Ovulation & Dread

ovulation_dread

I had an interesting study brought to my attention recently (ht/ Robert Burriss) and I thought I’d get back to a nuts and bolts post with something useful I found in it.

Women Selectively Guard Their Desirable Mates From Ovulating Women.

As you might expect, much of the findings in this study reinforce many Red Pill principles founded in evo-psych, but there are a few new angles to consider here. Before I start to riff on this study, bear in mind that the concept of female mate guarding behavior centers on what the researchers define as ‘desirable mates’ to women. This subjective assessment of desirability will play into all this analysis.

For women, forming close, cooperative relationships with other women at once poses important opportunities and possible threats-including mate retention. To maximize the benefits and minimize the costs of same-sex social relationships, we propose that women’s mate guarding is functionally flexible and that women are sensitive to both interpersonal and contextual cues indicating whether other women might be likely and effective mate poachers. Here, we assess one such cue: other women’s fertility. Because ovulating (i.e., high-fertility) women are both more attractive to men and also more attracted to (desirable) men, ovulating women may be perceived to pose heightened threats to other women’s romantic relationships. Across 4 experiments, partnered women were exposed to photographs of other women taken during either their ovulatory or nonovulatory menstrual-cycle phases, and consistently reported intentions to socially avoid ovulating (but not nonovulating) women-but only when their own partners were highly desirable. Exposure to ovulating women also increased women’s sexual desires for their (highly desirable) partners. These findings suggest that women can be sensitive to subtle cues of other women’s fertility and respond (e.g., via social exclusion, enhanced sexual attention to own mate) in ways that may facilitate their mate retention goals while not thwarting their affiliative goals.

Right from the start here we have two Red Pill foundations confirmed; the influence that perceptual SMV plays in women’s sense of passive Dread and the fundamental influence that menstruation dictates to sexual arousal and concurrent motivations for sex appeal during women’s ovulation phase.

I’ve previously gone into the dynamics that play out between men and women with regard to perceived SMV of a partner versus the other partner’s self-perception of their own SMV and how this determines secure vs. insecure attachment. This post was more of an outline of results of SMV imbalance rather that the motivations for the characteristics of those personal attachments. This study illustrates these underlying motivators very well.

Anyone who’s heard my Man in Demand talk on Hypergamy understands the (menstrual cycle) biological root for women’s personal and sociological behavior, and this study provides yet another confirmation of it. I’ve also written in the past about men’s propensity for mate guarding and the behavioral cues women, both subtly and not so subtly, display that prompts them to mate guarding. However, I’ve yet to explore women’s mate guarding behaviors.

I’m bringing up the SMV ratios and Mate Guarding posts here because it’s important to bear in mind the subjectivity that perceived SMV plays in regard to motivating mate guarding. Depending on that balance (or imbalance) one partner will be more motivated to mate guard than the other. Which of course then brings us back to the Cardinal Rule of Relationships. Mate guarding impulse is contextual to the comparative value of both individuals and the value of others in their social environment (potential sexual competitors).

Thus, it is a significant challenge for women when other women attempt to poach their partners. For instance, over 50% of women admit to attempting to poach another woman’s partner, and over 80% of men admit to having been the object of another woman’s poaching—with about half of men admitting to “going along” with the poaching attempt (e.g., Schmitt et al., 2004; Schmitt & Buss, 2001). Women have good reason, then, to mate guard.

I’m going to encourage readers to take the time to, at the very least, read the introduction, premise and results of this comprehensive study. Naturally there will be incredulous women who will insist that men tend to overestimate the displayed sexual interests of women towards them. This is a common social convention that serves a very specific purpose for women; plausible deniability.

If the common group-think is that men are egotistical, think they’re “all that” and stupidly believe they’re seeing sexual cues from women because “that’s just how men are”, then we have a pre-established condition in which women can believably deny interest. Thus, should a man not find a woman attractive, or opt for another, this then serves as a rejection buffer as well as a precondition for her own rejection of a man should he make an approach and not be found attractive.

The Schmitt & Buss studies account for this, but even if they didn’t there would still need to be a functional reason for women’s mate guarding behavior. That reason puts the lie to the social convention of women presuming men aren’t as perceptive of their sexual cues as they’d like to believe.

[…] whereas men have at times physically isolated and sequestered their female

partners to restrict other men’s access to them (e.g., in harems), women may analogously socially isolate their partners from potential poachers—keeping them apart so as to preclude potentially costly competition for their romantic partners.

The usefulness of this strategy depends on women being able to identify those who might be likely and effective mate poachers, and then excluding them (but not others) from their social circles. If a woman indiscriminately distances herself and her partner from potential poachers (i.e., all other women), she is assured of his fidelity but at the cost of eliminating her access to the numerous benefits of female–female friendships.

Spoiler alert: The study confirms that women will covertly exclude themselves and their lover’s company from women who A.) outclass them in comparative SMV (hotter women than they perceive themselves to be) and B.) happen to be in the proliferative phase of ovulation.

This indicates that not only are women subconsciously (if not consciously) aware of intrasexual rivals ovulatory states – as evidenced by dress, ornamentation, vocal intonation, scent, sexual proceptivity, etc. – but they are aware enough to orchestrate covert methods to protect their sexual investments in a ‘high value’ male while ensuring future intrasexual friendships.

That may seem like an overly scientific way of saying women watch out for other women slutting it up, but the subcommunications of ovulation are so subtle that women’s subconscious, peripheral awareness of those cues evolved for a sensitivity that goes beyond the obvious slut. That’s how important retaining a better-than-self SMV optimal mating choice is to women in an evolutionary scope. That sensitivity is part of women’s psychological firmware.

[…]In addition, if a woman were to consistently and indiscriminately exclude other women from her own and, by extension, her partner’s social circle, she might gain a reputation for being non-communal and non-nurturing, and thus, for being an undesirable friend. This might not only thwart her ability to form future friendships with other women, but might also lead her partner to perceive her as highly difficult, uncooperative, controlling, and non-trusting.

Thus, on one hand, the costs of indiscriminately avoiding other women are high because women reap important benefits from making new same-sex friends, On the other hand, women can and do mate poach with frequency, and those women deeply embedded in one’s social circle may have increased access, motivation, and ability to poach successfully.

There’s a few things to unpack here before we can make this information Red Pill / Game applicable. The most important metric that female mate guarding indicates is her genuine assessment of a man’s SMV and how valuable his participation and investment in their LTR (or even STR sexual value) is to her.

I’ve seen this mate guarding play out in my own relationships before, both as a Red Pill husband who happens to work with beautiful women in the liquor industry and prior to my Red Pill awareness of it in my libertine 20s. Back then it was easy to pass off as ‘bitches be crazy’ when a girlfriend or a short term sex partner “just got jealous”. But in hindsight the timing of those fits of jealousy seemed a bit to regular.

I’m going to suggest that developing an awareness of a woman’s bouts of jealousy or her subtle timing in wanting to spend time alone with you, or her being more sexually proceptive (she wants to fuck more) with you at times you may think odd. These are Alpha or Beta TellsA woman’s preoccupation with guarding you from other women is a prime indicator of your SMV worth to her. It stands to reason that only ‘desirable’ men deserve the effort of her mate guarding.

This is an important Red Pill sensitivity to have as it also allows you to determine a woman’s unspoken understanding of where she and you stand in relative SMV comparison. As I was saying in the introduction here, that ‘desirability’, that SMV ratio, that Alpha impression that makes you worth mate guarding is subjective to what a woman’s self-perceived SMV is in respect to your own. When we interact with women in the long term it’s very easy for men to lose sight of this balance and think that their frumpy wife is the best they can do. There is a definitive psychological game that women of low SMV will play with men they know are of higher value – they will continually devalue that man as a form of mate guarding.

That devaluation may take the form of browbeating, nagging or accusing him of being attracted to other women in an effort to get her higher value LTR man to self-limit his being poached by endlessly qualifying himself to his low SMV wife/girlfriend. It’s far easier, and far lower an investment of resources if a low SMV woman can convince her higher SMV man to mate guard himself.

Just as an aside here, there may be a few readers who’ll think women will rationally consider that their long term provisioning is virtually assured in a feminine-primary social order. Alimony, child support or pro-female government will assure her and her offspring a baseline of security, so why mate guard any man?

The answer of course is that women’s psychological firm ware didn’t evolve to acknowledge these considerations. Once again T-Rex doesn’t want to be fed, he wants to hunt. So even with the logical consideration that provisioning is assured women’s limbic (particularly on an Alpha Fucks short term breeding assurance) still wants those environmental and behavioral cues that indicate they have that security.

Passive Dread

So with all of this to digest how do we put this knowledge of women’s limbic desire for ensuring a mate’s exclusive sex and provisioning to use for us?

The obvious answer is in the title of this post – developing that awareness of your SMV worth to a woman is a good starting point from which you can subtly employ a passive form of Dread.

I’ve gotten a lot of grief for just my acknowledging Dread, much less using it beneficially for both a man and whatever woman he chooses (long or short term). It’s always about how horribly manipulative it is, or it’s just an unsustainable game of brinksmanship between a couple that destroys trust. But what these (usually female) critics never recognize is that Dread is already an integral part of every relationship by order of degree.

The fact that both male and female mate guarding behaviors are evidential facts of both sex’s hindbrain function should be proof enough that Dread, the concern of loss of investment, and the subconscious, comparative evaluation of SMV is something that’s always an operative. It’s inherent to our conditions as evolved human beings.

My advice in this instance is for men to become sensitive to the indicators of that ovulatory mate guarding dread and use that insecurity to promote a better, genuine desire in that woman. Suggesting this will seem counterintuitive to a Blue Pill mindset. The conditioned response will be to allay that woman’s fears (the ones she’s subconsciously aware of but will hate you for making her acknowledge) and provide her with comfort and familiarity.

But comfort and familiarity are anti-seductive and kill the genuine desire, the genuine need to fuck you in order to keep you and show her appreciation for your higher SMV. Why does a woman compete for what she is constantly comfortably assured she already has?

The trick to employing soft or passive dread is making yourself sensitive to the opportunities to use it and then gently provoke it in as covert and indirect a way as possible. One of the better ideas the early PUAs had was mastering the art of the Neg, or the backhanded compliment. The idea was to casually knock a woman’s self-image down to a manageable degree in order to get her to qualify herself the the PUA. Passive dread operates on a similar principle.

You need to see the opportunities for its use, and women’s propensity for mate guarding men they find ‘desirable’ is a reasonably predictable opportunity. See those chances for other women’s casual flirtations with you, look for those unsolicited opportunities for easy social proof, and don’t dissuade your woman’s initial mate guarding response. Casually push back on the mate guarding impulse, don’t jump to the reassurances of your undying love and interest.

See that opportunity for what it is – a chance to restate whose Frame she’s chosen to be a part of. She wants to merit your value. Take that effort away from her and you become valueless to her.

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Published by Rollo Tomassi

Author of The Rational Male and The Rational Male, Preventive Medicine

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Roused
Roused
5 years ago

Last several comments were awfully good stuff. I need those reminders. As I read Blax’s post I was thinking yeah, it’s all about your mental point of origin. Sure enough, he nailed it as he closed his post. +1 SJF, thanks for more copy pasta goodness. Always appreciate your nudges that help keep complacency at bay. KFG wrote: “He isn’t necessarily chopping wood to attract a woman, he’s chopping wood so he doesn’t freeze to death in the winter.” Indeed, my stacks of ash have made for a toasty hearth this week. Coincidentally, my gf texted me a photo today… Read more »

Andy
Andy
5 years ago

“Andy, perhaps take a step back and not overthink this burden thing. When I embrace the burden I feel energized and firing on all cylinders.” @Roused Yeah, I embrace my masculinity and burden and everything. I guess you’d call me a “handy” guy. I live in an old house, so I pretty much always have some sort of project going on. I do all the car work and such. Also, my beard would make Dan Bilzerian poop his pants. My issue is just like the whole separating my id from my ego. Am I doing X because I truly want… Read more »

Forge the Sky
Forge the Sky
5 years ago

@SJF I think you’ve taken a single aspect of Andy’s circumstance and pigeonholed him in it. When he was first digesting RP stuff he was frustrated that his circumstance (wife with kids) limited his sexual options. That’s not something that frustrates you in your circumstance so you’ve interpreted that as ‘he’s just a kid who’d rather bang chicks than accept his responsibilities as a man.’ I don’t think that’s fair; I think it’s great that you’re satisfied by your wife, and I could see myself having a similar mindset if I were married, but I can also empathize with his… Read more »

having a bad day
having a bad day
5 years ago

@Andy “@Blax Yeah, this all sounds real simple. The problem is that you’re not really taking into account how deep societal programming runs. It affects what we perceive as a “want” or a “need” despite the fact that it may not be necessary at all. Subconsciously looking to the FI for direction. THAT is my problem. Not the burden itself. Deciding if I’m actually doing something for myself, or if I’m doing it because that’s what I’m “supposed” to do. When I say FI, I mean societal programming. Maybe you take it to mean something else.” FI = societal programming…it’s… Read more »

having a bad day
having a bad day
5 years ago

i guess i missed a /blockquote in there somewhere…lol…oh, look! velcro!…now, i can tie my shoes…lol…

Andy
Andy
5 years ago

@Forge, “I think you’ve taken a single aspect of Andy’s circumstance and pigeonholed him in it.” Ah, that makes sense. Is your IQ like 2 billion or something? @HABD ” but really, how many red pillers ARE there ” Right. I am doing an okay job of making friends… But god. I practically have to call their wives and ask if they can hang out. “Hey can Jimmy come out to play?” So, yeah. I know I need to get out and find some single friends. “that shits like a root virus…lol…” Exactly… that’s why I have a hard time… Read more »

having a bad day
having a bad day
5 years ago

@Andy “So I guess stepping outside your comfort zone to learn and accomplish new things is a true desire?” it can be, and it’s pretty cool when it is (which is why it’s good when you adopt that attitude), but mostly it’s where personal growth takes place, so you just need to go there regardless…that’s why buffers are so insidious…bc they create comfort…which is…comfortable…lol… i used to know this really cute girl (total hippie freespirit type…one of the coolest/realest people i ever met…(back when i was a clueless omega sperg…and couldn’t see the IOIs…lol)) and every time she got ‘comfortable’… Read more »

Anonymous Reader
Anonymous Reader
5 years ago

Andy Like, the first time I fix the car, it feels fucking good. I don’t really get much credit for it, but it still feels good. The next time I fix the car it feels a little less good and a little more like work… So I guess stepping outside your comfort zone to learn and accomplish new things is a true desire? The first time you unstop the toilet the kids plugged is an accomplishment. The next few times, not so much. Then it’s just a chore, part of maintaining the house, and also a teaching moment for the… Read more »

SJF
SJF
5 years ago

Let me be clear on my motivations and intentions. See this place is a safe place for men to discuss (through intellectual debate) things that they can’t in real life. That would be because some of you guys can’t find any red pill men out there. So we are here to talk about red pill awareness and game. Even though the last half of the discussion should be and is about how to score easy pussy, the first half of the discussion is about masculine self improvement. I’m not here to dis or to sucker punch Andy or anyone else.… Read more »

SJF
SJF
5 years ago

HABD you are infectious. I forgot to close the blockquote after

“Morpheus: No, Neo. I’m trying to tell you that when you’re ready, you won’t have to</blockquote

To use the strike through format set it up like this but use the instead of the brackets like this

[del] strike through text[/del]

to look like this: strike through text

SJF
SJF
5 years ago

…use the greater than and less than sign instead of the brackets.

SJF
SJF
5 years ago

Here is some background material taken from “The Way of Men” in regards to us men “fighting” like in a bar fight, or in a pre-agricultural game in online blog intellectual debate: As prosperity and security increase, and the need for men to hunt, struggle and fight decreases, the male desire to engage in gang activity can be controlled and channeled though simulation, vicariousness, and intellectualization. A minority of men need extremely frequent opportunities for vital, immediate equivalents to hunting and war as they can get to keep them productive, and to keep them from self-destructing. Charles Darwin thought that… Read more »

SJF
SJF
5 years ago

In regards to this not having decent guy friends in real life. You know red pill masculine ones. Keep searching, but vet them and next them if they don’t live up. One thing I did was convert some online friends in a different venue. A sportsman’s forum where there was at least the Private Messaging feature on a forum, rather than a blog which doesn’t have this feature. I met up in real life with sportsmen that had the same narrow and broad interests and that worked out well. These guys were already vetted somewhat by their previous posts and… Read more »

Andy
Andy
5 years ago

“if opening is your current sticking point, here’s a tip = open EVERYBODY you meet” Yeah, good advice. Why didn’t I think of that? I’m going to a thing tomorrow. I’ll try that. “and you can game the wife, too” My learning curve has kind of leveled off here. I don’t think I’m going to learn much more from this one. Similarly, I have this weird thing where if I get to a certain level of familiarity with someone then the “fun, outgoing, gregarious” switch goes off. Also, if there’s say… 3 people I’m familiar with and 2 people I’m… Read more »

Andy
Andy
5 years ago

“and don’t get me started as to why you don’t want to do this or you are really going to want to take your ball and go home.”

Lay it on me sensei. I don’t want anyone walking on egg shells around me.

SJF
SJF
5 years ago

Father issues. You don’t want to be like your father. I can elaborate as needed.

SJF
SJF
5 years ago

I’m not saying this applies to you. Just food for thought. Chapter 10 of Deida’s “The Way of the Superior Man” Enjoy Your Friends’ Criticism A man’s capacity to receive another man’s direct criticism is a measure of his capacity to receive masculine energy. If he doesn’t have a good relationship to masculine energy (e.g., his father), then he will act like a woman and be hurt or defensive rather than make use of other men’s criticism. About once a week, you should sit down with your closest men friends and discuss what you are doing in your life and… Read more »

Andy
Andy
5 years ago

Oh god. This sounds like it’s going to get deep. Ok so I have father issues so that means what?

Andy
Andy
5 years ago

Hmm chapter 3 doesn’t apply. I’m fairly certain I’ve exceeded his expectations.

SJF
SJF
5 years ago

And here, I am not saying you are a Nice Guy, or that you are ineffective. Nor I am I saying there is anything wrong with your father. It is just that certain things have been run by the FI that don’t benefit sons. I know this doesn’t apply directly. But there is probably some indirect impact on all males that applies to not having stand up masculine fathers, dominating mothers and the lack of agency in sons of some sort. Forget whatever he is saying about “nice guys” and translate this into anything you are lacking agency in. Up… Read more »

SJF
SJF
5 years ago

Not saying that Chapter 3 applies. But maybe your father wasn’t as strong as you wanted him to be in retrospect. What about your mother’s influence? Again, I’m not saying you are a “nice guy” without testicles, but the FI has been an issue for you. It is the Matrix and it is feminine feminist. And strong male guy friends that you can hang out with, bond with and have them resonate with you on your terms are necessary to advance your mission and help define your mission. Contrary to the prevailing sentiments of the last few decades, it is… Read more »

SJF
SJF
5 years ago

Heh, I reached the end of the Robert Glover book. Not much of the “nice guy” type resonated with me because I never really acted or behaved as a nice guy (who would have thought). But I do resonate with his ending suggestions and have employed most of these suggestions he suggests as a breaking free excercise at the end of the book. I did most of these things by default in my life. Sure it is common sense in a red pill/game world, but it doesn’t hurt to review. 1 If it frightens you, do it. 2 Don’t settle.… Read more »

Andy
Andy
5 years ago

Sounds like a good book, but I worked through that shit a long time ago.

SJF
SJF
5 years ago

“Sounds like a good book, but I worked through that shit a long time ago.”

Me too. And more.

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[…] Ovulation & Dread […]

Elli Sanders
4 years ago

Well damn that certainly explains a lot of shit I see inside my clubs!

Roberto Alba
4 years ago

Another masterful post. I can attest to this myself. I work out often and am in great physicial shape. I had a cute girlfriend back in the day who was cute, but not crazy hot. She was jealous as hell and it was partly because I gave her reason to feel that way – I would flirt lightly with her friends and with women in front of her. And she was frequently immersed in this feeling you speak of. With all the manipulation they employ… heck, I’m fine with us having some of our own tools as well. It’s only… Read more »

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