind that everything you had done before that was all fine and dandy. “You barely called or texted me!” Worked fine up… Read more »

driveallnight
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driveallnight
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Agreed, 100%.

jj90
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jj90
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How do you maintain balance? How do you even know you’ve achieved it?

The idea of gaming your girl 24/7 until the end is a daunting idea.

Mohammed the Purple
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Mohammed the Purple
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She doesn’t happen to own a coffee shop?

Anonymous
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Anonymous
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This underscores something about Game I noticed – not all women prefer to be the submissive partner in relationships. The vast majority, certainly, which is why Game works as well as it does, but there are also many who prefer to take a more dominant role – something that’s been made clear to me many times in the BDSM scene, where one’s preference for dominance or submission in social situations is extremely…apparent. I’m not surprised someone would run into this situation with a female, extremely confused as to why she wasn’t allowed to take the reins and not satisfied with… Read more »

Grit
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Grit
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What happens to you, you poor bastard, if you cut the game and then an hour later she leaves and gets fucked by the guy around the corner? Will it have been worth it to deny trusting in your own instincts? What if she is getting fucked on the side already? You will be made a fool.

Did all of those ‘murky’ ‘unstable’ and ‘borderline insane’ instances involve sex acts with other men? You sound like you are describing a girl version of the 50 Shades of Grey. Aka slut.

Big Pimp
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Big Pimp
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I have exactly the SAME story. Just make the woman age 37, married and with 3 kids. Everything else is the SAME.

Leap of a Beta
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“It’s at this critical point that most LTRs destruct, because the guy reverts back to his old AFC mental habitus, or the girl settles into the comfort knowing she controls the frame and can dictate the terms of her intimacy as she sees fit.”

Been there, done that. Multiple times. Get better with it each time though. All comes from experience and knowing how to calibrate to the situation correctly

Rollo Tomassi
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leave me an email address on the About page. I’ll contact you.

Simon Corso
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Simon Corso
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I don’t think of myself in terms of alpha or beta , just pre-game and post-game. Pre-game I probly would’ve submitted to the “crazy chic” tactic listed above. Since adopting the abundance mentality I realize that there are far too many women available, for me to waste time with ones that don’t make me happy… Or the ones who are constantly trying to change me. Post-game, several women have said to me , ” If you don’t stop talking to other girls then I’m not going to see you anymore ” And my response is “Okay, Bye . ” because… Read more »

never give in
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High level post.

FFY and Simon Corso are 100% correct. It’s a massive shit test. It sucks, but we don’t make the rules we just need to play by them. This guy is projecting because he himself doesn’t want it “to always have to be like that”.

Remember once the cat finally grabs and pins down the bouncy toy, she will lose interest in it.

Joe
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Joe
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Consider running Game Lite here, more LTR game. Switch from stronger negs, to teasing. Don’t make her wait overnight to text back, make her wait 2-3 hours. Don’t tell her you’d leave her in a heartbeat, ask her if she thinks another girl is attractive. If you really like her and want to keep her around, you can’t go all squishy (cuz then she won’t be attracted any more). So instead of driving her clinically batshit (that’s a real psychiatric condition I just made up) with your game, you want to drive her a little less nuts. Just dial it… Read more »

David Collard
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This is a good piece. I have applied most of this in my marriage, especially in the last few years. It does mostly work. Sometimes letting the woman have her head is OK too, but you have to be at least minimally aware of where you are in the relationship. I never had to “unplug”, because I was brought up in a time and place where we didn’t get a lot of blue pill. Also, I have always been comfortable being a bit domineering anyway at times. But getting the level of Game calibrated correctly, and getting used to the… Read more »

David Collard
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I agree that some women probably don’t really want to be the submissive one in the relationship. And even when they do, they may do so to a greater or lesser extent. Even the same woman will vary over time in this regard. But I think the assumption should be that a woman will want to be led. The only thing I would add too is that quieter, mousier girls are not necessarily the most submissive; nor are louder women necessarily less submissive underneath. I have seen apparently happy female led relationships, but they still seem strange enough that they… Read more »

E
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E
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A key characteristic of BPD is they are very skilled an being attractive. They are intense and able to connect strongly. As such, they have a huge amount of appeal. However, their emotionally unstable condition frequently spills over to their LTR, causing the “sane” ones to have significant problems due to the problems and emotional turmoil they generate. If you actually think you are dealing with BPD, then get “Stop Walking on Eggshells” or “The Essential Family Guide to Borderline Personality Disorder.” Also remember, that only when you have your life in order, are you fit to have a relationship… Read more »

revolutionarycause
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Rollo…this is by far one of the best posts… it really describes and anylizes something that is not talked about too often, the second unpluggin. In fact I am going through this right now. I have manage to get the girl that I was crazy for by using Game. At first I was an AFC and almost managed to lose her. After I found out about game, i was able not only to get her back but to also having her being crazy over me (along with being able to talk to other plates and keeping them spinning). Now I… Read more »

Robert Lee
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Robert Lee
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That may be true, but as a man, I like Moses’ quote from the old Ten Commandments movie. When the princess of all Egypt asks why he doesn’t kneel before a queen, Moses says “My knees are caked with mud and will not bend.” She says “Shall I call in the guards?” and he says “Do you think they can bend them?” Ok, yeah, a movie and a little hokey, but you get the point. Real men don’t bend to their subordinates, and women are subordinate… period. If you start from any frame other than that, you’re going to get… Read more »

Anonymous
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Anonymous
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“Male” and “dominant” aren’t synonymous, nor are “female” and “submissive.” If you’re a naturally more submissive guy meeting women using Game and you find yourself falling for a woman who would really rather be in charge, you might as well tone it down some if you want to be with her, you both might enjoy it more. And don’t assume all men must be looking for a meek and submissive wife and mother for their kids…some of them are looking for goddesses to worship, some of us are looking for nothing but fun and adventure and tying ourselves down to… Read more »

Robert Lee
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Robert Lee
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The way I’ve personally avoided relapsing into beta is by keeping alive the bitter long memory of the female who drove me to take the red pill in the first place. The caveat to that is not comparing that situation to the woman I’m with now (and being a sad MGTOW), just applying the lessons learned. But maybe you can touch on that in a future post, Rollo: Dealing with the absolute self-damnation of knowing that you maybe lost a really decent girl – the girl who drove you to take the red pill – solely because you didn’t know… Read more »

Robert Lee
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Robert Lee
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I suppose. If you aren’t a real man, meeting a woman more ‘man’ than you might be your bag.

It just isn’t conceivable for those who are real men, so maybe my perspective is skewed.

Justanotherintelligentintrovert
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Rollo, concerning this topic of inner resistance to unplugging, there is a theme I would love to hear your thoughts on. It seems to me that one of the most powerful sources of psychological resistance in this area is the fear of solitude. I don’t mean the fear of lacking companionship, but rather the fear of the feeling of solitude that is part and parcel of the experience of leading, of taking the ultimate responsibility for a situation. It is my observation that it is all to easy in daily life to take control of a situation whenever there is… Read more »

Vicomte
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Vicomte
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This is why I think of game as influence, not sorcery.

You can’t control everything a woman thinks or does.

I’m not saying one isn’t accountable for their relationships, but too many game proponents believe they pull all the strings, and a failure is something that could have been rectified with more knowledge and different behavior. This is where we get these ‘She flaked because you texted her back right away instead of waiting four hours’ shit.

It can be narrow-minded to not allow for other possibilities. Game is one lens among many.

Vicomte
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Vicomte
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John Wayne wasn’t even John Wayne.

Marion had tight game.

Mohammed the Purple
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Mohammed the Purple
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Axiom 1 don’t listen to women Axiom 2 don’t talk to women. Learn to grunt. Read Lord Chesterfield’s letter to his son regarding women. Things have not really changed. 50 years of birth control versus 1,000,000 years of human existence, women don’t know how to deal with that power. We just have a different set of circumstances to deal with. We’re kinda at the same point in our history timeline as a civilization as the Romans (if you’re familiar with Oswald Spengler) were when Paul the apostle was writing to early Christians to avert their eyes when they had to… Read more »

Stingray
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Stingray
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Isn’t this one of the reasons men had “Men’s Clubs” to join? To get together with other leaders who are ultimately responsible for their own situation? A place where these men could talk and unwind, or discuss whatever they needed to aid themselves in their leadership roles? Whether it be a few hours of relaxation with a glass of scotch or other men to discuss problems, it was a place to be with other men in the same boat and escape that solitude. Do you have men friends that are like you whom you can do this with? Shooting range,… Read more »

Stingray
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Stingray
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I sometimes feel “guilty” because I was treating that chick so “bad”. I would try to be “rational” and decide that I was going to treat her better. You are still thinking of it in terms of what you or other men would consider bad. In trying to be rational in what you believe would be treating her better, you are thinking of what other men or yourself would want. Not your girl. She might verbalize that she wants these things “better”, but if she truly did, you would not have almost lost her and you would not have won… Read more »

Phinn
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Phinn
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It’s amazing — this woman’s list of the things that bothered her the most just happen to be the most effective Game techniques. My wife did the same thing to me. 18 months ago, I was thisclose to being cuckolded by a guy with a better physique than me, a more upbeat attitude, lots of free time, no responsibilities, an innate sense of how to play hot-and-cold, and an attitude that the world was a playground built for his entertainment. I had to alpha-up quickly. Unplugging was awful. But I did it. But after the crisis passed, and there was… Read more »

FNG
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FNG
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@justanother…
It’s not just a leadership vacuum. Thank God sites like this are beginning to fill that vacuum. It’s also the presence of a powerful, pervasive active evil. So much of society and recent history (re-written) has conspired to make our (men’s) lives contrary to our nature and to even question that nature. It is feminism, yes, but it is more than that. It really has become the matrix. Not much help to Rollo’s original questioner I realise (btw great post Rollo, as usual) but needed to say it. It’s a war.

operatingomega
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Game is the practice of creating a purpose-built persona / character that you play or act as in order to get sex. If the problem is that you are struggling to maintain that persona long term because it deviates too far from core concepts you have internalized as your “true self” then the choice is simple: 1. Refuse to sacrifice the core concepts of self that form your identity and cease to maintain that part of the facade. 2. Selectively sacrifice core concepts of self in order to maintain more advantageous parts of the facade. 3. Completely do away with… Read more »

Jason773
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Jason773
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I can feel what this guy is saying and my advice is to just be congruent. I’m currently in a 6+ month LTR and in true alpha form, I set the frame early by explicitly stating what I expect. I told my girl I didn’t want to, and wouldn’t, play games and mind fuck her, but I expect actions to be completely reciprocated. I am keeping up my end, and she knows that any deviation on her end and the NEXT button will be smashed without pity or second thought. I am a high value male who knows his place… Read more »

Jason773
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Jason773
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Summing up what I said, this is more or less Rollo ‘dread game’, albeit quite implicit. I don’t have to say that if my expectations aren’t met, I can and will find someone who will, because my attitude and actions imply it.

daniel
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daniel
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“She literally just wants you to feel bad for being awesome and bring down your game to her level so she can win.”
I dont agree qith that. At least on a subcounsciuos level, what she wants is to see if you are really the man you are selling. It’s just a big shit test, but women want men to pass on then.

gaius mucius
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gaius mucius
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rollo, i’m in the midst of this second unplugging you speak of currently. i often find myself wondering if i should be nicer to her too. i haven’t been, I have been treating her like my personal call-girl. result? she now comes and fucks me on demand in the morning in addition to night. she’ll come over in makeup, (after fucking me and leaving because i want to fuck but not sleeep together) heels a nd a nice outfit at like 9 in the morning and cook too. its like her attraction to me is such a burden that she… Read more »

Rollo Tomassi
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I am a high value male who knows his place in this sexual market, and when a woman knows that you are self aware, she tends to respect that authority.

Nothing is more threatening yet simultaneously attractive to a woman than a man who is aware of his own value to women.

https://rationalmale.wordpress.com/2012/02/10/the-threat/

killing oneitis
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Rollo, Your site is of there with the highest quality of the Manosphere. It has been a tremendous help to me post-divorce. I suspect a significant portion of your readers are female-initiated-divorce recipients who you have helped unplug and improve lives. We thank you. Was wondering what thoughts you have on ways to totally destroy oneitis with an ex wife? Let me explain: No divorces are easy, but no kids or alimony are involved, it’s possible to make a clean break, unplug, and live happily ever after spinning plates or applying game techniques to a better LTR situation. However when… Read more »

emmatheemo
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emmatheemo
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Hmmm.. Maybe he should go beta on her. If she resents him for it and breaks up with him, he will prove to himself (at last) that game is really necessary, and perhaps even lose oneitis, since she isn’t special. Plus she doesn’t sound like a person to have a LTR with, perfect person to test it with?…
(sorry if it sounds insensitive, it’s just an idea. But I realize it might be too painful to execute if he’s really involved).

Rollo Tomassi
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Oddly enough I had entertained that idea for advice at first. Experience teaches harsh, but teaches best is usually my go-to reasoning, but this isn’t a case of learning about not touching a hot stove to realize it’s dangerous.

Sometimes the only way a guy will learn something is when the opportunity arises for a ‘teachable moment’.

FFY
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FFY
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which is why you hold the line…

her winning = you failing the shit test

tom
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tom
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classic, that’s what always happened to me (and almost every guy i know) before i found out this blog… well i’m not the religious type at all but check this out:
“Curb every passion, and be on the alert. Your great accuser, the devil, is going about like a roaring lion to see whom he can devour.”
hahaha it kinda fits doesn’t it?
spin those plates!

AlphaWhiskey
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AlphaWhiskey
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You need to reframe your perspective. Did that douchebag “steal your wife”, or did he simply provide opportunity for the low quality disloyal woman, who gains pounds by the day, to demonstrate her true colors? Did he “win” the competition, and you “lost”? Well perhaps, but the way I see it he is now saddled with a woman who he watched screw over her ex and subconsciously knows she’s got a propensity for that sort of behavior, and it may very well happen to him too one day. Conversely, you are now a free man. You have learned much from… Read more »

Rollo Tomassi
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This might be helpful to you:
http://rationalmale.wordpress.com/2011/11/15/rejection-revenge/

YOHAMI
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YOHAMI
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Rational Reader: you’re an idiot, and now she knows it, too.

HungHo
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HungHo
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“if you dont tighten your saddle, you may fall off”…
-Dwight Schrute

Hypergamy doesnt care if…. you feel guilty for gamin her.
Chess not checkers gents! Game on. Pause only when she sleeps..

unstable? borderline? hottie? -bet the broad has daddy issues too! rough sex and choking should keep her ass firmly in line.. for awhile.
when she stops cooking, then worry! She smells beta guilt youre done.
You have the hand -stop whining about it, tighten up and live the dream son!

Feel you though, unlearning is the heavy crown! beta brain vs dominant frame.

HungHo
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HungHo
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Been there. ingested Red pill and fuck it worked! Then she’s submissive and you’re like… “WTF now what?!” , Then you feel guilty b/c the game comes natural to you by now and you know you cant go back .. Youre scared, fearful that you’ll be outed and she’ll see herself as just a prop in a production you’ve created for yourself and her, and see you a wannabe player Fuck that.. I’ve learned through experience that its best to assume control over them than to crawl into it like an infant to its highchair. Shit I just think of… Read more »

Solo
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Solo
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Was reading this at the bar last night waiting for my buddy (yeah I’m lame but I don’t have time to read blogs these days)

In the words of the great Anti-Dump

“Brilliant”

killing oneitis
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thank you sir. you can whip these posts out like tools out of a toolbox! i like your take on revenge – the more one really breaks it down, the more one realizes that revenge is inherently beta. it’s tricky because the concept of revenge conflicts with the “nobody messes with me and gets away with it” alpha stereotype.

killing oneitis
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thanks! believe it or not, this is very close to the perspective i have adopted and have made strides with over the past year or so. i used to be a lot worse with it. what i find is that when i do have to see them, my frame occasionally relapses. especially with my own offspring involved and having the lack of power divorced fathers currently have in our society. think 5 steps forward, 4 steps back. it’s good advice, that perspective coupled with continuing to grow in my own alpha lifestyle i think is the winning formula. Loading...

Jim
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Jim
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It seems like another reason many post betas feel pressure to drop the game techniques they’re using on girls is the vulnerability it causes in these girls, which naturally provokes feelings of sympathy in most men. Always keep in mind though, that if the power dynamics within the relationship were reversed then the same sympathy would not be felt by women over your vulnerability. In fact, your vulnerability would make her feel repulsed.

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Gideon
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Gideon
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Rollo’s post was a complete ‘Whoa…’ moment for me. And this is a very insightful comments as well. Even though I’ve known about spinning plates for years… it was the one part of game I didn’t use much because I always felt guilty about it. It’s not in my nature to hurt other people… and I perceived causing jealousy and insecurity in women as causing emotional pain. But that’s a projection of what I feel onto women. The fact is that first of all they perceive these emotions differently than I do as a man. And second, you are right,… Read more »

Survivorman
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Survivorman
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“A good friend just announced today that he’ll be marrying the single mom he’s been living with for a few years.” Oh yeah – this has happened to me numerous times since “unplugging”. It’s horrible to watch – like a train wreck or an airplane crash, made worse by the fact that it’s a friend that is blindly/willingly walking into the fire. On one hand, if you (tactfully) try to “enlighten” him – he’ll get pissed off at you and break contact, or possibly accuse you of being envious of his “happiness”. Sometimes (maybe MOST times) all you can do… Read more »

anonymouslyanonymous
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anonymouslyanonymous
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Yeah, the last point you made is what I’ve been trying to internalize & actualize the most. I have just begun to learn I’ve been in a toxic environment most of my life, and it’s hard to accept the truth of a failed father who could have become or remained alpha, but instead became extremely beta on top of being with a vile human being as a wife. His health since meeting this woman and marrying her should be big enough of a sign. Her behavior toward me should be big enough of a red flag. I’ve caught her cheating… Read more »

anonymouslyanonymous
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anonymouslyanonymous
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edit: I asked her if I could borrow the volvo, and she said I could, just to bring it back the next morning before noon.

Nomad
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Nomad
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While the girl in this post may be crazy this post also speaks to calibration. I have improved my calibration significantly of late but in the past I have driven girls crazy by overgaming them. In an LTR it is essential to dial back active gaming (negs, preselection). Long term game involves more frame control and less active gaming. You can make a girl neurotic when she thinks that every girl wants to shag you and when you’ve given her the impression that you can, or are, shagging them. I have a girl currently who decided she would prefer to… Read more »

Team-Red
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Team-Red
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Napoleon once said, “Men are moved by two levers only: fear and self interest.”

Wilson
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Wilson
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Dominant women are even less satisfied with weak men. Honestly I don’t know if they are ever happy unless they can be broken

Black Man, Red Pill
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Black Man, Red Pill
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I read this post a little too late but I’m glad you posted this. The same things happened to me in my previous LTRs, I got too comfortable and lost alpha.I was the leader and I basically abdicated the throne.

VersLaGloire
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VersLaGloire
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This. Although i can’t really complain. Losing frame and hand in a LTR and not being able to figure out why was what put me in a mindset receptive to new ideas. It allowed me to take the red pill. It was devastating, maintained a near perfect LTR for 4 years, let it all go in a matter of months. The true shame of the situation was that it took me almost 3 more years to figure out that I had destroyed the relationship beyond repair in a few short weeks of weakness (depression due to legal troubles that were… Read more »

Beenthereseenit
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Beenthereseenit
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Different people have different tolerance and preferances. So if your friend is happy with it, be cool with it. When/if he wises up or raises his standards…etc just be his friend and don’t say anything like I should of told/warned you so it’ll just salt the wound.

wingwoman
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wingwoman
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Someone needs to meet actual women and stop reading… Nobody is dom or sub 100% of the time. There has to be some give and take. Most of the problems are just people who aren’t willing to compromise because of their egos or some power trip to compensate for whoever fucked them over.

wingwoman
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wingwoman
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There’s no such thing as a shit test. Fuck men are so stupid. She was giving it to this guy dead straight. She doesn’t like his bullshit she was tolerating it probably because she thought he’d get more serious and stop being such a fuckwad. At this point it’s put up or shut up and gtfo. Woman don’t know what to expect out of a guy at first. We like to try and get to know them which takes a while but there’s no substitute. Lucky for men in the mean time we don’t have too many expectations in the… Read more »

wingwoman
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wingwoman
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By true colors I meant what a self serving asshole a guy is not beta which isn’t being used in it’s proper sense.

wingwoman
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wingwoman
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You could make your wife feel secure loved and appreciated instead of playing asshole circular mind games. If she’s lost trust or respect for you that might not work so hot. How the fuck do you know about this other guy yet claim you were going to be cuckholded? That’s takes you not knowing or willing to be a doormat if she did. She probably did the same thing you’re saying to do which is to make you aware you’re replaceable or just dumpable even without a replacement. She was sick of your shit long before she said something to… Read more »

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Average
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Average
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You people need to tone down dread game. I understand the benefits of it. But sometimes it’s too much. #fromafemale Context: I acknowledge the benefits of game and I admit to recognising the matrix despite my being called an infidel from basically all womankind. #Icomeinpeace

Anonymous Reader
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Anonymous Reader
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You people need to tone down dread game. I understand the benefits of it. But sometimes it’s too much. Each man needs to calibrate his Game continuously. Not just day to day or hour to hour, but sometimes minute to minute. It is inevitable that every men will make a mistake in Game, either over or under gaming. So there will be time when too much dread is used. Just as there will be time when too many shit tests of too much intensity come way too fast. Stuff happens. Feminism has made a mess, but mainly men have to… Read more »

A
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A
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I never shit tested anyone.

A
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A
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Who has watched Inglorious Basterds lol? Damn Shoshanna really didn’t like the Zoller. Or did she? Hard to tell. I’m a female I don’t even understand her.

YOHAMI ZERPA
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We’ve got a psycho.

“you people need to” is a shit test.

“I acknowledge the benefits..” is mirroring.

“my being called an infidel” Is simultaneously playing the snowflake AND the victim / distress card, doing the setup for a white knight situation, then:

“I never shit tested anyone” is beta bait, but in conjunction with the previous shit test is gaslighting

“Inglorious Basterds lol?” is hunting for rapport. Who’ll bite?

Average, you could try hunting beta guys at Hooking Up Smart if that still exists.

A
Guest
A
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I actually didn’t shit test anyone.

A
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A
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I wasn’t hunting for rapport! I thought that relationship would be interesting to be analysed because the guy is clearly an alpha right YET she doesn’t like him. WHY!? I’m not saying I identify with the female but I have some feminist friends who would love to kill alphas… They have tried!

A
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A
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I wasn’t trying to hook up!? Also to RM, you should have an edit function on your comments otherwise you have to make multiple comments and it looks messy.

A
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A
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Quentin Tarantino is pretty alpha right? Yet the love story in Inglorious Basterds is a symbol of feminism vs alphas basically. It’s just interesting and unexpected. In the end they both kill each other. I think the moral of the story is both sides are wrong/should have compromised on their egos +/- communication/apologies. The way Red Pill is going everyone is unhappy e.g. public humiliation of Mark Zuckerberg’s sister (feminism), all these Red Pill guys (alphas/wannabe alphas) on the Roosh forum turning to spirituality cos they’re unhappy lol… (Pretty sure they’re still looking for ‘the one’?)

A
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A
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Okay spirituality has nothing to do with finding ‘the one’ lol, I retract that bit. But it is about finding oneness with God. To ultimately find peace.

SFC Ton
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SFC Ton
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Tone down dread?

Fuck that bullshit with a rusty HIV infected dick.

Also good to see Yoh

YOHAMI
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YOHAMI
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Cheers man

SFC Ton
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SFC Ton
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All good with you brother?

YOHAMI
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YOHAMI
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Yeah, setting a new blog soon

SFC Ton
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SFC Ton
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Nice man let us know when you do

A
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A
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When I ask why Shoshanna wasn’t attracted to Zoller I mean that rhetorically. I’m not seriously asking why Shoshanna wasn’t attracted to some ‘alpha’ (*nauseous*) n***. Obviously he had harmed a lot of people and Shoshanna actually had a lot of boundaries that Zoller refused to accept.

theasdgamer
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“A” is a girl/wannabe girl. Bet her cup size is a AAA.

Anonymous Reader
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Anonymous Reader
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I Come In Peace, yeah, ok.

Anonymous Reader
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Anonymous Reader
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A
Quentin Tarantino is pretty alpha right?

Dunno. Do you think so?

Yet the love story in Inglorious Basterds is a symbol of feminism vs alphas basically.

It’s a story. Not even all that good of a story, really. Plus actors are people paid to pretend they are someone else. Any connection to reality is a coincidence.

Try something other than make-believe to engage us with.

PS: Good to see you back Yohami.

A
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A
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I don’t know who’s alpha haha. I thought Jesus was alpha because of the self sacrifice/commitment to truth aka spirituality. I can’t talk about reality because the real life ?alpha I’m talking about is borderline homicidal towards me and I think he religiously reads this blog (he recommended it to me and not in a gentle way). For all I know he’s going to make life worse for me and I have no idea why he’s been doing that for the past few years. Why was he targeting me? What motives did he have? So he can boast about it,… Read more »

A
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A
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Okay QT is not an alpha lol. Definition of alpha is how hot the woman you can get is. I thought he dated Charlize Theron/the blond German one from Inglorious Basters, I Googled it and I stand corrected. It was Tilda Swinton lol. As in the dude I’m talking about, I don’t know if he’s put on BPD traits to assume your ‘post-deep conversion’ identity, you know, Super Sonic Red Pill man! You know like… literally BE the mind of a woman with Zen-like zeal so that you have power against them. The thing is he somehow pinned his issues… Read more »

YOHAMI
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YOHAMI
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A, drop that BPD bastard and get a nice beta. Then fix your own issues – you have plenty.

A
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A
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Are you perfect? Who are you to judge the BPD guy? No one is perfect, we all seek companionship and sometimes use dysfunctional methods to obtain it.

Yollo Comanche
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Yollo Comanche
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@A

Some people don’t like perfect. It makes them feel worthless by comparison.

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