For the past three years of The Rational Male there’s been a consistent presence in the comment threads of guys seeking advice for particular situations with regards to Game. Whether it’s fine tuning certain aspects of Game or a larger consensus of the guys participating in my comment threads it’s become obvious there’s a need for a dedicated page and comment thread to address these Field Reports.
So I’m instituting this page for exactly this. If there is some urgency to have members of The Rational Male community analyze your particular situation feel free to hit anyone up in the comments of my current post, but please refer them to your particular field report with a link to your comment here. I’m hoping this will alleviate the mass of posts for field report analysis and Game specific insights piled into the main blog post for any given week.
There will be some rules for this “forum” as such. I ask that you only keep your comments to addressing the field reports at hand and save your larger theoretical stuff for the main posts, or if relevant, keep the “bigger scope of things” posts to being as succinct as possible. There will be no moderation in this comment thread (spamming excepted), so realize it will be a very hot kitchen before you post. I will impose no restrictions on video links here, nor will I limit links to various, but pertinent articles.
Understand, this is an experiment for now. It’s likely this comment thread will exceed thousands of comments. I’ll be instituting new comment plug-ins for wordpress to deal with this in the future, but I may archive this page the the posts and refresh this page in the future as well. If this gets cumbersome I may simply institute a dedicated forum-style sub-site of The Rational Male to accommodate for Game specific questions.
So have at it, post your field reports and feel free to comment on the ones you have some particular insight for. Be forewarned that it’s likely things may get a bit salty at times and I expect a lot of back & forth with debate and disagreements, but that’s what this thread is for – to hash out Game particulars for your given situations.
@IAS I don’t remember seeing pen pal on your hierarchy of needs. It’s great you took initiative and went to lead but I think you allowed yourself to languish in a medium that she is obviously adept at. One of my friends is doing the same thing with a girl by continuing to reply to her innocuous text messages without taking any further action. Why do you feel so compelled to respond to the rest of her e-mail? She did not comply so why would you reward her? Why not cultivate new prospects and see where they go instead? Something… Read more »
@Catchers: even if she had complied with the meetup, I should still cultivate new prospects. I did say to you guys from the start that I am enjoying the messaging, @IRL even pointed out that she can sense that I’m enjoying it and that is why I’m running into problems. We are discussing things that are interesting to me inc. sports and she has a good sense of humor etc (unlike say girl 1 which I also found interesting on that level but language barrier and girl 3 which was talking mostly about boring stuff pretty much whenever I wasn’t… Read more »
IAS Well you are thirsty for a companion, so it’s not surprising you enjoy the contact. It’s OK, it’s just not tight game, where tight = moving quickly to sex from an Alpha position. You can still get laid by this girl, it will just be after more rom comming, hand holding and waiting. which is Ok as well… this is how most guys get laid. 3rd, 4th, 5th date etc… Now if you want to accelerate the process… do a lot more push… ignore her beta bait… be less available, etc. Standard text game stuff. It may be too… Read more »
@Sentient: I suspect we both are thirsty for a companion, with the mutual LDR thing :/
Just don’t friendzone yourself IAS. Keep sexualizing.
“It may be too late frankly to do this from your position at this point”
lol this was over a long time ago. Shes getting what she wants (attention) while you get nothing in return. It would take an experienced seducer to turn this around. Just take the L and move on to other girls, man.
J Why move on? He needs the experience, he likes the girl (too much really), it’s low time investment, not much in way of opportunity cost, not keeping him from other girls… I agree it is too far gone to turn around with alacrity – she isn’t going to rush over and bang him, but otherwise it’s standard Beta Date Model. He can still kill it of course. But she has some attraction for him. The main risk is he continues to desexualize and FZ himself. If he gets out on another “date” and runs standard game then, he has… Read more »
@Everyone: We all spotted from the start that I liked the girl too much (myself included).
I’m not going to stop trying with other targets.
She is having a kind of emotional affair with me which is kind of a new experience for me (not completely new actually, but first time it happens since I discovered RP and Game).
@IAS
I don’t remember if this specific girl is in a town you do not live in or something but why not setup a date to talk instead of banter over e-mail? That way you can work on sexualizing, escalating, etc.
Right now you’re playing on her home court and giving her everything she wants.
Channeling Sentient … what do you WANT again? Act accordingly.
“The most important part is the meetup. She is waffling and gave 3 or 4 excuses, while stringing me along saying maybe another time for the beach, and that she was thinking of doing some other 2 things that weekend (which wouldn’t involve me).” “Don’t insist 🙂 Maybe later, not now” Maybe maybe maybe. Is this what she would say to an Alpha Fucks lol? Don’t reply to any more emails. If she doesn’t respond on day x, or says “sorry i forgot insert bullshit” move on. Otherwise she’ll classify you as an orbiter. Very difficult to be AF after… Read more »
@IAS
I will still reply to the e-mail (like I say, I really want to).
This is you being needy, which, of course, you broadcast to her. So, of course, she hustles you.
j wrote: “Don’t reply to any more emails.”
Cosign. Radio silence for three weeks. Radio silence in your head for three weeks, too. After that, check whether you don’t have better options.
@IAS
Feelings are not your friends.
@Everyone: schooled again, thanks. @Catchers: different city, on the day(s) I tried to set something up I’d be closer due to other stuff I’m doing. @j: that I’m not pinging enough as AF has been clear since the dinner date FR – that one had some stuff that confused me. Now she was rather overt, not confusing at all. @Sentient: I think I’m out, I don’t see another date. It is pretty unlikely she will take initiative, being a woman and all – she didn’t even do a counteroffer this time, remember the dinner was a counteroffer. I briefly thought… Read more »
“I briefly thought about going “No counteroffer?””
Passive-aggressive pussy begging. You’d never get frame back after that one.
IAS Well here is my take… You have a free option here. she isn’t banging you. You aren’t expending resources on her (negligible email time). You keep your end of that investment and you have nothing but upside. You either fail, while learning more, or you succeed. No one is keeping score. So I would use it as the gift it is… a free option. You can approach it a few ways, either by trying to reassert an alpha frame and turning it around, or by coasting in a betaish frame to get a meeting with favorable logistics and getting… Read more »
And just to be clear, I’m not saying throw that one out of your quiver. It’s matter of who has frame. If she took the initiative and tried to get you to go out you could use that to play with her:
@ Sentient Good stuff. ” For the former I see two options… First path is to just fuck around with her and just hit her with increasingly outlandish shit from an alpha frame, because you don’t care if she gets pissed and never responds. And see how that goes. You may be very surprised…” That’s what I was thinking when I ran the scenario through the ” what would I do ” machine. A chick that I eventually plated tried to use me for an emotional tampon, then turn me into a dear friend. I didn’t get it at all,… Read more »
@ASD: yes, feelings are mostly detrimental. But it comes with our biology. Even for those on the spectrum.
@Sentient: excellent haggling scene, LOL. I prefer the Holy Grail movie.
@Blax: nice tale, also LOL.
kfg blax
LOL… yes the whole area around reverse psychology is very ripe for game. IAS you could also try that frame “Oh believe me… I know why you don’t want to get together…” “Why is that?!” “Come on… we both know it… you don’t trust yourself around me.” That kind of thing. Chicks are like kids…
@Sentient “you have nothing but upside. You either fail, while learning more, or you succeed” “First path is to just fuck around with her and just hit her with increasingly outlandish shit from an alpha frame, because you don’t care if she gets pissed and never responds” …Or she could find his wife and forward him this email if he fucks it up. This requires at least intermediate level game. This isn’t newbie territory here. Fuck it up and there will be consequences. Like I said, he should just take the L and focus on pushing for SNLs/Day 2 lays… Read more »
@IAS It reminds me of one of many failures of mine. I had drinks with a girl I couldn’t close the same day and I went away for a few weeks. It wasn’t bad for Day 1, come to think of it. It went downhill from there though. I thought I was doing fine via text (being flirty and fun, teasing her, contacting not more than twice a week, not responding too quickly) and I can relate to your pleasant messaging experience. I even pitched the meet closer to my return date and she was eager. Then a day or… Read more »
Gents… IAS’s horse is out the barn… He gave his email, so… Maybe he can be traced maybe not. Assume yes. She can get to his wife whenever she determines she has to. Whether now if he pisses her of with “tits or gtfo” or a year from now when he doesn’t want to marry her or have a baby or whatever the hamster tells her in the moment. This includes months from now if he ghosts her today and has had a bottle of red wine… There is only going forward and dealing with comsequences as and when they… Read more »
Nice little post from WIA
“Instead of doing things that you think are right, that society says, that she says – focus your attention on things that make her respond”
http://www.westindianarchie.com/pathology
@IRL: appreciate the FR. Just to clarify, this is on personal e-mails, not work e-mails and I don’t actually work with her. @Everyone regarding the potential downside: I’m not going to pull off the outlandish shit approach. Whether that is because I’m buffering, avoiding rejection, or afraid of consequences is up for discussion. I’m simply not ready for that over e-mail. j has a point that leaving an electronic paper trail with stuff like “tits or gtfo” (notice the alluring lack of punctuation) isn’t super wise. Through text messages/IM it is slightly less bad to pull that off, and in… Read more »
West Indian Archie is in his 40s?? Did not expect that…I’m starting to read through his archives now. He’s good. @IAS – Great advice from everyone, but only one thing to add – the texting/emailing stuff – it’s no different from any other Game stuff. Just practice, but the same principles. Read some of the older YaReally Archive stuff from when he was still doing text game and apply (also this other old CH poster called Ripp – it’s in the archive) Earlyish in my online dating career, I (who had never asked a woman for a picture of any… Read more »
Culum guess that makes me a Provider lol – Egg McMuffin? Nice stuff, you are doing a service to some of these older women… but you are in the batting cage… By no means a slight. Batting cages are fun, but not the same as a fireball lefty. Or you can start charging them… raise the stakes that way… LOL. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sWs843kQxaM On Harvard girl… next time you can play with setting a more dominant frame. Shshhhhh her “little spoon doesn’t make the rules” stuff. for the experience of taking a woman LIKE THAT and unraveling her… pushing her past her… Read more »
Culum is reaching the point where sex is becoming boring. Lol. kudos man, now you’re ready for that next level.
The first objective is to pull them for the lay. I happen to think that Tinder and similar stuff is actually a hindrance regarding the quality of the sex. Easy becomes boring. Eventually, the hb8’s and 9’s will become boring too, unless you can find something else within the context of sex to keep things interesting – for the both of you.
This is how one becomes a Sex God… lol.
Unexpected chick behavior data point I went to a frp game meetup group…5 men and 1 chick…1 man made a gay apology for calling the chick “beautiful”…I may have done an eyeroll…been years since I did frp gaming and it was a nostalgic experience…I didn’t know shit, but ended up leading the fucking group, lol… at one point the chick was laughing and I was laughing and we made eye contact…she held my gaze…I held hers for the slightly-longer-than-socially-approved length of time, then looked away…and she continued staring at me…so I stared back…both laughing…weird and awkward…a shit test Ten. Fucking.… Read more »
@Culum You won’t find those girls on Tinder. Gotta do Daygame/Nightgame in specific spots that’s where you’ll find the HB8+s with feminine energy. I usually type in to google: “city name” + “roosh v” and look for datasheets from at least 2015 and then i star them on google maps. It’s harder and more challenging than swiping right, but the end result is well worth it. Quote from one of the commentators from the forum answering where all the HB8’s are: “you have to live in a large metropolitan area that has at least one large university in the area.… Read more »
@Blax
It took about 48 hours before she was hungrily head bobbing. She became my most reliable plate for a long time.
cool story
J
Ever read the book?
@Sentient
Nope didn’t know there was one. Didn’t care much for the storyline, Just one of the many movies I’ve watched specifically to study the character’s body language/charisma to adapt for myself
FR I typically spend a lot of time at local pools cooling off and have always had fun on the diving board. As such, I’m pretty social when doing something I enjoy a great deal and this manifests itself in me chatting up everyone in line and getting them to push their limits a bit. This particular place turns into an arena like setting and once the better divers are jumping there’s a fair amount of applause and most other attendees are focused on what’s going on in the diving pit. I’m having fun and challenging kids and end up… Read more »
@Catchers
Do you see the connection between I didn’t sexualize the convo at all and Not generate enough attraction?
you obviously feel the FI impinging on you to avoid sexualizing…as I often say, don’t be afraid to sexualize using double entendre…it works in almost every context
NB
double entendre is very cool because it is sexualization with plausible deniability…it shows great social skills, wit, and cats understand its subliminal message
My previous comment here didn’t go through, probably because of a link, so this time without one.
Blackdragon posted a few FR snippets on his blog. Left my comment there.
@IRL
Latest post about Russians?
Catcher’s
” The angle I was going for was “it’s fun to hang out with me, I’m good at what I do, let’s dance and grab food this weekend”.”
Interesting gambit. The angle I am always going for is “we both like what we see… How do we move this to fucking?” And then lead.
I had decided I was going to go for a number close yesterday night on a girl that is somewhat adjacent to my favorite sports activity, but I pussied out because she was leaving earlier than I expected and I’d have to do it where her brother had line of sight. In hindsight that was a weak buffer because I could have just pretended to go for the bathroom and as she was leaving I’d go “Hey wait up” and have her in isolation. My question here is, would that ping in her hindbrain as chasing? @Everyone regarding the other… Read more »
Thanks guys. It’s still kind of a mind fuck in terms of how I’m starting to feel about “just” sex since I was a virgin till 24 and I’d made it such a big deal. With the Harvard girl types Sentient..yeah, that’s what I was trying to articulate. She wasn’t as much in my frame as I wanted. I’ll try more dominance next time. But with this woman, my frame wasn’t (yet) strong enough to completely dominate. Perhaps more importantly she was so average looking that I didn’t really have the desire to project with her either..if that makes sense.… Read more »
J – the book is worth a flip through. Goes into his mindset much more than the film. I read it back when I was considering working as an escort while in college. My dad gave me three books growing up… The Adventurers by Harold Robbins (yes that Harold Robbins, a loose retelling of the Porfirio Rubirosa story, Casino Royale and The Poor Boy’s Guide to Marrying a Rich Girl. He always said “Never get married. If you do, it’s just as easy to love a rich girl as a poor girl”. I didn’t follow either. http://static.getkempt.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/playboys3_crop.jpg IAS – you… Read more »
Catcher’s Since we met at the pool I didn’t think a number close was optimal so just went with this instead. Did I give her too much opportunity to flake? Not generate enough attraction? How can I refine this approach Refine by putting your sexual intent out there. You are just a Manny in this scenario. http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2015/06/18/20/29C1736900000578-3130372-image-m-105_1434656607204.jpg My neighborhood has a lot of nannies strolling kids around. I like to play with them. One thing to do is sexualize like Me: [strong laser on her approach with stroller, I stop, put hand up] Is that your baby? [laser] Her: [Usually… Read more »
Harold Robbins…
Born Harold Rubin… son of a pharmacist. He became his creation…
http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2012/08/04/article-2183504-01E4C7E9000004B0-453_634x487.jpg
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2334392/Harold-Robbins-New-tell-book-ex-wife-best-selling-novelist-Harold-Robbins-claims-demanded-open-marriage-affairs-world-hosted-wild-orgies.html
Who do you want to become?
http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/308580.Harold_Robbins
summer reading…
@Sentient
SOLID. Thanks, will work on this.
Always good too.
You are so right when you talk about “kids with dynamite”. That is what I was. I spent years in the pickup community having amazing adventures and increasing my confidence and positivity as well as the quality of women I was meeting. I travelled a lot and built up a harem in every city I went. At the same time, I followed my dream, freeing myself of my regular job and seeing my artistic projects all the way through to completion. During this process I built up my willpower, positivity, health and general happiness. Until I met my dream girl.… Read more »
@Sentient: I know, right? World class. Maybe I can use this gift for something more productive…
@ WoundedGiant I’ll bite. What a pickle you got yourself into. This won’t be as coherent as I can be. But I would like throw some things out there. And see if they stick. This is more abstract concepts as usual from me, rather than concrete advice. Bone up on Briffault’s Law: https://youtu.be/2JVDo_Pv_vo Your situation is about changing you. Not her. You cannot change her. She is who she is. You knew that going into having a child with her. It is not her fault what goes on in the future because you chose to have a baby with her… Read more »
I forgot to add a statement made by Stephan Jenkins in a current Rolling Stone article. He made it big after suffering greatly for his artistry and then came out with a bang with Third Eye Blind’s first album. Being detached from a self-conscious attitude and ego is important. Be detached and fierce, no matter what you do. Not fierce in terms of beating your head against the wall. Fierce as in determined, or to have desire to kick ass. Not like a fly beating it’s head against a window pane trying to get out, when a door is open… Read more »
@Sentient
Picked up The Adventures, thanks. Been a big fan of Rubirosa ever since CH dedicated a post about him a couple years back:
https://heartiste.wordpress.com/2013/10/30/alpha-of-the-month-porfirio-rubirosa/
Big influence in my vibe/game comes from him. The mysterious “be careful, this man is dangerous” international playboy archetype:
https://thump.vice.com/en_us/article/i-partied-with-an-international-drug-lord-in-mexico-and-somehow-lived-to-tell-the-tale
Field Report: A tribal raid to capture women Last night was a Red Pill night…I was at a bar and met a couple of guys…both 21 yo. We hung around and I asked them what they did and they asked what I did… me: a writer guy: about what me: social dancing…using it to meet women [they’ve seen me out dancing with a few women] me: excuse me, I’ll go ask another to dance [I went and danced with a hottie] guy 1: what do you say me: wanna dance? guy 2: that’s what I say, too guy 1: hmmm… Read more »
Field Report: Epiphany Girl is resisting epiphany my country bar venue…three girls who all went to a Catholic school…all hot…29 yo…I’ve known them for about a year and danced with all three…two of them avoid me…one of those two still smiles big when I say hi…that’s a big clue…Epiphany has a bf making six figures…I’ve told Smiley that Epiphany needs to start having kids…needs something steady…it ain’t me…of course they know I’m married…Smiliey is protective of Epiphany I chat with Epiphany…bf is at home…on call…(bf resents me and is insecure about me…tries to do dick-measuring contests with me, but I… Read more »
Update on e-mail saga… I tried 3 of the moves Sentient suggested, maybe a bit too toned down. It worked partially. I didn’t have the balls to describe specific erotic dreams in detail, but I used an opportunity to say I have erotic dreams sometimes and wake up from that, and asked does that happen to you. She replied “Not that I remember, I don’t have a perverted mind like you” with a friendly smiley. Thinking of blasting her for being a prude and that I can’t believe she doesn’t enjoy sex, also say it looks like you could use… Read more »
Mini-FR: went out tonight, saw lots of girls, didn’t really open anyone as I went into a kind of social circle thing where only one of the guys knows me (so his social circle really). Couldn’t push much with him there, but I chatted up the boys and the girls, very light kino on one of the girls that appeared to be a free agent, she seemed to respond well. Two of the girls that were clearly in LTRs with guys that were there were super friendly (as in, more than the two girls that appeared to be free agents).… Read more »
@IAS
She replied “Not that I remember, I don’t have a perverted mind like you” with a friendly smiley.
“I’ve never been in a convent…how’s the food?
Field Report: Pushing with Compliance Testing…with a breakdown This is an important tactic in Game…venue: my standard bar…I had established social proof…saw a quintet of 23 yo hotties…another group of Catholic school girls…they were milling around…I calibrated…they were uncertain…looking for leadership…I approached…looked at various ones in the group…finally asked one to dance…she didn’t know…I pressed her about why she was reluctant…she said that she didn’t know how to dance…I said that I had taught hundreds of girls how to dance…another girl (validating girl) said, “yeah, he has taught hundreds of girls how to dance”…I asked her how she knew…she said… Read more »
@IAS The girl hit you with a shit test, calling you a perv…she was thinking about fucking you did you see how my response was brilliant? it’s a double bind…ignores the shit test on one level by blandly asking about convent food, yet smashes it on another level by assuming that she’s in a convent without explicitly calling her a prude…she will be amused by it because the request for info about convent food will be so gay and unexpected that it will be funny…the gayness will contrast with the tension of your IMPLICITLY calling the girl a prude this… Read more »
IAS
The group date is not what you want.
@IAS “I didn’t have the balls to describe specific erotic dreams in detail, but I used an opportunity to say I have erotic dreams sometimes and wake up from that, and asked does that happen to you. She replied “Not that I remember, I don’t have a perverted mind like you” with a friendly smiley. Thinking of blasting her for being a prude and that I can’t believe she doesn’t enjoy sex, also say it looks like you could use one of those dreams to relax / lighten up.” Here’s how I would handle that response. “Trust me, if you… Read more »
@IAS It’s a trap! It’s gonna be impossible to isolate and bang her. They probably know her bf (ASD) you are the secret bad boy lover not the bff “fun guy”. Tell her one of your old friends is in town. And you think it’ll be weird if you bring HER (preselection lol) to the meet up. “If that works, I can have her in isolation for a while, allowing me no excuses to not K close” P in V > K close “I’ll still pussy out of doing it even then I’m sure” Fuck this defeatist attitude dude. 99%… Read more »
@IAS A simple, very effective way to sexualize that works 100% of the time for me: Ask her “What was your favorite part of 50 Shades of Grey?” It assumes she’s seen it and she probably has. If she hasn’t you can tease her about it. If she has seen it…she’ll say something….then all you have to do is say “Interesting…I would have thought a girl like you would have liked the helicopter scene…” IF she hasn’t seen it, tease her: “So you’re a Harry Potter fan?” or whatever. Then open it up from there. It sounds like you’re talking… Read more »
@j Normally I would agree with you, but IAS is nowhere near being viewed as her secret bad boy and his self-confidence is in the shitter. He even said he might have an opp to pivot to one of her friends. Why limit himself to eggs in one basket Ms. prude, Lukewarm I-have-a-BF when he could have a shot at one of her single friends? It’s amazing what competition dread can do. I’ve seen it for myself when I laugh with and become touchy-feely with my interest’s GFs … she starts pouting and takes it upon herself to isolate me… Read more »
@IAS @Sentient IAS The group date is not what you want. well, if you wanna be a blue-balled orbiter, it’s perfect I actually think the female friends may be a lucky break for me as I could pivot onto one of them. at least you’re thinking about other options…that’s very smart…you need to think shotgun, not rifle if I went on a group date, I’d invest very little time in the group until they chased me hard…I’d flit in and out…go chat up other people…create some social proof and options with women outside the group and with the bar staff…sexualize… Read more »
@TheMarquis Arriving quite late here; I wish I could help you out but I have never been in that situation you describe… From what I have read you should do some Heartistean “agree & amplify” stuff, for instance saying “of course I am trying that, it is like black magic on you” or some ridiculous stuff along those lines. My experiences have to do with dating apps. I text for a while, then I try to arrange a meeting. Girl agrees. I set it around 12 AM: we have a drink, and if things go well an hour later when… Read more »
@SJF Really appreciate this thoughtful and detailed comment. I have made notes about which books to read, and I have subscribed to The Red Pill reddit. You asked me how invested in Red Pill I am, and what state of grief/Red Pill awareness I’m at. The answer Is probably more nuanced than it would be for a lot of other guys. This is probably to a great extent due to the fact that I’m only beginning to follow Red Pill blogs and vlogs a couple of months ago. However, I read both Rational Male books two years ago. My PUA… Read more »
@Everyone: thanks for the ideas, some very good ones. In order… @ASD: brilliant convent play. Also I’m aware it was a shit test, meaning the erotic dreams thing worked to get her mind on the right track (thanks Sentient). @Sentient: brilliant idea on the dreams. I’m aware the group date isn’t what I want. If she doesn’t agree to meet me before hand in isolation I may just not go entirely. The guy of course would just be cockblock and not interesting, but the girlfriends could be interesting in of themselves. although I also agree with j (It’s a trap!)…… Read more »
J – ” I’m not going to be the person I’m expected to be anymore” YESSS!!!! IAS – you need to remember that the back AND forth is part of the attraction building… Keep telling yourself this is chess not checkers… many many moves ahead… so when you do your big move and you don’t get the response you are looking for, you can fall back on THE PROCESS… Ajax had an awesome response… When you get stuck toss the hamster a pellet… Judgment laced with ambiguity is always good. You: “Oh… your one of those girls…” Her: What do… Read more »
IAS
“Two of the girls that were clearly in LTRs with guys that were there were super friendly (as in, more than the two girls that appeared to be free agents). I’m not saying they were into me, just thought it interesting that the LTR’d ones were more open. Maybe the single ones are kind of shy and that is why they are free for longer?”
The LTR can “safely” flirt with you and be “open” because they are “taken”… less ASD. The “single” ones can’t just throw themselves at you else – ASD…
@Oscar – I am not TheMarquis (that’s one of the married guys who posts I think – not sure how often he posts) but online dating I know. Lots of points to unpick in your post, but the issues aren’t baffling at all – clear as day in fact. I used to slip up in many of the same ways. First, if you’re consistently getting girls to meet you off Tinder/Bumble/whatever, then you must be decent to good looking with good pictures, so that’s one big step you’ve already taken. Only thing I would add is that if you are… Read more »
@Sentient: there are some similar yearly events that take place in a different date in my city and her city. The one in her city is the thing I thought about instead of the beach initially, because it has a high likelihood of her joining, with the downside that there will be crowds almost everywhere. There will still be some possibilities, even to F close in a semi-public setting would be possible. Beach with water above the waist would be better, and I’d get to see her in bikini so I went for that and got shot down. Anyway, I… Read more »
@WoundedGiant “So I’m determined to invest all the willpower and determination that I have built up for other purposes into this process of fully waking up and being assertive.” Glad to see you here and to see your motivation and desire to improve yourself via Red Pill Awareness. Just to tell you my context, I’m married and have two adult children. Ten years into marriage, because of ignorance I was Betatized and turned into a drunk captain and ripe for mutiny. Four years ago I came to the manosphere because my son got into a lot of trouble and my… Read more »
IAS
““Are you going to the event there in your city?” I replied very short “Yes. Wanna join?” ”
reverse the roles… How would a hot girl respond to the initial question?
One of the last, most difficult things I had to learn when I was practicing texting (and still learning really) is that *you do not have to reply* and you *do not have to chase* (initiate yes – chase, no. there is a difference). Walawala had a line that I remind myself of often – something about “giving her the gift of your silence”. It only comes with practice and a sense of abundance, and it is easy enough to lose that mindset when you’ve gone a while without getting laid. But once you’ve had it, you can at least… Read more »
@IAS Also I’m aware it was a shit test, meaning the erotic dreams thing worked to get her mind on the right track this is imprecise…maybe you are buffering…she was thinking about fucking you…she was trying to come up with a reason to not fuck you…she wanted you to pass the shit test so that she could fuck you when men think about sex, we think about how to get it…when women think about sex, they think about reasons to not do it with a particular guy you are still thinking subconsciously that women aren’t very interested in sex, which… Read more »
@Oscar Okay, so your date itself. I’m assuming here that your goal is to get a lay in reasonably quick time, and not simply dating or spending time with the girl etc. You need to *plan* this and then execute the plan. You can’t just wing it and hope to get lucky (you will get lucky sometimes like most other men, but what’s the point?). Over time you’ll internalize the principles and won’t have to think consciously about the plan. As preparation make sure your logistics are tight – most importantly that your place is close by and easily accessible… Read more »
@Sentient: I’m not sure, but I imagine a hot girl could go “Maybe, if I feel like it”. I wouldn’t expect her to offer the guy to join up. I’m not sure that is the right play though. Usually I could have done better and go something “Oh I see… You would like to come. Maybe if you ask nicely/bring me a gift I’ll let you join me”, but I now expect her to go “I don’t actually want to go” as every single time I’ve tried that kind of frame grab with her she busts me on it very… Read more »
Update: got her reply regarding the arragements for the meetup. She doesn’t hesitate in being direct and that corners me. Like when she outright said “No, and don’t insist” for the beach. Still, more props to ASD – the Convent thing went down pretty well I think – even though she said I’m unpleasant, that she isn’t a saint but she doesn’t feel comfortable talking about certain things with people. But then a few lines below she callback humor saying “that kind of thing [referring to sex] isn’t allowed in my convent ;)”. Also, regarding the meet up, she is… Read more »
The only play I can come up with to reply to “Why do you want to be alone with me” is a pressure flip along these lines:
“Why don’t you want to be alone with me? I’m not sure if you don’t trust me or if you don’t trust yourself…”
This is written in dog language. Boolean logic.
In cat language, it *feels* like you want her to deal with her doubts, inhibits, obstacles and, on top of that, to build a scenario in which it is still fine to fuck you. All on her own.
Play with her imagination and pull the rug from under her when she thinks she has you sussed out. Paint emotional pictures. Role play. Take her on a roller coaster. You want to hear her squeak OMG!
How would you prank her in 5th grade?
@Culum: Here’s an example. Girl I’m gaming comes back from holiday: Me: “if you promise to stay awake, let’s meet for drinks. I’m free tonite late or wed/thu after work”. Her: –sends a photo of Haagen Daz ice cream: “They have this new flavor” I didn’t and won’t respond unless she sets up or offers a meet up time. Girls are such masters at time wasting when they want attention. So yes, initiate like I did, but only respond to things that lead to the outcomes you want. This was such a lame response it’s almost like she’s gaming me…… Read more »
” This was such a lame response it’s almost like she’s gaming me…”
That’s exactly what she was doing. It’s almost as if they want to see if you’ll play along with any kind of inane stream of consciousness shit they can spit out.
Aww, I think it’s adorable. Lol. But don’t play along.
@IAS – I have not followed the details of your exchange with her, but just reading the last exchange – why are you still engaging with her at all? Much less on her terms and in her frame? Think about what YaReally would say – if you had ten other women to go to the beach (or wherever) with, would you really engage her? Or would you ignore her and punish her by *withdrawing your attention* if she started messing with you (as she’s doing)? At best there might be a “Lol” in response if it was congruent..even that risks… Read more »
@ IAS Part of a field report is self reflection on what you did. The other half is getting advice. You are still not ‘Knowing Thyself’ and what you want. A companionship, a kiss, a lick, a suck, a PIV. Define your goals and move towards them. What about thinking: You are the Prize. But you are leaning too far into her frame and she is controlling your frame. “Why don’t you want to be alone with me? I’m not sure if you don’t trust me or if you don’t trust yourself…” Weak. Don’t ask. Tell. This is not Beta… Read more »
IAS Suspend linear, logical thought… Your job here is to display high value and to DHV by passing shit tests… So at this stage, you want to pass them by flipping things around on her or otherwise leading to a new frame which you create. Just ducking them isn’t going to build attraction. You might prolong your interaction, but to where? that kind of thing [referring to sex] isn’t allowed in my convent ;)” You: Reminds me of the sotry of the two nuns? Do you know it? [wait for her to engage] You: Yes there were two nuns. An… Read more »
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dvsKLy5nQ5g
Basics IAS.
@IAS She doesn’t hesitate in being direct and that corners me. So be direct, too…if she ignores you, ignore her twice as long…if she shows you disinterest, show her disinterest…do you remember a feedback loop…standard dog training…reward good behavior with attention and punish bad behavior by withdrawing attention when you’re showing a girl attention, include some DHV in it and a little sexualization and calibrate her response…if she shows disinterest, find something else to do for a couple of days…if she does it in a social environment, leave her and go chat up some other people for awhile before giving… Read more »
@Culum: one day I will be on the other side. Just not today. I’m glad someone else is benefiting from the FRs. Also, why am I still interacting with her… I’m learning a bunch, hope I’m internalizing it. After the beach blowout I was considering letting it die, but instead I outright mentioned erotic dreams and some other stuff like the convent play. I’m pushing my boundaries. And she didn’t even react badly either. @Sentient was right. I’m not losing that much by continuing the messages, even if I’m lowering my chances of getting K or F close by messing… Read more »
@IAS Take a 30,000ft view of your interaction with this girl and re-evaluate your approach my man. You have seemingly been relegated to an orbiter of hers and are only being pushed further into orbit with ever successive e-mail. ONEitis in full effect as she paws at you playfully like a cat does to a mouse it knows it can kill at any point. You have convinced yourself that if you continue to play HER game that you’ll avoid those pearly white fangs staring you right in your face. How did Jerry defeat Tom in the cartoon? He outsmarted him… Read more »
@IAS
I concur with Sentience…this girl is good practice…you will learn a lot trying to turn it around without investing much in the outcome because you have low expectations…in the meantime, find other girls to game
Her eyes…..
@IAS
build a lawn…lots of blades of grass for you to look upon and play with
@Blax
her eyes…
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0070903/mediaviewer/rm1979975680
not a fan of babwa
@Catchers: while she continues to send me shit tests that I don’t know how to smash, I don’t think it is a waste of time even though it is clear to all of us that I’m not getting much beyond some experience. I don’t think you realize just how inexperienced I am. Here is the latest shit test, following from Sentient’s suggestion on me dq’ing myself by saying “I’m married, remember?”. I could see it coming and here it is “I remember perfectly, it is good that you also remember it ;)” Back to basics as I can’t rely on… Read more »
IAS –
“I could see it coming ”
Good… now next time anticipate what you say next, and what she says next and what you say to that. Chess…
“I remember perfectly, it is good that you also remember it ;)”
Naughty girl…
“In case I forget and I’m already on top of you, please do remind me *before* I go inside you”
lol. I kinda like this one.
@IAS “Here is the latest shit test, following from Sentient’s suggestion on me dq’ing myself by saying “I’m married, remember?”. I could see it coming and here it is “I remember perfectly, it is good that you also remember it 😉 Why did you leave out the rest of Sentient’s suggestion. That would haved passed the shit test. “You know there are going to be tons of people around right? Jeeesh… somebody has a high opinion of themselves. I just don’t want to waste time with a bunch of people talking about their job when I am on holiday… save… Read more »
@ IAS “I remember perfectly, it is good that you also remember it ;)” Is this a text? A while back I was warned by a girls to – ” be careful, or I’d get myself into trouble ‘. Immediately I responded to her to define ” trouble “. It gave me a few moments to formulate a better, more devastating response. Your girl seems to have a knack for catching you off guard. Figure out ways, numerous ways, to answer her quickly and buy yourself some time to think for a few seconds. “I remember perfectly, it is good… Read more »
@Blax: I thought of you when I wrote that one. @j: I did include the rest and still got that… The extra bit which I did include got an “Alright :)” from her, which is perfectly ambiguous. It can mean “Alright 🙂 [you convinced me, we can meet alone a bit earlier]”. Or, more likely, it is just “Alright [thanks for explaining why you want to be alone with me, orbiter IAS]”, and thus bait for me to go “Cool, then meet me a bit earlier” and then she goes “Nope”. Given this, I’m extremely reluctant to re-initiate the meet… Read more »
O/T I watched Cool Hand Luke for the 1,975th time this weekend. I can’t not watch it whenever I happen across it. It’s an addiction since I was 6 years old, lol. Needless to say, every female within earshot of me was subjected to ” You better get your mind right ” consistently. The reaction was pretty consistent: Confusion ( they’d never even heard of the movie ) followed by laughter at the absurdity. Ditto with quoting the Godfather ” … You broke my heart Fredo ” spoken to a chick after she’d said something negative, lol. ” who?”… Short… Read more »