Field Reports

lion-chasing-gazelle

For the past three years of The Rational Male there’s been a consistent presence in the comment threads of guys seeking advice for particular situations with regards to Game. Whether it’s fine tuning certain aspects of Game or a larger consensus of the guys participating in my comment threads it’s become obvious there’s a need for a dedicated page and comment thread to address these Field Reports.

So I’m instituting this page for exactly this. If there is some urgency to have members of The Rational Male community analyze your particular situation feel free to hit anyone up in the comments of my current post, but please refer them to your particular field report with a link to your comment here. I’m hoping this will alleviate the mass of posts for field report analysis and Game specific insights piled into the main blog post for any given week.

There will be some rules for this “forum” as such. I ask that you only keep your comments to addressing the field reports at hand and save your larger theoretical stuff for the main posts, or if relevant, keep the “bigger scope of things” posts to being as succinct as possible. There will be no moderation in this comment thread (spamming excepted), so realize it will be a very hot kitchen before you post. I will impose no restrictions on video links here, nor will I limit links to various, but pertinent articles.

Understand, this is an experiment for now. It’s likely this comment thread will exceed thousands of comments. I’ll be instituting new comment plug-ins for wordpress to deal with this in the future, but I may archive this page the the posts and refresh this page in the future as well. If this gets cumbersome I may simply institute a dedicated forum-style sub-site of The Rational Male to accommodate for Game specific questions.

So have at it, post your field reports and feel free to comment on the ones you have some particular insight for. Be forewarned that it’s likely things may get a bit salty at times and I expect a lot of back & forth with debate and disagreements, but that’s what this thread is for – to hash out Game particulars for your given situations.

 

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having a bad day
having a bad day
11 months ago

@Rudolph Yeah. The timing is tricky. They come from the building to the garage without using the crosswalk at the corner. So I don’t get in ear shot enough. And there is the entire hurry to get home from work thing after darting across traffic. Weird distances and not enough consistency with seeing the likely candidates. There are few ways to play it that aren’t thirsty no matter how casual you are because you pass too quickly or too far away. The idea I have is to maybe peacock a bit about the pedestrian plaza nearby for lunch. There is… Read more »

Rudolph
Rudolph
11 months ago

why would you think ‘setting up’ in/around a parking garage (ie stalker central…lol) is a good idea?… serious question… haven’t you ever seen ANY low budget horror movies?…lol I am not “setting up” there. I park there. I am on my way to my car in a similar space of time every day. I see girls who work similar schedules to me with regularity. A couple of them are cute. But the timing doesn’t work out in as you note any sort of non-thirsty non-creepy way. But that is more or less the day game pool. Loading...

wahoo Mcdaniels
11 months ago

Waitress “everything you can think of but it really isn’t a good use of my time to go through them one by one – they’re on that shelf… Read more »”

PS; I am sorry to hear that you are a short timer. How long did the doctor give you to live?

Rudolph
Rudolph
11 months ago

@palma Yep about like that. I don’t threaten her gig at all. The only reason I’m not lowest of the low is I’ve been doing the job for going on twenty years. I don’t have any authority when it comes down to it other than just being there all the time and knowing what’s going on. I’m good at the job and it’s got some things that aren’t easy to do. I have to make six year old kids cry sometimes. And I work practically every weekend. The organization has several facilities and she doesn’t work in mine. Employees get… Read more »

having a bad day
having a bad day
11 months ago

@Sentient palmasailor @Sentient I’m gonna call this girl a high value mark (don’t shoot me) in the sense that you’ve decided you want to hit it cold, and it’s valuable to you that you achieve this as a game test. At this stage in the game I’m not sure there’s a right or wrong approach. Memories of knocking on my new neighbours door at 10pm about 5 years ago, having only previously waved at her through the window spring to mind. I kissed her and walked her upstairs to bed so anything can be done if you handle it right… Read more »

Sentient
Sentient
11 months ago

Palma/HABD

Good observations. One of the reasons I’ve not delved deeply into the details of her situation is because it does seem like a constant trainwreck – she works crazy and unpredictable hours – often from 12-8AM, is often between two different residences, has her own kids, babysits others. Lot’s of potential drama.

But I do need to probe a bit more.

having a bad day
having a bad day
11 months ago

@Sentient Palma/HABD Good observations. One of the reasons I’ve not delved deeply into the details of her situation is because it does seem like a constant trainwreck – she works crazy and unpredictable hours – often from 12-8AM, is often between two different residences, has her own kids, babysits others. Lot’s of potential drama. all i see is the potential for really wild crazy s*x…lol plus a GREAT opportunity to work your game chops…lol But I do need to probe a bit more. yes… yes you do… lol… plus… if she babysits other kids, then someone else also babysits her… Read more »

IRL
IRL
11 months ago

@HABD @Sentient @Palma by the numbers… By the numbers, we shouldn’t be skipping an important step (which @Palma’s intuition is trying to signal). Yes, all this should be coming from your own MPoO. Yes, you should know her logistics. And you should not ignore the IOD DHV IOI loop either. You can send the “come join me” text, but it won’t be correlated with her emotional state. This is a compliance test which you put forward without knowing her state of mind. Statistically it works because one of your leads happens to be up for something and maybe is still… Read more »

IRL
IRL
11 months ago

@Palma

Check this out, good primer for ping texting:

https://krauserpua.com/2016/08/25/how-to-ping-a-lead/

Sentient
Sentient
11 months ago

IRL

Yeah you’re right. Still feel this is a bit too outside for trying over text. Will wait for the next face to face and see where that can go.

having a bad day
having a bad day
11 months ago

@IRL @HABD @Sentient @Palma by the numbers… By the numbers, we shouldn’t be skipping an important step (which @Palma’s intuition is trying to signal). Yes, all this should be coming from your own MPoO. Yes, you should know her logistics. And you should not ignore the IOD DHV IOI loop either. You can send the “come join me” text, but it won’t be correlated with her emotional state. This is a compliance test which you put forward without knowing her state of mind. Statistically it works because one of your leads happens to be up for something and maybe is… Read more »

IRL
IRL
11 months ago

@Sentient
Still feel this is a bit too outside for trying over text.

Too outside? Care to elaborate?

@Palma
Ref texting

Texting is just a tool. What matters is the process and your understanding where you are. As such, it’s secondary if you eliminate texting completely, use it to quickly get a girl out at the right time or play a bit to warm up your old lead.

@HABD
your pedantic thoroughness

Mine? Haha, I like that!

plausible deniability to meet

Good pointer, I approve. +1

IAS
IAS
11 months ago

@IRL: “too outside” I interpreted as “outside chance”, i.e. low odds.

Enjoying the analysis by everyone, thanks.

IRL
IRL
11 months ago

@IAS
@IRL: “too outside” I interpreted as “outside chance”, i.e. low odds.

I’m interested in the intuition behind it.

Sentient
Sentient
11 months ago

IRL Re “too outside” I mean as a mode of communication at this point it will be ineffective. I’ve seen her about six times total over two years, with long gaps in between. So like a six months between 15-20 minute in person meets. All of them random and with bad logistics. This last gap 29 days. She still doesn’t even know my name as far as I can tell. So while the in person has been good in situ there is not enough connection to carry that vibe through in between. I could “start over” via text, basically follow… Read more »

Sentient
Sentient
11 months ago

Thanks Palma. I’ll keep that in mind. There were a couple of others, nothing here she “lost her shit”, pretty similar to these.

We will see. If I see her this week or next , I’m going to push things more and see what happens.

IRL
IRL
11 months ago

(@Rollo, comment stuck in mod…. whitelisting would be cool)

Sentient
Sentient
11 months ago

Racist! Shut it down…!!!

IRL
IRL
11 months ago

Ok one more time, at least the main bit: @Sentient Make sense? Thoughts? I agree with your approach. In person is more solid and you’ll run it on autopilot. This here though… I don’t think it will translate well though without more recent in person references. …is not necessarily correct. If it was 100% true, you wouldn’t see instances of guys turning cold leads around and blowing up long fuses via text. It’s just less predictable (there are patterns, but nothing granted). Try a “my world” text like this (from a bar, actually doing this): (you could capture some more… Read more »

IRL
IRL
11 months ago

Or go bolder and send these lol:

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-7z3PuxEeQfs/Vq3lGhBssbI/AAAAAAAAACw/XFpg4QtlCaQ/s1600/photo%2B%25284%2529.JPG
comment image

(@Palma, they closed the place, oh well)

FR challenge: caption the pics.

Oops
Oops
11 months ago

uhhh, sorry bonus question, how do I erase my email in the comment above!

IAS
IAS
11 months ago

@Oops: Rollo himself can sort the issue above, and he has in the past so it is pretty certain that he will remove the info. However depending on when he reads this and notices it may take a bit. Maybe try e-mailing him (check the about page, I think he has his contact there). Meanwhile, if you stay non-exclusive I think you will stay quite safe from actual, crippling One-itis. Beyond that, there are guys here in monogamous relations (marriages included) and even those who (at least apparently) aren’t getting extra on the side, aren’t afflicted by One-itis. You are… Read more »

Sentient
Sentient
11 months ago

Palma

“Until I went for it, I really believed it was a waste of time, ”

Going for it arouses them. Bit you have to go all in, no half measures.

Btw – your dinner protocol is very similar to The Thin Man’s over at sedfast, he does roast chicken, and my old standard omellet aux fin herbs. DHV is DHV.

Nice

Sentient
Sentient
11 months ago

Braveheart

You don’t need permission to do what you want to do. So do it and enjoy. If things change with hrr and you move on so be it. Move on.

No worries.

Enjoy!

IAS
IAS
11 months ago

@Palma: it is clear that under MM viewpoint, cooking is to act as a DHV.

That will depend a bit on the “target”, but clearly competence will be a good idea.

WIA
WIA
11 months ago

@Braveheart

This is actually a tough scenario because you’ve figured it out. Even if she says she doesn’t want kids, it’s a good chance that she does.

The play here is to enjoy as much of the moment as you can.

Sentient
Sentient
11 months ago

Palma

Sure. It’s not about eating or calories. It’s about creating a world and inviting her into it.

IRL
IRL
11 months ago

@Braveheart do I just go with the flow and enjoy this till it runs out, or do I cut the risk of an emotional loss if I for some reason get more attached and bail out now? Well, playing not to lose vs. playing to win, right? Up to you. In the long run, two things tend to happen: 1) Guys get comfortable and complacent with what they have. They invest more in one girl or less in other options/areas of their life (betaization if you will). 2) Girls’ priorities and expectations shift. They either try to have kids or… Read more »

IAS
IAS
11 months ago

N=3 😀 Thanks to Palma for some great advice. I’m happy to report it wasn’t as “Paint by the numbers” as when Sentient helped me when I got N=2 (Sentient and others, but Sentient really put some time in). LR: With YT who features in a previous FR where after some kino and dancing I went in for a kiss and she told me she didn’t like to be touched. I didn’t just want to Kiss Close her, I wanted to bang her, so after that I was playing conservatively until I had good logistics. Several days ago I went… Read more »

Sentient
Sentient
11 months ago

IAS
comment image

You monster… 👹

You bring her home in a wheelbarrow?

Rc
Rc
11 months ago

hi all, I’m in need of some help in reading a situation here. apologies for the wall of text. I’ve got no big changes to report – I initiate often, am turned down pretty often, get the question “are you upset”, I play it cool, rinse and repeat. Never passive aggressive, always playful and in good mood during the day. I’ve been leading more, taking more decisions, been more in charge. I’ve been noticing – now that I do that way less often – that Mrs’ Rc punishes bitterly when I show any uncertainty. Lesson learned. Mrs Rc’s mom is… Read more »

j
j
11 months ago

@RC “Mrs Rc explodes, says I’ve ignored her in taking a decision that should have involved both; […] I don’t explain, I just say I’ve decided to bring her with me”. “Got back later, am getting the kind of shitty passive aggressive behavior” You should have expected this would be her reaction when you got back. So, what I would have done is do something nice for her, that would act as a pattern interrupt. https://nlp-mentor.com/pattern-interrupt/ Like had your daughter make something nice for your wife at the office, then hand deliver it to her when you guys got back,… Read more »

Sentient
Sentient
11 months ago

RC “Honestly I don’t have a clue about what’s going on. Any insights? Thank you all.” What’s going on is she is losing control. That’s it. So she’s gonna fight it until she submits. So ignore what J is saying (romance? Come on dog…) and be the rock she wants. When you get through the funnel here, you won’t be getting these kinds of shit tests and she wont be turning down your advances so frequently. On that front, you need to start leaving the house after she does this and go somewhere where there are women. And yea it… Read more »

Rc
Rc
11 months ago

@j, yes, I did expect her to be like that – but didn’t want to come back with an apology. I did what had to be done with the kid. I see though that if the kid had done something for her, that would have been different. I like the second link – not so much the first I have to say – thanks. Good ideas.
I still can’t figure out exactly why she’s behaving like that. Is that just about the shorter time we spend together? Any thoughts will help.

Sentient
Sentient
11 months ago

Cats are not dogs! Say it with me.

So it’s ok she is a bit unhappy. That bit of unhappiness makes her wet. She doesn’t get it, but her pussy does.

kfg had a comment the other post on “poking her with the sharp stick of “no””

rc
rc
11 months ago

@sentient thanks – gotta run right now, will reply soon. Good advice.

Sentient
Sentient
11 months ago

RC

“I see though that if the kid had done something for her, that would have been different. ”

This is the kind of beta logic that will blow everything up. Have a backbone. Stand up to her. Draw lines.

Don’t try and fake her out with passive aggressive Bullshit. This is what she is already testing you about!

j
j
11 months ago

“romance? Come on dog…”

[calculated] romance from an alpha male is chick crack

SJF
SJF
11 months ago

@Rc My opinion is that Occam’s Razor might apply. She’s having trouble differentiating her self as a person standing on her own two feet. Rather than finding her in a role of mother, wife and daughter. She’s twisting in the wind. She doesn’t have a solid sense of herself. She’s increasingly dependent on you. And rigid brittle and controlling. She’s not being flexible. She’s not calm, cool and collected. She’s testing you for guidance. She’s over-reacting. Notice I didn’t suggest any actions. Just pointed out her behavior because you asked for insights. This is where married pill gets somewhat differentiated… Read more »

SJF
SJF
11 months ago

I went back and read Sentient and J.’s notes: J is dead wrong. Sentient: “Don’t try and fake her out with passive aggressive Bullshit. This is what she is already testing you about!” Yes. And you don’t reward shitty behavior with cash or prizes or romance or time or attention. She’s covertly asking for guidance. She can’t handle herself properly. Sure, it’s a bummer when she isn’t rewarding your sexual advances. But she’s just feeling shitty in general and she’s acting out. In MRP it’s more of a bummer too to realize that it falls back on you to guide… Read more »

Sentient
Sentient
11 months ago

J

And you coming home with a rose after an argument rules you out as an alpha male…. 🌹

And it’s not romance, it’s apology and surrender. Your whole approach is one of appeasement, firmly in HER frame.

Honey Badger comes home and doesn’t give a fuck.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=4r7wHMg5Yjg

j
j
11 months ago

@Sentient

“And you coming home with a rose after an argument rules you out as an alpha male”

I’m not an alpha. I’m a sleazeball.

Us latinos like getting into fights with our women, then winning them back with romantic gestures + charm. Repeat.

Keeps em’ hooked. I understand if y’all ain’t about that life.

Blaximus
Blaximus
11 months ago

depending on stuff, all that ” fight with her ” shit stops working 1) when she’s matured or past 26-27 ( whichever comes first ) 2) another dude comes along and won’t take ” no ” for an answer and just…takes…her. That’s what I’ve seen happen numerous times with all of that hot blooded stuff, lol. My boy Angel used to get all machismo fueled until one day he was like ” where’s my girl??”. She was with another dude. Not arguing. Theatrics are okay up to a point. Beyond that point you are venturing into her home field –… Read more »

Blaximus
Blaximus
11 months ago

Lol, the way it really goes down for most dudes…

Check ’em.

j
j
11 months ago

Lmaoooooo

Just don’t take them seriously. fuck outta here with that shit.

Blaximus
Blaximus
11 months ago

Lmao.

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
11 months ago

J
Us latinos like getting into fights with our women, then winning them back with romantic gestures + charm. Repeat.

“Emotional roller coaster” in YaReally terms.
“Break up to make up” in terms of 1970’s pop tunes such as Peaches and Herb’s “Reunited”.

SJF
SJF
11 months ago

“I still can’t figure out exactly why she’s behaving like that. Is that just about the shorter time we spend together? Any thoughts will help.” She’s just plain frustrated. It’s her not you. Tell us more about her character. How well is she parenting the kids as a mom? Is she high self-esteem or low self esteem? And tell us more, as I asked earlier, about her relationship with her mother. It’s all an ego boost to you that her mom backs you, but that’s not how a marriage is best kept healthy. It’s you and your wife in a… Read more »

Sentient
Sentient
11 months ago

“Us latinos like getting into fights with our women, then winning them back with romantic gestures + charm. Repeat.”

Repeat indeed. One of the most beta cultures on display.

Hint – are all those gas stations roses there for “your people”?

Take two more blue pills and call me in the morning.

In the meantime tell us how long your longest relationship has been?

Sentient
Sentient
11 months ago

Blax

“Beyond that point you are venturing into her home field – The Drama Bowl. She watches you be all dramatic. Consistently. Then one day she wakes up and realizes that you’re acting like her sister when they have a fight.”

Wisdom on display. Wisdom = knowledge + experience.

Sentient
Sentient
11 months ago

Coming up on TRM – The Timewaster…

aka Validation Queen.

j
j
11 months ago

“Hint – are all those gas stations roses there for “your people””

Let the record show: j has never bought a girl anything in 4 years besides a $3 travel souvenir to one fuckbuddy. And a $7 beer to another.

“aka Validation Queen.”

Not DT girl surely?”

Ahhh that’s why my niggas pissed 😂

Sentient
Sentient
11 months ago

J Precisly why KJ is frowned upon🐸 Palma – ha no. Timewaster is that kind of mid 40s woman who is married and only plays so far… Because “married” after all… Meh. Just another complication in this thing. Annoying at times though. Short shrift – picking up some take out, pop into bar next door while waiting. About 8pm. Nice little spinner type eating alone at the bar. End up chatting. Have a drink. She has Ubered into town to have a bite and drink. Her husband and kid away. Ding! She’s a lefty type – yoga, vegan, nose hoop,… Read more »

Sentient
Sentient
11 months ago

Palma Yes. RT gets shit for “muh Hypergamy” but this is it in action. Her hisband is her second husband. Had 3 kids with the first and 1 with #2. Been married 7 years. That hypergamous pre menopausal extinction burst compels her to “go out to eat” in a way where her brain can be satisfied she just “went out to eat” and her pussy can find a way for “it just happened”… So she goes. If my game was tighter it might have been Door Number 2. As it is she got Door Number 3 – her pussy tells… Read more »

Rc
Rc
11 months ago

@sentient, This is the kind of beta logic that will blow everything up Yes, I see it. I guess this is why I was hesitant in writing her back or offering olive branches after I left in the morning. Which indeed I didn’t do. Mrs’ Rc punishes bitterly when I show any uncertainty. Lesson learned. Really, have you learned? I am seeing these things in real time and behaving differently way earlier than I used to. In yesterday’s case for example once I expressed that she was coming with me, there was no reconsideration, which is part of why she… Read more »

rc
rc
11 months ago

@sjf, thanks for focusing my attention on those things. she’s very invested in raising the kids as well as possible, and quite low self-esteem. Lower than she should I believe. She has always paid attention to her look and being in shape, and she is. Oftentimes she gets up very early in the morning to go to the gym. She’s attractive and I like her – which makes me so much more upset when she behaves like a dead fish in bed. But I don’t show that at all now. She has spent five years out of the labor force… Read more »

Blaximus
Blaximus
11 months ago

Palma

Idk. I don’t see a.real shutdown. It depends now on how much sentient wants/chooses to proceed ( moar skillful pressure/game ).

Few women that way ” …we’re not having sex” actually hold to that under game. Lol, she’s telegraphing, bless her heart.

It’s up to sentient to decide if juice=squeeze.

But interesting fun in the meantime.

Sentient
Sentient
11 months ago

Blax

“…we’re not having sex” actually hold to that under game.”

Yeah this is usually a signal that sex is very likely… It’s her “Well I told him we weren’t” so she’s not guilty if it just happens.

Palma

Yeah let me think some more on it. For brevity I didn’t go into a lot of detail.

SJF
SJF
11 months ago

@Rc “If any of those things I’ve speak to you, I’ll gladly listen.” Interesting. Your replies to my questions were answered with what I expected. That’s why I asked. Because what little you’ve said about her actions belied that underlying low self esteem. And her need to control the kids because she doesn’t feel in control. Her low self esteem is a troublemaker for you. Her idea that you and grandma “let the kids do whatever they want” belies her not feeling in control. Normally in a mother/father role, feminine/masculine, the mother gives unconditional love and forgives their transgressions and… Read more »

having a bad day
having a bad day
11 months ago

@Sentient i see a ‘timewaster’ but it wasn’t her…lol… what do we tell Culum?… 15 minutes is not ‘too fast’?…lol where was the first place you had ‘isolation in a sex location’?… you’re slackin’, bro…lol her hindbrain was taking her for an ‘outing’ to get laid… she was DTF… you just had to convert… (seven year itch, yo!…lol) ‘a couple of minutes behind that bush over there’…lol Timewaster is that kind of mid 40s woman who is married and only plays so far… Because “married” after all… Meh. Just another complication in this thing. Annoying at times though. Short shrift… Read more »

j
j
11 months ago

“missed your window…lol”

Yup lol. I bet sentient didn’t even consider the possibility of a bathroom fuck.

j
j
11 months ago

@HABD

Your breakdown has me thinking tho. If there even is such a thing as a ‘timewaster’ or does it always just come down to mediocre game/missing windows?

interesting.

Sentient
Sentient
11 months ago

Now you’re sounding like Mystery J… 😉

Sentient
Sentient
11 months ago

RC Seriously just ignore all that “low self esteem” stuff. It is just going to put you down a well trod dog logic path of “solving for her”… “Well if she has X issue I can just do Y” etc. Pure Bullshit and betadom awaits. She is fighting for control and she won’t submit because she doesn’t yet trust you as Alpha enought to lead her. That’s the whole issue. Who has Hand. Also be careful with stuff that “makes it easier for her”, like her going to the gym to stay fit and getting back in the workforce are… Read more »

Sentient
Sentient
11 months ago

“consider the possibility of a bathroom fuck.”

Here’s the thing. There is a mutual aspect to the bubble and she can break it just as easy as you can.

I’ll get to HABDs points tomorrow. Thanks

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
11 months ago

Rc She has spent five years out of the labor force raising the kids and in some sense this took a toll on her – she was getting increasingly frustrated about the prospect of her life becoming meaningless after the kids were old enough to leave home. Last year she went back to work. This is what put a lot of pressure on mine; I have less time to work because I pick up kids from school – schedule just doesn’t work otherwise. This could be her going along with the social pressure on women to “have it all” by… Read more »

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
11 months ago

Sentient to Rc
Also be careful with stuff that “makes it easier for her”, like her going to the gym to stay fit and getting back in the workforce are also signals that she is looking to keep her options open. Straight up how Hypergamy works. Also be aware this is in all likelihood not a conscious act on her part.

Agree with these possibilities. Don’t let her get “one foot out of the door”.

rc
rc
11 months ago

@AR and everybody, thanks – I’m understanding most of it I think. @AR, what do you mean by “letting her get one foot out the door”?

In the past days we’ve been joking about me getting younger colleagues instead of her – just funny teasing, though you could see her with the grim that doesn’t know how to reply. When she attempts that I give her tips. So not sure about letting her get one foot out the door; what do you mean?

rc
rc
11 months ago

@sjf, you have very good antennas for those things. This low self esteem thing is something I have tried to address directly and indirectly a LOT in the past. I must have done it in the wrong way, because @Sentient is right, that’s part of why I’m in this situation today. And it just generated an enormous amount of frustration along the way. Lately I’ve just brought those kind of low self-esteem statements to the extreme ridicule. Most of the times she gets how silly this is, but sometimes you hear the “you became insensitive to me” sad line. If… Read more »

Sentient
Sentient
11 months ago

RC

“If any of you guys have been in this situation before and want to chip in on how you dealt with it, it’s great.”

Heh. Look man she isn’t a snowflake. She’s a woman. Every guy who has been betaized has been here. It’s all her trying to control stuff because she isn’t in submission.

All the terms “low self esteem” etc. Are just rationalizations.

She isn’t submitting because you aren’t (yet) worthy of it.

Fix that and her “esteem” will go up… Lol.

Always focus on you.

Sentient
Sentient
11 months ago

“If there is another way to deal with this you guys let me know.”

Well ig she starts to focus on keeping YOU around it gives her less time to moan about her stuff.

On the kids thing, it’s fine to lay down the law from time to time in front of the kids. They see everything anyhow.

You are not a team. You are not codparents. Or 50/50 partners. You have no board to report to. YOU alone Starbuck are leading this thing, for good or bad. Act like it.

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
11 months ago

Rc @AR, what do you mean by “letting her get one foot out the door”? If it is ok with you for her to be working for money and it’s for the family then that’s one thing. However just by being out in the world she’s associating with different people, both women and men. Women are more sensitive to group thinking than we are; they are more likely to adopt the behaviors and even beliefs of “the herd” that they are exposed to all day. Pay attention to her behaviors and subcommunications, especially right after she gets home from work.… Read more »

SJF
SJF
11 months ago

Every guy who has been betaized has been here. It’s all her trying to control stuff because she isn’t in submission. I’m in agreement with Sentient and Palma on the fixes. It’s pretty axiomatic in MRP that you don’t work on fixing her. Sentient is right that focusing on the self esteem issue is a rationalization tactic. Doesn’t mean it’s not there. It just makes your burden of performance more difficult. You fix yourself. You lead her by demonstrating leadership, not explaining it to her. And yes, she will keep trying to control, including hide the vagina, until she breaks.… Read more »

Softek
Softek
11 months ago

Working on your own self esteem is the solution. The correct behaviors just go on auto-pilot when you highly value yourself and your time here on earth. At least that’s my hypothesis. I have yet to field test it. The kind of shit I went through involved suicide threats, flat out banshee screaming, wailing and crying, throwing and breaking things, ripping phones out of the wall, etc. That was in response to me any time I would simply get up and start to leave after she tried starting shit with me. I could not think of anything else to do… Read more »

TantumErgo
TantumErgo
11 months ago
Reply to  Softek

@Softek

W o w!

I thought that I had had a tough time with my last LTR (‘Babushka’) — who was every inch a faithless, feckless, reckless drama factory whom I foolishly allowed to walk all over me.

But you, sir, appear to have been taken to the depths of hell!

How did this situation resolve itself? I would be grateful for your experience, so that I can prepare myself better for my next encounter.

Props to you 😊

TantumErgo

Sentient
Sentient
11 months ago

“The only problem was her trying to train me that comforting was the “correct” behavior, and that just getting up and leaving was “bad.” At least, that’s the impression I’m getting in hindsight. I’m not sure how accurate that is.” She was training you for that purpose. I recall a central part of your drama with her was your desire to be non exclusive and her knowledge of that. See how her antics could work to prevent that from happening? Girl card 1 – sex him into compliance. Well she did that and it didn’t work… Girl Card 2 –… Read more »

Sentient
Sentient
11 months ago

Soften “You could say I’m not on board with the deliberately creating bad feelz schtick.” Well if you had stayed with the other girl, she would have “won” and then she’d continue to consolidate beyond just you and her being exclusive… Her drama a tool to get her way. For everything. And after a while of this and you capitulating – betaization is death by a thousand cuts – she will give up any pretense of being afraid of you leaving. And THAT’S when you start “creating bad feelz” aka “dread” – if you want to change the dynamic. And… Read more »

rc
rc
11 months ago

good, thank you all. I hear what you guys are saying – at least I think so. Got another rejection yesterday and really was totally untouched. Today she’s testing again with questions like are you upset etc. I’m starting to see the pattern. Now, I’ve got one follow up questions for the crowd – and one report – based on @AR’s “getting the foot out the door”. @AR says “don’t let her do that”. I get what the end result of her testing the water is. But even if I don’t like it, I certainly don’t want to be a… Read more »

rc
rc
11 months ago

@softek, thanks for posting that. I may not be en route to that level of shit, but one needs to know how bad it can get. Great you made it through.

SJF
SJF
11 months ago

@Rc @sjf, you have very good antennas for those things. This low self esteem thing is something I have tried to address directly and indirectly a LOT in the past. I must have done it in the wrong way, because @Sentient is right, that’s part of why I’m in this situation today. And it just generated an enormous amount of frustration along the way. Lately I’ve just brought those kind of low self-esteem statements to the extreme ridicule. Most of the times she gets how silly this is, but sometimes you hear the “you became insensitive to me” sad line.… Read more »

Sentient
Sentient
11 months ago

RC First of, don’t freak out. I highly doubt your wife is having an affair. pay attention to the meta analysis. The framework. This is what you must understand… The Feminine Imperitive is working against you. Always. what is the FI? Heartiste described it as “as maximally restricting a man’s sexuality while minimally restricting a woman’s”. Can you see it in play here? How you got to this – “even if I don’t like it, I certainly don’t want to be a beggar and give DLV” and how that mindset is just degrees away from : “even if I don’t… Read more »

Sentient
Sentient
11 months ago

RC

Got another rejection yesterday and really was totally untouched.

Yeah it’s time to move on from stoic non butthurt “look at me Mommy how fine I am!” to the point where SHE is starting to feel “touched”…

“On that dulcet note, reader Sentient demonstrates by example,”

https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:6-1a0PzFonAJ:https://heartiste.net/asshole-game-week-the-relationship-reset/+&cd=6&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us

Spot the “pointy stick of no” and dread…

SJF
SJF
11 months ago

“And after a while of this and you capitulating – betaization is death by a thousand cuts – she will give up any pretense of being afraid of you leaving.” I had forgotten that Softek had used that lifesaving plot device of non-exclusivity in his non-girlfriend narrative. Which reminds me of a few things. Kindness and niceness (or conversely cunning hind-brain of a woman) can be a killer. I watched the whole Magnolia (1999) movie this past week. Tom Cruise play Frank Mackey, loosely based on Ross Jeffries. PUA/RSD like guy. It was a big ensemble cast. Aimee Mann did… Read more »

Softek
Softek
11 months ago

@ Palma Yep. Completely out now. We’ve had sex a few times since it ended months ago, but by her initiative alone (hitting me up and asking me if I want my dick sucked/if I want to fuck her, etc.), and she has not pulled any manipulative BS before or after those encounters. It isn’t regular enough to be a FB relationship. As far as I’m concerned it’s completely over, and whatever interactions I’ve had with her since have been on my terms, oddly enough without me even consciously setting any terms. I literally just did nothing, let her exit… Read more »

Sentient
Sentient
11 months ago

Softek

Soooooo when you started to treat her like an Alpha fuckbuddy would, she started to respond like an Alpha’s fuckbuddy?

Lol. Those dots connected enough for you are do you need an etched fucking diagram?

Good on you. Learn the lesson. YOUR behavior influences HER behavior.

As far as killing the Beta. Start to follow The Platinum Rule – do whatever YOU want to do, whenever YOU want to do it.

Leads to alpha behavior.

TantumErgo
TantumErgo
11 months ago
Reply to  Softek

@Softek Many thanks for sharing your tale of woe — this is something of an eye-opener for me, as I am the neophyte here, having resolutely refused to unplug from the Matrix despite ALL the warning signs in my previous relationships … so now only swallowing / choking-down the RP with as much relish as I can muster. 🙂 Sounds like you went through a total war of attrition — but managed to come out of it, despite being scathed — in more or less one piece: this, it seems to me, by NOT giving your ex-girlfriend what she wanted:… Read more »

TantumErgo
TantumErgo
11 months ago
Reply to  Sentient

@ Sentient
@Softek

“Learn the lesson. YOUR behavior influences HER behavior.

As far as killing the Beta. Start to follow The Platinum Rule – do whatever YOU want to do, whenever YOU want to do it.
Leads to alpha behavior.”

THIS … The Platinum Rule = My new Cardinal Rule. 🙂

Softek
Softek
11 months ago

@ Sentient I am not completely opposed to the idea of an etched diagram. I’m convinced my thick skull came from being dropped on my head multiple times as a baby. I have the dents to prove it. I tend to overthink everything, perhaps because of the guilt complex. Platinum Rule = Following your gut instinct, IMO. So many times I’ve wanted to leave a situation, or say No, but immediately would ignore/suppress it because I thought it would make someone uncomfortable or upset with me, etc. My first auto-pilot tendency is to ignore my gut and prioritize accommodating the… Read more »

Sentient
Sentient
11 months ago

Tantum

To fully appreciate The Platinum Rule compare and contrast with The Golden Rule.

The GOLDEN RULE – do unto others as you would have them do unto you.

Perfect for creating supplicants, covert contracts, losers and an impotent MPoO…

Wonder why THAT caught on?

Softek
Softek
11 months ago

@ Tantum I’m not sure if it’s ongoing. It seems pretty random, could end at any time. I don’t really pay any attention to it at all. But am always down for it if she wants to swing by to hook up. Early after the breakup I felt needy a couple times and would try to get her to have sex with me and…medium is the message. She completely ignored those messages or would reply with something completely unrelated. I did that once or twice before tiring of degrading myself so I stopped completely. Then some months later she just… Read more »

TantumErgo
TantumErgo
11 months ago
Reply to  Sentient

@Sentient

My neophyte understanding of what you are saying:

The Golden Rule does all as you say it does… and has created a false reciprocity not actually reciprocated by women, but exploited by the FI for the purpose of subjugating men for the furtherment of their sexual strategy.

The Golden Rule plays to men’s rationality and requires compliance.

The Platinum Rule flips the switch: No pretence at reciprocity, and preys upon women’s emotionality and inheherent insecurities; they can no longer pretend that they are in control.

Dynamite! 😊

Sentient
Sentient
11 months ago

HABD You know “Timewaster” is somewhat tongue in cheek. It is interesting though because I’ve had half a dozen of these types act like this and they all have one thing in common, been divorced. Of course other divorced ones worked out so that’s not an efficient screen. But is a common factor. Some other data points… where was the first place you had ‘isolation in a sex location’?… Hehe the car. Interesting thing there. So when we left the bar, walking out towards the car, here I would normally take her hand and lead her out. I was on… Read more »

Sentient
Sentient
11 months ago

Tantum

not actually reciprocated by women,

Well it’s broader than women, it’s society at large. Do your work, clean your room, keep your head down, wait your turn – great is your reward… later. after you are dead…

Good for parents, teachers, employers, The State etc…

Bad for liberty, freedom and MPoO

Sentient
Sentient
11 months ago

Tantum

and The Platinum rule is the path towards attaining Alpha.

https://newlyaloof.wordpress.com/2016/12/02/sentients-dynamic-passionate-authentic-framework/

Alpha is not a beard and a 400lb dead and a cigar and a lisp…

j
j
11 months ago

@Sentient “she made a face like she wasn’t into it” shit test. “I said I wasn’t that into it either, she asked if my wife liked it, I said not really sure, it’s not my thing, we’ve done it but meh… she said you should do it for your wife… haha”. yeah. just a missed opportunity to go deeper (heh) into sex talk. “you look like you don’t like anal.” You’ve tried it before and it was a bad experience/didn’t do it for you?” or go into a descriptive sex story of your own about fucking a girl (not your… Read more »

j
j
11 months ago

@softy

“The part that sucks is she explicitly told me earlier on in the relationship she’d be down for threesomes”.
comment image

Aight lesson learned. Now stop feeling sorry for yourself and go out and get another one.

Sentient
Sentient
11 months ago

J

that would have kept the bubble going….

True, true…

TantumErgo
TantumErgo
11 months ago
Reply to  Softek

@ Softek Hindsight is a wonderful thing, as they say. Interesting parallels for me with my experience with Babushka. She, too, was down for threesomes, but I declined, despite also being a pervert in essence, and this because I developed feelings for her (I fell in love with her), and thought that being monagamous was the way to go (v e r y Beta of me). Initially she had a voracious sexual appetite for me, during the attraction >> idealisation phase of our relationship… then she delivered the ultimate shit test: she told me that she had no objection to… Read more »

TantumErgo
TantumErgo
11 months ago
Reply to  Sentient

@ Sentient

“and The Platinum rule is the path towards attaining Alpha.

https://newlyaloof.wordpress.com/2016/12/02/sentients-dynamic-passionate-authentic-framework/

Alpha is not a beard and a 400lb dead and a cigar and a lisp…”

And so my path begins… Many thanks, Sentient — both for the theory (Alpha Triad) and the practice.

I am looking forward to field testing some of these ideas.

TantumErgo

Softek
Softek
11 months ago

@ Tantum We sound similar in terms of knowing better, but defaulting to stupid auto-pilot Beta behaviors due to anxiety and overthinking. As long as you learned your lesson, all is well. It just gives you a better opportunity to have more solid Frame in your next relationship, and totally avoid the pitfalls you made in the last one. This is the diamond I’m holding on to that was refined out of the near 4 year experience I went through in my last relationship. He is best prepared for trouble who sees it coming from afar. What does your Frame… Read more »

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