For the past three years of The Rational Male there’s been a consistent presence in the comment threads of guys seeking advice for particular situations with regards to Game. Whether it’s fine tuning certain aspects of Game or a larger consensus of the guys participating in my comment threads it’s become obvious there’s a need for a dedicated page and comment thread to address these Field Reports.
So I’m instituting this page for exactly this. If there is some urgency to have members of The Rational Male community analyze your particular situation feel free to hit anyone up in the comments of my current post, but please refer them to your particular field report with a link to your comment here. I’m hoping this will alleviate the mass of posts for field report analysis and Game specific insights piled into the main blog post for any given week.
There will be some rules for this “forum” as such. I ask that you only keep your comments to addressing the field reports at hand and save your larger theoretical stuff for the main posts, or if relevant, keep the “bigger scope of things” posts to being as succinct as possible. There will be no moderation in this comment thread (spamming excepted), so realize it will be a very hot kitchen before you post. I will impose no restrictions on video links here, nor will I limit links to various, but pertinent articles.
Understand, this is an experiment for now. It’s likely this comment thread will exceed thousands of comments. I’ll be instituting new comment plug-ins for wordpress to deal with this in the future, but I may archive this page the the posts and refresh this page in the future as well. If this gets cumbersome I may simply institute a dedicated forum-style sub-site of The Rational Male to accommodate for Game specific questions.
So have at it, post your field reports and feel free to comment on the ones you have some particular insight for. Be forewarned that it’s likely things may get a bit salty at times and I expect a lot of back & forth with debate and disagreements, but that’s what this thread is for – to hash out Game particulars for your given situations.
Sentient – the sex talk, yes, to a guy who isn’t used to speakign that way with women. It would definitely have come across strange and contrived to me a decade ago, when I didn’t have experience of actually having that kind of conversations with women.
Hell, I remember feeling nervous even about asking women to send me sexy pictures when we were texting..
@Palma I seem to say this in every other post, but YaReally wrote a lot about this dynamic and how to handle it. From what I recall, basically, be discreet, don’t do bf/gf/relationship type stuff with her (only sex) etc. He also minimized how much personal information the girls had about him (only his first name, even if he took them home, he would kiss them as they went in so they wouldn’t notice apartment number etc) but that kind of stuff may not be practical for you. But the rest of his advice will apply. He also said if… Read more »
Palma
Women don’t set their Plan B guy up with a friend unless it is in the circumstances you describe. They do share their fuckbois/Alpha Fux though – the secret society guys.
YaReally’s advice was not on the basis that the girl was looking to branch-swing and make him her new boyfriend – his general vibe made it clear that wasn’t a possibility. It was more to avoid messy scenes and angry boyfriends and that sort of thing if it came out that she was cheating.
@Palma – possible, but I doubt there is that level of master-plan stuff at play. Probably just your secret society vibe leading to a recommendation to someone trusted – and then if that goes well, the network builds. No doubt the local MILF network gossips about you (I get the impression you’re not in a huge city or anything so the group can’t be that big), but I doubt there is a group effort that is testing you with a low-stakes woman. More likely the woman who recommended you has put forward someone trusted… ..but hey, anything’s possible. And these… Read more »
Ask for a photo to see what EE girl looks like. Face and body. If she looks good, then tell EEGF that you want to meet her (EE girl) for a drink. Then all you guys go back to your flat. And bang. If you play your cards right, you could even have a MFF threesome. If she doesn’t look good, then all of this doesn’t matter. But yeah…get that photo. Don’t be reckless by going to her place, risking her getting caught by her man and losing the £££ house. That wouldn’t be very secret society of you…
“Sex is not a big deal to women, in that they can always get it.” True. I’m now gaming an HB8 24 year old. We’ve gone out 4-5 times. She has resisted sex although she likes to me grabbing her ass and escalating. It’s a game. She resists, I ignore her, she escalates, I resist. What she’s more interested in is getting inside my mind, “discovering” me…and gets all tingly about meeting up, dressing up for me etc. It’s a very primitive mating game. I will eventually bang her. But clearly the mental sex is much more important than the… Read more »
@palma “And it’s with EEGF who is going to “arrange something”” You need to follow up, mate. As you said, you’ve had tons of girls suggest arranging something with a friend, and its never happened. Stop wanking off at this “I’m not doing anything. Girls have to come to me” garbage. You are a man. You want something to happen. Then you need to make it happen (in this case, by nudging EEGF, to ask EE girl for a drink with you @ X place). Don’t mistake this for being ‘needy’. Neediness is a mindset. Not a behavior. The girl’s… Read more »
Palma
“So EEGF has said she wants to set me up with EE girl because she “EE girl wants the sex”.”
That’s it. Secret society intro secret handshake…
This is Why I told Culum not to worry about banging girls in his social circle and small town.
Have fun.
“For a bigger job than the one woman
Because there are loads of these women where I am.”
Yeah man. Burden. Never ends…
“This old porch is just a big old red-and-white Hereford bull
Standing under a mesquite tree out in Agua Dulce
Just keeps on playing hide-and-seek with that hot August sun
He’s sweating and a-panting ’cause his work is never done, oh no
I’ve known a whole lot of ol’ bulls in my life, and their work is never done”
https://genius.com/Robert-earl-keen-the-front-porch-song-lyrics
Palma
“And it’s with EEGF who is going to “arrange something””
Well there you go. She is coming to you.
@palma “Despite all the talk a few days ago Nothing was mentioned” what did I say about not waiting on the sidelines for something to “just happen”? “I said “hey get me her number I need to book her in” and EEGF says she needs to speak to the EE friend first.” Good. Now she’s gonna tell her friend about you 🙂 “probably because I’ve never been banging the referrer as AF” The sex story that I’ve shared most often, involves me arriving in my AirBnB on a Thursday night. The hostess knew I was going to one of the… Read more »
Palms I think your gut instinct was right, have her come to you. J is dealing with a younger demo with less baggage. “. I said “hey get me her number I need to book her in” and EEGF says she needs to speak to the EE friend first.” Calibration is hard on this. Another way to approach this would have been to give EEGF your number, perhaps on paper, and have her friend get in touch with you. So she’s tasked with making it happen and you aren’t chasing. Preserves your non needy position. Then if she did get… Read more »
@Palma 4 dates is a long time.. I made the mistake of doing 8 once and the sex was terrible. I just get bored with them if I don’t get them into the sack between 1-3.. The line is definitely 3 now, no matter about anything else”” It would be except it’s low investment on my part so ghosting her would be shooting myself in the foot. I have 3 other plates so I’m not sitting around hoping she’ll bang me. She is interested. I think she’s inexperienced and the age gap requires additional comfort. At one point she did… Read more »
@Blax: Let’s see, something that wala wouldn’t call ” yesterday man-ish “, lol. More recently I grew the meetings we had for young men/youth from it’s initial 50-100 attendees to ( the last one ) 1,500. Some of by best buddies said that younger dudes wouldn’t listen to any guy my age or over 30 years old. I was told judges and lawyers and law enforcement wouldn’t volunteer their time because nobody gave a fuck and that I was just wasting my time. Now that I have less free time ( work constraints ), I’m calling out the ” religious… Read more »
http://www.tremcar.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/20150918_103004.jpg
Wala’s weekly delivery of haterade.
Thanks for the sideways compliment, but it only shows that you really don’t get it.
Dad sweater…😂 that’s a good one.
I figured out the meaning of a code word for a group that meets so people can pair up at the end of the night at a bar. A broad invited me into the group a couple of times and told me the code word but didn’t explain the meaning. (Why would she invite me into the group?) I asked one of the guys in the group if the code word was happening that night. “How’d you know about that” was his response.
Palma
That funny if not unexpected. I think the Tate’s will go to jail eventually.
And the greatest PUA Owen ever raised got married.
https://www.instagram.com/p/B2Pp7Z8H0W9/?igshid=g1rvtspeeh54
…but why would he get married when there are billions and billions of hawt 20 year old hb9-10’s all over the place?
Did he hit his head?
Time. That shit reveals all.
@Sentient. Great breakdown of that interaction. The age thing is irrelevant just shows game works it’s just a matter of calibration . The short shorts at her age would be a tell. But the other thing to pull from this is the logistics suck. You spike her buying temperature And then there’s no where to go with it which is where most guys get blown out…this happens and the next time he texts her he has to start from the beginning which is why a comfort shift from attraction is critical. I now bounce back and forth to always be… Read more »
Wala “But the other thing to pull from this is the logistics suck. ” Yep. There really is no place to isolate away from eyes inside the security ring at any of the airports I’m in. This is just a bit of fun. Stepping up, seeing where it can go in an hour. From my perspective it’s all just an opportunity to practice and you usually get something from it. That “heels to bed” line is new and will go into the toolbox. And there is no real downside. So at best it leads to a little snogging and a… Read more »
Another interesting point to ponder… Is this the FI’s devious hand on me HABD? “We chat a little about football game on. I was taljing about Baker Mayfield and say “he looks good” but she hears it as me saying she looks good. Lol. Not my intent so have to work off this. She says “oh you are kind”…” This bit took me aback a sec. In the moment I was choosing between two responses, the one I went with or “heh slow your roll I was saying HE looks good. Somebody’s full of herself” or along those lines. It… Read more »
Have been listening to a Farnam Street podcast where the guest is Annie Duke (famous pioneering female poker player for those that don’t know). Very interesting – made me think about this FR thread and the process of learning Game (or putting on the Red Pill lenses) a lot. She’s talking about learning to play poker well, but the exact same points apply here. She talks about how there are lots of guys who play poker for decades but they plateau quickly and siply don’t get better and she was able to get better than them fast, and a key… Read more »
@Sentient
Is this the FI’s devious hand on me HABD?
your bad feelz maybe are… but otherwise that’s just good calibration…
good luck!
“that’s just good calibration”
+1
@Culum
Thanks bro. I’ll give it a listen. Used to read Shane’s blog religiously back in 2014-17. Unfortunately I stopped checking out his site for the same reason as these guys:
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18433239
@j – hahaha, yes I’m familiar with most of that list of people and I agree.
I think interviews are a bit different because it depends entirely on the person being interviewed – so I still like to listen to long form interviews – commuting, or doing the dishes or whatever.
Palmasailor
That and giving away seats “free one for one” at the next connvention.
Kind of a steep discount. Guess he plans to make it all back on volume…
Palmasailor
He’s relying on getting bums on seats for 2 reasons:
If all that is required is bums on seats, shoulda had the convention in Seattle or Portland or San Francisco or even LA. Plenty of bums on the streets there.
Rollo,
I need to share some recent field reports, for you and the sphere. Just testing this out, as I’m fairly low tech. I’m a recovered “serial monogamist”, and former blue pill beta. I’m 47, and have only been divorced for 7 months…but my frame is tight now. It’s amazing, actually (i.e. the results). Much credit to Rian, Carl, Rich, and Donovan as well. Anyway. Thanks to you all! Crazy shit out there that I never knew about.
M
Hey guys. I am feeling kinda like an AFC rn but the cause of the problem is the not an AFC cause. Basically the problem I am having is: So much of my time is being devoted to my goals of being a state champion this year, preparing for success in D1 College Wrestling, and becoming valedictorian this year. I have been grinding this year basically unrelenting during the day on these goals. Most of the small amount of free time I do have I spend with my bros keeping those relationships strong before we go away to college. What… Read more »
Hell yeah Palma. I know it will be much easier in college to balance the two based on simple proximity. I will live in a coed dorm etc. it is interesting though, a common thing successful people have told me, especially top wrestlers in the country and world, is that there are sacrifices involved with being the best. Now is the first time I am really starting to experience these sacrifices firsthand and why it is “lonely at the top”
@Young Shagger: Not making the sacrifices you need to make to be the best means that you have to sacrifice being the best. Nobody can do everything. Everybody picks and chooses based on their priorities. When someone talks about your “sacrifices” what they are really doing is revealing and propagandizing their own values. Success means achieving your goals. When somebody asks me about my “sacrifices” I tell them I don’t know what they’re talking about. I haven’t made any. Yes, it’s true that while I was practicing violin I wasn’t out partying, but I didn’t set out to party. I… Read more »
👍
YS. Go with your strengths and realize that when 3 months, 9 months, or 3 years or 9 years down the road, that delayed gratification is OK to achieve your purpose and mission. That is the essence of the masculine male virtues. Strength, courage, mastery and honor among other men. And it gets lost sometimes when talking about Red Pill and Groupthink. You don’t have to compromise your short term Senior year mission. Three years from now it won’t matter that you didn’t get laid in the next three months. And then you have the time after the wrestling season.… Read more »
Youngshagger Well you expose the lie that external “success” is enough to fuck women… Whatever the waypoint – looks, money, status, etc. It’s good but not sufficient. Sure that may attract girls but you still need to know how to turn that into arousal and bangs… The Purple Pill Lie is a lie… When dealing with girls remember they are girls. You need to emotionally engage them, over and over. Eventually that is through dread. That’s the only passive element that works, other women wanting you. And even that has limits (I.e. she gives up). As to wanting mature deep… Read more »
“Nobody can do everything. Everybody picks and chooses based on their priorities. When someone talks about your “sacrifices” what they are really doing is revealing and propagandizing their own values.”
“Well you expose the lie that external “success” is enough to fuck women […] Sure that may attract girls but you still need to know how to turn that into arousal and bangs…”
@J:
If you keep pondering it it’s possible you might get it someday, but I suspect you’ll need a couple whacks upside the head with a 2×4 between now and then.
@J
If you see a short cut in the road, take it. It’s what your soul is telling you to do. You wouldn’t want to deal with cognitive dissonance, would you?
Sentient The mature audience thing is not really the girls. It is more the guys honestly and my classmates as a whole. It all feels so kiddy. I don’t expect to “get really deep” with a highschool hookup. It is just when almost everyone it seems has no purpose and no real goals they fully commit to, then I am the vast minority of students and I find myself having to dumb myself down in most social settings. The only person I don’t have to do that around is my closest guy friend, and he actually is noticing the same… Read more »
@Young Shagger:
Something to be aware of is that the people who are around you now are also the people you will meet in college. Perhaps once upon a time it acted as a filter of sorts, but it no longer does. Today’s immature high school seniors are next year’s immature college freshman, only they’ll have fewer restraints on their behavior.
Just be aware that you’ll have the same social issues and have to find the one or three like minded people in the crowd.
kfg
Today’s immature high school seniors are next year’s immature college freshman, only they’ll have fewer restraints on their behavior.
A friend of mine called it “13th grade”, joking but not really joking.
Unless one goes into something that requires diligence and hours-on-the-floor. Then there’s a culling.
Youngshagger
“I find myself having to dumb myself down in most social settings”
Palmasailor
Yes me too. My sense of humour is wasted on 99.99% of women, and about 80% of men.
That’s all part of calibration. We don’t tell the same jokes at a convention as at an auto parts store as at the bar later than night. Right?
Calibrating so one doesn’t come across as a know it all or an autistic sperg is a good thing. Arguably part of reading people. So part of “burden of performance”.
YS Avoid the path of ” dumbing down “. People are as they are, and sometimes never grow and mature. Don’t cater to those folks. Nowadays maturity has been demoted in favor of a arrested development program. People are not keen on acting their age . It’s part of the downward spiral thing. You don’t have to join. Once upon a time I made friends freely everywhere I went, but things change as broader society excuses adolescent behaviors until deep into a person’s 40’s. Stay true to yourself lest anxiety set in. You might have to go through 10-20 ”… Read more »
@blax It’s not about having to dumb oneself down to get young attractive girls. It’s about developing an attractive personality/sense of humor. That they resonate with. It comes from hanging out with 20 something year olds, watching the same TV shows/movies, following funny meme accounts on Twitter/Instagram etc, Like I brought up this point with Sentient a couple of months ago, about Palma’s sense of humor when he shared a screenshot about some young chick who ghosted him after his “low bridges” and “cattle grids”. I know you’re not stupid. My wing’s not stupid (works at one of the big… Read more »
trigger warning: I’m speaking to autists “Avoid the path of ‘ dumbing down ‘” …yet meet people where they are…I wouldn’t talk to Blax using physics jargon…he might understand it and surprise me…but probably if I talked about the complex index of refraction his eyes would develop a glaze…so, I would speak to Blax assuming intelligence, but not a physics background… …but with people of modest intelligence, I’d speak differently than I would to Blax… …all that being said, Blax is talking about dumbing yourself down. He is right. Don’t do that. “broader society excuses adolescent behaviors until deep into… Read more »
Asd
Adolescent in this case refers to those who just mentally don’t nature past a younger age.
Some folks just get stuck and they get older, but they don’t mature. They may be 40 chronologically, but they still see and understand the world around them as they did when they were 19. One is supposed to gain wisdom with age. It’s mostly acceptable nowadays to be a dolt at any age.
I think it’s a function of everything being so convenient and easy in some way.
Asd
My eyes only glaze when I hear folks gossiping or talking about the most basic shit.
I know enough about physics to want to know more, so I’d probably dig the conversation and will come away with more than I knew going in. My uncle once told me ” you can live a thousand years, studying ever single day, and when you die the book of things you never knew would be taller than you are right know “. LOL, it’s like he cast a spell on me by saying that.
Palma
I was more focused on having fun with my friends last night than that girl so I was not too concerned. What is AMOGd though?
“What is AMOGd though?”
You showing the other guy up. This would have to be done with Game. He was tall and skinny. You are short(er) and muscular. So personality would have to be the tie breaker. Or Frame>Game>Looks.
https://www.pualingo.com/alpha-male-of-group-amog/
https://therationalmale.com/2015/02/02/the-art-of-amog/
@YS “I was more focused on having fun with my friends last night than that girl so I was not too concerned.” hmmmm… “I am mad that the kid kind of cucked me and garnered her interest” you sure about that? lol. “What is AMOGd though?” He means if you wanted to fuck her, you could have gone up to him and tooled him in front of her, then taken her off him (after spiking her emotions: “hey bro, is it cool if I borrow my friend back? I needa talk to her real quick about some dumb shit. but… Read more »
“You might have to go through 10-20 ” regular ” people before you find 1 person you can resonate with. That’s just the way it is, but it will come with built in appreciation for all involved.” Yes. And these days, people don’t always need you so much. So when they do mature in a relationship with you? Sometimes they move on. Sometimes you move on to greener pastures. So you got the 20:1 to deal with, then you got the moving on to deal with. It’s just how things happen to go. So with that knowledge, plow through a… Read more »
@Youngshagger You’re wayyyyyyy over-thinking banging girls and making excuses for not doing so by positioning your personal goals as taking precedent as though that is some sort of excuse. By thinking too much about banging (or not banging?) girls you’re still obsessing. By obsessing you’re likely giving off an awkward vibe that girls smell as trying too hard or somehow being uncalibrated. Relax. I find myself in similar situations when I’m too worried about one thing over another. The key here is prioritizing your goals and making sure you find time to do things you enjoy. In that context you… Read more »
“I know enough about physics to want to know more, so I’d probably dig the conversation and will come away with more than I knew going in. “ Going on 14 like me, lol. Having a fresh way of viewing the world without getting cynical or jaded. But not being adolescent according to your meaning. “Some folks just get stuck and they get older, but they don’t mature.” Some of us have developmental issues, possibly because of genes. But I do develop–just more slowly than non-autists. The upside is that at my age I don’t have joint issues. The downside… Read more »
Part 2
On consistency:
https://www.girlschase.com/content/daniel-adebayo-becoming-more-consistent-seduction-podcast
Short FR – Popped out last night for a beer. Opened 2 girls sitting down. Both very hot. Opened with a self-amusing/ silly roleplay type opener (tend to do better than with most other PUA opener advice, tbh!). Pretended that my friend was some German pen-pal who I needed help with and couldn’t understand, and within seconds the vibe was really good and we were all laughing etc. They were super friendly girls. We ‘came clean’ and just started chatting. One of them kind of recognised me. I started trying to game the one nearest to me. Teased her. DHV’d.… Read more »
@ford ‘she more or less picked up the girl I had been kissing and carried her away” Something I like to do with unattractive friends of the girl I’m interested in, is rather than send my wingman to help me out (because I know he’s gonna be useless lol) is I game both of them. With emphasis on trying to find the unattractive one a guy, by asking her what kinda guy she likes. Usually the guy, is unnatractive himself. Because unnatractive girls want guys who they know will give them a chance (they don’t pick out the hot guy… Read more »
@Sailor – yeah, wings are a weird one. One of my wings is like some male model and it screws up my head when i’m out with him as all the PUA stuff I read gets turned on it’s head in front of my eyes lol. Girls open him, sometimes fairly directly, and even escalate on him etc (especially when it gets later) and all he needs to do is not be super weird/awkward. Probably same as Bacchus and many of the new age pua’s I see on youtube I think Reminds me of this from rooshV https://www.rooshv.com/you-have-no-idea-how-easy-it-is-for-good-looking-men My other… Read more »
Just came back from Dancing meat two really beautiful women One is older and such a great dancer her name is Tammy the other is a girl who just came out for the first time an the dance floor been in the area for one mouth from Columbia.
Anyway reaching out and dancing is enriching. Came back to work right after
https://imgur.com/ELHoGLD
Hey guys! I am posting here because I need some specific Game advice. I know this is not a PUA forum and broader topics are discussed here. If anyone on here who is still out in the field could please help me out, it would be great. I have been out approaching in nightclubs primarily but also on the street doing some daygame. I read the Book of YaReally and the RSD products he recommends and have been trying to follow that advice. With RSD there is no initial structure for the conversation, Julien says say whatever and the whole… Read more »
@DJM Welcome to the TRM Field Reports section – this is the right place to talk about Game and PUA stuff, although the perspectives you will get in response are broader than most PUA perspectives. If you’ve read YaReally’s stuff and have looked at the RSD content, there is not that much more you need in terms of reading and resources. It’s more a question of getting out there and practicing and applying it (and then reflecting on it – writing Field Reports, thinking about what you did well, what you did badly, what you can improve). This is a… Read more »
@Everyone: I’d appreciate some external insight and specific advice if you men care to give it. It concerns my wife. Some of you may remember, most don’t care so here is with some relevant background. We live in a long distance relationship for many years (mostly my decisions regarding career). Present status (for 2-3 years), I don’t wear a ring for a while, and we are legally financially separated (strongly my decision, she hated it but I said it is that or divorce and she mostly accepted it as the new normal). We are both nearly 40. She ever increasingly… Read more »
IAS
Well I had a post go missing. Short answer…
Stop fucking around and get the divorce sorted asap. Tell her not to worry about you and use her good feelings in getting things done. You dont want to set off any jealous spurned crazy drama. And you dont want her to get pregnant while things drag out. Right now she thinks she has 12 orbiters to call on. Use this window and get things sorted.
Just be like “you deserve kids you need to use all the time you have” etc.
DJM
RSD had structure, copied from Mystery… Just stripped down.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=R2uvc6AwjRY
Put yourself in the state they want to be in
Self-amused opener
“Swing through” the opener until you reach hook point (90/10)
Layer in Statements of Intent/verbal flirtation
Begin interacting physically / establish romantic attraction
Determine logistical suitability
Build trust, comfort, and connection
Pull smoothly yet decisively (baby steps)
Make love in the night
IAS
You see there is her when you two are alone, and then there is her away with 12 “sisters” brining all their baggage to the table and all wanting a pound of male flesh… Your skinny ass can’t afford all that.
@IAS – good luck with it all.
I can’t really give the advice on this, but I will just say it’s not beta to have emotions and feelings about your wife for god’s sake! That’s normal and healthy – what you don’t want is to be ruled by those feelings, and you don’t want to put her on a pedestal or be subordinate to her – your Mission comes first. But other than – of course you’ll love your wife – you’re not a robot.
IAS —
Double on the getting things done re divorce while relations are still amicable. Much, much better that way. Play up to her freedom and so on to get it finished and over with.
Don’t worry so much about your feels — you will have them. Don’t dwell on them, or let them control what you do, just experience them and let them pass and move on with your plans.
@IAS When do you get the worst outcome? Not necessarily when you make a bad decision. Most likely when you don’t make a decision at all and you slowly drift with the stream of things unrolling without you realizing it. Sometimes it takes minutes, sometimes it’s years. But the world is not static and eventually moves on. Up to you how painful you make this. I just checked the dates in my notes and it looks like I wrote this to you almost 2 years ago: But you, my friend, don’t look for excuses in my dealings with life to… Read more »
@IAS wow… you’re really f*kin’ up your situ…lol and we are legally financially separated not unless you went to court for a decision, you aren’t… if all you have is ‘separate accounts/’separated money streams’ you are still legally financially together… unless the laws are much different in your country… but likely not… We are both nearly 40. She ever increasingly decided she wanted kids and I don’t. sooo, you “cheated her out of her child-bearing years… and likely any opportunity to have a child at all… with the man she loves and waited for… and was faithful to…etc”… <— what… Read more »
@Everyone: thanks. The situation is legally safe on the economic front (Palma knows this – if he remembers – but the rest of you wouldn’t). The laws are different here. I got legally separated (in financial terms) lover 2 years ago, she got legal rights to half our shared income up until that legal separation. She can no longer divorce rape me or get alimony, and because we did it more than X months ago, either of us can get a divorce without the other consent or other trouble with courts. It was actually very recent that I basically bought… Read more »
You’re physically separated. You’re not only legally separated, but have already surpassed the waiting period. You aren’t staying together for the kids you don’t have and don’t want. You’re not monogamous.
So, ummmmmmmmm, what?
IAS I’m sure I’ve asked you this years ago, but I don’t remember your response ( early onset dementia and all that ) – why did you get married if you didn’t want kids? As for the divorce stuff: 1) It’s emotionally hard at points if you actually loved your wife. As was said earlier, we aren’t robots ( nor psychopaths….mostly ). I shed many tears before, during and after my divorce. Don’t tell anybody = ) 2) Cosign what others have said here. It’s solid advice. Make up your mind and get moving on this a.s.a.p.. My divorce destroyed… Read more »
@HABD: LOL you are great man, thanks for the laughs and the good advice. @KFG: yes I get it, I’m an idiot. Years ago I floated the idea about “demoting” my wife from marriage to LTR (because the legal system here allowed it). I think pretty much everyone in the MRP reddit told me I was an idiot (which as the current situation shows, is true, but not for that reason). Yet I did manage that and it became the new normal. I guess that success gave me too much hope that she would “fall in line” and that my… Read more »
@Blaximus: thanks, that really does help. To answer your question. I didn’t know whether I wanted kids or not, neither did she. I think the true answer is that I was – beyond BP – very religious back then, and by 26 I really wanted to have sex already (I wouldn’t have phrased it that way back then). I had some epic blue balls I can tell you – we had been together for some 6 years by then. She is my first and only girlfriend, likewise for her, and although I didn’t really know how to vet I don’t… Read more »
“I don’t want to go into that too much now as it makes me sadder”.
IAS OK I get you are dealing with feelz etc. But this place doesn’t care. Just like Hypergamy! “I guess that success gave me too much hope that she would “fall in line” and that my RP awareness would be enough to keep her there. ” You need to be clear with yourself that you did not push things. Tou did not declare she was tour wife therefore she would be living with you etc. You have several moves ledt on the table. You can’t say the RP let you down here. You sidestepped. Perhaps this is the opportunity? I… Read more »
@Sentient: yes I’m dealing with feelings, which is particularly hard for me. I’m sure it wasn’t RP letting me down, even if I think my knowledge of it is strong, my skills in putting it to practice are below average. I fucked up. As IRL so explicitly illustrated with his repost. What you said is what I considered. That was the hope really, that she would fall into my Frame, give me desire sex on demand, stop wanting kids and be happy for a change. Obviously none of that is happening. I admit I didn’t fully commit. Acceptable to her… Read more »
@IAS
This may not be a popular opinion here but in your shoes I would be getting snipped ASAP and divorced. Even though the laws in your country are on your side now, once she has a kid (either yours or someone else’s) (y’know, baby-fever)) the ball game will change on you. Use N2/N3 and N3+1… to enjoy life.
IAS That was the hope really, that she would fall into my Frame, give me desire sex on demand, stop wanting kids and be happy for a change. Obviously none of that is happening. Yeah well that is every guy’s hope. But hoping is not how that happens… And trying to game her when she is far away is not how that happpens. I mean you are spinning two plates and she doesn’t even think you would be ready for sex with another girl…? She never felt any dread at all… That’s beyond not “fully” committing. That’s just sticking your… Read more »
@IAS
And I don’t want to tell her to quit her job to come live with me for some reasons, one of which is she is very likely to say no because she doesn’t like living in the “big city” (she directly says she doesn’t want to live here, I never did outright tell her to come)
seriously dude?…lol
i can’t even….lol
good luck!
@IAS
have you EVER been out of her frame?… serious question…
good luck!
@IAS: I wasn’t trying to highlight that you were being an idiot. I was trying to highlight that you weren’t answering the question. You’re dithering. If you were being an idiot at least you’d be doing something. Up until now your dithering has been asymmetrical, it’s moved you to the point where you are a just a mechanical process away from a final decree, yours for the asking, but that has put you up on the razor’s edge. You can’t balance there forever. Sooner or later you will slip and fall, and when you fall you will be cut. You… Read more »
He only sees her 3/4 times a year so it’s not huge risk.
No, she may just decide to use someone else to get impregnated and then he’s stuck for the next 18+ years.
“she may just decide to use someone else to get impregnated and then he’s stuck for the next 18+ years”.
How?
Can’t he just show the court the papers with the date he had the vasectomy done. Showing how the timing of her pregnancy wouldnt add up?
lol my bad. Dumb brain.
But yeah. Get snipped and keep seeing her long distance. While continuing to bang your plates. She’s clearly still in love with him and has been with him for over what 15+ years without a child. Clearly having a kid is not really a top priority for her, if she’s been with him for this long without ditching him for a new man to get her pregnant.
I had posted a comment in the Best of Rational male section earlier, and was kindly recommended to post here , Thanks to ‘Palmasailor’ and ‘having a bad day’ for the advice. After 11 years of marriage, being a good husband and a good father to my two beautiful children, my wife informed me that she no longer loved me and thought we would separate. After going crazy trying to figure it all out an acquaintance of mine passed me your book and things are beginning to come into perspective that I had never connected the dots to before. I… Read more »
Thanks Palmasailor. I already booted the in laws out, but spent the past month away as my father was dying of cancer. I was actually already acting like more of an asshole in an attempt to force her out. Going to grab her ass, grope her boobs, tell her how fat and poorly dressed she is and make her as uncomfortable as she has made me while I was still in the appeasing what she is saying phase. But now reading your response, that may have the opposite of defect of what I was planning. I will post after some… Read more »
Jody After 11 years of marriage, being a good husband and a good father to my two beautiful children, my wife informed me that she no longer loved me and thought we would separate. The best thing you can do is to STOP living by the Golden Rule ^^^ and start living by the Platinum Rule. The Platinum Rule – Do what YOU want to do, whenever YOU want to do it. This is the way to start to develop Alpha, and kill the beta. as to this “she has offered in couples counseling that I am not a “doer”… Read more »
@Jody I had posted a comment in the Best of Rational male section earlier, and was kindly recommended to post here , Thanks to ‘Palmasailor’ and ‘having a bad day’ for the advice. After 11 years of marriage, being a good husband and a good father to my two beautiful children, my wife informed me that she no longer loved me and thought we would separate. basic sh*t test… and need more detail… After going crazy trying to figure it all out an acquaintance of mine passed me your book and things are beginning to come into perspective that I… Read more »
Thanks Sentient. Well I have had around 19 sexual partners in my time. I was in three long term relationships but other than my marriage the longest before that was 3 years. I was raised single handedly by my mother who stayed married to my father until his passing earlier this year. He was a hard worker but not very involved with his children and an alcoholic. I have 2 brothers and 2 sisters, and we are all very close. I met my wife after moving to Toronto for work after university. I was in a good place in my… Read more »
Thanks having a bad day.
“want your wife slimmed down/yoga’d up and s-ckin’ your c-ck everyday (with anal on the weekends…lol)… with home-cooked meals in a clean house?… totally doable…”
Doesn’t every man want that?
Jody, Welcome here. “You might post a little background on your experience level with women, how you met W, her experience etc. for more context.” The comments section, especially here in field reports is a good venue to actually give a field report: a story about something that happened or is happening, and how you did something and your wife responded, or how she reacted or how her efforts at shit testing you are affecting you. I wrote out some questions that I thought of to find out more about you. I did this before you responded to HABD and… Read more »
“Doesn’t every man want that?” No. Some men just want their wives to drive off a cliff so badly that they’ll provide their favorite car if it will make it happen. What do you want? Protip: Your wife has been telling you that she doesn’t want that, but doesn’t like not wanting that and wants to want it (yes, that makes woman sense), but you haven’t figured out how to hear that yet. So, putting some top spin on the question, are you willing to want what you want? That question, which so obviously ought to be answered “Well, duh!”… Read more »
@Palmasailor @HABD I don’t want to interfere why not?…lol… i make mistakes too ya know…lol… and when you ‘interfere’ everybody wins!…. bc we can all learn some new sh*t… but why this: “as long as it hasn’t gotten to P in V” You repeat this so it’s a point for you. yes, it is… and why do you think that might be?… do you suppose?… (hint – a girl’s hind-brain is like an autistic Yoda…lol… “Do (AF) or Do not (BB)… there is no try…” (on steroids)) what position (‘have options’ = AF… OR… ‘no options’ = BB) do you… Read more »
@Jody
Thanks having a bad day.
“want your wife slimmed down/yoga’d up and s-ckin’ your c-ck everyday (with anal on the weekends…lol)… with home-cooked meals in a clean house?… totally doable…”
Doesn’t every man want that?
do YOU?… <— that’s the ONLY man that matters in your situ…
good luck!
@Jody kfg
So, putting some top spin on the question, are you willing to want what you want? That question, which so obviously ought to be answered “Well, duh!” is actually the tricky part.
restating for emphasis…
the FI/BP will try to/has punished you (shaming) for ‘wanting what you want’… so, this is an important RP concept to swallow…
good luck!
@Palma I get the gist of what HABD is saying if she gets other P in her V. At that point, he can’t retrieve his status. Merely the difference in married Beta status (which Jody’s wife is telegraphing loud and clear), vs. single guy non BB status (which have been your reference experiences). Illimitable Man maxim #27: “Women will not go backwards in commitment, men will not go backwards sexually. Corollary: unless the man or woman in question has no better options, in which case they will, with misery.” Jody’s wife being overt about interest in another man/men is a… Read more »
Jody
“. I was in a good place in my life, starting a career in IT for a bank here and made a lot of new social connections and had had my share of girls.”
Can you tie this Jody into the Alpha Triad – dynamic, passionate and authentic displays?
It’s the usual case J. You had enough Alpha back then, probably had some hand in the relationship… Then pissed it all away trying to do the “right” things… That FI is a real bitch.
You just need to wake up now and let the inner Jody back out.
@HABD: I don’t see how several of my actions, mentioned in the recap, could be seen as being in my wife’s Frame. Prioritising career over living with her and not being monogamous any more in particular. In general, yes I’m often in her Frame in that I worry significantly about what she wants etc. @KFG: your point was clear. See below my cost-benefit analysis. @Sentient: I’m looking at it this way: At this stage, if I was already divorced, I wouldn’t (re-)marry her. If I look at it from the outside, that means I should divorce unless what I have… Read more »