Field Reports

lion-chasing-gazelle

For the past three years of The Rational Male there’s been a consistent presence in the comment threads of guys seeking advice for particular situations with regards to Game. Whether it’s fine tuning certain aspects of Game or a larger consensus of the guys participating in my comment threads it’s become obvious there’s a need for a dedicated page and comment thread to address these Field Reports.

So I’m instituting this page for exactly this. If there is some urgency to have members of The Rational Male community analyze your particular situation feel free to hit anyone up in the comments of my current post, but please refer them to your particular field report with a link to your comment here. I’m hoping this will alleviate the mass of posts for field report analysis and Game specific insights piled into the main blog post for any given week.

There will be some rules for this “forum” as such. I ask that you only keep your comments to addressing the field reports at hand and save your larger theoretical stuff for the main posts, or if relevant, keep the “bigger scope of things” posts to being as succinct as possible. There will be no moderation in this comment thread (spamming excepted), so realize it will be a very hot kitchen before you post. I will impose no restrictions on video links here, nor will I limit links to various, but pertinent articles.

Understand, this is an experiment for now. It’s likely this comment thread will exceed thousands of comments. I’ll be instituting new comment plug-ins for wordpress to deal with this in the future, but I may archive this page the the posts and refresh this page in the future as well. If this gets cumbersome I may simply institute a dedicated forum-style sub-site of The Rational Male to accommodate for Game specific questions.

So have at it, post your field reports and feel free to comment on the ones you have some particular insight for. Be forewarned that it’s likely things may get a bit salty at times and I expect a lot of back & forth with debate and disagreements, but that’s what this thread is for – to hash out Game particulars for your given situations.

 

15,573 comments on “Field Reports

  1. Regent

    I will admit I like to push boundaries a bit

    Yeah I push boundaries all the time… Last night was talking to a woman I just met minutes before about her gyno visit and asking if the doc warmed up his hands first, rubbing my hands together like a happy merchant…

    And i got kicked out and banned from the bar because she went screaming to the manager giddy laughter and an OMG! I can’t believe you said that, you are outrageous and big eyes… Oh yeah I had my ring on and an answer when she asked where is your wife…

    So what do you think you are doing wrong?

  2. @bad day

    I see what you mean , ha, ha, should have my shit together etc. And yeah she pushed for the marriage in early 30s

    I don’t think I give off a beta vibe though I think people just don’t know what to make of me!

    And yes I agree lots of shit tests but it’s over the top, ha, ha.

  3. ” male model ” doesn’t mean what it used to mean, once the FI took over.

    I will walk past 20 of these types when I leave the house today. In fact my daughter is at breakfast with one this morning, but at least he’s been working out and weighs more than a buck 20.

    I don’t think these guys get laid because ” model “, as much as women like them because very much not ugly. Like the make equivalent of an hb7, which is easy to be when most guys all dress exactly the same, and do nothing to appear ” better looking ” . It doesn’t take a whole lot to stand out from ” average ” dudes and gather more attention from females.

    And yes, they will fuck a pretty boy in her frame. Always in her frame😁.

    Why!

    Because girls fuck.

  4. @Ehintellect

    You’re kinda pissing me off, I mean maybe I’m drunk, uncalibrated etc. but this shouldn’t be that fucking complicated. And just teasing and flirting is no big deal, it’s just snowflakes. They don’t want men they don’t know to push boundaries because it makes them feel weak. And I wasn’t even interested in that particular chick was just an example. I may be weird and not a “chad” type guy but I’m no fucking shlub.

  5. @blaximus – ”I don’t think these guys get laid because ” model “, as much as women like them because very much not ugly”

    Yeah, that’s kind of what i’m saying. Personally, if I have attraction (the girl thinks i’m good looking) I tend to always close that night. I don’t know whether that’s because it’s super easy to close in them situations or my closing game is better than I give it credit for, but that’s the way it is. If a girl has ever opened me with something nice or maybe told me i’m hot, it’s basically in the bag. Similarly, my handsome wing get’s laid like a rockstar and he honestly doesn’t have ‘game’ in the PUA sense. (Just talks to girls like a normal dude)

    In regards to Bacchus verbals, I could be way off base, but maybe @palmsailor will be able to back me up (being a fellow Brit), but his posts on verbals made me cringe a little bit.

    Stuff he says in set like:
    ”When I sit down to make a portrait, I am usually alone, and when i happen to be alone,I tend to feel slightly inside my own head, it is like an emprisonment of your own mind, that only the strongest souls can liberate themselves from. It is one of those situation Ida, where time just flies by… now, used to be then and then suddenly becomes now, an hour becomes a minute, a minute a second and each and every second turns into small pieces known as milliseconds…Completely focused on the things to come, and it’s like that sensation of every bone in your body is working towards creating something big, something new, something that would just blow your mind away. Now with me, It’s a struggle, but I love it””

    or even ”When I sit down to make a potriat… I’m usually alone, in my own head. Time just flies by and you don’t even notice it.
    You’re like… completely focused, and it’s like every bone in your body is working towards creating something. It’s a struggle, but I love it.”

    I just imagine tsaying that to he Brit girls where i live and them looking at me like I was the most boring, pompous, strange guy in the venue lol. I’m sure he’s a coodl dude though and obviously slays tonnes – I do wonder how much actually IS down to the stuff he writes about, though

    Would like @j to maybe give an overview of Bacchus’s game at some point, actually. I’d like to try his style out for a few nights lol.
    I know he opens with something simple like ‘how’s your night going?’ and then ‘drops bait’ like ”Wow, it’s so hot here. It’s not like this where i’m from!”. Then she asks where he’s from and he’s reached the hook point.
    Not sure from there how he actually builds attraction in someone that DOESN’T find him good looking (assuming they exist)
    I don’t believe he’s a fan of most of the sedcution methods out there from what I remember of his posts

  6. Regent

    To women, if you are not a guy who “just gets it” – or can reasonably mimic just getting it – you are a schlub. Full Stop.

    Schlubs get schlub outcomes, as prima facie evidence of schlubbery.

    In other words, if it walks talks and acts like a schlub – it’s a schlub.

    Note this does not have anything at all to do with how guys see you.

    Don’t get mad, get better.

  7. Regent

    So how can we help you?

    You posted your original comment and asked for help. But you didn’t actually define what it is that you want to accomplish. You beat around the bush.

    You are straying into the weeds in referring to “it shouldn’t be so complicated” to just all get along with chicks in your milieu.

    Perhaps you could be more forthright about your goals and plans for dealing with your inter-sexual relationships.

  8. I don’t understand this “male model” stuff (actually I lie, I do – it’s a buffer used to avoid looking at oneself and take action to improve oneself if someone else’s success can be blamed on their looks, and not their actions, one is absolved from having to take action oneself).

    But FWIW, “girls coming up and opening him” is no big deal. You still need to have Game to take that initial spark of attraction (which can be easily replicated by going up to a girl and opening her with confident subcomms) and turn it into a lay. And most guys fail at that (myself certainly included)

    I am a skinny-fat, prematurely graying, distinctly average looking dude in his late 30s. I do have a “prestigious” career and beta bucks appeal, but I dress very average, and no one in a loud nightclub knows my job (if early 20s girls in nightclubs even cared about BB appeal which they don’t).

    Even I get cute early 20s girls “opening me” – maybe one time in every three or so that I go to a club. Note: by “opening”, I mean a girl I don’t know at a club talks to me first – the excuse doesn’t matter – I don’t mean she walks up to me and says “you’re hot” (although that has happened a few times too). If I add in other IOIs and approach invites (eye contact, lots of it, or proximity etc), then it’s a lot more – half a dozen or more every time I go out.

    Incidentally, these haven’t happened at a steady state level. There was a period in my mid-30s when the “base level” number of IOIs on a night out just shot up in the space of a few months from “occasional” to “consistent”. My looks didn’t change in those months – I wasn’t lifting or anything. The only thing that changed that year was that I finally got online dating nailed down and became really comfortable with sexualizing and escalating fast with girls. I slept with more girls that year (in the dozens), than any time before or since. That abundance mentality and the confidence from being able to sexualize and escalate fast is like catnip to the girls – and they noticed it in clubs long before I consciously did – by the end of the year, the whole “online date to get laid” process was pretty routine and boring and consistent – but the girls noticed and IOIs shot up long before I felt (consciously) any more confident – it happened right after the first few consistent lays – they sensed the subcomms change long before I noticed consciously.

    It’s funny – I didn’t even realize that till I posted a Field Report saying “I don’t understand why I’m suddenly getting so many IOIs” and HABD pointed out back then that I had improved my subcomms enough for girls to notice.

    But to get back to the point of the post – I got all those IOIs and if you see them, you think “oh this guy’s gotta be pulling these girls all the time” – but I didn’t. Because I didn’t have the Game to capitalize on them.

    Being good looking and having girls approach you isn’t some magic cure all pill.

  9. Rogent

    I see what you mean , ha, ha, should have my shit together etc.

    That “ha, ha,” comes across as weakness.

    And yeah she pushed for the marriage in early 30s

    Any of several men here could have told you that. A demonstration of knowledge about women. You should ask yourself the question “what else do the men here know? What else is on Rollo’s site about women that I don’t know?”.

    One thing that may be an issue for you in real life: butthurt. If you are being all defensive and passive-aggressive and generally bitchy around people & it doesn’t work out, perhaps you are butthurt and it’s showing.

    There are archives here. Rollo’s written three (3) books and they are not expensive. Either way you can learn if you put your butthurt and pride aside.

  10. Look you guys don’t know me, and since it’s hard to describe the situation, online and outside of this milieu. I guess there’s not much else to say. I know I can’t determine if anyone is beta, alpha, a schlub, or wuss. just by a few internet posts. And all of our life experiences are different. Some of you guys made good points, I’m just totally baffled by the weird experiences I’ve been having. Maybe this is the wrong place for feedback. But I do appreciate Rollo’s work.

    -Take it easy for now.

  11. ” . . . this shouldn’t be that fucking complicated.”

    Driving a nail isn’t complicated, but you can still do it all wrong.

  12. Crystal ball show me your secrets…..

    I see a man…it’s misty. ..oh it’s j…he’s old….44, 45 maybe.

    He’s with a fat woman….he’s complaining no one likes his art no more and his dead bedroom is on his mind..

    Woman complains she has no purpose, finds j unattractive.

    No kids to be seen….

  13. “Look you guys don’t know me . . . And all of our life experiences are different,” is the sort of thing artsy special snowflakes say.

    “Maybe this is the wrong place for feedback.”

    No, it’s the right place, but they have to get your attention first.

  14. Regent —

    It isn’t complicated at all actually. It’s simple: if women perceive you as not being able to socially read and calibrate properly in real time (as Sentient says, “just getting it”), you’re a schlub in their eyes. It’s that simple — not complicated. Negging an unattractive woman is a known fail, and will be read by that girl, by any other girl around her, and by guys around “who get it, as you “not getting it”, and therefore being a schlub.

    In order to change that, worry less about whatever websites girls are reading or whether their minds are mush or what have you and instead improve your read and calibration so that you appear to “just get it”. Much less complicated that analyzing the influence of social media on girls’ minds — girls are girls.

  15. “…And that’s why therapy fails you too.
    You take zero ownership of your lot…”

    It’s just I can’t stop looking at other women. Especially younger women.

    there is a lot of that going around…lol… and to quote SJF…

    ‘what are you going to do about that?’…

    (I digress, here: I was tooling around reading and figuring some stuff in regards to Red Pill and Religion. I’m not very religious, but I was drawn to Confessions by St.Augustine, which I’m currently reading. I looked into this based on some stuff that EhIntellect learned from his son in regards to red pill and True Humility vs. False Humility. And some other stuff. Because someone actually figured out some of this same shit 1669 years ago.

    I can’t figure out the importance of St. Augustine and how it fits in here. But he was a well read, snarky writer. Pretty judgemental to boot.

    But he went all God Pill. Directed all towards “God” and renounced the flesh, became celibate and didn’t think much of propagating a genetic legacy after enjoying the flesh like Malcom X and Thomas Merton types. Rogues in youth, virtuous leaders as adults.

    So, Augustine went outward and upword, but a more contemporary follower of his, more modern Dorothy Day, went inward and into towns and actually helped other humans. She brought her God down to the city level of community.

    So now that I’ve bored you by this digression,…)

    Here’s the punch line.

    A guy told a story in an article in regards to getting Dorothy Day kind of Grace. Similar to a guy coming here and getting Red Pill Awareness and some handy advice from those that have done the work to get game.

    The guy went on a retreat to an Abbey. The foundress and abbess was a formidible and no nonsense person. He asked her to pray that he would receive grace.

    She bluntly stated: “You Will. You just have to act on It!”

  16. Novaseeker, I wasn’t actually negging her it was an innuendo! It was pretty funny so I’m not sure why she got so offended.

  17. Who is J? You guys just want to razz me, and I’m not old dude, just trying to make sense of shit.Christ If you saw me you would think I’m a kid. I mean I can read Rollo and take some stuff into acct. But Jesus you guys tough, ha, ha!!!!!

  18. Regent
    Look you guys don’t know me, and since it’s hard to describe the situation, online and outside of this milieu.

    We know about men, women and reality. Your situ is not that difficult to understand. Stop being a special snowflake and learn.

    Step 0: No butthurt. Not in real life and not on line.

  19. “”When I sit down to make a potriat… I’m usually alone, in my own head. Time just flies by and you don’t even notice it.
    You’re like… completely focused, and it’s like every bone in your body is working towards creating something. It’s a struggle, but I love it.””

    lol. Once she’s deeply immersed in the bubble you created…talking like this…in a slow relaxed deep voice…as you look at her with sexual eye contact….it’s pure chick crack….lol.

    “But FWIW, “girls coming up and opening him” is no big deal. You still need to have Game to take that initial spark of attraction (which can be easily replicated by going up to a girl and opening her with confident subcomms) and turn it into a lay.”

    yes. as I’ve often repeatedly said on here, “Looks get your foot in the door. Game converts that foot in the door to sex”

    “by “opening”, I mean a girl I don’t know at a club talks to me first – the excuse doesn’t matter – I don’t mean she walks up to me and says “you’re hot” (although that has happened a few times too)”

    yeah. The model girl that opened bacchus in his the imgur link I posted, didn’t go “omg your so hot, what’s your name?” she asked him if he knew any cool clubs in the area.

    You can increase the amount of girls that open you (or even throw you approach invitations) by looksmaxxing, controlling your facial expressions, and projecting a sexual state (i.e. good subcommunications). Maybe one of these days I’ll post a comprehensive lookmaxxing guide for y’all.

  20. Yes, please do post some looksmaxxing (😁) stuff. I hear you talk often about ” looksmaxxing “, and I know your fave pua sites are into it, but I don’t know what exactly it is, and I need to know is it the ghey.

    Sounds ghey af, but let’s see.

  21. @blax

    “I don’t know what exactly it is”

    oh? Man I knew you were old. but I didn’t know you suffered from dementia, dog. Here let me scroll up and repost the comment you wrote a couple hours ago to refresh your memory. Maybe write it down somewhere this time. so you’ll remember it better:

    “Like the make equivalent of an hb7, which is easy to be when most guys all dress exactly the same, and do nothing to appear ” better looking ” . It doesn’t take a whole lot to stand out from ” average ” dudes and gather more attention from females.”

  22. @culum ”But FWIW, “girls coming up and opening him” is no big deal. You still need to have Game to take that initial spark of attraction (which can be easily replicated by going up to a girl and opening her with confident subcomms) and turn it into a lay.”

    If that’s true, then maybe i’m not giving myself enough credit. If a girl opens me, or tells me i’m hot early one etc, then I have like a 95% record for banging the girl that night.

    I can close girls who are attracted to me. I can’t bang girls who aren’t. My lay count has shot up since I last posted here and it’s now respectable, but i’m yet to be convinced about ‘conversion’ game, tbh. I honestly feel like guys are out there banging girls who are already into them tbh (and they tell themselves it was their ‘game’)

    ANyway, @j, let us know when the site is up. I’ll stop by every few weeks

    later

  23. @scars

    “If a girl opens me, or tells me i’m hot early one etc, then I have like a 95% record for banging the girl that night.”

    Which doesn’t happen that often now does? lol. Especially with girls you actually want to fuck.

    Yeah game can’t help you if she thinks you’re ugly as sin+bad subcommunications, but game can help you when she’s on the fence about you.

    Fence about you (“umm he’s cute, but I don’t know”) /= thinks you’re ugly.

    Good way to find out, how she felt about you when you first approached her, is to literally ask her, post-sex, “what did you think about me, when I first approached you?” or “did you want to fuck me right away?” (This girl from earlier this year said “no” https://imgur.com/07v9Zpc)

    I find that, here is where you’ll get an honest answer.

  24. J

    “Waiting for them backwards rationalizations from them WIA fanboys. “dude like who cares what another man thinks is a 10”.”

    How would that be a backward rationalization?

  25. Re: looksmaxxing…😂… Just typing it makes me laugh.

    That’s why I legit want you to link some. I know what I said/meant, but young pua dudes have a whole other meaning to the simplest shit.

    For the record, I’m not talking about wearing tight pants and shiny shirts, or getting ghey haircuts or shaping eyebrows… You know, ghey shit.

    Nor am I taking about wearing 200 dollar t-shirts and 500 dollar jeans.

    That’s try hard. They harder a guy tries, the more he speaks about how soft and mushy his internals are.

  26. @Sentient

    So are those 10s or nah? Rhetorical 😆

    @blax

    “For the record, I’m not talking about wearing tight pants and shiny shirts, or getting ghey haircuts or shaping eyebrows… You know, ghey shit.

    Nor am I taking about wearing 200 dollar t-shirts and 500 dollar jeans.”

    ….should be obvious I’m not talking about any of that dumb shit. Apparently not.

  27. J

    Let’s say no. K

    ““Waiting for them backwards rationalizations from them WIA fanboys. “dude like who cares what another man thinks is a 10”.””

    How is this a backwards rationalization?

  28. Drop by any time, Regent. Reality will still be available.

    “If you can’t take the heat, stay out of the kitchen” — Harry Truman

  29. Hot off the back of that lay 2 weeks back there was only one target at the weeding in Prague (weekend just gone) who was just beautiful but I wasn’t able to get any attraction from her unfortunately so that was a wash-out.
    Tried my best with the teases and the DHV’s and what not, but she was never into it.
    At the time I regretted not being braver and not just escalating despite the lack of IOI’s from her but in hindsight (and after speaking to mutual friends) i’m pretty sure It wouldn’t have worked out anyway (I just wasn’t her type and she had the hots for the best man lol)

    Popped out last night for 2 beers to meet 2 people I met in that Prague trip who happen to live close – after 2 beers they left and I still had half a pint and there were 2 tables outside in the beer garden. One to my left, one to my right. Both tables with a hot girl and a less attractive friend.

    I decided to open the ones to my left simply because the target on that table was wearing an interesting jacket and I figured that would give me an opener lol (All I had for the other table was either ‘hi’ or maybe just a random opinion opener which I just don’t love using)

    I opened her and commented on how her jacket looks warm and asked whether it was ‘real yeti’ and both girls laughed. They asked where my friends had gone and I told them that I was just ‘3rd wheeling’ it and I was now alone.

    Then the hot one said ‘that’s usually me 3rd wheeling it with her! (points at her friend)’.

    I was like ”Awww…why are you single? Hard to live with?!” and she laughed and hit my arm and qualified herself a little and then I went into a short story about Prague.

    The targets friend told me to grab a eat and join them.

    We chatted for 10 mins. The friend was slightly more talkative and at a few points dropped small ‘matchmaker’ hints. I lightly flirted, slightly sexualised the convo and then the target added me on facebook.

    They’d came together and were leaving together and I wasn’t able to isolate her in that situation but I definitely sensed attraction. She’s older than I like (28 I think) but we’ve been chatting and she lives close so it’s another possible one for the future

  30. Ford IRL

    “girls are where you find them” (cough cough – Culum…)

    Concur. Nice example of being a normal guy who can speak to girls.

  31. @Sentient – noted. Now that I’m a bit more settled into my training, I’m starting to learn a bit more of the local language, so I can at least start interacting with the girls around me. Full conversations are a while away but at least I can have conversations in shops and restaurants and practice my nonverbals and lasering etc.

    @scars – indeed. That’s your blind spot. Everyone has one. Mine is that I struggle when I’m cold approaching to connect to the same attitude that gets me laid super consistently with online girls. Yours is that you seem to think “attraction” is some kind of fixed quantity that is decided when a girl first looks at you and cannot be changed after that…

  32. @ Regent

    What are your good guy friends ITL telling you about your situation these days?

    What’s their advice? What do you think of their advice?

  33. @ SJF

    Regent lacks basic discipline. All his credibility perches atop a triangle of ignorance, laziness and arrogance.

    Apart they aren’t too bad but together they are deadly.

  34. “All his credibility perches atop a triangle of ignorance, laziness and arrogance.”

    Lol.

    I’m having a hard time slogging through St. Augustine’s Confessions. So far, through the first four chapters is a reminiscence of Augie being ingnorant, lazy and arrogant up to the time he was 27 years old. And he seemed to have regretted that dearly. But someone helped him through that. And he writes about it in a comfortable tone. Like he’s at peace with his soul, at the time of writing the book.

  35. And one of the reasons I cultivated good friendships with red pill buddies was as an antidote to ignorance (blind spots), laziness (seeing them move forward with great strides), and arrogance.

    On the arrogance note, it is related to one of the 16 commandments:

    XI. Be irrationally self-confident

    No matter what your station in life, stride through the world without apology or excuse. It does not matter if objectively you are not the best man a woman can get; what matters is that you think and act like you are. Women have a dog’s instinct for uncovering weakness in men; don’t make it easy for them. Self-confidence, warranted or not, triggers submissive emotional responses in women. Irrational self-confidence will get you more pussy than rational defeatism.

    But more as a process to Game women. In Fake it till You Make it. Not with hubris and arrogance manufactured as a lie to yourself or your male buddies.

    True Humility (as opposed to False Humility) opens you up to being teachable, receptive to recieving correction, training and feedback.

  36. “True Humility (as opposed to False Humility) opens you up to being teachable, receptive to recieving correction, training and feedback.”

    Arrogance vs. certsinty…..

    Based upon most people’s sketchy understanding of the world and themselves, those acting with certainty (humility) are considered confident and arrogant to insecure types.

    People will not accept definitives. There’s always a need to build in wiggle room in their lives as they’re routinely unsure of their abilities and purpose.

    Purposeful, consequential, creative people are arrogant to the indecisive.

    Stop being indecisive = Be irrationally self-confident

    Acting on bad plan is better than acting no plan is better than inaction.

    Confidence with a plan is better than half-stepping or stasis.

  37. So this is an Irish all-woman group I’ve been watching on Youtube a lot over the last few days – I stumbled on them by accident and really liked them so have had them on a lot:

    I’ve been thinking about why I have such a strong visceral reaction to them. I mean sure, they’re attractive enough (and generally I go for this “type” in terms of looks) but they’re not amazingly hot or anything. The music is pleasant enough, but again, nothing amazing.

    But I have a powerful visceral attraction to them when watching this and I can only conclude that it’s because they’re just more feminine than most of the women I see (in real life or Youtube or wherever) .

    The “anti-Miley Cyrus” I guess.

    That femininity – sort of happy positive feminine energy – it’s like kryptonite. It’s also incredibly rare to see when I’m out in the field – why are more women not like this?

    I’ve only met a bare handful of women that have had this in all my time going out and dating (it’s not about looks, although obviously it’s better if they’re hotter). I’ve met lots of girls way hotter than these women – but they didn’t have this.

    The girl HABD calls my “Epiphany Girl” had it, a few years ago. A few more, but hardly any. It’s to the point where I even remember random 5 minute chats in clubs with girls that had it – it’s that powerful.

    Obviously I don’t know what they are really like in their private lives etc – I’m only talking here about my reaction to what I see presented on screen here..

    But there’s something in the “subcomms” there that I really respond strongly to, and I’m struggling to pin it down.

    By analogy – I’m assuming this is the equivalent of what women feel when they encounter authentic masculinity (as opposed to a guy who is good looking but not necessarily masculine) and the reaction is equally powerful. But also very rare to find.

    So we were talking about Grant Cardone and his daughters a few days ago – if I’m putting the pieces together correctly now, what Sentient and IRL etc were saying is that the problem with what he’s doing isn’t that the message is wrong, it’s that teaching them to do what they do on that video, doesn’t lead to THIS. It leads them to be more like boys. But then that begs the question, how do you teach girls to be like this?

    Or I seem to remember an old FR from Sentient – something about meeting a European model in a bar or something, having dinner with her and then taking her for a walk but couldn’t get her into his hotel..something like that. I can’t remember the details but I think he was saying similar stuff about her…

  38. Since looxsmaxxing got brought up, For anyone who read the RSD forums, ‘cowboy’ was the poster child lol
    Read all about ‘game’ and got rejection after rejection implementing all of the theory
    No joy.
    Got plastic surgery (jaw implants, otoplasty, chin implant, nose job and some other stuff. Lots of money)

    https://imgur.com/a/lIcMbvv

    Now he is somewhat of a slayer banging very hot young girls according to the pics he posted before RSD went down

    In fact, not only that, he actually ended up rejecting ‘game’ in terms of anyy technical stuff and feels it does him more harm than good lol (so no pushh/pull, or qualifying girls or negs or models in his head etc etc – although he admits to having mental health issues including anxiety which he now takes meds for, so maybe implementing theory was too much for him, although he doesn’t need it due to being able to skate by on looks. It’s a fun topic lol)

    I’m at a fairly good place now in terms of girls/game etc and do fairly well (and have lookxmaxxed but not the that degree), and do kind of feel that physical attraction is more necessary that we’re lead to believe, but I know many don’t agree, and that’s cool.

  39. Culum Palma

    Interesting topic.

    But there’s something in the “subcomms” there that I really respond strongly to, and I’m struggling to pin it down.

    Yes you are attracted to their base femininity, the polarity. I see it this way – after a long day of collecting mastodon meat or beating back raiders the ur-dude came back to the shelter and just wanted some care. A bit of food, a drink, maybe a compress on a bruise and chillax, maybe have his brood paraded before him as a helpful reminder of why he didn’t just take off for the next town. Some nurturing, caring etc.

    That is the ideal…

    https://img.playbuzz.com/image/upload/q_auto:good,f_auto,fl_lossy,w_480,c_limit/v1524018428/vmhdotjof4cwgwh2q0pq.png

    Not another battle at home. These girls radiate that kind of energy.

    Is it nature or nurture? I think you need both. There is no doubt in my mind that girls who come from impoverished areas display more feminine characteristics. Whether it is Asia, EE, Ireland etc. And the big winners from those areas have looks plus attitude.

    But then that begs the question, how do you teach girls to be like this?

    Now if the mom has these qualities, she can model them for her daughters. It doesn’t come from the dad, the dad however DOES reinforce the behavior via approval. So mom trains by example, dad judges and reinforces. Daughters can also be raised to show feminine nurturing sides by having younger siblings, and by jobs like babysitting and nannying.

    Really hot girls have the ability to have this kind of nature as well, because they don’t need to fight for anything, often they maintain a very pleasant demeanor, thinking everyone is treated like they are. The “bitchy 9” is more a myth and proof of a 7 than 9.

    [Culum that old FR is here https://therationalmale.com/field-reports-comment-page-2-comments/comment-page-42/#comment-216248%5D

    They’re traditional Southern Irish women that want to be women and don’t hate men.

    I’ll think it through in more detail, but most of them are like that over there.

    Cue stampede to Southern Ireland…

    +1 on Irish girls… The good news is there are more of them over here in the US than in Ireland. How to find them though? Again the demographics will help you, WC and LMC girls.

  40. Palma

    Agree some illustration would go a long way. Would be great if Cartoonist could do it, he has the perspective.

  41. Triggering IOIs on steroids.

    I wrote this guide with the following person in mind:

    you are between the age of 18-40 (inb4 “so you saying if I’m 17/41 this guide useless to me?”)

    you’re not dark skinned (black, indian guys with very dark skin, just skip the section on ‘tan glowy skin).

    you are at least 5’10” (http://blog.aaronsleazy.com/index.php/2019/08/11/the-ultimate-post-on-male-height/)

    Live in the USA (only because most of these are american products I believe).

    Intermediate level game: at least 50 cold approach lays. or basically you know what you’re doing for the most part. and can do most of it on autopilot.

    Why are IOIs money? Well IOIs get you preselection. See, by following everything in this guide, you’re gonna start getting a whole lotta IOIs from now on. So when you cold approach some random girl throwing you IOIs, other girls in the immediate environment, will see that you successfully cold approached some random girl (“wow that guy has balls!”). And she seems to really like you (“and she likes him!”). What she didn’t see, is that girl you approached was throwing you really obvious IOIs (so in reality, it was a very low risk move lol). But it doesn’t matter because it still triggers the preselection effect. So now that girl (who may have not been throwing you IOIs/or even noticed you before) will definitely be keeping her eye on you, throughout the night. And will be more receptive, if you were to approach her.

    Consistent compliments I’ve received over the past couple of months since really getting into looksmaxxing, from people who knew me before I started: my skin, hair, facial hair, muscles (been asked if I’m on steroids lol), how I smell. So I know this shit works.

    Everything in this guide is all stuff I own and use.

    Because there are a billion links in this post I will be spacing the word that comes after the “.” from the link (ex: sleazy. pua. com), so that my post gets through. just backspace the word back to the “.” to view the link.

    Alright, without further ado lets begin with supplements

    SUPPLEMENTS

    Supplement companies to buy from:

    Nature made, NOW, Carlson, Doctor’s best, and Swanson.

    *Some supplements here may be repeated more than once because they serve multiple purposes *

    Healthy Youthful Looking Skin

    20mg daily of MK-677 from PureRawz (other uses: rapid muscle growth (so money), increased hunger)
    Vitamin C 1000mg
    Glycine 1000mg
    1 tbsp of Verisol Collegen Bioactives Peptides

    Tan glowly skin

    10mg of Astaxanthin
    25,000 IU of Beta Carotene

    Strong Bones + Testosterone

    1000mg of Calcium

    Supplements to ensure it goes to the correct areas within your body, and hence get the most use:

    2000 IU of Vitamin D-3 (IU amount depends on your skin. the darker you are, the higher IU you need)
    5mg of Vitamin K2 (supposedly helps jawline. Not sure. my jaw was already pretty good before I started taking Vit K-2. I also chew gum pretty much everyday)
    30mg of Zinc
    200mg of Magnesium Glycinate

    Relaxed good mood (important for pickup). High Serotonin + Low cortisol

    Increasing Serotonin:

    2000 IU of Vitamin D-3
    100mg of Vitamin B6
    3 x week of 1400mg EPA&480 of DHA Omega 3

    Reducing Cortisol:

    2 glasses of Water (it makes it easier to get yours glass for the day, if you mix that tablespoon of Collegen Bioactives Peptides into your water). Then anytime you’re thirsty, get one more glass. i know a lot of guys don’t like drinking water for lack of flavor, but what helps me, is adding a coulple of ice cubes into the water. I don’t know. cold water with ice cubes just taste better for me. Use whatever method you can to get yourself to get that daily water intake).

    Daily 3-3-3 meditation (www. seduction .com/blog/3-3-3-meditation-why-its-important)

    Daily cold showers

    PERSONAL CARE

    Not recommending an exercise program you can follow your own (As some of you know, I’ve been on Kinobody’s warrior shredding program for over a year now. But I don’t recommend going down into the single digit body fat range for the reason Sleazy talks about here: blog. aaronsleazy. com/index.php/2017/01/05/dont-bother-getting-body-fat-down-to-sub-10-levels/).

    FACE
    * Facial Cleanser: Rugged & Dapper’s Face Wash
    * Lips: Burts Bees – Wild Cherry
    * Beard: Rogaine 5% Minoxidil foam (doing this for a full year and you will have a beard if you can’t grow one. There are probably better youtube channels on this, but this is the one I consulted www. youtube. com/user/Mastervds/featured)

    HAIR
    * Shampoo: Tea Tree Special Shampoo
    * Conditioner: Baxter of California Conditioner
    * Prestyle: OGX Moroccan Argan Oil
    * Hold: Blind Barber’s 90 Proof Pomade

    BODY
    * Moisturizer: Lust in the Dust body lotion by outlaw soaps. sandalwood.
    * Body wash: Everyman Jack Sandalwood (sandalwood is an aphrodisiac)

    SCENT
    * Deodorant: Mitchum unscented roll-on (lasts forever. been using it for 2 years)
    * Salux Nylon Japanese Beauty Skin Bath Wash Cloth (you’ll never need to buy another one. because it washes itself when you use it).
    * Cologne: Dior Sauvage 10ml travel size (purchased in january. still going strong).

    For hairstyle I like to keep it simple with a side part. tapered on the sides.

    https://www.styleswardrobe.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/04/mens-tapered-haircut.jpg

    taper > fade tbh

    For best beard trimmer, electric tooth brush. sunscreen and hair dryer, bath towel and other essentials with regards to personal appearance, consult – TheWirecutter’s personal care section. They’re sole purpose is to extensively test out the most highly reviewed products, and select the best out of the bunch for you. Pretty neat.

    thewirecutter. com/health-fitness/personal-care/

    CLOTHES

    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1mhOIpjUUibBf3QueJs8iRJy5gBKCILq82ekJkiC5uqQ/edit#gid=0

    A user on reddit’s r/malefashionadvice complied this spreadsheet, which features the best stores to buy certain items at certain price points.

    for example:

    blazers for $ get them at X stores.
    blazers for $$ get them at Y stores.
    blazers for $$$ get them at Z stores.

    That being said, here are my stores to buy everything at

    BEMJU:

    Banana Republic Factory
    Everlane
    Massimo Dutti (Mango for EuroCels)
    J. Crew
    Uniqlo

    Solid/graphic shirts

    Everlane and Banana Republic. I like the T-shirts these companies make because they fit me really well. good material. and low price. I personally like to wear these shirts tucked in because I think they look better that way. And I like that traditional Marlon Brando, James Dean, Steve McQueen look tbh:

    i. warosu. org/data/fa/img/0093/13/1420754891453.jpg

    i. pinimg. com/originals/3e/cd/db/3ecddbe4272830ec5e2329341786c03e.jpg

    especially if you’ve got some muscle.

    Patterned Shirts

    IMO, J Crew offers the best patterned shirts at an affordable price.

    Chinos

    I like the Mason Athletic fit at Banana Republic. Got them in Khaki, Navy and Black. Super cheap buying them at Banana Republic Factory.

    Shoes

    i pretty much wear these 90% of the time I go out clubbing:

    media. gq. com/photos/5583bb1f09f0bee564420f52/master/w_1280%2Cc_limit/style-blogs-the-gq-eye-Jack-Erwin-jack-monk-635.jpg

    Cause they go well with all my pants. Unfortunately Jack Erwin doesn’t sell these single strap monk shoes anymore, but you can shop around for something similar (take a look at the spreadsheet).

    PHEROMONES

    Comprehensive writeup to get you Red Pilled on Pheromones:

    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/485166152595537920/488506996920680458/Cognosc_SB_Pheromone_Write_Up.pdf

    I personally wear Bad Wolf + Max T150.

    For those who know, know 😉

    MISCELLANOUS

    Voice

    I receive lots of complements on my voice when i speak Spanish. little do these bitches know, that’s not how I normally used to speak it. See the way I speak, was influenced by watching how other Spanish guys who girls viewed as sexy spoke. I simply adopted that speaking style. I learned this neat trick, back in 2016 when I was going through RSDMax’s The Natural. I used to watch his videos so many times, that I soon found myself even beginning to speak like Max with his Austrian accent lol. But yeah. If you want a sexy voice, just listen to guys who girls think are sexy. Soon enough you’ll find yourself, unconsciously beginning to start speaking that way too.

    Which delves nicely into the next, subject:

    Facial expressions

    All credit for the way I look and smile at girls naturally, goes to watching Marlon Brando in Streetcar named desire, and James Franco in his early stuff (Freaks&Geeks, Spiderman 3, and Sonny).

    and finally…

    Posture

    I’ll leave you guys with this comment by Alek Novy

    blog. aaronsleazy. com/index.php/2018/05/30/why-women-like-men-in-suits/#comment-13185

    “Here’s some positive news for average height guys though. If you’re 5’10, you can appear 6’0 to people. It’s simple and nobody does it.
    It’s called posture and no I’m not kidding. I’m 5’10 and no girl ever believes me… not even my 6’1 friends who claim I can’t possibly be shorter than them. About 99% of the population has horrible posture and that makes them look shorter. No, posture won’t make you taller. But it makes them look shorter.

    When a woman thinks of a 6’0 guy, about 99% of the ones she’s met had bad posture. That’s her idea of how tall 6’0 is. A 5’10 with good posture is just as tall standing in the same room as the 6’0 guy who has bad posture.”

  42. Free Looksmaxxing Guide–worth every penny you pay for it!

    Clip random laissez faire hair in nose and ears…wash your shit stained boxers so that they’re clean before going out…if you don’t have time, douse your boxers in cologne and deodorant
    Check up from the neck up…you’re the life of the party and you’re bringing the party with you…of course, the neighbors may call the cops on you, so be ready to bug out at a moment’s notice…
    Stand tall…head back, chest out, belly in, smiling big so that people can see your awesome buck teeth
    Walk with a spring in your step and a bit of a swagger…(wiggling ears is optional)
    Look girls and men in the eye, briefly, then look away without dropping your gaze…every now and then smile suddenly and warmly at people you run into…tell girls that you’re gay, but you’re open to letting them switch you straight
    Shake hands warmly and slap man friends on the back and punch them on the arm or gently in the gut…if they grab your cock, you’ve gone to the wrong bar…bug out…
    Pull friends in to you…you hug girls while holding them around the waist/back…kiss them behind the ear if you feel like it…avoid frenching too soon
    Drink until you can’t stand up…you don’t wanna look tipsy!

  43. Field Report

    Person of interest: College student front desk girl (FDG) at my hotel

    I checked in to the hotel with family and she was the sweetest and most helpful hotel person I’ve ever run into. FDG met my requests within five minutes of asking them. Daughter Gamer thought that she was really sweet. I asked FDG about places to dance and she came up with something on a Mon/Tues–which seemed weird–and she steered me towards that place…we chatted a bunch and FDG paints and cooks…has her own apt….not old enough to drink legally…when I told FDG that we were leaving the next day, she dropped her gaze and looked somber…I thought that she might be aiming for a nanny gig with us, but FDG doesn’t have time for it

  44. @Culum: you bring a very interesting topic. I can’t say the women in the clip you posted really did it for me (although I would definitely be interested in the brunette – despite the age, and the red head violinist), but they do display something… Alluring.

    I think I get that vibe from Susanna Hoffs:
    https://giphy.com/gifs/80s-music-bangles-susanna-hoffs-v8xmVfox6XOq4

    I definitely got that vibe from a girl I had a major crush in high school (I had One-itis for her for quiiite a while).

  45. @IAS – yeah, it’s interesting isn’t it? The way you have a response but can’t pin down the reasons for the response?

    Susannah Hoff is attractive but I don’t react to her the same way. It’s also personal to some extent I think. As for the women in my video – they are cute, but they are actually not all that beautiful – that was exactly why I was puzzled because I reacted so strongly to them (yes, I think the brunette is the best of the lot – I just googled her and she’s just turned 30, so not that old – also looks like she was smart enough to get married at 27, just before hitting the wall..).

    The band appears to be some kind of ensemble group of Irish female singers, and the membership changes a lot over the years if you watch their older videos (the one I linked is one of the newest) over the last ten years. Whoever set it up clearly has an eye for a very specific type of woman to join the group – they are all in that mid twenties to mid thirties range (not teens or early twenties – I wonder why) and all have that kind of smiling, pleasant feminine vibe and they are all above average looking, but not stunning.

    @Palma & @Sentient – I hadn’t really thought of Irish women as being in the same economic category as Eastern Europeans and that having an influence. I thought Ireland was quite affluent. Hmm (I never got this vibe with EE women incidentally – I’ve been with a few and the coldness puts me off – it does go away when you break through the initial facade but somehow they don’t particularly do anything for me).

    Also interesting just how rare that “base femininity” is. I didn’t realize till I saw these videos. It’s part of sexuality but kind of like another layer on top. Yes I want to bang hot girls, but this is kind of part of that but on top of it.

    I know YaReally had some posts about how when he talks to younger (early 20s) girls these days, it is so rare for them to actually experience masculinity and a strong frame that many of them freeze up and get confused because they literally don’t understand what is happening and why this man is making them feel this way and why they just feel they like it so much – because they have never encountered it before and simply don’t know how to react.

    If the reaction is anything like mine to the few women I’ve met like this (or even to these videos), then I can relate -it certainly took me by surprise – and I’m a lot older than them. Masculinity must be even more endangered in that early 20s demographic..

  46. I mean, look at this video for example (from the Pitch Perfect movie):

    By any objective standard, these women are way hotter than the Irish girls (err..except Rebel Wilson). They are at least as good at singing.

    But just…nothing. No reaction from me. I mean they’re sexy – I’d bang them. But just zero visceral reaction to them compared to the Irish girls.

    I know it’s the “base femininity” thing Sentient talked about, but I find it interesting I can’t pin it down to anything specific – it’s just the vibe and energy from them.

  47. lol. If you want “femininity” then make her feminine (hint: they all have it inside them. Its natural. It’s just a matter of them not wanting to act that way because they haven’t found the right guy to surrender to). I find the challenge of turning bitches into girly girls fun tbh. And besides. Those feminine nice girls are usually boring as fuck lol. Getting a girl with an actually personality to start embracing her feminine side around you, gets you the best of both worlds.

  48. “feminine” and “fun” are not mutually exclusive. And “feminine” doesn’t mean “stupid” either. Just as “masculine” doesn’t necessarily mean “big, dumb jock whose vocabulary is limited to grunting”.

    But yes, it’s possible of course for a girl to become more feminine, just as it is possible for a man to strengthen his frame and become more masculine. It’s just hard work and most girls these days a) don’t understand what femininity means; and b) don’t see the value in it anyway for many reasons discussed in this blog.

  49. ““feminine” and “fun” are not mutually exclusive. And “feminine” doesn’t mean “stupid” either.”

    Never said it was…

    This that feminine vibe you after right?

    https://st4.depositphotos.com/11717765/20743/i/1600/depositphotos_207431020-stock-photo-feminine-woman-portrait-of-young.jpg

    “It’s just hard work”

    not really.

    “and most girls these days don’t understand what femininity means”

    Sure they do. They will embrace that side of them once they meet the right guy. Then they go from this:

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5f/Madison_Beer_2019_by_Glenn_Francis.jpg/440px-Madison_Beer_2019_by_Glenn_Francis.jpg

    to this:

    https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/616535488535490560/6xPYplId_400x400.jpg

  50. Field Report — being a gypsy puts a damper on social life, but being with family is still cool

    I didn’t go out last night. I got a total of 9 hours of sleep the last two nights and was just too tired. I was too busy catching up from all the traveling to take a nap. On the plus side, I got to play with the baby a lot and that was a thrill. It’s a kick when the little girl brings a book over to grandpa and wants to sit in his lap and read it with him. The feeling is a lot like the release of orgasm.

  51. ” Getting a girl with an actually personality to start embracing her feminine side around you, gets you the best of both worlds.”

    “Getting a girl who has believed the blue pill bullshit of feminism to start embracing her feminine side around you, gets you the best of both worlds.”

    fify

  52. Culum, I was dancing with a high school girl who was out with her parents–teaching her how to dance. She was wearing a skirt and was new to dancing, yet could follow me just fine, even though she was being a dork and looking at her feet. This girl obviously was quite comfortable being a girl and showed it by the way she followed.

  53. Hello. Can anyone here direct me to the post, where the big debate about looks took place here with Yareally and other veteran commenters and also the thread where Yareally was expressing the difference between Roosh and the RSD way of Game. Thank you.

  54. YaReally 2015:

    “Guys who dress up WILL get some initial head-turns, dance invites, girls opening them, etc. (aka Approach Invites) but those ultimately mean NOTHING”

    If by “NOTHING” he meant you’ll be viewed as socially and sexually acceptable to fuck for taking pride in your outer appearance (+ working out), then ya. It means absolutely NOTHING. (https://www.girlschase.com/content/social-acceptability-and-sexual-acceptability-dating)

    “Let this sink in: Your game that lets you TURN those Approach Invites into LAYS is what’s important”

    Ya but what got you those Approach invites/Indicators of Interest in the first place? Oh ya. Being above her looks threshold (YES/MAYBE girl). (Sperg alert: Doesn’t mean you HAVE to wait for Approach Invites to approach a girl who views you as above her looks threshold. But you can tell right away if she’s a NO girl).

    “…but if you HAVE the game TO turn those Approach Invites into lays, then you don’t NEED those Approach Invites to lay those girls.”

    No you don’t NEED AIs. But if you’re ugly to her:

    http://giphygifs.s3.amazonaws.com/media/KZvT5AWF4ADAI/giphy.gif

    Then it doesn’t matter if you “HAVE the game TO turn those approach invites to lays”. Not happening (maybe somewhere down the line several months/years from now, but not tonight, bruh).

  55. @J

    Thanks. What do you recommend for an absolute beginner? I am looking to start off with daytime. I am such a beginner that I am starting with just asking women directions. And working on one thing at a time.

  56. @passerby

    I’d recommend joining Ultimate Man Project’s facebook group. They just finished writing a book which covers both night and day game. Once you’re in the group, you can put your pre-order in. Or wait for me to share a torrent over here like in about a month or something. When I was a beginner, I got a lot of value out of watching infields to give me a feel for what pickup looks like. Only guy I’d recommend is JP who is Todd’s assistant. His infield’s in Todd’s program, The System, are good shit.

  57. @j

    I am not doing nightgame consistently due to me just starting Uni and have to work part time. Any specific resources for that? I have just come across LDM with Yad, Krauser etc. Any alternative approaches to daygame. Roosh’s daybang seems something I could start off with. I was looking at Fearless Man youtube channel and got the progressive desensitization to approaching by asking directions and then moving on to other things

  58. @passerby

    “Any specific resources for that?”

    For NightGame I’d recommend Saul Tee’s Technical Game Bible:

    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/463682009089179648/547063045067636746/TGB.pdf

    Stay away from London Daygamers and Roosh. Their game is shit. Like I said, I’d wait for UMP’s book for specifics on daygame (if you get Todd’s The System, there’s several infields of both Todd and JP breaking down their (and their students) day game insta-dates which are good for beginners to see). I know those guys have good game. I’d recommend Bacchus’s daygame stuff to you, but he’s stuff is for more advanced players.

  59. @Palma –

    Pictures/video get inserted (aka “embedded”) automatically if you cut and paste the link directly to the video or picture into your post.

  60. Right, let’s go, a bunch of comments:

    @TantumErgo – your link is to the original forum post about the Secret Society many years ago by Tyler. It’s the first articulation of the idea, where he first coins the term. It’s absolutely legit, but it’s been expanded on and explained many times over the years by Tyler himself and others (and in Youtube etc), including by our own YaReally.

    I’m sure you get this, but just in case for lurkers etc – there is of course not a literal secret society that all women and 2% of men belong to. It’s about a particular mindset that almost all women and a small minority of women share.

    @passerby – there was more than one looks debate with YaReally and @j posted one of them (it was a popular topic – still is). But the “big one” – the Great Looks Debate which basically flogged that subject to death till it was deader than a dead horse etc, was in this thread (it goes on and on but by the end every conceivable argument has been argued repeatedly – all that is left is for you to decide which side you find more convincing – I personally agree with YaReally and Scray 100%. The discussion starts early on – particularly by Scray, but really kicks off around page 4 when HABD says something similar to Scray, and then YaReally jumps in in a big way after a few posts by HABD and Rollo):

    https://therationalmale.com/2016/05/06/good-girls-bad-girls/

    As for Roosh – not quite sure which discussion you’re talking about. YaReally talked about him many times (usually to make fun of him) – is there a particular subject or post?

    In terms of newbie resources, I don’t know anything about Ultimate Man etc. Todd is legit and very good. JP (who works for Todd) is an excellent PUA, but his style is different from Todd – depends whether you respond more to Todd’s analytical personality or JP’s Natural flow. The best resource I can suggest is YaReally’s own “Newbie Guide” with Newbie resources he recommended as of 2016 (note that Todd’s The System wasn’t released when YaReally made his post, but in general I think you’ll do just fine with Ya’s recommendations):

    https://www.reddit.com/r/yareally/comments/5pi5fv/newbie_guide_as_of_september_3rd_2016/

  61. @theasdgamer: question does not compute. My definition of “femininity” (in this context) is basically that it makes me respond in a particular way. If I respond in that way to a woman then she is by definition feminine – there is no question of “faking” it. Or to put it another way it doesn’t matter if she’s doing it consciously or unconsciously – she’s still feminine.

    @j:

    You’re basically saying that femininity is inherent in women and will come out in the right circumstances (ie, for the right man).

    Well..kind of.

    Yes, the instincts are inherent but a lot of women simply don’t understand them or what to do to express themselves in that way. They have the instincts and feelings but have no training in how to apply it, no model to emulate. Sure, they can still try to do what they can do, but the less exposure they’ve had to it, the worse they’ll do to it.

    It’s kind of like saying all men have the inherent instincts of an African savannah warrior and the drive to fight or whatever. Sure, that’s true, but if you have no experience of fighting, have never been in a fight or trained in how to fight, you’ll do pretty badly at fighting.

    As for the Approach Invites post – just for the benefit of any lurkers here since I know I won’t convince @j – the flaw is that there is no looks threshold: it’s not a question of “you use Game if you’re above her looks threshold and she lets you talk to her and gives you a chance” (which is what @j is saying) – the point is that irrespective of your looks, if you approach her with the right DHV (the right subcomms, social proof etc), she will talk to you and respond to you, and then you get the chance to apply the rest of your Game etc. There is no question of being dismissed solely on looks, unless you also screwed up your DHV/social proof/subcomms etc (to repeat YaReally – I’m NOT saying good looks don’t help you – just that they aren’t necessary).

  62. @Culum

    “You’re basically saying that femininity is inherent in women and will come out in the right circumstances (ie, for the right man).”

    yes. And as for as long as you remain the right man, she’ll stay that way:

    https://i.pinimg.com/originals/57/e0/60/57e060da64f4cd527621eac415594325.jpg

    Just don’t be foolish enough to marry a girl who’s been a slut for most of her life. She ain’t the right girl for that:

    http://i.imgur.com/rrLe319.jpg

    But hey, if its feminine behavior you after, you can certainly get that from her while you’re together.

    “It’s kind of like saying all men have the inherent instincts of an African savannah warrior and the drive to fight or whatever. Sure, that’s true, but if you have no experience of fighting, have never been in a fight or trained in how to fight, you’ll do pretty badly at fighting.”

    shit analogy. Yes, like masculinity, we all have that drive to fight when someone pisses us off. Thats instinct. But that doesn’t mean we are born with god-level fighting skills at birth. That’s a skill.

    Wanting to be loving, affection, submissive is feminine INSTINCT. Not skill. If she can see how behaving that way around you, and doing what you tell her to do (how to dress, cook, do your laundry etc.), pleases you, then she will realize (again this is if she’s had no training/models to emulate. Girls that have been trained properly already know how to keep their men pleased) that this is something she will want to keep doing. If I act like X, I get Y. And I really like Y, so I’m gonna keep acting like X. Keep reinforcing X behavior in her over the long haul, and it sticks.

    “There is no question of being dismissed solely on looks, unless you also screwed up your DHV/social proof/subcomms etc”

    https://i.imgur.com/E0xQm9R.jpg

    “Bro stop fucking worrying about fixing your looks lol. Your subcommunications are just off. That’s the only reason why she rejected you. Come on lets keep getting rejected approaching”.

    BTW, when you hear guys say they know an indian guy who slay white girls, they aren’t talking about guys that look like deepak over here. They’re talking about guys who look more like this:

    https://www.newfrenzy.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/34013911_10156924098557565_1481932290291400704_n.jpg

    ya know? Tall and lookmaxxed to death + game.

    “I’m NOT saying good looks don’t help you – just that they aren’t necessary”

    lol.

  63. Women are told that being feminine is catering to patriarchy and hurts women. Women have been brainwashed in this regard and thus they often try to tone down any inherent femininity and consciously try to appear masculine.

    “My definition of “femininity” (in this context) is basically that it makes me respond in a particular way. If I respond in that way to a woman then she is by definition feminine – there is no question of “faking” it. Or to put it another way it doesn’t matter if she’s doing it consciously or unconsciously – she’s still feminine.”

    …it doesn’t matter…except when it does…you want to avoid getting played by golddiggers…and you want to get desire sex…so you really want to find out if a woman’s appearance of femininity is real or a ruse…there are some tomboys who will consciously make an effort to be more feminine because they know that men like girly girls, especially when they are focused on one man. But they aren’t running a ruse….

    As for ugly men…women always respond to masculinity and you can up your chances simply by behaving in a traditionally masculine way. Also, you can use preselection to make yourself more attractive to women whom you would normally think are out of your league. Here’s how this works…

    There will always be some women who will give you free IOIs. You approach them and get them giggling and chasing you. Then, girls with somewhat higher SMV will notice and give you free IOIs. You approach them and get them giggling and chasing you. Rinse and repeat.

  64. @j

    I know an Indian guy much, much uglier than “Deepak” whose face looks like 20 miles of bad road and whose features are a little “off” and who’s slaying it…because he’s really dominant…girls like masculinity…

  65. @theasdgamer – I’ll say it one more time – femininity (in the sense described here) cannot be faked. It is defined by its effect. If the effect is there, the femininity is there. Doesn’t matter if it is conscious or unconscious, doesn’t matter if the girl is not usually like that and she’s only acting like that for you (see j’s post on this point).

    What you’re saying is kind of like asking if someone is faking being good at basketball. You can’t “fake” it. If you can consistently sink the 3-pointers like Curry, then by definition you are good at basketball.

    @j – the looks stuff is just flat out wrong. I’ve had this discussion before so I’m not repeating myself. I’ll just add one thing:

    I don’t look too different from the guy in your first picture and I do just fine (no, I don’t look quite as bad as him, but I’m not that far off – certainly I’m a million miles away from the second guy). However, I don’t look like life fucked me in the ass and like I’m about to go tie a noose around my neck after the picture is taken – which is the real difference between those two guys – aka subcomms.

  66. Oh and PS – my analogy about femininity was spot on. Femininity is an instinct, but expressing it is a skill. You need both (or as Sentient called it “nature” and “nurture” in his earlier post).

    Ever been with an inexperienced girl who desperately wanted to please you but didn’ tknow how to give a good blow job?

    It’s not that different.

  67. In fact, let me repost this here from the old Looks thread – it’s one of HABD’s posts which summarizes the key points in about 1/10th of the space YaReally did.

    We didn’t really need to have 500 comments arguing the point after this post from HABD, because he nailed it, but this kind of belief is pretty core to some people’s identity (such as our own single-letter-username poster) and it’s hard to change someone’s mind if his self-identity depends on believing it.

    Anyway here’s HABD:

    “having a bad dayOFFLINE
    @scray
    @Andy
    @Rollo

    ‘for me, ex, if i’m short, off the bat, there’s negative norms associated with me, so i need to roll in and DHV to erase that perception and change it.

    if a lot of positive social norms and pressure comes with my look, then it will make my frame stronger, which will make things easier for me, too.’

    and

    @scray

    I get what you’re saying. But when a poor short skinny-fat ugly balding dude can land models and celebrities? From my perspective that means looks don’t matter.

    from Rollo
    ‘Good looks are not a handicap to overcome. Game and practicing it is vitally important. Affluence is not a necessary component to getting laid, but it often seems so when men observe women’s attraction responses to it.’

    i think this overall effect is the same principle as what happens in ‘peacocking’… you ping as ‘alpha stud’ when you defy social expectations of how you ‘should be’… (provided you can hold your frame, of course…lol)

    so, looks matter to the extent that you can use that (social ‘conformity’ = a guy she is ‘supposed to like’) to get some initial attraction/IOIs…but that initial attraction isn’t going to carry the bang…lol… but it will put you into beta orbiter status a lot easier…lol

    and so being ‘fit’ is both easier (bc you have some amount of time to open/get in set)… and harder (bc you are going to have to work more at drawing some shit tests (to show your internals) and hold your frame better, so you can convince her hindbrain to go all in…lol… (and not just for ‘provisioning sex’…lol)… and you are going to have to calibrate better bc a girl might not feel like she ‘deserves’ you (so her ASD will ping as a potential pump and dump…)

    and she’ll want to see you as actually LTR material, bc that’s what disney tells her is going to happen…lol

    whereas somebody like Tyler isn’t ‘conventionally handsome’ (lol), so just his APPROACHING a hot girl is going to draw the initial shit test… AND show his internals a lot faster than a chad thundercock… and he can just keep pushing the alpha fux angle (without much pullback calibration…) bc the girl isn’t thinking about him as a potential BF…it’s just a straight up hindbrain-sanctioned ‘genetic dump’…lol…

    BUT…then, if you are fit, the issue becomes NOT letting the FI push you into a ‘traditional’ (beta provider) role… since that is a girl’s default setting and the FI’s goal… where ‘nice guys’ end up…

    and why wouldn’t she want to settle down with a Forge, er i mean, a chad thundercock…lol…

    so, the looks and money get ‘attraction’ from girls… but game gets you to ‘desire’…

    good luck!”

  68. One more single-post explanation of “Looks Matter” again saying almost the same thing as HABD and YaReally, this time from our own @IRL (from a different thread, not the Mega Looks Thread).

    I’m reposting these because these posts deserve the exposure and get the point across in some ways better than YaReally (who hammered every point into the ground, but many people simply don’t have the patience to follow his walls of text):

    “The ‘looks’ thing… Why argue? Lol…
    TL;DR looks matter only if there’s nothing else that spikes her RAS stronger… Don’t make them matter.
    It’s exactly like verbals and all sort of subcomms… Like everything coming to the brain from the environment… Some of it won’t register, some will spike/excite a well localized tangible thought or emotion, and some will induce a hardly noticeable background state that shifts the mood ever so slightly… Positive, negative or neutral association… or just ‘nothing’ below a threshold… Lasting only a fraction of a second or decaying slowly… Ahhh women… The stimulus/trigger is just a detail… be it a word, a gesture, a reaction of/to the environment, a prop different than anything around… or appearance… Shake that emotional soup…
    Looks are an obvious, very first ‘straight in the face’ cue that contributes to the overall perception of who you might be and how you may meet girl’s social, emotional and physical needs (based on her preconceptions)… Not only are we genetically ‘molded’ to notice looks, but also socially conditioned to pay attention to them. Therefore, good looks ping off as something ‘positive’, average as ‘neutral’ and bad looks, or even worse “ugly and ungroomed, unhealthy”, as ‘negative’. Here +, 0 and – are just simplified concepts of how a stimulus triggers/sets the trajectory of emotional associations that follow… How your mind’s complex strings resonate after this or that touch…
    So of course your ‘looks’ can make your approach warm… or ‘Ice Queen’ cold…

    It’s like asking whether your bad breath matters… lol… duh…

    Actually… Bad breath trumps looks! Boom! Looks don’t matter! Lol… but I’m not joking.
    The thing is… looks are just one of many stimuli that her brain is bombarded with. Above some very low threshold, looks don’t register that strongly as other factors that could induce plenty of more intensive thoughts and emotions and basically take over the overall perception… That’s why YaReally was talking about ‘Predator vision’ and not perceiving details, just an emotional ‘blob’ of how you make her feel in the interaction (good or bad… doesn’t matter)… Nb. we’re getting close to the magical ‘laminal space’ where so many things just don’t register beyond the actual ‘bubble’… lol
    And this is also why the conclusion should be… looks don’t matter… at the same time. They just determine (to a relatively small degree compared to other stuff) how ‘cold’ or ‘warm’ her reception of you is from the get go (but also where your mindset starts at in the ‘looks’ scale compared to her). If you always start from +1 degree higher than other guys… you may get used to relying on the head start… but get stuck when this little detail is missing (no grooming, no gym for a few weeks, green spots and unicorns on your dick… whoops I should get it checked… lol). A mental feedback loop to the value of ‘looks’ can either fuck you up (when no ‘good looks’) or… fuck you up (when ‘good looks’ temporarily missing/not enough compared to another reference). An HB9/HB10’s RAS can easily notice the little difference, ‘hair thin’ imbalance in your Frame.
    I’d say it’s all about leveling the field and topping it up with things resulting in positive reinforcements for her attraction. No need to tickle her RAS with negative triggers. Yes, do take care of your looks, your social proof, your money. But know you can overdo it (too expensive grooming, clothes etc. and you’re risking ending up in the provider territory). My rule of thumb is just get some of it to a neutral level (so no negative pings) and focus on improving your game and things that can build your long term overall happiness. Social circle game, money or good looks could actually make access to poosy too easy… and then we’re back to “are you actually running game”?
    Sometimes it’s good to remove some of it and see if you can step your game up.”

  69. Meanwhile… Palma wrote and published a book in what four days?

    THAT my friends is the difference between “hustle” fraudsters and the real deal.

    Good Luck man. I expect you will find some 💸

  70. @Culum

    already debunked @IRL’s post here:

    https://therationalmale.com/2019/02/27/the-global-sexual-marketplace/comment-page-3/#comment-270955

    now lets debunk @HABD’s post

    Disclaimer: what I’m about to say is really mean, but necessary. All <3

    “so, looks matter to the extent that you can use that (social ‘conformity’ = a guy she is ‘supposed to like’) to get some initial attraction/IOIs”

    yeah. Or you look like someone she’s hooked up with in the past.

    “…but that initial attraction isn’t going to carry the bang…lol”

    Mostly agree. Sometimes girls will do all the work lol.

    “… but it will put you into beta orbiter status a lot easier…lol”

    Ok now we start with the bullshit? Really Culum. You believe this garbage. Being good looking makes it a lot easier for her to put you in the beta orbiter status rather than making it a lot easier for her to hook up with you? smh.

    With regards to conformity. See reputation is what its all about with young girls. So, when you conform to what they are expected to want/suppose to like, you get what Chase, calls “he makes me look good” points. She’ll want to be around you. Because you look good, you’re tall, you’re in shape, you got a nice haircut, well dressed, she gains socially when people see her flirting with you. And best of all, her friends will leave her alone with you (unless you start doing some weird uncalibrated RSD shit) instead of actively trying to sabotage your set. It pays to look good.

    “being fit… and harder (bc you are going to have to work more at drawing some shit tests (to show your internals)”

    More bullshit. And I feel like this is the reason Culum refuses to work out. I mean I get why YaReally provoked shit tests (so he could pass them, and spike her BT). But there’s really no need lol. If she shit tests you, then just pass it lol. There are other more efficient ways to build compliance (the goal here) than drawing shit tests.

    “a girl might not feel like she ‘deserves’ you (so her ASD will ping as a potential pump and dump…)”

    See my post on getting ‘investment’ from her (or read Saul Tee’s book). Its for her to feel like she deserves me because she poured all this deep emotionally rich information about herself. Which makes her feel like I know her at a deep level. #ConnectionGame. “he ain’t a player after all” [insert fingers crossed emoji].

    “and she’ll want to see you as actually LTR material, bc that’s what disney tells her is going to happen…lol”

    No. This is what setting a sexual frame (via sex talk, sex stories, nonjudgemental frames, proximity, bedroom eye contact) is for. Which has nothing to do with being good looking and fit. Literally just gets you passed the looks threshold. Being ugly to her, will not let you advance to this stage of the seduction.

    “whereas somebody like Tyler isn’t ‘conventionally handsome’ (lol), so just his APPROACHING a hot girl is going to draw the initial shit test…”

    Yeah he’ll pass her initial shit test. And that’ll get a “heh” from here. Then she’ll proceed to give him nothing else to work with. Until one of her friends sees him not going away, then steps in to tell him to fuck off.

    “bc the girl isn’t thinking about him as a potential BF”

    ….she isn’t thinking of him as a potential fuck either. More entertainer for the night.

    Y’all gotta understand that most of Tyler’s 50 lays from 2002-2012 didn’t come from cold approach. But from social circle game and bisexual girlfriend game. Today its social circle game in addition to Instagram/snapchat game.

  71. “It’s a kick when the little girl brings a book over to grandpa and wants to sit in his lap and read it with him. The feeling is a lot like the release of orgasm.”

    Ahhh. Come again?

  72. re: Looks

    Just from a purely evolutionary perspective, muscle is extremely metabolically expensive, so a guy with high lean body mass, by default, has to be successful. And extraordinarily successful at that. Our bodies are extremely resistant to putting on muscle without having a damn good reason to do it, because it’s metabolically expensive to put on and maintain. To put on a lot of muscle, you need to be thriving, not just surviving.

    Purely evolutionary standpoint? Your muscular body is evidence of both your ability to compete and defend yourself, as well as provide resources. There’s a reason women’s “ideal male body” is practically unanimous. A body with a lot of muscle is a body that is exceedingly successful at Survival.

    The irony for me is, for the time being, working out is way more interesting to me than girls. I am hardly thinking about them at all these days. Too focused on my life. And a part of that is that I’m exploring the limits of my body and pushing myself harder and harder on a daily basis. Seeing progress is awesome. And I get excited about seeing more. Being able to move my body in new ways and feeling like I’m defying gravity. It’s addictive.

    Like many other things, guys may initially get into it to impress the wimminz, but genuine interest in the activity ends up taking over in the end, and is what keeps it alive as a lifestyle. If you are not deeply motivated to give it your all in the gym, you will not commit to it as a lifestyle.

    Working out is so beneficial in so many ways. Not the least of which is the high you get from it. It is an excellent remedy for neediness/insecurity/loneliness. It’s as if the acid building up in your muscles as you work out is burning the Beta out of your body. Because no matter who you are or what your past is, or what your goals are, your only focus in that space of intensely working out is giving 100% of your effort. What a great thing. You feel completely alive in the moment. Doing this every day is a very good thing. Learning how to have singular focus and intensity is a good thing. It builds Frame. It builds an understanding of Mental Point of Origin. And of course it builds your body. Win-win-win.

    Personally, working out has vastly improved my quality of life and I am enjoying it a lot. For the time being I have zero interest in going out of my way to interact with girls in any capacity at all, and am enjoying my solitary lifestyle, growing bigger and stronger and improving my health and discipline on a daily basis.

    tl;dr = Hit the fucking gym. I think guys who don’t know what it’s like to really give it their all in a workout and get up close and personal with “Intensity” are missing out on a fundamentally masculine and awesome part of life. To each their own. But I certainly recommend at least trying it out. For me it’s become a bit of an obsession. And a very satisfying one at that.

  73. @Palma – thank you.

    @j:

    HABD can speak for himself, but I will add a couple of points from my perspective

    ““… but it will put you into beta orbiter status a lot easier…lol”

    Ok now we start with the bullshit? Really Culum. You believe this garbage. Being good looking makes it a lot easier for her to put you in the beta orbiter status rather than making it a lot easier for her to hook up with you? smh.”

    I think it would be more accurate to say “beta provider”, not “beta orbiter”, because you can get the girl this way, but otherwise accurate, yes.

    I know you’re smart enough to follow HABD’s reasoning through to the logical conclusion and figure out the reason why – if you can let go of your looks fixation long enough to think it through.

    Hint: it’s related to the dynamic where a successful guy can get a girl home for an SNL from the club at 3am and she sees the size of his apartment (or that he drives a nice car, whatever) and a girl who was ready to bang him 10 minutes ago will suddenly start talking about how she’s not that kind of girl and they should go out for dinner etc.

    “With regards to conformity. See reputation is what its all about with young girls. So, when you conform to what they are expected to want/suppose to like, you get what Chase, calls “he makes me look good” points. She’ll want to be around you. Because you look good, you’re tall, you’re in shape, you got a nice haircut, well dressed, she gains socially when people see her flirting with you. And best of all, her friends will leave her alone with you (unless you start doing some weird uncalibrated RSD shit) instead of actively trying to sabotage your set. It pays to look good.”

    Not quite.

    Those things will make her more likely to want you to be her boyfriend (ie, beta provider) which is related to HABD’s point above. And for that reason her friends may well leave you alone etc (although you still need the social skills to handle the friends). But if all you want is to be AF and bang her that night, then all you need is the social skills to disarm and befriend her group – ie, Game (not looks).

    Oh and of course the “he makes me look good” factor is important – what do you think “social proof” is?? But you don’t need looks for that, you just need social proof in the club.

    ““being fit… and harder (bc you are going to have to work more at drawing some shit tests (to show your internals)”

    More bullshit. And I feel like this is the reason Culum refuses to work out. I mean I get why YaReally provoked shit tests (so he could pass them, and spike her BT). But there’s really no need lol. If she shit tests you, then just pass it lol. There are other more efficient ways to build compliance (the goal here) than drawing shit tests.”

    Dude. I literally quit a good job this year to travel around the world and physically train full time 4+ hours a day. The difference is that I did it for my own reasons, not to get chicks. Thankfully, I’d already fixed my mental attitudes about looks (mainly because of YaReally) before I did this and had enough reference experiences to know looks aren’t that important – or I’d have probably gone down the looks rabbithole and started using it as a crutch.

    As for the second part – well yes, you don’t NEED to provoke shit tests to build attraction (ie, A2) if you’re already in A2 for some other reason (it could be because of your looks, but also any other reason – social proof etc) – you can just go straight to A3. But if it’s not there, then you need to build attraction first (and provoking and passing shit tests is a great way to do that). It’s not “the right way” and the “wrong way”. It just depends on the stage you’re at with that particular girl.

    ““whereas somebody like Tyler isn’t ‘conventionally handsome’ (lol), so just his APPROACHING a hot girl is going to draw the initial shit test…”

    Yeah he’ll pass her initial shit test. And that’ll get a “heh” from here. Then she’ll proceed to give him nothing else to work with. Until one of her friends sees him not going away, then steps in to tell him to fuck off.

    “bc the girl isn’t thinking about him as a potential BF”

    ….she isn’t thinking of him as a potential fuck either. More entertainer for the night.”

    Dude. Come on. This is demonstrably not true. Are you seriously suggesting Tyler didn’t get cold approach lays? Or that he was always a dancing monkey who got blown off by girls when he cold approached?

    I’m not YaReally, I’m not going to post the 50 infields that disprove your point. But you and I both know they’re out there. And why limit it to Tyler? There are plenty of below-average looking guys who get cold approach results (have you ever seen a picture of RSD Derek?)

  74. Nearly pulled a hot one last night but just couldn’t get her to invite me back. Really pretty Russian blonde girl with amazing eyes! Tried some plausible deniability stuff but wasn’t happening. Didn’t help that she had work in the morning and stuff. We’d been making out and getting handsy and she’d been grinding her pussy on my knee HARD whilst we were dancing and stuff lol. Thought she was gonna cum at one point! haha

    She actually recognised me from tinder in the beer garden after I opened her friend! That’s how it started. And I just had a playful vibe throughout. Used a little question game thing that i’ve basically made into my own routine in order to get things moving and get more sexual etc.
    Think I even used that mystery line about telling her she looks like she wants to kiss me lol
    She had a friend who was a mild cock block too but I managed to win her around in the end and she left, leaving me with her friend once she trusted me (which is why it’s so annoying that i wasn’t able to close her!)

    Talking of ‘looks’ I was with an exceptionally handsome friend who had girls opening him and stuff. He could have pulled just about any girl there, i’m sure! (but he’s got a GF). It really is a whole different game when you have looks, but I don’t wanna go down that rabbit hole at the mo. Gets me depressed!! haha

    I also opened the 2 hottest girls in the whole place earlier that night. Two teen blondes. Had a fun convo. flirted with both, and they disappeared to get drinks, but came back to stand near us again – we should have pushed it more and tried to take them with us, but we got a bit sidetracked (A small group of girls who danced for a living opened and were trying to hard to bang my wing and I think the 2 hot blondes disappeared during the polava)

    Grrr….would have been quite a nice notch with that Russian girl. Amazing face. Very Decent chance i’ll see her again (bump into her) but typically I seem to be way way worse with girls where it isn’t our first ever meet! It’s unusual and i’m not sure what it is, but it’s definitely a thing!

  75. @Culum

    “Hint: it’s related to the dynamic where a successful guy can get a girl home for an SNL from the club at 3am and she sees the size of his apartment (or that he drives a nice car, whatever) and a girl who was ready to bang him 10 minutes ago will suddenly start talking about how she’s not that kind of girl and they should go out for dinner etc.”

    Um how exactly is it related to guy running provider game? You saying a good looking guy can pull a girl for a SNL from the club and then suddenly once realizes he’s good looking, then all of a sudden she’s not that kind of girl? lol?

    “Those things will make her more likely to want you to be her boyfriend (ie, beta provider) which is related to HABD’s point above.”

    Being good looking, in shape and well dressed doesn’t automatically make her want you to be her boyfriend. It’s one of the factors of….I’m beginning to think none of you read Chase’s article on sexual acceptability:

    “Certain men, who are sexy enough, get a kind of ‘pass’ with many women’s friends. It is okay for a woman to sleep with such a man, because he is just so sexy.
    they will look at her draped all over you, and simply not try to stop her, because it’s pretty understandable she’d go for a guy like you. After all, you’re so damn sexy.

    Major factors that play into sexual acceptability:

    Hair, clothes, and appearance
    Disqualification as a boyfriend candidate
    Adherence to the Law of Least Effort
    Sex talk, sex stories, chase frames
    Proximity and touch
    Getting her to comply with you
    Irreverence / rebelliousness”

    “although you still need the social skills to handle the friends”

    Speaking from experience, if her friends think you’re sexy, and see that their friend likes you, then you don’t need to “handle” the friends. You don’t really need to talk to them that much lol.

    “But if all you want is to be AF and bang her that night, then all you need is the social skills to disarm and befriend her group – ie, Game (not looks).”

    like I said you don’t need to disarm or befriend anybody if she thinks you’re sexy. I’m looking at my bangs from this and the last third half of 2018 (when I started taking looksmaxxing serious), and I barely spoke to their friends. And I certainly wasn’t trying to “disarm” anybody lol. Girls cockblock either when they think you’re below her standards or they see their friend is giving them “the eye” signally to come in and get her away form you.

    “But you don’t need looks for that, you just need social proof in the club.”

    And an ugly guy will get social proof in the club….how exactly? See preselection works when the girl you want (lets say an HB8) sees you flirting with girls within her range (HB7-7.5). Talking up HB5s (which is the girls that might throw IOIs at an ugly guy), won’t trigger the preselection effect from the girl you want. By looksmaxxing you increase the odds that the girls in the HB7.5 in the venue, will throw you IOIs so you can get that social proof train rolling.

    “But if it’s not there, then you need to build attraction first (and provoking and passing shit tests is a great way to do that). It’s not “the right way” and the “wrong way”. It just depends on the stage you’re at with that particular girl.”

    Good point. But I’ve yet to see anyone close a NO girl tho….lol. NO girls aren’t girls that go, “sorry it’s girls night out”. its girls that give you visceral negative reactions (“ewww”), upon you approaching them.

    “Are you seriously suggesting Tyler didn’t get cold approach lays?”

    No I said the majority of his lays did not come from cold approach.

    “Or that he was always a dancing monkey who got blown off by girls when he cold approached?”

    He entertained them. But didn’t sleep with them. This is very typical RSD shit.

    “I’m not going to post the 50 infields that disprove your point.”

    50 infields are not 50 lays…

    “There are plenty of below-average looking guys who get cold approach results (have you ever seen a picture of RSD Derek?)”

    I’ve been in the same venue with Derek twice. First time, he was dancing with this girl at his table (so table game not cold approach?). And more recently, I saw him standing around, holding a drink in his hand, talking to his assistant for an hour (had to leave cause the venue was dead). Never saw him cold approach, but despite having a shit face, he is tall, jacked, and stylish.

  76. @j

    Oh god, I was just about to step away from the computer and then you posted. Okay, I’ve got 15 minutes, let me get into this, although I’m now getting dangerously close to the “repeating myself” line because your mental block won’t let you process the points I’m making:

    ““Hint: it’s related to the dynamic where a successful guy can get a girl home for an SNL from the club at 3am and she sees the size of his apartment (or that he drives a nice car, whatever) and a girl who was ready to bang him 10 minutes ago will suddenly start talking about how she’s not that kind of girl and they should go out for dinner etc.”

    Um how exactly is it related to guy running provider game? You saying a good looking guy can pull a girl for a SNL from the club and then suddenly once realizes he’s good looking, then all of a sudden she’s not that kind of girl? lol?”

    I’m not going to spell this out. I know you are capable of figuring the point out. It’s not that hard – you just need to take HABD’s logic and project it forward a little bit. But your mental block on this subject is preventing you from doing it.

    “Being good looking, in shape and well dressed doesn’t automatically make her want you to be her boyfriend. It’s one of the factors of….I’m beginning to think none of you read Chase’s article on sexual acceptability:”

    Not automatically, no. But in makes her think in that direction and start to categorize you that way. This is exactly the point HABD was trying to make.

    ““although you still need the social skills to handle the friends”

    Speaking from experience, if her friends think you’re sexy, and see that their friend likes you, then you don’t need to “handle” the friends. You don’t really need to talk to them that much lol.

    “But if all you want is to be AF and bang her that night, then all you need is the social skills to disarm and befriend her group – ie, Game (not looks).”

    like I said you don’t need to disarm or befriend anybody if she thinks you’re sexy. I’m looking at my bangs from this and the last third half of 2018 (when I started taking looksmaxxing serious), and I barely spoke to their friends. And I certainly wasn’t trying to “disarm” anybody lol. Girls cockblock either when they think you’re below her standards or they see their friend is giving them “the eye” signally to come in and get her away form you.”

    a) “being sexy” isn’t the same as “being goodlooking” – this is the core of the disagreement.

    b) But in any event, if you’re suggesting that being sexy by itself is enough and you don’t need to care about a girl’s friends if you’re hawt enough, that’s not true. Yes, it can be true sometimes. Other times you need to deal with cockblocks and mother hens and white knights and guys/girls dragging the girl away because she has a bf and they don’t want her to “make a mistake” or whatever (ie, the cockblock can happen for more reasons than the two you list)

    ““But you don’t need looks for that, you just need social proof in the club.”

    And an ugly guy will get social proof in the club….how exactly? See preselection works when the girl you want (lets say an HB8) sees you flirting with girls within her range (HB7-7.5). Talking up HB5s (which is the girls that might throw IOIs at an ugly guy), won’t trigger the preselection effect from the girl you want. By looksmaxxing you increase the odds that the girls in the HB7.5 in the venue, will throw you IOIs so you can get that social proof train rolling.”

    Do you even YaReally bro? You know a ridiculous amount of his Archive is about exactly this right? You basically start with lower level girls (and hired guns) and go step by step up the ladder. Mystery also talks about this a lot although he uses different words “merging sets” and “pawning” girls etc.

    Note that you don’t need a pre-existing IOI or Approach Invite to start the process so it’s irrelevant who gives (or doesn’t give) the ugly guy a free IOI. The fact that you think the initial IOI is required is at the heart of your mental block. It’s the kind of thing I would expect a Natural to say, not someone like you who learned Game.

    ““But if it’s not there, then you need to build attraction first (and provoking and passing shit tests is a great way to do that). It’s not “the right way” and the “wrong way”. It just depends on the stage you’re at with that particular girl.”

    Good point. But I’ve yet to see anyone close a NO girl tho….lol. NO girls aren’t girls that go, “sorry it’s girls night out”. its girls that give you visceral negative reactions (“ewww”), upon you approaching them.”

    Yes, it’s rare, because most guys don’t have Game. It’s certainly possible. Not easy, but possible. Part of the problem is that if you’re getting that reaction you’ve already made a mistake by not laying the foundation properly (building social proof in the club etc). So once you’ve got that reaction you’re already in a hole and need to climb out and that’s harder than not making the mistake in the first place. But basically you need to back off, build social proof and get her curious about you and wondering if she made a mistake about you, and (done right) she will start to give you IOIs and proximity and you can reopen her successfully. Is that guaranteed to work? No, of course not. But it can be made to work.

    There was literally a post on the old Heartiste blog called something like “How to turn around a no girl” on exactly this point. It sparked a long discussion and YaReally explained this there.

    ““Are you seriously suggesting Tyler didn’t get cold approach lays?”

    No I said the majority of his lays did not come from cold approach.

    “Or that he was always a dancing monkey who got blown off by girls when he cold approached?”

    He entertained them. But didn’t sleep with them. This is very typical RSD shit.

    “I’m not going to post the 50 infields that disprove your point.”

    50 infields are not 50 lays…”

    This point was made to YaReally many times and he addressed it many times.

    If you have what is basically religious faith in your belief, then no contrary evidence will convince you otherwise. If you see the video in the club, you’ll ask videos of them leaving the club and him pulling her. If you see the videos of them leaving the club, you’ll ask for the videos of them getting into an Uber. If you see that, you won’t believe it unless you a video of P-in-V, and if you see that, you’ll claim the girl was a paid actress.

    As for me personally, the infields of Tyler pulling girls out of clubs and leaving with them is good enough to accept he slept with those girls (combined with my personal experience that it IS possible to do that).

    “I’ve been in the same venue with Derek twice. First time, he was dancing with this girl at his table (so table game not cold approach?). And more recently, I saw him standing around, holding a drink in his hand, talking to his assistant for an hour (had to leave cause the venue was dead). Never saw him cold approach, but despite having a shit face, he is tall, jacked, and stylish.”

    Are we talking about the same person? I’ve met Derek (I attended one of his Free Tours years ago and had a brief chat with him afterwards). Scrawny, distinctly average looking dude in his late 40s (looking every one of those years), who is a convicted felon with jail time, who made a small fortune doing some kind of property investing?

    “Tall, jacked and stylish” is kind of the opposite of how I’d describe him and I’m struggling to imagine that guy dancing at all, much less on a table. I can’t link to a picture or video because he tries to avoid having his picture online because of his investing etc (you might find one if you dig enough but it’s not a question of a 30 second google search).

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