Field Reports

lion-chasing-gazelle

For the past three years of The Rational Male there’s been a consistent presence in the comment threads of guys seeking advice for particular situations with regards to Game. Whether it’s fine tuning certain aspects of Game or a larger consensus of the guys participating in my comment threads it’s become obvious there’s a need for a dedicated page and comment thread to address these Field Reports.

So I’m instituting this page for exactly this. If there is some urgency to have members of The Rational Male community analyze your particular situation feel free to hit anyone up in the comments of my current post, but please refer them to your particular field report with a link to your comment here. I’m hoping this will alleviate the mass of posts for field report analysis and Game specific insights piled into the main blog post for any given week.

There will be some rules for this “forum” as such. I ask that you only keep your comments to addressing the field reports at hand and save your larger theoretical stuff for the main posts, or if relevant, keep the “bigger scope of things” posts to being as succinct as possible. There will be no moderation in this comment thread (spamming excepted), so realize it will be a very hot kitchen before you post. I will impose no restrictions on video links here, nor will I limit links to various, but pertinent articles.

Understand, this is an experiment for now. It’s likely this comment thread will exceed thousands of comments. I’ll be instituting new comment plug-ins for wordpress to deal with this in the future, but I may archive this page the the posts and refresh this page in the future as well. If this gets cumbersome I may simply institute a dedicated forum-style sub-site of The Rational Male to accommodate for Game specific questions.

So have at it, post your field reports and feel free to comment on the ones you have some particular insight for. Be forewarned that it’s likely things may get a bit salty at times and I expect a lot of back & forth with debate and disagreements, but that’s what this thread is for – to hash out Game particulars for your given situations.

 

15,570 comments on “Field Reports

  1. @Sentient

    Wat? 😂

    indigenous looking girls are just as ugly as black girls to me, broski. I shared her face before in a separate post. No indigenous facial features.

    “Look you miss the note as per usual”

    You framed it as 1st world women are superior to 3rd world women. Looking at Ruby’s roster, that’s laughable (although I understand Ruby was using these older girls to fund his lifestyle).

    “It’s not about a 5/6”

    If the girl in the pic is a 5 (lol) then what are Ruby’s girls rating (I know you have a bias for blondes so you’re gonna rate them higher than me).

    “or even pygmy fetishism”

    Had to Google that. You saying I have a fetish for short girls? lol yes that’s true. I’ve stated that before.

    “It’s about the validation seeking. Break that before it breaks you.”

    It kinda feels too good tbh. This constant supply of girls feeding your ego. Wish I had it younger. But I’m sure I’ll get bored of it eventually 😉

  2. @Tantum

    “Me: Very well — Catch you next time”

    maybe I’m reading this wrong, but I think what she was trying to say was that she just wants to fuck. And doesn’t want to stay over for dinner/sleep over. so I would have replied, “aight see u friday”

    1. @j

      Read FR #4 and my later follow-up.

      She already made it clear that if we meet on Friday, then she plans to go home straight afterwards because she has “plans on Saturday morning”.

      Hence the ‘I am cooking dinner gambit’.

      GC knows that if she comes round to my place then I will nail her. 😊

      TantumErgo

  3. @Tantum

    Yeah mate I’ve read it. To me “after seeing you” = “after fucking you” (she already knows where you live. And even if she wants to meet somewhere else first, then just meet her at a spot near your place (don’t let her pick). Then just turn her on, and bring her back to your place (“change her mood, not her mind”) (“hey lets go to my place for a bit before you go back home”).

    “She already made it clear that if we meet on Friday, then she plans to go home straight afterwards because she has “plans on Saturday morning”. Hence the ‘I am cooking dinner gambit’.”

    Think you got it backwards lol. You did the cooking gambit first, then she informed you she has plans Saturday morning (which I think is bullshit. She just doesn’t want to stay over, cause she doesn’t want to catch feelings fast).

  4. Tantum

    Yeah man agree with J… she was down to just come over and bang…

    Question: Are you OK with just providing the dick and NO rom-comming? Or do you think you have to earn it in some way? Are YOU enough?

    [serious questions]

    Your path to improvement is going to be inner game/frame and technique/sequencing…

    Look at this

    Took some good advice from Palma, and played the ‘I am cooking gambit’ – here’s how the exchange of messages has run:

    Why do you need a gambit on a girl you’ve banged what FOUR times??? Unless YOU are NOT enough… ya don’t

    GC: On my way to work, feeling surprisingly fresh considering. I don’t know where I get the energy from at my age 😂

    This is beta bait, looking for you to compliment her age…. One idea “surprised you can walk tigress…”

    Me: Glad you are feeling energised. I reckon it’s your hot Latin blood. 😉 Let’s meet on Friday. x

    Good enough response. Pretty direct. leading. OK

    GC: Ok x

    Aaaaaaaaand…. it WORKS! She was sold. She wanted more of that Tantum dick… That is IT… No gambits, no pretexts, no song and dance. No “earning it”… Come over and get dicked sideways, she’s like “Yaassss!” as the kids say…

    Me: Hello, gorgeous – hope you working week is going well …😘 Come round to my place on Friday evening – I will cook. 🙂 x

    Just strike the “I will [anything – other than break your pussy]” next time. she’s 55. She can cook and feed herself. she can’t get Alpha dick. That’s what you have. It is enough. YOU are enough.

    GC: That’s a lovely gesture, I like a man that can cook 😊. I will have to decline, as I was planning to go home on Friday after seeing you.
    I have plans for Saturday morning. XX

    And you pop her bubble… For sure her “after seeing you” meant – in Catonese – after fucking… Poor girl.

    Me: Very well — Catch you next time. xx

    GC: X

    If I had to bet, I bet now she will look at you as a bf and make you wait and earn it…

    Be firm next time. Just meet, drink sex…

    1. @Sentient
      @J

      So… re GC .. (FR4#) — All good points, so thank you both. 😊

      Key question: Can I retrieve this situ now, or should I let it ride?

      @ Sentient

      Your guess that she plans to meet one of her BFs for brunch on Saturday is probably on the money.

      TantumErgo

  5. @Sentient

    “it is harder to come from a shithole and get laid in the top strata of society than the reverse.”

    I agree. But while Ruby may have been born in a shithole. He was always banging upper class pussy. He was born to UMC parents after all. And spent much of his youth in Paris, France (a first world country) up until age 17:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Porfirio_Rubirosa

    Brazil and Peru, like Dominican Republic, may be shithole countries in general. Especially when compared to the likes of Switzerland, Norway, and America. But the neighborhoods of Jardins, Sao Paulo, Brazil and Miraflores, Lima, Peru, where both of these girls live (upper class neighborhoods), are anything but shitholes. I suggest you get around more before making such generalistic claims.

  6. J

    I suggest you get around more before making such generalistic claims.

    There is a reason there is a term sex tourism and there is a flow to it. For men and women… And gradations as well… Based on core concepts of value and who has it and what they are willing to do for it.

    Why do you think all these London guys were heading to former SU countries? Cause there are no hot girls on the high streets?

    See if you can figure the dynamic in play here…

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/9e/Female_Sex_Tourism_Map.gif/300px-Female_Sex_Tourism_Map.gif

  7. The claim was that I was banging 5/6 indigenous girls.Which was false. Now you admit there are hot girls, south of the border, but that they are “easy” for men from 1st world countries. “It’s suppose to be hard to get laid bro!”

    I’m not traveling to these and other countries because I can’t get laid in my own country like the London daygamers. I travel because I want to.

  8. J

    lol… I know there are hot girls all over the world… but still that pic is not a good pic hoss…

    Carry on playa

  9. ” Brazil and Peru, like Dominican Republic, may be shithole countries in general. Especially when compared to the likes of Switzerland, Norway, and America. But the neighborhoods of Jardins, Sao Paulo, Brazil and Miraflores, Lima, Peru, where both of these girls live (upper class neighborhoods), are anything but shitholes. I suggest you get around more before making such generalistic claims.”

    https://media2.giphy.com/media/kgn9UdY7IgnIs/giphy.gif

    Question: What does any woman’s ” class ” have to do with anything, especially wrt ” hotness “?

    Btw, sorry J, you post up an awful lot of 5/6’s as if they’re universally ” hot “. Lol, you talk a lot of shit about others, but you’re not ( by posted pics ) setting the world on fore. You’re just banging average chicks.

    https://media1.tenor.com/images/3c5331500e37e3fd389392b28fc99195/tenor.gif

  10. And…. drum rolll…

    It’s OK to bang average chicks – if you want to… Just don’t get all validaty over it.

  11. …. ohhhhh, maybe that’s the ” validation ” thing. Upper class chick ( lol ) banged me, so I have worth that’s been validated .

  12. Sentient

    Correct. There are more average chicks around than above average chicks. There’s nothing inherently ” wrong ” with banging them. I’d bang that chick J posted ( although she’s carrying a little extra around the waist ), but I drive past those every day when I’m out. 5/6 on a good day.

  13. I post girls that are 7-7.5s (and i take photos while I’m with them. So they don’t have time to Photoshop/alter the images. I notice some guys post pics from the girl’s instagram. Where she looks her best. And not as good as she looks like IRL). and you call them 6s. (If I recall correctly, sentient called skinny no tits or ass Taylor Swift a 7. And you call your 50 something year old wife a 7. I know what a fit 42 year old woman’s body feels like. It’s nowhere close to as good as a fit 22 year old chick. So I’m very skeptical about your 7 claim too). That’s a POINT difference in our ratings. I’m not and never have claimed any of these girls are 10s.

  14. Lol, don’t get upset playa.

    I’m still waiting for you to post a 7-7.5. Haven’t seen it yet, but you are posting up 20 something average chicks.

    There’s. Nothing. Wrong. With. Average. Chicks.

    like sentient says, as long as that’s what you want to do.

  15. Tantum

    Oh you still got this. Put those red pill glasses on and her next pitch is going to look slow and fat.

    Those glasses and some game knowledge and you are all set.

    In your next interaction just forgo and beta buxy stuff and focus on logistics – time and place and give her the D she was out late at night looking for.

    Then take yourself to brunch 😁

    If she doesn’t hit you up, hit her up to come over when you have a window.

    1. @ Sentient

      “Oh you still got this. Put those red pill glasses on and her next pitch is going to look slow and fat.

      Those glasses and some game knowledge and you are all set.

      In your next interaction just forgo and beta buxy stuff and focus on logistics – time and place and give her the D she was out late at night looking for.

      Then take yourself to brunch

      If she doesn’t hit you up, hit her up to come over when you have a window”

      CHECK. 😊

      TantumErgo

  16. People buy me/comp me drinks a lot.

    Last Sat. night a buddy gave me a shot that a waitress had “comped” him when she assumed that he had a tab. He gave me one of the shots. Ex cop and gave me shit about nystagmus cuz I’d had two “boosted” bourbons already. Mom taught me to play dumb and it has never failed.

    Was on a flight and a female flight attendant comped me some booze. I told her that I had been on the maiden flight of the airline. True story.

    @ Blax

    Grandbaby Gamer pointed at me and said, “Cracker.” Out of the mouth of babes… Daughter Gamer gave me some shit about it. lol

  17. @Tatum

    “Presumably at no stage did you even attempt to justify the deleted message, but rather brush it aside and go straight for the meet? I ask as a newbie.”

    In the accidental case I suggested drinks after the “Was that for me hahaha” and “What did you want to say to me?” i just replied with “oh. let’s meet up. drinks. what’s your sched?” and we’ll be meeting up next week.

    After I posted this I tried it with a few girls I had lost contact with including the girl I posted about who wished me a Happy Birthday then deleted her greeting. I sent a message and deleted it. She didn’t respond. But she did look at it immediately.

    A third immediately responded and I suggested drinks and we got into bantering. So it’s a good revival tool instead of “Hey” or whatever…

    There is something called the “ping text” which is a non-sequiter you send to a girl out of the blue to revive a cold lead. I think the ‘Message deleted” text works better because it works on a girl’s imagination.

    Remember that a girl’s imagination is your best tool in getting her thinking about you.

    1. @ walawala

      Many thanks for the clarification about how to use the deleted text gambit. (I am a Chess player, and am starting to see the analogy between certain types of Chess Openings and Game).

      I am really looking forward to trying this out, but need to give it some more time before I do for the two targets I have in mind, both of whom have effectively nexted me for the time being…

      “Remember that a girl’s imagination is your best tool in getting her thinking about you.”

      I do get this, and have actually managed to put this to the test.

      TantumErgo

  18. Tantum

    “(I am a Chess player, and am starting to see the analogy between certain types of Chess Openings and Game).”

    Now we are cooking.

    Yareally used to say “chess not checkers”…

    Go check out his archive as well… Well it’s only some early stuff. You can find the whole tging with wayback.

    Yareallyarchive.com

  19. @Tantum

    Context is everything. If they nexted you because of a lack of attraction, this won’t work.

    If they nexted you because you wouldn’t be their bf or if you banged them already, then i’d recommend this.

    The other girl I tried this on actually gave me the idea for it by doing it to me. So I did it back to her a week later. No response.

    The overall goal is to spin plates and have a few on the go.

    Girls in their 20’s are prioncesses used to soy boys chasing them. You have to find a way to make it seem like you’re interested without overtly being interested.

    My way is to invite them out. They can accept or reject. But build up enough attraction first then move to comfort to ensure she sees you as a real person, then suggest drinks.

    I saw two guys in a bar the other day working a pair of girls. They were in flip flops and looked like yabos.. They approached the girls for a light. The one girl was laughing and giving off IOI’s. His friend then approached her friend. That was lamer. She was keen but he was sloppy.

    Guy number 1 number closed. Guy number 2 followed up. They left. Text book. But after I could see the girls getting in to a conversation with each other, their friends came, everyone’s drinking. I could see that they instantly forgot those two guys.

    The girl gave me an IOI as she left and I smiled. Girls have options. You have to do 2 things: 1. tighten your overall game 2. Approach more.

  20. @Tantum – also you need some practice at text game generally. It’s not really one specific mistake (or rather it’s lots of minor ones that add up), more that overall you’re chasing her too much and giving her too much validation. You need to text less, compliment less, focus more on emotional spikes and let her chase you. YaReally’s text game advice is still the best going – lots on it in the YaReally Archive.

    PSA to everyone: The Book of YaReally PDF can be downloaded at the link below. Much faster than reading the website on the Internet Archive.

    The presentation and context is better on the Archive copy of the website – this PDF is basically a categorized compilation of his posts, but some context is lost from the original discussion. Still worth getting and reading every page. It’s the best PUA/Game resource out there (it’s based on MM principles so that is still required reading but YaReally is superb at explaining it and breaking down FRs and bringing in supplemental resources and relevant videos etc).

    https://www.mediafire.com/file/v97p3rhw9hanot2/Book_of_YaReally.pdf/file

    I also have a full (not partial) copy of the YaReally Archive website, as well as the Book of YaReally. Happy to circulate it to anyone but not sure how to send a download link to Dropbox or similar in an anon way without posting it here in public and getting so many downloads that it smashes the bandwidth limits.

  21. @Sentient
    A C S is a progression but not a stair step “set and forget” routine. You will cycle between/through as you go. If you want to criticize MM this is one area he did not make hyper explicit in the book for the sperglords.

    Watching the dozens of tapes fills in the gaps.

    Yohami had an interesting “critique” of Mystery Method… or rather its misinterpretation by sperglords lol

    https://rivsdiary.wordpress.com/2016/05/11/yes-im-always-right/comment-page-1/#comment-2677
    (websites come and go so the full text below, wise words in the closing paragraphs)

    The reason the Mystery Method is codependent is because he is – he’s a guy chasing a narcissist and trying to turn rejection into approval, through a maze of false signals and manipulation. PUA stays persistent in the face of rejection, playing until the last minute in a glorious underdog uphill battle, and then getting sex is a validation of all that work.

    Thing is, for most men that is exactly how dealing with a woman feels. For a beta or lower, dealing with a woman is dealing with a narcissist. Ah fuck. For every man dealing with a woman is dealing with a narcissist.

    Except for attractive men sex comes first, at the beginning, and all the negotiation is about the woman offering goods and planting seeds for a relationship and demanding more investment and commitment. It’s NOT about the man chasing the woman for sex. So Mystery Method is right but it’s wrong.

    In the natural order of things the woman chases the man. If this doesnt resonate with you, you still dont know women. Every woman is chasing a man. Most likely the same man most other women are also chasing.
    Mystery is oblivious to this. PUA doesnt understand this. In pickup, when a woman likes you and offers to you easily, that’s like a random gift from the universe that doesnt mean much, doesnt increase your PUA pride, doesnt count. What counts? the girl you wanted and you did a thousand little things and adjustments and chased and obsessed and manipulated the whole world and then you got.

    Read about codependency.

    Check this:

    The neg.
    attraction
    Comfort
    Seduction

    It contains perks of wisdom but overall is bullshit. It doesnt account for when a girl likes you – do you understand? And when you’re an alpha man, an attractive man, every girl likes you, go deeper:

    Women are attracted to qualities and behaviors from the top dog. Anything and everything that comes from a place of authority is attractive. Let’s reveal the true nature of things here:

    THE NEG

    The reason why the neg works is because superior people talk down to inferior people and not the other way around.

    So take everything that comes from the same place of the NEG.

    Talking down, passing judgement, patronizing, making fun of, disregarding, cutting contact, breaking rapport, indifference, independence, also violence, rudeness, mistreatment, irresponsibility, prepotence, not giving a fuck, being spoiled, making a public scene, demanding, being the center of attention, talking over you, and these turned into more affirmative: giving orders, commanding, expecting yourself to be pleased, putting yourself first, “just doing it”, self amusement, not being controlled by the social expectations, not being restrained, etc.

    Anything and everything that comes from the same place of the Neg, which is, “a being superior than you” is as powerful as the neg. The neg as an opener works because it’s demonstrating value quickly, but all of the other stuff is as functional, and when you do all of them at once it becomes something that is “coherent”.

    If you’re in a place and you start talking to a woman, you dont “have” to neg her to convey you’re a superior being. Your body status can convey the same. You passing judgement over something, positive or negative, does the same. Making a face and saying “what the FUCK is this music?” is perfect for getting a laugh. But see the next one.

    ATTRACTION

    Attraction is nothing but this: a woman interacting with a superior value man she’s attracted to and trying to measure to see if he’s the real deal. This process is a lot of fun for the woman since that’s what they are wired to do. It’s equally fun for them if the answer to the question of you being a real man is yes or no. They will be happy either way.

    Attraction, on your side, or “running attraction” is nothing but demonstrating high value in the form of attitudes and behaviors. Which becomes something like this:

    Loud club, cute woman is passing you by, you make a face and tell her “what the FUCK is this music?”. She laughs? she’s yours for taking. She comes back with a test, like “I LOVE this music what are you talking about”? Then she’s not convinced yet so you double down “well OF COURSE you love that look at what you’re wearing!” to which she’ll punch you in the arm and call you a jerk then she’s yours for taking. If you fail to convey coherence, or if you’re not coherent, then you’re just rude, but rude from an inferior caste, which will have the police or whatever other authority send your way. I got kicked of places for not knowing what I was doing.

    So attraction is, basically, teasing the girl with a carrot. You just have to know what the carrot is. More on that on the “Seduction” phase.

    COMFORT

    The worse about the PUA method is putting attraction vs comfort as being two distinct things, because the PUA reality is of an inferior man pretending to be a superior being, so comfort becomes about relaxing and showing their real selves and pretending to care, from an inferior place, which means putting the woman on a pedestal.

    Comfort is nothing but “making her feel good” which is nothing but validation. Validation of what? Stop for a second and understand where she’s coming from:

    You have a woman who saw a guy who was acting like a superior being, or talked to her like he was a superior being, negged her, made fun of her, ignored her, or is out there independent to her, and she’s trying to figure out if he’s the real deal, and she tries to bring him down or figure things to see if he’s the man or not, and this is making her get exposed and vulnerable, it’s using her valuable social time giving a window to this guy. She is chasing the seed making herself vulnerable and weak. Is she doing the right thing or not?

    The superior man is “risky”, “dangerous”, “cant be tamed”, and I said comfort is validation, which means in this context, when this dangerous risky man makes her feel safe. That is the pay off that validates her chase.

    Are you about to jump of a cliff? say “trust me” and take her hand. Do you understand? Taking her hand and saying trust me are not comfort if you’re not jumping of a cliff. Comfort is when she’s taking a risk and you make her feel safe. Comfort is when she’s dealing with you and she’s mad because you teased her or she’s calling you a jerk, then you say “ohh come here” and pull her in.

    Comfort is when she gets confirmation that she’s a valid individual in the right path and getting validation from you, feeling safe with you, because you provide a path to safety in your dangerous and unpredictable kindgom.

    Comfort is not something you offer so she offers you pussy. Comfort is a reward you give for her chase, acknowledging that she’s taking a risk, and making it easier for her.

    A lot of guys (like Riv) start talking about family illness and drama. The Daygame video guys start interview mode talking about rational things, where do you live? what do you do? where is your boyfriend?. That’s not comfort, that’s playing a beta. Betas are not “comfortable”, they are asexual, asexuality is not comfortable. You know what’s comfortable for a woman? a big dick just when she wants it the most. Which brings to this:

    SEDUCTION

    Seduction is nothing else but giving the woman what she wants, and this is very simple.

    First you need to be a superior man and have all these attitudes ingrained and naturalized, all the good and all the bad that comes with it, from body posture to giving commands to throwing tamtrums to bitching to laughing to self amusement to authority to humor etc. That must be your natural state.

    Second you interact with women, tease them, but dont destroy them. You treat them gently with your monster claws. You treat her gently with your monster jaw. You could destroy her, in a second, because you’re that strong, but you dont. You could bully and abuse her, but you dont. You have the power, you could use it to bring doom to her and to the world, but you dont. You’re dangerous, but you offer her a path to safety, you offer your hand just before jumping – or not.

    You can also jump and then tell her that you expected more from here – you can stretch things like that, but then it will need a bigger payoff for her.

    Anyway. I start with who you have to be as a man because Seduction is nothing but giving the woman what she wants. Which means she has to want you, at least enough to want to figure you out and chase you some, or otherwise there’s no seduction for you. If she’s not trying to figure you out and chasing you, then you are the one chasing her, you’re seeing her back, you’re doing pyrotechnics to make her turn and see you, which never works, it just never does, because that’s not what a superior being does, which means even in the best case scenario (it’s not a good case scenario but let’s pretend) that she takes you, she does so not because she’s turned on by you and wants to keep you, but because she wants to use you and all the things you’re offering. But I digress.

    Seduction is nothing but giving the woman what she wants.

    Which translates to this, as a technique:

    When something works you do it more, when something doesnt work you do it less – without EVER losing center of how you got here, how you are, and what you want.

    You said “what a shitty music” and didnt get a response from here, keep moving. But if her eyes shine and she laughs, keep doing it, keep pointing at shitty things. If that’s not it, switch to music. If that’s not it, let it go and move on.

    Every woman wants the same monster dick but they want it in different flavors. You need to be able to give the woman the flavor of dick she wants, so it becomes a monster dick with a plus, just for her.

    If she’s sad, comfort her. If she’s fun, make her laugh. If she’s angry, side with her or bounce her back.

    Whenever you’re dealing with her, there’s something she will respond to and most things that will be invisible to her. Your job is to press buttons and see what she responds to. Then give her more of that. But not give in a beta way, but in an alpha way, this is something she IS working for, and you reward her with validation. It’s the joke with the punchline. It’s the orgasm and the climax. It’s the tension and release.

    There is a man that she will die chasing for and abandon her life for. Who is that man? that’s what you’re figuring out while you talk to her, without asking the question, but seeing to what she responds to.

    You roleplay with her, does she respond to it? make jokes, does she respond to it? you talk about a subject, does she respond to it?

    Women in this regard are infinitely self centered so they only respond to the things they are already into.

    So you must first be the thing they are into, and then give them more of that.

    CLOSING

    So after about a year of doing Mystery and PUA crap I got a hold on the principles. I call it “Game Everyone” and “Find Out If She’s Fun”.

    Get a life where you can be an alpha dog. If you’re in a job you dont like and life is treating you unfairly this is impossible. You need to be winning in life so you can be winning in a congruent way. Become the alpha dog whatever that means to you, but align with it. Then you treat everyone from there and you learn how to be the alpha dog in every situation. Most of the time it wont be much, it will just be. It will be just you stand and how you ask for things.

    Then when dealing with people and women – do you really care about where they are from, where do they live, the job they have? what do YOU really care about? for me and for this context, it’s actually a different question, is: “are we compatible?”. The way to know that answer is to run compatibility tests by talking subjects, roleplaying, passing judgement, taking sides, making fun of something, getting closer, getter farther, invading the personal space, making boundaries, touching, creating space, increasing the tension, making a safe space, it’s all a game. How you play that game is what defines who and what you are. Let’s call that “social skills”.

    So this is not something that is turned on and off, this is “how you are”, so this is how you deal with everything, everyone, all the time, no facades, no games, no posturing, just you, from the throne you built for yourself, figuring out everyone else and discerning friends vs foes vs allies vs fun people vs boring people.

    When you’re there, a lot of girls want you. Most that you can take care of and that’s part of the charm. You dont deal with all that attention by doing four stages of bullshit. All is already assumed. When girls want you and you deliver what they want, all this can happen very quickly. You can “seduce” a girl ins 30 min, the same girl some beta has been chasing with chocolates and “comfort” for three years, and you have her in the bathroom or a spare room asking for more dick that actually feels comfortable, instead of just pretending.

  22. lurker123

    @HABD or anyone else

    Hey HABD,
    I have seen you mention the guard dog spinup situ many times but havent seen it used by anyone else in these parts of town and don’t get it from context. Would you mind explaining it in short?

    here’s one…

    https://therationalmale.com/field-reports-comment-page-2-comments/comment-page-59/#comment-224489

    @Sentient dr zipper

    “HABD

    and to also avoid spinning up a guard dog situ…

    You know you are going to have to explain that…”

    ya, ok…lol

    guard dog situ…

    how do you train a guard dog?… you push it a little, and when it ‘fights back’ (pushes back against your frame) you let it ‘win’… next time you push it a little harder, and when it fights back, you resist a little bit, but then you let it win… rinse and repeat until you can break baseball bat over its head and it will still rip your arm off…

    same thing with girls…lol…

    you push against her frame, but when she pushes back (with her rolodex of shit tests), you let her win… next time, you resist a little harder (and maybe pass THAT shit test), but she pushes back harder than last time, aaand… you let her win… (can be with a different shit test in her rolodex…)… rinse and repeat until you are sitting in a jail cell for being ‘creepy’… (how’s that for pulling this back around to the current OP?…lol)

    i would just add that instead of ending in jail “for being creepy” which was the current OP at that time (and is still a real possibility), you might more likely end up on the kitchen floor with a knife in you…

    if you want to have a good example of this overall dynamic playing out, go through EhIntellect’s situ in the first few pages of the FR section… he got a good handle on it soon enough (and turned his situ around admirably i might add…), but other dudes out in the world end up in various flavors of dead…lol… but not kidding…

    good luck!

  23. @palmasailor

    He’s in North Korea – inaccessible behind enemy lines with Stockholm Syndrome.

    That’s where it is and I need a life as well.

    If he emerges in here and I’ve told him that.

    But he has to emerge.

    and when/if he ’emerges’ what will he find?… congruence or incongruence with mom’s narrative?…

    my goto example is a story i heard about a bitter divorce where the mom told the kid that his dad did not want to have anything to do with him bc the dad had his ‘new family/kids’ to spend his time with and didn’t want to associate with him… she told the kid that his dad was living in a big mansion and spending time/money/etc on his ‘other family’… and didn’t pay his support payments… the kid felt abandoned (which was mom’s goal)… end result is that the dad died, and the kid turned 18 about the same time and found out that his dad had been living in an efficiency apartment all alone.. and had written to the kid every week (and never missed a support payment), but mom had sent the letters back… she cashed the checks though…

    mom had cheated the kid out of any relationship with his dad… all out of spite…

    i have a distant relative that is actually almost as bad as that bad mom… she turned the kids against their dad… the thing is though, he bought into that narrative/frame too… he didn’t even have a place for the kids to be when he had visitation… he had plenty of space and money, too… but he basically said ‘f*k it…’ and played his role… so the kids saw the congruence with mom’s narrative…

    i still want the best results for you, so i’m pointing this sh*t out (in case you haven’t worked through it… due to whatever reasons…)… will your actions ‘now’ be congruent or not with what you think she is telling him?…

    Oh and yes – and she is destroying him.

    But I have no access or control over that.

    but you do have control over what he will find once he comes of age… and ’emerges’… and how long is that?… over here, child support usually runs until the kid turns 18 and is out of high school… so basically an adult… it should say how long in the custody/support order… he isn’t going to just magically transform his attitude at that time… stockholm syndrome is the proper idea… but you can be set up to provide maximum cognitive dissonance to him when he finally ’emerges’… and i will point out, that’s actually the best way to f*k with your ex…lol

    Short of getting a machete out and explaining the way it is to the new boyfriend.

    And don’t think I haven’t considered it, I just don’t think it will deliver my chosen objectives.

    I even still have my fathers old machete and it is in perfect working order.

    the machete is a bad idea… and i’m glad you know that… but that’s not the only way to win…

    questions for you…

    does your son have a ‘place’ at your place/in your life?… what if he showed up tomorrow?…

    if he did show up, would he feel comfortable (trust you enough) to just ‘leave mom’?… do you want that?… is there anything you can do to increase that trust/end point now?… it might not even have to be delivered to him at this time…

    just some thoughts…

    good luck!

  24. Relatively new to RP(2-3 years). Just read the post Relationship Game-Wife Sex and had a couple questions I hope to get answers too. Is it safe to assume that in withdrawing attention you men having sex with her also. Is this an indefinite period of time? Also is there a difference in this as you get into your 60’s? I’m 62, wife is 64. I’m far and away in better physical shape than she is. Frequency of meaningful sex is once a week. Am I crazy to think it could be more if I do things properly?

  25. Tcjcox

    “Am I crazy to think it could be more if I do things properly?”

    Not at all. Game works on wives. Evo bio is Evo bio. Dread works.

    Describe why you arent having the sex you want. More specifics will help sort out the issues.

    Also some of your background together, who is submissive to who etc.

  26. TJ, you are already doing good, things can always be better. What I do is make my mission primary, I have a plan for work to do today ,this is my plan and none of her business. When I leave the house I don’t tell her unless she asks then it’s vague answers only ( first off she doesn’t care except for comfort or control) IE going to the shop,heading up the mountain or going for a drive see you later don’t hold dinner. She will message me when it’s time for lunch or coffee,I will come in when I find a good stopping point in my work. If I want sex and she hasn’t already initiated I will pat her ass when walking by. Also it’s good to get her out in public regularly so she can see how other women react to me.

    She hasn’t changed much in what motivates her even post menopause the most annoying thing is she is more possessive and requires more comfort.

  27. @TjCox

    2-3 years? Relatively new? That’s a long time. What red pill sites and materials and books have you been reading?

    There had been a lot of material developed on Married Red Pill game. There is not much here on The Rational Male as far as prescriptions are concerned. Are you familiar and have you red the sidebar and curated best posts at Married Red Pill Reddit?

    Sentient is correct in that you giving more information about your situation in how ever you feel comfortable will yield more actionable advice.

    The major problem in long term marriages is that each spouse falls into unhealthy behaviors. And want to protect their power base. She will hide the vagina to keep and not relinquish power and control (what else does she have to bargain with? Meals, housework, admiring and respecting you?

    In regards to your questions, most of that, including what Wahoo McDaniels said is covered in Blue Pill Professor’s book, specifically in Chapter 4.
    The whole inexpensive and easily readable book is a distillation of MRP stuff up till about 4 years ago. All in one spot, theory and practice. Otherwise all this stuff about MRP is fragmented on the internet.

    The whole book is a distillation of former works of Red pill marriage concentrating on levels of dread. If you have a decent marriage, you won’t have to get through more than like level 5 out of 12 dread.

    And the operating principle, like Wahoo said, is to get spin-off covert dread because she generates it in herself and feels comfort and desire in you. Not dread for the sake of dread to get more sex. It’s about getting to healthy, masculine/feminine polarity and generating more organic desire from your wife. The person who has lower sexual desire is always the one that “will” control the sexual frequency.

    The gist of that chapter 4 is that you be the best representation of yourself in having attraction/desire from her triggers.

    You condition her “bad” behaviors (soft or hard denials of regular good sex) with withdrawing time and attention for poor behavior. But not affection and presence (including fucking her good). Affection and presence includes paying attention, even if briefly, being there in spirit, realizing when she is throwing bids for attention.

    When she is playing hide the vagina transactionally, you have other things to do. She doesn’t get your time and attention.

    In shitty relationships, you only withdraw presence and affection for hard, vicious and wicked denials.

    Here’s and introduction to his book:

    https://bluepillprofessor.wordpress.com/2015/05/22/hello-world/

    The book has a Male Action Plan. It is cheat codes. It is a start for newbies. There is a higher level of beyond this process, when a man internalizes his MRP Game, and gets up the learning curve of mastery in the Game.

    There is no doubt you can increase the sexual frequency. But a lot of us found that there is a saying “it’s not about sex”. And when you get there you will recognize what that means. Otherwise you can have more pussy and fuck it too. And it’s husband/ wife sex. And something that should be encouraged. 2 to 3 times a week is average for actively sexually active couples (which is probably only about 28% of couples your age) and post-menopausal women often can’t handle 4x a week. And it is best to be quality desire sex.

    And don’t be fooled, it is simple to get there but not easy. IOW, don’t be afraid or uncertain if it takes process time for a while.

  28. @Tj

    Keep in mind that every relationship, every man is different (and unhappy in their own way). So you have to know yourself and your strengths and weakness. And minimize your weaknesses. Be careful in following generalized prescriptions.

    Notice the words incremental and covertly and get to where something has changed in you in the original essay you read:

    https://therationalmale.com/2012/04/23/relationship-game-wife-sex/

    Make her want it

    If you’ve been married for years, she probably feels pretty secure with you and whatever degree of control she has in regards to regulating the flow of sex. Make her uncomfortable. As counterintuitive as it sounds, this is the single most important advantage you can take. Begin to incrementally take the power that her intimacy has had sway over you for the past 10 years back from her. When you were unmarried even the slightest bit of anxiety that she may be put off for another, better, prospect than herself prompted that desire to fuck you better than the others.

    Most important though is to do this covertly. If you go popping off about how you’re taking your balls back and she’d better shape up or you’ll be looking for a woman who is into fucking you, you’re dead in the water. You have to imply with your attitude and behavior that something’s changed in you. The best principle to remember in marriage is that you will only get what you’ve gotten if you keep doing what you’ve done before.

  29. “It’s about getting to healthy, masculine/feminine polarity and generating more organic desire from your wife.”

    This^ right here 100%.

    With all the conditioning being thrown at us from the entertainment industry and main street media the natural mpolarity is out of kilter and the only one with the proper tools to correct it is the man in the relationship. This is done by leading without attention given to the other end of the rope.

  30. @tj

    Q: “Is it safe to assume that in withdrawing attention you men having sex with her also. Is this an indefinite period of time? ”

    A: Yes. As long as you (can) leverage dread upon her she will fear losing you.

    Hey there. Welcome aboard.

    You want more sex. Right?

    Play along with me here.

    Consider your wife an amalgam of 1) unthinking natural existential needs and 2) sentience

    The needs side demands sex, food, air, shelter…

    The sentience side demands knowledge and understanding.

    TRM focuses on correcting women’s (and men’s) belief that men are pure useful workhorses, sometimes for labor and sometimes for sex, run hard and put away wet.

    Men aren’t all #1 satisfiers.

    Disabusing her of your unitary usefulness requires you to remove or threaten to remove that usefulness to her.

    Dread by definition is the fear of nothingness.

    TRM recommends operant conditioning of women to respond to your usefulness with sex.

    It is a negotiation. If you can convince her she’s worse without your labor or sexual attractiveness, she’ll fuck you.

    Know this tj: As long as you use dread y’all are having a 3-way. You, her, and the dread.

    Take the dread away, no sex.

    See? It’s really not about valuing you for you. It’s about denying her basic needs.

    It works. People don’t fear asphyxiation until the noose tightens.

    Dread sex is sex alright and that’s what satisfies most men. They don’t care if their wives are fucking them for the best interest of the marriage, comity and joy of complementarity…or if she’s fucking the insecurity into manageable size.

    If you feel you must right your natural self into something more masculine…..good for you. That’ll help her natural desire to fuck something pretty. As long as you remain pretty, that is.

    Sounds like you are already a few SMV up on her. It should be easy now to dread-drop complete household and emotional collapse upon her head.

    Don’t mind her terror filled crying and pleas for forgiveness. That ship has set sail long ago. Hang tough and you can do whatever you want to her in a few weeks.

    She’ll get her due when she drops her trousers. She wanna play negotiation? You play hardball and watch with amazement.

    Again, welcome aboard.

  31. @EhIntellect

    I was pretty sure on the withdrawal thing, so thanks for confirming that. In my case, we’ve been married over 40 years, so mostly I think a level of taking me for granted is the issue. When I say once a week, I’m more talking about genuine desire sex. We have sex just for me more, but I’m looking for the “Hell Yeah!” girl I married. My second question is more aimed at what is reasonable to expect in terms of her libido.

  32. tj,

    “I’m looking for the “Hell Yeah!” girl I married.”

    Nice….now here’s the rub….put a tack in all that evo-bio stuff…it’s an observation of the sexual dynamic, not the dynamic.

    IMO, desire sex concept is a tortured attempt to lobotomize a woman into sex for AF seed. In short she has no option to choose to fuck you in that HELL YEAH! manner unless you engender it with physical and emotional triggers and/or she peaking in some estrus phase and a bunch of other variables guys kick around here.

    That all above has its place and will not get you what you’re looking for without a lot of work.

    Sentient wrote awhile back that to get in her pants you first get in her mind. True.

    Take a step backwards with me. What in her mind motivates her not to fuck a good looking husband? Something else than pure evo-bio. If what you say is accurate about your physical and emotional self she should be happily banging away atop you. She’s not.

    She’s choosing not to. She not sleeping around, right? You’ve got your macho ducks all aligned, why doesn’t she play the inexorable evo-bio game? Y

    got an AF/BB balance…as far as you can tell…what else is there for you to do?

    You want steamy sex and you deserve it…she does too and would like to give all of herself but she can’t figure this shit out either and might think life is a long, inevitable, slow slide into irrelavance.

    You’re not playing games or being a dick. It’s a matter of no one knows how to or is willing to elicit the “ride or die” in their woman.

    tj, for that wild sex she must choose to
    find her meaning, sexual and otherwise, through you and ONLY you to fuck you like that. You must present yourself as a partner that together with her, 1+1=! or, a you and me against the world scenario or, there’s somewhere special yet unknown you two are going in this life and only you two together can make it go.

    It’s not about trips or toys or $$ or hitting the squat rack or alpha up bro!

    No joke. Look at, and act in real time, as your years with her are an yet unending journey of grand commitment to something special beyond both of you. She’ll think you’ve lost your sense and then soon realize you’ve become that guy she married for all the right reasons years ago when the journey was just starting.

    Then, you tacitly stir her thoughts that only she knows real you, the true crazy you, the guy only she gets to sleep with. Your plentiful self-respect and spirit is something you hold precious and defend to death, even more precious than her…and yet you allow her to share it as you’re THAT type of guy.

    But then again girls don’t like crazy guys.

    No wait….girls ADORE the crazy guys.

    You must ruthlessly let your heart guide your love life. I’m not telling you to be nice. Nope. Be serious as a heart attack about this.

    All in, all the time. Anything else is a overwrought, meat-fisted pick-up algorithm.

    Beware the reaction you’ll get from other women doing such. No need to consciously evoke dread no more. You’ll have to meet out the affection to the ladies judiciously.

    Keep me informed. I expect a lot of fireworks. Stay cool and enjoy the world freak out at your clarity and peace of mind.

  33. Thanks to all who have replied. As far as materials I’ve taken in, I’ve read the first RM book, I follow his blog here obviously, I also follow Dalrock, and used to follow Heartise’s blog. I’m in the middle of reading the 48 Laws of Power. I’ve also watched a lot of RT’s Red Pill 101. Read Athol Kay’s books also.
    Our marriage has been mostly based in a Christian atmosphere. There have been exceptions. At one point, we were separated for 5 years. Went through a major bout of depression during that time. She was a virgin when we first got together, and says she has never been with anyone else.I’m skeptical, but realize she would never admit it, and have no evidence of it. Just kind of a gut feeling, When we got back together, all her friends in the church were dead set against it, and she cut them off to be with me. We have 7 children together, all grown now.
    I’ve always been the dominant in the relationship, as we both believe in Biblical submission. I’ve been incrementally working towards an almost D/s dynamic in the relationship, only from an extreme Biblical point of view. So no DD with us, although she has rules she is expected to follow.
    The one thing that jumped out at me was the statistic that only 28 percent of folks my age consider themselves to be sexually active.So maybe once a week ain’t that bad. I can get her to take care of me a couple more times a week on top of that, but I’d really like to have more of the desire type sex. Maybe I expect too much.

  34. tj,

    “The one thing that jumped out at me was the statistic that only 28 percent of folks my age consider themselves to be sexually active.So maybe once a week ain’t that bad. I can get her to take care of me a couple more times a week on top of that, but I’d really like to have more of the desire type sex. Maybe I expect too much.”

    I was born in 60 and the wife of 38 years in 57 so you have a few years on me, that’s why I say your doing good. It’s no crime to miss the good old days and I can get her hot enough to jump my bones like a crazy woman. One thing is getting it on every day takes the passion out of it, no anticipation lower testosterone and the lack of spontaneity all work against the heat. So once a week for passion sex isn’t bad, just saying.

    If i get wrapped up in my work and miss it the pressure builds and her desire goes up till she’s practically like her old younger self and wanting it bad.

  35. @ tj

    Congrats!!! Once a week is more than a lot of married men half your age can seem to manage after a 7-10 year stretch, and desire sex is damn near out of the question, so you’ve been doing something very right over the last 40 and survived the complications.

  36. @wahoo Mcdaniels

    Sounds like pretty much the same deal as us. Even though I’ve always been dominant, before discovering RP, I believed I ought to have Oneitis, and couldn’t figure out why I couldn’t get there and be happy. So for 40 years I’ve been trying to reconcile that with my default nature. That kind of blue pill dynamic, takes time to turn around. We have made a lot of progress over the last couple years, but I’m not where I want to be yet.

  37. “I’m skeptical, but realize she would never admit it, and have no evidence of it.”

    There’s zero point in ruminating about it.

    As for statistics about human sexuality… they are worthless. You’re killing it 1x weekly. If you want more, you can have more. It requires you to disregard life is a lowest common denominator.

    You miss all the shots you don’t take.

    Look yourself in the mirror. What’s to be gained reliving the past and how does it make you better doing so? IMO, little.

    You’re a great guy posting all you have and you’ve many friends here.

  38. “I believed I ought to have Oneitis, and couldn’t figure out why I couldn’t get there and be happy. So for 40 years I’ve been trying to reconcile that with my default nature.”

    I had oneitis bad over this cheerleader in 75 and even then i stuck to my default and never was faithful to her. The trouble with oneitis is it feels good to have but she doesn’t want it in her man. In fact I think they find it repulsive. I just put it down to a conflict of interest,if there is no conflict she isn’t interested.

    Now at 59 the reality is apparent that I am more attractive for my utility and just how many women can I really afford?

    The oneitis of my youth is a fat bitchy old woman that used to attract all the alpha studs and can’t figure out what happened.

  39. FR in order to see women’s behavior and compare notes

    New bar, new city, in the South. Cab ride was expensive. 30 clients. Oh boy. I got a drink from a bartender and chatted her up. She came from a small town not too far from my home town and wanted me to hit her up for drinks (Ok, now the penny drops). So I watched several line dances drinking my booze. Didn’t know the dances. I finished my booze about the time that a line dance came on that I knew, so I hit the floor. I did a little bit of unusual shit. A lovely, tall young lass with large tracts of land kept bumping me. Could have been drunk, except the last time she zigzagged her finger on the back of my shoulder. Wanted attention, or so I thought. I later asked her to dance and she turned me down.

    Anyway, I asked a pretty young blonde thing to dance (maybe in her teens–she was with her parents) and she at first was gonna decline, but I said that I’d teach her how to dance. She was a good student and followed well. I taught her a couple of dances last night. No hugs. Maybe Mom and Dad being there was a factor, Idk.

    I went to chat up the door man and another guy was there, so I chatted him up. Then I went back inside and drank some water and watched a line dance. Was going back outside when I saw a woman on a screen who looked a little like the cashier and mentioned that to the cashier. We ended up chatting an hour. The cashier mentioned that she and some girlfriends had gone to New Orleans and flashed their titties. Also talked about how her daughter “just got saved.” She talked a lot about her traditional upbringing. A lot. (“I’m a good girl, I am.”) I told her a couple of sexual jokes and she liked them. One thing I noticed–I liked her voice. It was melodious. Always a sign that a girl is interested. Oh, yeah, she was lovely and 32 and blonde with C-cups. And engaged and her fiance was a bartender at the bar. Told me this after 45 mins. Oops. Well, she’d been working at the bar several years with her fiance and she always chatted up customers, apparently. Not a big deal to her, but I was a little freaked out at first.

    The cashier showed me pics of her family and her girlfriends in NO (sorry, no titty pics). But she was baiting me and I wouldn’t take the bait. The cashier asked me to come back next time I was in town. Just being friendly and wanting some attention and validation. And she forgot that she had a fiance and her body language was open until I reminded her. When I left, I shook her hand.

    Went to get a second drink and ordered it from my original bartender, then checked my cash. Uh-oh. Just enough for a cab ride home. I went to cancel the order and the bartender said that it was on her.

  40. Oh, two more observations about the cashier:

    She said that she noticed me dancing (with the young blonde).
    She said that it’s hard for her to compete with younger women.

    My conclusion about the cashier was:

    The cashier was looking for an interesting way to pass her time and she was just teasing someone that she thought might be a player. At one point she was leaning strongly towards me and at that point likely she had forgotten that she was just teasing. Just before I left, the cashier said that she would keep me in her thoughts. She also said that she had a Wild Side ™. Sounds like Girl “Beta Bait” Game ™ to me. I gave her my poker face response.

  41. Palma,

    Consider all these homosexuals define themselves, find existential meaning, by sexual disorder. These types apply all their time, talent and treasure maintaining fictions as if bagel rubbing or gloryholes make a difference beyond orgasm. It’s important to them. Like existential important.

    Homosexual suicide is horrific for this reason. They demand a lie as truth. When the truth is irrepressible, the .45 is in the mouth.

    You ain’t gotta throw it their face. lesbians are the most emotionally, spiritually fragile creatures. They’re women dealing in groupthink fakery.

    You, Palma, aligned with consequence, if only by accident, can run the field in a gay pride situ.

    Hell. Lesbians will spend 20k for IVF consequence that I did for free x 4.

    Severe frame collapse.

    It’s no different than sexless betas asserting less sex is net positive. Tortured logic. Up is down.

    The subtext is: homosexuals, betas, delusional WK’s, pick whatever weakness and insecurity and turn it to a positive ego booster….yet we know….all are living an almost-life.

    All squeeze. No juice.

    Thus the RP calculus yet applies. Gay pride is straight up more cowbell.

    Lesbians, as all women, are evo-bio commanded to fuck penis. The fear of full existential commitment freaks them the fuck out…yet all that generation is commanded of them.

    My approach with lesbians is that they are fearful girls…..wait…..they’re all fearful girls….

    Lesbians are looking for consequence and in all the wrong places. They need a constant artiface spackling. No different than jerkoffs here at TRM demanding unfruitful in-the-100’s n-count is street cred beyond douchey RP posturing.

    GAY.

    No one of any basic value cares how many people a guy has fucked.

    Yet everyone fears an inconsequential life…aka…purposeless death.

    Inconsequential death is lesbianism’s, well everyone’s, thumbscrew.

    Turn that thumbscrew and subtly so and you’ll pull lesbians.

  42. Cashier girl started the night with “Yes sir” and “No sir” and ended it with “Yes, Baby” and “See you later, Baby.” I don’t doubt that she was trying her Girl Game ™ on me, but I also don’t doubt that she was feeling affection.

    (For you spergs, no, affection isn’t sexual desire. Affection isn’t DTF. She was bringing up lots of sexual topics, though. Don’t get all spergy, now, I’m not saying that she was DTF. I’m just saying that she wasn’t looking to use me to cuddle with. There was some sexual interest.)

  43. Sailor – you asked about gay pride. I went there on the weekend! It was pretty fun! One of my friends got laid, so yeah, it’s possible. In fact, i’d say 80+% of the girl there are just straight girls looking to have fun, get drunk, and show off their bodies.

    Here’s the FR

    Went to Brighton (UK) on the weekend. It was full of hot, half naked girls, so tonnes of girls too approach

    Initially me and the guys I was with done some AA exercises and were trying to get girls to dance with us on the street. Me and one dude got lots of rejections, but the 3rd guy (very handsome indeed. Looks like a young Dicaprio) killed it lol. He was getting numbers and young girls throwing themselves at him as soon as he got near them.

    I got one girl to dance with me out of all of my attempts and I told her she was cute and she volunteered her number. She was very young and cute.

    I hit on a group of girls on the beach. The one I liked was a professional model whose been in music vids for Greenday and a few others. Solid 8.5. She also had a hot sister. 8. DHV, Cold read, tease, ask questions etc etc, but No luck. I just wasn’t her type. (Although the hot sister wanted my handsome, ‘Dicaprio’ friend despite him not really talking and being a bit shy lol)

    Then went bar hopping and made maybe 15 approaches or so, mainly around the bar area or on the dancefloor, but no bites. Mainly just insta-rejections or just opening girls who weren’t really interested and not really talking back much. None of my push pull stuff or cold reads etc was able to ‘flip’ them on this occasion. Not to worry

    Part of the reason I went is because the 2 guys I went with work together with 2 hot girls who I was hoping to meet and try my luck with, but DiCaprio has already banged them BOTH so he didn’t want to see them as he said it’d be awkward, and so I never got to meet them.

    I Got a call from the girl whose number I got earlier on the street, but I couldn’t hear her in the club, so I rang her back and text her, but she never replied. Grrr!!” haha

    Handsome friend pulled a barely legal teenager who he’d met earlier that day and went to go bang her despite the horrific age gap lol (she was stunning to be fair, though)

    Other friend made out with a pretty girl who I thought was like 21 but she was actually in her 30’s!! Good genes! He Didn’t bang though. She had a boyfriend

  44. “There was some sexual interest.”

    Thanks for always making me laugh man 😂. The 5+ dislikes you get on your comments are the cherry on top.

  45. J, the broad was outta your league. You wudna have even approached her, much less chatted with her. C cups and she was pushing her tits at me all night with both body language and shit like “I went to New Orleans and we flashed our tits” and “I didn’t like my fiance at first. He swatted my tits.” I think she also was wearing a push up bra.

    I figured that she bought her tits. The guy was just checking by swatting.

    You keep me laughing, too, with your FRs of average broads. They are low-hanging fruit to me. Different strokes…

  46. Reposting my post, I wrote on investment for sedfast’s private reddit group…

    Recently there was a question, posed on one of the facebook groups I’m in, on Todd V’s evaluation concept. The person asked, if the girl you’re interested in, is giving you boring unimpressive answers to you’re evaluation questions, what should you do?

    For those of you who don’t know, Evaluation, according to todd, is basically doing anything that sets the frame that she has to impress you. Making it clear that she is being evaluated here, and not that you just decided you like her from moment one. Something as simple as saying, “you’re actually pretty ok” or looking at her with a puzzled face, “what”? to an answer she gives you, so that she has to justify herself to you, would fall under this concept.

    So that’s evaluation. And the guy who posed the question WASN’T impressed by any of her answers. Just her looks. According to Todd, he should move on, because she’s failed the evaluation process. And this is where Todd is wrong or the way this guy’s understanding of evaluation at least. Because the purpose of evaluation isn’t to extract “impressive” responses from the girl you want to fuck or else you’ll walk away. The purpose is so that she can invest/qualify herself.

    She invests. And then you reward that investment. so that it creates a good feeling in her. And will therefore, want to continue to keep investing to get more of that good feeling she gets for doing so. Which works very much in our favor.

    Investment is, as I’m sure Teevster will talk about in one of his upcoming articles, one way to combat Female State Control (FSC). FSC is a defense mechanism that auto-regulates a woman’s state whenever she feels that her emotions are getting out of control. And that often happens when you rely on one form of generating compliance: Spiking her emotions.

    Compliance is simply a girl’s willingness to agree to a certain request of yours.

    If you make a girl laugh/horny. Pass her shit tests. (end result of these is a spike her emotions (/\/\/)). She will be willing to follow your lead to the dance floor and dance with you. Maybe even let you touch her body/face….get turned on in the process and make out with you…because of the good emotions you’re generating in her. Sometimes this alone can be enough for her to go ditch her friends and go home with you. So yeah. In those situations, where the girl didn’t invest anything of herself. There was no connection. None of you guys even got to exchange names, jobs, or even age. Both of you were just horny that night and wanted to fuck.

    But what usually tends to happen in those situations where you DO end up fucking the girl (because most of the time you won’t fuck that girl by running this sort of game, because FSC kicks in), is that those sets often end in One Night Stands. She got what she wanted and doesn’t want to pursue anything further. And if you also don’t want to pursue anything further, well then it doesn’t really matter. Both of you had a fun night together. exchanged a couple of orgasms (hopefully!) and you can add another N to your total N-count. But most guys, that end up pulling hot girls, want to fuck them more than once. This strategy makes that a lot less likely to happen.

    On the other hand, If you can make that girl invest (basically, get her to the point where she’s giving you long-winded emotionally rich answers about herself. Because she wants to impress you), then you will also find, that she is willing to agree to your requests. The interaction may even look kinda boring to novice onlookers because of the noticeable lack of emotional spikes.

    But by focusing on getting compliance via investment rather than solely focusing on spiking Buying Temperature, FSC WON’T kick in (that phenomenon, Teevster talks about where her logical mind wakes up (some call this “out of state”. But with investment you don’t even need to worry about this occurring), and realizes, “holy shit we don’t even know this guy. What are we doing? This is a mistake. Lets stop this” and then all that emotional arousal you built up throughout the night drops right down back to zero. Bring her compliance levels down with it (her “willingness to go home with you” is the highest level of compliance. and now its 4a.m and her compliance level is near zero). Because she feels a connection with you. And feels in control of the situation (and this is key because her feeling in control of the situation creates comfort. If she’s uncomfortable, she simply will not allow herself to get carried away with you). She’s logically decided she wants to go home with you.

    Anyway what led to me writing this post, is that this other guy, on the facebook group, referred him to RSDLuke’s material on investment. I took a look at it myself, and was quite surprised to discover, that Luke has it down. I’ve never seen anyone (besides Saul Tee, who I will get to in a second) explain investment so well. So that’s what I’m here to do. Break down this investment formula, so that its simple for guys (beginners and intermediates) to understand, and start using right way. Because seduction shouldn’t be so confusing.

    RSDLuke’s formula is: investment hoop -> her investment -> reward.
    rinse repeat.

    Ideally this is what you want. Her investing on every single investment hoop you throw at her. but if we’re being realistic here, we know that not all girls are just gonna want to pour out all this investment right off the bat. Especially to a complete stranger she’s never met before. So the gold in Luke’s videos is that he goes over what to do when she DOESN’T invest. and that is:

    Investment hoop -> non compliant -> tease -> smaller investment hoop -> her investment -> reward.

    How does he know she will invest to that smaller investment hoop, even tho she was non compliant to the initial hoop? It’s because it allows her to save face. And that’s the genius of it. In order for her to not feel the awkward social pressure, she HAS to invest.

    Example:

    You: what’s your favorite place you ever traveled to? [investment hoop]
    Her: umm i don’t know. I don’t really travel that often tbh [non compliant answer]
    You: oh you’re one of those girls, huh? Why travel to interesting places all over the world, and immerse yourself in foreign cultures, when you can just sit at home, and look at pics through your laptop? (then imitate her, “hmm let me google, Effiel tower real quick. oh that actually looks interesting. Welp I don’t need to travel to Paris anymore 😃”[tease]
    Her: hahaha no it’s just that I’m always so busy. And I don’t have time to travel blah blah [qualifying herself/justifying herself]
    You: ah ok. so where’s the last place you traveled to? [smaller investment hoop. allowing her to save face by making it easy for them]
    Her: um i was in Greece with my sister last summer [her investment]
    You: oh nice! [reward] wait. were you guys in Mykonos? Cause I know what really goes on over there you know 😉(giving her a mischievous facial expression) [exploring topic]

    So that last part, “exploring topic”, is from Saul Tee. Luke’s investment structure is very similar to tee’s structure, only that saul throws a tease/disqualifer (can also add cold read, sexual misinterpretation, and takeaway) before asking an investment hoop question.

    So its:

    Tease/disqualifer/cold read/takeaway -> investment hoop -> her investing -> reward -> explore topic -> repeat.

    an example of this from his book, “Technical Game Bible”:

    Validation Stripping and Reinforcement
    Her: I go to Yale
    You: Really? I thought it was suppose to be for high achievers…how did you mange to sneak in? [tease. You stripped your validation from her. Creating an emotional vacuum, which triggers the desire for her to correct and prove you wrong]
    Her: (laughs) no seriously I’m actually smarter than I look
    You: okay…whats the most intellectually challenging task you’ve ever accomplished [investment hoop]
    Her: Well during my first year in Yale [out-pour of investment]
    she now invests and qualifies in order to fill that emotional vacuum and get your approval/validation back.
    You: okay, thats actually pretty cool. i like the fact that you enjoy challenging yourself in such an intellectual capacity. most girls tend to try and breeze on their looks alone. [rewarding her investment].

    For hotter girls tho, you can actually punish (by punish I mean tease/disqualifier) her investment, to get even BIGGER investment from her.

    His example:

    You: so what do you do here? [investment hoop]
    Her: well I…[cut her off] and please don’t tell me bottle service girl or stripper
    Implication of that statement being that you’re unimpressed by those things (as well as a hint of preselection suggesting I’m bored with these girls) and that she needs to have something more going for her before she can win you over.
    Her: no i own a company and i do VIP service for…..[continues investing]
    [cut her off] i really hope thats not just a fancy way of saying ‘i’m a table girl’ [tease]
    Typically this is where you would be rewarding her investment. but since this is the type of girl who loves getting challenged as it only happens to her with extremely high value men, you can push the boundaries here.
    Her: No well the way it works is that one of my best friends is the [goes on for another few minutes with more investment] and when i moved back out here all my friends were already married with kids..
    You: [as soon as she mentioned her friends are married with kids] are you jealous?
    [another challenge, this time referring to the fact that her friends are married with kids]
    her: yes
    [tap her stomach lightly] i can put a kid in here tonight if you want [sexual innuendo. sexual frame]
    her: [playfully] shut up…
    You: alright…we’ll use a condom then (reframe her rejection of the sexual frame)
    her: [laughs] i like your personality
    big IOI and implicit acceptance of sexual frame
    You: good..so you’re not just using me for my looks
    [flipping the script with a prizing frame.]
    You: go on though…your friends are all married, kids…{investment hoop]
    her: yeah exactly so i just need some 9-5 thing to do. i only….[more investment]
    You: damn…i like the fact that unlike most girls here you’ve actually got some real things going on in your life. [reward]

    Getting investment from her, while also setting a sexual frame. Powerful stuff.

    So finally to end this post, lets take all these elements apart and talk about them separately:

    Investment hoop – These are simply questions you ask her. as you progress through the seduction, you want the questions you ask to become more personal/deeper to elicit those strong emotionally rich answers. For example, “where are you from?” is a low level investment hoop. Not much emotions, but its still generates investment from her (she doesn’t HAVE to tell you anything). “what’s the craziest thing you ever done?” would be a mid-level investment hoop (asking this question at the beginning, will most likely render you a mild non-sexual answer (that is of course, when you ask the follow up smaller investment hoop. simply because her compliance level won’t be high enough to get you that juicy answer you’re after. unless she’s really into you right away). Which is why that investment hoop is better reserved for later in the seduction process when you have more compliance.
    Tease/Disqualifer: RSDLuke’s go-to is “don’t be gay” to any non compliant response to your investment hoop. “ Come on. Don’t give me this bullshit answer little girl” (said jokingly! not serious). But you can come up with your own tease/disqualifer/takeaway/cold read, according to your sense of humor/style. Maybe this tease, will get her to respond to your investment hoop, but more likely she will respond some form of, “noooooo I don’t really know hahaha” in which case its time to throw her a smaller investment hoop to allow her to save face. But please keep in mind, that the purpose of teasing/disqualifying her or yourself – is to create that vacuum so that she is more likely to want to qualify to the investment hoop you’re about to throw at her. Because the state of mind you’re putting her in is one in which, she wants to prove that what you just said is wrong or not true about her. Its human nature to want to defend ourselves whenever someone says something wrong about us.Its a means to an end. You don’t want to be stuck teasing/entertaining her all night. Remember the goal.
    Small investment hoop: Luke’s comment on smaller hoops, is to give them questions that are easy to answer, that don’t involve creativity from her. Because the goal is simply an answer. That you can then build on.
    Reward: Once again Luke, on the two types of rewards via examples for each:

    Disbelief reward – “get the fuck outta here. no way. shut the fuck up. i don’t believe you that cant be true. “there’s no way that you’re from [place she says she from]. thats awesome! what’s your favorite thing about that place?”

    Belief reward – “that’s so cool, thats awesome. I’m so proud of you for. that’s actually amazing that you blah blah.”

    Just keep doing this over and over until, you reach the point, where you ask her your final investment hoop, “hey you want to continue this conversation somewhere else?” 😉

    Hope this was useful. For more, be sure to check out these clips by Luke:

    11:15 – 15:05 in this one https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4_yBKY_4eX8
    This entire fluff-free 12 minute video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RF-aFEP3tjs
    Read Saul Tee’s Technical Game Bible.

    But to really sink in how important investment is…

    In the first video above (12:20-13:00), Luke talks about a very familiar situation majority of guys face in cold approach pickup: You’re talking with your target in isolation. and then her friends come over to check on her.

    If you’re a cold approacher, you know that if her friends aren’t sure about you (Because you don’t look like the type of guy she usually hooks up with). Or they notice their friend is giggling a lot, because you’ve been spiking her tipsy ass’ buying temperature, they are very likely gonna cockblock you and try to take her away from you (“umm we have to go to the bathroom – to cool off her BT. so that when she comes back, you’re nothing to her), because they know she’s in a vulnerable state and don’t want her to go home with a stranger they don’t approve of. By instead focusing on investment, like Luke explains in the clip, you have nothing to worry about. You’re chill. And because SHE’S the one telling off her friends, they’ll back off. without you having to defensively be all, “oh hey guys!!!” in your chody attempt at trying to “win the friends over” so you don’t get cockblocked.

    And one more example of the investment process. For when she’s shit testing/non-compliant:

    You: so do you live here or are you visiting? [investment hoop]
    Her: I’m not going home with you [shit test/non compliance]
    You: Damnnnn bitch. who said anything about going home with me? are you really one of the girls whose always got sex on her mind? besides I think you might be a little too young for me [misinterpreting+disqualifying]
    Her: hahah. oh really?
    You: maybe you might be mature for your age…what’s something you do besides going out clubbing? [investment hoop]
    Her: oh I’m actually not mature at all haha [non compliant]
    You: Yeah. You know what? You actually remind me of my niece. She is a really beautiful girl. But she is so fucking silly. And gets into all kinds of trouble at school. Always in detention. I bet that’s exactly what you were like as a little girl [cold read]
    Her: yeah hahaa how did you know?
    You: Come on girl. It’s so obvious. What was something you did silly you did back in school. I won’t judge. pinky swear [investment hoop]
    Her: Ok you promise you won’t laugh? ok so this one time [investing]
    You: Hhahaha damn that’s hilarious(reward). But you know. I think that’s actually pretty tame compared to what I was like in school. [baiting her so you can DHV]
    Her: omg what did you do?
    You: [DHV/exploring topic/commonality about being troublemakers in school]

    Investment hoop -> non compliance -> punish -> smaller investment hoop – keep repeating until you get her investment. then offer a small reward for doing so, and explore that topic.

    1. @j

      “Reposting my post, I wrote on investment for sedfast’s private reddit group… ”

      Many thanks for this — very helpful for me as a game newbie.

      “Investment hoop -> non compliance -> punish -> smaller investment hoop – keep repeating until you get her investment. then offer a small reward for doing so, and explore that topic.”

      And the beauty of the Investment Hoop model, it seems to me, is that it weaves in building attraction and compliance in a way that creates comfort while side-stepping any objections a woman might throw your way, because SHE does all the work to qualify for your attention.

      TantumErgo

  47. Just now… Cooking dinner which I’ll do occasionally when I’m inspired (I’m a way better cook than she is and she hates it). Her: “are you using garlic?”… Me: “Yep”… Her: “You know garlic doesn’t go well with what you’re cooking”… Me: (Without even looking up from the pan)… “Hmm. Well maybe you better come finish it then”… Her: “No reason to get so angry!”

    Me: No response… No acknowledgement… I don’t even look up.

    15 year old daughter at dinner 10 minutes later: “Dad, this is awesome!… Like one of my favorite meals”

    Wife: “Yeah, this is really good.”

    Me: “Yeah…not bad is it”

  48. J

    It’s good to see people bringing back Mystery Method… If only they could be honest about it. Mystery has a whole Chapter about Frame Control, Hoop Theory and using Bait-Hook-Reel-Release… Chapter 7 on A3…

    At least Todd Valentine (fka Xaneus) and Owen Cook of RSD were AT Project Hollywood being taught by Mystery in the early Aughts… Teevster lol.

    What’s AS important as BHRR etc. is the Sequencing…

    Mystery Method

    “Many of the tactics in the game are not designed to attract her but rather to use that attraction as bait in order to get her more invested in her interaction with you. (See chapter 7 for these tactics.) ” Page 30

    “As you proceed with the pickup, keep the woman just inside that window between revalidation and rejection. She must be baited to chase in small increments, just like a cat with a string. ” Page 37

    “A3, C1. He uses takeaways to bait her into chasing after him to earn his affections. As she becomes more invested in the interaction, he rewards her with indicators of interest. Then he moves her to a quiet area of the bar to begin building comfort. ” Page 65

    “It could be said that attraction is only a tool In A3, you will use her interest, combined with takeaways and screening, to bait the target into demonstrating value of her own. When she demonstrates value in an attempt to win you over, reward her with IOIs, then bait her again as the process repeats. In this way, her reward is tied to her investment. As she demonstrates value, she is simultaneously rewarded and baited to demonstrate more value. ” Page 126-127

    “When you can bait a woman into working for your affections and you can convey your resulting “growing pair bond” effectively, you have mastered A3 and are ready to move into comfort. ” Page 127

    “Indeed, few would jump into that hoop, which would be tantamount to accepting the frame that one is in fact his bitch. So… what you want to do is start small. Bait the target into innocuous little hoops: “Could you hold my drink for a sec? Thanks.” Over time, as she falls into your frame, those hoops can become larger and more frequent. In the science of social dynamics, this process is known as compliance momentum. Soon she’ll derive pleasure from rubbing your back and cooking your dinner, but for now start small by making her guess your age. ” Page 131

    “Bait—Hook—Reel—Release The bait—hook—reel—release fishing-for-investment metaphor is one that continually resurfaces in study of the Game. One way to apply it is in A3. You want to give IOIs to the target, but you don’t want to seem too easy. (Otherwise she won’t value your pair bond; instead, she will enjoy your IOIs as a validation of her sexual power, but she will lose attraction for you.)

    The idea is to make the woman demonstrate higher value to you. Bait her into telling you interesting things about herself (not “What do you do?”) so when she replies (the hook) you can IOI her (reel her in) only to push her off again (release her from the pressure of being hit on).

    This process repeats several times.

    Here is aft example for you to Use in-field right away: You: [Bait] What nationality are you? Her: [Hook] French. You: [Reel] Seriously? No way! The girl I had the biggest crush on in high school was French! [Release] I can’t even talk to you now,

    Every time she gives you a demonstration of higher value, indicate your interest to her. This way she will believe your IOIs, and when you fully SOI her, she will feel like she really deserves it. This allows your attraction for her to legitimately grow over several minutes, instead of just IOIing her because she first IOIed you. An important aspect of the Mystery Method is to restructure routines to be in context with your particular identity.

    Take the time to write up some personalized routines with this in mind. Again, make yours congruent with your identity. You do not have to be a magician to do the Mystery Method, but you do need a strong identity.

    Here is an example, using my identity: Mystery: If you could be anything in the world with no chance of failure, what would you want to be? And don’t say princess. Girl: Um, an actress. Mystery: Really? When I was little I wanted to grow up and be a magician. And you know what I am now? A magician! So you want to be an actress. I’m living proof that our dreams can come true. It would be so cool if you were an actress. I love that! We need to figure out how to make that happen. I bet you’d be an amazing actress. But what if you get more attention than me? I can’t even hang out with you now.

    The bait—hook—reel—release metaphor perfectly matches the A3 process described in this chapter, whether applied to screening, hoops, kino escalation, or compliance testing.

    Here are some examples: Bait-challenge her Hook—she DHVs for you Reel—give her an SOI Release—false disqualifier Bait—give her a compliance test Hook—FAILURE; she defies Release—give her an IOD Bait—DHV in some way Hook—she gives IOIs Reel—kino escalation Release—throw her hand away Bait—give her a compliance test Hook—SUCCESS; she complies Reel—kino escalation Release—push her away Baif—ask her a screening question Hook—she qualifies herself to you Reel—give her an IOI Release—false time constraint ” Page 152-153

    “The bait can be a challenge, a screening, a screening question, a compliance test, a takeaway, a hoop, or so on. These are only examples. The truth is that bait can be anything. It can be a subtle cue in your body language. It can be an allusion to a tempting bounce, giving her an opportunity to show interest in joining you. Find what works for you through experimentation and field-testing. ” Page 154

    Tantum do yourself a huge favor. Study the source, what most of these guys are copying out right or stumbling into for the first time and think it’s new…

  49. Is this guy legit?

    From what I can see, his ‘system’ (that he sells for like $500 or whatever) is to go up to girls, say ‘I had to meet you’, tell them that you think they are hot, tell them that you are a DJ, talk about the height difference between you and the girl (be tall!), tell her it’s your friends birthday, ask if she likes grey goose, invite her back to your place, have sex

    I’m not sure where the ‘skill’ element comes into any of that tbh lol

  50. Ford

    his ‘system’ (that he sells for like $500 or whatever) is to go up to girls, say ‘I had to meet you’, tell them that you think they are hot, tell them that you are a DJ, talk about the height difference between you and the girl (be tall!), tell her it’s your friends birthday, ask if she likes grey goose, invite her back to your place, have sex

    For ANOTHER $500 he will let you in on his SOOPER SECRET last step which is GUARANTEED to work…

    Pay her.

  51. @Sentient

    It’s not mystery method ffs. This is the investment process used by Saul Tee and RSDLuke, broken down by me for beginners and intermediates.

    If this was mystery method, then ya boy, WestIndieArchie would have told his audience, “brahs this is just a rehash of mystery method. Don’t even bother reading this shit. Just get the original MM”). Instead, he’s dedicated a 3 part series on his blog.

    Hell even Mystery didn’t come up with his own method by himself. Oh you didn’t know that Mystery Method was based on a modified version of R. Don Steele’s 1989 Find-Meet-Talk-Date formula? Well now you know.

    2007: “Hey that’s just the FMTD formula! Nah brah this is an improved and updated version of that shit.

    2019: “Hey that’s just MM! Nah brah this is an improved and updated version of that shit.

  52. LOl

    RSDLuke’s formula is: investment hoop -> her investment -> reward.
    rinse repeat.

    Yeah that’s totally different from:

    “When she demonstrates value in an attempt to win you over, reward her with IOIs, then bait her again as the process repeats. In this way, her reward is tied to her investment. ”

    Better pay Luke… (aka Tyler…)

  53. “Yeah that’s totally different from”

    Yes…It is.

    “Then bait her again as the process repeats”

    You dont bait her again, following the reward you gave her for investing. You explore the topic with her (as I mentioned in my post). Starting with fun and interesting topics, then transitioning into a emotionally stimulating ones, before moving on to sexually arousing topics. Then fractionating all the way back to fun and interesting topics. Repeating the process again.

    That’s not MM.

  54. J

    Well I know reading is not your strong suit.

    Tell me what does “rinse, repeat” mean? lol

    from your OWN post:

    RSDLuke’s formula is: investment hoop -> her investment -> reward.
    rinse repeat.

    Ideally this is what you want. Her investing on every single investment hoop you throw at her. but if we’re being realistic here, we know that not all girls are just gonna want to pour out all this investment right off the bat. Especially to a complete stranger she’s never met before. So the gold in Luke’s videos is that he goes over what to do when she DOESN’T invest. and that is:

    Investment hoop -> non compliant -> tease -> smaller investment hoop -> her investment -> reward.

    How does he know she will invest to that smaller investment hoop, even tho she was non compliant to the initial hoop? It’s because it allows her to save face. And that’s the genius of it. In order for her to not feel the awkward social pressure, she HAS to invest.

    You are talking about MULTIPLE compliance tests, and hoops… In the same interaction. Because they BUILD to larger compliance…

    which is what Mystery taught Tyler and Todd (who taught Luke)…

    here:

    “Indeed, few would jump into that hoop, which would be tantamount to accepting the frame that one is in fact his bitch. So… what you want to do is start small. Bait the target into innocuous little hoops: “Could you hold my drink for a sec? Thanks.” Over time, as she falls into your frame, those hoops can become larger and more frequent. In the science of social dynamics, this process is known as compliance momentum. “

    The “genius of it” is “it” is copied right from Mystery… Maybe actually read MM with an open mind…

  55. “Tell me what does “rinse, repeat” mean? lol”

    Rinse repeat the investment process. Throughout the interaction. Not immediately following a reward. You want to explore the topic. There are frames to be sets, my man. Investment alone won’t get you gonna get you laid. But this post was specifically on investment so yeah.

    If that was made unclear….my bad homie 😎

    ‘You are talking about MULTIPLE compliance tests, and hoops… In the same interaction. Because they BUILD to larger compliance…”

    Yeah..

    “which is what Mystery taught Tyler and Todd (who taught Luke)…”

    That’s fantastic. That means they are well qualified to be able to innovate on what they learned from him back then…

    ”Over time, as she falls into your frame, those hoops can become larger and more frequent. In the science of social dynamics, this process is known as compliance momentum”

    Yep thats exactly how it works. Unfortunately mystery’s method of getting investment via bait hook release is a bit outdated. Saul’s investment process works better to accomplish what you quoted above..which is why I mentioned him instead of mystery in my post….

  56. https://youtu.be/XF1aumE3O8M

    Incredible. 12 years post book release, and the man’s STILL using the same examples in his book.

    But yeah. You don’t have to wait till A3 to start asking investment hoops. You can do that well before moving her to a quieter area. Hell, her passing your investment hoops could be the reason why you want to move her to a quieter area. Because you liked her answer.

    Rookies listen to this shit and are like, I’m not suppose to ask her questions about herself here. I’m suppose to DHV until she gives me multiple IOIs lol. But she’s not giving me IOIs to my DHV stacks? What do I do? lol

  57. Baby J (now baited into hearing frim the master)

    “You don’t have to wait till A3 to start asking investment hoops.”

    Of course. You CAN just go up to her on the open and say “Hold my cock”…

    Or give her some “fractionated sex talk” lol. As she walks away.

    OR you could run solid game and move when conditions are optimal.

    Refer back to my post were I remind that Sequence is as Important as Technique.

    Once again for the cheap seats. MM is about solid game, repeatable, predictable…

  58. “You CAN just go up to her on the open and say “Hold my cock”…”

    https://www.logicallyfallacious.com/tools/lp/Bo/LogicalFallacies/30/Appeal-to-Extremes

    “Or give her some “fractionated sex talk” lol”

    Ahhhh you don’t know how to sex talk. I get it. It’s cool tho. Not for everyone.

    “MM is about solid game, repeatable, predictable…”

    Right. Because you, a MM practitioner, are drowning in a sea of new pussy in between posts here…lol.

  59. There were quite a few days when I woke up and knew I needed some serious sex, I’d go to a party/house party, and announce to any grouping of females in attendance , ” I’m fucking somebody, or everybody here”.

    … don’t get what this https://www.logicallyfallacious.com/tools/lp/Bo/LogicalFallacies/30/Appeal-to-Extremes really has to do with anything at all. Lol, but I didn’t spend a lot of time reading stuff like this.

    Ime, ” hold my cock ” works best when you actually produce said cock to be held.

    Lol.

  60. ford

    I don’t understand the purpose of videos like this. I’m serious.

    [youtube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PFkvM8IGsL0&w=830&h=471%5D

    Is he legit? who knows really, but 1000+ girls in 30 countries ( lmao )and 15 years of ” coaching “?

    I find the reasoning behind this kind of acrobatics confusing.

    Why not fuck 1000 girls in your home state or your home country and save the money? What’s the purpose of banging Poland or some shit?

    Girls fuck. Everywhere. Here, there, everywhere. Why fly to Bulgaria or some shit to have pussy? What’s different? ( any answer is a lie because anatomically, there’s no difference ). It’s all in his head, and in the heads of anyone he can convince that he’s pulled off some impossible feat that no man before him could have ever dreamed of.

    So is he saying he’s fucked 1000 girls in 15 years?

    Look at it this way ( because I always do immediately ), 1000 girls in 15 years breaks out to 66 chicks a year, which sound like a lot until you break it out to 66 chicks a year is 1.269…. chicks a week. ( not certain what .269 of a chick is, but ” maths “. )

    Is 1 chick a week a monumental task for any man that sets his mind to it? Lol, especially if he’s willing to spend his coinage flying all over God’s creation to do this?

    15 years….

    ” Gene says: “I didn’t do drugs in the crazy times but I did do sex.

    “Did I sleep with 4,800 women?

    “So they tell me.

    “I did have the Polaroids to prove it, oh yes.

    “But most of them were burned. “

    Gene Simmons

    At 7’1″, Wilt Chamberlain may have been the most dominating and amazing basketball player of all time. In his legendary career, Chamberlain scored 31,419 points, including the unbelievable time he actually scored 100 points in one game. He holds dozens of unbreakable basketball records.

    In addition to his accomplishments on the court, Chamberlain also authored four books. None of the others created nearly the stir and controversy as his 1991 book, A View From Above. In it, the basketball great claimed to have slept with 20,000 different women during his life.

    A media firestorm erupted, and Chamberlain was attacked from all sides. The country was at the height of the AIDS crisis, and activists criticized Wilt for his promiscuity. He also came under fire in African-American circles for promoting black racial stereotypes. And feminists resented his blatant sexism for using women in such a manner.

    To Wilt’s credit (I guess), he never backed down from his claim, never said he was just “bragging” or “stretching the truth.” He simply stated: “I was just laying it out there for people who were curious.”

    Wilt was emphatic that he never went to bed with a married woman. “I was just doing what was natural—chasing good-looking ladies, whoever they were and wherever they were.” But could he really sleep with 20,000 different women? Let’s analyze it.

    DOING THE MATH

    If Wilt started at the age of 15, from then up to the age of 55 (when the book was published) he would have had 40 years to sleep with 20,000 women, or 500 different women a year—easy math.

    That works out to roughly 1.4 women a day.

    According to close friends, Wilt loved threesomes. According to legend, he was intimate with 23 different women on one 10-day road trip. Wilt was also a lifelong insomniac, sometimes just not sleeping at all. He probably would take a woman to bed any time he couldn’t fall asleep.

    But the time factor is an interesting point. A close childhood friend, Tom Fitzhugh, said, “I don’t remember him having a date. He was probably a virgin when he left high school.” So let us assume Wilt really started around the age of 18, which ups the average to 1.5 women per day for 37 years.

    Additionally, he did have a six-month schedule, for 14 seasons, of playing professional basketball. That’s 82 games a season, not including playoffs, exhibitions, practices, and travel time.

    The fact that he said 20,000 different women also leaves little time for repeats, or love. And what about sickness? Everyone gets sick once in a while, which would have cost Wilt precious time during those 37 to 40 sexually active years.

    But most incredibly, even with those reported 20,000 sexual liaisons, Wilt is not known to have contracted any serious sexually transmitted diseases. Nor was there ever a woman who came forward with an unplanned pregnancy, a “little Wilt,” or a paternity suit.

    And what about turndowns? Every guy in human history has been turned down by a woman at some point. One can only wonder at Wilt’s rejections … probably extremely few, to manage that 20,000 record.”

    ( btw, I believe Wilt slept with a CRAZY number of women, being an athlete and all, but I’ve never bought that 20,000 number )

    So ford, the question is: do you believe it’s feasible for a man to sleep with 1-2 women a week for 15 years if that is what he sets his mind to do? Even if he’s not famous?

    I can’t tell if any of these video dudes actually have any super strong Game because they are selling something and marketing themselves to an audience. but the numbers aren’t that far fetched. I personally don’t see the point in doing that over a decade and a half. Like saying ” I’ve eaten 1,500 steaks in 30 countries!!!”.

  61. “I’d go to a party/house party, and announce to any grouping of females in attendance , ” I’m fucking somebody, or everybody here”.

    … don’t get what this https://www.logicallyfallacious.com/tools/lp/Bo/LogicalFallacies/30/Appeal-to-Extremes really has to do with anything at all.”

    Well…We’re not talking about what worked, this one time at band camp…we’re talking about solid game and consistency. Under the Mystery Method mode, you are suppose to go up and talk talk talk. Until she’s given you back sufficient interest. What Mystery calls A2 – Female to Male Interest.

    My argument (which 4 years of field experience has backed up) is that you CAN ask questions. Literally anytime you want. Placing restrictions like this, only serves to put new guys who don’t know any better, inside their own heads (“fuck I can’t come up with something to say. And Mystery says I’m not suppose to ask her any questions right now cause she hasn’t shown much interest in me yet”. Self eject). So ask away….just remember why you’re here. That’s it.

    Sentient equates THAT argument to running up to a random girl and saying, “aye bish, hold my cock for a sec will ya?” Hence my link, brah.

  62. J

    You know I love ya, goes without saying.

    I’ll shut up and defer to your 4 years of field experience.

    … sorry to interrupt.

  63. “Well…We’re not talking about what worked, this one time at band camp…we’re talking about solid game and consistency. Under the Mystery Method mode, you are suppose to go up and talk talk talk.”

    not necessarily

    Nonverbal communication is essential. Talk is what fills in the gaps and is optional.

    I showed up for a “study date” and just studied for ten minutes, but I noticed that the girl kept looking at me over her book. I walked over to her and she closed her eyes and pursed her lips and I kissed her. We greeted when we had both arrived and that was the sum total of talk.

    Try working a bar without saying a word–just using body language to establish your dominance and to request compliance from girls.

  64. I never went to bandcamp, and I thought I knew about consistent game decades ago, but I guess I don’t know what’s going on now…in the last 4 years….in the field.

    😂

    Must’ve been in a coma that I don’t know about.

    I hate when that happens.

  65. @J ”My argument (which 4 years of field experience has backed up) is that you CAN ask questions. Literally anytime you want. Placing restrictions like this, only serves to put new guys who don’t know any better, inside their own heads (“fuck I can’t come up with something to say. And Mystery says I’m not suppose to ask her any questions right now cause she hasn’t shown much interest in me yet”. Self eject). So ask away….just remember why you’re here. That’s it.”

    Yeah, I ditched the strict mysterymethod stuff due to this initially. Millions of weird rules and stages etc, and once I saw other guys breaking every single mysterymethod rule and killing it (both online and my wings etc), it was clear that there’s lots of ways to skin the cat and it was just unnecessary to worry about his rules and the ‘order’ that you are allowed to do certain things etc.

    The other thing that put me off a little was his infields (some of which have unfortunately been deleted – in particular one I wanted to post) – like, despite apparently being the master, he just wasn’t impressive. He seemed to bore girls (and their friends) with his dhv stories and stuff and he’d dance around for ages only to eventually get a kiss close with some 40 year old on his best sets. Simply, his results didn’t seem that good? I think he claimed to have had sexual contact with 52 women from 1992 to 1998, but he was also going out 4 times a week, approaching 3 women per hour on average.

    I just personally feel like it’s kinda simple – what’s important is that she thinks you’re decent looking, and from that pre-requisite/point, you just need to show some confidence, charisma, and be sure to escalate and deal with logistics issues stuff. Whether you do direct or indirect, or use ‘Hook, Reel, Release’, or ask interview questions after opening, or compliance tests, or bother to qualify her etc, just doesn’t seem important in my experience.

  66. Going to public settings (bars/farmer’s market/restaurants/mall) where there are a couple cute girls you’d like to fuck shouting ,”I’m fucking somebody, or everybody here” will not yield consistent results. It may have worked once or twice at a house party with a girl that was just down to fuck, but that isn’t a good enough reason for a man who needs sex to start doing. He’s better off running solid game.

  67. 😂

    What you fail to grasp, is that wasn’t a ” routine ” or something someone once said I should try. We have very different idea about game…we’ve been over it akready. You can’t explain ” a Game ” to me j, no matter how many videos and web blogs you’ve seen.

    True game isn’t about following steps. Nobody has to tell me what I should or shouldn’t say or do, or where and when certain things are appropriate or not. I’m not confused about it and nothing has ” worked ” once or twice.

    You my man and all, but when we have these little discussions it give me insights to where and what your true ” Game ” level is, and how you see it.

    You try to figure out what’s possible, I understand everything is possible.

    Can I get you to see this?. Evidently nah, unless I write it down or make a video about it.

  68. Oh god, not this again @j.

    Sentient’s covered most of it, but I’ll add a bit more:

    ALL systems and frameworks build upon each other. As Blax is fond of pointing out, people were having sex before Mystery was born (in fact, since homo sapiens became a distinct species 70,000 years ago – the basic principles haven’t really changed). So yes, Mystery’s system wasn’t completely original – it literally could not have been since homo sapiens haven’t changed in millenia (although as far as I know, he did come up with it completely independently based on his personal field experiences – he didn’t learn some other system and construct it as a hybrid refinement – and that takes genius).
    Mystery’s Method is valuable not because it is entirely original but because it is the best and most comprehensive modern codification of the principles of seduction and the steps involved – a praxeology of seduction if you will.
    The underlying principles and structure are a praxeology, the way the Red Pill is a praxeology. It simply describes how seduction works, the structure and process. It simply “is”. The specific actionable advice Mystery gave however on how to navigate those steps can certainly be refined and improved – it wasn’t handed down by God on the Mount.
    HOWEVER, there is a huge difference between simply rehashing/simplifying MM in different words and presenting it as an innovation (which is what 99% of PUA gurus do – and usually they don’t fully understand MM and the underlying principles themselves, which then causes flaws in what they teach – since if the teacher doesn’t fully understand what he’s doing, he can’t help but pass his flaws on to his students), and actually understanding MM fully and refining and improving upon it (1% of PUA guys, or less).
    What Sentient is basically doing is explaining why most of what you have posted falls in the first category and not the second.
    There are a few people who fully understand MM and have built genuine innovations on top of it – for example, RSD Julien’s pumping attraction hard and cycling through validation/devalidation loops and disqualifying girls to take them on a more extreme emotional rollercoaster (back in the PIMP/SHIFT days about 5 years ago) was a genuine innovation and gave great results in the Tinder age (but it was still within the MM framework even if not consciously stated – it’s a way of holding a girl in A2 and pumping that much harder than Mystery would have – basically not letting her go into A3 too easily).

    As far as I know the importance of laser EC was also not something Mystery emphasized – you could call that another innovation. Guys like (for eg) Todd and Jeffy also fully understand MM but haven’t necessarily come up with structural improvements – although they are very good at explaining it and teaching it (Todd’s “leveling” concept might rank as a genuine innovation though).

    I could go on, but you get the idea. I don’t/didn’t follow Sedfast the way you did, but when I glanced at it, I didn’t see anything particularly new. Is it possible that there are genuine innovations coming out of there? Sure. But nothing you’ve posted from Sedfast has met that standard.

    People just don’t understand MM or the underlying principles these days (@bronson – I’m looking at you – if you’re really interested in going deeper, I suggest you study MM in depth, or at least start with the YaReally Archive explanations of seduction – perhaps start with the discussions on the relevance of looks) or they misunderstand what he was saying and/or what he was trying to do. It’s kind of like how mainstream people think PUAs are guys in funny hats who neg girls (to give just one example, Mystery was going for consistency and repeatability as Sentient points out – a system which optimized percentages – and in which he wanted to get a girl of his choice (not just whoever passed his boner test who was willing to sleep with him that night), and he was targeting minor celebs in the LA party scene, and he wanted those girls to not just sleep with him once but be obsessed with him – he was not trying to get a HB7 in Kalamazoo, MI to sleep with him at closing time in the local club 20 mins after meeting her – a lot of the so-called flaws in MM can be traced back to this – that his goals were not what people assume them to be)
    Incidentally, Mystery didn’t say “never ask questions in A2”. That was a rule of thumb for newbies to stop them from sucking value from girls by asking the dreaded Interview Questions of Death. Mystery’s point was more that you need to be giving value (ie, DHVing) to build attraction in A2, and then move into comfort. You CAN of course give value and DHV by asking questions – it’s just that most newbies don’t ask questions from that frame – they do it from a place of desperately seeking rapport and sucking value (there is a public Youtube video by RSD Jeffy where he talks about doing really well by asking Interview Questions because he asked the questions from the right mental frame – there is also a video by Julien in PIMP or SHIFT where he talks about this in more detail and literally talks about how you can DHV and give value with questions by varying your tone of voice and giving them emotional resonance – he literally asks the same question in different voices and explains how the emotions delivered in each version are completely different).

    PS – Blax, once again for the record, you’re doing (or used to do rather) exactly the same thing all the RSD guys are doing. THe same things that happened in any successful pickup or pull. Because men and women don’t change and the underlying principles don’t change. The only difference is that you’re doing it on instinct and you internalized it all in your teens and stopped thinking about it. To borrow an old YaReally analogy – I don’t know anything about cars. All I know is how to turn the ignition on and actually drive it from point A to B. You can come up to and start talking about “fuel injection” and “internal combustion” etc (actually I don’t even know enough to come up with realistic automotive words here) and I’d just tell you “dude, I don’t know what you’re talking about – I just hit the gas and the car goes forward and I use the steering to turn” – but that doesn’t mean that the engine and everything under the hood don’t exist or that they aren’t important – it just means that I don’t know about them.

    You’re basically like an expert F1-level driver who doesn’t know anything about what happens under the hood. But there’s stuff happening there whether you know about it or not.

  69. “True game isn’t about following steps. Nobody has to tell me what I should or shouldn’t say or do, or where and when certain things are appropriate or not’

    😂 Bro….That’s what mystery and sentient are saying. Not me. Read his comment again smart one .

    I said you don’t have to wait till a certain point in the interaction to start asking questions. Sentient said, ya well you CAN just go up to her and say “Hold my cock”…as she walks away. OR you could “run solid game” which I agree with. But his example he used to argue AGAINST asking questions was an extreme.

  70. Pedantic point of order:

    ” . . . homo sapiens became a distinct species 70,000 years ago . . .”

    That is the dating for the successful migration of homo sapiens out of Africa (there were unsuccessful migrations before that. There was a colony in the Levant at least 100,000 years ago). Homo sapiens is at least 200,000 years old.

    ” . . . people were having sex . . .”

    People, that is to say the genus homo, were having sex for millions of years before sapiens. And, of course, our ancestors have been having sex since we “gave up” reproducing by cell division. It took hundreds of millions of years to develop the cognitive ability to be all over thinking neurotic about it.

  71. @Culum

    “although as far as I know, he did come up with it completely independently based on his personal field experiences – he didn’t learn some other system and construct it as a hybrid refinement”

    Yeah. Ya might want to pick up a copy of R. Don Steele’s 1989 book lol.

    “Mystery’s Method is valuable not because it is entirely original but because it is the best and most comprehensive modern codification of the principles of seduction”

    It was. Back when getting phone numbers and getting a makeout were a big deal for PUAs back in the 90s-early 00s. That’s why there were acronyms for them. number close and kiss close. Because it was assumed, you would have to go on a second date, after first meeting a girl in order to fuck her. So that whole 7 hour rule was probably legit (although Jon Sinn said the reason it was 7 hours, was because most PUAs sucked back then) 2 hours the first meet. Then 2 hours the second meet.

    If you recall, most of the girls Blax fucked weren’t single night lays. And YaReally, before being forced to throw out his text game in 2015 because times be changing, was getting phone numbers from girls he met at the club, then running text game to get the girls to come over to his place. He switched to SNL game after that strategy stopped working for him.

    Today getting a makeout or even a phone number isn’t a big deal. She makes out and gives her phone number out to anyone who has has an ounce of game.

    The only “close” that matters is P in V. And Mystery Method was not optimized for SNLs.

    “The specific actionable advice Mystery gave however on how to navigate those steps can certainly be refined and improved”

    yes. I agree.

    “What Sentient is basically doing is explaining why most of what you have posted falls in the first category and not the second.”

    What I posted was Saul Tee’s investment process. Had it been exactly the same (“Rehash – put (old ideas or material) into a new form without significant change or improvement”) as Mystery’s investment process only worded differently, as I said before, then WestIndieArchie would have pointed it out.

    Quotes straight from WIA’s part 1 review of Technical Game Bible:

    “Investment – This is one of the better sections of the book.”

    “Phase 2 is similar to the trust build/comfort and rapport phase, but it still incorporates his themes of compliance, BT, and investment.”

    “Phase 3 is the bounce to end game. What’s noteworthy is that he doesn’t rely on seeding the bounce. His game is a lot more Pimp Like or ‘pimp tight’. She’s so invested in him and is giving him so much compliance, that he doesn’t need to entice the girl with something at his place. She just wants to be with him.”

    “RSD Julien’s pumping attraction hard and cycling through validation/devalidation loops and disqualifying girls to take them on a more extreme emotional rollercoaster was a genuine innovation and gave great results in the Tinder age”

    “As far as I know the importance of laser EC was also not something Mystery emphasized – you could call that another innovation.”

    Ya. So if you read Mystery’s 2007 book alone, then you wouldn’t even know the power of these and other innovations that have come since then were possible.

    Or another innovation: Sex Talk. Invented by Teevster

    https://nextasf.com/forum/nextasf/general/321180-my-dream-verbal-stack

    …also not in Mystery’s 2007 manual.

    “perhaps start with the discussions on the relevance of looks”

    lol I already destroyed you in that discussion we had. You sure you want to get into it again?

    But yeah anyway here’s a PUA getting his ass handed to him, using the same “looks don’t matter” arguments YaReally lied to you guys about.

    “Mystery was going for consistency and repeatability as Sentient points out”

    And he didn’t get it. As Bronson pointed out, he bored most girls to death with his dhv stories, kiss closed 40 year olds and fucked around 50 women in a 6 year time span, going out 4 times a week. That was enough to consider him the best PUA of the late 90s-early 00s.

    “– a system which optimized percentages – and in which he wanted to get a girl of his choice (not just whoever passed his boner test who was willing to sleep with him that night)”

    I’m sure the 40 year old he was filmed talking to and making out with, was his choice, and not whoever was willing to sleep with him that night (spoiler: he didn’t).

    “he was not trying to get a HB7 in Kalamazoo, MI to sleep with him at closing time”

    https://a2-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/55/6593010c6bdd358b77aa7b2ce20689d0/full.jpg

    https://www.datingskillsreview.com/images/profiles/Mystery-Erik-von-Markovik/mystery-erik-von-markovik-in-club-w-girls2.jpg

    Supermodels.

    This HB7.5 https://www.instagram.com/saanaraw he was dating (are they still together? lol) is not because his game is lightyears better than his 20s, 30s, and 40s, but because he’s actually rich and has high status now. The perfect provider.

    “Mystery’s point was more that you need to be giving value (ie, DHVing) to build attraction in A2, and then move into comfort.”

    Saul’s thing is you give value, by spike her BT via self amusing/cold reads/teasing/disqualifiers so that you can leverage her elevated state, to get investment in return. Until she starts, giving you solid answers (not one to two word responses to your questions) to your questions, then you can move her. That works a lot more solid, than “bro just keep DHVing then move her to comfort.”

    “DHV by asking questions”

    lol no Culum you can’t DHV by asking questions. You can however ask questions, so that she’ll return the question back to you, So that you can DHV tho.

    i.e.
    You: What’s something you’re really passionate about? (not’s not a DHV)
    her: um lately I’ve really taking a liking to drawing. What about you?
    You: DHV

    1. @j

      VERY helpful link to Teevester’s tactics on sexualisation:

      “Or another innovation: Sex Talk. Invented by Teevster

      https://nextasf.com/forum/nextasf/general/321180-my-dream-verbal-stack

      Have recently had a few messaging exchanges with some 20-somethings – although I lack text game to close a meet, despite coming close a couple of times (they both flaked at the last minute).

      That said, I do get the value of not just talking a good game, but in walking a good game. Eg, in my early days with Babushka, I would tell her how I was going to make her cum … and then do so in the exact manner described. One to try again. 🙂

      TantumErgo

  72. Culum

    Great post. refreshing to have intelligent dialogue. Look forward to you getting back on the horse.

    Bronson

    You’re just one of those guys that doesn’t really understand Mystery Method… You left out “fuzzy hats bro” btw…

    Placing restrictions like this, only serves to put new guys who don’t know any better, inside their own heads

    This is just retarded. Of course there are optimal responses in every interaction. That also doesn’t negate that there is a probability that ANY will work. See the “Hold my Cock” opener. It’s probabilities. And let’s get off the “for the noobs” BS.

    fuck I can’t come up with something to say. And Mystery says I’m not suppose to ask her any questions right now cause she hasn’t shown much interest in me yet”. Self eject).

    Wrong. Just wrong. Uninformed. Mystery would say you would ALWAYS have something to say because you had a stack to rely on (and ideally one you honed like a stand up comic had a stack (sperg disclaimer – not just jokes btw). You avoid asking “so uhh… What’s your name?” because you can DHV instead (and not just stories) And Mystery would say NEVER self eject.

    Millions of weird rules and stages etc,

    Simply false. Attraction – Comfort – Seduction.

    once I saw other guys breaking every single mysterymethod rule and killing it

    If you are unaware of what the “rules” are, this is doubtful… The main “rule” involves who gives IOIs to whom, when, and how one responds. This happens in every interaction whether you are aware or not.

    both online

    Yeah… No. Mystery pray for him!

    I just personally feel like it’s kinda simple – what’s important is that she thinks you’re decent looking, and from that pre-requisite/point, you just need to show some confidence, charisma, and be sure to escalate and deal with logistics issues stuff.

    Yeah man, just be yourself. And do you even lift bro? Point him to the beard oil…

  73. J

    then WestIndieArchie would have pointed it out.

    You just have trouble reading for context my man… WIA isn’t comparing this book TO MM. He’s reviewing the book on it’s own, in comparison with the dreck that exists TODAY. He says this in the first para ffs…

    Overall, I really like this book. I think it’s a good distillation of actual pickup principles before pick up got all “woo woo”. It puts contemporary RSD and London Day Game style into context. It explains why they work and don’t work. It leans back into a traditional (old school/indirect game) and talks in the language of psychology.

    You might wonder why he makes this opening statement…

    And as for picture mining… YOU may not want to open that can of worms…

    On SEDFAST, it’s a chronic circle jerk. when they are not banning each other, they are calling each other out as frauds… There were some good posters, largely the guys that were NOT selling systems and coaching… It’s a gamma breeding ground largely.

  74. FR

    Popped out briefly last night.

    My friend opened some girl he liked at the bar and then her friends came over to get served at the bar
    I got speaking too an older lady, but next to her was some fairly pretty 18 year old. They were work friends.
    I started talking to the one I liked a little.
    Teased her about some guy who kept trying to hit on her who she wasn’t interested in. Made her laugh a bit. Challenged her to a quick dance off anf just tried to be fun.

    We all left the bar at the same time and on the walk I spoke to her about her university course and tried to lead the convo in a slightly more man-to-woman topics and she told me the guys her age don’t every approach her and I tried to DHV a little with some short dating stories and stuff.

    I was considerIng going for her number here but I pussied out as I didn’t really sense any attraction.
    They went too a different bar. I told her what bar we were heading too and said ‘bye’
    However, she ended up coming to the place me and my friends were at an hour later or so and kind of made a beeline for me as soon as our eyes met.
    I start dancing with her and slowly kind of isolate her a bit. I bring up the topic of dating as a way to kind of feel her out and I start to make some flirty comments and I decide to play ‘fuk, kill or marry’ with her, using random strangers in the bar
    We’re flirting and I start giving her some verbal IOI’s as per Jeffy, whilst also ‘pushing’ a little too with some teases
    At one point she tells me she likes guys with brown eyes or something, and I accuse her of flirting with me (I have brown eyes). She laughs
    I know she is about to leave as her friend wants to drag her away. I try a few angles but she really has to go.
    She kind of gives me a look and I finally sense attraction, and I pull her in for a makeout. We kiss.
    She gives me her number
    Text me at like 3am just to say she had fun
    I know it’s only a kiss, but she’s kinda cute and my type that it gives me a little confidence boost
    On the downside I was a complete pu$sy in terms of approach anxiety last night

    https://imgur.com/a/ze3em5G#FaKzJwV

    She’s hella younger than me! 18 lol

  75. “And as for picture mining… YOU may not want to open that can of worms…”

    My bad bro. Here’s a couple more to even it out:

    https://www.datingskillsreview.com/images/profiles/Mystery-Erik-von-Markovik/mystery-x-girlfriend-from-the-game-katya.jpg

    (rated an HB9 in Strauss’ 2005 The Game btw)

    https://www.datingskillsreview.com/images/profiles/Mystery-Erik-von-Markovik/mystery-erik-von-markovik-girl-hold.jpg

    “On SEDFAST, it’s a chronic circle jerk […]There were some good posters”

    Yea and that’s why the good serious posters (Bacchus, Teevster, Sparxx, Gunwitch, Pelusita, Kant, TheThinMan, Hector Castillo, PureEvil, Karea), on sedfast created the facebook group I’m in, to get away from the trolls of sedfast.

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